Legal AF by MeidasTouch - Prosecutors file MAJOR STIPULATION in Trump Case

Episode Date: August 9, 2024

In a breaking development in the Trump DC Election Interference criminal case, Special Counsel Jack Smith just revealed to the court that he continues to consult with all DOJ division heads and DOJ leadership to reach a consensus on what position to take on the Supreme Court’s immunity decision and has asked for 3 more weeks to report back to the judge on it. Michael Popok analyzes why it’s taking the DOJ and Jack Smith so long to make its decision, its impact on thousands of other cases now and in the future, and why it does not actually cause any real delay to the case after all. Keep American farming going by signing up at https://MoinkBox.com/LEGALAF RIGHT NOW and listeners of this show get 2 FREE Steaks in your first box! Visit https://meidastouch.com for more! Join the Legal AF Patreon: https://Patreon.com/LegalAF Remember to subscribe to ALL the MeidasTouch Network Podcasts: MeidasTouch: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/meidastouch-podcast Legal AF: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/legal-af MissTrial: https://meidasnews.com/tag/miss-trial The PoliticsGirl Podcast: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/the-politicsgirl-podcast The Influence Continuum: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/the-influence-continuum-with-dr-steven-hassan Mea Culpa with Michael Cohen: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/mea-culpa-with-michael-cohen The Weekend Show: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/the-weekend-show Burn the Boats: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/burn-the-boats Majority 54: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/majority-54 Political Beatdown: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/political-beatdown Lights On with Jessica Denson: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/lights-on-with-jessica-denson On Democracy with FP Wellman: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/on-democracy-with-fpwellman Uncovered: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/maga-uncovered Coalition of the Sane: https://meidasnews.com/tag/coalition-of-the-sane Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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We've got a late breaking development in the DC election interference criminal case against Donald Trump with the Department of Justice asking Judge Chutkin for a three week delay or extension in order for them to inform her through a joint report with Trump's lawyers on their position about how the July 1st immunity decision, Trump versus the United States

coming out of the Supreme Court, how that maps onto the indictment in the DC election interference case, what survives in terms of allegations, facts, operative facts, and what survives in terms of counts, criminal counts. Now, it was a little bit surprising that Jack Smith's team was not prepared to deliver their joint status report as ordered by the judge on the 3rd of August. She said to everybody, get together. We've been sitting around for over a year.

We've been waiting since July 1. So just submit to me a joint status report by the 9th of August and on the 16th of August, a week later, let's all get together and have a conversation about how to move this case forward. You would have thought that with the July 1st date, already here on August the 8th, they've had five weeks for the Department of Justice already to put together their plan. In fact, the fact that they filed a day before the joint report was due indicating in their request to the judge not that they're having a dispute with Trump's side, but that they're having internal deliberations among the various entities. The other Department of Justice components, as they said in the

filing, indicates that there is a little bit of a struggle going on, a little bit of sausage struggle going on, a little bit of sausage making going on on the Department of Justice side because Jack Smith needs to consult with other branches, if you will, other departments, components of the Department of Justice. I assume that means he's also consulting with Main Justice, with the attorney general, with the deputy attorney general, and others to see how, because what the Department of Justice has to be concerned about is to be consistent and the law that they're about to make, because this is going to be precedent and how it sets up the next appeal. This is going to be precedent that's going to bind the hands of

future Department of Justices and attorney General's and special counsels. They want to get this right. As my grandfather used to say, they want to measure twice and cut once. They don't want to do it wrong, haphazardly, haste makes waste. Now although they had five weeks to kind of figure it all out internally, let's be honest, the Department of Justice is a big giant organization and it doesn't always move in lockstep. And there are different departments within civil and criminal, different heads that would have to be consulted. I am picturing a giant

boardroom, sort of like on television, where there are these various heads of civil and criminal departments within the Department of Justice or divisions, and they're being consulted and writing memos about how a certain position, a certain sentence, a certain way that they're approaching the immunity decision as precedent can backfire on, for instance, the Jan 6 cases that have already been done and the Jan 6 cases that are yet to be done criminally in the DC election interference case. Think of it this way. There have been well over a thousand prosecutions

leading to hundreds and hundreds of convictions and indictments of Jan 6 people, but they're not done. And it's not only the immunity decision on July 1, it's the companion decision that came out a couple of days before in US versus Fisher in which the same 6 to 3 majority let the Jan 6 defendants off the hook from being prosecuted under obstruction of an official proceeding as a crime. So they got to deal with that too. And they got to think about what that means in the future. For the future Jan 6th insurrectionists, the ones they haven't caught yet, the past Jan 6th insurrectionists, and the next, God forbid, Jan 6th insurrection. And so you've got to go around a table and you've got to get input from all these various components.

In fact, I'll read you the order in a minute or the request in a minute. Jack Smith says, I have to, as special counsel, consult with these various components in order to reach consensus. And they haven't yet reached consensus. He says in his motion, those discussions, of course, have been underway. I'm sure they've been underway since the oral argument

back in April or before. But he's telling the court, we're not ready. I'm not ready because it's easy for Trump and his lawyers. Trump and his lawyers, all they got to do is go, what do you think? Okay, let's do that. They're done. They don't have to worry about precedent. They're not running a four level chessboard where every move has an impact and a consequence on another move. The Department of Justice is. Not just the 2024 Department of Justice, the 2025 Department of Justice, the Department of Justice under a future Kamala Harris presidency and administration. Because they can't just selfishly decide now. What they decide could just be great for them

right now at the moment, but they have to think about the repercussions, the domino effect of the position they're going to take with Chutkin and how that affects all the other cases now and in the present. A complicated decision. And that's all you're hearing in Jack Smith. I don't know what the other reporting is on that, but that's all sort of that I heard. Let me read to you from the actual decision so you know where I'm coming from. And it's very short. I said decision. I mean the actual joint report. It's a joint report because they both filed it, but it's really Donald Trump not opposing. Here's what it says. The government, which is Department of Justice, continues to assess the

new precedent, that's Trump versus US, the immunity decision. Although they don't mention Fisher, we know they're doing that too. That they're continues to assess the new precedent set forth in the Supreme Court's decision in Trump versus the US, including through consultation with other Department of Justice components. That's the civil and criminal divisions within the department that exist and the leadership there thinking forward and back prospectively and retroactively about what this decision means. And it's taken a minute.

And he cites to a particular provision of the Code of Federal Regulation. Again, only Aileen Cannon in Florida in the Mar-a-Lago case believes that the special counsel is a figment of our imagination and has no jurisdiction or constitutional authority to prosecute. Then how does she explain provisions of the Code of Federal Reg regulation that talk about the special counsel, which was passed ultimately by Congress. The code of federal regulation, section 600.7a says, a special counsel shall comply with the rules, regulations, procedures, practices, and policies of the Department of Justice, including consulting with appropriate offices within the Department of Justice with respect to establish practices, policies, and procedures of the department. In other words, we don't want a rogue special

counsel who's not mindful of the institutional history, the institutional procedure, the institutional precedent of the Department of Justice, because he's of the Department of Justice. Despite being a special counsel, he's not independent from, he's an employee of and has to make decisions in consultation. He can't be out there doing his own thing and making Jack Smith law, he has to make appropriate precedent that will now bind the hands for the Department of Justice

and the position they take and think several moves ahead. So I'm sure there's appellate lawyers sitting around that table who are helping make the decision because they're worried about the record and the precedent that's being set. Not in this case, in 10 other cases, in a hundred other cases, stretching out for the next 10, 20 years or a generation.

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but for a limited time. Spelled M-O-I-N-K box.com slash Legal AF. That's moinkbox.com slash legal AF. I know I've seen some criticism about, oh, they just can't get their act together. There must be infighting within the Department of Justice. I don't think so. I think it's 20 or 30 people from appellate heads and civil heads and criminal heads within the department thinking through this on a five or six level chessboard about this case and a thousand other

cases now and in the future. It takes a minute. They go on to say, the Jack Smith team goes on to say, although these consultations are well underway, sure, I'm sure they've been going on since before July, the government has not finalized its position on the most appropriate schedule for the parties to brief issues related to the decision. I think it goes beyond that. I think he's being coy, doesn't want to reveal the internal deliberations. I think there's some fundamental discussions being had about what position ultimately Jack Smith should take once the briefing schedule is in place, Because they can't go back and have another meeting.

Once he asks for the three-week extension to file his position, he has to have his position done. And that's the way, that's what's happening here. The government therefore requests additional time to provide the court with an informed proposal regarding the schedule for pretrial proceedings moving forward. The hows, the whys, the contours, the logistics, the briefing, and the position that the Department of Justice through the special council is ultimately going to take. So they asked to instead of file something on the 9th,

yes, of August, the joint scheduling report together, let's do it at the end of the month on 830 and then hold a hearing on this sometime thereafter. They're telling Judge Chutkid that they are available any day after August 30th and then inform them that the defense, Trump side, is unavailable on September 6th and the week of September 16th. But other than that, they're available. All right, understood. I think this also gets Jack Smith over a couple of humps. One, he knows that he's not getting a trial given how late the Supreme Court was in holding oral argument on the last day of the oral arguments in April, how late they were in issuing their decision in July, the last day they could issue their decision,

just stretching this thing out. He knows now that it's impossible to have tried this case, get this DC election interference case up and running by the November election or even the inauguration. So now let's just take our time and do it right and measure twice and cut once. That's what we're watching Similarly, we're watching that with Jack Smith in the 11th Circuit Court of Appeals with Judge Cannon I had already predicted and I was wrong on this it happens occasionally that on the 11th Circuit

They were gonna take up the invitation from the court and ask for expedited briefing on Judge Cannon's dismissal of the Mar-a-Lago case But they have't. They're letting it play out through a September and beyond briefing schedule that will time this thing out into October. That's at the 11th Circuit. Once I saw them do that, I'm like, all right, they know they can't get either of these things resolved. They can't get Mar-a-Lago resolved before the November election, and they can't get either of these things resolved. They can't get Mar-a-Lago resolved before the November election and they can't get ultimately this Chutkin case back up and running before the November election. So let's take our time.

I think that's what we're watching as well. So that's the first thing we're watching. And I also think they want to keep an eye on what goes on on September the 18th. In the ultimately, they'll have the benefit of what goes on with Judge Murchon on September 18th in the sentencing. So, they'll file their joint report on August 30th, and by the time they all get back together with Chutkin, Donald Trump may already be sentenced for 34 counts in the New York State proceeding, which sort of changes the weather in the room and gives the Department of Justice,

I think, a little bit more leverage because that glass ceiling has already been broken with the conviction of Donald Trump several months ago by the jury in New York and now the sentencing by Judge Mershon. I think the rest is just there for the taking for the Department of Justice. So we'll continue to follow the next development. I assume the judge is going to grant this and give the lawyers and particularly the Department of Justice time to finish their internal marinating on the issue and working their way through this giant, almost unfathomable universal size decision-making tree, come up with a position about how this immunity should be mapped onto the indictment and what they should do next

about it and then bring that to the, and the judge will approve that. And then sometime, as I said before, in September, late September, mid September, before October 1, the judge holds a hearing and they figure out how they're going to conduct the ultimate substantive analysis about the immunity decision, how she's going to do it, the briefing she's requiring, maybe an evidentiary mini trial that she's requiring about the evidence that's presented by the Department of Justice, and then she can make her ultimate ruling. Again, managing expectations, pump the brakes. This is going to be tight, this process now, especially now that we've just lost three weeks to get it done before the November election.

And it may be secretly something the Department of Justice, you know, so they're not continuously accused of lawfare and weaponization of the Department of Justice. Maybe they're like, you know, well, let's just get over the election. Because now, you know, it looks likely that Donald Trump's going to lose and we'll be swearing in Madame-Elect President Kamala Harris. See, all that, at the intersection of law and politics, all of these things, these moving parts, even though the prosecutors all say that they're not looking at the political calendar, they don't look at the calendar in other cases, they're looking at the calendar in other cases and they're looking at the political calendar. Of course they are. And how all this comes together and how the weather changes for them and what they have to do next and how they respond to it and all of that. We'll continue to follow that intersection of law and politics. The only way we know how without

blowing smoke or sunshine right here on the Midas Touch Network and on Legal AF, the leading podcast at the intersection of law and politics. We founded it four years ago, Ben, Mycelis and me to cover just this kind of moment. And we're doing it, Minus Touch Network, YouTube, Wednesdays and Saturday night, 8 p.m. Eastern time, we live record. And then you can pick us up on audio podcast platforms of your choice. And Wednesdays, I do it with Karen Friedman and Nick Niflo. Saturdays with Ben Mycelis, and I do hot takes like this, I don't know, about every hour right here on the Minus Touch Network. You can help free subscribe and get us to 3 million independent subscribers for free.

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