Las Culturistas with Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang - "Gay Ne Sais Quoi" (w/ Janeane Garofalo)

Episode Date: February 7, 2018

She's an absolute icon and NOT Generation X! The hilarious Janeane Garofalo stops by the studio before Matt & Bowen depart for Orlando to weave a brilliant tapestry of her cultural upbringing and to discuss the insanity of American politics, the sweeping generalizations of social media, and the challenges we face now that the world's gone DIGITAL. It's a thoughtful, fun, and dare I say enlightening conversation that will make you laugh AND think at the same time!What else? Stories from Season 7 of 24? (Cherry Jones has the gravitas!) Crushes from the set of Wet Hot American Summer? A song about Space Mountain? It's time...LISTEN!LAS CULTURISTAS HAS A PATREON! For $5/month, you get exclusive access to WEEKLY Patreon-ONLY Las Culturistas content!!https://www.patreon.com/lasculturistasSUBSCRIBE ON APPLE PODCASTS TODAY!CONNECT W/ LAS CULTURISTAS ON FACEBOOK & TWITTER for the best in "I Don't Think So, Honey" action, updates on live shows, conversations with the Las Culturistas community, and behind-the scenes photos/videos:www.facebook.com/lasculturistastwitter.com/lasculturistasLAS CULTURISTAS IS A FOREVER DOG PODCASTforeverdogpodcasts.com/las-culturistas Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This fall on Bravo. It's time to turn up. Think you've seen it all? I don't think you've been a good friend to me lately. We're friends like that, who needs enemies? You ain't seen nothing yet. Cheers to being Germanic. With the Real Housewives of Potomac.

Oh my gosh, can I take this in? It's gonna be amazing. New York City. Everyone is a gossip. No one gets a happier life. Salt Lake City. We don't wear costumes, we wear fashion. And below deck sailing out.

You broke the rules and now you're here getting upset. Watch all new seasons on Bravo or stream it on City TV+. On Thanksgiving Day, 1999, five-year-old Cuban boy Elian Gonzalez was found off the coast of Florida. And the question was, should the boy go back to his father in Cuba? Mr. Gonzalez wanted to go home and he wanted to take his son with him. Or stay with his relatives in Miami. Imagine that your mother died trying to get you to freedom. Listen to Chess Peace, the Elian Gonzalez story on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. talking football. Every week, we're discussing our favorite players of all times from legends

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and I'm the host of On Purpose. My latest episode is with Jelly Roll. This episode is one of the most honest and raw interviews I've ever had. We go deep into Jelly Roll's life story from being in and out of prison from the age of 13 to being one of today's biggest artists.

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Wow. Bowen, look over there. Wow, is that culture? Yes. Oh, my goodness. Wow. Las Culturistas. Ding dong, Las Culturistas calling.

And here's the deal. Okay. You hear our voices, and I can tell you from where we're speaking right now, we are currently in Dumbo, Brooklyn. But when you're listening to this, we will be in Orlando, Florida. That's not necessarily true. Well, you know, if you're listening on the day of release. Well, okay, just metaphysically, we're not going to be in Dumbo is what Matt's trying to say.

Right. But as you guys know, I don't know my words, but I do know my heart. And I hope that you're listening on the day of release. And I have a feeling people are going to be excited about this episode. Of course. And if you are, I'm going to say what is it probably noon sure if you're listening at noon on the day of release we will probably if our fast pass is followed yes just be getting off space mountain absolutely we're doing a noon space mountain because that's the time to do it if i'm correct about my itinerary

that i created sure sure sure and i think i am am because I do invest a lot of energy into this. You are fastidious in your planning for Disney World. Bowen is, of course, pulling the word fastidious from a recent audition breakdown that we both got. And they were trying to say gay without saying gay. So they said fastidious. They're weaponizing the word against us. Right, right, right. So you know what?

Why not throw it back and take back the power? Absolutely. We're two fastidious boys who are in Orlando, perhaps currently, depending on when you're listening. Exactly. Well, you guys, we're so excited. And having a great time. And having a great time.

We assume. And for those of you who are joining us on Patreon, thank you so much. We're having a blast on there so far. So please keep tuning in. Maybe throw $ dollars our way five bucks it's nothing it's a latte which everyone says right like that's the price point it's a coffee it's a coffee if you tip if you tip that's the rule today i spent 475 on a coffee it's too much it's too much it's too much anyway you know what it was a fine coffee okay good all right

good right great um we have really a truly incredible guest today. Don't jump around it. Icon. Icon. You know what? I was going to ask her this. And here's the thing. You shake your head and get bashful, but you are.

And I have a question that's just a rephrasing of what a friend of the show, John Early, asked her one time at the Ally Coalition, at an Ally Coalition event. But, you know, we'll get into this. We'll get into that question. let's go through the credits i mean they come rolling down as we say reality bites which wikipedia says solidified her as a icon of generation x wikipedia quoted someone else as a secondary source okay so this is already something to get into here what the hell i don't even know what our generation is i know know millennial, but it seems broad. I don't know.

Okay. All I know is the Spice Girls did a Pepsi ad and they said, Generation X. And even with them, I was very unclear

who they were talking to. We were in that window. Anyway, Wet Hot American Summer, baby. Both the movie and both series on Netflix. Uh-huh, uh-huh. Romy and Michelle's

High School Reunion. Perhaps my favorite Mystery Men. And you haven't seen Mystery Men, which I just... I which i just haven't mystery man well thanks for outing me right in front of her listen we can't all see everything but you should have seen mystery of course i should have um the larry sanders show the ben stiller show the west wing and 24 which i have to get into it with her about 24 because all right everyone please it please. It's time. You should stand up. And I come, as we said. Please welcome Janine Garofalo. Oh, thank you.

Thank you for having me. Hi, Janine. Hi. First, I'm not Gen X. What Gen? I'm the tail end of the Baby Boomers. I was playing a Gen X. I was 29 at the time, playing a 20 or a 21-year-old.

The rest of the cast was Gen X. One No No was firmly a Gen X. But I actually was 29. So what's the tension between Reppers being the poster child for this generation? I don't think I am the poster child for that generation. At the time in the 90s, I guess I was lumped in with that. But I always tried to say i i i'm much older than i mean i can't i can't take that mantle but um i guess if there's a poster person for it it would

be winona she i think probably is the poster child of that and you know we recently have seen all these commercials about the comeback have you you seen these perfume commercials with her? I saw it once, yeah. It was pretty amazing. It's this commercial that's like, once in a generation. It's like this kind of comeback-centric perfume ad, and then you see it's Winona. And I didn't know who it was going to be. It looked like Natalie Portman from the back.

And then it was Winona, and I was like, absolutely 100%. But also, she didn't go anywhere. She was in Black Swan, among other things. She was more artsy films and also by choice. Yes. She was around. But she was definitely around.

But it's very strange. A comeback, they would say Will Smith, who is sitting here. I remember once in a preview for a film he did will smith's comeback are you kidding me yeah he's ubiquitous absolutely has been for years absolutely no i mean that's not a comeback now i don't call it a comeback don't call it a comeback i do want to follow up with what john asked you one time which is i mean he he was going to phrase it as who is also also in What Hot American Summer. Yes, absolutely. Who is also in What Hot American Summer, your co-star. Ubiquitous as well these days.

Also ubiquitous. Will not have a comeback anytime soon. No, no, no. John asked you, am I a gay icon? But he really, I mean, that was like a misdirect from asking you, are you a gay icon? Janine, can you answer that for us tonight? I don't know if I'm a gay icon. That might

be overstating it, but many, many people over the years have mistaken me for both gay and Jewish, to which I say, thank you. I take it as a compliment because it makes me seem far more interesting than an asexual atheist. But it gives me more texture. Sexuality is inherently interesting, I would say. Absolutely. It's just more interesting than the presence of sexuality. It's not what I mean. I think most people would describe themselves as sexual beings and to be asexual. interesting i would say absolutely just more interesting than the presence of sexuality it's

not what i mean i think most people would describe themselves as sexual beings and to be asexual that's yeah i have a biologically low libido always have i mean there was a brief period where it seemed to be kind of normal in my late 30s and i think it was a biological imperative like my body saying if you want to have a kid which i did not this is your last chance right also when i used to drink heavily i would be sexual but that was just a chemical thing contingency of the alcohol exactly as it often is well i mean janine that technically qualifies you to be under the lgbtqqia for asexual you know all the letters so many letters now so many letters now. So many letters. It's a big old soup,

but you're technically a queer icon, so I think we can bestow that honor upon you. Well, I take that as a huge compliment because the queer intelligentsia tend to have interesting taste, you know, discerning taste. Oh, wow. Absolutely.

I mean, we're pretty, we sort of wallow on the low end of things on this program. I don't know. We saw Call Me By Your Name of wallow on the low end of things on this program. I don't know. We saw Call Me By Your Name. Well, there's low end taste, you know, which would be, I feel Perez Hilton and Andy Cohen. Sure, sure. Who sort of cultivates that gossipy.

Sure, sure. Sometimes the comedy of cruelty. Yes. The succession of like a John Waters, maybe. Yeah, I feel like I take it as a huge compliment if it is coming from the right source. I would consider us the right source. Sure.

I consider you guys the right source. Did you see the queer film of the year, Call Me By Your Name? No, I haven't. I haven't seen that, but I have certainly read every great review of it. Every piece. Every piece.

Of which there are many. We're not necessarily fans. Well, you really don't of it. Every piece. Every piece. Of which there are many. We're not necessarily fans. Well, you really don't like it. I'm comparing it to the source material, to the book, which I love. But you know what? I mean, we don't have to get into this. I just want to say,

because I don't want- But I love Kissing Jessica Stein. Oh, yeah. But you're all over the place, because, okay, I had forgotten you were in 24. Right, I was just in it for one season. Right.

And I watched the season that, I actually watched that season. See, before I understood what 24 sort of was, I was very into it. There was the one season which was, remember when the president was a terrorist at the end? Did you watch the show before you were on it? I didn't really, but I was just flattered somebody offered me a job and my good friend mary lynn rice cup was on it and also she's amazing so yeah there you go i was very happy to have work a and work with friends although i did not agree with the politics of the uh creators producers that was an issue and also i was just there to make liberals look weak. And he did that on purpose.

Joel Cernault, who's a big right-wing guy who thinks it's a great thing to say that he's best friends with Rush Limbaugh. I really feel you should keep that to yourself. A hundred percent. But he thought that was, aren't I great? But he knew about my politics and he intended to make me look weak then there was a big writer strike i celebrated two birthdays in one season on that because there was so much time off and then their new writers came in and they never picked up that through line of and also it was supposed to make a female president look weak but you can't make cherry

jones look weak cherry jones has the gravitas yes so his plans were foiled yeah a few times there you go that's actually rule of culture number 75 Terry Jones has the gravitas you know we'll find

she stands in her truth as Suzy Orman would want her to do absolutely another gay icon big time are Suzy and Cherry linked at all a financial icon

well of course are Suzy and Cherry linked at all or is that just like a convenient no no no Suzy Orman always talks about standing in your truth. Standing in your truth. And she does.

Oh, boy. I fucks with a Susie Orman 40-minute video of her just lecturing about, you know. Fiduciary responsibility. Fiduciary responsibility. Fiscal prudence.

There you go. I like the cut of her jib. She knows what's what. I await further instructions. Yes, absolutely. Let's absorb. Let's absorb. So is that what happened

on the season of 24? Your character gets interrogated and broken or give us up information? Well, it was all changed because a couple things happened. The strike and Mary Lynn Rice unexpectedly got pregnant. Ah, yes. So then they had my character have her thrown in jail because it's just one day. Yeah, right. And so after the strike was over, she was clearly showing a pregnancy. because you couldn't because even though it's just one day yeah right and so after the strike

was over she was clearly showing a pregnancy so there was she in the video where she's incarcerated

she's behind a big box uh huh yeah sure that box those boxes that are in prison so that you can't see she could have just had a big lunch

much like on that great show playing house which I love where one of the characters was pregnant and they went out of their way to have boxes everywhere that you stand behind bird bones the character of bird bones i see the best is i think i think it was on like desperate housewives they all had to like carry a pillow at some point they always they always try and hide it in some way if they don't want to write it into the story right right right i think it should be written into every story. Absolutely.

Maybe, I mean, you know what? Maybe that character on 24 just, I was going to say had a big lunch, but maybe she got knocked out. Well, like I said, it's just one day, so it's hard to... Exactly, this is true. Because Marilyn Rice Cup is a very lean, there's no body fat on Marilyn Rice Cup. And even when she was

very pregnant, it was just like a little basketball, but the thing was, it was different. The television, it does famously add 45 pounds. In my case, it adds 45. Well, here's the thing. We are going to now ask you the question that we ask all of our guests, which is, what is the culture that made you, Janine, step in a cultural direction? Like this was the first movie you saw, tune you heard, television show you were a regular fan of that made you say, okay, culture, it might be for me. Well, the thing is, it's a difficult question because culture is around us.

It's not nowhere. And there's high, low, middle brow culture. It just exists. Just by being born, you are part of a culture. But I do have some key things that I guess directed my taste. Or one of the first, I guess there's a combination. As a child in the 70s, comedy albums were very big. My older brother had George Carlin, Cheech and Chong.

My parents had Nichols and May and Bob and Ray. And I would just listen to them, listen to them, listen to them all the time. And I was just a huge fan. Then SCTV came on in 1975 and was a huge influence. And also around that time I saw a movie called Take the Money and Run by Woody Allen. And I thought, I want to somehow this. And the thing about, I guess, one's taste, because we curate in a way our own culture. You have, I don't know if epiphany is too strong a word, but something catches your attention and it sticks.

For some reason. And then you become intellectually curious about wanting to go deeper into that thing. Right. And so I would say comedically speaking, I feel I had good taste in comedy even as a young person. And they say comedy's subjective. I disagree with that. There is some, by any metric, bad comedy.

For sure. You know what I mean? And good comedy. For sure. You know what I mean? And good comedy. And Albert Brooks also, I became a fan of his albums, A Star is Bought and Comedy Minus One. And, but I would say

those were huge influences. And as I got older, Letterman came on when I was in high school. That was a real touchstone for many, many people. Because everyone tried to emulate that thing.

Right. But also it caught the attention of certain people. This is different. Something's going, because it that thing. Right. But also it caught the attention of certain people. This is different. Something's going on because it's authentic. Right. And it's very cerebral, too. When things are authentic.

Yeah. And even when it's being stupid and silly, it's coming from a smart source. So that's very different from when stupid comedy is coming from a dumb source. But when it's coming from a smart source, it's all the more interesting. Yeah. It just feels different. And then I would say the second major factor was when I went to Providence College, Rhode Island. Big mistake, but at least I got to.

Was it Rhode Island or Providence College? Providence College and Providence, Rhode Island. It was a very religious university, which I went to by choice. I'm an atheist now, but I was religious. And WBRU, which was Brown University's college radio station, I could get on my radio. And that music reached me. It was different. It was better. And sent me down a path of seeing these bands live where you meet other people at these venues in Rhode Island and Boston. And you see different kind of people and also sartorial choices. There's ways people dress and carry themselves, the music they listen to, the comedy they like, the books they read. Also, somebody turned me on to Howard Zinn and Noam Chomsky. So all of these things taken together became sort of, I guess, my awakening.

And I don't like words like woke. And I understand woke in the dictionary means awake. I guess my awakening, and I don't like words like woke. Like, you know what I mean? And I understand woke in the dictionary means awake, but I don't like, it's used with slang. And when people use slang for important things, it bugs me. Oh, yeah. Hashtag woke.

Just speak it. You're an adult. Speak it. Just say enlightened, awake, whatever it is. Don't put a hashtag in front of it. It undercuts the gravitas of of what you're talking about right it makes it seem like a tool instead of like something that you feel you're just making it frivolous you're just you're being frivolous

with language right but janine you just gave us a full sort of tapestry of the contours of your and also then kids in the hall things of that nature. But also I grew up in a time before social media, before personal computer. People had them before all of these things. So when there was comedy or music, people made tapes and passed them around. You know what I mean? It's like an underground railroad of re-watching Robert Tilton, The Pastor of Gas, or The Uncle Floyd Show, which was on a local affiliate or just it used to be called College Radio. Then it was Indie and then Alt. Yeah.

But these things were not that easy to find. And then also in independent film when it really wasn't, there were certain touchstone movies that people saw. Betty Blue, Repo Man, With Nail and I, Wish You Were Here, and then also British culture. Like there was things that were not as easily found, but if you were in a certain type of world, they were things that everybody in that world was doing.

So what do people stand to lose now with the loss of that tactile element? Because you're talking about like, you know, tapes like being passed around or it's like, oh, have you heard of, or just like, you know. Literally having to go out and connect with people in order to share this shit.

I mean, yeah. I don't know if anything's lost because more and more people find community now in many ways. You know, when I was growing up, you know, I was neither particularly popular nor unpopular. There was no poor me story,

no nothing. But there were some people that were definitely, definitely on the fringes and far more complex than me and I, you know,

who could not find community the way young people can today. So I think there's a lot of very good things that come with that. Now with that, obviously, comes a lot of nonsense and a lot of narcissism and a lot of cruelty and bullying, a whole new layer of bullying and stuff like that. But I do think there is some very, very good things, especially for young people.

They can find comfort and people like them very easily now, which was not the case. That's definitely. So do you use social media at all now? I don't. There's a fake me tweeting and a fake Facebook me. But it's not me. And a fake Instagram.

I don't understand why, but I just that's a full time job. And I'm not right. I'm not. Like I said, I'm 54. So most of my life is without it i'm more comfortable without it and i feel the more you put yourself out there the more you give people a reason to dislike you oh sure a reason to take a shot at you and it doesn't roll off my back i yeah i really like when people like me yeah and um i don't i don't and some people get alerts

like when people talk about them, things like that. It doesn't roll off my back. It hurts me terribly. Yeah. Especially if it's unjust. If somebody says something where it's like, yeah, well, there's a fair point. Yeah. It still hurts my feelings, but I'm like, okay.

But when it's unjust, especially for political stuff or things you've said that are completely reasonable and on the right side of history right when you get attacked for that it is the most painful painful thing yeah at least for me me that's no yeah no there recently was an interview with erica badu the interview and there was the larger interview and then there was of course the poll quote and the poll quote was i see good things in hitler but what she was saying as a whole. Journalists are not your friend. Exactly. And also, everybody loves to take a shot.

Everybody, you know. And the thing is, Erykah Badu has proven herself to be a thinker. Yeah. An artist. Huge cultural shaper. Goes her own way. Yeah. And now that's a tough one when you mention Hitler.

That's like one of those things always an obstacle like as soon as you it's like somebody dropped an anvil into the conversation but pull quotes up they're just not fair and the journalist is always looking for something and then they create a faux manufactured anger and it's usually just a very small group of people but it can grow yeah and and it's. And it's just schoolyard bullying and also a distraction at work. Yeah. You know, oh, I'm going to weigh in

on this person I've never met. And everyone has to. Yeah. But I feel like they don't. That's the thing. No, they don't, actually. And I know that for younger people, it's very hard to disengage

because it's part and parcel of the fabric of their being. But the thing is you don't have to. But the unit of measurement nowadays is like these little low kiss, low sigh of like PR bullshit. Like it's like this Erykah Badu thing. It's like, oh, my God, Erykah Badu is a Nazi sympathizer. Like the takeaways are just. What has she ever done that shows she's a Nazi sympathizer? I, the takeaways are just... What has she ever done

that shows she's a Nazi sympathizer? I mean, nothing. Truly, literally nothing. It's people that I think don't even... They see the headline, don't even read the article

because who has time? Right. And then they take this and they have their take and then what really sucks, I think... And you have to take the word for the journalist.

Right. Which, over the years, time and time again, they are very willing to take poetic license with what someone says. And also leave out if somebody was laughing or being sarcastic. Right. And yet they love it because they feel it's their job. Not all of them, but hack ones. Let's create a controversy.

So people talk about my article. Yeah. And I don't even know if it was literally the headline of the article, but it was someone who took that from it. And then that, of course, became the conversation and a conversation that truly never happens about her in a positive way. There's no discussion about her and the impact she's had on culture and black culture and like music culture. I'm sure there is, but not in that in that world that that was trending with that and also yeah leave it alone yeah i could care less like everybody's upset about whatever are they is everybody's everybody's talking about really i have heard no one talking

exactly exactly it's just it's just one of those things um i can't stand sweeping generalizations like that and there's nothing more powerful than a fixed idea. You drop that in, everyone's like, oh, I heard she's a Nazi sympathizer. Yeah, yeah. It's just lazy. And also, it's just verbal dust. It just means nothing. And also, like, the arrogance that comes with thinking you're going to have the hottest take on that.

You know what I mean? Like, it's going to be my tweet that gets the 3,000 likes. And it's going to be retweeted. the 3,000 likes. And it's going to be retweeted like there's nobility in it. Now, if you are somebody who has tweeted something that is truly edifying and enlightening, like you've created content or tweeted or done something that people go, hmm, I never thought of it like that. Or that person, that's right. You know, whatever it is.

That does mean something but when it's this nonsense uh so that we can all pile on it affects the quality of your life and actually people are lesser than the more they participate in that god i just uh this is just an erica story but i saw her this summer at a music festival and she was incredible she's amazing one of the best amazing and then like she had a 45 minutes like just 45 minutes and like but meanwhile she like just wraps you up in her sound like within like the first number but then like they like the time her time was up and they just cut off her mic and I'm just like damn like they wouldn't do that that That's so disrespectful. It's so disrespectful.

To anyone. Even people you don't like. It's embarrassing and it's disrespectful. There's better ways to do it. Absolutely. Now, if it was somebody going on and on, you know, who is a blowhard and is just wasting people's time or drunk, whatever, that's one thing. But if it's an artist like Erykah Badu can you not give

maybe have somebody signal that you need to wrap it up whatever it is there's another way she's done this before and it's you know

I don't know this is sort of a weird counterfactual or hypothetical but it's like would this have happened to a male artist

who knows but it could that's one of those things where you don't know because time is time and the bookers of things where you don't know because time is time and the bookers of the show and the managers,

they don't care who it is. Right. It transcends gender. Sure, sure. There might have been somebody that they fear. Right, right. Oh, someone's gonna be mad.

Right. So we better not do it. But I feel like I've heard many stories about both genders having the mics cut. I just think she's just been burned by the industry a couple times.

But she's also beloved. For as much as she's burned, she is as embraced. Yes, yes. That's usually the flip side of that. When people are lightning rods, if you will, for whatever reason, there are just as many, if not more.

It's just the squeaky wheels that get the grease. The naysayers always are the biggest babies and fill their diapers first so they get paid attention to. The rule of culture, it's always the squeaky wheels that get the grease and the biggest babies fill their diapers first. Yeah. That's a good rule. That's a good rule. This fall on Bravo. It's time to turn up.

Think you've seen it all? I don't think you've been a good friend to me lately. We're friends like that. Who needs enemies? You ain't seen nothing yet. Cheers to being Germanic. With the Real Housewives of Potomac. Oh my gosh, can I take this in?

It's gonna be amazing. New York City. Everyone is a gossip. No one gets a happier life. Salt Lake City. We don't wear costumes, we wear fashion. And below deck sailing out. You broke the rules and now you're here getting upset.

Watch all new seasons on Bravo or stream it on City TV+. Let's have a real good time. I'm Julian Edelman. I'm Rob Gronkowski. Guess what, folks? We're teammates again. And we're going to welcome you guys all to Dudes on Dudes. I'm a dude, you're a dude, and Dudes on Dudes is our brand new show.

We're going to highlight players, peers, guys that we played against, legends from the past, and we're just going to sit here and talk about them. And we'll get into the types of dudes. What kind of types of dudes are there, Gronk? We got studs, wizards. We got freaks. Or dudes dudes. We got dogs.

Dogs. We'll break down their games. We'll share some insider stories and determine what kind of dude each of these dudes are. Is Randy Moss a stud or a freak? Is Tom Brady a dog or a dude's dude? We're going to find out, Jules. New episodes drop every Thursday during the NFL season. Listen to Dudes on Dudes on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

On Thanksgiving Day, 1999, a five-year-old boy floated alone in the ocean. He had lost his mother trying to reach Florida from Cuba. He looked like a little angel. I mean, he looked so fresh. And his name, Elian Gonzalez, will make headlines everywhere. Elian Gonzalez. Elian Gonzalez. Elian. Elian.

Elian Gonzalez. Elian Gonzalez. Elian. Elian. Elian Gonzalez. At the heart of the story is a young boy and the question of who he belongs with. His father in Cuba. Mr. Gonzalez wanted to go home and he wanted to take his son with him. Or his relatives in Miami. Imagine that your mother died

trying to get you to freedom. At the heart of it all is still this painful family separation. Something that as a Cuban, I know all too well. Listen to Chess Peace, the Elian Gonzalez story, as part of the My Cultura podcast network, available on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Sheryl Swoops, WNBA champ, three-time Olympian, and Basketball Hall of Famer. I'm a mom, and I'm a woman. I'm Tarika Foster-Brasby, journalist, sports reporter, basketball analyst, a wife, and I'm also a woman.

And on our new podcast, we're talking about the real obstacles women face day to day. See, athlete or not, we all know it takes a lot as women to be at the top of our game. We want to share those stories about balancing work and relationships, motherhood, career shifts. You know, just all the s*** we go through. Because no matter who you are, there are levels to what we experience as women. And T and I, well, we have no problem going there. Listen to Levels to This with Cheryl Swoops and Tarika Foster-Brasby, an iHeart Women's Sports production in partnership with Deep Blue Sports and Entertainment.

You can find us on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Elf Beauty, founding partner of iHeart Women's Sports. This actually reminds me, the other day they had Rose McGowan on The View. Oh, great, yeah. And it was a large interview with her. They devoted a lot of time to her story, as they should, because she now has her new book called Brave, which I can't wait to read. And it was a two-part interview with her.

And then, actually, when they came back from commercial break, the ladies were talking about it more after she had left. And it's true. Whoopi Goldberg was making this point about what Rose had said. And they start playing Whoopi off. And then she turns to the camera and she goes, maybe don't play me off now. Maybe this isn't the time to do this. She locked eyes with the camera and was goes maybe don't play me off now like maybe this isn't the time to do this like

she like locked eyes with the camera and was like there is nothing more cowardly than a network tv producer but having been on the view uh back over the years and um having some discussions about them asking me to tempt this is when i worked at air america and during the bush year uh we could you please just tempt not, you know, just fear, coward. You know, that's just, that's the nature of mainstream show business. And mainstream any business. Yeah. Is fear.

Just protectiveness. And bureaucracy. Yeah. That's a tale as old as time. Right. But with Rose McGowan, I was watching a little bit of her interview last night on amazing with christian uh christian on poor and it seemed as if um christian was trying to catch her out on something it seemed like i don't know for sure but it felt like it was going that way yeah and so my stomach started feeling sick and so i changed the channel

but it uh it seemed like she was saying so you were in the hot tub with, you know, like, now that all of these things are problematic because it's when I believe the story was. It was a Weinstein story and they were both in a hot tub and then unwanted advances came and christian kept harping on that like why were you in the hot tub but and and rose to her credit was saying let's not make it about this right yeah let's not make it about you know i've got much more to say on this it's just one of those things that also in culture in in life will never get past when people are in hot tubs with an aggressor any of these things why were you there because people who aren't there go i'd have never done that right exactly but when you're 20 or whatever she was and was being told she's the next big thing and also had been raised in a highly sexualized Yes. Her whole life was inappropriate advances. Yeah, yeah.

And unfortunate events. And from the very first doom generation, everything and all the things, she was used as a sexual objectified person. She's a very, very beautiful person. And she went along with it. That doesn't mean she would like to be harassed. Right. with it that doesn't mean she would like to be harassed right but it's one of those things where um you have to factor in all of what made her her yes how she got to this place and um i don't unfortunately i don't think she'll ever get past with many interviewers

those types of questions but she's very very good at deflecting those questions it's always the circumstantial sort of questions that always right tossed around but with her i think people do it even more because i think this smear campaign that weinstein did embark on with her and not just him oh absolutely not you know the massad just this whole collection of people that whose job it was to discredit her. That's been the narrative about Rose McGowan for the last 10 years. It's crazy. Wacko.

Well, that's the thing. It's easy to... It's low-hanging fruit. Right. It's very easy to mock and marginalize anyone in entertainment. That's a... Yeah, right, right. For a female in entertainment.

Oh, my God. Get out. Really easy. And if you have taken your clothes off... Yes. That's a trifecta of mocked, marginalized, out. Really easy. And if you have taken your clothes off, that's a trifecta of mocked, marginalized, out. But also people like to do that. And again, I don't like sweeping journalism.

But for the most part in mainstream media, what they like to do is, I don't want to think about this. How can I categorize this person so we could dismiss it? Exactly. Exactly. You know what I mean? Like it's just let's do this. Let's pigeonhole it. Let's classify it and lay it to the side yeah and that's just the nature of mainstream

especially news media yeah sure it's trick it trickles down all the way to i remember in my in my like sketch group in college like i became the director of it and i could feel people taking me less seriously just because I was gay he's saying something forceful and it's bitchy forget it and then my successor who ran the group after me

dealt with it on a whole other level because she was a woman and it was coming from 20 year old kids I always find that it's difficult to blame or to hold people to what they did anything below the age of 30 yeah you know you put a camera on them or you interview them most people are going to say something dumb yeah dumb uh when they're young

yeah that's just the way you're not the best version of yourself at 21. You will grow and evolve, hopefully, hopefully. But if anyone, everyone in the world, and people turn the camera on, they love to take pictures of themselves with rice pudding and cupcakes. But I'm saying if people follow them and listened to their interactions

all the time and then put it on the TV or whatever, people go, that was dumb. Yeah, you're going to find something. Any interest, because obviously in these fraught political times, blah, go, that was dumb. Yeah, you're going to find something. Yeah, yeah. Any interest, because obviously in these fraught political times,

blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, any engagement interest at all to like, what's the equivalent now? Like, I guess crooked media, like Pod Save America, that kind of stuff. Well, there's all kinds, there's tons of standup benefits, raising money for certain things.

And I've attended many of the marches and actions. And then also Dave Rath, It's raising money for certain things, and I've attended many of the marches and actions. And then also Dave Rath, one of my managers, has this tour, the Comedy Resistance, that he's going to different swing states and stuff and comics are performing there, raising money for certain things. Amazing. To get people engaged. There is – one of the great things about living in this city in the Outer Boroughs is there's an action almost every day. You can accidentally walk into one and go, hey, I was there. I was a citizenship.

I'm engaged. Even if you didn't mean to go, you just stood there and I was there. I stand with everyone. So there's that. public service announcements which i uh no longer have a wish to do because uh having gone through that yeah that mill uh in in in the early aughts and the bushers and and with yeah air america um again being entertainment makes you not listen to that for whatever reason it's like you know they could get people people could quote unquote unquote respect from all walks of life who are willing to say the same thing. But in a lot of these shows won't book them.

They just want somebody. But even with like, yeah, but that has been on a TV show or something like that. But it's and in my stand up, I'm happy to talk about things like that. I make no secret of how I feel about things. Right. And in one-on-one conversations, you know, anywhere that I go, I'm not going to keep silent about certain things. Right. But I don't know how productive it is all the time. Let's get actors, and also don't use the word celebrity.

I mean, A, I'm not a celebrity but b that word is so off-putting sure don't say celebrities for blah blah blah and also usually people in entertainment don't refer to themselves as celebrities no not at all um but the people putting the campaign together do thinking it's the right thing to do it is not the right thing it's discrediting it's it's silly and it's just people this person it doesn't define them just because i happen to have done stand-up or been in a show or been in a movie it does not define me i am a citizen like anybody else and i have thoughts and feelings and you know if i was a if i was a um an electrician would you take me more? Can I say something?

Shut up and wire. Shut up and sing. Shut up and do comedy. I want to hear that. Shut up and finish the plumbing. How dare you? How dare you? I was at a Barbara Streisand concert last year

and there was this woman, and she got political as she does, and there was this woman a few rows back just screaming about how she didn't want to hear it. And it's like, where the fuck did you think you were coming? And not just that. So you don't give a shit? Yeah. I'm sorry.

No, no, please. I don't care what you're saying to me. You've just spoken volumes about you. You don't want to hear it. But I'm sure you're happy to give your opinion anywhere else what this person cares about things and you must have known that yeah sorry so you're i don't want to hear it just means i don't agree with what that person's saying but if it was toby keith i'll hear it you know i mean it's it's one of those things but when people say i don't want

to hear it then leave yeah you leave you know what i mean it's one of those things, but when people say, I don't want to hear it, then leave. Yeah, truly. You leave. You know what I mean? This is important, and especially now. It was dire during Reagan and Bush, but it is beyond critical now. Oh, my God. And if you're going to be a person who doesn't want to hear it, this affects you.

Do you not know that? Yeah. It affects if you have children. Your children and your grandchildren. Now, if you don't give a shit about yourself and these things or you think you're above it, do you not care at all about the air your kids breathe or about the financial stability, the infrastructure that's not being served? All of these things that affect your life, deeply impact. Yes, we got rid of Frank Underwood. Yay, Kevin Spacey. He'll never be making decisions that impact your life deeply impact. Yes, we got rid of Frank Underwood. Yay, Kevin Spacey. He'll never be making decisions

that impact your life negatively. Okay, Kevin Spacey's gone. Stop the celebration. It does nothing to affect your life. Do you know what I mean? Jeffrey Tambor's gone now. And that was, you know, and I- I hear he's back now, which is-

Which actually, you know what? This is, it's like talking about Israel. It's gonna get me drunk. With the me to, is, it's like talking about Israel. It's going to get me drunk. With the me too. I think it's okay to question the questioner every once in a while. If we transcend gender like the bathrooms, human beings are making accusations. Is it, you know, the person that went after Al Franken, worked for a Fox affiliate, was contacted by Breitbart before she decided to take this issue with this picture.

Is that not fair to ask that question about why now? Why this? And also this photo. And also I was talking to some other comics who were doing their due diligence. And apparently that photo was fake. They were fake sleeping. Right. So, and also beyond that, you were just in war zones.

This is your takeaway? This is your takeaway? An illegal war that kicked off this whole thing that's still going with people dying, the refugee crisis, women being sexually assaulted all the time on both sides, and people living in dire poverty. This is your takeaway, that this picture from Alfred, now he's gone. And it throws away all the wonderful work he's ever done. And I think it's okay to question the questioner. Now, people immediately recoil when I start talking about that. In the same way when I talk about it's OK to care about Palestinians. Oh, you're anti-Semitic. No, I refuse to get put in a box like that because it's bullying and it shuts down meaningful conversation. You're looking at the, you know, the million different variables that go into just human beings talking about other human beings

and anything i think it's problematic you call anything me too there's a lot of people who want to get on board look at me look at me too me too that's what bothered me it's a it's it's me too can become uh like a rod serling episode of lights out on maple street you know i mean like or any of the themes he dealt with during the macquarie yeah, yeah, yeah. Or the McMartin case way back when. These things catch on like a wildfire and they get out of control.

And then people, like I said earlier, nothing is more powerful than a fixed idea. That's, that's more, that sticks more than the truth. People's lives are destroyed.

Yeah. Some of these people have been accused to have daughters who read the press and hear about it. And I don't think it's fair for any story

to say, we don't question the questioner. Right. That's like the Spanish Inquisition or the Crusades or anything.

Now, obviously, there are people who need to be heard. There is no question about that. And I am not questioning that. Right. But I do feel if Breitbart News has something to do with it, you have every right to question the accuser. in these cases. And I feel like when is it going to be, maybe it is okay

to talk about that, but it's much easier to come at it with vitriol and sweat. Just no, no, no. No, because when I have discussed this in stand-up

about the Rod Serling aspect of it, I can see people, some people, recoiling in their seats. They'll look on their face changes. They're waiting for the shoe to drop. Even before I even start discussing

what I'm going to say. They're ready for impact and ready with a response. It's a conditioning that we have now. And it is, I think, the internet that terrifies us. I mean, even, I'm not even going to, I'm going to be transparent about it.

Even talking about it now, it does make you a little nervous because there are those people who will refuse to see the whole picture. You have to fight it. Absolutely. You have to. This is why the Palestinians are still living under apartheid, because in this country we are not allowed to care. That's been the M.O. since post-World War II. God. Basically. You are right. In's been the M.O. since post-World War II. God. Basically.

You are right. In mainstream media anyway, mainstream media, and politicians, you better not discuss it. You better not talk about the Palestinians in a kind way. Right. And that's why for years, you know, it has real impact. People are dead, dying, living in poverty and living under apartheid. And it is apartheid. Yes.

It doesn't mean I am not, I don't care. It doesn't mean I'm anti-Semitic at all. And it is a child's argument to talk about that. And I refuse to back down from these things. Yeah. Because this is how people suffer. Yeah. And it will go on for years.

Because maybe your stomach felt a little knot when i started talking about this you that tells you you got to push against it absolutely or nothing will change well it's it's a it's on purpose too people want you to see an quote-unquote enemy as inhuman they don't want you to to to um understand that there's a person on the other side it's what happens right here in america it's what you know if r Russia's interfering the way we think they are, they want us to have a civil war. They want us to see the other side as inhuman. That's Trump getting up there and saying they ripped the babies out of the wombs.

That's them wanting to see us as monsters. That old chestnut has been, you know, but the thing is, is Russia, there was collusion. I don't know how many, he confessed to it. Right. I mean yes obviously he's guilty of many many things which just shows you that if he was on the first 48 they would have wrapped that case up in in 48 hours i don't know if you watch the first 48 on a and e but they get it done if there's a crime scene with a dead body a carcass and and maybe a nickname of somebody who

might have been there and they solve it this they have nothing but evidence from right from the person himself and yet oh i'm just not it's like trying to get john god oh a million years it's because should have put him on first there's foot dragging and because many many other people will be implicated but that's just that's just the nature of government in this country or any other but that what you mentioned brings me to another book that influenced my life a great deal called i and thou by martin buber which was another one of those life-changing things and uh it talks about how people either have an i it relationship with people or an i thou i it means you deify you you vilify the other right and you lack empathy

and I thou is this is a human now I'm not at all saying everybody has right believe me there are people I feel should be shut down eight ways to Sunday yeah it is not a side to a story to be homophobic or misogynist or a war hawk or a liar. That's not a side to a story. Right, right, right. So I'm not one of the, as much as I love J. Krishnamurti, and I do, and that was another seminal book, Awakening Intelligence, for me, and a lot of Eastern philosophies,

I can't go as far as your enemy is your teacher. No, Tucker Carlson's not my teacher. Ann Coulter's not my teacher. Kellyanne Conway, Sean Hannity, I wish them ill. And when Andrew Breitbart died, I was walking on air.

When Andrew Breitbart died, I felt joy. The same joy as when I found my wallet in Union Square when I lost it. That level of joy. I've told my Breitbart story a million times. This is when he was still alive uh this is right after sarah palin had her whole um uh uh what was it what was the word that she made up that fucking stupid oh so many i don't know so many but she it was she made

up uh refute refute it was refute it and i had tweeted some some like stupid old i was 19 i tweeted some fucking stupid ass zinger of a tweet. It wasn't even that good. But then Andrew Breitbart somehow got wind of it, retweeted it to all of his followers. I was on a flight. They don't really care. They don't care. They just want to attack.

So I was on a flight, turned my phone off. And by the time I landed, turned my phone back on, all these crazy-ass motherfucking tweets just calling me all these racist things. Right, that's the point of it. That's why it was done. And Andrew Breitbart, the reason I felt joy is his behavior impacted negatively the lives of many, many people in society. And the sting operation, shutting down EggCorn, all these many, many people in society. And the sting operation, shutting down egg corn, all these many, many things. He is a person with no moral compass

who doesn't mean anybody well. And I'm assuming self-loathing has a lot to do with that. You can't be a happy, stable person and behave in that manner. And taking him out of the equation is a very good thing. Now, I'm not talking about my vitriol is not aimed at little petty things in my personal life, like that person was mean to me at the deli. I'm talking about people harmful who have actual power that destroy lives for years to come. And if the Trump voters who, by the way, are not hard,

decent, hardworking Americans, and I'm tired of that myth. Yeah. They are decent, hardworking, nothing. If they didn't get it by the time. And first of all, he didn't win. Didn't win. He didn't win. No.

Not by any sense of the word. Oh, he was elected. He was not. No. What with the rolling back of the Voting Rights Act, with voter suppression, with interference. Bingo. With the rolling back of the Voting Rights Act, with voter suppression, with interference, and with all kinds of software tampering that was in play when John Kerry won and when the late Antonin Scalia, good riddance to bad rubbish, installed George Bush illegally. I don't believe a Republican has won legally since Bobby Kennedy was shot. Oh, wow.

I believe. And this is not conspiracy. This is business. Because with right-wingers, it's business. It's blood sport. With Breitbart, it's a blood sport. There is a concerted effort to dominate and to make sure less people vote. Because when more people vote, especially since the 60s.

Swings left. It swings left and the the world american culture especially there was no putting the toothpaste back in the tube after the 60s and the early 70s that's just a fact and the the great majority of of humans that live in this country uh are not with the uh quoteunquote moral majority, the evangelicals. They're a very, very small part, but they're well-funded and they've got power. They've got also big industry behind them. And a decision was made, I think, we got to make sure that people who have an impact like George McGovern, like Mike Dukakis, like Bobby Kennedy do not have this input.

Like Jill Stein or Elizabeth Warren or Maxine Waters. They got to neutralize them and they have to create myths around them and they have to create that it was a landslide that McGovern lost in. I don't know if that's true. No. Because there's been, I don't know if I, am I allowed to say the F word? Yes, absolutely. Rat fucking, which is made famous during the Nixon era. Yeah.

Where, and Karl Rove was recruited as a young man because Haldeman and Ehrlichman noticed what a piece of shit he was in tampering with college elections. Does that tell you something about, you know, where they're coming from? So after Watergate, you know, the phrase Republicans would say never again. They didn't mean never again that. They meant never again will we be busted and transparent. And they started at that time buying up news stations and papers and creating faux think tanks and influencing people. And again, this is just business. It's not tinfoil hat time.

And that's another way to disengage and dismiss. It's just to say, oh, that's gobbledygook yeah they're just a conspiracy since we can go back to ancient rome we can go back to ancient egypt well that's just the nature of power it seeks to consolidate well there's something happening now and like maddo talked about this like she was like two things about obstruction of justice are either people get caught or people get away with it and people risk their entire lives and their careers because they know at least there's some chance of them getting away scot-free yeah and that's what's happening now with with all well there's never been big repercussions no really not for watergate not for not for

rencontra not for nicaragua none of these he just couldn't run the free world anymore not for not for ran contra not for nicaragua none of these he just couldn't run the free world anymore not for bridge gate yeah but benghazi oh let's keep talking about that you know that's because the right uh tends to dominate the conversation because because they're very loud and they've got the money and the power and the and the airspace to do it and also the left and the center is not that mean-spirited they are not that's that's yeah yeah it's it's who you are that makes you be how you gravitate it's neuroscience it's it's it's not even always about issues especially for the right it's not about issues at all because there are no issues right uh it's it's limbic brain neuroscience cruelty anxiety

fear you know or uh money grab whatever it is there's the cynics and the suckers the cynics are at the top using the dum-dums as a hammer it is and then the dum-dums at the bottom think they're gonna get what they want and also uh there's something people of color and the gays will go away yeah right it is a limbic brain thing because it is just all like. It's all emotion. It's all emotional but it's all everything else is informed by that emotion of just. Right. It's frontal lobe too and it's myopic.

Yep. And because and it's easier right. If you're a right winger you get to claim the moral high ground. You don't have to care about anything. You don't have to do anything. You don't have to sacrifice anything. You've got to recycle. I don't want to pay my taxes. And I always feel like, do you like driving on this road? Do you go to an airport?

Guess what? Your taxes do that. We all paid for this shit, motherfucker. I don't want my taxes going to Planned Parenthood. Well, first of all, because of the Hyde Amendment, they really don't. So you want 90 cents on every dollar to go to the military industrial complex? that you would prefer that and to lobbyists and all that kind of stuff but that would require unpacking and thinking so it's much much easier to be on the right right because you get to pretend that you've got the you know the flag and jesus whatever the heck. Yeah. You're on the side. You're on the right side.

Yeah. But you get to coast. But you will, it does bite you in the head. You still have to breathe dirty air. You still have to drink water that's tainted. We're all living on the same world. Yeah. You still have to go on a bridge that hasn't been serviced for 800 years.

Or Amtrak that has antebellum infrastructure. All of these things, they still have tobellum, you know, infrastructure, all of these things. They still have to do that, too. Yep. Yep. Yep. So what are you thinking in terms of 2018, 2020? Who are the strong leaders? Like, I would just like to hear from you who you're excited about, if anybody.

Well, I really enjoyed Kennedy's rebuttal to the State of the Union. I love Joe. I love Elizabeth Warren. There's a lot of good Democrats, Maximo's. And many, many of the great Democrats you'll see on C-SPAN, too, on the floor fighting the good fight. They don't get a lot of major airtime. But the thing is, none of that matters until we undo what's been done with gerrymandering. Right, absolutely. And the Voting Rights Act and the tamerrymandering. Right, absolutely.

And the Voting Rights Act and the tampering of software. Nothing will change until that is addressed. Right. All of that's being appealed up to the Supreme Court, and that's just like a dead end. Well, unfortunately, the Supreme Court is... Right. Hopefully, somebody will do the right thing in the Supreme Court.

I mean, there's some decent judges, but for the most part, it's been packed. With, you know, a lot of these people that are on the side of the bullies. Right. Because I think was it North Carolina overturned or something? North Carolina, again, they are not well represented. The people of North Carolina are not in any way well represented by the handful of assholes. They're represented in the same way that the right wing of the Knesset in Israel dominates. The right handful of assholes they represent in the same way that

the right wing of the kinesit and israel dominates the right wing of our government dominates it does not represent us but it is easy and also brexit doesn't represent england no but it's easy to see why people go what a bunch of assholes yep if and also fox news unfortunately thanks to rupert murdoch goes all over the world yeah yeah and see Fox News. So you can understand why they'd go, what's wrong with them? Yeah, they think that's us. Yeah. Yeah. And they don't realize unless they go outside of that.

But also if you only saw the Brexit people and the Theresa May people and the UKIP in England, you'd go, what a bunch of assholes. Yeah, of course. Every country in every era has these problems yeah and until human nature changes this is not going to change oh shit so well i mean but luckily we do make more i mean time does go on i mean progress does that's why they have to i don't know if it's consolation that they have to steal the elections to win them right does that make sense you know i mean that's a comfort to know, but it's not really. I mean, yeah, the moral arc bends not linearly, not even.

Well, there is no moral. The universe doesn't tilt towards anything. No. It's neutral at best. Right. At best. But when people talk about the universe tilts towards justice, I don't think so.

I think it's, and also it doesn't take requests. So stop asking me stuff. It's not your personal. It's not listening. It's not Alexa. You know what I mean? It's just stop. That's narcissism to me.

The universe is not Alexa. It's there. It's not, it doesn't hear you. Right. It's not going to speak back to you. Right. And if it tilted towards justice history would be a very very different thing we should say it is rule number 98 of culture the universe is not

alexa although what you're saying about we just have to point that out because it is a rule we have to just immortalize that what you're saying about the toothpaste not being able to go back in the tube after the 60s is and the early 70s were people People don't remember that. Having been cognizant and in school at that time, they were very, very, you know, the early 70s were even a person like Carter and the First Lady Rosalyn who are still building homes for Habitat and Humanity Bios. They're authentically trying to make a better world. That's why the Republicans have to tar and feather them and pretend. And by the way, Reagan in cahoots with Kissinger kept the hostages hostage until after the election. This is the kind of person that you're talking about to make Carter look bad.

And do we know he went on a landslide? I don't trust that. And you know, our press is very fast to call out other countries. They'll, in a second, stolen election, stolen election. Yet here, you bring it up and then you're seen as a pariah.

First of all, whenever I go to Atlanta, I cry because there's a big sort of banner that honors Jimmy Carter. As well he should be. Just the best man. And if you go to his presidential library in Georgia, it's the most beautiful building in the world. They play the sweetest little video about him and Rosalind. Rosalind. Rosalind.

Rosalind. Just about the peanut farm and everything. Oh, my God. Jimmy Carter's the best. Well it they make it very easy if you hear um Charles Crutham or or Hannity or any of these guys or uh Bill Crystal or um any Fox any Fox and then the ones that are considered the smarter ones. Yeah. Wait, what about Shep Smith now? Shepard Smith, he has his moments because of his personal struggle, but he still works at Fox. He's still there.

The bar is still so low. And if you hear some of the usual suspects castigating, disparaging the person, then you know that you should be on that person's side. Do you know what I mean? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Or in the same way that Bush and Reagan and Trump, they name things. The Clear Skies Initiative. Well, you better watch your back, birds,

and anything in the sky. You know, if it's called that, everything's opposite today. No child left behind. Yes. So they make it actually quite simple. Yeah. Everything is the opposite in that it's branded because also they have no respect for their base, who they're talking to. No, no, no.

Because you can't respect people and lie to them that way. Fox News, Roger Ailes, who was there, Rupert Murdoch, none of those guys. Now, having been on Fox a number of times, which is a fool's errand, you see that there's a divide between those that know they're lying and those that don't. I don't know which is worse. There are some that are very clearly understanding what their role is and they know that they're lying. Right.

Then there are some that you meet there, Hannity, Brian Kilmeade, some of the Fox friends. They are dum-dums. They are the high school bully. Gretchen. Oh, Gretchen has to find a fucking clue. And they also aren't real political animals. They don't do their homework. Yeah. They read the high school bully. Gretchen. And they also aren't real political animals. They don't do their homework. They read off the teleprompter.

Then there's like Bill O'Reilly, who in the early days anyway, Greta Van Susteren, Tucker Carlson, they know they're lying. They are just getting paid. They're opportunists. I don't know which is worse. They're both bad. What's your take on Megyn Kelly? I don't like her. I don't like her. You know what?

Day late daylight dollar short true colors shine through because you hear about this jane fonda stuff she's completely nasty anybody who's got a problem still like my father still refers to his hanoi jane yeah man is baby he is won't let it go can't't. And his whole life is – and it shouldn't be because he is the child – he's first generation, raised poor in the Bronx, first to get past the eighth grade, and wanted to be the opposite of his family. You know what I mean? Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's that same. And he, at college, was a young Republican and has never let it go because now, at this point, and he's very religious, but he's a very nice guy and he's very bright.

He's just wrong. Yeah, he's wrong. On so many things. But now, and he doesn't like Fox. He doesn't like Trump. He's not one of those. Yeah, right. But he is a hardcore Republican.

There's no, and he has elevated Clinton bashing or distaste to a philosophy. I don't know why. It's just the way it is. But to pull at that thread now, he'd have to rethink every, every, everything that he has built his ideology upon. It's now in him. It's in there. But he's actually a very nice guy. But in the aggregate, out there but he's actually a very nice guy but in the aggregate out there the they

out there although he is in retirement he does nothing but volunteer he meals on wheels the big grandpa program for reading all of these things but he still has a they yeah and also he thinks uh because sandwich and those guys, wacky liberal. Yeah, right, right, right. Are you seeing Obama, a liberal? Are you kidding me? Obama is a Republican, if nothing else. I mean, I am a fan of Barack Obama, but he was a conservative of the old school, and he was far too conciliatory.

Makes no sense why he would ever think there could be bipartisanship when they said out loud we will do everything we can to stand against this man yeah that there is no reason in the world to try and curry favor with people who will never never accept you yeah they were up front about going as low as possible I know and they certainly did and he always was so nice tragic so parsing his words so much which was and you know what he had nothing but support he had people running through the streets that's when does that happen oh i remember yeah and and and yet still to have rick warren at the inauguration was the first thing where you go now i feel sick it's starting the the conciliatory nonsense is starting. He actually thinks that he can build a bridge. Or he's secretly more conservative than we know. But – and when – that guy said you lie at the State of the Union. Oh, he might as well have said you lie, boy. You know what I mean?

If you don't understand how racist the Republican Party has become over the last 30 years, then you're either a liar or stupid or you don't care. Because you know what? The whole thing about him thinking that he can build a bridge to the other side is just made so much worse by the fact that that's never happened. The reverse of that has never happened in the last decade or so. Democrats always are willing. Always are willing. And yet they're painted as ones who are not because that's what makes them Democrats. Right.

They are a different animal than a Republican, especially today. A modern-day Republican, I don't know what you would call it. No, I don't know. A nihilist. Actually, that gives nihilism a bad name. I'm not even going to do that because nihilism is often misunderstood. But they are – They're like proto-fascists, but you can't even use the word fascists anymore because people just overuse that word.

They are opportunists, craven, limited. They're obsessed with being victims. I mean I think in any position they want to – And that's all fake. They know. And in the same way that Bill Buckley knew there was no liberal media bias. But you say it enough and you know that they're going to bend over backwards to try and not be. Do you know what take the label it is not a dirty word that's what i had when i got the job at air america i had liberal tattooed on my arm just to and that's not like aren't i cool it's just to say

it's not a dirty word it should be embraced i don't want and progressive is fine or whatever but even at the registration they said maybe we shouldn't say liberal and i was like i am absolutely saying liberal yeah it has a grand tradition of being the reason we make any progress yes absolutely progressive and i feel like but even in high school i grew up on long island i was scared to say i was liberal i i thought i thought like i the easy thing is saying like well if i say i'm liberal they're gonna know i'm gay and I'm afraid. See, that's brainwashing. Of course it was.

That's what filters down. Liberal is something to be proud of. Conservative is not at this point. And saying you're Republican, as I said, you should keep that to yourself. Or if you voted for Brexit, don't say it out loud, man. That's like you don't. Rush Limbaugh's your friend? I know.

I remember that because I do watch Real Housewives. And on the New York, Andy Cohen fully asked them, so who voted for who? And the ones that voted for Hillary Clinton are raising their hands proudly, and then the rest of them would rather keep it private.

Right, which tells you that they... That they're ashamed. And why do you want to keep it private? So you know that it's bad. So then why did you do it? Because they know it's about their money. Right, but it isn't. It isn't.

They're gaining nothing. Yeah, but... They will gain nothing by this. Everybody thinks they're going to somehow make money through this dysfunctional government. That is not the case, and it's all going to collapse. You know what I mean? There is no there there with that money. He doesn't even manage his...

He's bankrupt three times over. No, it's horrible. And won't release his tax returns for many, many reasons. Mamba money. It's just – and I think Russian money. And Russian mamba money. Clearly. It's just silly.

And like I said, that decent – when people try and say, you know, the Tea Party, just – no, racist. Racist. Not voters, not decent, hardworking. You were out against the Tea Party very early. Right, and I was banned from MSNBC. I was on Keith Oberman's show, and I was banned from MSNBC. Although, oddly, they started calling me

after Al Franken was accused to come on and talk about it. And I was like, you guys can go fuck yourselves. No, no, no. That is, you were banned me for being, for what? For what? Was it Keith who, like no no keith okay was was appalled and then keith left shortly after yeah yeah sure sure yeah but then i became a regular on his new right series yeah that he then left i'm not the only one who's been banned

for things like that but um i also lost voiceover jobs after that because a faux controversy was created by the Webber and fake things. It wasn't really. And the companies I was doing voiceovers with wouldn't have even known. They're not watching that show. But the pretend, we're going to boycott. And they also almost like robo-bomb it. You know what I mean? It's like the same five people creating tons of fake outrage.

Yep, yep, yep. And – but then, you know, when you lose jobs over something like that, then you realize, oh, I probably shouldn't be working with those people anyway. Exactly. If they take issue with racists being called racists, then I probably shouldn't be working with those people. Before we move on, I have to ask, and this is just a very frivolous question because I wanted to ask this for so long. Was the scene in Wet Hot American Summer where you had to find the phone in the infirmary shot in one take?

Yes. We only had one chance to do it because of the money. I mean, like the budget. They didn't have enough to redo everything. To redo the whole thing. Oh, my gosh. Much to my chagrin because I enjoy doing that with Joe so much. And I loved screaming, running up.

And I had wished so much we could keep that scream. I would have liked to have kept on running, screaming, and knocking things over. But my favorite part is when Joe is frightened by a lampshade. Yes, yes, I know. And then punches it. And unfortunately, in the liner notes for this release of this Wet Hot compendium, I said he punched the phone. And I should have corrected that, but I didn't feel like retexting David Wayne. But he punched a lamp.

And that was like in the moment. And I should have corrected that, but I didn't feel like retexting David Wayne. But he punched a lampshade. And that was like in the moment. But that makes me laugh so hard when he gets startled by the lampshade and then hits it. Oh, my God. It's so funny. Yes. So people who are reading the liner notes, just know that Janine knows once and for all. It really is so incredible, that cast and what everyone went on to do. It's just crazy.

It's amazing that it was Bradley Cooper's first film, Amy Poehler's first film. I mean, Paul Rudd obviously had another. Elizabeth Banks' first film, I believe. There's gotta be... Well, Chris Malone, I guess. Chris Malone actually was an actor, but then became even more.

Became bigger. But the level of fame achieved by Rudd, Cooper, and Poehler is one of those. That's very rare. Crazy. That's for anybody. Yeah, yeah. But then also David and Michael's trajectory. Oh, yeah.

Upwards and Kenry. Like all of that. All the states, Stella, those people. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because you're lucky if one person makes it that high in the pantheon. Right. But to have so many in that cast who went on to become uber famous.

Iconic signature performers and artists. I mean, yeah, that just goes to show like the curation that went into that ensemble was just so important. just well also we all mostly knew each other sure beforehand the

I had not met Chris Maloney before that but I but I knew of of him amazing versatile oh my gosh

so funny hugest crush I had I can say it now oh yeah I mean the biggest crush on Chris Maloney so good looking

oh my god like when he walks in the room like you become an animal not only not only No, I had the biggest crush on Chris Maloney. So good looking. Oh my God. You have to imagine, like when he walks in the room, like you become an animal. Not only attractive that way, but funny and nice and very, very talented. And I used to just go watch him do his scenes. Really? Oh, fun. With pure lust. And that's, I'm not really like that.

You know what I mean? Sure. Famously low libido. It's not about somebody's looks all the time, but if you make them funny yeah then it's like now there's a power there i don't even know what to do but he is he is like his body is is ridiculous and usually i don't go for that kind of sure no but in his case that's a man something that's a man that's a manly man also never forget that gay sex scene. That was like

totally pure and very great and like honestly very loving like super respectful. That's just great acting. Not for laughs. Yeah, yeah.

Not for laughs but like great acting. No, that's authentically committed to the characters and doing a great job and also it's testament to both of their acting because not everybody

thinks Michael Ian Black is gay. That's David Wayne, Michael Schultz, or Michael Ian Black. They've been dealing with that since they were teenagers. Yeah, no. And they embrace it because they are secure in who they are. Of course. And it's not, and they know that it's not a criticism. No, of course, no.

To be called that. But Michael Ian Black, that must have, do you know, he told me, sir, I don't know whether he's joking. He claims, and I'll take him at his word, that when he was a kid, his mom and her partner sat him down and said, you know, you can come out to us. He says that that happened. He was like, I'm not gay. I like that. Even his two moms. They knew. He has a dad and then they divorced and then he had two moms.

And if he's telling me the truth, I believe him. Yeah, 100%. They sat him down and said, you know, you could come out. Isn't that hilarious? Lovely. That's very funny. And he has to say it to his moms. I'm not gay. And they're like, okay, not yet.

That seems like a sketch from something. Oh, 100%. Oh, my God. That's pretty great. It's always the ones. We have these straight male friends who are just the best people in the world. You're like, damn it.

We're often mistook for being gay, but then there's something. No, they're just a good human. That usually means that they're either nice or British. Exactly. Because it's a fine line. It's a fine line. It's a fine line.

With the Euro. Actually, the whole British, French, sometimes Scandinavian. Yes. Gay or just internationally. line with the euro actually the whole year british french sometimes sometimes scandinavian yeah yes gay or just internationally such a gray area it's true once you go to europe you're like god everyone here is an option no but they just have style yeah exactly and they've just got a certain way about them yeah um wow a gay je ne sais quoi um a je ne sais quoi A gay je ne sais quoi A gay je ne sais quoi A gay je ne sais quoi

Title of episode Title of rap Write it down Here we go Will Okay so we should move on To I don't think so honey Okay This is the moment

Where you take some And we've done it a lot already But this is more Of a concentrated one minute Anything in pop culture Anything you want Take one minute To rail against it

Okay well it's very difficult For me to get to a point to singling with clarity. But you know what? You do what you do. But if I try to get into a minute, you can just stop me in a minute and maybe it'll be under a minute. Okay, well we'll go first so you can see a demo. Something I touched upon

earlier that I will expand upon. Okay, perfect. So I think I have a good one. Okay. Great. This is Matt Rogers' I Don't Think So, Honey. His time starts now. I Don't Think So, Honey, fantasy movies with long ass titles like Fantastic Beasts and Where to Find Them. And now this next one is going to be called Fantastic Beasts and Where to Find Them and like The Secret of Dumbledore and also How to Lose a Guy in 10 Days. It's like simplify it.

If you want me to see this movie, call it Dumbledore is gay. Second, I don't think so, honey, on this topic. Them saying, well, Dumbledore's not gonna be explicitly gay, but watch this space. Quote, watch this space. No, I've been watching this space. Dumbledore is gay, and I also think he was an intense fuck.

Here's my thing. If you don't want him to be gay, don't cast Jude Law, who is one of those straights who gives you gay. We're seeing him as a psychosexual gay young pope. I mean, he's not gay in the thing, but he might as well be. The man gives more face than Naomi Campbell. Here's the deal. 15 seconds.

We are over it. We want Dumbledore to be gay. I'm here watching the movie. Let me tell you something about the first Fantastic Beasts and Where to Find Them. It was more sexual than Call Me By Your Name. Dumbledore is gay. Let's have him be gay. Jude Law's playing him. He's gay. I don't think so.

And that's one minute. Wonderful. That was gorgeous. That was well constructed. That was a gay arthouse film. Fantastic Beasts and Where to Find Them. Did you see that? I didn't. Just take us at our word when there's just very artfully done homoeroticism in that movie.

Beautifully shot homoerotic scenes between Colin Farrell and Ezra Miller. Isn't that true of many films, especially in early cinema? Absolutely. The Celluloid Closet. Let's say it's a harkening back to The Celluloid Closet. But I'm upset with them because they have Johnny Depp in the movie. And it's just, you know what? His taste in jewelry is not right for me.

There you go. And also just his sartorial choices in general are not quite right for me. Right. But he seems like a very interesting person. Yeah, right? You wouldn't have gone to a college radio,

college rock concert back when you were in school, back when you were at Providence. Just sartorially, he did not inspire you. He would not have inspired you. into music and stuff, he always has been.

Right. But I don't know that we would have had the same taste. There you go. I don't know that for sure. Right. Sure, sure, sure. Right. But. There you go. Okay. But anyway,'t know that we would have had the same taste. I don't know that for sure. Sure, sure, sure. Right.

But. There you go. Okay. But anyway, look, I'll probably go see you. Sure, sure, sure. But I just think, let's move past. Who's going to be the first character in one of these big things to just be gay? You know what I mean?

Like, when is that going to happen? Yeah. Like, Star Wars with Poe Dameron. Like, that character, he's on the edge. At what point are we just going to have a major mainstream gay character? Who's going to take the risk?

You don't even have to move the dial that much. You just make him be like, just make him scoff in the fucking scene and then we'll get it. I get what you're saying. I have that frustration too. Has there not been? Not in film. Not in like major motion picture.

We were just talking about this. On our last episode, I said there's not a gay character in this one thing and there literally has to be. It was Star Wars. Oh, sure. You know what I mean? I get like not wanting to risk Star Wars, but it's like you take risks all the time in Star Wars.

It's 2018. Exactly. That's how I feel. And I'm like, you're telling me in the galaxy, because it is a galaxy, as actually rule number 13 of culture. Still in the galaxy, one out of every four people. Right. Rule number 13 of culture.

Star Wars, it's a galaxy. And in the galaxy, there's not a gay. You know what? You're right. I don't know, honey. Maybe they transcended that and just pansexual. Sure, sure, sure. Polyamorous and pansexual. They do say that Laura Dern's character in the extended canon is same-sex oriented.

But we didn't say that on screen. Is Leah's lover potentially? Is potentially. Well, I don't know if that was fanfic or not. Got it, got it, got it. But listen, give me something. Throw me a bone, films. Come on.

All right. So that was beautiful, Matt. Thank you for saying it was beautiful. My phone's fritzing out a little bit. Well, don't worry, baby. I got you. I don't bone, films. Come on. All right. So that was beautiful, Matt. Thank you for saying it was beautiful. My phone's fritzing out a little bit. Well, don't worry, baby. I got you. I don't know. Nope.

It's good. Okay. It's back from the fritz. Great. All right. This is Bo and Yang's I Don't Think So, Honey, and his time will begin now. I Don't Think So, Honey food truck culture? Listen, it's ephemeral.

It's the whole construct of it. It's built on it not being available to you at all times which is fine but just to have to create this uh artificial scarcity around oh oh the dumpling truck's here it's thursday and having a line of people this throng of people just clamoring for dumplings is just not what we not we we've grown out of this as a culture, haven't we? We've grown out of, first of all, eating from fucking styrofoam trays. I don't fucking think so.

Styrofoam's harmful. What am I supposed to do with this? Throw this in the trash and have that not be a stain on my conscience? Oh my God, I don't think so, honey. Food truck culture. 15 seconds. For having food that is subpar,

that coasts on novelty because you got it out of a fucking vehicle. I don't think so, honey. You know what? This is not a novelty in some countries. I go to China. I get fucking delicious meals out of a cart as well. It doesn't cost me an arm and a fucking leg to buy stuff out of a food truck. It's well over one minute.

I don't think so, honey. Food truck holds her. One minute, ten seconds. That's all right. You will be docked pay pay okay that's fine i'll take it listen janine uh are you ready for your i don't think so honey i am so this is janine garofalo's i don't think so honey her time starts now i do not think so my dear um i a couple of things one is the vocal fry valley girl speak.

At least when I was growing up, it was contained. Mostly to Southern California. Moon Zap, of course, made it very, very famous. But it's broken wide, domestically, internationally. And when I hear people who are far too old to be doing it, it's just one of those things that becomes, it's an affectation that becomes, unfortunately, part of their way of communicating. And it's very annoying because it's not authentic. And also slang and lingo when it's used by adults, especially on the cooking channel, the food network. And also, I believe Richard Lewis deserves credit for on steroids and from hell.

Now, he coined those phrases on Letterman in the 80s. And they are now part of everyone's lexicon on steroids. First of all, you shouldn't be still saying it, but Richard Lewis deserves credit for on steroids and from hell, from Letterman from the early 1980s. Boom. And that's one minute. Oh, gorgeous. What a gorgeously timed.

We covered quite a- But nobody ever gets- Yeah, no, thank you for that. in his comedy routines, and they became like a fire. You know what I mean? Yes. But when people still say, on steroids, on acid, first of all, it's been done.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Let's talk about the food as an adult would. Yes. You don't have to say that that cupcake, first of all, it's of average size. Stop pretending it's large. I can't stand when people are pretending food is large when it's really of average to small size. I don't want to play along with that.

But when you see adults, hashtag worth it. Just speak. Just speak on it. Speak it. Because I feel like the hashtag thing literally couldn't last much longer than when it first became a thing. I was like, okay, the hashtag thing, that's going to get filtered out. But no, it's now becoming the world's on every television show they say hashtag this. It's just all kinds of slang and lingo.

And I understand that's part of our language. Which there's all kinds of slang that has stood the test of time. I mean, from Shakespeare on, I mean, Shakespeare is responsible for a great many things that we say. But some of the things, and also the way up, it's like, so I was like, I didn't want to go and then be late. Like, you hear it on the cell phones, because once you overhear inane conversations on cell phones, you can't under hear them. You know, you just hear them. And adults in business, you know, they're real business. You can tell because they say, we're on the same page and at the end of the day.

So that's how I know they're in business. Oh, my God. But they're speaking in that childlike little sing songy way, male and female. Yeah. People 30 and over. Yeah. And I just feel like that's not how you spoke. No.

You know, and you are bastardizing the queen's english and i shan't have it we love it we love it and yeah we it's such a hard left turn mentally to be like wait i'm gonna hashtag this out loud like what are you doing yes you know the conversation going don't don't punctuate it with this unnecessary like redundancy Or even like, you are so funny. Like when the person has said something, and also I've noticed a lot of younger people, not gonna lie, it's a thing. It's a not gonna lie.

Not gonna lie. But then what follows is the most innocuous statement no one would ever doubt the efficacy of. It's like, not gonna lie, love bottled water. It's the strangest. Slang must go. Slang must go. And on House Hunters too. That's what I'm talking about. the strangest. It's slang. Slang must go. Slang must go. And on House Hunters, too.

That's what I'm talking about. That's what I'm talking about. Bonus. It's not a bonus room, first of all. It's a room. Let's get that straight. Meteor room, man cave, she shed. Oh, God.

She shed? I haven't heard she shed. All of these nonsense words that adults use, especially like fun suburbanites, like when they get together. You know what I mean? You see them on HGTV a lot. It's their form of humor, I guess, and communication. But it's just like that's not how you speak. Right.

And I'm sure when the chips are down, if there's an emergency, if the house is on fire, I doubt very much when things are serious. People are like, oh, my God, grab the duvet. Not going to lie, we need to get out of here. Not going to lie, we need the duvet. Hashtag disaster. Hashtag over it. Unfilter yourself, people. So if you don't speak that way when things are important to you, I feel like just speak normally.

Because also, it's more interesting to the listener, I find, and for you to up your linguistic game. Just speak and don't back off. I know a lot of young people don't want to be vulnerable and that's part of it. And I was all – and they're like – and I know that's part of teenage. I don't want to commit because I'll get embarrassed if they make fun of me. So I do understand that. They might not know anything else. But I feel like, just speak

it. Speak it. And it's better for you. It's better. And also, there's many, many very intelligent people in my peer group in my life who speak, unfortunately, with a lot of slang and with a vocal fry. Now, if I didn't know that they were as smart as they are, and I'm not even talking about academics,

I'm talking about emotional intelligence, which can be more important sometimes. You wouldn't know it, you know, by the way they kind of communicate in a general way. And then it surprises you that when they do form a cogent thought. It takes a while to get there, not because it literally takes a while to get there,

but because you've written that person off. And I don't, you know what I mean? What I'm saying is I don't write them because I like them and I'm worried, but I don't understand the need to speak in this manner. Especially, you know, like I said, I'm among the oldest, but

you're 48 years old. Why are you speaking like Guy Fieri or a child? Which is basically the same thing. Like Guy Fieri or a child. Why? Well same thing pretty much like Guy Fieri or a child why well wow

this has been such a delight thank you so much Janine for coming on thank you for being here this has been an amazing episode

now here's the thing I guess like from where you're listening we're probably gonna get on Splash Mountain very soon sure just to let you guys

know where we're at between Space Mountain and Splash Mountain we just took an hour to like eat a turkey leg. Depending on the lines. Depending on the lines and other contingencies.

Exactly. So many contingencies. Anything could happen. But we probably just stopped and ate a turkey leg for an hour and now we're getting on. It's very, very warm.

There's that. There's bathroom bricks. There's crowds. You must consider all things. All variables. Yes, yes, yes. Consider all variables

out there. So aspirationally, aspirationally you aspirationally, you will be, hopefully, on Splash Mountain at this point. And really getting

our ultimate life on it. Of course, of course. To use a slang term. Not a slang term. That's more like an Oprah live your best. Right. That kind of thing

or you're better angels or a little aphorism, a little platitude. Or people love to get it on jewelry or t-shirts sure just somehow like that yeah it's gonna do it for well

I'd rather them have a phrase or a saying on their necklace than their own name oh I don't mind the name I don't mind the name than namaste or or live love laugh

no namaste and live love laugh both have to go for sure all right everybody thank you for listening thank you Janine Garofalo thank you all righty Live, love, laugh. No, not to say live, love, laugh. Both have to go for sure. All right, everybody. Thank you for listening. Thank you, Janine Garofalo. Thank you. All righty.

Should we close it with a song? Yeah, what song? Let's do the theme to Space Mountain. There is space. And on that space, there is a mountain for sure. And we found love on the mountain. space. There is a mountain for sure. And we found love on the mountain.

Bye. Forever Dog. This has been a Forever Dog production. Executive produced by Brett Boehm, Joe Cilio, and Alex Ramsey. For more original podcasts, please visit foreverdogpodcasts.com

and subscribe to our shows on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. Keep up with the latest Forever Dog news by following us on Twitter and Instagram, at Forever Dog Team, and liking our page on Facebook. On Thanksgiving Day, 1999, five-year-old Cuban boy Elian Gonzalez was found off the coast of Florida. And the question was, should the boy go back to his father in Cuba? Mr. Gonzalez wanted to go home

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Be a delusional dreamer. Just don't be a desperate delusional dreamer. Listen to On Purpose with Jay Shetty on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Trust me, you won't want to miss this one. I'm Julian Edelman. I'm Rob Gronkowski. And we are super excited

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