Lateral with Tom Scott - 109: The blue room

Episode Date: November 8, 2024

Julian O’Shea, Bill Sunderland and Dani Siller face questions about astronautical activities, appliance actions and Allen's abilities. PRE-ORDER THE BOOK: https://www.lateralcast.com/book LATERAL is a comedy panel game podcast about weird questions with wonderful answers, hosted by Tom Scott. For business enquiries, contestant appearances or question submissions, visit https://lateralcast.com. HOST: Tom Scott. QUESTION PRODUCER: David Bodycombe. EDITED BY: Julie Hassett at The Podcast Studios, Dublin. MUSIC: Karl-Ola Kjellholm ('Private Detective'/'Agrumes', courtesy of epidemicsound.com). ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS: Jovi Thorne, Dave Matthews, Jeff. FORMAT: Pad 26 Limited/Labyrinth Games Ltd. EXECUTIVE PRODUCERS: David Bodycombe and Tom Scott. © Pad 26 Limited (https://www.pad26.com) / Labyrinth Games Ltd. 2024. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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What flying animal is missing from this book title? P is for blank. The worst alphabet book ever. The answer to that at the end of the show. My name's Tom Scott and this is Lateral. Hello, welcome to Lateral, and a little bit of behind-the-scenes info for you today. We are recording this show at an earlier time than usual, so forgive us if we take a little bit of time to warm up. We tried solving a test question just before we started recording, and it turned out it was just the instructions for the coffee machine. So we didn't solve anything, but I do now understand how to make a macchiato.

So there's that. Here to see what's brewing, we have an all Australian special today. We start with YouTuber talking about city design and Melbourne, Julian O'Shea. Welcome back to the show. Saying g'day feels like the right thing to do today. Yeah, we can do it. Every time you say g'day, those Brits, they're like, what's going on? What's he saying? What are the words coming out of this guy's mouth? But we can do it today.

We can tell who the rest of the panel is already, but Julian, how are you doing? I'm doing great. I'm doing great. Fantastic to be back. You say it's an early start. No, it's not, my friend. It is evening time. According to three quarters of the panel. Yeah. What are you up to at the moment? What's going on in your world? Making videos. Making videos for the National Broadcaster, which feels like a promotion.

Yes, so you can see my stuff on the ABC, the little Australian cousin of the BBC. I do like how Australia and the UK refer to it as the ABC. The BBC. That's right. America is just NBC, CBS. They don ABC, the BBC. That's right, yeah. America is just NBC, CBS. They don't get the article. That's right, and that pause just kind of matters, you know? The elevation, the status, the. Well, thank you for slumming it with us down

in the podcast world today. No worries at all. You are joined by folks from our very first show, returning guests time and time again. We will start today. Bill, you spoke up earlier, so I'm deliberately going to go to Dani Silla first from Escape This Podcast. Dani, how are you doing?

I'm doing great. I do feel like this is much earlier than we normally get to record. I like that because there are three of us. We got to choose this one. We overruled you. Yeah, you did. I appreciate it. How is the podcast going? It's going very smoothly. We've been finishing off a lovely run of some guest run rooms, so I actually got to play.

I didn't have to do all of the design work for this half of the year, which is always a treasure. And our third guest today, the other half, the other regular half at least, of Escape This Podcast. Oh, that one. Bill Sunderland, what sort of rooms have you been working on in the podcast lately? Well, the thing that's coming up, so we've done this set of fun rooms from guests, which Bill Sunderland, what sort of rooms have you been working on in the podcast lately? Well the thing that's coming up, so we've done this set of fun rooms from guests, which

we do fairly regularly. We have people say, I've written a room and I want you to play it. These are escape rooms to be clear. These are audio escape rooms. Sorry everybody, they're audio escape rooms. I should have put that in the intro. That was on me. You know what? It doesn't… people can figure it out through context, like a lateral thinking puzzle. But yeah, we usually have guests on to play through the rooms we design. Lately, for the last five episodes, we've had guests running rooms for us, which we've done regularly,

escape rooms where we solve all the puzzles and escape. And then I think following that, which by the time this comes out will be already underway, A series of connected escape rooms all set on a cruise ship with various players coming on and taking their turn at a short story on a cruise ship with puzzles and enjoyment like that. You are doing... this is a really, really tentative link, but you are doing the escape room podcast equivalent of The Love Boat. Yeah, exactly! Yes, it is, because it's quite episodic as well. It will be. It'll be the of The Love Boat. Yeah, exactly. Yes, it is, because it's quite episodic as well. It will be. It'll be the Puzzle

Boat. And you can bring in a different guest star each episode who's just there for that one bit of the cruise. Yeah, but then everyone knows that that's the murderer. Sorry, I think I watched a really unique episode of Love Boat. Well, good luck to all three of you. With coffee at the ready, let's see which questions will grind you down and which you'll get in an instant. We're going to start with question one.

Why didn't any Apollo astronauts high-five when they were on the moon? I'll say that again. Why didn't any Apollo astronauts high-five when they were on the moon? Okay. Short and sweet. First pitch. High-fives weren't invented until 1987. You think it was all-

First high five happened in 1987. This is not something that I have ever researched before. Julian, do you know anything about the history of high fives? I'll be honest, not my specialist area, but what is interesting is that everything does have to be invented. And it's so weird to think about things. There must have been, of course, a moment that didn't exist. One I was looking at recently was the introduction of the first roundabout. And you're like, of course, there was a moment in time when roundabouts didn't exist.

But just think about the maverick who had to pitch it. That's right. You could be onto something there genuinely. I wonder if it was an era of handshakes, of gentlemanly fist bumps, of maybe gentle hugs amongst colleagues. That classic Roman arm clasp where you grab each other's forearms and say salve. I find it so hard to believe that people weren't just high-fiving each other for fun. I can only assume the one other logical reason would be that much much like The Simpsons, people didn't have the fifth finger yet, so it couldn't be a high five. Yeah. Oh, they're doing the old mitten two instead.

Mitten two! They did heaps of them on the moon. Bill, we were expecting all sorts of diversions here about static electricity and moon dust and spacesuits, and the thing is, you are exactly right. Oh, come on! Yes, he is! I was absolutely on moon poison. Yes, we are making the shortest podcast ever and I'm down for it.

Think about it, at Woodstock, right, they're holding up like two fingers like a peace sign and then they needed more time, they kept adding more and more as time went by. Would they have only done two if they'd known that there were more options available to them? The last astronauts to walk on the moon, Eugene Cernan, Harrison Schmidt, in Apollo 17 in December 1972. The high five did not become popular until the late 1970s. And obviously it is shrouded in the mists of time. We're never going to know the true origin story. Does anyone want to take a guess at where it might have been popularised? What the big moment might have been?

Okay, late 70s. Surfing culture? Star Wars and Elvis died. I wanted to go like basketball. I could picture being a... like you shoot, you leave your hand up like this, and then someone's like, nice one, baby! And they smack it out of the air. It was sport.

It was baseball. It was Glenn Burke of the Los Angeles Dodgers high-fiving Dusty Baker after a home run in 1977. Now, that's probably not the first high-five in history they will likely have picked up from somewhere, but that was the most likely high-five seen around the world that meant that we now have that as a gesture. That's the patient zero of high-fives. What a contribution to culture. Do you know what that also means? Someone had to invent, download too slow.

You're right. Yeah, we know when high five happens, so we know between then and now. That's the window. I'm sorry, there's still more. The classic thing when someone is going to go high fiving, you do download too slow, is to do the Elvis hair thing, which meant for a while there was the Elvis hair thing, but not its usage as an anti-high-five defence. So anyone listening, there is a PhD topic up for grabs called the invention of all P-parts of the high-five.

Yep. Well, having blasted through that one very quickly, we'll go on to the first guest question, and Bill, we'll start with you. Yeah, lovely. This question was sent in by Jovi Thorne, so if you have any problems, tell them about it, not me. Here we are. During the American Civil War, children would be required to write a number on a piece of

paper, fold it up, and put it in their shoe. And this allowed them to swear. What was the number and why was this done? And one more time for you. During the American Civil War, children would be required to write a number on a piece of paper, fold it up, and put it in their shoe. This allowed them to swear. What was the number and why was this done?

Not where I thought that sentence was going. No, that was a constant set of unexpected words there. Now it is worth remembering that the high five was not invented at this stage. It is off the table. We do need to remember that. That's right. Nothing to do with high fives. That cannot be the answer. The number might be five, but that's not why. I immediately went to those online things. I love reading those on the internet. I don't know if they're real urban legends or whatever

of children in the US writing letters to soldiers overseas and a soldier opening up a letter from a child and one of the ones that went around the internet was just, hello, I hope you don't die. Kids, they write the darnedest thing to soldiers. Now I am not on the right path, obviously, because my brain's like, you write the number down so if the kid gets lost, you can just phone the parent. You can just pick up the telephone, you know, that thing that exists at the time. Just pick it up. So I'm going to give a handball to someone else to chime in some thoughts. My next nomination is that we come up with some Civil War-era swears.

I remember reading something about how swearing changes over time, and it was about Deadwood, the TV series. So Deadwood is famously filled with modern profanity. They talk like they're in the Old West, but there's a lot of F-bombs in there, a lot of really modern swearing. And they were trying to make it as authentic as possible. They talk like they're in the Old West, but there's a lot of F-bombs in there, there's a lot of really modern swearing. And they were trying to make it as authentic as possible. And originally they were using Old West swear words,

which were things like tarnation, which would have been offensive back then, would have been horrible. And it just sounded so corny that they decided to update the swearing to make it feel authentic to the audience, to make it feel blasphemous and profane in a way that makes them not sound like Yosemite Sam from Looney Tunes. Cor blimey. Yeah. I mean, that would have been God blind me way back when. That's where that comes from. It's a minced oath.

On that God, I did think it wondered if it did have something to do with some kind of religious link, some kind of, you know, when you say you're allowed to swear, some kind of... The other meanings of swear. Pre-approval of, you know, you've done your confession, here's your receipt, you've earned a couple of noughties. Or to promise. Sorry. Oh, I said do 12 Hail Marys, but you did 14. Alright, you got two swears. That's right.

Someone somewhere is just getting ready to just hammer a treatise to your door with a nail there, Julian. I'm not entirely sure that's how that works. Okay, okay. Do we think that the war part had anything to do with this, or is it just a coincidence that that's the error? I was thinking it might be swearing allegiance to someone, rather than swearing with profanity. That it might be part of some ritual or some rule that not conscripted them, but meant they were definitely on one side or the other.

Look, I will say, the war is important. If there was no war, this would not be relevant. Be no shoe numbers. Yeah, exactly. Okay. If there wasn't, if there was no war, this would not be relevant. Be no shoe numbers. Yeah, exactly. No numbers in shoes if there was no war. And I will say as well, you're right to be thinking about different forms of the word swear. What other forms are there? You were very close, like swearing allegiance, not quite, but that sort of vein of... Swear an oath, swear a, yeah. I think you are under something. Is it, you've done some

kind of assessment or check, you've signed up for some cause and you're swearing commitment to one side of the civil war perhaps? I mean, the... For children? The number's almost like your barcode check to say, you know, you're pre-approved? Long shot, Bill. How about it's the number of siblings you have? I will say, and this is inadvertently saying no to the number of siblings. Okay.

For everybody who did this, for all the children who did this, it was the same number. Oh. That's absolutely throughout my last thought. Mmm. The same number. If we knew the number, would it be obvious? If you knew the number, you'd be pretty much on your way there. Interesting.

They've got the same number. Because these are kids, it's not the number where they like something triggered, like the age they'd be allowed to do something, or this is the time they'd be allowed. Julian, you are getting closer with the last thing that you said. You're getting close to the idea. Okay, no, it was the idea that maybe it's a time or a trigger at some kind of point, like when they become an adult, when they become... But it's all the same number, right?

Well, when do people become an adult? Their age? Yeah, something about age of majority, the birthday that they hit that age of majority, things like that. Oh! Wait, were some of these kids lying about their age? The same way that folks in the First World War would sign up and claim they were 18 so they could go to war because they would want to be patriotic? Oh, but Tom, they're not going to outright lie. They're swearing an oath. So how do they get away with it? They're not going to lie, Tom. They would never technically lie.

That'd be unchristian of them. They'd be saying something like, Something like, I'm 18, down to my feet. And then the number 18 is written on the feet. You're so close. If you can figure out this pun, there is an 18 on a piece of paper in their shoe. So what do they claim? On my soul, I'm 18. That's pretty good. That's good. That's real good.

Oh, well done. That is good. That is good. It's not quite right. I'm not going to let you. I'm not going to. Class, look, the bell doesn't dismiss you. I do.

And class is not dismissed until you can tell me the pun that all these children made. I am above 18? I'm over 18. I'm above 18. I'm over 18. So the story here is children wanted to join the war. It was the civil war. What else were you going to do other than join the war? But of course, if you're under 18, they wouldn't let you enlist and you had to swear truthfully. And so for people who didn't want to lie, didn't want to incriminate themselves, they would put a piece of paper in their shoe that said 18 and when asked,

how old are you, they would completely coincidentally say, I'm over 18. Fun, fun fact. Some of the war stories are a bit harder to get like a full, like, is this pure apocrypha or are there any cases? But there is one registered, like, recounted case where it happened in terms of voting, where in an election someone had put 21 in their shoes in 1833. H.N. Horan had put the number 21 in his shoes and sworn, I'm over 21 so he could cast his vote. And that is a documented case. When you get an image in your head, just say, picture a Civil War soldier. You don't picture like a 16 year old little language troll. Yep.

Yes. So underage soldiers, most of whom I will say served as musicians, as drummers or medical assistants just trying to help out, not actually go to war, who still wanted to enlist, would put the number 18 in their shoe so that they could truthfully swear they were over 18. This winter, take a trip to Tampa on Porter Airlines. Enjoy the warm Tampa Bay temperatures and warm Porter hospitality on your way there. All Porter Fairs include beer, wine and snacks and free fast-streaming Wi-Fi on planes with no middle seats. And your Tampa Bay vacation includes good times, relaxation and great Gulf Coast weather. Visit flyporter.com and actually enjoy economy.

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Mark Allen is a professional snooker player. During matches, he sometimes pauses to speak to the referee, who replies with information that could help Mark win. Despite this, his opponent doesn't object. What's happening? And one more time, Mark Allen is a professional snooker player. During matches, he sometimes pauses to speak to the referee, who replies with information that could help Mark win. Despite this, his opponent doesn't object. What's happening? I'll be honest, I've been this person in so many sports and activities where I'll be playing a game

and be like, look, can I do this? And due to my sheer like lack of ability versus whoever I'm playing, they're like, I'll allow this one. Good luck. Am I allowed to do this? That's fine. How much is that allowed just in a tennis match? Can Nadal just go up to the chair on pirate? Am I allowed to step over this line when I serve? Sorry, just... Wait, what happens after 40? Is that right? 30, 40? What's next? Nadal has had this long career, but he's like, look, I never actually asked anyone about what's the boundary. And at this point, it's too late to ask. It would be embarrassing. But you joke about that, but when I was a kid, like, no one taught boys the rules of soccer.

Like, it was just assumed that we knew them. You just gotta know them. I didn't think this was weird at the time, but when I was six, seven years old, going in for the first time in PE in school to do soccer, I didn't... You kick the ball towards there, I guess? I didn't know what a corner was. I didn't know any of the rules. You just had to pick this up by osmosis because it was assumed you knew it didn't know what a corner was. I didn't know what any of the rules were. You just had to pick this up by osmosis because it was assumed you knew it.

You know what? I remember a similar experience as a sports kid, specifically with soccer. I didn't play much soccer. I just went in and kicked a ball around, and then at some point someone yells, oh, offside! No idea. No one ever explained offside. I still, as far as I understand, a lot of adults don't know what offside means. Daddy's put on Australia only really discovered soccer in the last year or so when the Matildas crushed it in the Women's World Cup. I think it was a whole country just together going, so football, how does this work again? Okay, I see what's going on. I see this. Good sport. I have one idea. The very few things I know about Snooker. It's got a whole load of different coloured balls.

How colour blind is this man? Oh, that's such a good pick! He's just like, is that a pink one? Is that a blue one? Is that a green one? That is such a good pick. I will accept no other answers. Fortunately, you don't have to accept any other answers because you are entirely correct.

Out of nowhere. Amazing. Yes, we had all sorts of diversions here about the score, about anything like that. No, Mark Allen has red-green colour blindness, so he struggles to tell the difference between the 15 red balls and the brown. Of course. Teddy, as this question got asked, I'm like, I wonder if he needs assistive support? I'm like, maybe he's blind. I'm like, no, that doesn't make sense, surely.

You know, playing snooker, blind, where's the ball? That would have been a fascinating one to pitch and be told you're half right. Why doesn't he have to do that all the time? Does anyone here know the rules of snooker enough to figure out why it's only sometimes he has to do that? You start by hitting the red ones and then you move on to the next colour and things like that and eventually he'll run out of the ones that he cares about or that are difficult to tell. True.

The brown is normally on its spot. Each of the colours has a specific spot. But if at some point there was a big mess of a break and the reds went everywhere or everything got knocked up, you could lose track of which is which. As soon as the brown is pottered, most of the time it goes back on its spot and it's obvious where it is. But sometimes from context it can be difficult to work out. Okay, so knowing a little bit about how snooker works would have helped. Apparently not! Just absolutely nailed it, thank you very much. We will move on to the next question.

Danny, with that wonderful solve, we will rattle on to your question, please. Absolutely. I have a good feeling for all of you about this one. No pressure. The words donna, gyros and shawarma are used for three dishes that contain meat and flatbread. What completely different thing do they also have in common? One more time. The words donna, gyros and shawarma are used for three dishes that contain meat and flatbread. What completely different thing do they also have in common? I don't know if it's helping, but I've eaten my body weight in these foods multiple times. Like, there's nothing better at 2am than a rotating slice of chunk of meat and some flatbread.

I will say, I looked at this question and I said aloud, we've got Australians on this show. and I said aloud, we've got Australians on this show. LAUGHS And it is regional. Like, depending on which part of the world you go to, it'll be a different word that was imported for that, based on which group from which country got there first.

Which part of Australia even matters, yeah. Yeah, that's right. All these Melbourneians, I don't remember, in Melbourne, Savlaki, Yiro? It's time. All these Melbourneians, I can't remember, in Melbourne. Savlaki? Euro? It's time for some Donner conversation here, because I went to Canada and found it's Don-air there.

D-O-N-A-I-R. With a local sauce that is basically sweetened and evaporated milk based. And it's like you've mixed garlic and evaporated milk, and I'm really not sure about that but every region has its own. If you want this to be a controversial podcast just say, and this type of food was of course invented. Oh no, no, no, no, no, no. It doesn't matter how you finish that sentence.

I can hear the complaints arriving already. Click, click, click, click. Okay, so there's another thing they have in common other than describing the food that they describe. I have again a pitch that I worry is just too correct. Mate, I'm gonna get in before you nail it. Cause enough of your smarts. Here's where my brain's going.

Oh, she said Donna. I'm like, that's a name. Donna. These are names of things I reckon that are more than just the food item. Are they names for a certain thing? I mean, that's kind of the question. Unfortunately, that is. No, no, no. But I think it's like a nana. I think it's a grandma. I think it's a family member. I was going to say, I thought to me, Donna is the one that's throwing off my connection to the other two. Oh, okay.

Right? Because when I hear a euro, for people who read it as they read it, or say it as they read it, that's a gyro. Yes. Like a gyroscope that's spinning around. And if I was hanging around, coming up with an Arabic language word that sounded like I was spinning something around, Shwama sounds pretty... spinny. It's a shwama. So are they all words that are just like to spin or like a word? Because you've got spinning meat, you've got a wrapped up...

There is no way, there is no way that hero slash gyro slash however you pronounce it in your region has the same root as gyroscope. But you wrap it up in the meat spins, Tom! You wrap it up in the meat spins! That can't be where that comes from. But you wrap it up in the meat spins! You spin the bread, you spin the meat, you eat the bread. There is a gyrocopter, famously a, you know, Donacopter, a Schwarmacopter, they're all things. But Donna sounds so unspinning.

I can't think of a word that sounds less like I'm spinning than Donna. Like if it was Donna Minogue, that song would never have been written. I mean, that is slightly unfair to Dani Minogue, but... Hey, she didn't write that song! So that's my thought, that they're all kind of whirlpool-y, spinning... Schwamas and gyros. That's just, I'm just saying. But I don't know. You know what? We've got some foodies here, we've got some linguists here, and sometimes

you just have to go with what a word feels like, because once again, you're absolutely right. No! They all mean spinning and rotating in their various languages. What?! They wrap it up and the meat spins, Tom! They... they... That's so good.

There's no way... How do we keep stumbling into these this episode? Like, I can hear our producer unlocking the shiny bonus question already. How? How? That was... that was a gag. There's no way those have the same basis. Really? Turns out Greek is easy. Tom, if you walked into a restaurant, if you're a Greek man and you walked into a restaurant and you said, hey, and I'm not doing the voice, if you said, hey, that meat's spinning,

because yeah, that meat is spinning, and you're going to take that spinning meat and you're going to put it on a piece of bread and you're going to serve it flat, right? No, no, no, mate. I'm going to spin the bread up. Okay. And you call this a, I call it a spin. You'd be like, yeah, that makes sense. You'd be like, yeah, it's a gyro. I get it. If you were going to name that, that's what you'd name it. And I can't help you with the other pronunciations too far, but yeah, Turkish in origin, like Donna or again, I'm not going to try, but in Turkish, Donna, with some alteration to the pronunciation, I'm sure, means rotating.

Gyros in Greek, yeah, it's the same word, it means turning around. And yeah, shawarma also comes from a different Turkish one, meaning rotating. All right, well, we got that one very quickly, so let's move on. On one type of household appliance, you can see a picture of a man wearing a top hat and carrying a ladder. What is the appliance, and what does the symbol indicate? I'll say that again. On one type of household appliance, you can see a picture of a man wearing a top hat and

carrying a ladder. What is the appliance and what does the symbol indicate? Surely it's the device to put your monopoly set into the attic, you know? Your old monopoly set lifter? You know that? It's gotta be. You've played Monopoly once, you don't want to play it for another ten years, so put it up in the attic! You've ruined one Christmas, let's not ruin another. Grab your monopoly lifter and chuck it up!

Why does that sound like an insult? Oh, you monopoly lifter! I really thought, Tom, that expression on your face was just going to be a, oh, and you got it again too quickly! I was confident it wouldn't be, I'll be honest. Yeah, I think we could agree on that. Quick side, not enough top hats these days, just not enough. I can't remember the last time I did housework in a top hat. Yeah, right. It's been at least a month for me. I agree. It's the death of culture. What room are we feeling? I mean, it's household appliance.

It might not be limited to one room, but where would you have your top hat and ladder appliance? What do you think, Miss Scarlett, in the kitchen with the candlestick perhaps? I think my thought has got to be, this is like a fun inventive sort of Twittery kind of way to describe like, oh, when I saw this image, all I could see was a man with a top hat and a ladder. But it was actually like a person with a, I don't know, I don't know what was on their head, but like if it's an appliance, what if the ladder is like the grill of an oven and where, and it's like cleaning instructions for an oven grill.

It's like a big pot and it just sort of looks like it's on their head. Isn't a top hat that they could be wearing that the internet has been like, that's a guy in a top hat. Now I feel like I have to draw a man on a ladder with a top hat that they could be wearing that the internet has been like, that's a guy in a top hat. Now I feel like I have to draw a man on a ladder with a top hat and then turn it upside down and see what happens. Very much. Mr. Squiggle upside down, upside down.

Oh, it's a lattice. It's a, it's a, it's a lattice that the, that your tomatoes are growing on. And the top hat is the pot and the stick figure man is the, is the tomato vine. No, that's not an appliance. Bill, let me tell you, you're absolutely completely wrong. Nothing to do with that. Oh, okay. So the ladder feels like a no to me if they're holding a ladder, you know? It's like a big diagonal striped knit.

Well, am I wrong about the ladders, or am I wrong about the misinterpretation of a symbol? Bill, you are actually wrong in that whole concept. It really is. So it's a top hat and a ladder man? It really is a picture of a man with a top hat holding a ladder. It is iconography. It's not a clear photorealistic drawing, but that is genuinely what it's trying to portray. Okay. Top hat, special occasions, ladder. Back to monopoly lifters. That's right. When there's a formal event, lift up this bit. If you've got guests coming over,

lift this part of the couch and the bed will pop out. He's carrying the ladder, he's holding the ladder, like he's carrying the ladder, like he's not on it. It's just a little infographic of like, top hats and ladders. You said it was an appliance, Tom? Yes. It's not, for example, on a ladder perhaps. No, this is definitely an appliance. And pretty much all houses except very traditional ones are going to have one of these.

On a microwave? A microwavie, if you will? That's not one of the settings I've seen on it. And this is reasonably common, by the way. This is not just one obscure brand having double checked. Because I looked at this question, I was like, I need to check this. No, there are multiple brands of this appliance that have that design somewhere. What sort of, what is something that, yeah, a traditional house would lack? And that makes it sound like it's quite built into it, almost.

Do you reckon the top hat is part of the aesthetic, or that's just become the common symbol of it? Is it like one of the washing machine settings? This is the setting for your ladders and your top hats? Washing machine! But I was going to say it's not a ladder, it's a clothes haul. A ladder in your stockings, yeah. It's the millinery and stocking setting on your washing machine. Those are delicate, I assume.

They're delicate! Hats and stockings. The picture is a quaint reference to the past. Oh, okay. Hey, you know what you might do back in the day in the top hat wearing era? Chimney sweep, maybe. Okay. So this is the heater setting, the cleaning setting for your chimney. Yes. Keep going, Julian.

You know the clean chimney button? What button do you press? It can't be on a chimney because most houses don't, I mean, most houses here don't still have that. That's what the traditional houses have. Yeah. That's right. So if you don't have that, you put a heater instead. Yeah, I'm not giving you that right away, but yes, it is an icon of a chimney sweep. And it is associated with that. So you've nearly got it.

I need you to dial in what that might be representing. So it does feel like we should go towards something heating related, right? Maybe a, I always call it a fume hood, but it's not a fume hood. Yeah, that's what I was thinking. The fume hood over your oven. You know, the fume hood? Whatever it's called a few years what I was thinking the the few the few hood over your over your oven You know the few hood whatever it's called the exhaust yeah, the exhaust yeah There's that or like oven itself you might clean. It's like a cleaning thing you're cleaning the hot thing that's in your house It's the symbol for where the smoke goes yeah, Bill and Julian you've both kind of nearly said it

It goes. Yeah. Bill and Julian, you've both kind of nearly said it. No. You're in the right area. It's more general than that, rather than one specific thing. Exhaust. Smoke exhaust. It's the...

Exhaust. Exhaust. If we just say it enough, he'll give it to us. I reckon so. I reckon so. Twin attacks? Exhaust? To find this picture, which you may not have noticed, you would have to press a special

button or certain key combinations or something like that. It's not just going to be on there and obvious, which is why you may never have noticed, you would have to press a special button or certain key combinations or something like that. It's not just going to be on there and obvious, which is why you may never have noticed it. Is it like an oven cleaning setting? Like you put your oven into exhaust mode? Something mode, yeah. It is actually called chimney sweep mode. Chimney sweep mode on your Roomba and then you put it in the oven. No, you're right that it's on a boiler. You're right that it's chimney-sweet mode on a boiler. It sounds like he's talking to a lot of Australians who don't have a lot of boilers down under.

They're not big boiler-based countries. Or at the very least, a lot of people who live in apartments and don't have to engage with that sort of thing because someone else does it for them. Fair enough. Why might you put the boiler into chimney-sweet mode? Which is slang. It's self-clean? Is it a flush? You know what, that's close enough. It's maintenance mode. It is the setting that allows you to go outside all of the normal parameters. You might want to run it over the temperature it's normally allowed to go.

You might want to just have it only exhaust and not actually heat things. Whenever you want to do something weird with it, with a professional around, you put it into what is known as chimney sweep mode. But what you forgot about is that in Australia, when it's hot, we just want it to get really cold. When it's cold, we all freeze in our cold houses and nobody is warm in the entire country. And we're so sad and no one's ever tried

to fix this problem. And no one sympathizes because they just say, it's Australia, how cold could it be? They're like, oh yeah, it's not that cold. And we're like, look, it's 10 degrees, but it's really cold. Do you know what we could do? With a boiler, with a chimney sweep. Where's our boiler? Where's our top hat and our ladders?

Julian, it is over to you for the next question. The Unbelievable Truth is a BBC radio panel game where four comedians take turns to hide true statements amongst a plethora of lies. Why did one listener re-edit every episode so that the order of the comedians was swapped around? I'll say that again. The Unbelievable Truth is a BBC Radio panel game where four comedians take turns to hide true statements amongst a plethora of lies. Why did one listener reiterate every episodes that the order of

comedians was swapped around? What? One or two episodes of this show. There are some similarities with this, whereas there's a lot of fake information that occasionally some truth flows in. But it's a different game. I mean there are a lot of British panel shows, including one that I've run in the past, where it's basically just lying about things and working out, which is true. We had Call My Bluff, we have Would I Lie to You? We've got a lot of these.

So why would the order of who's speaking be interesting? Yeah, outside of them just doing it as their own fun little thing, like reordering every episode in the order of most lies to fewest lies, or just, I want to see these people in alphabetical order now. I don't have, I can't think of… That is a gag on Taskmaster. If you ever watch Taskmaster, in pretty much every version of it around the world, the comedians on the panel will be seated in alphabetical order.

And that is just a little thing that got put in at some point and became a rule. It's the kind of nerdy detail you'd expect. And now people do in-depth analysis of which seat is most likely to win, and so how likely you are to win, based on the first letter of your name. Well, actually, is it something like that? Are you more likely to win that show if you go first? Or go saying, but even if that's the case, why would you do an edit to reverse that? You said reverse, not randomise, right? It says re-edit so the comedians were swapped around, is what it says.

So it could be swapped in any way. Not necessarily reverse. Because yeah, that was my first thought as well, was for some reason someone who's like, no, the integrity of this game is ruined by the fact that to keep listener engagement, they always put this thing for the last person, and the first person, and so to make it truly random, I'm going to mess them around so people won't know what's coming. There was someone on the Australian version of The Traitors who got cut out of the show for metagaming too much. He's visible in the wide shots.

I mean, I haven't seen this. If the details on this are wrong, I'm getting this secondhand. He's visible in the wide shots. He's introduced a couple of times. He doesn't really say much. He just gets eliminated at one point and no one really mentions or cares about him in the edit. And it turns out that's because it was season one.

He'd worked out how the game works. And he kept saying things like, oh, well, those two came down to breakfast last, so the producers clearly want us to think this, so that means they're safe and they're not traitors. And it just kind of... It was really useful information for him, but just ruined the show for all the viewers. That's just something you've got to keep to yourself. That's like when the casino kicks you out for counting cards. It was really useful information for him, but just ruined the show for all the viewers. So he just…

LORRAINE Yeah, so you got a kick to yourself! GOOSE Well, he didn't… GOOSE That's like when the casino kicks you out for counting cards. He's like, I'm just playing the game! I'm following the rules! Yeah, but you're too good! Get outta here!

GOOSE So because he didn't win, and he didn't really actually affect the game all that much, they just kind of dropped him from most of the episodes. LORRAINE I suppose I would believe that some die hard fan would have figured out the meta game and tried to rearrange things so that it didn't work anymore, so that they could still feel the thrill. GERARD Well, there's plenty of shows that have that problem. If you are 27 minutes into a 30-minute show and they're just starting a game, they're

probably not going to win it. They've probably just been dropped in there to, you know, probably going to crash out early. So with the ordering, instead of being Comedian 1, 2, 3, 4, the new order was 3, 4, 1, 2. 3, 4, 1, 2. That doesn't even make pie. Doesn't even make pie. This is very intentional. So basically, 3, 4, 1, 2 basically just means they took the latter half and they made it the first half.

They want the end to be the start and the start to be the end. Which is odd. And they did it because... Tom, you take it away. I don't know, Danny's the one who's seen some episodes of it. Were they colourblind? No. Alright, I'm going to set a scene here.

Was there someone else involved with this? Like, was the listener editing it and then playing this to someone else? No, quite the opposite. So they were a genuine fan of the show, and they were doing it for their own reasons. Because I was thinking that it might be those people who watch a game show while their partner is not around, so they know the answers in advance and can pretend to be clever. And there was some trick in doing that that...

No, okay, never mind. No. I've also got another... You know, I've got all these ideas that don't seem to hold up to scrutiny. It's aired at different times when you cross somewhere, and they started listening to it and they knew that when they crossed over they'd get to the next part, like it would be restarting. So it's like, well, I want to listen to three and four first. And by the time on my regular

drive I cross over into Wales, they're airing it later and now they'll be on one and two. So that's what I'll hear when I get across the border on my regular truck drive. But that wouldn't really make that much sense either because they would have already had the capacity to listen to the whole thing. The timing of the listening to the episodes is key. It's key. Oh. How is the show distributed?

Is this a radio show? Is this a podcast? Radio. Radio show and podcast. It is a radio show. So the way the show works is, yeah, each of the comedians is kind of a standalone piece. Oh, I think this person's just quirky. That is a quirky character.

Yeah, this is a quirky person. That's it. Now, the episodes of the show, they are fairly long is something to note, which is part of it. Do they always save the best guests for last, and this person's just like, look, I'm going to fall asleep by the end. So why don't I get the best guests first and then the other two while I'm falling asleep? Cause I listen to podcasts when I go to bed or I listen, I download this and I listen to it when I fall asleep. And so they were like first two boring, it's always the same people. That's always there. They build up to the good ones. You are so close my friend. It is about listening while falling asleep. Finish it off.

There are plenty of shows that will reorder the questions, the players, even the episodes in a season, to move things around and make the dramatic arc better, or just put the good ones first so people keep listening. Mate, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You're really close there. The reason is, is they like to listen when they fall asleep when they go to bed. So yeah. So they listen to the last two not just because they're the best, but because the first two are always the same host and they're one of the first two.

And they don't want to listen to themselves. Or it gives them two versions to listen to. No, because you could just pop... Are they uncertain of when they fell asleep and then they have to listen to the other episode the next day? Like the edited one is there so they can hear the bits that they missed the previous night? Spot on. That's exactly right.

They listen to the show, they hear comedian one, they hear comedian two, somewhere along the way they fall asleep. They try again the next day, they fall asleep at the same point, so they get to listen to all the favourite, they show again and catch up with the ones that they're normally asleep by. Interesting. I should try that with a couple of movies. I've got a couple of movies where I always fall asleep at the same point. Deep Impact, I'm so sorry. Try Memento for that, that'll work well. Ha ha ha!

So yeah, it broadly gives you two listings to the show. They're only standalone, but the only downside is some of the callback jokes don't quite work. So give yourself a high five if you've done that to this show right now. As we suspected earlier, our producer has unlocked the shiny bonus question because there were some very quick solves in there. This question has been sent in by Jeff. Thank you very much, Jeff.

In 2017, why did a New York store open a Robin's Egg Blue Room so that people could fulfill a 56-year-old ambition? I'll say that again. In 2017, why did a New York store open a Robin's Egg blue room so that people could fulfill a 56-year-old ambition? I've got a guess. You've got it. I've got a guess, so I might draw something.

Well, Danny, what was 56 years before 2017? Well, that helped a little bit, possibly. I could be super wrong, but I'm drawing it anyway. 2017. What is it? 1960? Yeah, so like 1961? 1961.

1961. What was the, what were the big bands at the time? What was the big, big events at the time? Oh, there was the Blue Room Band, where they said, everybody come and dance in the Blue Room. Everybody loves the Blue Room. It's 1961 and I love the Blue Room. Dance with me. And everyone was like, I'd love that.

Robin Egg Blue, Robin Egg Blue, Robin Egg Blue, Robin Egg Blue. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's the chorus. I didn't think we could sing that though. They might not have the rights. That's right. Until you got to the third line of that, Bill, I was genuinely convinced that was a real song.

So it's a real song. It's about the Blue Room of that, Bill, I was genuinely convinced that was a real song. It's a real song! It's about the Blue Room! Now that was my lie. Here comes my truth. When did Breakfast at Tiffany's come out? Can I show you my picture? It does indeed say Breakfast at Tiffany's, and that is the correct answer.

Yes. My picture is two very fancily dressed women with lots of jewellery eating some breakfast. Yes. Yeah, there must have been a blue room in that movie. I believe Tiffany's is associated with a light blue colour, right? Oh, well there you go. So they had a breakfast nook. Yes, they specifically opened a little dining room so that people could in fact have breakfast at Tiffany's, which was not possible until 2017.

Wonderful. Which brings us to the question right at the start. What flying animal is missing from this book title? P is for blank. The worst alphabet book ever. I think we've proven ourselves in tune with childlike trolls in this episode. I think we can get that. I feel good. I don't. I'm just thinking of like in tune with childlike trolls in this episode. I think we can get that. I feel good. I don't. I'm just thinking of like, Pig with wings. Whoa, whoa, whoa!

Ooh! Oh, pterodactyl! It's pterodactyl! I was going to say, Julian, I think you had it and then kind of had that snipe from you, like a pterodactyl swooping down and stealing... I think it's pterodactyl. So if you want to edit that in, David, as I put my answer over the top, I'll go first. Pterodactyl. What were you going to guess, Bill? What were you going to guess?

I was going to say it was a penguin and it was bad just because it's incorrect information. Yes, this is a book released in 2018 by Chris Carpenter and Raj Haldar. It is full of words that use silent letters. And this is something I've also heard, which is the Devil's Phonetic Alphabet. Which has things like A is for Aural, C is for Q, D is for Gin, and just lots of words like that. I don't know what the original ones in this book are, but there are various alphabets out there that entirely rely on silent letters. Love it.

Well done to all of our players for some very, very quick and efficient solving in there, and also some good conversation as well. It's literally what the show's about. Well done, everyone. Let's find out what's going on in your lives, where can people find you. We will start with Bill. Yeah, if you want to check out more of what we do, you can look for Escape This Podcast for audio escape rooms and Solve This Murder for audio murder mysteries. Dani, what kind of things can people find there? Oh, you'll mostly on Escape This Podcast find rooms that I, or occasionally someone else, have written and guests coming on and solving the puzzles and winding their way through the stories.

Tom, you're in a couple of episodes yourself, so those are a good place to start. I am. And if you want to hear what producer David sounds like, he's also on those episodes. Oh yeah. And Julian, what's going on with you? Where can people find you? My name's Julian O'Shea, and that's the handle I use making videos about design cities and the great city of

the world, Melbourne, Australia. And you have previously held the camera for me on a shoot at Luna Park in Melbourne. Thank you very much for that. Indeed I do. So if you need a spare camera hand, down you go. Thank you very much to all our players. If you want to know more about this show, you can do that at lateralcast.com. We are regularly at youtube.com slash lateralcast

with video highlights, and you can find us at lateralcast basically everywhere. Thank you very much to Julian O'Shea. Thank you. Danny Siller. Thank you. And Bill Sunderland. Thank you for having me. I've been Tom Scott, and that's been LATR-LATR-LY.