Kyle Kingsbury Podcast - #314 Blood Flow Restriction, Believe The Hype! w/ Dr Mike Debord

Episode Date: August 2, 2023

Dr. Mike DeBord is a former Chiropractor and owned his own Chiropractic and Performance Center for 15 years. Dr. Mike discovered BFR bands in 2016 and shortly after started building B3 Sciences. He has 6 years of use, research and experience using and applying BFR, as well as 6 years of reviewing over 300 papers, studies, and reviews of BFR. Dr. Mike has vast knowledge of the entire BFR industry. He has 4 years of experience educating Clinics, PTs, Doctors, and ATCs on how to implement BFR, and is a consultant to many sports HS, Collegiate, Olympic and Professional Sports Teams. Dr. Mike is one of the top experts in the world in BFR. He teaches a BFR Certification course to Health Professionals, Trainers, Athletes, and everyday people in all 50 states.   In this conversation Dr Mike hits us with a ton of the science behind the anecdotal stories we both share in the episode. He’s a wealth of knowledge and looks like a guy worth taking fitness advice from. If you haven’t seen both Tash and I are rocking these and they’re rocking us right back. Listen to our stories/why and check out Dr Mikea and these bands at their site(link below).   ORGANIFI GIVEAWAY Keep those reviews coming in! Please drop a dope review and include your IG/Twitter handle and we’ll get together for some Organifi even faster moving forward.   Connect with Dr Mike: Website: KYLE.B3sciences.com Facebook: I Am B3  Instagram: @b3sciences  Newsletter: [e-mail]   Show Notes: KKP #303 Tuning Your Nervous System w/ Justin Frandson Spotify Apple   Sponsors: Organifi Go to organifi.com/kkp and check out their impeccable collab with Mind Pump Media! Click that link and use code “KKP” at checkout for 20% off your order! Manna Vitality To get the absolute number one mineral replenishment in my arsenal head over to mannavitality.com and punch in “KKP” at checkout for 12% off! Mark Bell’s Mind Bullet This Kratom Extract supplement supports your cognition like no other and that’s not just because Mark’s a homie. Get some over at mindbullet.com and use “KKP” at checkout for 20% off! Cured Nutrition has a wide variety of stellar, naturally sourced, products. They’re chock full of adaptogens and cannabinoids to optimize your meatsuit. You can get 20% off by heading over to www.curednutrition.com/KKP  using code “KKP” To Work With Kyle Kingsbury Podcast   Connect with Kyle: Fit For Service Academy App: Fit For Service App  Instagram: @livingwiththekingsburys - @gardenersofeden.earth  Odysee: odysee.com/@KyleKingsburypod  Youtube: Kyle Kingbury Podcast  Kyles website: www.kingsbu.com - Gardeners of Eden site    Like and subscribe to the podcast anywhere you can find podcasts. Leave a 5-star review and let me know what resonates or doesn’t.

All right, y'all, we're back. You might hear some lovely violin in the background. That's my son getting his weekly lesson. So if it shows up very faintly, that's him working on it. So nature of the beast these days. I actually don't mind it. It's nice to have as a soothing background, not for the entire podcast, of course,

but for the intro here. Yeah, that would be unacceptable for an hour-long podcast, but I figured for a few minutes, no big deal. Anywho, today's guest is Dr. Mike DeBoard, somebody I was introduced to through Justin Franson, who was a recent guest on the podcast. I love getting body workers and different specialists that know everything. They're just tapped in when it comes to all things physical.

And so there's plenty to learn from on via the podcast, questions that I have, that kind of stuff, and reading their books, if there are books. But when you get to experience one, that's like a whole different animal. Then you get to really see like, is this guy or gal worth a shit? That's what they're talking about works. And when I was with France and his ability to reset my nervous system, calm me, increase hand-eye coordination, balance,

it was pretty awesome. I mean, it was really awesome. And so any recommendation that Justin had for me, I took really seriously because I knew this guy was plugged in. And if you haven't heard that podcast, it's a couple months back. We'll just put that in the show notes for you.

But I was talking to Justin about my knee being hurt and how it just didn't recover the same way that it had when I was younger with stem cells. It bounced back in like a month and eight months post stem cells at 41 years old. I was kind of like this, did they inject it in the wrong knee? Like what's going on here?

I don't get it. And I was telling him about the knee pain not going away, being a little older, these kinds of things. And he brought up blood flow restriction. And when I was in the UFC years ago, Victor Conti would send me tons of science, anything sports related that was worth a shit. And he was sending me a lot of science coming out of Japan on blood flow restriction. It had serious benefit to people

who are recovering from injury and it benefited old people in particular who didn't want to lift super heavyweights because of the nervous system or they simply couldn't. And this allowed them to get a lot of the gains they get in the gym. It also helped quite a bit with muscle building. And while I was fighting at light heavyweight, I didn't want to build muscle. I wanted to get stronger and more endurance, but I actually needed to keep my weight down fighting in a weight class. So I weighed a lot much heavier then. So I tabled it, didn't think about it. And Franson brings up blood flow restriction and I'm like, oh yeah, oh, wait a minute. A, I'm older, not a geezer, but I'm older, not in my 20s. B, I have this injury that hasn't gone away. And C, I don't mind having extra muscle

so long as it's useful. You know, there is a point of diminishing returns for sport. I still go into boxing once a week. I go to jujitsu two or three days a week with my wife. And I want to be functional. You know, I also run and I'm a big guy, a big runner. So running around at 220 is a little bit easier than running around at 230 or 238 for that matter.

And I've been, 238 is the highest I've been since retiring from fighting. And I've been as low as 216, but there is a happy medium there. Anywho, it's a long ass intro to tell you, I've been really thinking about this for some time. And so when Justin set me up with Dr. Mike DeBoard and said his company is the best in BFR and he understands the science inside and out, we started doing phone calls. It's like, I got to get this guy on the podcast as soon as we can, but I want to test it out. So I've actually, at the time of this podcast, had four weeks of working with his bands that you put on. You just pump them up.

It's explained in the podcast. It's very simple. But you can train any style you want. You can train footwork, speed work, mixed martial arts, jump rope. You can do powerlifting. You can do all the things with these bands on, but they're creating a hypoxic environment. And again, we'll get into the science of it, but I'm just telling you right now, I'm fucking blown away. I've gained muscle, but the muscle that I've gained has endurance. It transfers. It transfers in boxing.

It transfers in sparring. It transfers in advanced jujitsu classes where I'm just going with black belt after black belt for an hour. It transfers. And that to me is pretty mind-blowing. The injury status of my left knee is also mind-blowing. And I talk about this on the podcast,

but I don't know. There's very few things that come along in strength and conditioning where you're like, holy shit, this is a game changer. It's been around long enough to where those don't happen very often. Creatine, one of the most best studied sports products, is very good for certain aspects. It's good for low rep weight training, strength training. It's great for getting a good pump if you're doing hypertrophy.

And it's really good for sprint work. It can give you a little extra oomph in a short distance. That was like the biggest news like pretty much for in 41 years until I hear about this and actually get to try it. This stuff is legit. Mike knows the science inside and out. And I think you're going to be absolutely blown away. I immediately bought a pair for my dad who's 72.

I got my wife and son sharing a pair. One of my main homies on the farm squad bought him a pair. We train every week together in boxing and weight training. It's just like, this is phenomenal. Aubrey Marcus got a pair. Like everyone I know that is trained with this says, holy shit, I want to try this. And including my main homie, Dr. Nathan Riley, the holistic OBGYN was staying at our place, getting the tattoo work done from our same artist, Heidi. And I put him through a series of these workouts and he couldn't do a whole lot because his skin was so fucked up

from getting a fresh tattoo. So when his tattoo is fresh on his upper body, we were just doing legs, but we were doing enough that he had some serious response from it. He's gained about six pounds now. And I think he's been doing them for two or three weeks, six pounds of muscle. It's the only thing he's changed. So I'm telling you, results like this are fascinating to me. And I immediately would smell bullshit if I didn't have hands-on experience. I'd be like, no, that sounds like too good to be true. But having done it for a month at 41, I'm a fucking firm believer in it. And seeing other people's results like Dr. Nathan Reilly, like six pounds,

I mean, you're just getting jacked and he's not doing anything else other than this and his other training styles. So he just added this one implement in, which is pretty remarkable. So I know you guys are going to love this podcast, share it far and wide. Anybody who wants to build muscle and burn fat, anyone who's recovering from injury, anything that this podcast specifically pertains to, and it does pertain to a lot. I think a lot of people would benefit from this, if not everyone. And even professional athletes, um, Kansas city chiefs use this, you know, LA Lakers, like there's the best teams in sports are all working with B3 bands. So, uh, yep. Share it. Leave us a five-star review with one or two ways the shows helped you out in life. Organifi will be giving away my favorite product from them. And that's, that's always been,

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I think I got the homie hookup from our buddy, Justin Franson, who I had reached out to. Actually did a really nice session with him before we podcasted where he did a lot of nervous system retooling and I was complaining about my knee not healing the same. I had torn my knees multiple times and usually stem cells would just have them back in a flash. But now at 41, for whatever reason, it just didn't bounce back. And he's like, yeah, man, have you heard of BFR? And I was like, yeah, I heard about that years ago, but it was really for elderly people, injured people and hypertrophy, muscle building. None of those things mattered to me when I was fighting because I wasn't old, I wasn't hurt.

And I actually was trying to stay as dense and lean as possible. I didn't want to put on muscle. Fast forward to now being out of the game for a long time and a little older and definitely not recovering the same way from injuries. That's where the intro came. So I'd love to dive into your background.

What did sports look like growing up? Um, what were you interested in growing up and what led you on the path that you're into now? Well, I had a lot of injuries while I was young. I had early on, I blew out a PCL in my knee. So I probably, by the time I was 21, had three or four surgeries on my knees. So I started down the path of knee problems. And then by the time I was 21, had three or four surgeries on my knees. So I started down a path of knee problems. And then by the time I was 44, I was looking at my first knee replacement and then a hip replacement and then another hip. Now, part of that was lifting heavy weights, always trying to keep that macho look, right? Not caring about pain, not caring about swelling, just caring about keeping muscle, which is a trap most of us fall in. Now at 59, fortunately, I've got this technology.

By the time I hit 52, I couldn't do it anymore. Losing the stomach, getting a belly, feel my age, tired, just feel like crap. That's when I found BFR through Dr. Jim Stray Gunderson when he found it out of Japan and then man it was absolute game changer so after a couple years of playing around with that I launched a company in 2019 B3 Sciences and now we've got over 35,000 people using the bands and I mean just on a rocket ship with this new technology. And I feel 25 years younger. I mean, I feel like I'm in my thirties when I use this technology. Yeah, I can attest to that myself. There is something to it. You know, like I think I've been, we've all been inundated so much with the biohacking movement and gadgets and gizmos

and all these things. And when I first had seen it, it felt kind of gimmicky, like, oh, you dress up, you do this stuff. But honestly, when I was fighting, I was already playing in that arena. I was doing quite a bit of altitude training and really looking into anything that moved the needle, anything at all that from a sports science standpoint, that was really worthwhile. And that's when I started getting all this information on BFR from Japan. And then there was a company called VASPR systems that were based in Moffett Field and, you know, travel the paleo effects. And, you know, their, their claim to fame was this science that they

had from doing sprint work with, with blood flow restriction. They were putting on these cuffs, you know, on the machine and it was a cool machine. I got to use it at Moffitt Field for a while, but they're $30,000. So I was like, this isn't something I'm going to buy and have at my house, but it is a cool thing. And I liked how much evidence they had of hormonal change and how fast you could adapt.

And I thought that was unique to them, but it's actually not. It's unique to BFR and blood flow restriction. So I'd love for you to break down what is happening when we put on blood pressure cuffs and pump them up and work out. What is happening to the body on a physiological level? What's happening on a hormonal level to the endocrine system? What's going on there that makes this such a cool and unique mode of working out? Well, for your listeners, let's start with an explanation of, you know, exercise. If you want to create an adaptative change in exercise, right, we all know you got to work two different muscle

groups, slow twitch, fast twitch, slow twitch, aerobic, cardio, endurance, VO2 max, fast twitch. That's muscle hypertrophy, muscle strength, muscle explosion. But what most people don't know is you've got to hit a certain fatigue point. So let's start with slow twitch, right? When you start doing aerobic exercise, you elevate heart rate and breathing. Most people, that's all the farther they go. Your heart rate elevates, your breathing elevates to bring the oxygen level back up. Most people aren't willing or can't continue that exercise to drive the fatigue deeper to where you go get nitric oxide and mitochondrial adaptation.

So that's one thing. On the other side, you got to get the burn and strength training. You can't just do light weights. It's not going to change anything. And you can't just go and tell you get to the burn. A lot of people are like, woohoo, there get the burn and strength training. You can't just do light weights. It's not going to change anything. And you can't just go until you get to the burn. A lot of people are like, woo-hoo, there's the burn. No, that's where, it's not where it ends. That's where it starts.

So the average person who's exercising is not hitting a deep enough fatigue. This new technology is basically a biohack. I kind of relate it to, remember when we used to fly from New York to LA, had to stop in Chicago back in the old days, right? Well, now there's a new direct flight. What if you didn't have to stop in Chicago? Why would anybody do that? So how do these bands work? Well, for the listeners who can't see as visually, you slide these bands up your arms and legs. Now, they're not a blood pressure cuff. When you use the right kind of bands like ours, they're flexible. You put some air in them. It's very easy to apply, and it's going to slow down blood flow. Now, your first question would be, why do I want to slow down blood flow? Because blood is carrying the main fuel of oxygen into the muscle. So let's

take an example. You're walking on the treadmill. You're walking around the track. You're going for a bike ride. You have more oxygen flowing in than is being used. So you are below oxygen threshold. You're not really creating any hypoxia. Hence, nothing changes. Nobody says, hey, I went to Planet Fitness. I've been on the treadmill for 30 minutes. I got my six pack. I lost all my weight. I feel 20 years younger. Nobody ever says that. So the problem with this exercise is you're not creating enough oxygen fatigue. So now the bands are on and we pump them up. And because there's less blood flow, completely safe, by the way, there's less oxygen. So let's say we cut the oxygen in half. Instead of a 10, the oxygen's at a 5.

Without the bands, when oxygen's flowing at a 10, you got to exercise at an 11 if you want to create fatigue. You got to do high intensity. You got to climb on the treadmill. You got to sprint. You got to get on the Peloton and go up and down hills. You got to do intervals when you run. Most people don't want to do that. But now the oxygen's only a 5. You don't have to intervals when you run. Most people don't want to do that. But now the oxygen is only a five.

You don't have to exercise an 11. You only have to exercise at a six to create the hypoxia. So imagine going for a light walk, getting on the bike, getting on the elliptical, and you're doing something light that you probably do it for hours on end. In three minutes, you can't go anymore. You're using more oxygen than is flowing. That's number one. So you're creating this biohack into the aerobic muscle fibers.

Also, when you lift weights, you're going to lift weights, you're going to lift lighter weights, weights that would normally not attract fast-twitch muscle fibers, meaning, Kyle, you and I could curl five-pound dumbbells all day long and it would never end. It's not heavy enough. But with the bands on, because the slow twitch muscle fibers, the aerobic fibers cannot keep up, not enough oxygen, they start to fatigue. The fast twitch muscle fibers do something really interesting. Previously, we had to load heavy weight, but the fast twitch muscle fibers

basically say, uh-oh, slow twitch muscle fibers need some help. And they jump in and help crossover recruit. Now, again, you're doing something light like walking or curling a five-pound dumbbell or something super light that would never get your fast twitch engaged. And all of a sudden, the fast twitch fibers jump in and help. Now, how do you know that's happening? You feel the burn because you've jumped over and you've gone anaerobic. You've biohacked into the anaerobic pathway and you're burning glycogen. That's where the burn comes from, the lactic acid, which is really lactate and hydrogen ions. It's where the burn comes from. So now you're in the burn. Fascinating thing number two. Number one, we got a deep hypoxia

and a heck of an aerobic workout in a couple minutes. Number two, now we've hacked into the fast twitch muscles. Number three, now you're in a light activity firing fast twitch muscle fibers. And it's easy with something light to keep going and produce lactic acid. So if I'm curling 40 pound dumbbells, that's a heavy load. I'm going to have to stop at some point because it's 40 or it hurts or it's just too hard.

If that's only five, six, seven pounds, I can keep going. So now the fascinating thing we're seeing with all these bodybuilders, elite athletes, people like me and you, Kyle, we can actually go deeper into the glycogen, the fast twitch muscle fibers and produce more lactic acid. And lactic acid is what triggers growth hormone. It's not heavy weights. We all think, oh, you got, it's heavy weights. No, heavy weights is just a tool to get into the fast twitch muscle fibers to produce lactic acid. So if we can get in the fast twitch muscle fibers with a lightweight, produce more lactic acid, better results. So here we got this incredible biohack, better aerobic, faster aerobic fatigue, crossover recruitment of the fast twitch muscle

fibers and an exercise that would never engage that. And then we can actually go deeper in fast twitch. And the average person, right, who doesn't want to go bang the heavy weights and kill themselves, they're working out like they're doing maximal, you know, strength training and getting the results, but they're not sore, not tired. I mean, it's just, you know, it's just incredible breakthrough. Yeah, it's massive. And I'm not unfamiliar with training lighter to save the nervous system, right? I've spoken many times in this podcast

about one of my favorite strength books called Easy Strength by Pavel Tatsulin and Dan John. And the basic idea or premise behind it was, you know, Pavel actually coming out of Russia and working with the elites over there, coming here, first guy to bring kettlebells to the US and really made a name for himself. Verka Chansky and Sif, who wrote Super Training, were looking at people training and they said, everyone's training at 80%, 90%, 100% of their one rep max to move their one rep max.

That's fine when you're in your 20s and early 30s, but at a certain point, the nervous system can't keep up with that workload and then we run into injury, illness, that kind of stuff. Or you have to train way less frequently if you're going at that output. So they thought, can we train at 50% of the one rep max and move our 50% up? If we move the 50% up, does that correlate to the one rep max? And it did. Hence the entire book comes out of that, right? But there's concepts in that book that really land and actually flow directly with BFR because you're not taxing the nervous system. That means you can do it more often. One of the cornerstone quotes from that book is, if it's worth doing, do it every day or as close to as every day as possible, right?

Strength training isn't exercise per se. It's not about burning fat. That's a side effect. Strength training is a practice, right? And we can practice these primal movement patterns. We can practice any kind of pattern we want, even bodybuilder patterns, you know, where we're just doing curls, strict curls and tricep, you know, horseshoe kickback, that kind of stuff. But you can also get weird. You can do all your functional fitness with these on. And because the nervous system's not taxed, I have no problem training again. I have no problem if I hit BFR in the morning, going for a good run later or getting to do jujitsu at night. You know, if I hit jujitsu in the morning, I can still hit BFR later that

evening, right? It's just not going to, it's not going to mess my nervous system up. And it's something that I can do every day, which is really remarkable. And I can also feel the layers building. You know, I hit back to back,-back full-body workouts, but it was pretty leg-focused. And it was a lot harder to get my three sets of 30 on walking lunges the day two, but it was awesome because I knew I'm just adding to that lactate threshold. I'm just pushing myself beyond where that was before, and I'm going to have a greater hormonal response because of that. Yes, exactly. And, you know, for the listeners, you know, when you tax your nervous system, you release cortisol, you know, cortisol will block growth hormone. It will block the anabolic response. So that's, that's happening out there. People get mid thirties, late thirties,

forties, fifties, and sixties. They do a workout like they did in their 20s and they wonder why they hurt, wonder why they don't grow, wonder why they hold on to fat. Cortisol, it's the stress hormone. So that's one of the big things we accomplish with BFR. We reduce all that workload and stress so we don't have cortisol in the way of our adaptative response. I know a lot of questions. One of the first questions I had for you, and you answered it perfectly on, it's nice to be able to just hit you up whenever I want and jump on the horn with you. It's very, very convenient when I'm first learning about this stuff. But as a guy who came with a strength background at Arizona State football, training with some of the best strength

coaches in the world, Coach House, Coach Uwe, and then getting into MMA, and then later with Jesse Burdick and a lot of the Westside barbell tutelage, powerlifting and doing everythings like that. Mark Bell is a good buddy. One of my first questions was, if you're just training light and you're just using these things,

is there application to strength sports? Is there application to other things? And you brought up Chris Duffin, the mad scientist, his creator of the Duffalo bar, Kabuki strength, a legend in the strength game. One of the, I think the first men on the planet to do a thousand pound squat and a thousand pound deadlift. Previous to him, it was, you had either or, you know, but nobody could do both. And he said, he's been working with these for some time and there is application to strength where you can still hit these heavier sets and then move to BFR to finish off. And it made me think of Louie Simmons from Westside Barbell. They might do 16 doubles or eight triples with

adequate rest in between three to five minutes of rest. So they're hitting pure strength on a big lift like deadlift or squat. And then at the end though, they're going to bring in their accessory muscle groups and they're going to do two AMRAPs, as many reps as possible, right? To get the burn and get the pump. So I was like, actually it's already encoded, you know, in one of the legends of strength, like his manual to workout, right? But now there's an easy way to AMRAP. There's an easier way that's going to be less taxing on the body and less taxing on the nervous system that will create an even bigger pump and even greater lactate threshold response and an even greater hormonal response. Yeah, exactly. Well, let me give you a couple of stories. Number one, USA Olympic weightlifting,

Mark Lavelle, Mike Gattone, they have these bands, Okay. They implemented and did a little trial mark. Mike told me about every other workout. Heavy workout, BFR. So instead of always heavy, they go heavy BFR, heavy BFR. And Mike called me back and said the results were shocking. Shocking. Number two, there's multiple studies out there. There's a study called the Luber study out of Kansas.

High school football players. These aren't recreational out of Kansas. High school football players. These aren't recreational athletes. These are high school football players. They did back squat with BFR 30% of one rep max training for a period of four weeks. And they did traditional 70% one rep max. And the group doing the BFR had a better change in strength. Number three, Cassandra LaMadrid. She runs the BFR for Chris up at Kabuki.

She called me and they were getting ready to go into COVID lockdown. Said, Mike, I'm not going to be able to, I'm not going to have access to my heavy weights. What am I going to do? I said, Cassandra, perfect opportunity. You're going to use some dumbbells, air squats, air lunges for three or four weeks in BFR. She said, well, I'm not going to have access to any heavy. Am I going to lose strength? I said, I don't think so. So she called me back before she was getting ready to go back in. They opened up. She said, okay, what should I do? I said, go load it up. She said, really? I haven't lifted heavy.

I said, yeah, go load it up. Called me back, said, why am I stronger? Stronger than she was before. So here's the paradigm shift that's happening with BFR. Load, time, and volume are not as important as we thought they were. Volume, not as important. You're using volume to hit a fatigue point. Time, time's irrelevant. Doesn't matter if you work out 40 minutes, in my opinion, or 10,

tell me how long you were in the burn. And I'll tell you if you're going to change. If you're working 40 minutes and you're only in the burn for one minute, you're not going to change. If you're working 10 minutes with BFR and you're not getting any burn, you're not going to change. But if you're working 10 minutes with BFR and you're in the burn six or seven minutes, that's like working out for an hour and being in the burn. And then number three, depth of fatigue is appearing to be a greater goal target than any weight, load, or volume. How deep can I push the fatigue? Meaning I'm a strength guy. I'm getting at the end of a deadlift. I'm deadlifting 335. At the end, I have to stop because it's 335. If it was 100, I could keep moving. If it was 100, I would never get to the end. So with BFR, you get to the end as if you're dead lifting 335 and then crank out more reps.

And then number four, really interesting. When you create an inflammatory response in muscle, I want to teach everything something here in a second. Part of the protein synthesis that occurs has to deal with the repair of the muscle fibers or the inflammation. So when you do a traditional heavy weightlifting session, you create some inflammation and you create it, let's call it a negative one in protein synthesis because part of that protein synthesis has to deal with the repair. So you create a three, a positive three in protein synthesis. Negative one plus positive three is a two. One of that has to deal with the inflammation or repair. The next two can deal with growth and hypertrophy. Now here comes BFR. You get the same

positive three in hypertrophy change or stimulation of protein synthesis, but there's no negative one. Zero plus three is a three. Where do you want to get three or a two? That's why all these studies are showing you grow muscle faster. You grow quicker. You grow without all the damage. Every study I've read is you can build muscles faster, faster with BFR. I haven't read a study yet that said heavy weightlifting beat BFR. To haven't read a study yet that said heavy weightlifting beat BFR. To the contrary. And part of that reason is these two things I just explained. You're able to go deeper and you're doing less damage. So you got more protein synthesis to work on the hypertrophy and strength. Yeah, it's a really important piece. And I think for a lot of people, I know the age demographic of the show and it's not a bunch of young guys. And I think for a lot of people, you know, I know the age demographic of

the, of the, of the show and it's, it's, it's not a bunch of young guys, you know? So I'm sure there are some young men and women listening to this on occasion, but for the most part, a lot of people have reached that point in their lives where they don't have all the time in the world to dedicate to their fitness. They would like something that gives them a minimum effective dose in a quicker timeframe. Right. And I mean, most, the vast majority of my BFR workouts are 15, 16 minutes. It's pretty rare where I'll hit like 20, 22 minutes. I'd have to have some time off where I really want to kick my ass for that long and be that long in the burn. So that's remarkable just in and of itself to know if I've got no other time today, I can demolish myself and get a full body pump within 15 minutes.

And I'm going to burn fat and build muscle from that. But this other point you make on like the time without going super heavy, still creating overall strength, you know, and it likely has to do with the muscle recruitment and different things like that, the positive anabolic pathways that are opened up without the negative. But it's really remarkable to think like,

I'm actually getting stronger and it's a useful way. I've talked with you on the phone about still doing jujitsu, still sparring and boxing and things like that. And one of the things I've always been concerned with, with hypertrophy is having a point of diminishing returns where now I've got all this muscle, but on the mat, it's not necessarily transferable. If I have 17 inch arms, then I go to guillotine somebody, I might have 30 seconds of output before my arms fail. Cause they're too pumped and can't do anything. Same thing on the bags. You know, I remember when Eno Explode came out and Forrest Griffin, a lot of the champion fighters, you know, were a part of

their advertising scheme with BSN. And we tried that at AKA. And it was like, I can't even, my shoulders are so pumped. I can't even, my shoulders are so pumped. I can't even lift my fucking hands up to hit the bag after 30 seconds. Right? So there's a point of diminishing returns there. As I started training with the BFR, I had a wrist injury. So I couldn't, I couldn't go to boxing every week. And to the same point that you make about Cassandra, I did BFR for three weeks. I came back to boxing and not only did I increase my power, but I increased my endurance. I could not get tired on the bag.

I was doing 20 seconds on 10 seconds off Tabatas for probably six rounds as hard as I could. And there was no lull. There was no point where I lost pop or I lost power in my punching, kicking, kneeing, whatever the strike form was. I found that to be remarkable from an N equals one standpoint.

Look at jujitsu. You know, I don't train hard all the time. I can't, but every Thursday, we've got an advanced class at Gracie Humida, and we do a very hard warmup, live drills, and then we might do live rolling for 40, 45 minutes. One of the hardest classes we did 30 minutes straight with no breaks, no water. So three minute rounds times 10 rounds, you had enough time to turn from your opponent and slap five and hit the fist with your next opponent. That's how much time you had in between rounds. So it's not like anyone else had a break and you're taking on fresh bodies, but three minute rounds is a sprint in jujitsu. And we had 10 of those back to back. And I was able to make it through that just fine because my muscles had

gained endurance. There was a functional strength component to the size that I'm putting on. And when I think about that too, I've never had that in any other form before where I could actually put on muscle, get bigger and stronger, and it still functioned well in sport. For me, I feel great around 220. If I go up to 230 or 240, I'm screwed. It's not going to transfer. But I dropped from 238 down to 222. I'm back up to 225 now. I've gained a few pounds of muscle

and body fat's as low as it's been since I was fighting. And I've got way more cardio, sport-specific cardio. It's pretty crazy. Yeah. So for the listeners, let me repeat a couple of things he said, because we tend to skim over these things that this is this doesn't happen.

He just said, I don't work out more than 15 to 16 minutes. That's unheard of everyone. Number two, he just said, I got better endurance. I didn't break down. That doesn't happen. That doesn't happen unless you're doing some kind of crazy training and you're 25. And he said, I gained four or five pounds of muscle. He's working out for 15, 16 minutes with a third of the normal weight and he put on five, six pounds of muscle and got chiseled. That doesn't happen. If your listeners just hear that, their jaws got to be on the floor

about right now. And with my company, we've gotten so used to these just crazy results that we tend to skim over them. So how in the world is this possible in a 41-year-old body? He is creating a depth of fatigue that he can't get without the bands. Number two, he's doing less stress on his body, so he's not getting cortisol. And he's working both sides of the muscle fibers. This is fascinating. Why do we do CrossFit, aerobic and anaerobic work? Cardio and weightlifting, right?

But most athletes don't work both sides of it. The fascinating thing that I want to share with everybody is you're doing strength training. Let me give you an example. Ingrid Boyd, three-time Olympian, cross-country skier, calls me up. She's now early 40s. Mike, heard about this. I can't lift the heavy weights anymore. I got to maintain my strength. I still compete. I'm one of the top in the world in my age group. Could this help? I said, yeah. What are you going to use it for? She says, I'm only going to strength train with. I just need to drop the weight and not lose any muscle. I said, great. It's going to work perfect for you. Drop the weight down to a third of what

you're working out with. Go quick, go short. You're going to maintain all your strength and muscle. Call me back four weeks later. I said, Mike, love it. A little stronger, put on a little muscle, but how in the world do I have more endurance? I'm not using them. I said, Ingrid, how many reps are you doing when you start? Well, I'm doing 30, like you told me. Is that aerobic or anaerobic? Is that slow twitch or fast twitch?

She says that's slow twitch. I said, so you're here doing a strength training move, starting aerobically and creating a deep hypoxia. Yeah. I said, is your heart rate up? Yeah. I said, Ingrid, it's like you just ran five miles and it took you 45 seconds. You hit a depth of fatigue in hypoxia that stimulated nitric oxide and mitochondrial adaptation. You just got the most efficient cardio workout of your life and it's translating over. So here, Kyle, you're doing right strength training and your endurance is going through the roof because you're hitting a deeper fatigue. So let me go back to my point. Time, load, and volume are not as important. Time and volume, especially in aerobic conditioning.

What's important is can you push the fatigue point in slow twitch muscles to a point where they go, whoa, holy cow, there's a bunch of hypoxia here. And then all of a sudden the mitochondria rapidly multiply. That's really what's happened to you, Kyle. Your mitochondria basically rapidly multiply because you hit a hypoxia faster and deeper than it's used to. So now you're going through these 10 rounds and you got way more mitochondria pumping out ATP. And you just go and go and go.

And every endurance athlete I've had do this is just like, you got to be kidding me. This is just, and at some point, what we're going to see is people are going to quit doing long cardio, long aerobic because they're not going to need to. Yeah, I agree with that. I mean, there's just, there's better ways to train. And I, after Tim Ferriss came out with the four-hour body, I really started to think about that. I know Dr. Doug McGuff was on there, body by science guy. He was talking about ARX training once a week and, you know, doing different things. And it just made me think like, what is the minimum effective dose, you know, and what do I actually need at this point in my life to get the results that I want? I've never done any application with the success that I've had from BFR that took as little as it

does. I mean, that's first and foremost, the point that I want to make, like, I didn't bring this on and, and completely overhauled diet, go to bed at a different time, do these other things. Like I trimmed a little bit of carbs in the morning. I have some ketones so I can hit a good workout without hitting the wall. But other than that, it's just been this, right? And then because of the knee and the wrist and every other little ticky tack thing, I haven't been able to do a whole lot on top of that. You know, it really has been these workouts. My knee hasn't felt this good in probably close to two years.

You know, I remember I hit you up two days after my first workout and it was stupid fast, right? Like one workout, the next day I'm sore. The day after that, I remember flying up my stairs. And I was like, whoa, that's interesting. I feel considerably lighter right now on my feet. And I started thinking about that from an athletic standpoint, because a lot of times, people confuse strength and conditioning with how they get prepared for sport. And for most applications, that's not how you're going to get prepared for your sport. But from this application,

it does make you better at sport, which is fucking weird. It's just weird. It's odd. And with that, I think about, you guys work with the Kansas City Chiefs. You work with a number of different super high-end people in sports. You have the N equals one of your son, which I would love you to dive into in all the different videos you guys offer, because I think it is something, there's many people here that are like, all right, cool, but I'm an athlete and I really care about pickleball or I really care about, um, boxing. I don't give a shit about being stronger. Less is going to help me in boxing or help me in my sport. So I think it'd be great if you spoke to that because it is really remarkable, the transfer of usable stuff

that you get from it. Yeah. I want to talk about sport in a minute. Kyle, does that wrist still hurt? No, I mean, it's completely fine now. Okay, so everybody listening, this does not happen. Kyle's got a knee that hurts and a wrist that hurts, and it's gone. That doesn't happen. It's just unheard of. So why is that happening?

Here's what you got to understand about your joints and your tendinitis. Okay. All the things you're working. As you age, these things lose blood flow. They get into what's called ischemia, lack of blood flow. It's just natural and they don't have as much oxygen. Then you have a little injury, you get a little micro tear of a tendon, you get a little tweak in a cartilage, the articular

cartilage on the end of your bone starts to get rough and you get arthritis. And there's no good blood supply. Now, how do you know this? Well, you go put a heat pack on the knee and it feels a little better. Why? Because the heat brought blood flow and it temporarily feels better. So why is BFR all of a sudden getting rid of everybody's pain? That alone makes it the biggest scientific breakthrough in exercise. Let's go back to what are we doing when we do BFR? You're starting

aerobically, slow twitch muscle fibers, you're creating hypoxia, up goes heart rate, up goes breathing. That normally solves the problem, but the bands are on and the hypoxia keeps going down because you keep going, you keep walking, keep doing your light exercise. And all of a sudden, the body, the brain and the cardiovascular system goes, OK, we got to do something else. We got to kick in the next stage of releasing, relieving hypoxia, drop nitric oxide. We've all heard of this. OK, nobody's ever took beet powder in their joint, quit hurting. You do not release nitric oxide because you took the beads. You can promote more nitric oxide that is ready to be released in your arteries, but you've got to go create hypoxia. So BFR allows you to hit this deeper hypoxia and your body drops nitric oxide. What happens? The blood thins and the blood

vessels open up. All of a sudden, Kyle's got more blood flowing, more oxygen going to his wrist and his knee. It's like he put a permanent heat pack on him. That's number one. That's an immediate relief. So here, Kyle, the next day he's running up and down the steps, the knee's not hurting. Number two, he is continuing his BFR and he's crossing over to the anaerobic side. He's creating a burn. He's dropping growth hormone and he's creating regeneration and repair because he's elevated growth hormone. So now the growth hormone goes in here along with an increase in anti-inflammatory macrophages. One study, 163% increase.

Now you got better blood flow. You got more oxygen. The micro phages are clearing out the inflammation and here comes the growth hormone into rebuild, repair. And pain goes away. I mean, that alone would revolutionize the whole industry of joint problems. And I see this in everybody. Oh yeah, Dr. Mike, I'm bigger and stronger. How's that knee? Oh yeah, it doesn't hurt anymore. Wait a second. Say that again. Yeah, my knee doesn't hurt. Well, how long has it been hurting? Oh, two or three years. And it's gone. And I have to get them to say that again. So they're like, oh yeah, you're right. That doesn't happen. That's just another one of these adaptative systems in your body that's just fascinating.

I can't tell you how many people are out of pain. It's just so many. Fibromyalgia, diabetic neuropathy, sciatic neuropathy, phantom pains, autoimmune pains, arthritis, gout, rheumatoid. Just absolutely fascinating. So that's kind of like the pain talk. And then Kyle, you want to talk about sports improvement, right? Absolutely. that's kind of like the pain talk and then you Kyle you want to talk about sports improvement right absolutely and I will say for the pain you know it's um I think one of the things that helped me with that is the fact that I could get results with so little added weight right so when I when I first I mean for the vast majority I mean I said we're probably four weeks into this into my

training the first two, it was all body weight. I did walking lunges. I'd push back to rehab the knee, kind of like a step out, step back, not continuing to walk forward. That way I could really work on the knee, but it was body weight. So my knee in its pain could handle that load. It could handle my body weight in a lunge. It couldn't handle more than that. And I was able to train effectively out of that injury. That's pretty remarkable. And now increased load, wearing weight vests, holding dumbbells, doing all that stuff. I think that's, you know, for people that have trouble, I hooked up my dad too, from an injury standpoint. He jumped into jujitsu in his 50s because he had

done full contact karate, boxing, and wrestling. When I started fighting professionally, he was like, man, I know there's technique here. I just don't know what it is. So as a fan, to be a better fan, he got into jujitsu, got his black belt, excuse me, in his early 60s. And he's got a lot of wear and tear. If you're watching this, that's how you arm bar him. His arms lock out at like 90 degrees. So a lot of pain in the joints, that kind of stuff. And I'm like, just do pushups as far as you can, you know, hold your dumbbells, you know, that are as heavy as you can that don't hurt the wrists and the elbows. And he fucking loves it. He absolutely loves the workouts. He's blown away by how fast his body's responding as well. So it's because you can get away with so much

more in the oxygen restricted hypoxic setting because of the benefits are going to be there. The same as if you're going to heavy, it's a wonderful thing for people who are injured because you don't have to start with heavy weight. You can start very light and work your way through there. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Then the sports performance side is a shocker too. Yeah, let's dive into sports performance, brother. I just wanted to get my old man mentioned there because it's pretty cool. He's injury ridden. But yeah, I mean, think about all the people that you have in various sports. Chris Duffin is one of the major names in strength training. But working with the Kansas City Chiefs, Super Bowl champions, many other great people in sports. Talk a bit about how they're applying this and talk about your son as well, because I think

this is mind-blowing to me. Yeah. So, you know, when I got into BFR, I started using the Japanese system, Katsu. Excuse me. It was expensive, wasn't practical for every day, but I was one of the first ones that bought a set and I just used it and was blown away. I never thought I was going to launch a company then. Two things happened. One, first hip replacement, 12 weeks. That's pretty good. Second hip replacement, I was running at five weeks. Just shocked because I used BFR. So we can bring that, save that for a next topic. Then my son, he's 17 years old. He's a quarterback, wants to play D1 football. I mean, he's really talented, but he's not the prototype.

So they say, look, you want to be D1, you got to go wide receiver. You got to get faster. So they switched him, and coming into his senior year, he's going to play wide receiver, and his fastest 40-yard dash time four six two not bad you know that's but that's not d1 that's not elite d1 speed so he's been doing speed training for a long time i go to a guy named vick piegler who's a big sports training guy here in dayton ohio and he give him said vick i don't care what you do don't change what you do but when you do it the bands will be on that's it i don't care what you do. Don't change what you do. But when you do it, the bands will be on. That's it.

I don't care if you're doing curved treadmill, vertimax, ladder, box jumps, whatever you're doing, the bands will be on. So I remember putting him on calm the first time because they don't listen to their dad, but he listened to Vic. So he puts the bands on him the first time. And I mean, that first workout,

he usually blows through, he's on the ground three or four times, almost crying. He's in so much burn because he never felt it before. That didn't hurt him. He's just never felt that. So all of a sudden now over the next six, seven weeks, he's hitting a tennis ball, throwing a football, jumping, pickleball, hitting a golf ball, hitting baseballs off the tee, throwing, running. I don't care what your sport movement is. Imagine that you are, first of all, practicing your movement, running, sprinting, jumping, hitting. Now, imagine in that movement, all of a sudden you're hitting a fatigue or a burn like somebody just loaded you up with weight. Like you're combining your movement with heavy weights. These kids, these athletes, they feel a different burn when they're doing stuff.

For example, I had a Big 12 quarterback, Seth Dagey, played at West Virginia, top three in the Big 12. Had him go out and throw. Just throw, Dex. Just throw, you know, Jared. 60%, 70% a couple days a week called me back, said, dude, I've never felt a burn like that throwing. Okay, so let's get back to my son. He was topping out 19.3 on the curve treadmill. In six weeks, he went to 21. He went up to Ohio State, ran a 4.3540. Got the camp card. And I was out of town.

My buddy called me and said, Mike, your son just ran a 4-3-5. He's in the burnout race. He's the only white kid in it. And then he won the burnout race. They took him from outside with a bunch of nobodies and they brought him in the bubble. And he got 10 scholarships. Now he's not an Ohio State kid. Right?

He got Northwestern, Indiana, Bowling Green. He got about 10 different offers. Ended up Bowling Green for a four-year ride because we changed his speed. And if you read the studies, they all say the same thing. And then spring comes around. Track coach recruits him. They put him on the anchor. He's up at Jesse Owens Stadium in the finals of the D1 big school. And he's the anchor and he's the only white kid in the finals. And he's the anchor and they got second place. And now he's in the school's track hall of fame for that. So we took a kid and dramatically increased his speed. Next story, Utah volleyball player, Emily Smith. She's only jumping about

nine, eight. That's pretty darn good for a girl that's about five, 10, five, 11. They volleyball player, Emily Smith. She's only jumping about nine, eight. That's pretty darn good for a girl that's about five, 10, five, 11. They tell her, look, if you want to play big, big time, you got to jump 10. So they start training her with the bands. Jim actually trained her, Jim's wife, put her in the bands, replicated these exact same things she was already doing. So listen, everyone, don't change. Just put the bands on bop jumps, set jumps, spike jumps, bop jumps. And first time she did it, she's on the ground said my legs. I've never felt this before. Six inches on her vertical in six weeks. An inch a week. So every athlete that does this, let me ask you a question, athletes on the call. So if

you go out and play pickleball and play golf and do any sport movement, hit off a tee, shoot three point shots, and you hit a deeper fatigue in that movement, striking, punching, I got a four-time martial artist. He's the only martial artist in the world with four world championships. His name's Vinnie Meng. He increased his speed and his strike strength by three to four percent. Kyle, you know, you increase your strike strength three to four percent. That's huge. So every athlete that has put these on and replicated their movement, you fatigue deeper. I mean, the changes are just going to be just phenomenal. So, I mean, that's coming. We're probably the only company

really that's out there doing that stuff, right? You got companies doing rehab. You got companies doing home exercise. I'm really the only company out there, right, that's really driving sports performance in these type of movements. Yeah, and again, to reiterate, it's remarkable because if I go and improve myself, if I improve my one rep max on bench press, that doesn't mean that I punch harder. It doesn't mean that I last longer. It doesn't mean that I throw a football farther. It doesn't mean anything else other than my bench went up. yet when we apply this to sport, you literally can be faster in your sport, more agile, more versatile, more durable, increase your vertical, increase your 10 yard, your 100 yard, your 40 yard, everything in between is going to improve from that. I don't know of anything else that

really can make those claims. No, because if we get down to the very basis of why do we train, we're trying to hit a fatigue point that moves adaptative response in the slow aerobic and fast twitch anaerobic pathways. And if we move that fatigue point, but don't overstress our body, don't create cortisol that blocks the adaptation, it's like training it's like going like training from an amateur athlete to a collegiate athlete going from like a collegiate athlete to olympic athlete and for us older guys it's like we can train like we're 18 again and there's no limit to how deep we can fatigue and it doesn't even hurt yeah it's pretty remarkable and the the fact that the muscle can get to that point

from so little does transfer to aerobic cardio as well. You know, like my ability to recover in between rounds when I'm doing hard rounds of jujitsu is right there. Like I'm pushing myself to where I would be exhausted and normally need two rounds off. And then I take a couple of breaths and I'm ready to go for the next round. Take a couple of breaths and I'm ready to go for the next round, take a couple of breaths. I'm ready to go for the next round. So, uh, you know, the fact that it's, it's working, you know, on, on the physiology. And I want you to speak to this too. You know, one of my first thoughts was if I've got these things connected at the upper portion of the limbs, for sure, it's going to work, you know, everything downstream of that, meaning my entire legs,

my entire arms, But what happens upstream of that? My shoulders, my traps, my chest, those kinds of things. And then as I've gotten into more compound exercises like clean and press, pushups, things like that, you can see the pump affecting all the other muscle groups just the same. Is that because the venous return is slowed down? Because I mean, it will affect the entire body as if the whole thing is cuffed. And I found that to be interesting as well. So if you're listening, you can't see, we put these bands on the upper arm right below the axilla. So Kyle's saying, okay, I get it. Below the band, I can work my biceps, triceps, I can work my forearms.

But the shoulder, the chest, the back, the traps, those are on the other side. You would think we can't affect the blood flow there. But when you affect the venous outflow of the arms, you also affect the venous return from the entire upper body. So I'll give you two concepts. One, creating deoxygenation in your arms has a crossover effect of deoxygenation in the upper body muscles. Number two, if you decrease blood flow going through the major vena cava of the arm, those other muscle groups dump into that same one. So you're basically having this crossover effect of reducing venous flow and basically reducing available oxygen. And like Kyle will tell you,

you put them on your arms, you go do your shoulders, they're going to light up quicker and deeper. You put them on your arms, you're going to do pushups, light up quicker and deeper. Do compound movements quicker and deeper. And you get the same thing. Give you a quick example. If you can do 100 pushups and then 60 and then 40 and you put these on, you're probably going to do 60, 30 and maybe 10 if you're not resting much. Those last 10 are going to feel like a burn you've never felt. Again, you're getting to that same point, which is that end burn that's driving deeper and creating this massive adaptation.

Yeah, it's pretty nuts. I can't do three sets of 30 on pushups yet, you know, not with 30 seconds rest. I'll get 30, I might get 20, and then hopefully I can still, you know, get 10, 12 on that last set. But it's, and it's funny thinking about that too, because I've seen the correlation already, you know, between sport and how everything's been working, not being able to do that. So I really wonder, what does that actually look like

when I can hit three sets of 30 with that very tiny window of rest in between, how strong will I be there? How much will that affect sport at that point? It's pretty remarkable because at no point did I say, if I increase my bench by 20 pounds, is that going to make me better jujitsu? Is that going to make me better boxer? It's just not, It doesn't translate. Yet now with these bands, I'm thinking about that. Well, if I do hit 30, 30, 30, how does that look in jujitsu? How does that look in boxing in the 12th round? It's going to make a difference. Well, and remember, typically when we do strength training, we only tap into the anaerobic side. But when you're in the 12th round, that's not anaerobic, right? You're still aerobic and anaerobic. You're kind of in between both. So you need the slow twitch

muscle fibers. So again, going back to a couple of these stories, you're doing a strength training move, but you're working the aerobic side first because you're using a lighter load and you're creating endurance in an activity that you wouldn't think would create endurance. I mean, that alone, what if you didn't have to do aerobic training to get aerobic endurance improvement? What? I'm telling you, in three to five years, that's going to be the norm. You're not going to have to go get on the treadmill for 30 minutes. You're just going to have to put the bands on and in 30 to 60 seconds hit hypoxia. That's all it takes. And I mean, people tell me I'm nuts. I had Brent Romhardner.

He's the three-time 24-hour mountain bike champion, national champion. Calls me up, Mike, put my daughter down at nine. I go start training in my garage and I go six hours, five nights a week. I go to bed at three and I get up at seven. I go to work. I can't do this anymore. Can you help me? I said, well, it depends, Brent, on whether you're going to, you'll listen. He said, dude, I'll try anything. So here's what you're going to do. You're going to train every other day. I want you to go do your six hour because you think you need it, but I'll teach you different. But the next day you're going to go 20 minutes. And he just laughs at me. I said, you're going to try it or not? He said, dude, I'll try it.

I said, so put the bands on, crank them up, get into the burn and don't let it go. Here's what most people do. They get into the burn and then they back off. So then you got to go back in and then they back off. No, get into the burn, step on the gas and get her done. So he calls, he texts me at 930. He started at nine, texts me at 930, said, I've never felt anything like that. What in the world?

And I just laughed at him. He called me, said, I told you, dude, you're all stuck on volume and time. Start pushing fatigue point. So he checked back on me at 30 days, said, yep, my endurance is better. I've cut 16 hours off my training. I'm sleeping. But Mike, why are my quads growing? How is that possible? I've never grown my quads. I said, so Brent, when you get about five to 10 minutes into this and you real, most people two to three minutes, but he's so in shape, takes him about five to 10 minutes to really get into the burn. I said, what are you feeling? He said, I'm feeling, yeah, I feel the burn that I don't normally feel.

I said, are you on the anaerobic or aerobic side? He said, never thought of that. I'm on the anaerobic side. I said, yeah, it's like you jumped off the bike and you started squatting. What would happen if you jumped? Yeah, my legs would grow. And he went, you got to be kidding me. I said, dude, it's like your strength training and riding the bike at the same time. So he's doing aerobic training and he's getting a strength training workout. Kyle just told you he's doing strength training and he's also getting an

aerobic workout because his endurance is better. It's like it doesn't even matter which side of the equation you work. Starting an aerobic cardio exercise, build strength and build endurance. Oh, okay. Go do a strength training movement, build cardio and strength training. I mean, just fascinating. Yeah. I love that. I love that example. That's phenomenal. Talk a little bit about, you know, the different offerings you guys have from, from a video standpoint. I've been able to look at the speed training and some of the different things. And it's like, oh, of course, you know, like whatever I do on ladder drills or footwork drills or plyometrics, you know, depth jumps, box jumps, some of the things you had already mentioned, I just do those with the bands. And then I'm going

to get that explosiveness. Jumping rope, same deal. You know, when I hit my boxing warmup, I'm shadow boxing, I'm jumping a rope, doing various things for footwork, doing line jumps where I'm back and forth, just agility things to change direction. I do all that with the bands on to begin. Then I'll hit a few rounds and then pop them off and it's game time. But how that applies, this is really what you were talking about with your son and with so many different athletes is like, go do the thing that you're already doing with your trainer, just throw the bands on. For people who want to increase speed and athleticism, things that are very hard to get to without having a trainer, without having some write-up

and periodization and all this shit, how does this apply to them? And what are the different things that you guys offer from pickleball to you name it? I think it's pretty cool that you guys have so many different offerings. Yeah. Well, the first thing I recognized in the BFR industry, when we started, there was only a couple of companies, like one or two companies, right? People got to be coached, right? How do you put these darn things on? How do you pump them? So we're the only company out there that provides an extensive coaching program. So you buy a set of our bands, you immediately get an email with the videos of how to put them on, and then we got all the programs. Anytime you want a specific program, you just email us. We'll design it for you. For example, I got this guy, a buddy of mine,

Doug Zucco. He's got these fast fits body sculpting centers in Las Vegas. And he wants to put all these clients, because he's using it, that come in and they get this cool light therapy detox. He wants them to do some exercise. So we made videos. So now we got all these fast-fit videos. So trust me, we got a video for everything. You want speed training? We got it.

You want knee rehab? We got it. You want pickleball? I got Scott Moore, the number one pickleball player in the history of the sport, senior, got his videos. Golf program, Gaylord Rhodes, he's wrote the golf program. So when you buy our bands, we're going to give you the exact program and what to do. And then you've got a coach. Number two, if you become a member, which is only 49 bucks, you get the mobile app. There's over a hundred videos on there.

There's a video on pain. We were talking about pain. You're going to want to say, hey, dad, hey, brother, hey, friend, you can get out of pain. Or you just click the button and send them the pain video I did. So we built this over three years. I've built this library. So you're going to know exactly what to do if you need support. But like Kyle said, just put the bands on. The only thing you got to do is not lift heavy. Just cut the weight, put them on, and go get the burn in whatever you're doing. They're waterproof. There's only two bands out there that are waterproof. Katsu Aqua bands. You got to pay more in our bands. Now you can swim with them. Water yoga. So, I mean, we've got all those things. We even do 30-day money-back guarantee, 12-month warranty, zero down, zero into six months. So, I mean, nobody's got the systems

in place we've got, you know, to get people in so they can get started, get results and know what they're doing. Well, it's been, it's been so cool getting to know you again, thanks to our buddy, Justin Franson. I think, uh, yeah, he's cool. He hyped the shit out of you and I still, it still didn't do you justice. You know, it still didn't do B3 justice and, and what, you know, this has been pretty much over an overnight success. You know, in my mind, if you think about, you know, the years of training and, and everything that I've done from stem cells, the peptides to all this other shit to heal, um, it's, it's really remarkable how fast the results come in and, and, you know, to get, to get stronger, to get faster, to get more cardio while rehabbing, it just doesn't happen. You know, but the fact that I've

able, been able to achieve all this, it's something that I've been very excited to bring this podcast to my listeners. And we're going to link in the show notes, a place where you guys can click on this. If you guys are interested and purchase bands, do whatever you want to do. Where can people follow you and stay connected to the research you guys are doing and stuff like that? Well, number one, go out to the website, b3sciences.com. Okay, that's number one. You can follow us. We got a Facebook group or a lot of people on that. Go look for Iamb3, I B3, the letter three. But if you want to get on our newsletter,

just send an email over to support at b3sciences.com. We'll put you on the monthly newsletter. But really, if you want to plug in, just get a set of bands. You're going to get plugged into everything I'm doing. And here's where it starts. You should have the same opinion Kyle said. Okay, yeah, yeah yeah yeah but you know what if that's true what the hell right you shouldn't believe any of this but what you

shouldn't do is say okay i'm gonna put those darn bands on and i'm telling you they will blow your mind i've never had anybody send them back and say not i mean god what would it take for somebody to take your bands from you? It's not going to happen, is it? No, I mean, the first thing, you know how long it took. It took me a week, and I bought bands for my 72-year-old dad. The following week, I bought one for my homie at the farm, Eric Vaughn, the manager of the farm team.

I was like a guy I trained with all the time at boxing and weightlifting. I'm like, nah, we can rotate on these, but I'd rather us be able to knock it out at the same time. So I bought him a pair. I bought my wife a pair. She can share with, share with my son. Like I just want every, I want everyone I know using this shit, you know, she liked in the bands. She absolutely loves it. And she's, again, she's not doing a whole lot because she's, we're still co-sleeping her nervous systems fried. She doesn't have a lot of time to devote to anything as a mom. And at the same time,

even if she had the time, her nervous system can't work with that kind of output. So it's been really perfect for her to come in, you know, on less sleep and still say, you know what, I can say yes to 10, 15 minutes. Get a good pump, change her neurochemistry, feel better about the day, sleep better the next night. You know, that's all a part of it. How about your son?

He loves it. It's funny because, you know, with kids because with kids, I go on a run. First time I'm going, we do a one mile and he's like, daddy, my legs burn. And I'm like, yeah, that's the point. That's why we're doing this. And he's like, no, I don't like it. I don't like it.

It burns. And we'll have to stop and walk. And then we jog again, start running. And then the burn starts and he stops again. This was the first time where I told him, hey, it's going to burn. And that's what we want. You don't back off when the burn starts. You push through the burn. You breathe through the burn. And so watching him do, you know, sets of 30 on walking lunges and whatever pushups he can do to failure, I think he can get like 15 or so with the bands, about 20 without, you know, and then there's some significant drops

in those pushups, but literally he's just doing pushups. He might do curl to overhead press with the little, you know, the surgical tube and then his lunges, that's it. And he's already stronger. He's already faster. And he actually enjoys pushing that burn and seeing the pump. You know, he enjoys the feeling of that because there is a neurochemical response. Why Arnold talked about it. I'm on stage, I'm coming. I'm in the gym, I'm coming. Everywhere he goes, he associates the pump with an orgasm. It feels that good.

And so I think that it's been really cool to give an eight-year-old that feeling without worry. Am I compressing his spine? Am I going to injure or stunt his growth? I mean, all that's off the table because he's just doing body weight. Yeah. And kids love it. You know why? Because it's quick, so they don't get bored. It's on them so quick, and then they start flexing. All the kids, they're like, look at my muscles. Wow. And it's game changer for kids, right? Five, six, seven, eight minutes, get your

kids in these, do some jump squats, some lunges, some pushups, watch what happens. You'll turn your kids into a freak. The other kids will not be able to compete with your kid if they're not doing BFR. That's all I'll tell you listeners. They won't be able to compete. Yeah. Jumping, jumping backs has been a great finisher too. You know, just hitting jumping jacks with the band on has been something that's like, it's an excellent way. Like he's already kind of fried the major muscle groups. Now it's getting, you know, full body, it's cardio, but he's also getting that quick jump, you know, that rebound. And, you know, when you're hitting that at the fatigue level,

you're hitting it at like, where would you get that on a run? Way late in the game, you know? So whatever his, you know, wherever his threshold was before, he's way beyond that now. Yeah. Yeah. It's going to be fun to watch what happens to him. Oh yeah. Well, dude, it's been great. I feel very privileged and honored that I've been

introduced to you and that I got you in my corner as a major part of my strength training programs and athletic programming. I think that it's been phenomenal and I have many blessings and you've definitely been one of those. So I appreciate your time, Mike. I appreciate everything you guys are doing at B3 Sciences. And like I said, we'll have links in the show notes for anybody that's into it. And I'll for certain have you back on down the road because I'll have stats on my dad. I'll have stats on my son. I'll have a lot longer for the N equals three or four people that I'm working with pretty steadily to show what their results look like. And we'll circle back on it for sure. Awesome. Great to show, you know, what their results look like and, and,

and we'll, we'll circle back on it for sure. Awesome. Great to be here. Thanks Kyle. Have a good one, brother. Thank you.