LadyGang - Jackie Goldschneider

Episode Date: September 5, 2023

It's official, the LadyGang members REALLY want Keltie and Jac to go surfing and BBQ sause is the best sauce. Plus, The Real Housewives of New Jersey star joins us to talk about her new book "The Weight Of Beautiful".  Check out our amazing sponsors!!! Just Thrive: Get 20% off a 90 day bottle of Just Thrive probiotic and Just Calm at JustThriveHealth.com with promo code: LADYGANG Nutrafol: Get $10 off your first month’s subscription and free shipping when you go to Nutrafol.com and use code "LGPOD" KiwiCo: Get 50% off your first month with code LADY at kiwico.com/panda  Angi: Download the free Angi mobile app today or visit Angi.com to get professional help on your next project!See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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Well, what is this? Welcome to the Lady Gang. That's amazing. Say that again. The Lady Gang. Things are about to change around here. Each week we catch up with Hollywood's hottest girl posse, Kelty Knight, Becca Tobin, and Jack Vanek. Hello, hello, hello. Welcome to Lady Gang.

I am Becca Tobin here with Jack Vanek and Kelty Knight. And yes, I do own other clothing. If you are watching the visual medium of Lady Gang, I believe I've been in a denim shirt like for eight hours. The problem is, is that I fly in to LA to do these recordings with you guys. And my, my layer of choice on an airplane in the summertime I've decided is a denim shirt. That's crazy to me.

It is. You're not cold. I think, I think a denim shirt is the new cardigan. I mean, I agree. I just, I am so freezing on a flight no matter what time of year it is. Like I need full on sweatsuit. You've not been on one of those flights where you're boarding and there's no cold air coming out of the vent and everybody's sweating their tits off.

I've been on three planes this summer that until you take off it or in the air, and then you're sweating for an hour or you're like hot and you feel like you're having, so that's why I feel like the denim is a really perfect cause it's a shirt, but it also is an extra layer. Anyways. So that was my proof. My, I just had to give a disclaimer. It's a great, I never changed her shirt.

And Nina Bing makes great basics and this is what this is. So shout out. um it's time for good week yes it is bad week oh no who would like to go first i'll go first okay because you're talking about airplanes and one of my my bad week has to do with an airplane so i was on one of my many flights that i've had recently and i went up to go to the bathroom first mistake i'm waiting i'm waiting i'm waiting i'm waiting having sex i'm waiting for like 10 minutes right finally the bathroom door opens i'm sorry can i just i need to preamble this what preamble might be my word today um preface is the word you're looking for preface you didn't

pay attention to whether it was red or green uh obviously not red means there's someone in there i know but yeah but if you don't get up one line somebody else is gonna get mad dash and also sometimes i like the the opportunity to stand up yes okay you know what fine fine so i was standing up waiting for this by the way there are two bathrooms nobody was coming out of either of them for like i'm not kidding at least five minutes which is a long time when you're standing there and waiting i had my phone at my seat i'm like what am i doing finally the door opens and this guy walks out we make eye contact like i looks we're looking straight at each other in the eyes i go in the bathroom there is the largest piece of shit in that toilet that he did not flush

and he looked at me straight in the eyes and thought that that was did you go in there yeah i flushed his shit so it wasn't even like he couldn't flush it that's what i thought oh no no no it was just sitting in the toilet i literally feel like i'm gonna bar and for this man to have the audacity to look at me straight in the eyes and make eye contact i'm like that is a level of confidence i've never seen in my life that's gotta be a kink maybe oh a kink he didn't look at me sexually, but that is, I should have thought about that. It's like a flasher. Yeah. It's just when you, when you go in the airport or airline bathroom, airline bathroom, the air, what's it called? Airplane bathroom. And that like, you know, it's just sucked

into the nether region and you never know what you're going to get in that pot. You're going to get like old pee. You're going to get, uh, it's making me sick. Like I do like it. Cause it's just like a vacuum seal. Yeah. The smell goes away pretty quickly. Remember the thing with dave matthews band where they dumped all of his like private jet poop over like over the earth it was like over i think a river or something and it got all over people this is anyways this guy's could have gone in there anyways that was insane that was one of the craziest like crazy shit happens to everybody on planes but that was nuts so the eye contact was insane that would have been my bad year yeah it was pretty bad i went in there anyways because

like what can you do so my good week is i checked something off my manifestation list did you surf no by the way i found my old manifestation list from like 2020 and it had learned to surf on no so this has been going on for i'm not kidding like three or four years at this point a girl came up to me in the airport i think her name was emily this morning i hadn't had my coffee yet it's in six in the morning she comes up and she's like hey are you becca and i was like yeah she's like i love the lady gang and i just i really hope that jack and kelty surf this year that's so weird that she 2024 is our year to surf for sure so weird that's part of your good week again because i was like oh my god i'd forgotten already again again i know i was shocked i was like

um i know this from somewhere learn to surf okay i always go what did you do i released my art oh you did and it was a big success i sold it out in 24 hours i was shocked i think it's very it's very um not embarrassing is not the right word vulnerable vulnerable to like put that out there because i'm like i think it's kind of cool but i don't know if anybody i mean people think it's cool but like are people going to spend money on it and like actually care about what i'm doing so it was really validating and awesome and i'm just really proud of it so that's my good week congrats i love it the list bye look at you manifestation station i have an airport um bad week can i yeah like a theme okay so i was also in an airport recently and uh if you know lady

gang merch, you know, that we made sort of like, you know, one of Jack's signature things at sometimes is taking a well-known t-shirt and then turning it into like a lady gang t-shirt, you know, like a dupe, if you will. A dupe, yeah. So we had a shirt called Earball Pleasures, which was like, I don't know what it's based on. Joy Division. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And so it's black and it has like this mountain stripey, whatever those are. It's like heart waves. Yeah. And oh, it is? Yeah. Oh, wow. It does look like mountains. Okay.

Yeah. and it says earball pleasures on it because the original t-shirt it's the album is unknown pleasures so you know it all makes sense yeah so i'm in the airport and as you know i'm in my fame era yeah so i like you can't tell me that i'm not a star right now you know what i mean like i am i'm just like i'm peaking i've never i'm like oh you did see me in people.com star sightings bitch you are thriving it is so palpable online yeah like you are where you're supposed to be where i'm supposed to be so i'm like walking through the airport like i'm hot shit and i see someone and i stop and i go oh my god it's me and they were wearing oh no no they were wearing a joint

division i swear to god it said earball pleasures and i was like hey and they were like hey and i was like oh i'm sorry i thought you were wearing a t-shirt for my band and then i was like uh He's like, are you in Joy Division? And he just walked away. I felt like such a fucking- It was a guy? It was a girl. That's why I thought she was a lady ganger.

I was like, what's up, lady gang? It's me. Ha ha, hi. And then it was him. That's so embarrassing. It was so embarrassing. I wish I had been there. Amazing.

My good week is, you know, listen, I'm 40s. I'm sexy, mature. I'm discovering new things about me all the time. Like bodily functions? No, no, no. This is like just something I love. i have recently very recently just realized that the best sauce on earth is barbecue sauce oh barbecue sauce where have you been all my life you're so delicious have you had a mcdonald's

french fry with a barbecue barbecue sauce is pretty good have you had a uh cheese mozzarella stick with a barbecue sauce crazy have you put barbecue sauce on your eggs what is happening in my life barbecue sauce is the new number one sauce wow first of all welcome to planet earth No, I've never had, cause I don't do, I don't really eat meat. Oh, so I've never experienced a steak with barbecue sauce or people are like what you don't put barbecue sauce on the vegetables on the barbecue, right? Yeah, that's true. I've never had access to barbecue sauce before.

That's so good. That's Zach's condiment of choice. Really? Over ketchup? Yep. They make one at, I think they sell it at Whole Foods for sure. It's called Japanese barbecue or Japanese barbecue sauce. It is the most delicious sauce.

i'll get you some now that you're she's a barbecue queen you're enthusiastic barbecue sauce wow congrats it's the little things you know things like i'm excited i'm like oh what can i put barbecue sauce on today so i mean yeah it'll give you a little meaty yeah adventure it probably has meat in it and i don't know no it doesn't okay so i heard a quote the other day i don't know where and i don't know who part of having a child is that i don't remember where i've been who i've talked to, but sometimes I remember golden nuggets of what was said. Yes. And someone said something very wise and it was nothing happens for a decade. And then a decade happens in a moment. Sexy mature. It's a little bit like, it's not that devil's advocate. It's that

no, nothing happens in a decade. Nothing happens for a decade. And then a decade happens in a moment. It's so true. Well, it's like the quote, it takes a decade to make an overnight success or whatever that is, but like more for life chills. Yeah. Chills. Well, speaking of something that's going to take a decade, um, my bad week is that we've lost Alex, the person who runs the lady gang. So the fact that the three of us are still living and breathing is shocking. It's crazy. She went on to greener pastures. You know, you can only be at the lady gang for so long until you're either stuck here forever or, you know, you're like, I need to do something better with my life. This is not where I saw my life ending up long-term. So we have been creating,

we've been having to put on like a little bit more business hats than we've ever had to since before Alex, which I don't even remember the time before Alex. And Kelty had this idea where like, everything needs to live on a Google sheet, a Google sheet, a Google sheet. No, no, no, you're not in trouble i'm in trouble because me too if someone stops hiring me to podcast or act i cannot work in a corporate job because google sheets like i almost have a mental breakdown every time i open it on my lap on my laptop oh on your laptop i was gonna say it doesn't work on your phone not doesn't work on your phone but then on your laptop i'm like how do i have to follow like coordinates on a map like it's a game of battleship i i can't we need to do it no we

need to form out our google sheets you know this is an offline conversation but it does i hate it okay good okay good you write a paragraph and then it takes up the entire screen there's a thing where you can cut it off yeah and so here's my question uh is there a better app for this is it excel but no everyone sheets sheets is it google sheets is it no sheets is for mac but sheets is ugly like can i get a fucking emoji to be like i don't know i just like a gold star it's giving me agita i don't know what agita is but it feels like that's what it's giving me and i'm sorry and then i'll just rack i'm sorry that i am very right now in my life and i was like jack's not using the sheet and then i yelled at her i know you did i was like well it's really

redundant it is the truth i'm sharing a video five different places but that's fine i'm gonna streamline but i just i know that i was like actually i've always felt like put me in a corporate like situation i can run the company yeah it's mundane it's fine whatever i could do it and then i opened up that sheet and i was like this is what people are doing every day some people are about like it's the left brains that are good at it it's so i can't i can't do a sheet for the life of me i know it's very difficult okay well i love you and i'm very excited about this episode jack go on to your um wedding festivities because we have an interview without jack don't be sad don't turn this off it's a very good interview yes very good interview

but jack has many many duties as a bride goodbye bye farewell this episode of lady gang is brought to you by neutrophil you guys know i love neutrophil i've been taking it for i think six years now it has literally changed my hair i had no hair and we were just talking about this on the podcast the other day because becca and jack were like i think hair is genetic and i was like maybe But like I had hair my whole life Like I was the girl in second grade with the short haircut because I never had that full beautiful like toddlers and tiaras hairdo Like I just have never had good hair my whole life until I started neutrophil every single night before I go to bed I keep them in my medicine cabinet. It changes everything but you have to take it for a long time

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is work on this little wooden puzzle that we received from KiwiCo. They have a panda crate. It's so amazing. It's such an awesome way to keep your baby's curiosity going through play. So it's bi-monthly subscription for babies ages zero to 24 months built for brain building fun. So KiwiCo's panda crate supports your baby's rapid development in the first two years of life with science-backed products that support child-led play and encourage open-ended exploration. Every crate comes with high quality toys a magazine activity cards featuring research-backed content and activities to nurture your little ones all shipped right to your door and there's no commitment so you can pause or cancel at any time plus kiwi co baby products are free of bpa phthalates and lead

they use only non-toxic water-based paints and finishes unlock brain building play with kiwi co's panda crate get 50 off your first month with code lady at kiwi co.com slash panda that's 50 percent off your first month at k-i-w-i-c-o.com slash panda promo code lady now back to the lady gang our guest today is known for her honesty on bravo's hit housewives of new jersey but there's so much more to this lady than the camera show from a former attorney and freelance journalist to unveiling the raw truths of her battle with anorexia in her debut book, The Weight of Beautiful. She's all set to spill the tea on her journey of strength, recovery, and how reality TV saved her life. Please welcome to the Lady Gang, Jackie Goldschneider.

Hi, everyone. Hi. I'm so excited to be here. Before we started recording, I started to tell you and then I was like, no, I need to wait. We get sent books from people who are coming on the podcast a lot. And you know, it's always like in that annoying digital format because the book itself is not actually out yet. And I will, I'll like skim and I'll do what I need to do to get through the interview. And when I tell you everything I scheduled to do this morning was canceled and I got through a hundred pages of your book and I just, I, I am so mad. I didn't have more time, but as soon as we get off, I'm finishing it. It is so amazing. It's so beautifully written. This is a first, like I'm just starting to get feedback on it. This is my

first podcast about it. Like this is the beginning of everything. And, you know, like I wrote it myself, like no one helped me at all. So like every word of it is, is from me. And I just like getting feedback is the most amazing feeling in the world to know that it like touches people, you know, and it's so well written that I was actually going to ask you if you had help, because I know you're very intelligent woman, but that doesn't always translate into a beautiful writer. No, writing is my first love and writing this book. When I tell you I had all these experiences in my head since 2003, I mean, since childhood, I've just thought about everything and thought about why I did this to myself. And, you know, so I had all of these stories in my head

and I just, when it came time to write it, as soon as I got my book deal, I sat down, it came pouring out of me. It's really, really beautiful. And so for everyone listening, this is where we're going to jump in and say a quick trigger warning. If you're someone who's battling an eating disorder or has had that sort of trauma in their past or someone they loved, and you don't like to hear things about it, thank you for joining us on Lady Gang and we'll see you next week. But we're going to continue this conversation and I want it to be in true Lady Gang fashion, real and authentic. And so I want to be able to dig in with you. And so I just wanted to let our girls know that if, if this is something that they don't want to hear this week or they can't take

on, then that's for them and maybe come back and visit at another time. So I guess my question is this. I think that there is why the book, like, why did you want to tell the, they're so personal. It's embarrassing at times. Like there's so much shame because you did this to yourself and these stories. So why now? Because there are so many people like me who think they're the only one who think that these terrible things that they're living through every day and the way they torture themselves, that they're the only person doing that because for a long time I felt like that. And so if I can put these stories out there and I am sure that there's so many people who are going to say, Oh God, I do that too. Oh God, I do that too. Just to make people feel less alone

and to let people know that as bad as it can get, you can fully recover from all of this. I don't want anyone to go through what I went through, which was, it was so isolating to have this disorder. And mine was, I mean, as bad as it can get. It was so bad. But I don't want people to think they're the only ones anymore. And so for people who haven't read the book, or cause everyone's going to buy it after they listen to this. Can you give us a brief like overview of where the story starts, what you're explaining and like kind of what the whole book is? Okay. Well, I guess you know, I had a really pretty normal childhood, very happy. And then in high school I had a really, really hard time. It was actually like a terrible and it,

it shaped me and it, it scarred me and I became convinced and I was very overweight in high school and um i became convinced that the only way i was going to be accepted was if i was thin and my doctor put me on basically a starvation diet and i lost weight and then i went to college and gained weight and then i would come home and lose weight and college and gain weight and i was just on like this crazy cycle trying every crazy diet in the book for a really like a I guess probably from 1994 to 2003, I was just trying really wild diets and some that I would create myself, some that were out there already. And then in 2003, I decided to start cutting foods out and I just got, so I started losing weight and then I got scared of gaining weight

back. So everything just escalated and got worse. And before I knew it, I was just eating nothing. And I kept trying to stop, but I was too scared to stop because in my head it was, you know, it was all or nothing. It was go back to being fat and being ignored or stay anorexic and be thin and be pretty. And, you know, I just got really scared and I didn't I didn't know how to go back. And so it stuck for 18 years. I was anorexic through pregnancy. I was anorexic through getting married on my honeymoon. I mean, there are stories that are just so if you remember, there was one point when I went on vacation to Mexico that it was just so horrendous what I did to myself to not eat that I always think back to that moment. But, you know, when I got on the show, I was hiding it for a long time. And and then I went through something really bad on the show.

And I know it looks one way to viewers. It looks like just something that happens in a season and then you get past it. But it was real in my life. And the way I dealt with stress was just, you know, eat even less. And so I started really like as bad as I was, I got worse and I got to a point where I realized that I was going to kill myself if I kept going like this. So, um, I chose to recover on the show so that it could be on as visible a platform as possible. And, um, and it really, I take people through the beginning of recovery and what that looks like and a lot of the emotions and it was

not easy. Um, but, uh, you know, I think, I think a lot of people will find a lot of hope in this story. You know, you said something when you talked about childhood that I just had never, I, I didn't have the same experience. I don't think any of us have the same experiences in high school. I think it's everybody, everyone's in a little version of their own hell, I think. and you talked about how there were comments made about your weight but it was also so crushing to feel like you were invisible that you just went so unnoticed and I was on this walk and I was reading the chapter about that and then about your brother who had special needs and you were constantly having to defend him and I was I was actually just sobbing and I think that it's so

important for someone like you who's on this platform, who is beautiful, who has a gorgeous family, who has money, who has all these things going to see this person as a little young woman and hear about the struggles and the trials and tribulations. It's so, it's just, it's really important that you wrote that. And it makes you such a whole human where I think we look at these housewives a lot of the time as caricatures and compartmentalize them in this like part of our brain where they're just like one dimensional vapid humans. And I'm happy you're breaking the shell. And I hope more housewives start to do this. We're all important and interesting women with our own battles. Yeah. And I mean, all those experiences shaped me and made me who I am. And

you know, in some ways I almost feel like being so desperate for that attention in high school stayed with me and I truly was ignored, completely ignored. And it stayed with me. And I think a piece of that was why I was so desperate to get on the show when I first like was offered it is because I was always chasing that validation, even as an adult, it just stayed with me. And when I entered recovery and I got a therapist and we really started intensely digging into all of that, I mean, my whole life improved because not only did I, you know, get past my eating disorder, which I never thought would happen, but I also really uncovered like the root of all of this garbage. And it's not to say I don't love the show anymore. I still do,

but I really had this need for people to tell me I was special because nobody did for a long time. And I think that, that really interrupted my life for a long time. Let me ask you this. You, you talked about, um, you know, those 18 years, which is a very long time. Um, and you know, and all the things that happened during that time, right? Like kids and pregnancies and weddings and all those things, uh, vacations and all that stuff. Like, I know that when you're dealing with something like this, it's sort of all encompassing.

do you feel like you were present in your life during those moments at all? Or was it constantly like, did you enjoy your wedding? Did you enjoy your pregnancies? Or like, was the number one thing on your mind always this demon? It lived side by side with everything I did. So I just got used to it. I mean, it's like, if you have an injury, you learn to live with it, right? I mean, so it was always my priority was staying thin, but that was a part of my life that I got so used to that I was able to find a lot of joy in other things, but it lived simultaneously with my anorexia. So anorexia, um, never allowed certain things to happen. So like I could be with my children and I mean,

my family would give me so much joy, but if my children wanted to go out to eat, Like I did what I had to do, you know, so I did what I had to do. And yes, I did have moments of pure joy, but none of them had to do with food. And anytime food came into the picture, um, I was not present. I was, I was very focused on how not to eat. What would you tell that version of you now? Like if you were to see yourself at dinner with your kids or the wedding or whatever it is.

Oh God. Well, I mean, I wasted so much time and I wasted, well, first of all, I taught my children terrible lessons and I will own that. I mean, they watched me for, they're 15 and 13 now. They watched me for a good decade, just really drilling in that thin over everything, you know, and they watched me exercise until I couldn't breathe. And, um, you know, I would, no matter where I took them to eat, I drank water or a Diet Coke.

and I never thought that I thought they were too young to notice. So I never really stopped myself, but God, I would tell myself, first of all, that I was continuing a cycle. That's very dangerous. Um, but also, you know, like nobody really cares. Nobody cares what size I am. The people who love me, love me regardless. Um, and really I would go back and tell myself that this, this could kill you. You know, like, I don't think I ever really stopped to think about what it was doing to my health. You know, I knew it was impacting my health and I go through all those ways in the book. Um, but God, I wish I could go back and, and stop. But then again, I do believe, and I strongly believe this, that there was a purpose that this was my purpose.

It was my purpose for being on the show. It was my purpose for struggling for so long was to tell this story and, and try to help other people. I love it so much. You know, we talk on Lady Gang a lot, you know, and we, we joke with each other at some point about like the body dysmorphia. We live in LA and, you know, Becca has been on TV for, you know, a very long time. And so have I. And, and so, you know, there is that thing of like, we, we talk about that. We don't really know what we look like anymore because, you know, we see ourselves through the lens of like not gorgeous and as beautiful as we probably are because of the standard of Hollywood, if you will. Do you know what I mean? And, and I guess I was

just wondering, like when you go through recovery and you've done all this therapy, do you coming out of anorexia, do you get to a place where you actually look in the mirror and you can see beautiful? Or do you always, is your mind always see fat and you're like, I'm, but that's okay. Like what, what version do you get? Sorry. Does that make sense? Really? Yes, absolutely. Took me a really long time to get to the place where, and I'm, I'm here only for a few months now where I look at myself and I say, God, I love this new body. And I'm not just saying that, but it took me a long time. I was in recovery for a long time before I got to that place. And when you read the end of the book, you'll see that, um, I learned

how to eat, but didn't learn how to love myself. And it was like, everything was just waiting there for me just in case I needed it again. And I, I knew that. And I realized that there was like a pivotal scene at the very end where I realized that unless I start really loving myself, it's never going to really go away. No matter if I start eating, no matter how much weight I gain, it doesn't go away until you really start loving yourself. Um, so, and I know that sounds cliche, but like, it'll all make sense. But now I look in the mirror and I still have those moments where I'm like, uh, like I wish, you know, my abs were nicer or I wish that my arms were a little, you know, less thick, you know, and I, I, but I'd say like most of the time when I look in the

mirror, I'm, I'm really happy with what I see now. And I'm proud of myself. And I actually try to not even derive happiness or sadness from the way my body looks. I try to actually cut off those thoughts when I start looking at myself and I say, it doesn't even matter who cares. My husband adores me. My friends love me. I have great career. Um, so like, what does it matter? You're like a few pounds, who cares either direction, right? So I try to not even pay that much attention to it. And obviously, this comes with having your therapy, I'm sure is how you kind of found that way to love yourself and practice that. But for people who don't know, because we hear this all the time. And it's like the message that for me personally, I'm like,

I want to learn this skill harder than anything else on planet Earth. I know it looks different for everyone but like a little bit of a glimpse into how you got to that place and what you did were there practices that you went through mantras that you said like what did that involve yeah it wasn't really like mantras it was um well it took years it took two i've been in recovery for two years so it took took a long time um i have therapy every single week um for the first year i had it twice a week. That's in addition to my dietitian, my therapist stopped working on any food related issues, like teaching me how to eat stuff. And that was all went to my dietitian. And then my therapist, we really intensely like went back and went through the emotions of what, why I was doing

this to myself. And, you know, I don't know, it's just time. It's a lot of thinking about it. It's, it's realizing what it does to your life when you, um, when you try to gain so much validation from other people's approval. Also at a certain point I realized, and you know, Ozempic had a lot to do with this. I couldn't compete anymore. I mean, like, unless you're going to go on a diet drug, I realized that my body just didn't want to be skinny like that. And I had to starve myself to be skinny like that. And I had to make a choice, you know, I had to make a choice between being a normal size and I'm still like on the thin side. I mean, I still don't eat with abandon. I just eat now like I eat and I'm healthy and I don't exercise the way I used to, you know.

So but I realized that, you know, with everyone getting so thin now, if I'm going to compete with them and I'm going to try, I'm going to it's going to take over my life again. You know, so I had to, I had to stop thinking like that. It's just a lot of time and therapy and really going back and uncover and talking about like the hard parts of your life and what you went through and how it impacted you. um, learning to make boundaries with people. And, um, you know, it's actually like doing things that scare you too. Like there were times when I would, um, you know, someone would say to me, Oh, here, I ordered you this. And like inside, I would say, Oh God, no, why are you ordering that for me? And I, and I would say, okay, thank you. Great. I'm going to eat it. And then I would figure out how to eat it, you know? So, I mean, it's just, it's a combination of just a lot of things, but a good therapist is invaluable. What do you think of the Ozempic craze?

I think it's terrible. Listen, I'm not judging anybody who is on Ozempic because I don't want to shame anybody. People's medical decisions are their own. But I think in general that drugs like Ozempic for people who are not obese and just want to lose some weight are very dangerous. And I think basically that if you think about what an eating disorder is or what anorexia is, is trying to cut off your hunger. And so these drugs basically, I mean, they induce an eating disorder and whoever starts taking them, that's, that's the bottom line. And I know that I'll get shit for that, but they are basically an eating disorder because you're cutting off your hunger. The way I cut off my hunger was to find any kind of fake, horrible food that would

just fill me enough so that I didn't fall over. And Ozempic is basically just tricking your brain into believing that you're full. So what's the difference, right? So I think that these drugs are going to leave an awful lot of people with terrible eating disorders. We don't know the long-term effects. People are hurting their, hurting their health to be thin. And I just think it's setting a terrible example, you know, for, I look at my daughter, she's 13. And I think to myself, like, God, what if, what if she asked me to put her on Ozempic one day? Like, what if she gained some weight and doesn't, and wants to be thin? What if she goes out and gets herself on it? I know if this drug was around when I was 16 years old, goddamn, I would have been the first

person on it. And that's horrifying because it's a life sentence. It really is a life sentence. So what I think about Ozempic, I think it sucks. Thank you for your honesty. No, I love that. This episode is brought to you one of my favorite products, Just Thrive, probiotics, and Just Calm. Let me just tell you, this is a one-two punch that needs to be sitting in your medicine cabinet. If you are listening to Lady Gang right now, and you are someone who's like, I don't take a probiotic every night before I go to sleep. No, nope, nope, nope. And I'll tell you why. Just Thrive Probiotic is the best probiotic on the market. We know this because it has a spore-based technology where it doesn't get eaten by your stomach. It actually waits to

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deal. You know, if you sell me something on Instagram, I buy it. Whoever markets to me does a fabulous job. She talks about the economy. We used to joke that'll be the thing to send them to therapy okay we're creating jobs can we look at it that way she talks about parenting these kids want to come home they don't want to leave they don't want to drive they want to stay in the womb let's talk with heather debrow every thursday on podcast one or wherever you get your podcasts you're listening to the lady gang you said that um housewife saved your life yes it did because i would never have recovered if i was only holding myself responsible because i would wake up probably every like monday and be like this week i'm gonna stop this week

and then i just wouldn't you know like it was just too hard and if i was the only person holding myself accountable it was like i would look at the food and then i'd be like you know what forget it you know and that went on for a really really long time um and I had a like really kind of like a pivotal moment and there were a lot of moments but there was one moment in particular where I was like this like I'm gonna die this has to stop and I remember thinking if I do this on the show i won't let people see me fail not because i was embarrassed of failing because i've done a lot of embarrassing things as you'll read but i didn't want to send that message to anybody who was struggling because i remember when i was very like sick um portia de rossi

wrote a book about her eating disorder while she was on ali mcbeal and i would read i read it like eight times. Did you read it? That was an incredible book. It was, it was amazing. But at the end, I would always search for how she found her way out. And it wasn't there. It was an amazing book. But at the end, she met Ellen, she came to terms with being gay and her life kind of straightened itself out, but that didn't help me. Right. So I was like, well, but just tell me about like how you got there. How'd you get better? Who'd you go see? What did you do? And so I wanted to tell my stories like she did, but I really wanted to give people like a way out and like just a little bit of hope. So when I realized that if I did it on the show, the whole world

would be holding me accountable and Bravo was amazing and so supportive. And so if I, if I didn't have this public platform to really have people not only like holding me accountable, but also cheering me on. I don't, I don't know if I would have done it for myself, you know, but in that sense, the show really did save my life by, by really giving me a public platform to do it on. And I think there are so many of us as women, like reading your book, you don't have to identify with every piece of the story, but I, I can't imagine. I'm sure it exists that there's a woman out there who hasn't had some of these same thoughts done these same things bought these same foods did the same diets like there was so much in there that I was like

oh my gosh and and a tip of the scale no pun intended a lot of us could have ended up as bad as sick as you as you were and a lot of us have people in our lives even that you're watching and it's like watching you in your first season when you were on Housewives of New Jersey I think as a woman you can see especially a woman who struggles you see it in other women and I watched you and it was so heartbreaking because it's very obvious that women are not naturally that thin majority really not they're not it's like like if you're in your 40s and I'm not judging everyone because people have different metabolisms yeah I know that and I am not a doctor I'm not pretending to be, but like when you're really thin in your forties, it's you're, you're probably

cutting too much, you know? But I mean, I guess there are people who have medical conditions and what, but like, you know, it's such a hard line. Cause I was so scared of people saying things to me over the years, but there were times I wished that someone would just be like, Hey, if you ever, you know, you ever want to talk about what you're going through. You ever want, you ever want me to try to help you or find someone to help you, you know, like once in a while, I just wished that someone would do that. But I also, you know, I also scared a lot of people away, but I would shut down conversations.

So, you know, it's a hard line. I don't know. It's these things are so shameful and so secretive. And I mean, I'm sure you read some of the like horrendous things that I did. And even like the freedom meals. Like, I don't know if you made it to that part yet, but like, that's so embarrassing to have to call a meal, like to name a meal, you know, and like just the ways that I would like manipulate food and everything was so shameful and embarrassing that if I could take some of that away, you know, I don't want to sound like a, like a cliche, like I want to erase the stigma, but like, I really do. Like if we could talk about this stuff, I think a lot of people don't realize that eating disorders are not about the food. I mean,

they are a little bit but they're mental illnesses and i'm not embarrassed to say that at all i suffered from a severe mental illness for a long time and thank god i am like better now i'm not all the way recovered by the way i am about 75 recovered i have a lot of fears still with food that i conquer every day i do not move backwards but sometimes i stay still for a while before i can take more steps forward. Yeah. Sorry. No, no, please. But like, that's okay. You know, so I just, you know, I want to let people start talking about this stuff because there's no shame in it. Like it's, I think, I think that, um, the secrecy is killing people. You know, I lost someone last year to anorexia and it went totally unsaid. And at her funeral, a lot of people were

saying, I don't understand what happened. She was so healthy. She loved running. She always watched what she ate. And I just kept thinking to myself, God, you can't see the forest for the trees. Well, yeah, you're right. It's, it's like shrouded. It's so much secrecy. And a lot of it is because like while reading your book, I was thinking so many women are so aware of the problem but they are so afraid to be healed because they are so afraid of not having that willpower and not having that body so it's like the quote you open your book up with if you want to keep a secret you have to also keep it from yourself yeah so there's like a portion of it where you're in denial yourself of it it's like you don't want the awakening you're so afraid of

the awakening coming you have to like buy into it and well also because like if you gain weight in our culture it's looked at as failure like oh you did great for a long time but you know eventually you gave up you know i think it's a really interesting conversation about right now because you know we've been through the last few years and i think it's been quite beautiful the changes that have come in hollywood and the world and you know i i love with like good american they're like we don't do plus size like we're just all sizes and you get a size and you know for the the people in my life, you know, who, you know, have, have different shaped bodies, you know, it's been really nice for them. Cause I think that finally like the culture caught up with like, we're not

all shaped the same. And then we've seen this Osempic thing come in and it's like, everyone who said, I love my curves was actually lying. They didn't love their curves. They were just, I mean, I know that I'm going to get shit for saying this, but it just feels like we got to a place where we're like body acceptance and every size is important and you matter and you're beautiful. And then it was like, ha ha, just kidding. Try to get on Osempib because thin is all that matters again. And like, we've taken such a, you know, a step back. It's such a weird time, you know? I know it really is. And, and I feel like, God, I mean, the timing is so bad on one hand for me and recovery. It's like, um, I go out and like people I used to look at as like

goals for how to eat with enjoyment. I never enjoyed eating. Um, eating for me was merely something that, um, was like impacted your body size. That's it. So I never had enjoyment from food. And, uh, I used to watch people and be like, God, the way you enjoy food and the way you stop eating naturally, you listen to your body. I used to watch them and say, how the do you do that because I was completely separated my hunger and the way I ate were completely different entities and now a lot of those people I go out to dinner with and they're on ozempic and they just you know they take two bites of their dinner and they don't want to eat anymore they don't feel good they just sit there they move the food around and it's weird for me because on

one hand I'm like oh god I should stop eating they stopped eating it's okay for me to stop eating and on the other hand, I have to remind myself, like, I have a healthy relationship with food. Now I don't need to stop eating just because they did. It has nothing to do with me. I'm going to eat until my body tells me to stop eating. And a lot of times I'm the only one at the table that finishes or that actually eats a good portion of their food. So on the one hand, it's really bad timing for me. But on the other hand, it made me even stronger. It made me even more determined to talk about all of this and to really let people know that like thin doesn't mean you're winning at all at all and food is meant to be enjoyed and i'm so i'm really sad actually for people on ozambic

because i'm just now i'm like a child like it's learning how to eat again like there are foods when i tell you that i haven't had since childhood that i am first eating again and some of them i love some of them are not so great but like i'm like a baby learning to eat solids it's crazy And I look at people who are on these drugs and like, great, if they're happy and they love their new bodies, great. I'm not judging them. But I, from where I'm sitting, I'm saying to myself, you're like, are you just never going to enjoy food again for the whole rest of your life?

Is that it? Are you going to be full from two bites? Because I'm in this place now where I'm enjoying food again. And it's, it's unbelievable. It's unbelievable. It really is. I loved that scene when you first, first, first opened up about your struggles on the show where you went and had ice cream with your kids. It was really beautiful. And it was such a moment. Like I have a son who's one and a half and like, I'm gonna cry. i i cry reading that back it's it's that scene for me was so hard but it was so important for

my kids to see and i don't think they understood what was happening like if mommy likes ice cream like why wasn't she eating it all along and like they didn't really like see how significant it was, but they, they knew it when Hudson said, I don't think mom likes it. I know the whole world heard just like a kid talking. I heard in that just one line, like he was waiting to see if I liked it. He needed me to like it because he needed to know that his mom can share this with them and that this is really kind of over, you know, they wanted, they needed me to like it. And I did, I loved it, but like, it was, it was hard for me afterwards. I went home and I had like a little mental nervous breakdown, but you know, my, that scene was really important in my

real life too, but it really was the first bite of something that wasn't on my diet that I ate in, since it all started. Were your kids such a huge part of your recovery? I mean, just that scene was so obvious that that was huge. Yes. I mean, they were in the sense that I was doing it, um, not just for me, but for my family and to break a cycle, um, and also to share joy with them. But in terms of, of talking to them about it, um, no, i didn't get like moral support from them or anything um i didn't you know i i they watched every episode of that season where it concerned food and we would talk about like what mommy's going through after but um they shied away from the subject sometimes but importantly they saw me

eating and as i got better and better and better they saw like really normal things happening you know, I also used to talk, um, I don't talk about this much in the book, but I ate on a schedule. So if we were having an early dinner, I just didn't eat. So all, all of those things went away eventually. And so, um, I know that they saw them and knowing that, that they were watching me made me, um, you know, even more committed to following through. But, um, yeah, it was hard. It's, it's been hard. It's tricky to talk to your kids about this stuff because you don't know the right words, especially my daughter. She's, you know, newly gone through puberty and like her body is changing and I get very nervous about how to talk to her. Um, I actually ask my therapist

for advice all the time because I don't want to say the wrong thing, but I still, I want her to be happy and healthy. And I know that you feel better when your, your body is in shape, but not necessarily thin, but just, you know, I want her to move and I don't want her to overdo it on dessert, but I want her to enjoy food and I don't want to pass on anything. And I'm, I'm still learning how to talk to people about it because in my head, God, there was just so much disorder. You know, I come from a place where I really had this as bad as you could have it. So I feel very qualified to write this book. Um, but I'm, I'm nervous about what I already passed on to her and, and, and my boys, you know, so I, um, you know, my kids, they inspire me every day

and they keep me strong. And if I don't do it for me, I do it for them. But in terms of being moral support, I haven't put that on them. I love it so much. The book, um, is really incredible and I know it's going to be a huge hit. It's just, you know what it is. It's such a quality. And I, I remember, um, uh, the Portia book and what a amazing story that was. Um, but this is, it's just so special and I think it's coming at the right time. And first of all, congratulations to you for two things. Number one, for being, you know, so strong and so in recovery and number two, I think this is episode 650 of lady gang. We've never had Becca Tobin cry on an episode of lady gang like a full wipe away tear so you know the book is good because becca who's

our she's a little bit of our resident you know uh you know devil's advocate did you cry with the sneaker scene in high school oh my god that's your brother like i can't even i did the audiobook last week and like there was a lot of scenes where i cried but that sneaker incident my god crying horrendous and then you talk about your anger and how those boys are gonna get suspended and sit at home and play their nintendo like i just i was like the how you didn't go into a full rage and just but the way you just i just didn't like myself enough to like care that much about anything i was just sad all the time not depressed just like sad i just hated myself so much for a long time and when i tell you that shit lasted my god that it's like these things from your

childhood can really last you know um and i had amazing parents and i had financial security but it's you know you you have these like years where you're just you don't feel worthy of anything and it stays with you you know i also think there's like another another book you need to be writing after this about your grandparents and how their story amazing story the holocaust it really is an amazing story and you're talking about the history of your family and like also the history with food and in israel and and the situation with food over there and i'm jewish and we joke all the time about how like food obsessed our culture is and our grandmother like you didn't walk through her door there wasn't there's just food everywhere and food and and you know it's like it just i

didn't ever think about it that way it was like well this is just how my family is but then you look back at the the generations before and like the trauma surrounding starvation and you're like it's no wonder they over corrected in such a way and unfortunately there's casualties with with both and the way you talk about that and generational trauma it's really it's really eye-opening and and again so beautiful so i hope everybody buys this book and the the the weight of beautiful is the title alone is just yeah incredible the weight of beautiful is on sale it goes officially her pub date is september 26th so you can pre-order right now and if you know anything about lady gang you know we have educated you on the importance of a pre-order when someone

is releasing a book so please go add it to your cart now that's very important you can follow jackie at you already following her but follow her at jackie goldschneider and um you can follow gallery books as well if you want more insight onto the book um we're so so excited for you we'll be thinking of you on september 26th come back so much and also it's not just like an eating disorder book just to put that out there like it's actually like an incredible story and it's got some reality tv in it i mean it is it it has a lot of eating disorder obviously but it's like there's a lot it's like it's actually a fascinating story if you ever want like insight into like the brain of somebody who is like really like obsessed with food I mean it's it's a really

interesting story and it comes full circle in such an organic way that it's you know I hope everyone loves it I love it I think if somebody in your life struggles with this it's actually maybe more important for you to read this because it does get inside the mind of somebody who struggles yeah yeah thank you guys so much i love talking to you i love your podcast and i'm so honored to be on thank you so much thank you so much and let us know how we can help we'll link it we'll put links to the books and everything well we're gonna blow this out bestseller thank you so much guys thanks guys oh becca you're so cute today bye thanks for listening the lady gang is produced by alex ingbert will sterling steve delameter and jared monaco make sure you subscribe

rate and review our podcast and if you love it share it with your friends on social media like oh my god i just listened lady gang this episode's are great swipe up to listen and if you really want to which we know you do please follow us on social at kelty at becca at jack vanek and at the lady gang sign up for our newsletter at the lady gang.com and join our secret facebook group it's super fun see you next tuesday i'm lola and i'm megan and we're the hosts of trust me cults extreme belief and manipulation. We both have childhood cult experiences and we're here to debunk the myths

about people who join them and show that anyone can be manipulated. Our past interviews include survivors and former members of the Manson family, NXIVM, MS-13, Teal Swan, Heaven's Gate, Children of God and the Branch Davidians. Join us every week as we help you spot the red flags. Get new episodes of Trust Me

every Wednesday on Podcast One or wherever you get your podcasts.