Last Podcast On The Left - Episode 507: Fred and Rose West Part II - Mum & Dad's Room

Episode Date: October 1, 2022

Strap in because this week the boys close out the story of Fred and Rose West, diving deep into gold star territory, recapping the list of numerous brutal atrocities that took place within the walls at 25 Cromwell Street.

There's no place to escape to. This is the last talk. On the left. That's when the cannibalism started. What was that? Okay, so, last week, obviously, people said, uh, Henry Sprousey doesn't have a full encyclopedic knowledge of all the various different regional accents of the UK, England, Dublin, and, you know, a lot of people say this. I don't think they said it like that. They were like, your accent sucks! Yep, is what they were saying. But, you know, one person did, like, kindly say, like, I don't think Henry quite grasps the West accent. And I don't. But this is how I figured it out.

He's struggling with it quite a bit. This is how he figured it out. And tell me if I'm incorrect, because I did find sections of Fred West's diary. So, one thing I want to read to see if this sounds like it, right? It sounds like it, right? I look up to the roll for the back of the cafe, and there was Bill. He had taken over him by the bathroom window. I said, what you're doing up there? He said, shh, he came down to me. He said, I pick up two young girls in Britain, and how we're coming to Gloucester, and they stay the night, and they're having a bath. And this is the best way to see them.

You sound like you're from fucking Minnesota. I don't! I don't know, either way. We're going to learn though, aren't we? You sound like the world's worst linguistic teacher, and I think you're going to be fired. Welcome to the last podcast of the Left, everyone. Ben hanging out with Marcus and Henry. Of course, Henry teaching all of us about accents through the disgusting words of Fred West.

Don't worry, there's going to be a lot more of it, but it does feel like it has sort of the same vibe. There's something about the country English accent and the activity of watching two plump girls in a well, like stuck in a well, with their butts hanging out, and you're just sitting there with a weird, unlit long, like kind of like a cigarette, but it's more just a bunch of leaves in your mouth that's gone, hey, er, hey. And that's it. That's very scary. I feel like that's the entire experience. Put the butter on the sourdough.

All right, everyone, welcome to Fred and Rose West part two. He's not saying put the lotion on the skin. He's saying put the butter on the sourdough. The butter on the sourdough. Wow, that was like a five degree joke. Good work, Marcus. Yeah, yeah, you're welcome. Yeah, I know him.

Welcome to Plumpy's Hostage Academy. You got to have a catchphrase if you really want to have him hostage. Put the butter on the sourdough. All right, honestly, hey, Jam, next time eat lunch before class. Aw, dang it. So when we last left Fred and Rose West, they just tied the knot a few months after Rose turned 18. This is when Fred was in his mid to late 20s. Oh, he's like, they ain't cook.

All right. Afterward, they moved out of their starter home into another building owned by Polish immigrant Frank Zygmunt, the infamous 25 Cromwell Street. And there's never been a man more proud of his sex dungeon than Fred West. Now, Fred and Rose's previous apartment have been just fine for burying a body out in the yard. Sure, so are most. Yeah, because Fred stepped out of Charmaine, had been buried out there after Rosemary killed this young child in a fit of rage. 25 Cromwell Street, however, afforded a slew of new opportunities for the burgeoning psychopathic couple

from extensive body storage to a space for a proper torture and kill room. And a proper torture and kill room, by the way, honestly does not often exist outside of horror movies. That's what makes this all so much scarier is 25 Cromwell Street sounds like it could be the place of Wallace and Gromit. Oh, it sounds like it could be. It should be where everyone has crumpets for breakfast, lunch, and dinner. They do, but it was not. They were Wallace and Gromit's neighbors. It is completely real.

And when Marcus said to about a dungeon, like an actual sex dungeon, you're right. It is mostly art designed, like, you know, they have that. You see that cute show that Netflix shows like, oh, it is on your sex room. Oh, I see that. It's all about your sex room and he's supposed to be like, you know, sex room. It's a way cheeky. And then the whole thing is, I don't know, none of them have pictures of fucking Woody and Buzz before they were Woody and Buzz crudely painted on the walls by the victims.

And that's the sex dungeon. And that's where this woman will never put in the proper detail to properly, properly make you scared to go down to a place. Triple X Toy Story. Now the house at 25 Cromwell had, oh, fucking Christ. Yeah, I'm not going to go into this ain't Toy Story triple X. No, it's not. It is not Toy Story. Now the house at 25 Cromwell had three floors, an attic, and most importantly, a cellar.

The cellar was accessible and usable only by Fred and Rose West. And as soon as the couple moved in with Fred's surviving child, Anna Marie, and Rose's first child with Fred, Heather, the Wests began plans to expand their cellar into a nefarious dungeon of pain and death. If you cannot go, as we've talked about many times, into certain sections of somebody's home, that means you're a serial killer unless it's Guy Fieri, in which case he has to hide his chicken recipes under lock and key. Because they're proprietary. In a random garage. Yeah, they're worth their weight in gold.

It is. Yeah, well maybe he should let out that fucking recipe to some of the Guy Fieri pop-ups that are coming up around the country, because that is the single worst meal I've ever had in my entire life. Besides the crimes of Fred and Rose West, Chicken Guy is like the second worst thing I ran into this year. Unfortunately, I don't want to sham which a chicken review into this episode, but it is not great. Well, according to one young woman who got snared in the web of the Wests but survived, Fred gave her a tour of the cellar before it was outfitted as a torture room, in which Fred very explicitly said that he was going to turn it into a torture room.

But Fred's superpower, if he has one, is he does have the ability. Because again, let me just, maybe it's the country thing. Like I sent you a, I sent Marcus a clip of like country British humor. You know, it's all being like, you know what she popped over, she was bent over the test code, she was bent over the freezer there, and I saw a couple of her shorties popping out of the inside. I had to give her a portion, I had to give her a bit of a portion. Oh my. But he had a bit, he kind of did have an ability to say things that he was doing,

but because he had like a little horrible like jack-o-lantern glint in his eye. It's smirk. Yeah, smirk. He'd be like, he's like, yeah, we're going to turn it into a torture room. And they're all like, Fred, you're crazy. Well, that's ridiculous. No one would ever do that in real life. They do.

I know. Well, the cellar itself was divided into separate rooms featuring white walls that had long since disintegrated away or mostly disintegrated away to show the long standing brick underneath. And above one could see the floorboards of the first floor apartment and hear the steps of people walking free. But what's almost unbelievable about 25 Crime Wall Street is that Fred and Rose weren't the only ones living in the building.

They had upstairs neighbors. No kidding. While the Wests had the first floor and the cellar, the second and third floors were rented out to tenants the entire time that the Wests were doing what they were doing both in the cellar and in their own apartment. I will say, after fucking 13 years living in New York, you learn to not hear. A lot of earmuffs going on without a doubt. Some Vince Vaughn activity happening.

You just don't hear it. You just go like la-la-la-la-la-la-la-la-la because then you also know how much they hear coming from your apartment. Yeah. So we all have. Oh, the grunts alone just from the bathroom. Was there a shiplap down there? Honestly, if only because you fix all that up.

You go there. You have a couple of track closets. Marcus doesn't know shiplap. It is very nice old wood. I've never heard of shiplap in my life. Because he doesn't know. It's called old wood that you resell to white people. And what they do is they look at it and they're like,

oh, look, it's all degraded and old and you go vintage shiplap. Why are you people fucking always talking to me? You may always making fun of me for going to the fucking dump. You guys are putting up old wood in your houses, calling it shiplap, giving it a fancy ass name and on the dirt bag for grubbing around the fucking dump. Hey, man, it's like I only most of the time is just the chef's come. What? All right.

That's why it's thinner. Isn't that something? Well, before Fred and Rose even moved into 25 Cromwell Street, and this is concerning what they did in the apartment. Rose West have been doing sex work for at least a couple of years. But after moving, they got a bigger space in which to stretch out. And Rose began taking clients at home full time. This was actually something that Fred fully encouraged

because he particularly liked watching Rose get railed by all manner of men in what came to be known as mum and dad's room. Oh, man. Oh, my goodness. I wonder if he thought that he was being sneaky. I do think in many ways he did think that he was this genius, but he just kind of slid past a lot of bullshit because he did have that little twinkle in his eye.

But just the idea of like, I mean, obviously, I guess at this point, you're having sex with Rose West in a basement. She looks like a minion. Oh, you're not in a basement. You're upstairs. You're in the apartment. You're in the bedroom. You're in the bedroom.

I mean, honestly. Well, that's so much better. But then you know, you hear the eek of like the little holes, and you just see him going like, all right. Yeah, give it to him. Give it to him. And you think that he's giving it a portion. And you think that he's just fucking it up.

He's obviously not sneaky. There's some porkies like activity going on here, but Rose West and Fred, Fred being a cuckold is really the least of our worries. Of course. Yeah, that's the healthiest part of this story, I think. Well, I mean, calling Fred a cuckold is simplifying things a little bit. Let's get into it.

He's an entrepreneur. An innovator. This fuck space had a plaque in the wall bearing Rose's name. But beneath the plaque was a spy hole that Fred could use to watch. It was so low to the ground that he had to kneel down. And concerning this part of Fred's paraffilia, voyeurism was certainly at the forefront, but there was an element of cuckoo.

Specifically, Fred would sometimes take the used condoms left behind by Rose's clients and slather himself with the spent semen contained therein. Again, the filthiest people alive. You mean, you know what they say? They're like, when will they make the Netflix show? Yes. What is it going to happen?

I can't wait to see who plays Fred West. You know what's going to be, I mean, it's... It'll be somebody British. Actually, they need to give this role to an American. You know who I'm seeing? Chris Pine. You know who I can see for some reason? Ben Savage.

There was already Fred West. Fred West was already played by a guy there. There was a movie. It was called Appropriate Adult. I think Dominique West is the guy that was in The Wire, the main character in The Wire. Oh, yeah, perfectly. Oh, yeah.

The guy that played McNulty, he played Fred West. Interesting. Well, okay. Caused a bit of a ruffle in Britain. Oh, yeah, because again, it's making them like sexy and interesting. When they were just... They were the epitome of life. It's like, in my mind, it's like what you base the trolls of folktales on are them.

Yeah. As far as the kids went, Fred installed a red light bulb in the living room connected to a switch in mom and dad's room. And that light would be turned on when Rose was quote-unquote entertaining so as to keep the kids out. As far as extracurricular sex went though, Rose was bisexual. So she and Fred engaged in a number of threesome's, although threesome might be a stretch since Fred, of course, always ejaculated within seconds, no matter what.

Hey, man. Hey, man, that counts. Right. Come on now. Also, he's easy at least. Yeah. Yeah. Regardless though, these girls who were runaways, hitchhikers, and other marginalized...

What do you mean, easy? He's easy. He's fast. He's real fast. Regardless though, these girls who were runaways, hitchhikers, and other marginalized members of society, they got picked up from various locations around Gloucester. Gloucester?

Gloucester. Around Gloucester. I'll definitely get a little email about that one. Gloucester. Give him a shorty. Give him a portion. I don't like that. Give him a little bit of a portion.

I don't want to have a portion. But Fred didn't just do a solo snatch and grab. Instead, Rose came along, riding in the front seat, enticing the girls into thinking that the situation wasn't highly dangerous. But while they didn't immediately start putting the girls they picked up into the ground upon moving to 25 Cromwell Street, they did decide to test it out prior to making it a kill room. And they did so with one of their own children.

And this here is Gold Star Territory for sure. Yeah. After bringing Fred's eight-year-old daughter, Anna Marie, down to the cellar, Rose Marie held her down and laughed maniacally as Fred raped his own daughter. He then removed the remains of her hymen and collected it in a pyrex bowl for reasons beyond understanding. I'm glad you don't understand. But seeing how there were so many body parts missing from his murder victims and

considering his behavior during this disgustingly evil act, it's speculated that Fred West may have also been a cannibal. Oh my. I completely believe that he was a cannibal. I mean, at this point, it doesn't surprise me, I guess. But not too long after the collection of the broken hymen, days at most, Fred brought home a long metal bar bent into a U-shape and fitted with handles, which he had commissioned as a custom-made piece at the factory where he was then working as a machinist.

After taking it down to the basement and installing this metal bar, Rose and Fred strapped Anna Marie into the frame and Fred and Rose took turns abusing her over the course of an entire day, Fred using himself on his lunch break and Rosemary using a large vibrator the rest of the time. Hours later, once Anna Marie thought it was all over, Rose drew her a bath. But to add just that little extra touch of sadism, Rose had poured salt into the water before Anna Marie had climbed in, which burned all the small and large wounds she'd suffered at the hands of her father and stepmother.

And right around the time that these horrific acts were committed by both Fred and Rose, Rose gave birth again to another baby girl, and trust me, we're going to lose track of just how many children Fred and Rose had when they had them and who the actual father was. Now, these are just slices of what happened in that home. Like, we're going to talk about it a little bit about the extensive abuse of the entire family, but it just goes without saying. It's kind of beyond the pale. It's something that you can't imagine.

It's the reason why this story is very difficult to cover. Unless you read the books, because the books are difficult to read because it is hundreds of pages. I truncated that experience greatly. That experience goes on for pages and pages and pages. Yeah. And so it's important to know, like, while we wanted to cover it for detail sake so that you know the extent of what happened in that home, but just know that it happened again

and again and again, our goal is to try to make you... We want you to know that it happened, but we don't need to drag you through every single minute of it. Yeah. But part of the reason why keeping track of which kid was born when and to whom, it was that the house at 25 Cromwell Street very quickly turned into a sexual free for all that never slowed down, despite the fact that it was being quickly filled with children. It got worse.

Yeah. The tenants that I brought in to live upstairs were mostly young men at this point, and Rose was having sex with most of them out in the open, often wearing little more than a dressing gown to entice the overly horny young men into railing her day and night so Fred could watch. I mean, and again, I just, you have to be super horny. You have to be crazy horny to look at Rose West and be like, yeah. Well. Excellent.

I mean, but the thing is, the picture that we have of Rose West that everyone thinks of, that's Rose West 25 years after the time that we're talking about. I looked at the old pictures of her, too. She looks like fucking Ringo Starr. I don't know, folks. You heard it here first. Marcus thinks that Rose West is a real kid. I do not think I'm right.

No, no, no. That's unbelievable. This guy is a Randy Krabs number one fan. Randy Krabs number one fan is going to fucking come to me about this shit. Wow. And everyone gets mad at me for like an LRH. And all he ever did was generate millions of dollars of income for Tom Cruise. I'm just putting shit in the context.

I'm making sure everything here is accurate, sir. Fantastic. That's what we do. That's what we do. Yeah. We're driving accurate here. Yes. Are we the accurate?

Are we the accurate? Oh, my God. No. I can't do that. I can't have a spoiler. But since there was so much railing happening in the house, the West had to hire another live in nanny, a 17 year old named Carolyn Owens, who worked for the West family for three pounds a week.

Eventually, she grew to despise Fred as most people did. She was mostly creeped out by the way conversations always turn to either sex or Fred's proficiency at medical procedures, specifically abortions. It's not a fun topic of conversation, but I, you know, I guess, yeah, it's not good. I mean, not all the time. No, I have to get down all the time. Not all the time. What's a week at most?

I mean, yeah, if you're talking about not more than once a week, it's beyond the pale. Yeah. Now, after a few weeks living in the West home, Carolyn Owens wisely decided to leave. But Rose was a little miffed because she hadn't yet had a chance to have sex with her. So Fred and Rose formulated a plan to kidnap and rape Carolyn together. But Fred did make it very clear that the affair might end in murder, which was just fine with Rose. Just having these open conversations, not only I have a hard time discussing like what

we want for dinner. You know what I mean? Like we really get into log jams talking about being like, well, you know, I'm Mexican. I don't know. I got to feel like I have Japanese. I can't imagine bringing up the idea of like, okay, we're going to co sexually assault this woman. Hey, I just want to warn you, we might have to murder her at the end of it and then her

sitting there. Oh, let me think. Oh, is it bad? Oh, is it wrong? You know, you're right. You're right, Fred. Well, maybe sometimes you should cook for your wife. I do.

I do cook for my wife. Well, in December 6th, 1972, Fred and Rose West followed Carolyn in their car and rudely confronted her on the street after she'd visited her boyfriend. After getting into the backseat of the car and denying Rose's advances, Carolyn was punched repeatedly by Fred until she blacked out. When she woke up, she was bound and still in the car. But Fred was wrapping a roll of brown tape around her head while Rose again laughed and held her down.

That's going to be a common theme. Rose laughs through all of these every single one. She finds all of this very funny, very pleasurable, very enjoyable. She loves it. She loves it. She loves people. And then we'll cover a little bit later, Myra Hindley, same thing, loved it. They then took Carolyn back to 25 Cromwell Street and sat her on the couch, where Fred

cut the tape off with a knife, slicing her face in the process. After they both raped her, Fred and Rose West went to bed, leaving Carolyn gagged with cotton balls and tied up in probably mom and dad's room. She was there for two days until finally Fred came to her with tears in his eyes. This happens more than once. He does this thing where he goes to all of this stuff and he's a demon and then he comes in and then he does this weird other fucked up because there's another form of abuse. Just being like, he starts crying and he's like, I'm out of control and I don't know

how. And it opened all this. Well, this time he said that it all been Rose's idea. He claimed that this was just what she was like when she was pregnant. Oh yeah, my mom was super into boiled potatoes. Yes, I know that. She just, that's the only thing she could eat. Some gals like pickle and ice cream and I guess Rose at a different fascination.

You're right, Kissel. By this point, Fred had a good idea of what Rose was like when she was pregnant because this was, I think, Rose's third child with Fred. I think it's maybe when she was pregnant with her son, Stephen, although I could be wrong. It was fucking eight. So it's hard to keep track of who was born when. Incredibly, Fred asked Caroline if she still wanted to be their nanny and because she didn't

want to die, she agreed. She spent the day cleaning the house and caring for the children until the whole gaggle went to the laundromat. But as Fred was parking the car, Caroline escaped, ran home and told her mother what happened. Soon, detectives were knocking on the door at 25 Cromwell Street and when Rose was asked if the allegations made by Caroline Owens were true, Rose said, quote, don't be fucking dived.

What are you doing? Well, it seems like you're a psychopath. But after a cursory glance at Fred's car, detectives found a button from Caroline's coat, a roll of brown tape and a large collection of pornographic photos in the car. Mind you, it's for driving around. Yeah, okay. I have a little Texas chainsaw massacre toy I play with sometimes in red lights. Yeah.

I read. Really? Yeah. We've talked about this before. That is dangerous. That is dangerous. Yeah. You read at the stoplight though.

You don't do it while you're driving, right? Yeah, sure. No. If you read while driving, it would interfere with the road rage because the problem is the reading sometimes has set it off like, oh, I'm sick of learning. So Fred and Rose were arrested together for the first time. Now both of them eventually admitted to just physical assault, although Rose soft pedaled and tried to mitigate her participation by saying that she was supposed to have been

seeing a psychiatrist for her, quote unquote, lesbian tendencies and she had stopped. That's why she lost her mind. She's, but when it came time to get a full statement from Carolyn Owens that would have cinched the rape charges, Carolyn was reluctant to relive the experience and Fred and Rose West both agreed to plead guilty to the lesser charge of assault. The magistrate somehow bought it saying that Fred West was, and this is a direct quote, a docile sort who did not look capable of violence. Yeah.

And it's literally got it wrong. It was the whole time because he does the thing was like, yeah, of course, we're a bit of an art sort. We give a bit of a little nudge, nudge, no, what am I, no, what am I, little grib, grib, little snip, snip. You know what I mean? Like he just talks like that. And they're all like, that's what my body says.

That's what my body does. He says the same thing. He's always in with a bit of an elbow rub and a big dog and a big of a snip. And it's just like, that's all they do. And then when they say all those little fun, little rabbit words, like they all live in like a toadstool like Cassie, they then are like, they don't understand that's a covering up like years of abuse. Yeah.

A lot of stuff seems like they didn't really do a proper character assessment. No. No. Right. And since the magistrate decided that Fred's criminal history, which was all theft at this point, he decided to add no relevance to the current case. He also decided that, you know, Rose, no criminal history at this point, also pregnant. So he said, hey, 25 pounds and you're free.

What? They did. They paid a 25 pound fine. And then they went home. Unbelievable. I actually did hear some research from, I got some really great emails about ECT and being pregnant. And it's kind of all over the place.

There are some, there are many of them that many emails were like, well, there's no documented process, but it can't be like great. Yeah. It can't be awesome. And then there is, but there was one study that said that there was no effect that sometimes, but it was only supposed to be done for emergency purposes when somebody is literally suicidal and you're pregnant. And so it's like, yeah, sure, I could lightly fry the baby for a couple of seconds instead

of you killing yourself and the baby, but, you know, you know, good, I don't think it's great. Yeah. There's one study that says that there's no effect, but multiple stories that say, or it's multiple studies that say it ain't good. I mean, there's a couple of stories that say climate change ain't real. It doesn't mean that it's fucking true. That's exactly why I'm here.

And I think we should really get into climate change and start talking about that. The only way that the subject of the episode becomes less pleasant, sea levels are rising for us. Let me get my graphs. Come on. Get on my, who wants to sign up to my newsletter? My email chain. Yeah.

I'll send you some graphs. I'll send you some graphs. I don't want to be electrocuted. No. No. Now, obtaining their freedom so easily taught Fred and Rose a couple of lessons. One, they learned that it was possible to do absolutely horrific things together and get away with it, even if they got pinched.

But more importantly, they realized that it was best to not risk leaving anyone alive. Furthermore, it was best to choose victims nobody would miss, although they would break that last guideline time and again to no consequence. Because again, we learned the biggest thing is that they need confessions, the criminal justice system works the same way over there as it does over here where they are desperate for confessions and nobody, no crime. It is very difficult to get somebody for murder if you don't, if you don't first find the body, it is very difficult.

More wigs though. Way more wigs. They do have more wigs. Slide from your clay. A roast as dark as the night, perfect for fueling the cryptid research and mad ravings required for your podcasting. Don't mind the red eyes. He's just trying to warn you of the bridge.

The bridge. Finally, from the caffeine-addled brains of Spring Hill Jack Coffee and Last Podcast on the left, we bring you Mothman's red-eye blend. Yes, delicious Panama beans, go to lastpodcastmerch.com to order yours today. But because they got even the tiniest bit more careful, Fred and Rose wouldn't come close to a police investigation for another nine years and nine women would end up dead buried at 25 Cromwell as a result. If however, Fred and Rose killed at least an average of one woman a year from the time

they got married until the time they were arrested, as is suggested by the bodies found buried at their home and considering how they sometimes clustered kills, it's thought that the true number of victims is upwards of 30. Oh, yeah. I absolutely can see that. Again, we talk about on the show quite a bit with some of these guys where some over-exaggerate, Henry Lucas over-exaggerated, Pee Wee Gaskins, perhaps? Pee over-exaggerated, where I think they, especially as you get into Fred's confessions

later on, they were so cagey, like he did not want to talk. This was their true private life, and they viewed it as, essentially, the investigation, they viewed it as an invasion of their privacy. Oh, well, God forbid. God forbid. Well, like John Wayne Gacy, Fred and Rose eventually ran out of room to bury bodies at 25 Cromwell Street, but unlike Gacy, they almost certainly found another place to bury those bodies at locations that still have yet to be found.

Or they smashed up the bones even harder. I also think that the one thing that was really interesting was in the excavation of the property, the bodies were buried extremely deep. He had lifted, because he was in construction, so he had used construction, I guess, tools to basically dig a fucking 15, 20-foot trench underneath his own home. And like, so there was a, it was layered, and so they only got what they could get. So he's better than Gacy when it comes to having his home become a morgue. It's also, I mean, I think it really talks more about this.

Unlicensed graveyard. Unlicensed graveyard. Unlicensed graveyard. Yeah. I think it's more about discipline. Yeah. Jeez. But as far as Fred and Rose's first victim together went, her name was Linda Goff, and

she was a 20-year-old who'd agreed to help babysit after Carolyn left. Now, in this, I can't help but wonder why anyone would ever agree to even walk inside the West Home more than once. Well, it's because if you listen to all the witness people who talk about it in all the documentaries they watch, you're like, oh, it's a lovely home. And people know, you could tell he was a lovely family home. I mean, you don't really expect the home that you're walking into to be a murder shack with a sex dungeon.

I mean, you don't. I do. I mean. I'm always looking. I can't, I can't. I don't know. My eyeballs are fucking peeled, dude. Yeah.

Well, to that point, Gloucester is barely a city. Even now, the population is less than 30,000 people, and even in a town five times that size, I'd imagine rumors of what went on with Carolyn Owens would have been enough to make people stay away. Well, it's all they only want to do is a bit of a duck-duck, the big of a snip-a-snip, and he just wanted to rub it in over the main, over the main, rub the elbows, this is how well he's been doing. And I do have to push back a little bit.

I grew up in a town of 23,000, and we had a Walmart, and we had a Target, and we had an Applebee, and we had a Fizzoli's. You tell me that's not a fucking city. You tell me that's not a, you tell me that, you tell me I didn't grow up in a fucking city. Whoa, look at that accent. Whoa. Who are you?

Mr. Eighth Avenue. Yes, I grew up at some of the more controversial streets. Controversial streets. Oh, there were passive-aggressive lanes. Oh, yes, that's very Wisconsin. Yes, indeed. But on the other hand, this was a time of deep recession in England, which made it nearly impossible for especially young people to find work.

They were desperate, and even those that found work were sometimes limited to only three days a week as a measure to save on electricity. Therefore, there was a fair amount of desperation and boredom, a sort of fucking attitude, and that hopelessness that burrowed deep into the souls of the English youth was almost certainly sensed by two predators like Fred and Rose West. Thank you, London calling and then around. Let me take my underwear off and throw them at you. Oh, there you go.

But it's every time you talk about something where it's brown buildings, brown bricks. I remember always remembering that first time we went to Manchester, where someone from London was like, enjoy the bricks. We go there. Well, they're made of human bones. Sure. And Edinburgh as well. It's always that one song from the clash.

Because it's just, I mean, it's got a good clarion call, and it sounds good over old footage of people walking quickly through London. Yeah, it really does. And you play it really fast, and you have a couple of punks, and they're talking really fast to each other. And when him goes, yeah, man, man, man, all right, then you got a guy going, oh, I can't believe it. And he's got like a lawyer, he's got the wig on, and the queen comes out there and she

fucking queeps or whatever, fucking fuck her around. Well, you really got that dead woman. You got her again. I don't still know. I can't wait to be in the UK. I can't wait to be over there. We're really going to learn again, boots on the ground. Yeah, don't worry here in October, if you're listening right now, we're going to be in

a few cities. Get tickets if you haven't got tickets yet. All right. Well, as it was, Fred and Rose were able to ensnare dozens of desperate people, some of whom weren't missed by anyone, and some who didn't have a person who cared enough to keep searching. Case and point was Linda Goff. Linda disappeared on April 19, 1973, with the only trace being a vague note left with

her mother that said not to worry because she'd gotten a flat and she'd come see her mother sometime in the future. In reality, that note was probably written by Rose West. Rose West really, what I'm kind of also discovering too, is that within it, Rose West kind of becoming the brains of the operation. Like Fred West was the muscle, and she kind of directed stuff in a way that I didn't really think about before. Like she did a lot of these things where she'd be like, we've got to cover it up.

And she would like do notes and like, do calls like fake being the people and shit. Yeah. As we'll get into later, like Fred West was described by some as Rose's minion, you know, that did her bidding and did it happily. Banana. Yeah, I remember that deleted scene from the rise of Gru. Well, Linda had actually been taken down to the cellar and using BDSM magazine's inspiration, Fred and Rose wrapped her head completely in brown packing tape, giving her only a tiny

tube to breathe through. It's unknown exactly how she died, but she either expired during the sexual torture or was killed after the Wests were done, all because they didn't want to risk another situation like Carolyn Owens. I would imagine that most of them were kept, they were, they were, their heads were covered in tape. That was like their MO. Right.

And then the, a lot of times the way Fred West talked about it, he's just like, you be sprawled, how easy it is to just strangle someone. You can get run and then he just, because he said that because his hands are so strong, because he could move a, he could pull a lug nut off a thing without a spanner. He was able to do that, that it was easy for him to do it. That's surprising. That's where we breathe from. It's like, he didn't like grab her ankle and he was like, no, I'm like, yeah, that's

how you would do that. Wow. These people are gross. Good call. Another good call from Kessler. Thank you. I'm on a lot of hot, I got a lot of hot takes today. Well, as far as the body went, Fred cut the legs off at the hip and dissected the hands,

feet and knees so he could keep his trophies. The rest was then buried under the garage in a rectangular concrete hole called an inspection pit used to work underneath cars. Rose meanwhile, rifled through Linda's possessions, keeping what she liked and burning the rest. Three weeks later though, Linda's mother showed up at 25 Cromwell Street looking for her daughter. Incredibly, Rose answered the door wearing Linda's slippers and several articles of Linda's clothing were hanging from the washing line outside.

Yeah. Yeah. She had like one of those like necklaces on that just says Linda, you know, you get from Macy's. When all this was pointed out to Rose, Rose said, oh yes, Linda had been living there, but she was kicked out for beating the children and she'd left all this behind. This story was taken as truth by Linda's mother who never reported her as a missing person and never organized any sort of search for her daughter.

Good Lord. Yeah. I mean, at least put it, I don't know. I'd feel like I'd fight a little bit more. I just feel like, yeah, I guess, or you're just like, yep, sounds like Linda. Oh man. I found out you want to be a 90 and I was like, oh, you have to do his head every child to within you.

So I didn't fall free to you. So I don't really know why we want to do that. I'd rather be a mini meanwhile, Fred worked at all hours of the night on expanding and customizing the torture dungeon. He made it bigger by digging past the foundations so he could stand without hunching and he installed a new floor. More importantly though, he installed strong, sturdy hooks into the wooden beams, which they used to dangle the young women they kidnapped for the sadistic and deadly sexual games.

Fucking hellraiser. Yes. Yeah. But as far as where Fred dismembered these young women, his son, Steven West would maintain that his father didn't just use the cellar. There was also a terrifying derelict farmhouse outside of Cheltenham, Cheltenham, Cheltenham. Just know, we don't know, our dear, our dear British, whatever your dear British listener, listen, we don't know all of the little towns, how they pronounce it.

We're trying, we're working hard. But I think it looks like Cheltenham. Cheltenham. Cheltenham. Cheltenham. You know what, if America wasn't so famous, I'd like to see those motherfuckers looking at Albuquerque and pronounce it correctly. I will say, the truth is, is that every town in Texas is also said different than it is

written. Oh, so we're going to bring up my Emma again. We're going to bring up my Emma. All right. It's the same shit. Let's move on. Let's move on. Well, there at this farmhouse, Fred could take his time, and the remains were transported

to and from this farmhouse in fiberglass tanks, stolen from Fred's place of work. It's also likely that murders outside of Rose's participation occurred here as well, which would put the number even higher than 30. But the young women killed by Fred and Rose weren't just runaways or hitchhikers, or at least the ones we know of weren't always runaways or hitchhikers. Both Carol and Cooper and Lucy Partington, the next two victims, Lucy Partington, by the way, was killed after seven days of torture. Both of them were reported missing by their families, but there was nothing tying them

to Fred and Rose. But the only thing that could have brought any suspicion was when Fred showed up at hospital, as the British say, with a cut on his right hand, most likely sustained while dismembering Lucy Partington. Well, because they had a very similar MO that you would say to about Myra Hindley and Radley, where it's like they would drive around and they'd have Rose in the car, and it really never changed. And they'd scoop them up.

They would see somebody on the side of the road because hitchhiking was very common. Bus stops, mostly. Yeah. And it was common, especially at this time period, and the fact that a lot of people knew each other and, again, having the woman in the car made him seem, made Fred West seem a lot more or less dangerous because, yeah, he's saying a bunch of fucked up stuff, but this woman seems to stand it. And now, now, but you don't know, she's the fucking true evil other half of it and brings

you in. So that's kind of where they pick it up, then it really kind of expands from it. Now, eventually, the West realized that their own home was actually the best trap at their disposal when it came to just sex, so they stopped accepting male tenants and only allowed young women and girls in the upstairs apartments. These tenants, however, both male and female, later said they heard a lot of mayhem coming from downstairs. Yes.

And sometimes they smelled odd odors, but, of course, nothing was reported officially or investigated. Yeah, because a lot of times that just sounds like a British chef in the kitchen. That could be a little rat-tattoo-y type stuff, I mean, improv troupe moved down there. I mean, think about the people who lived above 656, when Murderfist was actively just destroying that whole place. Oh, yeah. Yeah.

No, I can only imagine that we were fucking shooting Toilet's Joe in there. Oh, yeah. How much screaming did I do? Screaming and screaming. Absolutely. Smashed up the whole kitchen and just like, screaming all hours of the night, smoking inside and screaming all sorts of sex noises and fucking, yeah, I can't even imagine. There were a lot of different kinds of sounds there.

And beans. Were there beans? I feel like Toilet's Joe, wasn't he covered in beans? No, no, it was over. It was an over-all. Shaving cream. Shaving cream. But it was the essence of beans.

I mean, that's just what the essence of beans is. Yeah, I bring a bean flavor to everything I do. I don't get you, because beans are always known for their flavor. Yo, I love a good bean. Give me some Heinz beans. There's a lot of flavor in some Heinz beans. I'm going to eat so many fucking Heinz beans when I'm in fucking England. I'm going to eat beans for breakfast every fucking day.

This is making this story more disgusting. This story with the English breakfast backdrop is even more disgusting. It's just all the fucking, I like it because it's soft. Soft bacon. That's what I do. It's all that. It's the weird like, it's like bacon that has the same texture as spaghetti. Hard bacon makes my teeth hurt.

Oh, guys. It's supposed to be a little hard. Oh, this is open. I know, it's ridiculous. Some murder victims were known to the West, but many were picked up from the side of the road. Sometimes once a year, sometimes in clusters. One of these girls was Therese Ziegenthaler from Switzerland, whom Fred nicknamed Tulip

because he thought she was Dutch. Therese. Does that make sense? I don't know. I don't know. I think yeah, we're going to Tulip too. Yeah, apparently they do. Yeah.

Okay. Therese was picked up while hitchhiking from London to Wales and was buried in a square grave in the cellar. Again, the Wests were never suspected because Therese's family in Switzerland hadn't even known that she'd left London. Each time, however, Fred and Rose got more extreme. They escalated as serial killers always do. About seven months after Ziegenthaler, Fred and Rose picked up Shirley Hubbard from a bus

stop and forced her down into the cellar. There, they wrapped tape around her head 12 times to create a brown mask that stopped just beneath the eyes. To breathe, they ran a small plastic tube three inches into her nasal cavity and extended the tube a foot outside of the mask to make it as hard as possible to breathe. The tube was only about an eighth of an inch in diameter. Jesus. Again, they're not.

What's weird is I can almost see it in there. I mean, what's weird? Jesus Christ. But you know, like Fred West in his way, he's like, they're so chic and brave. And to me, it's probably would kill her. Oh, no. They are doing that specifically to make breathing as hard as possible. They're not doing it as a favor.

They're doing it because they know it's going to be difficult and they're taking it to the absolute edge of how can we torture her the most while still keeping her alive. Right. But after she died of presumably asphyxiation, Fred cut off her head with the mask still on and the tube still attached. He cut off the heap ahead at every single person he killed. Her body was then buried in the part of the cellar adorned with pictures of Marilyn Monroe. Oh, God.

Again, she was reported missing, but no leads were found. This is why it's weird to be famous. You never, it's like when your song is used by a fascist or like Marilyn Monroe didn't take those pictures, being like, what? I hope I'm in a cellar. No, no. She didn't know. She was like, I really, it's artistic.

I hope people respect my work. It's just always like, especially it's like someone like highly innocuous to use a UK reference. It's like the chef like Jamie Oliver. Like if you know who that is, it's like somebody, if somebody in the background, we're like, we love, we absolutely love him at this house and he's like, oh, Jamie, some of your healthy meals have really helped us keep our energy up for all the time. Absolutely. And he's helped, Jamie Oliver helps a lot of kids as well.

Yeah. Kudos to him for that. School lunches. Yeah. Yeah. School lunches. But while many young girls were taken from the side of the road, Fred and Rose would occasionally take a tenant, Juanita Mott had been living as a tenant at 25 Cremwell Street

for about two years, partly because the rates were always cheap at the West home. I wonder why. I don't know. Wow. What a stunner. Most rooms rented for only seven pounds a week as advertised in the local newspaper, The Gloucester Citizen. Most tenants, however, came by word of mouth and Juanita had actually visited the house

a few times before moving in. She disappeared down into the cellar on April 12, 1974, hung from a seven-foot noose, suspended around the ceiling beams while tied up in complicated bondage knots. She was likely killed by a blow to the back of the head with a ball-peen hammer, and her body was buried in the cellar between the staircase and the second alcove. And here comes that also weird, the weird thing that Fred West kind of also threads throughout his confessions, which like, you know, like, well, she asked for it. She asked for it.

I don't think she did. No, I don't think she did. I mean, like, no, she wanted to die, right? Oh, I see. I didn't even ask to die. Oh, I see. Because she was being tortured so much. Yes.

And so that is, like, what? And they were like, yeah, probably. But you started the process. Yeah. Well, Fred West's whole thing was that he never set out to kill anyone. No. Everything was like, it's an extreme pleasure. Got out of control.

Yeah. And then he just, and it just accidentally happened. He said, whoa, whoa, yeah. Someone was like, why did you murder these girls? I was like, whoa, whoa, you're making it sound like I went out to murder someone. Yeah. And he died then. Yeah.

Oh, my God. It was DiGiorno. Right. Now, it was a risky move to kill a tenant, but Juanita's family never reported her disappearance. Had they done so, it would have given police ample reason to investigate, because Juanita's legal address was 25 Cromwell Street. Otherwise, the only reasons police had to investigate the house was for Fred's constant petty thefts or the parties thrown by tenants in which copious amounts of British weed

was smoked. Hey, Marcus. It's pronounced, weed. All right. British weed. Man, that must have been some shwaggy shwaggy. Oh, yeah. The shwaggy is too shwaggy.

It literally must have been just clumps of dirt. Yeah, I think so. These parties, this was actually the most likely reason why tenants kept coming, because Fred and Rose knew, just like other serial killers like Dean Coral knew, that a party house is the perfect trap for young folk. Do not go to the party house that is owned by older people. Do not go to the party house that's owned by people in their 20s, that's owned by people in their 30s.

Definitely not owned by people in their 40s. I'm telling you kids this, as a PSA, do not go to the party house owned by the older person. Do not go. Do not go. Never go. There should only be children in that house, and you should, at the end of it, probably be close to setting it on fire. There should be nobody here to take care of it if you are partying as a child.

Right. At some point, Fred and Rose began targeting a children's home for delinquent and expelled kids called Jordan's Brookhouse that was located nearby. Fred and Rose started grooming residents, inviting them over for tea and biscuits. They also made sure to tell the kids, to tell their friends, about how nice Fred and Rose were. I just feel like if I've got these two fucking evil, they're gross, look, they're gross. I know he's like vaguely charming, they keep saying that he's vaguely charming, but still,

I don't know, just the idea of these two weird older people being like, you go tell your friends, you tell your friends, we're, we're nice, we're fun, we're funny guys, we're fun, we're cool. That's why they preyed on people who needed, they probably liked the attention from the adults and they needed some comfort. Of course. And who doesn't want a tea and a biscuit? I'm fine with that.

Oh, yes. I'm not big on the hard tea biscuit. No. I just love biscuits. Yeah. And the British biscuits and American biscuits. Those are cookies. I love all biscuits.

Within they also have cookies. No, there's a difference between cookies and biscuits. Yes, that's it. There is. There is a difference between cookies and biscuits. They interchange them sometimes though. No, no, no way. Sometimes they'll, well, many times I've been offered a biscuit and it was a cookie.

Well, you think that it's a cookie, it seems like a cookie, but it's a biscuit. A biscuit's a hard bite, it's got a snap to it. Okay. Well, eventually, Fred and Rose stared a 15-year-old girl known only as Miss A. Who ran away from Jordan's Brookhouse and moved into 25 Cromwell Street in the summer of 1976. And here we've got another mercifully brief gold star. Once she was moved in, Miss A was involved in a horrific orgy involving two of the West children, who reportedly sucked on Rose's hair while Rose, again, laughed maniacally

throughout. That sounds like the stories that the witches told, right, and the afflicted told of the activity that they would see, like that kind of maniacal, like many people all laughing and con-forting with the devil. So now you're a pro Salem witch trial. No, I'm just saying. Yeah, it sounds like you're coming on the side of the afflicted, like it's that whole Satanic panic thing where there's actual real shit that's provable, it's like, you know,

this actually sounds a lot like what they're saying is happening at the McMartin preschool. Henry's going full-warnky. He's going full-warnky. You know what I mean? Where it's like that idea of Rose West having that sort of like, she just sounds like a modern-day version of a child's story witch, where she's just always like filled with this like maniacal joy, whatever it is that she's doing. Yeah, I mean, that is a one in a billion person, Rose West, like it is not, that is not by

any means a widespread person. I mean, we're not trying to romance her here. You're one in a billion, Rose. They broke them all when they made you, Rose. Oh, my. Well, concerning Rose, one of the most shocking facts about the Fred and Rose West saga is that the West children actually remembered Fred West more fondly, because in their words, he wasn't as insanely violent as their mother, nor as unpredictable.

That's how they described Rose West, insanely violent. Yeah, and Fred was the stable one. That's probably not good for a relationship. Yeah, and like I said earlier, Steven West said on the podcast series, based on Howard Soons' book, that Rose was actually the instigator, particularly in the realm of torture. Fred West was more of, again, a minion than a driving force. Now, Miss A was actually allowed to leave 25 Cromwell after this nightmare, and reportedly Miss A returned six weeks later with a full can of gasoline, with a full intent of burning

the house down. Oh. And when she showed up, she thought better and returned to the children's home, only to later testify against Rose West. Oh, man, this is a rare time where I say she should have committed an act of arson. Yeah. It's a rare moment. I think more things could be set on fire.

I mean, in this case, that's the whole damn thing on fire. Well, it might be tempting to say burn it down, but Miss A probably decided against burning down the house because she would have taken far more people than just Fred and Rose West. Yeah, they're all, everything's right on top of each other. There's seven young women living in the rooms in the top two floors that were completely cut off from the West. Just give my heads up. Just be like, about to burn it down.

You're going to want to exit. I couldn't help but notice you're putting a bunch of gasoline on my apartment. About to burn it down. You're just going to want to get out of here. Thank you for the warning, then. No problem. And also, there's five or six children living in the West Department itself. There's going to be a lot of people taken along and a few people stayed at the West

House for any period of time, but at least once a tenant would not only settle into the lifestyle, but would engage in a relationship with Fred and Rose at her own peril. In this case, we have a young woman named Shirley Robinson. Shirley Robinson was a sex worker known to Rose and she ended up in a thrupple at 25 Cromwell with Fred and Rose. It's not a thrupple. This is how he's saying thrupple, because now thrupple's cute. Yeah, thrupple.

You know, like thrupple's all like, meh, well, you know, it's all like it's TikTok people having sex with their wife and sex and you have to act like it's fun and every high five means the other. I don't know. A thrupple sounds like it would be fun if you have like, what do you call those grass uppers? Taika Watiti. Taika Watiti and the other woman that he's with and he has another supermodel.

That's a thrupple. Oh, I was thinking grasshoppers. Or the grasshopper, the candy with the chocolate and the peanuts and the caramel. Yeah. Again, this is all about him not having had food before the show. I mean, thrupples. Yeah, thrupples are fine if you want to be in a thrupple. I mean, I've never seen a thrupple in which one person didn't eventually get kicked out

and had their fucking heart broken into a million pieces. But if you want to try the thrupple, go right on ahead. I'm just saying the West and somebody else is like, it's not like the bitch in apartment 4B, whatever that apartment is. I mean, by accounts, this was a consensual relationship. I mean, Shirley Robinson was in it with the West. Eventually both Shirley and Rose got pregnant at the same time, both by clients. And Rose hoped she and Shirley would raise these illegitimate children together.

But strangely, during this pregnancy in particular, Rose refused to ever wear underwear. She'd often be seen sitting on the back steps of her house with her legs wide open, airing out her crotch. However, things soon went south with Shirley Robinson for reasons unknown. I mean, it's speculated that Rose grew jealous or she just got tired of the situation. Who knows? Either way, after Rose gave birth to her child, a girl named Tara, she and Fred decided that Shirley no longer needed to be around.

She was due to give birth in June of 1978. But after seeing her doctor in May, Shirley was murdered by the West eight months pregnant, most likely by simple strangulation rather than extended torture. With this one, though, it is suspected that Rose committed the murder and disposed of the body herself because the dismemberment was far messier than any of the others. From what I can tell, it seems like Fred told her, you made the mess, you cleaned it up. Well, couples fight like that, like that everybody loved Raymond episode where it's not about the suitcase.

It never is. In his little autobiography that he wrote in jail, one thing that he does is he's obsessed. He doesn't say anything about any murder or none of the crimes, but he talks about the loves of his life and the ones he wished that he could be with forever. And one was Shirley. And so there is a little bit of that. So Rose was jealous. He was just like that.

She was one. She was one of a fucking row of thousand poems. I'd write at least one about Shirley. And one I'd write about crisps and another I'd write about tape and another I'd write about concrete. Yeah. Can I write about what you know? I guess.

Yeah, I'm saying. Yeah. Anything else? No. Okay. I hate that poem. No one likes it. No one does like it.

Fred now. See, instead of carefully carving away the flesh and disarticulating the limbs, the thighs were hacked off with a heavy axe by nine blows before the bone finally broke, which is a far cry for the meticulous work that had been done on most of the bodies. Trophies, however, were still taken, although this time Fred and or Rose also scalped the hair either before or after decapitation. Where did they put all this shit? We're not shit.

Where do these human parts? Don't know. Nobody fucking knows. It must have been out in the fall. I think that they just went out to that farm area. There is no way. I feel like that's where they had it there because Fred West brings up that place again and again and again.

And I feel like they went there a lot or he did. I think he went to go because he was hanging out in a room full of severed bones and skin and just was very romantically obsessed with these ideas because he also talks about in the confessions and he's like, I close my eyes and the ghosts that come to me, they come and ask me when we're going to see you, Fred, when we're going to see you. And so he's like, he goes and he says that he he speaks to all the ghosts. Oh, OK, like maniac. Yes.

I mean, I think, you know, the fact that the scalping was the only time that this was ever done to any of the corpses, I think it points towards Rose doing it because I think it seems like that's Rose's thing because Rose is also like it cannot be stressed enough that Rose was also a serial killer. She's also experimenting. She's doing the same shit that every other serial killer does. Yep. Concerning the eight month old baby, it was dismembered as well.

And Fred again took trophies, didn't matter who it was with Fred killed. If there was a dead body around, Fred's taking the fingers and Fred's taking the toes. But after this murder, arguably the most distasteful, the magic of the act sort of lost its edge for a little while. Instead, Rose focused on sex work, putting ads and magazines saying shit like this. Sexy housewife needs it deep and hard from VW a very well endowed male while husband watches. Oh, man, I'm just not that well and dead.

I bet you take you. OK. Well, the herd clients in the mum and dad's room, Fred installed a doorbell for. Yeah, mum and dad's room is always off. It's just I just also don't like it. It's just again, they're beer, you know, they're bad. They're bad. They're bad.

They are bad. Just bad. Yep. Fred installed a doorbell for Rose's clients labeled Mandy, which was Rose's professional name. When it rang, Rose dropped everything to attend to the client, sometimes leaving food burning on the stove. Fred and Rose also had another child.

Number six, mostly because Fred said that quote unquote potting Rose helped her from getting topsy. A baby in Rose helped her from getting top. He literally filled her with child because we are watching the inner mechanism of the murder group fall apart. We are seeing him look at Rose. And I think after she's scalped a corpse, yeah, he's like, oh, shit, roses get no little out of hand.

This is the breaking point. She is starting, it's starting to separate where I think especially where she puts the driving force on, I want to get back into hardcore and the sex work. Because again, insinuating you're not enough. And what do we do with people that don't start to fit in with our lifestyle after a while? We fucking kill them and we dismember them when we put them in the backyard. It's a strange ad for a local paper. I'm sure there's mostly editorials about jaywalking and how it has to be banned.

And then all of a sudden Rose West is just like, I'll take it deep and hard. I actually feel like it was way more, I think it was way more DIY. What do you mean DIY? Like they, they stacked up fires on fucking telephone posts. It does kind of feel like it's got a sort of like feel, maybe I'm wrong, side stories LPOTL, gmail.com, if you know anything about this time period and sex work at the time. But it feel like it was a little bit more accepted and it was way more people going into people's homes.

Like it was like that. We're like, well that's what I want to do. It's a nice home. Well, sure. It's a lovely home. I don't, I don't think that sex work was super accepted in small town England in the 1970s. All they're doing is fucking each other's aunts. Well, they do enjoy that.

Obviously. It's a matriarch. Well, I imagine the ad was probably in like a flesh world type of magazine. Yeah. Yeah. Oh. But this time of relative peace was disturbed when Bill Letts, Rose's father, died of mesothelioma. Whoa.

He said it. Did he get it at Camp Lejeune? He said it. No. Mesothelioma. If you had been stationed in or around Camp Lejeune, please call. Yeah. Go on.

You would have mesothelioma. Wow. A few months later, as it often goes with serial killers in a stressful life event, Fred and Rose returned to murder, albeit for the last known time with a sexual motive. The victim this time was another girl lured from Jordan's Brookhouse named Allison Chambers. She again worked briefly as a nanny before being killed, dismembered, and buried in the garden. Now, she was reported missing, but because she wrote her mother a letter saying she was

off to live with a family to look after their children, she failed to name the Wests. So the police determined that Allison Chambers was most likely fine, just unreachable. She's fine. She's fine. See how easy that is to be a detective? She's fine. Right. All right.

Well, she's got feet. She ran away. Get away from me. Boom. Hold my stick. Absolutely. Look at the hat. I'm a corp.

Can we please go get a meat pie now? Now, by 1980, there were six kids living at 25 Cromwell, and a new baby replaced Anna-Marie after she finally left at the age of 15 due to years of abuse. And by the way, if you're curious, again, those years of abuse are detailed to an insane degree in the book, Fred and Rose. But when Anna-Marie left Heather, Rose's first child, she became the eldest in the house, and she began to bear the brunt of both Rose's beatings and Fred's sexual abuse, something that Fred called a father's right.

You know, yes, because he learned that again directly from his father. We know that he was sleeping with his own mother. We know that he probably impregnated his 13-year-old sister, and he's viewed this again. That's just country living. It's really not. It's really not. He brought it to the city. Look at that.

And concerning that so-called right, I mean, one of the kids that were fathered by a customer of Rose's, one of the Kittara that was not Fred's daughter, she said that Fred only abused his natural children because he looked at them as his property. As such, in one case, when Anna-Marie briefly visited with a boyfriend, he heard a protracted 20-minute screaming fit in the middle of the night, which Fred and Rose explained away as Heather having a nightmare. And of course, it's just them torturing Heather down in the cellar. Oh, yes.

Now, soon after, Anna-Marie was unfortunately forced to move back into 25 Cromwell, although she made her boyfriend promise that he would never leave her alone with her parents. And I'd be the boyfriend being like, well, I really got to get in the middle of this fucking shit. Like, we need to move to Hollywood or something. We got to get the hell out of here. You don't just date the person who dates her family, too. You're right.

Well, Anna-Marie moved back in to help raise another child, Rosemary Jr., who'd again been born as a consequence of Rose's sex work. A year later, another sex work baby was born, number three out of eight, I think. I think it was the third one in a row, and after that, Rose got even more violent, even more frequently. How do you do so much after being pregnant for a decade? She likes it. Yeah, I guess that's what it is.

People just like it. Yeah. It's a lifestyle. Yeah, it is. Yeah. She punched her children, stabbed them with knives, slammed their fingers in doors, choked them, tied their hands with wire, made them drink mixtures of salt and vinegar, and beat them with the buckle of a belt, and that's for starters.

Anna-Marie, of course, moved out when she again reached her limit. Meanwhile, as Howard Soons speculates, and we wholeheartedly agree, Fred and Rose were almost undoubtedly abducting and murdering girls throughout the 80s, although there is no proof they did so outside of Fred's talk about the possibility of as many as 30 victims after his capture. Wow. Yeah, there's just nowhere else to bury them at 25 Cromwell Street. Yeah, they just outsourced it.

I think they went to the farm and they just slowly started to leave them various places, and I think that the dismembering just got way more articulate. Now, Heather West, the eldest of Fred and Rose's children together, she was trying as hard as she could to escape 25 Cromwell. She begged her sister Anna-Marie to let her come live at her place. She also applied to work at a summer camp just so she could escape the house for at least a few months. But her sister probably rightfully pegged that Fred and Rose would just come snatch

her back if she tried running, and her application at the summer camp was tragically denied. God. God, just one job interview. You gotta... Oh, God. Yeah. After Heather West disappeared like so many girls before and became the last girl killed by Fred and Rose West.

For some reason, Fred and Rose had become obsessed with the possibility that their daughter Heather was a lesbian, and some speculate that perhaps it was this obsession that led to Heather West's death. Howard soon speculated that Fred and Rose tried quote unquote curing her by tying her up and raping her, and at one point, one of the two of them strangled her to death. Fred did say that he was the one who did it, but it's more likely that it was Rose because Rose's temper was now beyond imagination. Because she'd also go into these games and then truly get jealous of her own husband

in the moment, and then freak out and kill the person in front of him. And he was like, again, he's just all wrapped up in it and looking at her, knowing that at some point, it's gonna come down to me and you. It might. It might. Maybe. Another clue as to which one did it is in the dismemberment. Like the body of Shirley Robinson, the corpse of Heather West was hacked to pieces in a

manner that we could call inexpert. This again suggests that Rose both committed the murder and dismembered the body, but before the corpse was buried, it was left in black garbage bags under the stairs until they could figure out a place to bury her at home. This does actually point towards the possibility that maybe Fred and Rose did take an extended break in the eighties, because otherwise she would have been just buried along with all the others. Unless the new spot was also full.

Maybe. It also might have been that since Heather West was their own child, they might have buried her close by in a sort of perverted extension of the possession Fred felt towards his children. That's exactly what I think that happened, because Fred West will talk about later on that he would say that they would, after burying her, he would come out and he said he was obsessed with this idea, we'd go, and they'll wake up, and they'll come to your father, like he would go and scream, yell at the grave and say, like, wake up, which is, you know,

I don't think he did it. I don't think he did that necessarily, but I think that he, that's, that is that, because then he'd use her as an example to the rest of the children. Could have been cool if she woke up though and then killed him from the grave. Yeah, it would be a great movie. Yeah, it would be cool. And when the rest of the children came home from school to find Heather missing, they were flatly told that Heather had gotten the job at the summer camp after all.

No. Fred then asked Stephen to help him dig a hole in the garden for a new fish pond, which was unbeknownst to Stephen, his sister's grave. The hole was then paved over with pink and yellow square slabs, and a patio was built over Heather West's buried body. Now, after Heather's murder, Fred West decided to move his younger children into the cellar permanently. Oh, no, that's not good.

Covering the floors with linoleum to permanently entomb the five young women buried beneath the house. And eventually the West kids would cover the walls of the cellar in childish graffiti, bizarre murals of cowboys and crudely drawn cartoon hearts, all scrawled on the remaining white stucco that hadn't crumbled off the exposed brick. That's what I was talking about with the idea of like the buzz and woody drawn on it. Because as you look at the police pictures afterwards, I feel like that is, I mean, obviously it's all deeply disturbing, but that was one of the things that's the worst because it

does look like the basement and a child daycare because it's all painted up with kids drawings and shit. I mean, it doesn't look like a child, no child daycare looks like that. No, of course. You've never been to. I had this guy in this great neighborhood named Danny. I used to go down there every like for six weeks at a time and I'd go down to the basement and he'd chain me up to, he said, you're trying to make me taller.

I think you're trauma dumping. Yeah. There's a lot. Let's talk about that. The thing is that I would make him laugh so hard he'd let me go. Isn't that fantastic? But then I'd always go back because again, I've got to get that laugh. Yeah.

Put the butter in the sourdough. No, I'm sure Fred and Rose got a kick of just how evil this move was, but the practical reason was to just get the kids out of the way. Oh, yeah. You'll see Fred and Rose wanted to transform the entire upstairs area into a brothel while the lower section where the kids lived in the former torture and kill seller was sectioned off with an iron gate to keep the kids isolated and held captive when they weren't at school. Now, for the next five years, it's unknown how many young women Fred and Rose killed,

if any, seeing as how they'd converted their torture and kill room to holding cells for the six remaining children. Really, all that's known is that Fred would threaten the kids, often and loudly, that they would be killed and buried under the porch like Heather if they didn't behave. Yeah. If it wasn't one over and two to the left, they'd go and he'd look at the panels on the ground and that's where they would say that she was buried in the backyard. And what's kind of funny is that my momma used to say that she was just like, you know,

like, I'll get ready and I'll make another one just like you. I don't know. Your mother wouldn't want to. Why would she want to make one just like you if she wanted to get rid of you in the first place? I'm not saying that no one would miss me, but again, it was a funny bit at a time. That is funny. Yeah.

It's kind of funny, but how many little Polish redheaded squealing boys were there running around Queenie at the time? Yeah. There's not really that many of them. I killed each one because honestly, I didn't need the competition. No, you didn't. That was me showing them. Survival of the fattest.

I'm in charge of this ginger yard. Right. Absolutely. All right. I'm the big fish. Indeed. No doubt about that. Well, we don't know if they murdered anyone in those five years.

They certainly never stopped abusing young girls. And in 1992, one of the girls that Fred and Rose had groomed and raped talked to a friend about what she'd suffered. Thankfully, the person assigned to the case was Detective Hazel Savage. Ooh. This isn't a, again, with last podcast, a lot of times we tried to be pretty honest about how cops do their jobs and how they don't do their jobs, but this detective actually dug in.

Yeah. Hazel Savage. Actually did her job. Nice. The detective was like, yeah, isn't that great? How we have to differentiate and have to say, wow, there was a cop that did their job. Holy shit, dude, because the story literally already has several decades of police not doing anything.

Yeah. That's the thing here. It's a real dirty, foster situation. Silence of the land. Yeah. She was a woman. Yeah. Yeah.

She got into it. I just remember her climbing the rope. Yes, indeed. That was the beginning of the movie. Yep. Yeah. Hey, what's up, everyone? How you doing?

Ben Kissel here with Henry Zabrowski. Yeah. It's me, man. Yeah, bro. Henry Zabrowski is smoking some of that sweet last podcast on the left, babe. Go out there and purchase yourself some. I hope you enjoy it. We have Sativa.

We have Indica and we have a hybrid and I have to tell you, from my personal experience, they are wonderful. Super tasty, live resin. You really get the delicious, weedy taste, which is what I like and three different experiences. You go to your local vape store and get it. Absolutely. Thank you all so much for supporting the show. We absolutely love you.

Can't wait to see you on the road and get that vape, put it in your brain and have a good time. And if you want to set your favorite weed store, give them a call and ask for them by name. Absolutely. Last podcast on the left, it's weed. Hail yourselves, everyone. Hail Satan.

Now, Detective Savage was one of the first women to become a detective in England and she was highly regarded by damn near everyone as a super cop. Additionally, she'd already had a brief run in with Fred West way back in 1966 when Fred's first wife, Rena, had run back to Scotland after a string of petty thefts in England. Detective Savage was the person who'd found and arrested Rena, but Rena soon told Savage all about Fred West's violent tendencies and sexual deviancies to the extent that Detective Savage remembered it nearly 30 years later. Sure enough, when Savage looked into Fred's criminal history, she found the 1973 assault

that we talked about the beginning of this episode. And so after serving a search warrant for 25 Cromwell Street for child abuse and pornography possession in which a vast collection of pornography, both homemade and professional, plus a treasure trove of sex toys was confiscated, Fred and Rose were arrested for the rape of the girl who'd reported them. This was 21 years after their first arrest. There was 21 years between their first arrest and their second arrest. For some reason, I feel like they were really offended when they took the pornography because

he was just like, I read Easy Rider for the articles. Yeah, they are. Yeah, that's it. Easy Rider's not a pornographic magazine. Easy Rider, no, you're thinking more like Nugget, I mean, Hustler Nugget. No, Easy Rider. Nugget. It was the gals and the bikes.

Easy Rider. Nugget is where you see an old woman just sitting on a toilet. I know, but Easy Rider was definitely pornographic. They weren't dressed like Secretary of State. They were just pornographic. How many issues of Easy Rider have you read, Ben? Because I've read two. Wow.

He just pulled your pornography card. I don't know. He just went up to and checked you. I don't know. I love to see the showdown of old vintage pornography and two men who it makes hard. I actually have started quite the nice little penthouse collection that I started at. What's the place in Pittsburgh? Edie's?

Edie's, yeah. It's a great time to admit that. Yeah. It's perfect time. So if you are here, send your vintage pornography to PO Box 470 North Hollywood, California 9160. Great. Unused pornography.

Thank you. I will only take it in meant or near meant collection. You won't know. You know how he does this. He's not going to know. You know how he knows? Yeah. I looked every page.

This one's particularly gross. Give it the old sniff test. Sniff. Open up that poly bag. Give it a sniff. Give it a portion. I don't want it. No one wants a portion.

A new singer knows he's wrong for me to be one of sex with my wife and they say, well, it's fine for you to be one of sex with your wife, but now you're banned from the Tesco. Okay. The 70s penthouses are fantastic. But me? Just not the hill to die on, Marcus. It's not a hill to die on. I have a fucking penthouse that's got an interview with John Hinckley.

It's amazing. It's a hill to masturbate on. Meanwhile, Detective Savage had a hunch that there was far more going on at 25 Cromwell Street outside of the rape of one girl. So starting with Anna Marie, Savage began interviewing everyone who had any sort of contact with Fred and Rose West. Now, of course, Anna Marie talked about everything that was done to her, but she also mentioned her half sister Charmaine and her mother, Rena, both of whom had been missing for decades.

This is 1992. They've been missing since the late 60s. Wow. Anna Marie's boyfriend added that Heather would probably know more than anyone, but no one had seen Heather in five years. But meanwhile, every other police officer is like, everybody runs away. It seems like it. Everybody just run.

You'll be surprised how many 15 year old girls are absolute experts at hiding their personality and then fading away as ghosts in the mist. No trace. No, indeed. There's a lot of parallel between this story and the Dean Cole story. It's very, very similar. Yeah. There's the party house angle.

There's, you know, the fact that kids are kids are very transient in these days. So it's like, ah, they'll turn up eventually, not putting in any effort. And then boom, all of a sudden, 35 kids are missing. And actually, Kissel, there is quite a bit of candy because I was reading through it. They Fred West did have a notorious sweet tooth and that was like how they ate. They would eat like children. They would eat like candy and whatever was garbage, but yeah, he loved his candy. Oh, Lucky Charms for dinner.

And so Savage looked into a possible paper trail for Heather West and noticed that there had been no income or tax records since she, quote unquote, left home and no records of state or health benefits, all of which was nearly impossible if she was still alive. Now, Rose's story was that she gave Heather 600 pounds to leave home because she didn't want her daughter's quote unquote lesbian ways influencing her other children. But without hard evidence, Rose was only charged with child abuse. She was granted bail while Fred, who was also charged with child abuse, he remained in prison. Rose subsequently attempted suicide by pill overdose.

But after Steven saved her, she got a job as a janitor, continued doing sex work and filled her days watching Snow White, Looney Tunes or the Robin Williams movie Hook over and over again. Now that's a good plug for Hook. Well, again, as an artist, you just never know who's watching your work. I could also imagine how the Lost Boys, like that's kind of, kind of be fun. Yeah. All you do is kill little, you kill children, right?

I mean, you're not supposed to empathize with Hook. I mean, I actually feel, I feel he's a complex man. He's not that complex. Little girls in Hook, though, is all Lost Boys. Yeah. No, there was a, well, there was one little girl, but she was only in the beginning in the end. And then Julia Roberts.

But how those boys make more boys? It's a mystery. No. They reproduce asexually through potting. Is that real? Yeah. Wow. You just don't know, do we?

I guess Lost Boys lay eggs. Yeah, they might. Or is it all just a collection of boys from other timelines? I think they're all dead. I think they molt, and then when they shed their skin, that becomes a new Lost Boy. So there's no way that they're actually alive. Side Story's LPOTLGmail.com. Do the Lost Boys have a reproductive system?

And I want to know, and I don't want to hear any of your filthy pornography. I want to hear from scientists. Well, absolutely. But I think they're all already corpses, and that's why they can imagine food and it appears. You think that's a superpower corpses have? Well, he's just saying that they're in heaven, and they were up in the middle of the noise and they're now in limbo. Yes.

Absolutely. Now, the Gloucester police were content with simply charging Fred and Rose West with child abuse despite the many disappearances surrounding them, and indeed, the witness in the child abuse case dropped out at the last second once again, meaning both Fred and Rose were allowed to go home. But both social services and Detective Savage knew that there was far more to discover at 25 Cromwell, especially when the West children told them about Fred's frequent threats about the patio.

This is true. Yeah. This is completely true. What, how it began, how the whole thing sort of fallen apart was that the kids were playing on the street and one of them, I guess truly understanding that maybe if all the other brothers and sisters are missing and more continue to go missing and mom and dad are obviously a bit chaotic, to say the least, that maybe this attention might turn to them. At one point, they saw Bobby on the street and they went up to him and said, hey, what

if our sister hasn't been around for a long time and our parents keep saying they buried her in the backyard? Oh, that's not true. This is completely real. Yeah. And their cops were like, well, let's all just walk a bit of a concern, then. That is a bit of a concern. That fed in to, and so they were already, now they're, but it took literally finally

one of the children being like, we think we might be next. And they still were like, well, you run home now, I'm just going to go and you're like, how? Right. Yeah. I got to go home. You would think the detectives would want to solve this case. It would be.

Now we're starting to get some heat. Come on. Well, it's starting to get heat, but that's the thing is that it's still a risk and it still costs money because one, it's on the word of a child, you know, and you never know. And so just before detective Savage retired, she put everything she had into pushing a full search warrant to dig up the grounds at 25 Cromwell, much to the resistance of the Gloucester police. Geez.

See, they were mostly concerned about the cost of digging up the patio because if they were wrong, they'd have to compensate the West. They have to replace it. We got to replace that patio. That's 50 to 75 pounds and a couple of cans of beans. Yeah. Yeah, they bring in, that's a whole month's of work, right? Or we could solve this like dub with eight murders.

We could, it was like, you know, but whatever. It would be so expensive though, if it was like also linoleum, that's going for these days. And Fred and Rose West, they believed they'd once again skirted justice, even though their five youngest children were thankfully taken far away from the West home permanently after their arrest. As a result, Fred and Rose disgustingly tried starting another family after reversing Rose's tube time procedure that Rose got after the birth of Luciana 10 years before in 1983.

But in early 1994, one of the West children got much more talkative about what happened at 25 Cromwell, and that gave Detective Savage that last little bit of leverage she needed to dig up the patio. Indeed, even the Gloucester police admit that this would have never happened had it not been for Detective Savage's persistence. Damn. You take her out of the picture, never would have gotten caught. Just there.

Wow. Just there until, I mean, you know. Oh my God. Well, yeah, I mean. I mean, until someone, until a young girl ran screaming out of their home, they would not have been caught. With shackles on and a picture of her next to Fred West with a newspaper in the background that says, this was the day that it did it in the headline says, Fred West is guilty

of rape. That's when you get it. Now when police took custody of Fred West while they dug up the patio, they told him that they were investigating the disappearance of his daughter Heather, to which Fred replied, entirely unprompted, that he definitely didn't murder her. I definitely didn't murder her. We heard that you would bring that up. No, you brought it up.

No, you brought it up. You brought up how many murders I've done. I've done 12 of them, but I haven't done it at the same time. Okay. Fantastic. I just thought about it a lot and have planned and have done it. Great. So you murdered 12 people.

You said it, but false allegations. Well, Rose, meanwhile, got aggressive in the box, shouting and swearing, taking the who gives a shit approach by saying that hundreds of thousands of kids go flip and miss an EV every year. So why should they hassle her about Heather? Yep. But even before Heather's body was found, Fred decided that there was no use in prolonging the inevitable.

At five PM on the second day of digging, Fred told police that they were digging in the wrong place. So beginning a long confession in which he took responsibility for everything in an attempt to save Rose. It's a really interesting documentary I watched called the Unseen Fred West Confessions. That was like, it was only in the BBC and I found it. And it's very, very interesting to watch him escalate because it begins with just being like, that's where you get the, the, I didn't understand.

I was, I was mad with Heather and you'd be surprised how fast you can strangle someone. Like you can be surprised. And it's like, he did that like by talking about how strong his hands are. Yeah. He's just trying to not blame himself. Yeah. Of course. And then slowly, but surely we'd get more and more.

After the confession began, Fred chose an attorney named Howard Ogden, who usually represented thieves and drunks, a sort of Saul Goodman type, who advertised on the radio with this catchphrase. If you've been nicked, call Augie. Oh, all right, fantastic. Augie, Augie, Augie, Augie, Augie. But he also was the dude that Fred West, because he's all telling me, all of them believe it was hanging and Fred did it.

Oh, because if Fred called me, he'd say, I don't know why you did it. But what do you know? He did quite a bit. Yeah. At the same time, Rose and her Q&A with an hilariously named officer called Terry Onions. Yes, indeed. She did her level best to pretend like she didn't even know Heather was dead. She claimed that she didn't even know Fred was a murderer, again, nonchalantly commenting

on the state of affairs by saying she felt, quote, like a bit of a cunt for not knowing what was happening in her own house. Yeah, I go, I say that too. Don't we all sometimes, yeah. While Fred was confessing and Rose was denying, police found Heather's remains in a slurry of, quote, glutinous black matter, decomposed flesh and organs mixed with dirt. They'd also found someone else's thigh bone. And after that, Fred gave away the locations of everybody entombed in the garden at 25

Cromwell. And this is where police senses of humor and British sense of humor meet, because the way it was discovered is that they went in there like, so what we've got, what we got then is it's been like, well, you got two bodies unless one of them's got three legs. Well, now that's a practical joke there. What a good piece of humor they're in, Officer Fred Willard. And he laughed and laughed and laughed. Yes, indeed.

Eventually, Fred also said that Rose was an accomplice, particularly in the kidnapping of Carolyn Owens and the murder of Shirley Robinson, the pregnant woman. And with that, Fred and Rose West were both charged fucking finally. Damn. After that, people started telling the newspapers, as is par for the course, that they always knew there was something fishy about 25 Cromwell. Oh, they're full of shit. No, they didn't.

What about this? They always said fishy about the old 25 Cromwell, they always knew. Maybe he could have said something a little earlier, but. But day night after his talk. Yeah. Yeah. In the late nights, there's always all these screaming, all the time, there's a plague of flies coming up for him to sell.

I always knew there was something fishy about the old 25 Cromwell. I've been going out for 20 years, so. Fred, meanwhile, couldn't even remember how many bodies were buried there, guessing around nine, which I think does indeed tell you that he killed far more than what were buried in the cellar in the garden. We kept being like doing the thing him and it's like, there might be one here. There might, there might be, there might be, and it's like a real vague and he, he'd wait to see what they found and then he'd be like, yeah, all right, yeah, it might be

some more, much more. And then he waits to see what they found, like there might be some over here. Fred also refused to explain why bones were missing from every single body and he claimed that he only cut off the heads to make sure they were dead. As far as Rose went, she flipped on Fred as fast as she could in an attempt to save herself. Yeah. What? She's not really trustworthy.

I can't believe. Yeah. She fucking, she said he knew when he sat because he was so excited to see her. He'd been separated and the whole time he's just been like, what's so silly about Rose? We gonna get together? We gonna have it? We gonna be, are you knowing in front? That's gonna happen.

And then we showed up. She turned away from it. Yeah. It was at the, at the hearing. That was the last time they, the first time I saw each other after the trial and the last time they ever saw each other. But in between accusations, Rose spent her days in a police safe house wearing only a dressing gown while she watched cartoons or played her own version of Scrabble in which

you could only play words that involved sex in some way. Yeah. It's like Arkham. Yeah. Jesus. And she would do the same rocking back and forth, the same self soothing like mechanism that you do her whole life. And I did see some studies that say that it was also, it can be connected to developmental

disabilities like having like that sort of rocking. But I think that she was, she was perfectly normal. I don't think so. Now after both Fred and Rose West were charged with nine murders, in addition to the two Fred had committed on his own, Fred spent his days in prison as a somewhat bipolar prisoner alternating between crying Jags and greeting the guards with a cheerful al-Augabna. Yes. And he wrote his little journal like, so that was his thing that he started going into the

detail. Well, no details, the absolute opposite. But what he viewed as an explanation, which was that he was a romantic that no one could understand and his whole life, he was just searching for that perfect love. He also breaks down why he thought it was okay for his father-in-law to have sex with both of his daughters. Because he says. And his wife.

And his wife. Yeah. Okay. So who was his daughter? So one night Bill asked me to take Glenny's home with his van. So on the way I said to her, hey, do you have sex with other men? And she said, oh, yes. I said, and I said, was your dad?

Yes. Yes. Oh, yes. He pays well, right? and I said, do you know that he's having sex with Rose? And she said, yes, he gave him money to do it. So it was for money, his daughter was doing it for. Oh, that's a hell of a memoir. Yeah.

And so she was around. So Bill was there, obviously an accomplice, definitely was involved in a lot of crimes. But he also was a client of his own daughter. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. I'd speculated that Bill was involved in definitely some of the rapes, possibly some of the murders. Fred's brother was definitely involved in the rapes.

He was actually charged with raping Anna Marie over 300 times. Oh, yeah. He killed himself in prison. He hung himself in prison. And speaking of hanging yourself in prison, on New Year's Day, 1995, Fred had his choice of meal, as was tradition for British prisoners on the holiday. He had soup and pork chops, but I don't fucking British, man. Neither we shouldn't go.

I don't know. I mean, I like pork chops. Yeah, I just don't miss soup and pork chops. That's my question. Have you ever had a fantastic pork chop? I don't. I make pork chops quite often. It's one of my signature dishes at home.

At home, but not in a restaurant. That's what you would beat Bobby Flay with. Your signature dish would be the pork chop. Yeah. Yeah. Off that I cut the recipe off of inspiredtaste.com. I could beat Bobby Flay with my pork chop. All right, Bobby, I'll give you my favorite meal and see if you can best me.

It's used condoms and Sprite. Oh, wow. Unbelievable. We must be going to get Fred West today. But soup and chops was actually Fred's last meal. After slorping it down, he tore the sheets of his bed into strips, fashioned a noose, stood on a chair and kicked it out from underneath. Fittingly, the fall did not break his neck, so Fred West slowly strangled to death in

his prison cell. His body was then cremated at Canley crematorium miles away in Coventry, because it was the only one that would accept Fred's body. Wow. And Rose was the only other one. Yeah, I guess. Now Rose West lawyers weekly tried arguing that since Fred had taken all the blame for the crimes, Rose shouldn't have to stand trial.

Oh. But stand trial she did, shockingly and ill-advisedly taking the stand at her own insistence to narcissistically set the record straight. She is a pain in the fucking ass. So the defense attorneys didn't put her on the stand on purpose because she was so charming? Yeah, they didn't think she was going to rock the room. It's like, when she does her tight 10, she's walking out of here for sure. But they also, there's a great snippet of a phone call that she made where she's denying

anything that she's done. And one thing is, she does the Canadian thing. Do you remember with Robert Picton, when they had the undercover cop talking to him and the whole time he's just like, and the way he thinks to talk like a criminal is to say fuck over and over again, being like, I mean, like, oh, you know, like, thank you. She does the same thing, which you mean like, fuck Fred, oh, never. I can't believe, fuck that, oh, never. Fuck him.

Oh, you know what? And I'll have her write mine and say, fuck him. I think I disagree with Fred. I couldn't be farther from him. I could actually say that Rose probably used fuck pretty often. Yeah. She's the most articulate woman that's ever lived. But on the stand, she vastly overestimated her own charm.

She called her dead daughter, Heather, a quote unquote, awkward baby. She joked about how Fred drank vitamin supplements to keep up his strength enough to keep her constantly pregnant, and she openly made fun of every victim. This of course was followed by a highly sarcastic and very British cross examination in which every claim of innocence was easily proved to be utter bullshit. Rose West was therefore found guilty of 10 murders and two rapes, ensuring lifelong imprisonment. Apparently in prison, Rose West, who's still alive, she is addicted to watching TV documentaries about her own crimes, which there are many, there are many.

And she's been heard joking about the huge goofy glasses she wore during her trial. Reportedly, she said she wouldn't be caught dead wearing them now. Oh, can we go dead? Oh, no. Yeah. That's embarrassing for you. It is. Rose, though, still maintains her innocence and shows no remorse, and her tragically dangerous

horniness did not abate with imprisonment. According to reports, soon after her conviction, she started a prison affair with Myra Hindley. Yeah, man. She was half of the Moore's murderers who killed six children in the mid 60s. So what do you guys talk about? I don't know, but they said that they would sit every day for breakfast. They would meet because Myra Hindley was famously very scary in jail, one of the only other women.

I think she is the only other woman to get a life sentence in British crime history, I believe. And she was a chain smoker and everyone would tell that they have all these prisoners talking about what was like being in jail with her. And she was like, Myra Hindley was very scary, but that when Rose West showed up, they were like, she's just this like dumpy, like grandma, they didn't understand, but they immediately started slapping clams and Rose West, her move, her move in the shower was she'd just sit there.

She would always shout. She'd shower three or four times a day, and she'd never put on any clothes. And her big thing was to put on a big display of dry in her back, waiting for somebody to come and give it a lick. Okay. That's basically disgusting. Well from what Hindley's former lawyer said, Rose West upon coming into prison, she was impressed by Hindley's quote unquote, thirst for knowledge.

And prison guards like to refer to them as the gruesome twosome. Wow. That's awesome. They got a cute nickname. Oh, wow. It's almost like there's no justice in the world. This relationship, however, ended soon after it began, because West said that Hindley could be very manipulative.

Other reports say that the relationship ended over a fight over which one was more famous, because Rose's star was starting to overtake Myra's as the most notorious female serial killer in England's history. Wow. Man, oh man. That is a disgusting story. Yeah. I'm glad that we are at the end of it.

Yeah, absolutely. I'm prepared for the UK now. That's for certain. I can't wait. I'm going to be a little bit more aware of my surroundings. Yeah, because you're definitely going to, they're looking for you. I know. I've got to get some beans.

You'll get some of those beans, Marcus. I've heard, this is going to be my first example of this, I've heard this Liz Truss is a bit cheeky as well. I don't know what that is. That's the new prime minister. Yeah. Oh, okay. So we're going to have to learn these things now.

I don't want to learn any more about them. We're going to go over the area, we're going to learn different knowledge, different things that will help us talk. And we're going to say stuff like Liz Truss, more like Biz Nuss. I don't know. I feel like in some way we're going to have to figure out something to do with her name. Yeah. They'll get rid of her.

They get rid of people real quick over there. Yeah. And please, I know it's very sweet, but don't bring me cans of Heinz baked beans to the show. I can't carry them with me. They're too heavy. It sounds like he's asking for it. It does sound like he's asking for it.

They're too heavy, I'm still asking for it. I'm still asking for it. I'm still asking for it from Long COVID. I can't carry things. Yes! Okay. Well interesting. So don't bring beans to the show.

Unless they are in bags. Bag beans. Well, it's the can that really is. That's what I'm saying. That is a lot of the ways. A ziplock of loose beans. Sure. That Marcus will gladly take that.

Yeah, absolutely. And also it's going to be difficult for it with, with truly traveling with pallets of Irmbro. Yes. But now I need to actually settle- It's iron brew. I don't know why you insist on calling it ear and brew. It's iron brew. You know it's iron brew. You know that I don't I don't know I've gotten several emails immediately that have like they've already said that apparently there's a new formula to iron brew and it is

Disatisfaction, it's not as good saying that for years now. It's not quite as good. They did change the formula They put less sugar in it now. They've been saying it for years. I know it's not as good as the first because to make it healthier Are you American? Are you even American? What do you mean am I American? I didn't fucking go to Scotland and tell them to change the goddamn iron brew recipe Apparently if you want the original iron brew taste you can drink the iron brew energy drink That tastes like original iron brew. Oh, that's nice. That gives you a little pep in your step there That'll be fun to dance to all the fiddle music and have a good time with. Oh, all right everyone Well, thank you so much for listening and again

Couples, huh? All right, we'll really really good way to wrap up on next week We've got a we're got a bit of it a UFO tale and then Begins the true Spooky time because we're gonna be there. We're gonna be in the UK. We're gonna be following some spooky fucking bullshit over there I'm excited like and we uh, you know, honestly if you got a good scary story We've got a good scary place for us to visit. Yeah, I would love to go see some haunted homes and not just your home Okay, like something. It's like where can we go?

I know they got the the the the Tower of London You just said don't go to these kinds of places and then you're requesting people to tell you to go to those places I'm just gonna get murdered not us Why not? Yeah, once we're there. We're gonna be doing like a special. What is it UK Marcus side stories edition? Yeah, we're doing it. Yeah, so you got anything if you get anything like a cool like fucking Story from like paranormal British history. That's not as well-known. We already know Borley Rackery. We know all about Absolutely, but if you got something that's a little lesser known send it on to us might talk about it on the show

No crimes have ever taken place in England All right, everyone. Well, thank you all Inequivably not true. We just covered. I know no, it's fully haunted. It's a scary place. All right, everyone Thank you so much for listening. Hail yourselves. How's that again? Magustalations everybody check the floorboards. Yeah, I'm gonna put it out there if you're moving in a new place Oh my god, check the floorboard. What a nightmare. Do you get like a refund? No, you don't know. I'd be real mad if I bought a house that had a bunch of corpses in it As a matter of fact, the government shows up rips up all of your property and then they just leaves

Unfair It's true though We were joking about that, but then our contractor we were like if you see a skeleton in there Tell us it's great for our brand and he's just like just so you know if I do see a skeleton in here We're gonna have to call the police It's just like whatever man This show is made possible by listeners like you thanks to our ad sponsors You can support our shows by supporting them for more shows like the one you just listened to go to last podcast network.com