LATE BLOOMERS - WHO LEFT US IN CHARGE?!: A teenage dad, an ADHD stepmum, and how we survived becoming parents

Episode Date: April 16, 2025

This week on LATE BLOOMERS, Rich and Rox talk about becoming parents... without ever planning to. Rich became a dad at 18. Rox became a stepmum with ADHD, trauma, and zero idea what she was doing. Neither of us signed up for this, but somehow, here we are — co-parenting, healing, messing up, and figuring it out one meltdown at a time. We talk about what our childhoods taught us (and didn’t), why parenting can trigger your deepest wounds, and how we’re trying to do it differently — with love, honesty, and the occasional family-sized panic. If you're a parent, a step-parent, or just someone trying to break the cycle and build something better than what you had — this one’s for you. You don’t have to get it perfect. You just have to keep showing up.

Today we're talking about parenting. Don't worry though, we're not going to try and teach you how to parent because we are not qualified. It's more about survival of parenting. Just about surviving. Before we get into it, we would just love to tell you about our brand new kids book, AD and Me, that is available to order now. This is a picture book basically about what it feels like growing up with ADHD.

It is actually for kids aged three to nine. However, we've had a lot of comments from adults saying, can I buy it for my inner child? Yes, you absolutely can. I'm just going to read you very quickly at the back of the book because it's going to be way better than anything I could say. I have a secret that lives in my brain. I call him A.D., but that's not his name. Doctors told dad it's called ADHD but that's way too boring for AD and me. Sophie's life with ADHD, or as she sees it, with her best friend AD is filled with all sorts of highs and lows. From doodles to paint spills, distractions in maths and more. Follow

AD and Sophie on a journey from misunderstanding to love and acceptance. Right, let's get into it. Welcome to Late Bloomers, where we are getting our lives together eventually. I'll say eventually this time. Oh my gosh, the parenting episode. Yeah, okay. So I think it's best if we just kind of... Well, we've got five questions, haven't we, that we'll both answer.

Yep. Just to keep us on point. Yep. So shall I start asking you? Yep. This could be a messy one. Yeah. So first up, when did you become a parent and what did it feel like?

Okay. So I've got two kids. When I first became a parent, so when I first had Cere, my eldest, I was 18. I was just 18. So I was 18 in November and Cere was born in February. So what did it feel like? Terrifying. I had no money. I had a job that couldn't even afford rent, really. Parents lived in Spain, and then all of a sudden I was responsible for a human. I was barely being responsible for myself.

I was married at 18. That's another thing I wouldn't recommend, is getting married at 18. Well, I'm sure for some people it works out magically. Not for me. So yeah, it was just terrifying. I didn't know what to do. There's no sort of handbook sort of learning as you go. I didn't even have a driving licence, I don't think, when

Sia was born. So it was probably six or seven months later that I passed my driving test. So yeah, it was scary. Terrifying, basically. And then what about with Lily? That was a bit later, wasn't it? Yeah, Lily was easier for me. So I was 10 years older, so I'd been 28. And yeah, I just had my life more together, probably not emotionally, but financially and, you know, with my job and my house, I was a homeowner, everything was sort of in place. So it was a bit, it was a bit easy.

I mean, it's never easy. Like having a kid is well hard. Like, you know, it makes me smile because you hear the perception of having a child is like, it's the best thing that will ever happen to you and it's so magical and stuff like that, which, you know, I love my kids, don't misunderstand me, but it's not fun. Like, you have no sleep, you can't do anything anymore that you used to, you've got no freedom. Of course it's just as rewarding because they're amazing, but I don't think how hard and awful it is is talked about enough.

And I mean, being 18, you say you can't do anything that you used to. I mean, you were just out of school. Yeah. So there was no, you never had a young person's life. Yeah, no, I didn't. I went straight from sort of school apprenticeship, moved in with my first wife when I was 17 and then had a baby all a bit fast. The one good thing is though, I was saying last night to Sia, because they made some joke about when I'm gone, they want something. I can't remember.

Classics. They want to be left something in the will. I can't. But my reaction was, well, hopefully, touch wood, you'll be about 70. I'm only 18 years older than you. Yeah. Isn't that lovely? That it's a sort of surprising benefit. Yeah. So yeah, that's my story. So what about you?

When did you become a parent and what does it... So it would have been five years ago. A bit different to you. I became a stepparent to your kids when I was 35. And what did it feel like? So I think it felt quite amazing in the beginning. The struggles didn't really start till a little bit later on. I was completely in love with you and when you love somebody that much and you're invited to be part of their kids' lives. It's an incredible honour. It's an

incredible challenge. And it was something that I took really seriously, probably too seriously at times. But yeah, it felt really amazing. I guess I was 35, had some sobriety under my belt, had some therapy under my belt. So it felt like an adult decision to become a stepparent. So a bit different from your experience. Question though, you said, you know, when you love someone so much, it becomes an honour to be part of the kid's life. Obviously lovely to say, but the way that you said it assumes that everyone feels like that. I've heard loads of stories where step parents resent the kids, it takes time away

from the partner and stuff like that. So like... I mean, obviously I don't get on with my step-mom. And she obviously didn't see it as an honour to be that role for me. But that was very different, I feel. I think it's hard if you're the stepparent from an affair. Because how you approach that, get over that, deal with that or not is going to massively impact. So I already had known my step-mum for 15 years as a long-term affair partner before they made it official. There wasn't any of that with me and you. I met them when we were hanging out as friends. They didn't meet me as a step-mum. I wasn't an affair partner. I was just a friend of yours. So I had it easier. I had a clean run. They got to meet me without any history. So yeah, not all step-parents are going to feel it's an honour and are going to take it really seriously. And that's rubbish. Don't marry those people.

Do you know what I mean? It's your kids. Find someone who's going to take it really seriously. And that's rubbish. Don't marry those people. Do you know what I mean? It's your kids. Find someone who's going to be real. I would imagine a lot of our listeners, you know, statistically will be in that situation at Don't Get On. And it's a tough gig, right? Being a step-mom.

Like, I would imagine anyway. I don't, like... I mean, I haven't found it a tough gig. No? There's been huge challenges I don't like. I mean, I haven't found it a tough gig. No. There's been huge challenges between us, between me and the kids. Sure. But I haven't found it tough. I found it this amazing learning curve of which I've just grown and grown and grown

and got closer and closer to them. Sorry, but like I have just found it brilliant. I think what I meant more, I don't think I sort of meant it's hard with the kids. It's sometimes maybe, and it's something that you've said to me in the past, I have to think about how I word this, is it's sometimes tough emotionally if you'd like just be in the step mum, do you know what I mean? The actual act of step mumming, yeah, it's finding your place within a family system that's already set up. It's not overstepping the kids boundaries, but trying to become

a parent. It's trying to not piss off the other co-parents, the other mums and wondering what that relationship should look like. And of course, I'm always aware that I'm not their real mum. They both have real mums, they both have those relationships. So that has been tough trying to find your way in. And a huge wounding for me from my own childhood is that I don't matter I'm not cared about. So then you become a step-mom where you're not part of the real family it can trigger that so there's definitely been the odd tear in the bathroom about that but on the whole, it's okay. Okay, next question. Did you always want kids?

No, so, and I don't, but I don't mean I didn't want kids. It's just something that I just did because it was, I guess, drummed into me that that's what you do. You get married and have kids. Didn't work for me the first time, so I tried it again. And then we got a dog. So it would be wrong of me to sit here saying like in childhood I always dreamed of being a dad and I just didn't think about it. When you guys got pregnant, you'd been 17 years old.

Yeah. It's like four years younger than Sir now. Yeah. Obviously your dad had you when he was really young. He was 18, I think. Yeah. So when you say drummed into you, quite literally, that was your formative view of a relationship. An older lady with a younger man having a kid.

That's the blueprint. So it's no surprise. Yeah. I think now it's such a hard question to answer because now I wouldn't change anything. I and both my kids are so awesome. I have so much fun with both of them. Me and C are probably the closest we've ever been.

Lily's like a legend. She's like really getting into sports and stuff and looking to me for guidance, which feels amazing. But yeah, like if you ask me honestly, would I go back to and relive and choose to relive the 18 years to 25? I'm not sure that I would say yes. Like it's really tough mentally.

Like I'm so happy now and I'm glad it all happened, but it was tough. Yeah. What about you? Did you always want kids? Absolutely not. It was my 100% rule. I will never ever ever have kids. I never wanted it as a young kid, teenager, 20s, 30s. It just never happened to me. The thing everyone said would, oh, one day you'll

change your mind. Nope. I didn't want to play with dolls when I was young. I was out on a BMX bike, digging like dirt holes and climbing trees. I was just not that way inclined. When I was young, I was very much more identified with like being a little boy, out running, playing football, nicking stuff from the shop. Nicking stuff from the shop. Big time, big shoplifter vibes. And then in my twenties, I had loads of relationships in my twenties when I was still a baby. And I'm sorry to say this to you because you became a parent at 18, but me and my partners in my twenties, we were not ready to be parents. We were drinking

alcohol. Some of us were taking cocaine. We were all over the place, we didn't have money. It was chaos. So yeah, no, that was never going to happen. And I was like a hundred percent never ever don't want them, don't like them, that ain't for me. So with that in mind, was, I know you've obviously said you fell in love and you loved becoming a step-mom. When you sort of first knew me, so before you'd had any sort of weird, weird connected in any way, was that a bit of a not a tick box? A hundred percent. So when we met, I had been 18 months celibate because I was dealing with obviously addiction.

So I'd stopped drinking for 18 months, but I'd also stopped any form of dating or relationship or sex because it had been such an issue for me. I'd never got it right. So I just put myself on the bench. Obviously I knew I was going to go back to dating. I did want a partner, but for me, the parameters on that dating app would be a hundred percent no kids. So I, I never would have met you had it been through a dating app rather than real life.

So obviously when I was told, oh, it's my friend, Rich, she's got kids. Cool. Like no issue because that's never going to. And then you saw me. life. So obviously when I was told, oh, it's my friend Rich, she's got kids. Cool. Like, no issue because that's never gonna... And then you saw me drinking a beer with the tattoos, bypassing the dating app. Boom. And then, but it's funny, it's funny how it happens. But now I'm obsessed with the kids and parenting in all its challenges and triumphs is a huge part of my life. So it is funny how we can change. But within that, even though I love it and I love them so much, I still have never got to a point with you when I've gone, I

want a kid with you. So even in like a super healthy love in relationship with step-parenting experience, different financially, it still hasn't happened to me, which is a really odd thing. And a lot of people have kind of looked at me and said that that will change, but I'm 40 and it never has. Well, look, for the record, I'm fairly pleased that that hasn't changed because if you, oh my god, if you turned around to me and was like babes I think I want kids that would be an interesting conversation. Yeah because you've been doing it from 18 to almost 40 so.

And it is a slog like you know I'm barely hanging on with a puppy to almost 40. And it is a slog. Like, you know, I'm barely hanging on with a puppy. To be honest. We did get a puppy. I feel like that was a really nice compromise. I'm happy to be a mum to a puppy. Next. In all your years of parenting,

what has been your greatest parenting challenge? Or, you know, the one moment or one story? Well, I'm not going to go with one moment. I'm just going to answer broadly what the hardest thing in my view about parenting is. And I'm going to be really simple and blunt. It's that they don't listen. Like I didn't listen either. So it's not a them thing.

It's just a human thing. And it will be so many decisions. You know, I'll talk about Sia because they've just got longer on the earth than Lily. But so many times I've said or given them advice to not do something because I know, I know it's not going to go well. I know that it's a bad decision to make. I know. And I wish that I could distill with absolute because I know with

absolute certainty, I wish I could just like use a wand and put that feeling in them so they know, but they don't have it. They're like, I'm gonna do it myself. I make the same mistakes. And I guess that's important, but it's really hard as a parent because it's like you just, if you just listened.

Life would be. Life would be well easy. Yeah. I think we've had to learn that we don't get to tell them what we think they should do. We have to watch as they make the wrong decision and then be there to help them pick up the pieces. And that's how they learn on the way. It's like letting them mess up. Yeah. And I think actually the reason I went to see it is because I think it really happens

from sort of 11 onwards, maybe a bit older, maybe 12, 13, because when you're sort of nought to 10, it feels like you do listen to your parents and you do think everything they say is correct. But there's no sort of gradual decline from, I think everything you're saying is correct and then a gradual decrease. It's like, I think everything you're saying is correct and then switches to, I think everything you're saying is wrong. Cringe. Shut up. And I know best and nobody understands me but me. I'm so complex and special. Like it's, yeah, I just wish I could do that, but I just can't, I have to accept it.

Okay, what about you? What's your greatest parenting challenge? Mine has been my relationship with you. Yep, I agree. Yeah, I agree. We talk loads online and hear about how we don't argue. We don't argue, do we? Not really. The one area where we have had, and it's never ever ever been shouting rouse. It's not arguments as you imagine, but like really strong

disagreements, long walks where we've both been not backing down, not backing down totally on the other side has been with parenting. I think we're in a way different space over the last couple of years, but our first few years together., I think we're in a way different space over the last couple of years, but our first few years together. And I think we've both said this, that if our relationship was ever going to fail, it would be because of our different views on parenting. And I don't think we ever would have got to that point, but the fact that it took us into therapy,

it's taken us so many years to be on the same team. I can see that, yeah, it potentially could have gone that way, which is quite scary. It wasn't, you know, even took us into therapy and then we were having arguments after therapy and stuff, but that didn't even really help. Or it sort of, I don't know, it didn't in a weird way. I don't think it did for us at that time. I think we've had to walk that journey and we've both had to grow massively in order to both come in from the sides. And just to, you know, can't distill five years of our parenting discussions into a minute. But if I were to try and describe it, you were very far this way in terms of rules, tough love, not really leading by emotional connection. That wasn't necessarily there. It was do it

this way because I say so. And I was very much this way, a bit coddley. Let's have cuddles. Let's talk about what happened. Let's find what happened in your past that explains why you are the way you are. And neither of those two worked. Your way meant that kids felt unknown and my way felt that kids felt disempowered because they weren't doing it themselves. So actually looking at it from where we are now and what we do now, we were both wrong. So we're both arguing for a side that wasn't actually right. The magic point is a bit of both in the middle. It's boundaries that are explained because we respect the kids and it's loads of love led by them, a safe environment. It's neither cuddling or tough love. So we wasted

loads of time. I think it's hard when you're over one side to even meet anyway close to the middle, to be honest. And I think that's taken a long time. And I am pretty sure that the disagreements won't be over. I think they'll come up again. I mean, we haven't had one for quite a while, so you never know. Well, yeah. Okay, so what moment has been your greatest parenting triumph? I think it is probably, or it'll be seer again so far. And that's just because if I look at where seer was a few years ago, they weren't looking after themselves. They were eating terribly, low energy on lots of medication,

quit their job against advice. And then was really struggling to get out of bed and do anything and do any work. You know, and it's not one moment again, it's loads of little boundaries, support, coaching, love, all of that stuff over, I mean, it took years, but to look at them where they are now, that is, I don't think they'd mind me saying, I don't think they would have got there by themselves. Like that needed quite significant parenting. That's what parenting is. It's if you can get your kid on the right track and just

get them, yeah, get them healthy and happy. And obviously within that triumph, what did you do to turn Sears life around? Because that's what's happened. We've gone from identifying with clinical depression, loads of medication, saying that they can't work, starting to show maybe alcohol things popping up to, I mean, they're a bit of a joy to live with now. I mean, they're a bit of a joy to live with now. I mean, they're working hard. They've got a wonderful partner.

They, we're so close. Like, what did you do that's turned their life around? Well, it's loads of little things. So it started when they moved in with us, I think, or maybe just before that. I'd done loads of therapy, became a little bit more emotionally available and was able to talk about emotions and stuff. They still don't like doing it.

Occasionally they will, but they then wanted to move in with us. So they lived here for four years or something, something like that. And it sort of started then slowly and it was really tough. But with loads of conversations, loads of explanation, loads of not just telling them what to do, but having firm boundaries and explaining why important when they crossed and pushed those boundaries, which they did a lot at the start, super important to that there's consequences for that, which were sort of pre-agreed, but also, you know, acknowledging when they have done stuff really well and saying that proud of them and stuff like that.

So I think it's just loads of little different behaviours that build it. You know, from the outside in, I've been a huge part of it in my own way, but watching your relationship with Sir, the biggest change that I saw was you went from sort of barking orders at them, like, don't do that, do this, get out of bed, get a job. To speak into them like you was on the same team. Okay, so here's why you need to save money, let me explain it, how can we help you? Here's why this is your wake up time in this house. You became, you treated them with like so much respect and like they were really smart and capable of making great decisions. Even when they weren't making great decisions, you totally changed like the person you were

speaking to. And it's taken years, but now we're watching Seir make good decisions off their own back. And that's, woo. I think it's important just for listeners. It wasn't just me barking orders at C. It was a lack of parenting. So me and C were best friends probably, like before this, they would come over, we would play cod and drink beer. So it was more of a mate relationship. So we were like super... So it wasn't that we were disconnected and I was just ordering them about what to do. It was like we were mates and there wasn't that we were disconnected and I was just ordering them about what to do. It was like we were mates, there wasn't a huge amount of parenting and explanation and stuff.

It was just, we're mates but do this because it's the right thing to do. And I'm not giving you an explanation as to why. So it's mutual respect, they probably have grown in their respect for you as well. Yeah. So what about you? Your greatest parenting triumph? It's going to be the same. It's going to be Cyr. From the moment I met Cyr, when they were 16, I just felt an incredible affinity towards them. There was a lot of similarities between me as a teen and Sia as a teen, but to sum it up, I could feel that they were really lonely and really lost and acting out and therefore pushing everybody away so you end up even more lonely and even more lost. And I think I said to you really early on that I wanted

Seir to live with us. That I thought if we did read all the books, the podcast, do therapy, that we together could build an environment that kicks this kid in the ass the right way. And I just, I felt so convicted about that. Like I just, I knew it was going to happen. And that took, that was a challenge. Your relationship with Sia was really different then. I don't think necessarily you wanted them to move in full time because there'd been so many challenges, which I wasn't part of. So I think that was quite a difficult dynamic to walk through. They did move in with us. We had fights both with ourselves, with Cere.

fights both with ourselves, with Sere. We've had horrendous moments of having strict rules that they ignore. They can't drink in the house and they're drinking at the park. You need to get a job, they leave their job. You need to do therapy, they do one session and then quit. It was really tough. And there was times when I didn't know what to do. However, looking back five years and looking at that kid now, I see this happy, connected kid. They're still seer. They've all still got all their seerisms, but they don't say they're clinically depressed. They don't say they can't work. They don't say nobody understands them. they don't say they're clinically depressed. They don't say they can't work. They don't say nobody understands them. They don't say they're masking all the time. They just live their life. We have a laugh. We have cuddles. We all say we love each other

and they are making incredible choices. They're even looking, they're going to move out in August. going to move out in August. So that it's being part of changing the trajectory of that kid's life. And that's what parenting is. Putting your kid on the right trajectory so that they go on to succeed and make choices without you. So yeah, it's been that. Lovely. Okay. And now it is the last question. And it's just one to sort of reflect on and for listeners to think about as well. How did your childhood shape how you parent one good thing and one bad thing? I think that my childhood has really shaped how I parent and still does.

And part of it, I think, if you think back to me, moved out at 17, had a kid at 18, had this kid that we're talking about at 18, had to provide financially, had to go work, had to work hard. I just had to. There was no choice in it. I needed it to buy nappies and formula and food for everybody. So I think that that has lowered my tolerance for some behaviours, I think. You know, if I think back about, you know, without sounding too millennial, it was like, well, I can slip into, well, I've done it 10 times worse than what we're asking you to do, you know, such that one of the challenges was getting up by 11 o'clock in the morning. And like that for me still is like, what the hell am I doing?

Like, if I think back to what I've had to do, what society's had to do, why is this so hard? Like, and, you know, it reduces tolerance down to pretty much nothing. Well, the part of you that was on a bike going to buy baby formula, working as a cashier to provide for Sear, that part of you that had to walk through that alone, is probably quite resentful when you see someone in bed till 3pm. It makes total sense. Yeah, and I could probably sum up the arguments that we've had. You know, if I look at my story about being sexually abused, parents moved away at 17, had to just get on with it and do it. And then, so I'm over dramatizing this for effect,

but then you're saying we need to sit down and love this kid into getting up into at 11 o'clock in the morning. I'm like, no, fuck that. Like, what are you talking about? I know. And I sometimes do slip into, well, if I can do it, they can... We're not sometimes the expectations I struggle with

because the expectations felt at the time so much lower than what I had to go through. Because they objectively were. And I sort of fell into, we're not asking much, so just do it. And I think that will always be there because that's not going anywhere. Yeah, that's part of your story. But the most amazing thing is how easy would it be to just hate your kid, think they're a failure, kick them out, say you're on your own. You have walked towards love, connection and parenting at every step, even when it was hard. That was bad. Good. I don't know. I think I probably do role model resilience. I think because of everything that I've gone through, every time they panic, I like, I don't, I think I'm pretty calm in any situation, whatever it is, I'm quite, so they've always got a

safe space to, to go to. They always ring you, it's like, I need to speak to dad, they know that you'll be able to talk them through it and assist. So when you say that's a good thing from your childhood, did you learn that from a parent or did you learn? No, I think it's just shaped me because, I don't even mean to sound horrible, but I know whatever it is that either of the kids are going through, I would have gone through worse. Like it's not a big deal. Like it will be fine.

So let's just calmly navigate the situation. And I think why that's so good, because it comes from sort of the bad places that I've come through. But there's nothing worse than phoning a parent and them being just manic and anxious. And I know that that's not where parents felt, so I don't want to be shaming of that. But it just doesn't help the kid. Yeah, they have to know, they can trust that you can deal with it. So they always have that safe place. Yeah. What about you? How did your childhood shape how you parent good and bad? So a good thing is I was really loved. I'm gonna get sad. Oh dear.

It's okay. I've made it through the whole episode. I was really loved by my mum. Yeah. So I had the gift of knowing what it feels like to be like cherished. And it is such an important part of parenting is to cherish your kids. So the way she'd smile if I walked in a room, she'd cuddle me, she'd tell me she loved me. I had that.

I don't think you had that. No, I don't. It's not a thing in my family really. So I've been able to bring that, you know my mum's been dead 18 years, I've been able to bring that into our family, your kids, my step kids, and I see it all the time. The way I just, I'm so, I just love them out loud in the open. And I think I also love you that way. So to bring out loud affection and love and joy, I think that is like a huge benefit of me in this family. Well done for getting through that. I completely agree.

Can we, can you move on to bad? That might, that might just be tears. So is it something bad I went through that I've learnt from or how I'm bad? Well how did your childhood shape how you parent both the good style and the bad style? Okay, so. So not something bad in your childhood, what you're bad at parenting at. Right. So my biggest fight in parenting has been really, really firm, respectful boundaries

and understanding that being strict, really strict in a respectful way is an act of love. So I think you've seen obviously being like loving and affectionate, that comes really easy. But for me, strictness, that really hurt me as a kid. I was hit, I was shamed, I was shouted at. So I was almost allergic. Strict meant being aggressive and deeply hurting your kids. Which of course it doesn't mean that. Which it doesn't. So I have had to learn strict rules, not only protect the kid, they tell the kid that you love them. So I really had to find that voice. So when it's like, we can't shame see it into waking up at 11. You can't call them lazy when then

you're a divergent. We have to let them discover it. We have to love them. And it didn't work. And then I had to learn, here's the house rules, here's why they're the rules, and here's what's going to happen if you don't follow them. That is being strict. Yeah. And I never learned. So I was pretty rubbish, but I'm a bit of a hard ass now. You are, yeah. Just something you quickly just said, you can't call them lazy because they're neurodivergent.

So I wouldn't ever suggest calling anyone lazy because it's quite shaming. Let me be clear, everyone can be lazy. Yeah, of course. Neurodivergent or not. Yes, of course, of course. That was a heavy episode. Well done for getting through the end.

Yay. Hopefully this has, well, whether it's helped or not, or whether you just feel less alone in the constant struggle of parenting. It's a tough gig. We all bring our own childhoods and I just think the best thing you can do is to just think about that kid's future and then rocking and rolling on their own, living a happy life. How do you get them there? And it's very often a combination between a safe, connected house and strict rules. I think the biggest thing we've done is our own work to deal with all our issues, anxieties, avoidance, so we can just be present in a really happy, close family.

And that's a tough thing to do if you haven't had it. This is Late Bloomers. If you have enjoyed the episode, please like, subscribe, share. If not, then... Move on, because otherwise I'll start crying. Thanks.