Kyle Kingsbury Podcast - #145 Dr. Mike Hart

Episode Date: March 2, 2020

Dr. Mike Hart is somebody I've been following for a long time now. He's been a guest on the Joe Rogan Experience and he's got a lot to say about alternative, functional and family medicine and a deep understanding of cannabis. We take a deep dive into all the medical benefits and uses of cannabis.    Connect with Dr. Mike Hart: Website - https://mikehartmd.com/ Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/drmikehart/?hl=en Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/MikeHartEPS/ Twitter - https://twitter.com/drmikehart YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/sportsdocmike     Check Out:  Kyle's Inner Circle Course (Private 1 on 1 Coaching) https://www.kingsbu.com/inner-circle   Natasha Kingsbury's E book (30 recipes)   Purchase for $5 at https://www.kingsbu.com   Show Sponsors:   Ancestralsupplements - Grass-Fed Colostrum  https://ancestralsupplements.com Use codeword KING10 for 10% off / Only Valid through Shopify Option    OneFarm Formally (Waayb CBD) www.onefarm.com/kyle (Get 15% off everything using code word KYLE at checkout)   Sated Keto Shakes  https://sated.com/kyle  use codeword KYLE for 20% Off Storewide    AMP Human PR Lotion www.amphuman.com/kyle or KYLE20 at checkout (for 20% off)        Connect with Kyle Kingsbury on: Website | https://www.kingsbu.com/ ( Supplement List & Newsletter) Subscribe to Kyle Kingsbury Podcast iTunes | https://apple.co/2P0GEJu Stitcher | https://bit.ly/2DzUSyp Spotify | https://spoti.fi/2ybfVTY  

Thank you guys for tuning in to today's show with my man, Dr. Mike Hart. Dr. Mike Hart is somebody that I've been following for some time. He's been on the Joe Rogan Experience, and he's got a lot to say about alternative medicine, functional medicine, family medicine, as well as a deep history and knowledge of cannabis from all forms of THC to CBD to other cannabinoids and terpenes found within the plant. We take a deep dive into a lot of the medical benefits and uses of cannabis on this show today. Lots of good stuff. I put him through a gnarly workout at the house. I had him over in the garage. We just finished out the garage gym and we got to do some hypoxic training with the altitude mask and the concept

two gear and some other fun stuff. But he was put through the ringer. So on the podcast, if you're watching this, you definitely see him break a little sweat as we get going. And I mentioned the workout we did, which was hard by my standards for sure. But he's got a good physique. He does jujitsu. So why not push the envelope a little bit? I had a really good time with Dr. Mike Hart, and I learned a lot from him. He's definitely going to be a guy who comes back on the show in the future. There's a number of ways you can support this show. Click subscribe. That way you never miss an episode. Also, leave us a five-star rating with one or two ways the show has helped you out in life. And also go to kingsmoo.com. That's my website. Many of you know that I'm off social media now. So that is one way

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one farm, because here's a great place for you guys to get some of this medicine that Dr. Mike Hart and I talk about. Thanks for tuning in, and we'll see you in a week. Dr. Mike Hart is in the house. Thanks so much for having me, brother. So excited to be here. Yeah, fuck yeah. You came all the way down from London, Ontario, Canada? I did. So London's about two hours from Toronto. So had to get up at three o'clock this morning

to make that 8 a.m. flight from Toyota Austin, but happy to do it. Holy shit, dude. I had no idea you'd be up that early. That's brutal. It's all good. That's brutal. And you have a family medicine background? So yeah, I'm a family doctor. So I went to school for nutritional biochemistry,

and then I went to school to become a doctor, and then I did my residency in family medicine, and that's what I practice now, yeah. So where, and I know you were talking a little bit about this with Rob Wolf, probably had to be two years ago, but where in your practice of Western medicine, did you start to dive into all things optimization from bioidentical hormone replacement to cannabis and everything else that you've gotten yourself into? Yeah. So, I mean, you know someone like yourself like i just try to optimize everything all the time like i've always been

obsessed with health and nutrition like this isn't something like new for me like i i was doing weird stuff when i was like 14 years old um like i remember at that time i couldn't even get protein powder so used to put tuna and like the blender with Diet Coke and drink it. Like weird stuff like that. With Diet Coke. Yeah. I used to do the poor man's protein shake. It was six whole eggs raw

with two scoops of ultra slim fast. Nice. And whole milk. I never did the slim fast thing, but I definitely did the raw egg thing for a long time too.

Oh, yeah. Yeah. That's cool. How old are you now? 35 now. Okay. So, yeah. We were about 37. Yeah. I remember right about that time for me,

Creatine 6000 ES came out by MuscleTech and that was like all the jam. And they're like, no, bro, you got to add like 75 to 90 grams of dextrose. That's the only way it'll work. And Bill Phillips had just made his supplement guide, which was a giant advertisement for all of the phosphagen HP and EAS products that he had. Yeah. Bill Phillips, he was the big guy that was like six meals a day in the Law for Life. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. And I mean, that can work for some people, but I don't follow that at all. I don't do anything close to six meals a day.

Well, it's not ancestral. In a way, it is. I think I called it the baby diet on Rogan's or like babies eat every two hours, you know, and they're growing. So if that's your thing and you're cranking hormones through the roof, you know, to be a bodybuilder, then maybe that's right for you. But for most people, that's not the way to lose weight or to be healthy. Yeah. And it's certainly not ancestral. And it's definitely not convenient for someone who's busy you know what i mean and you know i know we talked a little about uh fasting before i mean that's way more convenient you know you do a little bit of fasting what do i have to eat nothing it's not very hard that's true well let's talk about that let's let's dive in because you're

you're listed as one of the paleo docs is that right on their website i believe so yeah i have been for a while so you obviously have an ancestral background. You understand benefits of fasting and things like that. I think for a lot of people that want to get into it, who maybe follow Dr. Rhonda Patrick or my buddy, Dr. Peter Attia. I always like to say my buddy before I name drop. But if they're following a guy like Peter Attia, who works with Xero, which is a fasting app that helps you do intermittent fasting. For a lot of people, it's really fucking hard if you've spent your entire life of 30 plus years eating carbohydrates at every meal. And it can be a real shift for people to just to extend that window from say 16 hours of eating to eight hours of eating and 16 hours of fasting. How do people

inch their way towards that successfully? Well, I think, you know, if you're, if you're going to start fasting, like look at how much time you're taking in between meals now, or look at like the longest time you have in between your longest or between meals right now. And then just try and extend it by an hour to each day. Like you don't have to go from like eight hours to 16 right away. You know, you can just go from eight to nine to 10 and then possibly, you know, you know, extend it a little bit further. And if you stop at 14 or 15, like you stop at 14 or 15, you know, maybe you can't do the full 16. So I don't think you should, you know, get too down on yourself if you can't do the full, you know,

16 hours. I think that, you know, as long as you go longer between meals, you'll be doing better. Yeah. If you're used to eating every couple hours or say you have three regular meals and you have snacks in between and then you start to not have snacks, that's a benefit. You know, if you have dinner a little earlier and have breakfast a little later, that's a benefit. It's not black and white. Yeah. I mean, I don't want to live my life where it's like, everything is just so regimented where like, I have to eat 20 grams of protein every three hours or whatever it is that Bill Phillips and these guys are kind of recommending. I'm just like, let's eat a healthy

diet and let's get something that I can actually follow, right? just like, you know, let's eat a healthy diet and let's, you know, get something that I can actually follow, right? Because you want something healthy, but more importantly, you want something you can follow because anyone can write down a healthy diet, but can you follow that diet, right? So I think the big thing for when you're trying to initiate like a new diet is, are you going to be able to sustain this? Because if you can sustain it, that's a good diet for you. If you can't sustain it, that's not going to be a good diet is, are you going to be able to sustain this? Because if you can sustain it, that's a good diet for you. If you can't sustain it, that's not going to be a good diet for you.

Yeah. What else differs for you in your learning from the traditional Western medicine outlook? I mean, and this isn't me poo-pooing because I've had a torn labrum from fighting in my right shoulder and Western medicine fixed it. Sur like surgery is phenomenal and there's many many aspects of western medicine that are great um some things many things can be changed you know i was talking with you earlier at on it gym about um my wife's in the second trimester and the lighting in hospitals is probably the worst fucking thing you could have we had matt maruka on the show going over that. And anybody knows what it's like to spend a day under fluorescent lights that works in a cubicle.

And that's me for the most part. That's why I try to work from home now or in Aubrey's office. It's a real issue, you know? Yeah, I mean, bright lights can definitely interfere with your circadian rhythm, right? Your circadian rhythm is linked to not only to sleep, but to hunger, to your mood,

to your appetite. So all these things are linked to your circadian rhythm. And because of that, you know, you want to make sure that you're taking in light at the appropriate times. So like for someone like myself, like I do the blue blocking classes at night, like all the time, because, you know, I don't want, you know, bright LED lights in my face at night before I'm going to bed, because that can interfere with your melatonin production. If you don't have melatonin production going on at night, then, you know, oftentimes you can't sleep very well. So, you know, because of that, you know, I think it's really important to, you know, just be conscious, be aware of the light that you're taking in, you know, and if you're someone who lives, like I'm from Canada and it's winter now, right?

So in the morning time, you know, getting a little bit of light in the morning can really give you some energy and can really kind of, you know, give you a little bit of a boost to kind of start your day. Whereas, you know, if you're just starting off in like dark light in the morning, you're not going to get that little bit of a boost. So you definitely want to, you know, just be aware of the light that you're exposed to and just be aware of how you're responding to that too. Like if you use blue blocking glasses one night and then you sleep better, well, then you know that, you know what, maybe, you know, the

light at night is affecting my sleep. So, you know, that's always something to consider, but you know, if you use them all the time and you don't see any, like that's not fixing your sleep problems, then, you know, maybe your sleep issue is from something else. But, you know, if you use something and it works and then, you know, you try it without it

and it doesn't work, then likely that probably is the issue, you know? And a lot of people have found blue glocking glasses to be effective and they have done studies on them before. So it's not issue, you know, and a lot of people have found blue glocking glasses to be effective and they have done studies on them before. So it's not just, you know, anecdotal evidence from people. Yeah. And it's a very cheap hack. Like we have these amber bulbs that we have throughout the house. We got salt lamps, shit like that. Our led bulbs overhead, they're still emitting blue light, but they're dimmable. So we can really crank those down, but we still try to

stick to the amber bulbs. And then, I mean, I had to outfit this stuff around the house because I don't expect my four-year-old to put blue blocking glasses on, even though he might think they're cool. I don't think there's a huge market for kids' blue blockers. But to what you're saying about getting that morning light in, I mean, from Matt Maruca to Dr. Jack Cruz to all these OGs who have worked on photobiomodulation, Is that it? I'm not sure if I'm saying that right. But how we process light and the circadian rhythm impact of that morning sun, it's a critical thing. It's an absolutely critical thing to let our bodies know. And I think a lot of people in this space will mention that. Like when they travel, one of the ways you

cure jet lag is to get out and see a sunrise or to watch that early morning sun and have a little movement. It doesn't need to be a killer workout, but just some sun exposure at wherever you just landed in life to let your body figure out where it's at and get on tune with that. Yeah. I've heard Tim Ferriss actually talk about that before a bunch of times. And one of the things he says when he lands is that he always tries to see some type of times. And, you know, one of the things he says, like when he lands is that he, he always tries to, you know, see some type of light. And then the other thing that he mentioned, I know you said, you know, it doesn't have to be a huge workout, but sometimes, you know, when, when you land and you do a little bit of a workout, it can, you know, put you into a better circadian rhythm so that you can sleep better that night, wherever you are.

Well, we're on the topic of sleep. we were talking in the garage we just hit if people are watching the video and wondering why you've been sweating you're just cooling down now also if people are listening to this and like what the fuck is that background noise this is at my house and i have yet to figure out how to turn my air conditioner off it just goes on even when i have it off the fan goes on so i'll get that solved for the next interviews. But that workout was intense, by the way. I've never, ever done altitude training. I was totally dizzy the whole time. You kept a perfect pace, man.

You looked like you weren't even feeling it. That's why I was like, just sprint on the last hundred. I was almost like meditating when I was doing it. I was just keep going, just keep going. Dude, that's it. It's funny you say that because the book Chi Running is phenomenal. And I applied those concepts. You know, Tai Chi is where he based, is where he took to make Chi Running.

But the concepts around Tai Chi in running have a lot to do with posture and breath work and not burning yourself out. On a Concept2 rower, it's not the same posture. You're going from this almost fetal position into this extended position. But similar concepts around breath and not overdoing it is the basic idea that I will have more energy in the tank when I finish, right? So, Paul Cech has these concepts of working in versus working out, working out is energy expending, working in is energy building, chi building. And you can marry those two if you do it correctly. And so that's so cool that in your first workout, you're talking about meditating through it because that's what it is for me. It's a meditation. It's an active meditation,

but if I can follow the breath and do nose-to-nose the entire way through, and then the last 100 meters gun it, then I have more energy in the tank. It doesn't destroy me in the workout. And that's a very specific aerobic based building co2 retention style training that we were talking about from the oxygen advantage but it's a gnarly fucking workout for sure it's insane it's completely different than what i'm used to because like usually you can like if you're lifting weights you can just use raw power and sort of just like run through the workout type of thing and then you know when you're doing mma and that and someone's holding pads for you it's just a

different type of like cardiovascular workout we have that mask on and like the oxygen is just you know you're just sucking you know the air just trying to get some oxygen we got up to 12,000 feet by the end of it we incrementally went up about a thousand feet each each round well i felt it that's for sure still feeling it now yeah. Well, so we're on the subject of sleep. We talked about the book Sleep by Nick Littlehill. It's one of my favorites. I mentioned that the first time on Rogan's. And this air conditioner is going. Temperature is such a big one. There's a lot of things that can affect sleep. But I want to dive into cannabis here because you're the first cannabis expert that I've ever had on the show. You are a medical doctor, not a doctor of chiropractic.

Not that that would eliminate you from being a cannabis expert. However, you're a medical doctor who kind of went against the grain first, even though Canada has been way more liberal about cannabis laws than the U.S. I guess let's just dive into all things cannabis. But specifically, let's talk about sleep and impact of the brain because i know there's a ton in here sure yeah i mean i i definitely use cannabis with a lot of my patients for sleep um you know i think that we just don't really have the best sleep aids out there right now you know a lot of people are still using like benzodiazepines to sleep uh things like ativan xanax like those medications can be very very addictive you know if it works for you great but

like you know i would try to stay away from them as much as i as i could because they can be extremely i'm raising my hand for the video watchers because uh i was addicted to xanax and valium in college okay and that's what would knock me out you know but it's like that then then all of a sudden i have anxiety during the day yeah and that'll help with that because it gets you high it works yeah it works it gets you high. It works. It works by getting you high. It doesn't fucking eliminate the anxiety. It is patchwork.

It's fucking throwing band-aids on holes in the ship. Yeah. So, I mean, I don't want to be prescribing, you know, that type of medication to patients because I know, you know, what the long-term effects are. So, you know, because of that, you know, I think cannabis is a much, much better alternative. And, you know, specifically, you know, we can talk a little about THC and CBD.

So, you know, I know that a lot of your listeners probably listen to the Rogan podcast with Matt Walker that got a lot of play on the internet. And, you know, he was talking a little bit in that podcast about CBD and how it can affect sleep. And there is some evidence that like having a little bit of CBD can actually stimulate your prefrontal cortex or give you a little bit of energy, right? So, I mean, most of my patients actually use their CBD in the daytime, right? So they find it to be effective for, you know, anxiety. They find it to be effective for pain, for reducing inflammation. And of course to be effective for pain for reducing inflammation and of course some people use it for seizures you know there's a variety of different indications for cbd um but just getting back to sleep you know some people may find that a higher dose of cbd oil

can in fact put them to sleep what would that be just to? Is that in the 100 milligram range, 150 milligrams, 300 milligrams? So, I mean, I would say anything over 20 milligrams is actually a decent-ish dose. But the thing is too, you definitely want to, everyone's different. And you also want to look at the terpenes that are within the CBD oil. So like there's a terpene called myrcene, for example, that's very, very sedating. So if you have a terpene called myrcene, for example, that's very, very sedating.

So if you have CBD oil and you have myrcene, that might help you because you have the CBD, which can maybe calm down your anxiety, and you have the myrcene, which is extremely sedating, and then that can just kind of knock you out for some people. Now for other people, that's just not gonna work. And this applies not just to vets, but also to civilians as well.

But a lot of veterans, and I do see a lot of veterans in my practice, do have PTSD or post-traumatic stress disorder. And these guys just really, really can't sleep at night. And the best thing for THC, for guys who have is, or sorry, for people who have PTSD and have nightmares is THC because THC can reduce the amount of nightmares that people get and the frequency. So I have a ton of patients who have like night, they were having nightmares like every night and then they use a little bit of THC and then all of a sudden like their nightmares

literally are like gone, you know, for, and for some people, like it's literally like a hundred percent gone, you know, other people might reduce by 50% or 75%, that are veterans and a lot of them have post-traumatic stress. And I've found just from hooking people up, you know, I got, when I was out in Vegas last time, I ended up picking up a bottle of five milligram CBN with five milligram THC. Nice. And that was the only thing that worked for my friend to sleep. He said he hadn't slept that well in probably 15 years.

Yeah. And I'm happy you actually mentioned CBN. So I tend to mostly talk about THC and CBD because those are the ones that are commercially available, especially in Canada. There are so many other cannabinoids out there. There's over a hundred cannabinoids in cannabis. CBD and THC are only two of them. You named CBN. And a lot of people have said that CBN has been really effective for sleep for them. So, you know, if you combine cheat C with CBN, you know, and as to your, your friend's point, you know, who obviously, you know, did really, really well with that, you know, you might get a really good night's sleep with that

combination. So, you know, it's, it's, it's cool that actually you found that, that, that product, that's like something just on the shelf here. No, that was in Vegas. I think it's called planet 13 or planet 49. It's a, it's off the strip and it's like a 40,000 square foot Apple store for cannabis. It's the coolest fucking place ever. If you're going through Vegas, you got to go in there. They have like 40 inch plasmas that are vertical and you, and it's all touchscreen.

And then you have a bud tender come out with an iPad and he's like, what can I help you with, brother? And they have fucking everything. I mean, everything imaginable. But yeah, to the point of THC in combination with these things, I've found, I mean, look, personal story, and I definitely want to extract as much as I can from you in this hour rather than just personal stories and my own conjecture. But I use cannabis as a crutch through college, through largely a lot of shit that I hadn't dealt with in my childhood, and then through ayahuasca and some of these other things. I feel it stripped my receptors. So when I worked my way back to cannabis with respect and reverence, I couldn't handle a half as much. I couldn't handle a quarter

as much. So a little goes a very long way for me with THC now. But what I find is the closer it is to whatever we'd find in nature before we started fucking with it and deciding that THC was what we should be going for long before CBD was figured out or CBN or CBG or any of the terpenes or any of these other wonderful pieces that come in this thing nature made for us, I find that the closer they are, I guess in concert, either a one-to-one ratio of THC to CBD or a one-to-three ratio of THC to CBD, that seems to work best for me. What do you find works? I mean, is it just trial and error as you work with people one-on-one or is there like a screening process that you have to determine what you feel is best for them? There's definitely a little bit of trial and

error involved. You know, some people though, like say if you're a brand new patient to cannabis and you come in, most people still just want to try CBD to start just because they have that aversion to THC, which is fine. And then usually on follow-up, they'll say, okay, now I want to try the THC. But, you know, getting THC. But getting back to what's the best ratio of THC to CBD for sleep, that's something that's really hard to answer. And it's also very, very individualized. But I will say that in general, it would skew more to the THC than the CBD. So you might find that it's two to one or three to one THC to CBD, but some people do find even just a one-to-one works really well. And it's interesting that we're talking about this

because I actually just polled my audience on Twitter about this maybe a week ago or less. And one-to-one was definitely the highest. So a one-to-one ratio of thc to cbd thc only was second uh cbd only would would have been third so you know and i i think that uh i think that even though that was you know a small sample i think maybe a thousand people responded or something like that i think that that's still fairly accurate it's a thousand people just because it ain't a fucking double blind doesn't mean shit like that's the other problem we have with western medicine it's like no no look at this there's some validity here you know yeah no you're absolutely right i mean i don't wait for like you know a bunch of randomized controlled trials to come out before i want to try something you know like i'm if there's enough

evidence for it and if it's a pretty safe molecule whatever i'm looking at i'm just going to go for it right away yeah very little side effects here well effects here. Well, there's a number of things that I want to bring up, but yeah, to your point, many of us have our backs against the wall with health and the health of the earth, as well as the health of ourselves. And so waiting for this shit isn't going to work. You know what I'm saying? Waiting for doctors to cure your autoimmune disease with conventional theory is not going to cut it. So if somebody tried, like Michaela Peterson tries carnivore and all of a sudden she feels great, like it fucking works. You don't need the science to back it up. You know, like simple as that.

Right. But let's, I guess, let's talk about the benefits of THC because I forget, man, there was a couple of great documentaries that came out on Netflix, The Union and then The Culture High. And in The Culture High, they talked about, and this was years ago, but they talked about a study, one of the first studies being done by Japanese scientists at University of California, San Francisco on THC specifically for beta amyloid plaque and tau proteins in the brain. Yes. Yeah. So, you know, if you look at the pathophysiology of Alzheimer's and, you know, Alzheimer's is a horrible disease because it doesn't just affect the person, it affects everyone around them, right? Because the caretaking involved with that is really, really difficult. So, you know, anything you can do to maybe, you know,

reduce that or delay that is absolutely welcomed by anyone. And THC specifically has been shown to inhibit the formation of beta amyloid plaques. So that would be the hallmark kind of pathophysiology of Alzheimer's disease. And that's exactly what THC does, is inhibits the beta amyloid plaques from actually aggregating together. So I do believe, I do believe that, you know, using a little bit of THC every day may in fact be a very effective treatment for Alzheimer's disease in the long run based upon that research. Yeah, and you were talking about, I think with Jay Farrugia, a retroactive study

they had done on NFL players with THC to TBI. Can you break that down? Sure, yeah. That was, so that was, there's actually one incredible study on that. So what they did is, I don't know how many people were in the study, but they looked at the mortality rates of people who were using cannabis versus people who were not using cannabis that had sustained a TBI. And this is a PubMed study. We can even link it to the podcast

if you guys want after. And what it showed was that if you had THC in your system, your risk of death was one-fifth compared to the people who didn't have THC in their system. And I mean, that is a crazy statistic. It's something that should be replicated more often in studies. And it's something that should be implemented because we know that, you know, traumatic brain injuries, I know you had, you know, Dan Carstilla here on recently, you know, who I've just kind of become friends with. And, you know, we know that traumatic brain injuries can cause a ton of damage to someone, particularly for their mental health, you know, if their overall cognition, it causes physical symptoms as well. So, you know, anything

you can do to potentially stave off any type of, you know, symptoms from someone who has a TBI, you know, it's going to be welcomed by that person. So, you know, I think in my opinion, it's really just an underutilized treatment. And again, you know, we're talking about like death. We're not even talking about like quality of life in this study, you know, so it's something that we need to look into more and we need to implement it more. Yeah, no doubt about it. What else do you think THC helps with? I mean, I watched Weedikit. I forget the name of the guy. Krishna's this first name, I think. It was one of his first episodes. And I had heard you, I'm not sure if it was with Rob or with Jay, but you were talking

about the benefits of THC with cancer. And I know Rogan's brought up a couple of studies that were done with fasting and THC and then with fasting or with THC in conjunction with chemo. But in this, it was called Stoned Kids. I think it was one of the first four episodes of season one on Weedy Kit. And it was in Oregon where they followed all these families who were basically giving their kids really high dose THC from Rick Simpson oil, who were going through some of the gnarliest forms of childhood cancer. And they were staving off cancer. Yeah.

Like no doubt about it. And they were stoned and happy. You know, they weren't just vegetables on the couch. Like they were outside playing. They were being kids, but they were being kids and their quality of life had improved significantly in a way that their parents hadn't seen since the diagnosis. Yeah. So I see a lot of kids actually in my practice and we can chat about kids and we can chat about cancer as well. So with cancer, there is cancer, you know, there is, you know, evidence in animal models that, you know, THC and CBD can be effective. There's also a lot of case studies

showing that THC and CBD can be effective, you know, and I've posted studies about, you know, someone with a lung cancer, lung carcinoma, used CBD and, you know their tumor shrank again it's just a case study but again like these things do do happen you know and uh you know i talked about a little bit on rogan before like you have to be careful with somewhat because um like say like breast cancer for example so if you are her2 positive which is a certain form of breast cancer um it has been shown that thc can be helpful but say if you don't you have a cancer that doesn't express any a breast cancer, it has been shown that THC can be helpful. But say if you have a cancer that doesn't express any, a breast cancer that doesn't express any THC receptors, it has been shown that THC may actually worsen it. So you do have to be a little bit careful. So you want to

make sure that you know how THC and CBD affect your specific cancer. And you don't want to just say like, you know, cannabis cures cancer in like a general kind of like term. We want to say that, you know, in this particular type of cancer, this type of ratio of THC to CBD would be best based upon these types of studies and based upon what we've seen. You know, that'd be the best approach to it. Instead of just, you know, encompassing cancer is like one is one thing yeah that's like saying the ketogenic diet cures cancer it's like no no but there's some very specific forms of cancer

that it really does help with yeah things like that right yeah um yeah i get that well let's let's talk pain because sure pain for me you know i grew up playing football. I fought for eight years professionally. And in fighting, I would take eight ibuprofen a day. I'd take four before each practice. And it was something that I just did routinely. And then as I started getting into all things optimization, starting with diet through How to Eat, Move, and Be Healthy by Paul Cech and then many other books, I realized how much damage this is actually causing my gut and started switching to CBD. Thankfully, I was in California, so we had a lot of these things available ahead of time to the rest of the country, but CBD fixed it. I didn't need ibuprofen anymore. My inflammation was coming down. And of course, that was in concert with

cleaning up my diet and putting better things in me, you know, fixing my sleep, that kind of stuff. But speak to that a bit because it doesn't appear, even with the awareness of the opiate epidemic, it doesn't appear that that's going to shift overnight. Yeah, I totally agree. And again, you know, some of it just comes down to, you know, the pain medications that we have available. And, you know, they're not that great. Like right now we have NSAIDs. So you just talked a little bit about Advil. And then once you go beyond that, there are things like Lyrica and Gabapentin and that. But a lot of guys, once they fail on NSAIDs, they just go straight to opiates. There's a lot of people who do that, like not just patients, but doctors will do

that in their approach. You know, we'll try on NSAIDs. If NSAIDs don't work, we'll just go, we'll just go straight to opioids. Like I said, there are some people who use like gabapentin, Alerica and these other drugs, but, you know, a lot of time it will be NSAIDs to opioids. And, you know, you know, to your point, so, you know, what are you doing when you're taking an NSAID? You're like ibuprofen, you're taking something that's supposed to decrease inflammation. So we know that CBD can also decrease inflammation. And your story, even though it's very, very compelling, it's definitely not unique in the fact that there's been a lot of other people who have also used a ton of ibuprofen, you know, Advil, all these other types of NSAIDs, and then have been able to come off of them successfully just by using C-Bio.

And of course, you know, if you have, you know, a poor diet, poor lifestyle, all that type of stuff, you know, you definitely want to work on that first. But, you know, if you're working on the lifestyle part and then you're also introduced CBD, then it only makes logical sense that you're probably going to be able to eliminate the Advil or the ibuprofen that you're taking. And then just to chat a little bit about the opiates, yeah, I mean, it's definitely very, very scary because the thing is there has been a little bit of reduction in doctors prescribing opiates over the past few years in the US, thankfully. But that doesn't necessarily correlate with a decreased death rate

because it's also available on the street as well. So there are people who are dying from physicians prescribing medications, and there's also people dying from fentanyl overdoses on the street. Fentanyl came into the picture and fucking all of a sudden, mortality rates just really went up. It's one of those things that I think hits so hard so quick. I mean, I've lost two friends to heroin, and I don't think it was the heroin. I think it

was the heroin cut with fentanyl. It's one of those powerhouses that can kill you very easily. Yeah. Yeah. It's something that you really want to be careful with because you should never get anything off the street anyway. And even with regards to supplements and things like that, like it's always best when they're third party tested, you know, and that's sort of the, the standard that I hold to myself if I'm going to take something. And that's the standard that I think everyone should, should hold to themselves as well is that, you know, if you're going to take something, you know, make sure that it's, it's third party tested. And that way, you know, that whatever is within the bottle is actually what's in the bottle, you know, because, you know,

lots of supplement companies, you know, they can, they can put things in there that, that you, you know, are really, really bad for you. And then of course, you know, if you buy something on the street, you have no idea what you're getting yeah cannabis as well right yeah you know that was one of the first benefits i saw to first with medical marijuana and then with with um you know recreational legalization is the degree at which we see testing being done so you know i'm not going to smoke or inhale pesticides and herbicides that the product is in fact organic and that these are the constituents within that particular strain or within that particular tincture yeah and and you also too it's nice to know that okay this is 10

so you know if i have a little bit of this i'm not going to get blitzed yeah you know you have someone's like 28 you don't know about it and all of a sudden after a couple puffs you're like head spinning and you don't know where you are like you know so it's always it's always better to know you know exactly what you're getting. And then that's just going to increase your own self-awareness as well. Because then you're going to know, like, okay, I know that when I use 10% THC, I can take a couple puffs and I'll feel this way. I know if I use 5% THC, I can take a couple puffs and I'll feel this way.

So I think that the more you know about the product, the more in turn that will just increase your self-awareness kind of naturally as a byproduct of that. Awesome. How much does THC fit into the picture with pain? Because we've talked about inflammation. We've talked about CBD's ability

to help lower inflammation, which of course, if that's high, you're going to feel all the nagging injuries come back. THC clearly has a euphoria and it clearly has a component to help with pain. Yeah. So, you know, part of the reason, and I mean, you kind of touched on it a little bit, is that that dissociative effect that THC has, that's part of the reason why it's an effective pain reliever, right? So all the time patients will say to me, I can still feel the pain, but it just doesn't bother me anymore. And it's because they're in that dissociated state. And because they're in that dissociated state, they don't feel as much pain. It's the same way if you're meditating, right?

You know, and this isn't like some hokey, you know, BS. It's like if you meditate and you're concentrating on your breath, you're concentrating on meditating, then your mind isn't on the pain, right? Your mind isn't, why am I in pain? Why does my back hurt so much? Your mind is concentrating on something else. So it's taking your mind off of the pain. And when you use THC, you get the same thing.

You get this dissociative effect. So it takes your mind off of the pain, even though the pain is still there. And then if you combine THC with CBD, then you're going to get that dissociative effect from the THC, and you're going to get the anti-inflammatory benefit from the CBD. So that's why the combination of the two of them can be incredibly effective for pain. Awesome. Let's dive into some of the lesser known things. You talked about mercine as one of these beneficial terpenes that can help us rest at night. I think I've read, let me see if

I can find it. The Cannabis Health Index, I interviewed the author of that book. I'm forgetting his name right now. He's a German guy. But there's a laundry list of terpenes within these compounds as well. And things like D-limonene can help with fungal overgrowth and candida to immune function and all sorts of things. I mean, D-limonene's in everything. It's in orange oil. If you're going to treat termites organically, they might use orange oil or lemon zest, things like that. We have terpenes in the peel as a natural deterrent for bugs. It's kind of like the organic pesticide herbicide within some of these plants that are citrusy. Yeah. And I mean, you should know your terpenes. And again,

coming back to like the Alzheimer's thing and the memory thing, you know, pining has actually been shown to be effective for improving overall memory because it has an acetylcholine race effect. So if something is a natural acetylcholine race S-race inhibitor, then that's going to help with memory impairment. So let me unpack that real quick. Acetylcholine being kind of one of the most important neurotransmitters for memory, thought, cognition. All nootropics on the market are trying to increase acetylcholine production by taking choline and then combining that with either iracetam or something else. Like we use alpha GPC and alpha brain on it. And then we have other things like Hooper's area and Hooper's ENA and

just different products that help upregulate that into that. And then on the flip side of that, we have this enzyme that comes through like Pac-Man and clears it out of the system. And so that's the enzyme you just mentioned. If we can stunt or blot that effect, then we're going to have acetylcholine in the system longer, which would enhance it. And pinene does this. Correct. Yeah. And you mean that, and you talk about CBD and pinene, I mean, then you're getting like, almost like a double eutropic at once, right? Because a lot of people do find that

once they have some CBD on board, they have a little bit less anxiety. They just feel a little bit better overall, like verbal fluency increases, sometimes memory increases. And there has been studies that show that CBD does have this rescue memory effect. So because of that, if you have CBD and you have pining and acetylcholine,

which you explained very, very well, then, you know, you're probably going to get a little bit of a cognitive boost from that. And that's what a lot of people are reporting. And I do think, too, there is a little bit of, you know, a blend or a blur between like something that's like a nootropic and something that's like considered to be like a drug, you know, because we always think that, you know, that a drug is something that sort of takes you from like disease to a normal state, right? And like a nootropic is like something that can take you from like a normal state to

maybe like superhuman. But in many ways, like I think that more people should have that approach, you know, meaning, and I've chatted about this recently with like a few people, like, you know, if you go to your, your cupboard every single morning, your kitchen cupboard, and it says like antidepressant, anti-anxiety, I mean, that's almost enough to like, you know, put you in a bad state right there. It's like, I have to take this to feel good. I have to take this to, to, to feel good. But if you're taking something that's like a like a nootropic it's almost like it's amping you up it's like oh i can't wait to take this because it's going to make me feel amazing so you know i think that more people you know who are depressed and anxious kind

of should sort of not necessarily change you know what they're taking, but change their approach and their thinking. Because I mean, going to your cupboard every day, seeing something that's like an antidepressant can't be that motivating compared to like going to your cupboard and you open up a bottle of creatine or whatever it is to say like, I'm going to take this now, I'm going to lift five more pounds of weight. And I think that's the kind of like mindset that like you know we should be encouraging more in medicine and just more in like in modern society and it's fine that we're talking about you know mental health and we're talking about suicide and all these things all the time but you know talking about it sometimes almost just like gives people like that option you know like let's give them like like a different

option like let's give them like hey like we know option. Like, let's give them like, Hey, like, we know that, uh, that, that there's things that you need to, to address, but you know, maybe you can try a different approach and just try and do it almost like aggressively. Just be like, just try to become awesome instead of, you know, trying to be not depressed, like try to be like your best self. Yeah. That's a better way to do it. Of course. Yeah. It really speaks to the language that we use in our own story of ourself. And I think neuro-linguistic programming addresses this very well. NLP, you can look it up, just Google it. But I'm working with a lady named Micra Hamilton who works at Aperion on South Congress. And she does a lot of brain optimization. But that's one of the things she says is that we don't work,

we don't fix anyone. And we don't work with anyone who needs to be fixed. We work with people to optimize them. We work with people who want to be better and who already know that they're not broken. We're just going to take you to levels that you've not reached before. It's a different way to think about it, right? Yeah, it's a way better approach you know um because like because i think the the old

school approach is a little bit you know depressing and it almost encourages someone to have like depressive symptoms whereas like if you have like the approach that you just explained it's more like it's it's giving the person their power back because there's because when you when you do it the opposite way that we're doing it now we're saying that you know you need this because you're depressed and you don't feel well you're going to need it for the rest of your life your serotonin is all messed up like that's not something that's very encouraging to hear you know and then you know that's probably being told to them all the time. Whereas like, you know, if you have this different approach, like this, you know, lady who has this NLP program going on, then perhaps maybe, you know, you're going to have a different mindset

of like, you know what, instead of not trying to be depressed, I'm actually going to try to be the best person I can be. And that's a completely different mindset. And when you have that mindset, the depression goes away. Yeah. Yeah. It's one thing to be sold a bill of goods like, hey, this is a neurochemistry imbalance that you have and it's genetic and it's an inevitable thing. Now you have to take this for the rest of your life. Like, no, no, no, no, no. All systems work together, right? You're looking at a symptom of the brain. Something caused that. And let's look holistically to pull out of that, right? There's so many lifestyle factors

from working out appropriately, not overdoing it, not beating yourself up in the gym, but working out to feel better, like what we did today, right? I have more energy after that. I'm not beat up. And I still have workouts where I beat my ass, but those are very few and far between the workout like we just had, right? Things like that, getting the sunlight

first thing in the morning, cleaning up your diet, making sure you're sleeping, and then finding some space inside the day so that when you lay down at night, that's not the first time you've been alone with yourself. That's a huge issue for sleep, right? for sure i think that that that happens to a lot of people is they don't reflect you know and uh like one of the big things that i do every day is i'm i'm a big believer in the five minute journal you know something i got three or four years ago and you know i get a new one every six months basically um and if i don't take that time to reflect, I can feel it. I can feel it in the morning and I can feel it at bed as well, because I need that time to reflect to myself. And if you don't have that time to reflect to yourself, and if you're just going straight to bed, well, then

all the time that you should have been reflecting in the day is just going to come to surface that night. And of course, you're not going to be able to sleep well, right? Because you should have thought about these things during the day and dealt with them on the spot instead of just putting them to a side. And now all these things are just going to come to a head at night and you're wondering why you can't sleep. I mean, it's almost funny when you actually say it out loud, you know? So, you know, reflection is a very big part of my day. And I feel that, you know, a lot of people are underutilizing that and they don't appreciate actually how effective it is. I mean, very few people journal, very few people write down their thoughts.

And, you know, that just leads to really, really poor self-awareness. And, you know, we have poor self-awareness, you're going to make poor decisions. Poor decisions for your health, too. Yeah. And I mean, to that note, even on journaling, I just got into... Can you grab that, pal? There's a journal that one of the members of Fit for Service created for us. And I think they're still on Amazon now.

It's fucking awesome. But I've been doing the day and the night. It's over there on the counter to the right. Anyways, I'll get the name of this in a second. I have my lovely wife here at home. She's Ryan Giles for today, helping us out. Podcast producer extraordinaire. The one that I have, the five-minute journal,

it's three things at the beginning of the day that you're grateful for. And then you write down three things that will make today great. And then you have two daily affirmations. So that's how the morning starts. And in the end, you have to write down three things that happened today that were great

or three things that you appreciate it. And then two ways how you could have made your day better. And doing that every single day just makes such a difference. And there's a guy, James Clare, just wrote this book, Atomic Habits. Yeah, we had him on the podcast. He's incredible. It's my favorite. I've read Charles Duhigg's book, The Power of Habit, which is great. But Atomic Habits is like, that's it, dude. That's the one. It's totally next level. Yeah. And in his book, what I was going to say is that he was saying that if you get 1% better every day, it's not that you get 365% better at the end.

Because of compound interest, you're like 37 times better, he says, right? So if you're doing this journaling every single day, I mean, how much more grateful are you going to be after a year or after two years? Even after a week, I mean, your thoughts are going to change. I'm going to, you know, it's just going to say your life is going to change, but your thoughts are your life, right? So if your thoughts are going to change, your life is going to change, right? And very few people take the time to journal and to practice gratitude. But when you do that, it absolutely works. And it's been shown in numerous studies as well.

So that's just a simple hack that I think that everyone should incorporate. Yeah, it's incredible. I've done Five Minute Journal before, but this is called The Legendary Day Life. And they have a morning journal and an evening journal. And I'll just run through what it is. You start with what you're thankful for. I'm thankful for today. I look forward to how can I make myself feel good today? So this is how I feel, fill my own fucking cup, right? What am I going to do for me? Not the work that has to be done, but not with the work for my family or for my wife. What's for me today?

Is it a workout? Is it meditation? Is it a float tank? Is it getting stretched? Is it going to yoga? Is it doing breath work? Is it a cold tub? Something that's going to fill my cup and allow me to drop into my zero state center. What can I do today in order to bring me closer to my goals? Getting clear on what we want to accomplish, right? Atomic habits. It's not about mastering any one thing. But as he says, if you get 1% better, you take on one thing at a time, right? You don't take on fucking everything at once. But say you want to make a dietary change and you make that and you get 1% better at that dietary change. Then a week later, you add in a different thing. Like, I want to learn music, so I'm going to start playing a handpan. Now I get 1% better there every day that I do that. And you start adding these things together.

That's where you start to grow. And he goes through like Pat Riley and some of the greatest franchises in NBA history. And all these other people that have mastered this concept of 1% better in all directions. And like you said, that compounding interest, it makes such a fucking big difference. It really does. Yeah. Because as soon as you stop too, like James Clear says, that's a vote to what you're not doing, right? Or the person that you don't want to be. But as soon as you start writing those things down, you start becoming grateful, you're taking votes to become the

person who you want to be. And then once you become the person that you want to be, everything is going to get better. You know, your confidence is going to increase, your well-being is going to increase. So everything's going to get better with that. So, you know, each time, you know, you, and we talked a little bit about essentialism, you know, earlier today too, I think that ties in a little bit with, with atomic habits in some ways. But, you know, with regards to, you know earlier today too i think that ties in a little bit with with atomic habits in some ways but you know with regards to uh you know atomic habits um you know one of the big things that i took away from that book is you know each time you take an action it is a vote to the person that you want to be now it might be the wrong vote if you're taking the wrong action so that's something that you want to be that you want to be yeah don stop at McDonald's. Don't be an idiot. Go somewhere else.

Yeah, I think about that a lot. Essentialism is a book that completely changed my life. I read it at the end of 2019, and already I'm putting a lot of that into practice. It's one of the reasons we're here right now, podcasting from home. I can get a lot of work done at home. The lighting here is better. I've got nature right outside. We're about to plant a bunch of new trees. So I'll be surrounded by that. There's a ton of houseplants. I think we can see one of them in the background of this podcast right now. But this is my sanctuary and largely in part, thanks to Natasha over there for making it, turning a house into a home. But thinking about that, what is essential, right? And one of the things that he put in there is an acronym WIN that I really have always loved.

I learned it first from Lou Holtz. I think he mentioned somebody else where he heard it from, but what's important now, right? So we clarify that in every fucking action we do. And he even said something that blew my mind. When the word priority became added to whatever language it was at the time, it might've been Greek. It wasn't priorities. It was singular. There was no plural for it. It was the most important thing. It wasn't the most important things. It wasn't a fucking list. There was one thing that was the most important, right? So what's important now is

one thing. It's not fucking 10 or 12 things and that'll make you so much happier too because then you just concentrate it on one thing it gives you you know that like sense of like certainty you know and when you have that like that like sense of certainty that's that's when you feel your best you know um you know i go back and forth on tony robbins a little bit i mean, overall, I do like him. I love him. And I'll link for people who are on the fence. I'm going to link to an episode he did

with Russell Brand in the show notes. It's fucking incredible. I love Russell Brand. It's incredible. The two of those guys are fucking magic. And I mean, I say that. I've gone and seen him twice. So I really do like him overall.

But he talks about that stuff a lot. And the other thing that he talks about that I really do like him overall. But he talks about that stuff a lot. And the other thing that he talks about that I really like too is he always talks about appreciation over expectation. And that's something too that I come back with in my journal, like the five-minute journal all the time is that maybe there was something that I was expecting today and, you know, didn't happen, didn't get it, whatever happened. But maybe there's something else that, you know, kind of passed by that I didn't appreciate that I should have. And he talks about, you know, I don't know that exercise where he talks about, you know, if you look at everything, if you look for something

red, then like everything, you know, you'll see is red, right? And you'll start calling things that are like kind of orange, like red, you know what I mean? And the point of that is that like, if you're, and you talked about this recently too, you know, like if you're looking through life with this like lens of like anger all the time, then everywhere you see, you're just going to see anger, right? But if you're looking through life with like, you know, you said love and happiness and gratitude, then when you're looking through that lens, you're going to to see anger right but if you're looking through life with like you know you said love and happiness and gratitude then when you're looking through that lens you're going to find those things you know you're going you're going to see beauty in things and the things that you know are just you know kind of red you know you'll see that those things are kind of beautiful or

you'll be like i'm i'm kind of grateful for that you know and that's the way that you want to that you want to kind of see things. So that's one of the things that I found that one of the quotes that he brought up in one of the seminars that I saw that I thought was like, you know, spot on and I've used it ever, ever since. Yeah, it's really powerful. It's reminding me and I forget which I've read a lot of Dr. Wayne Dyer's stuff, but he talked about, you know, running in his hotel because he used to run a 10K every day no matter what. So he was actually running around this atrium on one floor of his hotel and he's just running down the hall.

And so he's getting his fucking 10K and some lady opens the door and she's like, are you running out here? And he's like, yeah. And I just kept running. But he spoke about how a lot of people are looking to be offended. And it seems in our political climate and in our social media climate and in all the things, all of the polarization of what's going on right now in the world, that there are, in fact, a lot of people, he said this long before Trump was an office or anything else that would, you know, cause such a rift or a divide among the population of the states, but also elsewhere,

just that people do look to be offended. And you can catch yourself in that and say, why am I doing this? Right? Yeah. And I think that, and not only just like, we're talking, I think a little bit like online, but in person, I think too, people are like that.

They want, and it's because they don't have something going on in their life that provides any value. And if you don't have anything in your life that provides any value and you see someone else that has value in their life, all you want to do is kind of take that away or take that person down. And that's, I think, what's happening to a lot of people in society these days you know it's like uh jordan peterson's analogy of the crabs yeah in the bucket yeah you don't need to put a lid on the bucket because the crab that's about to leave gets pulled down by the other crabs as those crabs are trying to climb their way up yeah so no crab get

out yeah it might be lobsters but it's one of these yeah i think he's a lobster yeah yeah but his book's incredible too i always recommend that book for people 12 rules for life i think he's i think he's one of the most brilliant people in the world i think he's got a pretty incredible mind and he's he's just thought about things so so much you know and he's researched them so much that when he he says, there's a lot of thought into it. Yeah, he connects a lot of dots. And he's also, for everyone listening who might be triggered by us liking Jordan Peterson, maybe you consider yourself a bit progressive. I'm progressive too. I love psychedelics. In some regards, I'm progressive. But I would say

that he's a guy who's not afraid to admit when he's wrong and i think that's something that's lost in the conversation today yeah it's that if we're going to talk and i want to learn from you and i disregard the need to be right then i should be able to find a spot where at least i can look at things objectively enough to say oh you know what i can see it from your lens. And you know what? Maybe I am wrong, or maybe I should rethink that. Maybe there's a different way to look at this.

And maybe it's not right and wrong. Maybe it's just a different perspective or a different way I look at that. And if I'm open to that, that's how I can grow, right? I'm reading this book, Vedanta Treatise, and I've talked about it before. It's an excellent book. But he says, a belief that's strong enough

is the end of learning. Yep, because it's where you understand it as complete. And if it's complete, there's no further learning in that entire, whatever the fucking belief is, it's capped, there's an end point, right? And there is no end point, whether that's God, whether that's anything you want to fill in on the blank, whether that's science, all of it's unfolding, all of it's relearning, all of it's God, whether that's anything you want to fill in on the blank, whether that's

science, all of it's unfolding, all of it's relearning, all of it's saying, hey, guess what? Saturated fat's not bad for you. Guess what? Cholesterol is not bad for you. You know what I'm saying? Everything is being relearned and reimagined in different ways and it's all unfolding. Yeah. And where you got to catch yourself there, you're looking for the truth. You're not looking to be right. And that's how a lot of people come across. And that's how a lot of people get blindsided and why they don't learn anything more is because they get dogged down into like one type of thinking. And because they have this one type of thinking, they're not willing to learn anything else. And because they're not willing to learn anything else.

And because they're not willing to learn anything else, they're not going for the truth. They just want to be right. If we were having some type of disagreement right now, some people, even though they know that they're wrong, they'll still continue to argue their point just because they want to win the argument. They'd rather win their argument than actually get the truth, right? But in the end, the truth is what's going to set you free, as corny as it sounds, but it's absolutely true. So you don't want to be right. You want to find

the truth, right? So you want to find the truth before you want to be right. And I think that a lot of people are not doing that in society these days. And that's why they're not learning new information. And that's why they're stuck in their old ways, because they're unwilling to learn anything new. Fuck, I love it, brother. Where can people find you online? Well, people can find me online on Twitter, on Instagram, on Facebook, on LinkedIn. So it's Dr. Mike Hart on all uh social media platforms i also have a website mark uh mikehartmd.com uh and just as we were talking about earlier i am going to be launching a podcast sometime in 2020 hopefully in the next two or three months uh so you'll be able to get you know some more great content there hopefully fuck yeah brother uh what's the name of

the podcast going to be my cart show so far so far. Oh, that's keep it simple, dude. We went through three title changes and landed on Kyle Kingsbury Podcast. Like, we don't need anything else. That's awesome. Yeah. Awesome, brother. Dude, thank you so much for coming out here.

Thanks so much for being on the show. And it's been a pleasure working out with you and spending time with you today. It was really difficult to work out with you today. But I definitely still appreciate it. And thank you so much for having the podcast. I really wanted to come on. And I'm really, really happy that I did. Fuck yeah. Thank you, brother. Thank you guys for listening to the show with Dr. Mike Hart.

Let me know what you think at kingsboo.com. Sign up for my monthly newsletter, all that good shit. Check out my boys, onefarm.com slash Kyle for 15% off all their amazing CBD products. And we'll see you guys in a week. Take care.