Last Podcast On The Left - Episode 193: Son of Sam Part I - Kill For My Master

Episode Date: September 24, 2015

In the first of our two parter on David Berkowitz aka The Son of Sam, we cover the beginnings of David's life as a pudgy arson prone child in the Bronx to his eventual status as the man who held New York City hostage with his .44 caliber revolver throughout the first half of 1977.

Hey, just reminding you guys, we got a live show this Saturday, September 26th at 11pm at the Creek and the Cave in Long Island City, Queens, 1093 Jackson Avenue, off of the G-Train and the 7th train. If you can't make it out, we're going to be live streaming the show like we do every month on our YouTube channel. We got Hold McNeely from the Round Table of Gentlemen sitting in for Henry this month, so we'll either see you guys on the live stream or here in Queens, and that is 11pm Eastern Standard Time for all of you guys out there around the world, and speaking of Queens,

it's time for today's heavy hitter, Son of Sam. Alright, well that's not going to help. That's not the spelling. That's not the alphabet as I know it. Hey, baby, say the never-gone-safe thing. Alright, welcome to the last podcast on the left, everybody. I'm Ben Kissel. As always, joined by Marcus Parks in the studio, but unfortunately, all the way across the,

what do you call it, border is Canada, and there's a person there in Toronto that we know. I got to tell you, you know, the funniest thing about baseball is that all you need with baseball is a ball, it's 95% ball, and then it's got to be 13% bases, and that's baseball. That's why you don't talk to people at a water cooler. Yeah, and that's why I've just been delivering wisdom as Yogi Berra until yesterday when I died of a self-inflicted gunshot wound to my own face.

Oh, that's not, oh, that was a sad death, Yogi's death. Yogi Berra, just another Brooklyn idiot. Well, some people thought he was a genius. I just think that it's funny that Yogi Berra said things that in many other societies would label him as a man with a learning disability, and it made him very famous. Yes. The idea of him just going like, you know, a fruit is a fruit, vegetables are a fruit for assholes.

You know what I mean? And that's all he said was stuff like, you know, sometimes when you're wearing a hat, it's like he got something on your head. And then he became famous, and also like, kind of like how Forrest Gump was just because he was so sweet, still doesn't change the fact that a folk singer made love to a gigantic retarded man. Yep, yep, and she hung out with very, very difficult left-leaning individuals who beat her.

Chen-A, all right, but speaking of summer, Yogi Berra, of course, baseball is the game of the summer, and back in the 1970s, there was another activity that was happening in the summer, a whole bunch of shootings. Today we're going to be discussing The Son of Sam. Oh, yeah. Yogi Berra-Bercawitz, AKA The Son of Sam, AKA The 44 Caliber Killer. Can I give him a new nickname today? Mm-hmm.

Soggy bottoms. Oh! Not going to argue with that one. After having done quite a bit of research on Mr. David Berra-Bercawitz, many a soggy bottom were had between 1976 and 1977 in which he killed six people and wounded seven here in New York City, a spree that lasted one year and three days. That's right. So today here on the last podcast on the left, apparently we're going to be focusing on his liquid dumps. Is that what we're getting at so far?

Just something about like when I think of David Berkowitz and I look at his face, I imagine the wet gene of a man sitting at a magic, the gathering competition all day. Or this man is a David Berkowitz and getting deep into the research about him is that he's amazing what he did to New York City. He held the entire city and the grip of fear. We covered it a little bit when we did our in search of the boogeyman, when we looked at where he shot people up in Forest Hills. But getting into the man himself, he was just kind of, I think of him as an Ed Kemper light. Yeah, yeah, he might actually weigh less than Ed Kemper. Oh, he weighs much less. He was like five

eight. Ed Kemper was your size. Oh, interesting. Yeah, huge in human. Oh, I see. Right. Like if you were to take an elephant and match him with an orangutan, then have to tell him, try to put in some Wrangler genes. Put him to work. So David Berkowitz, as I said, he was known as the 44 caliber killer because the weapon he used all throughout was a 44 caliber revolver. Now Berkowitz is very rare in his use of firearms as a murder weapon in the serial killer world. Gunshot wounds account for less than 8% of all sexually motivated serial murders. David Berkowitz was also a lot younger than a lot of the other killers. The average age of a serial killer during their first murder is 27.5. But Berkowitz

had already racked up seven before he was 24. And what am I doing at 34? Good God, what a loser I am. It's like Daniel, David Berkowitz is sort of like the Dakota Fanning. Right. Serial killers. I also want to put it again. This is why I like to refer to him as Ed Camper Light because he has sort of the same motivation. So it's delivered. It's kind of he's got a big old fashioned, old timey mommy complex and he hates girls who are making out with dudes because they're not making out with him and they never will because he's a fucking loser. And so Ed Camper felt those same feelings. But what he did was really get all with the stabbing of him and getting really intense

and jizzing in his pants. And then you remember the whole thing. Do you remember Marcus when he cut his mother's head off and made it blow him for a bunch of days? Blow him and then put it on the mantle and yell that up for two hours. You remember that. Yeah. There's a whole episode about it. Yeah. David Berkowitz just blamed it on a fucking dog. Or so he claimed. So let's get into the early life of David Berkowitz. Birth name Richard David Falco. He was the product of an affair between a married real estate agent named Joseph Kleinman and Betty Falco, a former fish market employee.

And I'll say this. You could never trust a woman who works at a fish market. A monger. A fish monger woman is not to be trusted. You know why? Because she spends older times with eels and eels are liars. I don't know if that's true. That's untrue. I'm going to say a fish market lady is the most trustworthy person on the face of the planet. Fish is a very controversial thing to sell and they got to be telling the truth. Otherwise you'd die. You're just trying to get a toe into the fish market. Fish monger single scene. There's a dating app for it. Wet women. Yeah. Don't look that up. Don't look at the women at work right now. Don't do that.

No. Carp chicks. Nothing like a bunch of flappy carp chicks. Yum, yum, yum. So immediately this guy was given up for adoption and Dick Falco became David Berkowitz, the only son of Nathan and Pearl Berkowitz. As Henry said, unusually close to his adopted mother, but his father would repeatedly refer to David every chance he could as, quote, a mistake. Because you know how it is with Jewish couples. They just got really upset that they never received a receipt and could not return him. So adoption, not uncommon in serial killers. Kenneth Bianchi, one of the hell side stranglers and Joel Rifkin, who killed 17 prostitutes here in New York City between 1989 and 1993.

Both adopted. Here's another interesting side note. Berkowitz and Rifkin, both Jewish, which is extremely rare among serial killers. You can actually find out that that was part of why he felt so isolated because he felt like he wasn't like the other Jewish kids. Because the other Jewish kids respected their mother and father and respected society and were like law abiding good people. And he felt that he was always lacking in that always. He always felt he had a whole deep inside. And at the same time, he had a very normal childhood. Yeah. And not only did he not feel at home with some of these Jewish kids, but he was also in the Bronx during a time of transition

from a Jewish neighborhood over into an Hispanic neighborhood. So he was getting constantly like Jew boy, being made fun of and picked on because he was Jewish. Well, that's really all that is is a switch from Kendall Labra's to Pinata's. That's really all it is. If you want to switch it over is you have to take out all you take out all the what they call the the muckersharkers. What are they called? The Hamses? No, no, no, no. The things that the Kendall Labra's. The Mizzuzes. The Mizzuzes? No, no, no, that's a scroll. Let's just agree they're not the muckersharkers. I think we know what they're not, which is an important step to finding out what they are.

Every single thing that looks Jewish, anything that looks like it's got like an alien language written on it, that's Hebrew. You take that out and you replace it with a bunch of corn with cream on it with spices on top. I love Mexican corn. Sounds like kind of a racist way to describe that gentrification there. That's all I'm about. Yeah, interesting. And of course, after the killings, you know, he felt very guilty. So David, extremely hyperactive child, bigger, heavier than kids his own age. In fact, the word pudgy would be used to describe him all of his life, having been used in almost every single article, book, or documentary written and made after his arrest.

And I also want to put it this way, okay, he's TV fat. He's not even real fat. Okay, John Langey, he was actually fat. Yeah, this guy is this is the fake Seth Rogen. I'm your harmless boyfriend fat. So David was said to be a relatively normal child until like many other serial killers, he suffered two dramatic head injuries, one at four, in which a kid dropped a rock on his head from the top of a building. So it was the kid Wiley Coyote. Yeah, one of those and he saw him and David ran by and he had like a puff of smoke behind him. Because he missed him on a giant like slingshot. He was trying to shoot himself at him with it. It's different different times. It's more

of a cartoon time. Lord of the flies situation. Oh, I remember the Acme neighborhood really changing when it went from the Acme Jewish neighborhood to where it was a lot of yarmulkes with springs on them. You know, to rice that you couldn't eat because it was fake, just fake rice on a dish. Well, that was the only head injury that he had. He had another one at the age of seven after being hit by a car. Now, following the second brain injury, he became fairly aggressive, but quiet and prone to temper tantrums. He once tore down all of the curtains in his family's apartment in a huge fit of rage. He also enjoyed burning bugs as a hobby and killed his mother's pet bird, all behavior that came after the injury.

And the truth is he killed his mother's pet bird because he was jealous of the attention the mother would give to this bird. When his adoptive parents were raising him, they told him the whole time that his mother died in childbirth. And this filled David with this sense of guilt that he killed. He killed his mom just by being brought into this world and that his father left the scene quickly afterwards. And so this caused him to have this sort of like fiery intense connection to his adoptive mother. But at the same time, he like hated her for it. Yeah, he had very common serial killer trait that we see constantly where it's just like, love mommy, hate mommy, want vagina, hate vagina. Yeah. So when David

was 14, 15 months after his bar mitzvah, his mother died of breast cancer completely devastated him because again, it was another woman leaving his life, not just had his mother left him at childbirth, but now his adoptive mother had left him as well. And he had known all of his life that he had been adopted, as Henry said. And he would also blame himself not just for his birth mother's death, but also for his adopted mother's death. He said that he thought that she died because he quote, wasn't good enough. And you have these reoccurring nightmares where his real father would come back and kill him. And eventually he was consumed with nightmares as a kid, a very frightful kid, like a pussy. He was definitely doing

something wrong. He's doing a lot wrong. All of his moms are dead. He's got to figure that out. No, the first one. That was a lie. His first one was still alive. But he thinks she's dead. So what's the difference? So David, he did, despite all the things with, you know, the problems with women and all that, David Berkowitz is a fascinating character to me, not just because of how he grew up, but also because of the perceptions that people have about him. And they weigh in the way that people really oversimplified this guy is that David Berkowitz was actually a pretty complicated guy in a lot of different ways. He actually did have somewhat of a sweetheart growing up, a girl named Iris Gerhardt. Oh

yeah, good old Iris. About David, she said, I was never intimate with him, you know, I mean, we were full. We just kissed each other on the lips of the buildup and co-op city when we all hung around the local community club. But I must confess, I like them a lot. Yeah, I've got this book. Yeah, I got this book that I got in fascinating little true crime artifact. It's called Son of Sam, the 44 caliber killer. And it was written after Berkowitz was caught, but before he was sentenced. There's a little picture on the cover that just said that has a son of Sam and it says the accused and it was written by a New York Post reporter, probably in, I don't know, three weeks or something like that. So it's

just horribly but wonderfully written all at the same time. And he devotes an entire chapter to Iris Gerhardt. He went, he found her, he did interviews with her and found out that they and found out a lot about David Berkowitz when he was growing up, when he was in high school, was not always the loner that he later became. Weird dude, definitely a weird dude, but he still had close friends. In fact, they all threw him a party the night before he left to join the army in 1971. They all drove him to Port Authority the next morning, all said goodbye. They hung out together. They had like New Year's Eve parties together. At some point though, it sounds a bit like an overkill when they throw you the party,

when you're leaving and they drive you to make sure you get on the train. It makes you think that they wanted him gone, you know, and he's like, guys, but what if I stayed and they're like, no, you want to go? You're gonna, guys, you guys have been so nice. It's 1971. Vietnam's going to be a blast where you're going to Vietnam. You can do nothing but surf. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, get in the bus. I was thinking you guys have been so good to me these past couple of days, maybe I should just stick around. Get in the bus. Drive the lane. Drive it. So he did actually manage to avoid Vietnam. But what he said about himself was that no matter what happened to him, he said he was

always surrounded by love and people loving him and he had a lot of friends, but he always felt distinctly alone. Like what you see a lot, it's a treat of being a kind of like a psychopath because a part of it is that you do believe you're better than other people. He believed that he was the thing because he called himself the schmutz, which means the dirty one. And he said that he was never good enough that all he did was bring the party down. And the thing is that if you have that attitude, you are ruining everybody's good time. You are doing that. So yeah, it's self fulfilling prophecy. Yeah. You can't receive love and you can't give love. That's the problem.

You can't love yourself before you love anybody else. That's right. That's right. So David, he managed to avoid Vietnam. But also he had a very big nationalist streak, which we're also going to see about Dave, the fucking Davey, fucking Murky, is that he loved to belong to a group. He never wanted to be a leader. He just wanted to be a part of some sort of society. And so he went to join the army because he wanted to be a Jewish super soldier. Like truly, he was like, I want to be a Jewish kid that becomes famous for like dying in Vietnam. And what happens when he goes to Vietnam? He gets sent to Korea, which is of course part of a larger government

conspiracy in order for them to continue the war in Vietnam, the proxy war against the Russians. If Berkowitz goes over to Vietnam, you know what happens? We win the war. And they know for a fact, as soon as you send big fat David over there, you know, the Viet Cong are going to surrender immediately. We need at least in their five, six years of this thing. The other thing about David Berkowitz wanting to belong is that in his co-op, where he grew up, co-op city that had their own fire precinct, he would go down there. He would sneak in and put on firefighter uniforms and would sometimes like wear them home and they'd have to go

up and say like, Hey, David, you can't, you can't do this. You can't steal uniforms. He was a part of the NYPD auxiliary police force for a couple of years. This guy, all he wanted to do is to belong to a group. Loved the uniform. So he was sent to Korea. But even though he was sent to Korea in because he scored pretty high on his test on his aptitude test, they sent him to Korea to be pretty much an administrator. He nonetheless learned how to shoot a gun. He was not that bad at it. He was able to bullseye 37 targets out of a hundred. That's not the best, but it's sharp shooter range. That's pretty fucking good.

37%. Bullseye 37%. Oh, bullseye. Oh, yeah, man. Yeah, yeah. Pretty good. It's easy to do when you just imagine, you know, at that time, just being like, gotta get it right in the hole in the vagina. That's the only way to really destroy the one. You

don't see it. Oh, the Korean with the ace got a vagina for it. I'm gonna put a bullet right in there. No, no, David. We're not at war with the Koreans. We're just hanging out here. We're just here going to whore houses, wasting everybody's time and money. Well, David, he never really talked a whole lot about his experience with women while he was in Korea. He said sometimes he said that he chased him a little bit. Other times he said that he hinted towards that he might have lost his virginity in Korea. And if he did, that was the only time he had sex. We know that for a fact. But David also in Korea

started to experiment with drugs, took a lot of acid, smoked a lot of pot and did a lot of cocaine. Normally that makes somebody really awesome. Well, yeah, I mean, well, we're getting into that. You know, he was starting to live the groovy drug life. He started to become kind of a super left wing pacifist. And in letters to Iris, he would started to ramble about non violence, quote unquote, war pigs. Yeah. And the power of love, you know, pretty 1971 acid head ramblings pretty much. He refused to carry a weapon and was nearly discharged for that. But by the time he's in the army,

you know what I mean? You're still in the army. You got at least a cold the gun. Yeah. Well, he was trying to he was trying to get conscientious objector status. He wanted to work as a firefighter or something like that. But by the time his career in the army was almost over, this the rhetoric that he had that went from, you know, the power of love, like all these war pigs, like, man, you know, we really got all come together. It started to change. It started to sour a little bit. And this is what he wrote in one of his last letters. I might turn out to be a lifetime freak. They taught me about many weapons. I will use these

tactics to destroy. Also, please send Schmere. Please send bagels and Schmere to Korea. The only Schmere I find comes from them. It's horrible jarred stuff that comes from the legs of some of these whores out here. And I'm looking for some real cream cheese, some real Brooklyn. Oh, how I do the long for some some scaling and cream cheese. Vietnam was hard for everybody. It was a tough war on many, many levels. So I think that Berkowitz, much like the Manson family, like a lot was happening in the late 70s, when a lot of people were experimenting with this stuff and didn't really understand that you can't take acid every day.

Well, not if you have an STD either. I'm just sitting here thinking how trippy it must be to have like gorpy, you know, the big love bump on the side of your penis and you're tripping acid. And at some point you just start talking to it. Yeah, it becomes your friend. Yeah, but it's just like, don't worry there, buddy. I don't love you. I'm your girlfriend now. I ain't never gone away. It's the only gal that stuck around on them. Well, I think Berkowitz, like the Manson family, they took so much acid, they went straight past peace and love and landed in the land of violent paranoid delusions. He was so close

to being groovy. If he only would have stopped doing the cocaine, if he only would have stopped taking acid every day, and if he wasn't kind of fucked up to begin with, he might have been okay. Just kids out there, no when to stop. Just do it. Basically, as soon as nobody else is dancing, that's how you know when like the party's going, too long, where you're the last guy dancing and you have to do like, come on guys, let's go, let's get into it, let's get nuts. The party's over, you gotta stop. I always say take a nap. You know, that's kind of a fun thing to do after you're doing a bunch of drugs. And as soon as you start

boarding up your windows. So David also had one more change in store from the army. He found Christ in Korea. Not surprisingly, I saw the face of Jesus in her labia. Would you even believe I saw it and it was just like, oh, I see his beard on his long hair hanging down. Oh, that's just, oh, she is unkept. This woman is just not been maintaining, but I can see the nose, the top of it, dog's clitoris. Not surprisingly, the Christians who knew him in Korea, that this guy, this post reporter went and interviewed, they called him, quote, fantastic guy with a great personality. Great. He's a sir winner. Henry, they weren't Korean. The people, they

weren't Korean that he was hanging out with. They were in Korea. They were white people in Korea. Missionary. It just says the Christians that he knew in Korea. No, no, no. I know that's what it says. I know it says the Christians he knew in Korea, but they weren't actually Christian. They were more like, fantastic guy with a great personality, a great soul winner. Yeah, maybe Southern, something like that. Oh, yeah. I just assumed, you know, role in church in Korea. They just start talking like that because that's how the Korean Jesus talk. I'm actually, I understand Henry's point of view on this. It's very confusing.

Gracie d'Artimique, for the day man here hit the bird, sir, sir, sir, better than barbecue sirs. And welcome everybody. Tune it in after the heroes premiere this Thursday. That's right. That's Henry's a Browsky, the man you're cheering for. So he was discharged in 1971, returned to New York City, a completely obnoxious evangelist and left wing anti-war dove. Now between the new Jesus freak thing and the constant anti-war ramblings, not a single person who knew him before he went into the army, not even his father could stand to be anywhere around. And we talked about this on top of that. People coming back like totally peaceful after they

see the perils of war. Of course, he just saw a whole series of prostitutes and traumatized him to the point where he became a dove. But I guarantee you he hopped on that bandwagon and I don't know this for sure, but I guarantee you, I guarantee it, he voted for Mr. Jimmy Carter. He might have. Well, he was imprisoned by the time Carter came around. Well, he still voted for him. So, man, he even called his best friend Ed, who had joined the Coast Guard. He called him, quote, a war pig and rightist militant. That's what we call our friend Ed. Which is so strange. No, no, no, we call him a war pig. Oh, yeah, that's right. Because it's our word for, for how wide he is.

Yes. The thing is, is that Ed, during the Coast Guard, to get as far away from fighting as humanly possible, he's being a beach cop. That's what being a Coast Guard is. He's literally a bikini inspector. Yeah, it doesn't sound too war pig-ish to me. No. So Berkowitz, alienating everybody that he knew, moved out of the neighborhood that he grew up in, got a job as a security guard and officially began his life as a loner. Now, did he join the loner union? Because what they get with the loner union, you get trench coat grease for your hair that just comes from the crooks of motel beds and you

get the action sandals. Wow, that's a hell of a grab bag. So David's new neighbors, they didn't have any easier of a time with him than his old friends and family. His downstairs neighbor, Craig Glassman, received threatening hand written letters from Berkowitz on a regular basis. This is what one of them said. How dare you force me into the night to do your bidding? True. Yes, I am the killer. But Craig the killer kills on your command. The streets have been filled with blood at the request of Craig because Craig is Craig, so must the streets be filled with Craig. Signed David Berkowitz, Department 1B. This is from David Berkowitz. I should have said

something that didn't mean to scare you. Didn't mean to surprise you, but you left your newspaper out. I thought I'd bring it to you. I hate it when people steal it. Craig forcing me to murder. I just, you know, if I was Jewish, I would be upset with Woody Allen because he just created every impression that's Berkowitz. Oh, God. It's the dog. It's telling me to do it. And I told him, I said, your old dogs need to be spayed. I'm more of a cat person. It's so quiet, self-maintained. But this dog, oh, God, it just won't let me sleep. Oh, where's my Muguga? I gotta put my Muguga on before I go to Sabbath sometime. There's a Sabbath soup night. Muguga, I go.

Boy, you're just never going to work again, are you? Sabbath soup night does sound very fun, though. I would love to go. If you're out there listening and you know where a Sabbath soup night is in your area, let me know. I'll fly down and see you. So after Berkowitz returned to New York, he found out that his birth mother was actually still alive. He contacted her. Strangely enough, failed to connect with her. Because you know what he said? He expected her to be a beautiful woman when he had built her up in his mind. When he got the word that his mom was still alive, he went to go look

for her and they met up with each other and he said he met her and he expected her to be this ethereally beautiful woman dressed in white and she was just this tiny Jewish woman and he couldn't handle it. She was a little Jewish Italian woman and he would do this impression of her where he would put his hands up over his ears and go, I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry. Which is what he said to the psychiatrist. The psychiatrist talked in this great documentary called Son of Sam Speaks and it's just him, he was just so mad that his mom didn't have big tits.

That's a fun client to have. If you're a psychiatrist, David Berkowitz is a hell of a client to have. Oh, great one. Never meet your idols. They always just end up getting drunk, whipping out their dicks and demanding you go buy him cocaine. So not long after he visited his birth mother, he wrote in a letter to his father. The girls, they call me ugly and they bother me the most. Oh, I get all into my underwear and it gets all tied up inside of my, my, my, my guga, my guga, which is between my

knackers and my, my bishel back here where my pupil comes, pupil comes out of the bishel and my, my gugas are with my seamen's are. Yeah, I think that's accurate. Yeah. So again, like many other serial killers, David was also an arsonist from 1970s. From 1974 to 1977, David was responsible for 1500 fires in and around New York City, each one detailed in his journal in which he referred to himself as the phantom of the Bronx. Very fun.

Can I toss a nerd alert onto that one? But 1500 fires. I mean, that is enough for in itself to stand alone as a career criminal, right? Yeah. I think that's the other step of murdering people. Yeah. He was caught trying to set fire to his own apartment building. That is true. They caught, some guys caught him and it's like, what are you doing? He was out with like literally

a can of kerosene just going like, oh, just making the building wet. They're like, no, no, no, no, no. You're trying to set fire to everyone inside. They stopped that. He said that he would love the idea of setting a fire and then he'd immediately call the fire department. Right. So that he could feel the feeling of saving everyone as well. Right. That's the definition of don't shit where you eat. You know, he just tried to burn

down his own place. Just go, gotta go a couple doors down. Actually, the very definition of that is shitting inside of a Happy Meal box. Yeah. It wasn't the only time he tried burning his building down. The man downstairs, Mr. Glassman, he used to set trash on fire. One time he set trash on fire on Glassman's front porch and threw a bunch of 22 bullets into the fire, hoping that it would explode when Glassman came out. A much more cruel... So that's called technically setting a Yosemite Sam bomb.

Yeah. That's kind of fun. So as Berkowitz's hatred and resentment of women reached a fever pitch, David decided it was time for him to take action. However, he would not use the revolver that he would eventually become famous for. His first weapon of choice was a knife. And because of what he'd seen in the movies, David thought that knife in a woman would be quick, easy, just one in the stomach and then she'd fall. But on that...

Also very, but that is very similar to Ed Kemper. Same thing. Where it's like, because they're losers. They build up these ideas of killings like in their mind because up to this point, he was just obsessed with killing. His biological aunt wanted him to be closer to their family. So he kept showing up and like hanging out. But eventually, like he would just be consumed with this idea of I have to kill women. I have to kill women. And he just thought it would be easy. Yeah. I mean, he's not a very smart guy. He gets a lot of his ideas from movies. It's just also why he bought a white Volkswagen bug and he thought he could talk. He named

it Herbie and he tried to win the big race. Just the saddest thing of him. You see him at his car just going like, why won't you be my friend, Herbie? I know. You're supposed to help me win the race, Herbie. You're supposed to help me find Goldie Hawn. Me and Goldie Hawn are supposed to go on a date, Herbie. And there's just like cars just lined up at the red light. Right. Herbie's just not going.

Yeah. It's just not going to happen. Herbie, you said you were going to take me for ice cream later. But you're just sitting there. You're not driving yourself. Drive me to ice cream, Herbie. You're my slave. From the first night of the first attack, it was Christmas Eve, 1975. Berkowitz discovered that stabbing was actually a prolonged, messy and very loud process, particularly when you're attacking women on the streets of the Bronx as he was. I did it on Christmas Eve because all Jewish people are invisible on Christmas Eve. But

I didn't realize that people were just going to see a knife floating around. Oh God, I should have thought about it. You know, what's scarier than a knife floating around? Even that scares me and I'm the one with the knife. It's a terrifying idea. Really is. So he tried to kill twice that night and neither attempt gave David anywhere near the satisfaction that he wanted. The first attempt, she simply, when he started stabbing her, she was walking out of the grocery store, he started stabbing her. She just turned around, looked at him and wordlessly just ran away. But the other one, she screamed

her head off as he stabbed her six times. About that attempt, he later said, I didn't want to hurt them. I only wanted to kill them. So about a month later, David moved from the Bronx to Yonkers, where he claimed his demonic delusions began. His landlords, Jack and Nan Kassara, owned a German shepherd that David claimed was the one who first told him to kill young girls. Why, oh, what is everybody have these dogs? Why is it always dogs? Why can't it be a parakeet? Oh, my mother had a parakeet and oh, that's right. I killed it. Well, I just, maybe it's pets I have a problem with. I'm allergic to them.

But you do wonder if his previous downstairs neighbor missed the notes. If they know, just like, I didn't like the notes so much. I thought they were creepy. Well, it was here, but I missed that creepy fat pet. Well, he also said that Jack Kassara had an alias called Captain Jack Cosmo, in which Captain Jack commanded an army of devil dogs all across Yonkers. I wish I had an army of devil dogs right now. So he lasted three months in that apartment before he moved to the studio where he would live for the duration of the murders. But David couldn't find any peace there either for a black lab named Harvey owned by his neighbor. Sam Carr was waiting for him. David

said that Sam was possessed by demons. The son of that demon told him to commit the murders. And with that, son of Sam was born. Well, yes, it's, and it's very interesting because this is where the story was where his son of Sam tale began. And we're going to find out later on that this is only the first tale that he would tell about his actual demon possession. And this is actually not the true one. The true one is that he was a part of a gigantic multi armed international satanic cult that was aimed to create societal chaos, right, dog meat. Oh, just like the hand of death was created to do the exact same thing with Henry Lee

Lucas and Audis Tool. Hmm. Coincidence, I think. Yes. So about a month before the murders began, Berkowitz drove down to Houston, Texas to visit an old army buddy of his, a man that would later refer to David as his best friend in the whole world. Oh, that's the saddest man in the story. So sad. You know, just a guy hanging out in Houston waiting for his big buddy from the big city to come down and visit.

So apparently David was just kind of went to Houston, convinced his buddy to ask him to basically convince his buddy to buy a gun for him because he didn't have a proper driver's license. But you needed to have a driver's license in Texas to buy a gun. So he went all the way to Texas to buy a gun that was more difficult for him to get in Texas. And then when his buddy asked him, why did you get this gun? Why am I buying this for you? He was like, Oh, it's to protect me on my way back from Texas to New York City. So he bought a gun. He traveled the dangerous trip quote unquote dangerous trip to go to Houston to buy the gun to protect him to go back.

Makes perfect sense. Well, logic like that works with the person who considers David Berkowitz his best friend. Oh, yeah. I'll just say I locked his Persian eyes and I lock his constant complaints. So the gun, the revolver that was bought, that's the gun that would give Berkowitz his original nickname. It was a Charter Arms Bulldog 44 caliber revolver. Now the Bulldog was a very interesting weapon. It was originally designed for use on passenger aircraft after all those hijackings happened in the 1970s. It was designed to not puncture the fuselage

on an aircraft. So what it was designed for, it wasn't designed to be rough enough to go straight through the aircraft and to cause cabin pressure to go out the window. It was designed only to kill at extremely close range. Air gun. Cool. Yeah. It only, after 20 feet, the aiming went all off. The velocity definitely went down on the gun. So this was a gun that was designed for the express purpose of close up murder. So when David got back to Yonkers, he quit his security guard job and got work as a cab

driver, which is where he learned the ins and outs of the roads in the Bronx, Queens, and Brooklyn. Well, it's very interesting how he took, he took a bunch of like quintessential 1970s New York jobs. It's like every job that Robert De Niro had in a movie, he did. And it all made, it's all about getting used to the underworld. And it's part of filling his weird fantasy life about being this underworld creature. And I think that he didn't even belong in the underworld. Like he was such a weird guy who just, he was such a try hard, no matter what it is that he did, that even there, it's like you're not even like a cat burglar man.

You talking about how you fucking prowl the streets at night just makes you sound like a bigger loser. Yeah. But I will say I've been in many cabs here in New York City. Nobody knows where they're going because they don't have any motivation to learn the streets. And if you get in Berkowitz's cab, you know for a fact, he's, he's educated, he's got the maps out and he's going to get you to your location on time. Hopefully you get in before he goes on his killing spree. So after work as a cab driver, he'd come home and he'd listen to records. His favorite

artists, Carol King, Peter, Paul and Mary, and James Taylor. Notice no, no death metal in there. It's always the people who listen to that peaceful, hippie stuff. That you know. And it's literally all songs about having friends. Right. Isn't that sad? Yeah. He'd also later say that a rich girl by holla notes also inspired him to kill. I'm sure holla notes love to hear.

He was also said to be extremely fond of love themes. Yeah. Do you know what a love theme is? No, not really. Let's hear a little bit of a love theme. David slept on a bare mattress on the floor, one naked light bulb swinging above him, the shag carpeting in his studio apartment, strewn with empty milk cartons and bottles, along with various pornographic magazines.

K-Romantico. I also will say that this music, doesn't that song come from the album Music to Load a Gun to? Yeah. I thought it was music to lick a knife to, but maybe it was the wrong album. I don't know. What you've been able to imagine for the past week is David Berkowitz sitting on a bare mattress on a floor drinking milk straight from the carton with a naked light bulb above him. Right.

Just staring at the wall, listening to the Romeo and Juliet theme. His mind began to deteriorate. I love this idea too, that he basically became the movie maniac. Yeah, he really did. He was on the walls, he had written messages like, in this hole lives the wicked king, kill for my master, and I turned children into killers, mostly with neglect. Yeah, completely covered all of his windows in dirty sheets, long hallmark of weird and insane people.

I tell you, I had that in college though, so I kind of take umbrage with that fact. You grew out of it. Well, actually, yeah, you could play him in a movie. Can you imagine me in the Oscar-winning new movie of Son of Sam? Yeah, I could tell. You know what the blue contact said? Just going like, oh, I wish you were prettier. My adopted mother is blind to me. I just go, why don't you got the big prices, mommy? Oh, I'm going to be the son of Sam now. Well, thanks for coming in, Mr. Zabrowski. I think we're going to go with something a

little bit less stereotypical. What? Just less stereotypical. This is my interpretation. I am an artist. An actor takes the mask and puts it on and interprets it. You know, we've heard it, you know, and we thought we might go with some a little more fresh. You think you can give us some? Try it. Try it. Try it another way. Give us another reading.

Let me give you one more shot. Okay, let me try it. Yeah, yeah, check it out. I get the knife in the first, but it's too difficult. As a matter of fact, oh, Mr. Zabrowski, we'll see you now. It turns out you've been talking to the janitor the whole time. You don't want to audition very well. Well, there's nothing I love more than pranking actors. Mm, look at there.

Yeah, how many brilliant readers I've heard as a janitor here in Hollywood, California? Well, well, well. Well, Mel Gibson took a shit on top of the toilet again. Oh, that'll happen. So it's time for the killings to begin. His year-long killing spree, it would begin six months after his first attempt in only two weeks after he picked up the 44 in Houston. July 28th, 1976, two young girls,

Donna Loria and Jody Valenti, they were sitting in their car after returning from the Peach Tree Disco, where they were regulars at the Wednesday night backgammon tournaments. But I feel like this is a New York thing from the 70s, where there were just odd circumstances and stuff like that.

Everything was called the disco. When you hear the eyewitnesses talk about it, I want to cover it more in the next episode. But it's like more people just like talking about about what they would do during nights of the killings and everyone was just kind of hanging out at a disco and were doing stuff like this, like playing a crib game or doing stuff.

And I think it's all just code for crimes. Could be. This is before the internet though too. So you actually had to go out and play backgammon in real life and just sit at home. You couldn't play with a lonely Korean man. Why you always cheat? Why you never play rules?

You come away from Bronx to do what? To come cheat me here at Backgammon Disco night? You know this is how I make living for family. So Berkowitz approached the passenger side of the Oldsmobile Cutlass, where the girls were sitting. He pulled his gun out of a brown paper bag and fired out five bullets. And he was still pulling the trigger

after all the chambers had been emptied. So Donna Lauria of the Bronx would be Berkowitz's first murder victim. And although the young girl's death, yes, very tragic. Her murder barely registered in a city that averaged over 2,000 murders a year at the time. To give you some perspective, right now in New York City, we averaged less than 400 murders a year.

Damn. No murders, I mean New York City was just something entirely. We're gonna cover that a lot in the next episode too. New York City was a jungle at this point. Like it's absolutely, you know, whole places that had no police presence whatsoever. And so he just shot, the people that he shot on the street were just like open,

was just out in the middle of the street, wasn't hidden at all, like this person, he shot her five, he shot at the car five times. But what he says is that he didn't even know that he murdered anybody, he just ran. Like he did it and he was just like, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh. And then when he got back to the house, he didn't know that he had killed somebody

until he read the newspaper the next morning. And the eyewitnesses said they heard five shots and then they saw somebody slowly running. No way. Like I think that's him, we could catch him. Almost an ambo? Yeah, just kind of walking around. Oh, why are these sidewalks are all cracked?

I gotta watch my ankles. I didn't put on any of my braces before I started running. You gotta be careful out here, get me a wrist guard. But like, oh, I gotta bring my wrist guards next time I go out to kill a woman. So the second attack came three months later in Queens, Carl DeNaro and Rosemary Keenan, whose father would eventually work on the task force

to find son of Sam, again had five bullets fired at them as they sat in their car. Luckily, neither one was killed, but DeNaro, he got a metal plate in his head after part of his skull had been blown away. He was just really happy because now wherever he went in New York City, he was always getting personal reception of the Yankees game.

Yep. So that's all he gave a shit about. So Berkowitz returned to the Bronx for attack number three, taken down two girls aged 16 and 18. After a showing of New York, New York, on November 26th, he approached the girls asking for directions, but opened fire on him before he even finished his sentence. Neither would die, but one would be paralyzed

from the waist down for the rest of her life. What if he was actually looking for directions? He wasn't, he's a fool. The gun accidentally just went off on him. Oh God, I'm sorry. Oh God, no, I'm just, oh, I'm so jumpy tonight. I didn't mean to, I was just gesturing with my, I called it my gesturing stick.

That's what I was gonna call it. And then I've got a gesturing thing. I wanted to go to the Costco because I'm running out of Quico oats and milk. That was just sort of currency in the 70s, just a gun. So the following January on a cold, cold New York night, they said it was two or three degrees above free, or above zero that night.

Berkowitz approached Christine Freund and John Deal as they were waiting for their car to warm up, listening to Abba after seeing a showing of Rocky at the Continental Theater in Queens. Berkowitz fired only one shot this time, hitting Freund in the head and she died the next day. You know what's really interesting is that during this time period,

David Berkowitz would also keep a emergency pack in the back of his car. He had a fantasy. While he was driving around stalking people to kill them, what he also wanted to do was see a house burning and go inside and save a family or stop a robbery. He had this idea that he could also be a hero. And so the night that he killed Freund,

three hours before that, he helped a group of teenagers push a car that was stuck in a pile of snow. Yeah, it was all about power with him. It's where that, the killing, the arson, all of that is all, like arson is all about controlling your environment, controlling what happens. And I suppose it's also sort of similar

to what people do when they're on a diet. They had a salad for dinner. So then they're like, I'll have five donuts just as a snack. I had a little salad. So he did something sort of nice, helping someone push a car. And he's like, I'll just go kill two people.

I burned it, I burned the right. Everything was just weight watchers points to him. He's also the, he's the piece of shit that becomes like a cop for the wrong reasons. It's like, why we have so many shitty cops? Cause it's somebody who's just wants the badge and be able to have a gun legally. So this is a very interesting fact here that I found out.

Just, I knew that David Berkowitz worked at the post office and he got the job just a few days after killing Christine Freund. What I didn't know about him is that he was actually an operator on the infamous ZMT machines. Now, if you've ever seen the documentary Going Postal, the ZMT machines are the ones in which postal workers have to identify and tag 60 letters per minute.

They become an extension of the machine and they go crazy because they're humans. Yeah, exactly. They become extensions of the machine. And it's pretty soon. And they also kind of attribute, hardly blame the Going Postal killings of the 70s and 80s on the introduction of this machine into the post office life.

And it's very interesting that not long after David Berkowitz starts working on these ZMT machines that he starts writing the letters to the police, starts writing the letters to Jimmy Breslin. This is kind of the time when he really starts to lose his mind. So everybody who got those clearance house things in the mail with a little penny, they're all complicit.

At any time you filled one of those, you're complicit. But I also, this is, it's very interesting because we have now the classic view of the loner killer. This is the guy who created the stereotype. He created the idea of the man who then, because of his being treated like a cognitive machine, his whole life, he's felt like he's worth nothing, that he was always, he's the dirty one.

He ruins everything. He ruins everything that he was, he wasn't good enough. He killed both of his fucking mothers. He did all the stuff. So now the idea is to, he wants to be somebody. And he wants to be somebody in a bunch of different ways. And it's all like really dramatic and like classically lame. You know, like it's all just, it's now it's classic.

But then I mean, like this guy is just being fucking prince about it. He's really inventing some shit. It's unbelievable. He seems to get every job he wants. The economy was booming. Yeah, he's getting jobs and giving them up. He's getting, yeah, it's unbelievable.

Yes, security guard, cab driver, post office worker. That's the- These are all jobs with crazy benefits. Yeah, but don't, I mean, what color do you think of? I think of gray with every single. If I had to associate all three of those jobs, I'm like, that is a gray Seattle sky. Yeah, that's a gray existence.

That's what he had. Yeah. I also see a browns. I see browns in there. Okay. Yeah. Okay. Good test.

So Berkowitz would return to the sidewalk for his next killing. He shot college student, Virginia Voskarychian in the face as she tried to shield herself with a textbook, killing her instantly. Now this is where we actually traveled to the site of this murders for Dartmouth place. I think it was.

And there is a feeling to this site. And I can't really describe it, but there's something eerie about it. Well, we interviewed, if you go back and listen to that in search of the boogeyman, we interviewed the couple who were there. One of the men was alive during that time, or the daughter was too, but yeah,

they were discussing how chilling just being in that place was. Yeah. They said. Well, if you look at it, it's a very scary looking place. If you remember where she was shot was down, it was a scary walkway. It was very dark at night.

We walked around this winding path under what was sort of like an overpass kind of hallway where two buildings were connected. And it was this hidden little door. And you can see him come around the bushes out of the shadows and surprise her as she was standing in front of her own door. And then honestly, a very smart move,

the gardener face with a very expensive textbook in these days, it's very scary. It was a very scary little neighbor. You can see what happened to New York City. We're gonna cover next episode, like how the randomness of it and the innocent people that he was targeting were made people really go nuts.

And it's too bad it wasn't the 90s when this happened because the 90s textbooks all had little CD-ROMs. And that might have been just enough to stop the bullet. But another interesting thing about that area is it's very segregated. So one side is where the poor people are. And you remember how wealthy that other area is. So that's one of the reasons these killings

started to resonate with the entire community because he was getting into the area of the wealthy. Yeah. And then people started to pay a lot more attention, obviously, then. This was an extremely wealthy area. And his first murder was in a mob-controlled neighborhood. And in fact, some of the people,

especially reporters, thought they're like, ah, we're not gonna cover that. Like this could very well be, this is a girl that may have seen something that she shouldn't have seen, may have said something that she shouldn't have said. So if- Which is why every eyewitness in every one of these stories

are like, yeah, you know, we were outside watching, you know, I had heard about the shootings, it's not the same shootings, you know, because we were standing outside of a Domino's Club and we would just, you know, that was a club where we would commiserate, sit around in chairs, just hanging out, having glasses of beer, just commiserating, sitting around in chairs,

you know, just a lot of sitting around in chairs, just me and Tommy and Ruby and Marco when we sit around in chairs and just kind of just, we'd be sitting around, commiserating. I mean, like, what are you doing? What is your job? Yeah. Sitting around, chairs, Domino's.

Commiserating. Yeah, commiserating. Yeah, yeah, they're commiserators. Professional commiserators. So although Berkowitz, he racked up relatively small number of attacks, seven or eight, I think it's eight or nine, somewhere around there, relatively small,

but definitely not for lack of trying. This is what he said in his initial confession to cops. Sure, I was out almost every night, driving, looking for game. I'd look for a parking space for my car. If I found one right away, I would be so tickled pink. I knew I was being commended, then I'd hit him. Yeah, he didn't say he was tickled pink.

Yeah. But that was his thing, is that he would drive around and if he didn't find that magical parking spot right away, a lot of times he'd go back to the scene of his previous crimes and he'd either just masturbate in his little Ford Galaxy or he'd get out of the car and reenact the killings. That is just the lamest thing.

Yeah. That is very lame, him going like, I got you. And then I remember I walked up and I pulled up, my god knows, I got you, I'm gonna blame, I'm gonna blame. It's so New York, it all relies on parking. Like your entire night will be dictated by what parking spot you got where and what time. Absolutely, yeah, whether or not you go out or not.

Yeah. You know, it makes you lame after a while. It does. So after Voskarychian's death, this is when the cops finally start putting all of these attacks and all of these murders together. And this is not surprising because as we said earlier, the five boroughs, they averaged 2,000 murders a year

in the 70s. There was no computer system to link the crimes and also besides that, the NYPD had huge, huge cuts to their staff. They went from 3,000 detectives to 1,800 in just a few years. They lost 1,700 just beat cops because of these huge corruption scandals. So it's not surprising that it took them a little bit

to put it together. They realized that there was a definite emo happening, that there was a guy that was walking up to people in cars or on the street and just shooting them with no motive whatsoever. And they started to notice that all of these had 44 caliber shells. And so they started looking for similarities

and they proved conclusively that the first and last murders both came from the same gun. So a task force was created to bring in Son of Sam. They called it Operation Omega. Very dramatic. I think they give themselves fancy names just to make up for the lack of information and the total. They know for a fact they're never

going to catch this person or not for a while anyway. They had all kinds of crazy ideas. At one point, the weirdest thing that they thought about trying was putting a cop in a bulletproof car with a mannequin sitting next to him. Oh, I think that's brilliant. I also heard they had one where they were just going to take a bed sheet covered in honey

and throw it on random spots. See if they couldn't stick it. So this task force had happened nine months after the first killing and soon after the link was made. By the way, they had 300 detectives on this case. This tells you how serious the case was and how badly they wanted to catch this guy because they only had 1,800 detectives.

Because think about that, I think there were 1,200 detectives in New York City. 300 of them were working on Son of Sam. There were 2,000 murders happening a year in New York City. So soon after the whole link was made, police commissioner Michael Dodd held a press conference and announced that there was a serial killer loose in the city, panic set in across the five boroughs,

and the summer of Sam truly began. It's kind of fun if you're a police commissioner. As a stand-up comedian, you go on stage, try to elicit laughs. As a politician, you try to get votes. But if you're the police commissioner, you're like, I hope I get some good panic. If I get them to panic, I crushed this speech.

Oh, look, and I crushed it's speech. Look, that woman's crying. Yes, yes. That's great, yeah. I'm going to ruin Bolin for everybody, yeah. Yeah, panic is the reaction you want from a police commissioner given a speech about a serial killer. So we're going to leave it right there.

We're going to come back next week with what actually happened in New York City after people knew that there was a serial killer out there operating the entire city went nuts. And we'll tell you exactly how. And we'll also be back with the infamous letters that Son of Sam sent to both police detectives and the New York Daily News columnist, Jimmy Breslin.

That's all coming next week, along with the 12 disciples of Satan. Whoa. Yeah, yes. Can't wait to hear it. Henry Zabrowski, this is the last day of you being a nobody. Heroes Reborn comes out Thursday.

It was at 8 PM on Thursday at NBC. Yeah, 8 PM, NBC. It's coming good. It's good. Yeah, it's good. I saw it last week. It is very large. OK, that's a good show.

That's the oddest show. That's the oddest pitch I've ever heard someone make for their own show. Large. It's a lot of show. I would say that it's very good. It is exciting. I am hesitant to.

I want everyone to enjoy it. That is what I would like. I want everyone to enjoy it. I'm not nervous. Yeah, you're right. You answered your. Yeah, I'm not thinking about my entire career just being absolutely obliterated by everybody

hating my face. No, no, no, no. You can tell you can tell he's not worried about that because he said he's not. Yeah, I'm not worried about it. Yeah, so there's no worry there. Just like all the times that you say you're not angry about something.

Not angry. I'm not mad. Don't get mad. Henry doesn't get mad. I don't get mad. I'm wearing pants right now. He's not wearing pants. That's that's actually untrue.

You've been shirtless and pantless this whole time. I stripped down totally to my underwear because I have to build a canopy of blankets in my Canadian apartment in order to make an even a viably sounding recording for our podcast. You actually are actually living exactly like Berkowitz did. Yes. Right now.

Quite a bit of milk as well. Yeah. Amazing. I'm going to put the blankets up on because then the sound reverberates and I just want everyone to know how clear and sweet my voice can be. Just imagine.

Remember, he had shag carpeting in that apartment. Yeah. And there were discarded milk cartons everywhere. So he didn't drink every drop of those milk cartons. He just threw a milk carton on the ground. So you'd imagine his shag carpeting was just crusted with rotten milk. No, this is Berkowitz or Henry.

Just smudged with my milk. Yeah. And his butt smell, you know that he wasn't because it's also in the 70s. No one really showered all the time. Yeah. You know, so it was like butt smell and milk smell. And it's a different sort of.

It's not a hip. It's not a drifter smell. No. It's a Bronx smell. Well, if he would have just hung in the dating game, he would have found a woman that loved it. I would imagine he's somewhere between Bundy and Kaczynski as far as scent goes.

Bundy smelled great. OK, Gacy and Kaczynski. Yes. Because Gacy probably didn't smell good. Well, he smelled like Stetson. You know, he smelled like low level politician good. Yeah. Yes.

Something like that. All right, everyone, thanks so much for listening. Let's see. I'm doing Red Eye on the 24th, which is this morning at 3 o'clock in the morning. Marcus has new shirts. Marcus. Yeah, the Cowmen.

We just got in new shirts with the Cowmen. They're fucking awesome. Reed Failor, the same guy that did our cover design, designed them. And they are at, you can find them at thecowmen.bancamp.com, which is also where you can buy our album. They're $20 each.

Go and check them out. Plus shipping and handling, of course. And if you want your own last podcast on the left t-shirt, go to cavecomedygradio.com slash merch. And you can get one of those for $25. And that includes shipping and handling, $40 international. And yeah, follow us on Twitter at LP on the left. And go join the Facebook group and follow us.

And also, please continue to send us your listener pasta. Any sort of creepy pasta you're in, please send it to us. We're sifting through. The emails are already got to choose the ones that we are going to read. And then we're going to record your true scary stories, just pitch them to us. And then we're going to set two recording times, right, dogmeat?

No, yeah, on a Sunday and probably on a Tuesday evening, we're going to try to get it where everybody has some sort of time that they can do it. But yeah, send us, definitely send us the creepy pasta that you're writing, but start sending us the stories that you have to tell that you can actually call in and tell us. So yeah, so get ahold of us on that.

And also start thinking of some questions to ask some real live wizards we're going to have in the studio. And that is true. We're going to have two real life sorcerers that will answer your magical queries. I've got some questions for them. You can also find Henry on Twitter at Henry Loves You, Marcus Parks on Twitter at Marcus Parks.

I am at Ben Kissel. Continue. Thank you so much for supporting all the shows here on CCR, Page 7, Sex and Other Human Activities, Roundtable and Top Path. Those are very nice shows. Thanks so much for all your comments about those. And what is there?

I'm a goestalations. I believe so. And Ohio Gein as well. Oh. Hail me and hail sweet Satan who provides for those who do something about it. That's right. And hail yourselves.

And hail yourselves specifically when you're watching Heroes Reborn. Absolutely. Henry, everyone's very proud of you. Just DVR it if you got to. DVR it. You know what I mean? And just trying to leave the direct criticisms to a place

where I can't immediately see them, if you would. Maybe put it, maybe if you're going to completely trash Heroes, maybe put it over to the, I don't know, somewhere else. Just remember that we are all people with souls. Right. Also, let's say Henry, don't actively seek out criticism. Do not actively seek out criticism.

These are the rules. I do not do that. I do not do that. I read everything. I read everything. Yep. And it's extremely unhealthy. All I get is love.

Oh, and also, one more thing, thanks to research assistant Sammy Coughlin and science officer, Megan Fierro, for all the help on the research this episode. Well, are we allowed to give out her email yet? So she can service you. Absolutely are allowed to give out her email. We are? Yes, we are.

I asked her, she is. What's her email? And the purpose of giving out her email is just to make her life more, you never know how today's going to go. It's just more like if you have a specific, I don't know, critique or something about facts on the show, you send it to her.

Yeah, and you're sure you want to do this to her? She said yes. I asked her three times. I asked her three times. She told me yes, three times. I had to make absolutely sure. So yes, she is absolutely down for answering all of your science questions.

You can get ahold of her at FierroM90 at gmail.com. That's F-I-E-R-R-O-M-Nine zero at gmail.com. Also just know this, we will probably be recording her reactions to some of these emails for a future Patreon price. So also no, Dick. Don't send any cockpicks. No, don't even, don't even die in the way.

Don't even bring it up. I don't know why you brought it up because now it's out there and now it's in their hands. Throw things into the world. And then they exist. You could show her pictures of your titties, though. I don't know if she really wants, I don't think she wants that either.

say none of that I don't think she wants any sort of genitals or mammary glands again human being yeah yeah human human being yes she's a nice girl from Long Island everyone just pretend like I didn't see either bit of that all right everyone thanks so much for listening goodbye for more shows like the one you just listened to go to cave comedy radio .com