LATE BLOOMERS - THE COMEBACK ERA: 10 reasons why starting late is your biggest advantage

Episode Date: April 1, 2026

In this episode of LATE BLOOMERS, Rich and Rox are calling time on the idea that you’re “behind.” From failed careers to addiction, debt, and starting again in their late 30s and 40s, they break down why everything you’ve been through might actually be your biggest advantage.They share 10 powerful reasons why starting late hits different — from resilience and self-awareness to having nothing left to prove and everything left to gain. It’s honest, a bit chaotic, and full of moments that will make you rethink your entire timeline.If you feel like you’ve missed your chance, this is your reminder: you haven’t. You’re not late. You’re in your comeback era.20% off Loop Earplugs: https://www.loopearplugs.com/pages/lp-adhdlove

Do you feel like it's too late for you to achieve your dreams? Do you feel behind everybody else? Have you given up on even dreaming because you think it's too late for you? We are here to change your minds and convince you that actually starting later is your biggest advantage. This is the late bloomer's podcast. Where we are getting our lives together. Eventually. Wow, what an intro.

brought you by our amazing sponsor loop earplugs. And I do just have to very quickly say a massive thank you to our incredible, gorgeous listeners who have been sending us the kindest messages about our new book, The Cherry Tree Theory Theory. We have read all of the reviews and all of your comments and we have been blown away. So thank you so much from the bottom of our hearts. Yeah. Right. Are you ready for some late. bloomer propaganda. I'm always ready, I think. Because I have had a white monster today. So I am like pumped. Is your heart okay? My heart is good. I'm just ready to convince people that now is the time that it is not too late. So many people feel like it's too late. I felt that way until my late 30s.

I'd miss my chance. I was never going to achieve my dreams or find true happiness, whatever that thing is. I feel like so many neurodivergent people feel that way. Babe, yeah, I was in a job for 20 years that I hated in the bank, 20 years. And now, what am I, podcaster, influencer, app developer, author? Like, what is actually insane? Well, your dream is always to be like a derma O'Leary. Yeah, I love Dermott. And look, you're not on the TV presenting X Factor, but you are on TikTok making funny shorts for that ADHD, so.

But yeah, but whilst there's no real. romanticising TV anymore. You get loads of people watch us on social media. So you've literally made your dreams come true. And my dream was to do music. I did music for 20 years. A lot of projects didn't work out. I gave up, swore I'd never do it again. Started doing it again. And then last year at the age of 41 got a top 10 album in the UK. Yeah. So your dream is starting to shift a little bit though, isn't it? Like music you still love, but like being an apt to, like an entrepreneur, I would say I love Dhabi. I love the podcast. I love writing books. Basically, not only can your dreams come true, you're going to discover new dreams. And the fact that you're coming to it late is the best thing. By the way, before we get into the propaganda and the good stuff, I just want to say one thing for me. When I was younger, I wanted to be a musician. And I was a really, really big fan of Taylor Swift. And Taylor Swift really, really. her first album debut because it was called Taylor Swift Taylor Swift.

Right. Yeah, you haven't heard of that. I don't know where this is going. It was released in 2006. Right. 2006 was the year my mum died. Both me and Taylor Swift when we were kids, wrote songs and thought about doing music. And she did her first album in the same year that my mum died.

I was quite busy trying to stay alive. Yeah. So I couldn't chase my dream. And you watch, it's not always people like Taylor Swift, but for me it's a good example. You watch someone with a close family just being able to spend time and money and be supported in their dream whilst your life falls apart. And I thought that was over for me. And I have realized it's not, it wasn't, I'm doing it at 40 and I just want to light a fire under people's bums. Yeah.

But starting late is actually starting right on time. Right, are you ready? I'm ready, yeah. Ten steps, is it ten things? Ten something, ten what? Ten fires. Right, ten fires to light under the bum. Don't actually do that, though.

Methane is flammable. So, safety first. Right, number one, you survived what other people didn't. You are tougher than pretty much everybody out there. I mean that that resonates with me low not in like the literal sense I don't think I'm the toughest person alive but I reckon my resilience is up there with with some of the best I reckon just because of what I've had to go through same as you you went through pretty horrendous childhood SA abuse became a teenage dad were in poverty gambling addiction then gambling addiction

then drinking problems it's so difficult though isn't it because when I think about you as a little eight year old boy I'd never be like this is a good thing this is going to build resilience like that's not what we're saying

well it's interesting so I wouldn't change anything believe it or not this is this is a question that comes up a lot in my own head and I feel like I'm exactly where I need to be right now. So it's a really difficult question to answer, but I think I keep landing on I would want everything the same.

As crazy as that sounds, that's how I feel. Because I wouldn't have the same skill. I'd be a different person. It was that slide-in-doors effect. I love who I am now. Can't risk that changing. So everything has to stay the same. And that's because you found a way.

To find true happiness, build a business that you love, find success. We went back 10 years ago. You might not say the same thing. No, that is really true. So we are coming at this from the privileged position of having spent years and years, sorting ourselves out, being in therapy, finding each other, learning about neurodivergence, dealing with trauma. It takes years.

But when you get through it, that's where we're coming from. Yeah. So, yeah, you're a tough, mother fudder cookie you're we're tough cookies yeah

like I'll be like like am what like something goes wrong at work like my mum died I sang at the funeral you will never bring me anything worse than what I've been through

the reason I think that's important I suppose in love and sort of business wise I certainly feel it myself is I do not remember the last time I panicked in a situation at work or personally or whatever. I'm like so calm.

Now, don't get me wrong. If there was a car coming towards you, I would panic and stuff. But do you know what I mean? All those problems that people think are massive don't really feel massive to me. When you've been through massive trauma, you have a perspective on life where you understand

what you can make it through, what matters. Okay, number two, you are less afraid of failure because you've already failed in the most epic ways. Yeah. I have run up 40,000 pounds worth of debt. I have started and not been able to launch three different artist projects in music. I've been absolutely on my knees. Unable to afford 300 quid a month rent in a spare room

when I was in my late 30s. So you know what? If I put out a song and someone doesn't like it, it's all good, mate. Like it is not going to knock me or affect me. Like bring on the failure. If something fails, cool. You learn the lesson you keep going.

if you are starting late, like you're just not afraid because you've done it all already. Yeah. In a really simple way, I sort of think about the videos that we make. And if some don't do well, I know people in the industry that if they put out a video and it maybe doesn't get as many views as they used to or it flops, the term is they're really upset about it. Like they really are linked to it. Now I'm just like, let's just go again then. Let's just keep turning up.

And it's strange, isn't it, to link that back to a past life when we failed at huge things. Yeah. Huge things, the most important relationships and jobs in our lives. But it makes you brave. And you've got to be brave if you're going to jump in and try and live your dream. Definitely. Okay.

Okay. Number three, you are deeply self-aware to pull you. yourself out of rock button, you've probably had to think about your own patterns, you might have had to go to therapy, you will have an awareness about yourself, your history, your patterns, your motivations that no one else has. If you've just always had a happy life, even some stresses, but you've kind of moved through, you've never had to learn someone that goes to, let's say, therapy, because they're on their knees, because they're on their knees, need help, you end up almost learning more than those people. You understand deeply what matters, what motivates you, what infuriates you, what you can't stand, where you want to

grow, like, which means that you have so much self-awareness with what you're going to bring to this like next phase of life. Definitely. slight caveat to this one. I think there is some work required, regardless of age for this one, because whether it's therapy or whether it's something else that you do to increase your self-awareness, because there are a few people I know that are, I know, 60, 70-year-old and aren't self-aware. Do you know what I mean? Like some work would have needed to be done as well.

Yeah, we all know like 80-year-old teenagers. Maybe self-aware is even the wrong phrase, because there's a lot of people who say they're self-aware but have no idea what they're driven by, have done the deep work, have faced their demons, like face to face and come out on top and just like understood a lot about themselves and what drives them. So you're never going to end up dedicating your life to something that you don't like. Yeah. Because you're so deeply connected.

Yeah. Okay. number four, you have skills that other people cannot and will not have, having gone through some quite horrendous things, things like a deep empathy for other people who have been through the same thing, bravery in the ability to speak about it, to break through that shame, to own it. the fact that you can speak about what happened to you when you were eight, that is a skill that not many people, thank God, will ever have to develop,

but you did develop it and now you get to use it. You as a man show up on the internet and you talk about the darkest days of your life, you as a parent, you as a partner. Not a lot of men have that ability to be that vulnerable. Definitely. Even on a shallower level though, babe, like I always remember when I was the youngster at work and I would look at all the 40, 50 year olds.

They always used to say stuff like it's all the same. It just happens in cycles. Like stuff happens that comes back. And that now I understand is they've been through everything, whether it be emotionally or professionally. Just stuff happens. I sound old now. Maybe it's because I'm getting there. I look at 20 year olds now that are like not.

technologically, because they're way more advanced to me, but are just learning things about employments or contracts or holiday. I look at sear and stuff like that. They're just learning life. And I'm like, I know all of this now. And I'm, I, because I've done it all years and years ago. And you can't really, you can't, you can't, you can't academically learn that stuff. That's so true. I was kind of seeing it as like you've developed skills through surviving trauma, like empathy and breaking through shame. But actually what you're saying is, skills just from being older and being in the world. Yeah.

Wiser. You are wiser. And that is worth so much. For me, if I look at music, I failed so many times in music. Every single time has taught me something. So no wonder when I came back to do Rory, it was a bit better. Well, and you also know what's bullshit and what's not. Like you, because when you're, you're naive, young, youngsters often aren't naive and they'll go and do things for other people because of the empty promises and so.

Do you know what I mean? You're just, yeah. Right. Number five, you've got people to prove wrong. If you are someone that has been underestimated, if you're someone that's had a problem with substances, if you're someone that's had a problem with substances, if you're someone that. has had family dynamic problems, if you've been a scapegoat, you will have been looked at as a failure, the person that's always going to mess up, quit, never amount to anything. It's a powerful motivating force to be like, do you know what, I'm going to prove you wrong.

And that's a part of my story. When I first started doing music again, it was like everyone that didn't believe in me, including myself. I'm going to prove you wrong. I'm going to do the work. I know, like, where I'm standing right now. Yeah. And it's almost like spite can be quite a big motivator. Yeah, big time.

And I think even if I look at me, I was the bank manager. And even whether it was not necessarily self-belief, but I didn't have any ideas and stuff. I remember telling some really close people to me that I was going to take a year off the bank to go and make some videos to put on the internet. They were like, what? What are you talking about?

We'll see you in a year, mate. Yeah. Yeah. And it was like, no, you won't. You'll never see me again. Well, you will, but on a feed. Oh, shove down your throat on a for you page. It's probably all blocked you now.

But yeah, like there's this power. in your belly when you come back to start late? You got people to prove wrong. Right, before we get on to number six, I'm just going to take a moment to talk about our amazing sponsor. Rich and I very recently got legally married, and we actually had a little bit of a party after the ceremony, and we had a DJ playing all of our favourite emo, pop punk and metal tracks.

I found rich outside of the party because it was too loud. I went to find him and I said, what are you doing out here? This is your wedding. You need to get back in. And he said it was too loud because he's got sensory stuff because of his autism. I pulled out a pair of loop earplugs from my bridal corset to give to him because I knew that he would need them. That is how much we love loop earplugs and why it is literally the perfect sponsor for our podcast. All of our listeners get 20% off our favourite loop earplugs. We've got all the different ranges from loop quiet to loop experience to loop engage. Check out the show notes for the link or the link in our social media bios to get your 20% off. Or if you get married, get some loops.

right I'm going to jump back in with number six and it's about being streetwise so we sort of touched on it on a previous point but more for me this one is like maybe I'm too far the other way but I don't trust anyone and I can definitely smell rats do you know what I mean in not actual rats but just people that are full of

just nonsense So funny, because I think the phrase is smell a rat and it's kind of like a metaphor. You think I can smell rats. The autism, you've taken it literally, but you can. You can smell rats. Like if there is people with, I don't know, horrible agendas, trying to take you for a ride, you're just like, uh-uh.

Or not even, yeah, like that definitely. And also just the people that are just full of shit. Like I just, I'm like, what? Yeah. talking about. What are you talking about? Or the phrase is my perfect, this is the phrase I love to challenge the most and I'm sure I annoy loads of people is the phrase, oh, it's always done that way, whether it's in the music industry, the publishing industry, whatever, I hear so many times. I'll just that's the way that it's done. And I challenge it all the time. Yeah,

like brave enough, streetwise enough, with enough experience to just back yourself, believe yourself, You can see through stuff. I know for me, when I did music in my 20s, I was in some horrible situations. I was so green. I was so naive. I got taken advantage of, put in positions I didn't want to be. Horrible things were said and done to me.

People taking money off me. That's never, ever going to happen now because you're older, you're wiser, you're stronger, you're nastier. They're never going to do that. What colour are you now? So presumably green means naive, right? I think so What's the colour

When you're not green anymore Bright pink I just said that Because it's the book And the mic that I'm currently looking at But there's something I'm also Mrs Pink So

Okay Number seven And this next one We could probably Fill an entire episode with You've made your mistakes I genuinely

genuinely I'm so grateful That every music project I tried to do in my 20s failed because I would have not been here anymore. If I had had success in my 20s, I was so desperate for it for the validation. I had no relationship, no home life. I was terrible with money and my substance abuse was probably only kept at bay from my lack of funds. So if I had had success, I would not have been able to handle it. I would have been out partying.

I'd have become absolutely insufferable. Sometimes I see young artists that have quick success and I honestly get so scared. I'm like, I don't know if you're going to make it or if you're going to be okay or people with like mental health struggles or addiction issues. You go and live your dream when you're older.

I've already done it, mate. I've ruined every relationship. I've run up every credit card. I've been thrown out of a few places. Like, I've already done it, mate. Now, for the people listening to this episode and currently thinking these two are insufferable and maybe you're going through the period of making all of those mistakes currently, just to highlight this, we are coming at this from a,

we've done quite a lot of work in learning from them and making changes. But I guess it might be quite hard to hear for people that are in the middle of making the mistakes, right? I mean, I don't imagine lots of them are listening to the late blooms podcast. Maybe they are. I wouldn't have. I would have hated us. I'd have put it as cringe, shut up, cheesy. That's interesting.

Never would have would have listened. I think if you're listening, you want to check. Even if you're struggling, you've got that fire in your belly. You know you've got more to give. Yeah, okay. So maybe there's the ladling of hope. Oh, look at you. The old ladling of hope.

What about you, though, with that one? What, with mistakes? Oh, there's a song lyric that nearly popped into my mind. Babe, I've made loads of mistakes. Like, all over the place. Whether that be, it's hard to say, I love my kids. Would I become a dad at 18 with no money?

No. I wouldn't change it now. But, like, do you know what you mean? Like, it's hard to, it's hard to quantify now but professionally I like I stayed in a job for 20 years that had huge impacts on my mental health um I didn't explore my autism until recently like even though sea was diagnosed autistic when I was early 20s like it's if I was going to live my life again not know me now.

Yeah, with the knowledge that I had, I would do things differently. I'm glad that I didn't on reflection because I'm where I am now. But yeah. You've got two divorces. Oh, yeah. Oh, you just want to carry on.

Gamming addiction. Right. The drinking problem. Yeah, but what's glorious now is we're so lucky with our amazing community, the people that watch this podcast or buy the books or use Dubby. we're able to do this as a full-time job.

I struggle with the word influencer because it's got some pretty negative connotations, but we kind of are like influencers and influencers have a bad reputation for, I don't know, going to film premieres or like spending loads of money or whatever. Like we're never going to do that. Well, we're not going to go to film premieres. You love spending money. Yeah, but unlike the house and stuff, not drugs. Come on, babe.

that's true. Yeah, that's true. Give me some credit. We don't like live in the house, babe. Unless it's a Marvel film, maybe that would be okay. Anyway, it's usually me that keeps getting distracted. It's usually you, sorry, that keeps getting distracted. It's me today. Number eight, you have powerful urgency.

Is that because we're old? So it's like we need to do it now, really? Yes. When I went back to music, late 30s, I just knew this is it like this is my last chance I'm going to go

hard yeah going to go hard and I didn't know it was going to work but I showed up and I sang my little songs on TikTok put on my little wig like I went so hard and I grafted and I joined singing lessons

and I like I worked so hard because this is it now. I haven't got loads of time left. You know, if you start a music career like most people when you're a teenager, you could have two decades of that career before you're my age. People, when I went back to music, Avril Levine was coming back for her like greatest hits tour. Yeah. 20 years later, I was just getting started at the same age. Like, come on now. We need to do this kid. Come on now. Mine is

it's the same but different. My urgency was, yeah, how many times have I said 20 years in the bank? But I had a year off. So I was like, I have to make it in that year or I'm going back to a job that I hate. So. More than that, you and I speak about this,

I tell the exact story in the book, which is when I was like, yeah, take year off. Let's like do ADHD love tick And you were like, I've got two kids. And I have a lot of financial responsibility. There is no world I could leave my job. Do you remember in the pub?

I thought you were. I thought you were crazy. I mean, I am. But in a good way. Crazy is good, people. But I think how amazing is that? Like, I had urgency because I felt like it was my time was running out. And like, I've got to do this.

You had urgency because you had one year to try and make it work. And by the way, anyone here that bought our first book, that was just enough money to pay our rent. Yeah. So you could take more time off. So I just want to say thank you. The only reason we're here today talking about this third book, talking about all these lessons is because of what you guys did for us.

So thank you. Number nine, your pain has purpose. Now, what this means for me, it might mean something slightly different. to you. But this really leans me into the gratitude, like what, what the pain and suffering of the past, the trauma, the gambling, the losing all the money, the two divorces, all of that stuff that are probably my deepest pains and most vulnerable bits about me. All of them things make me more grateful. So like the good for me is better than the good for someone that's had like a lovely life, I think, because I am more grateful for it.

So that's another reason why I wouldn't change my past, because if there's a blue sky, I think it'll be bluer for me than others. I think it's true. And you've seen how dark life can get when it's good. It just hits differently. When I hear that, I think about work, I think about music, I think about the books, and I think about Dubby. I lived such a troubled life for so long after my mum died.

My mental health was horrendous. I was struggling with self-injury into my 30s. Drinking, substances, financial problems, relationship problems. Like, I did not want to be here many, many times. When I then got myself together and things started to change and then I met you and then I went to therapy and then I found out I had ADHD. Like, I was able to realize

why I didn't want to be here anymore and speak to those people. So the songs that I write about the family stuff I went through losing my mum, the lowest moments, I get to sing that into the ears of kids going through the same thing. The reason we made dubby

so many people out in like San Francisco making apps to try and like, make money because they think they've got a good idea. Do you know where that idea came from? Because I was so ashamed of how dirty and messy I was when I was younger. I almost like didn't make it through those times. So we now have live sessions where people can come on and clean their house together. We run eight a day, seven days a week.

It costs $4.99 a month. We're not making a lot of money from that. We hire 10 people. Yeah. But there is, the pain is in the purpose. It's like helping people. The book to sit down and write those chapters about both of us, the day that we both almost weren't here anymore,

the worst times in our addiction, the worst times with relationships. You get to transmute that pain into purpose. You get to like alchemize it and use it for goods. And when I think about music, for example, there was an 18 year old kid that's had everything. Oh, I decided I want to be a singer. Cool.

What are you writing songs about? How is it going to have like that depth that I feel stuff needs to really get through to people? It's like, I am so grateful. All of that stuff. Well, I almost want to leave it at nine after that. A little monologue there. You also used transmute and... Alchemize.

Alchemize. Two words, I don't know what they mean, but they sound great. Last but not least, you're starting from experience rather than scratch. So I guess it's a bit of amalgamation of everything, right? It is everything you've been through, every failure, every trauma you've survived, every difficult day, month, year. or decade has given you gold dust experience and you might not see it that way. Yeah. But it really, really is.

Not everybody gets to see life in that way and learn those lessons, build that kind of strength, those kind of dreams. I think it's amazing. And I go back a few years ago before starting music again, I was petrified. I felt so embarrassed. I felt so old. I considered lying about my age, taking 10 years off because I was so ashamed to be 37, trying again. By the way, young, that is so, that is so young. Yet I felt so old. And I like didn't understand at the time. I just, I felt like a failure. I felt it was too late. I felt embarrassed. I didn't understand all the resilience, all the experience.

All of this stuff was like in me. Yeah. Anyone that identifies as like a late bloomer or being for a terrible time but having survived it. Or maybe like you missed your chance. No, you've got to challenge that narrative. What about you? What can I say to that? Come on.

I don't know how to follow that. I think that's a beautiful ending. I completely agree nothing to act. Like I, everything I've learned, I'm thought, I feel I'm not wise. I'm sure there is wise people. But in my lane, in the experience of life that I lead, I feel like, I'm not going to get flustered about anything. I'm not going to, there'll be nothing that I like wouldn't be able to figure out how to

get through it. That's how I feel, but just about life generally. So, this has been one of my favorite episodes. I can tell, yeah. I need to drink more white. monster. Guys, thank you so much for tuning in. Thank you so much for letting us bring you the propaganda that if you feel late in life, maybe you are right on time. In fact, maybe you have skills and experience and resilience that are going to set you apart. We would love to know

what your dreams are. Let us know in the comments. See you next week. And if you've enjoyed it, Like, subscribe, follow. Anything else? No, I think that's it. See you next week.