Kyle Kingsbury Podcast - #155 Dr. Jason Wersland

Episode Date: May 11, 2020

KKP Dr. Jason Wersland is the Inventor and CEO of Theragun and we dive deep into percussion therapy and pain management. We discuss the birth of Theragun and his path to developing one the most elite products on the market for percussion therapy that has helped people around the world feel and move better.   Check out the NEW Generation 4 Theragun | https://www.theragun.com/us/en-us/kyle10   Connect With Dr. Jason Wersland Instagram | https://www.instagram.com/drjasonwersland/?hl=en Twitter | https://twitter.com/drjasonwersland?lang=en Facebook | https://www.facebook.com/DrJasonWersland/   Check out the Theragun app | https://apps.apple.com/us/app/theragun/id1445611295   Help support the podcast by visiting our sponsors:   Check out Dry Farm Wines and get a bottle for a penny | DryFarmWines.com/Kyle   Ancestral Supplements - Grass-Fed Colostrum  https://ancestralsupplements.com Use codeword VISIT  for 10% off / Only Valid through Shopify Option   OneFarm Formally (Waayb CBD) www.onefarm.com/kyle (Get 15% off everything using code word KYLE at checkout)   Get $100 off the Chek Institute’s Holistic Lifestyle Coach Level 1 online course by using KKP100 at checkout |  https://chekinstitute.com/hlc1online/   Connect with Kyle Kingsbury on: Instagram | https://bit.ly/3asW9Vm   Subscribe to the Kyle Kingsbury Podcast Itunes | https://apple.co/2P0GEJu Stitcher | https://bit.ly/2DzUSyp Spotify | https://spoti.fi/2ybfVTY IHeartRadio | https://ihr.fm/2Ib3HCg Google Play Music | https://bit.ly/2HPdhKY   Show Notes Muscle Activation Techniques | http://bit.ly/2vytM93 Vibracussor | http://www.impacinc.net/vibracussor.html Ivica Zubac | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ivica_Zubac Deskbound by Kelly Starrett | https://amzn.to/2xij4E7 Eric “Primal Swoldier” Leija | https://www.instagram.com/primal.swoledier/?hl=en Todd Durkin | https://todddurkin.com/ Mark Bell’s 10 minute walk | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DqpnpRW5DQA  

Hello friends, happy quarantine. We've got Dr. Jason Worsland on the podcast today. He came all the way out to Austin, Texas from California right before quarantine hit us. And we took a deep dive into his personal journey into health. And really, it's a fantastic interview. I'm just gonna leave it right there.

I wanna start to crunch these intros and just, especially when we have such great podcasts, if there's nothing else on my mind, I'm just gonna leave it to the interview itself and take care of sponsors. Today, we are brought to you by Living Collagen by Ancestral Supplements. Ancestral Supplements makes New Zealand-sourced nose-to-tail organ meats, bone marrow, and living collagen in simple, convenient gelatin capsules. Modern-day commercial collagens are produced from hides, hooves, and horns that are otherwise inedible. As such, they are highly processed with high heat, degreasing agents and acids and end up being far removed from anything resembling the ancestral living collagen that our

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night before. In fact, the other night I was watching the UFC fights with no fans in the audience and cracked open a bottle of dry farm wines and it was fantastic. So dryfarmwines.com slash Kyle, and you're going to get an extra bottle of wine for a penny. That's dryfarmwines.com slash Kyle, and you're going to get an extra bottle of wine for a penny. That's dryfarmwines.com slash Kyle for an extra bottle of wine for one penny. They can't do it for free. There's laws against that, but check these guys out. They are fantastic. We're also brought to you by One Farm. One Farm is making the very best CBD products on the planet. They are 100% USDA certified organic, and they use a full spectrum hemp, which means you get not just CBD, but all the other cannabinoids, all the other terpenes and things that have been shown to boost immunity like D-limonene and pinene and some of these fantastic nutrients that we're

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onefarm.com slash Kyle, 15% off everything storewide. And last but certainly not least, we're brought to you by my dude, Paul Cech. Paul's wife, Penny, reached out to me and wondered if I would be willing to promote their HLC1 class, which they're offering online. And I said, fuck yes, I have actually taken this course. I took it in 2012 and Angie was the teacher who, I think it was her first time teaching it. And you may have heard me talk about this in one of the many interviews where I've had Paul Cech on the show.

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notes for the brand new Theragun. Last but not least, Dr. Jason Worsland created the Theragun. I use it every single day. I've got a lot of old nagging injuries and sometimes I wake up stiff and it's one of the ways I wake up the body through percussion. And a lot of you are living solo right now and don't really have access to friends or family or people that would touch you. And even if you did, it's not like we all have a licensed massage therapist as a homie. And outside of that, really, how do we treat ourselves to a little tender, loving care? And Theragun is that thing. It's the thing that I wake up to and I say, okay, cool. It doesn't matter what kinks I have. I'm going to unlock them and really just open up my body before I do any practice from yoga to weightlifting to going for a run. This is the way that I get everything going. And as we dive into in this

podcast is one of the ways we wake up the nervous system and their generation four model just came out. It is the most elite system on the planet for percussion and opening up the body. And I think you guys are going to find a lot of use from it. In addition to that, it is dead silent. I mean, super quiet. It sounds like a Prius. I mean, it's just very, very incognito, almost like you don't even know it's on. But just a fantastic product.

I absolutely love Dr. Jason Worsland. Thank you guys for tuning in today's show. Let me know what you think. We are back on the gram as a joint account at living with the Kingsbury's. If you've got questions, shoot them over to me and my wife and we will get them answered. Thank you guys. Hope you enjoy this podcast as much as I did. All right. We just got clapped in. My boy, Ryan Giles is with us. I think for one or one, maybe one of his last episodes, on the team brian let me just say let me thank you brother you've been a brother and a friend and i fucking love you man so absolutely it's

been great great having you uh uh be my young jamie on this podcast for as long as it's run dr dr jason worsland is in the house yes sir there a gun yes sir well where do we begin i don't know i'm kind of honored though that i didn't realize this was your last shot like one or two more maybe we'll see yeah yeah lots of changes happening here at on it but uh let's talk um tell me you you have uh an incredible physique let's talk about growing up when you got into weightlifting all that stuff and kind of what led you to theragun you know my my it's funny i grew up in utah a little small town just outside of salt lake and um my my family's from norway so i think there's a little bit of that genetic in my you know like whether or not i worked out when i was younger i just was

always kind of a bigger kid so i was lucky in that sense I have a bunch of brothers and we're all kind of built the same way and but they there's a little saying in my town where I grew up where they all know if you're a Wurzlan because your ass is so big so I've always had good haunches and been a been a bigger dude wrestled and played rugby and all that was active when I was younger younger. And I actually started life, you know, I was going to play college football and things didn't work out, you know, that whole story. And I started doing some pre-med stuff. And I just, it was too much at the time. Like I hadn't really gone into biology and sciences and stuff like that when I was in

high school. Took a break, was a sales rep, bounced around just trying to figure my life out in the 20s. My mid-30s, I had a business of my own in Utah and I just wasn't satisfied. I'd always wanted to be a chiropractor kind of in the back of my mind. My neighbor when I was growing up was the chiropractor for the jazz. And I used to see what he would do. And he actually worked with a couple of guys from the Denver Broncos. And he came up with this muscle activation technique. It's called MAT.

And it's just sort of a way to work on meridians and different trigger points in the body to release tension and stuff. And I was really fascinated with how well he knew the body. And I thought, man, I want to do that. So so that was always there i went through a rough patch with my business guy stole a bunch of money from me so i had i look back on it now the worst time then but i thought i have to start over and i'm starting over what i want to do and i want to do something that i really love doing i can just be passionate about so i decided to go to chiropractic school i had two kids went through a divorce it was pretty ugly and in the lot of reinvention going on yeah it was it was um it was shedding the skin you know and i didn't i didn't realize but that takes time

you know i went to school at a little bit older age you know i was 30 32 33 when i went back to chiropractic school and you know taking a break and then going to school like that was tough and jumping right into those heavy sciences. But I did it. It's supposed to take four years, took seven. I didn't pass the national boards, the first two national boards, the first two times. And you have to wait six months to do it again. So I think the struggle was there and it was real. I had two kids in Utah and I was flying back and forth. And I just had this vision in mind. I wanted to have that doctor name.

I felt like if I had that, I could really do some things in life. And I envisioned brick and mortar and I'd have my sign on the building and things like that. And my brother's a chiropractor in Utah and to see his success and what he's doing and changing lives and how he's been able to really prevent some things in people's lives. It just was really inspiring and I wanted to do that. So that was my goal. I started a practice with a buddy of mine in LA on Fairfax and Wilshire. And I had another test to take at school and I jumped on my motorcycle in the morning. I lived in Venice and I was flying up the 10 freeway and a car cut me off and I slammed in the side of this car going 55 miles an hour. I sustained a ton of soft tissue

damage. It was crazy because I'm sure you've had a concussion. I got one and I hadn't had one for several years since probably high school or something. And I stood up and it was like a dream. It was like things were slow motion and I take my helmet off and it's cracked and I'm looking at the bike. I'm like, how the hell am I still walking? And I felt this blood on my arm. And there's a lot of traumatic things were happening at the time.

And I think what's really important is it was the worst timing ever. I just finished chiropractic school. I hadn't started a practice yet. I borrowed money to start the practice. And now suddenly I'm in this state where I can't do what I sacrificed everything to do. So I think that also put me in a foggy state, no pun intended from this concussion, but I really started trying to find alternative ways to treat myself. At this time, I really felt comfortable treating other people. And I was actually working on a lot of UFC guys at the time. They kind of came in and out of our gym. And I was really fascinated with what we could do, but there were a lot of modalities in

that chiropractic field coming into it at a little bit older age. Honestly, I thought it was bullshit. I'm looking at this stuff and I'm thinking, why are you doing all of this? Is it just to build the customers? And it didn't make sense to me from a business perspective. I want to get someone better and I don't want to see them on the street and have them be like, I came and saw you 10 times and not shit happened. And that's to be clear clear because a lot of people go back on the back and forth about this i've worked with some of the best chiropractors in the world it's 100 legit and but for every single chiropractor i've worked with that was legit there's at least one other guy who just wants to keep you coming back and they that's a business model of i'm going to get you

just good enough and then you're going to come back to me and then you're going to come back to me and you never get to leave any good trainer for physical training will train you to a point where you're good enough to go out on your own and you can train other people or you're you're at least set any good life coach wants to fix you or get you to a point where you've got shit figured out and you know how to trust your inner source yeah not to keep you coming back to them for the fucking rest of your life totally right so i just want to differentiate that because you know i know clearly that you you are that was what was to my understanding not resonating with you about some of these other yeah it just didn't that's a great way to say that actually i want to teach a man to fish i don't, I think there's a lot of fear-based things

in medicine in general, and then in chiropractic as well. I think everyone that you're talking to has had that experience where they meet a guy and he says, well, you got to come and see me twice a week for the next eternity. And that's just not, I didn't like that. I mean, my philosophy is if I can't get you better in four times, four visits, I'm the wrong guy. And if I can't like that. I mean, my philosophy is if I can't get you better in four times, four visits, I'm the wrong guy. And if I can't educate you about your body and your habits and your behavior, my whole goal is behavior change. Whether you're a fighter or you're a mother, what are you doing in your life that's breaking

your body down? And how can we prevent that from happening? What things can I put in your mind that helps you understand things from a different perspective that we're saving this vessel like this thing's got to last a while i i kind of had this philosophy and i i was using it and then i heard um uh not bill gates what's the guy's name warren buffett did a commercial for an insurance company i think and he and it was the most touching commercial. I was shocked that he was saying because it was so perfect. But he said, if you were born and your dad gave you a car, and it was the best, nicest

car ever, and you could only have that car the rest of your life, where are you going to park it? What kind of oil are you going to put in it? How are you going to treat it? How often are you going to clean it? And you think about this car has to last you your whole life. We would probably treat that car better than we would our body. And so that's kind of my philosophy. And it's not my body, it's yours. So with that concept, as I was working with people, I started understanding I

needed to empower them. And in chiroiropractic they'd have these handouts or homework or something that here's this sheet take this home and i realized i'm calling a lot of guys out by this excuse me i realized that that's a billable event that's why they're doing it and i thought well that's horseshit because no one's i remember maybe one or two things that a guy's told me i go home i get in my life and you don't do it so i think this whole concept was there but i'd i'd i'd set it on a shelf because i thought that was for everyone else and i'm stuck with this pain now and i i have a brother uh one of my brothers i mentioned as a chiropractor he'd been he was in utah and he'd been in a water skiing accident. And I remembered him using something that vibrated.

He was doing traction on his neck, hanging himself from his balcony out in Utah and looking through the kitchen window. I'm like, what the hell is he doing? And it didn't really register with me until I had my injury. And then I called him and I said, hey, he's been in the practice a little bit longer, a lot longer than I had, about 10 years by then. And I said, what were you doing? And he said, well, I'm tractioning my neck. And he kind of explained the physiology of what's happening. And then he said, this vibration really helps because it takes the pain away. Do you have one

of these? And it was called a VibraCusser. So I called my buddy at the time and I said, Hey, do we have one of these? He said, yeah, I haven't used it forever. It's in a closet. Go grab it, pulls it out. I go to the office, pull it out. It's about the size of a Coke can and it has an adjustable speed on the bottom, but it didn't have an adjustable amplitude. So it's a vibrational product and chiropractors use this to run it up and down your spine, to hit your facets, to kind of loosen up the joints. They'll use it sometimes around other joints in the body. It has different attachments. I was relatively familiar with it because they talked about it in school, but I'd never used one. So I pull it out. My brother

told me what to do with it. I took a bunch of piece apart and I started using this. I literally would just rest it underneath my armpit and the vibration would make the pain go away. And I was fascinated by that. Like, how is that? How could I put this underneath my arm? And within seconds, my body's relaxing. And my brain relaxes. I'm not on that fight or flight mode. I'm in this rest and digest mode. But what happened is my body started to accommodate to that.

I learned about accommodation in school, but I had not experienced it personally. Accommodation is like, you have your pants on, necklaces, earrings, glasses. I mean, how many times your parents walked in, their glasses are on their head, and they're like, you haven't even seen my glasses? Yeah. Because your body accommodates to that. It's not threatening. It puts it in the subconscious.

And I was really getting irritated about the fact that i kept it feels so good but then it would accommodate and it wouldn't work anymore so i'm messing with this for about 30 days this is in my accident was in uh on october 17th 2007 so october november december i'm working out at gold's and i'm just having this searing pain and I can't figure out what it is. It's like a cramp that won't go away. Finally go get an MRI at a nine millimeter disc bulge in my neck on the right side. And I'm like, I know what that is. This is not good. So I knew within the next 90 days, I better start dealing with this or I'm going to have permanent nerve damage.

So my only options at the time was surgery. And I didn't want that. I'm especially cranking on my neck and, and opioids. And we all know what that means. So I'm like, okay, none of that now starts coming back. These thoughts of being able to treat myself or do something with myself. I knew what I needed and I was getting it for maybe an hour a day for my buddy, but then I'd go home and I'm stuck. And I started recognizing the same thing that all of us deal with is that lonely, fearful, just that state you're in where like, is this how I'm going

to be the rest of my life? And for me, I'm thinking I sacrificed everything to come here and this is what I get. So that's the state of mind I was in, not realizing that I was literally going to invent something that has changed my life, let alone so many others. So I'm sitting in my house at 3.30 in the morning, January, 2008. And I'm irritated with this thing. I want to throw it out the window because my body just starts getting used to it and it's not working anymore. So I was thinking, I grew up with tools and I grew up around a farm and you become resourceful. And looking back on it now, I realized that was a little bit different for me. A lot of buddies I grew up with didn't have that. They didn't have horses and Tools and all those things so I became real handy when I was younger

I'm sitting there in my apartment. I'm like, I don't give a shit what this sounds like what it looks like What you call it? I need something that punches my armpit My subscap was so tight. It hurt all the time and I couldn't make it stop So i'm like, you know what i'm gonna make something So I went out to my garage grabbed two tools tools, brought them in, started messing with them. And I made one. And I started using it. And it's our, I call it V1, version one.

There's this thing and it was a jigsaw. And I would just take a hand towel and wrap it around the end of it. And then I put duct tape over that. Well, that's rough surface. And it's punching me at about almost an inch of amplitude. And it starts to make my skin raw so i'm thinking what i need to use something else i golf add some practice foam golf balls in the corner in my bag grabbed them and stuck it on the end and i just started using that so basically got myself better from january of 2008 to june of

2008 first little while was really treating myself for pain. And I think one of the things that's really interesting for people to understand is pain travels to the brain on one pathway and it's 55 miles an hour, ironically. And when something touches you on your skin, that information travels to your brain at 268 miles an hour. I was just messing with my nervous system. So I wasn't, the pain wasn't going away.

I was just using this product to stimulate the outside of my skin that was traveling to the brain faster. Now I'm overriding that pain. There's a analogy I do sometimes and the people in my office give me shit about it because they're like, what kind of mom did you have? But when you grow up and there's this analogy, you fall and skin your knee or you hurt yourself and you come in and you're like, hey, mom, I hurt my knee or whatever. She pinches the back of your arm and it makes the pain go away.

So that's getting to the brain faster. The brain suddenly now has to pay attention to that and not this slower information that's coming through our muscles and joints. That is really what started triggering this whole thing. It was for pain relief. And I use this still for pain relief with patients, athletes, people that I work on. That's the first thing it does. Then the next thing it does is releases tension. So the next few months I was releasing tension in my body. And then the next few months I was doing recovery. I was walking around Gold's gym with this jigsaw with a long cord, finding plugs wherever

I could, plugging in, doing my workouts with this thing during my sets. I'd rest and use this on the muscles. And I found that it just made me, it released it. It increases blood flow. The lactic acid wasn't there. And my muscles that were weak were splinting a lot when I was lifting and it was hurting. So I basically didn't realize it at the time. And the reason I kind of shared a lot of the backstory is you can

understand the state of mind I was in. I wasn't thinking of anyone else. I was really thinking, I got to get back to work. I got to get back and make some money. And I put that thing away. And I thought, okay, I'm done. There's got to be something like that out in the world somewhere. Someone's made this for sure. I'll see something later on down the road. It's not super pressing now. Go back to practice. A few months later, a patient comes in. My secretary hands me the paperwork. I'm reading through this paperwork. He'd been in a hit on bus collision. He's a bus driver in LA. His insurance sucks. His income isn't that high. And I knew with that story, I resonated with that. And I think had I not met this guy, this may not have happened. Because I looked at him and I thought, he needs what I

needed. He needs to be able to have something that can empower him in those times that i'm not treating him because if he comes back 12 times which is all his insurance would pay for i'm not going to get him better because every time he's going to come back especially in that first 30 to 45 days i remember that you didn't want anyone to touch you so i'm thinking i'm going to use insurance and i'm going to get him to the point where I'm doing therapy and nothing's going to happen after that. So I thought, you know what? Maybe I'll let him try this. So I remember telling him, like feeling his pain, knowing what he felt like.

Look, dude, I want you to use this. And it's just your only job is to keep yourself out of pain until you come back and see me the next time. I could spend a lot of time on that story. But basically, long story short, he came back and it worked. We got him better in a short period of time. And I remember walking in one time and seeing him in the corner of my clinic on this table, using it in my clinic. And he just looked at me with these eyes and he said, Doc, this thing's amazing.

And I remember feeling, oh, no, I got to figure this out. Like it worked for me and it worked for him and I need to figure out what this is. So from that time forward, it's just really been nonstop science. I made five different versions between 2008 and 2015. Met my business partner in 2015. We started Theragun as a company in January of 16. Then we launched our G1, which a lot of people still have seen or have in June of 16. The minute we started doing that, I realized ergonomics of that just aren't scalable. I couldn't use it a long time. I had to hold my hand on the trigger. And there were a lot of inherent things that I just didn't like about the product. And earlier on, I'd drawn some different designs about

maybe ergonomics and how I could hold it and how someone else could treat themselves. And that's when I started understanding how empowering it was that I could teach someone how I did it and watching him have his relief. Jigsaws aren't made to treat people. They're made to cut wood. Yeah. So I had to make something that was more ergonomically designed so that it was easier for you to use on yourself. So G2 came out in July, August of 2007. We launched, immediately started working on G3. g3 pro we launched in january of 19 april 19 we launched g3 and live and now those were like 12 13 14 versions and um i think one

of the things to understand is that i'm never satisfied these These things have to get better. I see the benefits that happens with my mom, Kyrie Irving. I mean, there's people from either ends of the spectrum that are using this and I wanted to make it so that it was applicable to both sides, multiple speeds, different attachments. People don't know, it took me years to figure out these attachments and how they work with your physiology of the body and how you don't want to overstimulate the skin. You want to stimulate the tissue underneath. So a lot of the products on the market right now have these hard plastic attachments. That feels good.

Just like a Swedish massage feels good, but there's probably not a large amount of therapeutic benefits to those. So I think that's one of the things that's happening right now is people like oh my god this feels so good with some of the vibrational products but they don't recognize the difference between vibration and percussion that was a long soapbox i like that no i like fucking throwing lobbing softballs and letting people knock it out of the park that was that was great um let's let's talk a bit about that. I would love to know more. You guys did a clinic here at Onnit when we partnered with you. And I think I was out of town, so I didn't get a chance to

make it to that. Talk a bit about, I guess, first, talk a bit about the difference between percussion and vibrational tools. Because I know a lot of people saw Dave Asprey on vibe plates and shit like that. And he's talking about working out once every two weeks and you're like oh so i can have your body no fucking thanks you know um yeah sorry i'm not interested um but but talk a bit about this because i mean there there is something i've used your product for a long time it is absolutely phenomenal and i've got a lot of old kinks and shit from fighting and playing football since i was 10 years old. And it works very quickly. But I want to dive into some of the differences between percussion and vibration and then some of the ways in which this is being shown to work on a deeper level.

So vibration is, I think the easiest way to say it is vibration is a great therapy. But it's a whole body experience. It's more of a global experience. And that's why vibrational plates became so popular is they recognized if I put something vibrating on your shoulder, your body really can't identify where it's at. So it recognizes that as noxious information and it accommodates to that. Now, if you stand on something that's vibrating and you're rocking back and forth and some of those protocols they do, it'll stimulate your nerve that travels straight from your foot to your brain. There's not many nerves, very few of them that actually go straight to the brain without bifurcating, meaning it's accessing other parts of the

nervous system. So that's one of the strong things about vibrational platforms. I've been able to, since this has happened, I've been able to really spend a lot of time with some of the best scientists in the world about vibration percussion. And it's very clear that it has a different effect on the nervous system. I think in a simple way for the people that are listening, for you and I, percussion has a larger amplitude and a lower frequency. And if you think about physical therapy products, not knocking them, but that's where a lot of the vibration came from, they have a large frequency but a low amplitude,

like shockwave therapy. That's on your body. It's not coming off the body and back on, but it's click, click, click, click, click, click's not coming off the body and back on okay but it's click click click click click click click so it has a certain frequency but the amp like a stem unit yeah stem unit great ultrasound is another one um there's a lot of products in that space that they used high frequency to cold laser cold laser yeah yeah exactly and look i use all those they're amazing and i use them for specific things

the difference between that and and uh percussive therapy is percussive therapy is flipped on its head it's a lower frequency with a higher amplitude and what makes it work so well is it comes off the body and back on the body you think about, it's happening 40 times a second. The body can never accommodate to that. So it feels good the whole time. You're basically outpacing the nervous system. Totally. Exactly. It's a great way to say that. So that feedback mechanism back and forth, the body just can't keep up with it, but it can't accommodate to it either. So percussive therapy gets deeper into the tissue, which releases heat

in the tissue, deep in the tissue. So now you're getting heat from the inside out. I like to say it's like melting butter. If you melted butter and you get just enough, like eight seconds, it's soft in the middle, but it's still hard on the outside. That's what's happening to the body. That heat's generating from the inside out i've worked on people and they get up and it's like my body's whole body's warm but you touch their skin and it's no different temperature than you're not sweating from it yeah yeah so they feel the heat those are things that i need so basically percussive therapy decreases pain and increases range of motion the second thing the increased range of motion is The second thing, the increased range of motion,

is it actually has an effect on the Golgi tendon organ. Our Golgi tendon organ, to activate it, it's kind of you have to think about it backwards. When you activate it, it releases. So now hamstrings, everyone's got tight hamstrings. We do this little test where you do 10 seconds on the origin of the hamstring, which is where the Golgi is on the origin.

You do 10 seconds on the insertion of the hamstring, which is the insertion of the Golgi organ. And you do 10 seconds up and down the muscle. That muscle now is 50 to 80% more flexible in 30 seconds than the side you didn't do that on. And stronger. And stronger. And stronger because it activates that actinomycin. And now the actinomycin are binding and it's not, you're not causing tug of war between

the muscle and the Golgi organ. So obviously I didn't know this when I started doing it, but I've learned it since then. So you're not, I've done the same test with a vibrational product and you don't get that same release. Now it doesn't last forever. It doesn't last all day. You know, I, I joke with people. It's not Jesus.

It didn't cure you, but you staff to stay on that. There's a story I like to tell that kind of explains this. There's a guy who played for the Lakers. He's, he's on the Clippers now. And I never remember his name. He's a Eastern European guy. Zoback, I think. Zuback. Gunnar Peterson's a buddy of mine. He's the strength coach for the Lakers. He calls me. He's like, hey, can you come over here and work on these guys? So inflexible. And he's a big dude. One of the things I really love doing is changing people's paradigm.

And when you talk to someone about an injury or something about their body, they're convinced that is gospel. Yeah, they're going to be this way the rest of their lives. This happened to me. They're locked in that narrative and it's reinforced through the mind. Yeah, and I wasn't able to do that.

That's why. And so they come to me with this really convincing story about how they are who they are and i in subtle ways i want to try and change that for them so i walk in this guy's seven two he's never been able to touch his feet never been able to touch your feet well i did when i was younger well then don't say never okay so what do you want to do well i want to be more flexible hamstrings i took theragun in probably 10 minutes working the kinetic chain releasing his tension from his mid back to the bottom of his feet dude stands up and almost

touches the ground and when he first started he was just past his knees the players you can imagine these guys are all giving him shit and hollering about the fact that he now can lean over and touch the ground almost but But I think the point is him standing up and looking at me, that first look like, holy shit, what'd you just do to me? And I had to tell him, now it's your responsibility because this you can do. So no more limits, no more excuses. Now you got to start using this product. That's an athletic setting. Now you take that same sort of experience with someone who's had shoulder surgery and now it's affecting their daily life and their

ability to be with their kids or make an income or commute, whatever it is. And now you release that tension, that's a massive change. So for me, I've just found how this product works effectively and efficiently, and your body's not accommodating to it like vibration therapy. So I hope that kind of explained a little bit about the differences. Vibration, again, is a global experience. Percussive therapy is a local experience that your body doesn't accommodate to. I love that answer, brother um let's talk a little bit about like uh best practices in terms of obviously you know the majority of human beings are in a seated position some people go as far as to say sitting is the new smoking uh kelly

stirret who's the homie wrote an entire book i love kelly that's a good friend bound you know and so um let's talk about that because i mean i remember the first time i watched his super couch stretch i realized how important not only is that for me to get the anterior chain open but how important that is for a lot of people and i mean to be quite honest like i use theragun before and during every fucking workout i have and the reason for that is uh it's kind of what you were alluding to. And I saw Swolder doing this. He was using it in the workout, in between sets. And it's flushing the system.

But I want you to get through a lot of these things because I think a how-to guide, I think everybody should own one. And I want a how-to guide on best practice because I missed the seminar that you guys did. I find when I hit insertion points like the hip flexors the psoas uh it's like kelly says you feed slack through the whole system yeah it's almost like the body starts to open up my my quads start to relax into a stretch it's much easier to

get into his super couch stretch if i first get those insertion points yeah um talk a little bit about that and then talk about priming the system because there is a clear fucking difference in uh my ability to fire quickly even in my opening sets you know if i warm up with the bar if i foam roll and i warm up with the bar for back squats and then 135 it's not the same as if i foam roll get some breath work going and then get the Theragun going in different places on my body before I start. And then 135 feels like a fucking paperweight, as it should, right?

Because my nervous system is switched on in an instant. I'd love for you to expand upon that. It really is tension. The Golgi, the things that Kelly's are talking about is, and it's fun to meet other people that know him. I love him. He's a great dude and a good advisor for me in a lot of things. But the tension that builds up in our bodies is subtle, but it compounds. When you use this product in those areas, you're allowing the body to move the way it's supposed to. And people will say to

me, what is Theragun doing? And in that course they taught here, we talk about four physiological things and four neurological things. Those are just the four that are easy to talk about, but there's a cumulative effect of a lot of things happening. So when you release that tension in the body, it triggers a part of your brain that allows you to move in a larger range of motion. Some people say that it's proprioception. It's our ability to know where we are in space. I believe that, but I also feel like there's other things we just don't know yet that this thing's doing. When you apply this to those areas, and I do it on the airplane. I mean, your hip flexors, I can't figure out why they're firing, but my body is in this subtle state of tension. And now we always are. When you're sitting in a chair, you don't feel like it, but your body's joints are becoming shorter and the muscles are becoming shorter. Now you stand up and you have to move in a dynamic way. It's not ready for that. And when we quote unquote warm up, we're getting blood flow into white tissue and that triggers a release. If you could get blood flow into white tissue

without having to warm up, that would be a magic. That'd be magic. That's what's happening. So the stretches that Kelly talks about putting you in, you're increasing the range of motion on those joints and your body can't just jump right into that. As we all know, that's why the warmup, but to his point, if you're sitting on a couch and you've got to get up and move, you're a fireman and you're asleep and it's three in the morning and you have 30 seconds, sometimes even less to get something moving. Firemen use our product and that's exactly why they do it. Because to your point, whether you're lifting a 300 pound hose or 250 pound squat, your body has to have the power and the range of motion.

And it's got to communicate with your brain so that you know what that range of motion is. So Theragun's facilitating movement by releasing tension and firing those parts of your brain that allow you to move through better space. I work on a lot of quarterbacks and Deshaun Watson has been a good friend for a few years. And I was working on him as his last year before he went into the combine and then through the combine and then at the combine. And then as he got, went into Houston. And one of the things he loved about theragun is that it allowed his ability to aim to be able to turn on you know you think about how many times those guys are throwing

a baseball a cricket thrower i mean people that are just winging the ball they have to hit the bullseye every time i was watching this morning they're talking about how accurate um breeze is and breeze works with todd durkin and and i know those guys use theragun i'm not saying theragun is what's made him that accurate i'm saying how accuracy is such an important thing to what he aspect of what he does so i think to your point it's really back to what i was saying it releases the tension of your Golgi. And the secret of that class you're talking about is where to put it and how long to leave it there to get the outcome you're looking for. So before and during, you're hitting different spots.

Before your workout and during your workout, you're hitting different spots, but it's allowing the same facilitation. And after you work out for recovery, it's anywhere. It's like you're painting your body or shaving your entire body. You hit everything. Increases oxygen to the muscles, releases tension in the body, increases lymphatic flow, increases blood flow. And all of those things is what your body needs after you just treat it like a race car for an hour.

So does that make sense? Yeah. Hopefully that makes a little bit more sense. Yeah. What have you come across in terms of consistent injury with the general population? Because I think this is, I guess the thing I'm driving home here, we have a lot of athletes that listen to this show, professional fighters, different people like that. But for people who work a nine toto-five and show up in your

office with something going wrong yeah i mean i i remember the first time that i had learned low back pain is likely tight hamstrings type tight psoas uh talk about some of those connection points for people who yeah are stuck in a desk we you know i think unfortunately sciatica 12 years ago wasn't a commonly known ailment, but now it is. And it's usually from sitting too long, whether you're in a commute. I mean, in LA, there's people that's sitting on a wallet and they don't realize that sitting on the wallet is actually causing some of your issues. Sciatica, let's answer that question. Sciatica, carpal tunnel tunnel low back pain for sure um shoulder and neck pain we call it tech neck you think about what everyone's doing nowadays you know

i was standing at the airport yesterday just waiting in line and i watched this lady she was probably 60 her chin was in her chest for 20 minutes staring down at her phone. And she's probably not going to realize when she gets home that night, why her neck hurts so bad. My grandpa was a tailor in Norway and I remember how thick his neck was. And I'm thinking how you're 80 years old. How are you still this chunk of meat? But he was constantly looking down. Like that's what his position was and you start

putting that strain on those muscles that's what's going to happen so the that's we built we had an app we have an app right now and our app has the top 17 ailments that i've seen over the years and effective treatment protocols to treat yourself not me you treat yourself for these issues how to identify them and due to your point sciatica is generated from the nerve either being caught in your piriformis which is right in the middle of your butt cheeks on either side or it's being impinged on from you loading your low back now Now, I can identify those. I can diagnose that by movements and orthopedic testing, but there's a lot of people that are suffering and it's a dull ache. They start messing with the Theragun and they find out, oh, it's right there.

They find the piriformis and their instinct is just jam it in there. Like, I'm going to make this pain go away. That's a nerve. If you piss that nerve off, you're going to be in trouble for days. So to put together that protocol, it's ironic. You have to do the opposite side QL. You have to do the same side glute med to release that. The same side hamstring, and then go back to the same side QL. There's a protocol to that.

And you're releasing, I can think about it like you're straightening the covers on your bed. You can't do it from one corner. You have to go to all corners and flatten it out. So that's the same thing you're doing. Imagine your piriformis is in the middle of the bed and there's a huge wrinkle there. If you keep pulling from one side, you're going to rip the whole thing off the bed. But you have to go side to side, side to side. The last place you treat is the piriformis and you do it lightly. You're adding this increased blood flow. You're letting the piriformis release.

It's splinting. It's squeezing that sciatic nerve between itself, kind of like cutting paper with scissors. You have to release that. So there's those ailments. that pure that that sciatic nerve between itself kind of like cutting paper with scissors you have to release that so there's those ailments that's the part that's not instinctive about theragun and honestly that's where i feel responsibility to make sure that my 12 years of experience that i can actually share that with people and they understand like really how to treat themselves my business partner called me it's been a couple of months ago, they were up at Aspen

skiing and he actually, no, they were back at home and he calls me and he said, hey, my wife can't get out of bed. She's got sciatica. I'm like, or I over the phone, I'm like, what is it? Tell me this. Oh, it's sciatica. We'll tell her to do this, this, and this. And she did it.

It didn't cure her, but she was able to get up and move. And then it started to kind of, the heat started coming, the body started warming up. She starts moving it. And I like to talk about how the brain starts to recognize, okay, this is the new movement pattern. If you don't understand that, your body's going to take the path of least resistance. Now you have these shitty movement patterns. You don't know that. And you're suddenly stuck in an area where you got to put something in an airplane overhead and you can't get your shoulder up. Now you just pulled your, your rotator. So there's a lot of those things that, that I talk about with prevention, but back to

your question with some of the most common ailments, they, they are from people being sedentary. You know, I, you know i think kelly and i joke about the sitting is the new smoking that whether or not that's dramatic or not it kind of is i mean that people are just out of shape they don't move anymore and i think they don't move because it's it's resistance and not a lot of people like resistance you know i don't know if that makes yeah no that makes perfect sense yeah i'm thinking about uh not a lot of people like resistance you know i don't know if that makes yeah no that makes perfect sense yeah i'm thinking about uh not a lot of people like resistance i mean i mean mark bell a lot of people in the space of health and wellness fitness bodybuilding powerlifting crossfit

whatever the case is we're all circling back to ancestral living i mean we're all circling but the paleo movement we're circling back to how did our ancestors live how can we recreate that you know mark bell uh coming up with his 10 minute walk idea it's so simple but it really is brilliant like everyone has time for a fucking 10 minute walk right you know and if you can start to add that into your your post breakfast your post your post meal at lunch right after dinner now all of a sudden you got 30 minutes that's that's that's stockpiling the bank of movement opening up the limbic system getting you to flush your body and even that's not great if you sit at a desk for for eight hours nine hours a day right and obviously there's a lot of tips and tricks from kelly's book desk bound for that standing desks different things to flex the feet but i find so much use for their gun out in and

outside of working out and it's just something that that really it is it's a brilliant invention brother without question you know i don't usually i've had i think a small hand under five products that i've had on here juve light was one brilliant product uh i'm not the kind of guy that's like yeah come on the show you know it's it's it to discuss a product but this is it's something that can really help people and change people's lives i mean without a doubt yeah it's it that what you're talking about right now is really what's driven me you know i in the story i talk about this a lot but i didn't i tried to quit a dozen times. And when I say that, I mean, I didn't understand why this kept coming back into my life. There's a time in my life where I was

getting up early in the morning and driving to the UCLA track to work on a bunch of track people, and I'd make $20 for four hours, work till noon, go to my practice, get done at practice, go do concierge treatments on celebrities and different athletes and stuff around the town. And it was just grind after grind and everyone wanted Theragun. And I'm thinking, I can't do this anymore. It's not scalable. It's not paying my bills. And I'd literally, I would be pissed. I'd put it in a box and I'd put it in a closet somewhere. I'd be like, fuck you. You're not working for me right now. And inevitably, someone would call me and say, can you get that thing?

There's a girl who's a performer, a dancer for shows in Vegas. And she has to wear this huge headdress that's connected to her low back. So imagine carrying that big, heavy thing. And you have no rotational experience. Her neck was massive. She was 130 pounds. And most of it was in her neck. And I'd treat her and she would love it. And I just used so many different people as validation for what I was doing.

But it's been hard. It's been difficult. It's a lot of work. But I also feel like it's important people understand that there was something behind this product that drove me. It's not fair for me to take the credit. It really isn't. I just happened to be this conduit of this product and feel the responsibility to make sure everyone understands how to use it from you to your mom. And it does work. I mean, our whole goal, people, I think the reason I'm here is people have seen athletes use it.

And the athlete world really did grow us quickly. But people don't realize I was using this in my clinic on injured and chronic pain people for years before anyone even knew what it was. So when people say to me, is this for everyone? I'm like, yeah, that's where it started. So I think that's our goal now as a company is to be able to provide this for everyone? I'm like, yeah, that's where it started. So I think that's our goal now as a company is to be able to provide this information to the masses and help them understand there are natural alternatives to treat your pain. It doesn't always have to be a pill.

Yeah, brother. Fuck yeah, dude. It's been so excellent having you on the show. I'm excited to give you a tour here. I appreciate you having me on here. I'd love to have you work on me. I've got some tightness, brother. I'd love to get some tips and tricks. Very cool. Where can people find you online? And where can people get their hands on this product?

And mention the app one more time. Yeah, theragun.com. It has everything on there. We've got some YouTube channels and stuff. They're on there. Instagram is theragun, at theragun. My Instagram is at drjasonworsland, W-e-r-s-l-a-n-d people think there's a z in there um we have educational programs we have online courses that have to help people understand how to use this from a licensed massage therapist to a clinician and a personal trainer we're building

those out more and more uh we kind of want to have something like a genius bar where people can pop in, take a five-minute little course and understand how to use this for really anything, getting out of a wheelchair, taking a walk. You know, walking is a real important thing. So I really appreciate you having me on here. I mean, these types of experiences help people understand and open their mind to the fact that there are other things out there and they're not just for athletes so appreciate it

yeah fuck yeah brother beautiful thank you so much for coming on appreciate it thank you guys for tuning in to today's show remember to check the show notes for the link for the brand new generation 4 theragun and uh let us know what you think over at, at living with the Kingsbury's. We can get any and any and all questions answered regarding this show. And we've got all of our other sponsors listed in there. Love y'all. And I'll see you in a week.