Kump - Ep. 242 THE EPSTEIN LIES

Episode Date: February 23, 2026

Ray discusses Epstein Denial, Wexner, Lutnick, Punch the monkey, and much more.. patreon.com/raykump⁠ for bonus episodes

Hello and welcome to Comp. There was a blizzard on the way. More snow for New York. More fake snow. More polycarbonate bifrost, which Mandami will use to clog up it. He wants to clog up capitalism, the socialist mayor of ours.

So he lays in these chemicals with the snow so they don't melt and clogs up business so he can come in with his with his garbage men and and clog up the works and ruin capitalism so he can save the day with his with his stipends handing out turkeys like he's John Gotti on Thanksgiving you know I'm not don't fall for you know

you look at when uh communism takes hold in countries. And there's always a time leading up to it where they're just sabotaging businesses with fake snow, with, you know, murdering Rockettes. That's happened in the past.

The Rockets, you know, are wonderful, our national treasure. New York used to not, they used to get murdered on their streets during the Dinkins administration. I've covered this before. The Rockettes there should be an indicator on Wall Street about these women

protect these women these Rockettes You know I'm a you know There's a lot of pushback As with me too Arrow like oh we don't have to protect all the women Well that's not for me to say you have to

But definitely the Rockettes Because it hurts morale You have a goddamn giant 18 inches 24 inches It's too much goddamn snow Why can't we do something about this you know, we're melting the ozone layer

and we still, it's like no matter you still lose. Like, oh, I guess there's going to be like a thing where the earth's uninhabitable. And that sucks. But it will be warmer in the winters. And for a bit, it was.

But then they go, well, yeah, but you can't. See, this is, I don't love that science has caught a bad reputation. in recent that, you know, flat earth. And, you know, kids are getting the mumps and the measles because they don't want to get vaccinated.

These dumb, these arrogant kids who won't vaccinate themselves. That being said, science is not doing themselves any favors. But a lot of this double speak. This is constantly, you know, oh, you know, it's going to be a boiling Sahara Desert everywhere south of Alaska. And go, well, okay, but there's, that's not ideal. And if I go back in time, I wouldn't pick it again.

But there's some tradeoff there at least. At least we can enjoy the, enjoy February a little more. And then they find some way to take that from you. They find some way to suck your dig with a gun and pull the trigger. Don't, this is not some situation where you have. some giant gun with a giant barrel it goes around your dick and you think it's nice. It's a metaphor

for shooting your dick off. All right, don't be a fool. Don't be a goddamn fool. I'm talking about a man coming to you with a promise of a slurping mouth, I guess. I don't know. A man comes to me,

I mean, I'm just getting lost. It's not, you know, it'll be, you know, can I interest you in a woman, whatever this fucking thing is. you know, the whole gift horse in the mouth those who refers to blow jobs. It's not about blow jobs.

Don't just, someone, no one's just coming and offered you a blow, no reason, you know? You go up to a woman, you go, let me eat your pussy.

It just doesn't happen like that. There's a sequence of events, right? There's a way these things evolved. So, you know, do you get your mouth, or get your dick shot?

Don't complain me. Don't complain to me. You know, is that how Prince Andrew got ensnared in his life of ill repute? I don't know. The man has been arrested, right? Britain's former Prince Andrew has been arrested on suspicion of misconduct and public office. Now known as Andrew Mountbatten Winter, he was taken into custody in Norfolk just a short while ago. He is accused of allegedly sharing confidential information with the late-southsend. sex offender Jeffrey Epstein. Ooh, that's a faux pa.

Batten, Windsor has previously denied any wrongdoing over his ties to Epstein. King Charles had stripped his brother of his titles back in October and has since evicted him from Windsor. It's cold blood. It's like, oh, Charles! Why can't I be a pedophile? Don't take away my horse. I want to be a pedophile, Charles.

I don't want to be a Mountbatten? The fuck is Mountbatten. Is that their name? that's what's her name is Windsor. I knew, like, the guy who, like, the, from Game of Thrones in the show, the Crown, the guy who, like, you know,

Tyrion Lannister, right? Tywin Lannister, you know, Tyrion's dad, he played a guy who was in the Crown who was named Mountain Batten, Dickey Mountain Baton, right? But I don't, that's not, these guys were Windsors. No one knows how this works over there,

these royals. look this look this guy he was look at this picture he's going well he looks it's disgraceful

he just looks I mean they really he took him he took himself down a peg on his own bitard imagine you were a prince of England

and now you're a mountbatton and he's just a scumbag you but you you friggin did all the wrong things all the worst things

and now you're here that's nice it's a nice thing right I think it's a nice I mean it's a nice that there's finally something going on with this Epstein shit yeah there was a lot there's years where it was just like well there's like you know

the worst shit in the world and we're not going to do nothing and so much for they haven't done anything you know they've talked a lot and they've uh you know but there's finally you know we've had we've had to take a bunch of people you know Chomsky had to take a peg in his uh

his reputation. Noam Chomsky, the famous, I don't what you'd call him. He invented linguistics or something, but he's more famous for writing manufactured consent

and being, he was like, is in Goodwill hunting? I wonder if he'll digitally take him out of Goodwill hunting, his name. Did they say Chomsky's name and what did you say,

manufacturing consent? Either way, take it out. I just look at the idea to have a forcing Gus Van Zanzas. like you know take it out well you mean if you're gonna do it I'm not gonna be involved I'm I was you know it's owned by Miramax or whatever

don't make it no we're gonna make you a commentary for your connection of Epstein I'm not connected with Epstein well Chomsky was kicking ass and taking names but no apparently Chomsky yeah I did say the guys it's you know he probably wasn't

when I first heard I'm like yeah I mean I probably wasn't uh like he probably like you know chomsy he probably hit him up on email he's probably oh well you know well yeah i do think blah blah blah uh the mechanisms of power or blah blah you know because he's just you know chomsy would just let you fucking flatter him with but apparently you know like chomsky's giving him money and he's like helping him like he's like he's how he's how he's how you here's how you here's how you defend yourself when he's pedophilia charges i'm don't chomsky the genius

like god damn and like apparently he needs the money because sons were suing him like how do you I mean you're 98 years old like you're like the world's most famous like I know I know it's like he worked for MIT which is a government military whatever he's probably you know intelligence asset or something so people you know leftist think he's controlled opposition whatever you've got this reputation you wear sweater vest and you go um you know when you're like a professor you that's all you got I mean you make money I mean I didn't think they were making that kind of money. I thought they were making, like, he lived in, like, a townhouse in Boston and went to dinner

parties and, you know, oh, yeah, that was very interesting, Mr. Pinker, whoever he talks to. Oh, oh, yeah, I know he hated Sam Harris. But apparently, like, you need tons of, you, if he should have just fucking, like, just been a bum. Why are you, like, you're 95, you have his, you have, like, a kind of virtuous reputation. Your sons are suing you because you don't want to give them, I think he hated his new wife, so they tried to sue him, like, to get his money out of his estate before he died, which I didn't realize you could do. I'm going to try to do it to my parents. I don't know if you just sue, like, I mean, I can just sue him and maybe I win.

You know, I'm more famous than my mom. Maybe I can convince the court to give me a little money to sell their house right from hundreds of them. I go, well, you know, they'll be homeless to go, well, but, but maybe, maybe, say, sarah, your honor. I need to build a skateboard ramp to shoot myself on. Imagine if I did that and I built like a skateboard ramp in my, I don't know where. I build it in some in some lot. I don't even know the house.

So I just build it next to someone else's house while they're on vacation. And they come back, they go, what is this? We're going to, you know, we're going to sue you. Why did you do this?

This is crazy. Are you trying to squat in our house? No. We're not going to let this state here. Like, yeah, probably not. I just shoot myself. That may mean wow. They were that's a one because they go from being like a real like you're a doctor not like a very wealthy person you make a good good living

you know you're a an osteopath. I'm not even sure what that is. Sometimes other kind of doctor. They make everyone everyone makes some money if you can but a lot of doctors don't make that much anymore. A lot of doctors get like you know have to go like work in urgent cares and they don't make a ton of money, especially when you factoring how much med school costs. I don't care. I'm not sitting here going let's fucking sort of charity for doctors. Don't get me twisted.

I'm just saying you make a little bit of money. You come home. You know, you went to, I don't know, where do people go? You went on a carnival cruise because you saw, you got drunk and you saw a fucking stupid

Drew Baramore and Orlando Bloom talking about, well, we got crump teas and crumpets. You know, maybe Maybe you come on this cruise and fucking forget that you fucking hate your wife, whatever. And then, like, you know, they go. And they come back, it was fine. There's a lot of fat people. Smelled, I don't know.

Maybe they smell good at these. I never been on the cruise. I wonder if they smell. Whatever. The point is they come back. They didn't love it. And I'm in their back fucking yard with a skateboard ramp. It's some weirdest thing in the world.

I imagine if that is not even like, that's not even close to what the situation is going be in about five minutes. You're like you're trying to process it. You're yelling and I'm just like very calm. No, it's fine. I didn't think you'd like the skateboard ramp. I see why you're mad. Don't get me wrong.

And you're going like, wait, so is this guy, maybe this is a guy who didn't do it? Maybe this is something kind of like his father of the person who did this. He's trying to, well, you're trying to process what's happening. This guy's very calm. He's telling us this is not correct. Maybe his son, he found out his son and built a, built a skateboard ramp

strapped hitlessly in someone's yard uh or in my or yard and now he's come to like i don't know do a lot maybe he's got money and he's going to take care of it it's not the case but i just what actually happens is i shoot myself god that's got that that's that's chilling

but not like you know oh like we're scared more like i mean you wonder i mean if that happens do you assume you're in some kind of like did like if that happens to you if a man I mean because it's not you know what's one thing where man to break into your house and kill himself that's crazy for a man to like

pay people because like you know you're thinking you need plans you need permits you need X Y and Z but not if I pay a bunch of people who have no stake in the game you know I pay a I don't know if they have to be illegal

they can be illegal immigrants they could be just I don't know what guys I mean I don't know maybe he's a bunch of guys you don't want to be bonded, right, to build stuff. There might be a bunch of guys. I'll pay you a triple what you normally... I'll pay a 10 grand each. Pay a 20 grand each.

To help me build this for me. You know, it's all my name. Fuck do they care. I'll pay for their fake IDs that they can carry around. Doesn't matter. It's all on me. I'm not going to be alive very much longer.

So it's whatever, right? You know, I get it done. And then they just don't know. I'm just saying you don't know what to make of it. Do you assume you're in like a horror film? Some kind of film. It's like a jackass situation, right? I mean, that's the thing.

We haven't really experimented with bringing jackass into the real world. Or these impractical jokers, right? Like, things are getting weirder and we're getting weirder in life. People are getting the throats cut over. Nothing. right people getting this shooting is happening all the time you know you you're in school and someone

shoots you and the cops you know it's like well just watching the cop the cop didn't even try i'm not saying all the time that happened right once i don't keep up with the news wasn't there a cop who didn't try at one of these schools very sad imagine if you were like you know you were like going oh there's a cop and then you get shot in the head you didn't even know he didn't even know he didn't try. Random life. Point is, but we're not really like

upping the whimsy. If we up the whimsy, I feel like there's something, there's something there's something there. We can maybe get like a, just like a wild situation. Like, you know, why, why have these suicide pods, for instance,

that they're always talking about? They're always talking about these like pods that you can go into and end it very calmly. But why not, end it with a lot of chaos maybe maybe that's why they can offer and I can't look yeah I has to phrase this very carefully I I much in the same way when you play Dungeons and Dragons I'm you know I can't play the game for you if I'm the inventor of Dungeons and the Dragons you know I'm about rolling dice for you

you're making your own character and you do but here's the here's the campaign or whatever the witches of Norfax all these witches of Norfolk's look at the look they're doing they're they're poisoning the well they're they're stealing a bunch of people turn them into into rats these which is the north some got to do something you got to do something about give me 20 bucks i'll give you this script i wrote and imagine they're living in such a time by the way where you could just sell horseshit like that and people are happy to pay it because there was nothing going on you're even a bunch of other fucking you know uh ex-cons get together and you play dungeon and dragons every Saturday.

Which is, hey guys, I put the Witches of Norfolk's. Like, what the fuck is that? This guy, 7-11 sold to me. He says,

this fact guy, 7-11, he said he wrote it, he worked for D&D. That's not, that's just a fuck that's written in a, you know,

marble notebook. What do you fucking are you talking about? How much did you pay him? Like, 20 bucks. That's a lot in this time. This is not, you know,

that's a decent amount of money in whatever time I'm fanzizing about the 1980s. you p you fucking idiot whatever i did you know i wrote some i i i gave him a scenario to play it was fun for him these these guys are like sex offenders or whatever it's not like he shouldn't feel ashamed like oh i mean if i was there i'd be like whoa whoa whoa whoa i wrote the fucking thing it's good i mean i didn't like pitch it to

wizards of the coast or whatever you know i didn't like go through their legal department i'm sorry i'm sorry a bunch of guys who fucking what did you do fucking kid and you're gonna get him indignant about me fucking not like it's not an officially licensed dungeon and dragons expansion oh you just fucking touched yourself with the park well either you're still breaking society's norms and laws who the fuck of you do that's the d i ruin them all over no book what you want me a fucking paper 1980s publishing we don't have they'll have like you know amazon you know per book whatever they call it you know print per book book per print whatever the fuck it's called

i gotta take out of the shit from you perves you fucking scum on the earth fucking i mean it's just it's a wild it's a wild time it's blah people are very upset about this um we'll get we'll get the we have the we have the we have the waxter thing we can talk about we have it means a lot stuff blah what is this Tariffs. Tariffs! Can you believe it? He said tariffs.

And I got to be before a court. Can you believe it? This is like men playing in women's sports, transgender for everybody. I have a new one to add. Voter ID. Sure. The Democrats don't want to give us voter ID because they want to cheat.

I mean, I got another word for you. Scligalbub. I mean, he's just fucking throwing out things here. I mean, that's why he's better than me at this. Because that was my fucking, you know, why don't you say squiggle bob? What's that even fucking mean? I mean, yeah, he isn't coherent.

He's losing it. But like, I'm just like, say squiggle bob. I mean, there is this levels to this shit. He is better at, like, you know, I mean, because he makes it look easy. I mean, right now he's making it, you know, if you look, he's kind of making it look a little hard. This is not the,

He looks a little fucking shot. He's not, he's not, he ain't casual here. But still, I mean, you know, tariffs, fucking tariff. I mean, the Supreme Court shut down his tariffs, I guess. And he, like, built them right back up. It's hard to figure out what's going on. Apparently, they've struck down a lot of his tariffs. He's like, I'll just make a different law.

Because they use one set of laws. Because it's supposed to be, but Congress is supposed to do this. And they can basically give all the power they have to him, they said. But they didn't, which I don't know if they would. Maybe they would at this point. But, you know, apparently, but being two hours later, it was like, well, you know, I found a different law to fuck with. So now we have 15% global terror.

I mean, it's a lot of distractions. He's going, he's going into Iran. He gave them 15 days notice. some 10 to 15. Who gives you 10 to 15 days and that was before they bomb you? That seems odd. But apparently,

even though we dropped like the, you know, fucking bunker buster, mother of all bombs, like almost a nuclear bomb to blow up their fucking facility in Iran for Israel, I guess. I mean, right?

We need to do it for us. I guess, you know, we can pretend we did, but okay. We missed or that doesn't work. You know, this idea, well, we make a bomb big enough. It could just blow through the floor. Again, I mean, I guess he could.

I'm not trying to say it never happens. But, I mean, it does seem like, I mean, it's not like when you walk, when the nuclear bombs in Hiroshima went off. It didn't like, uh, blow up the ground completely. Did it? I guess there was craters. But I mean, like the rocky ground stayed there. I guess the point was supposed to be that you're supposed to.

I think they're supposed to, like, make a hole and then shoot it into the hole. Was that the plan? It just seems like why we don't, we shouldn't already need to go into Iran. It seems weird. It seems, I don't know, is a distraction from these Epstein docks or the Epstein docs are the Epstein docs distraction from Iran? Does everything just work together now or not work together now? I guess.

It is very odd. There's a, what should I'm called? What is this? There is this, whether it's with your besties or date night, get to all the hottest concerts with Go Transit. Go connects to all the biggest entertainment venues and makes it affordable with special e-ticket fares.

A weekend pass offers unlimited travel across the network on any weekend day or holiday for just $10. A weekday group pass offers the same weekday travel flexibility. from $30 for two people up to $60 for $5. So no matter what day of the week, Go's got you covered. Find out more at go-transit.com slash tickets. The tariffs have, uh, okay.

The tariffs got knocked down, right? And then this came out that Trump's secretary silent as sons poised to make bank from ends of days. I mean, this is Yahoo Finance. You would think they would like, you know, just say money, but they say bank. Because, or it's a new republic. Make bank from the end of terms. Apparently, they apparently, Candor Fitzgerald, which is the firm that Howard Lutnik was from,

that found him. He was the CEO of, and he's short, you know, except for being here in the white, as the treasurer, the, was it the Commerce Secretary? He's, he was still, you know, it'll probably still be when he leaves. They were buying up, they were buying people's rights to get a refund from the tariffs. If the tariffs, let's see. In July wide reported that Karen Fitzgerald, which Lutnik chaired until he was appointed Trump's cabinet, was allowing its traders to purchase their rights to hundreds of millions of dollars of refunds

in the event the terrorists were struck down in court. the firm now happens to be headed by Lutnik's sons, Kyle and Brandon, which I'm sure they're good kids. The magazine cited a letter from the firm explaining how Canada or Fitzgerald was willing to exchange refund rights for 20 to 30% of what the competitors paid. So for a company that paid $10 million, they could expect to receive $2, $3 million in a trade. A Canada Fitzgerald representative wrote, we have the capacity to try. trade up to several hundred million of these presently and can likely upsize that in the future to meet potential of the man well that doesn't seem at all right it seems like inside trading it seems like worse than that somehow

because these like you know it seems like if I could like insider trading at least implies that like someone wanted a trade to happen but I feel like these tariffs um I guess there's guys who like you know work in the steel industry who tell Trump was saying that some guy wanted to kiss him I didn't get that clip but yeah there's a lot of guys talking about guys wanting to kiss him today and stuff like that but a lot of things interesting

last week he's been on a roll this is him last week you led people to believe that you had cut off all contact with Jeffrey Epstein probably about 10 emails connecting me with him over a 14-year period. I did not have

any relationship with him. I barely had anything to do with that person. Did you, in fact, make the visit to Jeffrey Epstein's private island? Which is like, you know, you would think that I'd be like, well, no, I didn't go to the island.

It's crazy. Like, I just said I had colorful contact from the island. Like, I lived next door to him. Maybe I ran into him. You know, catch me on that. You're not going to catch him to go to the island. You crazy? I did have lunch with him as I was on a boat on a family vacation.

Did have lunch with him as I was on a boat going across. I was on a boat. I mean, I was on a fucking boat. We're the board rules, you know? Ross on a family vacation. My wife was with me, as were my four children and nannies. There's also a reference to the fact that Epstein had expressed an interest in meeting your...

Nana. Do you know whether Jeffrey Epstein ever met with your nanny? No, I saw that. I had no idea. I know it was about. I had nothing. Why do you bring up the nanny? I also went with my nanny. You know, obviously wanted to meet your nanny. As far as I know. Would you, Mr. Secretary, be willing to ensure that the file is complete to share with this committee and the Congress, your own records, any records you have that relate to Jeffrey Epstein. Love his pause.

I will surely talk about that. Hadn't thought about that. I have nothing to hide. Absolutely nothing. Oh, yeah, sure. I didn't talk about that. So, we're going to that. I can't commit to being honest. I can't commit to

being honest. Look, I'd love to commit to just being honest and telling you everything I know and everything. But I got done to hide, but I can't do that. That's And a couple of days later, they were in the Oval Office. He's really been great. And Howard has built one of the great companies, Cantor Fitzgerald.

It was wiped out, completely wiped out, other than a few people left in Europe. And he rebuilt the company into a bigger, better company. Canter Fitzgerald is one of the most, absolutely one of the top companies on Wall Street stocks, bonds, trading. And he took that, I mean, he literally watched the plane go into the plane. the building, going to the World Trade Center. Amazing story. That alone is an amazing story. He was delayed because his wife insisted that

he finally, after years, take his child to school. So he took his child to school that one day because normally he would have been in the building at six o'clock in the morning. That's that business, right? So you owe your wife a lot and your child a lot, right? But his wife insisted

that he take his child to school. For five years he didn't do it. He was horrible. kind of a... What just remind me of something? But on September 11, luckily for him, Silverstein didn't go to work. Even though he had already scheduled a business meeting

in the North Tower, he found out that his wife had made an appointment for him at the dermatologist. The morning of September 11th, Silverstein was scheduled to have breakfast at the restaurant at the top of the North Tower. He canceled at the last minute at the insistence of his wife, Clara, who wanted him to go see his dermatologist.

That particular morning, my wife God bless her and made an appointment for me yeah she found a rash she found a rash you know what's the what's the problem

in the days after she noticed three men on top of a van posing for pictures with the towers burning in the background that's not that that's just something else

well don't worry about that that's nothing don't worry about that no this is a this is a thing I didn't when Lutthik

when it kept talking about Lundig I'm like you know I didn't even know who this guy was at first. I'm like, Lutnik, who's this guy, Lutnik? And then someone mentioned Cantraverse Gerald. I'm like, yeah, I mean, the guy's in the, can I remember this? I, I, I, the guy who were, the guy was crying on TV, like 20 years ago, whatever. Uh, this is.

Normally, you would have been in your office, uh, on which floor? 105th floor. On the 105th floor. And yet you didn't go in early that morning because of a critical decision. you made. My little boy, I have a five-year-old, and it was his first day of kindergarten at Harz Man, so

I took him for his first day at Big Boy School. And because of that, I was late getting down to the office. Right. The head of Cantor Fitzgerald, Harold Lutnik, just happened to be out of the... As he earlier... In talking to our insurance company,

our insurance company, CNA told me that they would... Well, they told our guy. They didn't tell me, and then they told me that they were willing to treat this as an accidental death, which means that they would double the policy for all of my victims upstairs and all of us. And so that added $35 million, $35 million to that group upstairs. But the sad thing is, so $35 million sounds like so much money. He's so excited.

He's so excited he got over on the insurance company or whatever. You know, look, fuck it. Make them pay. I don't care. But if you divide it by 700 people. It's only $50,000. It's not enough to... You crocodile.

I wonder who... Were they the ones who... Oh, someone shorted that fucking airline stocks. Couldn't have been them, though. Couldn't have been them. That's crazy. It just seems very odd. It's a very odd time.

You know, but like, you know, did he do anything? Look, he had lunch on an island. Leave him alone. All right. This is what, what's the big fucking, we're not here to indict people for being like, you know, good at finance, right? We're not here to indict people for getting, you know, for making the insurance company pay what they're supposed to pay.

And for, and for fucking, I'm not here to indict people for fucking, you know, capitalizing, protect. on information and kind of manipulating things. I can't accuse anyone of anything. But, you know, it's like, you know, oh, look, there's terrorists for the first time since, like, the 18th fucking hundreds. Holy fucking terrorists. What is this, the wealth of nations part two?

We got fucking tariffs everywhere. And then we got people profiting on the terrorists going down. It does seem a little. Now I'm thinking about it. How do you profit from, uh, It's not a Supreme Court would have to tell him, I guess, right? Unless you knew it wasn't going to pass.

Unless you knew, it was like, Supreme Court, it's like, well, what if the Supreme Court approves it? Like, don't have to approve. This is so dubious. What we're doing is so dubious. It's so unconstitutional. Which I must. I'm not an expert, but I mean, that's, you know,

that's how you would know. It's like, why don't we just, why don't we just take a bet on Pollymarket that, uh, no, the Supreme Court won't let me become a, the, you know, the Holy Roman Emperor of America. I mean, I go,

well, what if they approve it? I mean, they might, though. That's the thing they might in that case. They make me the emperor of something. It makes me a fucking, um, give me something to do. People are upset.

We'll get more stuff out. Well, you think you think these topics? I think it's not more topics to discuss? You think it's not more, you know, why don't you bring up this and that? I'm getting to it, all right? I'm getting to it. Yeah, much like Pam Bondi,

I'm a trash bag. I'm a Dow! This is Punch the Monkey. Look at this thing. Look at this fucking thing. He's got, they gave the Lucy sent me this thing, you know, this is a punch the monkey

and he's this monkeyed in Japan in some zoo. I guess his mother abandoned him because his mother's a piece of shit. We fucking didn't like. him he's something he's some kind of man ma bibuchin munchy or something I don't know I'm a moochkin munchy he's very cute and uh they they gave him the people at the zoo gave him this stuffed monkey to like be his friend because you know I guess the mother again just abandoned him like a crack head maybe the mother was on crack uh it's very adorable but the problem is that once

once the other monkeys got involved I guess they think he thinks he's you know better than them because he has a stuffed monkey because this is what goes down now look this this shit they're beating the shit out of this monkey they are fucking this monkey he's running to his little stuffed animal they fucking hate him I was right the loose I mean I'm not the only one I was like starting to think violent things I was planning things collecting money for guns uh because all sorts of you know and I don't I'm going to defend some monkeys on or what am I going to do? But other people have too.

And why can't you, you know, people are rallying together much more than they do, you know, for the Epstein. The Epstein stuff is very much like tepid, like, you know, is a hamming and hawing. But, you know, we all seem to want the monkey to do okay. Apparently the whole time, like, but here's the thing with the internet and the way all this shit works is a lot of the time, by the time you get mad about something, it's already over. because you get sent these manipulating videos this is the time so he has this is similar footage and he's got the monkey a baby macaque was a baby macaque a Japanese who went viral with his relationship with the stuff rangatangang

uh it's so cute it's so cute dewkeeper say punch his name is punch now seven months old was rejected by his mother I said all this before is him crying but now he's the recent footage shows things are finally looking up for him so he's hanging with monkeys these older monkeys are pretty ugly by the way he's like he's not gonna be cute forever punches been spotted climbing on the back of another monkey being groomed signs say he's finally in the middle to make friends we made a big fucking this is all

they want to distract you from the Epstein docks they invented punch the monkey to stop you from asking questions about you know why why why they didn't stop releasing you know It's still like three million documents left. They still, uh, you know, there's still a lot of fucking, uh,

questions to be asked. Uh, yeah, we get punched a monkey as a, and the Iran war as, as a, as a nice little distraction. And then we have all these people out there who seem like, whose whole thing is like questioning,

not just question, but like, basically, you know, if you look, I mean, if you, if you, if you look, at this, for instance.

There's a tweet from Bill Ackman, the activist investor who, I guess, if you look at his feed, he took some time off of promoting the Iran war. I'm not just kidding about that. I mean, this is everything before and afterwards, them retweeting people going, you know, we're going to blow these people up.

The Epstein files have reached the McCarthy era stage. Oh, it's McCarthy era. Okay. Where innocent people are being slandered. Who's in, what innocent people are being slandered, by the way? Noamski? I mean, I like numbs to you before, but you know, the guy, the guy's fucking going, like, hey, here's how you get away with fucking kids.

That doesn't make you innocent. It doesn't make you the world, I guess it's worst people. We need to distinguish between evildoers and those who appear in the Epstein files. You know, there's plenty of people who are in the Epstein files, and like, it's obvious that they're just in the Epstein files. You know, he's, he was a comedy shows all the time. No one's like sitting and going, wow, hold on. let's get the cast of the kids in the hall and put them in front of Congress because he wanted to see brain candy when it came out which I made that up but

whatever I'm just saying he liked he liked super bad we should fucking you know put Bill Hader in a fucking chair uh who appear in the Epstein files but have done nothing wrong I'm hearing of totally I'm hearing of totally innocent people be forced to resign from boards etc because their name of somewhere in the documents let's return to a world where people are presumed innocent until they are proven guilty all right i'm hearing of like you know them this is very odd behavior and we're going to see a pattern here i think i think a weird pattern to me um of just be i don't i'm not going to ascribe motive to this there's people out there are describing motive to these people uh who are you know doing this is

and you can decide that for you. I mean, but it's more, I'm more confused by it. It's just, all right. So, like, if you are just hearing about this, right? You haven't like run down the leads? Why don't you check it out first before you put your neck out basically saying this is all,

but what if those things happen to be true? Like, it seems to be a very odd thing where if we accept your premise that you're just, hey, I'm just trying, I'm just asking for a reasonable approach here. I'm just asking. asking everyone be a little bit, you know, more reasonable. They're a measured approach.

Like, yeah, that sounds nice, right? So, yeah, let's not get too overeated. Did you look into it? No. No, I just, I heard. I just heard some innocent people. I heard innocent people getting accused of being petiots. I heard.

I mean, this is McCarthyism. You know what I mean? It's the divide. between like your the evidence you're providing and like the degree to which you're trying to it's not just that like hey the worst of these Epstein things that you're hearing

I just want maybe you know calibrate some of you for expectations you know some of the most outlandish things may not be totally true we know let's not get ahead of ourselves let's take it one step at the time it's McCarthy error where innocent people are being slandered

and you provide no evidence but no even people to like prove it's just take your word for it that you heard I heard hey I heard some innocent people he's like hey we gotta do something about the mafia hey I heard some

the mafia helps some people so maybe uh maybe don't do anything just saying you don't want to be uh going off half cocked I heard I heard some things I mean, it's a, look, this is a, this was a reason magazine. Do you talk about how you showed up in the Epstein files? Oh, I want it starts like this.

Okay, so 2017 was the 25th anniversary of The Skeptic Magazine. So I thought, well, we should do something to kind of promote it or whatever. So I hired a PR firm here in New York to put on some sort of an event. And they said, okay, we're doing this public event and we need some celebrities. Who do you know? I said, well, I know like Richard Dawkinson, Stephen Pinker and some other scientists. They go, no, no, we mean real celebrities. Like, oh, okay.

Well, I know Deepak Chopra. And they go, okay, Deepak, that's a big name. He knows everybody. Yeah, okay. So Deepak came. It was fun. And I vaguely remember he said, it's okay, if I invite some of my friends. I'm like, yeah, I don't know anybody here.

So, yeah. So it turns out, as I found out a couple days ago, you know, some of those friends included Jeffrey Epstein and two guests, female friends or whatever. I have no idea. Two, like victims? Who are these people? two randos that's a thing

they're all acting like these guys women who were they we're gonna see in a minute people just go like were they just prostitutes everyone was the president they're just prostitutes oh Jeffrey absolutely

was just doing prostitution oh okay so what's the problem then why why you're dissoning yourself no they're not just prostitutes friends employees yeah whatever so that that was it

that that's the entirety of it But then, you know, this gets thrown around, like, okay, you're in the Epstein files. I will also admit, I'll cop to the fact that I'm in the Epstein files. And I'm in the Epstein files for a very specific reason that on a list serve that I guess Epstein was on, somebody had sent around a documentary or not a documentary, an interview I had done in 2011 about Bitcoin. So it's like I'm in the Epstein files. We're in a weird, bizarre club. Yeah, it seems like if that's true, you're probably fine.

Right? You go, oh, look, I happen to be the obscene. I know people who are in, they don't go, they don't start going. And you know what? Those girls have it common. They don't say that. Those girls aren't even victims. Never heard anyone say that, except for certain people. But not in the way that people talk about it. And at Skeptic, you had a fantastic article about, you know, one of the things. And this gets to this idea of your book about truth, you know, what it is, you know, how to find it and why is it important. it talked about this idea, which is everywhere now, that it's obvious and it's irrefutable fact that Epstein was Massad or was working for the Israeli government. At Skeptic, the author of that article kind of runs through, how did this come to become an incontrovertible fact?

Well, look, I mean, look, is it an incontrovertible fact? No. You talk a little bit about that because it eases us into the themes of the book. right so I mean one of the questions about Epstein I would never say it's an controversial fact it's you know we'll get that in a second how did he make his money you know where did all that money in power where did he make his money yeah because all the rich people here in New York apparently know each other

and they like he wasn't in our club so how do you know so there must be some Jewish money behind it or something or the Massad so you know that was a mean that started years all right so this is what I'm saying the bunking boils down like you would think they would have something look like just cook up some I don't know. It's almost come from their deep personal compass.

So, well, I'm saying to make sense. But even then, you would think, well, let me steal him in my own argument. I should have an irrational here. Well, I guess they, you know, people, they saw he had money and they go, well, you know, we don't know him, even though he had fucking tons of people knew him. So what's the fuck you're talking about? He does this whole thing. He wormed himself into like, shit.

shitload of people knew him. Like, you know, that was his whole trade was knowing people. But regardless, they go, oh, it must have been some, like, we don't know him. It must be some Jewish thing. And look, I'm just going to, I think the Jews generally, like, there's a lot of them who were good in making money in this. I mean, is Jeffrey Epstein the first Jewish financier? I don't know.

I mean, I didn't think so. I didn't think he invented that for Jewish people. I didn't think he was the pioneer. But you're right. It is lazy to say it's just Mossad. I mean, it's not anything ties him to like fucking Israel. Like, what would be the argument here? Oh, what is this?

What is this? Barack? Barack? Barack said he visited Epstein at home but didn't attend sex parties. Former Prime Minister defends relationship with accused U.S. financier, Oh, Jeffrey Epstein. He said he never saw any

women or girls during his time at Epstein's New York Mansion and Caribbean Island. Oh, he went to the island, too. Former Prime Minister Harrod Barack said he visited disgraced financier and Benjamin, but he never turned to the parties.

He was arrested. Oh, my God. Wow, this is very interesting. And then, you know, this came out the other day. What is this? Why is this one? The next one. Israel installed security at Epstein's Manhattan apartment for ex-prime minister, Barack. So that surveillance equipment that people were talking about, you know,

which was one of the things that tip people off to maybe, you know, maybe there's something here that it's not just him. It's not just his own, you know, sexual applicability. Maybe he's, you know, getting other guys, he's getting them for other guys. He's providing, you know, girls. He's trafficking. There's a little less surveillance equipment. apparently Israel put it in

But they're like oh well that's just because Barack Barack lived there for a while Well I don't know look if you're telling me You know Iahud Barack to Former Prime Minister of Israel I mean look When is Bill Clinton going to stay at my apartment What are we talking about? I'm just saying Stop acting like there's no connection

Except you know basically The Prime Minister of Israel lives with him And he's like he knows all these guys I mean like whatever I mean Shimon Perez with whatever other ones, you know, we're at the island on the plains. And that's not even the only, I mean, I'm sure

it's, you know, Matt, his fucking, the woman who, fucking Wexner says he, at one point he said, was the woman he's going to marry. Jeline, Jolene Maxwell, whatever the fuck? I don't know, it's always, was her dad fucking high-level msaga? Yeah. So I guess that, I guess that's why. But no, you're right.

It's just to the fact he's Jewish and he makes money in New York. which is very odd I agree so that's why you just assume a sard not because his co-conspirator's dad was a with a massage legend that's another deal with it right no no this is unrelated very odd guys these guys I mean

oh and then you know you have so that's the problem with the Epstein files you would expect in millions of documents there'd be some paper trail of how he was paid by the Israeli government or Mossad agent contacted him here. There's nothing like that. It's just these kind of brief. Are we talking about something?

One of the questions about Epstein is how did he make his money and you can find almost anything. That was a mean that started years ago. And then, you know, you'd have a file dump of three million dollars like his money. Like that was a mean that started years ago. And then, you know, you'd have a file dump of three million documents. People go in searching of a pattern. And you can find almost anything. just cues here and there

but in terms of negative evidence what should exist if X is true so if 9-11 was really an inside job then all those WikiLeak documents there should be some paper trail somewhere

from the Bush administration paying somebody to do this or that or plant the explosive there should be no you're right that's what makes it that rules out of any conspiracy all the evidence of you know about 9-11 vigil and guardian whatever the fuck. If, you know, the fact that the war plans were on the desk before we even went in, well, yeah,

and the fucking, you know, the prior knowledge. The fact, the FBI had these people in custody, they're surveilling them. Whatever. That's all bullshit because there's not, we don't have a receipt of George Bush fucking paying some guys up to plant the explosives, a fucking door dach receipt for some semtex. The fucking talking about? These people just, like, I don't know what drives people. it might just be being a contrarian and look i'm not not not contrarian right i'm not i'm not the least

confrontational guy who's ever lived i like to be uh outspoken from time to time but you know there's hills to die on and you would and these guys seem you know otherwise like maybe they're otherwise intelligent you would think they'd have uh if they didn't have a good reason they wouldn't put their necks out to be contrarian over like the worst thing you're like the worst thing you you can be the guy's like a proven like fucking child sex offender what are we doing here we're like we oh there's no there's no evidence that what he trafficked other people not well not yet we still have like three million documents not being released you would think i mean look we'll get to admit but you don't you think that would be the last thing to give you

if they if they're showing a pattern of not wanting to give you stuff and you're getting this people get this piss about the stuff they have given this I'll admit it's not as damning as it could be don't you doesn't that tell you what what was Occam's razor tell you about that hmm is Occam's razor really tell you that oh there was no reason to this is all just mass hysteria mass delusion is that really the Occam is that really the razor I don't know you hear people go when Occam invented the razor like he the razors the razor's the thing I don't know how it works I'm the science guys I always throw it just like a metaphor but they refer you as the razor it's very confusing there's guys like

yeah it was michael malice went on rogan there's so much there's what three hundred three million epstein docs if you are not as invested as some people you are a kid toucher you're covering for them why is he why is he got what's on his face why he's dressed like a fucking like start like star like star original star trek villain like the episode of star track track is he going or like a fucking devil's hockey game later? You want this to happen. You're complicit, retroactively somehow. Yeah.

And I can't make heads or tails. I don't think anyone's getting shit for like not, like not assuming the jerky means, you know, eating kids, which it might. But I'm just saying. And also, yeah, maybe maybe not. Maybe the jerky's a little, like, they say there's actually a chef involved and he was on some kind of high

protein diet. Yeah, maybe. It just mentions a lot. It does get mentioned a lot. plus a lot of it also this is the whole pizza thing which you know when pizza gate first came out you know we were discussing you know

at that point we were discussing the Franklin scandal and stuff and the pizza gate seemed a little more outlandish at the time you know it seemed like you know it was actually real shit but we're talking about this but now in hindsight it's like that kind of ping pong was a very weird place it's like

oh yeah but maybe the jerk he's not yeah I'm not like the guy saying that like you know but no one is I've never seen anyone like catch shit, we're not going for every element of a thing. I had Luke Rukkowski in my show, who's been a conspiracy. I'm not saying the negative way. Conspiracy guy for a very long time.

He spoke with Alex. He broke it down. Then I had Michael Tracy on my show, and he said, look, a lot of hysteria. I don't know who is right, who is wrong. But if I... That's Michael Tracy guy. This guy, that guy must be pretty reasonable then, right? That's...

We should look at Michael Tracy and see what he's going on. Maybe Michael Tracy has... the answers. Welcome. The billionaire philanthropist. What? Exactly. I don't know. I guess it's a good. A advocacy group for the press. Good for them. It seems pretty objective. It was, okay, let's start with Virginia,

and then we'll go back to 2008. Okay. Who is Virginia? How credible are her allegations? What are her allegations? Okay. So first and foremost, I'm really not exaggerating when I say she might be the least credible person who has ever walked God's green earth.

Wow, that's a really, that's a really, objective way to look at things, huh? This is Michael Tracy. Let's go back a bit of these bookmarks what exactly, what precisely was Epstein accused and convicted

of, in 2008, and how do those actual convictions relate to the charge that he was convicted of, quote, pedophilia? Well, this should be good, because this is actually a really instructive event.

It tells you a lot, you know, there's a lot of, well, back here. Okay, so there's something subtle here that I want to clarify. I'm happy, obviously, to get into the 2008 Florida conviction, but I wouldn't say that's actually the genesis of what might be called the Epstein mythology. To the extent that there is a genesis of what we might call the Epstein mythology, that stems from one single victim, which is Virginia Roberts Guffray, or I should say alleged victim or purported victim. If I ever slip up and use the word victim in this podcast without qualifying it somehow.

Everybody listening should just imagine air quotes. Right, or that seems to be the thing we should focus on is making sure we don't accidentally call someone a victim. That's the dividing line. Sure, no, this is very reasonable. These are just reasonable people. We're always getting a little hysterical with the Epstein thing. Michael Tracy's here to be very reasonable.

So the mythology stems from Virginia Roberts, Gouffrey, which is like a separate issue. which we can talk about now if we want to talk about the origins of the mythology. So mythology didn't start in a way. If you really understand, we can talk about 08 and the charge he was convicted of, which also, like, how they're framing that, by the way.

This beandering way of answering things is very interesting because it's like very much like, we can talk about that and the fact that he would, you know, how does that relate to the fact that he would be able to a pedophile? Well, he was charged with soliciting trafficking for purpose of prostitution and trafficking in a minor for purpose of prostitution. Now, famously, that comes on the heels of an investigation in which dozens of girls, ages 14 to 17, came forward or, you know, the cops with Palm Beach police, and told the police that they were. molested, rape, you know, sexual,

were compelled to give sexual massages to Jeffrey Epstein. I guess they were paid. Ages 14 and 17, dozens of them. I think there was like 60 altogether. There was a whole investigation. Alpsa, the Palm Beach wanted to pursue much more charges than what happened. Alex Acosta on behalf of the Justice Department came in and said, I basically made a non-prosecution.

agreement with Epstein, which he would plead, you know, he agreed to not, and where he would agree to a plea bargain from the state, the federal government wouldn't prosecute him, and he would agree to, they negotiated this with the state, he would agree with, you know, a reduced 13-month sentence and plea to these, you know, relatively minor charges relative to what they had the opportunity to charge him with. almost universally was considered an extremely lenient deal. So much of that Alex Acosta ended up resigning years later when this became, you know, known publicly. So yeah, it just seems odd that you go, well, what were the nature of what were they charged with?

And how does that relate to being called a pedophile, as if that's a suspicious thing to call him? like here's the thing I never understood no one's ever really questioned if he was a pedophile or not it kind of just came accepted and not in a way where it's like you really blow him my mind here

it's like if he wasn't a pedophile just off the bat like if you believe he killed himself why would he kill himself if he wasn't a pedophile you know if he was so innocent like if you were saying he's innocent in the charges that he might not be

sometimes sometimes he is they're going back and forth but like this is this whole premise of like maybe he wasn't really a pet these girls were you know of aid or some of them i mean he gets into the whole thing with you know well virginia jufre if she did have sex with pres andrew at the time would have been of legal age in england which is like we're getting to dicey terror i mean if that's even like it's also like it's not just one one like but you know but the point is it's very obvious things here, like where no one, not even Jeffrey Epstein pretended to be innocent of that. He might not, he might say, I'm not, I'm not part of a blackmail thing.

I'm not part of a trafficking thing to other men. Maybe he would have said that if, you know, if he wasn't suicided. But no one ever claimed he was like not a pedophile. So it's right. It's an odd line to try to draw. You know how, which way you'd like to go. Okay, let's start with Virginia.

and then we'll go back to 2008. Okay. Who is Virginia? How credible are her allegations? What are her allegations? Okay, so first and foremost. Essentially, Colman News guys, like, well, let's keep it just a facts, ma'am, you know?

Were the allegations? Lay it out. I'm really not exaggerating when I say she might be the least credible person who has ever walked. This is just not what someone who's like being very measured and logical talks like. I'm just something about throwing it out there. doesn't mean that what he's saying isn't and doesn't going to end up not being held up to logical scrutiny. But I just don't, it's not the moment.

If you're teaching a class with how to come off logical, I wouldn't suggest using extreme hyperbole and dubious, of dubious merit on top of that. God's green earth. I mean, the most, the least credible, think of it. I get that it's supposed to be hyper. I mean, I'm not sure how hyperbole is supposed to work. Like, hyperbole is, like, it's never, like, supposed to be something that holds up to scrutiny. Like, you know, you're not supposed to use hyperbole

in the court of law. We're in a journalistic setting where, like, it's a very sensitive topic. You're trying to convince people. And you can't just go, if I, if I call you out, are you just going to say it was hyperbole? It seems like this doesn't seem like the event. I'm not sure what, because you should must be on.

stream liar. I mean, she, everything this woman, her name must not even be Virginia, but Frey, right? Because there's people out there who just live completely fake lives, right? And, and defar people of billions of dollars and, you know, just have like, you know, there's people who have multiple families. They don't tell anybody. They're serial killers. The Zodiac killer. The BTK, isn't it?

The BTK killer had a family and his family didn't know. wouldn't you say he's less credible than Virginia Gufrey even if what you're saying even if there's like a reason even if what you're going to say is true but whatever I mean this is this is where they want you to be arguing about it's just this is this is why it just seems odd because you hear people you know you're people all just hysterical why don't you listen to a guy like Michael Tracy's a reasonable man

seriously it's stunning how integral she was because she's now deceased to the propagation of this Epstein mythology that's gripping countries around the world. I mean, I keep hearing that the UK government might collapse as a result of this. Obviously, it's all anybody can seem to talk about in the United States.

There are flare-ups in France, Norway, Australia. I mean, it's incredible. And... I mean, doubly incredible is that virtually no one has ever bothered to do a dispassionate assessment of this person's claims and whether they stand up to scrutiny. So the reason

why I say that she's the genesis of the mythology... It almost seems... I don't accuse anyone of anything. It just seems... It almost seems like it would be convenient for certain people, or people who want... Look, if people want it somehow, for some reason, refute this Epstein narrative on some level. It seems like it would be convenient if you could

just dump it all into this Gruffray basket and then, you know, act like Gruffray has no credibility. It seems like, you know, it almost seems like that could be a strategy someone came up with. I'm just speaking, I'm just using hyperbole here. I'm just being hyperbolic and saying, imagine if someone had a, you know, a strategy session where you go,

well, here's the damage control. Thanks to everyone for coming to this meeting. You know, we're going to, here's what we're going to go with. We're going to first pivot to everything goes into the gufrey basket, and then we just, just do fray is a lying, scoundrel and nothing she said she's dead so good target because she

can't come out and talk about it because she's dead and we won't just talk about why you know not the first suicide in this case huh not the first big suicide huh so I don't know

just say it just seems but let's let's get some facts though maybe at some point I'll say some facts that we can actually consider is that the I mean, mythology was not really... I mean... I'm a very measured person. I just keep using loaded words like calling him a mythology, right?

I just keep saying mythology 10,000 times. As if I'm a moron, I'm all. I guess it is a mythology. I mean, that's not an objective word, by the way. I'm just saying... I'm not implying that he has any motive beyond just not being good at logic. I'm not implying that he has any motive

beyond using the language of a similar language style of someone who manipulates people, clumsily as it may be. I don't know this guy. I mean, apparently he was into the Ukraine stuff on Twitter, you know, that was his beat before this for a while. I ain't got no stake in the game as far as Michael Tracy. I just don't, you know, I have no reason to doubt his sincerity. it just seems

like he kind of sounds like other people I've met in my life who were completely full of shit but that's just that's not his fault at full throttle or anything close to it in 2007-2008 when Epstein pleaded guilty to two state level prostitution

in Florida charges in Florida the mythology really you're going to leave out oh the very you're going to leave out that during the non-prosecution agreement came with oh oh oh wait wait What was it?

Oh, a blanket immunity, a broad blanket immunity for any potential co-conspirators? It's very odd. Very odd things for it to come with. We're not going to talk about that, right? They'll just shove it into anything, all right? That's just like, there may not be any solid evidence right now that we can, on paper, beyond the testimony of Guffray, who, I mean, you know, she did. there was a picture of her with Prince Andrew who she claimed she claims death sex with Prince Andrew

um um that fashion guy whatever it was like three or four people um Andrew paid her like $12 billion I think in this element right Prince Andrew $12 million dollars

and there's a picture of him with there with and with with with Julian Maxwell and it just you know she's on the flight logs it doesn't seem like she's the least credible person that you can poke some holes in other in certain parts of it maybe I don't know

I'm not I'm not I'm not here like I'm not her lawyer uh it just seems like if she's said that um um durshowitz yeah she recanted she were can't she did somewhat recant her Alan Dershowitz claim uh because I think he sued her for defamation

and she walked it back or whatever and said you know I may have been mistaken uh it may have been someone else you know, other than Alan Dershowitz, who I was thinking of. Which, look, I mean, look, that's not ideal from a credibility standpoint. I don't know where I, you know, I don't know if I modify it at all. And I go, well, like, the one sort of recant, which she didn't even say definitely which was wrong or lies.

Again, look, I'm getting sued for defamation here. It's not the kind of thing you can really prove that easily. I guess there's a picture with, you know, she has no picture with Dershowitz. And he's a very litigious man. Now, maybe Dershwin didn't do it. who knows my point is like this is what you do you factor it in you go oh all right well look

the hand your thing seems to be seems to be true as a conviction as as it were does it make her the least credible person who's ever lived the fact that she modified her statement about Dershowitz who happens to be the very litigious lawyers

suing her for defamation that makes her the least credible person in the world that mean we didn't we refute everything she said? We don't like take it a grand of salt. We don't factor it in and wait it with certain, you know, put a pen in that one. No, no, we just, gosh, she's just a big liar.

Big idiot liar. Made it all made the mythology up. All right. I guess that's how objective journalism works. I guess that's how you deal with imperfect information. If you just, you know, kind of really get really what seems very emotional about it.

For a guy who's against a story, it seems very emotional. He only arose far much later to give you an exact date. December 30th, 2014, when Virginia Roberts Coup-Fray had a court filing submitted on her behalf by two lawyers, Bradley Edwards and Paul Cassell, the former being one of the paramount, quote, victim lawyers throughout this whole thing who's become obscenely wealthy, of course, as did Virginia ultimately become obscenely wealthy. You know, mansion in an oceanfront mansion in Australia, palatial ranch estate. etc. But in the... All right, she got paid. Why shouldn't a victim get money?

Everyone else is getting money. Everyone else is getting paid. Prince Andrew has said... Look, he thinks it was wrong, or he thinks it, you know... What do you think? The royal family is just getting like, you know... And you want you just go to the royal family. Go, oh, you got sex with me.

Give me some money, governor. And go, oh, I guess he got us by the balls here. we what is like come on like they're not just making a deal for nothing not filing which really only became public

so much Andrew should be like why is he get like you know frog frog born castle or whatever the fuck not anymore like you got lost that shit you know for being the for being the fucking abuser

but you're mad because someone who got abused got some money it just see I'm not I'm not saying that you know just just start don't bring money left or right to anyone who says. That's not what happened. Is that what happened?

Did we get every crackhead on the street to start getting cash out of the Epstein's? I don't think this is. I think a woman who apparently Prince Andrews Thor was pretty credible. The next month, so we can probably date the mythology to January of 2015. He's given no information, by the way.

She introduces what have now come to be known or what would now be recognized as the foundational tenets of the popular Epstein mythology, which is that she claims that she was... Oh, by the way, say mythology a lot. We'll do the whole group of state thing, we put it in her basket, and we'd call her a liar, and say mythology. That would be nice. Again, I'm not saying anyone planning this.

Essentially trafficked as a child, sexually trafficked as a child to scores of prominent individuals by Epstein and or Galane Maxwell. She names two of those specific individuals, actually three, but two for our purposes are the most relevant. Prince Andrew and Alan Dershowitz, also Jean-Luc Brunel, the French modeling mogul. She claims that this was a blackmail operation of some kind.

Obviously, these claims are very vague, impossible to corroborate. well unless you investigate I mean look it would be hard to investigate a blackmail thing I mean here those hard drives they go missing right when they when they seize the there's a lot of murkiness with hard drives and surveillance

I might look it's possible that's not a surveillance up that's what a reasonable person might say I mean I feel like I'm maybe a reasonable person it doesn't it doesn't seem to say you know but I don't know I mean you have a guy who owns like a fucking private island he fucking multiple properties throws these but

known as like a fucking sex guy right or something he's like people can refer to his harems he's fucking throwing these parties everyone wants a good he's like with young women whatever he owns these planes he's flying those guys around he's got surveillance and the fucking thing I'm just saying he got he has this deal and entering his case I mean there's there was a report where basically I mean it's it's not official U.S. document, I guess. There's a journalistic report where someone basically said that, you know,

Acosta got the nod that, you know, hey, he's intelligence. Oh, forget about that, but that's just, that's just, forget about that. Now, I can't, I don't know. Can I corroborate every journalistic thing? No. But there was a report where somebody, basically,

that Costa was told, his intelligence, you know, just don't question too much. Now, yeah, I don't know. people going to pretend like, no, because he's Jewish. That's what, no. He's a Jew who makes money in New York. So, of course, he has to be a massage.

That's what everyone, that's, that's the claim. That's no one's claim. No one's ever had, that's no one's claim. That's insane. This is like that. I mean, you would think there's a little more effort for whatever purposes is. Even self-education. I want to be the reasonable.

I want to be the reasonable, man. The objective man who fucking stood up to the hysterical Epstein hysterics. You would steal, you would steal, man, your argument, like you just come up with an argument. There's actually, like, halfway valid. Lawyers who filed it were reprimanded fairly shortly thereafter for having accused, put the accusation against Dershowitz into the filing without doing... Well, I don't know anything about that, honestly.

It does sound like something. I mean, I wouldn't be surprised. I don't know, though. I wouldn't be surprised if George was made a big fuss because they couldn't, you know, and so he's on, you know, he kind of prompted that scolding. But whatever, maybe not. Maybe the judge was very offended. Who knows? It's like due diligence.

I guess someone might know, by the way. I'm not saying, no. I mean, you know, I don't know. And so, and also she says that in addition to Andrew Dershowitz and Brunel that there's this. undefined group of others to whom she had also been trafficked. We should really begin to this, huh? It was sort of an astonishing thing to see in a court filing

because that's not really according to the rules and procedures, but she says, Prince's Prime Minister, etc., also sexually preyed upon her as a child. Now, it's caused a bit of a firestorm when it was publicized by the media. Look, even if she did overclaim, right? Like, the prime minister, I mean, okay. But Andrew, like, Andrew settled her for $12 million.

Like, we were dealing with, they're like, oh, okay. And a lot of the stuff, she, she, like, not everything she said, shelled with all the other, you know, victims. A lot of the other, you know, some of the victims they used in, in the case in,

I guess Maxwell didn't claim they were trafficked other people. You know, it's not like they have everyone. I'm willing to accept maybe, maybe it was on the people, but the idea that, you know, we're like, you know, the fact you think there is makes you a fucking maniac, but whatever. But then,

but then why? Are we, are we acting as if nothing she says can be bullied? You know, is she the only fucking person who's ever been a witness to, you know, in a case that has some, that has complications? Do we, do we question why Sammy the Bull? What Sammy the Bull says in the mafia case?

And that's actually a case where it's a guy who was like, complicit in the crimes and has like motives. He's like, all the time we deal with these people who are like actually part of a criminal enterprise and they flip very self-servingly. By the way, Jeffrey Dipson didn't flip. He didn't fill with anybody. By the way, you would think, oh, maybe he got that deal

because he flipped on someone or he cooperated? No, he didn't cooperate at all. He fucking didn't give him anything. There's nothing to give, you know, that's usually why people get better deals, right? Why would you get such a lenient deal? I mean, the little leverage they have. If he had good lawyers.

Yeah, these very good lawyers. Like Dershowitz and other people, very elite lawyers. You know, it's a factor. You would think, though, it's like if you, if you, it kind of tells you that it probably wasn't an overblown case, huh? Because if you had these great lawyers, if you didn't do anything, and you have these great fucking lawyers.

and you're going to serve 13 years 13 months in jail and you're innocent no about your billion almost almost a billionaire you're going to spend 13 months in jail for nothing who's doing that deal this is not like this is not the fucking the proof right this is just like let's just look at irrationally there's not proof of any it's more like let's not pretend like this idea we're going to like subtly try to like downplay these tries to charges in 2009 and like through semantics trying to just kind of gradually make them seem you know smaller than they were no they were fucking this is like a the deal he got was a it should I mean Jared Fogel did much less and has got 15 years the same in 2015

but it really gained traction as the years went by and the mythology sort of bloomed right There was almost virtually never any real corroboration for any of those stories. But it was bewildering to me, or not, I shouldn't say bewildering. It was maddening to me that when her posthumous quote unquote memoir came out last October, it became an instant international bestseller, Walde Ball Media coverage in the UK, the U.S. You name it. Every airport I've been to in the past few months. They seem bitter about it.

Like, why is her book doing well? I mean, I don't want to describe it. I'm not a body language expert, but they seem a little pissy about the fact that their book is selling well at the airport. Yeah. I did a review of that actually for unheard at the time, my own subsect.

And nobody noted except me that I'm aware of that the quote-unquote memoir that was produced by a ghostwriter was mostly a carbon copy. with some cosmetic adjustments of a prior memoir manuscript that she had generated back in 2011 and 2012, where she made all kinds of salacious claims against all kinds of prominent people, accusing them of committing sex crimes against her, that she later had to concede, or rather her lawyers had to concede on her behalf,

that she, quote, fictionalized the whole, the memoir. Now, here's the thing. Again, this is like, you know, you go, oh, maybe he's just mistaken. That's a reasonable man. He's an objective man. He's just mistaken a little bit. He's a little mistaken. But this seems like a weird

distortion. If you didn't do it purposefully, you'd wonder how you'd do it at all. Because what really happened, no, I can't find any reference to the idea besides him saying it, that it's a carbon copy

of this other manuscript. But the reality is during her case, it was 2016, I believe, this can't you know they the opposing side tried to bring up forward this this uh like it's the defense tried to bring forward this uh manuscript as like some kind of uh impeaching evidence that you know well she she you know this is the version of her manuscript to you know her story that she told and it's uh these facts are all wrong and you go no this is something she'd written look She wrote a fucking fake people do this

It's not an unknown thing She wrote a fictionalized Account of her story She has her reasons whatever Or fucking publisher or more I don't know This is not disputed She was pitching it to people as a fictionalized version of the events And then they try to impeach her and then you know

The trial still went forward To my understanding it was like if this was impeaching everything This would have brought didn't seem to work. The judge didn't seem, you know, is, this is, this is, but that's what this, what, no one tried to pass it off as an actual,

it's not like she wrote this, like this version, draft one of her memoir, and it's all these lies or whatever. And apparently it wasn't even that much of a, we have to like, you know, go side by side and read them side by side and they get the distortions of it. But apparently it wasn't even that, like, this overstayed how, how, what was changed.

It's like the time and, the timing and the location of where these sexes crimes happened, which is like, all right. I mean, but this is not as if she wrote a draft and then, you know, came forward and was like, well, this is, I have draft three and like, well, this is these are a lot. Well, that's just, no, no, she was pitching this as a fictionalized account or whatever. I've seen these before. I've never forget what she wants. People do this.

So, like, it's just, you know, when you go, was that in a vacuum that hurt or not? I don't know. Like, me, I, you try to use it. it as it hurts her it's it's she she got she got she got she got shit for getting paid for an interview she claimed she didn't know it was a thing you don't get paid for interviews I honestly but I heard that I go I wasn't sure if I knew that um I'm I can definitely see how you can use that against someone I just wouldn't know if it was you know I assume when people do these interviews though I assume a lot of them are getting paid but

maybe not but you know what are we are we going to like kind of wait these things kind of no she's just a liar a lot a lot biggest liar ever lived Okay. It's very misleading. It's not that you don't believe. There's reasons. I don't know. We're going to distort.

These are very easily refutable distortions. So, you know, good guy, really reasonable guy. So it just seems like a strange, you know, this week when we have a lot of people in Europe, in England, we're getting, you know, some comeuppance. Other people are very upset that anything is happening, I guess. I don't know. we're we're there's too much it happens we got slow down the Epstein thing too much too fast it's you know it's been it's been what 10 years longer i'm just saying like we how long how long

go that he quote-unquote kill himself and we just do we have to read the are they just assuming that we've all forgotten the litany of the of the of strain of fuckery every step of way all the cameras are off oh yeah no that one cell oh wow oh that's crazy huh i mean it's just it's it's laughable it's like the guy we all were joking about is he gonna oh is he gonna get suicided oh shit he did oh the other cameras don't work okay i mean it's just it's it's it's a very i mean i guess it's just it's just you know at this point you just got to throw sand in the air well the walls closed in it would like to think so i we'll see what we'll see happen i just you know i just i want people to be reasonable uh reasonable all right well thanks

so much for tuning in uh you can check out more on the patreon is patreon patreon.com slash ray cump and we do an extra episode every week even when we're uh you know even when the the youtube show whatever is in the on that week we see every week is on the patreon so that's yeah whatever i'm just saying that's that's a nice thing um thanks so much for tuning in and you know stay uh stay safe and uh hope we don't go the war and have a good night