Law&Crime Sidebar - Alabama Woman Admits She Helped Mom Push Rival Off a Cliff

Episode Date: August 26, 2025

Years after Mary Elizabeth Isbell died at a nature preserve in northern Alabama, one half of an apparently deadly duo has pleaded guilty to killing her. Authorities say Loretta Carr and her daughter Jessie Kelly beat Isbell and took her to a cliffside before pushing her over the edge. Kelly entered a guilty plea to her role and has agreed to testify against Carr. Law&Crime’s Jesse Weber discusses the twists and turns in the strange case with Alabama criminal defense attorney Michael Hanle.PLEASE SUPPORT THE SHOW: If you’re ever injured in an accident, you can check out Morgan & Morgan. You can submit a claim in 8 clicks or less without having to leave your couch. To start your claim, visit: https://forthepeople.com/LCSidebarHOST:Jesse Weber: https://twitter.com/jessecordweberLAW&CRIME SIDEBAR PRODUCTION:YouTube Management - Bobby SzokeVideo Editing - Michael Deininger, Christina O'Shea & Jay CruzScript Writing & Producing - Savannah Williamson & Juliana BattagliaGuest Booking - Alyssa Fisher & Diane KayeSocial Media Management - Vanessa BeinSTAY UP-TO-DATE WITH THE LAW&CRIME NETWORK:Watch Law&Crime Network on YouTubeTV: https://bit.ly/3td2e3yWhere To Watch Law&Crime Network: https://bit.ly/3akxLK5Sign Up For Law&Crime's Daily Newsletter: https://bit.ly/LawandCrimeNewsletterRead Fascinating Articles From Law&Crime Network: https://bit.ly/3td2IqoLAW&CRIME NETWORK SOCIAL MEDIA:Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/lawandcrime/Twitter: https://twitter.com/LawCrimeNetworkFacebook: https://www.facebook.com/lawandcrimeTwitch: https://www.twitch.tv/lawandcrimenetworkTikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@lawandcrimeSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Wonderry Plus subscribers can binge all episodes of this Law and Crimes series ad-free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app Apple Podcasts or Spotify. An Alabama mother and daughter allegedly teamed up to kill a romantic rival. And now one has apparently turned against the other, taking a deal, promising to testify against the other at trial. The victim's family and friends who have waited years to find out the truth, they are one step closer to getting justice. We're going to sit down also with an Alabama attorney to analyze the plea bargain and what happens next in this very strange case.

Welcome to Sidebar, presented by Law and Crime. I'm Jesse Weber. All right, we have a major update in just a bizarre story out in Alabama. A mother and daughter who were both accused of pushing a woman off of a cliff have apparently turned against each other. That's at least what seems to be happening. Now, we first told you about the case of Mary Elizabeth Isbell here on Sidebar back in February of 2024. That's when then 22-year-old Jesse Eden Kelly submitted character references to a judge saying that she had a sweet, entrusting spirit and was a child of God.

Now that same woman has admitted to murdering Mary Elizabeth, who went by Beth. That's how we're going to refer to her Beth. So let me go back and get you caught up on this case that, by the way, a detective called Inhuman and Brunel. So we go to November of 2021. Beth, who is a mother to a teenage son, went missing from the Hartzell, Alabama area. Her ex-husband posted on Facebook at the time. I actually hate to put this out here on social media, but Facebook covers a wide area. Her son hasn't heard from his mom since September 6th on his birthday, and he's really worried

about her because she always at least calls him on the holidays. I've talked to her family, and no one has heard from her. So he thought about doing a missing person report. Now, that missing persons report was officially filed just after Christmas in 2021. This is according to Fox 54. According to news outlet al.com, officials were able to determine where Beth had been living using her phone records. They got a search warrant for her home, turned up physical evidence that showed signs of a struggle. And that included a bloody handprint.

But there was no Beth. Well, based on statements from witnesses and later details from the suspects, police believe she died around October. October 18th or 19th, 2021. And a big break in the case came in summer of 2023 when DeKalb County investigators got a tip, a very important tip, that led them to Loretta K. Carr and her daughter, Jesse Eden Kelly. Investigators had identified the women as potentially being involved earlier in the investigation, but their suspicions were confirmed thanks to this tip. According to reporting from WAAY, remember I talked about the blood. Investigators confirm that the blood was in fact Beth's, and that's because she had previously

submitted her DNA as part of an old rape kit. But the hand that made that bloody handprint, that was identified as Kelly's, and that was thanks to her prior criminal record. Carr and Kelly, they were brought in for questioning, they were arrested, and they were charged with capital murder. And almost two years after she was reported missing, that is when we had an update. Beth's body was found nearly 100 miles away near Fort Payne, Alabama, at the bottom of a cliff in Little River Canyon National Preserve. According to DeKalb investigators, one of the women led them to the victim's exact location.

In the beginning, we knew that there was a possible body there. We just didn't know where the Little River Canyon is like 15,000 acres of National Park. There's multiple overlooks that run along Alabama Highway 176, and also there's multiple overlooks on the Cherokee County side of Little River Canyon. So through working with the co-defendant, we were able to narrow down a couple of different locations, and that proved to be very accurate and the information that she gave. Now, court filings that were seen by WAAF say that Kelly confessed to the crime, told search teams where to find the victim's body, that she was the person. She reportedly said they wanted to make it look like Beth did this to herself. That it was a suicide. Human remains were discovered on June 28th.

Beth was officially identified on what would have been her 39th birthday. According to court documents that were reviewed by WAAY, the mother and daughter duo, they showed up at Beth's trailer in October of 2021, fought with her. It's believed that Carr hit the victim multiple times over the head with a pistol. And the pair allegedly took Beth to Carr's house, forced her to shout her to shower. to get blood off of her and then took her to Little River Canyon. Court filings indicate that Kelly told police she watched her own mother walk this woman to the edge of a cliff before pushing her off. In fact, WAAF reports that Kelly told police that Beth begged for her life.

And in another chilling twist, it has been reported that Carr visited that same preserve in 2019 and even posted a selfie to Facebook. That's the same area where she's accused of killing a woman. Now, for evidentiary point of view, that's going to be important because it will show that she knew the area, that she visited this area, that this is very specific area where they found Beth. Now, as we're talking a lot about the law here, let me real quick call out an expert on the law. The legal sponsor who helped make this episode happen, Morgan and Morgan, this is America's largest injury law firm. This is a firm with over 1,000 attorneys. You know why they're so big?

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What led to such a brutal killing? What's the why? Well, DeKalb County Sheriff Nick Weldon says the women were all acquaintances. An animosity may have been brewing connected back to a man. a love interest, although I'll be clear the exact details on a motive haven't been revealed as of yet. Maybe we'll get that at a trial. But Kelly, who was in jail in Pennsylvania waiting extradition to Missouri on a theft charge, was eventually extradited to Alabama on the capital murder charge. This is according to news outlet W.A.F. Now, a sheriff's deputy told AL.com

that she was deliberately held at a different jail from her mom to keep them separated. So Kelly was asking the court for youthful offender status, which we'll get more into in a moment, because she was 20 years old when the crime happened. That was denied. But as part of her request, she had multiple fellow inmates submit letters on her behalf talking about her apparent good character. In February of 24, Kelly herself wrote to the judge, I asked that the court to please take these letters in consideration on my behalf of who I am, rather than just when I'm being portrayed in black and white. Eight incarcerated women wrote letters, which included statements like, she is really a bright, well-meaning, an intelligent young woman who I feel could be easily taken advantage.

of due to her sweet nature and trusting spirit. Another letter described Kelly as a kind-hearted child of God. But now, Kelly is admitted to murder. Her trial was supposed to start this week, but instead she agreed to a plea deal. So what happened was her charge was dropped. So her charge from capital murder kidnapping was reduced down to just murder. And she was sentenced officially to 40 years in prison with credit for time served behind bar so far.

And in exchange, she has to test. testify truthfully against her own mother, Loretta Carr, at trial. Carr is supposed to go to trial in December. She faces the death penalty if she's convicted. Okay, so to help me dig deeper into the legal angles of this case, I want to bring on Alabama criminal defense attorney Michael P. Hanley. Thank you so much for coming on, Michael. Appreciate it.

So have you been following this case at all? What is your reaction to it? Because, I mean, unfortunately here on sidebar, we talk about a lot of different crimes. We talk about a lot of killings. this one is incredibly, incredibly cold as it's laid out by prosecutors. What's your reaction to this case? Well, it has an interesting tie-in to my past. My daughter was married in the Little River Canyon up on the side of one of these cliffs several years ago. So when they start looking at the crime scene, it brings back some very interesting thoughts. Oh, my gosh, I didn't know

that. Just so we know that environment, how steep is that cliff? You know, if you're imagining this woman being walked out to her death and being pushed over, what does that scene look like? Well, the drops in the canyon can be 60, 70, 100 feet. Think about the Grand Canyon, but stick it in Alabama where you've got trees and vegetation. And that's kind of the environment you're looking at up there. I mentioned before the social media post or the selfie, post that one of the defendants had there. I mean, it just makes it so incredibly cold and chilling and eerie. Talk to me, let's talk about the law a little bit. Talked about capital murder versus just murder in Alabama because that was a significant difference in terms of

sentencing. What does it mean we're talking about capital murder versus murder? Well, capital murder is just an elevated class of murder. It comes with an additional aggravator. In this, case that aggravator was kidnapping. So it's just a regular murder that occurs during the course of one of the aggravators that Alabama has created for its capital murder system. The biggest difference between the two, other than that additional aggravator, is the fact that capital murder only has two punishments, the death penalty or life without the possibility of parole. A regular murder, here is a punishment of between 10 years and 99 years or life.

So that's the main difference between those two. There's also the particularized intent to kill, which comes along with capital murder. And as we go through these details of this case, I can, you know, obviously the kidnapping component, but the egregious nature of this as well. I'm not surprised that's what the charge was. However, I talked about what her plea deal was and what she was sentenced to. She was, Kelly, she was requesting youth offenders. status even though she was apparently an adult when beth was killed how does that work exactly

youth offender status well in alabama anybody who is under the age of 21 years of age has the ability to apply for you for offender status um it is essentially intended to for folks to get that first bite off the apple um i apply all of my clients under the age of 21 for you for under status, even those who have committed murders. It is very rare to get a youthful offender grant in a violent felony offense like murder. Why is that? What is the judge, what are the factors weighing against a defendant? Well, the court is not supposed to rely only upon the crime that the person is charged with, but that seems to be the primary focus. The court's supposed to look at the history of the individual, any mitigating or aggravating circumstances that may surround the

defendant's life history, and any aggravating or mitigating circumstances that might apply to the actual offense. So there's a laundry list of things the court should consider. We usually file memorandums to the court, memorandums in support of a beautiful offender when we do that, kind of breaking down the law and the category of considerations so and she also by the way had a criminal history so we know that when she was charged in this case she was awaiting extradition to missouri for other charges theft charges how much impact would prior bad behavior impact the kind of plea deal the state would offer here even though you know when we're talking about those charges she hadn't been necessarily found guilty of those right as far as my understanding is but you know when you

think about a potential criminal history. How much does that affect a plea deal in a case like that? Well, if you examine the plea documents in this case, it clearly shows that she has no prior felony convictions. So that was a consideration by the district attorney's office. The fact that she had pending charges elsewhere, you really would have to look at when those charges arose as it relates to this capital murder offense. If they occurred after the conduct of the capital murder, then usually they don't get considered by the DA's office or the judge in, you know, in a sentencing phase. What did you think of this deal? I mean, 40 years in prison, that's a long time. She will get time, you know, served, but 40 years in prison is very different than life in prison or the death penalty. And the timing of the sentencing you thought was interesting, too, right?

I did. There's some speculation that she was going to cooperate. against her mother and that she was going to testify and provide some valuable information to the district attorney in exchange for that plea agreement. What I found interesting was that she pled guilty to an amended charge of murder instead of the capital murder in count one of her indictment. She has a second count in indictment which is a straight murder charge. So they could have dismissed count one and let her plead on count two but they didn't. The other thing that I found interesting was the fact that she was sentenced immediately.

immediately following her guilty plea to 40 years. So any agreement that she may have had with the district attorney's office to appear in the future at a trial in an effort to minimize her sentence is really a move point at this at this stage. Can we expand upon that? What happens if she isn't truthful on the stand? The prosecutors say she's reversing what she said she was going to be saying. She's not being truthful. Maybe she's refusing to cooperate. What? What leverage do they have over her now? I'm not really sure that they have any leverage. That plea and sentence is a lawful plea and sentence.

There are delays that will expire here on the court's ability to maintain jurisdiction over this defendant. And so in a year, if the mom goes to trial and Kelly says, no, I'm not doing it. Or she gets up there and says something otherwise, I don't think the state's got a lot of, of leverage to to impact her sentence at that point but this this could actually work in favor of the state in another way right if she gets on the stand and she starts testifying and giving them what they need it's getting it may be difficult for a defense attorney to say hey you're saying whatever you need to say to get a favorable deal she like i'm already sentenced it's already been done what i could lie if i want to but i'm not i'm telling everybody the truth that's another way

looking at it right absolutely and i had this situation in a capital murder case 10 years ago where a co-defendant was took a plea to testify against my client ultimately she was she pledged was sentenced just like kelly was in this case and therefore you know you have that dual-edged sword you know she's not going to get any benefit if she comes forward and co-op continues to cooperate but i can't cross-examine her on her ability to get a reduced sentence either so Yeah, and that's interesting because, you know, it's one thing to talk about someone testifying in a murder case like this, you know, a co-defendant, but a daughter testifying against her mother. And now you have this added complication about the sentence. Have you ever seen that before? I don't think I've ever seen a child testify against a parent as a co-defendant. I've seen them, you know, their witnesses in a case, victims in a case, but I don't think a co-defendant. I mean, that's an interesting dynamic to say the least. It is interesting, and I've never experienced that in my 30-plus years of criminal offense work. I've had husbands and wives charged in capital murders as co-defendants, but I've never had a child, you know, as a co-conspirator in a case.

What do you think that testimony is going to look like? What does she need to say? Well, she's going to need to tell the truth. And that truth would be whatever she did to assist her. her mother in committing these heinous offenses. And I think the motivation would be key. I think the way of going to that crime scene, right? Because it's, it's the idea was, right? Push her off the cliff. That's the allegation to make it look like something else.

I think they need that connective tissue, right? They do. They're going to have to draw a connection between, you know, going back to the house and cleaning and taking the shower and then moving from there. from there to the murder scene. So they're going to have to have her be able to testify about what the plan was and how it unfold. Does she need to testify in a way to show that she was in fear, that she was reluctant to make her more credible? You know, look, I think about it.

40 years is a long time in prison, but this was a brutal crime. You wonder if that's enough. How does she need to come off to the jury in a case like this in order to get the conviction against her mother? Well, you know, in having done this for 30 years, I'm confident that this summer's Sanford, Somerford will prepare her witness to testify in a way that she is credible to the jury. I understand that there may be some intellectual disabilities involved with this witness, and you'll have to be careful how you present her because of those issues.

But I think you just want to be a sympathetic witness, you know, and of course, defense counsel is going to try and beat her up the best they can. But again, defense is going to have to be sensitive to any intellectual disabilities that might be there to avoid appearing that they're badgering or beating up on the witness unnecessarily. This case was, I don't know if I didn't know if the word is cold, but it was broken after several years of not having answers. It was broken wide thanks to a credible tip. How important is it for people with information to come forward to law enforcement, despite the age of a crime, despite, you know, some of the characteristics of a crime. It seems like we might not be here if it maybe wasn't for that tip. Well, law enforcement is

always looking for information. And a good investigator, a good detective, is always out there looking for the clue that will help them, you know, break open a case and provide them with, you know, credible evidence. And apparently that's what happened. here. So it's important for folks who know something about a crime to be available and to make that known to the police. If you had to defend Carr, what's the strategy? Is it to strike at the evidence of the prosecution? Is it to put the blame on her daughter? I mean, that also becomes a question of how you cross-examine the daughter and what the goal might be. Well, I guess the biggest question at this point, not having access to the discovery in the case, would

be, we know that there's a bloody handprint that belongs to Kelly. Is there direct evidence that ties the mother to the scene of the crime or, you know, to any portion of that planning and preparation for it? And so if I were representing this car, that's what I'm going to have to look at. What are the direct links or the direct evidence that connects her to this? and how do we deflect, you know, some of that away from our climate? What a case, just a savage, savage killing. I can't get over it. Really, you know, the idea of her begging for her life is just hard to get past.

Michael P. Hanley, thank you so much for taking the time and appreciate it. Thank you. Enjoyed it. And that is all we have for you right now here on Sidebar, everybody. Thank you so much for joining us. And as always, please subscribe on YouTube, Apple Podcast, Spotify, wherever you should get your I'm Jesse Weber. I'll speak to you next time.