Legal AF by MeidasTouch - Legal AF Full Episode - 11/29/2025

Episode Date: November 30, 2025

Trump’s exploitation of national tragedies for cheap political gain, backfires. Trump senior officials admit to violating court orders in contempt, and are caught giving oral orders to fire missiles at people clinging to life. MAGA and the public start recognizing Trump’s lame duck status and starting talking about the “next DOJ” and what it will do to Trump and those in his Administration. Ben and Popok cover it all on the latest episode of the Legal AF podcast. Support Our Sponsors: Cornbread Hemp: Head to https://cornbreadhemp.com/LEGALAF and use code LEGALAF at checkout NOBL: Don’t miss NOBL’s biggest Sale of the Year! Head to https://NOBLTravel.com for up to 62% off your entire order! #NOBL #ad Miracle Made: Upgrade your sleep with Miracle Made! Go to https://TryMiracle.com/LEGALAF and use the code LEGLAF to claim your FREE 3 PIECE TOWEL SET and SAVE over 40% OFF. Udacity: For 40% off your order, head to https://Udacity.com/LEGALAF and use code LEGALAF. True Classic: Head to https://TrueClassic.com/LEGALAF to grab the perfect gift for everyone on your list. Smart Credit: Head to https://SMARTCREDIT.com/LEGALAF and start your 7-day trial for just $1. Learn more about the Popok Firm: https://thepopokfirm.com Subscribe to Legal AF Substack: https://substack.com/@legalaf Check out the Popok Firm: https://thepopokfirm.com Remember to subscribe to ALL the MeidasTouch Network Podcasts: MeidasTouch: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/meidastouch-podcast Legal AF: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/legal-af MissTrial: https://meidasnews.com/tag/miss-trial The PoliticsGirl Podcast: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/the-politicsgirl-podcast Cult Conversations: The Influence Continuum with Dr. Steve Hassan: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/the-influence-continuum-with-dr-steven-hassan Mea Culpa with Michael Cohen: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/mea-culpa-with-michael-cohen The Weekend Show: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/the-weekend-show Burn the Boats: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/burn-the-boats Majority 54: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/majority-54 Political Beatdown: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/political-beatdown On Democracy with FP Wellman: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/on-democracy-with-fpwellman Uncovered: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/maga-uncovered Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hey Ontario, come down to BetMGM Casino and see what our newest exclusive the Price is Right Fortune Pig has to offer. Don't miss out, play exciting casino games based on the iconic game show, only at BetMGM. Check out how we've reimagined three of the show's iconic games like Plinko, Clifhanger, and the Big Wheel into fun casino game features. Don't forget to download the BetMGM Casino app for exclusive access and excitement on the Price's Right Fortune Pick. Pull up a seat and experience the price is right fortune pick, only available at BetMGM Casino. BetMGM and GameSense remind you to play responsibly, 19 plus to wager. Ontario only, please play responsibly. If you have questions or concerns about your gambling or someone close to you, please contact ConEx Ontario at 1866-531-260 to speak to an advisor, free of charge.

BetMGEMM operates pursuant to an operating agreement with Eye Gaming Ontario. A lot to discuss this Thanksgiving weekend on Legal AF. You have the head of J.P. Morgan Chase, Jamie Diamond, indicating that he has deep concerns about any affiliation with the Golden Ballroom because it may be illegal, as we've been talking about here on the Midas Touch Network. We will cover that. Also, what happened with this DC shooter in Washington, D.C. Trump granting this individual asylum back in April. Then you have the Trump regime blaming former President Biden, although extensive vetting was done. in connection with this person's arrival, because this person was working with the CIA and the US military for about 10 years, we'll break that down. Donald Trump's election rigging of the midterms

is going wildly wrong for him. Indiana Republicans are asserting themselves against Donald Trump for various reasons, including that they're getting swatted based on Trump regime threats. Donald Trump's use of the R word to refer to Governor Walls, And one of the Indiana state senators said that I have a person with disabilities in my family,

and to use the R word, crosses the rubicon for me. We'll talk about that. And more, Donald Trump posted that he's canceling any executive order that was issued by former President Biden because Donald Trump says that Biden used an auto pen. And if Biden says he didn't use an auto pen, then Donald Trump says, I will charge him with perjury. He doesn't have the ability to charge him with perjury. There's no statements under oath. Not only is what Donald Trump saying is crazy, it is deeply unlawful.

We will break it down. Also, we'll talk about the bombshell report by the Washington Post, which identified, I think, in greater detail, the war crimes being committed off the coast of Venezuela and how the Secretary of Defense, who unlawfully refers to himself as the Secretary of War, Pete Exif, ordered that. that individuals who survived some of these boat strikes be killed by SEAL Team 6, and SEAL Team 6 then killed, survivors, it's a violation of numerous international law, American law, it's a war crime, it's murder, we'll cover what the implications are there.

And also in a declaration submitted in connection with contempt proceedings out in federal court in Washington, D.C., the DOJ was required to surrid and submit affidavit of who was involved in the decision to violate a federal judge, Judge Boasberg's order not to send migrants to the El Salvador concentration camp until due process was provided these individuals. And the DOJ identified that Christy Noem was aware of the court's order. And Christy Noem said, basically, we don't care. Send the individuals to the El Salvador concentration

camp. And that's how those individuals got there in violation of the court order. And now Judge Bozberg's demanding that Christine Ome submit a declaration of herself, and then we'll likely see her testimony. I think the judge is going to order, but we haven't got to the live testimony. We're at the declaration stage right now. That and more here on Legal A.F. Michael Popock, great to see. Happy Thanksgiving to you. Happy Thanksgiving to all the legal A-Fers.

We know that it's a difficult Thanksgiving, given what Donald Trump's done to this country. Although I think it is a Thanksgiving, unlike last year's Thanksgiving, felt a little more hope that there's a path beyond this Trump horror show, and it feels that there is a major shift happening, at least in this country, vis-a-vis Trump. Yeah, I think you're absolutely right. Look at what we've watched in the last two weeks, some of which we're going to touch on an update today. You got the Trump administration back in the crosshairs of a criminal contempt proceeding by

Chief Judge Bozberg in D.C., one that they probably thought was long buried because of some appellate rulings that went originally in the Trump administration's direction. But he's back, and he's like a bad penny for the Trump administration, but he's great for our democracy. You know, I saw a couple of hundred former federal judges or so got together and are now speaking out. And I like former federal judges that speak out against the attacks on the rule of law. But what I really like and appreciate are judges who are still on the bench,

wear on the black robe at Judge Bozberg's level, appellate court level, or senior status level that are just winning against the Trump administration and their attack on rule of law. So just in the last two weeks, criminal contempt proceeding blows up in Donald Trump's face. Judge Curry dismisses both Halligan, tosses Halligan, Lindsey Halligan and the indictments of two of Donald Trump's arch enemies in his own mind of the Attorney General of New York and the former FBI director, James Comey, the Epstein cover-up, cover-up blows up in Donald Trump's face again in a way that you and I could not, and as much as we've followed this, and as closely as you have particularly, we could not have envisioned that it would lead to Marjorie Taylor Green being tossed out of MAGA, but MAGA also imploding, at the same time as people realize finally on the right side of the aisle that the emperor has no clothes, that he's insane, that he's barbaric, that he is deranged, and they are no longer

following him. They find that they can survive politically without Donald Trump as his grip on power has tremendously slipped. As his administration does what other dictatorships swirling the drain of history do, they start committing war crimes and murder and they act with impunity and they act with a certain smugness that comes with this drunken, drunk, being drunk on power. And then it all devolves down, Ben, into the polling numbers. I mean, another round of polling numbers just came out in the last couple of days. He's down by double digits, Trump, in not only the original seven battleground states by 14 and 15 points unfavorable in all the battleground states that he brags about having a one run the table against Kamala Harris but in a couple of states that aren't even really or three states that aren't even really considered battlegrounds but are now Texas he's down six points along with Ohio and along with Florida so we just saw what happened three weeks ago election night in America, we can anticipate what's going to happen now as people jump off the Trump

train. And then what is he left with? He's left with what happened after the murder of Charlie Kirk, the unfortunate incident of the shooting and the murder of National Guardspeople in D.C. He's left with overplaying his hand and making statements to try to go back against the Biden administration that end up backfiring in his face. At the same time, the American people are suffering under the crushing weight of inhumane and economically disastrous Trump policies. Anytime he mentions Biden, it's an instant backfire at this point. Because, look, you're in charge now for 10 months.

And whether what you're saying about Biden is true or not, it's almost besides the point, although it should be true statements, not lies. Let me be very clear about that. it's just you're in charge now like you're 10 months in we're basically a year in and you're whining about Biden right and so the moment you start doing that I think no matter really what political side of the aisle you're on unless you're just total magamush brained which there still is you know 25 30 percent of the country that's that but everyone else I mean independent voters Democratic voters we're up you know lots of Republicans even are like what are you doing man just just you promise these things you're not delivering these things you're a liar you breached our trust and worse yet, you're inflicting pain upon the American people. Okay, let's get into these various topics right now because we've got a lot to cover on this episode.

The first one will start off is something that we've been focused on a lot here, the ballroom and the golden ballroom and the unlawful nature of it. We've been talking about everything from how the mere construction of it is unlawful in my view, and also how when corporations are attaching themselves to it, It's an obvious kind of quid pro quo, which to me violates very clearly multiple bribery statutes. And as we look beyond what our country can look like in a post-Trump era, those who are involved in bribery schemes, those who aided and abetted the criminality taking place, right, those who are involved in, we'll talk about later, war crimes, you know, there will be, I think, a now. national reckoning, international reckoning when it comes to the war crimes. And these things will not be forgotten. These things will be exposed. And people will be held, I believe, accountable.

I think that any Democrat running for the presidency will have to, I think, describe as a platform ensuring that the U.S. is part of any international response to the war crimes that America is committing. I think the way we dealt with Nixon, pose Nixon, in terms of changing laws and dealing with accountability, it's going to be that times a multiple that is so far out there that I don't even know what the number would be because this is Nixon every single day, 20 times a day, way worse every single time a day. Watergate would be a blip on a Friday afternoon based on what the Trump regime does every single day. Let me toss it to you, Popak, on this issue of the ballroom.

Two things are happening. One, you have the architect and Donald Trump fighting. John McCreery the second and Trump are fighting over the size of the ballroom. The architect says it's big enough based on the current plans. Trump wants it bigger and we see how Donald Trump gets into these lawsuits all the time with people he works with. And now this McCreary guy, the architect, I mean, not only do I think he looks like a horrible figure historically based on him taking part in this. But now he's in a fight with Donald Trump

over the size. He wants it smaller. Trump wants it bigger. And then you have J.P. Morgan Chase head, J.P. Morgan Chase had Jamie Diamond saying the following. We have an issue, okay, which is anything we do, since we do a lot of contracts with governments here and around the world, we have to be very careful about how anything is perceived and also how the next DOJ is going to deal with it. So we're quite conscious of risks we bear by doing anything. Now, it looks like buying favors or anything like that, he continued. Popok turned it over to you. I think he means a few things there.

He means the way it looks, meaning bribery. Number two, as U.S. is getting weaker and other countries are asserting themselves, J.P. Morgan Chase does business in Europe, in Asia, with Canada, in Australia, in South America, and Central America, and Africa. and as the United States is being very harmful to those other areas, I think J.P. Morgan Chase recognizes as an international company, it can't also be aiding and abetting assaults on the sovereignty of other countries and being perceived as astute.

So I think he's astute in making that observation. What do you think? Yeah, I mean, look, what we're starting to see is what Donald Trump fears. and what his nightmares are made of, which is the lame duck status of Donald Trump. All the talk about, I'm going to run for a third term. No, you're not. You're closer to being impeached and convicted than you are getting a third term

or being declared a war criminal. That's what keeps Donald Trump up at night, his loss of power, his loss of influence, which is why he's reaching out like, hey, there's an election in Honduras on Sunday. I got an idea. Let me let out the narco-terrorism. as president serving a 45-year term in New York that my criminal defense lawyer, Emil

Bovi, worked on when he was a U.S. attorney to try to curry favor with the Trump of Honduras. Make Honduras great again. He has to do that because his waning influence in America is so debilitating to him. The grip on power has been lost. Tito Asforah, everybody, write it down. If you had Tito Asferra on your bingo card for us supporting it on And every time he tries to get involved with foreign politics and tries to lead to regime change, it backfires for him, just as you outline him going after Joe Biden, backfires for him here. You know, he goes after Brazil and the Trump of Brazil and how he's being treated in the criminal process.

And Brazil stands up to him even at great financial sacrifice of a 50% tariff because they're going to put and they have put Bolsonaro in jail for 22 years. So what we're watching is the incredible shrinking presidency and Donald Trump knowing it. And the MAGA is falling apart because they no longer need him to get elected. Quite the contrary, as far away as they can get from the imploding presidency, the better it is for their own political fortunes. And they now realize it. You and I are not going to be talking about MAGA Mike Johnson in about a year.

I don't think at all. I don't think he's going to survive his own caucus. And so Trump sees this landscape, at least people around him, see this landscape. And now things that were sort of, oh, that's Trump being Trump, those golden ballrooms and marble bathrooms. That, as you said, the narrative has shifted. The ground under Donald Trump has changed considerably. The shutdown showed him to be the heartless petty tyrant that he is attacking poor Americans, literally. which makes a lot of people upset, including those that aren't poor,

but that support the disadvantaged in America. So all of that has happened. So once when you and I and others recovered from, he tore down the East Wing and the legacy of First Ladies operating out of the East Wing. He bulldozed the whole thing. During the shutdown, you and I were scrambling along with media, like trying to cover the shutdown and the funding and the this and that. we'd be like oh yeah the ballroom but now that we're all back and congress is all back things like the

ballroom and and letters written by senate democrats like elizabeth warren and ben and ben jonson benny thompson who says to all of the corporate donors give me all your contracts give me all the ways that you what you were promised for building this ballroom is now the chickens are coming home to roost and what you're to see. What I loved about, maybe we could have Salty put it back up, what I loved about Jamie Diamond's comment is all of a sudden I'm starting to see references to the next Department of Justice. I saw it in elected members of the House talking about the murderous rampage of Donald Trump in the Caribbean, taking out and making disappear 80 human beings, including new reporting that he double-tapped with Pete Heggseth giving oral command as two human

being clung to the side of a boat to fire on them again, shooting them in the back. What a coward. And to this day, you and I can't report on who any of the 80 people are, what they did, what their link, if any, to narco-terrorism is, or to the Trenda-Aragua cartel, or what was on board, because it's all been blown to smithereens. So, and you have people now claim, now saying, we're going to hold you a count. Not only Donald Trump, who has his own shield given to him by the Supreme Court in the immunity decision, but those around him do not. And we're looking at you, Pam Bondi and Tulsi Gabbard and Steven Miller and Pete Heggseth, and the list goes on.

And so what I what I like about where we are coming into 2026 is that the people have spoken in elections, in polling, in the way the economy is being handled and the like. The Democrats are starting to get their groove back in leadership. It's hard to lead from the minority position, but the Democrats are doing a very, very good job at setting the table for the conversation they need to have at the midterms. And we're winning the fight, thank God, in the map areas so far. So for me, the takeaway of the ballroom thing is not just the ballroom. It's that business leaders who had supported Donald Trump are realizing that he's running out of time here, the time horizon for Donald Trump is much shorter than they anticipated. And now we're worrying about what the next Department of Justice, the next FBI, the next Democratic-led government looks like.

You mentioned Honduras, Tito Asfura, who's running for president. He's running against a candidate who is indebted. endorsed by the current president of Honduras, Siomara Castro, and Trump hates Seymara Castro because she asserted the sovereignty and autonomy of the country as against Donald Trump. But Trump's trying to install his kind of magistuge in Honduras, and as part of doing that,

and to kind of rile up division and kind of civil war and just bring up pain and strife within the country. and to harm the United States of America in this post where Donald Trump interferes at the election in Honduras, which is just unheard of for the United States president to ever post anything like this. He goes like, if Tito Asphira wins, we will help Honduras. If he loses, we will throw you under the bus. And we will not care about Honduras anymore. And we will, like, harm Honduras.

So that's one of the threats that Trump makes. And then he says that I will give a full and complete pardon to the former president, Juan Orlando Hernandez, And this is what Trump says, who has been, according to many people that I greatly respect, treated very harshly and unfairly. This cannot be allowed to happen. Congratulations to Juan Orlando Hernandez. That's Roger Stone. Roger Stone is the only one promoting the pardon of a 45-year convicted narco-terrorist,

former president of Honduras. So anytime Donald Trump is out there and saying that, oh, we're doing this to stop the narco-terrorist, that one of the biggest narco-terrorist is Juan Orlando Hernandez, and Juan Orlando Hernandez's brother. They provided quarter help support. They used the office to provide logistics to the Sinaloa cartel with Chapo, and they moved, like, quite literally, 400 tons or more of cocaine into the United States, tens of billions or hundreds of billions of dollars of cocaine and other drugs.

into the United States, they're the worst of the worst of narco drug trafficking, of narco drug terrorists. And Trump says, this guy has been treated unfairly. I know that Juan Hernandez is not as like high profile, perhaps in our country, as the name El Chapo, but there is no El Chapo without Juan Orlando Hernandez. And so we're basically like pardoning Chapo. And by the way, you go back earlier in this regime and what they were doing. Remember, people, People saw Chapo's family getting a VIP tour into the United States from Tijuana as part of a deal that Trump was making, which wasn't announced with anybody, with the cartels. And right now, in this country right now, Choppos family, they basically have full FBI protection. We don't know where they're living, but he basically gave the Choppo family VIP right now.

And that's who Donald Trump is. But notice, that's the people he supports, the billionaire corrupt criminals, and who does he, who does he take down? The lower level people, and in this country, who does he take down? Most of the people who he hates and who he helps is the right. Well, this is why MAGA is imploding, because even the Laura Loomers are like, we just pardoned the narco-terrorist bribed accepting president of Honduras after the DEA, Donald Trump. started under Donald Trump. Donald Trump's U.S. Attorney's Office, including Emil Bovey and others took the guy down. A jury convicted him and sentenced him to 45 years in prison,

and we're letting him walk out the door because Donald Trump wants to influence the election on Sunday in Honduras. Why I say Popak that anything on a random Friday that Trump does would make Watergate look small is quite literally an example like this, right? A random Friday, this is what he posts, that he wants to help pardon and support one of the number one narco-terrorists that's out there. And you'll hear not a peep from state regime media known as Fox and right-wing media. Not like this. If Biden or Obama ever made a post like this, I can assure you, on a bipartisan basis, they would be impeached the next Monday.

There would be proceedings the next Monday. If it was on Thanksgiving, they may even started on that. That's Saturday. Popak, we've got a lot to discuss. I want to get into the war crimes that Hegsseth is committing. I want to get into the rigging of the maps and more. Let's take our first quick break of the show. Just a reminder for everybody about Michael Popock's law firm. Check it out. If you or anybody you know has been injured in an accident, a car accident, a trucking accident, give a call to thepopokfirm.com. 877 Popok AF. Go to thepopfirm.com or call. 877 Popak AF. The consultation is free. Popak's representing a huge amount of people who listen and watch legal AF. So take that free consultation. If you or somebody you know has a potential case, let Popak's team take a look at it, and they have lawyers all across the country. Also, subscribe to the LegalAF Substack and subscribe to the LegalAF YouTube channel. That YouTube channel is so close to hitting one million subscribers in 2025. And wow, would that be great if we can hit one million

subscribers in the first year of that LegalAF channel? All right, let's take our first quick break of the show. We will be right back with much more Michael. Never wake up sweaty, freezing, or just plain uncomfortable. The temperature in your bedroom can make or break your sleep. That's why I switch to miracle made sheets. They're inspired by NASA technology and use silver infused temperature-regulating fabric to help you sleep perfectly all night long. With Miracle Made, you'll sleep at the perfect temperature. Whether you run hot or cold, these sheets keep you in the comfort zone from the moment you crawl in to the moment you wake up.

And here's what I love. They stay cleaner longer, thanks to their antibacterial silver technology Miracle Made sheets, stay fresh up to three times longer than regular sheets, meaning fewer odors, fewer wash cycles, and way less laundry. They're luxuriously comfortable, too, smooth, breathable, and soft like what you'd find in a five-star hotel, but without the luxury price tag. So upgrade your sleep or give the gift of better rest. Go to try miracle.com slash legal a.F to try miracle-made sheets today.

You'll save over 40%. And when you use promo code legal AF, you'll get an extra 20% off. plus a free three-piece towel set. They make an amazing gift, and with a 30-day money-back guarantee, there's no risk. That's try miracle.com slash legal a.f, code legal a.f at checkout.

Thanks to Miracle Made for sponsoring this episode. Before I found Noble, I never thought about how easy it is to break into regular luggage. Most bags can literally be popped open with a ballpoint pen and zip back up like nothing ever happened. And we leave them every,

with hotel staff, airline crews, overhead bins, one poke, and your laptop meds, passport, gone. But once I switched to the noble all-in-one carry-on, I became obsessed. It's totally zipperless. It locks shut with a latch like a safe. You feel that solid click, and suddenly you're traveling without that low-level panic. They also fixed all the annoying travel stuff, a built-in charger so you're not crouched by an outlet, a front laptop pocket that makes TSA painless. super smooth 360-degree wheels and the clutch flip-out cup holder so you can actually juggle your coffee

and boarding pass like a human no wonder over 500,000 people 12,000 pilots and flight attendants and even TSA agents swear by it plus a 100-day money-back guarantee free three-day shipping and a lifetime warranty noble gives you real travel peace of mind security design and convenience all in one For a limited time, Noble is having the biggest sale ever. Head to Noble Travel.com for up to 58% off your entire order. That's N-O-B-L Travel.com for up to 50% off. After you purchase, they'll ask you where you heard about them. Please support our show and tell them our show sent you.

Let me talk about True Classic for a second, because these guys started with a simple mission, bringing premium comfortable clothing to the masses, since looking and feeling great shouldn't come with a designer price tag. And clearly, people agree. They've sold over 25 million shirts to more than 5 million customers with more than 200,000 five-star reviews backing them up. But what I really love is that True Classic isn't just about the fabric or the fit. It's about confidence, about helping the people you care about, show up feeling comfortable,

pulled together, and honestly, well, just better. that's why true classic has become one of my go-to holiday gifts their clothes look amazing feel even better and now they've got options for the whole family i originally bought true classic for myself and once they launched their women's line i even grab some stuff as gifts for the women in my family their sweat sets are insanely comfortable and that tank top total hit super easy to dress up or down so skip the stress and the overpriced designer stuff this year give comfort, give confidence, give True Classic. You can find them at Amazon, Target, Costco, and Sam's Club, or head to True Classic.com slash LegalAF to shop the perfect gifts for everyone on your list. Let's welcome everybody back to LegalAF. Thank you to our sponsors. This show does not exist without our pro-democracy sponsors,

so make sure you follow them, try to check out their products. The discount codes are in the description below. All right, Popok, why don't we talk about, want to talk about Bozberg and then we can get into war crimes? I'll toss it over to you to speak about Judge Bozberg moving forward with contempt proceedings after a circuitous route in the Court of Appeals. It's interesting because there's this Trump, there's this Trump or judge who always supports the Trump or stuff. Judge Katzis over there on the circuit court, on the D.C. And it's the Trump regime keeps on citing Judge Katz said. Judge Katz said, and Judge Bozberg's like,

you keep citing one circuit court judge. You want to talk about what everybody else is basically saying right now because I've been given this case back to now look into contempt proceedings. And this is all arising out of, it shows you how these cases take a lot of time, Popak and legal efforts. The original kind of a little, a lawful order that was made by the Trump regime to round up these migrants, send them to the concentration camp in El Salvador.

Judge Bozberg made that order saying, way, way, way, wait. Maybe we do that in the future, but let's understand what this plan is. Let's understand if due process has been violated. What's going on here? And the Trump regime said, we don't care, Bozberg. We're sending them to the concentration camp.

and then everything kind of flowed from that. And it's kind of, as we talk about Hegson's order, which is, you know, kill him after the initial strike as well, you know, you just have these rogue criminal people in the Trump regime, starting at the top of Trump, who just keeps on making these criminal orders over and over and again. So what's going on with Bozberg and how did Christy Nome get exposed as the person who directly Gnome herself said, basically, screw the judge. You send them. And now she's wrapped up into these proceedings. What's going on here, Popeye? Yeah, it's, you and I covered it at length when it happened

in March. Judge Bosberg was one of the first judges in a case called JGG. I've had the ACLU who's leading the charge there. So of you. I've had Lee Glartner from A.C.L.L. from the ACLU on as recently as a week ago, talking about the case. And that's when Donald Trump, that's when Boseberg for the Trump administration said, you're not sending 200 Venezuelaans to El Salvador and the prison there, Seacot prison, without due process until I get my arms around it. So I'm going to enter a temporary restraining order. Knowing that the temporary restraining order was coming that day, they continued to fuel the jets and fly them away. from federal court jurisdiction and oversight on purpose and when they got into the courtroom

they had drew ensign who's the lead lawyer there effectively not tell the truth to Boseberg I don't think they told the truth on their recent filing either about the timing of the planes versus the judge's order the judge had grounded the planes and he said any plane that has left needs to turn around and come back because I have jurisdiction over human beings, right? Like federal officials and pilots tell them to come back. And they didn't do that. They grounded some other planes, but 200 people went to Venezuela. In fact, most of those people are no longer in El Salvador. They were later traded in a prisoner exchange back to Venezuela. So they were so mean and ornery and narco-terrorist military combatants

that we sent them back to Venezuela to rejoin the narco regime that we're at war with? Does that make any sense to anybody? No, because all of it's untrue. So the judge says, what do you mean the planes went? They said, well, you gave an oral order. By the time you reduced it to writing, there was this gap. And he said, oral order, oral orders from a federal judge are orders of a federal judge. And you violated those orders.

and I'm going to get to the bottom of it. Now, a little twist here. The actual order itself later, much later, got vacated, thrown out by the United States Supreme Court. But at the time they needed to be complied with, they were orders. And the way this works is you don't get to say, you know, I think one day, Judge, your order is going to be found to be, it's going to be reversed on appeal. Or you're going to lose at the Supreme Court, so, you know, contempt, I don't care. You can't do that. You have to abide by the order, less than until you're relieved of the order down the way.

So that's what you hear a lot of MAGA jumping up and down. But he lost. Bozberg's order was reversed at the Supreme Court. He said, now I need to get to the bottom of who violated my order and why. And you and I reported in April about the start of a criminal contempt proceeding. He found probable cause to start a criminal contempt proceeding. against the Trump administration. They appealed all that to the D.C. appellate court.

Three-judge panel, you know the old joke, how many Trumpers does it take to screw up a decision? Two. There were two Trumpers, Judge Rayo, Judge Katz's. And they, but they, none of that, along with, I think it was Polard as the third judge, a Democratic-appointed judge. And they couldn't come to an agreement on a consensus

of what they're even their ruling meant. So, but it did stop the content. proceeding. Then I went off on another layer of appeal related to whether this was going to be heard by the entirety of the D.C. Circuit. And then when they said no, but they also gave permission for Judge Bozberg to pick up where he left off to get to the bottom of contempt, which the appellate panel said was very, very serious. And the Trump wasn't relieved of the Trump administration wasn't relieved by the contempt contumacious behavior. behavior because the Supreme Court later bailed them out on the order.

So that's how we got here. The judge reopens the hearing last week, and he says to the parties, give me a briefing schedule and witnesses that you think would be important for me to hear from. One in particular the judge says I want to hear from is right what you and I talked about. I said at the time when Eris Ruvani, who just joined democracy. forward as a new lawyer democracy forward is over with us on an amazing playlist on legal a on legal a f channel they have they have a hundred cases against the trump administration now eras rivenny is one of their lawyers but eros rivenny used to be for 15 years the head or one of the senior lawyers in the

immigration litigation division of the department of justice serve five administrations apolitical you and i should never have to say the words eros ruveni but he's one of the sung heroes because he told the truth to Judge Zinnis and Judge Bozberg, that things were happening, that illegally Abrago Garcia was sent to El Salvador when he shouldn't have been. That's not part of the record. And he told Judge Bozberg when he was in the Bozberg courtroom, he told him the truth that planes went after the oral order was issued and he got fired for doing so. And when Emil Bovi, the number two in the Department of Justice, number three in the Department of Justice, who was nominated to be, and has now been confirmed to be,

a Third Circuit Court of Appeals judge sitting in Philadelphia, former criminal judge, criminal lawyer for Donald Trump. When Amel Bovi was in his confirmation process, out came like a 30-page, single-spaced whistleblower complaint from Amel, from Eris Rivetti, who said, right in the same time block, same days, as Judge Boeberg's order was violated, that Amel Bovi from the Department of Justice,

got the litigation, immigration litigation lawyers together in the DOJ, including Eros Rivetti, and told them that if a federal judge asks you where planes are, as we fly people away under the Alien Enemies Act, you're to tell them to F off. Literally, F off, fuck off. Became part of the Senate record as Adam Schiff asked Emil Boeveh, did you ever tell the lawyers under you to go tell federal judges to go, F off? And now we have the explanation. When we saw that letter, we said,

uh-oh, Judge Zinnis in Maryland in the Obrigo-Garcia case is going to want to hear from Eris Rivetti, and so is Judge Bozberg. And Bozberg, whether he's a fan of the show or not, said in court last week, I want to hear from Errors Ravetti. And Errorvetti's ready to go. He's ready to get testimony in that courtroom about the reason that the Trump administration violated his order

looks like it's because a now Third Circuit judge gave the command to violate the order. When it came down to who made the decision within the administration that wasn't a lawyer, they threw Christy Nome under the bus. She's always good to throw under the bus. Puppie killer Nome, I, based on the advice that was given to me by Todd Blanche and Emil Bovey and other people in my department made the decision that an oral order wasn't binding or whatever this crazy crackpot. theory was to let her give the go signal for these 200 people so to the answer to the you know to answer the question who gave the the code red it was christine home she's now going to have to testify in on paper we

call it a declaration if it's live we call it live testimony under oath amel bovey might have to that's going to be weird third circuit appellate judge coming over to testify to chief judge Bosberg in his trial court about a hearing, you know, because they all thought, Trump thought he was going to bury this problem. He was going to take the 200, take him out of El Salvador, send him back to Venezuela. He was going to take Elmo Bovi, go hide him in a court position, a judge position. Nothing to see here, right, folks? Not according to Judge Bosberg. And so what we're left with is the Trump administration and Pam Bondi continuing to hammer away at the reputation, which is unassailable, of Jeff Bozberg. Oh, Jeff Bozberg. He's the one as the chief judge that allowed those subpoenas

about the phone records for the senators. By the way, note to MAGA and Lindsey Graham, nobody gives a shit about the fact that your phone bill was looked at in order to determine whether you were trying to overthrow democracy. No voter cares about that in the swing states. And yet this is what the Trump administration is left with. Oh, Bozberg was involved with that. Oh, Bozberg is a radical terrorist-enabling judge, Bondi said recently. I'm like, they obviously know that their time on planet Earth in the Department of Justice is short. And they're making, they're just, I mean, would you ever think that an attorney general

would attack a sitting chief judge of the D.C. court in the vocabulary that's being used by the Trump administration. Would you ever see that, Ben? You would never see that. You would never fathom that. What you would see is where I went to law. School, Georgetown Law, someone like Bozberg and the AG sitting on a panel together, you know, having a collegial conversation about the rule of law. That's what I was used to seeing

when I went to law school. I agree. I mean, I went to Duke and we were within the three-hour drive from D.C. And Supreme Court justices used to come down to judge our moot court competition. When I was on Moot Court Board, I got to sit next to Justice Kennedy, who just got put on brand new justice, even though I was still the same Democratic person I am now, you know, I was still an honor and a privilege to meet Justice Kennedy and host him at my table and all that. Scalia came down for, but like, that's, this administration does not take, especially the Department of Justice, there is no independence. They're just political hacks who are an arm of the Trump campaign instead of being what you and I expect and demand, and the people demand,

from their Department of Justice, look, there's a lot of repair work that's going to have to get done starting at the midterms, but then when a Democratic president takes office, he has to rebuild almost from scratch the Department of Justice, put in an attorney general that is respected, who then spends time to take 5,000 people that left and either get them back, hopefully making it attractive to bring back career prosecutors back to the fold because of the brain drain, and then new people because there's another major problem you and I only touched on law students don't want to work in the government law students don't want to work in the Department of Justice from the top 10 or top 20 law schools and they're abandoning clerkships you know and and so there's

this whole gap it's like COVID gap for kids in school like oh I didn't I wasn't on campus for three years there's a whole gap in the training and the talent that would be in the Department of Justice All has to be rebuilt from scratch by a new president. One last thing. The only thing that's been good so far, it's hard to believe there's been so few, I want to get your opinion on this, so few federal judge openings for Trump to fill, there's been a few, but very few in the first 10 months. I'm not saying it's going to hold for the whole next three years.

But what do you make of the fact that there's so few people retiring or openings for Trump to fill right now? Look, I would say that about 90 to 95 percent of this current federal judiciary at the trial court level, federal judges by and large do not like this regime, uphold law and order. I may disagree with their rulings. but by and large, have a view that Trump is a threat to this Constitution at that level. Okay? You, of course, have your outliers like your judge canons and others. But I would say 90% of the federal judges have actually done their jobs by and large.

Then you get up to the circuit court level, and I feel like that probably drops to about 65%, 70%, but by and large, the circuit court judges, taking their responsibilities seriously, usually affirming the rulings of the trial court judges. We're talking about Trump judges. We're talking about Obama judges, George W. Bush, George H.W. Bush, Reagan judges, Biden judges, you know, Clinton judges. At the Supreme Court, that's been the biggest betrayal and the most significant because they've used their shadow docket by invoking perceived.

Needral nuances that they've never invoked before to often stay or pause the federal court or circuit court rulings pending trial and trials can take years as we're seeing take place. So if it takes years and the status quo the Supreme Court says is what Trump says not the federal judge order or not what existed before Trump, which I would interpret the status quo as what was the lawfully existing thing before Trump broke it. The Supreme Court saying, well, Trump broke it. That's the status quo. And the federal judge stopping Trump is not the status quo by bringing back what existed before Trump, but is breaking the status quo because Trump's status quo. That's what the Supreme Court is saying. So they're allowing Trump's policies to stay in effect based on shadow docket and staying these rulings. So I think that the federal judges have made a pact with each other. And I think that they've been able to make it not like by being in like a back room,

smoking cigar saying, here's what we're going to do. But I think if you've listened to their messaging at the various conferences, they've been signaling to each other, we need to hold the line right now. And not to suggest that someone who's on the older side, there's going to be resignations, of course, just by the nature of the age of some of these judges. But Popak, I believe it's intentional. But I want to talk about this too before the break, and I think we can take this one in a little bit of a shorter nugget here, which is we're also seeing now state-level legislators assert themselves against the Trump regime in a place like Ruby Red Indiana, of all places, where we've just seen a group of about eight of them, but it could be even more at the Indiana state Senate level saying to Trump, we're not okay with you rigging these Indiana maps. And many were saying, well, we were open to it and receptive to it. We don't

like the tactics that you've used to try to kind of bully us. And, you know, Trump goes through his whole abusive cachet from charm to threats to, you know, basically inspiring death threats. Want to come to the White House? You could be a club Rose Garden. You want to take a picture with me. You want to golf with me. I got you. Oh, you don't want to do it. I'm going to primary you. I hate you. I'm going after you. You're the worst. primary this person. So we heard just in the past 48 hours from two Indiana state senators, you had Michael Boecheck, Indiana Republican state senator, whose second daughter, whose second daughter has Down syndrome. And he says, you know what, Trump, you've been referring

to people as the R word. You've called Governor Walls the R word on Friday over the past few days or on Thursday. And he's like, you know what? Good luck. Convince the American people over the next 10 months that your policies and your behavior deserve a congressional majority. Try to tell the American people that this is the behavior that they want in the president. A Republican, Indiana State Senator said that. And then another Indiana state senator, Greg Walker, says, I don't even want to go to the White House. He goes, I refuse the invitation to go to the White House. But the underling who reached out to me is trying to influence the election on my dime.

that individual works for me. He works for you. He's on my payroll. He's on your payroll. And he's campaigning on company time. That's a violation of the Hatch Act. He's a federal employee. He works in the White House. But does anyone care about the rules anymore? Not that I can tell. I want to talk to you about this a little bit Popak. We come back from our next quick break. And then let's talk about the war crimes that Higgsith is committing. And we'll talk about more. And we'll talk about the fact that Trump granted the D.C. shooter asylum back in 2025, but is now trying to blame Biden. But here again, we see another example of Republicans, you know, in a ruby red area saying, no, we're not doing this. We're not doing this. Sorry, see you later. We don't like your behavior

and your conduct. We're not attaching ourselves to this. I think a major reason is they saw what's going to happen or what happened in the blue tsunami earlier in November. But if you thought that blue tsunami in November was something at these midterms, if you see a result like that at a grander scale, the Trump presidency is over. And not only is it over, but I think you can now encourage Republicans to actually support impeachment efforts and to support basically standing up to Trump because they now have to think about what's their future in a post-Trump world. They have to triangulate.

They'd have to triangulate to show they're not Trump in order to save their own politics. As you and I have said, as we round out this segment here, the time horizon for Donald Trump and those of the Republicans are different. Donald Trump has a short time horizon, both chronologically and electorally. He's not, right? And people know it. And so others that want to have a career beyond Donald Trump are going to have to figure out And I believe you're right about the pent-up demand to vote against Donald Trump that's coming for the midterm election.

He will be the lamest of lame ducks. As you said, his presidency will effectively be over. And then people are going to be trying to figure out how they survive beyond because the MAGA movement is not going to be picked up by, like, Marco Rubio and J.D. J. Vance. I mean, you know, Donald Trump is one of one. when it comes to the ability at the height of his powers to commandeer that party. And now it's just going to be a mad scramble, to which the Democratic Party, which usually gets bad publicity for not being disciplined and not being organized, we look tremendous.

The party looks tremendously disciplined and tremendously organized as a counterweight to Donald Trump. Let's take our last quick break of the show. A reminder, Michael Popock's law firm is doing a great job. representing so many people in this country who have their own individual cases, and he's representing a lot of people who listen and watch the show. So if you or anybody you know has been injured, whether it's a car accident, a trucking accident, whether you know someone who's the victim of, who died in a horrific accident, catastrophic accident, whether it's medical malpractice, a victim of sexual assault, give the Popock firm a call. The consultation

is free. It's 877 Popok A.S. or call or go to the Popok firm.com. That's 877 Popak AF or visit the Popokfirm.com. Consultation is free. And then if Popak's firm takes the case, they do it on a contingency mini, they don't get paid unless you get paid. Also check out Michael Popak's substack,

the LegalAF substack, and subscribe to LegalAF on YouTube. So close to one million subscribers, so close. All right, we'll be right back after our last quick break of the show. Have you been looking for a natural way to relieve aches and discomfort? The CBD gummies from cornbread hemp are formulated to work with your body, not against it. Cornbread hemp's CBD gummies are made to help you feel better, whether it's stress, discomfort, or just needing a little relaxation.

Their full-spectrum CBD gummies come in watermelon, berry, and peach. Cornbread hemp uses only the best part of the hemp plant, the flour, to create. create pure and potent full-spectrum, CBD, and all of their products are third-party lab tested and USDA organic, ensuring safety and purity without unnecessary fillers. Right now, legal AF listeners can take advantage of holiday bogos savings and enjoy free shipping on orders over $45. Head to cornbreadhemp.com slash legal a.f and use code legal a.m at checkout. That's cornbreadhemp.com slash legal a.f, code, legal,

L-A-F, cornbread hemp. This is the good life. It's called the holiday credit dip, and it hits millions of people every year, and most don't see it coming. The holidays roll in, you swipe your credit card a few extra times, your balance goes up, and your credit score drops. That's where smart credit comes in. Smart credit helps you stop the dip before it happens. They're patented technology, pinpoints exactly which bills to pay, and when? To maximize your credit score, In fact, the average smart credit user can see an increase of 34 points in just 30 days. Maximize your score now, and you could save big in the new year. So while you're out spreading holiday cheer, set yourself up for your smartest financial year yet with smart credit.

Don't wait. Before you take that next swipe, hit to smartcredit.com slash legal AF and start your seven-day trial for just $1. That's smartcredit.com slash legal a.F. Smartcredit.com. Individual results may vary and are not guaranteed. Everyone acts like they fully understand AI. And meanwhile, I'm over here arguing with my smart fridge. If you feel that way, too, that's where Udacity comes in. This podcast is sponsored by Udacity. Want to learn skills that command high salaries? Udacity is an online learning platform with courses in AI and tech, including generative AI, agentic AI, Python, data science, and much more.

Instead of wasting time on random YouTube videos or prompting chat GPT, Udacity cuts the guesswork so you learn exactly what matters. And you're actually doing real hands-on projects. That's why 90% of Udacity graduates say that they achieve their enrollment goal. Last week, I tried Udacity's course on boosting my data skills. Yes, in my sweats, and it felt great to learn something valuable without leaving the couch. There are tons of places to learn tech, but only Udacity is consistently ranked as the top skilled development platform. Real projects, human experts grading your work, it actually works.

Plus, Udacity just launched a master's degree in AI. For under $5,000, you can get a Master of Science in AI, a fraction of the cost of technology. traditional degrees with way more flexibility. What I love most is that with Udacity, you're learning AI but with real human support. Whenever I need help, there's someone there. And having a certification from Udacity really gets recruiters' attention. The tech field is always evolving, and you should be too. You can try Udacity risk-free for seven days. head to udacity.com slash legal a.F and use code legal a.f for 40% off your order. Once again, that's udacity.com backslash legal a.f for 40% off.

And make sure you use my promo code legal AF so they know I sent you. Welcome back to LegalAF. We've got a lot to discuss in this last segment. Pope, why don't we just go straight to talking about this Blockbuster Washington Post report, Which is, by the way, consistent with what we were, I think it was more than just simply we would be speculating about what took place. I mean, you had a four-star admiral from Southcom, which is that region, kind of abruptly quit and resign, which you never see take place. Someone halfway through their term like that, that was four-star Admiral Hoseley, he resigned. And obviously, we had heard stories from the president of Columbia and others in the region

in Trinidad and Tobago that a lot of these people in these fishing boats that have been shot down by the Trump regime, that these people were fishermen, that they were not drug traffickers. In any event, even if you assume that they were low-level drug trafficking mules, at worst, they were the lowest level in the drug hierarchy, people who have the task of basically being their life being threatened or are in the most destitute and they're being sent by the cartels out. Now, we also know based on the size of these boats, 24 feet, these are not big boats that are being used. They likely don't have the fuel to even get into the United States. So they would have to be refueled several times.

They were likely probably going other places in the region if they were going anywhere with drugs. We also know for a fact that there was not fentanyl in those boats. I mean, if anything, there was cocaine, the fentanyl comes from basically the precursor and the ingredients that fentanyl come from Mexico. They're not coming from the region of Venezuela or Colombia, for sure they aren't there. So those are kind of the undisputed facts. And look, we have Coast Guard. You know, Donald Trump was talking about on that deranged press conference he gave on Friday about the Coast Guard cutters, those Coast Guard ships. for very long time, we have these Coast Guard cutters, interdict the ships that are close to the

United States. They go on the ships. They see if the ships, if the boats have drugs on them. I think the statistic is somewhere around one-fourth of the ships that they believe have the drugs on them. Actually don't. But that's why they interdict, they see. There's a process. They don't kill them. And if there are drugs on it, they arrest the people. And then they try to figure out the source, and then they build a methodology, because ultimately they want to get to the high-level traffickers, Popaq, like Juan Hernandez, the president of Honduras, like the guy in the Honduras.

You take your sources, you find who the real person is, you run a case against that person, and that person gets sentenced to 45 years. It's hard to interrogate them when you blow them up. And one of the reasons, one of the things that we've seen in Colombia and Honduras is actually, I'm not going to say that they're drug-free, let's not get carried away, but you've actually seen with President Petro of Colombia, with Seomera Castro in Honduras, for the first time, with help of the United States, real efforts to, reduce the drug narco states in those countries now as the narco states in those countries have

diminished you've seen an increase in fentanyl from china and mexico and elsewhere so you know you it's a little bit of a whack-a-mole game taking place but we we've seen what actual the right efforts can do in and in and in columbia but let's talk about what this new reporting though that hegsa ordered seal team six which had always been viewed as the elite within the elite, shoot to kill if there were survivors of these boat strikes. And we know that there were survivors of the boat strikes, and then they followed in order to then kill the survivors. And this is a clear-cut war crime. We know it. Going back to the 1800s, this was defined as war crimes based on international agreements,

obviously Geneva Conventions, obviously the Rome Treaty, and American law. These are war crimes. This is murder. And after World War II, there was a lot of examples of German U-boat captains, Japanese ships, examples like this, where people would shoot people in the water after they were surviving. And they held trials. And they were like death penalties that sent, you know, people sentenced who were involved in these war crimes after World War II. Popak, break it all down. Yeah, I mean, listen, I live in an area.

I live in Miami where drug trafficking. was part of the scene throughout the 70s and 80s. I mean, you can leave in comments if you know what a square grouper is. A square grouper is bales of marijuana or coke that have been dumped overboard in wrap, in shrink wrap, by boats who have been interdicted, and the fishermen that later find them jokingly referred to them as square grouper. But interdiction, where you, as you said, you get to interrogate. the people on the boat, extradite them, and move yourself up the chain, and find out what was on the ship and go through a due process is quite different than the 20 boats and 80 human beings that have been made to disappear by the Trump administration with a push of a button or a series of buttons off of Trinidad and Tobago and other drone locations. And what we don't have, when the Coast Guard interdicts,

We hear about the tons of cocaine and whatever other drugs and the people that were on board and who they are. We don't know who these people are because the Trump administration doesn't know who they are. They go on and they lie to Congress and Pete Hagseth says they were definitely trend to Aragua. All right, give us the big board. Who in trend to Aragua? Who are they? How are they connected to the cartel? How are these low-level guys on a fishing boat connected to trend or tell us no because they don't know because they don't know the identity of these people and then let's go to phase two what was on board as you said they don't even know what's on board that's why we haven't heard about oh we stopped a ton of cocaine from going it's not fentanyl coming out of these countries it's coke and marijuana it's mainly coke so you've got that you got the lying going on to congress

and congress getting upset about it including ones that have been in the military that's why you see at the very same moment you and i are talking about this story members of former members of the military that are in congress senators and congress people or members of the intelligence community came up with the don't give up the ship video in which they said remember rank and file and army and navy and other armed force brass it is illegal It is unconstitutional for you to follow an unconstitutional order. The Nuremberg principles, which came out of World War II, where German soldiers of different ranks tried to defend themselves for the Holocaust

and the horrors that they perpetrated by saying, we were just following orders. That got thrown out as a defense. You have a moral and legal obligation not to follow illegal orders. That's been embedded in the Code of Military Justice for the United States, the Nuremberg principles. And you and I were talking before we came out of the air that I would not be shocked if in 2028, 29, there are a televised Nuremberg-like trials of people in the Trump administration who have committed acts in violation of the Constitution and of penal law, murder, international law, and the rest. That's why we talked about at the top of this podcast about there's now people, it's coming out of people's mouths, this concept of the next Department of Justice and what they will do. First of all, there's going to be civilian lawsuits filed by the families of the 80 that disappeared. We may not know who they are, but they know who didn't come home from a fishing

expedition. And they're going to be suing in American courts with American federal judges, including the ones you identified, but were not really thrilled with the Trump administration on civil cases. You're going to see versus Pete Hegseth because we just got new reporting coming out of the Washington Post, of all places, in which, in the first strike, at least, in September,

which they only showed us the edited version of. Because if the American people that have seen that video have said, if the American people saw the complete version which is too it was shocking to those in military who were watching this you know on some screen that two people survived three strikes on the boat but they survived and they were hanging on to the side of the of the boat and pig heggseth according to the new reporting gave an oral command not the president of the united states pete egg set to double-tap that boat and fire another missile from a drone and take them out leave no survivors

let's just leave that let's let that reverberate for a second that is in it that is a confession of a war crime and murder committed by the head of the department of defense or war whatever it is that for which he does not have immunity the way that the president of the united states was given immunity by the united states supreme court three years ago in the trump decision he instead has a very flimsy office of legal counsel conjured up fabricated memo that says that he's allowed because they've declared war or taken up arms against Venezuela that he that anything that he does is right and it has cover but every other military justice analyst including those within the

military and outside the military have also that was the commission of a war crime and the impunity by which this administration operates the smugness by which they think they are imperious and they think they are immune to future prosecution and investigation but it's just it's just staggering but it's going to start then with the civil cases that are going to be brought by those families in federal courts that are going to bring out all this evidence as the trump administration scrambles to defend themselves and they're not going to be able to say but we got el chapo we got the head of the narco you didn't get anything because if you got it you would have told us what it was instead you just blew people

out of the water without due process in a tough guy move in some sort of deranged foreign policy related to narco-terrorism? You know, I think that someone should file if they haven't already a Freedom of Information Act request for the full video of that shooting, of the killing of those two individuals, because what's the Trump regime going to claim that it's classified? They've already released all of the image other than that part of it, right? They showed it off. they posted it on social media, and I think that as sick and disturbing as that image is,

I think that it's important to actually see the war crimes that are being committed. It's also notable that during the oral argument a few years back on the issue of absolute immunity, one of the hypotheticals that was used by the liberal justices who voted against absolute immunity was a question to Trump's lawyer, do you believe Trump could order CLE Team 6 to kill his political opponents? And then the lawyer, who's now the Solicitor General at the DOJ, tried to avoid the question, and then ultimately said yes. I think that that is something that you could do if it was viewed as an official act under Article 2, if there was a war being declared, or if there was something in taking care of executive two functions. Yeah, I think you could. And then there was

a debate. You'll recall our coverage on legal AF between the right-wing justices, six of them who ultimately gave Trump absolute immunity, and the liberal justices who voted against it. And the right-wing justices were telling the liberal justices, stop it. Those hypotheticals are never going to happen. What we're worried about is the split-second decision. that a president needs to make, and if they're worried that they could be criminally prosecuted, they won't be able to make those decisions, to which the liberal justices says,

you know what, we've been a country for a pretty long time, and no former president was ever worried about such a thing because they followed the law. And if you're worrying about those things, then maybe you're a criminal, and maybe you're involved in criminality because there's never been this concept of absolute immunity since the very founding of our Constitution

was based on no kings. on no kings. You want to talk about originalist thinking, right? That's one of the frameworks that the Supreme Court's were originalists. We interpretate the original framing. The whole freaking constitution was created as a reaction against the kings, against the monarchy in Britain. So the whole thing was created against absolute immunity. But I think it's interesting because actually Trump used that ruling, as he always does. You give him an inch. He takes your life, is what I've always said. And in this case, he's used that ruling and said, I can go and kill people. I can send ice on the streets. And I won't be held accountable. I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I. But as Popock

makes clear, the people who are in that chain of command, who are following the unlawful orders, there will be a time, as Jamie Diamond said, well, there'll be a new DOJ. And again, I think that any Democratic candidate in the primaries is going to be asked, what is your position about the United States joining with the International War Court? What's your view of the United States following international law when it comes to war crimes? What would you give immunity to Hegsith and these types of people? Would you pardon them and would you protect them from war prosecutions? And I don't see how any Democrat makes it out of the primary without saying we will agree to any international ramifications for these people who committed war crimes, we will not offer protection and we will not offer any

immunity or pardons. I don't see how you make it through the primaries unless you make those commitments. And also, we're going to tear down the golden ballroom crap and we're going to remove all of this stuff. I think that will be a litmus test. Finally, we talked about a lot, but I think it's important to talk about here before we go, which is, of course, we know the identity of the shooter in Washington, D.C. Tragically, we know the National Guardswoman passed away from this horrific shooting. The shooter is a guy by the name of Ramunala Lakhanwal, 29-year-old Afghan National. He entered the U.S. in 2021.

He worked with the CIA in Afghanistan, Special Forces. He was in the Afghan military since he was a teenager and was working with the CIA there in Kandahar and in other areas. areas. There was no red flags at all about his background when he entered the U.S. You all remember that Trump cut the deal with the Taliban, released 5,000 Taliban prisoners, the Taliban prisoners then took over Afghanistan. Trump promised the withdrawal, but he didn't do a withdrawal in May when he promised that he was going to withdraw, and then he provided no intelligence or communications with the Biden transition team. Ultimately, Biden removed the troops from Afghanistan, to which

the Trump regime, to which Trump and all the Magna's would constantly attack Biden for the exit and the withdrawal, what Trump was supposed to do, but Trump refused to do because Trump is Trump. And this person was heavily vetted, heavily vetted, and because this person worked with the CIA, he was basically a member of the CIA for 10 years in Gondahar and fought alongside American troops, this person was allowed to show up. There was no signs that this person, as far as we know, Asim now was engaged. He's living in Washington. There was no red flags until this shooting took place. But then again, the Trump regime granted this guy asylum in April of 2025. And we know the Trump regime has dismantled counterterrorism within the FBI and instead placed the FBI on

going after abuela and abuela duty, like going after people who have been here for a long time and who have been contributing to our country. They have attacked migrants in the fact. and in the restaurants and on the farms and in the Home Depot parking lots and going through Latino neighborhoods and terrorizing them and landscapers instead of focusing on the bad guys or developing intelligence on the bad guys.

And the Trump regime picked an intern from the Heritage Foundation whose only other job experience was as a summer landscaper and maga social media guy who is a big super Trump fan named Thomas Fugate, Gate, 22 years old, no experience in the FBI, no experience in intelligence, no experience in

anything, other than he was, the guy was an intern. They made him the head of counterintelligence at the FBI because Trump hates the FBI and wanted to destroy it. What better way to give the middle finger to the FBI than bring in a 22-year-old guy who has no clue about the FBI, right, and make him the head of the most important division, counterintelligence. So I'm not going to do what Maga does and say, well, because if you gate, that's why this happened. But I will say, objectively, our counterterrorism has been extremely degraded and our ability to develop real-time intelligence. So who knows?

Could the FBI have been keeping track of people in chat rooms and see if somebody was getting radicalized? That's what they would do. That capability has been severely harmed, if not outright removed. And lots of former FBI agents have been warning us about that. against the Trump regime. And these are FBI agents who served under Bush and Obama and even the Trump First administration who are now saying this second administration, this regime is engaged in this type of conduct. So I covered a lot of it there, Pope Buck, but I'll give you the final word on

the subject. No, I think you hit it all. But I'll just do it for what I did at the top of the podcast. Every time Donald Trump tries to make political, politically accessible. exploit a tragedy. It backfires for him, but how quickly those in his administration are so in this hermetically sealed world that, you know, right on cue, John Rackcliffe, the head of the CIA blames the Biden administration, and this one blames the Biden administration and all. And, you know, and then, oh, let's turn it towards now nobody from Afghanistan is ever going be able to come here again and another Muslim country ban is going to happen. That's not what happened

here. What happened here is a guy who starting in 2011 worked for some combination of the U.S. military and CIA and was trained and trusted in Afghanistan and got resettled in the state of Washington. Somewhere along the way, something happened. A circuit breaker blew, a fuse blue. A fuse blue. and he got radicalized or is just a crazy mass shooter. I mean, there's plenty of white, non-Muslim, non-Afghan mass shooters also, including ones that fire at ice regardless of who's in charge. But Donald Trump's attempt to exploit it is what you and I keep a close eye on, just as we saw in the Charlie Kirk murder, him trying to turn that into a cause

Celeb, in order to crack down on DEI and First Amendment speech and, you know, Democratic groups and fundraising and all that. And that seems to have backfired because the American and Jimmy Kimball, that backfired on him because people stood up for First Amendment speech and against tyranny created by a president who had lost sight and lost any, what's the word, any barrier between his presidency and his political world, when they saw the entirety of his cabinet go to Arizona for the Charlie Kirk vigil, when they saw J.D. Vance hold a Charlie Kirk podcast from the White House. That actually turned against the Trump administration. His efforts now to blame Biden for the tragedy that happened

with the National Guard similarly is turning against him in the public polling because, frankly, the American people don't see a president who is focused on what matters to them on a daily basis. And I'll end it with the polling that I started the podcast with. While the ruby, ruby red areas like Wyoming, he's never going to lose Wyoming, in the seven battleground states plus Texas, Wisconsin, and Florida, he is underwater double digits at the moment, meaning if we were to run the election again, he would likely lose all of those battleground states. You and I wouldn't be talking about a Trump presidency. People want their vote back, especially the independents, which have rejected.

did Donald Trump? Seventy-six percent of independents want their vote back. It was just staggering numbers. We're 10 months into an administration that is looking for any, any way to distract from a floundering administration, even exploiting the death of a poor woman who served this country honorably in the National Guard. And that's why you and I got to talk about it, like instantly, getting on the air and talking about it. And the people now are starting, you can see it in the polling and the voting. People are starting to see through this administration and they're just exploitation for political gain of any tragedy that should have no political red or blue analysis applied to it.

Right? This should just be about the tragedy and then maybe set up a blue ribbon battle to make sure it doesn't happen again. but Donald Trump can't help himself because he's looking for any life preserver that he can find for his depraved administration. I want to thank everybody for watching this episode of Legal AFA Reminder. Check out Michael Popock's law firm. If you or someone you know or love you believe has a case, call 877 Popak AF or visit thepopok firm.com if you've been involved in a car accident and trucking accident, if you know somebody

who has or someone's the victim of wrongful death that you know, just have them called the Popok firm, the consultation is free. Popok is representing a lot of listeners and viewers of the LegalAF podcast. So please, 877 Popok AF or go to the Popok firm.com. Again, consultation is free. And if they take the case, they don't recover unless you recover, go to Michael Popock's substack, the legal AF substack. Check it out. Substack.com, then search LegalAF. And then make sure you subscribe to the LegalAF YouTube channel, almost one million subscribers. I think we could hit that one million subscriber mark this year. Thank you so much, Legal A Effers.

We appreciate you. We hope you had a happy Thanksgiving. I know times are difficult, but you make these times manageable. And you make this enjoyable for us, even during very difficult times. We'll be here with you shoulder to shoulder every step of this fight. As always, we're grateful for you. Happy Thanksgiving. Please send our love to your family, to everybody you know, let others know about this show.

as well. Let's keep on growing. Thanks everybody so much. We'll see you next time on Legal AF. I'm Ben Micellis, joined by our co-host Michael Popak, signing off. Shout out Legal AF for a shout out Midas Mipan.