Kyle Kingsbury Podcast - #275 Dan Cleland - Soltara

Episode Date: October 26, 2022

Our brother Dan is back on the pod yall! You know him as the mind and warrior behind the incredible ceremony space, Soltara. I’ve been and will 100% be back to give him and all the fam down there big love. He’s back today to One: cut it up with yours truly, and Two: Talk about his new book, band and life. We dive into the state of the world’s consciousness and tensions that arise globally.    New book: "12 Laws of the Jungle: How to Become a Lethal Entrepreneur    ORGANIFI GIVEAWAY Keep those reviews coming in! “GotTuba?” got it in September, hopefully they’re reaching out though kingsbu.com. All ya new ones, please drop a dope review and include your IG/Twitter handle and we’ll get together for some Organifi even faster moving forward. Connect with Dan:   Website: danielcleland.com                soltara.co Instagram: @danielccleland - @soltarahealingcenter Twitter: @soltaracenter Facebook: facebook.com/soltarahealingcenter Podcasts: Daniel Cleland Podcast                  Spotify - iTunes YouTube: Soltara   Show Notes:   KKP #185 Dan Cleland - Soltara Spotify Apple     Sponsors:   PaleoValley Some of the best and highest quality goodies I personally get into are available at paleovalley.com, punch in code “KYLE” at checkout and get 15% off everything! Our Sponsor - Aura offers all-in-one digital safety for your entire household. Identity theft, fraud, and malware are just some of their offerings. Go to https://aura.com/kyle for 14 days free and 40% off your plan.  Bioptimizers To get the ’Magnesium Breakthrough‘ deal exclusively for fans of the podcast, click the link below and use code word “KINGSBU” for an additional 10% off. magbreakthrough.com/kingsbu  Organifi Go to organifi.com/kkp to get my favorite way to easily get the most potent blend of high vibration fruits, veggies and other goodies into your diet! Click that link and use code “KKP” at checkout for 20% off your order!   To Work With Kyle Kingsbury Podcast   Connect with Kyle:   Fit For Service Academy App: Fit For Service Academy  Instagram: @livingwiththekingsburys   Odysee: odysee.com/@KyleKingsburypod  Youtube: Kyle Kingbury Podcast  Kyles website: www.kingsbu.com  Zion Node: https://getzion.com/ > Enter PubKey  >PubKey: YXykqSCaSTZNMy2pZI2o6RNIN0YDtHgvarhy18dFOU25_asVcBSiu691v4zM6bkLDHtzQB2PJC4AJA7BF19HVWUi7fmQ   Like and subscribe to the podcast anywhere you can find podcasts. Leave a 5-star review and let me know what resonates or doesn’t.

All right, y'all, we are back with a shorty, but a goody. I want to say it's a shorty because for the first time in a very long time, I had a technical difficulty podcasting with the return of my brother, Dan Cleland, the CEO of Sultara. Sultara being my absolute favorite place in the world to journey pilgrimage for ayahuasca. I think they have the best hands down. I mentioned that in the podcast here, so I'm not going to beat the drum too bad on it. Dan has a new book. Back to this tech issue. Dan and I are podcasting. He's in Costa Rica, not far from Sultara. And every now and then,

they get rolling blackouts. And what had happened was using our web service, it cut out. We went to log back on. And when we logged back on, because it was quick, it hadn't finished uploading his original file. So we lost the first 15 minutes. I'll give you the short of it. Dan was wondering how to stay shredded while on a ketogenic diet, but keep his strength.

And I was talking about this little teeter-totter, if you will, of carbohydrates adding muscle. And, you know, yada, yada, yada, went back and forth. So that was that. I mean, the best I can remember from a week ago. And I've had a couple of podcasts since, and I actually don't remember what the fuck we were talking about. So I'm sorry. I'm sorry. We don't, that's gone. It's gone. It's somewhere in the Easter's. Um, the last 45 minutes was dope. And that's one thing I made sure of. Um, I listened to it. I had the crew listened to it and they're like, yeah, this is absolutely good.

We dive into the nitty grittiness of his book. We dive in a lot into Dan's music, which is total fucking left turn. I did not expect the conversation to go there. And it was awesome. And a lot of what's happened for Dan personally and, you know, as the man in charge of Sultara since the last two years, because this is a business that doesn't exist without tourism, right? So just imagine the hit they took when their country locked its borders

and when all the new things started coming into play. Quite scary, but he's able to pivot and run with it. And he's done such an excellent job. And I'm so thrilled and happy for him. And he's got a new book. So we talk all about that good stuff, what he's able to pivot and run with it. And he's done such an excellent job and I'm so thrilled and happy for him. And he's got a new book. So we talk all about that good stuff, what he's learned, a lot of what he's learned through the parallels of the jungle and life.

And this was a phenomenal conversation. So I know you guys are gonna dig this one. There are many ways you can support this podcast. First and foremost, just share it with a homie. Share it with a friend that is interested. So in any of these, like my last podcast, if you it with a homie. Share it with a friend that is interested. So in any of these, you know, like my last podcast, if you've got a friend who likes music or is getting into sound healing and things like that,

send them to Listening Smile. Send them the podcast with Ian Morris. If somebody is saying, hey man, I think I'm ready for plant medicine, send them this one. Let them hear about Dan Cleland. And obviously this podcast we dive into is, you know, it's not just about ayahuasca.

It's mostly on all sorts of other shit, but tell them about this podcast to have a vibe with Dan and have them look at Sultara. Share it with people that you know are interested in the thing that you're sharing with, and that'll get them to listen. And then little by little, we spread the word. And then finally, leave us a five-star rating.

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version of anything pumpkin spice. It's a must-have. My wife right now is actually going to potentially start working with the Japanese yams we've grown on our garden, the Gardeners of Eden. And we're going to see if we can mix in a little pumpkin spice into that, how that turns out. So stay tuned for the next Organifi read because I'll likely have some intel there. Organifi.com slash KKP. Do not forget to use the code KKP at checkout for 20% off. Thank you, Organifi, for being such a long sponsor and hooking up my listeners fat. Y'all are the best. And without further ado, my brother, Dan Cleveland. All right. Well, brother Dan, we lost you there for a second. You're out in Costa Rica and you get the rolling blackouts, just like I'm familiar with in

Tulum and different parts of the world. Thankfully, your internet restarted quickly. And even though I lost wherever the fuck I was talking about with regard to ketosis and I think you were just telling me to lift heavy. Yeah, lift heavy, keto gain style, right? Lift heavy. When you do decide to fast, throw it in as a curveball. Don't make it every single day. You'll find after a heavy lift, if you're doing four sets of eight to 10

on big lifts like deadlift, you got to fucking eat breakfast. You can't skip breakfast the next day because your body's demanding it for recovery. But as long as you're not overtraining, you'll have days where you feel decently recovered. And the next day you're not training, as long as you're not overtraining, you'll have days where you feel decently recovered. And the next day, you're like, fuck it, bulletproof coffee or just water up until noon, those kind of things. So you'll have that opportunity to kind of mix and match. And I think that's where, as long as you keep your body guessing, that's when fat loss continues. Sick. Well, you got a new book.

We've been chopping it up here for like 15, 16 minutes, all on diet and goodies. And it's great to see your face, man. I miss you. I miss coming out there. Unfortunately, well, not unfortunately, we're very fortunate to have little ones. But we made the decision to not leave our little ones while they're little. Bear, when we left him, I think he was three with my family out in California. He had a gnarly accident at a play place and cracked his head

open, hairline fracture. We had to fly out the next day. He was in the ICU. Thankfully, there's no brain bleeds, nothing. He recovered too fast for his own good, and we had to slow his ass down. So full recovery, but life is precious. And even though the same shit might've happened with me there, I would have rather have been there for it than to have him go through that without us. So with Wolfie at two years old, it's probably going to be a few years before we make our way back to Sultara, but it is on our mind. I'm right there with you guys when Aubrey and the crew make their way out and Eldaray Gon comes in and I'm listening to all these stories and I can't wait. I'm super excited to be able to head back and spend time with you, brother.

Well, you know, you guys are all really, really good friends to us. And you've not only been good friends to us, but you've helped us out a lot in kind of spreading the word, especially I think you were the first one from the whole kind of on it, Aubrey, FFS crew to come down. So you were like the FFS guinea pig in a certain way. And you came down and helped to build that bridge. You were like the FFS guinea pig in a certain way. And you came down and helped to build that bridge. So, you know, we're eternally grateful for that.

And, of course, you and Tosh are always welcome and Bear and Wolfie when they get old enough to come down to. Oh, yeah. Even if it's just to hang out and and kick it uh while you guys do your own work um so yeah man when the time is right you'll make your way back and we'll be here as they say here in costa rica si dios quiere which means if god wants then uh we'll still be here um and yeah man of course anytime i like that well you've been you've been busy since we last talked you've you've got i remember you you i think you were in a band prior i'm not sure certain but you've you're are you in a new band now no no no we uh you was this the same band i mean it in the same band which is also a new band band, I mean, we cliche and we we started playing

uh some of the old stuff we used to write and we wrote some new stuff and then we just uh i i was friends with a with a world-renowned producer named logan mater because he wanted to do ayahuasca so um you know so he was interested in developing a relationship with me i invited him down he invited me to some concerts uh to go like when they were touring go backstage and everything so that was i got like a kind of inside look at at all that and um we invited him down to record a demo this was like about a year ago in costa rica so not that long ago and uh he came down we recorded demo it became a full album uh but only instrumentals and then we found we found three other guys here in Costa Rica who

were like already in the music business here um and so they were interested in our project because they both they liked the music and and you know uh being the success of sultara i had some budget to put behind it you know and in the music business if you don't have budget you don't have anything so um so so they kind of they kind of dropped the band that they were in and they came and joined us and um you know then we added all the other elements to the first album. We released that in November of last year. And we've done a bit of touring and stuff. And we recorded a second album in actually December of last year. So really quick.

We added those guys into the second album. But we've been sitting on the second album for the whole year. We got a manager from New York. So and publicist from, you know know that he works with in pennsylvania and we've just been kind of taking a different approach doing it a little more slowly and more strategically so kind of building the foundations in the in the industry before launching that second album uh and we just got a uh a record deal just recently like a week or two ago so we're now just in the process of like giving them all the assets they're going to start

uh launching uh singles but doing it in a more traditional way like that's uh you know we're going to be working with premium partners for distribution and promotions and stuff like that so we'll have video content new music content all coming out november 2nd um starting and then you know just every six or eight weeks another single another video and then eventually the album so that's happening and we're doing shows uh we're playing in mexico uh with uh sepultura of all bands i mean any metalhead would know who sepultura is right they're brazilian band from way back in the day uh i don't i realize not lots of people like metal but you know we picked our niche and that's just that's just how it is um but yeah they're one of the legacy bands from like from way back it was actually the first metal band ever listened to

back in the 90s so um you know we're going on tour with them and then this this uh world renowned producer logan mader who invited me to go to see one of his concerts back in 2020 when before the pandemic started he's actually coming to join us on stage and play third guitar on stage for these shows of sepultura and he's also sepultura from like way back so this is kind of a momentous occasion for us coming up here and then you know right after that right after that tour of mexico we're going to be dropping singles and promoting the new album working on uh working on getting uh visas for the u.s so we can go in like we had a tour lined up in mexico but basically the whole u.s 25 dates but we felt it was too risky to go in there without having visas so you know we're

going through that whole process of getting visas seems like the only migrants the u.s wants right now have to walk across the border illegally but um but we're still trying to go busting people in that don't want to work and you're fucking people that do want to work they're making them go through the gauntlet exactly yeah so we're yeah we're going through that and then you know hopefully hopefully we just keep up the momentum because it's just it's fun you know it's just it's just like a hell of a dream come true. Being 40 years old, jumping up on a stage, playing metal with some of your all-time favorite bands is just super fun, man. So the fact that – and really it's been Sultara that's allowed me to do this. Just having such a great team to hold down the fort here while you know me and jesse go away and you know having having the budget to be

able to to put behind these these international adventures and stuff like that uh it's it's pretty sick and then yeah on top of that um i've got a a book coming out later this month in october which has also been a long time in the making and got held up to be a little more strategic about the launch. And that's just basically, you know, kind of telling the story from our perspective of what happened to our business once it was like at all time you know like kind of reached the reached the the objective right before the pandemic hit it was like okay we're great you know like everything's good the right people are coming you know we're finally in the black the team is strong and you know i'm loving life and then like literally two weeks after like the best, you know, that feeling of like everything's firing on all cylinders, when pandemic shutdown instantly turns off all revenues. And then it's like this no end in sight kind of bullshit lockdown that we were all going through. Right. We all have our own story for that but just from the perspective of like a startup business

and how we got through that as a startup business that really didn't have a ton of stability built in just yet and um and you know the the the methodologies and lessons that I had learned prior to that, that were maybe not quite as well defined or as specific that that I put into practice to get us through that whole, that whole kind of snake bite, as I call it in the book. And then, you know, really just come out swinging on the other side. And, you know, we've basically been, we've just been, I mean, doing extremely well since coming out of that lockdown and getting stronger by the month, you know, so, um, so really just trying to communicate that kind of knowledge that, that I've gained to other people who, uh, you know, startup entrepreneurs and people who are working on their own practices, there's probably life lessons for, for everybody in there, but, um, yeah, so that's really in a nutshell, kind of what what's been what's been keeping me active for the past you know year or so yeah that's badass that's a lot it is it always it always cracks me up you know i'm not i don't throw metal on by choice but i have a bunch of you know there's there's a lot

of metal classics that i love simply from my time at asu the the offensive line got to select what we listened to on one lift and the next lift, the defensive line. So as you imagine, that would oscillate between metal and then gangster rap. And I got classics on both sides, but anytime I hear it, if I hear for whom the bell tolls, it puts me right in that gym. I got a coach on both sides of me, fucking go, just screaming in my ear. All the fucking team is watching where you're maxed out for squatting. That kind of shit. Those are the memories I have

from metal. I've got a deep love for it, even though it's not something that I'm throwing on around the kids. It just is great. Was the gangster rap on the defensive or offensive side? That was the defensive line. White guys, black guys for the most part.

It flowed that way. And I loved it all. I could fucking get down to either one of it just because the team atmosphere, the camaraderie, we were going to fucking push weight no matter what. But it always cracks me up thinking of like, you know, there's so many beautiful songs in the medicine space, like Mirabai Sieba and, you know there's so many beautiful songs in the medicine space like mirabai sieba and um you know just so many artists i can't even think of them right now but like the that type of flow and gentleness you know and the harp and and shit like that and then the ikaros

and like the songs of medicine and you're the ceo of sotara and you're like in a fucking death metal band it just shows that the complexity of humanity right like it really does like it nope you didn't see that one coming well i mean it's really it's been it's it's been it it has roots and where where i grew up you know i grew up in a small town in the late 90s right in canada rural community like it's it always seemed like there were more boys than girls there was like nothing to do you know except for field parties and like gravel runs you know and and and at field parties of course what do you do at field parties you load up you load up all your amps onto a hay wagon uh and you know you get a generator out there or maybe a gravel pit party or something like that and everybody's got their own two four or you got a bunch of kegs

and you know you just you light it up and that was like and guys getting fights and you know all kind of everybody drives home drunk and that's kind of like that was that was that was the mid to late 90s right so it was really became part of our culture me and jesse we grew up on the same street as next door neighbors so um yeah yeah yeah man we've known each other since we were like five years old so you know we just we played in a band together in high school we played in a band together in college and that was just how we grew up so metal definitely predates soltara for me and then you know in addition to that it's like it's not suitable for all occasions like there's there's you know it's it's suitable for a few occasions live concerts being one of them like the the live concert is really the, the kind of the juice of the whole metal experience, because that's where you go.

And it's just, everything's so overwhelming and it's just so evocative. And if you, you know, it's hot, sweaty. And if you want to get in there and like, you know,

throw your weight around a bit, then there's all kinds of guys that want to throw their weight around on top of you, you know, and against you. Um, and, uh, you know, you know the musicians are so incredible like the performances are so incredible and then if you go to really good concerts um there's oftentimes like pyro techniques and yeah you know light shows and

everything so it's just it's a the live concert is the most evocative experience and then the other time i really only listen to metal is like working out and you know usually at the end of a workout like i might i might watch some youtube videos for the first like 30 minutes and then when i'm starting to get you know like okay i got about 30 minutes left to go or whatever i'll stick on an album i like um or you know the odd time if i'm driving but like if you're in a social setting it's rarely acceptable you know some slipknot in the background yeah right so i understand honestly like i understand not people people don't understand it um especially medicine people there's a few though we got a few people who work for us who are like

slayer that's awesome you know like um a couple of uh a couple of kind of, uh, rebellious ladies I can think of on the team. Um, who, who like know the, like they hear we're two or more supple tour. They're like, are you kidding me? You know,

not everybody does. Very few people do. It's like, it's like, I don't know, less than a single digits of the, of the population that, that are,

you know, even. Sure. But, but the people that are are you know even yeah sure but but the people that are there are fucking die hard right exactly it is a vibe you know the thing i love about music and this and i've i've especially i think i think one of the first things you realize in ayahuasca is how powerful sound is like when your first, you know, half dozen, dozen journeys, you're like, holy shit, this is what sound is like. He's making that sound with his mouth. She's making that sound with her mouth. And you're like, uh, and then if you're, you know, uh, I know, you know, at

Etzeltara, it's really just about the vocals, but in other places, you know, they might play guitar, they might sing, they might have different instruments that they play. And when you're connected to that type of vibration on that medicine, it's fucking turned your world inside out. You're like, wait a minute, this is happening right now. And then you realize like, oh, on a certain level, this is always happening with sound. This is always happening with music. It's only now that I can fully perceive it because I've dumbed down my refining centers of the brain and I'm letting it all come in and I can fucking see it and feel it for exactly how it is. And that changed everything. I mean, I started buying musical instruments. You look at our

upstairs and downstairs living rooms. They're littered with instruments, which are toys, toys that I expect my kids to play with. We've got a expensive ceremonial Native American drum with like five big ass tongs and my daughter gets on it and she's been playing since she could lift one. You know, we've got a hand pans, flutes, all kinds of different flutes, traditional flutes, Native American flutes. And it's just, if it's there and you walk by it, it's like, you know, Ben Greenfield's pull-up bar. Every time he walked by his pull-up bar into his office, he did five perfect pull-ups. By the end of the year, he's really good at fucking pull-ups. You walk by the instrument, you're like, yeah, I'm kind of feeling something right now. You pick it up, do a little something, and then you just feel that lift in your energy.

And I've loved that about music, that music does create a vibe. And it is such a powerful thing that if you're only listening to to top 40, you're never going to fully get it. Like the cartoon movie, The Lego Movie. Do you see that? It's funny because it oddly points out the picture of deep state, big government control and alludes to that. But they all are forced to listen to this everything is awesome song where it's like

the melody that keeps the workforce churning it's the top 40 hit that you know like and it's one of the ways you know that they can tell if if somebody knows what's happening or not can they see through the matrix or not if they like that song they're just one of the masses but um i think i think when you when you do vibe with something that goes against the grain of what you hear in the top 40, it doesn't mean that there aren't good top 40 songs. It just means that when you actually have preferences, generally the further out you go, the more of a vibe it creates. And that vibe might be, I want to fucking destroy something right now. Or I want to fucking butt heads with somebody with no helmet on. Or it might be, man, I feel fucking good.

I just want to flow kind of weird real quick and then sit down and enjoy the sunshine. You know, like all of those vibes are powerful vibes. So I definitely appreciate that. And I've always appreciated that about metal. Yeah. I mean, there's a vibe and that's the beauty of music, right? There's a vibe. There's a music for every vibe, right?

There's a music for every mood. If you're in a sad mood, there's music. If you're in a happy mood, there's a vibe there's a music for every vibe right there's a music for every mood if you're in a sad mood there's music if you're in a happy mood there's music if you're in a party mood there's music if you're in a workout mode there's music you know and if you're in a spiritual mode there's also music and talk about rock stars though like you've seen it firsthand like when i when i go into those ceremonies I have so much respect for the healers the Shipibo healers and what they can just do with their vocal cords and with their chants and every time I'm in that ceremony with these guys and ladies um I am I'm just constantly blown away because they not only like, they're not necessarily just singing, like they're singing,

but with a rhythm, like with a beat and they're kind of making the beat with their energy and with their diaphragm as well as producing notes. And, um, yeah, they're, uh,

definitely, definitely rock stars. No doubt. No doubt. They're tapping in and channeling shit. I mean, I had a guy in Vegas and I do want to talk about your book. I promise. Working well into this podcast.

Um, uh, there's a guy named Lenar who, who I think I've mentioned on the podcast before. I first learned about a ceremony in Vegas through Dan Hardy, British fighter, Mohawk. Oh, I know him. Yeah, Dan was at my first journey ever in California, him and his partner at the time, Lacey. And they were fucking phenomenal. I'm turning inside out. I'm looking at them. It looks like he's got a pinky up, proper British, while he's purging in the bucket and not making a peep.

And I was like, well, these guys know something's up. And if they're calm, maybe I can ride through this. So I, they gave me strength, especially Lacey, who is, you know, itty bitty Yogi. And I was like, cool, there's no panic in them. And I really allowed that to settle in. But when we moved to Vegas for only four months before coming here to Texas, I asked Dan, you know, I was like, Hey man, where's, where's this spot that I can go to? And he sent me to it and they were flying Shipibo shaman in. And so they flew this guy in from Pucallpa and he was young. It was the first thing I noticed,

just 25 years old. And I was like, interesting, you know, I'm slightly older than this guy. I was in my thirties and not that that means shit, but, um, he had been a medicine man since five. His grandmother initiated him. And he had asked everyone to bring an instrument, bring any instrument you can, bring them from all over. So, you know, there was like African tongue drums, the little wood ones. There was just all sorts of shit. And he saw this harmonica and he had only,

at that point, he'd only seen a drawing of a harmonica. He had never seen one in real life. And he played at different intervals. He would know what he was called to, and he'd just go fucking pick up the instrument and play it. And this dude was better than Billy Joel on harmonica. It was ridiculous. I was like, are you fucking kidding me? And I didn't know that he'd only seen a drawing of that. I thought he was like a lifelong player. You know, I found that out after the fact and I was like, that's impossible. That is absolutely impossible. So, you know, there is something to that when you connect deeply to the medicine and your antenna is that strong, like anything can come through, you know? So he was brilliant. That was one of my favorite three-night journeys I've ever had. Just being in his presence and listening to him work.

He sang a song, Acapella, about the moon that just had us in tears. I would love to sit with that guy again at some point if I can ever get a hold of him. Can you recall his name? Yeah, Leynard. I think I can through the lady that organized. I would love to fucking bring him out, dude.

He's a special human. Anywho, though, let's chop this up. Let's dive in here before we end this podcast. Your book is 12 Laws of the Jungle, How to Become a Lethal Entrepreneur. Yes, sir. Tell us, I mean, what is in your definition a lethal entrepreneur? The lethal entrepreneur is, uh, someone who effectively, um, gets the kills they need to keep their village alive. Well, I like that too, too. I mean, we frame, we frame everything in the context of like, you know, um, I spent a lot of time in the Amazon and that has shaped my

worldview. And I have many life philosophies that just go straight back to nature, right? And so we kind of framed this whole book of like, you know, you starting your business is like going on a jungle expedition, like You've got an objective. You've got a crew with you. You've got to cross a dangerous jungle. You've got to keep everybody alive. You've got to make sure you're getting your kill so you can feed the village. And you've got to get to your destination.

In order to do that, you need to know where your destination is. You need to be able to map your route there. You need to be able to hit the strategic checkpoints and set up camp along the way. You need to watch out for snakes and other predators that are trying to kill you. You need to have your machete with you. You need to manage your rations and things like that, budgeting. So kind of taking fundamental business concepts and putting an Amazon jungle lens on everything. lethal you know so there's a little bit of violence in there in certain aspects because that's how the jungle is you know there are there are threats out there that are trying to take you out maybe not actually kill you and i'm not saying like you actually kill anyone else you know but it's like you have to just imagine like a metaphor like um you know your your your village supports

you you're the chief of the village the village supports you part of the reason they support you is because you take your hunting party and go on successful hunts and you and you come back with enough like wild boar to be able to feed the village and now what happens if what happens if you go for a month without getting any hunts it's successful hunts what happens if you go for a month without getting any hunts it's successful hunts what happens if you go for two months what happens at three months what happens do your villagers um keep supporting you or do they do they mutiny or do they try to take you out or does someone else try to take your place or do they try to move to another village and go work somewhere else, you know? So it's really kind of lessons like that. We're maintaining,

maintaining the loyalty of your tribe. Part of that is providing resources. Another part of that is, you know, building community and culture. Another part of that is being someone, you know, they can trust and and and always be dependable and reliable and um you know everything to me has roots in in nature in my opinion business is no different i absolutely love that it's funny because of the you know the modern woke consciousness around toxic masculinity and you know there there is truth into um there's there's truth to a lot of this shit but i mean just the term toxic masculinity you know just gets thrown around so fucking loosely

and and the militarization of things right like a lot of people would say like the idea that you're going to kill or be killed is is a military industrial complex thing and um the truth is nature is metal right like that you follow that nature is metal, right? Like that, you follow that nature is metal on Instagram. Like, like it's fucking gangster. Life takes life. There's no two ways about it. And that's really, you know, the, the people, you know, sitting in their mom's basement that are coming up with this shit that go to the grocery store and buy ground beef and never saw that animal slaughtered. Don't know how it happened, don't know the process of cleaning and field dressing the animal, how long it needed to be hang dried for, bleeding the animal,

and then the grinding of the meat, all of those things to get that in that nice little ass package that they pick up for $5.99 a pound or whatever it is, that's completely lost. They talked about that in Food Inc. If you go hunting, it allows you to remember the buy-in for survival. There is a buy-in necessary for survival. Even if you were a grain farmer and you grew grains, there's a buy-in to protect that field from insects and animals that want to come in and harvest your harvest. You also have to kill the trees that were there before your field was there. You fucking mowed them down to make that field. You know what I'm saying?

And then you prevent other things from coming in to take that, right? And it's not a kill or be killed or survival of the fittest in all terms, but certainly that language does resonate with me. The more time I spend in nature and the more people I hang out with in the space of regenerative agriculture. I've read probably more books on the subject this year than I have in any years prior, but the laws of the jungle is something that is super resonant because I think part of the issue with what you would consider toxic masculinity is you end up with men in power positions that have never truly tested themselves.

You might bust your ass at one particular thing to climb the corporate ladder. That's not a fucking test. And I'm not saying everyone needs to become a pro fighter either, but there are things that can become catalysts for that. These were our rites of passage. These were our initiation ceremonies. And they were often hard. You know, Maladoma Patrisso May said,

unless death was on the line, it was not a real initiation. If there was no chance of you dying in the initiation, it's not a fucking real initiation. You know, and this was a West African shaman who was one of the greatest of all time. You know, he recently passed away. Phenomenal guy who understood this very well, right?

So this idea, as we've avoided death and pump people full of formaldehyde to fucking preserve their bodies so we can have an open casket like we've been denatured from that as we reintroduce death into the life death cycle and and uh you know um i can't believe it's coming up right now but but our good friend parker who had been out recently, passed away yesterday. So death is a part of the human experience. Parker? Yeah, Parker died yesterday. And I can tell you about it more after the podcast ends. Aubrey wrote a beautiful newsletter talking about our dear friend who passed away at a very young age and completely unexpectedly. But it's the understanding of that, that death is baked

into the equation for life to take place. And then how do we work with that rather than avoid it or have fear of it or try to fucking transcend humanity and put our souls or consciousness into a machine? That's a complete avoidance of the cycle. You can't step out of that cycle. But to acknowledge that this is how it operates and to learn those laws and how to work with them, I think that is a fantastic approach, and I'm excited to dive into it. Yeah, man. And also, a couple of good points there. We took a heavy stoicism approach in the book. I think stoicism is so important for a few of those core lessons like memento mori, you know, always understand that you're going to die, you know. Life is short. It's not just a cliche kind of message. It's like actual truth, you know,

and by the time you're halfway through it it's already done you know and i asked my grandfather who was 92 at the time he died when he was 96 i said uh you know if there was one thing because he was kind of i could tell he was getting old you know i was going to see if i could pick some wisdom from him before he got too old uh i said if there's one thing you could tell me what would it be he said life is short um do what you you know, get, get done what you can get done, but take your time because before you know it, it's gone. And, um, you know, so that's, that's been a really core tenant of, of my approach to life over the years.

And we, we really try to drive that home in the book um and then you know also on your on your comments there about about toxic masculinity masculinity and this kind of the shying away or the shaming of anything anything that resembles traditional masculinity in a way um i don't think it's actually good for society i don't think it's actually promoting peace in the world um you know and and and the harsh reality of the world as we're seeing with like some different conflicts around the world right now is you can emasculate your culture all day long the only way we get away with that is because you know years of development and progress have made everything so damn easy for people right and and so now we've

got this kind of uh movement shaming and guilting men into into removing their teeth um emasculating themselves and not acting not acting like like real gladiators and warriors that that were the the root and the basis for you know our development in society and then what happens you've got other cultures that still are legit predators right you've got like that and they're just they're just measuring you up right right? And they're waiting for that moment of weakness so they can come in and take advantage and claw back some power. It may have something to do with the introduction of these ideas into our society in the first place. 100%. And they actually use that against us.

Look at what, you know, you've got Putin in Russia right now, that's cultivating, uh, cultivating hatred toward the West. And one of his primary arguments is that, you know, we're trying to subvert them, but also that look at all the craziness going on in our society with like, uh, you know, they make a lot of fun of like some of the gender ideologies and and some of the the uh the political divisions and the and the woke ideologies that that um that are are really sweeping some parts of of the states and you know i i'm of course a traditional liberal not a not a socialist but a traditional liberal where it's like live and let live and everybody can do what they want. And like, you know, leave me alone. I leave you alone. I support your lifestyle choices. You support mine. But this kind of where it's gone right now in the far left has been more

of an overbearing kind of attempt at control and authoritarian by shame and guilt, not authoritarian by the gun, which is like, you know, the super far right approach, the fascist approach. And I don't think there's actually much of that in the United States right now. That's just something that the left says to, to create fear and try to move people toward the left. I think most people in the US are in the center or somewhat center-right, but yeah, this whole kind of movement of shaming and coercing people to take action has been seen around the world. And you've got populist movements, for example, in Italy, that they just elected a new prime minister, Moroni, I think. And, you know, her whole argument was, people are trying to say that I can't even identify as a woman now, or I can't identify as a religious now, or, or as an Italian national now, because there's something wrong with that and so you're seeing these kind of divisions building up and and um yeah i think a lot of that is just because people have forgotten their roots and forgotten that you know the only reason things are so easy is because we used to be strong and and if we stop being strong things are going to get hard so you know i think we're already there you know tim kennedy says you know like like strong people make for easy times easy times make for weak people and you know these easy times have made for weak people and and with without

nefariousness added to it that's just where we're at and that's actually that's actually the chorus of the single that's going out in uh on november 2nd let's go i love it along those lines yeah yeah it's that's right on you know it's it's right on but um we we now you know if this is a cycle which it likely is uh the the the few of us who remember what our strengths are and honor the strengths in women and honor the strengths in all of humanity will be able to lift and carry us going forward in the next phase. So I've oscillated quite a bit in the last two years through fear. And one of the ways that I've worked through fear is by preparing in the best way that

I can. You know, like I want to grow our own food. I want to raise my kids in the wilderness. Bear's in a survival school and he's learning how to whittle and, and, uh, make fire and do all sorts of cool stuff. And hopefully it never comes to that. May have building the fire by hand, but at the same time, it'll be so good for him. It's perfect for him no matter what, right? Like jujitsu. Like I don't, I don't put my son in jujitsu so that he can be a professional fighter. I hope he doesn't become a professional fighter. I put him in jujitsu because it'll make him a better person.

Yeah, exactly. That's it. It will make him a better person. You know, it's a humbling thing, getting your ass kicked as a white belt. And that humbling, if you continue, continues to hone you and make you a better person. And then as you get better, you can't forget all the times you sucked. So you take it easier on the guys that are younger than you coming up. And I think for the longest time, I know many other people like Jocko Willink and people have said this, but

jujitsu is the bully eliminator, right? It eliminates the bully in you if you're a bully, or if you have that archetype burning inside you because it gives you an outlet and it humbles you. So it takes the chip off your shoulder of wanting to fight in the streets or wanting to fight in the bar so long as you've done it long enough. I'm not speaking for somebody who's a white belt, three stripes at the local bar or a blue belt that wants to test what they're learning. I'm speaking about somebody who's made it through the ranks and stuck with it and learned that full progression of what it means to be a martial artist. So any, we've, we've, we've definitely brought this conversation all over the place today. If, if there was one thing that you

wanted people to know about your book, um, you know, that could help them. And you obviously talked a bit about the parallels, whether you're an entrepreneur or not, how this can affect your life positively, but, but perhaps break down one thing that you'd like people to know about your book that you think can help them right now. The material in the book can help you be more effective in any of your endeavors, really, and help set you on a path to strengthen the mindset and strengthen capabilities. I like that big time, brother. Yeah, we definitely need more of that. There's no doubt. No doubt.

A strengthening of the mind, a strengthening of the will. Well, I love you, brother. It's been fantastic having you back on the podcast. And I truly, truly can't wait to come hang with you again. So even though I must be patient with it,

Aya has been calling to me and Sultara specifically. So I hope to see you soon, my brother. Yeah, man. The link to the book, it comes out October 25th. Everything can be found on my Instagram page at Daniel C. Cleland. Links in the bio. We're actually looking for some advanced reviewers. If anybody wants to hit me up and get on a list and get the advanced ebook and leave

for free and leave a review, we're doing that as well. But yeah, you can hit me up on social and I'll definitely be there. Phenomenal, brother. We'll link to all that in the show notes. Sultara.co if people feel a calling to the medicine and want to go to the best place in my opinion on earth to be able to experience that medicine i talked about this a bit on our first podcast but i'll i'll leave the listeners with this the reason i recommend sultara to so many people aside from the credentials of having

you know the dennis mckenna's approval of the world and guys like that on your board, is that you guys pay so much attention to education upfront and integration on the backend. And it's better than anyone I've ever seen. The medicine is strong. There's a lot of places you can go where the medicine is strong. So that isn't in effect the thing that's going to help people change their lives going forward. That's the thing that can affect somebody having a big experience, but it's how you learn how to work with that medicine. I told this story in the first podcast, but when I saw on the to-do list that I had a three-hour orientation, I looked at my life and I was like, I don't want to fucking go to a three-hour orientation on ayahuasca. This is like my 25th journey. I think I got it. And I drug my

heels there almost out of fear of the embarrassment of being the only asshole that didn't show up. And an hour into it, I remember looking at Tosh and we were both like, if we fucking came here first, that would have changed every experience we've ever had. Because what you were teaching was things that I had learned the hard way through ayahuasca. But if I knew that upfront, that would have allowed me to have a better compass, a better navigation tool in working with that medicine and truly with working with all medicines. You know, and the fact that you guys have so many facilitators and apprentices and guides on staff with a very small group, a tight-knit group of people in the building really makes

for a profound, profound held and guided experience and and i absolutely love you guys and i'm excited to make my way back out thank you brother well you know um as always much appreciated and thank you for having me on to open up about the book and the band and cultural comments cultural comments always welcome, brother. Yeah. Awesome. Yeah. Much appreciated, bro. You got it, buddy. We'll do it again. Thank you.