Language of Love with Dr. Laura Berman - Nick Cannon: The Mother of All Fathers

Episode Date: June 14, 2023

Unless you’ve been living under a rock for the last few years, you’ve probably heard the name Nick Cannon. From his courageous health battle to his career that continues on a seemingly endless ascent, to the multitude of children he’s fathered through several different women, everyone has an opinion. He’s one of the most enigmatic figures in entertainment, an undeniably incredible talent … and an even more incredible person!  In this Language of Love Conversation, I sit down with Nick as he dispels myths, exposes us to some of the life and love lessons he’s learned along the way, and sets the record straight. We talk about the children and how to the outside it appears reckless, but to him, it’s the manifestation of a vision that at the time it was revealed, even he didn’t quite understand.  Nothing is off limits as we dive deep into his views on parenting, relationships, and the role past trauma plays in his current life. You’ve read the clippings and heard all the gossip, but today you’ll hear from the man himself as I get candid with the one and only … Nick Cannon! Visit my website and check out my books on love, sex and relationships. Be sure to tune in regularly to The Language of Love for great discussions and thought-provoking conversations with accomplished individuals and experts offering invaluable advice on how to love and be loved better.  Nick Cannon Nick Cannon Instagram – Nick Cannon Twitter – Nick Cannon  TikTok – Nick Cannon  Youtube.com – Nick Cannon  About Nick Cannon  Actor, comedian, musician, television and radio personality, Nick Cannon is a man who knows no limits. He’s a source of energy and one whose indelible, creative imprint can be seen etched all across the entertainment world. As he continues evolving and unveiling new layers of his brand, he remains committed to opening doors for those that follow while championing their efforts to make their dreams become reality.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hey, I'm sex, love, and relationship therapist, Dr. Laura Berman. And for the past 30 years, I've been helping people just like you learn to love and be loved better. Here on the Language of Love Conversations, I'm talking to some of the world's most influential and revolutionary experts, thought leaders, spiritual teachers, and celebrities about love, sex, and relationships from a mind, body, and spirit perspective. And that way, my goal is to awaken your mind, body, and soul. It's time to become fluent in the language of love. So, guys, you know who Nick Cannon is. He is a producer.

He is a television host. He's an actor. He's a musician. He's lots and lots and lots of things. A baby daddy. Well, we're going to get into the baby daddy stuff. Don't you worry. yeah that's what i was actually gonna say at the end of your long list what a lot of people know

nick cannon as in addition to all those other things is the mother of all fathers the mother of all fathers i like that because he is he has a lot of babies with quite a few mamas and it has over the past several years it's been a huge area of interest for the media and for popular culture and for late night stand-up comedians and everyone else so and you you and I have known each other I don't know how many years we've known each other now a few years now we met I think first when you were doing your talk show and we've stayed in touch and remained friends I know you like to call me your therapist yes I mean you are I have much much more than that Like, it's not just like I see you every week and give you all my problems.

I feel like someone that really cares. I feel like I'm sort of a love minister. I'll take that. I'll take that. And I've met a lot of your mamas. And I want to get into all of this stuff because, first of all, Father's Day is coming up. To me, this is a perfect time to have this conversation. And we're going to talk about a lot of things.

And as you know, Nick, I do hold your feet to the fire often. Quite often. But I don't think people fully understand, and I want to start here, that you are extremely earnest and well-intentioned and really want to do well in your work and in your community, but especially with your kids and in your relationships. and I think it's easy for people to be cavalier and like oh my god this guy has so many relationships and is having all these babies he must not give a shit about anyone and right but actually I really want to highlight that talking to you and seeing and how tender your heart is and how much you try

you know as you like to say juggling all those knives that you have to juggle at once machete juggler you're a good juggler i mean i was just you walked into the studio and you said i was asking you what you did today you were talking about a television show you're producing and that you have a dinner after this with the hosts of the television show and then you had a call you needed to make to your i guess one of your oldest kids right my oldest son your oldest son who's how old now 12 he's 12 and he's saying hey dad i want to get together with you for dinner yeah right and you just didn't even blink you're like all right i will come we may have to stop off at this work dinner but then we'll go to the grove and we'll hang out and like you just didn't

even blink yeah where a lot of parents wouldn't necessarily make themselves available as readily and as easily yeah yeah that was really kind of cool to listen to no no i mean that's like you said it's just the authentic way that i move i mean my children are my priority throughout my day but i just want to be there for it's funny because it is challenging because you know having 12 children and there's only so much time in a day but i mean it's funny like that's what i'm about to go do after that i'll probably go put you know a few others to sleep you know once i after he and i have dinner and then i just had three of them with me earlier on set you know i have a nursery in my office and yeah which is a good move yeah so like i most likely will see all my children

today all of them yeah because if they weren't they were either in the daycare or you're gonna see i either seen them this morning i woke up with them you know like it kind of it's a nice balance so you wake up with some you see some at work in the daycare you have at work and then you get together with some evening there's going there's bedtime a lot of time i try to set my day where i can actually pick a few of them up from school that are in school so we we do that so that's usually i try to clear everything from like two to four or five so that you can do all the after school stuff yeah yeah and then sometimes there's extracurricular activities like different practices and stuff so depending on the day and how do you do it like when five of them let's say

because all right so let's just discuss the ages because there is a gap right so the oldest two are 12 12 and then golden is golden is six and then and then after him powerful is two but turning three so he's like okay you know she's almost two and a half and then you went on a spree and how many do you have under three uh but no that's not nine because what we got yeah eight eight yeah eight under and there are how many moms that you're six six but Mariah and you are just pure co-parents and friends there's nothing we have two and there's nothing romantic there no okay and then the other five baby mamas are there romantic things with all of them not all of them you know what I mean it varies it varies it comes and goes I've learned that you know it's

probably wiser to or for certain i mean allow them to navigate as well as push their narrative in which how they want to define not say not define it for them yeah that makes sense but uh i'm gonna go with the flow type of guy yeah so all right let me just ask you about father's day okay okay you got all these kids what do you do who do you spend it father's day with like how do you father's day supposed to be for me right yeah so i'll probably it's i'll probably go spend it with my father so not with the kids well i mean i'm i'm being a tad bit facetious but it's actually during that time because i have three of my or four we're counting the twins of i have four birthdays in the month of june wow and that weekend is a birthday weekend as well so things

are balanced out based off of trying to be accessible and available on the actual day wherever but the same way that i balance every day so you'll just make the rounds yeah yeah and you'll work it out between the birthdays and visiting and taking some to maybe with you to see your dad exactly that and yep so it'll just be you know certain time throughout the day for for you know but i said some some dads don't even get acknowledged on father's day so i'm just happy that people want to acknowledge me and spend time with me yeah you know well I mean I think it's important and I think it's you know it's not just you being celebrated but it's that day of celebrating the relationship between you as well and you've talked before I want to talk

about this because I don't think you have to have 12 kids to have I mean certainly compounds it But all of us, I don't know a parent who doesn't feel, certainly not a working parent, who doesn't feel a certain amount of guilt or conflict over how often they see or don't see, like feeling like they can't give their kids enough time or that they're being pulled in too many directions. Yeah. So how do you handle that with so many? I mean, even if they were all living in the house with you, it would be hard. Yeah. And they're living in all these different homes all over the place. I mean, I struggle with the idea of attempting to be everywhere at once.

Yeah. Because one, we know that's impossible. Yes, it is. But I still try to do it. I try my best to make sure that my presence is felt each and every day. And not to compare anybody else's parenting approach, But I'm pretty happy with the ratio in which I can be effective in my children's lives. And I'm also often on set shooting something or out of the country or on the road, on tour.

So even with that, I know there is, like you said, there's that guilt of like, man, I wish I could be there more. But it's not from the negligence of just not making time or being selfish and only focusing on me. like every ounce of my free time is dedicated to my children and what about their mamas that's a whole nother thing well but it all i mean i always say like whoever wants to hang out with me i make myself available yeah yeah i mean but it's also you know if we talked about some of them are are living their best life doing their own thing and don't need me to be as accessible to where someone is like i'm here because of you i'm here to you know make this partnership work and those are the ones that i probably do lean into a little bit more yeah i've noticed that having met men and

not all of them but many of them and here's the thing that i wanted to ask you about and i've you know held your feet to the fire off and on about this so you're non-monogamous you're open about that yeah but what's interesting to me and what i wanted to kind of pick your brain about just understanding your perspective on this is that so each of these women who you are romantically involved with are monogamous with you uh i would like to believe so well that's the plan that's the agreement right i'm not saying they may be i've never made an agreement but also because i get this question quite a bit too and like i said all of i treat everyone like individuals And the conversations are different. Some will say, you know, because of their character, they want to be monogamous. They're not looking for anything outside of what we've built. And they're very content and happy with the scenario.

there's and there's some that tell me that this is cool for the time being and or there's some that you know but i'm not the end all be all then there's some that'll say i really enjoy the co-parenting space and i believe like you're a great parent and this is a healthy co-parenting relationship so i feel like i again as one who goes with the flow i'll take it however however it comes yeah and that actually because i'm in multiple scenarios i can't really argue how one would want to do it so but are you going to continue to because for a lot of them you're financially supporting them you're emotionally supporting them i mean separate from the stuff with your the child you have together i do things for them as well yeah and so if that person who

you are who you are supporting emotionally literally and financially decided that they still want to be in a relationship with you they want all of that but they also because maybe they they want someone that they don't have to share or they want someone that maybe they start dating or maybe they at that point what happens that's all up for discussion yeah i mean i'm but i'm not i'm not like absolutely not it's more because i feel like you have to be aligned and have a healthy balance and allowing new energy into a world in which if our children are supposed to be the focus, I would question like, all right, so you're searching and seeking something for yourself, which you should, but that really doesn't involve our parenting. I mean, as much

as it does, but it's like you wanting to be monogamous or have something of your own with someone else how does that look for you as a mother especially of a mother of an infant or a mother of a toddler or you know as they get older if you're asking my preference yeah I would probably say if that is something someone I'm involved with is looking for I would hope it would happen a little bit later once you've come into your own of what our parenting infrastructure looks like so once the child's a little older or even yet or we got it under we got it understood because if we're still figuring out how to raise this child in this unorthodox situation and then you enter it's already complex yes with my world and then you bring another outside energy that

doesn't like i don't know this person i don't know their motives i don't know if they're excited to I like why are they so into you when they already know that you are the mother of my children you know I mean the same way that I look at when people want to be in my life and they know I'm like I'm skeptical I'm like do you love me for me or is this because you want publicity or you want to you're intrigued or they just want your sperm because all right yeah you have very magical sperm that swim very well you said it not me doc i they it's magical nick cannon has magic sperm that there's there's the headline that's what we were looking for nick cannon has magical sperm but that's the thing that's where i get skeptical because i don't i mean i barely trust myself so i

definitely don't trust another man yeah so i'm like why is he here yeah and that's like if someone want what if you know the conversation is oh i just want to be promiscuous because you're promiscuous and you out in these streets i'm out in these streets right that's another conversation yeah that's i'm like all right well as a as a mother who's probably got primary custody of our children yeah and you know you're going out two three times a week you know i'm gonna probably be a little concerned you know just based off of all right well like then we need to figure out this exchange because rightly so you have every right to sow your wild oats and all of that but then i would probably start questioning all right well we got ourselves into this on a certain

agreement and now this is taking us in a different direction so you kind of agree with them there's like a plan in place right and i've noticed because you know a few of them that i've met were working before or their own careers and doing things and many of them not all of them but many of them stop working to have their baby right as they should yeah and they you need that time and they're taking a year or whatever off to be with the baby and you are supporting them and you also i've noticed support they during that time it seems like from our conversations because I talked to you and them together that they're starting to like think okay if I could do anything I maybe go back to school maybe start a business maybe and you kind of help them

develop their dreams and you set them up I like that I mean I think I'm a I'm a generator and like people plug into me at every capacity not just the mothers of my children I mean I am, too, by the way. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm a generator. Generators. Like, I think I like when. That's human design.

Yeah, I like when I can help people. I like if I can help you make your dreams come true, even with my children. Like, regardless of what you, your opinions of my lifestyle or how this is, one thing that cannot be negated is that all of my children will have opportunities, privilege, and abilities to do whatever they want in life. Aw. so there's not there's not if you want to be a neuroscientist let's figure it out let's yeah let's start now let's figure out how to get you on the best academic plan because you want to be a brain doctor yeah if you want to be an actor like let's figure out what we have to do obviously there's some so there's some nepotism there there's some doors i could probably open and

strings i could pull if you want to be an athlete let me you're financially set up to be able to get the best trainers and the best diets and the best process. So there's nothing on this planet that I can't say, allow me to assist you in your dream and your goals. And I say the same thing to the mothers of my children. Like, yo, you want to start a business? You want to go back to school? Like, yeah, because a lot of them are starting businesses and going back to school and doing differently. Live your dream. Like if I can help you live your dream, let's do it. Yeah. listen regardless of your sexual orientation or your gender or your relationship status every single one of us has struggled at one point or another with a lackluster or disconnected sex life

or difficulty finding the partner that we most desire so i have designed an amazing program for you seven days to better sex each day you're going to get a video and an information packet all designed to help you jumpstart your love life. Just go to www.drlauraberman.com. Well, the place where it seems to get tricky is that for many of these women, and granted, they have little babies, they're feeling hormonally vulnerable. There's a lot that happens when you have a baby, right? And you feel overwhelmed. I mean, you know that better than I after all these babies, right? But for these women that I'm thinking of, and it's certainly not all of them i would say maybe it's three of them i'm guessing i don't know all of them

you are their world like their entire yes you are their entire focus emotionally i mean not that they don't have maybe they work or maybe they whatever but they are completely focused on their relationship with you they are devoted to you and the baby but they're devoted to you and where i see you getting into trouble again and again is you're individually devoted to each of them but or that you're involved with you're devoted to all your children right but with the women you're devoted to them but that is divided you know what i mean yes i hear what you're saying so like i don't know if they would all agree with you in that statement though i don't know i don't know what i'm thinking the two i'm thinking of i don't know that i don't know if they but even if

they were sitting here i don't know if they would say nick is my world yeah i know that you are their world they don't say that but they would probably say their children are their world or they have their own things i think that might be even a tender spot yeah because i don't think anyone wants to admit that someone else is their world well i don't mean their entire universe i mean they're romantic emotional like or like you said i'm probably the only person that they're involved yes and they're totally and fully committed to that there's a few there's a few that even call me their man yes and they get flack for that yes in the world and social media like that ain't your man he everybody's man yeah well that's true that's what i'm saying you are

not everybody's man but you are they call me community dick doc i don't like that term but i am a man of the community um community activist one of them told me that you definitely dickmatized that's a term that you've introduced me to dickmatized and one of them says sometimes i have them dick lusional i think you do i mean because you are really sweet and loving and attentive but it gets tricky like i've seen it it gets tricky when one of them wants you right i need you right now i'm feeling overwhelmed i need my man i want him to come cuddle me i want him to come be with me i want him to spend 24 hours with me i want to go away on a vacation and we do those things right

but not when she needs it necessarily or wants then that's interesting and like you said that's where it gets tricky yes and not to play anyone else's world or compare traditions and but as a man as a provider as and i've heard this in you know monogamous scenarios that if you're looking for a man to be a provider yeah and a lover he can't be both at the same time no but he has why he's out providing right he's not going to be able to be home yeah loving and comforting but why he's loving and comforting he's also yeah and me being the superhuman that i believe that i am my uh narcissistic approach of myself i believe i probably can do both more than most you definitely can i don't know how the hell you do it but the difference between what

you're in versus the monogamous traditional whatever relationship where someone is either in provider mode or and isn't going to be available to you for that nurturing yeah home nurturing but let's say you have 20 but like kids come first then work yes okay so now let's just pretend i'm making this number up uh-huh you have 20 of your week available for nurturing right right the women yes and how does that break down well that's where i see you get into trouble that's what i do get into trouble in that space yeah because even like dedicating 20 percent of one because at no point did we say there's time for me yeah right which is also a huge issue and like that's my you know sometimes i'll just disappear yeah because i'm like yo i need to recharge if i'm the generator

i gotta go recharge so everybody who's plugged into me sleep maybe yeah exactly and that's where I might at some times get irritable and I get to my spaces. I'm trying my best. Yeah. And my best isn't enough. And then that's when it's like, well, see, that's where I think the agreement has to be clearer with it personally. This is me. You know me. I'm always telling you my opinion. Right. But this is where I think the agreement needs to be clearer. And maybe you do make this clear and they're like, yeah, yeah, it'll be fine. But the reality of it isn't really fine. Right. Like, they think it'll be fine, and it isn't. But, like, I have heard you say that, and I know for a fact you are doing your best.

Right. I know you're doing your best. Yeah. But to these women, when they really need you and want you to just, like, they just, okay, it's fine to be non-monogamous. Okay, I get that you have all these other children and responsibilities and relationships, but I'm having a really hard time right now, and I need you. And you are doing your best to be there for them. but because you have these other spread so thin and you know and it's not even just because that's one thing i don't i don't know if it's necessarily happened to where maybe during pregnancy times

to where i was needed at one space and i was actually with another like i couldn't make it because this one needed yeah and i don't believe that's happened that doesn't happen often right One, I'd have to say, you know, I have to commend and celebrate and salute them for being so understanding. They are so understanding. Because they don't have to be. Woo-wee, are they understanding. Yeah, they don't have to be. And usually, for whatever reason, it's God or whatever, I usually have enough time to cater to the needs.

We're not going to mention any names or any details. But recently, you and I, I was talking with you and one of these wonderful, by the way, guys, I mean, I'm sure you know this because you probably see the images, but every single one of these women are gorgeous, intelligent, like bright, accomplished, have everything going for them. I mean, I know how to pick them, doc. Yeah, you do. And they know, I mean, they're picking your genes and you're picking theirs and you're making these babies, which I wanted to ask you about that too, but I'll put a pin in that. so we were talking to this with one of these women and my heart like i was feeling so i was feeling her pain right because she there was something going on you know nothing serious but

kids get you get these scares with them or these weird symptoms or whatever right and so one of the babies or maybe you're i don't know how many babies you have together but your baby together was having some health concerns. Yeah. And she needed you emotionally. She knew you were going to show up. And I was willing to be there physically. Yes.

But I don't know if I was available at the level that she needed me to be. And you had to stop. She was focused on you coming over. Let's make up a time. And going together. And going and helping. Because she needed that.

As opposed to meeting. Yes. At the appointment. And at the last minute, another baby needed something. Because another baby, you had a health concern. You needed a prescription. Yeah.

And so you, being the father, right? The kids come first. You went and you're like, okay, I could do both. Right. I'm going to go get the medicine. But she needed you. And because of past trauma and triggers of me not being there. Yes.

I probably was looking like I wasn't prioritized. Yes. And they all have wounds or several of them. Yeah, because I fuck up all the time. around not feeling like they are and no and my fuck-ups usually are because just of like malpractice like what do you mean like i just being a dumb man like i didn't do what i said i was gonna do i forgot to call or you said i was one person's mother's day oh yeah like i do dumb shit like okay i try to write handwritten thoughtful mother's day cards and they get

switched up yeah which i by the way feel somewhat responsible for not the switch up yeah but we had just had we just had a conversation with another one who was saying i don't want the same mother's day words that you give at the same flowers and the same card so i said okay i'm gonna do individual and look where it got me switched up the damn cards and sent one mother's day card to one and then the fact that i talked about it was even more gut-wrenching because it's like oh now i'm like a comedy bit on your morning radio oh my god she's not the comedy bit but you are i'm the comedy of errors i'm the bumbling idiot that was a bad one my life is like literally i'm the black larry david it's like yeah curb your enthusiasm like the thing that you think will happen actually

does happen and worse and worse and so you mess up that way yeah but i mean again i'm trying my best so it's not so it's never not there's nothing ever manipulative or vindictive but things happen things fall through but then then they feel shafted or unattended or disrespected but they're very forgiving because they love me and i love them yeah i think at the end of the day and we have children together and we love our children and we're in this there's no running at this point where you gonna go yeah like we're in it and others are gonna have opinions we can have opinions but at the end of the day this is the challenge that we've accepted okay so i'm gonna ask you something that i've always wanted to ask you but i haven't had the balls to ask really yeah which is strange

you ask me everything i do i ask you everything but this feels like a question you haven't been asked before but it's something i've always wondered about all right hit me with it okay so you're a very spiritual man i know that yes and you've had many experiences i think a lot over the past several years where you had these moments where you go you commune with spirit yes right and you get downloads and you get messages yeah did god i don't know what you what do you call spirit god okay so so you've had the you know like many of us i have conversations with god too i get downloads in different ways we all do yeah but you've shared with me that you've had deep moments when you're in the woods or in the desert and where you're really going into that

connection with one yeah with oneness yeah so did god tell you to have all these babies you know what because i got in trouble about this too before because i would say like because people would ask me am i done and i was only god can let me know when i'm done because as much as i was open to every single child that i had i can't say the majority of them were planned yeah they weren't so if i look back if i looked at my life you know if you would have told me in 2012 when i was still married and really just diagnosed with lupus that 10 years from now or 12 you know because it's 2023 now that i would have 12 children i'd be like fuck out of here like there's no way in the world that i would say i would ever plan that or that i would even think

out what happened but in those moments of communing with spirit i have one and again a lot of people say oh like don't he's having all these kids because he's been on his deathbed before he doesn't know tomorrow i can attest because a lot of these moms i mean you do have freaking magic sperm because several of these women have been full-on birth control yeah and got and gotten pregnant yeah and like not wanted to get pregnant yeah and have gotten pregnant so i can't say i mean i lend that type of stuff to god like those are miracles told you that this is part of the plan because i feel like you've had that conversation yeah like like but now it's almost like when you have these manifestations or even these visions if that's what we want to

call them i'm like oh it all makes sense now because you get them in pieces or they're fragmented yeah and so is it like the father abraham conversation supposed to be like you're gonna be the father of many nations yes yes that's what i've never heard that clarity but i heard that like yo you're gonna be a father of many there's gonna be your great influence your lineage your offspring are gonna do great things like i've had that and i'm like oh well the more the merrier we roll the dice to to the name and and what you will build i've had the the vision that my name will be as great as like the rockefeller name yeah and when you think of like you know john d rockefeller and even his father like what they built for you just even not just you know american

culture but global culture and they and did they have 10 or 12 kids yeah a lot rockefeller had a lot of kids yeah and a lot of them weren't legitimate but he did have a lot of legitimate calculating route to avoid seeing poverty turn left to bypass the unhoused youth sleeping on the street then keep right to skip by the lines of people waiting for food steer clear of the crowded shelter turning people away then take the next exit let's stop looking away and get in the way of rising poverty your donations help the united way fight poverty in thousands of ways like providing food, shelter, and crisis prevention. Donate today at unitedwaygt.org.

So you have gotten that message that your lineage is going to serve the world. Yeah, and I'm careful even how I talk about that because I don't like to say, like I don't use the term legacy anymore. Lineage, I'm comfortable with. Why don't you say legacy? Because legacy is about what you do,

not what you produce. Ah, okay. My children hopefully will have their own legacy. yeah yeah what did you mean to the world if my legacy was to have children no it's not a not impressive i want my legacy to be someone who did for others someone who built hospitals and education facilities and left literature and content to where you say wow he was a he was a thinker he was a doer he cared about people that's your legacy yeah now my lineage that is my offspring that is you know my my dna and spreading my genetic seed yeah yeah

the gang is caught like even we think like gang is caught someone like that his legacy like gang is caught no but they i've been compared the modern day gang is caught but his legacy was one of a warrior yeah and we're considering or regard you know guarding what side of it you're on some look at him as a great person some look as a tyrant and a evil person but he's in every one of our gene pools yeah we're all related to him we're all related to uh and everyone in the world is one day going to be related to nick cannon that's what they said they did this funny national geographic meme there's like in 2000 uh i think it was in what was it like 2250 everyone will look like this and it's just different variations that was funny like

different versions of nick cannon so i mean there's enough dna out there but uh i mean i don't know like lineage is something that you are supposed to be proud of yeah uh but legacy i think you got to separate legacy and lineage and so right now you have there was this big la times article talking about your work and your net worth and whatever else yeah and i know you have your own production company your exec i think you're an executive producer of the mass singer yeah yeah executive producer mass you star in and you also host it you star in tons of shows you're obviously making bank yes but i'm investing in things that i also live every day i have a diaper company called incredible diapers i'm one of the investors and owners and other the new resurgence

of toys are us oh yeah yeah so we're doing you know in that space we're not only just making toys but content as well yeah that's so i feel like yo that's my world like obviously i used to be the chairman of nickelodeon and ran the teen nick team division so and that was i mean i had few kids then but now now it's like i'm turning i'm making them i'm it's a factory over here we're making products content we're doing it all yeah you are like a factory and you're also i think you told me that you are getting some sort of certification or degree in child development well that's now like because you know i went from 2016 to 2020 i went and got my degree in criminology from howard university i don't think anyone knows that yeah it was like a big story for

a moment but i think everybody thought it was like this gimmick like a rodney dangerfield one for my children at the time my oldest i wanted they i was always an advocate for education always and they're like dad well you didn't even go to college and i was like well watch me yeah and i had a little free time because i took a break off a morning radio for some time due to health and i was like well i'll take that same amount of time and go get a degree and it just so happened to be during a time where there was like a lot of social activism going on so i dove really deep into like facilities of incarceration and you know the criminal justice system and doing a lot of work in penitentiaries and with juveniles so it made it the stuff that

seemed like doing research and papers on it was like i was living this life so it was the work i was already doing i just had to organize it so that was interesting and so now in the same sense i was already going to get a master's in psychology and a phd in divinity because religion is something super intrigued by and i was doing the work already yes you are so then i shifted instead of just a master's in psychology now it's more in child psychology because yeah that'll come in handy yeah so and because i'm in that conversation every day yeah like oh the presence of a father and how much are you going to be and how much will they need you and the freudian aspect of like reverting back to your childhood trauma or the lack thereof and you know nature versus nurture

like these are conversations i have several times every single day i mean like with naysayers or with the mama not naysayers but i'm like i'm living yeah you are like whether in you know therapy of my own or even just like wanting to make sure that every single child has what they need developmentally yeah yeah and emotionally and even you know i'm i'm studying the brain and at what point does sensory matter and experience you know this is what i mean guys he really is you're very thoughtful and well-intentioned. Yeah. Like core memories and establishing those and things that may seem to be over the top, but you know, time that like, okay, you'll never forget that, that experience and traveling the world with my children. How many languages can

they speak and spirituality? Like all of these things matter. And so how are you going to, cause one of the things you've shared with me many times, and I know you're pretty, you know, You would, in your dream world, regardless of whether you're romantically involved or not romantically involved with the mothers, all your children will know each other. All your children will come together. They're all canons. You'll all go on trips together or go on outings together. But they're, that hasn't. They'll probably go to the same schools.

But that hasn't really, because, you know, some of the mothers are holding out on that. Yeah. I mean, again, one thing, as much as that may be a wish of mine, I got to respect that that's not a wish of everyone else. Yeah. That would make things so much easier for you. If they could just all come over for Father's Day, how good would that be? I think that will get there. I think one thing I've witnessed some of my elders in the game, once the children get of age to make their own decision, that naturally happens. I've seen that too. Yes, I have definitely seen that. Yeah. So when once or. Because they're currently under their mother's jurisdiction, I kind of play by mom's rules. Yeah. But once they can make their own decisions, I would hope and pray that we've established a strong enough relationship that they're going to want to come hang out.

Yeah, I can tell the 12 year old was calling you up to hang out. Yeah. And so I'm a cool dad. you are the cool dad nick but so with your kids obviously i'm assuming the twins yes the 12 year old twins the oldest twins yeah back to the magic sperm yes so the oldest twins know and you've had conversations about your lifestyle yeah we're very open you're very open with each other yeah do any of the other kids have you had i mean obviously many of them are too young i think right now is the time to start having and this is you know this has been a family debate about when to have the full and honest discussion with the six-year-old and how do you how are you genius yeah he is smart how are you going to tell him how would you want to tell him

if you were to have that conversation with him what would you say i think because one i think he's kind of already figured it out yeah i mean he knows he has other siblings even within his own household he's not an only child and then you know he has he knows about his older siblings and he's been around the young he's been around them yeah just no one talks about it nobody's like yo this is it hasn't happened like yo this is your brother or your sister yet and i think the school that he's in i think he's he sees he's on the internet and stuff so he knows that his dad is known for having a lot of kids and he's never asked you about it not yet so i think the time is now yeah so we're before another kid at the school says hey your daddy yeah yeah but i think

he's it's not going to be a difficult like what would you say i'm just curious what you would say to a sick you probably i would be like yo you know your dad or or you know daddy already has a lot of kids and you're special and i appreciate our bond and things but i also have you know other relationships that have produced other children that i love dearly as well and i would ask him how he feels about that yeah and then we would have because i had to have that conversation with you know my 12 year olds and it wasn't like yet well no part of it was like yay i have all these other siblings yeah but then it was like oh what about me yeah where do you know and it was even you know my oldest daughter is like well you love me the most right and i was like all right

well let's let's have that conversation you are my firstborn so you are unique and you find something that you can have that's just there just theirs i think every child wants that yeah but i also believe there's probably going to be some feelings that they may not even share with me right away they're like man i wish i was this or i wish i would have had a different scenario or different upbringing so and when those things are brought up we deal with them yeah and by the way you could not have 12 kids and you're gonna have those you know if you have two kids and a monogamous relationship take it from me they will share lots of ways in which you've screwed them up regardless Yeah. And that's one thing that I've understood. By no means do I sit here on tape or audio or in front of cameras and act like I got it all figured out. I mean, that's one of the reasons why I try to sit and talk with you as often as possible and other professionals that say, man, this is different. This is challenging. This is unorthodox.

And like you said, even with one child, there's going to be complexities. There's going to be things where I might operate out of ego or I might say something that I didn't really mean. Or you get triggered and your abandonment issues, which you did. My own abandonment issues. Do you admit, do you acknowledge now at least after, because you were having some trouble, you kept fighting me when I told you you had abandonment issues. Yeah, because it sounds like a bad term. it's not i had a you know i i have abandonment issues but i think and under the guise that we all have a band okay fine nick we all i will accept that nick doesn't have any more abandonment

issues than anyone else but i probably do because i was raised in an unorthodox scenario and yeah there's probably been times where i remember that little boy waiting for daddy or mommy or you know being what do they call when you're moved around a lot not a latchkey kid like a kid that was moved around moved around quite a bit so I learned how to love in the moment and compartmentalize my love and there was probably as a kid big disappointments that even at the time my my parents or grandparents weren't aware of but it was just like oh man I really wanted that I was really hoping this happened oh how much would I have loved to see both of my parents and growing up events or in a household but all the times they said they were going to show up and

didn't show up yeah you know or times but that happens i mean right and sometimes and that's where i said i have to accept that i'm not going to be able to be at every single yeah baseball game every single baller there you got to show up yes 99 yeah and if you don't show up you have have a really good reason you have to be able to articulate that to your children why you weren't able to make it yeah and make it up to them somehow yes so there's gonna be a lot of that in my life yeah and hopefully long as i put up the effort and don't become negligent then we should be fine long as they know that daddy is trying his best and operating out of love all the time i think the kids will be totally fine with that the ones that struggle are are some of the

mamas and and when i see you and that's their parents problem not mine i didn't make them that way no but you do have to deal with it and i do see that the times that you get triggered into getting angry or feeling frustrated or wanting to go and just like you know because i i run yeah you run i i just leave i'm a runner i'm a track star i try to avoid conflict at all times and then i go be by myself and you get really really so it's back to you i this is your like nick cannon is doing his best right like that's what you really need understood and what i see is when your best isn't good enough well then forget it yeah which then of course makes everything i evacuate yes because then until i talk to you and then you say you gotta go home

you have to deal with this don't run from the problem do it yes and then it always gets better right it does but it's when you run but my instinct is to yeah it's like i don't want to deal with this and it really hurts you yeah like it's not you're not doing it out of like screw i mean you act like that you act like screw this because but i feel their pain i'm empathetic to what they're like i don't want to see them hurt i don't want to hurt and you're the reason they're hurt yeah so then i'm blaming myself i get down on myself oh boo boo what happened so i think it's really interesting because in many ways a lot of men would would father 12 children maybe not having relationships maybe even while in a monogamous relationship on the side yeah on the side in

secrecy all these secret babies and that happens every single day i think there are thousands upon thousands upon thousands of men out there with 12 children we just know about two of them and the difference here is that you're not only owning it but i watch you you really do your best and you do pretty damn well given how much you work and how many women you're involved with you show up for them and even if you can't show up for them physically you show up for them on the phone you let them know you care you're involved in their lives you let them know you're interested you let them know you love them and you really want to understand and give them not only the best opportunities with whatever their dreams are but to really give them the infrastructure

that they need to follow their dreams do I mean at the core just like that's where I feel like God put me on this planet to actually try my best at accomplishing everything you just said. And so I'll ask you the question that you get asked a million times. You say it's in God's hands whether you're having more. I don't, I mean, I don't know. I really don't.

I mean, one, I'm getting up there. Like I'm a man that'll soon be in his mid 40s. Well, listen, look at- Robert De Niro and Al Pacino. Yes, in their 80s. They are inspiring me. Yes. Oh, my gosh.

By 80, you'll have 50 kids. Oh, wow. But, I mean, they'll be spread out. So, as long as everyone's happy. So, there's no vasectomy in your future. There's no. You never know. That you know of.

I mean, there's. I've definitely contemplated deeply about, you know. Because this is what I will say. I no longer want to be careless. Okay. I want to be a lot more intentional with life. and even especially when dealing with creating life yeah because i love all my children but i probably wasn't intentional i was kind of like oh if it happens amazing right god's miracle

we're now one i have 12 yeah you know so everything for no matter how much money you make and no matter you know you can't buy time no so i want to be intentional in all of their lives currently and i don't want to spread anyone else any thinner than they already are so with that if i do have more children it will be very intentional and the timing will be the best timing that i believe it should be but the other ones will be a little more there won't be any more accidents yeah or oops or what are these other terms that people use uh where they're just unplanned or surprises yeah yeah they won't although there might be because your boys can swim as you say i have magical sperm yes you love that and some but i'm being more intentional with

even my practice the celibacy thing that never worked no that did not work very well we tried that for how many months did that last they last like three months and then like eight kids came after that whole sabbatical you saved up all the magic yeah it's like don't do that again that's like when you like hold back a well or like a geyser yeah and it's like then you let the damn break in the leverage yeah no more celibacy yeah that doesn't work but one of the things that you know this is a theme of this whole conversation and all of our conversations and it's actually a change i've noticed over the years because you didn't used to be this way or as much not as much this way the buddhists will say that suffering comes because we are either living in the past

or we're living in the future right we're thinking in the present and every time we're talking about these issues or with many of the questions i've asked you you're like i will cross that bridge when we come to it right like whether it's with the women i don't have a story about how they were going to be or how i should be or what should happen we're just going to roll with it we're going to see what happens and we're going to deal with it when we come with the children we're going to deal with it when we come and i think that is the healthiest way to keep your peace and to and it's the only thing that's real i mean i always said that the only thing that's real is right now moment yeah because everything in the past we're making shit up and we have no idea what's going

to happen five minutes from now yeah so the only thing that's real is right now so let me just end with this question then because i know you have you're going to be a rockefeller right yes so the canon name will live on forever so you have tons i mean i've taught you you tell me all the you have a million ideas yes how do you balance living in the present because i was asking you i was telling you i really see in your future a ministry of sort now then they'll think it turned into a cult no you're not he's not a cult leader but i mean like you're not kanye yeah like kanye tried to do on sunday which was a beautiful thing sunday service and jason white and all those people yeah but i think because i grew up in settings like that yeah was very

organized and i would even say judgmental yeah no this wouldn't be that yeah religiously i flee from that naturally because people talk about that all my life they were like oh you're gonna be a minister no i don't see that i see you doing something with music and spreading love and spirituality and so when i said that to you you were like yeah that's definitely like that's something i think about and i said so when are you going to do that and you're like i don't remember how you put it but the message basically was god will tell me when it's going to happen right so is that how you approach all of your career plans yes or creations because i've had so many ups and downs and a lot of disappointments of things that like you i am a control freak and

And I've had to learn to let a lot of that go because there's so many blessings that come when you allow source to flow. Whatever's going to happen, yeah. And I used to be like, oh no, this has to drop this day and this has to come out this time. And then it never happens the way that you want it to.

So you can still be a director and a navigator, but allow the ocean to drive you. So it's like, I just got to steer the ship. So in that, I have great visions. I know I have manifestations. i know these things will occur yeah but it's like oh it's time is man-made yeah so when whenever when it literally positions itself i don't care yeah i know it's gonna happen that is really guys i want you to listen to that because that's what i'm always teaching about manifestation is that

you set the intention you understand that it's gonna happen the seed is germinating beneath the ground even though you don't see it and you don't know when it's gonna break through and you don't know when it's gonna blossom yeah right and so you literally and figuratively are planting poop tons of seeds yeah yeah that's that's really what it is your magic sperm yeah i plant seeds and i watch them i water them often and but i don't sit like they always say like you know have you ever watched a tree grow yeah it's the most frustrating process ever yeah you just gotta put the seed in the ground and nurture it nurture it and don't put it on man's clock yeah just let it happen and you you might have planted a mustard seed you might have planted like what's the one that is the

one that like doesn't look like it's gonna there's a certain type of plant like you put in the ground it's like it doesn't sprout ever and then overnight it's a boom it's i think it's bamboo I think so. And it can be a lotus that has to grow through mud and adversity before it's going to blossom. So you're just you're a seed planter. I plant seeds, including sperm seeds. Yes. But literal seeds, too. And the fertilizer will do what it does. Yes. The magic sperm fertilizer. yeah so see i feel like every time we have conversations in public it's often like you asking me a lot of questions yeah you got to come on my podcast where i get to ask you i want to

anytime we're gonna dive into quantum love anytime because i live by that book man i want to break it down i have so many questions all right i'm ready yeah we usually talk about it on your shows where we have three minutes yeah no like i need to i need one of these sessions so you got to come on cannons class all right and then we will sit down and we'll i'm gonna hold you but i'll let this one air first yeah i you know and so the part you'll be competition our next part will be me interviewing you about quantum love and i'll be like you and say nothing's off limits and then i'll dance around the question but mine is more from like an intellectual academic approach like how did you come up with this theory yeah all right i won't be prying into like i know your family i

don't want to talk about them so you do you walk you saw my kids building legos legos yeah they're dope so but no but like i really wanted like some of your philosophies i'm intrigued by and even like even now dealing with like spirituality and how does one who has a very clinical entry point now like master quantum love and teach it and still have to you have to walk in both worlds yes i do mostly i walk in the quantum world though that's where i enjoy to be so is it like so all of the stuff that you learned in like no it's all i say that and we'll talk about that i don't want to get too much into me because i'm focused on you but basically i work in both the logistical and quantum field at the same time yeah i think it is the dude wrote this book called proof of

heaven you read it yes even alexander yes he opened up a lot for me yeah because i was like oh you can have a scientific approach but there's also a lot of things that he had to let go yes once he stepped into the spiritual well you have to let go of needing because scientists prove everything proof right and with quantum love i wrote that book with my husband who is senior proof in mind yeah i don't even know i have to ask him if he ever even read it he read parts of it but i wrote it with because he i wanted all the data and all the science and he needed it to be as matter of fact yeah and backed up yes but lots of what i know absolutely to be true and have learned in practice is definitely true cannot be proven by today's science yes so you have to be

willing to walk in today's science is so fluid yeah it's really like even you can have the proof in the back like you know where i want to go and i like i'm really dying to go to like the monroe institute yes it's a scientific institution about spirituality yeah or the or the institute of noetic sciences yeah that would be a good one let's take some field trips yes let's do it all right nick cannon thank you for being a miraculous rockefeller worthy planter of seeds in the world i receive it you're welcome doc thank you for having me with your digmatizing magic sperm thank you i wonder what part of this i wonder what part of this whole conversation is going to go viral like what's the headline magical sperm it's maybe one yeah we did digmatize

already we went viral with that one we'll see we'll see what or if i probably misspoke and said something that people are gonna well they'll take it out of context but that's one of the things i love about you is that you don't worry about that shit no because then we get to have like if anyone actually takes the time to listen to our conversation like if we get if we get a few just to say let me see what they're talking about yeah oh he does he's not he's not a demon he's a You're a good, good guy. Like I always tell you, you're unbelievably adorable and lovable. Even though I'll never be your baby mama, I don't intend to, I definitely understand.

Thank you. Your husband's a good man. We're family. We would never cross paths. No, but I understand how irresistible you can be to these women. And they're amazing women. Yes, they are. Kudos to you.

Shout out to them. Let's end it just applauding and celebrating these women that put up with me. With the patience of saints. Yes. And they're gorgeous. It's not me. I'm not doing anything amazing. They're the amazing ones.

Yeah. You're just giving them hell. Yeah. And babies. Yeah, exactly. Thank you. No problem. Thank you.

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