Last Podcast On The Left - Last Update on the Left - Episode 16 - Biggie & Tupac: An Interview with Greg Kading

Episode Date: September 1, 2026

In light of today’s historic guilty verdict in the murder of Tupac Shakur, we’re revisiting our conversation with former LAPD detective Greg Kading, who led the task force investigation into the murders of Tupac and The Notorious B.I.G. and later wrote *Murder Rap*. Recorded in 2024, before Duane “Keffe D” Davis was found guilty, Kading takes us inside the rivalry and retaliation that led to both killings, the evidence investigators uncovered, and the forces that kept two of the most infamous murders in music history unsolved for nearly three decades. For Live Shows, Merch, and More Visit: www.LastPodcastOnTheLeft.comKevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0 Licensehttp://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/Subscribe to SiriusXM Podcasts+ to listen to new episodes of Last Podcast on the Left ad-free, plus get Friday episodes a whole week early. Start a free trial now on Apple Podcasts or by visiting siriusxm.com/podcastsplus. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

That's when the cannibalism started. Last update on the left. Welcome to last update on the left. Ladies and gentlemen, my name is Marcus Parks. I'm here with Henry Zabrowski. Yes, you are, Frank. And Ed Larson. How you doing?

And our guest today, we're doing an update on the series that we did on the murders of Biggie Smalls and Tupac Choucure. We have the author, one of the sources we used, we have Greg Kating, author of murder rap. How you doing today, sir? Hey, guys. What's happening? Don't worry, man. We're just trying to shift books, dude. We're going to shift them around, man. But thank you for updating us, because things have changed. Yeah, a lot has changed. So, like, so your book was first published in 2011? Right.

So what, I mean, what has changed since 2011? How has the, specifically, I know, like, the Tupac case in particular has kind of exploded since then. Yeah, because of their recent indictment and arrest and current prosecution of one of the assailants in that murder, things, the dynamics have changed. It's no longer an unsolved case, which it had been for, you know, decades. So 2011, I write the book. Years later, it's a documentary. A few years after that, it's a limited series.

And then, you know, so I'm telling my story, people that, uh, um, are familiar with it. You know, we've, but it's, it's been like an evolution, just a journey, but it's so great to at least in one of the two murders, seeing some, you know, some closure. Well, I mean, so when Keefe D was a, like, could you kind of give the, our listeners, like a background, like who Kifi D was and, like, how he, you know, what role he played in Tupac's murder? Sure. So the night that Tupac was shot, he'd gotten.

into a fight. He actually went over and kind of sucker punched a guy that was in the hotel lobby, the casino lobby in Las Vegas. He, Tupac had ran over and sucker punched a guy named Orlando Anderson, who was a gang member from Compton, California. And later that night, that individual, along with three of his gang associates, including his uncle, a guy named Dwayne Davis, aka Keefe D. They all go to retaliate. They track Tupac down. They run into them just off the strip in Las Vegas.

And the individual with a firearm and shoots Tupac who dies six days later. So that's kind of who Keefe D was. He was the one who secured the gun. He gave the gun to his nephew who was in the back seat. Kifi D was in the front passenger. your seat and he's the last man standing. He went on to brag about his role in the murder and his confessions are what actually landed him in trouble.

Why did it take so long? Because he's been bragging openly about being involved in this for a long time. Is it simply because, well, no real guilty person would just tell the world multiple times that they've done something terrible or is it just how do you put, is it about putting together the evidence? It was a perfect storm of stupidity on his part. So he confesses to us back in 2009, but it's done under what's known as a proffer agreement. It's an agreement between him, his attorney, and the government at the time.

Oh, the queen for a day. The queen for a day. It's another term for it. And so he sits down with us, confesses to his role in the murder, and then for whatever reason believes that that agreement extends into the public. So when you're having this conversation with law enforcement, you know, we're not, we honor our agreement. We're not going to use your own self-incriminating statements.

However, when you go out and brag to the world about it, you're no longer under the conditions of that agreement. He either didn't misunderstand it or disregarded it and wanted to go out and see what kind of, you know, attention he could get for himself. Now, I've got a question about the car in particular. So if I remember correctly, Kee-D was in the front seat and he handed the gun that they got from Zip, the drug dealer in New York. But who was the one who actually fired it? Was it D'Andre or was it Orlando?

According to Kifidi, DeAndre was in the best position to fire because he was in the past, he was in the rear seat of the Cadillac closest to Tupac. So he is right behind his own driver. And so, of course, Tupac is adjacent in the vehicle in the passenger seat. So D'Andre is in the best position. But Kifidi says when he went to hand it to D'Andre, D'Andre was like, man, no, thank you. Don't put this on me. Well, Orlando, who is the gangster in the backseat who had even sucker punched, it's really his job. He's the one who had been confronted and slugged by Tupac.

Orlando takes the gun, leans over D'Andre out the window, and begins shooting into the vehicle striking Tupac. Now, do you think Orlando's confidence was, like, really escalated because he was wearing a Dammerino jersey? This is coming from a dolphin fan. He's a dolphin fan. Sorry, I couldn't. He couldn't help him, though. So they were planning on assassinating him that night no matter what, correct? Weren't they looking to do it at the after party at the 6-662 club?

Yeah, everybody knew that Tupac and Shug and the rest of their entourage were all going over to the Club 662, which Tupac was going to perform. Mike Tyson was going to make an appearance. So it was well broadcast that that's where they would be. However, when Keefe D, Orlando, and the rest of them got over there, they realized like this is not the, this isn't the right place to try to handle this. There's cops in the parking lot. There's other gang members. So they realized that that just wasn't going to be a practical place to try to retaliate. Just by fate, when they leave, they go down the road.

And that's where they encounter Shuggen Tupac driving towards the club and take advantage of that opportunity. Well, I mean, if we go back to, you know, them being in Las Vegas for this purpose, like, one of the questions that we had during our series that, you know, we never really got, and we never really settled on a satisfying answer was as far as, like, P. Diddy's role in this. Oh, yeah. We could never quite land on whether P. Diddy, like, suggested, like, hey, it would be nice if somebody took. care of Tupac or if P. Diddy actually said, like, I will pay you money if you kill this man for me. Or if you kill

him and Shug Night for me. So, yeah, kind of the seem just like a fun suggestion from P. Diddy from one angle, but in the other thing, or wasn't an organized hit. Yeah, what do you think? I think it lies in that middle ground. I think that

Puffy was really afraid that, you know, he had a target on his back. He knew when he came to L.A. that, you know, he was a dead man walking. He really understood the seriousness of what was going on. And it was out of that sense of fear and desperation that he makes these solicitation. He was like, hey, man, somebody's got to help me out. You need to take care of these guys. I need, you know, I need protection. Can you handle this? Well, he's talking to these guys that are from South Central Los Angeles from Compton that don't think twice about shooting somebody.

Yeah. And so I think it was the fear and desperation in this kind of exaggerated conversation from Puffy. Problem is he's talking about to guys that have no problem doing this in real life. So I think it's a combination. Yeah, if he did it at a local improv troupe, they would have just done a scene about it. But because he told it to guys that kill people, they were like, oh, we do this. Well, that was another one of the, I guess, central themes of our series, like, with a lot of these guys is like, be careful what you pretend to be. And it seemed like a lot of these guys were pretending and did not realize that they had stepped into a very real world.

Yeah, so Tupac not being from, you know, the world of gangs had ingratiated himself with these gang members that were affiliated with death row records. And he had a sense of brotherhood. You know, he had a sense of belonging. with these guys who had his back. And so when an opportunity came for him to prove to them that, you know, he equally had their back is when he stepped into a hornet's nest and took on a fight that he couldn't finish.

And so that's really where he got himself into trouble was trying to be something that he wasn't. At what point do these guys, somebody like P. Diddy, become a musician and go from a musician to a human trafficker? I you know that was never part of our purview we never saw that it that was all very well hidden and now that it's coming to the surface and being exposed like we never none of that was being brought to our attention during that period of time wow I don't know what was happening back in New York with investigators that were perhaps investigating bad boy records as a racketeering organization back in the 90s I don't know what they knew But for our purposes, we never had any information about him being, you know, this, who we are beginning to see him as today. Yes, it's really strange. It's like, it's kind of crazy because all these guys, it was just kind of beat.

It was more like a straight up beef, like really guys fighting with each other. But it turns out that some of these guys are really running cryptic criminal enterprises underneath, which is already very challenging. Being a professional musician, it's very difficult. I feel like adding all of this other stuff is so much harder. So you're LAPD, correct? It was. I'm retired. You were LAPD.

So, like, so this murder occurred in Las Vegas. So how did you get involved with this? And how did how was your experience working with Las Vegas PD? Because I had, I had heard rumors that. the Las Vegas PD kind of drug drug their feet quite a bit on the investigation. So I'm a Johnny come lately. I don't get involved in this thing until almost 10 years after the fact. I come along in 2006 working on the cold case murder of Biggie Smalls,

which was a Los Angeles case. And so in the pursuit of trying to solve Biggie's murder is when we stumble upon Keefe D. And we have reason to believe he potentially had information on Biggie's murder. But when we confront him on that, he's like, I can't help you with that. That wasn't us. But what I can't tell you about is the Tupac murder because that was us. And so that's how it opened the door to Tupac's murder, even though it happened in Las Vegas. It's incredible.

So where are we at now with the Biggie Smalls investigation? So now we, because still technically it's unsolved, right? Technically it's unsolved. We have a similar type of thing in the Biggie case as we had in the Tupac case in that we have a confessing co-conspirator who was one of Shug Nights baby's mamas. And she confessed her role in that murder. In implicated both Shug Knight and the shooter, which was a gang member that was associated with Shug named Wardell Fowell.

So a female confessed to her role in that murder. It's a bona fide confession. It's one that we believe to be true. However, the shooter Fausen was killed in 2002. And of course, Shug Knight is, you know, in prison for an unrelated murder. And he's blind. So it's so hard for him to kind of discern what's going on anywhere around him. He must be so confused at all times.

Yeah, I don't think he can see the consequences of his actions. The bad pun. Have you met Shug Night? Have you done any, have you interviewed him or talked with him at all about this? No, I'd never had any face time with Shug. I spent a lot of time surveilling him, following him around and, you know, watching his activities. And then, of course, listened to him on phone calls. and requested an interview with him, but it was declined.

He didn't want to be interviewed. So I've never had the face. But I already know what it would be like. He would just him being smug and having smart-ass answers. You're never going to get the truth from Shugnight. Yeah. No. Have you listened to his podcast?

I've listened to a few episodes. What did you think of it? That's my point. There's a podcast from prison? Yeah. Shugnight is a prison podcast? It's called Colette Call. that's a great name it's expensive to produce

but yeah was it so it's just basically it sounds like him just giving smart ass answers it's just him being being shug you know he just comes out and blames everybody else for his problems and you know throws his uh his opponents under the bus it's it's actually a brilliant idea whoever came up with that concept and got shug to agree to do

all these phone calls pretty smart. But it's entertaining, but there's no value of truth in it. Sure. Yeah, because even just looking at this, it's just him being like, the one name of an episode of Collect Call with Shug Night is like, I salute the women. And you're like, I don't know if Shug is.

You know, I met Shug Knight one time at the comedy store, and he didn't want to talk about this at all. No, but, you haven't know. He almost ran him and Kat Williams tried to run. run us off the road afterwards. It was very they were having a great time. That sounds terrifying. Yeah, especially because he ended up killing somebody with his car. Yep.

But so when it comes to the the Biggie murder, is it, do we think it was Crips or Bloods or do you think it was outside? Because it could have just been everyone from L.A. did both of these murders.

Yeah, well, it was people from L.A. except it, you know, the Crips had killed Tupac and the blood. And the blood had killed Biggie. So it all came down to gang activity, gang rivalry. So you got to think about this conflict at three different levels. You had Puffy and Shug were at odds, right? Biggie and Tupac were at odds. Bad Boy and Death Row were at odds. And then, of course, they were associating with gangs that were historically enemies. And so there was four different levels of conflict It had gone back for years all the way back to 1994, you know.

And so it all just culminated in Tupac getting shot and Biggie getting shot. But it was all just gangsters doing what gangsters do. And after Biggie was shot, like, you know, to the point of it, you know, just to ask, was there an escalation like, you know, like smaller skirmishes that, you know, the public just kind of didn't know about? or was Biggie like sort of the high watermark of that particular feud? No, the high watermark of the feud was actually Tupac. Because after Tupac gets shot in Las Vegas, then back in Compton, a 10-day war started between the blood associates of Shug Night and the Crip associates of Puffy Combs.

So the war started that lasted 10 days and claimed several bodies. So that happened after Tupac. And then it just continued to go. But once Tupac died and Shug went to jail, everything kind of seemed to mellow out and calm down. And that's why I think that when Puffy Combs and Biggie come to Los Angeles, they figure that the coast is clear. Yeah.

And it's all put behind them. And they had a full sense of security. and they walked right into a death trap. Do you think these days, we've ever talked to these guys in more recent years? Like, do they ever regret these lifestyles that led them to this, like this idea? Because we did, when we did our series,

I'm still always haunted the idea of you're pretending to be this thing. And then it all becomes very real around you. And yes, they're a mixture of real criminals, but also a lot of these guys are just artists mixed in with criminals that don't know that they're kind of getting themselves in deep trouble. But like do you think that after the fact

like did anyone learn anything from their murders? It's a really great question and you have to like look there are guys for instance one of the main the heads of the mob Hyru gang

which was the gang that was affiliated with death row records Shug Knight's kind of gang entourage. The head of them was a guy named Mob James. And he's completely, you know, evolved beyond the gangs and has remorse and is trying to help youths at risk who wanted to go into gangs. So there are some guys that have transitioned out of that lifestyle and are trying to do good things. But meanwhile, there's a lot of guys like Keefe D who says, you know, I'm a Southside Crip for Life.

Yeah. And still continues to, you know, act like a 15-year-old when he's 60. How did you feel when... Forgive my cough. I've got some allergies. Oh, you're fine. No worries. So how did you feel when Kee-Fedee-D was arrested and he had a copy of your book? Yeah.

Well, it's interesting because that's going to be his whole self-defense is that, well, other people were benefiting financially from the story. That's why I'm telling my story. So that's going to be his defense. I don't think it's going to hold water. I think that he's going to end up getting convicted. And this whole thing will be put behind us. Well, yeah. I mean, he wrote a memoir in which he fully and completely confessed to being a part of the murder.

He just kind of thought that I think what you're saying is right is that he did not understand that it does not mean that you are legal to say it wherever you want. Yes. And I don't think his age is literally. whoever ghost wrote that for him, I don't think they wanted him to know. Because how are you going to sell books? Exactly. You're going to sell books recanting the confession? No, you're going to sell a deal, spilling the beans.

What do we know, Orlando Anderson, who we think was the shooter in the Tupac murder, what do we know? Because he was killed shortly afterwards. What do we know about that? Well, we know Orlando was suspected of committing at least one other murder. prior to shooting Tupac. And so in 1998, which would have been two years after Tupac's murder, Orlando Anderson and a guy named Michael Dereau

ran into some guys and were attempting to collect a drug debt. And they got into a shooting in a situation where Orlando ends up getting shot and killed. And Michael Doreau, of the four people that were involved that conflict, three of them died. Michael Drow, who was the last man standing, ends up getting charged and convicted of all three murders under what's known as the California felony murder rule. So if you participate in a crime and people get killed, even though that

was not the intention, you know, like if you go to do a robbery and one of your robbery partner shoots the clerk, you're going to catch a murder case, even though you never went into, you know, into it with that intent. So that's how Orlando dies. He dies in an attempt to collect a drug debt, and then his partner in that ended up getting three life sentences. My God. So when it comes to the Biggie Smalls murder, like, when it,

as far as like cold cases go of that sort, like how often is it the case where you know who did it? And you absolutely know who, but you just don't have the proof. Does that kind of come up a lot in these sorts of cases? It happens all the time. In fact, most gang cases are like that. In Los Angeles, we only solve about 50 to 60% of our murders.

But we probably know who did it 90% of the time. Yeah. So it is definitely a case of it's not what you know. It's what you can prove. Sure. And that's a tall order sometimes to be able to hold somebody accountable beyond a reasonable without. Do you ever just want to get back in? You're never in case that shows up in me like, I tried to get out, but they brought me back.

Like, are you going to be living in the houseboat coming back? That's not me, man. That is most certainly not me. The day I left was the day I never looked back. Yeah, my dad was a copy. He said the same. I think I don't want responsibility ever again. Why do you think this might just be my own personal judgment and if I'm wrong, please tell me. But why does it seem like LAPD isn't really concerned with solving Biggie's murder?

That's a fair question. And I don't think that, you know, this is a massive agency with hundreds and hundreds of unsolved murders. and I don't think that they're, maybe there's a sense of indifference because it's just another murder victim to an agency like that. And they had already spent, you know, hundreds of thousands, if not millions of dollars, not only trying to solve it, but defending themselves against the false accusations of their involvement. And so, you know, it's, it was an exhausted, it was an exhausted case. Investigators did just about everything they could. And even though internally, everybody perceives the case as being solved, the district attorney won't file charges, which

allows us to officially solve it because of the complexity. If you've got a baby mama who is not going to testify, who's got perjury issues in her past, and she's the only person that can point the finger at Shug, who's alive. So it's an impossible case to try to prosecute. And without the DA, it'll never be a closed case. But we don't. But we know who did it. It's wild.

Yeah. That's not better known. Well, do you think it's because also not like all the main players are dead? So the guys are dead. Like you got a couple of people that are left that are like that are involved. But maybe it's like, well, if the guy you pulled the triggers are already dead, then what do we even? care even though you're really trying to create closure for the family. That's kind of like one aspect of it, right?

And then, or is it also, it probably looks good to clear it. Yeah. And I agree with you. I think they ought to. I think that they ought to, you know, just say, hey, we know what we know, based on what we know, let's clear the case for history purposes. Yes. Get it off the books.

Get it off the books. And I agree with you 100%. This was a very closed. in the sense that there's only three people, the shooter, the intermediary, which is the girl, and Shug. The shooter's dead. The girl has limited immunity, and Shug is already in jail for murder. So what do you really do with that? You're not going to go make a deal with Shug like, hey, we'll give you some consideration on the murder case that you're convicted of if you'll tell us about another murder that you did. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Exactly. Very difficult.

How do we prepare ourselves for the upcoming war of Taylor Swift versus the rest of us? How do we stop this? How do we stop it now before she becomes the emperor she believes she is? Oh my gosh. I just came from Kansas. And I was staying with some friends in Kansas City. And we were talking about Taylor and her notoriety in Kansas City now. And I guess her and Travis had just bought this property behind a big Catholic church down the road from where I

staying and if you get in the right position, evidently you know, a bunch of looky-lose and other people are trying to figure out because they just bought in a house there together, evidently. I don't know if I should even be saying this.

Who doesn't matter? It's Kansas City. Who gives a shit? You know, I feel like that's where they live. They have 20 houses, I'm sure. Yeah. She lives in a floating, she lives in space. It's like, she could live anywhere. She bought Elsa's Ice Castle.

She could come to me in my house. She could just buy my house for me and live in my house if she wanted to. Against my will. She's already cloned herself and like frozen herself for the future. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. She's going to be performing on Jupiter. Now, as someone who worked so tightly in this case, this is going to seem silly as a question to ask,

but I have to ask because I'm curious, if you would think, is there any chance of a beef today, like with Kendrick Lamar and Drake, getting blown out of proportion like something that happened back then or has everyone learned their lesson? Most certainly they have learned their lessons.

All you have to Google is dead rappers. Oh yeah, yeah. It's a never-ending list. Yeah. You know, and it goes forever and it's consistent. There's just rappers just keep getting killed because of their affiliation

with people on the streets. Have you done any research into the Chicago, like, sub, it's like a hip hop movement that is essentially guys bragging about murders that they've done. That it's not fake. It's legitimately

they are murdering to rap about it. Wow. You should, honestly, it is a fascinating subgeneral of hip hop that is like, I'm looking up the name of it right now. That is very, very, very intense.

That is, but it's, they get really, it's like they are purposely taking the sort of pretend out of it and do it for real because they want to be able to um it's not ice cube right in poetry no it's not it's drill rap that's what it's called g r i drill drill drill so it is it is fascinating but there's a world of that that's also happening where it's like they're they've just decided to just do this in this kind of one little world of music right wow and you wonder where that's going to lead to you know is it a going to be a passing fad because all these guys are You know, going to get convicted because with their songs, they're simply confessions in real life.

I do think it eventually. Yeah. Eventually, enough will be arrested that I think it will stop the genre. Because if you arrest each one, eventually they just are rapping in jail. Yeah. Eventually. That'll be such a great court procedure to watch where the defendant is, you know, the defendant is sitting there and they're playing his song. You know, his don't stop conviction.

And you just see a couple that the jurors just going like, oh, God, damn. I mean, you say that, but I mean, isn't that what they're going to be doing with Keefe D once his case comes up in November? Yeah, as it stands, all of the evidence against him is his own statements. And it's going to be a really interesting trial to watch if it goes to trial, because I'm not familiar with anything like this other than, excuse me,

you guys remember the jinx? Yeah. Oh, yes. Right? With Robert Durst, where he, you know, has a hot mic

and he talks about, I killed them all. Yeah. And then they use that as evidence against him in his own trial. Oh, yeah.

This is so much more, like this is just so much more on the nose where KFED is writing books and doing podcasts and telling the world intentionally. that he was a murderer.

As opposed to Robert Durst, who unintentionally said it without knowing that his microphone was hot. Yeah, I mean, it's a memoir. He had to go to a ghostwriter and tell him the story, and it had to go through, like, multiple editing rounds, and, like, proofs and all that. And still, like, do you have any idea how he's going to try to spin this into a not-guilty play?

Right as it stands, his defense is that, he did it all for entertainment. That he lied to us in 2009 when he confessed. He lied to Las Vegas PD in 2009 when he did a second proffer interview with them. And that, you know, he's going to say it was all lies and that he was just doing it to make money. None of that really holds water because when he's talking to the cops on different occasions back in 2009, there's no promise of making any money. that is all perceived as being confidential information.

Yeah. Oh, yeah, and especially when they cut to the video footage of him confessing, where he's got, like, sunglasses on, and he's super happy about it. Like, he's super, super invested in the story. Nobody loves KPD like KPD. No, he really does. But I think it's good for people to see, though.

I do think that as we go along in society, there's going to be more and more of this. style of you went out of a podcast and told everybody exactly what you did. Like, I feel like that's going to happen a lot. Yeah. Yeah. It's good for the genre. It's good for podcasting. It is. Now, with all this stuff going on

with Puffy right now, do you think that any of Tupac's murder will be thrown into this trial, or they're just going to keep it all out of this? You mean Biggie's murder getting thrown into Tupac's trial? No, Tupac's murder getting

thrown into Puff Daddy's trial coming up. Oh, yeah, okay, I got you. I'm sorry. Not really. I think they'll keep everything really compartmentalized. If he has human trafficking issues, those will stay compartmentalized. Unless the feds back in New York do a very comprehensive racketeering investigation,

where they are trying to incorporate just all types of different crimes over a long history of time. but even with that, I just don't see anybody making official allegations against Diddy for Tupac's murder based only on Keefidi's

confession. Right. Yes. Wasn't there a situation where Puff Daddy allegedly offered $1 million for the murder of Shug Knight and Tupac and then apparently he paid $500,000 to the drug dealer in New York

Zip? Like is there something and then Kee-Feedee-D didn't get his cut? Is that like, that is like a rumor I heard about I don't know what the truth is to that. Also Zip's a great name for a drug dealer. Yes. Yeah. Who on his own nightclub called the Zip code? That's great.

Yeah, I know that's pretty clever. We, to your, there's two questions there and both are actually true, but they're separate. So you've got The thing with Kifi D.

Puffy offered a million dollars for the murder of Tupac and Shug Night, correct? Yes. And then he, after Tupac was killed, he gave $500,000 to Zip who was supposed to give that, who was supposed to broker the deal with Kifi D is what I'm. And so how do we, we will, you know, how do you not pin that on Puffy? Got you. Okay. So I got a little sidetracked there because way back when, back in the late 90s, there was a guy that worked for Puffy who filed a lawsuit against him. I think his name was Kirk Burroughs. He was a producer. And he had filed a lawsuit against Puffy. And in his lawsuit, he claimed that back then Puffy had solicited for $1 million to hit on Tupac Shakur.

And then that case got settled out of court for a certain amount of money. And so that was interesting for us as Johnny come lately investigators, and we're listening to Kee-Feedee-D talk about a million-dollar bounty on a hit. Somebody was already saying that 10 years before in a different civil lawsuit. So it lended some legitimacy to what Kifidi was claiming. Now, the second part of that being this thing was Zip. Zip's dead, as you know. and whether or not that money was ever paid, we've never been able to identify a paper trail.

So if Puffy had given Zip, the $500,000, because only half the job was done because they didn't kill Shug, we don't know. It's just an urban legend that could be true, but we just don't have any evidence to say it's true. Oh, man, does that mean the bounty's still out on Shug? Whoa!

Because I bet he could look for somebody Clean up some problems for him right now What if Shug killed himself to collect the bounty? Oh, yeah. This gives it to his children. Here's her inheritance. I mean, I am really interested. I feel like what we're seeing now,

like I know we keep coming back to Diddy just because this is just going to be such a big story. It's really, and it's all connected to all. all of these guys. I actually wonder how many of these other people from these stories are going to pop up in Diddy's Trial? Like when some of these same characters are going to come out?

And I wonder what that's, who's all going to end up being a part of his system or not? And who's still alive? Yeah. There's going to, I think there's going to be, there's going to be some artists that are going to be in a real precarious situation. Yep. that are going to have to come out and say, yes,

I was a victim of some type of inappropriate sexual, you know, coercion. Yes. Yeah. In order to get the kind of, you know, promotion that I needed,

I think there's going to be some artists that are like not wanting the truth to come out because it reflects so badly on all of them. Very much. Yeah. And what is you, because I think they're all underaged. Oh,

very much. Yeah. Do you think there's any weight to the rumor that Diddy had anything to do with orchestrating the murder of Biggie? No, I don't believe any of that's true at all. I think that this is straight retaliation that Shug Knight hired a guy that he knew would do it. He was extremely upset about the fact that Tupac was shot and killed. He himself almost got killed. Death Row was circling the drain at this point because they'd lost Tupac.

Shug was in jail. And so he just did what you would, you know, he just took matters into his own hand and had a gangster do what gangsters do. The idea that Puffy being involved in Big East murder is it just doesn't, it doesn't hold any water. There's nothing to support that conspiracy theory. Well, let's go back a little bit. I'm really interested in that 10-day war that you talked about after two-part. Like, what did that look like? What happened?

Well, as soon as Tupac was shot in Las Vegas, Shug Night and the rest of his blood entourage all got together. And they knew immediately who it was. They knew, hey, those were the Southside Crips. That was Keefe De and his crew. So when they get back to Los Angeles to Compton, the following day, it's on. It's the green light.

you know it's the they're all going to go to war and so for 10 days crips you know a south side crips he's a mob pyru or a looters park pyru they're going to shoot on site and vice versa so the crypts got all of their hardware all their guns um you know collected and began to go on the defensive because they know that the bloods are going to be hunting them down and so you listen to some of the Krip gang members who came forward and told their stories. They're like, man, it was a war zone. You know, we knew if we stood out on the street, a car was going to come driving by and we were going to get shot at. So we all had to kind of hunker down and, you know, congregate together so that we had, you know, the power in numbers. And it just went on and on

until finally, after 10 days, the Compton PD and about 400 other officers from other agencies just started to raid all of the houses to get all the guns and to try to quell the gun, you know, to quell the violence. And that kind of mitigated a lot of what was happening. But, you know, it was still on as far as, you know, until it never ends down there. You know, these beasts just never end. You're a blood. I'm a crip. We're going at it. Now, with the murder of Biggie Smalls, like you said that this woman was an intermediary, like what kind of of interest. What was her role

in the murder of Biggie Smalls? So she had a long history of criminal complicity with Shug. She was the mother of one of his children. She was this kind of a for lack of a better

term, kind of like a hood girl. She was a girl from the neighborhood and she loved Shug. And of course she was always competing with all the other girls in Shug's life. So she thought if she could be the one who's really down for him. She's the girl that will do anything, ride or die type of girl. And so she was complicit and, you know, helping him get an illegal gambling license in Las Vegas for the club.

She is involved in a bunch of auto fraud. She was involved in his bankruptcy fraud. She was involved in a bunch of white-collar stuff with him. And so when Shug went to jail after the beating in Las Vegas, because remember, he was involved in stomping Orlando Anderson down at the MGM. He gets his probation violated. He goes to jail for that. So when Shug's in jail, he can't really communicate with anybody without it being monitored. You know, if you have visitors, you're on the phone, but the deputies can listen to your phone calls.

They can listen to your phone calls with people outside of the jail. And so they come up with this clever plan where Shug Knight's attorney, a guy named David Kenner, signs paperwork saying, hey, all of these individuals are part of my legal team. And therefore, they fall under the privilege of attorney-client communications. You can't listen to them. So David Kenner writes letters allowing people like Shug's girlfriend to come in as a legal aid. and the deputies can't monitor. And that allows her and Shug to have a private conversation. And this is what she tells us.

This is how she's explaining how they did this. She says, I was able to go in there. We could have unmonitored visits. Shug told me he wanted Biggie shot. You know, he wanted Biggie taken care of. He said, reach out to Pucci, go find Pucci, tell him I'll give him whatever he wants. She comes back. She talks to Shug.

She says he wants this much money. Shug says, I'll make them, you know, I'll make sure you get the money. He does. He secures cash for her. She pays Pucci, and then Pucci shows up and kills Biggie. So she's the person who's communicating between Shug and the shooter. It makes me so sad that Biggie Smalls was killed by a man named Poochie. Yeah, he didn't deserve that.

He really didn't. No, it's Pucci because it's also, someone said it might have been a member of the nation of Islam, Or is that just like how Pucci dressed when he did the killing? So there's a conspiracy theory that's been completely disproven. But within that conspiracy theory, they thought that a guy named Amir Mohammed was the shooter. Because the shooter supposedly was dressed up with a, had a bow tie on. And so this led to people connecting the dots, all these circumstantial dots, in forming the conclusion that it was a nation of Islam guy that shot and killed Biggie.

Even though that's been disproven, the next thing is, well, why were people describing the shooter as having a bow tie? And our explanation of that is that gang, gangsters in Los Angeles were notorious for doing things that would mislead the police. We had gangsters in Los Angeles dressing up in the garb of this. nation of Islam and doing home invasion robberies because you get people, you know, unsuspecting, thinking, oh, this is the guy at the front door. He's a nation of Islam guy. He's selling bean pies. He's soliciting, you know, money for this cause. They open the door next thing you know, they're just gangsters. They rush him and they rob you. So it was not uncommon for people to dress up in order to mislead the police. In fact, in Los Angeles, during this period of time,

when blood gang members would do a drive-by against Crips or against any other enemies, they'd often yell out the name of like a Crip gang. You know, they'd be like, oh, Main Street Crips, Bamb, Bamb, even though they're bloods, because when the cops get there and the witnesses say, hey, they drove by and they yelled out. And so it's just this relatively clever way of deflecting. attention. That's really interesting. Yeah, it was very common too. And so, you know, when we'd get there and they'd say, yeah, some guys drove by and

the old Bloodstone villains, that's a blood gang. We're like, yeah, it means nothing to us because it's probably grips. Wow, that's interesting. Greg, thank you so much for joining us today. We really appreciate you taking the time. Yeah, thank you for letting us pick your brain. Yeah. Yeah, do you have any other projects coming up that you'd like to plug?

Yeah, I'm working on a couple of things. You guys remember back in 2013 when there was an LAPD officer named Christopher Dorner who went on a studio rampage? Never put Dorner in a corner. Oh, wow. Yeah. Can't corner the Dorner. No, dude.

No, it's a... I have a problem. Yeah, that's pretty good. Unfortunately, there's things about that story that aren't laughable. No, no. No, no. No, no, that's just what we do here. People that got killed.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. We're just problems. We're just problems. Yeah, I got you, man. Yeah, so I'm trying to get that story off. That's incredible. Tell that story, because I think it's a really timely story. Yeah, it's a good one.

It's very interesting. Yeah, because we read his manifesto. He was one of the, we did an episode on manifesto killers, and he was one of the first ones you kind of read it and was like, he's got some points in here. But most of the time, he's a total great, you know, he didn't do it right. He killed a bunch of people. You're he killed a bunch of people.

It's not good. And as far as you know, the only manifesto that has a shout-out section. Yep. Yes. That's true. A whole, yeah, an extended shout-out section, which is weird in the end of itself. Greg, thank you so much, man. Yeah, my pleasure, you guys.

I apologize for my voice. I'm fighting a cold or some allergies or something, so hopefully you can clean that up. Yeah, we're fine. Get some Iverbectum in you. You'll be fine. There you go. Some hydrochloric queen. The Trump cocktail.

I'm on it. Straight bleach always works for me. What an incredibly nice man. You know, especially for X-LAPD. He's a nice man. Yeah. And he was very knowledgeable, very, like, this whole story is, I get saddened. No, it really is because it is the case of, you know,

these are a couple of artists. Yeah. Like, you know, Tupac was a fucking thing. theater kid. I know. He was in musicals. Yeah. Yeah. But then he, you know, then he sucker punched the gangster. Don't do that. Never do that. Just don't do that. Don't try to, like,

just don't try to impress your friends with that. Just be yourself. If you're engaging with gangsters, I say the only way to fight them is their dance. Which he was good at. They have rap battles for a reason. That's right. So settle your disputes,

gentlemen and some of you ladies with the microphone. That's right. I think that's the only way you get it. It's not cool to go to jail, all right? Last thing I heard, it wasn't Trill to be arrested for murder. Yes. Please go see us at patreon.com slash last podcast on the left to see video versions of these episodes.

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