Leap Academy with Ilana Golan - From Losing Everything To CEO of a Global Publication - Chris Dutton

Episode Date: September 13, 2023

When is it too soon to quit on your dreams?  For Chris Dutton only death could stand in the way of him and his success. This interview will have you on the edge of your seat as Ilana speaks with Chris Dutton (Founder of The CEO Magazine a Global publication) about true resilience and staying the course even when it seems like everything is lost.  Watch this episode on YouTube - https://youtu.be/0rO6b69O2QYMore about Chris:Instagram @officialduttonWebsite: https://www.theceomagazine.com/ About Ilana Golan & Leap Academy:Website - https://www.leapacademy.com/Follow Ilana on LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/ilanagolan/YouTube Channel - https://www.youtube.com/@ilanagolan-leap-academy

So my first business venture was with this guy that ended up to be a professional con man. There was a shotgun and I will never forget seeing a shotgun lit up by the moonlight and then there was this squirt of adrenaline in my stomach. It was like a little, you know, that little punch and it hit home he was he was gonna kill me welcome to the leap show in the leap show we're here to bring experts from around the globe who share inspiring stories concrete tips and insight on what helped them become the best version of themselves and who they are today and create the incredible life that they wanted subscribe and follow us share this with friends who are also driven and aiming for more because you'll hear stories and tips that you'll hear nowhere else.

Hi, I'm Ilana Golan, CEO of Leap Academy, which helps driven professionals reinvent Leap their careers to the next level. Now let's get started. Oh my God, you guys are going to have an amazing, amazing, amazing treat today. So I met Chris Dutton when and he's the founder of CEO Magazine. You'll meet him in a second. But I met him when he organized this incredible retreat to Richard Branson's private island, Necker Island. And for me, it was one of the most incredible experiences of my life.

And I immediately knew that this guy is absolutely unstoppable. And he has an incredible story. So buckle up. Welcome to the show. Chris. Thank you for being here. Thank you for being here. What a lovely introduction. That's one of the best ones I've ever had. And you've been incredible. And it's so inspiring to see that, you know, you started CO Magazine from basically nothing. And you created this empire global publication that is just way beyond just a publication. And tell us a little bit about your story, Chris, because I found just the bits and pieces of it so inspiring. OK, well, thank you. So I was born in England originally. I moved to Australia in 2005.

I'll tell you I'll tell you what happened before that in a minute. And I was kind of in Australia um enjoying life for a few months with um with savings that saved up back in England and basically the money was getting low and you know neither myself or my ex-wife um we didn't have any sort of income um and she um so we were in Sydney um and she uh she got a job um which was great. But I remember thinking to myself, you know, oh, shit, I need to earn some money now. We probably had enough to cover rent, but that was kind of it. So she'd gone off and got a job. And I distinctly remember sitting in a spare bedroom when she went off for day one at work thinking,

I remember sitting there thinking, what am I going to do? Literally, what am I going to do? But I was fueled inside basically by what happened back in England before we moved to Australia. And that's probably why I decided to do what I do today. But yeah, I came from England, moved to Australia. I had nothing except for a PC and the internet. And I started the CEO magazine literally with $50 from that spare bedroom. We're now a global brand. We speak to more CEOs than any other magazine in the world.

And we have a brand reach every month of 13 million um yeah so that's from 50 from a spare bedroom to where we are now yeah we're doing okay wow what an incredible story and i have a feeling you're hiding some pretty interesting story behind it because it wasn't smooth sailing was it um not really no um this it kind of makes me think about kind of some of the hardest or sort of worst moments in your life um and yeah smooth sailing is never a never a thing I think but you know when I knew I was doing this podcast I thought you know what can I what was kind of like the worst thing that's happened to me that could potentially be of value somehow to the people listening to this podcast? But the answer is an easy one. And it's a it's a defining moment in my life that I'm going to share. But it's actually one of the best things that ever happened to me,

even though it was shocking and horrific at the time. So aside from Australia, as a bit of background, I started my career working in a tough call centre, selling advertising back in the UK. I was young, successful, I was earning great money. I was buying my mate's drinks. I was this sales rep in this boiler room type place. And it was amazing. I was buying my mate's dinner drinks. And I was young and I was going places. There were 120 salespeople in that company. And when I left, I left as the second best salesperson they ever had which still annoys me because I wasn't number one um but the reason I left that company was because I got um headhunted by the yellow pages um which was great you know I was on the

way up and yellow pages were calling in and trying to headhunt our best sales reps. And they got in touch with me and off I went. So I started that job at the Yellow Pages. And the story I'm talking about, I met this guy called Sean and something just felt right with him. He was older than me, steely faced, streetwise. He was successful. He'd been there and done it in advertising. And I kind of saw him as a role model. And it's not easy when you work at the Yellow Pages. It's a tough gig. You know, there's long hours and they got they got every ounce of sweat out of you.

But Sean, he was kind of there for me. I met him on the training course. He he supported me when I was out on the road late at night trying to sell advertising into their directories. You needed someone in the trench with you at the end of the phone for you. And Sean was kind of he was that guy. looked up to him and you know I'd call him on you know I'm gonna go and pitch an electrician for something and you know ring him up and say what do you reckon and give me some tips and we became close we bonded um so he helped me through the tough times um basically in sort of the first six months of learning to adapt to a new hard company. And during that time, he convinced me that I was too good, basically, to work for someone else.

And he said the only way to earn money in this world is to start your own business. That's what he said. And it turned out that he had some contacts and, you know, we ended up starting up our own company, selling and installing kitchens of all things now i plowed everything i had saved up basically working the previous role i've got money the bank i'd saved up everything i'd owned into this new business with him and i was excited and this was like I was early 20s this was my first ever business

but it wasn't all it wasn't all plain sailing things started to go wrong money wasn't coming in despite deals being signed the bank accounts were soon overdrawn and you know we were getting these dreaded repayment phone calls coming in onto my mobile i was like oh god i didn't want to answer this phone legal action there was something it was weird but to cut a long story short it turned out that um sean had been around the block uh he was he was actually wanted um by the police so i i learned that he was he was actually a professional con man and when I really actually I get shivers literally down my back talking about this so my first business venture was with this guy that ended up to be a professional con man and he got me hook line at sinker but

when I realized this I kind of had this realization of you know crap everything I'll put into I mean we business with the wrong guys he was a comment so I asked one money for my money back and you know I stood up to him and you know I was like me I've got bills to pay you know I need the money it turns out he was pocketing the money and I wasn't getting more cut to pay the bills and I stood up to him said I need I need the money um and he went quiet for a while and eventually he said okay you know let's you know let's I'll give you your money and um we arranged to meet now at the time my best mate back in England he was um

he was a security guard he actually worked in a prison um and we drove to the I remember we drove to the outskirts of London and I took him with me for insurance basically um and I was going to get the money that he he owed me um Sean and me we'd arranged to meet in a in a public place um but Sean he changed the meeting at the last minute when we was a couple of minutes away from meeting. I think we were meant to meet at McDonald's and he said, oh, we can't meet, it's full up. There's a car park down the road.

And he said, let's meet here. So we pulled into this car park at night time and I'll never forget it. It was dark, but the moon was bright. And I'll never forget it. It was dark, but the moon was bright. And I pulled in with my mate and then I saw Sean's car and then he got out and we pulled up and he headed around the back of the car into his boot and he opened it and there was a shotgun was a shotgun and i will never forget seeing a shotgun

with it was a professional comment obviously lit up by the moonlight and then there was this squirt of adrenaline in my stomach it was like a little you know that little punch um and it hit home he was he was going to kill me he wanted me out of the way um it was that moment in life where i thought i'm gonna die um i felt that so we for being the security guard his eyes lit up and he screeched the car around we just drove off as fast as we could um i deleted all these numbers. I decided to cut my losses as I wasn't prepared to die for money. But at the end of the day, I'd lost everything I'd worked for. You know, I was successful. I had tens of thousands of pounds in the bank account at an early age. I had a premium job, you know, convertible sports car, was literally gone overnight.

How did that make me feel? I don't know. Put it this way, I hated him. It was a hammer blow to me. But it's strange because if I could talk to that young man some 25 years ago, you know, a 20 something year old Chris Dutton, I would have kind of told him to get rid of the resentment in your heart, you know, get rid of it and move on. Because those those resentments will always end up harming you and, you know, creating in you like this sense of despair. You've got to let it go. So basically, Sean, he took everything that I'd worked for,

that I had. He spat me out like a worthless piece of chewing gum and he was going to kill me. He was evil. You know, he was, I remember that that saying he was like a snake in the grass but i think what i'm trying to say is that no one ever you know you don't you don't die from a snake bite you know the snake bite will never kill you it's the it's the venom that continues to pour through your body after that bite that's what will destroy you um and you know and you were living with that because it's hard to get rid of something so horrifying to trust people again to right i mean i assume there's a lot of that going on too absolutely um but i kind of often think about, you know, what would I say to myself as a kid? And I'm kind of like, you know, if I could kind of I went from this to almost being shot.

But I think you've got to harness the setbacks, you know, use them as positives and get rid of that resentment and alana honestly ironically i'm actually glad it happened um because as horrific as it was at the time he taught me a lesson and that lesson improved my life and it actually helped me become me if that makes sense um but yeah it wasn't all plain sailing life has ups and downs and you know you deal with the downs but at the end of the day it's how you let it affect you that shapes you that's that's where my head's at now oh it's and that's such a strong sentence right because it's never uh you know the challenges themselves it's your belief around these challenges that will set you back right so but tell, but tell me, I mean, this is an incredible story and still you decide to start your own business with no money, nothing basically, instead of just going to get a job.

First of all, why and how did you start Seal Magazine? Well, because of what happened, I had no credit rates. I couldn't get a job, literally, I had no credit rating. I couldn't get a job, literally. I had nothing. And the only place I could get a job was in a chicken factory, literally, with illegal immigrants that would come in and we could only work for cash. But that's all I could get.

I started the same agency when I came to Australia. But I remember before I was coming to Australia, I had this little locker in the chicken factory. It was cold. It was awful conditions. And you saw people getting stabbed and stuff. And I had this little marker pen. And I remember counting down the days until I used to come to Australia. But yeah, as soon as we got here, got to Australia. And then that's when I mentioned about my ex-wife my wife at the time she got her job and then i was kind of using that setback about what happened in england to think you know i don't have anything at the moment i've got 50 bucks

literally um she could pay the bills she could pay the rent and i need to start something so i used my media experience from having worked in publishing and advertising back in the UK, and I thought, yeah, I'll start a business. I'll start a magazine. And that's incredible because that's really, really hard. So what motivates you? What made you continue um probably i think that question comes down to um

it's interesting because what probably what probably motivates me and helped me as kind of a startup early days there was probably no one. And so when I started to see a magazine, when I look back on it, what motivated me was the fact that there wasn't a rule book to follow. There wasn't a PDF that I could download to say, hey, you want to launch a global business magazine, this is what you do. But that in essence was kind of like the reason probably why it became successful, because you you know, you just trust your gut. You trust your instincts. You do what you think is right. There were no rules. You know, I've never started a magazine before. Yes, I had media experience, but, you know, I've never even done anything like that before.

So you kind of trust yourself. You actually help yourself um certainly an interesting journey just yeah just let's start a magazine and you just kind of do what you think is right basically and it's incredible and now that you see it in retrospect right you're talking to some of the most incredible ceos in the world you feature them in the magazine tell me a little bit about what does it feel now that you're looking back um and seeing where where this is today um i feel i feel happy and i feel proud when i see impact it makes on other people um i feel i've always said that um you know a lot of people kind of say to me you know oh you've done well you know you you've settled, you've made it ever. But to me, I feel that that is such a dangerous position to be in, because the minute I think the minute you kind of go, yeah, I've done it.

I've launched the magazine. It's, you know, it's globally recognised. The minute you fall into that comfort zone, the minute you kind of go, yeah, you know what, globally recognized the minute you fall into that comfort zone the minute you kind of go yeah do you know what we've done it it's dangerous because you stop trying you stop you know you stop pushing you stop that that sort of the person that's inside of you kind of relaxes and goes to sleep a bit and I never want to be that person so there's still lots to do and I love that so I mean you keep pushing and pushing which what makes you such a brilliant entrepreneur right but how do you measure success like how do you feel you know and tell yourself okay so I've had these sort of milestones or whatever like how do

you measure success um in the magazine or personally so just kind of yeah i mean success to me is i mean i think i can sum it up probably fairly easily and this is the the answer is actually a powerful question and i've been asked this before but people say how do you measure success and to me the answer is um do the people i love most care about me because that answers the question about business it can't answer the question about life it answers the question about everything so if you know the day you you close your eyes or whatever and you know you move on from this world you ask yourself do the people I love most care about me? If the answer is yes, then to me, that's success. Wow. So I have to ask you a follow up on this, because on one hand, there's the people that really love you.

On the other hand, when you're an entrepreneur, there's always going to be haters. There's always going to be people that really test how thick is your skin. So so how do you balance? Because you're not going to always be loved. You're going to be loved by the people who love you and that are inspired by you, but there's going to be the haters. How do you balance that?

That's a good question, actually. We've had a lot of people that do hate us because we've done well and we've become who we are but um i think we've i think the haters and i think people that we've had people try and copy the brand you know we've had people that have produced their own magazines because you know because they think they can earn money off it and we've had the people try and take us down. And the mindset to me is, you know, if you've got haters, if you've got people that are, you know, copying you, if you've got people that are trying to be in competition with you,

you've got to take it as a positive because it means you're doing something right. So if you don't have haters, if you don't have the people coming out, giving you competition, that's not a good thing. The fact that you've got haters and you've got this is awesome because it means you're on the right path and you're doing something right. That's kind of where my head sits. I love this answer, which is so true. Because again, they always exist, right? But tell me,

again, I want to hear a little bit of, you know, less than famous word for you. And I will also add to the audience. If you're an incredible CEO running a mid to big organization, right, and you want to be featured in CEO magazine, I can't think of a better place to get the platform that you guys have, right? And the visibility that you guys have. right, and the visibility that you guys have. So this is more for my audience. But what are some of your kind of last famous words for our audience?

I suppose I think probably it might come down to – it probably would come down to help and support, I think think because I think it's important to say that anyone starting their own business anything like this probably last sort of famous words would be when I started the CEO magazine there was no one around to help it's you know there wasn't this rule book to follow like I said you know it's all that sort of stuff but um i think when you start there's there's no help and you actually have to help yourself um it's different when business grows and starts to become successful because then other people will come in and try and you know help you and come to you in terms of partnership

support and everything like that um but you know there's there's guys like john karagonis from the ceo circle richard branson you know i've been offered good advice along the way um my two daughters support me and help me in ways that they can't even comprehend um but you know my partner sophie she gives me a shoulder to cry on and a glass of wine to laugh over when things are good or bad or whatever. But that's kind of like all post-startup. I think it's important to mention to listeners that, you know, at the start, I genuinely believe that the only person that can kind of help you is yourself. Help comes in different forms at different times. You know, you can have all the support you want

as a startup um but if at heart if at heart and this is probably this is something to really sort of think the listeners should probably think about this if i could give one piece of advice it's like if at heart you don't have the you need this burning desire to succeed you need this genuine unshakable belief that failure isn't an option um which sometimes comes from adversity like i had but if you don't have that if you don't have that that inner belief that failure is not an option then your road to success just becomes a path to mediocrity that most people are quite happy to walk on. Does that make sense? It does. It does. So first of all, I think it's incredible what you said, because at the end of the day, yes, you can have coaches and you can have education and you can have people to lean on. But at the end of the day, if you can't motivate yourself, if you can't push higher, if you're willing to just settle for mediocrity, you're

absolutely, you know, nobody else can kind of push you forward. Right. So all the rest is it's going to happen within. Right. It's your mindset. It's, you know, and how do you catapult yourself and you know push yourself higher um and i love that chris thank you brilliant brilliant thank you so much for inspiring for sharing your story um folks ceos if you want you know we're gonna have all the information for chris um can't stress it. Like amazing connection to be part of. Definitely meeting next time in Necker Island and amazing. Chris, it was so awesome to have you.

Thanks, Lana. Keep up the good work. You're amazing. Thank you for listening and hope you enjoyed this show. Don't forget to subscribe, follow, share this with friends. I'll see you in the next Leap Show.