Language of Love with Dr. Laura Berman - The Sacred Wait: When Desire Meets Devotion with Sohale Sizar

Episode Date: June 4, 2025

What does it mean to wait for love—not out of fear, but from deep, spiritual conviction? In this extraordinary Language of Love Conversation, we meet Sohale—a man who, at 32, has never been physically intimate with another person. Not because he’s afraid of love, but because he reveres it. For Sohale, sex isn't casual—it's sacred. A union of energy, soul, and spirit. And he’s been saving himself for that. But the story doesn’t begin (or end) there. It started in childhood—with a mystical calling, a boundary-crossing pediatrician, and a little boy who learned to transform trauma into prayer. And it continues today—as Sohale navigates the modern dating world with ancient longing, tantric wisdom, and unwavering faith that the right soul will meet him where he stands. Here’s What We Cover: How a sexually abusive pediatric exam shaped Sohale’s sensuality—and his lifelong relationship with spirit How Sohale discovered fusing  sexual energy with prayer from a young age How gratitude (and a simple email trick) became the emotional lifeline in his darkest hours The unexpected power of tantric self-practice—and how it helped him heal What it means to look for a partner not just with a body, but with a soul attuned to divinity Try Sohale’s Soul app—where spontaneous gratitude meets spiritual practice. Whether you're drawn to Sufism, Tantra, Kabbalah, or Kriya Yoga, there’s a 30-day soul path waiting for you. Use code: 30DaysOnMe at https://www.bringsoul.life/ Got thoughts? Stories? Or a tantric soulmate for Sohale? Email me at [e-mail] And if this moved you—share it. Healing becomes sacred when we do it together. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hey, I'm sex, love, and relationship therapist, Dr. Laura Berman. And for the past 30 years, I've been helping people just like you learn to love and be loved better. Here on the Language of Love Conversations, I'm talking to some of the world's most influential and revolutionary experts, thought leaders, spiritual teachers, and celebrities about love, sex, and relationships from a mind, body, and spirit perspective. and that way my goal is to awaken your mind body and soul it's time to become fluent in the language of love so hale thank you so much for joining us on the language of love it's so good to be with

you here so i have lots of things i want to talk to you about now full disclosure so hale and i met at a mutual friend's, I guess it was kind of a New Year's party, right? Yeah. Yeah, that was it. And he's got this very magnetic personality framed in this humble demeanor. And you were kind of holding court. And it was really fun to hear more about your story. And we started talking about a lot of the themes that we're going to get into today. And then I just got really excited to share you with my peeps because a lot of us here are obviously seeking to love and be loved better, but we cover a lot of the mind, body, and spirit perspective. Everything's covered

from a mind, body, and spirit perspective. So you really have embodied that for most of your life and certainly in your work. So I want to start with your history because I just think it's really interesting, especially you as a young child. One of the things I think you told me when we were speaking was when you were really little, like a toddler, very, very young, you announced that you wanted to be a prophet. That's what you told your parents. Is that true? Am I remembering that? Yeah, I can't. Wow. I really shared a lot on that dinner party. What was in those drinks? i tend to have that effect on people yeah not like i'm not an open book too but well yeah so what ended up happening you're right good memory basically when i was growing up i was

about five my parents before going to bed they'd read me stories and often it was the stories of prophets saints luminaries like i distinctly remember the story of the israelites and far i think that was probably the very first story i learned ever like my memory at least and so my parents the way they framed it was that these people you know prophets and saints these people are leaders they're humble they're kind i mean this ideal version of what a great person is and so then i was like well i want to be that when i grow up makes more sense i thought you just like for no reason proclaimed i shall be a prophet okay so it was an archetype that you had been learning about and a value obviously that your parents wanted to impart to you an aspirational

value and so you early in your little empathetic sweet self want to say you know i want to be that Yes, that's exactly right. And then I went to my dad and I said, hey, I want to be a prophet when I grow up. And he said, well, the prophet job is out of commission. It was funny because his face was very like, what? I would remember that because I was surprised. I was like, well, you're telling me all this stuff. And then now you're surprised.

I can't be a prophet. Yeah. So he's like, you just be a good person. And so the next person I was thinking about during that time, for whatever reason, it just ended up coming to my life was martin luther king and so i started saying okay well how can i in my own world embody that vision that i have and so what ends up happening is i was at nine years old and i end up having this idea to cure aids using genetic therapy i read a lot i loved medicine you were nine i was nine i was in fourth grade an idea to cure okay so this is a beautiful

glimpse into your heart and mind that at nine years old, you came up with a strategy for curing HIV through gene modification, you're saying? Gene therapy. So I just was reading a lot, books, and I was really interested in medicine. And then I read about HIV and what really angered me about HIV. And anger is a strong word, and I use it intentionally because there's a hypocrisy to it it pretends it's something to a cell and then it goes in it's like nope actually i am you know it's a trojan horse model and destroys the cell and that angered me you know i was like this is wrong so i started reading a lot about genetics as well like this is all happening in one pot in one moment and i said well what if abcd and it kind of goes from there

and i spend the next five years sending letters across the country to phd labs saying i'm this nine-year-old or whatever and i had this idea and i got a lot of good responses but no one's saying yeah we'll let you become in the lab it sounds insane until high school so i'm in 15 at that point and finally this university phd lab is like okay you can come in and we'll mentor you at least a couple summers there yeah and then what happened did it work obviously well i but it plants a seed well i found out that it would take like take at least 10 years for it to just even get through all the trials and testing and research and i realized that that required way too much patience i wasn't as dedicated i was out of sync with lab life just lab life and working in a lab was very tedious

yeah it was very tedious and it was too slow for me and then also at that point there were other researchers who were on this thread, who were thinking similarly. So I said, I'll leave it to them. That's their job. And then that led me to going into medicine, to law, and went to undergrad studying domestic US policy. I started a prayer app when I was 18 that ends up going viral. And that introduced me to the power of technology, created a nonprofit called Bring on the Books, where we would reroute books from kids who have the kids in need, because my high school had a lot of extra books and they were throwing them out. And so we rerouted them, the books into schools in West Philadelphia. Point is, is that anywhere I could have made a difference in a

unique way, I tried, you know, whether it was a nonprofit, whether it was in technology, whether it was in medicine. Well, what I find so beautiful about that story is that you're just a kid, right? And most kids are thinking about like, where can I save up to get the skateboard I want or to get this new app or video game or whatever that i want to get and they're hanging out with their friends and getting into trouble and you're like spending your puberty and pre-adolescence trying to find a cure for cancer that's the first night like she's not cancer you probably would have found a cure for cancer but trying to find a cure for hiv and also that your lens was so trained toward where you could help? Because a lot of kids have that moment when they're young.

So I'm just so curious. First of all, did you get bullied or I can't imagine other kids understood you as a kid? Because I'm even thinking it's who were like that, one of them in particular, and other kids did not get him. You hit the nail on the head. I mean, I distinctly remember actually, first grade recess. And I literally would walk around. I had some conversation with students and I remember that they were talking about Pokemon. I actually remember I went to the smartest kid in the class and they were trading Pokemon cards. And I said, these things are going to be obsolete. I didn't say obsolete, but these things are going to be out of fashion. This is just the thing. He's like, no, absolutely not. And I was like, this is the smartest kid in the

class. I was thinking my brain. So I just would walk around recess. I remember on my own and I would talk to the teacher aides who were managing recess they taught me how to tie my shoes i remember with the bunny rabbit heads you know and all that and how you tie shoes so i always felt out of sync and honest i believe that that really comes to being an older soul i believe yeah i i really had when we talk about love i distinctly had a relationship with the divine well that's what i want to ask you about were your parents observant or did they break because like in my family there was a religious identity but we weren't at all observant maybe once or twice a year that was it and there was no discussion practice expression around cultivating a

relationship with a divine higher power none the closest thing to god was my father which was not nice he was not a very nice deity um so did your parents cultivate this or was this something that just you were born this way you know it's a mix of nature and nurture i think my parents told the stories and i ran with it you know actually i distinctly remember my father and my parents they really do their own thing they never told me you have to pray you have to do this they just did their own thing and so i remember there was this kid in first grade who was a bully and he was just really mean to me. And my dad, every time he'd come home from work, the first thing he would do is go and pray. And I remember I was young. I didn't have to pray or anything. I just would

watch him. And at the end of his prayer, he would give God his wishes. So one day I was like, maybe if I pray to God, this kid won't bully me. So yeah, that was my first prayer. And so I go to, I join my dad, I pray. And then two weeks later, I see this kid in recess and he's just so happy that, Hey, so hail, how are you? And I'm like, what? This worked. So I feel like that was one of the ways that gave deeper intimacy with the divine. I also felt every time my mom told these stories, I felt like I was talking with these people and these people, meaning these luminaries or these sayings or these prophets. And I felt like I had a relationship

that was beyond just this world. Yeah, you must have been born that way because most kids don't respond that way. I mean, they like the story and they find it compelling or interesting or inspiring or whatever, but you took it to the next level. I mean, the characters came alive for you

and then you continued the relationship after the story. Well, I give my ancestors credit. I am a direct descendant of Prophet Muhammad. my parents and their family members there's a lot of spiritual luminaries there and sufis and people of other faith traditions but passionate about their faith from a place of love yeah so you come from a lineage of that yeah and so like it could be seen as you know it's just the same story there's no that makes sense and also that you witnessed that was modeled for you by your father and perhaps by your mother too oh my sure the relationship that's something that i've had to

discover in my adult life how to do that and it's such a gift to get that as a child but you end up in Stanford business school right you went to business well yeah I did but I think we got to mention this part because we're talking about love yeah because something happens that's worth sharing about this okay girl oh all right a girl came into your faith journey dude tell me okay so I was less mystical. I was definitely mystical, but less mystical. Just reading the prayers, et cetera. I go to undergrad and I meet a girl who we start having a crush. I'm in orchestra. She's in orchestra. I remember putting down my violin. She played the flute. She was right next to me as she put our cases down. And then we would go and walk up to our seats in orchestra.

And so I just start flirting with her to be candid. And she responds. And those first end up being walks after orchestra and i'm like this girl she's so cute and she's bubbly and she's fun and she's beautiful i mean all of that and so finally so what i do i used to write poetry when i was in high school about the divine and all that so my pickup line my next level so my next level pickup line was i write these poems would you give me some feedback and these poems are juicy like in the whisper of your being you know like things like that yeah yeah so but they were hardcore love poems yeah but i'm like oh but but it's about god it's not about you it's about god okay got it and then i translated that to say would you give me like

how about we have coffee over it yeah so we get coffee and my whole goal is to basically understand where she's at in faith and she says to me i'm atheist and i'm like oh god everything is going perfectly like great chemistry like he doesn't believe in a god right so i say to myself all right you know what and i knew my intuition knew at that point this was a stretch but i was like maybe i could convince her yeah good luck with that i know you know the end but we get closer and closer and she basically turns from atheist to agnostic and then i felt like i had to make a decision between her and god and i decided god and i said i need some distance because i was falling for her but at the same time i knew it wasn't the person i wanted to

invest my life with and you're in high school at this point no this is freshman year of college freshman year of college okay so we have distance i actually transferred to another university because i wanted to study politics and u.s policy and i thought that i did the right thing i expected a reward from god pat on the shoulder i rejected quote-unquote temptations and i felt further away than i ever did everything that i described to you in childhood when i would pray when i was a kid i felt like a sweetness in my mouth all of that was just poof interesting so because you were like okay god i'm giving up love for you i'm standing for you now i should get the prayer rewards even more so on steroids yeah and it was the opposite complete i felt stranded in a desert

wow and so what happened so i try to do what i always did but more of it i started fasting every other day i started praying every night i mean it was literally for me fasting every day like no food, no water every other day. But it wasn't working. And I remember growing up in my father's library, we had all these books about Sufism. And my dad always said to me, he's like, this is the next level of people if they want to be one with God. When we talk about Sufism, we're talking about people like Rumi, people like Hoffes, these poets who are talking about being drunk with the love of God. And so I said, I got to figure out how to get myself into this. I need the next level because what I'm doing now ain't working. So I start this path of searching about Sufism.

And I was even ready to, I know this sounds crazy, and please people don't judge me who listen to this, but I didn't know better, but I was really even considering to go to religious seminary school in Iran because I thought that I would learn more about faith. Yeah. And it's just so interesting to me that as a young person, freshman, sophomore in college that you are so hungry that you know to be hungry for spirit that you had that hunger and that you were so driven and it makes sense to me i mean you're looking in every corner like of course you're gonna look there and so what ended up happening yeah so i emailed this really famous famous professor slash scholar who's in sufism and he says to me just out of the blue

cold email like this is a really famous guy and i'm not planning to like i don't know if i'll hear a response so i get an email from him from his assistant that says he would like to speak to you what time works for you like oh god i get on the phone with this guy and he says you don't want to go there here's the phone number of this other person if you really want to go to iran because i'm persian for those who don't know and call this guy who's a head of philosophy over at the university of tehran and here's his home phone number and he could probably get you a scholarship to go if you really want to go there i talked to my parents about it and they're like are you crazy like who wants to go there i mean no offense to that country and i was like yeah i'm not gonna

go there so so i'm trudging away i was you know at undergrad doing my public policy but so i was at georgetown at the time at georgetown there's a muslim student association so i was raised Muslim, for those who don't know, but very much had a kinship with Judaism in particular. Moses was actually, when I was sixth grade, I used to call Moses my first teacher. And so he helped me a lot and still does. So I was very much involved with the Jewish element as well as Islam. And there was a rumor in that community that there was a Sufi who would come into the prayer room and he was doing something with his fingers. If you could catch him, maybe you'd find that path Because the path is similar to Kriya Yoga or other paths.

There was a stealth Sufi that came into the prayer sessions unbeknownst to the others. But if you spotted him. Yeah. Ah, interesting. The year goes by. I go to the prayer room and that's the guy. Because they said that he does something with his fingers and I could just tell that's the guy. So afterwards he finishes praying and I go up to him and I say, you're in the miscarriage.

you heard this too yeah yeah exactly and he's like no horrible liar no i'm not yeah and then he mentions he's with someone else and i asked what's your name they were together as you know friends two guys and he mentions the name i said well your name sounds familiar and i still had that notebook with that phone number that that professor gave me it was the phone number of his dad in his home in iran he's like how do you have my home phone number in iran i said well i got it from this guy and they were blown away that led me to the path of sufism and i learned from those guys end up being a doorway towards getting deeper into that path discovering meditational techniques that are really passed down in tarikas is what they call them or these different schools

within Sufism. Sufism led me to discovering Kabbalah when I was at Stanford doing my MBA, which I was very involved in the Chabad community, which I absolutely love. And that led me also to Kriya Yoga and discovering Pramansi Yogananda and led me to Christian mysticism as well to where we are today. What I find so interesting is that you were studying around Islam and Kabbalah at the same time, where today, I don't know if those would even be in the same room or in the same campus. And so I just think that's a really beautiful part of the story as well. So you've been seeking in all of these religious traditions, the Christian mysticism, the Jewish mysticism, which is Kabbalah and Sufism, and you're getting an MBA. Now there's

two key things that I really want to make sure we get to in this conversation, in addition to everything, you know, that we're covering about your story. One is you ended up building a couple of businesses after, or maybe even during your business school years. I want to talk about the gratitude practice that really changed everything and that led to this latest business venture. And we also have to get into your sex and love because you have some interesting things to say about that too yeah let's start with gratitude and how that because you know you hear about gratitude all the freaking time you know and i agree that gratitude you know where attention goes energy flows and that it's a key practice for personal growth spiritual growth happiness you know all of that

but how did it play out here you are this spiritual seeker meditator communer with god But how did gratitude make such a difference to you? It's a great question. So after business school, I started a company called Alum. And it's a group celebration platform. And the idea was to empower hearts to open up to one another in card writing, especially in digital. So people could pull videos, photos, even money for a group gift and celebrate someone. So I was CEO of this company.

It was venture-backed, et cetera. And I've always written gratitude in journals ad hoc. And I never could get into the habit of gratitude journals. did prayers every day this but just like that habit of writing gratitude could not do it and about a hundred million americans actually fail at this they buy a journal and fail i fail every time yeah yeah it's it's so hard to keep it up so about three years ago a classmate of mine said we're gonna be each other's accountability buddy and we want you to we're gonna have a gratitude journal so i did it for five days and then again failed so i said this time i'm gonna figure out a

way to make this happen so i started writing an email to myself of what i'm grateful for and i'd schedule send it so writing what i'm grateful for schedule send it it come back to my inbox about a day or two days or five days later whatever i was feeling and when it comes back to my inbox i reply to myself and i schedule send it again and it come back to my inbox again so i end up doing that for three years and i actually build this gratitude habit and every time i'd open that email, I'd see all the things I wrote, which would make me more invested and bring back all these memories. And what it did was it made me realize how much more abundant life is. It was really an emotional life vest in this journey. Cause especially as an entrepreneur, you feel

like you're moving up a mountain. You feel like you're always not maybe enough because we need more growth and more sales and more of this and more of that. So with gratitude, it tempered that a bit more not the ambition but tempered the anxiety and the stress right because you were focused on things that you were happy about and grateful for rather than the fears yeah right so that makes a lot of sense so the app that grew out of this practice is called bring soul right it's called soul brings all that life is the left side soul okay so that so it's called soul and there are two or three like unique things about it that make it different than just like hey write a gratitude journal that are based on what you've found and now others have found

catalyze the ability to stick with this practice and benefit from it so really quickly explain what that is yes so last company gets acquired and i work and now i'm working full time on soul and there's three yes you're right there is three elements so the first one is it's a text message based tool. So it meets us where we're at. That's so much easier than downloading an app. So it's SMS, WhatsApp, and iMessage is coming out soon. Second element, it's spontaneous. And in the email story that I told you, I emailed myself spontaneously. It wasn't a daily thing, which is all right. So you get prompts spontaneously, like a Monday, then a Wednesday, Thursday, you don't know when you're going to receive it. And then lastly, I really lowered

the bar for myself it didn't have to be paragraphs even one word is a win so you can respond to prompts in your text message with a photo video you can talk voice memo and that makes it so easy we have folks who stick with the tool for months upon months upon months and now this is relevant to you we have something called soul paths where people can experience sufism for 30 days or buddhism for 30 days or tantric prompts for 30 days for couples or for oneself yeah and so thank you for being a part of that and helping to make those prompts yeah i helped you make your tantric prompts yeah that was cool so basically people get that in those same random times come into their phone and their prompts to catalyze them or ask a question or give them a little to do or something

like that. And then I also saw as I was exploring the app, and I don't know if this is happening now or phase two, but I thought this was interesting. I don't know if this makes sense given the world of AI, that based on all the things that you're submitting to yourself that you're grateful for, you can start to see a pattern of like, what are the things that really light me up? What are the things that really inspire gratitude so that you can feed more of that in your life, but also I can imagine it might highlight other areas you could explore that you haven't explored yet. Is that kind of thing happening on the app? Yeah, that is. So folks can opt into the AI. It's encrypted on our database, but if you want to get those insights,

you can. You just opt into the AI and we give you psychological patterns that inspire to be grateful, a word map, areas that you're showing gratitude, areas maybe you could show more gratitude and even recommendations of local events, classes, coaches, practitioners based off of your psychographic. Yeah, that's pretty cool. So you're building this life. You have this love affair with spirit. You had that girlfriend for a little while in high school and college, but much of your life has been focused on your work and on making the world a better place. and you build in tantra we've talked about tantra a lot but you're single and it doesn't sound like at least to my knowledge you haven't really had a love relationship with a human at least i know

you do with spirit but you haven't with a human other than that one girl yeah there was a crush in fourth grade i know people say it's puppy love but i remember i had a dream about her moving away and i woke up bawling and in 2015 i met someone and there was a good connection but it was long distance and ended up not working out. And so, yes, of course, I've dated or met a lot of women and dated and went on many, many dates, but meeting that right one has yet to transpire. Hey, it's Dr. Laura Berman. I've been a sex, love and relationship therapist for over 30 years. And the main question I always get asked is how the heck do we spice it up in a long-term monogamous relationship well if you want to take your love life your sex life to the next level whether

you're in a relationship or not check out my free course on quantum sex it's going to teach you how to take your sexual response to the next level capable of full body orgasms how to use sex magic to manifest your dreams and how to connect on an even deeper level sexually with your partner Just go to drlauraberman.com and you'll find it right there on the homepage, the quantum sex free course. Check it out. Let me know what you think. And this is, I think, an important piece, the puzzle that I don't know that, I mean, you've talked with me about it offline. I don't know.

You gave me permission to talk about it publicly here. I don't know that you have talked about it publicly before. but not only have you not been in a longer-term adult relationship, you haven't ever been physically intimate with someone, correct? That is correct, and that's intentional, actually. So how old are you now, just so people understand? In your 30s, right? Go ahead. Yeah, I'm 32. Okay, you're 32. You're not a 40-year-old virgin, you're a 32-year-old virgin, and you say that it's intentional, so tell me about that. For me, and this is from young age, I always wanted to make love in the name of God.

Actually, for me, I've always seen lovemaking as a tantric practice. So any of the women that I've met or dated, they're actually pretty out of line with me on that. Most people are. I would say your average bumble date is not necessarily living the tantra. Yeah. I mean, that's been my experience. and often i get like kind of like oh this is so weird or different and therefore a just a difference of alignment right i mean there are a lot of moments where obviously i mean i'm a human you

know where i've been in situations where both of us really want each other physically and i've had to put the brakes because in my heart i knew it was out of alignment spiritually maybe it was more lustful or maybe it was more physical and i also knew that i didn't want to commit with this person and it would simply be just a physical engagement. And that's been extremely hard, as you can imagine. So the Tantra thing is, and by Tantra, you mean a spiritual approach to sexuality and sees sexuality as a spiritual and energetic exchange

between two people and between two people or one person and spirit, I'm summarizing here. But so you're saying your commitment is to wait to have sex until you're with someone who you can absolutely see a future with and who you really want to be with and with whom you can make sex spiritual that's exactly right a line from that heart center so how do you bring that up first of all how have you sought to meet potential life i mean because you want a life partner she's got to be someone who's a potential life partner which I get I mean I think that part a lot of people share mostly women but a lot of

men are starting to say that too I'm not really interested in just having sex for sex's sake I want it to be with someone who I actually I'm looking for love I'm looking for commitment I'm looking for marriage or whatever and so I'm gonna not waste my time getting into a physical entanglement with someone who isn't a potential mate so I get that part but how have you been seeking to meet women who have that and the spiritual bend yeah that's been a bit tougher i've been open-minded i'll tell you that i'm a hopeless romantic i tried the dating apps i have friends set me up i have family friends set me up i go to events i try partings like parties i try like i really go you know try to go to places to meet people i watched you meet someone at this

party there was this young woman there yeah that our mutual friend who introduced us really was excited for you to meet and you talked to her for like maybe 10 minutes and then when I talked to you afterwards you're like no it was like you immediately knew that she was not gonna be a potential so what was it was it intuition or was it something is there a checklist that she didn't check what is it that leads you to say no because you said no pretty quick that's a good question you put me a hot seat here on this one i would say ultimately it's intuition there's no checklist i think it's alignment is the word i like this individual you're talking about is a very beautiful lovely kind soul yeah i think it's that place of you just know okay so let me put it this way

because some people say well how could you say that this sounds crazy but this is just who i am my soul really does feel other people and who they are and i feel like there's a two-way street i'm seeing and knowing people you know how you meet someone it's like a kindred spirit you just yeah yeah you know they're you and some people think that that is something you can build over time and there's an argument that that is the case in the romantic context i feel like you got to meet people where they're at yeah you can't change people and so i think in that context it was clear that we're just a little bit out of sync maybe and maybe that's not the one who I could see maybe potentially dating or getting to know deeper and going on dates etc but is that

the person who I could really see as this is going to be the mother of my kids well how do you know that you're saying that your soul would recognize that in the first five minutes that she's someone who could be the mother of your kids is it something you're like soul tells you have you ever met someone who could be that so we're I guess we're exposing a part that could be a little bit of a block so the answer to your answer is no I haven't there's a few people actually ultimately no and but there are certain people and this is the theme that I found is that there's some women who I've met who are much older than me that do get it I'm thinking of one I would love to fix you up with but you told me you want someone your age you know right yeah that's right

yeah so hey oh man this is gonna be i know this is a tall order that you have to find a woman who's under basically under 35 because most people aren't like you where they were born this way i'm not expecting that i know but for a young woman either she has to have been born and or raised that way so it was cultivated in her or she has to have had enough hardship in her life where she had enough afges as i call them another fucking growth experience that it broke her open and and led her to spirit which is how you know that's how we come to it we're either born that way or the universe kicks the shit out of us until we wake up which is what happened in my so that's why you meet older women because by the time we've lived long enough most of us don't have

our spiritual awakenings or life kicked the shit out of us early enough to by 30 be awake well i think more and more people are post-covid in the world we're in right now i think that's happening that a lot of people are waking up but most the time it happens in your 40s yeah you know that's where it starts to happen so you're wanting someone who's got a real spiritual depth to them and who's kind of living from that place but also reproductively viable you said it i'm not i don't want to so there's comments that come up from that but i do think there's something beautiful and maybe this is the hopeless romantic side of me but just someone who's in your generation and no i agree with that you've been practicing tantra by yourself

with yourself for how many years now this is this is again a revealing part when i was about seven i think it was six or seven so all this time that we were talking about i wanted i want to grow up be a prophet etc yeah i had a pediatrician female she seemed like she was in her 40s 45 40 something like that and she contextually society would consider that she sexually assaulted me or touched me in their program and what happened can you tell me what happened i don't need like a blow by blow description but was it during a exam that she fondled you basically yeah that's exactly right i mean in short that was it many years i thought that that was just like a medical thing you know like that was a part of the they were checking

something here but obvious i mean i spoke to some friends privately about it who are doctors and they're like absolutely not like what are you talking about yeah and i ended up finding out that she was basically doing things that one often definitely does in tantra like a prostate and so i was introduced to these feelings in a very very pure way i had no idea what was happening i didn't tell anyone about it my mom for like that brief moment would be just to give privacy was out of the room when i told her about it recently she's like hates herself for it she's like where was i and how many times did this happen would this happen at your exam every time you went to the doctor maybe three times two to three times okay and so that introduced me

to sexuality very very early yeah you know very though pure way for me at least and intimacy very in a pure way at that point i was so young i didn't have an ejaculation or anything of that it was just the feeling and that separated intimacy from just physical for me actually because it felt like such an intimate experience and I would say that definitely made me more mature than many who are they're teenagers and they're being introduced to sexuality a different way than my story was she just very matter of fact while she was doing these things to you like it was just all part of the exam yeah and so but you would have these responses and feelings and then when you went back home you would continue to kind of recreate that for yourself

is that what you mean by saying that you became sexual i would say so yeah yeah and then did it start because you were in this whole spiritual prayer relationship with god framework back then how did those two come together for you i think because i had a real presence of spirit it really was that union of spirit for me what would happen when you would recreate it for yourself it would end up being a spiritual communion and we're doing absolutely which orgasms technically are i mean even if you're not ejaculating you were probably having little or i mean children can have orgasms, even if they don't ejaculate. So, they can be and are designed to be extremely spiritual. So, I can kind of understand what you're describing, that if you were primed and

in this spiritual communion state and in this state of bliss in general, and then you're creating this arousal scenario. I wouldn't even say sexual, but it's like an arousal. Well, she did go forward with other things. I just don't feel maybe 100% comfortable to all of it i mean she didn't have sex with me but she did other things she did other things as well directly there did she make you do things to her or was it all her doing things no it's all her i'm so sorry that happened to you but in a way i also understand that you didn't internalize it or conceptualize it as a boundary violation or something scary or anything else i remember the physical I remember the butterflies in my stomach I remember how it made me feel it wasn't

until high school like puberty when other kids were starting to wake up and talk about this and I was like wait what I was doing was that really guilt like guilt and shame started becoming a part of it and that was being seeped from the outside like that's bad you shouldn't that was in adolescence that exactly I mean I'm not surprised this is and what you've done in a way I mean this is just me analyzing you without your invitation, but it's allowed you to kind of sublimate it, right? So some people, after something like this happens, they start acting out sexually. As a clinician, you're trained that if a child, for instance, starts trying to touch other kids or acting out sexually, that often they've been sexually molested, right? And so you did start to act

out sexually, but it was by yourself in a prayer kind of situation. It got sublimated into prayer, Alma. You started acting out in prayer, which is kind of interesting and strangely beautiful, but it also makes sense that that's where you put your energy, almost even perhaps, because that's where your energy was, but as a defense, right? As a protection. I think you you hit it really well on the head and and uh what ended up transforming because I did have guilt on learning that and there was a spirit that came to me that said you're meant to be free even within your own self and that actually amazingly normalized it for me that this is also to love oneself energetically is an element of freedom yes and it allowed me as well

to be way more thoughtful because it was inside that piece to make decisions with other individuals from a place of where is this really coming from? Is this really coming from a place where, and a lot of people I'm sure have heard or experienced where it's like, am I just lustful for this person? Am I just really wanting a one night stand? Or is this because I'm really interested in the growth of this other person's soul and who they are? And that's the only kind of sex you want to have. Absolutely, yeah. I think that has the most integrity with who I am.

One other question I have, when the Spirit came to you, because I think Spirits come to you often, do they come to you in meditation? Do they come to you in lucid dreams? Do they come to you in prayer, all of the above? Just using this as an example, how did the Spirit come to you? All of the above. And you just believe, like it's so true for you that you integrate them.

Yeah, absolutely. i mean it's been since i was a kid so for me they've been always my they i mean these guides you know people call them the guides right yeah i've always been informing you directing you so what do they say about your dating life be patient don't make a god out of it don't make an idol out of romance like your ultimate beloved is divinity and you're also here to experience the beauty of being human and be merciful to yourself be open-minded and let yourself be surprised ah that's all good advice so you are now moving cities and you're embarking on a new place to live and you're i'm sure going to be meeting a lot of people i'm sure a lot of people are setting you up

and by the way if you're listening to this and you're a woman who can we say under 40 so say under 35 oh my god sorry all right if you're under 33 and on you know on living a spiritual path and want to have tantric intimacy in the context of a love committed relationship let us know we'll look for love for you too so hell because that's very that's very sweet so so that's interesting I think this is really strangely beautiful. I do wonder, I'm going to want to keep tabs on you because it can be so easy, especially like you said, if you idealize too much, not that you shouldn't have a beautiful love that's perfect for you, but it can easily slip into writing people off too quickly as an unconscious

defense, no matter how much you want it. I've actually really explored that as to whether or not I'm pushing people away, what's my energy like, etc. And what I found is that I do draw in such amazing human beings. I've yet to draw in maybe someone who's more my age, who wants to start a family and have a couple years of honeymooning and then starting a family. But I'm open-hearted about it. there's something missing in that story that you mentioned about that very lovely young lady at that new year's party well it was missing which is that there was a woman there who for fun this is going to be interesting for fun not a full-time psychic she is yeah i know who you're talking

about and so she and i should we were there i don't know i think you got up and left and she started saying something that was 100 right at that point i did just meet somebody and she called all of it out and then she started talking about the person that i was meant to be with she's like that person that you're currently you just met isn't a fit which i knew but great yeah and this other person is you know coming up etc and when she was saying that i just like the intuition was like oh we like like since that and it was at that right moment that i met that lovely young but it wasn't her and it wasn't her

and she then turned to me after that after we met and we were talking and said that wasn't her that's not her

that's not her so I have this sense inside and then she then turns to me and confirmed it now some people may say are you basing it off

of a psychic I was like well not really I had that intuition but it just it ended up being another ding

but you haven't met but she said someone is coming but you don't know but you haven't met her yet yeah Okay. All right. Well, you're going to have to keep us... I don't know. I have this sense that everything you're saying is true and there is a part of you that may be writing off. I'm not

saying what that woman you met. I don't know at the party. I didn't even know her, this young woman. She was lovely, but I don't know anything about her. But I do have this sense that you have an accidental high bar inside yourself so that part about staying open that spirit said is really and to be surprised it's real important real important so hail i agree and i actually recently i've learned that more profoundly not just knowing it cerebrally but feeling that so let me just ask you this in closing people can check out the soul app if you want to explore gratitude you're someone who has been on a spiritual path basically since birth communing with spirit as long as you were communing with anything what advice would you give to someone

who is really seeking a deeper or even a starting connection with a higher power i could never say this answer till now and i'm still excited to say that which is a you gotta explore different spiritual paths to see what fits your palate yeah and so we just released paths in kriya yoga buddhism sufism kabbalah 30-day journeys where you can experience oh i could tell you yeah a teaser to see what resonates with you and then at the end of that 30 days we give you resources to other high integrity places that you can dive deeper in there's nothing like this out there in the world which is amazing so what I would say

sign up for soul the word is 30 days on me so you can try whatever path you want for free for 30 days and pick what brings you interest and then after that go deep on one of those and there are people and places

who have high integrity I think that's very important who can lead you or give you the resources and information and the direction that can get you closer to your inner self all right guys check it out we'll put it all in the show notes all the links so hell i just think you're so interesting i am grateful for the work that you're doing in the world around helping us

sort of access spirit more deeply access gratitude more regularly you'll have to keep us updated on your love life journey and when your tantric cherry gets popped we'll do i'm happy to report thank you so much laura you're welcome thank you