Law&Crime Sidebar - What's Next for Ruby Franke's Business Partner After YouTube Mom's Guilty Child Abuse Plea

Episode Date: December 19, 2023

Ex-therapist Jodi Hildebrandt is expected in court next week after her former business partner, Ruby Franke, agreed to plead guilty to four counts of second-degree aggravated child abuse. Franke admitted she and another adult restrained Franke’s two youngest children with handcuffs, denied them access to food and water, and made them stand outside in the hot sun for hours. As part of her plea agreement, Franke is required to testify against Hildebrandt. The Law&Crime Network’s Jesse Weber checks in with KUTV2News reporter Brian Schnee to discuss what we can expect during Hildebrandt’s hearing.PLEASE SUPPORT THE SHOW:If you’re ever injured in an accident, you can check out Morgan & Morgan. You can submit a claim in 8 clicks or less without having to leave your couch. To start your claim, visit: www.forthepeople.com/LCSidebarHOST:Jesse Weber: https://twitter.com/jessecordweberLAW&CRIME SIDEBAR PRODUCTION:YouTube Management - Bobby SzokePodcasting - Sam GoldbergVideo Editing - Michael DeiningerScript Writing & Producing - Savannah WilliamsonGuest Booking - Alyssa Fisher & Diane KayeSocial Media Management - Vanessa BeinSTAY UP-TO-DATE WITH THE LAW&CRIME NETWORK:Watch Law&Crime Network on YouTubeTV: https://bit.ly/3td2e3yWhere To Watch Law&Crime Network: https://bit.ly/3akxLK5Sign Up For Law&Crime's Daily Newsletter: https://bit.ly/LawandCrimeNewsletterRead Fascinating Articles From Law&Crime Network: https://bit.ly/3td2IqoLAW&CRIME NETWORK SOCIAL MEDIA:Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/lawandcrime/Twitter: https://twitter.com/LawCrimeNetworkFacebook: https://www.facebook.com/lawandcrimeTwitch: https://www.twitch.tv/lawandcrimenetworkTikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@lawandcrimeSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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will keep you on the edge of your seat. Don't let your fears take hold of you as you dive into this addictive series. Love thrillers with a paranormal twist? The entire Oracle trilogy is available on Audible. Listen now on Audible. Ms. Frankie, how do you plead to count one aggravated child abuse, a second-degree felony? Guilty. To count three aggravated child abuse, a second-degree felony. Guilty. To count five, aggravated child abuse, a second degree felony. Guilty.

With Ruby Frankie pleading guilty in her child abuse case, what does that mean for the woman she's throwing under the bus, her co-defendant Jody Heldabrand? KUTV 2 News's Brian Schnee is back with us to talk about what we can expect. Welcome to Sidebar, presented by Law and Crime. I'm Jesse Weber. There are still so many questions in the Ruby Fran. case out of Utah. And as our sidebar followers know, we have been actively following the story since it broke over the summer. And now that Ruby Frankie has officially pleaded guilty in her

criminal case, what does that mean for her co-defendant Jody Hildebrand? That is an important question. Now, do a little bit of a backup. Remember, Ruby Frankie was the once infamous YouTuber. She started a popular channel called Eight Passengers with her husband Kevin back in 2015. It documented their lives as a couple with their six children. And Frankie took a lot of heat for her controversial parenting techniques. You can shift from victim, whether in denigrating or adulating victim, you have the power to shift out of it at any moment. Now, at one point, Ruby ended up partnering up with a woman named Jody Hildebrandt who offered these life coaching services through this organization noticed connections. Ruby, in fact, was listed as a certified

mental fitness trainer on the Connections website. They're working together. Then you fast forward to August of this year. And she and Hildebrand are each arrested and each charge with six counts of aggravated child abuse of Frankie's two young children who were staying at Hilda Brant's place. Her 12-year-old son managed to escape. Hildebrand's home ran to a neighbor who called 911. The boy was reportedly emaciated with wounds and evidence that he'd been tied up.

The boy's sister, who was nine years old at the time, I believe she's 10 years old now. Again, this is Ruby's daughter, reportedly found in the house in similar condition. She was taken the hospital to be treated for malnourishment. And Ruby and Jody, they were each charged with six counts of aggravated child abuse. And it was our understanding that each count carries a maximum of 15 years in prison. By the way, Kevin ended up filing for a divorce from Ruby. And according to his lawyer, he had been living separately from her for over a year for her arrest. when I interviewed Kevin's attorney, he basically seemed to suggest that parenting techniques

were maybe one reason for the separation. But then you fast forward to last Friday, and Frankie's law firm indicates that she is going to enter into a formal plea deal, a formal plea agreement. They released a statement, and this statement was very illuminating, but there was one particular point I want to emphasize for purposes of our conversation today. It says, quote, Ruby Frankie is a devoted mother and is also a woman committed to constant improvement. Initially, Ms. Frankie believed that Jody Hildebrandt had the insight to offer a path to continual improvement. Ms. Hildebrandt took advantage of this quest and twisted it into something

heinous. Over an extended period, Ms. Hildebrandt systematically isolated Ruby Frankie from her extended family, older children, and her husband Kevin Frankie. This prolonged isolation resulted in Ms. Frankie being subjected to a distorted sense of morality shaped by Ms. Hilderbrand's influence. Okay, really putting the blame in a big way on Jody Hildebrandt. But then you go to Monday, December 18th, and Ruby Frankie officially pled guilty in the 5th District Court in Washington County, Utah in front of Judge John J. Walton. She pled guilty to four of the six charges, four counts of aggravated child abuse. Each are second-degree felonies. Ms. Frankie, how do you plead to count one aggravated child abuse, a second-degree felony? Guilty.

To count three aggravated child abuse, a second-degree felony. guilty to count five aggravated child abuse a second degree felony guilty and to count six aggravated child abuse a second degree felony with my deepest regret and sorrow for my family and my children guilty now there is no agreed upon sentence in this plea agreement the judge will ultimately sentence ruby frankie and based on the way that i read the terms of this plea agreement he has discretion. It seems that she could be sentenced to the maximum on each count, 15 years, and the sentences for each could run consecutively, meaning one after the other.

Not necessarily saying that is what would happen, but it'll be interesting. And after reading what I read in this plea agreement, I wouldn't be surprised, though, if she's hit with significant, significant prison time. Ruby admitted, and this is in the plea agreement, that she abused the children, such as kicking her son while wearing boots, holding his head under water, cutting off his oxygen by covering his mouth and nose, tying him up with handcuffs, forcing him to stay outside in the sun during the summer months. This was over a three-month span.

He suffered significant sunbirds. Her daughter faced similar treatment, and she was forced to run barefoot on dirt road. She suffered blisters and scabs. I mean, this is just truly unthinkable. This is horrible, horrible stuff. But she is also accused of indoctrinating the kids to believe that they were evil, and that this was all for their own good, presumably, with the help of Jody Hildebrand. And that brings me to the next part, because it states in this plea agreement that Frankie agrees

to testify against Jody Hildebrand. But the plea terms are relatively simple. She pled guilty to four counts of aggravated child abuse. The state agreed to dismiss the two other counts of child abuse. and she agreed to serve a prison term and that the term for the four different counts will run consecutively and not concurrently. And she agrees, I'll read this one verbatim.

She agrees to testify truthfully against Jody Hildebrand and in return to the Washington County Attorney's Office agrees to remain neutral regarding future hearings before the Utah Board of Parton. That was the prosecutor outside of court when this happened. So what does all of this mean for Jody Hildebrand. Well, I had an opportunity to sit down with Brian Schnee, anchor and reporter for KUTV 2 News out of Utah, who has been actively following this case. Talk about what all of this means for Jody. Now, here's a warning. I actually interviewed him before Ruby Frankie's court appearance. He was actually outside the courtroom or courthouse when we were speaking. So just to give you an idea, what we're talking about is before she officially pled guilty, before we saw this plea deal, we saw the details of this plea agreement. So just that in mind but here you go Ryan good to see you first let everybody know where you are right

now at the time of this recording right now in St. George Utah as Ruby Frankie goes into court here in just a few hours at the time of our conversation so what's interesting about this case is Ruby's rooted in northern Utah we are in southern Utah which is where Jody Hildebrand's home is so we're about 25 30 minutes from Ivan's which is where all of this went down months ago now but Ruby and Jody have been held here locally, about 10 minutes from where I'm sitting at purgatory correctional facilities. So Ruby Frankie's waiver hearing is today, and that's why we are here and we'll be in court for that. Now, let's be entirely clear about this. The reason you and I had this conversation, I think it was about a week ago, maybe a week and a half ago, the terrific

reporting from your team is what first broke it for us about this waiver hearing. And we were talking about, well, what could be a waiver hearing? And we know that a waiver hearing was essentially waiving a preliminary hearing and could it be that they just, you know, from a legal point of view, didn't want that hearing to be broadcast? Was there another consideration? Or could it possibly be that a plea has been entered or a plea is being negotiated? We talked about this. So the fact that we got this seeming confirmation from her law firm with that statement, what was your reaction to it? Not surprised based on the initial, you know, email I got from them a few weeks ago saying that they were hoping to reach a resolution shortly.

I think it's interesting because you have to let the process, you know, play itself out, as you know, Jesse. So it was really interesting to see that all of the things that we talked about in terms of a potential plea coming actually coming to fruition today where they're expecting to, you know, defense and prosecution come together and ultimately have this plea agreement. And I'm told that the court proceedings today should be relatively quick. That's not to say some of the things that will come out today. could be particularly heinous or really tough for some people to process at home.

Now, again, I'm teasing up because we haven't even gotten into what this means for Jody Hildebrand. I want to get there in a minute, but I first want to talk about this statement because you and I haven't had a chance to talk about it. I read you a portion of it, which I think when we're talking about Jody Hilderbrand, it's the most essential part, throwing her under the bus, putting the blame on her. Now, what is your reaction to that part? Because, you know, there's one thing for her to take a deal and plead guilty essentially to her crimes. but to put the blame on Jody Hildebrand, that was something, would you make of it? You know, I guess I'm not surprised because based on a lot of our reporting over the last few months,

the people that we have spoken to had similar stories about Jody Hildebrand, manipulation, isolation, separating of couples as it pertains to ripping apart marriages. That is, in essence, if you look at the timeline, that happened to Ruby Frankie too. Kevin filed for divorce. And then obviously there's the other parts down the line where it happened to do with, whatever is involved in this child abuse portion, which apparently, you know, depending on how you look into these things, a lot of people have looked at the YouTube videos over the years and said, hey, some things didn't seem right even before Ruby met Jody. However, over the last

three years or so, isolation from family, isolation from Kevin Frankie, isolation, and then other tactics with children. A lot of that is in line with what we've heard about Jody Hildebrand for more than a decade now. I mean, we did. a sidebar on this over the weekend when the news broke, and I was playing a few clips from Jesse Hildebrand, our interview with Jesse, who is Jody Hildebrand's niece, and those themes of isolation, manipulation, control were so consistent with that statement from Ruby Frankie's law firm. I, too, wasn't surprised, but from a legal point of view, it's so interesting, because I don't know how effective that would have been if they both went to trial

together if, you know, throwing Jody under the bus because there was an aspect of the charges that Jody, excuse me, that Ruby faces, that as long as you knew about the abuse and you allowed it to happen, you yourself could be convicted. So I didn't think, Brian, you know, I'm not surprised hearing this, but I'm also not surprised that this is no longer, we're seemingly no longer going to trial because that wouldn't have been a successful argument. Yeah, and I agree with that. And based on the conversation you've had with Jesse Hilda Brandt, and I have also had with her as well, a lot of these things line up. Now, Jesse was, what, a teenager at the time of her allegations of abuse,

running away from Jody Hildebrand, basically not having a very sustainable time living with her for almost a year after being sent there by her parents, thinking this was the right way and the right course of action to maybe, quote, unquote, correct her in some way. So it's kind of interesting, and I think that, you know, coming out of that statement, we do see some admission of guilt, right?

It's sprinkled in there of, you know, some, right, some. It's accepting responsibility and certain things to which we understand that there will obviously be charges today that will be discussed. Do we see all six? Probably not. Obviously, based on the deal, I would imagine not the case. But it is one of those things that most of that statement does point the finger at Jody Hildebrand, which, consistent with a lot of our rules.

reporting in a way makes a lot of sense that somebody was in a way manipulated and kind of rope into this sort of thing. Now, that doesn't mean not accepting any responsibility for the actions, which I don't necessarily think they're not trying to do. But the three quarters of that or five, six of that statement is indeed pointing the finger at Jody Hildebrand saying, hey, look what she made me do, right? Or look how this all worked out. And from a legal point of you, I'm not surprised there's clear admission of guilt because the deal hasn't been entered. deals can blow up and you don't want to say something you have to be very careful with what your attorney say prior to a plea deal actually being accepted by the court has to be accepted so they don't

want to make a blanket admission until they get that plea agreement you know final down and ultimately written up all right brian actually hold on for a second because we're going to get back to talking about jody hildebrand and there's a lot more to talk about but we all know how much these cases really emphasize how scary the world can be and how unsafe it can be that's why I wanted to take a minute to talk about our sponsor of this video, Morgan and Morgan. They have just been an incredible partner of ours. And the reason that I want to talk about them now is because one of the scariest things in life is when you get hurt and you don't know what to do.

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injured and you want to join the over 3 million people that call them every year, you can submit a claim at www.4thepeople.com slash LC sidebar or by dialing pound law. That's pound 529 on your phone. Now let me just ask you what the main question is. what does this mean for Jody Hildebrand? The last time you and I spoke is she has a separate waiver hearing. What is the latest that you have heard with respect after Ruby's law firm has come forward with this statement? She's about to seemingly enter a plea deal, plead guilty.

What does this mean for Jody Hildebrand? Well, this means there's a lot more heat on Jody. But maybe it does play in Ruby's favor that her hearing is first, right? And all of this is coming out first. The statement points towards Jody. there's about 10 days between the two different hearings, and I still have yet to hear back from Jody's representation, which I haven't since the very beginning of all of this. I mean, we have tried to at least get an inkling of how are they perceiving things compared to Ruby's attorneys.

They have at least replied to some of our inquiries, and we've had conversations. We have looked to this day, which is where we ultimately got the language in their statement first to be able to share with everybody. But it was one of those things that I'm still waiting to hear. from the person representing Jody Hildebrand where they stand in all of this because today has a big effect on what happens 11, 10 days from now. And it would be really interesting to see how they are processing this whole thing, to which again, at the time of you and I talking here, I did reach out again this morning just to say, hey, I'm in town here. I would love to get a little perspective from you about where things are right now, but it's been relatively silent. And as you and I have

talked about, most of this, with the exception of the first 15 days or so, after all of this happened in late August, and then their initial appearance in early September went really quiet, right? All we were hearing were people coming out of the woodwork, select family members, people that have the experiences, mostly with Jody, by the way, that you really hadn't heard much other than having to assume that both sides are looking at the discovery from the prosecution and they're going to come together and likely strike a deal because it didn't look like they were going to move forward to push towards trial at this point. It doesn't seem that way for Jody either. So you think there's a strong possibility that when, if let's say, December 27th

actually stays, that Jody Hildebrandt would actually plead guilty as well because you have to imagine if she doesn't, Ruby Frankie would potentially be a huge witness against her. Um, you know, for me, one of the things that I'm thinking about as well, the kids would have had to testify at a trial. And I think that's a major consideration for why Ruby Frankie pled guilty. That's why I also think prosecutors might be open to accepting some sort of deal for Jody Hildebrand to make sure that these kids don't have to testify in an upcoming trial. But you tell me, do you think it's likely, whether or not that hearing stays, whether or not the hearing is delayed? I mean, this is a very big development. You think it's potentially likely Jody Hildebrandt could plead guilty herself. As an educator, guess based on what we're seeing, I do believe that this, what we're seeing with Ruby could very well happen with Jody. And I do think a lot of it lies on the kids. They have been very careful with how the children have been treated through this entire thing, which I've been trying to be totally respectful of, because I understand. I mean, a new dad myself, the last thing I'd want is for my daughter to be roped into any of these things, right? If it ever came to that

point, you don't want to provide any further harm towards these children, then they've already been thrust into the spotlight, and you've already heard about the emaciation for two of the children, the horrific 911 call from the neighbor saying, hey, I just came across this kid who had ties around his wrists and his ankles. Having any of these children have to relive that in the form of taking the stand, I think would be very damaging for the rest of their lives if it already hadn't been based on a lot of this. So I do think we see something similar with Jody down the line here, but you're right. Things could very well be delayed after things take place today because what happens

today directly impacts Jody Hildebrand. Just to be clear, again, we haven't seen the hearing yet for Ruby Frankie as we're recording this. Do you know if any representative from Jody Hildebrand, her lawyers, anybody, is going to attend this hearing and be aware of what happened? Because I don't even know if Jody Hildebrandt has been working around, you know, behind the scenes trying to work out a deal. if she was hit by surprise at this statement from Ruby Frankie's lawyer, we haven't heard anything either.

So I'd be very curious if you know if Jody Hildebrand, her lawyers, anybody, are actually going to attend Ruby Franke's hearing today. You know, it's not clear if they will, but I'd have to imagine, given the connection between these two, right, the friendship, the business partner, the whatever. And the fact that Jody's attorney has an office, you know, relatively close to the courthouse here, I would really have to imagine. that they would be sitting at least in the courtroom listening to what takes place today, or maybe they already have a heads up on how this thing's going to go if they've worked together in any way. And it's a lot of those things that we don't know because, you know, they just don't talk about those things, right? But it's one of those things that we are waiting to see the exact paperwork on this agreement. Once it is filed into the system, I do obviously have the expectation that Ruby Frankie will spend more time in jail.

and that this is not getting off Scott Free at all because of the admission here or whatever she's pleading forth. But I wouldn't be surprised if we did see anybody, even if it's family or something like that, related to Jody Hildebrand, that will be there at the hearing for Ruby Frankie

on Monday, December 18th, coming up here as we are talking in just a few hours. And that's what I want to find, like kind of end the conversation on in terms of, yeah, I agree with you. I can't imagine a deal where Ruby Frankie would get, no time behind bars. Specifically, there was a part in her statement where it seemed that she said

she would support Kevin Frankie's ability to get custody of the kids, paraphrasing a bit, and that would seem to me to suggest maybe she's not going to be around. The bigger question is, what would happen with Jody? So, again, these are very serious charges. Now you have Ruby throwing Jody under the bus, which, as we've been saying, is consistent with what we've heard from other people. If Jody were even to enter into a deal, I would have to imagine whatever punishment she receives would be much worse than Ruby Frankie. Would you agree with that? Based on the understanding that we have for how this is going to proceed with Ruby,

I would really imagine that Jody will take the brunt of this. Based on what we've heard from, go back to Jesse Hildebrandt, I asked her directly months ago, would you say that Jody was the mastermind between all of this? And she said, yes. Based on the people that I've talked to about Jody, all of this screams Jody's tactics and how she has approached individuals over the years.

years, whether it be couples that have gone to them for counseling, whether it had been somebody way back when that was referred through the church prior to things blowing up in that standpoint, I would have to imagine that if there are extra charges to give, they would likely go towards Jody Hildebrand based on a lot of the conversations that we've been having with people that had past experiences with her and how Ruby does point the finger here, at least in this statement from her attorneys, it does make sense that there's kind of this uneven balance. here between what has been going on. Keep in mind, the children were found at Jody's house. So it's all these things that lean more towards Jody in a way than they do towards

Ruby, even though we do know that Ruby spent an ample amount of time in Ivans. We did see the video of her pulled over for speeding, what, six days, five days before all of this really shook out. She was in Ivins again. So there is that obvious connection between she was there, obviously very well knew what was going on. But I do believe all of this was spearheaded as it seems based on people that we've talked to by Jody. So I would have to imagine those charges are going to be heavily levied against Jody Hildebrain. And even in the police documentation, they suggested that Ruby had filmed a video with Jody in that residence two days before these arrests were made.

Now, I'll finish up the conversation by just saying, again, when you see this video, everybody, when you see my conversation with Brian, we will know the answer presumably about with Ruby Frankie, but I think all of this still applies because we are most likely not going to have an answer about Jody Hilderbrand by the end of the day. This is going to continue on. Brian, you've been doing incredible work. Thank you so much for taking the time to talk about this. For anybody who wants, you know, up-to-date coverage of what is happening in this case, Brian Schnee, KUTV 2 News, they're going to be on the ground there. Really appreciate it. The only thing, you know, is a little disappointing is that, look, we hope this case is resolved.

the best way it should be resolved in the interest of justice. I will say that will conclude, I mean, our conversations, if this case ultimately wraps up, which is something I'd be disappointed about because I've really enjoyed having these conversations with you, Brian. But let's keep in touch. Let's find out what's happening next. And I'm sure we'll have a lot more to talk about. Thanks, as always, for having me on, too. I've really enjoyed these. It's an opportunity to share more of our long-form conversation, a better understanding to people at home that have been following this. Maybe you don't live in Utah. You don't see our reporting every day.

And we've really tried to keep people up to date on this as we've been able to find out more. Sometimes when things go into the court process, they get hidden, they get stashed away, and we just don't know. But our team, not just myself, for example, we have a team here today. We've tried to do the very best we can to put all of this out there for ultimately the viewer to decide and the viewer to understand, however which way they'd like to look at these two women and this overall situation. but you never know. There could be always more interesting things coming out of Utah that you want to talk about. So just keep the number on speed dial, will you? Well, I will.

Hopefully that's not the case because anytime we cover it, it's not great news. But I hear you. Brian Schnee, thank you so much. Great talking to you as always. Happy holidays. Thank you. That is all we have for you right now here on Sidebar, everybody. Thank you so much for joining us.

Please subscribe on Apple Podcast, Spotify, YouTube, wherever you get your podcast. I'm Jesse Weber. I'll speak to you next time. You can binge all episodes of this long crime series ad free right now on Wondery Plus. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify.