Law&Crime Sidebar - Johnny Depp’s Attorney Reacts to P. Diddy's Bombshell Decision Not to Settle Cassie Lawsuit

Episode Date: December 4, 2024

If Sean “Diddy” Combs had settled a multi-million dollar lawsuit with his ex Casandra Ventura privately, could much of the backlash against the rapper have been avoided? Law&Crime’s Jesse Weber sits down with celebrity attorney Ben Chew, who represented Johnny Depp in his high-profile trial against Amber Heard, to get his take on the decision.PLEASE SUPPORT THE SHOW: Go to https://ground.news/Sidebar to cross-examine where your information is coming from and be a critical thinker. Save 50% off the Ground News Vantage plan and stay fully informed on the law, politics and more. HOST:Jesse Weber: https://twitter.com/jessecordweberLAW&CRIME SIDEBAR PRODUCTION:YouTube Management - Bobby SzokeVideo Editing - Michael Deininger and Christina FalconeScript Writing & Producing - Savannah Williamson & Juliana BattagliaGuest Booking - Alyssa Fisher & Diane KayeSocial Media Management - Vanessa BeinSTAY UP-TO-DATE WITH THE LAW&CRIME NETWORK:Watch Law&Crime Network on YouTubeTV: https://bit.ly/3td2e3yWhere To Watch Law&Crime Network: https://bit.ly/3akxLK5Sign Up For Law&Crime's Daily Newsletter: https://bit.ly/LawandCrimeNewsletterRead Fascinating Articles From Law&Crime Network: https://bit.ly/3td2IqoLAW&CRIME NETWORK SOCIAL MEDIA:Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/lawandcrime/Twitter: https://twitter.com/LawCrimeNetworkFacebook: https://www.facebook.com/lawandcrimeTwitch: https://www.twitch.tv/lawandcrimenetworkTikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@lawandcrimeSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Wondery Plus subscribers can binge all episodes of this Law and Crimes series ad-free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify. Looking back, why didn't Sean Combs settle Cassandra Ventura's claims before she filed that lawsuit against him, seemingly starting the ball rolling on all of his legal troubles? It's a question that has come up once again. And we're going to explain why. We'll try to answer that question, and we will break it all down with celebrities. lawyer Ben Chu, who famously represented Johnny Depp in his very public case in trial. Welcome to Sidebar.

Presented by Law and Crime, I'm Jesse Weber. When you think about the Sean Combs legal saga that's happening right now, you have to wonder, at least for Sean Combs, could it have all been avoided? I mean, assuming he really did all the things that he's accused of doing, if he didn't do any of that, sure, that would be a way to avoid potential criminal and civil liability. Of course, don't break the law. No, but what I mean is, is when you read all the allegations that are listed in his criminal indictment

and the multiple lawsuits that he's facing, these are alleged crimes and bad acts that were going on for years. And if you take all those allegations as true for a minute, they were happening since the 90s, the early 2000s, and yet this is really the first time he is potentially going to face accountability. Again, assuming he did all of this.

And so you have to ask, ask, why now? Why is this all coming out now? Why is his world falling apart now? The simple answer would be because of Cassandra Ventura, right? She sued him in November of 2023, alleging that she was sexually, physically, psychologically, emotionally abused by Sean Combs for years, that she was essentially forced into sexual slavery and sex traffic, that she files this massive lawsuit against Combs and then they settle the next day the day after it was filed after all of this was already made public you remember what the statements were that were released Ventura said I have decided to resolve this matter amicably on terms that I have some level of

control I want to thank my family fans and lawyers for their unwavering support combs he released a statement saying we have decided to resolve this matter amicably I wish Cassie and her family all the best love. Combs lawyer Ben Brathman released the statement to the daily mail saying just so we're clear a decision to settle a lawsuit especially in 2023 is in no way an admission of wrongdoing Mr. Combs decision to settle the lawsuit does not in any way undermine the flat out denial of the claims. He is happy they got to a mutual settlement and wishes Ms. Ventura the best. Now here's the problem. He settles this after the lawsuit was filed and made public. Everybody saw everybody knew about it. And that led to the beginning of lawsuit after lawsuit, after lawsuit

being filed against him, accuser after accuser coming after him. And it was because of Cassandra Ventura. And I'll tell you what, I'll give you an example. In a recent lawsuit that was filed by this unidentified Jane Doe, who's being represented by Texas attorney Tony Busby, he's representing dozens upon dozens of alleged victims of Combs, at the beginning of her lawsuit, actually, this is language that's presented in almost all the lawsuits that were filed by Tony Busby so far. There was a preface that talks about how first Cassandra Ventura filed her lawsuit. Then it was filed by Joy Dickerson Neal, Lisa Gardner, another Jane Doe, Rodney Jones, Crystal McKinney, April Lampros, Adrienne English, Dawn Richard. And then there's this line. Plaintiff joins many other

victims by filing this complaint in hopes their common voice makes it impossible for Combs to assault another person ever again. In other words, if it wasn't for Ventura, would these suits have followed? And it wasn't just civil. The federal sex crimes charges against Combs that he's currently facing, sex trafficking, racketeering conspiracy, transportation to engage in prostitution, those followed too. In fact, in one of the prosecution's filings, they write, in or around November 2023, federal prosecutors from the United States Attorney's Office for the Southern District of New York working with case agents from the human trafficking squad of the New York Field Office of Homeland Security Investigations began investigating

Combs and others for violations of federal criminal law. November 2023 is when Ventura filed her lawsuit. So what I'm asking is, why didn't Sean Combs just settle with Ventura privately before she filed a lawsuit? Would that have changed his whole life if this lawsuit was never made public? And let's not forget what Ventura's lawyer does. Douglas Wigdor said at the time of the settlement and the lawsuit. As reported by NPR, Wigdor claimed that Combs had offered Ventura eight figures to silence her to stop the lawsuit from being filed, and she rejected his efforts and decided to give a voice to all women who suffer in silence. And he also added, I am very proud of Ms. Ventura for having the strength to go public with her lawsuit.

She ought to be commended for doing so. So should Sean Combs have offered her more? I mean, they did settle the next day. It makes you wonder what was offered. Was the harm already done? I mean, Ventura was able to expose combs for his alleged wrongdoing, make it public, and seemingly settled terms that were favorable to her. Now, the reason I'm bringing all of this up right now is because you might have seen some recent headlines.

You see, law and crime has just produced a podcast on Wondery Plus called The Rise and Fall of Diddy. I actually host it. It's not about self-promotion. I'm not doing that. But what I'm saying is one of our contributors said, Attorney Dante Mills, He said something, and he actually said it in our prime crime episode on Combs as well. Dante said that Ventura came to him before she filed the lawsuit and said, I believe I was wrong by you, and she gave him an opportunity to settle the case before she brought the lawsuit.

Dante also said, I know that both Sean Combs' attorneys and Cassie's attorneys were in conversation and talks to see if they can resolve the lawsuit, but they were not able to, and those settlement negotiations fell through. Now, first of all, despite some press on this, I don't believe Dante was saying. that he had intimate knowledge of what was happening behind the scenes. He was just giving his take on how these negotiations probably went based on the reporting on this story and his experience. But the fact is, this wasn't settled privately. This became public.

And now Sean Combs could be facing the rest of his life in prison. And by the way, as an aside, let me also say real quick, it's not just us here at Long Crime that have been covering these ditty stories and updates for you. Websites all over the Internet are grabbing readers with headlines like Puff Daddy stays in jail for trying to influence witnesses. Woman sues Sean Combs for raping her. And that is exactly where a platform like Ground News comes in. So what they are is a small independent team

that we actually partner with because they can help us deliver just the facts when we report on stories like this. You can go to g-r-o-u-n-d-d-news slash sidebar to follow along while I show you how it works with this Diddy story. So we get a quick summary of how Diddy's lawyers claim prosecutors

allegedly unlawfully obtained his jail cell notes, including attorney-client-privileged information. Remember that? Well, based on every source that Ground News found on reporting on this, the left are clearly dominating coverage, making this a potential blind spot for more conservative news consumers. But it's not just about who's covering the story. It's also about how they're covering it. Well, Ground News calculated, the majority of these articles come from highly credible sources

so you can instantly see which headlines are more objective and which might be skewing the facts. The bottom line here, don't let someone else's spin shape your understanding of the truth. just head to g r o und d dot news slash sidebar or scan the QR code right there and use our link to save 50% off of the top tier vantage plan which offers unlimited access it's the same plan that we've been using so thank you to ground news for sponsoring this episode of sidebar okay let's get back to it and before i bring in my special guests to talk more about this just to circle back to what sean combs is facing now a year later he has been accused by federal prosecutors of committing

serious and violent crimes, that he abused, threatened, and coerced women and others to fulfill his sexual desires, including participating in sexual performances with sex workers known as freak-offs, that he relied on his power, wealth, businesses, associates to do all this, that he created a criminal enterprise that engaged in all sorts of crimes like sex trafficking, forced labor, kidnapping, bribery, obstruction. So again, could this have all been avoided? With that in mind, let me bring in a claim trial attorney Ben Shue, who famously represented Johnny Depp in his very public defamation trial against Amber Hurd. Ben, so happy to have you.

So good to see you. I mean, you are the perfect person to discuss the idea of the importance of when do you make allegations public. Your thoughts on what I laid out. Jesse, it's great to be with you again. Yes, I mean, I'm answering part of your question, I think his life. was irrevocably changed by her filing of the lawsuit. And I think he and his counsel should have moved heaven and earth to settle it prior to the actual filing, because once the filing was done, then the Rubicon had been crossed and it just set the table for all of the subsequent

lawsuits, civil and criminal, as you point out. Was it just as simple as he should have paid her more money? Would this lawsuit have never been filed? None of the lawsuits or criminal charges would have come to? I mean, do you think that's what it was? It was an issue of money? Or is it what I said? Look, Cassandra Ventura, she was able to make this lawsuit public, assuming all those allegations are true. He is now potentially going to be held accountable. His life has been changed forever. And she got a settlement. I mean, she settled on preferable terms. So was it just he didn't offer enough? Or maybe, I'm speculating, was there never? really anything he could have done to stop this from happening?

There may be a third alternative. I like your thesis. In my experience, it's not always just about the money. In this case, obviously, she felt strongly about what had happened to her, and she had a conscience about what may have happened to others. But I think, and again, we're speculating a bit because we don't know the precise nature of the communications, but Were I his counsel at the time, and maybe maybe Bronfman did attempt this, I would have gone to her on what we call the equities and to say, look, you may feel strongly about this. We understand that. But did he has a family? And these are people in his family, particularly his children, are innocent of this. And your going public may have implications on them. So my only speculation is that there are other things, things other than just money. that might have induced her or might have dissuaded her from actually filing the case. Do you think it was also, listen, I won't agree to settle with you, Sean Combs, unless you admit what you did.

You know, you have to put out some sort of admission of what happened to me, and that might have been a breaking point in the negotiations, which, by the way, I have to say, is really interesting, because even after he settles the suit, he denies all the allegations, He denies every allegation. And then when the 2016 videotape comes out of him beating Cassandra Ventura in a hotel hallway, he comes on Instagram two days later and essentially admits that he did that. Now there's a back and forth about was she trying to escape a freak off.

Was it sex trafficking? Was it a domestic dispute? But he essentially admitted and apologized for what happened on that tape. So it does make me wonder if during those negotiations one of the reasons they broke off, And maybe one of the reasons he didn't settle this was because of that caveat. Yeah, it could be. And that may have been something that she really needed prior to settling it. But if that was going to be his position, then what actually happened was the worst of all possible worlds for him.

Because he ended up paying the money and the allegations came out. So I think more thought should have been given to you either settle this quietly and do whatever that's required, even if that required a private apology or some kind of other non-monetary compensation, or you fight it. Because, again, my experience has been once there has been one allegation like this, there are going to be others, especially if you're, If there is substance to the allegations, they're going to come out of the woodwork. I mean, it's multiple lawsuits and now federal charges, and it seems, again, all based on her. I'll get to that more in a moment. But look, you also have to remember this is probably not easy for her to come public with these allegations and expose what happened and talked about the pain that she went through.

I mean, assuming these allegations are true, it probably was not easy for her to make something like this public. and now she's spotlight has been put on her, especially if she's a star witness in the criminal case. But, you know, look, Ben, you represented Johnny Depp and made his claims public. His personal life was public. His personal life was on full display. Text messages, videos, what goes into a decision like that? I would say for anybody, but particularly a public figure, that can't be easy. The risk of making things like that public versus the person.

payoff? Yeah, in his case, these allegations, the false allegations of domestic abuse had already been aired in 2016, you know, in the context of the divorce. So some of these allegations were already out. In that case, also, we were confident, and he certainly knew with a metaphysical certitude that the allegations of abuse were false. So there wasn't the concern about other people coming out of the woodwork. As we said in our closing argument, this is the Me Too case without any other Me Too's because there were no other woman who had ever made this allegations against him. So in that case, yes, it was a decision because he knew that there would be embarrassing texts and other things coming out.

But he knew that he was innocent, and even though he was assuming the burden of proof in a defamation case, so we had to prove, you know, the negative, which is always hard, we didn't have the concern that there was anything else out there. But it's not easy, right? It's just not easy fighting this publicly, right? No, it's not. And there were certainly down moments, and there was a lot of unfair negative publicity, you know. journalists who I had hitherto respected never changed their tune despite the actual evidence that came out. So that is we anticipated some of it, but we didn't anticipate all of it. It makes you wonder, again, how difficult it might have been for Cassandra Ventura to do

this and also for her lawyers to have that conversation with her, again, assuming these allegations are true. Well, and not to interrupt, Jesse, but you make a really good point. And again, I'm speculating, but perhaps Diddy and his counsel thought it was a bluff. In other words, knowing how difficult it would be for Cassie or any other woman or man for that matter who'd been a victim of abuse to come forward, it's possible that he believed that she wouldn't actually do it because they had a long relationship. I'm assuming, and again, this is assumption, that the power dynamic was he was usually in charge,

and maybe he felt as powerful as he was, that she wasn't going to do it. And that's a really, really good point. It goes back to the idea of why now, why is this happening now? And if you take the allegations from prosecutors and you take the as true and you take the allegations from the multiple people who sued him as true, he always found a way to cover it up, he always found a way to pressure people to not come forward. I am curious, though, do you believe that if Cassandra Ventura never filed her lawsuit? Do you still think that this would have happened? We'd be in the place that we are today because, look, she filed her lawsuit right before the expiration of the New York Adult Survivors Act in New York.

It was set to expire November 24, 2020, 23, excuse me, this gave a one-year look-back window to file these kinds of lawsuits for sexual abuse that would have otherwise been too old. They would have been time-barred by the statute of limitations. but she was not the only one. After she filed that, other people filed those lawsuits against him under the same statute. So it makes me wonder, would they have come forward if it wasn't for Cassandra Ventura? It's difficult to say, but again, we go back to the main question, Ben, if she never filed her lawsuit or if he settled with her privately before all of this is exposed, do you think we would be where we are today? Maybe not.

I mean, once the Rubicon is crossed, once Cassie had the courage to file that complaint, it made it a lot easier for lawyers and alleged victims to come forward. Being the first is always, as you know, the most difficult. And so it may well be that if he had settled privately or she hadn't filed it, that he wouldn't be in this situation he is now. And it seems based on what I mentioned about the, prosecutors, it was because of this lawsuit and the other ones that they started investigating. Absolutely.

And you know, it's interesting. She did a lot of this, the spade work for, for the criminal investigators. And what's interesting is according to prosecutors, Combs seemed to know that the floodgates would open for him, because in this filing from the government, in one of their filings, they write specifically following the November 2023 lawsuit, again, Cassandra Ventura. The defendant and intermediaries acting on his behalf reached out to potential victims and witnesses to the alleged conduct, including individuals he did not speak to regularly and had not spoken to in years to attempt to feed those victims and witnesses false narratives about the defendant's criminal conduct. For example, on or about November 19th, 2023, just three days after the filing of the lawsuit described above, the defendant made multiple calls to another victim of his sexual abuse and recorded certain of those calls using the cell phone of a co-conspirator.

During the calls, the defendant repeatedly asked for the victim's support and friendship and attempted to convince the victim that she had willingly engaged in acts constituting sexual abuse. The defendant also assured the victim that if she needed the defendant to, she ain't got worry about nothing else. vailed attempt to coerce the victim into adopting and supporting the defendant's false version of events to protect the defendant. Now, assuming that's true, Ben, he knew that the floodgates would open and maybe like one day after the lawsuit was filed and he settled, he said, uh-oh, this could start everything. I got to jump in there. I mean, again, assuming these allegations are true. Yeah, and that might support the theory that he thought it was a bluff. And once he saw the ramifications of it, he sprang into action.

But that also was a mistake because he went from having civil difficulties to criminal problems, which obviously put his liberty at stake and now he's lost his liberty. You know, Ben, going back to Cassandra Ventura, she seems to be the star witness in the prosecution's case because we believe she is victim one in the prosecution's filings. This person hasn't been identified, but based on the descriptions surrounding victim one, it's consistent with Cassandra Ventura's claims. I don't know for sure, but Judge Suburmanian, who's the judge overseeing this case, ordered that he listed in his order where he just denied Sean Combs' bail.

He lists out text messages between Combs and victim one and writes that this was just hours and days after the 2016 attack by Combs on Ventura that was captured on surveillance footage and was published by CNN months ago. And this, by the way, happened at the Intercontinental Hotel, I believe in Los Angeles. And it says that Victim One, again, who we think is Ventura, allegedly wrote Combs,

I have a black eye and a fat lip. You are sick for thinking it's okay to do what you've done. I still have crazy bruising. So not only now are you thinking if you're showing Combs, wow, right? I could have settled this, could have stopped all this from coming on, but now the prosecution has a key witness where right now the text messages, their video, that could be some of their strongest proof. And it all centers around Cassandra Ventura. I mean, assuming it's her, right, Ben? Yeah, no, I think she's an incredibly

strong witness. We've talked about previously, there's nothing more powerful than videotape and audio tape. And again, I don't know how you explain that, especially. especially since he's already had an apology of his own, that is problematic. So what's the, what's the, you know, look, on one hand, if you're Sean Combs, you say, imagine if he's innocent, okay, imagine he didn't do any of this, any of this, just imagine that. If you're his lawyer, if you're him, you're saying, man, I wish I would have settled that. You know, I wish I would have, I knew who she was coming out of woodwork with this. I wish I should have settled this immediately before it was filed.

But if he's really guilty and he did all this, then in a public interest point of view, it's a great thing he didn't settle because he should be held accountable. And it doesn't seem like investigators would have looked at him. It doesn't seem like other lawsuits would have come forward unless it was Cassandra Ventura. I mean, that might be, I'm assuming too much. But I think that's maybe a fair estimation. No, I think you're exactly right. I mean, this is something where they could have almost. certainly nipped it in the bud, whether it was with more money or some kind of private

apology. But the ramifications, you know, you saw it a little bit in the far less serious, but in the civil context in the Paula Jones case. I mean, that was a case that could have settled for under $100,000. And it snowballed into, you know, what ended up being an impeachment, a disbarment, and ultimately a multimillion dollar payment, had that case. settled quietly, history would have been different. And if you believe what's been going on with Tony Busby that he has been, he says he's going to name big names in his lawsuits, but these big high-profile people have been coming to him to settle the claims so their names aren't made public, you look at something like this and

you can try to understand why. Ben Shue, thank you so much for coming on. It was great seeing you. Thank you, thank you, thank you. Great to see you, Jesse. Hope to see you again soon. All right, everybody. That's all we have for you right now here on Sidebar. Thank you so much for joining us. And as always, please subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, YouTube, wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Jesse Weber. Let's speak to you next time.