Kyle Kingsbury Podcast - #457 Brian Costello The Primordial Code

Episode Date: May 21, 2026

Brian Costello is the author of The Primordial Code, a rapidly spreading FICTION story that depicts a realistic vision of a society that lives in harmony with the universal laws of nature. The story weaves in all the most important and controversial topics of our time— including Health, Medicine, Politics, Parenting, Education, Culture— all while uncovering the deepest connections between personal and societal transformation.    Our conversation covers Brian’s backstory that led him on the journey to writing The Primordial Code, why he decided to choose fiction, the unique plotline, and how the story is creating a community of people who are ready to bring the vision to life.   Own the book at www.ThePrimordialCode.com (use KYLE5 to save $5 at checkout)   Preview the audiobook for free!    Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/6g1Z60HwJzjpMU9AkZJb7O Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-primordial-code/id1707572526   Follow Brian on Instagram: @brian.costello_   Get the best microdosing products on the planet from www.BrainSupreme.co/kkp and remember to use code "KKP" for 15% off everything in the store! Up your brains hardware and software now! Join my new community The Kingdom Within on Skool right here for a free 1 week trial!  https://www.skool.com/the-kingdom-within-5541/about  

Welcome back to today's podcast. We have Brian Costello. Brian Costello is the author of the primordial code. It is a fantastic book. I had not read it when we did this podcast. I'm diving deeply into it now. Don't worry if you haven't read it. You don't have to read it to listen to this podcast. He breaks down a lot of the synopsis and the core of it, which is really incredible. I've never been more pumped to read a fiction book. And you know, you guys know that I'm in a fiction now. So fiction to me can scratch a a part of our bodies, a part of our souls that nonfiction cannot, you know, and in ways, it can inspire us until a broader story than nonfiction can. And so I really appreciate, you know, through Brian's path and we dive deeply into his background and, you know, what made him

him. And I love doing that. I love finding out, you know, the inner workings of people. He has a very cool story on how he got to where he is today. And his decision to make it fiction instead of nonfiction is really cool as well. So support Brian. Check out his book. book, the primordial code, look for it on just Google search it and find area where you can buy that. He's going to be releasing the Audible for free. So the first two chapters are on Spotify, but they'll be doing release parties where I think week after week or month after month, they're going to release one chapter at a time. He's doing his own reading, which is incredible. I love it when authors do that. And I'm excited for it. I think this is a book that has a lot of potential with it.

And I hope to spread the word and the message of that book, which is something I wholeheartedly agree with. Without further do, my brother, Brian Costello. Brian, welcome to the podcast, dude. So great to have you. Thank you, Kyle. I'm really, really excited. Man, I've been listening to your show for many years. Like, when you told me Bear's age, I can't remember if you were, the show was gone or like shortly after, but I remember. Shortly after. Yeah, he was, um, he was born in 2015. And I think I went on Rogans in August. or July of 2015 the first time. And so we drove, we were living in California.

We drove down in my minivan, me, Bear, and Tosh. And they were just hanging, you know, at the beach while I was podcasting. And that, you know, Rogan, like many people, said, hey, used to start a podcast. And that's kind of what led to it. Not immediately, but a year later, I started it. So 2016, I started it. And then that led to move in here and taking over the amount of podcast and everything else. Yeah.

Yeah, because when you said that, I was like, man, I've been listening to Kyle's show for a long time. You know, on and off, obviously, I don't catch every episode. I don't catch anyone's every episode. No, especially these days. There's so many good shows. But, yeah, so anyway, it's just really cool, man. And, you know, it's one of these funny things.

I had a similar situation earlier this week on a show where I've listened to the show a ton, almost to the point where, like, I feel like I know you. And I know, you know, it's kind of weird because we only just met, you know? So I know a lot about you and stuff, but it's cool that now you'll get a chance to get to know me a little bit too. Absolutely, brother. Well, you're familiar with the arc of the show. I want to know what drove you as a kid. What were you into? Where'd you grow up? What modeled who you are now? Yeah, so it's funny. A lot of the things that I cared about a lot as a kid I don't care about so much anymore. It was very competitive, very sports driven. As far as like family life and stuff,

I just came from, I was amazingly blessed to have two loving parents who just supported me. and stuck by me through anything I wanted to do and try. The only thing I really wanted to do and try was win things, really anything. Wrestling was my primary sport, baseball as well for a while, but really as time went on, I narrowed it down to wrestling. So I had that wrestler mentality, really, you know, just outwork everybody, out hustle, out push. I'm going to be the hardest worker in the room kind of thing. And I took that into, well, I took that into kind of everything.

I did, including, like, partying and stuff, you know, in college as a wrestling. Yes, yes, yes. Nobody's going to drink more than me. Yeah, exactly. It was just all out all the time. I only had one gear and it was go. And then after college, you know, I think what would be, seem relevant probably to your audience, too, was I started, so right towards the end of college,

I got into CrossFit. And it was kind of in the early days of CrossFit. It was like 06, 07. I was trying to remember recently. I couldn't quite put my finger on. I was around that time, which was very early on, but I was obsessed.

You know, I went into just all in, head first, not just doing the movements and learning the exercises, but reading blogs, reading forums, reading books and stuff.

And it was funny because I was a phys ed major in college. And I was barely getting passing. You know, I was, like, I didn't care.

enough when it was in the typical classroom setting. But as soon as I started applying like biomechanics and things, things that I was learning about, I barely passed my biomechanics course. But then when I started getting into CrossFit and moving and wait a lift, next you know I'm buying like biomechanics textbooks and reading them on my own. Anatomy trains. Yeah, exactly.

Kelly Steread and Brian McKenzie and all the guys. So I suddenly was like obsessed with this movement. And it just pretty much took my same wrestling mentality. I only wrestled for two years. college. And then I had like about a year of nothingness where I was a little lost and then I found CrossFit. And so I took that into CrossFit started, you know, competing or aiming to compete and started competing. And then I actually opened the CrossFit affiliate right outside of right as soon as I finished college. Where was this that? Where did you grow up? Where'd

you go to college? Where were you out right then? So I'm from Long Island, born and raised, Long Island, New York. I went to school upstate New York called Cortland, SUNY Cortland, C-State. It's a state school, Cortland State, C-State. And then after, so I basically was about to graduate this situation with teaching in New York and Phissette, especially, our professors were like, listen, you're not going to get a job. It's just like, it's just not going to happen. Any opening on Long Island for a job would get like six, 700 applicants, you know, unless you had already been there, subbing for years or whatnot, like you wasn't even worth it.

And I was with this new found obsession with CrossFit. It was the only thing I could care about, think about and care about. I was like, I'm going to open one of these affiliates. They're starting to pop up. It was very early. And, yeah, I had the support of my parents, even though they, everybody thought it was kind of crazy. You know, a young kid, no business experience, but I was just so obsessed with this movement.

And I went for it, bare bones, raised a little bit of money, got this tiny warehouse and started the cross gym. And I brought that same mentality to the training, to the business, to the coaching. You know, it was just kind of like go, go, go. The original, my wife and I were just reflecting, actually, because we were only just dating at the time. But I had a little office in the back that had a bed in it, dresser. I would sleep there.

I would coach late till night, sleep there, wake up, do it again in the morning. There's a deli right next door that was like eating all my meals at the deli. It's clean eating. It's what I thought in college. I was like, I eat clean, dude. I'm at subway three days a week. Exactly. It was all I had, you know, I was like I was 23.

And I was doing my thing in that. regards. And yeah, so, so that kind of leads into a change over time, but that's kind of like, I'll pause there for a moment because I was just kind of like, well, I'll also explain to it. So I was competing in CrossFit. I was competing, it would seem like in my mind, in the sense of business as well, you know, I wasn't like trying to beat all the other gyms necessarily. Like I didn't, you know, I wanted everybody to do well, but like I wanted to be the best. Like, I wanted to, We did stand out. I'm very proud of the service we offered there.

But I wanted to, like, stand 10, 10 levels above all the rest. And I was competing also. I was actually a lifeguard through high school and college, an ocean lifeguard, Smith Point Beach and Long Island. And I competed in that as well. A lot of people don't know this, but there's lifeguard events and competitions. And it gets pretty competitive. So I was competing in that.

And I was just in, you know, the same wrestler, mentality. I'm in my 20s. I'm just yonged out, like slamming barbells. Everything was 100 miles an hour, three cups of coffee a day, late nights, early mornings, you know, grind, grind, grind, go, go, go. And I'll, I'll pause it for a moment, but you'll probably guess where that's leading that it didn't last. But yeah, that's kind of like the background of what got me into high performance, you know, human optimization. That was the path that led me there, at least. Yeah. Yeah, I feel like that's a, it's a natural. fit.

You know, we just got a nice brightening here from the sun. Hopefully he doesn't crap out the camera settings. They're meant for low light. Anywho, you're a video guy. You can fix it after the fact form. You'll figure it out. Anywho, I like that my son drew a dick pick on my whiteboard here. Yeah.

It's upside down, but that works. Anywho, the, um, that wrestler's mentality is, is a unique skill set to have, right? And so, like, it's funny because nowadays you get this, it's really popular. to swing one direction and be like, you know, don't do the extreme. Balance is everything, right? And then on the other side is like the Goggins, right? Like, fuck balance, push till the end, you know, like go, go, go. And, you know, I see a lot of Goggins is an inspiration for a lot of people.

And I also see a lot of people crushing and ruining themselves the same way CrossFit did, right? Like there's very few awesome CrossFit gyms that knew how to push people. And it's an art. It's an art just as much as it is a science to push someone past their limits. carefully so that they don't break down knowing when to scale back, knowing how to periodize, all that stuff is its own thing. I mean, it's still in MMA. You see guys over training constantly and still fighting three days a week instead of sparring three days a week, which is for sure the case with me. But I think wrestling gives a unique gift in that more than any other sport,

it gives you a different gear, right? And that is a superpower. Now, learning how to back off that, That's like obviously where we're going to head next. But I think that that you can't, you don't really get it elsewhere. You know, I mean, there was a funny video on Instagram where this juditsu guy was, you know, was a wrestler. And he talked about how jihitsu made him a pussy. You know, he's like, everything is chill, you know, slap, flop, you know, just relax. And he's like, he's like, there's nothing, it's nothing like wrestling. I mean, it's grappling and it's like wrestling and it's nothing like it, you know.

And so like I resonate. It's funny, but also it resonates big time. And a lot of jude, ooh, it's bullshit. It's like, no, no, no, there's a huge difference. It's one's a sprint and one's a little bit more even keel. And so, but all that to say, like, you know, a lot of people in the modern world would take the side of like, oh, that's great that you know, you did that. You know, like that's a Hormosey style approach, right? Hormosey talks about, he's like the David Goggins of business.

He talks about how his wife and him have a business relationship. I don't know if I've heard of say that. I'm just like, fuck man, FML, dude. I would never describe that about any relage relationship. That is like the worst description possible. And I mean, who knows? It's one thing to say, like, well, if it works for you, it works for you. Define works.

You know, because to me, it feels like something is missing. Something is gapingly missing there in a way that should be there. And that's his own path. You know, like, and I'm not going to, you know, everybody's on their own path. something I learned about six years ago when I started talking about opening my marriage was that, you know, a couple things. One, not everyone needs to know my own private life, but two, I was in my fucking 30s, just experimenting, you know, like, hey, let's run the test.

I talk about running the test with everything else. Let's talk about running the test in marriage. And the backlash on that was insane to me, you know, seeing other people, we've been happily monogamous for nearly six years now. And that taught us so much, you know, like it brought us back together in a way nothing else could. And also, you know, if something's on my mind and it seems worth trying, I'm going to try it. You know, I'm going to see where I fail and it, what works, what doesn't. And so I gained so much from it.

But even the conversation around that is like freaking, you know, it just lights people up, right? Anywho, I'm diving down on a few different topics here. But I really feel like, you know, it is, it's an important skill set, especially to give young men. is that extra gear that wrestling takes because there's nothing else like it. You know, there's no football practice. You could talk about, you know, Camp Tona Zona at ASU, we're at altitude, we're doing two a days, we're doing 1,600 meters sprints at the end, we're forced in the ice bath where we want to or not way before Wimhoff, you know, like you have to do this after

each practice. And it was grueling, and that was nothing compared to wrestling. You know, so I have tons of respect for people that have that background, and it is a unique gift. What's up, guys? I want to give you a quick break here to tell you about Brain Supreme. Brain Supreme is by far and away the best microdosing company that has ever been created. True genius behind it, not just because I'm friends with the owner, but also because of the fact that their products work incredibly well. Everything is mailed discreetly. You know, there's a proprietary blend with about 100 milligrams of active mushrooms in there. But they're blended with other really high quality ingredients. So there's the genius, which has fantastic neutropics in it. and lions main mushrooms and other things that really help your brain fire. There's the athlete, which has rodeola and several other fantastic supplements that help you train your best and have the most endurance and just get the most out of your workouts,

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We'll also have them linked in the show notes. And now back to the show. Yeah, it really is. And it's one of those things. There's people who wrestle and then there's like wrestlers. You know, and like if you're a wrestler and that's your identity and your mentality, there's something special there. And everybody that is in that world really knows that.

And I'm so grateful for that path and those things. And like you said, it's a great gear to have. It's a great ability. It's something that you can tap. Like I love that I know I can tap in. to that. It's there at any time, that ability to really push and block out and go. And now I've learned how to not live in that gear, not have that be my default. In fact, I don't go there very much at all anymore. I know it's there. I can access it if I want. I did do a half Iron Man last

year. I had to start tapping into that stuff a little bit for the first time in a while. But it's not my default. But yeah, I wanted to quickly hit on something you said there because you were like, You should talk about defining like what works and kind of the harmonies thing kind of brings this to mind too and in Gagons and kind of where I was at in my 20s. Everything I was putting my effort into was like quote unquote working. You know, like my all I wanted to do in CrossFit, there's a lot of different like skills and things you're working on simultaneously, but all my lifts were going up, all my times on my workouts were going down.

I was, you know, doing better and better in competitions each year on CrossFit. I was doing really well in my lifeguarding beach sprinting competitions to the point where I basically rose to the top of the field. And so, and then even in the business, I was getting more clients every month. We were growing. The business was making more money every month. Everything was working, right, like by any measurement, any quantifiable score. And that's what I, in my mind, I couldn't really see anything other than that. It's like, well, these are the things I care about. They're all getting better. Therefore, I'm good. I'm happy. This is, like, why would I even stop and consider whether or not this is the right thing or not? I just lacked the awareness of what I was, what was actually happening long term, kind of the, the long term debts I was collecting, basically, or stacking.

because of obviously like I was leading to before that, I couldn't keep that pace and I couldn't drive like that forever. And sure enough, the wheels started to come off. And I was physically, mentally, emotionally, and then eventually even spiritually just started to plummet, right? Like, and it showed up. Then not only that, like, was I feeling it in my own personal body? Then it rippled out into all these other things that I cared about.

I had to stop competing CrossFit. And then I had to, you know, quote, take a year off from my beach sprinting and 11, 12 years later. So I've not been back. And, you know, the business started to fail. My business relationships and partnerships with people that were very good friends of mine were starting to crumble. My marriage was crumbling. All of a sudden, I mean, I'm going from my mid-20s where I'm like, everything's great. I got this whole kind of thing figured out to now I'm approaching 30 and entering my 30.

with like, I felt like everything I'd worked so hard for was just crumbling all around me. And that's when, you know, you talked about defining what works. Like, yes, it worked until it didn't. And it left me in a really bad place

and really like, you know, worse than I started. But what happened from there was kind of, nature took its course and I started to swing me back into balance whether I wanted to or not. It forced me to slow down. It forced me to buy injuries mostly.

Pain teacher. The pain teacher came in and said, listen, you know, enough's enough. We got to have a talk here. And yeah, I was around that time. I couldn't really point to a part of my body that wasn't in pain and hurting. Like I said, the emotional relationships around me. Crumbling was probably worse and obviously it was all connected.

Yeah. And like I started to get from that yang, go win, compete, do, started to slowly shift into the more yin side of things. I didn't even know what those terms meant at the time. time, but it just started slowing down, being still. I got introduced to Wim Hof pretty early on, got a sauna, got an ice bath, sold my business, or more or less gave it away to one of my employees, but just like stepped away from the business, kind of let things go. And really it was like, you know, I'm summarizing a lot of turmoil, you know, into a short thing, but realize I had to just come back to me and really start to learn for the first.

time how to connect with myself and my intuition and actually listen to my body and what it's asking for and not just say, here are my goals and I'm going to get them no matter what and just pull back and say, learn how to hear the whispers, tune into the subtle signals and the signs. And it was a whole new world for me to have to learn and skill. And now I feel like it's something I do really well, but there was, you know, it was a big relearning process for me. Yeah, that's another point to make, you know, on the, on the wrestlers meant to the it's not just about the the opposite being balance and equanimity and or or the opposite of it you know just just in stillness you know like hey you can go that hard just meditate you know but

you work out and you work in um it's it's the sensitivity you know that when you push yourself you know suck it up pussy at first i despise that you know looking back when i was like first getting into plant medicines then i was like no no no there's a point to that but there's also a point to can you feel? Can you feel it again? Now can you let those feelings come up? Can you, can you let that move through you?

Can you sit with it? Right? And that takes a certain sensitivity, which really is just an interconnection point. You know, it's like intuition, right? For people who have a sensitivity know what the fuck intuition is

because they're in constant contact with it. But somebody who's pushed through that and has not tapped back into their sensitivity, they're like, intuition, that's a female thing. You know, that's that. You're right? Exactly. So, like, those are, those are superpowers. And I feel like, you know, my wife's yoga teacher instructor, I'm blanking on her name, but she was a Rambos understudy. And she was talking about, you know, balance has always talked about in yoga, but she says sometimes that she was a meth head before she met Rondas and like yoga saved her, you know. So she knows extremes. But she said, you know, sometimes we push ourselves from one far extreme to the other just to know what our limits are. And that helps us find our balance and re-center. You know, and so I really, appreciated that too, especially coming from a, you know, 60 plus female yogi instructor who's like,

she fucking gets it, dude. You know, like she gets, she's rode the lightning. Methamphetamines will do that. Like, she knows the extreme, you know? That's awesome. When did, you got introduced to Wimhoff's work and things like that? You started with check too, correct? I didn't ever do any formal studies.

Okay. I did like binge his podcast and stuff, like his four-hour lecture ones. I would just listen to him, take notes. Like, those are my favorite. His solo caster, to this day, my favorites. In fact, you know, you saw I busted out the scientific core conditioning and scientific back training logs because of the fact that he had just done one on the core, you know, three hours from jaw to pelvic floor, you know, and I think it's titled something like

why you keep getting injured. But it's a fantastic episode. And I forgot, I mean, the depths of Paul's knowledge is fucking insane to me. And people won't get that from Instagram. They probably won't even get it from his podcast. But when you see, you know, if you're able to take a class or anything like that, you can see like the connection points from the physical to the mental, emotional, the spiritual is not just real, but I mean, it's pinpointed.

You know, the Chinese had it pinpointed. They knew, you know, the liver was connected to anger as an emotion. They knew, like, which teeth were connected to which parts of the body, which vertebrae can be shut off from a food intolerance that will lead to your back going out while you're lifting or the transverse abdominis relaxing when it shouldn't. You know, but Donner, just that's, that's, you know, people ask me, like, I've taken HLC1, and I've done a handful of journeys with Paul and I'm very close to him. But most of my knowledge from Paul is just that.

It's just just eating everything that guy consumed, that I can consume publicly. His YouTube channel was, was fantastic with the chalkboard for so many years. And then, you know, when we podcasted, when I first got to On it, Aubrey was like, hey, I want you to meet like Don Miguel. I want you to meet. Maestro Oberto. He was like, these are all my guys.

Like, who do you have in your list that I have to mean? I was like, we got to meet Paul Check. And so like, we flew him out. So you met him introduce him to Aubrey. Yeah.

And then, you know, he went on the on it podcast with me. And then he went on Aubrey's podcast. And that was like, you know, an explosion. We all hit it off.

And, and, you did a bunch of shows. I remember listening to all those shows. Yeah. That just started like a back and forth. Exactly. I like binge.

Journeys all the things together. So like that was really, you know, such a beautiful. And that's why that getting invited on Rogans was such an important piece to me, not because I had anything to sell or it did anything for me financially, but because like that push to do my own podcast led to everything opening up, you know,

including the awesome relationships I have. But yeah, you know, like I put Paul, I was telling you need a fucking podcast. I'm watching you on YouTube. Like, why aren't you podcasting? You know, I'm like, oh, Penny's been telling me for years. And I'm like, no, do it. And then like, you got enough people saying, like, you need your own podcast. And then boom, he started.

And his podcast is immediately, you know, in the top 20. in health and wellness, and it's fantastic. Yeah. Yeah, he was a big, big piece for me when I kind of discovered him. So I started exiting the fitness space, not fully, but like starting to like, at least like the competitive CrossFit games. That was all I knew for like a decade or more. And then I started to kind of slowly drift away from that into these more.

You know, I found Wim Hof. When I found Wim Hof, there was one video of him online. the world of him like hiking in shorts and on a mountain and doing this breathwork. And I remember sending to a few friends and like I'm doing and they thought I was kidding. I like, yeah, okay. But I was like, no, like this is like interesting to me. This was like, this was towards the very end. Like I think I had just left the gym and whatnot.

I can't remember for sure. But it was funny though, I bring it up too because like, I'm like, all right, I'm going to start getting to this breathwork and stuff. But immediately my mind was still like, well, I got to get a three minute breath hold. And now I have to get to a four minute breath hold. Now I have to get to a five minute. It was still like pushing my limits. And then in the ice bath, like, I got to get three minutes.

I got to get four minutes. How long can I stay in the sauna? How long can I make it hurt? Like my mobility, I was doing a lot of Kelly Starrett stuff. And it was all just like, how long can I stay in the pain test? Yeah. Like staying in the pain cave. And like, I was still just missing the point in some ways of like, of how to just tune in.

And what does my body actually want right now? Not what does the clock say or the scoreboard say or whatever term. thing I'm using to measure it. So, yeah, so that was like a big journey for me. And then I did this very long fast. I did an extended fast 30 days. There was juice. It was a liter of grape juice a day.

And then these like tinctures, herbal tinctures that basically kept your organs from failing. And then that was like the thing that brought me into, I mean, that just shifted everything for me. I didn't realize how much of a spiritual journey it was going to be, but it took me and basically just took off one pair of lenses that I was seeing the world through and put on a brand new, clear, just like different version of the world. The voice in my head changed completely. It was like I was having a communication with a new voice in my head. I was learning how to really talk to that voice anyway for the first time.

And then eventually, I did like a very long sun-gazing protocol, almost every single morning for a couple of years, just watching sunrise. And I was getting all these, like, I don't like to use the word downloads too much, but like it was no other way to really say what it was. And then eventually that led to the medicine work. And then, you know, so I've just been going deeper, deeper, deeper into the more connection side. It was always about blocking the mind out and pushing past. Now it's about bringing the mind and the body into coherence.

Even when I trained, even when I did that half Iron Man last year, I barely timed anything. I barely tracked anything. It was all about, it wasn't about blocking out the mind and just pushing, like I always did with CrossFit. It was about bringing it into coherence. And I realized that bringing the body and the mind into coherence is going to bring you much further than blocking the mind out and pushing ever well. And so that's kind of been the journey.

And as far as in the, at least in the optimization health's kind of performance side of things, that's been the journey now. I just turned 40, so throughout my 30s. That's awesome. That's an awesome run. Yeah, it's cool, too. You know, many paths lead up the mountains. So I'm always curious, like, what cracks people open. And lately I've been far more drawn to probably last like a few years. I've been more drawn and more curious or called to do, you know, these other forms of altered states of consciousness that get you there outside of the plants because I have so much experience, you know, in that and know, like, this is the route that'll get me there. You know, like, I know how to,

how to go see source and I know how to tap in for a long. And it's funny because like a lot of yogis was like, oh, you don't need that. It was already in you, you know, just meditate or just do this or just do that. And it's like, I never could meditate. You know, ayahuasca told me to meditate. And that's the only reason why I still even started and had an interest in it was because of the repeated information of like, hey, you need to try meditation.

You need to mobilize your body. It's like, okay, I'm listening. And, you know, thankfully I've had some great meditation coaches in now, But I mean, when I was doing that, it was like, if I had a question, if something hit me in life, that was hard, I would just write it down in the journal. All right, May 16th, I'm getting to go sit in the Amazon, or maybe I'm going to go to the reservation and I'll get to sit and I'll have all these questions answered. You know, and then now through meditation practice and things like that, rarely do I have a need. You know, there's never like a burning need to go sit with medicine because I'm sitting in it every single day. You know, like I don't have to write questions down.

Which is the point. I get to meditate on it every single day. And those questions are either answered immediately or, you know, they're tabled to a point where I get to live the experience and then the answer shows up for me, right? So, but I think like there's, I just like how you started with breathwork and fasting, you know, and different things like that and then got into the plants. And for me, it was like the opposite plants got me into those things. And now this is year two of my four-year vision quest. And so like that that's been a really potent medicine and kicked my ass the first time. You know, I laughed about it on the podcast.

My son was teasing me. I made it like 26 hours. You know, like go at least two days. Two days on your first year. You know, if you can do all four, cool. But there's nothing, it's not a big deal. Is this what Tim? Did you do, where did you do that?

It was here. It was here. Okay. With Ken Conti came out for it. And one of my good buddies, Jimmy Weldon. We did an episode on it. He and he had done a year before us. So I was like, all right, if Jimmy can do it, I can do it.

And then Eric Gazi sat with us. too for that first round. So he'll be with me for the four years. And the goal is to kind of, you know, layer it so that, you know, every couple of year or two, we're bringing someone new in to start their four years. So Mike Slemi is interested in come in. And I think that'd be a great thing. But that was as spiritual and experience as ayahuasca ever was. You know, it wasn't visionary in the same way. You know, like I didn't see like, you know, like I didn't become my wife and relive every argument we've ever had, which was my first vision on ayahuasca, but super potent. super powerful. And, you know, it's not necessarily accessible. It's not like, you know,

anybody could just stop eating and stop drinking water. It's like, no, no, it's a serious thing. Like, you want that guided. You want to prepare for it. You want the, you know, all pieces that you would properly set up for a medicine journey. It's the same thing. You know, you've got your pieces before. You have the event. You have your integration after. But that, that to me is like, I love all the different avenues. And breathworks such a potent one, too. I remember laughing about breath work. I mean, I'd done Wimhoff breathing and like gotten the charge and I was like, wow, this shit is legit. But I never thought breathwork could be visionary or like, you know, we talk about for altered states of consciousness, like holotropic breathing, Stanislav Grav.

Oh, you just do Wimov style, but you keep going. You don't do like three rounds of 50 breaths. Like you go for an hour and you might have one breath hold during it, you know? And the first time I did that with Anahata Ananda and Sadona, I just laughed after the end, I was laughing. So I was like, I'm so sorry. And she's like, what's the matter, honey? I was like, I thought this was going to be a fucking joke. I thought this would have no comparison. I was like, I was out of my body, you know, for a large portion of that, like, gone. And so, like, that's a really cool one, you know, like, knowing these things.

Because the truth is, plants are not for everybody, you know, and I used to laugh at people that say that and the disclaimer and everything, but I've seen enough people go off the rails that I really am, like, attracted to these other things where maybe you can't pump the brakes if needed. There's a little bit more control. You can step out of it a little bit more. I think breathwork is kind of the gateway. I've noticed it was for me

and I've seen it kind of with others like in the fitness space they're into the you know everything we talked about earlier just push push pushing and then like find this thing that's a slightly different it still feels like just like me

it's like it's still pushing it at first but you gotta work for it yeah you gotta work for it but then I think it tends to be a gateway into something you know just more connected to the mind and the mindfulness and the stillness that most people realize

I think pretty quickly that's missing for them You know, one or two experiences could be enough to be like, wow, this is something that I definitely need more of. Right. And that's the thing. Like, how do you give people that breakthrough experience in a safe way that shows them what's possible? So I had struggle with meditation for years. And I was the, you know, the techno guinea pig had on it trying like every device, every here's a gadget that guarantees, you know, brainwave entrainment and you'll get to an alpha state or deep theta and all this shit. And some of it worked. It would shift me in a way where I'm like, damn, that works. but I'd never had like a deep, like blissful meditation experience until doing it with Emily Fletcher. And I remember, it was face to face for like three days straight.

First time it happened, I was like, holy shit. You know, like, wow, dude. Like that's why people talk about meditation. Wow. And it just fucked me up because I was like, oh, this whole time I had no concept of what that could be like. And then, you know, she's like, okay, careful now. If you chase that thing, that's always out in front of you, right? So, like, you have to use the same methods that got you there.

You can't go chasing the bliss field. You can't go chasing, you know, zeroing out. And then Michael Holt from Savage and Saint, like, he took me several steps further in that practice. But, I mean, like, that's something. To me, I bring that up because it is worth striving for. It is worth, you know, like in jiu-jitsu, you get your ass kicked your whole life. You know, like, talk about like black belts have tapped thousands of times. Our teacher, Master Paula Brando.

just got his coral belt. You have to teach as a black belt for 31 years, have been a world champion, have taken white belts to black belts, and they've become world champions. And it's like four other things. It's insane. Like not everyone.

There's like maybe 40, you know, coral belts, red and white. And how many times you think that guy's tapped? Right? An insane number of times, right? And so, but it's worth it still. It's still worth it. Even though you're going to get dragged.

That is sharpening of the sword. and to get to that point, I don't think it'll ever be a coral belt, but it's worth putting in the hours to get to the point where you have equivalency. And I think the same is true for meditation because once you have that, once you have that experience, it's like, oh, fuck, that can happen.

Yeah, right. And it's interesting, though, too, because it's not as quantifiable and measurable and scorable as all these other things I was talking about earlier. But there's still that pursuit for continual improvement. and progress and growth through those things. So I was going through a lot of that through my 30s,

and it was a little bit tricky, though, because I didn't have much to show for it. I mean, I felt it in my body. I felt my relationships in my life. But outwardly, from the external, I'm coming out of this external validation period of my life where, you know, I wasn't a big shot by any means, but like, you know, I was doing well in all the things that people could see.

And then to be now pursuing all of these other things that have no quantified, How do I prove to somebody that I can be more still now? You know what I mean? Like it was... Get some Aladdin pants. Yeah, exactly. Right, right, right. Get the elm tattooed on your forehead.

Yes. But it's, but it's a, it's a really very noble pursuit. I think it almost more noble in some ways because it's only, it's between you and your creator only, really, and people close to around you that can really know what you're putting in and what you're getting out of it. And it's not too proven. anything. It's not to show. It's not to get external validation. It's just you're committed to yourself and to yourself fully. And doing so without the pads on the back and the awards and the achievements makes it less of a less popular pursuit, right? In our world where most people

that were chasing those external validations. But it's still really important. It brings me a thought that was coming to mind. I just made a little note to myself. It's like, The warrior spirit. When I think of the warrior spirit, I saw it, I think, somewhere on your bookshelf here, King Warrior, magician lover somewhere. Yeah, it's a great book. But when I think of the warrior spirit,

you know, that wrestling mentality, that go, go, go, push, push, push, fall out 100% all the time. And then I was actually just watching. Did you watch yet in Waves and War? It's a Netflix documentary about Ibegain, about Navy SEALs and IvyGene. I've heard about it. It just came out pretty recently.

It was really good. But it was an interesting part. when they were interviewing one of the Navy SEALs, and he was talking about Operation Red Wings, which was with Michael Murphy, the lone survivor, you know, and how they had to bury these guys

and how traumatic it was and how they were offered counseling, but immediately everybody was like, fuck that, we're not doing that, blah, blah, because it was like this feeling of being, being soft.

And it was interesting to me because I was like, you know, to me, the warrior spirit isn't cold-blooded, heartless killer, right? The warrior spirit to me has these gears, these ways that we can swing. We can turn it on to defend and protect and fight if needed and must.

But also to be able to tune in to ourselves and to our subtleties and to the people around us in a loving, endearing, tender kind of way. So we can actually feel and know what we're willing to fight for. That's being told, go get those guys their bad. Go kill them. Okay. But you don't just run out there. I think in just maybe in culturally or whatever, I think sometimes maybe that's something that gets,

it gets twisted in people's minds, guys like us who are like, you know, fighters, wrestlers, you know, kind of go, go,

to tap into these, the heart, to let the heart lead the way is soft, right? It's, you know, pussy shit, right?

Yeah. But I don't know for some reason. It's a brilliant point because like in King, we're a magician lover, if you think of it like a cross, right you've got king at the head you've got the magician underneath it they're paired on a line they balance each other right and the king is generative the magician is creator the the warrior is paired with the lover right and so if you have shadow warrior in you it's not necessarily about bringing

on more of the conscious warrior it's about figuring out where there's a lack of the lover that helps sharpen that and create the correct warrior right and so it's the balance point of love the lover with the warrior that makes those work in a proper way. And I think about that a lot. You know, you talked about the heart because there's no doubt that's that's an important piece. And you can also see in some people, you know, that you might say, you know, like we mentioned a couple of names here, you know, one guy was a former armed forces guy who now runs, you know, a marathon every day, right? Like that, that they're in my mind having read that book, I'm seeing a missing piece in the lover's side. When I, you know, we talk about the marriage,

is a business, right? There's clearly something missing on the lover side there. The warrior's active and it's doing great. The king is active. It's fucking generative. The magician's probably active too, but the lover needs some work. And so I think about those things, you know, like, not to like, look at this guy. What are he doing wrong? But like, I can refocus like, oh shit, how often do I do that? Where am I not in tune with that? And those are always beautiful reminders for me, you know? Because it is easy to get caught. When I first retired from fighting, I was like, I was cool. I had plant medicines.

I'm cool with not being attached to being labeled a fighter. Let me do an ultra. How many of these can I do? After the first one, I was like, I think I'm just chasing the dragon stuff. It's like, let's get into powerlifting. I get like a 550 deadlift. I'm like, cool, man, 600 would be great. And then like, right when I say 600 will be great, I'm sitting on the shitter.

And I'm like, what happens after that? Yeah, right. It's 650. Then it's 700. And then it's seven. And I'm like, oh, damn, there's another rabbit hole. Where am I doing all that? You know, like, where are I just, you know, like, where can I just find peace with maybe never peeing again and just fucking enjoying the lift because it makes me strong and it makes me good, you know.

I've taken a lot of concepts from easy strength with Pavel Totzulin and Danjohn. People have heard me beat this horse before, but, you know, the Virga Chansky and SIF, the famous Russian scientists from the 80s who were studying all the elite athletes, they had a question. They said, you know, at a certain point, especially in your 40s, but even late 30s, depending on genetics, your nervous system stops responding as quickly. And Russians know all the nervous system training. You look at the Morinovich team and Jay Schroeder, you know, and the guys like that trained NFL guys with that type of style of training. As that starts to slow, your recovery goes down. Even if your muscles are fine, if your nervous system can't hang, you can't deadlift, max deadlift every week and have a max school Monday, Wednesday, Friday, max out kind of thing. And so they wondered, they asked the question, everyone's training at 70, 80, 90, and 100% of their 1 rep max to increase their 1 rep max.

What if we train at 50% of our 1 rep max and just improve that 50%? Will that increase the one rep max? And it does. But the key about training at 50% is you're not frying the nervous system. Right. So now you can hit those lifts five days a week. And to me, that was like, turn my whole world upside down, right? The no pain, no gain model of training, all that shit.

And so when I started doing it, I started every week, I throw 10 pounds on. Every week I throw 10 pounds on. And all of a sudden, I've increased my deadlift by 100 pounds. I'm like, holy shit, dude, 10 weeks in, like, and there is a ceiling. It doesn't work forever. But it was just like, wow, I can train like this. I can hit an easy strength workout in 25 minutes. And I was doing this on it.

And I could walk because when 10th planet used to be inside on it. So I'd hit my workout and I'd walk right over to the mats, kick my shoes off, and start rolling. And in a 90-minute juditsu workout had me. more endurance. My nervous system was primed for. It didn't take anything out of me. And most of us, there's people that want to lift weights just for lifting weights, you know, but most of us want to lift weights for another reason, right? Yeah, to make us better at a sport we like or, you know, for longevity or keep us able to wrestle our kids, whatever the thing is, you know. So basically,

you know, as dads, we got a lot of shit on our plate. Even people who aren't fathers have a lot it on their plate, you know, stay-at-home moms, working moms, younger people, you know, we live in a society that says stack more, right? And so there's always responsibilities. There's always something that we have to do. There's always something that needs our attention. There's always more that could be done, you know, from an email side or, you know, cleaning the house or any of these things. And that doesn't necessarily go away until we start to create space. but the gift of something like Chi running or easy strength is that now when I fit in this 20-minute snippet, which isn't that long, I can go right into the next thing with a 30-second cold shower

and I have more cognitive ability for it, right? I'm better at the podcast. Yeah, I'm not, I'm not exhausted. I remember coming off the mat and coming home when my son was like three. And my wife was just like, why do you train like that? And it was like, this is how you train. You know, like I didn't know any better, you know? And I was like, she's like, you're not fighting professionally, though, anymore, you know? And I'd just be a zombie and a total piece of shit sore. Like if my bear came barreling into me, like, I was a dick, you know, like, oh, you can't do that, dude. You know, you could hurt me kind of thing.

And then it's like, well, if I'm mobile and I'm not training like that and he barrels into me. Then it's like, now it's fun. That's game on, punk. I'm going to get your ass, you know, and it'll tickle monster time. So then that was a mushroom journey that really showed me that. viscerally, but I think there's much to be gained because it's not an all-or-nothing approach. Like you don't have to say like, oh, weight training made me sore. It's like, no, it was the style of weight training that made you sore.

Mike Slemy, perfect example. He was state champion in California in powerlifting and Olympic lifting and then became a kettlebell sport champion, right? And then he was going to see check through all this. He'd drive down in San Diego and spend the weekend there and was doing all of his training and things like that. Paul was, you know, low-key, just breadcrumbing, all the shit, the working in practices in between sets, things like that. And, you know, his story was great.

I was a podcast with him a bunch. I've been friends for a long time. We've sat in many ceremonies together. It was only our last podcast where I really got to, like, hear this full story. But it was an incredible turn, right? And now he's like one of the best coaches in the world, you know, on the physical, the mental, emotional, and spiritual side because of that, right? Like, the lived experience makes all the difference. All right, guys, quick break to tell you about my.

my brand new community, the kingdom within 15 months in the making, I've really been dialing this in. We're on school. If you want to learn about the body, the mind, connection, family, psychedelics, all the things. This is your place to do that. This is about bringing people together who want to grow, who want to learn and are willing to make changes, but don't know how, or maybe don't think they have enough time. We're going to reframe that. We're going to reframe that through the wealth of knowledge that I've had 30 years as an athlete and training under the best coaches in the world, the best mentors in the world and putting that all together. The last seven years I've been coaching people in fit for service,

and now I get to be directly the coach with you guys. And I'm inviting in people that really want to work and people that are willing to make changes. And we're going to get that done. There's no two ways about it. You will make changes. It will change your life for the better. I can assure you that all you got to do is show up.

We meet twice a month once for a lecture where I have a deep dive on a particular topic with some Q&A. And then again, two weeks later, just for a pure Q&A to make sure everyone's integrating and practicing and getting this stuff down. And then it asks me anything. You know, that's all going to be in there too. But we're also posting in between you guys are privy to special emails and things that I'm not sending out to my regular group. So detox pathways, all the different things that you'd want to know. The questions I get on Instagram, I'm writing detailed reports for the people in this community to be able to get a hold of.

And it's only $150 a month. It is the cheapest way to work with me possible. I hope to see you there. Click the link in the show notes for the kingdom within. And now back to the podcast. Take us through. When did you start writing? You know, because you brought us up to like, you know, you're 40 now.

Yeah. The 30s were different than the 20s. 30s and 20s were a big difference. In the 30s, all along, I was just, like we mentioned before, just kind of being led deeper and deeper into the heart, into the body in a different way and into the spiritual, right? It was broadening my horizons of, what's possible through this realm in my own practices,

but in just endless podcast, books, documentary, you know, just immersing myself in all of these things. And then, like I said, the medicine work obviously comes with endless, you know, wisdom to pick up on. So I'm collecting, you know, what feels like valuable wisdom, just like in my own personal journey and things. And I'm mostly just journaling it, writing it down. I did start a, there was a chapter there where I, for a few years, had a holistic lifestyle

coaching certification that was, I still attached it to the fitness industry though because it was, it was called 023 holistic lifestyle as in 023 standing for the other 23, as in the other 23 hours of the day that you're not in the gym. And it all made sense. And I got people like, oh, okay, that makes sense, you know, but it was, everyone's response that was like you just think like oh we work out this is going to be the nutrition and the sleep and the mindset and that's what it was but i was really layering and it was kind of trojan horsing deeper inner personal development spiritual awakening into like into the fitness space into

gyms coaches would take the certification and bring our program into their gyms it was really effective but i was i just kept feeling like this attachment of the fitness the fitness industry just needed to be tethered you know i was just like, or untethered, I guess would be the word, I kind of had to keep making things smaller and fit into that box where I really wanted to be expanding outward. I was also just, for whatever reason, maybe, who knows why, I just attracted to a lot of things that I guess would be considered political, but really more freedom based. Like, what does individual freedom really mean and sovereignty and free market economy? And like, I was reading books and all these things.

I had no idea why, but I was just drawn to all this stuff. And I felt like I wanted, and I saw the connection specifically with individual freedom and our personal health, you know, and medical freedom and these things as well. And so I started drawing a lot of correlations there that felt like I just had this urge to want to share and talk about. So I've always imagined myself writing a nonfiction, typical, like the books I read, because normally what I read is nonfiction. I know you do as well. Well, I don't you read a lot of fiction too, but like these types of books. It was nonfiction for, I mean, from the first book. I said after college, I'd never read another book again.

Yep. I'm still a senior at ASU, so I didn't finish. I got my two-year degree in junior college at least to show something. But it was getting turned on that I watched the Flatten Your Ops Forever video on VHS from Paul. After my guy was like, my strength coach goes, will you read how to move me healthy? And I'm like, I'm not reading another fucking book. I watched the video. I'm like, all right, give me the book.

Read the book, do the questionnaires. That changed so much that it was, and I credit this for Paul. Like it planted the seed for me to read everything else that I wanted to read because I was like, damn, if this can move so much in a fight career, and wrestlers know this too. Like, if you change anything in your wrestling every day and you see it improve, like it's a very strong test to be able to tell you what's working, what isn't. But that led me to Kelly Strette and all the other things.

And it's funny because I was almost guilty, guiltily sharing this with Paul, last time he was here about how, you know, have I replaced the TV with fiction books, you know, because I have fucking obsess over him now. like they're the most spiritual fucking dope. You know, I love him. I love them. And he's like, not at all. He's like, when you filled your brain to a maximum, you need periods of time where there's

complete rest from any new information, right? Because there's, that's a part of integration as well. How do you package everything that you've learned into usable systems and actually squeeze the sponge out? Yeah, exactly. And then when you're ready for it, you take on more nonfiction. But this is, I just, that was a point that I didn't want to derail you, but like, that's a super big point to have for people that are just non-

I was a non-fiction guy like who would waste their time with a fucking fiction guy. That's what I always thought. I thought that for sure. A lot of listeners are kind of in the same boat and and so I just assumed I'd always write this non-fiction story. I had a working title and all these things. But then I started realizing again how it just sort of it covered so much ground and so many things. And I actually did read a few key pieces of fiction along the way.

Either fiction, you know, like, you know, the, uh, the, uh, the, The Alchemist, the Pilgrimage, but also, I don't know if you, have you heard of the ringing cedars, the ringing cedars of Russia? Yeah. My GM who's not here right now, Eric Vaughn, he's been on the podcast, one of my best friends. He told me about that book series, and I keep hearing about it. I have not picked it up. Yeah, yeah.

It's translated from Russia. It's a book series. It's technically, you know, according to the author, not fiction, but it's story. And even a big impactful book for me was Conversations with God, if you've ever read that. Yeah, you've got them right back here, all of them. Because the dialogue. It allows for it back and forth. And I started realizing that those books, things seem to retain more and stick more.

And I started having this vision to turn the book I had in my mind into a fiction story. And at first it was just like, that would be kind of cool, you know? And then I like just kind of whispering a little louder in my ear. I'm like starting to see a plotline kind of develop and like, oh, that would be cool idea to write a book someday. And then it just kind of just kept going and going. And next thing you know, it's tugging at me too hard to ignore. and I'm seeing the plot line. I'm seeing the characters. I'm seeing a general arc, story arc. And I'm like, I got to do this, you know. And so when I, because also when I realized with the fiction, I can weave all of these things into a story. And I could create characters that are going through a transformational process and an awakening and learning from, you know, learning along the way, the same way that I've learned all these, these things. So I start writing the book. give the general overview. So the book is called

the primordial code. And it takes place in a land called Oklblya. It's a setting of the Oklblaia is the Lakota word for freedom. And it's a hidden land and it's exists in peace and prosperity and

alignment with the universal laws of nature. And it's not fantasy. It's not science fiction. They don't have anything we don't have. It's modern technology but with different principles. And govern themselves by the all-knowing infinite universal wisdom that lives inside of all of us that they refer to as the primordial code. So that's the idea is that they're all tapped into this

code and they see what's going on in our world and they, you know, it's a little bit of a conflict within themselves. It shows how they handle conflict much differently, but it's a little bit of a split decision, but they want to help us. They decide they have to help us, basically. And they start this underground program where they kind of secretly bring over just regular everyday people and they bring them to the land and they bring them through the land and they have a mentor and they meet different teachers and guides and make friends. And along the way, they are, like their minds are basically being blown because everything is contrasted what they're doing there compared to what we're doing here. And they contrasts most of it to,

They're basically challenging them on all their beliefs because they're asking all these questions. Why do you do this and why do you do that? And they're getting to learn about this land. And then they're asking them back about what we do here and why and where all these beliefs came from. And they teach them about what they refer to as empirical code. An empirical code, what they refer to is the conditions brainwashing that we've all experienced through school and society and culture that serves empire. right that keeps us in formation essentially serves empire

but tends to override our empirical code that's all inside but excuse me override the primordial code that's inside so along the way they're learning how to get in touch and retune into themselves and unlock and that the answers that they're seeking are all within so there's like the contrast of the two societies that's really cool because there's a lot of like political talk

and how they do things that way but then you're seeing these two characters as one male one female and alternates point of view each chapter. They're going through like a really radical awakening and transformation is very challenging. One of the characters I won't say who ends up in a medicine ceremony and so you get to ride along that journey with them. And they go through this really radical awakening. And ultimately they're at the end, they have to decide like, are you, if they're going to come back for this even deeper initiation training, which is going to be book two, where they will basically undergo like a spiritual warrior initiation and and decide if they're going to dedicate

their life to the code and bringing the code back to us. So, um, so like, it was so exciting and fun for me to write because I got to every single little thing that I've ever like learned in my life and picked up on and learned from others. I've got to weave into this story in a way that felt fun. And like art where the vision I had for writing this nonfiction book felt like a giant work project that was going to take me years and suck my soul. This filled me up. Like it would You think reading a book that you don't know what's going to happen next is exciting? Writing a book where you don't know what's going to happen next is like way more exciting. It's really cool.

Honestly, I feel like that some of the best hearing that from you, but also Sergi Moss talked about that too. She includes her life experiences in her books. And hers is like total fantasy. It's also what you might consider smut. But she finally did an interview, some popular checkout in L.A. I forget the name of it. It's like one of the top five shows. But God, I don't want to drop it.

blank on her podcast. Anyways, you search Sergei Moss on podcast is the only one. But she talked about that, you know, like the sometimes she didn't know where it was going to come from next. Wayne Dyer used to say that. Wayne Dyer would say that he would just clear out. And when the book was finished, he'd read back like, holy shit, I wrote that. Like he was just emptying himself and letting it pour through.

That's what it felt like. Yeah, it really did. And when the only parts I went back and rewrote were when I could tell there was this blockage, there was what was coming through was I was putting my fear, you know, what I really want to get out of this heart and what I put in as truth the only parts I redid were where there was fear standing in the way

because there's it goes in it takes them through because I even get to wrap in on conspiracy theory Let's go baby yes So they get it's got to have some of that. And you know there's so it goes into the the moon landing and 9-11 and all these things in like a fun kind of way but it was like tough for me

because you know I'm like you know this is this is real like i'm putting this in a book and publishing it like not that i'm necessarily like scared for my safety or anything but you know i'm putting out some some stuff here and then obviously there's so much about you know tuning into the heart and love and compassion and all these things and you know i'm coming from a hard charging wrestling barbell slamming smelling salt sniffing you know guy a few years ago so it was like tough for me to like really open up in that kind of way but um i really uh i'm I think overall I'm happy with what I was able to allow to flow through. That's so awesome.

Have you read a couple of similar books that are popping in my mind? And then I want to talk really quick about the guy who I've learned from. Have you read the Kennevada or Waiting for You? No. You would love that. And then the Fifth Sacred Thing by Starhawk? Someone I met over the weekend at Confluence when she heard about my book. She's like, oh, this sounds very similar.

She mentioned that book. And I had heard it one other time, but that's definitely on my reader. Those books, Kenavada are waiting for you is, an awesome utopia novel that is like, their connection is through dream work. They wake up, they speak their dreams every morning. That's the first thing they do every single day, like ritually. And they interpret that and big dreams get taken to the head honcho

and they're discussed amongst the group. But the Fifth Secret Thing from Starhawk, that book was written pre-2020. Okay. I promise you now, like everyone listening to this right now, it is 100% worth your time. and energy to listen to that book or read it because it is fucking bang on, bang on, be pre-2020.

Like you understand this book was written pre-2020 and you read it and you're like, wow, wow, that dude was tapped in. And for sure, just in the book is just an incredible, incredible piece of nonfiction. It's awesome. I think you'll dig it. Yeah, I mean, now that especially the second time has come up this week. Yeah, and that's, that was kind of my goal. And to have a book like that, the story, you know,

Story sinks in. I've been on a few shows this week. I don't think we hit this yet. But story mythology, right? This is as old as human, right? When there's been humans, there's been stories. There's been myths. Even when they weren't written down, they were spoken.

And that's how they pass on and they live. And I think there's just something special about learning and observing. Because the book goes into all these rabbit holes. It's similar things that a lot of these books go into, but brought into one place. But it's just a little bit different. You can absorb it differently when you're seeing it through a character's eyes. And you can kind of draw your own correlations to how it reflects to your life. As opposed to reading a book of like, here's Brian Costello's, you know,

instructions on how to create the new earth. Like, because I don't have those answers anyway, you know, but it's like I'm creating characters that I think carry these universal themes. Like their awakenings. They're unique, but they're, you know, they're all universal themes that we, we've gone through and universal fears and stories and things. And the feedback definitely checks out on this. This is why I bring it up between the Amazon reviews and the personal reviews

and people that I'm meeting that are reporting back is like, I swear this was part was about me. And I swear, I'm like, you know, Gary is the male character and Saunders, the female, oh, Sandra's just like my sister's. You know, it's like they see it in there. And then it sticks and lands more deeply. So that was my goal. And the ringing cedars, I bring those up because what's happening in Russia

based on these books. They're older. It's been a longer time. It's over 20 years. But there's over 400 community villages in Russia based around the concepts in the story. And they've even changed some laws about how you can obtain land. Anastasia. Anastasia is the woman in the book who was like the truthkeeper.

They have like the Anastasia laws or Anastasia laws. And you can like obtain. I don't know exactly how it works. but you can get a hectare of land and live in this way that they teach in the story. And that's really what I'm trying to replicate with this story as well is that people finish the book. And again, this is great now because it's been about a year that since it's been out. And this checks out with what I'm hearing. They finished the book and they say, let's do this.

How do we do this? What do they do first? I even added in the new version. There's a QR code in the back that you can scan and join our group chat and our group calls right away. Got to read it first, though, because it's like when everyone calls, comes in having read the story, we're all on the same foundation. And yeah, I'm even starting in the early stages of designing a concept model for a new version of village based around the story as well, around the concepts in the story.

We don't have land yet. We don't have funding yet, but it's about creating the model first. And the model really is about the people and the principles of, you know, I'm calling it like modern tribal village. You know, we're not going back to huts necessarily. We have things that are here to stay, but the principles of tribe and what it means to not just live next door to each other and be a community necessarily, but live in a way where we, to at least some extent, rely on each other. Yeah. And with multi-generational permanence, like that we're going to kind of rebuild bloodlines as opposed, you know, outside of this system, kind of veering out of the system for good. And I think we mentioned earlier, a lot of us kind of with the way things are, we're kind of one foot in, one foot out.

But I think ultimately, if we can create a little more clear path outward, more people will take that second foot out. And this concept model of village is what I'm trying to create is like that clear path out. That's freaking fantastic. I forget the name of the book. I might be right behind you. It's the power over the powerless, Fayette Klob Havel. talked about how, you know, you don't have to fully dismantle a system. And in many ways, I'm reading Against the Machine right now.

I don't know if you're familiar with that. It's a great book, British author, who does his own narration on Ottawa. Did you post something about this recently? I did a while back. I thought maybe I saw it somewhere else. That name just came up. Against the machine's a great one. And it really details, you know, our history and how we've gotten here.

But, like, I bring that up because in some ways, you know, they couldn't, dismantle the socialist regime. Right. You know, they just couldn't do that. But what they could do is build a parallel system. Yes. And that parallel system gave enough people the ability to live side by side, the machine, and not be affected by it, you know.

And so I think parallel systems are an incredible piece that that has to be built so we don't come to, you know, war ending everything or, you know, a total bust or a total sacrifice of all personal rights and freedoms to live, you know, in a world. safe to live in China. I'm not trying to have an open air prison system either. Exactly. So that's super resonant. Yeah, I think that that's a,

I love what you're doing, brother. It's really cool. Yeah, I'll go to quick, quick mention. So the, yeah, the parallel system, so I've been doing a lot of studying with like common law and how to do, you know, basically do all of this in the private.

So a big shout out to Confluence. If anyone in the area or this event confluence is absolutely just awesome. It's just sitting in workshops all weekend about how to operate all this in the private realm and status correction and kind of legally and lawfully disconnecting ourselves from the system. But yeah, that's basically how I see. So the village model I'm creating is called Ocablo, Modern Tribal Village. And so Okoblai is the name of the land. Ocablo is the name of the people, like the Okablo people live in this land. So the Okablo village model is just like kind of It's an ode to the story.

It's not an exact replica. You know, it's not like we're not actually creating Okalbly, but like close enough. And but the point I was saying was that there's a, I'm just going to throw this out. I'm not going to buy tickets today. There's an event called Exit and Build that's coming up. And at the Sovereignty Ranch in Bandera and Texas. Oh, that's right. I just got an email from those guys.

Yeah. So the early bird tickets end today. So I'm going to get my ticket I decided this morning. But exit and build. It's about how to do this, how to come together, exit the system legally, lawfully, cleanly, and build the new one. So everything that I'm working on with this story is to excite people to be a part of that and do that. And then everything I'm working on in the village is how to actually make it real. So cool, brother.

We'll link to where people can purchase your book and the show notes. Right now, just give us a website. Sure. Yeah, the primordial code.com is the website. first two chapters are available for free on Spotify or Apple, so on audio. So you can listen if you're like a little unsure. If it calls to you,

I'd say just pick it up and go for it. I can say this with more confidence now just because of so much of the feedback that I'm getting and the reviews that are coming in on Amazon and stuff. It helps me. And normally I'm not like the type to push, promote myself so much. But if not just pop on the chapter one and chapter two.

They're each their own episode. Are you going to do the rest of the book audio? Yeah. So it's all recorded. I'm actually, my next like project is finishing all the editing and posting. And I actually plan to make it all free as well. Keep it all just out in the open. For me, the idea is that the story lives with no barriers between it.

Buying the book is helpful. It supports obviously me and my family and the project. So even if people listen to the story, there'll be just kind of little ads to go buy the book if you want. But I'm going to be releasing it kind of weekly dripping out like a Netflix series kind of thing because each chapter ends, you know, leaving kind of open for the next one. Yeah, little cliffhangers and stuff.

So I'm actually really excited about that. It's all recorded. I'm just working on the editing now. But today's May 1st, we're looking at probably mid-June to launch that. And it'll drip out all summer and then it'll be out there to live for it. It's a little less barrier right now. You know, people buy the book and then open the book and then finish the book is the kind of three barriers.

The finishing is the easy one. But this is like open Spotify and press play or open to Apple and press play is like pretty much no barrier. And that's all I want. And so I want people to enjoy the story. So cool, brother. Well, dude, I appreciate it. It's been awesome.

Good to know you here. We got to run it back. I'm going to listen to your book. And then when you get the second one out, we'll run it back, brother. Yeah, let's do that. That's going to be great. Awesome. Thank you so much, brother.