Law&Crime Sidebar - Depp v. Heard Day 19 Recap

Episode Date: May 20, 2022

Jesse Weber breaks down Day 19 in the Johnny Depp/Amber Heard defamation trial. Hear testimony from Actress Ellen Barkin and more. Was Johnny Depp's career already on the downward before the Washington post Op-ed article? Tune in to hear the biggest moments from Thursday's day in court.PLEASE SUPPORT THE SHOW:Get Surfshark VPN at https://surfshark.deals/LAW83 - enter promo code LAW83 for 83% off and 3 extra months for free!See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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will keep you on the edge of your seat. Don't let your fears take hold of you as you dive into this addictive series. Love thrillers with a paranormal twist? The entire Oracle trilogy is available on Audible. Listen now on Audible. At what point in time did your relationship with Mr. Dapp take it out romantic turn? After I had moved to Hollywood, And he, you know, switched the buttons. Recall what year you moved to Hollywood? Yes, 1994. When you said switch the buttons, can you tell me what you meant by that?

The friendship went from a purely platonic friendship to a romantic one. At that point in 1994, when the relationship turned romantic, do you not... You'll change that to sexual. To sexual. Thank you. For how long did your relationship with Mr. Depp remain sexual? Several months. Anywhere between three and five, six.

And during that period, how long? often would you see Mr. Doubt, that period when it was sexual? I'd say I'd see him three or four times a week. And again, I'm not looking to pry into private details, but can you tell me like where you would see him? Just give me some sense of that. Yeah, he would come to my house or I would go to his house. And both houses in L.A.? Yes, about 10-minute drive apart from each other. actress Ellen Barkin talking about her time with Johnny Depp and as you'll hear things allegedly took a dark turn welcome to Sidebar presented by law and crime where we recap the biggest moments in the day's biggest trials I'm Jesse Weber this podcast is sponsored by Surf Shark VPN when you're online you're looking at videos you're reading articles you're shopping the last thing you want to think about is that your information is being data mined by companies and people that you're constantly being watched and tracked and surveilled, it's very concerning and problematic and a little creepy. But Surf Shark VPN is a company that can solve all of these problems for you in an easy-to-use

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So we're talking the ongoing trial of Johnny Depp versus Amber Hurd out in Fairfax County, Virginia, which just wrapped up day 19. Now, Depp is suing his ex-wife for $50 million, claiming defamation, namely that she falsely accused him of domestic violence in a 2018 Washington Post op ed piece and that that article ruined his life and his career. But we can't forget that Heard is actually counter suing Johnny Depp for $100 million. saying he, through his attorney, Adam Waldman, orchestrated a public smear campaign against her in the media, calling her accusations a hoax. So the day started off with the testimony from people who know Johnny Depp very well.

We heard from Johnny Depp's former friend, Bruce Whitkin. Have you noticed a certain intensity of Mr. Depp's relationships? Yes. You know, when he was younger, he was jealous of Nick Cage or jealous of Adam Ann because my sister-in-law knew them. And was, besides that initial time period, was, did he ever tell you about any jealousy with any other women or any other times? Yeah. You know, he brought up a few with Vanessa, which were ridiculous. A lot of it was in his head and not in reality.

You know what I mean? And what about with Amber? Did you ever encounter any talk from JD of jealousy with respect to Amber? Yeah, there were a couple mentions if she was doing a movie with some guy or stuff like that. In terms of jealousy, would anything make Mr. Depp more bother or less bothered? Like I said, if she was on a film or doing something that he couldn't be around it to see what was going on, I think he'd work himself up. I mean, he tried to clean up a couple times, and he did.

I think he needed that and he needed therapy. And I recommended that to him. He did it a little bit, but then he stopped. Because from my experience, it's deep-rooted issues that he's dealing with. There has nothing to do with him. That's my opinion. And Bruce Wicken said that Johnny Depp basically cut him off as a friend because he didn't seem too happy.

He was providing this kind of testimony. in a prior lawsuit. But he's not alone, because even Depp's former psychiatrist seconded this by talking about the actor's drug use and how Depp would talk about his anger towards Amber Heard and what Depp allegedly admitted was a chaotic relationship. This all showing that Johnny Depp was out of control, obsessive, jealous, dangerous lends to support what Amber Heard testified to earlier in the week. And just to give you an example of that, listen to what Amber Heard's former attorney,

He said Johnny Depp did during the course of the couple negotiating a post-nuptial agreement. What if any communication did you receive from Mr. Depp in connection with the post-nup agreement? I received one telephone call. And whom did you receive that telephone call from? Mr. Depp. Please describe the telephone call from Mr. Depp. My recollection is that he was very mean, that he called me names, and that he fired me on behalf of them. When you say that he was very mean, what did you mean?

Well, my only exact recollection is he called me a bitch. Mr. Depp called you a bitch on that telephone call. Here, sir. I'm leaving. I mean, to really give you a sense of this, later on in the day, we all saw the taped deposition testimony of actress Ellen Barkin,

a very well-known actress. This is somebody who starred with Johnny Depp in Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas. They had a romantic, or, as she would say, a sexual fling. And then she described one alleged violent incident. Did there come a time, Ms. Barkin, when Mr. Depp acted in a way that was out of control with you? Yes.

Mr. Depp threw a wine bottle across the room, the hotel room, on one instance, in Las Vegas while we were shooting fear and loathing. in Las Vegas. Were you, was something about to happen? A fight was going on. Between you or Mr. Depp? No. Who was the fight between you? Between Johnny Depp and his friends in the room, the assistant.

Honestly, I don't remember. And the bottle that, do you remember sitting here today, Ms. Barking, whether the bottle was full of wine or empty? I don't. Sitting here today, Ms. Barkin, do you remember whether the bottle hit you? no it did not um did the bottle hit anyone else no it did not approximately how far away from you was mr death when he threw the bottle across the room so maybe by by that break in the table or a little further down it was a toss and uh saying your day if the bottle

had hit you would it have injured you miss bark was it your understanding was it your understanding saying back then that he was throwing the bottle at you? I don't know why he threw the bottle. And was it, when he threw it, was it in your direction? Yes. Was there other people standing around you? Yes. So he threw it in your direction at a group of people.

Yes. This helps to show the violent tendencies of Johnny Depp, whether or not he was actually aiming for Barkin. But the day wasn't simply about trying to dirty up the actor. It was also trying to show that he torpedoed his own career. and that is an important point for his defamation claim. We heard from Depp's former talent agent, and this testimony is absolutely critical.

And how did it become far more complicated in the last 10 years of representing him? Is unprofessional behavior? Anything else? I think that covers a multitude of things. And that's going to be my next question. What do you mean by Mr. Depp's unprofessional in the last 10 years of your letters? Going up late to set consistently on virtually every movie.

I would get yelled at I never said to him you're a difficult client I never used those words but I was very honest with him and said you've got to stop doing this this is hurting you and it did

and yeah did you still believe that Mr. Depp was the greatest movie star in the world no why not

because his star had dimmed due to it getting harder to get him jobs, given the reputation that he had acquired due to his lateness and other things. That is so important because in defamation cases, we need to know the harm that was caused by the alleged defamatory statement. It's so important. And Hurd is attempting to prove that Depp's career and reputational issues, they weren't due to the allegation she made or the watch. Washington Post article, but rather his own behavior. He torpedoed his own career. It was his own bad decisions, his own bad choices that caused him to suffer harm, including money decisions.

I mean, Depp's former business manager testified that the actor had some pretty extravagant spending habits. Get this. $300,000 a month on full-time staff. $100,000 a month to his private doctor. And this one, I just couldn't believe, $10,000 a day for his former person. private security manager. Clearly I'm in the wrong game, folks.

I mean, we even heard from a representative from Walt Disney Studios who said she couldn't confirm that anyone at the company actually read the 2018 Washington Post article, the very thing that Johnny Depp is suing for, meaning it may not have played a role in Disney's decision to not move forward with Depp as Captain Jack Sparrow and Pirates of the Caribbean 6. Now, I do want to briefly state that the jury saw the testimony of some other witnesses. We heard from an LAPD officer with the domestic violence unit who was called to support Amber Hurd's argument that the officers who responded to that May 2016 incident were heard now says Depp hit her with a cell phone and the police said they didn't observe any evidence of an attack or injuries. Well, maybe they weren't thorough in their investigation.

Maybe they should have taken notes. We also heard from Amber's former attorney Eric George, who was called to the stand to testify about his review of the Washington, Post article. Important to establish that these statements were carefully analyzed to make sure that they were legal, that they weren't defamatory. But we do have to talk about right now the testimony of a witness that I know I personally really was waiting to see, and that is Adam Waldman, Depp's attorney. He is at the center of Amber Heard's counterclaims for defamation, particularly public statements that he made to the media calling Hurd's allegations a hoax. He even got banned from Twitter. He was the one who leaked these audio tapes of Heard to the media as well. The question

is, why did he do all this? Do you have any reason to believe that you did not say the end of Ms. Heard's abuse folks against Ms. Johnny Depp? No, I have no reason to, no reason to doubt that. What was, were you representing Mr. Depp at the time you made this statement? I'm going to refer to it as a I'm taking specific words Ms. Hurd's abuse hoax against Johnny Depp. Were you representing Mr. Depp at the time he made the statement that included Ms. Heard's abuse hoax against Johnny Depp? Instruct the witness not to answer based on attorney client privilege. I accept the instruction.

Why did you make this statement? Same instruction, same basis. I accept the instruction. What were you trying to convey to the press in making? this statement same instruction same basis i accept the instruction did you make the statement on mr depp's behalf same instruction same basis i accept the instruction did you discuss this statement with mr depp before making the statement same same basis i accept the instruction did you discuss this statement with mr depp following making the

statement same instruction same basis i accept the instruction Was Mr. Depp aware either before or after that you were making this statement? Same instruction, same basis. I accept the instruction. Do you mean, did I ever see evidence with my own eyes that something she was saying was false? Yes. To some extent, I have seen evidence of things that show her statements to be false. Two police officers, one, domestic violence trained, female police officer,

who testified over and over and over that there was no damage to the penhouse, which Ms. Hurd claimed was destroyed. That's a direct quote destroyed. There are, I can think of, nine other witnesses, the majority of whom are either neutral or actually Ms. Hurd's own witnesses who have testified in various forms, various times, that there were no injuries to her face whatsoever. Okay, so it's not immediately obvious that Johnny Depp directed or authorized Adam Walman to make these statements on his behalf, particularly because there was only so much Adam Walman can testify to, given the attorney-client relationship, the attorney-client privilege. And also there's a question of whether or not these statements even meet the threshold of defamation,

especially if the jury comes back and says, Herd did defame Johnny Depp. in the Washington Post article. She made up these allegations. So these counterclaims could be problematic for Amber Hurd. But at the very least, at the very least, there's a strong argument that these comments caused Amber Hurd harm. Again, that important factor to consider in defamation claims. As Ron Schnell, a social media expert would explain on the stand, more than two million negative tweets about Amber Hurd were posted between April 2020 and January 2021 and about a quarter of them referred to Adam Waldman. So Hurd's side is establishing a connection between Walman's statements and the backlash that she received.

In fact, to give you an idea that Hurd's agent testified that, well, no one would actually come out and say it, she believes that Amber did lose a role because of Adam Walman's comments and that Amber's career has taken a major hit because of the online bashing. And she testified that she believed it was all of the bad news out there, all of the bad press about Amber Hurd, that led to this kind of petition to recast Amber Heard in Aquaman 2, even though the studio said it was due to a lack of chemistry with star Jason Mamala. And we've already heard reports, and from Hurd herself when she testified, that that role has been significantly reduced,

her role has been significantly reduced in this upcoming superhero film. So as much as we talk about Johnny Depp's case and whether or not he's going to win his defamation claim, we also have to think about whether or not Amber Heard will win hers. Thanks for joining us here on Sidebar. Please subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, YouTube, or wherever you get your podcasts.

I'm Jesse Weber. Speak to you next time. You can binge all episodes of this long crime series. Add free right now on Wondery Plus. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify.