Law&Crime Sidebar - Firefighter Forced Teen to Perform Sex Acts on His Wife: Cops

Starting point is 00:00:00 Wondery Plus subscribers can binge all episodes of this Law and Crimes series ad-free right now. Join Wondry Plus in the Wondery app Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Agent Nate Russo returns in Oracle 3, Murder at the Grandview, the latest installment of the gripping Audible Original series. When a reunion at an abandoned island hotel turns deadly, Russo must untangle accident from murder. But beware, something sinister lurks in the grand. View Shadows. Joshua Jackson delivers a bone-chilling performance in this supernatural thriller that will

Starting point is 00:00:35 keep you on the edge of your seat. Don't let your fears take hold of you as you dive into this addictive series. Love thrillers with a paranormal twist? The entire Oracle trilogy is available on Audible. Listen now on Audible. A gross and shocking crime has been reported in Central Florida involving a veteran firefighter and his wife. The two appeared in court this week accused of forcing a 16-year-old child to engage in sex acts or breaking down the charges against the couple with former sex crimes prosecutor serena townsen welcome to sidebar presented by law and crime i'm elizabeth miller hillsborough county florida fire rescue had to put one of its long-time firefighters on unpaid leave last week after he was arrested on multiple counts of unlawful sex with a minor

Starting point is 00:01:23 fire rescue lieutenant sasha ingle was booked into jail on thursday alongside his wife Alyssa Engel. The court documents in the case are sealed to protect the privacy of the victim. But Florida journalists who have seen the affidavit report, which reveals more shocking details. The report alleges Sasha Engel forced a 16-year-old boy to have sex with Alyssa Engel while Sasha watched. According to the Hillsborough County Sheriff's Office, the investigation started back in April when the teenage victim told a trusted adult about what happened when he spent the night over at the couple's house in March. But authorities say the victim was known as Sasha and Alyssa Engel before the alleged assault. The crime reportedly happened at the couple's house in Riverview outside of Tampa.

Starting point is 00:02:07 When the teen reported everything, Sasha was a lieutenant with the Hillsborough County Fire Rescue. He had worked there since 2004, being promoted from firefighter to fire medic one in 2015, and then on to Lieutenant in 2020. When he was arrested, Sasha was put on unpaid leave. Alyssa, meanwhile, worked as a legal assistant with the state attorney's office. office of the 13th Judicial Circuit from 2018 to 2021. The current district attorney wasn't in office when Alyssa worked there, but nonetheless chose to recuse herself. An executive order from Governor Ron DeSantis called on the 10th Judicial Circuit to handle the case. Part of that order reads quote, the Honorable Susan S. Lopez to avoid a conflict of interest or any appearance of impropriety

Starting point is 00:02:49 has voluntarily disqualified herself and has requested the executive assignment of another state attorney regarding the investigation and prosecution of this case and all related matters regarding Alyssa Aaron Engle and Sasha Alexander Engel. The Honorable Brian Haas State Attorney for the 10th Judicial Circuit of Florida has agreed to accept an executive assignment in this matter. Both Ingalls were brought to court last week to find out about their bond. The state would also ask for pretrial release conditions of GPS monitoring, no contact with minors, no contact specifically with the victim and to stay 500 feet from the victim's residence, vehicle, and school. A defense attorney argued that the bond should be set based on one crime, not three.

Starting point is 00:03:33 But I recognize three charges have been filed. It's really one incident that three charges arose out of. I believe really it's probably more appropriate to view this as one charge. But the judge didn't take that advice. He said a bond of $50,000 per charge for each of the suspects. According to jail records, Sasha bonded out, but Alyssa is still locked up. However, the married couple were arraigned on Tuesday. The Hillsborough County Sheriff said in a statement, quote, it is both disgusting and deeply disappointing to see not one, but two adults joined together to take advantage of a young child,

Starting point is 00:04:06 especially when one of those adults is a trusted authority in our community. This egregious violation of innocence is disgraceful and goes against every value we stand for in this community. We have a lot to break down in this case, and joining me in studio is criminal defense attorney and former sex crimes prosecutor Serena Townsend. Serena, always a pleasure to see you, and thanks for being here today. Thank you. This case is really disturbing on so many levels.

Starting point is 00:04:31 I mean, a firefighter allegedly forcing a 16-year-old boy to have sex with his wife while he watched all of this happen. What was your reaction to this case? Just really disturbing. Obviously, this is bad on every level, no matter what, but the fact that we're dealing with a civil servant, a public servant, a lieutenant in the fire department, Clearly, somebody who knows better, who has chosen a job to try to protect us, right?

Starting point is 00:04:55 Try to protect civilians. And now he's putting this young boy in harm's way. And the wife, who is a former state's attorney employee, I mean, just these are the people who should absolutely know better. They know the law, and they know they're breaking it. And you've prosecuted sex crimes. And for me, when we hear about these stories, my mind always goes to the victim. This is just a 16-year-old boy who, by all accounts, is growing into themselves.

Starting point is 00:05:19 They were probably going through puberty, and then they're taken advantage of by what could have been trusted adults. What is it like for the victims in these types of cases and what goes through their minds? You know, it's very traumatizing. I think sometimes people feel like, oh, teenage boys, you know, they're immune to trauma on this kind of category, but it's not true at all. Studies have very clearly shown, and I've dealt with victims myself, survivors of sex crimes myself, males of this age, And the trauma is deep. They experience it just as much as any girl would, and it lasts.

Starting point is 00:05:56 It's long-lasting. People who are in trustworthy positions like firefighters, police officers, teachers, you're raised to try to trust them and to think that they're there for you, to help you. And now you have the trauma of being exposed to this really sorted and criminal behavior as a victim. It's very difficult to have to endure. and then again, going through the criminal justice process itself is traumatizing. And we were discussing this a little bit before we had started the interview about just the grooming process, where we both were kind of agreeing that this doesn't just happen the first time the boy meets these adults.

Starting point is 00:06:33 There had to have been a process that escalated to the point they felt comfortable enough to commit this crime, allegedly. What are your thoughts about the grooming process and what does that kind of look like in these types of cases? Absolutely. So it would be very weird. and rare for these two grown adults to be in any sort of relationship with a 16-year-old boy. I have no idea how they even know this person. But yeah, it would be very strange for this boy to come over to their house and just have this interaction on the first go. There had to have been some sort of grooming process, some sort of relationship where this boy trusted these two people, trusted them enough, and his parents obviously trusted these people enough to let their son be at

Starting point is 00:07:17 this house. I don't know how many times he's been there, but it's pretty clear that it wasn't the first time. You know, we know from these types of cases that people are oftentimes not caught right away. And so time might tell, and we might find out more about this relationship, and it might be that there are more instances of, you know, criminal activity, sexual activity between these individuals. And that's really scary and really sad for the, for the victim. This case continues to get more disturbing, which makes you think about how scary the world can be, especially if something happens to you and you get injured. That's why I want to highlight our great sponsor and partner Morgan and Morgan.

Starting point is 00:07:55 Morgan and Morgan is America's largest personal injury law firm, and for a reason, they win a lot. They've secured multimillion dollar verdicts and settlements. Morgan also makes it so easy to start a claim, upload documents, sign contracts, and speak to your illegal team, all with a few taps on your phone. And it's just $0.0.0.0. No upfront fee. You only pay them if you win. So if you're injured, you can start by easily submitting a claim at www.4thepeople.com slash sidebar. I think a lot of times when we think of abusers, we think of somebody in a giant white van. But these two in particular, like you had mentioned, a firefighter lieutenant and someone who used to work in the state attorney's office,

Starting point is 00:08:40 who we all think may have just been outstanding figures. But as we can tell by these allegations, which are pretty shocking, that, you know, abusers can kind of come in all different forms. What are your thoughts, especially given that these two, again, firefighter lieutenant and a former legal assistant in the state attorney's office, they should have known better. They absolutely should have known better. And it's, you know, it's scary for regular people out here thinking, you know, we know how to determine who the predators are in our lives. and who they aren't. It's simply not true, and we've learned that that's not true. And it's, you know, it's sad because you don't know who to trust in life, and it just goes

Starting point is 00:09:18 to show you that parents and teachers, you know, all caretakers need to be very careful, and this is not to blame the parents, but we all need to be very careful with our children, and we need to know who we're trusting because we have found that predators, like you said, they don't just ride around in big white vans, there are doctors, there are lawyers, there are teachers, they are everywhere and it's hard to tell who is who you just have to really monitor your children and their lives and the current district attorney in hillsborough county did have to recuse themselves from this case despite even not working with alissa ingle at the time do you think that that was the right move for her to recuse herself yes there has to be no conflict of interest

Starting point is 00:10:01 whatsoever and the fact that this woman worked in that office even if the you know the head prosecutor the DA themselves was not you know intimately involved with this woman or even casually involved with this woman it's it's important that this case be handled by a totally different office otherwise there could be you know a pretty genuine appeal if she's convicted so and looking at some of the bond conditions we have $50,000 on each charge as well as GPS monitoring and no contact with minors or the victim in this case do you think that's appropriate as bond conditions given kind of the severity of this crime well 50,000 seems a little bit low honestly you know we don't know every single detail of the crime yet but obviously it's a felony charge

Starting point is 00:10:49 that's a high level sex offense and you know I think 50,000 is quite low I think probably the reason it's low is because the judge took into consideration the fact that these individuals don't have a prior criminal history they're probably not really a flight risk and And those are the things that are, you know, usually taken into consideration when it comes to setting bail. The fact that they're being monitored with an ankle monitor is very important and very good. So at least if they make bail at such a low rate, which they probably, you know, will or have, they'll at least be monitored by the ankle monitor. But it does seem a little bit low to me.

Starting point is 00:11:29 And how tough is it or what kind of uphill battle is it to prosecute this type of case, given that the angles are married, so when potentially crafting a defense, those two could maybe concoct a story together? What are your thoughts just on, or what's your opinion on kind of prosecuting this type of case, given that the two defendants are married to each other? Right. I mean, it'll actually be very interesting to see how that unfolds from both sides. So on the prosecution side, you know, you're going to need the cooperation of the 16-year-old. Right now, it's very early, and we don't know what kind of evidence exists. We don't know if there's hard evidence, like text messages, phone calls, videos, maybe even DNA.

Starting point is 00:12:10 We don't really know if that exists. And to the extent that it doesn't, the prosecution really needs to rely heavily on this 16-year-old's credibility and his testimony. So that's on the prosecution side. On the defense side, at least right now, it seems like they have the same lawyer, both defendants. I would be very surprised if it stays that way. I think, you know, in order to represent both parties, they would really have to waive any sort of conflict. Both parties would have to do. But it's kind of a dangerous position to take.

Starting point is 00:12:41 I think they should probably each have their own attorney because you never know, as the case proceeds, one may want to try to point the finger at the other. One may be more culpable than the other. And so that'll be kind of interesting to watch as this case plays out. And I can only imagine how traumatizing this entire experience could be for the victim in this case. Do you see this case actually going to trial or do you see potentially that prosecutors may offer the angles a plea deal? I think it's possible that there might be a plea deal here. You know, a prosecutor always has to take into consideration the retramatization of their

Starting point is 00:13:18 victim, right? So this 16-year-old boy has already faced trauma in this experience. But going through the criminal justice process of having to go to court, having to go to a DA's office, being prepped, being asked tons of questions, and having to revisit the issue over and over again. And then, of course, at trial, having to sit in front of your abusers and point to them and testify about them, it's really a retramatizing event. And so prosecutors will always take that into account, the victim's willingness to move forward, the willingness to testify, and how much they have to rely on him in order to make their case. And so it's possible that in order to avoid all of that, they'll make an offer to both defendants to try to resolve the case

Starting point is 00:14:04 outside of trial. And say the angles are convicted in this case, in your opinion, what does justice look like, especially for the victim? Well, you know, justice comes in a lot of forms. We like to say, you know, or we have to say, unfortunately, that nobody's ever fully repaired after going through a trauma like that. And so when you seek justice and you seek to try to make the victim whole again, unfortunately, it never really will happen.

Starting point is 00:14:31 The best thing that you can do is get that victim a sense of closure. And so whether that looks like a conviction after trial or if the 16-year-old boy feels, you know what, I don't really wanna go to trial, but at the very least, let them have to register as sex offenders and let them have to admit to something, whether it's the top count or maybe a lower count,

Starting point is 00:14:52 let them have a criminal record, admit their guilt, have to be on a sex offender registry so that this doesn't happen anybody else again and then you know there's always that you know thought process of a civil lawsuit and what could a civil lawsuit look like in this type of case so a lot of times a civil lawsuit relies a lot on the outcome of the criminal case because the burden of proof is so much higher in a criminal case beyond a reasonable doubt if the defense either takes a plea or loses at trial

Starting point is 00:15:21 then the victim and his family could use that conviction as proof for their civil case which has a lower burden of proof And so they could seek compensation from both parties after the fact if they're so inclined. All right, Serena Townsend, excellent discussion. I really appreciate your time today and always a pleasure to see you. Thank you so much. Well, that does it for this episode of Sidebar. Thank you so much for joining us.

Starting point is 00:15:46 And please subscribe to us anywhere you listen to your podcast, whether it's Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or YouTube. I'm Elizabeth Milner, and this has been Sidebar presented by Law and Crime. You can binge all episodes of this long crime series ad free right now on Wondery Plus. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify.

Your Ad Here

Law&Crime Sidebar - Firefighter Forced Teen to Perform Sex Acts on His Wife: Cops

There aren't comments yet for this episode. Click on any sentence in the transcript to leave a comment.