Last Podcast On The Left - LPN Deep Dives: A Court of Thorns and Roses / Episode 0: Enter the Maastiverse

Episode Date: February 15, 2023

LPN's Deep Dives makes it's much anticipated return with a brand new series!Join Natalie Jean (Some Place Under Neath) and Jackie Zebrowski (Page 7) as they titilate your earholes with their comprehensive "deep dive" style breakdowns of the popular adult fantasy novel series by Sarah J. Maas - A Court of Thorns and Roses.Fae Baes go down! On this the inaugural episode of Deep Dives Season 2, we discuss why and how we ended up sinking into Sarah J Maas' delicious world of Prythian in her series A Court of Thorns and Roses. There won't be any book breakdown in this ep. If you're following along, read up until Chapter 19 for Episode 1 (page 166 in the paperback edition).

LPN Deep Dives presents A Court of Thorns and Roses with Natalie Jean and Jackie Zabrowski. Well, imagine it through the eyes of a 23-year-old writing it, because that's who's writing it. The times that I don't like the beginning, I like to just in my head go, well, she's setting up this other stuff, also she was 22. And she has to be an insufferable human. She does. Humans are insufferable and it makes me hate being one. These books have made me only more so hate being a person.

I hate it. I want to live to 500. Let me be a fairy. I need my love to be eternal. Okay. Jeff wouldn't say, call me Fairy Darling. I said, you say it. He's like, I'm not saying the lines.

I'm not these characters. I'm your husband. Jackie Darling. Yeah, start calling me Jackie Darling. Is that fine? You can call me Jackie Darling. Because I don't want to be fairer. I wish I was fairer.

I know that you've got more of the fairer thing. People say I'm more Nesta, which I feel a little... I don't think you're more Nesta. If anyone's more prickly on the outside, it's me. Alright, you be Nesta. I think I'm more the Nesta. I mean, she's awesome. Yes.

She becomes a fucking warrior. I do think that, like... Oh, I mean, not without the warrior part, but the prickly part. I'm her. Oh, you're not prickly. I'm more lame. Oh!

Oh! My garden. We don't know what's going on in there yet. I feel like there's... No, there's going to be a lot. We're going to find a lot. Something. We can't talk about any of that.

No, not now. It's really hard. I don't know how we're not going to spoil these books. We're not going to. And we ain't going to. Alright. But that's... What books?

Not Dune? Are we already reading Dune right now? Screw you, Dune. We're going. Oh, we are going. Yeah. I'll just talk forever. Just keep going, Dune-ers.

Not Dune-ers. Are we reading Dune? No, we're not reading Dune. Dune's out! You can't force me to read Dune. I will watch the movies. I will watch them multiple times, but I can't Dune.

I've read the first hundred pages of Dune three times. We're really winning over the Dune subscribers right now. Sorry, Dune subscribers. Sorry. Dune is over. Dune is over for now. Yes.

You're out. You're out. One season you're in and the next you're out. Oh, my God. Don't bring... Is that Heidi? That's Heidi. Aw, yep.

Again, really bringing in the Dune listeners. So, hi. We're so happy to greet you, but it's over for now. Those boys have been washed away in the sands of Dune Island. Is that where they are? I think so.

All I know is that they're very thirsty. They are. Oh, my God. So thirsty. Just get back out on that worm. I know it's very cool. I know it. I just don't understand the economics.

You would think we were on Dune Island right now because there's five drinks sitting in the front of the two of us currently. We do have a lot of drinks. I have to have my many sips. What if I need a sip and the sip is not provided? Yeah, it's hard to sit here. Nobody appreciates how hard it is for podcasters.

Thank you. That's what this show is going to be about. How hard our lives are. Yes. And also just kidding. We know way more about Dune than that, I swear. It was written into my marriage contract that I must say I love and respect Frank Herbert

at least once a day. I don't have to as the little sister. I get to go, me, squirt. I furt on it every time he brings up Dune because that's my job. It is your job. Also, they're not actually going away. They are coming back for a review episode.

But you don't know when. So you can't go away doing subscribers because we lust you too. Won't we be talking about lust quite a bit this season? Oh, we certainly are. Why is that, Natalie? Oh, you're going to say hello this season to the Faye Bays. Oh, my God.

Yes, that is what we are calling ourselves and everyone who listens to the Faye Bays because, yes, we are delving into the series A Court of Thorns and Roses. Or Akatar as an acronym. Yes. Much easier to say Akatar. It's not the best acronym on earth,

but I've learned to appreciate it. Yes. Well, it's better than saying A Court of Thorns and Roses. And I am so excited to start getting into and talking to you guys about Akatar because it is an ongoing series that not all of the books are out yet. So we're getting this right in the middle.

We're jumping right into the middle of the pudding here. Yeah, we are diving head first into this world and it is rich and thick. Rich and thick. And I'm covered in all this viscous. There's a lot of fluids. So yeah, these books, Court of Thorns and Roses series, there's five of them like you just said.

And it is a world where humans and fairies coexist but are segregated due to an old treaty. So we are in a fantasy land for time. Why would you want to be a human when you can be a fairy instead? I do not want to be a human at all. Especially the ideas of, you know, they're not just fairies. They're the high-fay. We're not just jumping into the dirty bowels of fairydom.

No, no, no, no. We're jumping to the high ranks of high-fay. And I would do, I'd kiss anybody to be a high-fay. Throwing that out there. I'll get a real old. I'll get a 600-year-old. And be like, you kind of look like my husband. Yeah, and you know, in this world, 600 is not super old.

No, it certainly is not. Yeah, they're fine well up into those years. But there's a protagonist who is named Pharah. And she gets her ass in trouble and she finds herself tangled up in the mysterious world of the fairies. But she's scared of them at first. But is she scared or is she intrigued? She gets tangled up with them, I'm going to say that.

These books are delightful and addictive, and they're a combination of traditional fairy tale, action-adventure, and romance. Is romance a word or is it smut? A little literotica for you. It really is a matter of taste, I guess. What do you consider romance? It's almost like I can taste them.

It's almost like I can lick the sweat off their brows. I think romance novels kind of get a bad rap. And granted, there are a lot of them that are out there, maybe not for me. I think a lot of 90s kids associate them with Fabio. And like Harlequin romances, which are not bad, but they've been deemed bad and just like, oh, that's just a popcorn book.

But also, what the hell is wrong with a popcorn book? I mean, nothing. Nothing, and then I go, pop, pop, pull some bottle down my throat. I'm sorry, am I getting too horny too fast? You're making direct eye contact with people while you're saying that. Because we're sisters.

We are sisters. Yeah, so these books are not Fabio style. I will say that. They are H-O-T-T-T. And they are really fun. It's not just this sort of mommy kind of romance. I don't know. I get, when I think of romance books.

Depends on what kind of mommy you have. That's true. When I think of romance, I think of like soft lens people. Yeah, but in front of a fire. Sitting in front of a fireplace, like sipping wine, which is not like something that really gets me going. You know what I mean? They're not exactly like this.

This is a richly enveloping, exciting, crazy, violent story. It is very violent. And there's war in it. And you know, it's not just, like you said before, it's action adventure. It's not just smut. There's also fighting and smutting. Yes, please.

Also, the women get to do a lot of the dirty fighting, which is really interesting. Yeah, they get dirty, too. Well, also, it is smut written by a woman for female-identified people. Yes. I really do feel that it is the kind of sex that you're just like, mama mia.

And you're just like, rev it up, rev it up. And it's the longing. It's what we never got from Twilight. It's true. It's absolutely true. And I will say, I have already gotten messages from male-identified people who have also read them. Sometimes it's because their partner has,

but who also kind of get into it, because there's a lot going on. It's a big, vast world, and there's all kinds of fun storylines. And basically, I mean, the author, Sarah J. Moss, started out with Pharah as just the protagonist, and then moves out and branches out into all these other stories.

So the world has really developed, and it's really a fun read beyond just the SEX. Well, that's, yeah, sure it is a fun read. It's not like I'm just quickly reading through the book to get to the next box scene or anything like that. Yeah, I will say that there are many nights where you're going to be reading for four hours because you're like, the SEX, I can tell it's coming.

It's coming. I'm just going to keep reading until the SEX shows up. I've never read such a Throbby book before. It's very Throbby. Yeah, I'm Throbby. Don't look at me, Natalie. Have you ever heard of Edging? That is what I would call these books.

So, and it seems like in a lot of stories that are also fantasy based, you're like in the kind of Game of Thrones kind of series, the lady characters are 12, and the SEX scenes are mostly traumatic. Not in these ones. They are A, OK, with big old ladies. And it is all about autonomy.

Yes, and consent. And don't we just squirt for consent? We squirt for consent. Yes, we do. Febays, rise up. Can we still say rise up, or are we not allowed to because it's rude dooners, rise up? Oh, fuck.

They just take everything away. They take everything. We say go down. Febays, go down. Spread your legs. Go down. OK, so this is our sell on you. If you haven't read these books yet

and you want to stick around, these are rich worlds you can develop yourself into very easily. These books are exceptionally readable, very non-putdownable. To the point where sometimes when I was reading, I wouldn't go to sleep till like four in the morning and then have to get up immediately. I actually read it so fast that there are parts

that I kind of don't remember in this reread. I'm like, I'm glad that I'm taking my time with this now. Oh, yeah. No, I've actually read these several times already because I do find them very engaging. There are full and varied women characters who are sexy, flawed, and brutal. The women are portrayed as sexual beings

so a ton again of bodily autonomy. And at the same time, the men characters are not shown as weak. There's not this theme of men or women. It's sort of, which I think a lot of fiction gets, especially romance fiction gets trapped inside of, especially in erotica sometimes. So I do really like to see all of these characters

really like flushed out and seeing them all as people and not as just like sort of one-dimensional characters. Yeah, you see them all, right? They're mind-zined. You can see every crevice of every character, I tell you what. There's a lot of fan art, so yeah. Dude, the fan art is unbelievable. As you start reading these, please check out so many,

there's so many fan art sites that I just look at and was like, I had no idea. It really leans into my monster fucking. That's for sure. Oh, yeah. There's, because we'll get into, the fey have certain animal features to them, but it's not full animal sex, okay?

Everybody just get off, fucking don't freak out, all right? Just because they're humans that turn into animals sometimes doesn't mean it's just animal sex. They don't have sex in animal form. No, they don't. Yet, that we know of, that we know of. So these stories are full fantasy adventure and she doesn't pull punches with the brutality,

which I love. I'm always gonna be drawn to those kind of stories that put women in the trenches and kind of allow them room to get themselves out of it. She really is into the element of, she, the author Sarah J. Mass really was drawn more to like the Indiana Jones characters growing up, which she's talked about.

So she kind of gets to put herself into those roles in these stories, which I fucking love. And they're always eating monkey brains. And I mean, what are you talking about monkey? They are eating some kind of monkey brains. Is that what we're calling them now? I think that people do call testicles monkey brains. Oh.

See, you learn something every day. No, hangin' brain. Hangin' brain, yes. Isn't that when you just leave your balls out of your zipper? Is that hangin' brain? I think so. I think so. So we're gonna be teaching you all along.

We're gonna be teaching you so much about hanging brain. Oh, what I was going to mention too is that as we're going through the series, I'm gonna be calling out certain artists who have done a lot of really good fan art, so you guys can check them out. Because I highly recommend it. You should check them out.

So this, I mentioned Sarah J. Moss as the author. This isn't actually the only series she's put out so far. She's very young. She's only 36 as we record. And she's already put out a sort of prolific number of books for her age, somewhere in the range of 20. If you love it too, because looking up a picture of her, and I'm like, oh, that is Pharah.

Oh yeah, she's definitely, yeah. In my brain, I completely see her now as Pharah. Yeah. And I'm fine with it. I'm fine with it. Yeah. That didn't work. She is, yeah, she's awesome.

I would like to be her friend. Sarah, if you hear this, please come hang out with us. She is... We're a lot of fun. We're fun. We're fun. We're really fun. Some of her books so far, I say 20 in the 20 range,

because some of her books are considered novellas, including one of the books in the series. So she has three series out currently, two of which are still ongoing, including this one, like we said, A Court of Thorns and Roses. She began writing the first book in the series, entitled, with the titular, A Court of Thorns and Roses as the title,

when she was only 23 years old. Dude, and she wrote it in a month, which is Nazi sauce. Yeah. What was I doing at 23? I was at the bottom of a paper bag. No, I was crushing it. I had been smoking a pack a day for nine years.

Oh, I am impressed. Stop. I just don't like to brag about it, whenever. Actually, her first novel series, though, she began writing it at 16, which is crazy. Yikes. Yeah, so that's why all of that

started out firmly in the YA category. So even though, just as a forewarning, this series recovering a guitar is considered YA at the top, because technically, it's readable for a younger audience, comprehension-wise, but... I actually like that it's YA, because it does show that, yes, young adults should also be reading fun violence.

They should be reading fun consensual sex scenes. And complicated women. And complicated female characters. I think that, at first, when I heard that it was YA, it was like, in the same way, whenever I hear a horror movie as PG-13, I'm just like... Yeah.

Oh, well, you're not gonna go all the way, because I'm still that first, I'm still like a hard bitch on the inside. But then every once in a while, you see a really good horror movie that's not our, Poltergeist is one of my favorite horror movies. Oh, Craig T. Nelson.

Ooh. Sorry, if we're in Hornyville, and I can't not bring up Craig T. Nelson. I could see him being in these books, you know? Oh, yeah, I could see it. I'm seeing it right now. You should not close your eyes. Jackie.

Hey. So, yes, it is technically readable for a younger audience, but as the books have progressed and Mass herself has grown up, the books have become more adult with her. You actually watch her grow up. You wait till we get to the fifth book, y'all.

And she herself has said she kept amping up the sexuality in the books to try to get them out of the YA section. She did a really good job with it. She did. She did. So, yeah, I mean, if you began reading these books,

because the first one just got released in 2015, you may have been a younger person growing up into adulthood with these books, too. Man, I wish I was growing up with these books. Me, too. This would have just set my soul on fire. It really would. I feel like it really would have inspired me

in a lot of ways as a young person. So, yeah, when she started writing these books at 23, it was another several years until the first one got released in 2015. And the most recent book in the series, A Court of Silva Frames, was just released in 2021. So, we are in real time here. There will also be more in the series,

but she's currently in a book deal to finish the third of her other series that's out called Crescent City, which is a high recommend from me, also, by the way. I know. I got to start reading those, too. They may or may not be connected to these books. I don't know.

Yes! Sergibus! So, I have not read her initial YA series, which is called Throne of Glass yet, but I do recommend this other series that she's in the middle of. So, yeah, our final sale, man, she develops these lush worlds.

You just want to sink yourself inside of them. Deep, deep thrust inside of these worlds. Give me all these outfits, too, by the way. The way they talk about these worlds, this is like the way that she's built them. I just want to be living inside of it, and it's very sad that I close the book and I'm like, I'm the dumb human.

I hate being a human. I hate it, too. I hate it. She's made me hate myself. No, but also feel empowered. She hasn't. I feel empowered, but I'm just mad. I've never had the desire for the Westworld experience,

you know, where you create the fake land and talk to the AI. I'd do anything to talk to them in real life. Now I'm just like, make fucking Prithian. Please. Oh, my God, I'll pay. Anyway, I like my life, too, guys. I'm fine, sure.

My life is good. I've just been shown this now, this taste of this other life, you know? Yeah. And also, I mean, who wants to live forever? You need to think Highlander. Do you really want to live forever? I don't know.

I kind of do now. Yeah, I know. Queen was right. Yeah. So, Mass has said in an interview that as a child, she wanted to, you know, do the male parts, like I said, in Indian Jones, Star Wars. She always wanted to be Prince Philip

and Beauty and the Beast, which is one of the main stories that this series starts out being based in. And her female character starts with the name of the beast? Yes. Whoa. I had no idea. I was just like, oh, it's the beast.

I hate human beasts. I want to have sex with beast beasts. Yeah. I think she's more associated with, but you don't even see the guy. I don't know why she says Prince Philip. That is a quote from her, so that's her fault. No, I'm just, I'm surprised,

because I had no idea that I just always remember when he becomes a human and he's so less fuckable as a human than he was as a beast. He does seem kind of boring. Yes, he does, and he's just all like, oh, I'm just a boring human now. Yeah.

When you could have this big, complicated beast man instead. Yeah. And she, maybe she, based on the characters, she might have drawn from the beastly beast more so than Prince Philip. Yeah, I think that she did. Yeah, but she also uses the men characters

in these stories to sort of shape some of the women characters, which I really like. Beauty and the Beast is one of the stories that she uses to start this series. So at the beginning, there's three stories that she was inspired by, Jackie. You found these first, right?

Yeah, Beauty and the Beast, East of the Sun and West of the Moon, and Tam Lin. So three different fairy tales of sorts that she kind of weaves together to make one story. And as you're reading it now, I didn't realize that when I first read it.

So reading it with that background and we're gonna get more into how it comes into play with the plot and how she changes the fairy tales as we go through the books. Yeah, and so basically, it starts out with those stories and then it's sort of,

it's a launch pad for those other stories. So the initial ones, I'm sure most of you know Beauty and the Beast, most of you have heard of, East of the Sun and West of the Moon and Tam Lin are maybe a little bit less known, but we'll get into a little bit of those stories

and how they are inspiring to her. And also the latter I just mentioned is the name of one of the main characters of Aqatar too. So, but that is again just the launching pad and it kind of goes sideways pretty quickly. So on the show, we'll be breaking these books down in order.

So if you've never read them, you can follow along weekly and we won't be giving away spoilers. Yes, we're gonna actually tell you which page and which chapter we're going to be going to so you can read along with us every week. So if you have never read them before,

go up to there. I mean, you can go past there to you. I'm not your mom. I'm not your boss. No, but we are going to do our best. We're not going to spoil anything so you don't have to worry about hearing anything from this show that you haven't already read

if you have read up to where we are on the episode. We're never gonna spoil it. We'll never do it. And if we do, we're just gonna take it out in post. Yeah, we're very frightened. I'm very nervous about spoiling the books. We're not going to.

Yeah, so in each week, we're gonna tell you that where you can read up to. And then you can catch them weekly or you can, you know, bank them and follow them later. And some of your LPN listeners, and you probably already know us,

and some of your might be brand new. Hi. Welcome. Hi. I promise I'm not this horny all the time, just when talking about a guitar. Well, I'm trying. I'm trying to introduce myself in a better light.

Yeah, I think that it's okay to be horny. It's okay to be horny. If that's one thing, welcome. If you're horny, this is a no judgment zone for us horns out there. Yes. And as somebody who is your friend and sister-in-law, I'm around you a lot.

And I think it's good to be horny. Thank you very much, because as sisters-in-law, Natalie and I don't usually talk about sex. I especially am not sitting next to Natalie when we're talking about sex, if we happen to be in the same room talking about sex in any way, shape, or form.

So this is going to be an interesting experience for us both. That's true. We have talked about sex in the same room with a bunch of other people there. This is the first time we're up close and personal. Yep. And you know what? We're going to go through this.

You're going to hear this every week of me almost blushing, which it's very hard for me to do. Wow, so that's fun. Isn't that fun for you? It's exciting. But you are not new to the sex talk game. You've had several shows discussing sexuality

and sex and boning and pieces and genes. Oh, yes. Marcus Parks and I used to have a show called Sex and Other Human Activities on the network. And I currently do a Twitch show called Talking Sex with a sex therapist and a certified sex therapist. Her name is Dr. Jordan Soper.

And we talk every Tuesdays about people. We have an open forum where people can come and ask their questions about sex. So I'm not scared of it. But it is weird to be like, you are the woman that lays down with my brother. You don't know what we do. I don't know what you do in your marriage,

but I support your happinesses. With mostly standing. That's good. Standing and staring from afar going, ah, if only we could touch. Yeah, since we started reading these books, I do make him just edge constantly. We give a lot of longing looks.

I have read many a fuck scene from these books too, Jeff. And he's just like, yep, that's a fuck scene. And I'm just like, don't know, it's the lust. Do you feel it? It makes my loins burn. But in a good way. Yeah, not like in a scabies way. No, no, no.

Yeah, I don't have the erotica necessarily background that you do. I didn't read as much. Unless you count Angela Carter, whose books are more like nightmare. They're sort of like sexual nightmares. Cool. Yeah.

Wow, sounds real loose and fun like these books. Yeah, no, not exactly. But I do have a background in ballet and theater. And you know, you studied classical literature. I studied Russian fairy tales. But you know, whatever. We don't need super incredible backgrounds for you to listen to our beautiful lilting voices.

Yes, because I found this book last year through our Twitch community, because our Twitch community is amazing. And I said that I wanted to read a book that was the opposite of Twilight. I wanted to have something, I wanted a not. Something that actually ended in not just sadness. Petered out or Bella, where she's just like,

she's a girl, and the most interesting thing about her is that she hates the rain. And I wanted something different from that, because if you check out page seven, I did fall into a bit of a twilight hole during the quarantine. So the community recommended Aqatar to me. And after I read the first book, I promptly bought the first book for all of the women

in our friend group for Christmas last year. And it was like, it's hard giving a book as a gift because you don't want to force somebody to read it. Because then you're worried every time you see them, did you read the book yet? And I never asked, but I tell you what, man. We all finished it before you. It was wildfire.

They all blew through it. I'm talking like 10 of our closest friends ripped through these books. And yeah, finished before I did, because I'm a slow reader. Yeah. And you did this. It's your fault.

Yep. I brought it to the people, and now you're going to listen to us talk about it, and I am so excited. Yeah, no, this was all because of Twilight. And I can guarantee you in these books, nobody falls in love with an infant. No, there's none.

There's no imprinting. And there's no, like, I just think that I can't change you into a vampire or have sex with you until after you graduate from school and then we get married. So there's none of that in here. None of that. Oh, no, there's a lot of premarital sex in these books.

Yeah. And not a hint of Mormonism. No, none. How I like my fuck books. Same, girl. Same these. If you want to talk hot stuff, sex, fairy tales, banging, fantasy, fucking, venture, and sex.

Join us. Jackie and Natalie. Yeah. For season two of LPN's Deep Dives, a chord of thorns and roses, it is coming at you Valentine's Day. Valentine's Day. 2023, baby.

Faye Bays, get down. Ruduner's out. Please read up until chapter 19 or page 166 in the paperback edition. Hey, Faye Bays, if you want to listen to episode one, head on over to the LPN Deep Dives Aqatar feed and hit that subscribe button. Get new episodes every week.

Come join us. This show is made possible by listeners like you. Thanks to our ad sponsors, you can support our shows by supporting them. For more shows like the one you just listened to, go to lastpodcastnetwork.com.