Kyle Kingsbury Podcast - #331 Sacred Hunting, Tracking Big Cats, and Fostering Permaculture In All Aspects Of Your Life w/ Mansal Denton

Episode Date: November 29, 2023

Mansal Denton is back and radder than ever! You all know him as longtime friend of the show and dear brother of mine. Mansal is the founder of Sacred Hunting, guiding men and WOMEN now through transformational experiences via a combination of hunting and plant medicine. He has been an adventurer and seeker of a novel and deeper experiences with Nature since I’ve known him and in this ep we dive into some more of his life the last year+. We talk about his trip to Eastern Siberia, the week after Russia invaded Ukraine, to track and find relationship to Siberian Tigers. He just got back from a conservation expedition in Utah to track mountain lions and gather information on their lives.  Mansal shares with us some of the medicine he has received from guiding women’s only experiences in Sacred Hunting. He also shares some of what is on the horizon for him in his personal life.   Exit and Build Health Summit is a BRAND NEW FREE event from my good friend John Bush and his team over at Live Free Academy. It’s a 5-day series of conversations with over 25 world-renowned natural health experts in every area of wellness you can think of to share their proven secrets, strategies, methods and more for exiting disease and building lifelong health in your brain and body. Go check out Exit and Build Health Summit and I’ll see you there!   Connect with Mansal: Website: SacredHunting.com  Instagram: @mansaldenton - @sacredhunting     Show Notes: Fit For Service - Full Temple Reset  "The Invisible Rainbow" - Arthur Firstenberg  "Lion Tracker's Guide to Life" - Boyd Varty   Sponsors: The Wellness Company Grab your medical emergency kit from TWC.health/kingsbury for all the must-have medications you may need in case everything goes belly up. Cured Nutrition has a wide variety of stellar, naturally sourced, products. They’re chock full of adaptogens and cannabinoids to optimize your meatsuit. You can get 20% off by heading over to www.curednutrition.com/KKP  using code “KKP” Lucy Go to lucy.co and use codeword “KKP” at Checkout to get 20% off the best nicotine gum in the game, or check out their lozenge. Rhizal Get some great looking, grounding shoes over at Rhizal.co  and use code “KKP” for 10% off! To Work With Kyle Kingsbury Podcast   Connect with Kyle: Fit For Service Academy App: Fit For Service App  Instagram: @livingwiththekingsburys - @gardenersofeden.earth  Odysee: odysee.com/@KyleKingsburypod  Youtube: Kyle Kingbury Podcast  Kyles website: www.kingsbu.com - Gardeners of Eden site    Like and subscribe to the podcast anywhere you can find podcasts. Leave a 5-star review and let me know what resonates or doesn’t.

Guess who's back, y'all? We got Mansell Denton, a longtime friend of the show, the founder of Sacred Hunting, and one of my close friends. Mansell's been on the show multiple times before. We usually talk hunting nature and a whole host of other things, and he just got back from a really rad trip. One of the things that I love about Mansel is he's done some pretty crazy experiences

like tracking Siberian tigers out in Eastern Russia, or he just got back from Utah where they, for science, went and darted, not killed, but knocked out a mountain lion to get details and information on it and just really, really fascinating stuff and conservation efforts and all sorts of different things.

But he's a guy who goes around the world just doing really cool shit and I'm really inspired by that. He reminds me a lot of a young Boyd Vardy who instead of making his backyard wild, he continues to seek out and find wild places, both in nature and inside himself. I always love podcasting with Munsell. He's a regular on the show for a reason. He's one of my good buddies and he's always doing cool shit. So you guys are going to be fascinated

with this podcast the same way I was. We've got a lot to talk about in regards to what's coming up. It's the end of the year and I hope you all just had a great Thanksgiving. Mine was ridiculous. We had a Friendsgiving. And then Thanksgiving was with more homies out at the farm. And I, thankfully, have been training hard during all this. So I haven't packed on too many pounds. But, you know, I do throw caution to

the wind when it's the holidays. I do eat, uh, and feast, you know, it's the time the harvest is the time of the feast. And after that, it's good to reset the body. And this is why our Godsey and I have carefully selected when we run full temple reset. And that happens every year at the end of January. So do your thing, have fun during the holidays and trust if you guys sign up for this, that your body is going to be able to get right. You're going to, you're going to snap back into metabolic flexibility, metabolic health, and that lasts surprisingly a long time. The science behind it, fasting mimicking shows six to 12 months of benefit from an inflammatory standpoint to metabolic flexibility standpoint.

And I'm willing to bet that if you're trying to stretch that six to 12 from six to months to 12 months, that the difference there is how you eat in between. You know, if I get home and I go to say, I get home from full temple reset and I just start pounding pancakes with syrup, it's probably not going to, those benefits aren't going to last too long. But if I continue to put good things in my body and follow the teachings from the wisest people that I've met, this is really what the breakdown is. We have an immersive with Eric Godsey and I every year at the end of January, January 24th through the 28th in person at the farm in Lockhart. You can find it in the show notes, fitforservice.com. And then there's a bunch of forward slash all that jazz. Just click on it in the show notes fitforservice.com and then there's a bunch of forward slash all that jazz just click on it in the show notes and it'll take you right to the place you can join the

waitlist signups are going to be open very quickly here a week from today so december 6th you're going to be able to sign up for it open to to the public. But if you join the wait list, you'll get early bird stuff. So make sure you do that. Like I said, we hit fasting mimicking diet, sauna and ice bath every single day, mobility, opening up the body on all levels. And we deep dive with Godzi a ton of stuff from Jungian psychology on Jungian symbology, dream work, and how that pertains to plant medicines. And the list goes on and on of really cool shit. Basically the most powerful things that have influenced me and Eric in our lives. We get to deep dive for five days with you guys.

At the end, we have an amazing, incredible sound healing. And after that, we feast together. We enjoy the fact that we've been starving and now we get to eat together and celebrate the resetting of our body. Check it all out. It's in the show notes, fulltempleresetfitforservice.com.

And I hope to see you guys there. I hope to meet you guys. This is one of the best ways to get to know me and Eric is being face-to-face in a small group for five days. And I'm excited for this year. You know, every time we've done this, we've had just an amazing experience. Godsey and I fast with you. We do the whole thing with you guys. I know how important it is

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for free. And we give a ton of great knowledge in that hour. There's no doubt. We're not beating around the bush, wasting people's time. It is awesome what you're going to learn in that hour for free. And if you feel so inclined, you can purchase for a low price and upgrade to the VIP. We're going to get an extra 30 to 45 minutes, which eat with each of the speakers. And I can promise you, and this is, this is no, not bullshit. I even say this in the interview. I have never talking about what I talk about before online and there's good reason for that. Never on a podcast, never on anyone else's podcast,

never on my podcast, never spoken about the things that I speak about in that 30 to 45 minutes. The only way you're gonna hear it is if you sign up for the VIP, but you don't have to. Please just check out the free part and I can guarantee you're gonna be really stoked and happy that you did without further ado my brother mansel welcome to the podcast

mansel the return baby i'm back i'm stoked to have you back i'm glad we're both in camo too yeah it is it is lovely i mean i wasn't planning on wearing the full regalia, but it is whitetail season, and got some tags, and from a regenerative standpoint, they're the only species we have on the land that's not regenerative, because for our exotics, we give them inputs. We feed them.

The blackbuck have a very low impact, but more so, they can't reproduce because there's no males with them. So when we put the hive fence in, we left the gate open and let them all leave. And about half the herd left, all the males, and half the females stayed and had their last babies. So rather than let them eat all the grass and become old, inedible, we wanted to, wanted to harvest. So we're, we're working hard for that. They're, they're, uh, surprisingly challenging for only 118 acres with a high fence. It seems like a harvest and yet, you know, we're spotting stock, not using feeders and doing shit like that. So it's, they know when, when it's hunting season, as you know. Yeah. It just,

another reminder of how intelligent they are and how aware they are. Absolutely. Yeah, I thought whitetail was going to be easy on the first elk hunt I went on. It was up in Joseph, Oregon. And they were coming right up to the rig like we could take selfies with them. But they knew. They absolutely knew. And then I saw like the ass of one elk in six days.

And I was like, okay, this is why my uncles were pissed off a lot of the time. This is what it's all about. All right. You know, it's like fishing. You're in there for eight hours and you don't get, well, you get like one nibble and no fish. It's kind of the deal sometimes. And that's one of the beautiful aspects of hunting and fishing

that's such a reflection for life too. Absolutely, brother. Well, we always talk hunting. I'm definitely going to talk hunting with you. And I also want to bridge the gap for other people who may not be into hunting on some of the reasons you might want to get into it and all that fun stuff. But, uh, you recently got back from a trip and I want to hear all about it. You sent me videos and I was just, I mean the hair, I don't have much hair, but the hair, what little hair that I had on the back of my neck stood the fuck up. And I was like, Oh wow, that's a whole different

thing. So dive into this because you traveled the world doing super cool shit. I want to remind people, too, of the other stories that you have from making your way to the Gobi Desert and different places like that when you feel necessary. Just run those back. They never get old, brother. Yeah, I just got back from Utah

and as I've mentioned before, I am obsessed with cats and felines and, uh, loves the pussy. I love the pussy. They, you know, as far as the, the, uh, predators are concerned, they're just the best land animals. And I can watch them for so long, watch how they move, watch how they, you know, interact with the landscape and there's kind of a regal nature to them. So for me, it's just, you know, some people want to go on hikes and I just want to go all over the world, see beautiful new cultures and environments and try and find

the cats. And so luckily I got invited by a conservationist organization. They're out in Utah and they basically use hounds. So they use like seven to nine dogs, very well trained. I mean, some of these dogs are like the best trained in the world at what they do specifically. And so, and these are like 50 to $75,000 worth of dogs that we're running. And basically what we do is we let the dogs go in a specific environment where we know that there are mountain lions and they'll try and pick up a scent. And I'll get a little bit more into the relationship with the dogs because it's really cool. the whole point of the trip was to find mountain lions in the mountains of Utah, south of Salt Lake City, and either put GPS collars on them or replace collars that had died. And we also, you know, check their blood, check their teeth, check their height, weight, get all kinds of

data so that we could, you know, filter this data. I think it's a necessary evil, but in the West and in this country, kind of the way that we maintain and preserve wildlife is often done in a very scientific manner. And so some of this data was really, like, beneficial for making an argument that, you know, mountain lions need to be treated this way or a different way. And so that's why we did it. Um, we're like the aliens to the animals, you know, you didn't probe it, did you? Exactly. We didn't, we had, I had this conversation with people when we were out there because it felt almost identical to like what they were doing.

And honestly, I had some moral dilemmas about it because it's invasive. It's not, the animal doesn't want it. The animals, you know, a big part of my journey with that was like holding space for the animal in a various, you know, various different ways. Um, particularly with eye contact, you know, cause she's, she's awake, you know, the whole time She's just not able to move. So anyway, we got really spoiled because as you're talking about hunting, sometimes you don't see anything. First day we're there, by 8.30 a.m.,

we were already on a cat, and the cat was already treed. So what happens is the mountain lions, and most cats in general, they're fast as hell, like faster than, you know, anything you can think of out in the wild, definitely faster than the dogs. But they run out of oxygen fast. And when that happens, they go to the top of the tree. And, and so, and cause they know it's safe and they learned that it was safe. So the dogs find a track, they chase it up into a tree. We can hear it. The guy that I'm with, he's the houndsman. I mean, they're some of the best, you know, houndsmen in the country

and they, they're listening to their dogs and they can hear the different barks of the dogs. And they can hear that some of the dogs think that they've treed a mountain lion, but some don't. So he's waiting to figure out which dogs think that there's one in the tree. And so he's listening. It's a really unique experience. Is it the varsity guys that say he's in the tree or the B team, the B squad? A hundred percent. And the team is really like a pack, just like a wolf pack or a human pack.

Everybody has their role. There is 100% the alpha. You've got the woman, the female, Mercedes. She's an 8-year-old dog. And she's old. And, man, she's got scars all over her face from mountain lions. She knows what's up. And she's not the first one to capture a scent,

but she's the most right. So like all the young ones, the young bucks will get it, and they'll be running down the path, and they'll be excited, but they'll be running the wrong direction. And Mercedes is like, actually, guys, you're on the track, but you're going the wrong way. It's this way. So they all kind of have a role.

But, yeah, within like an hour, uh, eight 30 in the morning, we had this, uh, this animal up in the tree and then we went over there and the beautiful thing was you'd think, you know, in a process like this, you just be fought, you get there, you have a wildlife biologist dart, the animal tranquilize it. And then you go about doing your thing, but there's no telling whether we'll actually get a mountain lion in the tree. So the DNR, Department of Natural Resources rep, was in Salt Lake City. We had four hours just one-on-one with the animal. We couldn't leave because we had to make sure that it stayed in the tree and there was nothing else to do. And so that really became

my ceremony. And, you know, instead of a plant medicine ceremony sitting on a, you know, beanbag cushion or inside a Moloka, I was just in the sun, no cell service, no nothing nothing just looking into the eyes of a 90 pound female mountain lion damn so when you dart her is she in the tree or how do you get her down she's in the tree and this these were some of the interesting things so we knew who this mountain lion was the guy the houndsman this was one of the first ones that he had collared, so he knew her. He didn't go so far as to believe that she knew him. I was, you know, obviously I don't know, but I'm pretty sure she knew him. And I'm pretty sure some part of her could understand, like, this is not going to be comfortable and I don't want to be near them, but I don't have to fear for my life. So when she got darted, she stayed in the tree.

A lot of times the animals will run out of the tree. You know, they get darted, something's uncomfortable and they're gone and you got to find them again. This one stayed, she, she went to sleep in the tree and basically we have to go up, tie, tie a rope around its legs and then lower her, and then do the work on the ground. So she basically stayed pretty safe. That's cool. She was able to be unconscious up there and not fall out of the tree.

I mean, that speaks to the prowess of such an apex predator. Yeah. It was funny because so many times during the four hour process she's so intelligent and she when we would be on our phones because he would try and show us something he'd show us like the first picture of this animal on our phone when we were all looking at her phone she would know that our attention was not on her and she would start to make moves. And then we'd have to go like scream and yell and make sure she stayed up in the tree. But she was paying attention. And she also had particular attention on the houndsman. Like if I

was going pee or something, she wouldn't do anything. But if he was doing something else, then she knew like the leader here is distracted i'm gonna try and make my move but a lot of times she behaved just like a house cat and i i see the behavior of house cats every day because i have two of them and so there are times where people thought she's she's trying to go she's trying to go and intuitively it felt like no she's she's resting or she's stretching. And she was, she fell asleep. I have some great pictures of her just like sleeping with her paws over each other in the branches. So she, she chilled. That's awesome. And you've, I mean,

you know, one of the things we do when you lead hunts is, is we have a prayer to the apex predators of the land and out in Texas and a lot of places in the US that usually involves some form of snake and the mountain lion. So it's pretty cool that you get to have that level of direct interaction. I've told the story a couple of times in this podcast of coming here as the steward of the land in Lockhart

and just assuming my role and then meditating down by the Moloka Pond and I'm meditating, my eyes pry open and I won't just assuming my role, you know, and then meditating down by the Moloka pond. And, and I fucking, I'm meditating, my eyes pry open and I won't tell the whole story, but I see a cottonmouth swimming towards me. It's like four feet long. And I'm like, holy shit. Long story short, it puts his head, rests his head on my fucking knee, like in my lap. And we just hold eye contact. And I'm like, what the fuck's happening? And I realize, oh shit, you're the guy. I'm, I'm sorry. I didn't ask for permission. May I be the steward of this land?

And I got permission. And once I could feel the yes from my body, then it just moved on. But it was like, I'm here too. This is my land that you're with, that you wanna take care of. And fucking powerful, powerful moment. And a lot of people don't understand that either.

Everyone's got a, what is Tate Fletcher? He says, everyone's a contrarian. You know, we posted a clip of that online, uh, fit for service did. And, you know, you're like, Oh, you wouldn't do that with a grizzly bear. You wouldn't have, man, I did it with the snake. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. I wouldn't, I don't know what the fuck I'd do in a lot of situations. I've talked with Tim Corcoran and different people who have their own bear medicine experiences where they made it out alive and no, the fucking bear didn't lay its head in its lap, you know, it was a totally different experience, but, um, that was a powerful one. I can imagine, you know, I can only imagine what it would be like to be in the presence of an animal that is that thing. Like you, there's genetic history there, you know, that every part of your body is saying,

holy shit. Right. And that even though, you know, consciously that you're safe and that it can attack you, you know, many human has succumbed to fucking big cats throughout fucking history. Like it's embedded in us. It's in the morphic resonance, the morphic field, like it's there. It's not, it's not there in a little bit. It's there in a big way. It's yeah. It's honestly, it's the biggest one. So if you look back at our species evolving on the savanna, we got big cats there, lions. There used to be like saber-toothed cats and there were obviously jaguar, leopards rather. And there's an anthropologist who did a study on baboons. He wanted to see how do primates relate with cats in particular, and especially in relationship to shelter. And he went to a cave where he knew baboons would stay at night, and he was in the back of the cave. The baboons came in, weren't aware of his presence,

and when it got fully dark, he made his presence known. The baboons went literally apeshit. I mean, just screaming. Baboons are gnarly. They got fangs. I don't understand. He could have his fucking face ripped off. Why would he make his presence known at that point? He is – I mean he is – bless him for his research mind for putting himself in that situation.

But the thing that he realized, the biggest conclusion was no matter how fearful those baboons were of him in that cave, they would not leave. They would not leave the cave he spent the whole night with a troop of baboons shrieking and making noise because they would not leave because they knew what was out there were cats death damn and that has stayed with us and that's one of the reasons why people you know our our species feels so safe in shelters and homes, even like a little cottage, little cabin, we feel so good. And so, yeah, it's, I realized on this trip, how much of a deep, deep relationship to predators humanity has. And of course, you know, cats in particular. Um, but it's, it, it was a very old thing and you've experienced this, so I can make it a little bit more relatable for people. Uh, you know, when, when we go hunting, when you, when you kill an animal, I think people would understand that that

touches a very old part of ourself, right? Because we've hunted for our whole life. But by the same token, like our ancestors, you know, there's this great quote, our first religion was to kill God and eat him. And so our ancestors not only saw the animals we killed as gods, but they saw these even rarer predators as like the ultimate deities, right? And so there's something I think that moves within us when we have that close relationship with a predator that is, you know, similar to people do ayahuasca and they experience, experience God through, you know, relationship to the plant. And I think that's also possible. Even bringing up Aya, you know, like there's, I haven't had, of all my experiences

have been with North American animals, hence my children's names. But I think that, you know, a lot of people, you know, you go to the Amazon, they experienced Jaguar medicine or Anaconda or any like the, the, the great species that are known in the Ayahuasca folklore, you know, and in that, that, um, Pantheon and you can become that animal, you know, like that's a, that's a whole, like it's a whole ass experience to become an animal like that and to live and see as that animal sees. I think humans are, you know, we've conquered the earth for fucking better or worse, right? For a lot worse, probably for the rest of the earth,

but hopefully we can steer the shit back towards mother nature and away from other culture as Daniel Quinn puts it. But throughout human history, you know, before all these technological advancements, you know, with gunpowder and all human history, you know, before all these technological advancements, you know, with gunpowder and all sorts of other shit, like we're, we're kind of in the middle. We're, we're predator, we're forager, we're also prey, you know, like our eyes go forward. They're not on both sides of the head, like an iguana, but, and we can't rotate our head, you know, 180 degrees like a, like a bird. But at the same time, you know, we're not the apex, not by any fucking means.

And I think for all of the tens of thousands of years, well, 2 million years ago, 1 million years, 200,000 years, I don't think there's any fucking consensus on how long humans have been here. But I would venture to say it's longer than some people think, just due to the fact that like, we thought advanced culture started 10,000 years ago and then you see gobekli tepe and a lot of these other things they they redate you know at least at least in part many scientists have redated the pyramids and things like that so um it it it would make sense you know that that some of this stuff is so deeply woven into us it's beyond our conscious mind but it's it's in there yeah like uh jung said you know like the conscious mind, but it's in there. Like Jung said, the conscious mind is the iceberg

that you see above the water and the unconscious is the whole last 90% of it below water. That's how much is communicating with us at all times that knows the history, that knows everything that happened in our ancestors' lives and it's embedded in us. Yeah, and there's so much that's beautiful about Christianity and Jesus Christ as a wisdom tradition and as a wise person.

And obviously nothing is perfect. you know, Judeo-Christian values, which permeate the country, were evolving at a time when the key way of living with animals was through livestock. I mean, Jesus was a shepherd. You have these sheep. The sheep, as I'm sure you know, are literally one of the most vulnerable animals. I'm a shepherd, baby. Well, that's the thing. Yeah, you're exactly right. You're exactly right.

They've been domesticated beyond the ability to survive on their own. Right. And so when you have that dynamic, you have basically a religion that evolves around essentially like we have to protect from these predators, from these wolves, other animals that could kill the flock. I understand where they're coming from, but it's very different than the indigenous of North America. They didn't have domesticated animals like that other than the dog.

And so when they saw mountain lions, when they saw wolves and things, even down in the jungle, when they saw Jaguars and Anacondas, these were mystical magical godlike deities not something that was a threat to our livelihood that needs to be you know eradicated which you know if you look at our policies towards coyotes and wolves and things the united states it's it's a mess on both sides, partially because of

this legacy of deep-seated fear of the animals, which is understandable. Yeah. Even the snake stuff. There was one comment on the snake post where someone had mentioned, as above, so below, and it was taken out of context, but somebody was like, careful, that's how Lucifer got thrown out of heaven and the serpent. It makes perfect sense that the serpent was on your lap. I'm like, damn dude, there's still like, even we all have bubbles where they live within bubbles, within bubbles, within bubbles. Right. And Austin's its own funny ass bubble. And, and,

uh, I'm kind of in that bubble and kind of not in that bubble in many ways as you are. Right. Um, you're not the Austin influencer bubble, but you know a lot of people that are and it is what it is. But it's funny to me that there's still people on the planet that wholeheartedly subscribe to snakes are the devil. They're Satan, right? And it's like, just go one continent South and they're revered, right?

Then that's, you look at a Native American spirit wheel, they could be in the, in the east as, as like the, the fertility of the planet, you know, and they could be in the west as the shedding of the skin and the renewal of life. As we enter the decomposition phase and the death cycle, like they're, they're anywhere you place it, you know, it's a, it's a medicine, it's a, it's a medicine spirit animal, right? And it's in our, all the medicine decks, the snake medicine. Um, so it's interesting, you know, it is interesting that that's still, I mean, there's 2 billion people that are Christian. You know, you count all, I forget how much it is. I think it may be close to 3 billion if you count or 4 billion, if you count all the, um, Abrahamic religions together, that's a fucking big, big number, you know,

and it's not poopooing on all of it. I think there's gems in anything, you know, but at the same time, like that it's, you can start to think about even like sex in this culture, right? And you, people talk about the Catholic church and different things like that, but it's really like the Puritans that came here and the Quakers that came here that really wanted to impose that stuff, you know? So like there, you think about things like that and it's like, it's easy to overlook it and just take it as this is what it is. It's like kids are born with an iPad. They're like, yeah, iPads exist. Big fucking deal. You know, they weren't around before iPads. We weren't, we were around before cell phones. So like now we get to see that. But if it, if it happened so before, even not so long before you, but just

before you were born, you know, 10 years before you were born, you just take that as fact, you know, as not like a, why is it this way? Right. Why do we agree on it as this way? Yeah. And it's funny, you mentioned the screens, the iPads and everything. That was actually one of the most poignant reflections during the whole process. I don't think I'm as bad as some people, but I definitely don't have a relationship with my phone that I'd like and screens that I'd like. I don't think I have been

as attentive to something as I was. Even on hunts though, you hunt all the time, dude. But four hours of just staring in one animal's eyes. I mean, it's like so rare that I even get that opportunity. And I would definitely be bored in other circumstances, but it was just something that captured my attention so much that I didn't really have a need or desire or care to look at my screen. And it was, that was something that kind of dawned on me. Oh, this is deeper. This is, this is the original TV, social media. This is what kept people's attention and was so compelling before all that kind of stuff. The TV, even today though, you can't experience that in a video game. You can't experience that in fucking VR.

If you walked across a Jaguar in VR, big fucking deal. It's not going to make your hair stand up. But experiencing that in real life, that's an experience even if you only have it once right it's embedded in you you're never gonna you're always gonna remember that i'm always gonna remember a snake putting its fucking head in my lap always a venomous snake that i had to come to terms with it biting me and say fuck it if you're gonna bite me go for it let's lock eyes and we fucking did like that you don't get that

anywhere else there's nothing that competes with that, right? It impacts you on a level that you can't quantify. Yeah, and that's honestly what I, as I'm, because I'm on this quest myself, you know, this was, I just went on my own and there's some kind of like wild, wildness that's in my heart that I'm seeking to capture. And, you know, you mentioned some of the other stories. I mean, I've been down to Peru tracking Jaguars. I've been to Russia tracking Siberian tigers, Finland for lynx. Right. So there's, there's just something in me that is

trying to find the wildness in these animals. And yeah, you can't get that from any kind of screen, any kind of digital experience. Yeah, Boyd Vardy, I think in his storytelling captures it best because he talks about it. Lion Tracker's Guide to Life is only three hours on Audible. If you haven't read it, we'll link to the show notes. It's one of my all-time favorites. It's the first book Bear, as like a five-year-old, listened to all the way through where he's like,

can you put on Boyd Vartan? You call him Boyd Vartan. And those stories are captivating, right? Because the art of storytelling, Boyd has mastered, but at the same time, he's lived so many experiences like that. Like he had a fucking King Cobra crawl. He was hiding from a lion or a,

what was it? It might've been a cheetah, but he was hiding from a big cat behind a giant termite hill, like an African termite hill that was, you know, fucking eight feet tall, him and his dad.

And he feels the slithering across the back of his legs. He's wearing shorts and he glances back and sees a fucking cobra. He's just like, oh God, look, I love that story.

You know what I'm saying? Like, he's got so many like that. He's fucking had his leg bit off by a crocodile. Like he's in it, you know, and he talks about coming to the West, how much he misses that. And he's doing good work here. He's, he's sharing stories. He's turning people back to nature. He's, he's speaking to the inner wild man and wild woman and all of us. Right. And that's super important. And he's doing medicine work, you know, as a, as a medicine man and, and, um, really cool shit, but there's always that longing to be back work you know as a as a medicine man and and um really cool

shit but there's always that longing to be back you know to be back where you're in the middle you're not the fucking top of the food chain you smack dab in the middle where humans have always been and you have to acknowledge that yeah yeah that sense that i totally understand where he's coming from you know that sense of adventure the sense of desire to, I would say, in my words, would be like connect to higher power through that experience. It's incredibly humbling to acknowledge something that's greater than myself. It's in many ways even more humbling to touch something that is greater than myself. No doubt. I mean, I think Laird speaks to that, you know,

through the power of nature with, with the giant waves, you know, like he sees, you know, getting towed into a 50 foot wave. And like, I can acknowledge that anybody who's been tumbled before surfing on eight foot waves in, in held under for long enough realizes the respect one wants have for the ocean, you know, and it's so vast and so much bigger. You get that too. Like if you hike a big mountain and you look out and you're looking at from the top of the mountain down, you're like, damn, I did that. Like there's a sense of a real sense of accomplishment, but also you can take in the bigness. Like it fills you in a way that, that other things can't, you know, the minutia of daily life can't. I love how you've structured your life. You know,

I've, I've, uh, other than, than being, um, careful how I word this. Oh, it was being tied down by a wife and kids. Um, other than having the commitment and responsibility of fatherhood and, and being a husband, I, I fancy myself as somebody that has structured my life in a, in a meaningful, but awesome way where I'm, I'm paid to learn. I'm paid to experience dope shit and report back on that. And, uh, uh, the better I get, the more wise I get through experience and through, through the gnosis of learning something and trying it on for myself, the better my brand gets, the better I become at my job, the better I become as a podcaster, as a coach, all those things. And, um, it's really fulfilling to have that, but I also lack some of the freedom I once did

to say I'm going to go to fucking Utah or I'm going to go on the something monster. We're going to the Gobi Desert, that kind of shit. So it's really, I love it, living vicariously through your experiences because it's fucking rad. You get to go do a lot of cool things. Talk a bit about that,

just being able to travel and some of the more meaningful trips that you've gone on where you got to experience other cultures. We know, we just had Hilda Gore on the podcast who runs the wise traditions podcast West for the West Indian price foundation. And that's, you know, she prides herself on being able to seek out indigenous wisdoms from all, from all areas of the planet and report that back. You know, and I think that's like the coolest fucking job ever. It's such a brilliant thing to be able to do. Yeah, so, I mean, the one that comes to mind immediately is last year,

you know, a week after Russia invaded Ukraine, I went to Russia, which was just getting there in and of itself was an adventure, man. I had, you know, our mutual friend J.P. Sears was talking to people he knew, military, Tim Kennedy, everybody was like, the State Department is saying Americans need to get out of the country. So do not go to the country. I had, you know, my camera guy had been in Afghanistan. So it was just like a couple of crazy kids who are just wanting to go track some big cats. So it took 72 hours to get into the country because we had to go to the only places that allowed flights into Russia. It was wild. But once we got there, that was one of the most incredible experiences of my life because I was shooting a TV show. And so, you know, I really had to think about

what is the story here? What is emerging here? And I got to spend time with the Udige, which are indigenous people of Far East Russia. And they look Asian compared to, you know, the traditional Slavic Russians. And their relationship with the Siberian tiger was so different than the

Russians relationship, most Russians relationship. They, this one guy, Sasha, that I got to go fishing with and have a conversation with, you know, he told multiple stories where his dogs, his best friends, I mean, this is a guy who lives in a shack around nobody he's isolated his community is his dogs and his dogs have on multiple occasions been killed by siberian tigers and there's this one moment where he's running after his dog and he stumbles on this cat now mind you i had a 90-pound cat. These are four, five, 600-pound cats. This Siberian tiger is looking at him. These are the white and black ones? No.

That's actually a melanin mutation. They're still the russet color of the tigers from India, but they're bigger. They're just burly. They have burly big heads. Anyway, he they're bigger. They're just like burly. They got burly big heads anyway. So he turns the corner, his dog is being, you know, killed by this tiger and the tiger looks up and snarls at him with these big teeth. And, you know, I just imagine what most people would think when they see that. And it's got to defend my dog, got to kill this cat who's killing

my best friend. And for him, he said, I could never kill something that was so beautiful. Like this is God in front of me. I could never kill this. And he just, he just stood there in amazement at the beauty of this animal. And that was so moving to me to have his, you know, almost childlike wonder with this absolute apex of apex predators. I mean, this thing kills 1,200-pound grizzly bears, rips them limb from limb. And so that, you know, being able to have that experience

and I think about the stories that I had from that, you know, being able to have that experience and I think about the stories that I had from that. I think about what I get to teach my children and what I get to bring from this tiny little corner of the adventures that I'm just so looking forward to bringing to my children, both in memory, but also hopefully being able to do that when they're kids too. My current partner, who I'll probably have children with. Let's go, buddy. There we go. That's new information. I like it, bud. Dude, she is an insane adventurer.

Kind of tops me. So our kids, there's no way they're not going to be adventure kids. I like it, bud. Dude, she is an insane adventurer. Like, kind of tops me. So our kids, there's no way they're not going to be adventure kids. I like that. Yeah, it's interesting thinking about that. I've thought, you know, when's a good time I want to take Bear out to Londa Luzi with Boyd, you know, because he's met Boyd a few times. But, yeah, international travel with kids, that's a tough one. Londa Luzi ain't cheap, you know?

You know this, so there's multiple factors in there. But like what, when you think of like things that would change someone's life, going to Maui when I was 13 and surfing for the first time was a really cool adventure. Didn't change my life. Going to Puerto Vallarta a handful of times when I was in high school,

beautiful experiences, loved them with my family. Didn't change my life. I started thinking about things like that. It's like, what would really, like, yeah, that time where you fucking tracked a pack of lions and saw them, and on the way, you got to see rhinos and elephants and in their natural habit, habit, that would change your fucking

life. There's no two ways about it. There's no two ways. It's not a zoo. They're not doped up, sad laying in their own feces behind a 15 foot wall. You realize there's nothing I think about that even if you're in a

what are the cars that they go around in, the jeep things Safari vehicles. Yeah, even if you're in a, you know, what are the cars that they go around in the Jeep thing? Safari. Yeah, the safari. Yeah, even the safari vehicles, right? Like, boy's got enough stories where you realize very quickly, that thing doesn't keep you safe.

It's not like, you know, people get road rage or road rage, road rage, because they've got, you know, there's a difference there when you add a pane of glass and a little bit of metal around you, you think you're separate from the person that you're yelling at or cutting off.

You know immediately when you're there that there's nothing separating the two of you other than space and time and that they can get to you. And, um, I don't think of, I don't think there's many things you could give a kid that would be more special than that. Yeah. Yeah. I really, you know, when I go to Russia and I go track the mountain line and everything, it is the kid. It's the kid that's making those decisions in me to some degree. And, you know, it brings me alive. And that's really what I'm after is some kind of aliveness. And I think that everybody, what are we going to do with our one precious life? You know, get an opportunity to,

and no matter where one is, if people are listening to this, like there's an opportunity for that. I know people who will just go in their five acre, you know, 10 acre backyard, and they'll just sit under a tree for, you know, a couple nights nights and their whole intention is just like let the wild come to them kind of a mini vision quest they create then of course there's hunting which you can get into and you don't have to go

track lions and mountain lions is what I'm saying for people who are listening to this and think that that might be out of reach but it's such a important part of I I think, our lives is to have a deeper and deeper connection to nature and the wild things that are on our planet. Yeah, absolutely, brother.

It made me think of Robert Bly. God, what's the name of that book? Iron John. He talks about the prince has to, the prince leaves the castle, he goes into nature and he finds the wild man. And the wild man, you know, helps him sever the cord with his mother

and actually step into becoming a man with the wild man harnessed, you know? Like that's such a trajectory for, it was for all people. It's not necessarily that anymore, you know? But I think there are people that, like ourselves, that track that, they get a taste of it and they realize like,

oh, here's where the sauce is. You know, like this is where life becomes real. You know, before I was on the sticks, I was in a game within the game, you know, but let me, I don't want to play a game within the game. I used to think that with like Grand Theft Auto, these little mini missions. I'm like, why the fuck would I do that? I want to play the game. I didn't come here to

play the mini mission. And then it dawned on me on mushrooms. I was like, oh yeah, video games, we'll play a game within the game. I didn't come here to fucking do that. And I think these things that spark that aliveness in us, you know, it's not something that has to be done all the time, right? It is something that, that it's like fills the cup for a long time and you still want to do more, but at the same time, there's a fullness that comes from it that, um, I don't think you can get in a lot of other places. Yeah. You know, as we're talking about this, one thing that I'm remembering is the Dagara tribe. You, you turned me on to the book by Somae and, uh,

you know, what he talks about in the book is how for the Dagara, this is of water and spirit. Yeah. The, the first most intelligent beings are plants. The second most intelligent beings are animals. The third most intelligent beings are animals. The third most intelligent beings are humans.

And for humans to be in touch with and connected to their purpose and their mission on this planet during their lifetime, they have to go to the school of the really think the psychedelic renaissance is giving people a really beautiful relationship to plants. It is, you know, whether it be ayahuasca or wachuma, and then even the things that you're doing here, bringing the conversation around regenerative agriculture and the relationship to everything around us, all the plants around us. And also there's plant, there's also animal medicine. And that is what I experienced, you know, do ayahuasca, you sit, you know, six, seven, eight hours in a maloca. I was staring four hours at this mountain lion. I do think that that mountain lion medicine, that animal medicine is so important in that, you know, rewilding of humans today, trying to find purpose, trying to find meaning. And, you know, whether it be hunting, you know, which I do to connect

with animals that nourish me or,ish me or finding these big cats and predators that nourish me at a soul spiritual level, it is an important part of the equation. And as everybody, I mean, we definitely are in a meaning crisis where people feel like they're lacking purpose, they're lacking connection to the divine. And I think a lot of it has to do with,

uh, you know, screens and just being in the matrix versus like seeing the, and connecting to the wildness all around us, both plants and animals. Yeah. There was a guy, uh,

on Instagram going, I was fucking scrolling like years ago, right during the COVID shit, and he was talking about the inorganic versus the organic. You know, like they talk about AI and all these other things, and it's like, really, it's just like the, you know, whether it's the digital or no matter what it is, there's some, it's, you know, the simulation of the thing that's good for you, right?

Versus the thing that's good for you. And I think that in so many ways, like my life has improved a shit ton in this past year because I started boxing and kickboxing again once a week. And I didn't realize how much I needed that for me personally, right? Some people that's golf, some people that's running. And I run now too again.

But I'm just getting like a micro dose of this once a, I'm never going to fucking fight again, but like just to go for an hour, hour and a half once a week with a lot of the farm team homies that fills my cup for the whole fucking week. I look forward to Friday morning, you know, like that's when we're going to go rip it up. And then Monday nights and some other nights I'll get on the mats for jujitsu and I'm coaching my son. And then a couple of days, once or twice a week, I lift weights now. And once or twice a week, I go for a run and I'm getting in the sauna where I can, I'm doing mobility every day. But like, there's certain pieces there that, that are, I can't accomplish that just from weights alone.

I can't accomplish it just from running alone. You know, like I have to get it from the physical interaction of martial arts, you know? And I think the more, the more tools that we have individually that we're drawn to, right? Cause it's not one size fits all. It's not like everyone go and take an MMA class. No fucking, you might hate that. Um, it takes a long time for somebody to actually be comfortable getting hit in the face, you know, like that, that's actually, you can learn to be comfortable getting hit in the face, whether you want to learn that or not, that's up to you. But, um, there's so many things that I can't get from fighting that I can only get through hunting. Right. And so many things that I get in farming that I only get from having that, that relationship

over and over again, that I get to tend this land. I get to walk this land. I get to, even when I'm not hunting the land with a gun, I'm hunting the land on my walks with Guapo, you know, this little 18 pound Chihuahua Shih Tzu that's 10 years old and can barely see, you know, we're walking around. He stops when I stop, he's sniffing around. He tells me when shit's going off, you know, like where to look. And, um, and, and that, that's a connection point. You know, it's a connection point I don't have in the city. It's a connection point I don't get on other people's land. You know,

like there, we got many routes here on this place for 118 acres. Like we know, I know which herds like to hang out in different spots, and then we've got our own that we're rotating around, the flock and the herd, the flird, as Daniel Griffith calls it. And it is super special. It is absolutely super special. Even the plants themselves,

like Bear, he picked out a fig tree that we're going to plant by the house, not in the food forest. And we got seven figs off it in the spring. It was fucking awesome. It was the first time he tried fig, right? First time I actually ate a fresh fig, not like a fig Newton or something like that. And it was just like, what a cool, what a cool little way to reconnect, you know, like we're given this as some good organic, uh, um, soil amendments and things like that. And it's producing like crazy in a fucking pot. Like that's awesome. You know, that's a little touch point as well. Talking about, um, what you've

been doing, you know, you had the TV show. Is that going to come out? Where's it going to come out? You were doing the, the provider, you know, you wanted to run a test where you could see if the only meat you put in your body was something that you had hunted and killed yourself. Um, and you've been looking for land, right? I'm still running the hunt. So let's dive in, dive into this stuff. Catch me up. Cause it's been a minute. We only really get to catch up, uh, on podcasts. Cause otherwise I got the kids around and it's like, uncle Mansell, uncle Mansell, uncle Mansell. So, yeah, yeah. So, uh, man, that commitment that I made that we talked about on the first podcast, you know, that was one of the best commitments that I have, you know, made with my life.

And it's one of the most meaningful. It's honestly one of the things that has me feel so excited about children because I know it'll be challenging. I know it won't make a lot of sense, but it's going to be, you know, super meaningful. And, yeah, I did it for a year. Uh, you know, I've basically since then I have, I don't purchase meat to bring into my home. You know, it's stuff that I kill myself, uh, or I have a relationship with myself and it's, it's, you know, I can go on ad nauseum, but suffice it to say, it's, it's a, it's a very, very profound commitment to make. And there have definitely been times where it's created,'s a, it's a very, very profound commitment to make. And there have definitely been

times where it's created, you know, tension for me. Like I don't have any meat and I guess I'm going to be eating a lot of eggs for the next week until I can, you know, get out and actually kill a whitetail. Um, but it is a meaningful, you know, meaningful process. And that, because of that commitment and because of those early hunting experiences, you know, you came on, you know, I think the second hunting trip that I ever led. And, uh, the one that I'll do next week will be 60 in three years. Right. So that's a lot of facilitating a lot of, you know, creating these containers and obviously a lot of evolution and things change within that period. Um, you know, for me, it's been one of the greatest, uh, like training grounds, master's degree, PhD, even in

leadership, because the space that I go into, you know, we didn't on our experience, but I use plant medicine now we use psilocybin. We're, you know, you got two ones with you. That's right. That's right. That's right. Not with the carnivore. Not the first one. Yeah. I don't know if he'd have been down. Yeah. We did. Not then. Yeah. Yeah. Not then. Oh yeah. That's right. I forgot. Yeah. We Yeah, we've had an experience since then. But, you know, that, and you know this firsthand because you went back out and you hunted after ceremony. And, like, that's a lot of energy to be going through that process, right? Easily one of the most beautiful experiences of my life.

Yeah. By far. Yeah. By far. Yeah. Yeah. And that's, and, and, you know, to hold that, to create, to try and create that. Now, granted, it's not, it's not me. I'm just, you know, God's conduit on the earth trying to keep the wheels on the bus, so to speak, for, for, for this experience to unfold. And, but it's made me into a much better leader. And so, you know, now luckily I've, I've led some facilitator trainings and I've got, you know, 20 facilitators across the country. Our mutual friend, Nathan is, uh, Nathan Smith, one of, one of the facilitators and him and him

and Matt, uh, they lead experiences up in Colorado. So we've now we've done archery, like elk hunts. They lead some backcountry hunting preparation. So just pure skills-based, like long-range rifle, survival, all that kind of stuff, mountaineering. And then all over the country, there's in the Pacific Northwest and experiences. Uh, so I'm really wanting this, uh, organization to kind of take root and start to spread, you know, well beyond me because, uh, you know, I don't have any, I've thought a lot about this and, you know, I have the book sacred hunting and I have, you know, talked about it, but it's not me. This, this whole concept is so old. It's so human. I'm doing nothing more than just bringing back old things and adding some new pieces together. And so, yeah, I'm really in a process right now

of the organization trying to empower other people to go through this themselves. And you probably have people who are listening to this who, you know, they might not want to come on an in-person experience with me, but they hunt. They've hunted their whole life. Maybe they hunted their whole life in Kentucky and they just sat in a blind and now they can be inspired to kind of take this to their kids. important message for me to, to get to people because I think the ripple effect of more people and more children connected to their wildness, connected to the process of life and death can only mean, you know, positive things for society. Yeah. More people defending our right to grow our own food, to know that, that meat is healthy for us. It's probably one of the healthiest things we can put in our body for many people on the planet. hunted meat would be at the top of the best

of the best of the meat. Even Robbie from Force of Nature said that. Number one is something you kill yourself out in the wild. They got to select every bit of food that went into its mouth its whole life. Getting that, there's really nothing like it, you know. I mean, there is nothing like it.

So I think reconnecting people to that and making it available. I love the idea, you know, what you're thinking with your organization reminds me of like the food forest. It takes a lot of help in the beginning, you know, like raising kids. And then about 15 years or so, we die. And that thing would thrive without us because it's set up from a permaculture design standpoint. And, um, you know, you're trying, I think what you're doing now is you want to plant enough trees that hold their own seeds to reproduce on their own. So the thing can grow on its own and reach more people and make it available to people all over the place. Right. I

mean, for guys like us, it's like no big deal to fly anywhere in the country or out of the country. And for a lot of people, that is a big deal. So getting it to be local for them, and that's a big deal too, making it available for everybody. I really love that. Yeah, Nate's such an awesome guy. If you guys get the opportunity to go on a hunt with Montsell or Nate Smith,

highly, highly recommend both of them. Nate is an incredible cook. He always stays at our house in Austin when he's going to go, go on a hunt with you Montsell. And so it's, it's fun because he's really had a, a lot of experiences, you know, out of these 60, if it's in Austin, he's chilling at our house for at least one or two days and we get to catch up. So that's been super fun

he came out he and his awesome wife came out and gave him a little wedding gift to Arcadia tickets and they had a blast with us so that was lots of fun yeah I got to officiate his wedding oh that's dope dude super cool

it's been special to see his and yours and y'all met coming on his first Sacred Honey experience with you. And so, yeah, I mean, that's really what the good foundations is, is giving people who are already in of themselves, like incredible people, an opportunity to... We had Eric Vaughn, who's now the GM of this farm, was on that hunt with us. And Mike Salemi, who I was close with before, but far closer with now. I mean, I think there is something to that. Not plugging Fit for Service, but that's kind of the

idea is that we build community by bringing people together, putting them through a challenging experience and letting community foster from that experience. And you're doing the same thing. And I wouldn't say on a smaller scale, there's less people there, but the immersive seems to be something that is, is even more powerful per se, because of the fact, I don't want to compare it to fit for service, but when there's less people around and you go through something as challenging as a fucking hunt, and then you attach a ceremony to that, like those are your brothers and sisters in arms from now on like that's just how that works you come out of that experience and you know each other on such a deep and intimate level that you're not going to get anywhere else yeah especially because you know we invite the wild when we are out there

i mean you experienced it we lost power. We were eaten off like propane. We lost power more than once. We lost power more than once. It was funny. It wasn't funny because it was so fucking cold. It was so cold. It was an apocalypse. It was icy as heck.

And yeah, I mean, it was like we went on a moving meditation for ceremony because sitting in the cave just didn't make a whole lot of sense. So, yeah, that's the kind of thing that hunting brings. I think for men in particular, you know, sitting in therapy can be beneficial. And I think men really... You know Dr. Will Tegel thought that was nonsense when he started off as a therapist, right? And there's something about being engaged

in, in relationship with nature. That's going to put things up to your face. That's going to force you to face, you know, certain reflections of yourself, uh, that talk therapy just won't do, you know, talk a bit about you since, you know, we're in an over where we're not at a deadlock here to end it in an hour, but we are getting towards the end of the podcast. You've since run a number of female-only hunts. Talk a bit about that too. Yeah, so I have had a few co-ed experiences with women, and now I've started to do women-only. And I've been blown away by the experiences

and the way that women show up. And in many ways, you know, things that men cannot physically even do. You know, for example, the first woman to kill an animal, incredibly beautiful story. She's a teacher, English teacher on Long Island. She came with her husband. She was the youngest child of three and her two older brothers got to hunt her whole childhood with her dad, but she never got a chance to because she was a girl. And so for her, it was, it was really about kind of reclaiming that she could do this. She was capable. She, you know, wanted to go through that process. And Nathan was with her at the time when she killed

an animal. You know, one of the things that I'll have people do oftentimes is carry it for some portion of the time, because I want to, you know, metaphorically just have, take responsibility for the burden of taking a life and physically feel it. So she was carrying the animal and she later shared with me, she said, while she was carrying the animal, she started her moon cycle. And she said she wasn't intent. She wasn't supposed to, it was like two weeks off. And there was just such a, for her spiritual, like she's taking blood, she's giving blood relationship. Yeah. Give and receive at the same time. Yeah. It was really powerful for her. And so we, yeah, we, we just had an all female experience with seven women and, uh, you know, Lindsay, Lindsay, uh, animal based Bay. She was there. So she,

she was there with a group of women and it was really special. And I try to create a space, obviously with the sacred part of sacred hunting, I create a space that is intending for us to connect with our emotions and feelings. It is about as soft of a hunting experience as you can imagine in terms of allowing people to feel and go through those things and feel we did every circle that we had an opportunity to share. I mean, there were three to five people crying in the process and, uh, and it was, yeah, for me, it was, it was just really powerful to see people go through that transformation. You know, we had a lot of challenges, it was, it was just really powerful to see people go through that transformation. You know,

we had a lot of challenges, you know, whether it be a wounded animal or, uh, you know, not getting anything, uh, for, for dinner on Saturday night, oftentimes, you know, at least one meal is kind of dependent on if we kill an animal. So there's a little bit of skin in the game, so to speak. And the women, they had to face a lot, you know, like I have a leadership team of males and we're all, you know, I hand select them. And, uh, I believe there's a certain consciousness, a certain representation of masculinity that's in a more, you know, sacred or divine form. And that can be confronting to women. Like, whoa, this is what relating with men could be like. And also, whoa, we're being told what to do, right?

I have a strong container. So at certain times, you're not allowed to talk with other people. That came up with an all-women's group? Exactly. Amazing. I would never expect that. Exactly. to talk with other people. And that came up with an all women's group. Exactly. I would never expect that. Exactly. And my son's going to hunt with me tomorrow morning.

And first time he's coming with me and we'll just be here on the land. But that is going to be the sharpest curve for him to get around. Can he, can he, how long can he be quiet? How long can he listen and just listen and step quietly and just listen? We practice tiptoeing around the house like we're hunting. I think he's got the stock down.

It's just the constant talk. He's like the kid in the fucking van in Home Alone. He's like, what kind of engine you got in here? Is this diesel or gasoline? What's the horsepower on this guy? Is it a 12-passenger van or a 15 passenger van? I heard that you guys were flying to Miami, but the plane got checked. He just keeps going and going and going. He's like, I don't know, kid, leave me alone. Like that's him in a nutshell.

So like, I don't know. I don't know at eight if he's ready for it, but he's got a lot of friends like Tucker's boy, Bishop was just successful on a buck with his sister. And he's certainly interested, but there's a point where the rubber's got to hit the road. And that's the shit people don't realize until you're there. And it's like, uh-uh. You know, like this is how it's done

or we don't even fucking see an animal. You know, if it's not done a certain way, like we won't see one the entire time. You know, like you go pee before you go out on the land because you start pissing on the land. Like you won't fucking see one. You know, like you're going to be, they're going to know you're right there. So, I mean, there's so many things like that. That was, that's an interesting piece though. I think from a women's empowerment point of view, and it comes up in various ways

in Fit for Service as well, where like we're doing things to, about the remembrance of the divine feminine and the embodiment of that. And at the same time, how that's balanced, you know, the yin with the yang. You know, like that is a balancing point there. The one isn't better than the other. And you could, you know, depending on how woke you are, you argue that one has been in total control and at the demolishment of the earth and the disempowerment of the people

all across the world. Sure. And there's a positive side to that force as well that needs to be reenacted. It's not to be, you can't throw the baby out with the bathwater and get rid of masculinity. Like fucking James Cameron saying that testosterone is a toxin. Like no dippy, testosterone is 100% necessary. And high and highest in women and men, not just highest in men. It's, it's, it's a lot less in women, but it's still their largest, the most abundant hormone. Like that's a fucking big deal. Yeah. And then that's the beautiful thing about, I think this space, especially for women with sacred hunting is because there, there is structure and there, there is a decor, there's a way that it has to be done to be successful, right? We have a mission.

So at some level there's a masculine component to it and it will provide them with an opportunity to, you know, still be feminine, but be contained in certain situations by the container that I create. And I also see all the, the triggers and all the things that come up for good and for worse as being the medicine. And that's, I think, you know, to a T all the women that have come on experiences have had, you know, by their own account, great experiences. And, and I'm, I'm proud of that. I know that there's, you know, there's always room to, to make the space better. And also I've, I've, I've really appreciated the, the challenge of holding space for, you know, seven women. Hell yeah, brother. Well, I'm excited. I want to get, I know Leah, Eric's wife and T Tosh, my wife, want to get out there with you. And I think that'll be profound and amazing once the kids are a little bit older, getting them out for sure.

We got to wrap. I want to do one more lap on the whitetail. But is there anything that you've got coming up that you want to talk about? Things that you're unrolling for this next year? What's happening right now? Yeah. Well, to the point that I mentioned earlier of getting this into people's hands more, by early next year, I'm going to have a journal.

I'm going to have a journal that basically will take the best parts of a hunting experience that I bring people through and will allow you to go through that yourself. So kind of like a five minute journal, but instead it's like, you know, 30 pages. You have, before you go out on the hunt, certain things to do. Like one of my favorite activities is writing a love letter to the animal. And then there's, you know, reflections during the hunt

and then afterwards, you know, with the adversity and things that can facilitate transformation in day-to-day life. So I'm excited about that coming next year. But I've just bought land in Washington state. I'm going to be leading some experiences in Washington and in the Pacific Northwest. I'm also probably going to be leading fewer in-person experiences myself personally

as I work with the land, as I start to, you know, grow things on the land, as I start to plant those seeds and, you know, children and house and everything is probably in the next three, five years. So, uh, as I, as I start to have fewer, you know, in-person experiences would love to have, you know, people join. So yeah, next March, uh, I've got a slew of them, um, and people can, you know, visit, uh, to find out more. And then for, for people who come on a hunt and they just want to go to the next level, I'm going to start taking people to go find some mountain lions too. Beautiful brother.

Where can people find you online and where can people learn more? So sacredhunting.com. That's the simplest place for all the in person experiences that I lead and then I'm most active on Instagram which is just my full name spelled out M-A-N-S-A-L-D-E-N-T-O-N Monsal Denton well we'll have it all linked in the show notes

dude I love you brother you've been a huge impact on my life I realized when Saladino brought me on that hunt love Paul, love Paul. Absolutely love Paul. Wasn't a huge fan of the group per se. There was a lot of fanboys. Met some cool people.

But I realized I was on the hunt to meet you, you know, and I've had massive, massive amazing experiences with you thus far. I've continued to meet amazing people like Uncle Nate, and I've also grown closer with friends that came on that trip. You know, Eric and I have never been closer. He's one of my best friends. Thanks to having gone through those experiences with you. And you have set these containers in a way where there's maximum transformation, maximum beauty, maximum experience with very little downside. You know, and that's hard to do. You know, it's really hard to do. I've, you know, guided my old man in ceremony. I've done a, you know, a couple of experiences like that. And those all come with unique challenges. And it's apparent, you know, knowing that you apprenticed

for so long under Dr. Will Tagle, that you really carry that medicine strong inside you. So it's my pleasure and honor to be with you, brother. It's my honor to have you on the land. And I'm so stoked for what's coming from you, brother. It's going to be dope seeing you step into the game as a dad and as a purveyor and steward of the land. It's going to be really cool. Yeah. Thank you for that reflection, my friend. I appreciate that you know Will and that you can bring him back into our relationship. So yeah, it's been amazing to get to learn from afar as you've, you know, raised your children.

And even though I don't have children yet, it's all been filed away and I'll be using it. So thank you. Amazing brother. Thank you.