Kyle Kingsbury Podcast - #103 John Hackleman

Episode Date: August 23, 2019

John Hackleman is martial arts veteran who has worked and trained with some of the world’s greatest champions. He's the founder of the Pit. The creator of the Online Pit Dojo membership site and a variety of martial arts video training courses. He hosts a weekly Podcast called "Pit Master & The Doc" and is very active everyday on Facebook Instagram and YouTube. We travel to his home and get to know MMA legend Chuck Liddell's coach first hand.    Connect with John| Website: https://john-hackleman.mykajabi.com/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/pit_master?lang=en Facebook : https://www.facebook.com/ThePitMaster   Show Sponsors: MindBullet https://mindbullet.com/kingsbu (Use code word KINGSBU at Checkout for 20% Off)    Waayb CBD www.waayb.com (Get 10% off using code word Kyle at checkout)   Onnit Foods & Supplements Get 10% off all foods and supplements at Onnit by going to https://www.onnit.com/kyle/   Connect with Kyle Kingsbury on: Twitter | https://bit.ly/2DrhtKn Instagram | https://bit.ly/2DxeDrk    Subscribe to the Kyle Kingsbury Podcast Itunes | https://apple.co/2P0GEJu Stitcher | https://bit.ly/2DzUSyp Spotify | https://spoti.fi/2ybfVTY IHeartRadio | https://ihr.fm/2Ib3HCg Google Play Music | https://bit.ly/2HPdhKY

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Give it a try at on it.com using code word kyle at checkout for 10 off today's guest is an amazing dude john hackleman john hackleman i think is best known for being the ultimate corner man and coach to chuck liddell who is arguably one of the greatest fighters in the history of mixed martial arts and maybe the history of fighting in general. But John Hackleman has a wealth of knowledge in all things martial arts, and he's a pretty fucking funny guy. I mean, I got to know Coach Hackleman by training with Chuck a couple of camps as I was coming to the end of Chuck's career and, of course, tail end of my career as well. Just a phenomenal guy, somebody that I really

have grown to love and appreciate. Every time I'm with him, he puts a smile on my face. Every time I'm with him, he makes me laugh. Apparently, his mother has some pretty funny sayings, which we'll dive into in the podcast. But I know this is going to be one that you guys absolutely love. A couple of ways you guys can support this show is one, subscribe. Two, tell your friends about it and leave a review. That helps other people see this show and gets those numbers up so we can get to more and more people out there like yourself. And finally, of course, support our sponsors. We have an amazing sponsor today, MindBullet, which is a premium tea capsule. It comes from Southeast Asia,

and I believe the species name is Mitragina speciosa. There we go. Finally got it. It's probably one of the best things I've ever taken to support mood, energy, and just help me grind through a tough day. It's absolutely essential on road trips. I take it often. I'll have one first thing in the morning with my cup of joe and I'm rocking and rolling. It's great pre-workout and it's great pre-work. I'm not working out as much as I used to. I am working a lot more and I'm traveling a lot more for work. And this has been one of the things that I keep with me at all times. You can go to mindbullet.com slash Kingsboo for 20% off or just enter code word Kingsbu at checkout for 20% off at mindbullet.com. And another great sponsor that we have is Wabe. I've searched high and low for the very best CBD

on the planet. And these guys are fucking it. They are a 100% USDA organic product, organically grown hemp from Colorado straight to your door. This stuff is fantastic. I've given it to my son. I give it to myself.'ve given it to my son. I gave it to myself. I gave it to my wife. It is incredibly good. It has none of the nasty, harsh chemicals that you'd find in an inorganic hemp, in industrial hemp. And it certainly doesn't have the solvents and nasty things that are used to derive some of the best CBD on the planet from hemp. They use a 100% CO2 extraction process, leaving none of the nasty stuff in and only the good stuff there. I use it for inflammation. I use it for sleep. I take it first thing in the

morning and right before I go to bed. And I think it's an essential piece of the lineup in my supplement cabinet. Go to wabe.com, that's W-A-A-Y-B.com and enter code word Kyle for 10% off. And without further ado, John Hackleman is on the show today. Let's go. We've been clapped in a second time and I don't know that I can accomplish the intro that I just gave you, but I'll try. I'm here in your house, Coach John Hackleman, the pit, the pit master, even though you've been recently given a different moniker from our friends across the water in England. Wow.

Yeah, I have, but I'll stick with the pit master. Thank you very. Wow. Yeah, I have. But I'll stick with the pit master. Thank you very much. All right, that works. Welcome to my mi casa, su casa. And this is the pit. This is actually our, it's like a little storage room,

but it'll do. And this is where I do my podcast, which is, I'm humbled by this one, but we're here. Give me a title. What's your title? It's called Pitmaster and the Doc. And we talk about everything, everything.

Everything from politics, not much, to UFC, MMA, martial arts, fitness, to orthopedic surgery, because my partner is an orthopedic surgeon. Very cool. You guys cover a lot of ground. We do. Well, we have a lot to cover today. And I know, obviously, you've been on many podcasts before. So my apologies to the listeners that have already heard of you and know some of your backstory. I want to get your backstory. I was recently out in Hawaii hunting, and you grew up there, and you had long, curly blonde hair as a

skinny Howley and I want to know how yeah how that went let's get some of this the foundations of what led you to be one of the best coaches in MMA and a true martial artist I grew up thinking Howley um I didn't think it was Howley growing up I just thought it was fucking Howley because that's what I just heard. I always heard fucking Howley. It was like fucking Howley, go back to the mainland. Fucking Howley, give me your lunch money. Fucking Howley, what are you looking at? What fucking Howley, like beef.

So I just thought, I thought they were one word, fucking Howley. But now I find out they're two actual words. They were being rude. I just thought fucking Howley was what they were being rude i just thought fucking holly was what they were calling me and this was by my teachers i actually i can't swear to you i have been called fucking holly by teachers damn growing up i got punched by a p teacher i'm not gonna name him because i'm he's passed

away since then uh i was probably being a smart ass at the time but to get punched in seventh grade and being called a fucking howley is just it's a little bit much i don't think it would be i think it's uh i don't think it'd be tolerating as much now as it was then but so it was tough growing up back back in uh honolulu hawaii um like it's not like you could say you know south central la they weren't drive-by shootings even though my next door neighbor did get hit their house got shot once i remember that it was like fucking midnight i remember just diving under my bed but they were kind of into bad things, and their house got shot once. But anyway, but it's tough.

So it's not like drive-by shooting tough is beat the fuck out of you tough. There's fights galore in Hawaii. Locals can fight. I think locals that grew up in Hawaii can fight better than any other culture in the world. They just have a natural affinity for fighting. You know, it's not, they're not shooting. They're not stabbing. They're just putting up their dukes.

You watch two like third graders fighting in the schoolyard. You're thinking you're watching a full on UFC fight. These fucking kids can fight. It's like they're moving. So it's a very fight-oriented culture. When I was growing up, they didn't really respect money or brains, but they did respect the tough guy.

And for whatever reason, good or bad, I didn't grow up in a ghetto. I grew up in a very, very tough neighborhood. I mean, you just got to look at the two square miles in a ghetto i grew up in a very very tough neighborhood i mean you just got looking at the two square miles of the people i grew up with including israel kamaka vivioli if you ever heard of him brother is the really big fat guy that's saying he died oh yeah yeah brother is he was he went to school with me i grew up with him him. He's my age. But I mean, it's a tough, tough neighborhood. But for some reason, instead of like being the Howley guy that hung around with the other Howley guys and we had our own little safety place over here and they usually serve, smoke a lot of pot

and stayed out of the locals way. And when they were looked at by a local, they would, you know, they would avert their gaze and not look back at them. I don't know why, but for some reason I went the other way and I hung out with a tougher group. I started boxing. I started training Kajikempo and I started looking back at how locals, and when they said, what are I looking at? You know, what the fuck you looking at Howley? It would always be me saying something back like you i don't know you know it's smart something smart ass back so it's caused a lot of fights um and and i started training at a very young age in kaju kempo which is a system which was created in hawaii in 1947 have you heard of it kaju kempo it was formed for these locals kaju kempo karate judo jiu-jitsu kempo and boxing kaju kempo it was formed by these local guys in a rec center so they could beat up

howlies no i'm serious it was started in the 40s like 47 actually 1947 and these local guys that wanted to beat up the howlies down on hotel street which is the kind of place where everybody went for bars and stuff it was downtown um honolulu and the locals wanted to beat up the howlies the the the the military guys because they were like hitting on their chicks and they would go to their bars and stuff like that. So they started training this system, karate, judo, jiu-jitsu, and kenpo, and they would put those systems together. And it was kind of like our first actual MMA, kind of. But it was made for the street.

So I started training. That's kind of ironic that I started training with this system back in 69 or 70, 1969, 1970. And I had a really, really tough instructor by the name of Walter Goodine. And Walter Goodine had spent in and out of prison most of his life. And he was just this tough, hardcore guy that sold drugs. And he was strong arming. and he was doing protection rackets all over town. But he had a little like it was about the size of this room, which is probably 600 square feet. And this was the size of his gym. And I walked in at 10 years old because I didn't want to get the shit kicked out of me on Kill Holiday. So I walked into his gym. I looked in the yellow

pages. I found this place I go okay I'll check that out it was two bus rides I had to transfer and uh I went in I walked into this room and I just looked around I was like I just I found my I swear to god I remember like it was yesterday I was like 10 years old but I remember it's like it was yesterday I walked into this room there was a heavy bag a couple of makiwaras, and my instructor sitting behind the desk, big local Hawaiian guy. And I just remember thinking, I just found my home. I'm going to fucking spend the rest of my, this is me. So I started training and he toughened me up like that. And I went from, you know, being timid, looking away from locals, you know, being scared to go to school, you know, give me your lunch money. I

would give him my lunch money. But within like a year of training with Walter Goodine, I was like, I wasn't taking lunch money, but nobody, nobody was getting my lunch money i didn't look away from anyone um i was that guy i was like you know i was this fucking skinny howdy kid but i wasn't gonna take shit from anyone anymore i never did since then and and i i think it was all because of martial arts training i mean hasn't it hasn't it uh changed your life doubt. I mean, I didn't grow up with martial arts. Wrestling technically is a martial art. It very technically is. That for certain changed my attitude.

I got picked on a lot because I was tall and very skinny. I looked like I was a couple of grades older than I was. So a lot of older kids would pick on me and bully me. And again, I didn't grow up in the ghetto similarly, but the Bay Area can have some hard-nosed places and I'd get chased down. I could either outrun them or I'd have to turn and fight. Yeah. That was the case a lot growing up.

So you wrestled from what age? 13 through junior high through high school. And that definitely gave me a different. It definitely did. I remember. Because it is a martial art. Wrestling and boxing are martial arts. So you learn the respect, you learn the discipline,

and you learn how to kick ass. Yeah, and to be in shape too, like to the point where you put yourself through, as with any good martial art, you put yourself through the grind to a point where you realize, like, there's nobody else that's doing this shit outside this room right now. You know, like there's something special that's happening in shit outside this room right now you know like there's something special is happening in here is there a better feeling no there really isn't like like i remember it so well because i remember the day that i was in junior high school comic

intermediate uh rough school full surrounded by really really rough people. I mean, when I go there now with my wife, she's just like, you grew up here? What the fuck? But it's a nice place. It's not like ugly or anything. But I remember a guy named Daryl Silva, and I'm actually putting a different last name in because I don't want to show disrespect.

But he was the big tough guy at school, and he was like one grade older than I was. And he told me he wants my lunch money. I was like, lunch money was a quarter back then, guys. It was a quarter. He gave a quarter to the to the cafeteria lady and she gave you a plate of food. And he fucking Holly, give me a lunch. I was like, no, fuck you.

And next thing I know, there was a fight. And the fight got broken up within like five seconds. Teachers broke it up. You never got in trouble back then. They just said, get back to class. And he goes, you fucking Holly, I'll fight you. Monday, I'll meet you at the back campus at 10 o'clock. And I remember that.

I don't know how, but I said, all right. And that weekend, I remember training really hard and thinking oh man this week you know come Monday you know this is a big big tough guy of school you know so come Monday he we met at the back campus at 10 o'clock fucking place was surrounded with people and I just thought the choices I've made in my life that's one of them because if I didn't show up, I'm a punk. If I showed up and punked out in the fight, I'm a punk. If I showed up and tried my hardest, I'm not a punk, but I'm not quite here. I actually showed up.

We started fighting. I remember a roundhouse kick landed. I remember somebody, one of his friends obviously said, hey, you can't kick. I was like, fuck you. I remember that on the street. Yeah, I was like, fuck you. So I beat him and he was bleeding. And I remember the teacher came, broke it up and I beat him. He was defeated. And I remember I never looked back and nothing ever was the same again in my life. Nothing. I looked at people a different way. They looked at people a different way. They looked at me a different way. I walk with a different shoulders back. I mean, and this followed me

throughout my life. That one fucking morning on that Monday at 10 a.m. and nothing ever was the same. When I went to basic training, I carried myself in a way where even the drill sergeants were like, hey, do you mind doing push way where even the drill sergeants were like, hey, do you mind doing push-ups? I mean, if you want to, you can. While they were yelling at him, well, you fuck. I swear to God this happened. You son of a fucking bitch.

I'm going to kick your asses. Except for you, Huckleman. And I was thinking, and everybody else was like, what the fuck? And I was like, the confidence you get from martial arts which which wrestling kajikempo karate boxing they're all martial arts and they give you a confidence that you just walk around look out fanny pack i wear a fanny pack i wear my geese i paint my toenails i mean we do goofy goofy things because we can and people and and the confidence we have is is it's it's so good it feels so good to be confident even at our you know my age and your age i mean and it's it's i don't know there's nothing better in life than walking around knowing you're wearing a fucking fanny pack when nobody's gonna say a fucking word or, or, or walking into a club and just having fun with everyone.

And like, Hey, giving everyone high fives and shit. You don't have to look away from anyone because they look too tough. And it's awesome. Isn't it awesome feeling? Good feeling. Yeah,

it fucking is. I love it. I love being a martial artist. I can't, I, is this, is he a martial artist? I think he trains jujitsu.

Yeah. You got your blue belt now. All right. Almost. Almost. Okay. So he has, he has think he trains jujitsu yeah you're getting your blue belt now all right almost almost okay so he has he has he's pseudo confident but anyway i'm kidding i'm kidding but anyway so that changed my life for good um and i i had really bad feelings about hawaii like when i left hawaii to to pursue a boxing and then you know kickboxing career and then i went to college and became a nurse, respiratory therapist, and other things. But I always had this feeling about Hawaii where I held a grudge like, fuck you guys. You didn't like me. You made my growing up tough there. Fuck you.

So my ex-wife, hey, let's go visit Hawaii. I go, no, I'm not going to Hawaii. Fuck Hawaii. And I felt like that for a while. Then I went back for a for a reunion once a martial arts reunion and i just remember thinking oh shit i like it here you know it's like so we go back we go back and promote every year now that's where i do my black belt testing every year in nove. Yeah. And, uh, the pit Ohana, where's that located? The pit Ohana. Um, the pit Ohana is, um,

is our, is all of us. Okay. It's just all of our gyms, all of our, all of our gyms, all of our online, uh, students.

It's just Ohana means family. Right. So Ohana means family. So anyone that's in the pit, we just, we consider them pit Ohana. And then you guys all meet up the pit the ohana family all meets up once a year for the promotions we do and we go there and and my you know my older black belts come my my new black belts and we do promotions for the people going from brown black belt to a black belt and i take them

through some of my old neighborhoods. We do running the hills. We go to my old boxing gym, Palolo Boxing Gym. Great boxing gym. We go there and we spar in the ring. And it's kind of a pilgrimage or just kind of a ceremonial more than anything. And we just go back and they get to see how our system Hawaiian Kempo was formed. And it was from me growing up the way I grew up.

Bing. Bing. Love it. So let's, let's get into some other shit. You talked about a fanny packs. I found it curious when I was, when I was training with you down here that you,

you, at least you used to always keep a gun in your fanny pack. Yeah. And I'm like, well, wait a minute you're you're chocolate else coach you're usually with chocolate l you're also can handle yourself for damn sure like why do you needed a gun like i just said it was foreign to me

though the fanny pack um the fanny pack i've been doing since we went to japan and i fought there in like 90 or something 89 and they were wearing fanny packs and i love that custom i love having and i always wear a gi um so i always had to wear a fanny pack because i don't have a pocket and and i carry a gun because i believe uh i believe in keeping everyone around me safe and and and i. And I've been jumped carrying my gun. And I've never used it. I've always used my hands. But needing a gun and not having it is much worse than having it and not needing it.

My mom always told me that. What else did your mom tell you? My mom was a very wise woman, is a very wise woman. And she taught me, me number one you can never have too much mayonnaise she loved mayonnaise she just put it in her fucking hair it's like she oh it'll make it shiny so she put mayonnaise in her hair i love mayonnaise i eat mayonnaise i had mayonnaise last yesterday with my fried chicken i just i put mayonnaise on everything you can never have too much mayonnaise. Okay. You can never unsuck

a cock. You have to know that because it was a wise, it was a wise, it was wise words from a wise woman because sometimes you're in a position, you know, like, I don't know, you could be like, it could be a lonely night. It could be, you're in a prison cell. It could be, it could be a lot of reasons, but that's one of these decisions that once you make, you know, to do it, you can't take that back. Yeah. Like it's with you forever. It's with the, I could, I could like hit someone and then like pretend that didn't happen. And I can, I could, I could get away from that. You know, I could write something. I could erase it. Right. I could video something. I could break the video, all right?

But once you suck a cock, it sucked. It just fucking sucked for good, right? And the other thing she taught me was really good was she said, if you ever need a gun, right? You ever need a gun, think of this. If you have a gun with you at all times and don't need it bing there's nothing wrong with that but if you do need a gun and you don't have one good news is you'll never need it again bad news is it's because you're fucking dead yeah so it's it's i mean so i think it's a really important right that we do have as americans um i've been a felon. I've never been in trouble. And I fit the category for any kind of gun, you know, background checks or whatever, you know, serve my country, you know, never. I've never even had a misdemeanor, for God's sake. So,

you know, I do believe in being safe and providing safety for my ohana around me. So I've never had to use it. And like I said, I've been jumped with it on me and I've just gotten out with my hands. But if I was jumped with someone with a knife or maybe a gun pulled on me, then I would have, I could take it to that limit, level if I had to.

Yeah, and I think Sam Harris talked about this when, I don't know, one of the big mass shootings that happened. And he wrote a big article on this, on gun laws and just, you know, really went against the grain of what everyone thought he was going to say. It said like, it is, you are a clown. And this is me paraphrasing in my own words, but how I read it was, you're basically a fool to think that police will arrive in time in a situation where you need to have a gun. There is no level. And you could be the best self-defense in the world.

You can't stop a bullet. Right. So to have something at least there, like that is the ultimate protection. Cops are going to show up in like 15 minutes. You're done. To be honest, I love cops. We cops we both do cops are fucking heroes in my book um but there's only like one cop for every like fucking 2500 people so they can't be there for every single one of them and you're your own 911 call we are our our own 911 call. Where I live, I once called the cops

because someone was on my property, and for a split second, I thought I saw a gun. So I called the cops, and I said, I got a person with a gun on my property. Can you please get your ass over here? And I ran in and got my gun and just waited in the house, right? I timed it from the time I called.

It took them 29 minutes to get there, okay? Now, I love the cops. I love sheriffs in our county, and I do live way out in the boonies. So even more so, I need a gun where I am. But in the street, in the cities, the average time is right around 10 minutes. And in 10 minutes, do you know how many times you can get punched in the face in 10 minutes?

While you're unconscious on the ground. You could get stomped. You could get stomped. Check this out. You could get stomped 822 times if you're on the ground unconscious. Okay. You can get stabbed 3,000 times within 10 minutes, okay? That's by the time,

from the time you call the cops till they get there. You could get shot 922 times by the time the cops get there, okay? So you are your own 911 call. And as much as I love cops, I respect cops, there's just not enough of them to go around and we have to accept the fact that we are our own 911 call and if you have a gun and you never need it thank god for that but if you do need it and you don't have it you're fucked and I'm not gonna

say you're a clown but you're fucked you're fucked and your family's fucked and let me just tell you this if you're fucked in front of your family right like if you get the shit kicked out of you because you don't know how to fight in front of your wife she will never suck your dick the same again bang do you agree no she'll look at you like you get your ass kicked and you're gonna she's like don't i thought guys knew how to fight that's like girls know how to put on makeup and shit put on fucking nail polish and they knew how to do other things okay but a guy should at least know how to fight so like if she's with you and you get your ass whooped in front of her she's like what the fuck am i with this fucking bitch she'll never suck your dick the same again she might like do it like say oh it's okay honey it's okay just the tip it's all hand at that point

we've got some good stats here i don't know where it was i think it was a meme on instagram uh where it said the average it wasn't a meme it was some study published maybe rogan was the guy that put it on the gram that guy's the idea is a genius fucking genius the average person who has been in a street fight thinks they are three thousand percent more effective than they are that's not trained when they're right when the first fight happens yeah yeah like they think that they're that much better yeah i think they're so much better than they actually are yeah right and obviously you know that because you get people talking your ear off all day long it's like they and then i watch him hit a bag i was like you fucking bitch well how have you lived your life this long and you're a

grown-ass man and you don't know how to throw a punch that's seriously it's like it's like it's i'm not even going about it because you know, we both feel the same way about it pretty much. I'm a little more hard line on it. But, yeah, that's a great. He's so fucking smart. But once you've been in a street fight or once you've been in a cage fight, a cage fight and a street fight are very similar. They're not the same, but they're very similar. And the techniques, the strategies and the breathing and the conditioning are very similar. They're not the same, but they're very similar. And the techniques, the strategies,

and the breathing, and the conditioning are very similar. They're not exactly the same. There are some things that are different, but almost everything in a street fight and a cage fight, they cross over. So you know for a fact just how fucking frustrating it can be when you're trying to hit someone and you can't hurt them it's like it's the biggest nightmare in the world you want to knock them out so bad but you can't right and then they keep coming and and it's scary in the street in a different way because the the i mean the repercussions the end game can be so much different you're gonna end up fucking dead right in the cage you know you the referee will stop it or whatever but it's just it's such a

it's so deceiving it's so deceiving the one big difference is uh the lack of fine motor skills like in the cage since you're it's not a life or death you still have a lot of adrenaline pumping but you're able to utilize your your fine motor skills a lot more than you can in the street when you get in the street in the street jumped everything is just turned so quick plus you're not prepared and stuff like like you can't pry the fingers away you just you all you can do is like try to push the hand back if you try to defend a body lock from the back you know you just can't pry the fingers away. All you can do is try to push the hand back if you're trying to defend a body lock from the back. You just can't do certain things. And so it's a little bit of different training,

but the things that'll go through your mind are crazy. But once you've been in a fight and you know for a fact then that, oh shit, I better train, and you were right before where you know you're fucking three thousand five thousand times more of a bitch than you thought you were could you say it that way right i could say it that way yeah so what do you do you think uh i'm obviously i

think a lot of the listeners here remember the quote from fight club how much could you know about yourself if you've never been in a fight do you think that applies to a lot of men in modern society especially when you look at yeah all of our friends the social justice warriors and people that are yeah i do i'm in online i do because i give you for instance i don't you know i like to my own horn but i guess i do no one else does but my wife especially um but okay so there there's Mr. Arriet. Mr. Arriet was our PE teacher in high school. And like the first day in 10th grade, junior high school was 7th through 9th. I was the bad ass coming from my junior high. I was like the toughest guy in the school. But

there's other guys coming from different junior high schools now. So I'm in high school, and we're on the field and we're going to play some football, flag football. I never played real football. So they're picking teams and one of the guys, he was,

somebody said, hey, pick that guy. He pointed to me. He goes, I'm not going to pick a fucking Howley. I don't want a fucking Howley on my team. So I walked up to him, I shoved him

and I kicked him in the head. And he hit the ground, and Mr. Ayet came running. Mr. Ayet's a big local. I thought he was going to kick my butt. I didn't know him. This is like our second day of school in high school. And he goes, what happened? What happened?

And I go, the guy goes, fucking Howley just kicked me in the head. And he looked at me and goes, did you just kick him in the head? And I go, yeah. He goes, why? He goes, because he called me a in the head. And he looked at me and goes, did you just kick him in the head? I go, yeah. He goes, why? He goes, because he called me a fucking Howley. And he looked at the guy. I swear to God, this guy's a big Hawaiian. Mr. Aya, that's huge.

And he's like, looked at the guy. He goes, did you just call him a fucking Howley? And the guy goes, yeah. And he thought Mr. Aya would go, yeah, you know, and bond with him. He goes, well, then you deserved it. So now fucking stand up and keep playing. and i just remember thinking how cool that was and that's the way it should be but mr let me tell you a side note of that mr yet comes to our our black belt ceremonies now very cool and he tells that story because because some people might think yeah john right you know

but he actually tells that story about how it happened and how he remembers it and so so by all standards by all standards of today's school i remember when zero tolerance got implemented because i fought a lot at school and same kind of thing you know at worst i'd go to the principal's office my parents would get a call i'm 30 37 now okay so yeah so but i remember uh right when i got to high school they implemented zero tolerance so automatic expulsion for being in a fistfight and um but they're this leading me to this next question that i wanted to ask you which i think is really important when it comes to kids but in that situation the guy's talking shit yeah and he was really running his mouth and probably deserved to get slapped you went up to him and you set the record straight. But if a principal is looking at that

or any other regular yard duty or PE teacher, they're probably going to say like, well, he was just running his mouth and you escalated it. Right. And I got in a shit ton of trouble for that, for doing that. Like if somebody shoved me and I knocked him out or took him down and pounded a pound of their face in, I would get in trouble for that but there is something that you believe in that i also believe in and that is if your kid's getting fucked with or if a fight's about to start do you teach your kid to only throw the second punch or do you teach them to throw the first punch i teach them definitely to throw the first punch always and but you brought up something where i defended one of my students, big brother, who's undefeated now in MMA. He's been with me since he was four.

Now he's 22. And he's the fucking nicest kid in the world. But he was getting shoved. I think once you, I was completely in the wrong. Legally. I think in school, there's different rules. Schoolyard dominance is a lot different than self-defense for the street. Way different.

We train our kids much different than our adults. It's a different goal, different everything. But if someone's mouthing off to you in school, fuck, they asked for it. Shut the fuck up. There's one way not to get your ass whipped. Shut the fuck up. In the street, I don't i don't think that that that applies at all uh i think if no matter what someone says to you unless they say

i'm gonna hurt you right now okay if they say they're gonna hurt you right now and and they're close enough to do it i'm gonna pretend that they really are and i'll hit first if they call me a fucking whatever name they want to a fucking cock master whatever they could call me whatever they want i'm not going to hit them first yeah unless they're close enough and i feel by their body language they're about to yeah if they're approaching so but in the school it's different because it's schoolyard dominance and you're trying to you're trying to thwart the bully out of the bully. So Big Brother, some guy shoved him. He knocked the guy out with a punch.

He got expelled. He called me upset. I went down there and talked to the principal, and I said, I understand if the guy was yelling at Big Brother and he hit him first, but he shoved him. He put his hands on him. He put his hands on him. Do you realize that shoving causes just as many deaths as punching?

Because it's not the punch that does it. It's when somebody bounces their head off the concrete. And this was on the concrete. So should he wait till he shoved and hit his head on the concrete? And he's in a coma with a fucking tracheostomy tube being turned by a Filipino nurse every four hours? Should he wait for that? Or should he wait till he gets shoved, falls, catches himself, snaps his fucking arm, and it never straightens out again? What does he wait for once he starts getting shoved?

Right? And the guy goes, God, yeah, that shit can really happen when you get shoved. You're right, Mr. Ackleman. He called big brother right there while i was in the office uh you're come back to school you're back here you know um but but the words you know i don't think you should ever fight over words especially in the street yeah because the consequences are too high you hit someone kill them there's a video what are you gonna say well he called me a cock master so i hit him you're going to jail yeah right so never fight over words but uh i say always throw the first punch i like that a lot i had it reminds me of a story with a good buddy of mine who recently passed away about a year ago he was a year younger than me so he died young um great guy, definitely troubled, troubled life. But, uh, he was, when I was 19, we were

bouncing at a place called, uh, Polly, Polly something. It was in, uh, Scottsdale, Arizona. And so it was that seventies and eighties club up until 1am was when alcohol cut. And then it was 18 and up after that from one to 4am, which is the shit show. Cause all the 18 year olds gets hammered in the parking lot. There's bottles everywhere. We got to clean up after and they come in. And we would be pretty understaffed for that. But it was me, him who had grown up doing full contact karate and taekwondo. And he could do the splits. And he's pretty yoked. He lifted weights. And at that time, I had the wrestling background. I was still playing football. I had also done a little bit of training at AK when Frank Shamrock was running the show there.

And my other buddy who had a boxing background. So between the three of us, I felt pretty comfortable. There was seven guys that we had to throw out for groping women at a foam party. Because a lot of that shit goes down. There's foam you can't see. So the hands, guys start getting grabby. And- Foam party?

A foam party where they feel like the room like with four feet of foam you're walking through like soap basically dancing in everyone's in bikinis and these girls just get grabbed on and so we had a girl run up to us like screaming this guy just put his hand in my you know downstairs and um and i caught him and said something and he just mouthed off to me and i was like all right well're gone. So we go up to the guy and we realized he had a group of friends. And right as we were talking to him, he was kind of chill. And then all of his buddies stepped in and said, nope, you got the wrong guy. And we were like, wrong answer. And we started grabbing dudes and it was a melee. And of course we're over two to one outnumbered. So he throws a beautiful sidekick, but it hits the guy

right in the throat and right in the Adam's apple. And it's actually choking him. And thankfully, he had his life saved by, we had Scottsdale PD right outside. And they were able to save the guy's life. But of course, he sued the club, which ensued Christian. And it was a tough deal. But that's the whole thing. When you have the skill set, knowing where to exercise caution, just because, you know,

like anything can go down like that. I've seen guys, we worked at a, at a pseudo strip club, sporty's bikini bar in Sunnyvale. Good shout out the whole time I was in the UFC and making shit money in the UFC. And we threw some guys out and guys keep running up. And I had other buddies working with me. It was usually only two of us. And, you know, if we were outside, let's let stuff working with me. It was usually only two of us. And, you know, if we were outside, let stuff go on down.

Like we're in the parking lot. We're no longer on Sporty's premises. If you want to finish something up, go for it. You know, I usually didn't have to worry about that myself, but with some of the other team members, it would go down. And I remember a guy just blasted, like my coworker blasted this dude in the face and he dropped him on the asphalt. And I was like, bro, that can never happen out here. If you want to choke a guy with a guillotine or something like that,

that's fine. Make a point that way. Don't knock a dude out on the asphalt. That's a big no-no. Thankfully, he wasn't hurt, and they ended up leaving when they came to. He felt embarrassed and took off. But I was like, that could have gone all wrong. Yeah, more people die of

the the head bouncing off the concrete it's it's a it's a brutal it's a brutal way to go you know it's like you watch the takedowns and that slam a couple weeks ago in the ufc um and that could that could be life ending definitely life-changing and and uh you know every time you're training we work so much takedown defense uh my street guys and uh i am my my my mma team but you know my street guys don't do it just because they want to train like the mma guy no fucking being slammed in the street is life ending your fucking head bounced off the concrete you're never waking up so it's a it's it's a vital skill to have takedown defense uh um and takedowns for that matter so yeah that's that's that's a it's a brutal uh it's a brutal thing and street fights are different one thing about bar fights

bar fights are usually bar fights they They're not self-defense. Unless you're a bouncer and you get attacked, then boom, it's fucking on. But like the women's self-defense, like they learn all these wrist locks and shit, you know? Like, yo, put it around here, do this. Small joint manipulation, bullshit like that. It's like if a guy grabs you in a bar, let me tell you, I'll teach you all women this right now. And the only time, if a woman grabs you in the bar, if a guy grabs you in the bar, if he's good looking, then you like it. If he's not, then you're going to call the bouncer and tell him to let go. So, okay. So if a bad looking guy grabs you in a bar, here's your self-defense move. I'll show

you your self-defense. So you grab me any way you want. Bouncer, this guy's fucking won't leave me alone. Can you come kick his ass out? That's your self-defense right there. That's it. Just call the fucking bouncer. If it happens in the street, a whole different story. If you're alone walking or in a place where you're not in a bar, then there's all kinds of other self-defense. And that is a very serious thing because nobody should be putting their hands on you ever, ever. And once they do, you have to assume they want to do you great by all the injury. Because if they they do right and and you're not prepared for it you're fucked but if you fucking defend yourself overly and you fucking hurt them really bad and they weren't gonna really hurt you they should have kept their fucking hands to themselves in the

first place really i mean why would somebody i mean why would some guy come up and grab you like this right you have to assume he's about to stab me. He's about to kill me. You have to think that in that split second and fucking hit him, try to drop him right now. What are you going to wait? And you want to talk to him and say, you're going to try to talk him down? Hey, now. It's not okay.

Hey, hey, let's talk. Let's talk. This is not okay that you're grabbing me aggressively in this shirt. That's not the time to talk. If he's arm's length away and he's yelling at you and he can't touch you yet, you could try to talk him down. Hey, bro, what's up, man? I don't want to fight, but you need to back the fuck off. I'm telling you right now, do not come closer. But what's wrong? Do you want to talk about this? You know, oh, you cut me off. I'm a terrible driver. I'm sorry. I really admit that. But back the fuck off.

Do not come in this zone right here. Okay. So there's my talking down. But the second they come in my zone, why would they come in? If you ask someone to back the fuck off nicely, like back the fuck off, that's nicely. And they don't. Why? If somebody told you to back the fuck off and you're talking to them on the street,

I would bet my house right now. I would bet my house you to back the fuck off and you're talking to him on the street i would bet my house right now i'll bet my house you would back the fuck off yeah because i don't want to be in the fight in the first place right i've got nothing to prove there's no more chip on my shoulder perfect let's talk about that actually step one step further but why so why would they if they take a step further you might have to you probably would think they want more yeah yeah and then we got to put an end to it yeah but you know, that was something I realized among a lot of the black belts in jujitsu that I'd worked with was there was, and in any real martial art, there's a calmness, you know, sometimes they're playful, they're more aloof. Yeah. And it's like they've exercised whatever that itch was that maybe got them into it in the

first place, the need to defend themselves. Probably haven't been picked on or growing up in a rough area, but they no longer need to prove it to everybody because they've already done it before. Yeah. Already tapped a thousand times. So they don't have to be an asshole about it. And should shit hit the fan.

Like if I see guys in the bar scenario, which happened for years, I bounced from 19 up until I was 30. Shit. 33. I want to say, 34, long time. And in that, if there was a guy like Ryan Giles, my man over here, old Ryan, if old Ryan was in the club with his almost blue belt, that's a guy who I might have to worry about because he's still coming up the ladder. He hasn't been in the game that long and he might still have that chip on his shoulder. Whereas if a really high level black belt like Yuri Samoz comes through, I'm like, this guy's good. Obviously he can defend himself, but he's not looking for shit to hit the fan either.

You know, has that been your experience as you've trained a lot of people over the years and even in yourself included, you know know like you had a very fight or flight childhood yeah and to finally take that power into your own to be able to defend yourself and pull your shoulders back and look people in the eye it's a shift but then also once the word is out and people understand my boy ryan giles over here doesn't have his blue belt yet but he's sweating to the oldies so he's trying to fan us with the door. Anywho, did you see that? How does that shift happen? When does it happen? You know what? That's a good question. And usually it'll happen when that switches. And whenever that is, it's different for everyone.

And you know this, I could name some people, but I'm not going to. But there's some people, even that may get to the top already of the UFC, or the top of boxing, or the top of wrestling, and they never quite get that. Yeah. And those are the fucking people you got to watch out for. But with that said, okay, if you go to the UFC, any meeting with the UFC, I feel when I go to the UFC, a fight, say I'm going to work a corner,

there's no other time that I feel safer and more comfortable where I can just sit in a bar in the hotel or the restaurant in the hotel. And I'm surrounded by fighters, which are martial artists and their trainers and their coaches, et cetera, which are martial artists, and they're trainers and they're coaches, et cetera, and other martial artists, and I don't have to sit facing the door. You know, like sometimes I feel like, I'm so relaxed. I can just fuck with everybody,

have fun with everybody, because there are those guys that are always violent pricks, but the majority of people that are violent pricks and train stop always violent pricks but the majority of of people that are violent pricks and train stop being being violent pricks right and and and even and the vibe and the majority of people that get into martial arts in the first place aren't so it's like almost every every martial artist you know who's a black belt at the ultimate, uh, the super show in Vegas, which is coming up the first week in July at the Bellagio. And it's the martial arts super show

as a convention for martial artists. And when I go there, I'm just like, Oh fuck. I feel like I'm at home. When I go to a UFC fight, I remember, Oh shit. I feel like I'm at home. And I've never felt that close around like my friends back home or even when I was in the army I love those guys but I didn't I never had the same uh feeling as I did oh when I was in the army boxing team that's probably the closest I've ever been to a group of guys um when when you guys used to come down and help out Chuck, when the AKA guys come and then we'd be hanging out. I mean, it's like so relaxed when you're with a bunch of other martial artists that there's nothing you worry about.

You can just fucking be goofy and you can even act gay. I remember Chuck said, no one's going to out-gay me. I love that. I love that. but two people did ramsey ninjam yep okay that's true stripper ramsey yeah and antonio bonwallos those two have chuck beat i think he was okay with passing antonio the torch yes but we've we covered a lot here in this one uh where can people find you online? And we got the sign right behind us, the Pit Online Dojo. So if you want this stuff and you're not living in Southern California or anywhere else where there's a pit, you can find it online.

You can find it online. Just go to thepit.tv. Thepit.tv, we're here. I got this new conglomeration with Master Wong, who is a martial arts expert. He's all over YouTube, you know, millions of followers. His name is Master Wong and we have gotten together and we just, we're like, we're like, we, we, we seem to really hit it off.

And we're, we're, our goal is to be honest. It's like, we just want to, we want everybody to be safe. You know, I want everybody to be honest it's like we just want to we want everybody to be safe you know i want everybody to be safe i don't want anybody to be picked on i don't want anybody to be bullied i don't want anybody to be fucking raped or molested or fucking bullied and i just we honestly want that i want that at this gym i know you want that you i mean you you go about it your way. I go about it my way. But as martial artists, we want everybody to be safe. And that's, I mean, that's our goal. I love it. Coach, it's been amazing having you on.

Thank you, brother. Thank you, brother. Yeah. All right. I hope you guys laughed and enjoyed that as much as I did. John's got a lot of viewpoints that stretch my mind. He has a lot of viewpoints that I'm right in line thinking with. And especially when it comes to kids and self-defense, I think that's such a critical

piece that we as a society want to snuff out the idea that kids fight or the idea that kids would retaliate with greater force than the attacker or opponent for that matter. And I think that John has just so many great points on those issues. He's just a phenomenal guy. He is truthfully a sensei and he's my coach. He always will be. Hope you guys enjoyed that show and I'll get him back on the show shortly. Thanks for tuning in guys.

And as always, 10% off all supplements at onnit.com slash Kyle, 10% off all supplements and food products. Thanks for tuning in.