Last Podcast On The Left - Episode 176: Amityville Part II - The Truth

Episode Date: May 27, 2015

It's the actual truth behind The Amityville Horror today on Last Podcast as we go through all the more outrageous claims made by the Lutz family and refute each and every one, plus we'll hear more about what may or may not have happened the night of the actual murders from Ronnie DeFeo himself.

For some reason, even though we were about to talk about a family being murdered, cold-blooded in their sleep, the idea of you fitting an entire Q-tip in your belly button literally makes me physically nauseous. Well, you'll be happy to know I don't just fit one in, I can fit up to five. And you should see how many quarters I can fit in my nose. Alright, let's start the show, huh? Yeah! Marcus, I thought you were going to talk over this, because it was great.

Okay, okay, okay, let's take it again. Today, on Last Podcast, on the left, it's the story of Ronald Butch DeFeo. That's because the Butch DeFeo storyline reminds me of the song Iron Man, and then I was informed by Marcus before that, because I was like, this is the Iron Man. And he's like, we will be ripped from the sound waves so fast. Whatever gigantic corporate entity owns that song. Sharon Osborn owns it, you piss off Sharon, we've just pissed off the whole world. Oh my god, I don't want to piss off Sharon Osborn.

No, definitely. I'm calling Sharon Osborn out right now. If she wants to go, I'm willing to physically fight her. All of Black Sabbath's Disography. Well, alright, well, we're on Avenueville Part 2. And the last episode, the first episode, we went through the official story, the accepted story, as far as the DeFeo murders and the actual Haunting goes, and we told you at the end of the episode. On this one, we're going to tell you why all of that is bullshit.

Specifically, the Haunting is bullshit, but the Butch DeFeo murders are pretty suspect as well. Can we start with one thing? Because I actually wanted to talk with you about this, Marcus. Do you believe in ghosts? I believe in something. Not me, I don't know if it's ghost. We're strutting around the issue. What I'm looking for is black and white.

Alright, you're shooting for Grace. I farted myself awake yesterday. So that was kind of a Haunting. That's just making sure that you stay alone. Oh, okay. Oh, I see. It's kind of a different situation there. This case really disappoints me in many ways, because it is true.

It's totally horseshit, which we're going to nail it down point point point right now. Also, what are you going to do with the world's most famous ghost story? A lot of people are going to jump onto the boat. It's like the last boat pulling out of the children of men city where the babies can't be made anymore. It's like everyone's jumping onto the boat to get out of town, because that's where the money is. The Amityville boat. I'm keeping going with the metaphor. The Amityville boat is being driven by a man with a top hat and a monoclon, and he's sitting on a pile of coins.

They're going to Money Town. But I still heavily believe in ghosts. I think that you're over exaggerating how much money you can make with ghost hunting. With writing books about ghost hunting? Oh, yeah. J. Anson, the guy who wrote the Amityville whore, made millions upon millions of dollars. That's one guy. That's one guy.

You show me another. But this is a guy who sat on what was turned out to be the perfect storm of ghost stories. It's got family murder. It's got another family. It's all of these things that interest a lot of people. Never mind sitting on the storm that was the obsession with the exorcist that had just come out. It was primed to make money. I was listening to Coast to Coast last night, and he had a ghost hunter on.

He was trying to tell people to not do amateur ghost hunting anymore, because he's like, it's just far too dangerous, and you've just got to know, let the professionals do it. You know, I got a degree in ghost psychology from Phantom University in Fartsdale, Arizona. Fartsdale? I love Fartsdale, Arizona. Well, it's right next to Scottsdale. If my house isn't haunted, then why are there so many damn flies around? That's what I always say.

Look to where the flies are, and then you're going to find your ghost. But for your thing, I would say follow the money. Normally, you always got to follow the money. That's where the conspiracy is. But with you, I would say follow the many open cans of Budweiser and possible just plates covered with peanut butter, or what looks like peanut butter, which is probably just fucking feet diarrhea. You don't know me at all, Henry.

It is not peanut butter. And the thing is, when you buy Hormel Chili by the can, you're also buying a bowl. So I'm loving it. Thank you. So Amityville. Yeah. And the DeFeo's. So the DeFeo murders, what the accepted story is, or at least if you go with the haunting

story, is that there was a demon that came to Ronnie after he watched Castle Keep on TV and told him to kill his entire family. The Warren said that there was a demon that affected everybody who entered the house differently. And Professor Dr. Hans Holzer was super excited because he rode their horse. And nothing made him more happy than seeing a ghost freely on the back of a free ghost horse. Its ghost mane weaving in a ghost when I like to see it. I hate a real horse.

Oh, real horses are terrible. Terrible, horrifying creatures are big, six feet tall. I need a step stool to get on it. Take a car, I said, to my Professor Dr. Friends, of which there are only three. Well, that's a lot of friends actually. Rick Osuna, author of a book called The Night the DeFeo's died, he said in a meeting that he had with Butch on November 30th in 2000 that Butch confessed to the murders, but he confessed to doing them alongside his sister Dawn.

Cool. Now, how old is the sister Dawn? She was 18. Oh. Yeah. So unofficially, it points towards some sort of conspiracy. So first of all, let's go through these certain facts here. We said on the last episode that nobody woke up saying how creepy it was that nobody woke

up during all this. There were nine shots, but no victims made any attempt to escape, which suggests much more likely instead of, you know, ghost controlling the sound waves suggest a coordinated attack by more than one person. And we've got some footage from Mr. DeFeo right now talking about this exact conspiracy. So exciting. One person, go through the house and kill six people the way they think they will kill. The way they, excuse me, I'm going to correct myself.

The way they said they were killed. You show me how right now. Well, again, I'm asking the questions. I'm just giving you an opportunity. You're asking a question and I'm coming back, but you wouldn't answer. I don't know, but I'm not stating my belief in anything. I'm just asking you. I'm not saying you believe in anything.

I'm coming back with you. What an answer. I don't know. It's impossible. You're in an old one situation. You were in society and I'm going to tell you what. You, you, you, you and everybody else is scared. And you know what you're all afraid of?

You know I did this with other people and you're all afraid to deal with reality because that's reality, not the coming out of your mouth. But your explanation is that the other person was not. I wasn't there and you're never going to get me to change that. So it could have been someone else. Why, why would somebody else want to do that? Right. I'm just trying.

Are you intelligent people like yourself with all the years of college you got not sitting down in the lab examining and looking how to get the fail done all that by himself. But he's giving us multiple. Oh my God. It's completely reasonable and you got to listen to me. I went out and I had to get nine cannolis shaped in the pyramid because it was my sister's cousins and Lisa's birthday party two days from then. Right.

So I leave and kill my father. Who knows? Yeah. It could have been my sister. I don't know. It could have been. I could have swore. I saw a little leprechaun.

It could have been a goddamn leprechaun. I don't know. Two wooden shoes. And that leprechaun was so scared by my own goddamn sister. And I was like, God damn it, Dawn. You scared leprechaun? Because the thing is, you catch a fucking leprechaun, right? You can shake it gold out of it.

And I was like, you're the fucking judge. Let him kill all brothers and sisters. All brothers and sisters. All right. Let's just wrap up the interview. This is going absolutely nowhere. I love it. But the story that he put forth, that Butch DeFeo put forth,

he wrote in a letter, he said it was cold blooded murder period, no ghosts, no demons, just three people in which I was once. But you're also looking at, this was during the trial, again, you remember, he was going, he was trying to be ruled innocent by reason of insanity. Right. And so part of his strategy, where Butch thought he was a genius, was that I'll tell them nine different stories.

And so he started with the one story where he did it, and then he included Don. And then, because, you know, the story that he said here was that Don convinced Butch to do it while they were fucking getting wasted in the basement, watching Castle Keep, because Don, because their parents wouldn't let Don move with her boyfriend to Florida. Yeah.

Oh. Always a small island of excuses to kill your parents. If you have a daughter and her name is Don and she's 18 and she wants to move to Florida, let her go. Yeah. All women named Don belong in Florida. Beautiful, beautiful, luxurious Florida. Oh, yeah.

So Don supposedly convinced both Butch and a friend of theirs to commit the murders. Can you imagine being the poor celly for DeFeo? Yeah. Like every morning, every day, 24-7, you've got to listen to that voice. That would be the worst situation. I would hang myself with the first shoelace I saw.

That guy's like first parole hearing reasons. Like I just want to say, I know when I entered into this prison, I was a hardened murderer. I killed several gas station attendants. Run the cord around from the gas station, the machine. I just ran it around the throat and I killed them because I was mad at the government for how expensive gas was.

But now spending six months with Butch DeFeo in that cell, I've become a priest. So the murder plan was only supposed to be the parents. That's all it was supposed to be. But after the double murder, the friend ran out. And Butch said that he went out looking for the friend and while he was gone, Don, trying to eliminate all possible witnesses, shot the kids in their beds.

Okay, so I was under the impression it was a situation where they all went to individual rooms and said, count of three, we'll all shoot our guns off. And they do it all at once. Well, that's one of the stories. I mean, like Henry said, there's nine different stories going on here. Another thing, but then what happened is in his most

recent interview, which we heard that clip from first person killers on the bio network, which you know how reputable that is. It's a whole network based on biographies. Biographies, yep. He says that he just left, that there was no third person. He said now what he said that he'd left because he couldn't handle what just happened with his parents.

And then he left and then came back and Don had went nuts. And then he went to go get the gun from Don. And then in the struggle, he shoots her in the head. Yeah. Oh, and doesn't that happen all the time? Typical family tragedy. You leave the house, your sister goes, shoots up the whole family and you got a popper in the head.

Oh man. Well, there's also a DEA angle in this entire thing because it is also said that it's possible that the DeFeo's that Ronnie DeFeo, Big Ron, was involved in possible some mob business here and there. Well, the grandfather definitely was. Yeah, the grandfather definitely was. We can say they all were, right?

So there was a DEA agent that was staked out outside of the house. And this DEA agent told a journalist years later that he saw a woman exiting the house wearing a hooded jacket and black gloves holding a rifle and what Ronnie had or what Butch had said was that the demon had come to him wearing a hood and black gloves and has given him the rifle.

There was a member of law enforcement outside of the house during the shooting. Supposedly. We could argue this man isn't a hero. Is that correct? Well, he was a DEA agent. He couldn't fucking blow his cover. Absolutely. He's fucking six months deep into a story.

You can't stop a drug bust just because some guy kills his whole family. I just feel like that would be one of the times where maybe you could break character and try to save some lives. He's gathering evidence. Oh, I see. Partiality. It's like a documentary maker.

That's what cops are like. You watch something like, you watch something going on and you just need to commemorate it for history. You don't stop it. Yes, yes. That's very true. Some say that the two, Don and Butch, some say that they were involved in an incestuous relationship.

Okay. Yeah. Sisters sliding into one each other just planning some sweet, sick murder. They say that Ron killed the parents, Don killed the family, so Ron killed Don and the grandfather who was in the mob

when he showed up at the police station before Ron's confession told Ron to take the rap for all the murders to keep the name from being sullied any further. He said, take the rap. You take the rap. You're not going to talk about fucking your sister. Oh, okay.

You're just going to go to jail. Because honestly, because that is actually very true. His grandfather did show up to talk to Ron when all the shit went down and it's just literally just like, hey Ronnie, hey Lucy, come here, come here, come here. You know, I saw you fucking Don in the pool last summer.

It's all things your fucking fault. And you couldn't take all of this shit. Listen, I know, I watched you guys look at each other with this special magic. I know that, I know you guys had some special, I understand how my sister, how many times I looked at her and I was like, oh, oh, wish you swivels some hips.

I got to get up in them guts. All right, grandfather. I think you've had enough here. Good God. We're still in a police precinct for Christ's sake. Have you guys looked at a picture of Don DeFeo? She looks like mozzarella with a wig on. Isn't that nice?

And who doesn't love mozzarella? Put some eyes on it. Well, I love that. So this was the point of shame for the family, for the DeFeo family was that he was banging his sister, not the whole suicide murder that, the alcoholism, the drug abuse. I think it would have been way worse

if it was a point of pride for the family. I don't know. At this point, it's the least offensive thing that they could have done, I think. And a criminologist said in court that he believed that the bodies were moved and that more than one weapon was used. Oh.

Because they did this sound test by, because we were saying before, is it, what was the name of this rifle? You know, Marcus. 3030 Marlon. Exactly, because it's tattooed on your belly, all the lists of guns that are fun to shoot in Texas. Yep.

Now, the sound test by the police basically said that this gun is so huge, it could be heard for like four blocks and nobody heard anything at night. So it does suggest a different gun, but then also, what about demonic power? Marcus, I mean, there is a part of me that truly wants to believe that the house was haunted

and that a demon lived there named Munkashonka from the Shawnee Cock tribe, and he was making him kill the family. I would love that to be true. Yeah, I mean. So I'm still fighting for it. That's the narrative that I'm sticking with. I definitely believe the house was haunted.

Something compelled him to make these, you know, for these events to occur. Something compelled him, and I think it was a demon. Absolutely not. It was mama's dookie stew. What? The dookie stew pushed him over the edge. The demon was sick of smelling it.

She had to kill it. She had to be murdered. Well, that's the first... These white men don't know how to make proper casserole. They'll teach them through the acts of horrible revenge. So on November 21st, 1975, DeFeo, of course, found guilty on six counts of second-degree murder,

and he was sentenced to 25 years to life. So that part of the story is pretty much wrapped up. I mean, I wouldn't necessarily say that's a hoax, but there are definitely a lot of... That's where the seeds of demons were planted. And also a bit of this way, where Jail did great for Eddie Gain, where he gained weight and looked super, like, healthy and shit.

Ronald DeFeo looks like a rat. Oh, he looks terrible. Probably getting better food. But at Gain's situation, he went to an institution, which is where DeFeo wanted to go. Yeah, oh yeah, everyone wants to go to an institution. No one wants to go to the penitentiary. Every day I ask to be placed into an institution.

I would love to be taken care of, you know? And that would be so great, because a nurse is like a mommy girlfriend. And then she also goes, and if you do your job right, you may be a little tug out of her. Maybe... I don't know if it's like an Asian massage parlor there, Henry.

You can't just do the nurse to get a hand job? I don't know. I think they mostly force-feed drugs down your throat when you want to stay awake. Yeah, but it's 8 p.m., so it's bedtime. But that's what I was looking forward to cancer, because I thought that if you're in hospice, every nurse is kind of a prostitute.

Man, you just have a different idea of medicine, huh? I better start changing the way I'm living my life. So the seeds of the demon house of Amityville have already been planted. They've been planted by Ronnie DeFeo. They've been planted by Ronnie Butch DeFeo in his defense, and so the entire thing happens with the Lutz's.

J. Anson writes his book, and this guy's name is Rick Moran. He's a researcher. He compiled a list of more than 100 factual errors and discrepancies between Anson's true story and what actually happened in Anson. Which is what happens when you get a super nerd real mad and jealous of your money,

as if you will come straight for the logic of your lies and just start being like, yeah, well, flies wouldn't be there in the summertime. Yeah, exactly. The perfect villain to the paranormal. The dude who wrote this book is just looking at this guy and being like, yeah, bro, we know it's all bullshit. Shut the fuck up. Shut up.

Here, who's $5,000? Guess what? That was nothing to me. Yeah, just fact checking the ghost hunting book. Actually, J. Anson actually did confront this guy. J. Anson, the guy that wrote Amityville Horror, he did confront Rick Moran, and he said, I like to make money. One day you'll be broke and I'll be on an island

in the Bahamas with a truckload of cashmere sweaters. Which is also the last thing you want to have on a tropical island. He's gonna be hot. It's gonna be like, he's definitely gonna be the weird guy who wears cashmere sweaters. No one really knows how he made his money. Was it counterfeit pants or was it demonology? Just ruining them with sweat and sand.

They're so delicate. Literally, he just put together two things in his head that he thinks are fancy. Island and sweaters. This fucking long island bastard. That's so stupid. I'm gonna be out there on my tropical island, don't you worry about it.

I'm gonna put my own hot thaw in there because you know what, I hate how the ocean's cold. That does sound like fun. So let's just go through, let's just go through all of the shit that these people talk. First of all, the infamous priest, father of Picarro, the get out.

Get out. You're a bitch. You're looking at me. I'm not ready yet. It's bad luck. Bad luck to look at somebody before he's ready to go out. Actually, stay. So Picarro, he confirmed the claims on the TV show In Search Of.

Which if you haven't seen, do. Yes, go look up all of In Search Of. They are great. It is early 80s like schlocky, paranormal documentary style show. They have a lot of fun information. The Amityville one in particular is very fun because it shows a priest just like backlit because he doesn't want to be named by names.

So it's him just going like, yeah, I've seen a lot of shit in my diamonds. These little boys waggling the butts around. It just breaks a man. Are you admitting to being a pedophile? No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. I am admitting to watching them though. All right.

Let's just get to the demon stuff. I see demons. Every time I look in the mirror, it's hard to be a priest. So Father Piccararo, he said in Search Of, he told Leonard Nimoy, yes, all of this stuff is true, but in an affidavit while he was under oath,

he said that he never even visited the house. If you lied to Leonard Nimoy, you should be shot in the head. Are you telling me a court of law in affidavit compelled him to tell the truth but Leonard couldn't? Leonard Nimoy, the Spock? Yes. Rest in peace.

Right there on the spot. He said that he only, this priest said he only talked to the Lutz's on the phone. But he did say, he's like, the thing is, it was on that phone, the whole time on the phone, I heard like another line pick up and it goes, it's like, hey, I'm a ghost, hey, get out of there. No, I mean, yeah, actually if you got,

hey, if you could get off the phone, I'm waiting for a call. So, all right, bye. When you go back to talking to the person, it's like, hey ghost, he sure knew how to interrupt a really nice conversation. 2016 summer coming, phone ghost. To a line near you. So the people who owned the house after the Lutz's,

Jim and Barbara Cromarty, said that none of the damage that the Lutz's claimed, including the broken locks and hinges actually occurred, and that all of the various hardware in the house appeared original. So they said that all of these doors slammed open, they said that all of these cabinets just kept banging, banging, banging, all this shit was ripped off of the hinges.

The Cromarty said that, no, everything was in perfect working order and this stuff, you know, appeared to be well-worn. None of it appeared to be newly replaced. Well, is it possible that the demon picked up after itself? Could that occur? I don't believe so. So the claim made by Professor Dr. Hans Holzer that the entire thing was built on an Indian burial ground

was refuted by members of the Shinnokok tribe. Shinnokok. Shinnokok. Was that the job that they did? Oh, God, don't start this because we're going to get letters. We're going to start talking about how the Shinnokok tribe invented the blow job. It's Shinnokok.

I looked it up and I even heard an actual pronunciation Shinnokok. Because there is the Shinnokok tribe and then there is the Shinnokok tribe. Shinnokok tribe, they started in Vegas. And, oh, were their cocks just blinding in the light. Yeah, wonderful stage show, one of the best I've ever seen. Really powerful. It says in the book that the Shinnokok tribe used the site of the house

hundreds of years earlier as a place to dump their mentally ill and dying. Well, Moran explained that experts told him that the tribe mentioned was not from the Amityville area at all and actually they inhabited the eastern tip of Long Island 70 miles away. So even if there was a burial ground or something like that, the Shinnokok tribe's chief, straight arrow Cooper, said, that doesn't mean we will go into somebody's body and capture their soul and control in a very negative way.

That's just not us. But they could. I love it. Of course, we could go possess any sort of dumb Italian family, but we would not do that. That's not our style. We will ask you to get out, but also sometimes, I mean, we just bring corn. It's a bad habit we have. We just keep giving white people food and we should stop.

We should start doing that and inhabiting them and killing their families. Yeah, you're just feeding the beast. You're giving it energy to kill you. As far as the demonic pig goes, remember the little girl had a demonic pig friend named Jody that looked into her bedroom at night. The demonic pig was actually a cat that Ronald DeFeo used to call the pig because it was just a big fat kitty. Yeah, and the cat used to look into her window from a tree branch that was right next to her bedroom.

So that's that one shot down. Well, it was the neighbor's Persian cat. The neighbor, his name was Rufus Ireland. He believes to the... Rufus Ireland. Sounds like a street fighting character. Street fighter, rather. Rufus Ireland.

Rufus believes to this day that the whole thing was planned and not a single neighbor heard any disturbance whatsoever from the house during the 28-day haunting that the Lutz has supposedly experienced. Is it possible the cat did it? Do we know that the cat didn't do it? The cat didn't do the entire haunting? Yeah, it sounds like a Persian cat can hold a shotgun. Absolutely.

Well, yeah, if you duct tape it to its body, well, we don't know who he didn't do it. And on the day the Lutz's claim that they saw the hoof prints in the snow records show that there was no snow in Amityville, New York that day. And the window that supposedly went up and down on its own did actually go up and down on its own. It did do it without the aid of human hands, but the counterweights on it were improperly adjusted and an investigator said that you could make the window move up and down by stepping on a certain spot on the floor.

And it was really interesting because they showed it in a documentary and it's literally like, it's kind of crazy looking. It's a guy just stomping on the floor and the window just shoots open. It's like, that's a great way to scare the fuck out of somebody really fast. It is so cool. Every house needs to have one of those kind of fun trick windows. The original articles about the haunting were actually in Good Housekeeping. Oh. I didn't know this. The whole story started in Good Housekeeping.

It just shows in the front it's just a ghost with a sheet over it, with a broom and dustpan next to it, like a beautiful spread. Well, that entire article said nothing about human forms, nothing about slime, nothing about demon faces in the fire. All that it talked about was like, well, we got this beautiful house for cheap and all these people were killed in it, but you know, we're hearing some strange noises and we're hearing some banging on the pipes. George said that, and the funny thing about how George responds to that,

George Lutz, he said he was misquoted, but strange noise is a far cry from my daughter's friends with the ghost pig. I don't know because you never, I mean, they would be making strange sort of pig cat noises. The idea is right, no one likes to be boring. It's so much, like how many times have you told a story that you, I mean, you embellished some details, you know, to make this story more entertaining, you know, and that's all the Lutz's were being, they were being fun little Vaudevillians. They were, and when Good Housekeeping comes calling, they're not just,

they don't want some boring tale. No, no, no, you gotta take out your shiniest doilies and you gotta really talk about all the rape and murder that happened in that house. Oh, absolutely. There's nothing Good Housekeeping loves more than a sex tuplet murder that possibly involves incest. Yeah, where Rolling Stone at the time was the most popular music magazine and if you were a musician of any, worth any salt, worth your salt, you're in Rolling Stone. And if your house, if your house is haunted, you gotta get in Good Housekeeping otherwise, was it?

Well, no, you may ask yourself the question, like, okay, the Lutz's, they were just, you know, just regular Long Island family. How did it get from them having this hoax-haunting to writing a book? How did it get from the actual, like, the hoax-haunting to the book, The Amityville Horror, and eventually all the movies that came afterwards? Well, supposedly the story is that the Lutz's contacted Butch DeFeo's lawyer, William Weber, because they felt sorry for Butch and thought that maybe the haunting had something to do with these sex tuple murders. That, to me, makes no sense whatsoever.

Like, this is the part of the story that I don't understand, that, like, I don't know how they got together, but they definitely did. And William Weber is a great example of, like, a Long Island district attorney. He's, like, the kind of guy that, like, he doesn't just, like, handle witnesses, it's, like, he would, like, scare one. Like, he would go up to, like, you know, follow a witness home and be like, you better watch yourself, because sometimes the truth, you know, comes back and haunts you. You know what I'm saying? Give a little slap on the face. And it's like, you made me think about your testimony.

You know, like, he's this very, he's a character. Right, right. Well, I mean, it is possible that, here's one of the things that I think about Amityville, is that it is very possible that there was some sort of residual haunting there. I think there had to have been. Yeah, I think there, I think that what happened in that house and what they were talking about, I think there was a seed where all of this came from. There definitely was. Like, that Good Housekeeping article.

They're talking like, okay, yeah, there's, like, some bangings. There's some, you know, strange noises. Like, it's kind of a, you know, it's kind of creepy. And I think that Weber got a hold of the Lutz's because Weber was already starting to field book proposals. People, publishers were already coming to him saying, like, hey, this DeFeo thing, because true crime always sells. And there are publishers coming to him saying, like, hey, you know, like, we need to get into this DeFeo story.

And Weber starts hearing about, like, oh, shit, the house that they used to live in. There's some kind of a haunting going on here. He gets together with the Lutz's and DeFeo and Weber actually said in 1979, he said that he visited the Lutz's nine or 10 times and they stayed up until three in the morning getting fucking wasted on wine and concocting the story that would eventually become the Amityville horror. Which is actually a very, it's a very, very smart move. He saw 20 steps ahead and he was like, we can put together this fucking, it's like, you guys had a little bit of a ghost.

Let's say, like, how many ghosts? Like, yeah, you say one, huh? But let's see maybe 25. Now that's selling books, that's moving units. And so he starts to understand you tie a family murder in with a haunting. That is just money, money, money, money, money, money, money. Everyone's going to flip out for it. Yeah, it brings it to that next level.

It gives it a final exclamation point on the story. That's for sure. Yeah, and he also, in his kind of defense, he also wanted to kind of use this stuff in his trial with Butch DeFeo. Like, he wanted to try, not necessarily use like the paranormal stuff, but he wanted the whole Amityville thing to be in the public consciousness when he started going for DeFeo for his appeals and things like that. Did they bring up the demons in the courtroom?

I don't think they ever brought up the demons in the courtroom. You gotta bring up the demons in front of the judge. You gotta do that. He did tell the story of the hooded demon with black hands on the stand. That was one of his stories. They tried. They really tried, but the problem is that Butch was too dumb to be crazy. Yeah, isn't that sad?

Yeah, yeah. And what Weber did that was actually kind of genius was he brought crime scene photos from the DeFeo murders over to the Lutz House and showed them, like, okay, here is Don's room. And like, you can see in Don's room, you can see in the crime scene photos that there are a lot of flies around. And the reason why there are a lot of flies around is because the bodies were left in the fuck, in a Long Island household,

in a sealed Long Island house for 48 hours. Of course, there are gonna be fucking flies everywhere. I thought you were gonna say they were left in the fly room. Like, most Long Island houses. They don't have that fly, the fly-jugesting room. Of course, the cocoon room. But you know what else is, but the Lutz's, the way he played it out is that the Lutz's would look at these pictures

and Weber would be like, you see these flies? You remember seeing any flies? And the Lutz's now fucking hammered. Or like, yeah, there were a lot of flies, right? There were a lot of flies. And so they started building the story up. And the other one was that they saw these, he showed them the picture of where they had fingerprinted,

they fingerprinted, dusted the door, leading into one of the kids' bedrooms. And Lutz looked at it and he's like, green slime. Man, that's some crazy green slime. We should have seen that. I bet, did you remember seeing green slime? And then all of a sudden, Miss Lutz is just like, yeah, of course I did, yeah.

Yeah, green slime, yeah. And they started building it again. Yeah, exactly. Right, right, right. And it doesn't help, I mean, I'm sure he came with a bunch of flies in his pocket. And he had green slime in his back pocket. He was just rubbing everything everywhere. They gotta keep all those frogs in the house.

It's the only way to get rid of flies. Well, at one point, there was a split between the Lutz's and Weber, the lawyer, because Weber wanted to give portions of the book proceeds to Butch DeFeo. And the Lutz's, they decided to not work with Weber, and they hooked up with Jay Anson on their own, which proved to be a bad idea because Jay Anson made fucking millions on this book. Millions upon millions. And the movie deals after that and all that, the Lutz's,

they got about $300,000 from both the book and the movie. And Jay Anson, he as much admitted to the screenwriter of the movie that most of it was made up, he said it's up to the reader to decide what's true. Him and Oliver Stone. But then I also, there was an even more nefarious sort of, a little bit more of a nefarious angle that they didn't even, it wasn't even a moral choice. It was the fact that basically they had met with Weber, and what they did was they got really drunk and they created this story.

And then they sort of conveniently forgot that Weber existed. And then what Weber tried to do was horn in and try to get 5%, like send them a contract being like, and if you want I can handle your book deals for 5% of this contract. The Lutz's, in one storyline, the Lutz's say to him like, we don't actually know, no thank you, we don't want to, you know, we don't want to give you money, we don't want to take money from this. And then turned around and we're like,

we don't have to give a percentage to anybody. Like we can just do this all on our own and make all this money just for our pockets. The finances of this are, this is the most horrific part of the whole episode. Of the whole two parter. If I hear the word 5% ever again, I'm done. I'm done with the whole thing. So they're all just a bunch of lion schmucks. Oh yeah, all of them. Yeah, they're all lion schmucks.

Jay Anson, you know, like he said, you know, that great line about the cashmere sweaters, the truckload and the Bahamas and all that. You know, like they just, all of them. But the Lutz's, to their credit, they stuck to their story until the day they died. They both died, they both said that they saw shit, which makes me believe they did see things.

I think, I think that there was, there was some sort of activity going on in the house. It just wasn't all the trumped up horseshit. Cause even the Lutz's, you watch them get a little contrite when the movie comes out. Because they were talking about how like, there was an interview with George Lutz where he was just like, when the fly scene came out in the movie and the original movie

where the priestess is assaulted by the flies is good. Yeah, that's my favorite scene. It's a great scene. It's awesome. We will say he acted like those flies were a lot stronger than flies are. Yes, he was instinctive. I mean, they're just flies. Come on.

Come on, buddy. They're not going to bite you. But Lutz was saying, he was watching it and he was like, I feel guilty watching this because he's like, I wish that it had been more like what had actually happened because what had actually happened was truly scary. And I do because there's certain things that they say. I think that there's also a psychological angle.

I think he did started acting more hostile towards his family when they moved into that house. Right, I mean, and once you open up your mind door to the idea that your residence is haunted, I think you're going to start seeing things a lot more. You're just going to be more aware of your surroundings. Yeah, I mean, I'll say that something was going on there, but it is nowhere near as intense as I think something did go on there

that disturbed this family. But I also do think that they trumped it up for financial gain. It was like last night I was sitting in the house and I just got done watching a movie and I was sitting in the dark and I was sitting here and I just, I felt watched. And I felt like my skin was getting all goose bumpy and I was like somebody watching me and I started walking around the house,

like trying to see if anybody was looking at me and I felt like eyes on me. And it was unlike anything I've ever experienced. And then I looked at the window and it was just a Mountie doing a house check. I didn't know that they did house checks in Canada. I didn't know either and that's what he said. I hope he was a Mountie.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Because then he took a semen sample, which he said was a thing that they do in Canada, that they do it to outsiders. They're trying to collect as much American cum as they can because we're stronger. Oh, I didn't know. Yeah, well, that makes a lot of sense.

I'm sure it's at some lab right now and they're doing a lot of research on your semen. Yeah, he just ate it. Oh, he ate it. Oh, so he was kind of the vessel that he was carrying it. I see. Okay, well, maybe he throws it up then when he gets to the precinct.

There's no doubt that he's a real Mountie. You were not molested. He had a hat on. No shirt. No shirt. Okay, good, good. So one of the things that people point towards, as far as the Amityville horror story goes,

is that there is a very famous, very creepy photograph of the Amityville house. It is at the top of the stairs, because the Warrens, when they came in, when the Warrens and the team of parapsychologists and the reporters came in, the Warrens set up these automatic cameras that would just take pictures every five minutes.

And these photographs sat in a file at the Warrens' house for years and years and years until this secretary was looking through them. They were going back through the Amityville case. She was going back through them. And she said that every time she came to a certain photograph, the secretary was pregnant, she said every time she came to a certain photograph,

the baby would kick. Every time she said the baby would kick. It's going to be a little demonologist. The instincts are good. Oh, wow. And so she looked, she brought out the photo and she looked at it very closely. And you can see, it is very clear,

it is not an optical illusion, you can see a face in the back, it's kind of in the background. It's pretty haunting. It's a really scary little picture because it looks like a little boy and he's got his middle finger up. Oh, it's just really weird.

And his eyes are glowing and it's very, it's very, very creepy. But unfortunately for paranormal investigators, the most likely explanation is that the face in the photo belongs to paranormal investigator Paul Bartz. Paul Bartz did it? Yeah, he's wearing old time.

Get out of here, Bartz. You can see another photo of Paul Bartz that night and they're wearing the same shirt. It could also be Paul Bartz's nephew, a 10-year-old boy who happened to be tagging along that night. Oh, that is quite possible. Well, or it's a ghost.

I feel like it's a ghost. I like this quote a lot. This is from Paul Bartz. The image in the photo you mentioned does resemble me and I know that Ed now deceased and Lorraine went on record including national television

stating it was a ghost. Because I have great respect and admiration for them, I will say no more on the issue and I will allow the legend of the most haunted house in America to continue. That is my, that's a great response.

Yeah, it really is. It's like, listen guys, I know this is all bullshit and I know that's my nephew Johnny. And I've just told you it's bullshit. I've just said it. I've just told you it's bullshit. But now you can use this end quote to exonerate it every single time.

You can just paraphrase me like this and just do the brackets on either side of it and it will always land on the end. The legend of the most haunted house in America is continuing. I mean, it's like all weird. Yes.

Brackets and weird quotes they're going to have to work hard to make that go in line with the legend but they can do it. They can definitely do it. How many Phil Horror House has a lot of asterisks?

All over the whole story. Yeah, it definitely does. And I think people say like, okay, it was a big hoax. They made some money. What was the harm in that? I think there is a harm in faking a story like this.

Well, I mean, I don't know if there's a harm in faking the ghost story. I think in faking a demon story and faking a devil story, there is a harm in that because it implants into people's consciousness, it continues this bullshit idea that the devil is an entity, that the devil is out to get you.

The whole evangelical movement that sprouted out of the 70s and 80s, a lot of that stuff was rooted in stuff like the Exorcist and especially the Amityville Horror as a true story. And suddenly before the 70s the devil was something like, oh, the devil,

yeah, whatever, it's not real. But after that, the idea of the devil being an actual entity and something for the evangelicals to fight against and the rise of the Christian right, you can trace a lot of that stuff back to the Exorcist and the Amityville Horror. So there is a lot

of harm in these people making these. The character of our dark lord and savior, Satan himself, the master of illumination, the destroyer of ignorance, that is what they're trying to do. They're trying to say again and again that we're evil. How many times I tell people

in Toronto that I am a Satanist and they look at me like I'm some kind of crazy person. Do you do it with your shirt on or off? Well, mostly off and I'm yelling. But again, because I told them is that because lies can't stand a hairy back.

That's a good point. I love this story. I'm happy that it stuck around and I'm happy that we have a powerful Satan that has to be defeated by evangelicals. It's a good time, but you're right. It did get Jimmy Carter elected. Yes, it did. But that's okay. I think it was a wonderful

movies, great entertaining books. Yeah, they were in the books and the whole haunted house demon genre in novels in the 70s and 80s that came out. There's a lot of really great, like 666 is a really cool demon

novel about the haunting of Hell House. Hell House is really good. Anything Richard Matheson is really fucking good in terms of horror novels. The movie The Haunting is great. I love this whole again. Yes, I'm the same exact way. I like every single one

of the films in this genre. If it is a demon holding a house, I love it. Keep them coming. Even 13 ghosts had its moments. I got a bunch of pretzels in my bed. That is the saddest of all. You know what? I do too. You got pretzels in your bed? Yeah.

I washed my sheets last night so I'm a real bachelor. I got clean old sheets. I also watched a movie last night called The Canal that was very good. Very good. I saw a film a little bit off topic. It is not

about demons, but it's about aliens extraterrestrial. I gotta watch that. Which was phenomenal. Is it good? It is very good. It is very good. And it is on Netflix? Yes. And they did, of course, it was from Grave Encounters 1 and 2 and that plays with the demons. And they have a very good understanding of how to create fear.

Nice. Yeah, Grave Encounters is awesome. Yes, it was. Oh, yes, it was. We also, I guess we can get back to the Warrens. But as far as Warrens, as far as their approach to demon hunting, what are we going to give them? What's their grade? You know, at least they were respectful. A pet peeve of mine

is those ghost hunting shows where they're like, no, you fucking dickhead. Like, they sound like they're about to give it a swirly or, you know, call it some anti-gay slur. No, they're the Warrens. They get an A plus for their, the fact that they have their own demonology school and they had, it's a perfect pair of salesmen, like Guy who's

like the face of it and a talker with Ed and Lorraine who was the psychic. The medium. They went at that and they were very penitent and very serious and they they had that very great, you know, like her clutching her brooch, like going into a place being like, I feel

spirits here. You know, like that sort of vibe gives them an A. They must have had a very exotic sex life. Oh, you think so? I do. Yeah. Lorraine, I think that there's a ghost in your pussy. Are you better

scare him out of there? Well, it seems like there's one. It seems like your anus has been haunted by a horse ghost? Yes. Well, it seems like we need to call up Dr. Professor and see if he can come on over.

I'd be happy to help you look for the horse ghost. It's in the behind of Mrs. Warwick's excellent, excellent. Let me just get my ghost prod. Uh-oh. Amityville, the porn edition. Professor Dr. Hans comes over

because he takes the ghost scaring a little too seriously. We're just trying to fuck here, Hans. The role playing, though, you got to get into the role playing. Well, that's Amityville, part 2. We got Amityville, yeah, it's it is, it's come, I would say

80% bullshit, 20% run of the mill, family murder haunting. Okay, but it's very terrifying the idea of having a child and then killing all of your, all of his siblings and you as well. Yeah, yeah. So that is scary. That is definitely like the worst case scenario of a family.

Worst one, yeah, worst one. So go and write and review us on iTunes That helps us get bumped up in the rankings Go to last pocket go to cave comedy radio comm slash last podcast on the left to get your last podcast on the left t-shirt And we've got new t-shirts coming out here. We're probably gonna start pre-orders here in the next couple of weeks We've almost got the final design Lockdown and it looks fantastic. You guys are gonna absolutely love these. They're just god They're so cool. Oh, this is a shirt. I will wear around. Yeah

I always feel weird about wearing the actual last podcast shirt around because I don't want to be like Like the people while they walked on the street. Well, you know, but this is gonna be awesome All right. Well, yeah, I guess that's I guess yeah watch out on the Facebook page For that and I got big news here at the end is the Kalman album is out in two days on May 29th And we're gonna play a track here at the end. We're gonna play a preview track from the album Very excited. So enjoy enjoy this after the out after the episode's over We're gonna be playing a Kalman try you can find us on a band camp and you can pre-order the album now It's only seven bucks or what you want whatever you want to pay via bandcamp comm slash the Kalman

That's great. And of course find us on Twitter at Marcus Parks at Henry loves you I'm a Ben kissle and at LP on the left hail Satan I thank you for giving me the ability to smoke weed harder Yes, we'll do a hail you and thank you for all the nice messages on Facebook and Twitter as well Absolutely very well. I like that. Yes. There we go. And I mean and a high ol game and we've also got the album release show on May 29th. Now. Enjoy this track from the new Kalman. Oh, right? Well, I drink white lining when the cops are right, but them God damn coldies won't leave me alone. I'm a sad son. We don't drink in his bed, but she had to get thrown at sex with my bed. Lifted in love to be his wife, then Christy married old granddad on ice, miss a wife tender, don't be so slow. I got time for another and a six-pack to go.

If Triggins are sad, the girls, my friends, oh, give me a shot and we'll slip to the gym. I built my house out of beer bottles, but drank too much bourbon as a broken glass. I went to Tucson to see my old letter. She never knew so I drove back home. I don't need housing and I don't need wealth. I just need a bottle that I can call them. Give me a permit or give me a prayer. I'd listen to your story, but I cut off my ear. If Triggins are sad, the girls, my friends, oh, give me a shot and we'll slip to the gym. And now I've got plenty with a bottle of shots, but nursing the doctors say I'll call the cops. When it ain't over, we party till dawn. I named that bottle Paul Peter and John and I hang my first drink the age of three. I picked a bottle from the whiskey tree. I drank it, I drank it, I got rich. I learned how to cry and I learned how to fight. If Triggins are sad, the girls, my friends, oh, give me a shot and we'll slip to the gym. Thank you.