Las Culturistas with Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang - "All Up In The Macabre" (w/ Sarah Paulson)

Episode Date: November 12, 2025

Giving Amelia Earhart-but make-it-Fashion Pirate, the iconic and ultra talented Sarah Paulson joins Las Culturistas for an episode of all episodes! She speaks with Matt + Bowen about Kim K's revolutionary relationship with red carpet lighting, the Dynasty-coded character names in All's Fair, playing Lynette's sister on Desperate Housewives back in the day, and being a scaredy cat who stars in a lot of scary shit. Also, Sarah and Bowen's connection as real and fictional cast members of iconic sketch comedy series, Amy Madigan giving the performance of the year, going on the Goldderby and thoughts on the modern Oscar race, playing Marcia Clark, Linda Tripp and Nicolle Wallace, and . All this, the glamour of the Academy Awards vs. the reality of the Academy Awards, voting against your friends for awards, being there on set when Max Greenfield got fucked to death on American Horror Story: Hotel, how to do an Australian accent, and how mama excels in a wig. Check out All's Fair on Hulu now!See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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It's me, Matt Rogers, and in the words of another Christmas icon, it's time. I'm back with my new nationwide tour, Matt Rogers, Christmas in December. Yes, it's time to remember. when Christmas is. I'm hit in the road all of December with Henry Kuperski and the whole band performing my album. Have you heard of Christmas along with a bunch of other little surprises?

So if you're in L.A., San Francisco, Seattle, Portland, Philadelphia, D.C., New York City, Boston, Toronto, Chicago, or, yes, Orlando, Florida. I want to see your gorgeous ass. Go to Matt Rogersofficial.com or head to my Instagram at Matt Rogers, though, and hit the link in my bio.

Until then, stream the album, get your look together, and get ready to deck the damn halls at a venue near you. Christmas in December, you in my heart. X-O-X-O-X-O Santa Boy. Look, man. Where? Oh, I see. Wow.

Bowen, look over there. Wow. Is that culture? Yes. Oh, goodness. Wow. Las cultureistas. Ding-dong, Las Culturistas calling.

I was just touching base with you before we got on because you and our guests share something. You're on the real S&L. She was on the fictional Studio 60 on the Sunset Strip. She played a Christian sketch comedian. I'm halfway to that. I just have to be witnessed. Yeah.

And then I'll be there. One of these days, so I'm almost see you. What's your background with Christianity? Do you, okay, so we are on this ride. We're off to the races. I'm a confirmed Catholic. Get this. You got, you were confirmed?

I went all the way through. My parents cared so much about it. And then I got, I don't talk about my Christian cast. It was not Greek Orthodox. No, I was Greek Orthodox, and then we moved. And my parents were like, you know what, let's just be Roman Catholic because it's basically the same. And so then...

Don't tell the Pope. Then, you know, don't tell him. And don't tell him about us either. I don't want to know his opinion. It's rule of culture number eight. I don't want to know the Pope's opinion on us. What is the Pope what I'm going to do? What did the Pope went to one of your Chicago shows back in the day?

He'd be like, hey, I knew I knew I see that face. It's like when Taylor Swift recognizes someone in the crowd and it's the Pope. Honestly, he's probably a Taylor fan. Who isn't? Anyway, my confirmation name, it was between... This is so my life, too. I was choosing between Christopher and Blaze. You already have one of the Apostles' names.

Matthew. I picked Christopher, too. I stayed born. Blaze? No, I didn't pick Blaze. Blaze with I-E-Z or Z-E. B-L-A-I-S-E. That is the, there is a saint, Blaze.

Oh, that's right. People don't know this. And he was the saint of... I believe fire? I'm making it up. I don't think there is. Yeah, St. Sebastian. I just picked a gay name.

Speaking of names, our guest is in a show. Carrington Lane. That's a very dynasty-coded name. Esquire. Esquire. Yes. When I got on the Wikipedia for the show and I read the, first of all, the names of the real actresses in the cast was one thing. And then reading the character names really blew me away because Kim Kardashian will be playing.

Allora Grant Esquire. My name is Alora Grant. I'm your lawyer. Oh my God. Hey, you made it. Meet my friend Allura. You've met Allura. And you turn it to someone who looks like Kim Kardashian.

You go, that's the definition of overstimulus. What is Alora the Saint of? Gay guys. There we go. There we go. It's fun back around. Fucking All's Fair. Fucking All's Fair.

The show made in a lab and the Ryan Murphy Lab, which is one of the best labs. For us, I think. us. Yeah. You've got our guest. You got Kim, Naomi, Tiana. Nisi, babe. Judith, Niecy.

Miss Liz Berks. Miss Liz Berkali. Mm-hmm. This is a dream. This is a dream and a half. It's a fever dream that I cannot wait. It's going to be on Hulu. You're all going to be watching it.

November 4th. Our guest, Tony winner. Emmy winner. Culture Award winner. Culture Award winner. I'm sure it's simple. We've got a lot of categories. Icon 400, Honor.

Acon 400, Honor. Yes. figure of great talent, renown, and more. We are super gagged and more to have the one, the only.

Sarah Polson! I came dressed like Amelia Earhart today. You kind of did. Explain the... It's just Celine. It's the new Amelia. It's a new Amelia and I'm just

you know, representing it. Like a person who's more, I'm a terrified flyer also, so this is like not, it doesn't work together. I think it's incongruous. But that's why it works, is what I've decided. We were saying, like, the looks that were being turned at the premiere was just, I guess, just like all showing us into a new world of what red carpets can be.

Yeah, especially if Kim Kardashian is your co-star because what happens is Kim, sends someone to do a little walkie-woo, goes and takes a video of what the carpet looks like, comes back. And Kim is like, mm-mm, like this. Whoa. Yeah, like where's the lighting, where's the thing? And so when we were all standing there looking more ravishing than we've all ever looked. And we saw these pictures and we were like, what is the story with this?

And it's because Kim went and dealt with the lighting. So we were lit all from below and above. Like the Oscars doesn't have lighting like this. No. It's like, you know, and then she went and made sure that we had it in Paris and we had it in London. And so you're privy to the Woxi Woo video. Are you seeing the video?

I've not seen the Woxi Woo video, but I was told that Woxi Woo happened. She gets the info and she's like, mm-mm. Yeah. And I just, I got to say, sign me up for that. Yeah, sign my face up for that. You know, if you could just follow me around like this all day long. The glam factor was incredibly high.

No, it was just, I was like, who is that looking at my own face? I was like, who is, who is that? That's you. It's like, it's just me with really excellent lighting. You don't ask yourself that question very often, do you? Who is that? Because I don't, I mean, you're a great chameleon. I can look like different things.

You were Linda Tripp once for a spell. Yeah. One of the greatest spells. of my time. I love that spell. That spell was like really. Oh, Al-a-Cazoo, wiggily-woo, boom, Linda Trekk. It was like one of my favorite.

I like a peg leg and a black tooth. That's like what I care about from an acting standpoint. Like, do I have a, you know, is there a hump in the back? Do you play a pirate yet? Today I'm playing a pirate of the skies. It's like, today I'm the pirate of the skies. Like Amelia went down hard and like was, came back. I think she did.

Yeah. We can confirm at this point Like Amelia went down hard I think she's gone She's gone I still think we can find her Somewhere the plane or something But I digress

I think we should do a big gay modern Hunt funeral Oh I was gonna say funeral But let's hunt her down But we could also get the right minds I think we've like been on the wrong track Like we don't need the aviation experts

We need some like gay people We need a Laura Grant Yeah Carrington Lane I'm Glenn close As Dina Standish just on the case And I think we would Dina Standish. Emerald Green is amazing.

Emerald Green. Green, Green. Milan. And by the way, in Paris, Tiana, like all our costumes were in these different rooms like at these events. And it's just, we all have our names.

And then it's just Milan. Milan. And she's like, do they not give me a last name? And I was like, it's like your share or Madonna. Exactly. Just Milan. Mononym. 100%.

It's amazing. What can you tell us about Carrington League? I love your dynasty coded thing. Isn't it? God, I mean, I don't think Ryan and I ever discussed this, foregone conclusion to me that this was Alexis Carrington nod because this is just like and I am playing that person on the show I am your your you know esquire villain esquire it's giving antagonist she's

given antagonist she's given uh out for blood she's given revenge till she dies yeah she will be revenging because essentially these ladies started their own law firm they leave dina standish they leave the great glen close yeah go off on their own fly the nest and they don't take me with them And I am the greatest lawyer, in my opinion. And also Glenn Close's opinion. Like I was, not Glenn Close, Dina Stand is his opinion. I was the star of the thing.

But I'm a, you know, I've got a bad attitude. I see. And so nobody wants to be around. And so then they start throwing firm and they leave me behind. And when you leave this girl behind, she's going to come for you. Yeah, she's going to come for you. Oh. So basically it's that.

But it's basically like a little person who was injured and now she's out for blood. Great. You know, hurt people, hurt people. And we hope. to see her hurt very badly back and forth. You are gonna see a lot of hurt and then hurting. Yeah. People's husbands, I don't care.

Fuck, man. Let's just go for it. Delicious. I mean, I'm getting to that age now where I am thinking about how my own abandonment issues of calisphic. Because this is not something I've thought about until my 30s. Yeah. Abandonment is, she's a motherfucker. It's a very hard thing to heal.

She's a motherfucker and she really, some people retreat. Some people go all in in terms of like how they're going to recover. Some people's calcification around the original wound means they can no longer function or let anything in. Some people become, like, really desperate for some attention and won't let people go that they should let go. We're three actors here. Or you become three desperate attention-seeking freaks. Yeah. Speaking of desperate.

Oh, wait. So I think, so definitely the first time you hit my screen was Studio 60. And I remember being like, who is that? And I think many people in the world were like, who is that, finally? But you were iconically Lynette's sister on Desperate Housewives, which was really a formative culture in our life. Oh, I love this. Oh, no, I remember you from it. This was, you do.

Yes. This was a moment in my career where I, you know, not a lot was happening. It was not a lot was happening. And then Felicity Hoffman was a good friend of mine then, was a good friend of mine now. It was like, hey, you know, I think I was at some party with Mark Cherry where he has a grotto. There's like a swimming pool. Mark's Grotto. I can envision this very clearly.

And I was like, I think there was like a charades night. And then I think I got, you know, like a little crumb thrown my way where I could be Lynette's sister, which to me was like... Really good cast thing. Yeah. And it was Carrie Preston was the other sister. Yes. Elspeth. Elspeth.

And also, she on True Blood, that is an underrated performance. That's correct. That's correct. Carrie Preston's been giving underrated performances her whole career. And she is, her husband too. Yeah. They're just so good. So good.

So good. Actually, you know what? I remember that was like when ABC was like... kicking ass and Michael Emerson was Ben Linus on Lost and then Kerry. Yes, but wasn't he also doing something else at the same time? He was on the show with Jim

Kivisel? Was that? Was it? Jim Kivisel? Yeah, I said it. Christ is in the room. Really nice work. Strong. But was that true? It was a show. Yes, Jim Kvizel was on some like procedural. He was. I thought there was. Yeah. Something. But I feel like he was doing double duty. It was like

the time when someone like Michael Emerson could do both. Yes. And then his wife was all on all the other on true blood and it was just like a thing. And now she's Elspeth.

Now she's Elspeth. Completely taking over not just the airways but also the commercials. Oh, the Elspeth commercial. Burrays and scarfs and Elspeth. I just love it. I just love it so much.

You're going to see a lot of Elspeth Halloween costumes. Oh, yeah. I think that's right. Yeah. The other prediction I make is a lot of Gladys from weapons. Of course, a lot of Gladys.

Big time. There's going to be a lot of that. But see, but both of those are like colorful women. Color for women. I just hate Halloween. Right. Okay.

Talk about it. Actors tend to not. I hate Halloween. Yeah. I don't want you to ring my doorbell. Okay. I don't want to have to talk to little people. Nope.

Children. I don't like the dressing up. I'm like, oh, God. It's like the one day of year people are just like, I get to be. Right. And I'm, you know, I understand that I get to do this in my life and I've been so blessed and I'm so happy and lucky. Yes. And I'm also just like, my costume today is me.

Of course. I'm myself today. Yep. Here's my thing. I hate a pomp. I mean, I could go on about this when I've got my minute to rant, but I'm saving something else for bad. But, like, I don't want your pumpkin spice. I don't want it.

I don't like pumpkin. I don't like anything pumpkin. I don't like the color orange. I'm just, it's not my vibe. Halloween's not my time. Sorry. So I want to tell you something. You look at my life of a show girl colored phone right now.

Yeah, I do. This is not a good time for you. Because Apple has decided orange is in. I don't like it. I don't like it. So then how do you should get through this time of year? I do, I, I muscle through it. Yeah.

And I have often worked with wonderful. hair makeup people and they love to do the trailer in the Halloween jam and there is like nightmare for before Christmas stuff and like people someone's like in and like cobwebs everywhere you come in and you're like ah it just like I don't know why it makes me so agro but because I love candy yes never been happier about candy in my life and you famously are in a lot of scary shit I'm in a lot of scary shit but I'm the biggest scaredy cat I don't watch anything scary likewise I don't watch any of those one of those really scary movies with Patrick Wilson and Vera Farminga like too great actors I can't I absolutely cannot with a doll, a creepy doll.

The Megan's not for you. The Megan's, no, none of it. Yeah. But then you did see, you did see weapons? I did see weapons because I went with my friend Jason Butler, Hunter. Jason Butler-Harner and Pedro Pascal, and we went to see this movie. That was trickster, famous trickster Pedro Pascal. Yeah, he's a famous trickster.

I didn't know. I didn't know what I was, I didn't know. And you felt jilted, you felt. Except for, to me, it's like the performance of the years in that movie with Amy Madigan. It was just to me, I'm like, well, thank God, Amy Madigan. is being given an opportunity to do what Amy Madigan can do better than anybody. And she's just a genius. And I'm just like here for an, I want someone to accept an Academy Award for a movie like that.

Because James McAvoy in Split, I mean, do we need to talk about like, I mean, like, not even nominated. Like, what are we talking about? Tony Collette in whatever that scary movie. Herititary, yes. Herritory. Herritory. Herritory. Yeah.

I mean, these performances are, they're not easy to do. And like, nobody wants to give Ellen Burst. and the Exorcist. Linda Blair in the Exorcist. Why aren't we giving statues to people? This is another thing. I mean, I've got a lot of ranting to do, obviously, but I just... Horror movie performances don't get their respect.

Lupita Nyango and us should have been nominated. Correct. I thought Daniel Kulia and I should have won Allison Williams and get out. That was a should have been a sort of nomination. All of it. I think sinners is going to get a good showing at awards. I think you're probably right. And, you know, I recently, I'd be going on the gold derby.

I'd like to go on the gold derby too. I'd be going on it. I'd be going. And so shockingly high, Amy Madigan. And the supporting actress, like, people are predicting it because I think things are changing. They're changing, but also I think there's so much respect for her that predates this sort of genre moment that people are like, oh, my God, we want Amy Madigan seen by all of us all the time everywhere. And if this is the, you know, and it's just, it's also undeniable. And that movie is like a sneaky horror movie.

Yeah. It's not like Blood and Guts horror movie. It's more of a psychological thing. And so you think you're watching, like, you've got people like running around like this, you know? And it's like, are you a bird? Are you? Do you know what I mean? Like, oh, look, we can pretend.

That is, this of the, this of it all. And also the way that she styled, Bowen always says, like, it serrates the movie, like, memorable and serrated. I love that. But there's a pretty bloody, gory moment. And it's the only, it's true. It's the first time in a long time that I've had to cover my eyes. And it's always the gay couple that get it. I know.

Remember it too? No, probably not, because you didn't see that. You know. That one I didn't see. But you'd be going on the Gold Derby to decide what you're going to do or about what's going on for your friends. Interesting question. Are you like, are you like going for your own ballot and being like, what are people saying? Or are you like, my friend, so-and-so was up for it?

Are they going? Well, if I do remember voting, I always hope for you. But I like, I remember going and the first time I voted for SAG, I really surprised myself. Because I was like, wait, all my favorite stuff isn't even what's in the conversation. Because we're not, you know, I don't know how many ballots you've been sent, but there are ones that I'm like, what even is like, you know, they're big when you get to be a nominator. And it's like, I take this so seriously. I'm like a freak about it. I mean, if you're a brilliant and something, but like I like something else.

it's better and you're my best friend. I'm still voting for the thing I like. It should be like that. Because I just feel like you want to honor the greatness of the performance and not just like your friends. And I just don't, I can't. I watch, I will not vote in a category I have not seen. Yep.

I just won't do it. I take it very, very serious. I want you to look Pedro in the eye and vote against him. I did vote against him this year. Who did you vote for? I voted for, um. At Emmys? Yeah.

It was him. Well, because he was kind of barely in the same. No, I voted for Adam Scott. Oh, yeah. Sorry, Pedro. Sorry, Pete. Yeah, I couldn't help it. It was a performance to me that was just...

Of course. So good. Yeah. My main thing about Halloween, I agree with you. But my thing is, it's everyone's on about fast fashion and stuff, right? It is like the most unsustainable holiday. Yes, that's true. It's like people just wear, I think once and then throw it out.

Yeah, they do plus the packaging that it comes in, the plastic and the thing. Oh, exactly. Some dog is suffocating in the corner because they like got inside it. You see where I went? I'm sorry. No, it's okay. It can really happen. It can really happen.

I don't follow you for that. Oh. I just see the thing is you briefly lived in the macab there. I did. As someone who like literally, you lived in the macabre for years. You were all up in the macabre. Yeah. All up in the macab.

All up in the, all up in the macab. It's a good title of all up in the macab. I did live in it. I did live in it. How do you do that? I'll never forget the scene of you in hotel, which is the one I tried to watch because of Gaga. Yeah.

And basically what happens to Mr. Greenfield? Oh, yeah. Yeah. I had to tap out of that. It was so fun. And you were in a scene. I was like watching it. I got to watch it.

Yeah. How do you do that? I'm on set for it. I was on set for it. I saw it. Whatever you're thinking, it's way worse. It's like a giant conical dildo. Yeah.

Right? He gets fucked to death. Fuck to death, like, but with like a drill, like a real drilling. Ryan. Ryan. You're sick. You're sick. But, you know, I'm here for it.

Something's in my eye, guys. Whatever. It's fine. Macab. No, macob. Macab. Someings in my macob. First of all, macob or macabre.

Let's get on the same. Macaub. Macab. Macab. Thank you. I mean, I like, well, yeah. But then people make fun. They're like, oh, Mr. Frenchman, we, we.

And I'm like, no, it's just how you're, it's a silent art. No. Is your first language French? Not technically. You're a Frenchman? No. Born in Australia, moved when I was six months old. So you could say English and Mandarin were the first things that like hit my ears.

But then we moved to Quebec. Oh, so that kind of French. The French was like spoken the most in my life for a while. What? And then hard left into English. English. But you didn't have any sort of like Australian accent. Did you hear the horrible thing? No, that was good. No, I've got a couple of friends and all we do is this. That's really good. We just love to do it. It's great. My makeup bar is from New Zealand. Yeah, from South Africa, right? I can't remember. Remember. Remember. No, it's no. I love that. I love when people said no. No. No. It's really old for me. It's never going to be old. You don't never get old. But somebody taught me a secret about how to say, and be in a really great accent for this voice.

is to say rise up lights. Rise up lights. Rise up lights. Rise up lights. Rise up lights is the same thing as saying razor blades. Rise up lights. You say rise up lights. Rise up lights.

Rise up lights. My on ramp into Australian is always, oh yeah. Oh yeah. Because it is an activist, you're up a pallet. Yeah, you get your up a pellet going. Yeah, I don't know. Very resonant language.

Oh, yeah. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Up there. With the question? Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Okay. But I like rise. I like rise up lights. Rise up lights. Rise up lights. Rise up lights. What are, what are rise up lights? You know, like, just think of the word rise. Okay. Up. Lights. You're just like rise up lights. What's the favorite accent you've ever done? I haven't really done a ton of them. Yeah, I was thinking that. I don't really get to do that often. I'm usually just like running from a clown or. Yeah. You don't need it as a crutch. Yeah, it's not a crutch for me. I like to live in my Linda Tripp world and my martial club. I like a wig. You like a wig. Mama likes a wig. Mama likes a wig. Mama excels in a wig.

Mora excels in a wig. Love a wig. The Marsha Clark of it all, by the way, that was, I'll never forget the Marsha, Marsha, Marsha episode. Talk about going to Gold Derby. I was like, let me go on Golder, make sure that I'm not crazy. This is at number one for everyone. Oh, my God.

That was such a slam dunk, like such a well-deserved Emmy win after you being overdue at that point. Thank you. By the way, we also saw appropriate. You're brilliant. Thank you. Thank you. But I do want to ask the Kim Kay of it all figures. into people versus O.J. Simpson famously.

Yes. Did you touch base with her about that? Not during it. No. Of course. No, I barely talked to Marsha Clark before. I mean, I didn't talk to Marsha Clark before we shot it. So it wasn't until we were like episode six or seven.

I think I had finished the Marsha, Marsha episode. And Ryan's like, if you want to reach out to it, you can do it now. Oh, no. Even then you hadn't met her. No, no. We had a real drunken night one night after, like I was into episode seven or eight of the 10 or 12. I can't remember how many there were.

Yeah. And then that was that, like I saw her mold. Like I literally saw her face through a spinning like revolving door and I was waiting there and I was like I was so entrenched by mole in my love for Marsha Clark at that time because I was so inside it. Yeah. And then I remember like seeing like her walk through the revolving door and like I swear to God there was a glint of like sparkly sunshine right on the mole. And I was like molly molly moly. It was like I had like a cinematic like slow push in on the mole and it was like there she is. I can't believe this.

And she said let's get drunk. No, she didn't, but I was like, I guess I need to. Yeah. Yeah, she was really hesitant about the whole thing. She'd only been, like, raked through the coals publicly. So the idea of, like, a dramatization of this when nobody writing about it was actually there, the idea that it was going to be, I kept trying to say, like, this is going to be, I really think, like, the angle, I know, I can speak about what the angle is for sure. And I don't think you'll be upset by this. And she didn't really have a lot of faith in that.

But then I think, obviously, at all, at all. I guess it's like why would anyone who'd been only... For decades, like just, you know, where the fault of losing the, you know, whatever it was, was sort of laid at the prosecution's feed. And it just was a mess. And then just always, always, you know, poked fun of and all this stuff.

And so anyway, it just, I can't remember what your question was. Well, it was about Gold Derby. Oh, Gold Derby. Yeah, it was about Gold Derby. No, but it was about Kim. Because now you're in a show with her. That was like something that I think, like, our generation I didn't really understand that was the inception of the Kardashian thing.

I think Chris was really good friends with Nicole, best friends with Nicole. And so that was the real thing. So, yeah, Sama Blair played her. I can't remember who played the children. But just recently, Kim told me that there were people who played her on the show. Like, her played Courtney and Kim, I think. Yep, they were. Yeah, and I don't remember that part because it was a section I wasn't in.

So I paid it very little. You know what I mean? I still haven't seen it to this day. Really? Usually the usual of your work? I had always watched my work before then because I think I was so still thrilled that, like someone was letting me do it. I was like, look, there I am.

Yeah. And now, I think in particular with that was the first time where I was so obsessed and like deep in it that I felt like if I watch this, I'm going to see every time she was left-handed, I pick up the pen with the wrong hand, and oh, God, I'm going to see all the things that are wrong. And so, and then when the response was so robust, I thought, now I'm really not going to watch it because I don't want to be like, what's the big deal? Right.

Yeah. And you also don't want to, you don't want to convince yourself of like a reality where they're all lying to me. really something I'm very good at doing. I get that. So I just was like, I don't want to do that to myself. Why don't you let this one be enjoyable? Yeah.

And see what, you know, that feels like for a second. I feel like your work is so perfectly balanced between like something that is grounded in reality and something that's actually happened in the world, Studio 60, let's say, or people versus O'Day. And then it's also the corollary is like the can't be heightened reality as well. Like, is this a toggle for you where you have to, like, sort of change modalities based on what the project does? I don't feel toggly, I think, and that maybe is why I'm able to do it. Because the Ryan thing I do think particularly, but even in other things I did, I did this movie called Run about a, you know, child that I've, yeah, my child's in that where I'm trying to make my child sick, so she'll stay with me.

And even that is a sort of like extreme universe to live in. And I think the horror genre in general asks for a little bit of big swings. and I feel most comfortable there somehow. And I don't know whether it's because my mother called me Sarah Bernhardt since I was a tiny child. And I've always had sort of big reactions to things that maybe are outsized. That's for my therapist, not for the both of you. But, you know, I have, I have, I think I'm a big, big, big emotional response to things, big and small.

I think that's, the register is like it really, the pendulum can swing way, way far. there than most, I think. And so therefore, in that world, it doesn't seem off, or out of the realm of normal to have whatever reaction my character's having, even though an average person might be like, you're really freaking, this is too much.

It's too big. And it's surreal. No one can resist a rule of culture. So here's one for the dating files. Rule of culture number 72. Chemistry isn't just vibes, it's values. Because what's the point of matching with someone if you can't talk about the shows you binge, the books you dog ear,

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on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. What I love about the horror genre on its face is you kind of can get away with anything. That's the other, that's the other, imagination is then explored. That's the dirty little secret to me. Like there are no rules. Like when you're playing a real person, I actually feel most free then because I have all the boundaries have been set. And then I can do whatever I want inside it because I know what the truth is and I know

like I just, there are certain facts that are not up for my interpretation. Sure. Where sometimes when you have too much like paint to play with, you know, if you like pour all the paint in the world like on the ground, you're going to come up with just some weird muddy color. It's not specific enough. So it's like, if I have too many toys, it makes my head sort of pop off a little bit in a way that's not helpful.

Right. That's why I'm just like, let me play all the real. I'll be the lady who plays all the real people till the end of time. Nothing would make me happier. That would be amazing. Nothing would make me happier. But you were saying with Marcia, it was tipping into a zone where you were like, I'm going to look at which hand she uses to pick up this thing.

Where how she walked, she was a dancer. She had a little bit of a, she was always sort of standing a little bit in first position. There was so much amazing footage of her, which is, which was rare, which is like her walking into the courtroom where like, they're just hallway cameras, but you don't, you're not really thinking about being on camera. Whereas like when I played Nicole Wallace, before Nicole Wallace became like a household name in game change, like there was no footage of Nicole Wallace not being performance Nicole Wallace. So like speaking on behalf of the White House, whereas I could watch stuff also with Linda, paparazzi videos and things where I could watch

her move without her like public facing self. And so that was like a real gift because it was like, oh, I'm seeing what you're doing without an awareness of a camera. Right. Which where can, when can you get that. It's really rare. So it was very exciting to me to be able to have very specific things from which to pull from. And then I felt really free because I knew what the rules were. Under the veneer you saw. Correct. Yeah. Scraped that tooth enamel off. Got all the way down to the gum line and I was like, I see what's really here. We've got ginger vitus. We've got gingervite diagnosed. Let's ask the question. Okay. So we've been we've been kind of flitting around it. But Sarah Paulson, what was the culture that made you say culture was for you?

I love your answer. Well, for me, it was the VHS of Oscars Greatest Moments, 1971 to 1991. This is a VHS. It cannot be purchased or gotten in any other way. And I had this, I still have this VHS. And Billy Eichner actually also is obsessed with this. And when we had a conversation one day, our heads were both like, I didn't think anybody else really knew about this.

Wow. And he had it transferred to. a disc so that then I don't know how I would do it now I need of course he did but like as a present like a rat present when we were finished with the chorus story or something he gave me but this is something like I watched so much that it was like how I learned about like sashing little feather and the yeah that whole thing and the nudist streaking across you know the stage when Elizabeth Taylor was trying to you know watching every academy award win and every sort of like show opener and Liza Dantley it was like I don't think I knew who Liza Manelli was before I

watch this when I was like 14 or whatever and I was, but I just over and over and over again and I can memorize people's speeches and Ruth Gordon's speech. And like, it was like a, it was like somehow having a living, breathing encyclopedia of pop culture moments that meant something to me, obviously, because of my dreams and fantasies and hopes of like one day standing there with that hot little, right, tight guy, tight ass in my hand. Golden man. Golden man in my hand. Yeah, that it was just like getting to see it all, but it was all just right there. It was like having a computer before you could have a computer. Totally.

It's like being able to Google every little moment about and what people were wearing. So it was like a mixture of the fashion influx, cultural fashion moments, mixed with like political statements that were being made, mixed with like the performers of the day and also sort of recognizing that like the world was,

the performing world was so much smaller back then. It was the same actors over and over and over again getting nominated and the same. It was just there was not this saturation of the marketplace. And so like there were these 10 spectacular actors and these 10 spectacular actresses and these 10 filmmakers and it's like things tended to be

kind of uniformly excellent back then in that time period and they don't make some of those movies anymore but it was a real like I remember just buying that like purchasing that at the video store I think I rented it and then I went and found it and bought it

in Brooklyn in Brooklyn where I lived yeah and it was just like in the VCR and it was just like on repeat repeat and I do think even as I'm talking to about it now like just the Bob Mackey of it all and the different like there was just like the share that share the one of the greatest things that my best friend and I Amanda Pete are always saying

she does this whole bit where she comes out in her like early early acting moment I don't I think it might it maybe it was two times that are on this video yeah one of them where she comes out and she's bringing up uh reading the list of nominees and I can't remember who she's standing with but her line she has to say Marvin Hamel I'm going to mess it up Marvin Hamlish yeah and she cannot and she says, Marvin Hamlschmish, Marvin Hammschmish. And then she goes, sorry, Marvin. And it's like the funniest, most, like, she's so charming and so relaxed. And then another time she comes out in a giant headdress after she won, I think.

She said, as you can see, I got the Academy handbook on how to dress like a serious actress. And I just was like, but it's like I got to see like early day share. There's Bet Midler making fun of the way someone is, too many people are nominated for like one, like there were four songwriter. She's like also known as four on a season. song and it was just like, I mean, I just remember all these like really, oh yeah, for, for moon and, what's the song in New York City? When you get lost with the moon in New York City, the best that you can do. Yeah, it's fall in love. Yeah. Is that from Arthur? Yeah. And she's just like

out there doing her bits. And it's just like, I was just like over, it was like a tsunami of information. Yeah. You got to be like encyclopedic about this thing. Yes. And I was just like having this knowledge of stuff that like none of my friends knew what I was. We share that because we got really into, I believe for us, it was 97. So there was the Titanic Oscars, the model of that. Billy Crystal era. And he comes out and he's like, boop, boop and does his thing. He comes out on a horse.

He comes out on a horse and then he does the thing where he turns it off with the car. With a little cars. So good. Was the Academy putting this compilation out? Like who was publishing this? I think it's possible that the Academy put it out, but I'm not 100% sure. But I sure can let you know. Because the thing is, as you're describing this, it's like, sure, like, anyone can, like, look up on YouTube, like, these moments, but you need something, someone to curating it. Exactly. And it is curated so, and it just goes through and you see everybody's clothing. I mean, I remember having a conversation once with Jessica Lang about the Oscars and fashion at the Oscars. And she said, we used to just, whomever was doing my costumes on that movie, we would maybe go to the Saxford Avenue. And we found a dress. Like, that happened once. And another time it was, you know, it's like,

what it has become. And you can see when you watch this compilation of like somebody just pulling some Halston number out or Halston coming up with, I mean, it just, it's just unbelievable to see the way it changes. Yeah, Bet Mittler just said that I'm watched what happens live. Because he was, he was asking her about her nomination for the Rose. And she was like, I mean, this is back in the day when like you didn't think about what you were wearing.

Literally, she went. She was like, I think that was my dress that I still have. Exactly. I went. It was all very new to me. I didn't get the gravity of what it was to be nominated. I enjoyed it. but it's just not the industry it is now.

Diane Keaton drove herself to the Academy Awards. You know, it was like that the year she won. Yep, yeah. It's like parked your car under the Dorothy Chandler Pavilion. Wow, that's just like, it's just not, it's just such a different thing now. It's, and there was such a purity to it. I know.

That my initial love, I'm pleased for myself that I was alive during at a time where I could have had that experience of watching this in a kind of pure way, where now it's, I'm not saying it would suck to win an Oscar now, right, at all. I'm just saying, I have information about what it was and what it was for people and the importance and the sort of, I mean, the first Academy Awards that were handed out was just like in a room, it wasn't televised and it was like a banquet. Yeah. And it was just, and now it's become this like gold derby race to the top. You know what I mean? And like, it's wild.

Well, this is what I want to say. Like, there was someone on Subway takes recently was like, my take is like if you have a stylist, that means you're not a stylish person. I'm like, well, no. Interesting. And then I think, I think, some, some cool fashion person. And then it was 100% agree. It was just like, oh, but yes, but I see what you're trying to say. But the fact is this is just like another element in this whole maximalist thing that we have with awards now.

And also back then there were fewer things to like fewer ways to express. Like you maybe I could say that that might have been true 20 or 30 years ago. But now there is there's too much stuff. There's just like too much. Yeah. And like how would you even know where to begin? Right. unless you're Kim

and you go back and through all the archives and you pull them and then she does these things where I'm like what is this dress and she's like 1994 Galliano

and I'm like oh I see I'm wearing a new Celine but I congrats to you know what I mean how do you feel though about like the six month or seven month

Oscar race now like I wonder like as someone who loves it because we talk about this a lot too. I have a person who like remember from Premier Magazine used to be able to pull out

like Baller Movie Line Magazine Premiere magazine remember that? You could like pull out ballots and like, I just love it. I love it. Yeah, and I'm one of those people, this is off topic, but I'll get back to your thing,

which is, I don't want you to talk to me at the Oscars party. Like, when I'm watching, have you been to that? Yeah, I'm watching. We were there last year. So you go sometimes to the Vanity Fair dinner, which I've been too many times. It's a real honor to be there. I love it. You're with all these incredible people, but people are talking. They'd be talking. And I'm one of those people who's just like, I really, I care a lot about it. About it. We're at the finish line. And we're waiting for best actress and they are making us go crazy.

And it's just like I am, you know, the crazy person who doesn't not want to be talked to during an award ceremony. I want to watch it. Yep. People are like, oh, are you bummed? You're not going. I'm like, oh, hell no. I'm in my pajamas.

It's a big deal. They're coming over after. We're going to go to the party after. But I just want to watch. Anyway, the six month run to me is arduous. Yes. And also, I think sometimes like, I'm not going to say who, but I have friends who have gone through this.

All of it. And I've had like just the, just like the thing where you have these hopes. I know. These little twinkly dreams and hopes that then get dashed because someone has entered the race that wasn't expected. It's now won the National Board of Review. And does this weaken your chances? And it's just like. It's like sports.

It's like sports now where you're like, well, she won all five things leading up. So the odds of her losing. It's just really. And then you've got. And then it just puts everything. Holland Taylor, whom I love obviously very much, who's my partner in life and things. and all things that matter to me is always talking about

why are we doing this to each other? Because it's so subjective, what is the greatest? And why are you turning it into this thing of this is better than that? All of the things that go into what make a great performance, like there's so many variables from the actors you're working with to your editors to the movie itself,

whether it lands for people. You can be the greatest performance in a movie if the movie doesn't work. Does that ruin your chances? It's like it's such a really psychotic thing. to do to little fragile people like performers, like little artists, performers. Who are not necessarily cut out for the athletic.

For the cutthroat component of it. And I went through this during the Tonys, which to me was the most arduous of them that I had ever been fortunate enough to experience because you're actually doing the show while it's happening. And then like, you know, your stage manager will sweetly say we had 10 voters in tonight.

Like after you're done and you're like, oh fuck. And you're like, and you're like, and then you know, exactly, but act too. And I'm like, why are you telling? Like, and you then start. to like figure out whether or not you thought your performance that was like every like as you get towards the end of your run you're like you only have 20 performances left and like it gets sort of stolen from you with the worry and the fear that you had an off night or something that just maybe

didn't quite land or the audience was quieter and did that mean that they weren't as into it and it just like and then you're like out there in the morning doing your like good morning america's and you're talking to all the people and it's it's just you've been on vocal rest normally while you were doing your play for the whole time and now you're out there. Now you're on pounds of steroids and you're campaigning. And as much as I was happy to do it because I was truly, it was like the seven-year-old in me was like, I can't believe this is happening to me.

It still was also like, whew, like. And then I also had to deal with my hunger. Yeah. It made the hunger worse. I think it's so cool of you to admit. Oh, I wanted it and I wanted it very bad. And you deserved it. And honestly, but I was going to say like sometimes I feel like for both your Emmy win

and your Tony win, you were the front runner. I know because of gold derby. We were aware. This episode isn't an ad for gold derby. But this is a big part of like what got me aspirational about all of this. It's like and it felt like going to that site, you could be a part of it. And so when they make you the frontrunner, that feels like almost more pressure. I've been the front runner on that gold derby and not it's not and I've not won.

That's happened a couple of times actually. But, you know, so you kind of have to take it all with it. But it does make, it's like to me. me it's like you're a horse at a race and you've been running the same race and you know you're doing what you're doing and all of a sudden they put like a carrot in front of you and then they just keep moving it further and further away but like you're getting closer and closer and all of a sudden you're so hungry yeah you're like if you don't get me that carrot I'm yet die it's just like I didn't even know the cookie it's like I didn't even know the cookie

I didn't know that it was there and now that I know it's there now I really want it yeah yeah you you know it's so funny where all of a sudden it's the possibility of it makes you you absolutely have to have it. It fucks up your expectation and then it's just... He's been nominated five times. Oh, God. The thing about the horse... Have you won? You've won? I've never won. But the horse is... The horse doesn't know. The horse has no idea what the race is. The horse doesn't know what the race is and the horse is just running it. But you're now atop the horse. But we know the horse. You know the horse and you

were just the horse. But now you're riding on top of the horse. And now you're like, come on. You can do it. And it's like, I'm just tired. I just want to run the race. I know. And you're like, but look at this hoe back here. She's coming up on my heels. And I got to, we got to keep going. And then it puts this whole little thing of competitiveness around it that's just. Not natural to it. I've had some friends of mine who have been like, oh, it turned dark.

It turned dark. It can turn dark. Our friend, your friend, I think, Kate Blanchett was on this podcast. And she like made some headlines because she just expressed something very similar to this. She was like, I think what if we did it where it was just like no cameras around? And then that became a whole story. It's like, oh, no. This is like someone who has been celebrated by this.

contraption of some apparatus. Times over. Yes. And it's like she must be coming from a place of knowledge about this. Yes, it's really, I think it just puts a tiny bit of, and I can just hear like people a bit groaning

being like, oh, cry me a river. But it's like there's something about an artistic pursuit that is worth celebrating the pursuit. Like the pursuit is all. And then when you start putting these other things on it, it starts to become too heavy wears the, whatever that phrase that heavy is the head

that wears the crown. And it's just like, You want so much to not care. And then if you do care, you care too much. And it just becomes this dizzying, vulnerable-making thing that I think we should normalize a little bit where people are just like, aren't you excited? And you're like, I'm scared. I'm hungry. I'm in this dress all the time.

I really want it. I feel like I look old and fat and tired and, you know, it just, it's a whole thing. We were sitting in that room and we loved Mikey Madison and Anora. But when Demi Moore lost, it was kind of just like, the air left. I remember feeling like I wish we hadn't done any of this. I remember being in the audience when Olivia Coleman won the year of Glenn Close and Olivia Coleman thing. And there was an audible sound in the audience. And it wasn't because people weren't excited about Olivia Coleman because it's one of the great performances of all time, the favorite.

But I think this expectation was Glenn was finally going to get her Oscar. Yeah. It was six months of this. And then there she was in this gold guy. It was just incredible. And then it was like there was a sound. There was a sound. And I remember being like, oh, I can't handle this.

This is just... No, it was hard. And, you know, I... It just, there's something about it that... At the same time, I'm like, I can't wait to campaign for one. It means that... I'm just kidding.

That would mean that I was, like, in a movie, I was proud of and excited. Well, I remember you had deserved Buzz for, I think, 12 years of slave, for Carol. I mean, you've been in great films. I've been in some great movies. Yeah. We often think we know our type in dating.

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The kids didn't Come home last night Along the central Texas Plains Teens are dying suicides that don't make sense Strange accidents

and brutal murders In what seems to be A plot Ripped straight Out of Breaking Bad Drugs, alcohol, trafficking

of people There are people out there that absolutely know what happened. Listen to Paper Ghosts, the Texas teen murders on the IHeart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Robert

Smith, and this is Jacob Goldstein, and we used to host a show called Planet Money. And now we're back making this new podcast called Business History about the best ideas and people and businesses in history. And some of the worst people, horrible ideas

and destructive companies in the history of business. Having a genius idea without a need for it is nothing. It's like not having it at all. It's a very simple, elegant lesson. Make something people want. First episode, how Southwest Airlines use cheap seats and free whiskey to fight its way into the airline business. The most Texas story ever. There's a lot of mavericks in that story. We're going to have mavericks on the show. We're going to have plenty of robber barons. So many robber barons. And you know what? They're not all bad. And we'll talk about some of the classic great moments of famous business geniuses, along with some of the darker moments that often get overlooked,

like Thomas Edison and the electric chair. Listen to business history on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What do you think is, because probably nowadays it's a little bit different than it was, obviously, but is it directors that drive you? Because you're in a lot of great ensembles, too. Yeah, I mean, I think the truth is, like, I wish I could pretend that I was the architect of my career in a way.

Like, I don't know about you guys, but I often feel like I just sometimes say yes to something that speaks to me, but I'm not always, I've had conversations with Kate about, like, she is really thinking about a director and she really, and I do sometimes, but like, I'm mostly just so excited that someone wants me to be there, that if it's something I think I can, I mean, I will say the one thing that I think really drives me is actually the level of terror I have about my ability to do it. And that makes you want to? Yes.

And the more terrified I am to do it, the more likely I am to say yes. But there's more like hemming and hawing beforehand. And fear is a big motivator for me to do it. And it's surprising to me because I'm a little bit of a nervous nelly, I would say. So it's weird for me to be saying that. Is the fear in you reading what's on the page and what is happening in the script makes you nervous? Or is the fear in that you're reading it and you don't get it at first? No, it's my fear is that like is what I think.

it is what it is got it's like a combination of like intellectually am i is this hitting where it's am i do i get what is desired here do i i mean like i think about this all the time i haven't auditioned for something in a very very long time and i miss it because when you walk on a set for a job you've auditioned for you know that you were there because what you did for this very thing was the thing that they decided they want you don't walk on and going oh god they asked me to be here because of my Marsha Clark performance and this is a different piece and or they want me here because of some other thing they saw and so then I end up going I don't know if they know what and who it is and if my take on it is right I love that feeling of knowing I've earned a job based on

what I did for that specific job and then I feel more confident starting the day otherwise it feels really I don't know I just it it it it ratchets up my my terror of failing when I have not earned it But it might like, you know. And then have, because this is the thing that I've expressed to, let's say, my team. Yeah. And they're just like, oh, yeah, sure. I'm like, I would love to audition. Like, please don't ever tell anyone that I don't audition.

Like, I don't read for stuff. I would love to read for something. And they're like, yeah, yeah, yeah, whatever. Still haven't in a while. Yeah. And I almost kind of want to do it for this exact reason. Like, have you, has this been a thing that you've talked about with your people where it's like, no, but Sarah, like.

I did say it recently, I feel like, but on some level now, the other part is like, everything's happening on Zoom. So it's like, I think about the number of jobs that I got in my early career, which were not many, but when I got them, it was because of my experience in the room and a director going, could you try this? And then I did try it. And they either liked it or whatever, but like, or my little banter with them as I was leaving the room or whatever it was, it happened because of a personal connection in the

room, some sort of thing of. And I remember. Yeah, you collaborated. I remember auditioning for the Goldfinch, which was a movie nobody saw, but one of my favorite books and I got the job but the director wouldn't cast me until we had a FaceTime or we were supposed to see each other in person but we couldn't because he was like

I don't have people on my set I've never like sat down and had a conversation with because what if that's a vibe where it's like not going to be great for a myriad of reasons but like that that was the last time I auditioned and the last time I had an experience where a director was like it's important

to me to have actual contact with you before you're on my set just in case you know who knows what all the reason will have to make it makes a lot of sense to me yeah you have to I think the most important thing that you realize once you start working more is that people just get it and we can move on so taking a note and applying it quickly yeah is one of the most important things and it's how you can tell that a person can move quickly and think quickly right because that's what you need on a set where you're doing you know especially television it's like

you're doing 10 pages of dialogue in a day yeah that's why the self tapes of it all I just think are a bad way to do it I don't know how anybody gets a job I'm just like the self-tape thing is a nightmare. I don't, I don't, I don't, I don't think I've ever met anyone who like to listen to the sound of their voice, like on a voice memo or on a recording of any kind. It's hard. And then just take your face, blow it up on the thing and then be like, deal with it. And it's just really, it's not. Or imagine being like, yep. Yeah. There I am all big. Nisi, Nishy Nash is like that. All I want to do is just a little dose of Nisi Nash who just is like, I look great. And you're like, you do. I love it. And she's goddamn right. She's

goddamn right. Yeah. And I'm like, just touch me a little bit. Just let some of it rub off on me. I don't have that. The Nisi Renaissance is one of my favorite renaissance. Getting on was one of them. I mean, did you guys say, I mean, what can a person do to get getting on back on the

air? With Lori Meccaff, the greatest, the greatest actress in the world to me, Lori McKef, just get it back on now. Alex Borstein, I mean. So good. I mean, I think TikTok was kind of having fun with the whole, like, when like they're trying to, they're talking to the translating. Yeah, yeah, that was really.

Getting on, like, was. was what happened right before all three of them, like, re-popped off again, because that was right before Lady Bird. Yeah. It was before, um, and before Maisel. Maisel.

And then Nisi in everything. Everything. That's right. Dommer winning the Emmy. Yeah, yeah, all of it. All of it. Oh, I love it. I love a Nisi Renaissance.

Do you have a favorite Oscar win? Oh, a favorite Oscar win. It's a big question. I don't know that I do. Oh, I've got one. I've got one. Mine is a little basic, but it's Julia Roberts, Aaron,

Brocovich. That's just one of my favorite. Big movie star, Big movie star performance, but it was in a grounded Soderberg thing. I just liked that it just that she won for it. She won for it after all of her stuff. God. I'm going to share this one because it called me by surprise, but I loved it.

At the time, I was like, I can't believe they voted for that. And I'm obsessed that they did was Tilda Swinton and Michael Clayton. Oh, she went for Michael Clayton. Yep. That's a good one. Do you remember at the end of that movie when he's walking away from her because he's told her like, I got you and she just collapses. I was like

I was like yeah Tulsa went Delta yeah and Catherine James in Chicago because it's so

performance I just love a music I love when a musical comes through and just perfectly matched I guess I'm going to say Jessica Lang in Tootsy

because it is an extraordinarily special performance and she should have won for Francis now you can't beat Merrill Streep

and Sophie's Choice it's not that was the same year So Jessica was nominated. I think is, is it possible? Wait, Jessica, was Jessica nominated for two Academy Awards in the same year? I think she may have been one of those. Meryl Streep won for Sophie's Choice and the other nominees, this is good.

Jessica Lang, Francis, Tissy Space, like missing. Deborah Winger, Officer and a gentleman, and Julia, Andrews, Victor, Victoria. Right, and did Jessica win for Tutsi that same year for supporting actress? Let's look, 1982, um, this award. Awards. Best supporting actress was Jessica Lange, so I'm right about this. Thank you. I like my Oscar stuff.

Have you been Louis Vertel? No. Oh, I think I have. You guys have the same. I got it in there. I got it in there. And Jessica Lang, I think the reason I think that performance is so underrated. I mean, she won an Oscar, so not that underrated.

But like in terms of like why people don't necessarily know, it's just playing the girl in a movie like that with Dustin Hoffman being an absolute like next level genius. And to have this sparkly, she was so sparkly. And just like, but it was also the juxtaping. position of that performance with Francis, which her performance in Francis is one of the, for me, unparalleled. I think it's really and Kim Stanley. Kim Stanley, who is my favorite

actress at all time, who played her mother in that movie. Kim Stanley was my wallpaper on my phone for a very long time, and there's a very great book called The Female Brando about Kim Stanley. She's really extraordinary. She did so few movies, but she did a lot of stuff on stage. But she's, remember, she calls her little sister in that movie.

She's her mother. I mean, it's really... I've never seen Frances. You've got to get it. I mean, just let's please watch it. And the next time I see you, just tell me that you know what I'm talking. You will quiz your ass because it's really some of the best acting ever. Oh, so they make so few movies like that now. So right after you, Jennifer Lawrence is coming in and we just watched Die My Love. Oh, I can't wait to see it.

It's like Cassavetics. Oh, great. It's women under the influence. Yeah, it's another great performance. I mean, it's one of those things that's just like, oh. Like who won over Jenna Rollins for Woman Under the Influence? God, this is a really good question. 74.

That's the hero is born. Okay, so who won it? That was Ellen Burstyn, for Alice doesn't live here anymore. Okay, I'm going to say something really unpopular. Okay. That was incorrect. And that was the year after she had lost for The Exorcist. Well, she was excellent in both movies.

She was beyond excellent in Alice doesn't live here anymore. Nobody could be better. She's an extraordinary actress. Jenna Rowland's performance in a woman under the influence is just like somebody walking a tightrope a thousand miles above sea level. It's just not, it's not normal. No. It's, I mean, I'm not saying that Ellen Burstyn shouldn't have won an Oscar.

I mean, am I going to go to jail for not? Yeah, but decades later, she would deserve it for Requiem. Beyond the pale and did not get it, right? Yeah, did not get it. Was she nominated? She was nominated, but I believe that was the year of Helen Hunt. Hold on, wait. Oh, God.

Let me see this. Wow, so this is when it gets so crazy. I know. That's so, and this is why Holland's point is to be really, really, really, taken. How can someone measure that Alice doesn't live here's performance is better than this performance? And that Ellen Burstyn in Requiem does not best Helen Hunt in...

I lied. Ellen Burstyn lost to Julia Roberts for Aaron Brockovich. This was 2000. Damn. Well, they put her in lead? They did. She should have been in supporting. I think it was the Ellen Burston of it all that made her pushed.

She should have been in supporting and she would have went. Does category fraud drive you crazy? It does, but I feel like I've committed it. Where? When? I feel like on horror story once. It's not my fault. It gets decided.

Oh, that they put you in supporting. Sometimes I was put in lead because I technically qualified to be in it. Yeah. Because maybe the supporting actor category is going to be too crowded. So someone at the studio made a decision to put me in the other one. And then I did get nominated in that category. I think it was the right thing. But I don't, like, what's the worst, what's the most egregious version of category for the

worst that you and you know what's weird? In a reverse way, Anthony Hopkins is only in Silence of the Lambs for a little bit over 10 minutes in one best actor. Sure. Whoa. Yeah. Because that movie is all Jody Foster. Yeah. And she won too, right?

It is what it is. I understand why it happens. I understand why it happens too, but it's just, this is why we should just abolish it all. Well, that's have a party. Just like have a party. Everybody's nominated. You all get your certificate.

Everybody should get a statue. You get your Oscar first and then we'll abolish. Exactly. Thank you. This is my thing because I do agree it's getting weird, especially like the Golden Globes or whatever, but like the comedy drama placements. Like the Emmys, it's like, okay,

some of these things that go cold comedies. It's like so silly. I almost feel like everyone shows up to the awards and it's a surprise. Yes, like five awards get given out. You're nominated. You're nominated. You know what I mean? You're like I think that's, I think that's really true.

Something should change. Something should change. This is why we have our fake, goofy fun award show. Which I wanted to go to this past year, but I was out of town, but I wanted to go desperately. If we get our, if we have our druthers, we do it as many years as they let us. Why wouldn't they let us? you do it again and again. Wasn't it a delicious success? It was fun. We, you know how

it is. But basically, like, we, when we were reaching out to people for the culture awards, we didn't know who was actually out of town or who was like, what the fuck is that? Oh, no, I wasn't in town. I would have 100% been there. Okay, well, next year. Allegedly. Allegedly, alleged. Allegedly. Allegedly. Another really good title of that.

Alesidly. Yes. Elesidly is fun. But anyway, you're right. I mean, I think we've actually gotten this is helpful information, because I think when Kate was here in talking about this, like, of Of course, the nuance got taken out of it for the headline. Oh, yes. But I think this, like, let's please, y'all, EWs and ETs of the world, let's just really, like. Let's rein it in.

Let's rain it and do this conversation justice. You know what I mean? I think it's because we care. Don't wait because we care about it. It's because it should be real. It does matter to me in the sense that, like, little me watch the Tony Awards, watch the Oscars, watch the Emmys. Like, I watched them, like, was obsessed with them and planned out, political and mapped out. You want to know why we have Viola Day.

today being a lead actress because she was nominated for doubt because there was room for her in a supporting category that allowed a nine minute performance that was that outstanding to be nominated and so now she is the powerhouse Viola Davis that we have because she was an Oscar nominee. I have a whole thing that I want to do with petitioning SAG about this because I really feel there should be that the SAG Awards in particular they do everything everybody goes into one category so supporting actors are in the leading like you can't but why lump in it's ridiculous It's like also all the supporting actors, like there is not, it's like the buttress of a building. It's like the building cannot stand without, it's like you need all of it.

And I just feel like there's a real diminishment of a supporting actor by way of not giving like space, room and opportunity. And also the career change that it can affect if all of a sudden you're, you give a nine minute performance and something that is outstanding. And then you find yourself in the same conversation with these actors who have been around forever and who you all of a sudden are, have an opportunity to make a better living. You get more opportunity. It's just about the opportunity. So it's like. And then within 15 years, you fully egot. That's right.

You know what I mean? If you're Viola Davis. If you're Viola Davis. Which, there are so, there are so many talented people out there that deserve, the supporting stuff drives me nuts because I'm like, that's where the character actors get the time. That's where sometimes the best work is happening. 100%. I agree.

Every time. I do, just before we go, want to connect you guys on the Studio 60 and SNL. Oh, yeah. Because that was such an incredible show and undersung show. and your performance in that, I think, really put you on the map in six, seven, eight, nine, ten ways. You know what I mean? Yeah. It did, except for, yeah, I think a lot of people didn't think I was funny on it, which is fair.

But it was a drama about a sketch show. And also, like, Aaron wasn't, like, didn't, Aaron, who is Aaron Sorkin, who is a genius. Genius. But, like, didn't have any writers there doing any, like, sketch writing. He was doing all of it. So, like, based on, like, some of the things I did in my audition were, like, I imitated this person and I imitated that person. And I could do my impressions and things. but, like, it wasn't, it just didn't really become about that, you know,

but, like, also, every single time my character came on screen, it was like somebody was talking about how this, like, I was the Kristen Whig of the show, like, the world's, you know, I'm Gilderraten, like, the funniest sketch performance. And then, like, they never gave me any sketches to do. And then, like, some people were like, we don't get this. I was doing an amazing dramatic performance. Exactly. And they're like, what is this? But, you know, I was really playing Kristen Chenoweth.

Yeah. Who was Aaron Sorkin's love at the time. And so, like, that was, it's, you know. Yeah, it was just a, so she was conservative. And then Matthew Perry was playing this sort of Aaron character. And it was just really. And I thought that show was going to last for ever. It was sexy.

Because it was right after Friends, right after the West Wing. And it was like, well, look at me, walking up to this, right in this moment. And then, sure enough. Yeah, sure enough. Nobody cared. What year did you move to L.A. after? I moved to L.A. in 1998. Sheek. Great year, it seems like.

1988. 1998, 1999, 98, 98, 98, 98, I think. When Hollywood was. When Hollywood, yeah. But it's like, I kind of missed, like, back in the day, like, when we were coming up, it's like, okay, like, pilot season. Pilot season. Pilot season.

I got one and a half in and then it died. Oh, yeah. Because I moved out there, what, 2018? Yeah. No, we were still pilot season serious and, like, seeing all the same girls. It obviously audition and, like, going into, like, I remember when I went to test for Down with Love this movie I did with. Oh, yes, of course.

Yes. And it was like, Tina Fey. Like me and Allison Janney and Courtney Cod. It was just like pulling up and seeing so-and-so walk to their car and Zach Braff was in there reading with a bunch of people. And then this one came in to read with this one. And it was just like. Something glamorous.

And it was like, oh, it was a very different thing. And they were mixing and matching and putting different people. And it was a whole thing where you would like be confronted with your competition. And you learn a lot. And, you know, remember testing for a pilot against Hillary Swank. Wow. Like, oh, yeah, it was like a real, there was like a sea of us. And now, like, we never see everybody anymore except for like, you don't see each other in the trenches anymore.

You used to be like, look at us all out here. Like, we were in our bathrooms this morning, like, la la, la, like putting on our makeup and running our lines and in the car, like practicing your stuff. And then getting there and asking for a highlighter and, you know, all that stuff signing in and seeing who had been there before you. And those days are gone. Yeah, the la la land. Yeah. The la la la la way is not a thing anymore. Yeah, exactly.

I never needed anyone. There was a time when I would be in multiple waiting rooms for auditions with, for some reason, Leslie Bibb. And I'm like, Elle, I love that. The two of us being, like, we weren't up for the same cards. Me also. Also, Leslie Bibb also. I'm sure. But for me and Leslie Bibb to be in the same audition. He was hilarious.

Again and again? But I was like, well, she would never remember this. But it's like, I bet she would remember. I bet she would remember. I don't think so cool. She's cool. She's the coolest. We often think we know our.

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on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Robert Smith. This is Jacob Goldstein. And we used to host a show called Planet Money. And now we're back making this new podcast called Business History about the best ideas and people and businesses in history. And some of the worst people. Horrible ideas and destructive.

companies in the history of business. Having a genius idea without a need for it is nothing. It's like not having it at all. It's a very simple, elegant lesson. Make something people want. First episode, how Southwest Airlines use cheap seats and free whiskey to fight its way into the airline business. The most Texas story ever.

There's a lot of mavericks in that story. We're going to have mavericks on the show. We're going to have plenty of robber barons. So many robber barons. And you know what? They're not all bad. And we'll talk about some of the classic great. moments of famous business geniuses

along with some of the darker moments that often get overlooked, like Thomas Edison and the electric chair. Listen to business history on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Am I every time? This is our one-minute segment

where we take exactly that amount of time to dress something down in culture that's got us twisted and we've come to the reality portion of the episode because I got a bone to pick with an icon. Okay. This is not Roder's. I don't think so, honey, and his time starts now. I don't think so, honey, Jeff

Probst, you're not going to get away with calling Parvety Shallow a one and a half time winner of Survivor. Incorrect. She won two times. She won Micronesia and you know that. Yep. And she just won Australian Survivor which is, I'm going to say it, not only more difficult version of Survivor, but a better produced

version of Survivor. The besties of Survivor. American Survivor, you better get it together because they are lapping you. They're outclassing you. around the world. Do not play with me about parv. Don't get with parv. I've got a lot to say

about the amount of twists in the show. I'm a diehard fan of the show for gears and I just, I don't think it's getting better. So for you to pick on one of the great iconic winners of the show I think just because she went and did traitors and that pisses you off. Don't show, don't show

that you're insecure, Jeff. Oh, no. Because I will get you on this podcast. I don't think so, honey, nothing but respect for the queen, Parvety. Love you. Love you. That's one minute. Listen.

That is a tough fact to follow. I mostly, like, really liked your energy. I really like, I just, yeah. I don't like it. Are you a survivor person? In the beginning, I watched Survivor. You're a housewife's person. I'm a housewife's person in a major way.

So what are your recent thoughts? I mean, I'm obsessed with Salt Lake. I think I don't know what anybody, what I did to deserve it. but I am here for it. What did any of us do? What did any of us do? What did we do? Because this is, this is giving me,

I don't know what's going on with Lisa Barlow. I don't know. She's going through something. There's a meltdown happening. And the stuff with her and John, I'm a little bit like, what is that going to be?

Credit card fraud. We don't know. Whatever's happening with Bronwyn. I don't know. That came out of nowhere. And something is sealed and we can't discuss it, she was saying.

And I was like, what is sealed? She's like, it's sealed. I think it's probably because something happens. Yeah, but like what? Like, what would that? Like I think you can surprise yourself with like what is categorized as like male fraud. Like some things are weird and it might be something weird. Well, you're a lawyer now.

I'm Esquire now. But I'm just saying. Carrington Lane would know. Carrington Lane would definitely know. And she, yeah, she wouldn't be friends with any of them. She would hate them all. Yeah, no. Maybe she'd hang out with Mary a little bit.

And I'm, I can't figure out why does Angie talk so slow? Why does Angie? Everything with Angie. Well, it's very, it's, it's the speed. It's the speed and it's the gesturing. You know that you are my closest friend here. Right. And I'm like.

Also, did you notice this about her? Something that's become very apparent is that the way she turns. The side eye is very good. Someone did a super good. Angie Kay, our favorite. Our favorite. Yeah, I love Angie Kay. But like, why are we?

Why is everything? Well. And when she thinks she's giving a very, like a big diss, it's like she does it in this way that is so normal. Yeah. Like you are the. Jen Shaw. I mean, you're like, is that supposed to be like a gauntlet thrown?

Like, what are we throwing down? I can't. It's just, but I'm, I am the way I eat it up. Of course. I mean, I just can't get enough of it. I think that Angie K solidified, obviously high body count hair was great. High body. You know what doesn't get respected?

Trampoline with eyes. Trampoline with eyes. Trampoline with eyes is so good. High body count hair, but trampling with eyes. But also, I mean, I just watched the one with Brittany and her daughter. And that was, I just want to bring it down for one second and just say. Yeah. This is really, I felt sad because what I can't understand about Britney is why she's always like, okay.

Yeah. Everything is like, I know. I do. When Whitney was like, do you should want to deal with your daughter. And she's like, I do. I do. And I'm just like, something's, is everything okay with Britney? It has to cut through a lot of noise that has been like.

You mean the sound of like a flatline? It's like an emotional flatline. It's like, is there? I'm like, hello, is this on. Someone's there. Her daughter's like, I just. And the idea that she was this great mom and that like it's almost it's really hard when you have when you're 12 and like you lose your mother to another person who isn't even your dad. Yeah, a guy who's obviously like love bombing and gaslighting her again, a total narcissist.

They gave her daughter a confession. I thought that was wild. Have they ever given a friend of daughter a confessional? But I feel like Brittany isn't a friend of anymore. I feel like something's happening to us. No. We're being given more Britney. She's main cast now, right?

I think she's a big spot. You do? She deserves this spot. I think for her to really, like, have a footprint on that show with that cast, that stacked cast, I think she deserves it. Why not? Okay. Is there anybody you'd pull away? Oh, this is so hard.

Really tough. I wouldn't do that now. I wouldn't do that. Not more. You want to know what? Maybe last year I thought Whitney felt absent. Agreed. But this year, I think she's having a great season.

I'm really into Whitney right now. Yes. I'm into, like, her being like, everything fell apart. Also, what about, it's the way she says? Oh, God. What is it? Second day? No, no, no.

She says, I fell. Everything is, instead of feel, it's fell. I fell. And he tells. Telling journey. It's my helling journey. I'm still healing. I'm still helling.

Who are you on recently on watch what happened? Who of your most recent? I'm going on on Wednesday with Bronwyn. I'm on. I was last on with Heather. And he's been on with Angie. So we share Angie K. I was on with Heather Gay, Lisa Renna,

Dorinda, who still to my debt, to this day to me is like iconic. Yes. We recently sent a picture. I've, in fact, it was recent as last night, of Dorinda and Luann together. And all I can say is that the photo had sexual tension in it. Okay, well, Luan came to my, both of them came to my play. Luan came to my play and that was something.

Yeah, she's something. She is really something. She's a star. She's a star. Definitely. I mean, she sang a little bit for me. Did she? She did.

At your show. And my show, because a friend of mine is my friend Carla Gallo is obsessed with her and I videoed her and it was like she thought she was, doing a cameo is what it felt like. She was like, darling, darling cat. She's done so much. And I was like, it's just my friend on the face. It's really not.

But I was here for it. Have you ever gotten a Housewives cameo? No. Like Jamie Lee Curtis style and like go there with like, remember when she went on? Do you remember when Jamie Lee Curtis was on? She went on Beverly Hills. And she like brought her my hand in your stuff. I mean like a cabio like a like a like a like a video message.

Oh no. Because you know the literal cameo. Oh, like a literal cameo. Oh, no one's ever sent that to me, but I'm relying on you to do that. We won't do that for you. I'll pick. Who would it be? We got one from... Dorinda.

Dorinda. Joel Kimbooster sent us one so that he could ask us to be in his wedding party, and I got Dolores Katania. Oh, my God. Loved. Amazing. Love Dolores. I mean, I just love the housewives.

I'm very grateful for them to... I mean, they used to help me survive a jet blue flight to New York is really how I started it. When I would watch the OC from the beginning and just like five hours later, it'd be like, in New York don't want to get off the plane. Right. I'm glued. I always appreciated your love. for Bravo and Housewives, vis-a-vis you being this incredible actor because I was just like,

well, it has to be, it has to be informative. There's some part of me that is really fascinated by, you know, the thing you think when you read something and you go, no one would ever do this. Who would behave this way? And you're like, oh, no, there is no end to what people will do or how they will behave. And the minute you decide that it's like an impossibility, it's like all the more. And this show to me is like evidence of that on a daily basis. And I'm just fascinated by this human behavior. No, you couldn't make up Jen Shaw. You couldn't make up Ron. You couldn't make up Mary. You couldn't make up any of them.

No, you certainly couldn't make up Mary. Their heads like over here. Like, why is it on the side? Why is it on the side? We rewatch this weekend. I just don't know. We just did. You can leave Palm Springs.

Security security. You can leave. If you're looking for the best episode of Housewives, it is all tricks, no trust in that season. The Palm Springs episode at the Trixie Motel. And I did ask Heather Gay directly if she was peeing or if that was vomit. Both. I think it's both. She's not sure.

She don't remember. I don't think she remembers. I don't think she remembers, but I. She's a friend. I think yeah I she thinks it was vomit and I think it was too liquid it was too liquid

it was coming I think it was also coming from so low I just feel like it was like the way like the way it was coming out the force force like yeah yeah the pressure was like too low if it came that high

came up from high enough it would have been viscous yeah and it also would have like lost its power down and it had a lot of force totally I think we should revisit it because we're scientists we literally like I would watch

it once a week. Also, our friend Jared watches the OC reunion that's about Brooks. He like watches it to go to bed. He's like, he can't like do it unless it's the not, unless that thing is on. I'm like, um, Vicki's daughter. Oh God. What's her name? Jesus. Coming out and like, like, whenever it's like a conflict between a mother and their child on a reunion. I'm like, oh, it's too good. Gone too far, but I love it more. Are you ready? I know. I've got a simple one. This is. Bowen Yang's, I don't think so, honey. His time will begin now. I don't think so many movie theater seats costing the same across the board in the same room.

If it's front two rows, it better not cost anything more than $5, let's say. If I'm on the sides, it should be a little bit cheaper. If it's centered, it should be more expensive. Let's tear them out like theater. I'm not saying we, like, price, you know, stratify this in a certain way, but I'm just saying, like, let's treat it like a theater because that's what it is. Let's give it orchestra seating. Not that there's an orchestra, but you know, like, let's, there are certain seats that are objectively better than others in the theater.

We should pay accordingly, make them more affordable for some people. Make them, make the, make the, if there's, if the theater has a center aisle, then we, then we forget about it. And let's just, let's just call the whole thing off. Let's just shut it down. But I'm saying, if movie theater seats are all priced the same, then that just kind of flattens the experience of the movie going at all. Let's just, let's just, let's give it some meaning. Let's give it some interest again. I think five seconds.

Wouldn't save the industry. but it could go towards helping it. That's one minute. And that's one minute. I, a thousand percent agree with this. It's common sense. It's common sense.

Come on. And I would pay the extra for the thing where I would also be like, if it's the front two rows, I don't want to pay. Sometimes that's all that's left. And I'm like, well, I'm not paying $15. To have my neck and like to need a massage afterwards. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Also, I have an issue with, this is about theater, but previews, the tickets costing the same as during the run because it was gypsy. And look how that turned out

I saw the third preview It was not ready You know who was ready Audra of course Audra was perfect Never not But the thing is I was just like And then I heard it got so much better

I did end up seeing it like again I heard it got better So I went again And I was like See now this justifies the price Yep All right Are you ready

This is the opportunity for you to shred You ready Well I don't like the pressure But I've got some shit to say Okay This is Sarah Paulson's I don't think so honey her time starts now.

Okay, I don't think so, honey, that the pigeon is a rat with wings. I feel very, very triggered by this. I want you to understand something about a pigeon. Pigeons have been taught to be near us to carry our messages to our loved ones. Pigeons have been, they mate for life, first of all. They are not dirty.

We made them our city dwellers so that we could get them to take information to far away lands, to stop wars, to tell somebody you love them. They were our messengers of our heart, our minds, our brains. it was their job to do work for us

and we have had them now in the city people step on them people run them over they don't care they don't feed them they give them their trash they talk about them

the way they are talked about the way they are talked about they are talked about as if they are disgusting yes they mate for life I watched a pigeon I watched a pigeon make a nest for a cat

just out of the goodness of its heart you know what that cat didn't try to eat that pigeon that pigeon hate must be stopped I'm calling on the world to stop hating on the pigeon. And that's one minute. Thank you.

This is a movement, not a moment. This is a movement, not a moment. What the fuck did pigeons ever do to you? Pigeons didn't do anything to you. They're not seagulls. They're not seagulls. They are not seagulls. They're not, and they would never take your bagel.

They don't want your bagel. They want to sit on your shoulder and they want you to tell them about your day. That's what they want. And then if you would like to go give a message to Matthew across town, they will happily take it. They will take it there and they will deliver it to him in a scroll.

You could write it up. Yep. They'll take it in their... Do that. Send a carrier pigeon to give him the next message. Just let's put the pigeons back to work. They need to work.

They need to work. Tuppence a bag. Tubbins a bag. Tuppins a bag. Tuppins. They're doves. They're doves. And you wouldn't do this to doves.

They're doves in a beautiful, iridescent, like, movie egg plant thing with a little bit of green on their heads. They love each other forever. They pick a person and love each other forever. How could we treat them so terribly? They're monogamous. They're monogamous. Monogamous people.

Thank you. I'm about to cry. Love a pigeon. Guess what I grew up with? What? Grand Theft Auto 4. There is a whole side mission in that game where you all know what I'm talking about? Flying rats, Nick knows.

Flying rats and they're pigeons? You have to go, you have to go shoot them. I've been incentivized to shoot these birds. Next time you look at that bird in life, just remember, that pigeon used to do your work for you. That pigeon sent a text for you. sent your email, delivered it lovingly. Bless the pigeons.

Thank you. You're welcome. Bless the pigeons. A third option for title of that. He didn't think we'd have this many. Well, that was amazing. This is a true. I mean, I felt like in an extended conversation with you,

I'm like, oh, this is a real savant of the culture of the industry. Yeah. Thank you for sharing his opinion. Interesting. I just really. You love the stuff. I love, I mean, We know when Krista Miliani won the Emmy for the, which is like, I love acting.

And she screamed, I love acting. And I swear to God, I went like this out of my chair. I levitated because it was like, there is a person saying what is in my heart out loud and being celebrated for it. And it's like puts her hand in the air and it's like woo wooing to I love acting. It's like she rocks. She just rocks the Casbah and every other Casbah, whatever anybody rocks. And she rocks the Casbah every time out. Always and always has the voice of an angel to do you see her in one.

Of course. It's just like next level. She's next level in every way. She's the coolest. She's the coolest person, but was able to stand there and say, I love acting. And I swear to God, I was like, everything's going to be okay. That's my shit. That's my shit.

And I was like, I feel seen. I know who I am in the world when a person can do that. And people are excited about it. And so, like, I just feel like normalizing excitement about what you love. I don't care how, like, silly someone decides it is. And it's so cringe because you love it. It's like, you know what's cringe? Thinking everything's so uncool.

I'm just like. Guess what's cool. Being passionate is cool. Loving what you do is cool. Recognizing that you get to do something that you love and that people are like, yes, you get to do it. And I'm like, I know how lucky I am. I have friends who are more challenges than I could ever dream of being who do not have jobs. So just love it.

Love it because you get to do it. Love it if you don't get to do it. Just keep loving it. And you know who's loving it? All of you because you're probably streaming all's fair. I guess at least one episode is out now. Yes. And this...

Three, I think three are out now. Okay, great. First three come. First three. I love releasing like, you want three because basically the beginning is like letting you know who everybody is and that takes a minute

and then you got to get into it. So you got to like ride past one, learn who we all are. Yeah. Get to know. Basically, like, I don't know if you've seen the trailer, but the trailer is like... Yeah.

It's this much. It's a lot. And it's a lot. And it's a lot. You know what that's what I want out of the show. No, I'm telling you. You're going to get maximalism. There's nothing about this.

that is, I mean, I call Kim Kardashian beef curtains on national television. As you walk through a vaginal hallway. I walk through a cervical, a clown cervix. A clown cervix, that's what you say. Beef curtains. Emerald Green. Emerald Green.

I call, I call Glenn Close, um, George Washington. On national television. It's like, what more do you want? What more do you want? We love it. Mayor McHead Cheese. I call them that too. I mean, like, it's really.

Good stuff. Head cheese. I don't want to ever hear head cheese on a TV show except if it's all fair. Mayor McHead Cheese. And with that, we end. every episode with a song. Why is it this? Do you know this song?

There's always tomorrow when dreams will come true. Yeah, why is it that? I don't know, but it was an episode of Saturday Night Live with Kristen Wigg and Fred Armisen doing the thing where they were trying to sing the songs together and they don't know the song.

Yeah, it was that. Garth and Katz. Bye. Yeah. Lost Culture Reast is the production by Will Ferrell's Big Money Players and Iheart Radio podcasts. Created and hosted by Matt Rogers and Boweneg.

Executive produced by Anna Hosnier and produced by Becker Ramos. Edited and next by Duck Bame. And our music is by Henry Keperski. In the heat of battle, your squad relies on you. Don't let them down. Unlock Elite Gaming Tech at Lenovo.com. Dominate every match with next level speed, seamless streaming, and performance that won't quit.

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