Law&Crime Sidebar - Pediatrician Killed Her 4-Year-Old, Staged Body in AirBnb Pool: Cops

Episode Date: July 8, 2025

Neha Gupta faces extradition from Oklahoma to Florida on a charge of first-degree murder after Miami-area authorities say she killed her 4-year-old while on a beach vacation. The pediatrician had claimed the girl woke up during the night and accidentally ended up in the pool. But an autopsy of Aria Talathi’s body revealed shocking new details. Law&Crime’s Jesse Weber breaks it all down with coroner Naida Rutherford.PLEASE SUPPORT THE SHOW: Check out https://americanfinancing.net/sidebar or call 866-891-2821 to learn how homeowners are saving $800 a month on average. NMLS 182334, www.nmlsconsumeraccess.orgHOST:Jesse Weber: https://twitter.com/jessecordweberLAW&CRIME SIDEBAR PRODUCTION:YouTube Management - Bobby SzokeVideo Editing - Michael Deininger, Christina O'Shea & Jay CruzScript Writing & Producing - Savannah Williamson & Juliana BattagliaGuest Booking - Alyssa Fisher & Diane KayeSocial Media Management - Vanessa BeinSTAY UP-TO-DATE WITH THE LAW&CRIME NETWORK:Watch Law&Crime Network on YouTubeTV: https://bit.ly/3td2e3yWhere To Watch Law&Crime Network: https://bit.ly/3akxLK5Sign Up For Law&Crime's Daily Newsletter: https://bit.ly/LawandCrimeNewsletterRead Fascinating Articles From Law&Crime Network: https://bit.ly/3td2IqoLAW&CRIME NETWORK SOCIAL MEDIA:Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/lawandcrime/Twitter: https://twitter.com/LawCrimeNetworkFacebook: https://www.facebook.com/lawandcrimeTwitch: https://www.twitch.tv/lawandcrimenetworkTikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@lawandcrimeSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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will keep you on the edge of your seat. Don't let your fears take hold of you as you dive into this addictive series. Love thrillers with a paranormal twist? The entire Oracle trilogy is available on Audible. Listen now on Audible. A pediatrician charged with caring for children is accused of killing her own four-year-old daughter and staging her death to look like an accidental drowning. Her attorney says it is all a huge misunderstanding. and that prosecutors are jumping to conclusions. We're speaking with a coroner to find out what investigators look for in a case like this and the red flags that led to murder charges.

Welcome to Sidebar. Presented by Law and Crime, I'm Jesse Weber. 36-year-old Naha Gupta is currently in the process of being extradited from her home state of Oklahoma to Florida, where authorities say she killed her daughter during a beach vacation. Police in El Portal, Florida, this is in the Miami area, say that Gupta and her four-year-old daughter, Aria Talathi, checked into a rental property on June 25th.

Two days later, Aria would be dead, and Gupta would be in a police interview room questioned about how her little girl ended up in a backyard pool in the middle of the night. So to talk more about the investigation so far, I want to bring in a special guest. I want to bring in South Carolina coroner, Neda Rutherford. Neda, thank you so much for coming here on Sidebar.

I really appreciate it. Thank you so much for having me. This is a very sad story. It really is. And I would imagine, unfortunately, that in your career you have, you know, seen it all. How difficult is it to perform examinations, autopsies when you're dealing with a child? Honestly, you have to remove the emotion out of it. You have to remove yourself from it. I'm a mom. I can't imagine hurting my children. I can't imagine any adult hurting a child. but when you come across this in my line of work, you want answers. So you take the negative emotion out, like the anger,

and you put yourself into the shoes of someone who will want to know the answer. And that's what my job is as the coroner, is to do a death investigation that is so thorough that we get to the truth. Is the examination of a child, is it different than an adult? Are there circumstances with the body that are just different when you're dealing with somebody that young? Absolutely, especially with the way that. that the medical examiner said that this child died.

So in an adult, when you would see asphyxiation, you're more likely going to see defensive wounds on the person, you're going to see ligature marks, you're going to see certain things because an adult is much bigger than a tiny little child like this little girl was. And so the examination turns a lot to the internal structures.

You're looking at the inside of the mouth, even, the tongue, the teeth, the gums. to see what exactly happened and how this person may have been able to overtake this child. We're going to get to the autopsy results because there's a lot to get into there. But here's what we seem to know so far about what led up to four-year-old Aria's death. So this is the timeline according to the warrant in this case. Around 3.40 a.m. on Friday, June 27th, L. Portal Police and Miami-Dade Fire Rescue responded to a rental home. And Gupta directed them to the backyard where they found this little

girl submerged in the deep end of the backyard pool. Now, Gupta would later tell police that she herself couldn't swim, so apparently she couldn't really jump in herself to save her daughter. They pulled the little girl out. They started doing CPR, rushed her to a hospital, but she was pronounced dead at 4.30 a.m. This is, again, according to the warrant in this case. Now, Neda, the warrant for Gupta's arrest says that the little girl was submerged in the water. It's unclear how far under the water she was, but what could cause her to be submerged versus floating to the top if we just take that as true? Well, one, the way that a body reacts to water when it is actively drowning is very different than if you put a person in post-mortem. They're more likely to be submerged if they're not breathing when they go into that water.

So her body was just taking on the weight of the water and gravity just was pulling her down. She, the number one red flag for me in all of this was this mom claims that she waited 10 minutes to call emergency personnel because she could not swim and she couldn't figure out how to get her daughter out. Now, maybe in someone who has cognitive delays, but this is a woman who went to medical school. This is a person who is a physician. And you're telling me that in 10 minutes, you didn't know to call 911 as soon as you saw your child in the water. That was red flag number one for me. There are a pair of people who look, I don't care if you can't swim. If your daughter's in the pool, you jump in.

I mean, no matter what, that's a big red flag. And I think you hit the nail in the head really well. She knows. She knows the dangers of having a small child in the water for that period of time, right? That's what makes it a little suspicious. Now, of course, we'll get into the other side in a second. Again, how many comments are we going to get on this video where somebody goes, I'm a parent. I don't care if I can't swim.

I don't care if I see my child in some sort of environment. I'm rushing in no matter what. I don't know. Adrenaline takes over. I mean, we've all heard the stories about moms who've picked up cars to remove them off of their child. We've seen people who don't know how to swim, who jump in and are able to save their child. I don't know how big the pool was. I don't know what things she had at her disposal there, but I can't imagine that you have a pool in a rental home that doesn't have like a life vest. I mean, I would think it would be mandatory if you have a rental in a pool that you should have some sort of lifesaving devices there. Like you didn't have anything that you could jump into that pool with. This just there were so many red flags just from from the start of it. As soon as I started reading about it, I said, yeah, this mom definitely there's so many red flags here and she definitely did something to this little girl.

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But for purposes of this conversation, okay, how long does drowning take? In other words, how long would a little girl like Aria have to be in that water for it to be fatal? Seconds. You can drown off of a teaspoon of water. Like we've heard stories where people are drinking and they choke to death. It doesn't have to be a lot of water. It doesn't need to be some long exposure time in seconds this little girl could have drowned if that truly were her cause of death. Now, some other things to consider here are that asphyxiation due to drowning can happen in a number of ways.

Like I said, drinking water, a teaspoon of water is all you need, especially for a child that young. for it to go down the wrong way and not receive, you know, resuscitative efforts. But the other side to this is, is that this little girl to be out there for that period of time, 10 minutes in the middle of the night, like as a mom staying in a rental unit by yourself, like you didn't think to secure the doors, like there's no alarm. There's just so many red flags here. We're going to talk about that too. Look, I also am curious what were her life-saving evidence?

efforts to try to get the girl, her daughter, out of the pool as well. Well, I'll tell you this, hours after Aria died, Gupta was at the police station with her lawyer where police questioned her about what happened here. Gupta apparently told police that she and Ari had traveled from Edmund, Oklahoma to the Miami area for a vacation. The thing about that is Gupta and Aria's father, so this is Dr. Sarab Talathi, were divorced. They had apparently been embroiled in a vicious custody dispute. talk about that more later, but he told police that he didn't know his ex-wife and daughter

had gone to Florida. Details and the warrant reveal that surveillance video from the rental property corroborated Gupta's story that she and Aria were the only occupants of this Airbnb from June 25th to June 27th. So here's what Gupta had to say to the police department. This is again, according to an affidavit in her arrest warrant. And by the way, a quick note here, the warrant refers to Gupta as the subject and Aria as deceased victim. It says, quote, On Friday, June 27th, the subject voluntarily responded to Miami-Dade Sheriff's Office headquarters, accompanied by her attorney, and agreed to provide an audio-recorded statement. The subject stated that on Thursday, June 26, 2025, they arrived at the rental property

between the hours of 7 p.m. and 8 p.m. The subject stated that the deceased victim was tired after a full day of riding jet skis, along with spending the day at the beach and was asleep. The subject stated she carried the deceased victim into the residence, and at approximately 9 p.m., the subject woke the deceased victim up to eat dinner. The subject stated the deceased victim then ate dinner and remained awake until approximately 12.30 a.m. where they co-slept on a bed located within the master bedroom. The subject stated at approximately 3.20 a.m.,

the subject was awakened by an unidentified noise and realized that the deceased victim was not on the bed or within the bedroom. The subject said she then realized the sliding glass door located in the bedroom, which leads to the outside patio, was open. The subject stated prior to sleeping, she locked all the sliding glass doors at the residence. The subject stated she then observed the deceased victim submerged underwater within the

swimming pool of the residence. The subject stated she attempted to remove the victim from the pool. However, she was unsuccessful due to the fact that she's unable to swim. The subject stated she attempted for approximately 10 minutes to assist the deceased victim before contacting emergency services. So we talked all about how 10 minutes, very long time, but also a lot of weird things about that. NATO, we have to talk about this. You know, this idea of the timeline of it, the sliding door. Now, her attorney will later say that, you know, the door was so easy to

slide. You could use your pinky. But you're saying, I mean, how do we view this? Could it be a parent maybe being negligent, not doing enough to protect the area, not doing enough to secure the door from being open versus murder? I mean, I don't know. What do you take away from that description? Well, one, we don't make any decisions in the coroner world just based off of what someone tells us. We look at the entire picture. Does it make sense that the little girl could open the door? Had she met all of her cognitive milestones to be able to understand what it meant to open the door to go outside?

Show me, Mom, what you believe happened. Draw it for me. Write it for me. Re-inact it for me. Tell me exactly what you did when you brought your daughter. in to that bedroom. You said that she woke you up around nine o'clock. What did you eat? Because when I go to that autopsy and the stomach contents are removed, I want to see what she ate. Does the story make sense? Let's talk about that. Let's talk about that. Okay. So the warrant goes

on to explain what was found at autopsy, which took place two days after Aria died. So June 29th, Gupta wasn't held in custody because at this point, it seems like this all may have been some sort of tragic accident, but according to the warrant, quote, on Sunday, June 29, 2025, an autopsy was performed on the deceased victim by Dr. Tewett Tran of the Miami-Dade County Medical Examiner Department. Dr. Tran advised that the deceased victim's lungs and stomach did not contain water and was considered dry. Dr. Tran also advised that based on these findings, she was able to rule out drowning as being the cause of death. Furthermore, Dr. Tran discovered cuts within the mouth and bruising within the cheeks of the deceased victim's face. Dr. Tran confirmed

this type of trauma is not consistent with any life-saving efforts which were performed on the deceased victim by medical personnel. In Dr. Tran's opinion, the deceased victim was deceased prior to being placed into the swimming pool. While the official cause and manner of death remain pending further studies, the doctor's preliminary findings are the injuries are consistent with asphyxiation by smothering. Okay. Neda. Talk to me about these findings. I mean, any conceivable way you can have drowning without water in the lungs of the stomach? Okay, so let's get down to a little bit of science here.

So the medical examiner did a great job of explaining some things. So let's dig into it a little bit deeper. Number one, there was nothing in the stomach. That autopsy report also revealed that there was no food in the stomach. there was also no water in the stomach the fact that the lungs were not heavy wet when we see when we see people who have who have been submerged in water like a real drowning victim i'm in a large body of water like that we're going to see water in their airway we're going to see water down into their lungs we're going to see things that look like a drowning this did not look like that

there were marks inside of this child's mouth, bruising inside of the mouth. I would imagine that there was probably hemorrhaging as well because if you're trying to hold a child down and you put your hand over a child's mouth or even an adult's mouth, there's going to be some sort of bruising that happens with that. And you have to think an adult, even if it's a woman, is still going to be able to overtake that child. And so all of the bruising and the bleeding in the mouth is because she, She was trying to fight against whatever was being placed on top of her.

But if I use a soft thing like a pillow or something like that, I'll still have that bruising and that hemorrhaging, but I may not see a handprint. And so the evidence on this child shows that she died a traumatic death. And that's not an accident that did not come from resuscitative efforts. When we look at resuscitative injuries in children, we look for broken ribs, especially near the stern. area of the chest. We look for maybe a little bit of bruising around the lips. Sometimes we can see where they've tried to put a tube in and there may be a little bit of trauma there, but you're not seeing that in the cheek area. And so that is the second biggest red flag for me, the third being that there was nothing in her stomach. When I talk about that corner's investigation and that

death investigation, where's the food that you all ate? Well, because here's the thing. thing. She, Gupta, right? Didn't she say that they had dinner at 9 p.m. That contradiction. So, so what did you eat? You're in a rental. Did you buy food? Did you go to the grocery store? Where are the receipts? Did you order food? Where's the, where's the receipt for the food that you ordered? What did your child exactly eat? And a lot of times when we're questioning, um, uh, subjects, they usually forget those little details because most people are not good criminals. And I can't imagine that this woman has done something like this. this before. I don't know why she, you know, supposedly did this, but most people are going to

trip up when you start asking them those simple questions. Where is the food? That's a very simple question, but it means a lot in this case. Is there any way? I mean, of course, I'm sure the answer is yes. Of course you can have somebody. But realistically, is there any other way another expert could come in. We always talk about it at a trial battle of the experts. Another expert can come in and say disagree completely. This doesn't mean that the child did drown that this wasn't an accident because the way that you're describing it and the way that dr trann described it seems straightforward that there wasn't a drowning but is there another expert who can come in and disagree and why and how i i don't see how another person could come in and

look at this same uh circumstances within in totality and say oh no this is just a tragic accident you can't explain away those bruises and the cuts in the mouth you can't explain away the fact that she didn't have any food in her in her gastric contents you can't You can't explain a way that she didn't have any water in her lungs or in her airway or down where you would expect it to see for someone who's experience of drowning, especially in a large body of water. So I don't know what they could come in and try to say. I think this is pretty clear. Unless mom has some other explanation for this that actually makes sense, I don't see how another person could come in and say that. I think it's going to be a matter of whether or not her mental state was where it was supposed to be to be in the care of this child.

I think they're going to have to go down that route. I don't understand how in the legal province they could look at this same set of evidence and say something different. I don't. It wasn't in the arrest warrant affidavit, but could the medical examiner, could a coroner be able to determine what time Aria died, you know, either refute or corroborate Gupta's story? Well, one, we have video footage, which is always very helpful. And so I'm not sure if there's video footage over the pool. I didn't see that in any of the research that I did before coming on today. But the timeline of what she's saying, what did the skin look like on the baby?

Because this was a baby. This was a little kid who experienced a traumatic death. What did our skin look like? Was it pruned? Was it starting to slip? long had this little girl been in the pool, you can look at water damage. Now, an exact time is still something that, I don't care where you go in the world, post-mortem intervals and time of death is still not an exact science, but they could look at the water damage to her body

to see how long she had possibly been submerged. How common, if we take these allegations is true, how common are staging, stagings of deaths? Oh, very common. This is a why death investigations matter. This is why you can't just take someone's story. According to Gupta, she fed her daughter. They went back to sleep. Everything was fine. But again, the story isn't matching up. And I know I keep harping on this food thing, but it speaks to a pattern of lies at this point. So if you're willing to lie about the fact that you fed your daughter, but you didn't actually feed her, what else are you lying about? If you're willing to say that it took you 10 minutes to call 9-1-1 services as a physician, a board-certified licensed physician.

You don't know to call 911. Even when you call the doctor's office, they tell you if this is a life-threatening emergency call 911. I don't know why she wouldn't have called 911 earlier, but it's because she was trying to figure out her story. That could very well be, and that could very well be what the prosecution says. The defense would probably argue, hey, listen, she was panicked. We'll tell you how she was trying to get her daughter out of there. sure there's going to be an alternative explanation, but I won't say this. According to a charging document that was filed with the courts in Oklahoma, Florida authorities, they plan to

charge Gupta with first-degree murder because she allegedly killed a human being during the commission of a crime. In this case, aggravated child abuse. So the judge ordered that Gupta's arrest an extradition the following Monday, June 30th, staying tall and singular sheriffs of the state of Florida. Greetings, you are hereby commanded to immediately arrest the defendant and bring him or her before me, a judge in the 11th Judicial Circuit of Florida, to be dealt with according to law. Now, according to a news release from the U.S. Marshal's service, the U.S. Marshals, Oklahoma City, Metro Fugitive Task Force,

and Oklahoma City Police, they arrested Gupta in Oklahoma City on July 1st. Gagiasis Saralta, U.S. Marshal, for the Southern District of Florida, said in a statement Wednesday, July 2nd, this individual is accused of committing a horrendous act, and her swift arrest illustrates the professionalism, communication, and teamwork of all agencies involved. And according to Oklahoma court records that we viewed, a waiver for extradition

was filed July 3rd. Now in an interview with Florida's My Journal Courier, one of the lawyers representing Gupta, Richard Cooper, called the murder charges against Gupta, quote, absurd. Cooper told the outlet that he himself went to the Airbnb, tried to open the latch on the sliding glass door, said he was able to do it with just his pinky finger.

Again, goes to the idea of should it be properly secured. How easy was it for the girl to get? it out. But Cooper also told the outlet that he planned to have a second independent autopsy done on Aria's body. And Nita and I talked about, you know, redoing an autopsy, having a second autopsy. I mean, you don't think, Nita, that there's going to be anything necessarily different per se, unless I will tell you this much. In a statement that was released to several media outlets, Cooper said, we're disappointed at the Miami-Dade Sheriff's Office succumbed to pressure and rush to judgment. As a result, a grieving mother who just lost her daughter is in jail.

We look forward to a full investigation, which will uncover the truth of the matter. And in a separate statement to the Miami Herald, Cooper said, Dr. Gupta fully cooperated with law enforcement and gave multiple statements that never wavered inconsistency rather than conduct a thorough investigation, which could require multiple autopsies and toxicology analyses. The MDSO decided to apply for a warrant for a grieving mother going through the unimaginable. We look forward to all the facts coming to light. So, Neda, I mean, could a second autopsy say something? different? Could a toxicology report potentially reveal something? Was it a mistake not to have

multiple autopsies? Is that common? You think there's anything to this statement? Well, I certainly think that if I was being accused of murdering my child, that I would want to have an independent autopsy done. I think that's just part of the due process for someone who's being charged, you know, with first degree murder. A second autopsy is certainly warranted here. Yes, you can notice different things on the body, different sets of eyes. looking at things, but the facts remain correct. And again, knowing the full story and understanding everything about this investigation is going to be key. And so I don't think they're going to necessarily find anything new. I did think it was a bit a bit fast for them to release the

autopsy results. Even in the work that I do, we have child fatality reviews. This is a federal mandate that has to happen in each state. So I'm not sure why they were so rushed to put the information out there for public consumption because I certainly would want to wait until the toxicology report came back. What if there was medication in her system? What if there's poison in her system? What if she had been drugged? We don't know all of the details just yet. But in reading the parts of the story that we do have access to, there were lots of red flags for me as a coroner. Number one, the timeline for when she say these events happened, the autopsy report that was released to the media, those things are red flags for me because they don't line up with what mom is saying. And so grieving mother, all the things, sure, but something still don't add up.

You, Mom, Gupta, you're going to have to explain to me how your daughter ended up with these injuries in her mouth. they did not come from resuscitative efforts. It only takes two, three seconds for an EKG machine to be hooked up to a person they placed the leads on. We know that this child was probably in A's sisterly when they got to her. She was dead on arrival. They only transported her just to try because typically they will transport children if they can. But I think everybody who got to that scene knew that little girl had been dead. And for 10 minutes submerged underwater, there was no way that this baby had a chance of surviving.

So independent autopsy, sure. What does the toxicology say? Sure. Can they look at histology samples and look to see if there's any sort of inflammation in the lung? Did this little girl have any breathing issues or something like that that may have happened? Sure. But I don't think that independent autopsy is going to tell us something different than what we know. Such a sad case. Neda Rutherford, thank you so much for taking the time speaking with us about this. I really, really appreciate your expertise. Thank you so much for having me. Now, there's one more layer to this case that I got to touch upon to. Why? Because apparently there is another attorney who finds the investigation against Gupta dubious. And that is one of her defense attorneys in Oklahoma, Chris Smith, who said the allegations, quote, don't track with what he knows about her. He told the Miami Herald, now Gupta is a caring and attentive mother, fully dedicated to her child.

The idea that she could have harmed her child is completely inconsistent with her character. and the life she has led. This is a grieving mother facing unimaginable loss, not a criminal. We are confident the truth will emerge, and when it does, it will show the Neha Gupta is innocent. And when I say divorce attorney, that is important because it's being reported that while authorities haven't released a motive, nor is it clear why she and her daughter went to Florida, as we were looking into Gupta and these allegations, we have to talk about the divorce aspect, okay? We dug through dozens of court documents that were filed in divorce court in Oklahoma,

and I'll say this, this was a very contentious fight that went on for years. We found out that her ex-husband, Dr. Talathi, filed for divorce in 2022. So only, what, about a year after Aria was born, and the court didn't officially recognize the divorce until 2024. And as I mentioned before, Talathi didn't know that Ari and Gupta had gone to Florida, According to the arrest warrant, Dr. Talathi did not travel with the subject and the deceased victim to Miami, Florida, and was unaware that the deceased victim had left the state of Oklahoma. According to Dr. Talathi, there is an ongoing custody battle within the state of Oklahoma over the victim's care between himself and the subject.

Now, court documents that were filed with the court just before Aria died described the custody battle over the little girl as, quote, a highly contentious and procedurally complex litigation spanning over two years marked by aggressive tactics, repeated motions for extraordinary relief, and protracted proceedings. And the dozens of filings involved in the case include arguments over primary custody, who would have had the child when, child care for ARIA, including what daycare she can attend, what rights each parent has when it comes to Aria's medical care. So according to the Oklahoma and Miami Herald, Gupta had accused her ex of domestic abuse.

However, the court disagreed about that conclusion, apparently citing a lack of evidence, and the couple was assigned a parenting coordinator, and even ARIA, was granted a guardian ad litem. This is a person to support her best interest in these court proceedings. And in April of this year, a quote, report of the parenting coordinator and notice of concern of parental behavior was filed. The document detailed how a decision as small as where Aria would attend gymnastics classes was blown out proportion into a serious issue, so much so that the parenting coordinator had to intervene and help mediate. According to court documents, early on in the divorce proceedings in 23, a psychological evaluation was ordered for both parents. However, it seems those evaluations

were never done. Paperwork filed on April 10, 2025 reads, respondent, meaning Gupta, has again put her mental state in question and therefore it is in the best interest of the minor child that this court enforced the order of May 31st, 2023, and requests, respondent to undergo a psychological evaluation. Gupta's attorneys filed a response, basically saying, if she has to get one, so does Dr. Talathi, her ex. It's unclear, again, if either of those evaluations ever took place. But then in May, the court granted an emergency order first requested in March, which granted temporary sole custody of Aria to her father, Dr. Talathi. The order reads, the court finds that an emergency exists and that the respondent

will continue to interfere with medical treatment of the mind. child. And there had also been a lot of arguments over attorney's fees in the divorce case. Paperwork indicates that Gupta had requested around $4,500 from her ex-husband to cover the cost. Talathi said that Gupta owed him more than $100,000. So a judge ended up tossing out Gupta's request, reduced the amount that Talathi had asked for to around $79,000 in June of 2025. Gupta's attorneys filed an appeal with the Oklahoma Supreme Court saying that the court erred by denying her request that Talathi pay attorney's fees. And then you have this garnishment affidavit that was actually filed July 1st by Dr. Talathi's

attorney days after Ari's death, which lays out what Gupta owes him. Almost again, $80,000, attorney's fees, court costs, judgment, principal, interest. But there's also a serious snag in whether Talathi will actually see any of that money. It turns out Gupta was fired from her position at OU health before her daughter's death. This is a level one trauma center that's affiliated with the University of Oklahoma, by the way. OU Health, Dr. Nahag Gupta was suspended from patient care given notice of termination and was no longer seeing patients at the health system as of May 30th, 2025. She has also been given notice of termination by the university.

A more specific reason for her termination wasn't given. But I'll just tell you, look, sad case, strange case. We'll definitely keep a careful eye on it. That's all we have for you right now here on sidebar. everybody, thank you so much for joining us. And as always, please subscribe on YouTube, Apple Podcasts, Spotify, wherever you should get your podcasts. I'm Jesse Weber. I'll speak to you next time. Spotify.