Lateral with Tom Scott - 148: Cheese and laser

Episode Date: August 8, 2025

Tom Lum, Ella Hubber and Caroline Roper face questions about special substances, street squabbles and sporting stakes. LATERAL is a comedy panel game podcast about weird questions with wonderful answers, hosted by Tom Scott. For business enquiries, contestant appearances or question submissions, visit https://lateralcast.com. HOST: Tom Scott. QUESTION PRODUCER: David Bodycombe. EDITED BY: Julie Hassett at The Podcast Studios, Dublin. MUSIC: Karl-Ola Kjellholm ('Private Detective'/'Agrumes', courtesy of epidemicsound.com). ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS: Florence Bourgeois, Mike Sylvia, Jean, Harry Niall Levinson, Conall K., Aurélia Duchamp, Richard Sanderson. FORMAT: Pad 26 Limited/Labyrinth Games Ltd. EXECUTIVE PRODUCERS: David Bodycombe and Tom Scott. © Pad 26 Limited (https://www.pad26.com) / Labyrinth Games Ltd. 2025. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

What is the only food that humans regularly eat that isn't produced by a living organism? The answer to that, at the end of the show. My name's Tom Scott, and this is Lateral. I've got some good news for those of you who are looking to complete their collectible miniatures set of lateral guests. Let's take a look at their stats. With Charisma 21, Constitution 18 and Inside Leg 30, it's Tom Lum. This is a visual joke.

I'm in my miniature pose. Visual gag on a podcast. Visual gag on a podcast that's still a lot of people listen to an audio. And I shrunk down to miniature size. Help, I'm so tiny. Incredible skill demonstration there. How are you doing, Tom? Doing wonderful.

It's so nice to be back on. Next with Dexterity 23, Wisdom 19, and Platform 7. It's Caroline Roper. Oh, it's me. That's exciting. Thank you. I did worry that. perhaps David the producer had made these stats

try to make sense, and I'm happy to report that they don't. Boom. Well, let's see what you say for me. Yeah, beauty 20. Intelligence 20. Yeah, these are actually all percentages. How are you doing, Carol?

Oh, that's... Mildly offended from the get-go. I'm doing okay. Only mildly. We've started well this time. We'll take it, yeah. And finally, with Intelligence 24, Strength 17, and Gasmark. it's Ella Hubber.

I'll take it. We're easy to please, aren't we? Welcome back to the show, all three of you. Together, you are Let's Learn Everything. What have you been learning recently? Well, we are a science and comedy podcast. We learn about science and a bit of everything else as well. Very recently, we learned about dinosaur diet detectives,

how you figure that out. And also the history of podcasts, which I think some of your listeners might know what those are. There's always the chance someone just picked up a phone that was playing it, and they're like, oh, what's this? I saw your post, Tom, about wherever you get your podcasts, and I really, really agree with it. Oh, I'm so glad. No one owns that system.

And I hope listeners who listen to the podcast also think podcasts are cool. Chances are, this is really, I'm really, uh, preaching to the choir, aren't I? Podcasts are good. Yeah, there's a lot of plug-in going on here. I appreciate it. Very best of luck to all of you. Let's hope you roll a Nat 20 on question one. Thank you to Conall Kay for this question.

In what way have a meatball and a worm both been sent to space? I'll say that again. In what way have a meatball and a worm both been sent to space? And I can see Tom Lum nodding already. You know this? Sure did rule that natural 20, baby. Yep. If anyone was going to get this one, I thought it was going to be Tom Lum.

Caroline Ella, this one's on you. Why is it you thought that Tom Lum would get this? Yeah, I must know. Huh? Huh? Well, there might be a hint in that. Oh. Only slightly. Only slightly.

A worm? You're a meatball? What? You are some of the most regular guests on Lateral. And just based on many previous episodes, I'm like, I think Tom might get this one. Okay, so I would guess then it's something to... Okay, I'm going to go off Tom's background, which is in computer science, right? Is that right? You computer science?

I wouldn't go too inside baseball on that. Okay, fine. I was like, maybe it's like, a coding system or something, one's called WRM and one's called MTBL. That's a great shout. My brain went to, maybe they were like projected into space through an explosion or something like that. And you're like, maybe it's like a coding system's name or something. Like very different mindsets here. I think that's great.

I think that's lateral thinking. Yeah. Ella, I know you've talked on the pod many times about the many, many animals that have gone into space. I talked about so many things that were sent into space. And I know, I know Cellegan's is a type of worm that's been sent to space, which is a common model organism. But I haven't, I'll be honest, I haven't ever seen anything about a meatball being sent to space in the, in the traditional sense of like, it being, living on the ISS in a lab situation. A living meatball floating around existing. I guess my question would be,

are these, do you mean, is this an actual worm and an actual meatball? is representative of something else. And if you tell me that, have I asked too much of you based on your face. Okay. Go on, Caroline. Do some...

On command. Go. Go. The only way that I could imagine, like, if it is, like, a meatball is for it to be, like, spaced food meatball, right? And obviously, like, you know,

astronaut food freeze-dried food maybe a worm ended up accidentally entering the mix and you know like a lot of food has a quantity of animal product in it Oh we learnt that recently too

Maybe it's like a Ooh no but that's gross It's really Thanks Ella I feel like that's not a worm going to space That is worm going to space It's a very, it's a small but very important distinction.

Yeah. As the names imply that the meatball is round and the worm is long and thin. I'll say this isn't in accidents. This is something they are proud of. Yes. Are they trying to do some sick-ass dance moves in space? Oh, the worm. Oh, the worm?

The worm and the meatball. Is that possible in microgravity? Don't you need something to like bounce off? for that. Well, that's why they're so proud of it, Tom. Oh, that. And the meatball is a space-only dance move. You go into a cannonball and you spin around in zero gravity.

Okay, but someone actually did that. Like someone, I cannot remember the name, but there is a dance. It's a choreographer, that's the word, who designed dance for zero gravity. Whoa. How do you get into that profession? If I remember rightly, they were married to a science fiction writer. Okay. That makes sense.

Yeah. Okay. So they're proud of it. bit, something round, something long, and not an actual, I'm guessing, not an actual meatball in a word. No, in fact, the meatball is predominantly blue. Oh. You don't want your meatball to be that colour, typically.

Tom Lum, is there a reason why you would have gotten this, or is it just something you happen to know, just so I know not to be thinking down those lines? I could say it's specific to the US astronauts. Yes, that's true. Oh, okay. Well, that doesn't help, actually, so thank you. Is it something to do with getting the American flag into space? Not quite, but you are getting close.

Oh, wonderful. Oh, is it like some kind of, they're symbolic, they're symbolic for something in America that we would be unaware of? That's why Tom is, like, do you have... No, you're definitely aware of this. You will have seen both the meatball and the worm. Is it like how you call New York the Big Apple, you know? In that it's a nickname for something, yes

The Meatball and the Worm Are they pieces of like Technology, like pieces of equipment that are in that shape? No, you were way closer with the flags Okay, okay Are they like characters, like cartoon characters Like figurines of cartoon characters? Where might you see the flag

On a US rocket? On the outside of it, Tom Yes Oh, okay, okay It's just a picture It's just a painted picture of a flag on the side of a rocket What else might be on that rocket? Well, clearly a meatball and a worm

Yep If I tell you that the four parts of the worm Are letters of the alphabet My hint was going to be You will see this on a space shuttle But you will also possibly see this at Hot Topic Yeah, people on the worm Yeah, you will

In fact, I'm willing to bet that you'll see it somewhere in the background of one of your books, libraries, things behind you. Chances are it's somewhere back there. What? It's something that... It's like a pictographic... Something represented.

Yep. Of the US space program. Oh, my... Oh! So, like, the NASA symbol... Yes. Caroline. Because it's round and blue.

That is the meatball. The NASA logo that you know with the round blue ball, the stars, this kind of arrow going through it, that's the meatball. Y'all are weird for calling it. Just putting it out there. Now the question is,

what's the worm? So the worm is NASA, and if you're saying it's four letters? Yeah. Have you ever seen the old NASA logo before the meatball from the 70s and 80s? As we've litigated many times,

we're all very young and fresh Tom Scott. Such babies. The old NASA logo with the just N-A-S-A using a single line for each letter which I think you will have seen in archive pictures. That is the worm.

And the blue ball is called the meatball. Wow. Well, that's really interesting. I can't say we actually figured that one out, to be honest. you gave us pretty much every logo. Well, well, well done, Caroline. And Tom Lum knew it immediately. Ding.

Caroline, we will go to you for the next question. This question has been sent in by Mike Sylvia. Fiona is watching a group of tourists trying to open something. She has been trained to listen out for the phrase, cheese and laser. Why? Said that one more time. Fiona is watching a group of tourists try to open something.

She has been trained to listen out to the phrase, cheese and laser. Why? I know this one. I feel like I've heard cheese and laser. All right. So this time it's Ella sitting out. It's on, oh no, it's on me and you. It's on the Tom's.

Hey, everyone. Welcome to the Tom and Tom show where we take on these problems. Okay. My first thought is Disney. Cheese and Laser and Tourists makes me think of Disney World and Mickey Mouse. and Fantasia. And like, I don't know why tourists would be opening something.

But my first thought is like there is some kind of special effect, and cheese is like the code name for Mickey Mouse coming out to celebrate something. Laser is... My thought was, because it made me think of the accent reset phrase of riselblades. The what? That's how you get into an Australian accent. You say razor blades. Razor blades.

Terrible. Really? That's a terrible one. I just go, no. No. No. So I was like

shot cheese and liza. Oh, like beer can. I was like, is there a... Yeah, beer can for bacon, Jamaican bacon. Beer can. You not heard that one? She's and lies on.

I've definitely heard that one. I'm just scared to use it. Chews and lies on. You're... Kind of along the right... Actually, you're really along. the right lines there, Tom Lum. Is it specifically Australian, I want...

So is it... It's one of those phrases... Oh, oh, wait, wait, wait. Is it a mispronunciation or something like that? Like, it's really easy to hear that phrase because it sounds like something in a different language. Like, they're not saying cheese and laser, but to English ears, that's what it sounds like.

Yeah, you're really along the right lines there. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's exactly it. So just to be clear, not Mickey Mouse. No, I really enjoyed listening to you talking about that idea so, like, passionately, but no. Can we deduce the phrase, or is it in a different language that we don't know? It's, I'll say it's in a different language.

Okay, okay. It's a different language, so it's not even like an accent thing. I'm not going to try and work through every language to figure out what she's on Lazier. Oh, yeah, I think you went French with it, though. Yeah, I did. I'm glad you got what accent I was attempting there. That's less risky that one. So, there was like half a second of silence, so it was just like, oh.

What's the first part of this thing? It's when they try to open something. Fiona is watching a group of tourists trying to open something. Watching a group of tourists try to open something. I'm still stuck on like Disney parks and things like that. There's some kind of hidden door, hidden, like when you do this thing, you have to, like, it's not an escape room because you don't get tourists, well, you get a few tourists for escape rooms, but not many. Like, it's something that has to be manually triggered because they've done a thing.

Are you, are you sure? I saw Caroline's eyes fleet for a pre-cloment, so I'll quickly say my joke, which is that I thought this was like a pull-the-sword from the stone situation. That's what I was thinking. Yeah, something that's manually triggered. Like, you, they have to do a thing. Like, the sword and a stone gagged, a few of the, I don't know which parks this is, but it's remote triggered. So it is Disney.

There's someone watching it. and... Oh, and they do... So if an adult goes up and tries to pull it, nothing moves. But if a kid goes up, it might move a bit for them. That's great. But it's a pickle jar. Yeah.

Yeah. You are actually... Like, your thinking is so incredibly close, but you've gone down Disney again. Rather than the thing that you did say, you did say something in there, which is like... Was it a escape room? It was escape room. Yeah. Do either people do you want to put the pieces?

the final pieces together on that one. Okay, cheese and laser. Watching the people, are they like the, like, behind the scenes person at the escape room? And they're waiting to hear cheese and lays, they hear? They have to say the magic words out loud. Magic words are almost making it too complicated. When you're thinking about an escape room, what might you be? I mean, I mean, I guess it kind of is a magic word.

Please? No. What else might, what might you be trying to open in an escape room? The door to the exit? The door to the exit, yeah, the lock, absolutely. So what sort of thing might you need to be able to open the lock? Is it like a code? A key?

Yeah, no, you're absolutely right. It's a code that is basically exactly it. They're listening for the code number in another language. Oh. Cheats-on-la-jeure, something like that, right? forgot about the language for a second and I was like, you put the cheese in the laser and it opens off the line. It's like Indiana Jones when you hold up the thing to the sunlight,

but it's a cheese in the laser. And when someone yells that number, you know in a few seconds time, the door's going to be open and you need to be there to rescue the people who are now out in the corridor. Well, not even necessarily that, because what's a game master there for, other than just to let people out at the end of it when you're watching an escape room happening.

Your, like, sometimes technical issues happen and they've got to keep an ear out first. Oh, so it's like if the goofs up, this is like the manual, like, if people are like repeating the code because they're frustrated, you have to say like... Yeah, this is exactly it. You're exactly right, Tom. She's listening out for that code word. And if the door doesn't open, she then has to do something. She then has to go and open it for them, basically. So, yeah, Fiona would be the game master in an escape room. And occasionally people from other countries would turn up. Chi-Chi-Zan-Laser, or Chi-San Losa, specifically would be around Chinese. Wow. So it's a good approximation for Mandarin, for these Mandarin words,

for non-mandarin speakers to listen out for, basically. And actually, this story is based on a real room that Mike's company runs. So this is a real-world thing that's happened as well. And now you know the exit code, if you understand the... Untotal Chinese syllables there. She's going to go to any escape room just being like, hey guys, watch this trick. Cheese and laser.

Yeah. And all the doors open. So yeah, you're all absolutely right. Fiona would have been listening out for the code in another language, that language being in Mandarin. Thank you to Amelia Deschamp for sending in this question. For years, the citizens of Levalois-Perey

in the suburbs of Paris, found it impossible to use a road leading out of the city. This was despite the road being in good condition and not obstructed in any way. Why? Say that again. For years, the citizens of Lévolois-Perey in the suburbs of Paris

found it impossible to use a road leading out of the city. This was despite the road being in good condition and not obstructed in any way. Why? I spent so much of my time there being really impressed with your French words I wasn't fully paying attention to some of the question there, so... Thank you for hiding the fact that was take three.

It's appreciated. That's because Tom said his accent practice phrase, cheese and laser, that's one. She's on Lysweather. Yeah. Not obstructed, good working condition. It's a road out of the city. My first thought is there's some video game reason.

They haven't unlocked that area yet. That's why classic reasons you can't cross a road yet. There's a snorlax there, other reasons. So, did you say a year? I don't know if that was relevant or not. Oh. Four years. Okay.

No, not four years. Yeah, yeah. For years. Is it maybe it's superstition about using the road or, yeah, some kind of rule. There's a law that they can't use the role. The mayor has decreed it. It's a private road? Yeah, like, what would have changed is the thing after many years that would allow them to use.

My other first thought was, like, the road just, like, loops back around. It's not, it's perfectly fine. It's just badly designed or something. It just doesn't go anywhere. Was there, like, a broken traffic light that had, like, a red light there for years? And no one bothered even trying to go through the light. Yeah. I, that's...

They're so polite. They were just like, oh, I won't. Thank you. Oh, man. Is this a road that there's like a technology that hasn't been invented yet? Because I know there's a great story that I think you covered Tom about like an elevator shaft that was built before the elevator or something like that. There's a famous story about a building in Cooper Union that had that my dad tells me

all the time about a circular elevator shaft that they thought because they thought elevators were going to be circular. and then when they were rectangular, it was a really tiny elevator inside the circle. So I'm wondering, like, is this a road for, like, I was thinking, like, some electric or mechanical vehicle that can't travel it because it hasn't been me thinking.

It's a lovely answer, and it's completely wrong. The closest we've had, I think, was Ella talking about some mayoral decrees. It's not that close, but you were able to walk down this road with no problems. You just can't drive down it You just can't drive down it Can you cycle a bike?

Does that make a difference? I don't think so, no. Oh. This is anti to what I just said but I would love, truly love if the answer was that cars weren't invented yet. Yeah.

That was the reason you couldn't drive down. I would have loved that answer. You also said bikes can't go down it so it's something to do with wheeled things not being allowed down it than I assume. Can you push a buggy down it? I was just thinking that.

Yeah, you'd be able to do that. Okay. Is it a speed issue? Like, is it just like super windy and scary maybe? Couldn't quite... In the suburbs of Paris? The windy city. It's wide enough for a buggy, but not...

It's not width. It's a normal road. It leads to another nearby town. I mean, the only thing I think is just that it's just... You're not allowed to. Yeah. Yes. There's a bit...

more to it than that. Now, that's fine. Well, let me have it. Is it being used by someone, like, is it being used for military purposes and therefore the public can't not go on it? Then you wouldn't be able to walk on it. The city council here were trying to solve a problem.

Was it always super congested? And therefore they were like, well, to fix the congestion problem, we're just going to ban drivers on there. And, oh? They didn't want to ban drivers. Quite the opposite, actually. They just wanted to make a little bit of a change. They were trying to solve a problem.

So was the other town. Oh, they didn't want... The towns didn't want people from the other town coming in, so you said you can leave, but you can't... No one can enter, or something like that, on this road, on car, or something. Now you're getting very close. How would you...

How would you make that happen? If you were a road traffic engineer, you want to make that happen, what signs do you put up? like one way or oh there's a one way sign on each but like to block the other direction on each side in each town yes both towns complained that the road acted as a bottleneck to other roads in their jurisdiction so they wanted traffic diverted the other way so what happens next oh did they both put up a one way sign that's what i said from both ends no but from both ends so that no one was

Oh, sorry. And the thing is, and the reason I've not said yes is that's not the sign they put up. Surely they didn't just put like a no entry sign up. Both towns put a no entry sign because as far as they were concerned, it's one way the other way. They just never communicate with each other. And they never, wow. That's great. This has now been fixed, level while were the ones who kept their sign.

Oh, good on them. Yeah, yeah. Fought the fight. I'm sorry for missing your answer, Ella. I was just so delighted in coming up and hearing it for myself in my own brain. I was like, wait a second. I'm so sorry. Ella, your question. This question has been sent in by Florence Bourgeois. How has an addiction for American Savory Snacks

helped to save thousands of lives indirectly? Say that again. How has an addiction for American Savory Snacks helped to save thousands of lives indirectly. Indirectly, because my first brain goes to, like, salt having iodine and therefore, like, reducing malnutrition and things like that. But it's an indirect thing, so it's not okay. I was going to say, because as an American, if it was the,

I would just say the answer is savory lifesavers, which we were invented. They're meat-flavored lifesavers. What's a lifesaver? It's a polo. It's a little, it's like a mint Savory polons? Yeah, I know

that's the joke I know I'm the only American here but that was a joke about Americans Right, lifesavers, saving lives got it, that took a while to it's a really good gag just throwing the brain today just slow in the brain today.

It's a good gag for a good chunk of the audience. Yeah. I like your, like iodine answer, Caroline. I wonder if it is yeah, like was it? Like, is it a malnutrition thing?

Like, did it? No. No, it's not. Is it something to do with the packaging? Yes, Caroline. Oh my gosh. What? Did it have something written on it that could be like a good lifestyle?

But it was inadvertently. It was indirectly. So it wouldn't necessarily have been deliberate writing. My thought was in the same way that it's like, oh, the Bible in your pocket blocks a bullet. It's like a laid potato chip. That's why they're so. full of air. It's for your safety. If it acts like an air cushion

when you land. But if you talk to American savory snacks, then Pringles. Pringles. Like, you talk about packaging. Pringles tubes. It's got to be something to do with Pringles tubes, surely. Why does it? Why? Because I'm, because

this is me looking to the question writer's head and going, American savory snacks and the word addiction. The slogan. You have, you pop one you just can't stop or something like that? Yeah, that's, that's got, it's got to be Pringles tubes, but I don't know what you would do with Pringles tubes to save lives.

Because my other thought was like, if it was a plastic packaging of some sort and it was like specifically targeted like hikers or something, could they then use it to transport water or something like that? That's not good, it's Pringle's tubes. Oh, okay. How did you? What?

Cool, cool, cool, cool, cool. Because American Savory snack and addiction Yeah, that's a good show. That's a good show. Let's up in my head. Fun. Was it people getting their hands stuck in Pringle's tubes, going to the hospital, and then the hospital staff being like, oh, whilst you're here, we also found cancer.

You're not going to die anymore. That's so, so funny. That's such a wild idea. I mean, that's why we designed it. It's the same you all. It's not that. It's not that. The way people put their hands into the tube actually is important here.

I'm so upset about that. But that helped. Oh, is there like some, is there, would there be some, um, the, like, if, the, the, if, if, if you can or can't fit your hand in, it's like a test of some, of some, it's a test of how big your hand is. Yeah. Yeah, or something. I'm trying to think some like, like hypermobility thing in your hand or something like that that you need to get checked up on or. No, no, no. Here's an off-the-wall one. You can use Pringles to you. as makeshift antennas. You can do Wi-Fi extension

by some kind of hooky... I do not possess the electrical engineering knowledge. I've just seen the words can tenor around. Nice, brilliant. And Pringle's tubes can act as really directional Wi-Fi antennas. Yes, I'm gesturing like I'm holding a gun and a Pringle's tube here.

It's just a Wi-Fi antenna. It's just a Pringle Wi-Fi antenna. It's not a gun. No, I swear it's a ping of Wi-Fi antenna. Maybe they could save lives because they're like cheap antennas for communication somewhere, something like that. I love it, Tom. I love it. But no, it's the indirectly in the question is important here. The tube itself is not saving lives.

Wi-Fi's indirect. No, the tube is not being involved in the thing. How you... What's that like? People putting their hand into the tube made them realize something. something about their own health? No. No, no, no, no. Is it because they're, it's hard to reach the bottom ones and it's an unhealthy snack,

therefore you're having less of it and it's saving your life? You went too far. You got there and you went too far. It's hard to reach the bottom ones. If you can't get the bottom pringles out, you're way too drunk to drive. I think before then. It's a surprise test. No. So, you know, thinking about, think about how your hand enters that tube and, you know, do the action. Let's all do the action. The Pringle tube action. Listeners, do the Pringle tube action. Everybody do the Pringle tube. Yeah. You kind of like narrow your hand and you slip your whole kind of arm into the tube, right? Uh-huh.

Like, like helping a cow give birth. You're not so far off. I'm sorry, what? Okay, okay. Because my brain was going to those sorts of places and then I thought that can't be it. Are they saving human lives? Yeah.

Honestly, I was saying, is it saving cow lives? It's not saving cow lives. What? Is this, this is not like doctors training. No. No. Sorry, my face can't stop itself. What?

Is it? Training for what? for helping to give, not helping to give birth? To assist birth? Yes, that's it. That's it. What?

What? The Pringle maneuver or Pringlehand. No, no. Pringle hand is taught to midwives. It's a technique used by doctors or midwives. What? I'm sorry, Pringle hand. One word?

The Pringle. No, no. It's two words. Everybody do the Pringle hand. Good evening. this is Jeremy Pringlehand reporting the line So sometimes

I'm there's Pringle Hand I'm going to be helping with your baby Well she would be Or he Let's not get gendered about it

So sometimes when a baby's born Any gender can stick their hand In the Pringle too Exactly Sometimes When a baby is born The baby's head

I'm This is We've derailed Please explain the air I'm genuinely, I'm so curious. Oh, wow. Okay, everyone take a breath. Sometimes when a baby is born, the head comes out, but the upper most shoulder gets stuck

against the mother's pubic bone. So the Pringle maneuver is a way to move the posterior arm. The doctor inserts a hand into the birth canal, and the hand is like scrunched up as if, you know, you're reaching for the last Pringle in the tube, and then the baby can be rotated into a better position to be pulled out. Wow. Oh, my God. That's amazing.

It is amazing. It's really cool, and all I could focus on was how serious everyone went whilst you were explaining it and how much I wanted to laugh during that. There's a lot of hand action in that explanation as well. That's a real Mr. Miyagi moment. The nurses are like, why are you making me pull 100 Pringles from the bottom? It's like, you'll see, you'll see. So actually, the person who said the question is a finally-eared midwifery student,

and they're taught that this problem is relatively common emergency, so it gets really drummed into them that they have to do this. Thank you for realising during your studies that that was a really good lateral question. Exactly, exactly, yeah. Thank you to Richard Sanderson for this next question. When football teams play at the Estadio Milton Correa in Maccapa, northern Brazil, it's sometimes said that both sides are playing for the honour

of something much bigger than their team. team. How? I'll say that again. When football teams play at the Estadio Milton Correa in Maccapa, northern Brazil, it's sometimes said that both sides are playing for the honour of something much bigger than their team. How? I have butchered the pronunciation of the Brazilian town in there. Doubtless the emphasis is some other way on that. Does it matter who the opposing team is in this one? So what's bigger than their team? Their town. Their town name is perhaps particularly important, although we wouldn't know because Tom butchered it.

It's an M, a C, and a P, and there's some vowels between them, and I apologize to the entire nation of Brazil. Yes, you should. Is the giant statue of Jesus Christ in Brazil? Is that the one? You know what I'm talking about? Yeah. Okay.

That is, I don't think, northern Brazil. Okay, because I was like, that's a big honor. That's a literally bigger. If you can kick the ball over it, then that's the big honor that you get. What's a bigger honor than your town when you're playing for a, playing a game, a match? Being on lateral. Can I get a hit for that? When you're playing football, it's bigger.

Okay. It's football. You said football, right? Yes, football teams. So soccer for the Americans. Brazilians really love football. I don't know. Is something on the line? And also, I wonder if this is like a small local team. So this is sort of like they're playing for something or if this is like a bigger league that there's some prize.

If somebody sometimes comes to watch and therefore it's like an honour to almost. perform in front of them? There's something very special about the stadium. Oh. Oh, the stadium is where somebody special is buried. And their last request was to be buried in that stadium and then for that team to win every single time.

Otherwise, it goes against their last wishes. Wow, could you imagine? There's a, I live in Cardiff and the stadium, just outside the entrance of the stadium, there is a graveyard where they bury fans, like lifelong fans. Wow. Wow. That is.

Yeah. That's kind of morbid, but kind of cool. Yeah, exactly. So not that, though. No, not that. I'm like, is it a feel? I'm just thinking weird places a football field could be. I'm like on an aircraft carrier and they have to do something.

But how does it, what was the phrase one more time? I'm so sorry. An honor bigger than their team? The honor of something. much bigger than their team. And yes, that word order is important. Honor of something much bigger. I'm wondering if bigger is metaphorical.

Well, the stadium is much bigger. So they're playing for the honor of their stadium. Presumably, then the team. That stadium's location was chosen deliberately. Interesting. Is it something if we knew about the geography of Brazil or locations in it that we could deduce this? Or is this something?

Yes. And you don't really need to tell. much about Brazil for this. The Amazon is in Brazil, but that's not northerly, is it? That's most further down. Is it near the equator? Is that a thing?

Is it on the equator? And then on opposite sides of the field, on opposite sides of the equator. And, okay, playing for something bigger than their team, the Earth, or their hemisphere? Correct. Spot on. It's a hemisphere duel.

Yes Each team is playing for a different hemisphere of Earth This was originally That's metal! That's so cool! This was originally completed in 1990 as the Estadio Ayrton Center It is known colloquially as the zero Because the halfway line of the pitch

Was designed to line up exactly with the Earth's equator Great name too, man Yep, so when the teams play They are each effectively defending one hemisphere of the Earth Of course, halfway through a football game, you switch sides. Yes, you do. So you get to defend both sides of the equator. And then momentarily, the magnetic field switches.

Yeah, they time they have a game, when you feel like a weird spinning, like, whoa, what's happening? That's the game, yeah, yeah, yeah. All the compasses spinning around. It's like, oh, it must be half time. Searchlight Pictures presents the Roses, only. in theaters August 29th. From the director of Meet the Parents and the writer of Poor Things Comes The Roses, starring Academy Award winner Olivia Coleman,

Academy Award nominee Benedict Cumberbatch, Andy Sandberg, Kate McKinnon, and Allison Janney. A hilarious new comedy filled with drama, excitement, and a little bit of hatred, proving that marriage isn't always a bed of roses. See The Roses, only in theaters, August 29th. Tom Lum, it is over. This question has been sent in by Jeanne. In the 1984 computer game

Karateka, players may find that starting the game a specific way caused the graphics to glitch. When calling tech support, users were gleefully told to reload the game after doing something that was both logical and illogical. What was the glitch

and what was the solution? I'll read that again. No, I'll read it again. And we can all simmer on that answer. while I read this. In the 1984 computer game, Kara Techa, players may find that starting the game

a specific way caused the graphics to glitch. When calling tech support, users were gleefully told to reload the game after doing something that was both logical and illogical. What was the glitch and what was the solution? Is it licking? Licking. I was going to say, looking the CD, because we've had a question like this before

where you could make the CD skip. by, like, licking it, right? I don't think that would fix the... I remember that was for a speed-running thing to make the game slow down and stuff. Tom, I'm just stuck on the fact, like, in the way that you're, like, quiz bowl stealing an answer from someone that buzzed early,

but you buttoned... It was licking. You're like, oh, I can't wait to say it. You fool, you buzzed in. It's the right answer, but you buzzed in too early. Also, this is 1984. This is not a CD. This is not going to be CDs, this is going to be a cartridge or something like that.

Very good point. That's a good thought. But it's also the days when if you're doing games at home in 84, it's either going to be some very old personal computer or it's going to be one of the really early consoles. Either way, there's a lot of weird hardware stuff going on here. I'm guessing it's not just turning it off and on again. Yeah, I were like blowing on the cartridge and putting it back in again.

And, like, I've never heard of this game either. No. Is that important to the glitch? No, I don't believe so. I think it's one of those like side-scrolling, like, beat-em-up games, I believe. Very pixely, but yeah, I don't, I don't believe that'll help you. Interesting. I do like the word gleefully in the question.

Yeah. Like, people called for tech support, and it's like, this is a joke, this is a prank, this is some, this is the developers saying they're clever. You are, the gleefully is very. accurate um to the type of thing that's happening here i guess if you're so okay let's think of the era then again 84 what i think the type of thing i think the type of thing it's using would make the most sense here because you have to do you obviously have to do something physical here so either you're doing something to like the computer it's on or the thing that it's uploaded on and it's

not like changing the date on the console or something like that we've had that before that were also There were sorts of weird copy protection stuff back then, because things weren't always online. Piracy was easier, so sometimes the manual of the game would contain additional instructions. There was a game I remember having where every single time you went in, you would have to go to the manual, and it would give you like a little puzzle or a code or something like that. You would have to look up the answer in the manual and respond. So, yes, you could also pirate the manual. just a photocombed sheet. But that's a bigger deal than just putting a file somewhere and copying

just a disc. You wouldn't download a game manual. You guys are really circling on the era of technology and the gleefulness. I know Ella and Caroline, you mentioned something about like turning it off and back on again, right? It's, yeah, oh, you guys are, you guys, I think you guys will get it. Was this a piracy measure? Because it could be that if the game, was pirated. It did something wrong or different. And thus, they were being told, go buy the game, you cheap skate. No, no, this would happen with genuine copies and if you brought it properly. It wasn't a piracy measure. And is it something like, if you were playing the game as intended, it wouldn't happen? Or could this happen to like any player? It's a little

bit of both. Like, this, this, this glitch could happen to a normal person, but if you were doing it properly, it shouldn't happen. Interesting. It's not piracy. It's trying to skip forward. It is purely gleefulness. It is purely... Like, or is it's something that the developers have put into the game as like a joke and then so they, you can do the thing that they say and then, and then it like fixes it, but it's actually just like for fun. It's some form of Easter egg or something like that. Oh. Yeah, I would more classify this as an Easter egg.

Although what it causes users would think is a glitch. But it is more like a prank than it is a, it's two delights the customer service folks on the line trying to help people out. And just do all of the games start like this? like this game is like if it's like a deliberate glitch this was a deliberate glitch for this game I think Tom you might have a better insight into some of the oddities of tech of that era

you mentioned sort of like what was this played on whether it was a console or PC 84 it's going to be a very early nez or it might be a home PC like one of the early amegas or Amistrad a floppy disc Interesting. I mean, yes.

I don't know why. It feels better if I say, hmm, rather than saying... Okay, 1988 is too early for the three and a half inch discs. This would be like a five and a quarter inch literal floppy disk with a bit of wobble to it, I think, in 84. So was the solution to wobble it? That would be so fun.

Like the pencil illusion? I will say... Yeah, like the screen it turns on in, it's wobbly. And they say, wobble it. So, Ella, you are spot on it as a floppy disk. I think Tom might know the specifics of, because I don't know if all floppy disks had this functionality, but I believe, but this was a thing you did with the floppy disk.

Okay, right. It is time for the non-Jane Z person in this call to remember floppy disk. I'm a millennial. If it's a five-and-a-quarter inch floppy disk, the old-school ones, then technically you could turn it upside down, but that would be... Sure could. Oh, what would that do to it, though?

What would that do to it? There were double-sided floppy disks. Oh. Oh, my God. Okay, wait, I've got an idea. The glitch is like that it's... On one side, they have the game upside down, the other side they have the game the right way up,

and they tell you, just turn the disc the other way around, and so you put it in, and you get the right way up. That's exactly it. That's cute. That's lovely. It's so wild that they were like, we have some space on the back. What could we do? Yeah.

Yes. So the glitch is that the game was upside down. The solution was to turn the floppy disk over to side B. The developers of the game discovered that they were able to make the graphics turn upside down by changing a data table. And that gave them the idea to put a second copy of the game. just upside down. That's so fun. Give this joke and this note, which is so great.

Because the label's only on one side of the disc. You would have to make a mistake. You would have to put it in the wrong way up. No one would do that deliberately unless they knew about the glitch. At which point, your game is upside down. I cannot. What I wouldn't give to be a fly on the wall for people being like, turn upside and I go, oh, okay, that worked. Wait.

What? What? Wait. So the developers of the game discovered that they were able to make the graphics turn upside down by changing a data table, which gave them an idea to put a second copy of the game on side B of the floppy disk. And if any player loaded this version by accident, the game's graphics would appear upside down. And so occasionally a tech support rep would have the joy of telling puzzled users, oh, you inserted the game upside down. Just please turn the floppy disk over and reload the game. And the game was created by Jordan Mechner of Prince of Persia fame.

Which brings me to the question from the very top of the show. Thank you to Harry Nile Levinson for sending this in. What is the only food that humans regularly eat that isn't produced by a living organism? Anyone want to take a quick shot at that before I tell the audience? Is it salt? It is salt. Spot on. Yes. That's just a little science fact.

It is. I remember some child in, I must have been like year two or year three at school, like really young. And the teacher is saying that everything we eat goes back to living plants and then goes back to sunlight, everything. And some kid going, what about salt? And that kid, Albert Einstein. And everyone clapped. Thank you very much to all three other players. Ella Hubber, where are you all from? We're from Let's Learn Everything, a science and miscellaneous podcast, and we talk about everything, everything. Things like Tom Lum.

Well, we talk about some silly things occasionally. We just had a big bonus episode where we did a game show, where we each hosted a game show, including a friend of this podcast, Sabrina Cruz, joining us. And also, Tom Scott, for a guest surprise question. Very brief, but so funny. So funny. And where can people find you, Caroline Roper? Anywhere that you can listen to podcasts You can also find more details about all of us

at let's learn everything.com And if you want to know more about this show You can do that at lateralcast.com where you can also send in your own ideas for questions We are at lateral cast basically everywhere There are regular video highlights at YouTube.com slash lateralcast and full video episodes on Spotify Thank you very much to Caroline Roper

Oh, I'm out of breath just watching that Tomlom! I'm going to hold my breath until the next episode And Ella Hubber Bye-bye I've been Thomas And that's being lateral.