LATE BLOOMERS - HEALING HURTS: The hidden heartbreak of leaving your old self behind

Episode Date: August 12, 2025

In this honest and unfiltered episode of LATE BLOOMERS, Rich and Rox share the side of healing no one talks about—the part where it feels lonely, awkward, and nothing in your old life fits anymore. Sobriety meant losing friends who only knew them as drinkers. Changing priorities meant some family relationships shifted or ended. Even work and identity had to be rebuilt from scratch. They talk about the grief of outgrowing people you thought would be in your life forever, and how clarity can make old dynamics impossible to return to. But they also share the small wins, the peace, and the self-respect that come with sticking it out. If you’re in the messy middle of getting better, this episode is a reminder that the loneliness won’t last—but the growth will.

Everyone always talks about healing as if it's the best thing and it can be, but it can also be incredibly lonely. Often when we change, we find that we outgrow friendships, family roles and in fact our former selves. Me and Rocks have both gone through quite a lot of healing and actually like Rock said, it can be seen as a good thing, but it's really quite challenging. Absolutely. This is late bloomers where we are getting our lives together. Eventually. I don't really like the healing journey. Well, not at all. Well, no, healing is amazing.

Being healthy is... But like going on a healing journey, because people talk about it like, it's the most amazing thing and you're going to be doing yoga and eating well and connecting to your inner child. Truth is, you won't know what you're doing. You're feeling incredibly lonely out in the cold. You'll question everything. You can also, I struggled with this,

you can also become quite judgmental of others when you... Oh, in the early days. It's like when you quit smoking. Yeah. And then people like hate smokers. Yeah. Yeah. So let's talk about it, okay,

because when you go on a hashtag healing journey TM, a lot of stuff changes and a lot of stuff can be really, really difficult. Yeah. So we're going to talk about today outgrowing friendships, family roles, and in fact our formula sales entirely. So let's start with friendships. Yeah. So if you can go back to what friendship was like for you

and when you started to notice it changing and what that felt like. Well, firstly, probably should caveat that a lot of my healing was getting sober. And that's really important because drinking really shaped a lot of my friendships. That's what we did. We went to the pub. I had a big group of mates. We used to go and get drunk and watch soccer, like soccer Saturday. So it was like the football in the UK at 3 o'clock in the afternoon.

It just started there, then watched the late game. So it was like four or five hours of drinking, banter, taking the piss out of each other, playing pool, stumbling, stumbling home. But not just that. Work friends were based on, you know, fun during work. But then I was also, I was obviously. closest to the people that I would then go drinking with after work. And I think me as a personality was quite outgoing, quite loud, probably quite cocky, but I was also really hilarious. And modest.

And modest, yeah. And when I got sober, and it's really important because I want to make clear that it's not anyone's fault, it's just what happened. When I got sober, a lot of these people I had nothing in common with. I couldn't speak to them. We didn't know how to speak to each other because it was all based around drinking and being in pubs and all the stuff that I certainly in the early days just would have no interest in doing. I didn't want to go to a pub when I was sober, like what is the point?

Now I can go to the pub. I still probably wouldn't choose to and I certainly wouldn't choose to do it to watch football for four hours drinking my lime and soda. It doesn't sound fun at all. So, yeah, I just lost contact with loads of people, and it's because I'd never met someone for a coffee. Like, that was alien to me. I mean, I still don't really do that. But what else do you do? So what do you do if you don't drink? And that, in it really, in it really stump me. And I now think about some friends that I've made since being sober, and they're awesome. Like, we'll go and play golf or go to music gigs or, like, it's just, it's just loads better.

It's more me. So obviously now you're playing golf with people, you're having the odd coffee, we're having the odd games night. Yeah. It's amazing. But obviously, when you were first sober, realizing you didn't want to go to the pub or couldn't go to the pub, did you struggle with loneliness, with friendship or confusion at all? I mean I think that's quite a leg question because like I can answer now I don't struggle with loneliness

I'm like well happy alone back then loneliness would would be in entwined with a bit of anxiety so I you know I needed quite a lot of help therapeutically to to get over a lot of anxiety that I had about some past stuff which obviously you know in turn is probably why the reason I was drinking was to numb and medicate myself and stuff like that. So, so yeah, but I would play, I would play cod quite a bit when I first got sober, but then even that, even that stopped. So like, maybe yes and no. I suppose that's more of a complicated question. It was a bit anxiety inducing to feel the change, but you still kind of walk through it. What about you? Oh man, I mean, I lost all of my best.

friends and it's not woe is me because I've got some incredible friends now and actually a couple of my closest friends I've known decades and is this just to be clear we're obviously talking about the healing journey are you talking about relating to addictions as well in that statement yeah the biggest loss for me was getting sober and it actually it actually happened And before I got sober, I had a couple of best mates in London. One I'd been friends with since uni and one who was an ex-girlfriend, but it's often the way in women-loving women relationships. You just stay in each other's lives forever. It's a thing.

And we were thick as thieves. Ride or die, we always went on nights out, but we were there through tough times, we'd have deep conversations at after parties and that's the only intimacy that I ever knew drunk deep conversations and or high yeah but they were my people and we say thick as these we really were we weren't living the healthiest lives but we had joy connection and intimacy together and I remember before I stopped drinking I stopped doing class A drugs and that was like the first thing that just had to stop for me. All drugs probably as well.

Or it's just class. Just class. Well, okay. I was living in Amsterdam, so. Okay, it's fine. So when I pulled back from that, I suddenly felt incredibly rejected because I couldn't go on certain nights out. And they were still meeting up and having these all-night rages that I used to be on.

And I wasn't there. And I just, I remember just feeling like. so lonely and I felt like they were slipping away from me and I desperately wanted them in my life but I didn't know how because I also knew for me it was time for class A's to go just had to be for my own mental health and my relationship at the time and I remember I said I was living in Amsterdam they were in London they flew over one night to see me and the turn up at my door, they didn't tell me they were coming and they'd been up all night doing all sorts. They turned up at my house, high as kites, knocked on the door at 9am. And when

you've slept all night and people turn up, you can really tell. Yeah. It got any vodka. I was making them a sort of vodka and orange at 9 a.m. Oh, God. But it was, yeah, but that's what I used to do. You'd just like go out all night. I'm going to jump on a plane, jump on a train, go to another house party. It was, it was, it was, it was, crazy and I remember just looking at them and feeling like this isn't me like you're not seeing me because I'd been saying that I was trying to come away from it so it was months maybe even years of just like feeling really really lonely because I lost my best friends and even though I didn't miss the destruction that we caused as a little team my

God, I miss the connection, because it's the only connection I'd ever known. I think a bit of a difference between me and you is you, although you were in a relationship, you weren't potentially in the happiest of relationships, my sort of healing started when we got together. So we would find things to do together for fun, sober and stuff like that, whereas you maybe didn't have that. You had a sober sidekick. I did it alone and it was really scary.

and I doubted it loads but thank God I did because we wouldn't be here so you know I think sometimes you do outgrow friendships and we've both spoken about sobriety

but it might just be things they enjoy talking about or doing or it's an unhealthy dynamic you found yourself in over and over and you want to change there is going to be grieving

there's going to be loneliness but there's loads of our friends out there so you've got to give yourself time okay so next up is outgrowing your family role. So when you heal, the role that you've always had in your family will change. And that can often cause loneliness, rejection, confusion for your family. So what was your family role? And how did it change when you started getting a bit better? So in one sentence, I'll give you more, but in one

sentence, it went from loud to quiet, quite, quite drastically. So my family role, you know, Again, a lot to do with drinking, but also away from that, I was always in everyone's business. I was front and center of parties. First one there. Last one to leave. Most loud, most drunk, most fun, probably. And then now I'm never happier than just on the sofa with a dog with a cup of tea. I fancy a cup of, don't drink enough tea, actually.

I need a cup of tea after this. I'll make your tea after this. I have a cup of tea, watching a bit of telly, just in silence. I love my own company now, and I never used to. And again, that will be linked to some stuff around self-medicating and alcohol and stuff that up. And where, you know, being alone caused a lot of anxiety for me. Now it doesn't and it's wonderful. It's peaceful rather than anxiety-filled. So, yeah, they had to sort of get used to me being... loud and in everyone's business to just not like not around and that's not because anything's wrong it's just that I'm quite happy living my life me and my dad actually were we still are close but we

would we would speak every day we would talk about betting and football and stuff like that on the way to and from work and I would be as is drinking buddy so I can imagine it was quite difficult for my dad to come to terms with we've now we're now close again again. I'm not his drinking buddy anymore, but I'll go and see him and play golf with him and stuff. And we'll chat. Just not, it took a while to find our sort of new level, I suppose. Yeah, because if your role's always been, talk about you and your dad, his drinking buddy and his betting buddy, and then suddenly you're saying you've got a gambling problem and you don't drink anymore. Yeah. You've taken away what your whole relationship was built on.

Yeah. So it must have been really confusing for him. And tough, yeah. I mean, he has spoken about it. Like, in the early days, it was hard, wasn't it? I think maybe he felt a bit rejected by you, simply by you. Changing. Changing. And I think that happens so often because we do have roles in family that we all play out

and it keeps the equilibrium. You start messing with that. You start knocking on everyone's dog. Well, rejection's a big word. You know, he probably felt it. You talked about you feeling rejected when. you changed and your friends didn't see it. I think it's a word and a feeling that will play out a lot when someone changes.

It's like you're rejecting the old relationship, really. On both sides. Yeah. On both sides. Yeah, I think it's similar for me, not, I think you've had a slightly happier ending because you and your dad have been able to speak about it in moments. I've never had that. so my family role surprise surprise was just the nightmare chaos problem child mentally ill that

everyone else had to avoid manage criticize like my existence probably made everyone else feel quite good in my family because everyone else compared to me on the outside kind of had it together yeah so i was really just the family mess from probably from when my mum died maybe a bit before because I was rebellious teen of course but when my mum died just drinking nightmare always bringing different people back different partners back when all the other kind of siblings

from my dad and his wife's relationship had like got married I was always the odd one out they all had stable jobs I was always changing jobs big drinker big drug doer and then that all changed and I remember like in the early days of getting sober I thought that my relationships were going to be so much closer

because I'm the problem I'm the drinker, I'm awful I've now got sober so now everyone's going to love being around me but didn't happen like that It still confuses me. I became more dislikable to them, the sort of more sober and healthier. It's mad, in it?

I mean, there's part of me that's like it's mad, why don't you love me? Like, I'm actually a nice person. And then there's part of me that's, if I'm thinking about family roles, they kind of needed me as the difficult one, crisis one. and everyone kind of gets to look down on you a bit and you take that away from them. What does it mean when the problem child suddenly sorting out their stuff and... You've got no one to blame anymore.

No one to blame, no one to focus on. And unfortunately, my dad didn't want to get to know the new me. Yeah. His loss. But yeah, it's sad. It's so sad that we were close of and I was the worst version of myself. But actually a lot of my healing...

Sorry to use the word, but a lot of it has involved unpacking my relationship with my dad, the death of my mum, a lot of affairs that particularly the affair my dad and stepmom had. So I think it's also just fear and rejection of someone dealing with what's hurt them rather than just living with the symptoms. Like they were fine for me to be hurt and drink and have relationship problems, but they're not fine for me to say. I think the reason I might drink and have relationship problems is the 20 years of cheating that went on in my house. And I can understand who would... Of course. Who would want to hear that? So, the loneliness aspect for me, when it comes to family roles, I'm still incredibly lonely.

I don't have family. The reason why we've never had a wedding ceremony, because I have no parents there. I always want to ring my parents. I can't. I'm desperate for me and my dad to reconcile. I send texts. I send cards and I can't even get him on the phone.

So I still, I talk about it every week in therapy, I have chosen me and I'm getting better because look at life. Yeah. It hurts pretty much every single day. That's rough. That is rough.

rough there's nothing else i can say to it no it's rough so yeah i think friendships for me was hard but family is harder and honestly sometimes i'm like i should just start drinking again and like go and hang out because at least i had i don't think it's worth that no i know you always reflected back to me i was i was close with my dad when i was drinking not we weren't emotionally close didn't know me, didn't know anything about me, we were just able to have a laugh when we were drinking. So I think I romanticise what I had. I think you also romanticise what you want but never had. Like, I think about, you know, even when you were sober, you would able, you, sorry, you were able to go and have a laugh. What you wanted and needed was real conversations,

which wasn't possible and so it's like you romanticise what you would love is to have a really long deep conversation with your dad him taking accountability reflecting showing you validation and love

and support that's never been there no that's it's never been there so it's like it's realising that it's been a bit of a fantasy even that though it's not I wouldn't even want I don't even want a long convoy validation anymore.

Just some, a cuddle and how are you? I miss you. I'm proudy. Just a bit of day-to-day love. But that's not there. So I've lost, I did have a parent and I've lost that parent on my healing journey. So no, it ain't pretty. And it's been years and I'm still still working on it.

Anyway, moving on. Yep. What's next? So your outgrown friendships, out. Outgrown family roles. double out, then it's outgrowing your actual former self, like who you were, how you lived, what you thought your life was going to be. And I think you are such a good example, because for 20 years you worked in the same bank from cashier, all the way up to bank manager.

Yeah. And then you left. So, and I think this one is really easy to, you know, wholeheartedly say it's all, it's all positive. Like the relationship with yourself through this process gets better. Like there's pain family, sometimes pain, friends, but this is usually, this is usually a positive. Or it certainly was in my story. I mean, it's positive when you do it and it works. But I remember you feeling crazy amounts of worry and anxiety about leaving work.

That's just, I think that's just normal, though. Like, that's just, you know, what I wouldn't say is you'd never have emotions that you struggle with. Like, of course you're just able to process and deal with them better rather than going and getting pissed. So, you know, I'm not saying life becomes easy. It doesn't, but you're my relationship with myself and the trust that I have in myself and the convictions that I have, like that all gets better. I mean, you know, I was trapped in a job that I hated on the treadmill of a corporate organization, a bank that's horrible to work for.

And now I run my own business. We do this. We've got an app that we developed. We've got a podcast that's doing well. We're on social media and we're helping people. you know by the hundreds of people say that oh my god you've really helped me and like it's just it's so fulfilling and it's so free and I probably work harder now than I did in the bank I was nicking a living by the end of it like I was just turning up and going through the motions

didn't really care um now I deeply care about what I do and the work doesn't feel like work well sorry some days it does feel like work yeah um but most of the time it doesn't and what like, it's lovely and that's all intertwined and interlinked. There's no way like for 20 years I said I wish I was self-employed and I just

never, I couldn't do it. I never had the tools or ability or bravery or anything like that to go and do it so. But you did it anyway. Walked through the tough days made the scary decisions and whether you're leaving a friendship, changing a family system

changing job, it's scary in the moment and you're going to want to go, it's very common to want to go back or have doubts, but you have to keep choosing your own future and where you're going. Yeah, I agree. I think it's probably more, if I think about easy to want to go back, I relate that more to friendships and family, actually. I sometimes, not often, but I'll sometimes think about some of the scenarios some of the friendships like it was fun a lot of it was fun and and if there was like a bit of me that's like oh like sometimes maybe miss a bit of that um it would be in those areas not so much the relationship with myself yeah because i didn't really like myself very

much that's a good reason to yeah to heal i think with me um my former self and and outgrowing who I was and in work and stuff, for so long it was only music. Music was a coping mechanism, I think, a fantasy of making it in music, being famous, being validated as a creative. I chased it so hard. I chased it through times when my life was falling apart,

and I just held on to it. It was like this fantasy of if I, make it in music, everything will be okay. When I get there, everything will be okay. I'll be happy when I get there. And I chased it and I never let it go and it probably kept me alive. But what I've noticed is I don't feel that way anymore. And that's been really quite destabilizing for me to realize that I'm not desperate for music anymore. I choose to do it and there's moments when I love it. There's moments when it's really tough.

And if I wanted to, I could probably walk away from it. Yeah. And that really, we've had combos. I think every year I come to you and be like, I don't know if I want to do music anymore. Yeah. Because I relate music so much to desperation and it getting me through my mum's death and those awful years in London living alone relied on music to chase it to try and get

my self-esteem and like now I just love like you being at home on the sofa with the dog with a cup of tea I love so much running the app that we do I love it so much I love chatting with you on a podcast there's all this other stuff that has been built by the healthier version of me. Yeah. Sometimes music is a bit hard for me to carry. I think by my theory is if, if, you know, one of the times that you go, I don't want to do music anymore, you'd have to work on this, but I don't reckon you'd ever quit

music. I just don't, I just don't think you would. But if you could make it more of a hobby in the future, I think that's where you'd be happy. So you wouldn't, like the music industry is a shit show. Yes, horrible. It's a horrible place to. working. If you could sit at home, write songs, send them to a little producer. You'd still be

releasing music, but the, you know, you love the live gigs is great and you love it, but it's loads of effort. You lose money. It's a nightmare. Like, I don't reckon you'll ever stop doing it. You would just, if you could just take away pressure from yourself, because that's what I feel with you in music. There's loads of self-imposed pressure that you put on yourself. But imagine it. being the only thing you've ever wanted for 20 years. You've never made it. You've lost it and then you suddenly get it. And I think maybe as well in this growing is you get the thing that you always wanted that you thought your gent would make you happy and you realize it doesn't. It's wonderful and I feel proud of myself and it's a good thing to accomplish. But self-esteem and happiness

comes from the small moments at home. Yeah. So that's where I've grown and that's that's felt awkward and difficult when I've had this one vision, this, this goal. Well, when we were first together, I remember asking you one of the quiz questions on the phone and it was like, would you prefer an okay work life and a happy home life or the other way around? And you said I would prefer a happy work life and an okay home life. But that wouldn't be the answer now. Oh my Lord, did I really? Yeah. But I guess at that point I was still so focused on I have to make music work. It's my number one. It's my reason for being alive. I think sometimes if you haven't had a happy, close family and you're a very

sensitive person that actually at your core needs that, you just create something else that feels like it will fulfill you. Yeah. Because you feel like family won't, but actually can still go and find it in your own family. So that is the pain of getting better. I also do just want to say, it is absolutely worth it. Yeah. Even though there's been so much grieving of the loss of friendships, for me, the loss of family, and confusion in the loss of who actually am I if it's not all about music. And for you, you've lost a lot of friendships.

You aren't in a pub drinking. Your relationship your dad has changed. You've had to take a huge risk at work, and it's a lot riskier where you are now than the salary. But I think both of us would go, we wouldn't change. thing. Definitely not. So just know if you are on a healing journey, it's going to hurt, but it's absolutely worth it. And on that note, I hope you've enjoyed the episode. If you have, like, subscribe, comment, share, you know the jive. And if you haven't, just move along by and for those of you that will be returning, we shall see you next week.