Legal AF by MeidasTouch - URGENT LEGAL UPDATE on Trump SETTLEMENT and MORE

Episode Date: December 15, 2024

Ben Meiselas and Michael Popok are back for a new update at the intersection of law and politics on the Legal AF Podcast. On tonight's show, Ben and Popok cover (a) KFA's representation of Luigi Mangione; (b) Trump & ABC settling Trump's defamation case against ABC after being ordered to sit for a deposition next week; (c) whether Biden should give blanket pardons to defenders of democracy against Trump; (d) Republican states electing felons and sex abusers to office, and (e) the continued work of the DOJ and SEC under Biden to bring bad people and companies to justice; and so much more. Thanks to our sponsors: Henson Shaving: Visit https://HensonShaving.com/LEGALAF to pick the razor for you and use code LEGALAF for 2 years worth of free blades! SelectQuote: Get you FREE Quote today at https://SelectQuote.com today! Zbiotics: Head to https://zbiotics.com/LegalAF to get 15% off your first order when you use LEGALAF at checkout. Delete Me: Go to https://joindeleteme.com/LEGALAF and use promo code LEGALAF for 20% off. Subscribe to the new Legal AF channel: https://youtube.com/@LegalAFMTN Subscribe to Meidas+ at https://meidasplus.com Remember to subscribe to ALL the MeidasTouch Network Podcasts: MeidasTouch: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/meidastouch-podcast Legal AF: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/legal-af MissTrial: https://meidasnews.com/tag/miss-trial The PoliticsGirl Podcast: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/the-politicsgirl-podcast The Influence Continuum: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/the-influence-continuum-with-dr-steven-hassan Mea Culpa with Michael Cohen: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/mea-culpa-with-michael-cohen The Weekend Show: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/the-weekend-show Burn the Boats: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/burn-the-boats Majority 54: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/majority-54 Political Beatdown: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/political-beatdown On Democracy with FP Wellman: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/on-democracy-with-fpwellman Uncovered: https://www.meidastouch.com/tag/maga-uncovered Coalition of the Sane: https://meidasnews.com/tag/coalition-of-the-sane Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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To discover how, visit bhb.com slash better future. The Paramount Plus exclusive series, The Agency. The CIA sends us out to behave in a dangerous way. Starring Michael Fassbender and Richard Gere. Whatever it takes, make it invisible. The Agency, new series now streaming exclusively on Paramount Plus. Welcome to Legal AF with Ben Mycelis and Michael Popok. I'm Ben.

We have some breaking news to report. The utter and complete capitulation and humiliation of ABC News will break it down right now. Michael Popok is in transit. As you can see, I'm in a hotel right now recording this. We've both been traveling. I'm going to take this first segment, then we'll bring Michael Popok in. This is utterly outrageous what ABC just did.

One by one, we've seen corporate media fold, kiss the ring, and not just obey in advance, but go through humiliation ritual after humiliation ritual. Here is what happened. ABC has announced that it will be paying $15 million to a charitable foundation controlled and or run by Donald Trump for Trump's future presidential library as part of a settlement when Donald Trump, in my opinion, filed what might have been the single most frivolous lawsuit against ABC and George Stephanopoulos.

I am waiting to hear what George Stephanopoulos has to say, but shame on you, Stephanopoulos. Shame on you, ABC and anybody who works at ABC. Utterly atrocious and despicable. Let me remind you all what this lawsuit was and how despicable it is and was that ABC is doing and how it is more important than ever that we stand up and we just shut down corporate media at this point because they are nothing more

than a Donald Trump fascist mouthpiece. It is utterly disgusting. It is utterly despicable. And what I promise you here is that we here at Legal AF, we here at the Midas Touch Network will never obey in advance. We will never kiss the ring. You will literally have to take Michael Popak, myself, and our contributors to the gulag. We're not running away.

We're not freaking scared of this crap. How dare ABC. For real, I am pissed at the start of this episode. Again, let me remind you what this lawsuit was about. As you all remember, Donald Trump was found liable for sexual assault in the E. Jean Carroll civil case. Not a criminal. Jean Carroll civil case, not a criminal case, a civil case in New York Federal Court.

A jury, a federal jury found unanimously that Donald Trump sexually assaulted E. Jean Carroll in that federal case. Subsequently, there was another federal case where Donald Trump was found liable for defamation. When you add up Donald Trump's defamation verdicts against him, as well as the sexual assault verdict, Donald Trump had to post a bond nearing $100 million for his despicable actions.

Now, in New York, there are technical distinctions between—I'll give a trigger warning here again because I'm going to be describing some aspects of sexual assault. There's a distinction in New York law, a technical one, in how the law is just written between sexual assault and a rape, and that's the difference between a finger and the genitals. So what the jury found in New York is that Donald Trump sexually assaulted E. Jean Carroll essentially with a finger. And that's — and did not say that he did it with genitals. So that's the way the verdict went down, sexually assaulting with a finger. Now we've all heard Donald Trump on audio saying that he grabs women by their genitals,

and he says they let you do it when you're famous and rich like him. We've heard other statements of Donald Trump talking about inspecting women at beauty pageants. We've heard all of that. So, subsequent to that civil verdict, George Stephanopoulos on his weekend show on ABC described Donald Trump's conduct as rape. Now, the federal judge in New York in the underlying order, one of the orders, what the federal judge had said was that Donald Trump's conduct, based on even though there's a distinction in the technical language, the federal judge

said that the technicalities aside, one could basically describe the conduct as being the same thing. But there was that technical distinction, but the federal judge even basically said that they're, you know, that they were basically the same thing. So what Donald Trump's federal lawsuit for defamation against George Stephanopoulos, what it was about was Donald Trump saying, George Stephanopoulos went on TV and called my conduct a rape when in fact it was a sexual assault and you've defamed me, you've harmed my reputation. How dare you call a digital penetration with fingers

that a jury found sexual assault to be a rape. You've offended me, I'm suing you for defamation of my character. So that's what the lawsuit was about. Donald Trump said he was suing for billions of dollars. He got the headlines, right? So then there was a development this past week on that front as well.

The big development was that the magistrate judge ordered Donald Trump to sit for a deposition. Donald Trump was therefore kind of cornered. The magistrate judge also ordered George Stephanopoulos to sit for a deposition. That deposition of Trump and Stephanopoulos under oath before a video camera that would be eventually become public

because court records are public records, right? That was gonna be scheduled for this week based on the magistrate's order. Donald Trump was the plaintiff in this action. Trump was the person who filed the lawsuit. So we've been giving analysis here on the Midas Touch Network and Legal AF that there was basically no way for Donald Trump to wiggle out of this deposition or to squirm out of it unlike his other cases because he's the plaintiff.

So one of the things we were saying is, well, wow, now George Stephanopoulos' lawyers get to ask Donald Trump about sexual assault, about Donald Trump's distinction in his mind between sexual assault and rape. You could ask Donald Trump about all of the other statements that Donald Trump made about sexually assaulting women in the past that Donald Trump made about sexually assaulting women in the past or Donald Trump saying in the past that he grabs women by their, you know what? What did you mean when you made those types of comments, right? What were you referring to when you talked about inspecting people in your beauty pageants? What did you mean by that?

Going on and on and on about that. And Trump was never going to sit for that deposition. Let me give you another corollary example here of somebody who's, I think, paid a steep price for being courageous in the face of kind of Trumpism. But think about the Michael Cohen case for a sec. Remember, Donald Trump sued Michael Cohen for $500 million. Remember, then Cohen demanded

Donald Trump's deposition. And then what happened? Donald Trump dismissed the case right before the deposition. So that's clearly—Donald Trump was not going to sit for a deposition with ABC where he was gonna be asked questions about sexual assault and about what damages are you claiming and you're saying you were humiliated by this. Here, play this tape, play this tape. Here's what you said here, Donald. Here's what you said here, Donald. Remember when you said this? So your whole point of your case here

is that you think that the distinction between a rape and a sexual assault, a finger versus genitals, that that's what you're suing over. You would have had Trump looking right into the camera based on the magistrate judge's order. So the magistrate judge says, you got to sit in five days. So you know, any traditional legal analysis with our justice system, with our civil system, any analysis goes, well, look, for all intents and purposes, this case is over.

If you're the lawyers representing ABC right now, you go, Trump ain't sitting for this deposition right now before the inauguration, that ain't happening. Trump's not gonna answer these questions. And if you're the lawyers, you're like, we're going to, you know, one of the things they were teeing up is a motion called summary judgment, which is like a motion to dismiss the case before it even goes to trial, before the trial actually takes place. That's a summary judgment motion.

Once you get the depositions, you do a summary judgment motion where you say trump has no facts to even claim That he's been defamed in a situation like this And I think that abc in my opinion abc would have clearly won that and trump would never have sat for a deposition so then You know an hour ago or so or an hour and a half ago, before we're about to go, before we're about to do the show, all of a sudden there's an announcement. There's a settlement and the settlement is that ABC is paying $15 million to a future charitable foundation for Donald Trump.

Total and utter capitulation. What do you pay? There's no, in my opinion, no legal basis at all for Donald Trump to file, you know, to file this lawsuit in the first place. Or in my opinion, I think that there's no way that Donald Trump was going to ultimately prevail in this lawsuit. And then just an utter capitulation. Just set his deposition, take his deposition, ask him all of those questions right there and force him on those issues. What are you doing, ABC?

It is utterly despicable, utterly, utter cowardice. Here, let's just pull it up right here. And they settled on a, wanna know how extra cowardice? They settled on a Saturday. I'm wondering how extra cowardice? They settled on a Saturday. I'm wondering what George Stephanopoulos is going to say. Oh, and then ABC and George Stephanopoulos are going to issue a written apology based on this. Here's how Kyle Cheney puts it.

A day after Trump and George Stephanopoulos were ordered to appear for depositions, they settled the case. ABC has agreed to make a $15 million contribution to the Trump Presidential Museum Foundation and air an apology for mischaracterizing the E. Jean Carroll verdict. Are you freaking kidding me, ABC? Honestly, I don't know how people are gonna watch ABC.

How can you watch a network that didn't just obey in advance? That totally and utterly capitulated. This is, I mean look, the Jeff Bezos million dollar inauguration, shameful, despicable, not shocking that it's Bezos. Doesn't surprise me that Bezos would do that, but it's despicable. Mark Zuckerberg doesn't surprise me that Mark Zuckerberg, you know, would do that shameful, disgusting, despicable. You pick your words right here. This ABC thing in my view, so much freaking worse, so much worse.

A $15 million settlement, a kiss, are you absolute? Look at this. Now therefore, in consideration of the foregoing mutual covenants and agreements set forth and the parties agreeing to release one another of any related claims or liability, and for the good and valuable consideration recited herein, the receipt and Resufficiency for which is acknowledged ABC ABC shall cause a transfer in the amount of 15 million US dollars to be made to a presidential foundation and museum to be established by or for the plaintiff as Presidents of the United States of America have established in the past and by the way, you know where this money's coming from, right? ABC is owned by Disney.

This money's coming from Disney right now. So anybody who's working there right now, what are you thinking about this? $15 million to this library in advance where George Stephanopoulos described the conduct one way when Trump was found liable of sexual assaulting a woman in federal court, look yourself in the freaking mirror if you work at Disney right now. Look yourself in the freaking mirror if you work for ABC right now. Let's not forget what the underlying case was about, that Trump was found liable for sexually assaulting a woman and her name was E. Jean Carroll and you're going to talk about over here, 15 million dollars. The charitable

contribution shall be made within 10 days of the effective date of this agreement to an escrow account to be established by plaintiffs counsel who will serve as the escrow agent for this specific charitable contribution? Oh, what, ABC and Disney? You're going to get a charitable write-off for this? Is that how you view it? All we have to do is humiliate ourselves, get a tax write-off for $15 million, look ridiculous, and then maybe Donald Trump won't go after us.

Maybe he won't go after us. You're a news organization. What are you doing? What the hell are you doing, ABC, Disney, George, Stephanopoulos? Remember throughout the campaign, Donald Trump, George Slopidopoulos, George Stopidopoulos, John. And you back down to that? You back down to that?

You back down to that? You are utterly, utterly despicable. Take a look at this. Within one calendar day of the effective dates, defendants, ABC, shall publish the following statement – this is their apology – by adding it as an editor's note to the bottom of the March 10, 2024 online article, ABC News and George Stephanopoulos regret statements regarding President Donald J. Trump made during an interview by George Stephanopoulos with Representative Nancy Mace on ABC's This Week on March 10, 2024.

Utterly despicable and shameful. In a little bit, I'm going to be bringing in Michael Popock. I want to talk about preemptive pardons. Popock's view about preemptive pardons is a bit different than my view of preemptive pardons as well. Let's go to our first ad break of the show, and then we'll come back for more. Thanks. For me, having life insurance and understanding the importance to protect your family and

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When you head to H-E-N-S-O-N-s-h-a-v-i-n-g dot com slash l-a-w and use code l-a-w. Let's go to our next topic Michael Popock which is this idea of preemptive pardons. You've been talking about it now for several weeks even before it's become a it now for several weeks, even before it's become a, you know, top line issue that people are talking about. A Democratic Congress member, Benny Thompson, who chaired the January 6th committee and did a dutiful job chairing the January 6th committee. He's someone who's been singled out by Donald Trump and MAGA as being put on enemies lists. Someone that Trump and MAGA and all of the kind of MAGA politicians say they're going to go after Benny Thompson.

They've created this lie that Benny Thompson has like destroyed January 6th evidence, which he has absolutely not. They, it's part of when Donald Trump says the January 6th evidence and report is deleted. It doesn't exist anymore. It's like, anybody can go and Google the January 6th report and all of the supporting evidence when the new Congress took over, when the MAGA Republicans won in 2022, they took offline the official January 6th committee.

So it had to go to archives and the Magyar Republicans were the ones who wanted to bury it and get rid of it, but it's there. I mean, it's available. You know, I understand there's some dispute about whether, I mean, everything's in written transcription form, whether all of the written transcriptions and the audio and everything is being archived or not archived. But at the end of the day, Trump says that it's all been destroyed and deleted. It's 100% false.

But they're targeting the January 6th committee members for saying that they're going to go after them and criminally prosecute them. So one of the questions is, do you preemptively pardon if you're president Biden, even though these individuals didn't commit crimes at all, the January six committee members of Congress who are part of the committee to investigate the bad actors, the insurrectionists, the co-conspirators in Donald Trump who tried to overthrow the results of a 2020 election, do you give them a preemptive pardon? And a preemptive pardon or a blanket preemptive pardon is just to say, you know, even though these individuals have not been convicted or even charged, they are hereby absolved of any wrongdoing

whatsoever and they receive a pardon. So nobody can ever prosecute them. Like when president Biden pardoned Hunter, he didn't just pardon Hunter for the two crimes that Hunter was convicted of. President Biden gave what's called a blanket pardon from the years 2014 to the moment of that pardon for any conduct at all that Hunter could be charged with. Uncharged conduct that has not been charged yet. Why? Because the MAGA Republicans have continued to say, and Cash Patel, who would be the FBI director if he ends up being confirmed and others have been saying,

look, we're going to go after Hunter for other things. We're going to go after Hunter for everything. We're going to make our mission over the next four years to keep going after Hunter. That's what they said. So Biden's like, all right, I'm not just going to focus on those two things that he pled, just in general, because you guys are just going to make stuff up. Here is Democratic Congress member, Benny Thompson. Let's play. Well you know the president is his prerogative. If he offers it to me or other members of the committee, I think it I would accept it but it's his choice. I think the staff of the committee who did a wonderful job, I think the witnesses who were

primarily Republicans did a great job on the oath. We were not found to have purged it themselves or anything like that. There's nothing in the record that's not already on point. We've had two years of review by Republican chairpersons. They found nothing wrong. So there's nothing that we kept out of the record. There's nothing that we took out of the record. So we stand by the work of the committee. Our committee did a wonderful job. We shared it with the public. And all the public has to do is to read the report

that we found based on our report. So that's what he said there. There was another clip of him where he's asked about preemptive pardons and he doesn't answer one way or another. He said he basically wouldn't rule it out. He didn't say he would consider it, but he would not rule it out. He would probably accept it if it was given to him. But Popak, I know you feel very strongly that preemptive pardon should be given and accepted. When you brought it up on the last few episodes, I didn't really, I didn't have a thought. I was thinking about it. And over time, you know, I've netted out differently than you and I think it's okay.

We have differences of opinion. And where I've netted out differently is the following. I don't think preemptive pardons, even if they are given, I don't think they should be accepted. No, that's different. Acceptance is different. Given is one thing. Yeah. Yeah.

You know, but also I'll go a step further though and say, here's why I worry that if they're given a pardon by its very nature and you and I have covered, for example, when Donald Trump pardoned Steve Bannon, right? And the, we build the wall scam and federal prosecutors were prosecuting Bannon for diverting money to build the wall back in Trump administration. One, basically to line his own pockets. Bannon's now charged with that in New York as a state court, as a state crime versus a federal crime.

But when Trump pardoned Bannon, we all, you and I went through that order from that federal judge who this may jog people's memories who said, look, by its very nature, a pardon implies wrongdoing and guilt. For you to be pardoned by the nature of what a pardon is, it means that a wrong has occurred to be pardoned for that thing So what the judge made very clear is that by getting a pardon? It's not a

Magic wand that says you didn't commit the crime. It's that you committed a crime and that you are in and that you are absolved now of that crime from just the perspective of a public decree, but you did it. You are guilty, guilty, guilty of the crime. So in my view, Popak, for there to be an effective resistance to fascism. You know, I think about people like Nelson Mandela, you know, I think about the history of resistance in general. And I think would, you know, would a Mandela accept, you know, before being sentenced and before being locked up in solitary for, and solitary for 20, 30 years,

would he accept a pardon and say, hey, this is a get out of jail free card? And so I try to think about it in those contexts. And I think that it would play, I think that if you gave people, all these people preemptive pardons, who did not commit any crimes, like Hunter committed those two crimes. He says he admitted to it.

You know, and they were the types of crimes that people should get pardons for. I just think that it could be used and construed as a way of saying, these people were guilty, they did it. That's what a pardon is. And, you know, I think about myself too, you know, like what if, I'm not going to run away, you know, from Trump, you know, I'm not going to run away. If, if, if, if he targets us and this network and me and locks me up, so be it. We'll be stronger if he does that, if he targets us and locks us up for bullshit. So, you know, I struggle with it is all I'm saying, but I think for there to be an awakening,

I just think you have to resist and fully resisting is you want to come at me, come at me and build a movement based on you know, hey, you know, not trying to wiggle out of it even if I don't know what do you think Pope? I might. Well, no, no, I understand what you're I understand what you're saying. Let me give you my view. And the Justice Department just came out with a statement that is consistent with what you just said, which is even if Donald because we're

watching the Jan six judges, Chuck in Amy Berman, Amy Berman Jackson, Royce Lamperth, Dabney Friedrich, and the rest who are in charge of meat and madea, who are now busy sentencing and doing trials. And they're making sure that the record is clear. That for, let's say, the Jan Sixers, no amount of absolution or pardon is going to change the immutable facts that they attacked our Capitol, causing hundreds and hundreds of injuries and half a dozen deaths. And the Justice Department supporting that has said that if you take a pardon, it does not absolve your guilt.

Now, that I think is different than people who were being preemptively pardoned before they were indicted because they need a prophylactic protection from an out of control presidency who has already telegraphed in an anticipatory way that it will abuse power and that it will weaponize the Department of Justice led by Pam Lockerup Bondi and Cash Patel who they're all speeding towards confirmation. I'm hoping that they were able to derail some of these things when credible

Democratic senators do the live autopsy of these people in front of the American people to show how unqualified they are. But for me, we've never had a situation where a president of the outgoing party feels the need because of the incoming president's threats of retaliation upon which his entire presidency and his campaign were based in retribution, doesn't exercise the power of mercy to say not that you're guilty. It certainly, regardless, you know, there's enough language in the Constitution, I think this would fit.

Joe Biden doesn't have to write memos to go with his pardons. By the way, Joe Biden didn't have to do the Hunter Biden pardon two weeks before the 1800 or 1500 commutations and clemencies. He could have buried it in there, but that's not Joe Biden. And that's where I get back to. Joe Biden is an honest man. He's a good man. He's a fine man and president.

And so we're watching how Joe Biden uniquely is going to handle the clemency and pardon power. And he can write a memo that says, these people have done nothing wrong. These people should never be subjected to have their entire world turned upside down and the money that would go with that, because they're not in positions like Donald Trump, these people to raise, go fund me for millions of dollars for meritless prosecutions. And I want to reward them for being honest Americans. And therefore I am giving them in advance

of this incoming presidency and their stated goals, I'm giving them a pardon. We could do that. If they're not indicted, we could leave them to the wolves. You know, I love Nelson Mandela, but he spent 24 years in solitary confinement. And I'm not sure I want Adam Schiff and Liz Cheney and Betty Thompson and and Letitia James and the rest to do that. Now, there's a lot that has to happen. Even an out of control,

power mad Herbert Hoover for the FBI, Edgar Hoover, J. Edgar Hoover couldn't put everybody in jail. He did do things that were inappropriate. He did do investigations and spying and other things. And if he had the technology that we have today it would be even worse. But there's gonna be federal judge pushback for a lot of these prosecutions should they

start. And so I think you offer them, now you don't have to take them, but I think you offer them. Otherwise, my fear is that we miss the opportunity because we're good, honest Democrats to protect people that were just doing their civic duty and their patriotic duty. That's all telling the truth. As Benny said, no, no perjury, no nothing telling their truth about a criminal guy. And we leave them to be what Donald Trump has said he's going to do. It's not like we have to like, I wonder if he's going to do that.

We know he's going to do. It's not like we have to like, I wonder if he's gonna do that. We know he's going to do it. I had this debate, a little bit mini version of this debate yesterday with Michael Cohen, when I joined him on May Oculpa, I think it's going up over the weekend, about pardons. Of course, Michael, I've advocated for Michael to get a pardon on every hot take about pardons that I've done.

But I understand your point of view, and I don't want one, and I don't want one and I wouldn't accept one. But I'm also not, you know, the Liz Cheney's of the world and I'm not the Alvin Bragg's, anybody that's going after Donald Trump and put him into a defense criminal position. I'm worried, I am worried about and I would kick I think, if they go after these people and they file them in weird places and these people's lives are turned upside down and Joe Biden had an opportunity to do the right thing. I'm still there, I think. I think there's a difference though between a Benny Thompson, Liz Cheney, although Liz Cheney

is now a private citizen, she's no longer a Congresswoman, but Letitia James, an attorney general, the sovereign state of New York, Alvin Bragg, whose power as a district attorney emanates from the state of New York and the powers and strength constitutionally of federalism, where if Trump tries to send the National Guard or send the military to extract state officials or go after members of Congress, even in DC with Trumpy judges, we've seen Trumpy judges in DC saying that you can't, you know, these January 6th insurrectionists are bad people. These Trumpy judges in DC do not agree with some of Donald Trump's most significant illegal

excesses we've seen. They go a long way with him. So they're protected. Hunter is not protected. Like they'll go for Hunter. They'll throw him. They will throw him in jail for the rest of his life and they will make the next four years more about Hunter.

So I just think there's a different vulnerability there than members of Congress who in a civil context have a speech or debate clause immunity, who have constitutional provisions that respect their authority as a co-equal branch of government versus a private citizen. But I hear you, Popak, and I theoretically am on the same page with you in a different world, I suppose, but I just think that people right now, there needs to

be major acts of audacious courage right now in the face of threats. Not just you see lots of people obeying and submitting, but you need acts of audacious courage out there standing up and reminding people what our country is all about We it's people have forgot they've lost their they're so focused on their tick tocks and they're this and they're that that that that they don't care that people are the trumps appointing people to the Health and Human Services who like wants to get rid of your polio vaccine and get rid of measles vaccine and, and, uh, you know, and, and they're not taking care of the basic functions of

government. Like we need big audacious resistance right now. And I just think that giving and accepting pardons for people who already have massive constitutional power as members of Congress and as attorney generals. I don't know. I just think that I want to see them out there resisting in the spirit of a Mandela more. But to your point, well, Ben, that's great, but that means solitary confinement for 24 years. You do that, Ben, but I think you have to be prepared for it. I'm in a different situation, but I think in my mind, I think to

myself, I'm not running away. I'm, you know, I want to, I'm going to be here on the front lines. And if that's what it is, so be it. You have to think that way. I think if you're in this game. I'm going to be in the suite with you. It's going to be a room for two. I'm not sure it'll be a room for two. It'd be nice if we could shoot legal AF from there anyway, let's take Legal AF from the gulag We will be right back after our last quick break of the show Let's face it after a night with drinks. I don't bounce back the next day like I used to I have to make a choice

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please do so. Popak, you know, I was, I was just doing a inventory of what's going on in other states, uh, in their life. And I saw one of these stories. So I wanted to dig deeper and say, is this unique? And then it wasn't. And then it was in another state. And then it was in another state where Republicans who are big MAGA people who are kind of inspired by Trump, you know, in the MAGA movement, whether they're like county commissioners or school board members or whatever in Republican areas. These are people who are convicted felons,

who the Republican electorate in these Republican red state areas know that these people have been accused of some of the most heinous crimes or just very serious crimes. In some instances, the most heinous crimes are just very serious crimes. In some instances, the most heinous crimes. And the Republican electorate, the evangelicals, they elect these people to power in state and local elections. And it's becoming such an issue that we talk about how

states are laboratories for autocracy. That's a term that David Pepper came up and it's a great term. So while the states are being these laboratories for autocracy about taking away women's reproductive rights and then exporting that vision in more radical forms to other states as well, or in the same or more radical form, they're also now cooking up a laboratory in their laboratories of autocracy, allowing, making sure that felons can run for office. Even that felons who are in prison can still represent people while they are in prison.

You can't make this stuff up. I mean, this is some heinous stuff. Take a look at, um, this is an Indiana, uh, this is from the guardian report. Um, so, uh, a guy or a Republican politician in Indiana, um, ran for kind of a local commissioner position in Hancock, Indiana, um, people were aware of these charges against him that he sexually assaulted his own daughter in Vegas while saying what happens in Vegas stays in Vegas. It's a dad who sexually assaulted his daughter.

His daughter was the victim who went to the police who turned in her dad. The public had that knowledge about it. The guy, the guy then pled guilty to it. He won the election. He won the commissioner seat in Indiana and, uh, he sexually assaulted his own daughter and that guy, that guy won. You turn to Monroe, Michigan, a Republican commissioner there, felony drug charges. I mean, and the voters knew that this guy was a felon, that he was going to go to prison.

And for 18 months, they were aware of that prison sentence. And they elected the guy to serve his term as a commissioner from inside a federal penitentiary as the Monroe, Michigan commissioner. So, and then the guy talks about, he pled guilty. Um, and the guy talks about how, well, he's going to have some of the other commissioners are going to help them answer constituent mail and, but don't worry, he'll be back in 18 months once he finishes serving, serving his time. And then in Missouri, they have their Trump law. They actually call it the Trump law, the Donald J.

Trump election qualification act. When make it possible for those guilty of felonies to continue to run for office at the highest levels. And when I was doing this research, it was, it was shocking. Michael Popock. Shocking. Well, actually you shouldn't say shocking. I mean, this is who the Republican party is, but you know, it all starts at the

top, or I guess you can say with them at the bottom with Trump, but this is going to the Republican voters are just good with this. So it's not, you know, I think it was helpful to talk about it here in this episode, because this is not some like, Oh my God, they elected a convicted felon, like they're doing it throughout the country right now. And, and the same politicians who are taking away women's reproductive rights are sexually assaulting their own daughters and preventing their daughters from getting abortions in their

states and then allowing themselves to have more rights than their daughters who they've raped and then run for office and get elected by a Republican electorate in a red state. Popak. It is a symbol of how low we've sunk, or parts of this country, how low we've sunk, we're in parts of this country, how low they have sunk, and the fact of the social contract because of the tone at the top, the immoral tone at the top with Donald Trump, the social contracts sort of lies and tatters at our feet. There's things that you and I would never think to do, not because it was technically illegal, although that was a good

way to stop me from doing something. It's because it was immoral or against social norms or it was just the guardrails that were put around our country because we were just Americans. because we were just Americans. That bond has been broken. When I saw the statistic, Ben, that many millions of people sat out this last election, what I mean is sat out democracy. And I don't mean like a couple. I mean like the numbers like 9 to 10 million people just said, F it.

I don't like either of what's going on here. The brand of both Democrat or Republicans don't appeal to me. And I'd rather just sit on social media and go about my day. And I don't think that this matters to me personally, domestically, foreign policy wise, Supreme Court level, my rights.

That's saying something. That means the parties, and I'm looking at our party too, and the fair-minded people that we represent here, that are a part of our constituency on Midas Touch and on Legal AF. We got to do a better job of repairing a broken brand and around our political system so that people go to the polls and understand the importance of defending our democracy. And then we see it show up, right, in the water, seep into the water supply

in places like these red states that think it's funny or it's their new version upside down world of patriotism to allow a Donald Trump-like felon to represent their interests in elected office or a person who is convicted of sexually abusing their own daughter in Vegas. And that wasn't the only charge against them, by the way. And because we've elected, you know, with the people that voted for them in larger numbers than voted for Kamala Harris and the Democratic Party, although I don't see it as a lurch to the right

in terms of the magnification of the United States, I don't. I believe it came down to the economy and a couple of social wedge issues and nine million people who sat it out. But you know, it's like it's sort of like that guy that for in the NFL that during the recent game they told the linebacker, okay you're in. He said, no I'm out. I'm not playing. What do you mean? We're in the middle of the game. No, I'm out. But we have to find a way to get those nine people, nine million people re-engaged. And we have work to do here.

I don't want this, we don't blow smoke or sunshine here. I don't wanna say we have a perfect brand as a political party. And that really, we don't. And we have to work on, we have the makings of a great brand. It's not going to take much to tweak it. And I like us being on our side, not their side, because we would never have to tell a story like you just did about Democrats allowing immoral, unethical, criminal, felon, sexual abusers to hold high

office. We'd never, never do that. And that is one of the major distinctions that separates the Democrats from the Republicans. But we got a bigger issue right below it, which is what are we going to do to restore and reassemble the social contract that Donald Trump has spent the first four years, the election period, and then the next four years crapping all over and using it as toilet paper.

And how do we do that? And how do we through Midas Touch and Legal AF and all the other contributors and great shows here that we have, we're dedicated now, ever more, full time, how do we restore that trust in our political system and in our democracy and in our social contract. And then we have to educate and train around it because it's not going to come from TikTok or comments or podcasts necessarily. We have to work on the re-education. We used to call it when I was a kid in school, civics class. We all have to take civics class again about what it means to be a fellow

American and to support your fellow American, regardless of their religious stripe, gender orientation or politics. It has to happen. Well, look in the past week, Donald Trump has said that he makes no guarantees at all that he's going to lower prices, right? He's said, and Kristen Welker last week on Meet the Press, and then he said in his Time Magazine interview that it's very hard to lower prices and not sure that he can do it, probably won't be able to do it.

It's definitely very hard. Then he told some rambling story about seeing big ships at ports and docks because he's got property in Palos Verdes. Donald, you guaranteed every, but your whole thing was guaranteeing people on day one, you were going to lower the prices. That's literally the main thing that you lied to people about saying, you're going to lower your prices, you're going to lower prices, you're going to lower your prices. Then Donald Trump went to Wall Street. He was at the New York Stock Exchange. He was asked the

biggest softball question in the world by Jim Cramer, the kind of propagandist masquerading as a business reporter. He was asked, by the way, that all of the indexes went down when Donald Trump was there that day. And I think it had like its seventh straight down day, you know, which it hadn't done in a while. But when Trump was there, the market was down. And Trump was asked, do you think workers should feel confident to invest their money in the stock market? Popak, you don't get an easier softball question than that when you're out there bragging about how you're going to make the stock market the greatest thing ever, even though Biden stock market is 60% better than Trump administration,

one stock market is. And you're at Wall Street, you have your cabinet, this whole thing is a propaganda trip. You're asked, should American workers feel confident to invest their money in the stock exchange and stocks? And Trump goes, I don't know. He goes, you know, I think that if there's a dip, they can be hurt. So I don't know.

There's a dip they can be hurt. You're talking about a dip now. You're saying that there's going to be a dip in the stock market. You went from guaranteeing all of these things to now you're talking about a dip. You're not going to be able to lower prices. Then a health care, he still talks about having concepts of a plan and not an actual plan. There's a lot of work happening behind the scenes with these magas to repeal Obamacare, get rid of the Affordable Care Act, which they're absolutely going to try to do. So I'm bringing all of this up because I think that, you know, Americans have been

flirting with all of this, all of these horrific MAGA ideas for a long time. And, you know, there's been a buy-in, but there's been this flirtation with this awful stuff that's only going to benefit the billionaires and create an oligarchy. And so, you know, to some extent, Popak in terms of this re-engagement in civics, I hate the F around and find out stuff because that means people get hurt when they find out. But there, but there, there feels like as part of this journey, you have to see how, how bad it is, how dangerous it, and I don't wish that to happen.

I just know that our reporting has to be on the front lines on day one saying, wait, he promised you the price of eggs was going to go down. The price of eggs is up. Then he say he was going to fix gas prices. That didn't happen. Wait a minute. He said he was gonna stop the war and Ukraine wrestled an awful invasion. That didn't happen. Nothing's changed, nothing's changed. And now their billionaires are getting even richer and their first thing they're doing

is a tax cut for the richest people. Think about those optics. Popak, remember the optics back in 2017 with all the white guy Congress members, you know, and senators standing behind him and they were all clapping that they gave themselves the billionaires tax cuts. Think about those optics in a 2025 fire pressure cooker of America that, that,

cooker of America that, that, that Trump has created with his lies over and over again. And, and just think about what those optics are going to, are going to look like when he does that tone deaf stuff. I, I'll toss you to take out of this episode, but, but I, but I know you want to also mention, I think we should mention briefly though, that Biden's doing everything he can do, his administration on the agency front, to try to do as much as they can to stop the biggest excesses of Trump and the agencies are still working overtime right now to stop the bad actors knowing that Trump's gonna let his oligarchy just steal from everybody. Yeah, I mean I think what we're watching now is nobody knows

how to re-reinforce legislation and executive orders better than Joe Biden. I mean, people can say what they want about him, but he spent a lot of time in the Senate and he knows Capitol Hill really well. They're working overtime now. He has every one of his agencies trying to find ways through of his agencies trying to find ways through any power that he can use to both thwart Donald Trump, make it harder for him to dismantle the Biden legacy on day one, to install things now that he has the power to do as Joe Biden is president till he's not president that Donald Trump will have to deal with and tear down when he gets into office. And they're doing that systemically, systematically by department and department, department, even little things like there's reporting that Christopher Wray and

the FBI, even though he's getting out on January 20th, he's busy promoting people within the FBI to give them better pension grades and to give them more security and to make it harder for Donald Trump to fire them. And other agencies are doing the same thing. So they're not just sitting idly, but morale is terrible. I know people in the government and different agencies and morale is terrible because the career people didn't want to leave necessarily. The top people like that we talk about a lot, the cabinet picks and the commissioners, of course they're gonna change

and people are already leaving. But below that, there are hundreds, if not thousands of staff level people that really didn't wanna, they wanted to serve independently, non-partisans, different presidents, but Trump is making that almost impossible to do. So they're thinking about their own jobs,

but they are working overtime. For instance, I'll give you just two of them. We see the filings the Department of Justice continues to make. They just took a plea deal for the guy that accused the Biden of taking bribes. We talked about it over the summer in April or May. That guy just took a plea deal

and got convicted of felonies They're staying on top of that. They're breaking up neo-nazi groups. They're continuing to file, you know prosecutions that go after voter fraud and and Abuse at abortion clinics. They're all doing everything that we want in advance of the change in power on the SEC, the Securities and Exchange Commission side, which has been the bane of Elon Musk's and Donald Trump's existence because it regulates their public companies. I know this from a, won't name names, but they have been given the instruction

to get their enforcement actions out the door and off their desk and get them filed and get the cease and desist orders entered into with these bad companies and bad people and get the money and get the fines. There's one we just reported on, the incoming cabinet secretary who runs Cantor Fitzgerald. Cantor Fitzgerald just got hit with a cease and desist order and a $6.75 million fine just the other day by the Securities and Exchange Commission. I assure you they wanted to kick that off until January and not have to deal with it

when Gary Gensler, the head of the SEC leaves. But the regulators are all looking, these bad companies and bad people in the eye and they're not blinking. And they're saying, no no you are to sign the cease and desist letter you are to enter into this on fraud and you are to pay the fine within two weeks and this is gonna be repeated over and over again that's why Elon Musk just announced through his social media posts that he's being investigated again at the Securities and Exchange Commission on two different tracks, one related to possible stock manipulation

before he bought the entirety of what was then Twitter. He was buying and selling and he was making statements about it and manipulating the stock price. That's the allegation. Then he's got another company called NeuroLink that's made some outrageous claims about its technology and the SEC doesn't like it.

And so they've reopened or they're continuing. They're like, you enter into the cease and desist letter and you enter into this fine or, and he's like, or what? Or they're gonna take him to court and enforce it. So there's still a lot of juice left in the tank here for the Biden administration. So these are the things I think they're doing. Where they're getting the judges confirmed. They're

vetoing bills that would only help Donald Trump. They're trying to reinforce the Biden legacy in the ways that they can, in the remaining ways, including promoting people and selling off parts of the wall. I did a whole hot take on that. So Donald Trump has to rebuy it if he's going to do it. Don't make it easy on Donald Trump. I mean, they're not going to stuff the toilets with paper and snip all the wires on the computers, like what happened to them, and use glue on the keyboards.

That did happen to them on the way in. But they have other ways to try to protect the Biden legacy as he focuses along with his chief of staff and his White House counsel on pardons and on clemency, because as they said in the last order, they're not in their last statement that went along with the 1500 clemencies. They're not done. And we're going to be getting drops every few days about these new clemencies, they're not done. And we're gonna be getting drops every few days about these new clemencies and new pardons and we'll see if you and I are

right or wrong about who he does. If Michael Cohen, who's applied for a pardon, gets his pardon, well of course we'll report on it, you're right on legal layup. But that's what's going on behind the scenes. So you and I, and Karen and I, may not have a lot of like cases to talk about. I assure you that's gonna change when Donald Trump has already said he's going to pardon everyone in the first hours. There's a stack of executive orders he's gonna be signing in the first week, hundreds of them, and we're gonna need to be able to respond in the courts about them. Absolutely. And there's going to be a deluge of lawsuits, federal lawsuits. And you and I have described, and we'll describe it in greater detail on other episodes as

well. On our next episode, we'll do a whole segment on it. The strategy behind the lawsuits that are going to be filed against civil rights groups and legal advocate groups as Donald Trump tries to break down the constitution, where they get filed, how you petition for national injunctions to block Donald Trump's efforts, the strategy behind that will break it all down for you. And I'm sure, you know, we're going to be seeing a lot of that. So thank you everybody.

I've been traveling. That's why I'm in this room right here and took a red eye flight last night. And so it's good to be with all of you today though, this evening and Michael Popak, great being with you. And we've got a lot of work ahead of us together, a lot of work, but I'm very, very happy to be doing it with The Midas Mighty. And we'll do it with joy, with grace, with passion, with true resistance against fascism and authoritarianism and with the true vision to support, protect,

and defend our democracy. Thanks, everybody, for watching and we'll see you next time on Legal AF. Make sure you all check out Michael Popak's YouTube channel, The Legal AF YouTube channel. Subscribe right now to his YouTube channel and also you can check out some articles on MidasPlus.com as well. MidasPlus.com. Thanks, Michael. YouTube, Beth. MidasPlus.com.

Thanks, Michael. You too, Beth. Bye, everybody. We'll see you next time. This holiday season, surprise everyone on your list with the best gifts. Tickets to see their favorite artists live. Choose from thousands of concerts and comedy shows, including Mariah Carey, Mary J. Blige, Matt Matthews, Metallica, Thomas Rhett, Trans-Siberian Orchestra, Sarah Silverman, and so many more. Share a memory together or give a gift they'll never forget.

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