Let's Go To Court! - 203: A Stalker & a Deeply Stupid Heist

Episode Date: February 23, 2022

Get ready to be infuriated.  Tiana Notice wanted nothing to do with her ex-boyfriend, James Carter. He’d seemed perfect at first, but it didn’t take long for Tiana to see his true colors. So she dumped him. But like a true shithead, James refused to take no for an answer. He called her constantly. He stalked her. Tiana went to the police for help several times. In fact, over the course of six weeks, she visited her local police station 33 times. But the police never took Tiana seriously.  Then Kristin lightens the mood with the story of a hilariously stupid heist. David Ghantt worked as a vault supervisor for Loomis Fargo in Charlotte, North Carolina. David made very little money, but was surrounded by so much of it that he went home every night reeking of cash. It was annoying, to say the least. So when his crush, Kelly Campbell, came to him with an idea to steal all the money from the vault, David went along with the plan. He’d steal $17.3 million dollars from the vault, and he’d keep one third of it. But he wouldn’t get the money right away. He’d need to hide out in Mexico for a while. Kelly and the rest of the money would *definitely* join him later.    And now for a note about our process. For each episode, Kristin reads a bunch of articles, then spits them back out in her very limited vocabulary. Brandi copies and pastes from the best sources on the web. And sometimes Wikipedia. (No shade, Wikipedia. We love you.) We owe a huge debt of gratitude to the real experts who covered these cases. In this episode, Kristin pulled from: An episode of the FBI Files, titled “The Unperfect Crime” An episode of Super Heists, titled “A Van Full of Dollars” Reporting by Jeff Diamant for the Washington Post in 1999 “October 1997 Loomis Fargo robbery,” entry on Wikipedia In this episode, Brandi pulled from: “If I Can’t Have You” episode Deadline: Crime with Tamron Hall “Valentine's Day murder: Stalker violates restraining order, kills ex-girlfriend” True Crime Daily “Jury Begins Deliberations In Carter Murder Trial” by Hilda Muñoz, Hartford Courant “Carter Found Guilty Of Murder” by Christine Dempsey, Hartford Courant “Carter Refuses To Be In Court As He Is Sentenced To 60 Years For Killing Tiana Notice” by Christine Dempsey, Hartford Courant “STATE of Connecticut v. James P. CARTER, Jr.” findlaw.com YOU’RE STILL READING? My, my, my, you skeezy scunch! You must be hungry for more! We’d offer you some sausage brunch, but that gets messy. So how about you head over to our Patreon instead? (patreon.com/lgtcpodcast). At the $5 level, you’ll get 30+ full length bonus episodes, plus access to our 90’s style chat room!  

One semester of law school. One semester of criminal justice. Two experts! I'm Kristen Caruso. I'm Brandi Egan. Let's go to court! On this episode, I'll be talking about a deeply stupid heist. And I'll be talking about a stalker. What?

Are you doing masterminds? Yes. Oh! Okay, I don't know anything about the actual case, but I've seen the movie Masterminds 10 times probably. Okay, I've never seen the movie. Do I need to see this movie? I love Zach Galifianakis. Well, who doesn't? Okay.

And I love A Stalking Case. I realize that's a rough thing to say because it's not going to be good i'm sure it's real bad oh great it's real bad and if i'm being honest you're a stupid hope i am and i'm deeply disappointed in myself because i should have covered this case last week um but unfortunately i just learned of it this week's why should you have covered it last week because it takes place on Valentine's Day no no no no mm-hmm what do you mean gross no that's what it happened yeah but I mean it's like feels weird okay to cover a terrible story on the exact day that it happened. Okay, great.

You don't seem to be taking my feedback at all. You know 100% I would have loved to cover this on the episode. Sometimes you need to be told no, Brandy. No! Anyway, how you doing? I'm good. Yeah, pretty yeah pretty good okay someone just sent us a wonderful little gift we just opened it is the dino dna mr dna funko pop but no we have no idea who sent it to us it's a mystery it is a mystery and i love I love it. Thank you. So thank you, mystery dream girl. What's that?

What? Wasn't there like a board game that was like mystery dream date or something like that? You know, that does sound familiar. Yeah. I don't think it was a girl. I think it was a guy. I think it was a mystery dream guy. Well, we got to keep it hetero.

That's right. It'd be terrible if we didn't. You know what we should also talk about? Your butt. Well, yeah, it's about time someone mentioned it. It often goes unmentioned. You know, our Patreon! Yay!

Yay! You know what we're doing tonight? Oh, except you missed it by the time this episode comes out. We should have talked about this on last week's episode. See, this is why you just got to sign up for the Patreon now, because we don't warn you about the good stuff ahead of time. Everyone, I was attacked recently in our own Discord. Sometimes we make Midwest dishes on our Zoom calls with patrons, and it's always a laugh. You know, oh, isn't this so gross?

Well, then somebody posted something in there and was like oh this recipe looks disgusting it's called frog eye salad and yeah it does look gross but my mother made that for us every summer growing up and we loved it so we're making it tonight on our zoom call have you ever had it yeah yeah okay okay yeah all right all right yeah i'm a midwest i probably had it your house well that's what i was thinking yeah it was like shirley brandy ate this at my house all the time not shirley anyway everyone on our patreon at the seven dollar level or higher gets to be a part of that zoomy zoomy call. You don't have to talk if you don't want to. You don't have to show your face.

No, just like BetterHelp. Yeah, that's right. You don't have to be on camera if you don't want to. Although we do appreciate it. Oh, no. I'm sorry. These ads are getting worse and worse. They really are.

Also, you know, you get bonus episodes on there. Yeah, you get inducted on the podcast. You get a little card and a sticker if you're at the $7 level or higher. If you sign up for the big boy level, the big boy level, you'll get all that stuff we already talked about. Plus, you get ad-free episodes and you get them a day early. Plus, 10% off merch. Except don't order any stickers because I ran out of cards to send to me

can you tell can you all tell this is kind of a low budge operation we're running here don't worry by the time this episode comes out you'll have the cards order all the stickers you want I'm totally prepared alright Brandy Order all the stickers you want. I'm totally prepared.

All right, Brandy. Let's talk about a stalker. Shout outs. Off the top, I watched a new show for this. It's new to me, not new to the world. Okay. I watched Deadline. Crime with Tamron Hall. I with Tamron Hall. Ooh.

I like Tamron Hall. Tamron Hall, that sounds familiar. Yeah, look her up. You'll recognize her because she's on one of the other shows. Why are you saying it? Because I can't remember and I don't want to name the wrong show. You know Tamron Hall. You'll recognize her the second you see her.

Oh, yeah. I totally recognize her. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. I think it might be f***ing f***ing. I'm not positive. So if see her. Oh yeah, I totally recognize her. Yeah. I think it might be f***ing f***ing not positive. So if it's not, we'll just bleep that.

Also, read an article from True Crime Daily, which also I believe is the show Crime Watch Daily. Didn't watch the show, just read the article. I'm sorry. I'm still looking at pictures of Tamron Hall. She's beautiful. She's very beautiful. She's mesmerizing. Alright, I'll stop. She also, this has nothing to do with the case. What? If I remember

correctly, she had a baby at like 52 years old or something. What? Am I making this up? Well, I don't know if you're making it up. Tamron Hall baby. She doesn't even look 52 now. Okay, 48, sorry.

I exaggerated slightly. She had her first baby at 48 years old. Baby Moses. She is currently 51 years old. Okay, so you're right. She is not 52. So everyone, I think we've all learned a lot today. I've lied to all of you.

All right. All right. Anyway, Tamron Hall, beautiful, delivered this case to me, and now I'm delivering it to you. Great. And she delivered a beautiful baby boy at 48 years old. I can't believe you had London at 47. Stop it! I was

34. My mistake. It's a real young pup. Not anywhere near a geriatric pregnancy. A good year away from there. That's right. Alright, here we go. I feel kind of nervous. I don't know why.

Maybe it's because you're going to fuck it up. Well, great. Now that's probably what it is. This is teasing. Tiana, notice, had her shit together. But that was no surprise to anyone who knew her. Even as a kid, she'd been the kid who had her shit together. She excelled in school, sang in the choir, and wrote poetry for fun.

She even completed her senior year of high school and her first year of college simultaneously. Dang. All right. Yeah. On top of all that, she was beautiful. Tiana was a beautiful young black woman who wore her shoulder length hair either in kind of like loose waves around her face or she did the thing where she had this

smooth back tight low power pony. You know what I'm talking about. The kind that always looks amazing on other people but just makes me look like a founding father. But I always salute you when I see you. That's right. She also had just this beautiful smile, the whitest teeth you've ever seen.

And she wore these like sassy little black rectangular glasses. What year is this? Like 2007, 2008. Oh, yeah. Yeah, that was the year of those glasses. Yeah, I'm with you. By 2008, Tiana was 24 years old and living in her own apartment in Plainville, Connecticut. She had received her bachelor's degree in political science from the University of Hartford and was working full time.

And then she was also working on her master's. She was like a semester away from completing her master's. All right. Yeah. She had visions of going to law school so she could be paid to argue something her mother said she was great at. So, yeah, you could say and I did say she had her shit together. There was one area of her life, though, where Tiana felt like there was something missing. And that was her love life. Your hair is touching the microphone. Do you think people can hear it?

Yes. Good God. Put that back like the good founding father that you are. I'm not a founding father, do. Tiana and her college sweetheart, Robert Dennis, had dated for five years before they broke up. It wasn't a nasty breakup. Actually, it was quite the opposite. Robert actually came to Tiana and told her that he was struggling with his mental health.

He was in a really dark place, and he told her he needed to move back home, move in with his parents in Virginia, focus on his mental health, and focus on finishing his degree. So this time he was living in Connecticut near Tiana, but I don't think they were living together. He was like a music pastor at a church. And so he just was not doing well, and he was like, I got to step away. I'm going to go home and live with my parents. I'm going to focus on myself and finishing my degree.

And Tiana was heartbroken. She thought she and Robert were heading toward marriage, but she respected his need to focus on himself. And so the two ended their relationship and Robert moved away. But the two stayed friendly and they would kind of check in on each other occasionally. So some time passed and Tiana's best friend Anna or Anna encouraged her to put herself back out there. Start dating again. She was a fucking catch. But Tiana wasn't sure she was ready. Then one day, Tiana got a MySpace message from this guy named James Carter Jr.

And according to his profile, he also had his shit together. It was great. He had a good job. He had his own place. He had no kids, but he hoped to have some kids someday. And in his message to Tiana, James said that he thought she was beautiful and he thought they should get to know each other. Anna encouraged Tiana to respond to the message. And finally, Tiana was like, OK, what's the harm in messaging him back and getting to know this guy? And so they chatted for a while and eventually they met in person and they started dating. Oh, so he was a real person.

He's a real dude. Yeah, real dude. It's not a story of a catfish. All right. I just listened to all of Sweet Bobby. Oh, yeah. I just listened to Sweet Bobby, too. OK. No, this is not the story of a Bobby. Oh, yeah. I just listened to Sweet Bobby, too. Okay.

No, this is not the story of a catfish. All right. Great. I'm just so happy it's not her. That's right. And they. Brandy, that's enough. She didn't talk about that on the podcast.

She just. Sorry, this is a huge spoiler. Yeah, we got to get rid of all that. Patty, could you bleep like anything iffy? So, and things were pretty good between James and Tiana at first. He got her a new cell phone. He added her to his plan. So nice.

No, that seems weird. Then he noticed that the tires on her car were pretty worn down. So he bought her new tires. He's such a gentleman. How old is he? I don't know. Older than Tiana, but not significantly older.

What does he do for a living? I don't know. You do know, you liar. I legitimately do not know what he does for a living? I don't know. You do know, you liar. No, I legitimately do not know what he does for a living. But he did good. He had his own place. He didn't have any kids. He could get her a new phone and buy her some tires.

Tiana was super uncomfortable at first when he was like, let me get you some tires. And she was like, no, no, no. I'll save up for him. It's totally fine. And he was like, no, no. And he's like, you know what? Why don't you quit going to school? I'll just take for him. It's totally fine. And he was like, no, no. And he's like, you know what? Why don't you quit going to school? I'll just take care of you.

And she was like, no, school's super important to me. I've got goals. Yeah, but I'd rather just control everything about you. Yeah, exactly. You'll be my pretty, pretty princess and you'll stay in my home all the time. Yeah, and I can have you on my cell phone playing so I can track you all the time. Yeah. It was just totally normal stuff.

Oh, God. So about five months into the relationship, things, if you can believe it, started to sour a bit. Tiana learned that James Carter Jr. wasn't the person she thought he was. First of all, he was actually James Carter II because, oh, what's that? He had a whole fucking son he'd lied about? He had a son that was named James Carter III. Oh. Yeah.

So Tiana accompanied James to like a family barbecue in the summer of 2008. And there she met James Carter III and was like, what? Wow. I will admit that shockingly little is mentioned about this in like all of the sources that I have for this case. But this is kind of what I can gather. So like they show up to this family barbecue. This kid comes over to James and like it's very clear that this is his son. And she's like, who is this? You have a son?

And he was like yeah so i mean like technically i have a son but he lives with his mom during the school year and i only have him during the summer so like technically he's my son wow i bet that kid's not fucked up royally. Yeah. Yeah, I guess technically. When you really think about it, I do have a son. Yeah. Great. So, like, I don't think that barbecue probably went that well. Were there raisins in the potato salad? I don't know.

Then we don't know how it went, do we? So following that, their relationship continued to deteriorate and it crumbled altogether when Tiana learned that James had actually been charged with domestic abuse in a previous relationship. And in fact, he went to court when they'd been dating about six months and he was sentenced to five months in jail. Oh, shit. Yeah. Not only that, but it actually turned out that James had a sizable rap sheet for similar behavior. This was not a first-time offense. He was a habitual abuser.

So Tiana was like, well, that'll do it. Yeah. I'm out out and she did that thing where she like slapped her knees and then she headed out the door of course figuratively speaking yes yes okay from there the timeline is a little

bit iffy but it seems like James went off to jail to serve his five monthmonth sentence. They broke up. Tiana was already suspecting that he was maybe cheating on her. And so she was like, cutting that off. Done.

In the time that James was serving his jail time, she started talking to her college sweetheart again, Robert. And they were really talking it up. They were getting back together. He was going to move back to Connecticut and, like, they were going to be, like, full steam ahead towards marriage. Right. But James was under the impression, I guess, when he got out of jail that he would be getting back together with Tiana. So, like, legit the day he's released from jail, he called Tiana and was like, where the fuck are you to pick me up? And she's like, excuse me.

And things really escalated quickly. James began full on stalking Tiana following this interaction where she failed to pick him up from his release in jail. Yeah, because that's her job. Exactly. Exactly. And so she confided in her parents that James just won't leave her alone at first. Like he just starts showing up at places she is. Like if she's out grocery shopping, he shows up there like just trying to like run into her.

And then he did something pretty calculated. He showed up on Tiana's doorstep one day with a police escort. And he said, listen, don't make a scene. I'm just here to get my stuff. And then we'll be done. What stuff? Some stuff that he'd left at her house, I guess. And she was like, are you serious right now that you brought the police to my house?

And he's like, I don't I don't I don't want to argue with you. I don't want I don't want any of this. Oh, he's the victim. Mm hmm. Yep. That's rich. And so he was allowed to come into her apartment, gather up a couple things, and he left. And the police were aware of this whole situation. Right.

So then some time passes and his behavior is continuing. You know, he's showing up different places. He's calling. He's sending kind of nasty emails. And so she goes and she files for a restraining order against him. And then he filed for his own restraining order. He went to the police and said that Tiana had punched him in the face and kicked out the taillight on his car and so he was given a restraining order as well she could not believe it this is kind of common though it is it absolutely is and then from there things continued to escalate.

He started sending her more emails. Some of these emails came from like a third party. This woman that was pretending to be his new girlfriend. It was James the entire time. They were like, I knew there'd be a catfish somewhere. Oh, yeah, there is. Yeah. And so the message of these emails is super threatening.

She gets one that says, trust me, baby girl, you're going to lose everything. He sends another one that says, as God is my witness, punishment is on the way. So be prepared. And then one comes from this supposed girlfriend that said, you will have bad luck. You hear me? Remember this email when karma bites you in the ass. So she has this restraining order at this time. So she takes these emails to the Plainville Police Department and gives them to them.

It's like, look, he's violating this restraining order. He's not supposed to be contacting me at all. And they're like, that's not him. That's a made up woman. At first they're like, you can't prove that these are coming from him. And then when she has some that are coming from him, they're like, well, that's not really a thread. It's just an email. Oh.

So they're like, no, there's there's nothing we can do about it. This goes on for six weeks. Just endless messages. She gets notes like at her apartment on her like front door from him. Well, that's obviously a violation. They're not signed. Give me a fucking break. So she can't prove.

And they're just really vague in nature. She visited the police department 33 times in six weeks. Oh, my God. And each time they told her, call us when he does something. Fuck off. Thanks a lot for your help. Yep. Call us when he kills you. Mm hmm. Yeah. Yep. Yep.

And I'm sorry. He's got a rap sheet a mile along with all this domestic violence stuff. Yeah. She's got nothing. Yeah. And they're not willing to hear her out? Nope. So the way they – OK. The way they put this on the Tamron Hall show is that there was confusion because James is the one who made the initial contact with the police by asking for that police escort to the apartment. Okay. Here's what I'll say about that. That's super common in domestic violence.

Especially for a more sophisticated perpetrator. They're going to try to use the system against the other person. Yep. And the police have to be smart enough to know that very basic thing about domestic violence. Yep. So if they were confused by that, that's on their stupid asses. Absolutely. How dare you say that about the police?

By early February 2008, this was like completely out of hand. Tiana was scared constantly. She thought James was going to show up at her apartment and she didn't know what he was capable of. To this point, he'd never physically harmed her to my knowledge. I don't find that in the research anywhere, but she was scared of him. Well, she knew enough about his track record to be scared. And it sounds like terrible emotional abuse. Absolutely.

It sounds absolutely terrifying to think that someone's following you. Yeah. So one morning in early February, she came out of her apartment to find that all four tires on her car had been slashed. Of course. So she called the police and the police came and they said well you can't prove it was him and they did nothing so at that point tiana's dad who had some background in law enforcement, he wasn't a police officer, but he worked in the field somehow. OK. He set up a security camera outside of her apartment so that they could catch something.

That was really unusual in 08. Absolutely. Yeah. Absolutely. And like this was a security camera that you had to have a VHS tape to record to. Absolutely. Yeah. Absolutely. And like this was a security camera that you had to have a VHS tape to record to. Okay. Yeah. Okay. So they set this up and then she gets another note on her door and it's like, please forgive me. I'm sorry for everything I've ever done. All this stuff. The tape ran out before he left the note. So again, she has no proof that he is

the one who left it. Fast forward a couple of days. Tiana was at her job in Waterbury, Connecticut. She worked in some kind of customer service capacity. I'm not exactly sure what she did. She worked like in an office, kind of a call center sort of thing, I believe. And she got a call from James at work. According to the restraining order, he is not to contact her at all. And so she like put the call on speakerphone, had a co-worker come over and listen so that she had a witness and was like,, OK, this is something I can take this to the police. Yeah.

So she called the Plainville Police Department and she's like, he's violating the restraining order and I have a witness. And they're like, oh, gosh, that is interesting. But, you know, it's too bad as that happened in Waterbury. Oh, my God. In Plainville. So you're actually going to have to happened in Waterbury. Oh my God. Not in Plainville. So you're actually going to have to call the Waterbury police department. Well,

hopefully they're better than. And she's like, okay. All right. So she leaves work. She goes to the Waterbury police department and she's like, this is my restraining order. And this person who I have a restraining order against contacted me at work today.

I have a witness who overheard it. He's threatening me. Nobody will do anything. And they take her copy of her restraining order and they look it over. And they're like, you know, this doesn't look real. What? They tell her they don't believe it's a real restraining order. Just a crazy, angry black woman?

Is that what we're dealing with? And that she will need to have the Plainville Police Department fax them a copy directly in order for them to do anything about it. Oh, let me run around and do all kinds of paperwork while I'm being stalked. So that day she left the police department. She got in her car. She called her mom and she was just sobbing. Yeah. She said, Mom, you wouldn't believe these people. They treated me like dirt. They didn't believe anything I told them. They thought I was lying. And one officer accused me of having a fake restraining order. So Kathy is Tiana's mom, Kathy Lewis.

She calls the sergeant at the Waterbury Police Department and she's livid. She chews this guy out and he says, nothing is going to happen to your daughter. Oh, my God. And she said to him, look, I don't want my daughter to become a statistic. And I'm telling you now, if something happens to my daughter, you better move to another planet. Oh, my God. I love that. Yes.

Oh, I fucking love that. So this happened on February 13th, 2008. Oh, my God. Tiana then left the Waterbury Police Department, went to the Plainville Police Department, told them what happened. They faxed over a copy of the legitimate restraining order to Waterbury and they're like, OK, we'll make a note of this. And they contacted James Carter and said they'd received a complaint that he violated a restraining order. They just called him like, hey, we've received a complaint that he violated a restraining order. They just called him. Like, hey, we've received a complaint that you violated a restraining order.

That's all they do when you violate? What? What do you think that might do? Piss him off. And so then he goes after her. Yep. The Plainville Police Department did tell her that they don't think that she should go home. That she should find somewhere to stay for a couple of days. And that they'll't think that she should go home, that she should find somewhere to

stay for a couple of days and that they'll look into it. Great. With what money? I mean, like. Yeah. So. Does she have somewhere else to go? So she was going to stay with her parents for a couple of days.

So now it's Valentine's Day, February 14th, 2008. So the night of the 13th, Tiana did go home. Her dad came home with her and he actually like put a new tape in the security camera. And then he went through some scenarios with her of what she should do if she was approached by James, if James tried to attack her. Can you imagine having to have your dad role play with you? No. That your stock, if your stalker were to attack you, what you should do? No.

She's begging the police to help her. And this is what she has to do. It's horrible. So the next day, February 14th, 2008, she goes to work. She does her normal thing.

And then that evening, she's going to go stay with her mom for the weekend. It's a Friday. So she decides that evening, she's just going to run by her apartment real quick, pick up her laundry so that she can do her laundry while she's at her mom's house. It's in the evening.

It's after dark. She pulls up to her house, walks up to her apartment, and James comes out of the shadows and attacks her. He stabbed her 18 times. And then he ran off and got into his black PT cruiser and drove away. Tiana was horribly injured. He pierced her heart twice. Oh, my God.

And somehow she managed to call 911. What? While laying on the front porch of her apartment bleeding to death. She told the dispatcher I'm bleeding to death. My ex-boyfriend just

stabbed me to death. Oh my god. She was screaming. They got an ambulance to her. Her neighbors came out and tried to render aid to her until the ambulance got there. But she lost consciousness before the ambulance got there. They got her to a hospital. They rushed her into surgery.

Please tell me she died. She died on the operating table. Oh, my God. Her mother, Kathy, says, we got to the hospital at a quarter of midnight. I saw the expression on the receptionist when we identified ourselves. And I saw the look on the surgeon's face when he came out to talk to us. Then a team of doctors surrounded us and they said we did everything we could. They told her that they opened her chest up and massaged her heart to try and resuscitate her.

But she'd lost too much blood. There was no blood in her body. Oh, my God. They told her, we're so sorry. She's gone. Tiana Angelique Notice had been stabbed 18 times. She was 25 years old. She'd celebrated her 25th birthday nine days earlier.

Her dad was asked to come in and identify her body. He walked into the operating room and he said she was there on the table. And he said there were stab wounds everywhere. God. And he said, yeah, that's my daughter. And he said, of course, there was no question who had done this. Tiana had used her dying words to identify her attacker. Less than an hour after Tiana died, James Carter II was arrested and charged with her murder.

Oh, they didn't just call him? No. No. arrested and charged with her murder. Oh, they didn't just call him? No. No. This is so infuriating because this was just mishandled from the beginning. And this was so preventable.

Well, and it's mishandled every single time. Yeah. Yes. I mean, you would think that— 33 times in six weeks it was mishandled. So that's a huge systemic failure. Yes. I mean, you would think that. 33 times in six weeks it was mishandled. So that's a huge systemic failure. Yes. 100%.

I think you get to mishandle something once or twice. Yeah. Not 33 times. No. James' trial began in October of 2011. Prior to trial, James Carter II turned down a plea deal that would have given him 45 years in prison. I don't blame him for being so bold. I mean, he got away with everything.

Exactly. Why would you think the police are going to come down on you hard right now? Yep. The trial lasted nine days. During the nine days, the prosecution was led by Paul Rotorati. Rotorati. Okay. The prosecution called more than 30 witnesses and showed the jury 96 exhibits. The evidence included Tiana's 911 call, which is horrible. I listened to part of it and you can hear her screaming and you can hear her say, my ex-boyfriend just stabbed me to death. She knew she was dying. Yeah. death she knew she was dying yeah they played the surveillance video for the jury from that security camera that her dad had set up it captured tiana running from her killer and then they also printed off like still shots from the video and there were these still shots that showed a figure running from the scene

and that figure looked an awful lot like james carter they had a forensic expert take the stand who testified that tiana's blood was found on james carter's clothing and james carter's own brother and his brother's girlfriend both testified for the prosecution that on the night of Tiana's murder, James had called them and confessed. Oh. He said, I just stabbed T. What had they done with that information that night? You know, I don't know. I mean, he was arrested so quickly.

Oh, yeah, they were suddenly on the ball. Yeah. Yeah, that's refreshing. Yeah. James was represented by a public defender, Christopher Eddy. And James' defense did not deny that James had stabbed Tiana to death that night. Well, yeah, you really couldn't deny that James had stabbed Tiana to death that night. Well, yeah, you really couldn't deny that. Their defense was that pressure over financial stuff and other problems had built up in James

and it had caused him to snap. OK. Mm-hmm. Yep. OK. The defense told the jury that it was an extreme emotional disturbance and that they should find James Carter guilty of manslaughter and nothing more. Wow. They had a psychologist take the stand and testify that James Carter was psychologically fragile and susceptible to losing control, especially when under stress. The prosecution on their like rebuttal phase was like, OK, but look at all of these things that he did leading up to this.

Like he stalked her for weeks. Each time, like each thing was more threatening than the last this wasn't some like snap in the moment right this was something he planned there was actually even a moment um james where they were able to prove that James had called a locksmith that night and tried to try and get into her apartment so that he could be in there waiting when she came home. But the locksmith like wasn't going to get there in time and he was afraid he was going to get caught like with the locksmith there. And so he just like waited in the shadows. Yeah, that sure sounds like a snap. Mm hmm.

it in the shadows. Yeah, that sure sounds like a snap. Mm-hmm. There was a dramatic moment during closing arguments when James Carter leapt from his seat and screamed in the courtroom.

What did he scream? I couldn't find, like, if he said anything specific. He just kind of, like, cried out. It was during, it was actually during the defense's closing arguments when they were talking about him being a fragile person who was susceptible to losing control when under stress. So he took his cue. Mm-hmm. Yeah. We took his cue.

Mm-hmm. Yeah. And so he was removed from the courtroom during closing arguments and the jury was instructed to disregard his outburst. And he then refused to be present in the courtroom when the jury returned their verdict. Yeah, he sat like in a different room and watched it on a video. Well, this whole thing is him not accepting reality. So he knows how this is going to go. Yep.

The jury, of course, found him guilty of murder. And again, he refused to be in the courtroom during his sentencing. So the judge hated this. The judge spoke directly to him like over like a closed circuit TV thing and was like, you looked her in the face when you stabbed her to death, but you won't be in here to take responsibility for it now. You can't look the rest of us in the face. Can't the judge just demand? Apparently not. Wow. The judge was pissed.

Yeah. That he wouldn't be in the courtroom. And so the judge sentenced him to the maximum, 60 years in prison. It's the maximum allowed in Connecticut. Good. Tiana's family was thrilled with the outcome. They were like, this is exactly what we wanted. We know that Tiana is rejoicing in heaven right now.

But they were pissed. They were pissed that this happened. Where's the lawsuit? So they sue the shit out of the city. They filed a civil suit against both the Plainville Police Department and the Waterbury Police Department. And that went to trial before a jury. I can't believe it didn't settle. Oh, my God.

And the jury awarded them. How much? Ten million dollars. Hell yes. They also filed a civil suit against the city of Plainville itself. And they settled that. OK. For two point six million dollars.

OK. that for $2.6 million. Okay. I don't know if they actually got that money. I was just thinking I doubt they got that amount. I doubt they did. They have

been working in Connecticut to change some legislation there. They've introduced a pilot program that's like going on right now that involves GPS monitoring. So this is where when a restraining order is put in place, a judge can order the person who the restraining order is against to have a GPS monitor fitted for them. And then their victim, the person who is being protected, would get alerts if that person comes within a certain radius of them. That's a great idea.

I think it's a wonderful idea. They said if that had been in place then, Tiana would have known to go nowhere near her apartment that night. Also, if they've just taken this seriously from the beginning. Exactly. They've also – they're also working on a program where they do a lethality assessment against violent offenders. So someone who commits some kind of domestic abuse, they do this assessment on them to determine the likelihood that when they reoffended, it would be lethal. And so they're testing this to see if that's a way to predict if somebody will – is likely

to take another person's life. Hmm. So that one feels a little minority reporting to me. I was going to say it makes me a little nervous. Yeah. I agree. That one I don't know about. I like the GPS monitoring one though. Yeah, me a little nervous. I agree. I don't know about that. I like the GPS monitoring one though.

Yeah, me too. Yeah. Yeah. They started a foundation in Tiana's name to raise money for domestic violence and awareness around domestic violence. What? what so i know i told you that tiana and her college boyfriend richard were like getting back together yeah he planned to propose to her on valentine's day oh the ring and everything oh oh that's terrible so i'm gonna finish with a poem that Tiana wrote. A poem.

What do you say? Poem? Am I saying it weird? I say poem. Poem. What the fuck am I saying? Poem. Yeah.

But you're saying poem. Poem. A poem. What the fuck ever. Anyway, this is a poem that Tiana wrote when James went to jail on his domestic abuse charges and she broke up with him. Her dad read this as part of his victim impact statement. He said that it was very prophetic and it's called Chapter Closed. prophetic and it's called chapter closed sometimes you want to give a man the benefit of the doubt to prove he is who he says he is i was disappointed for all the words were lies and his actions spoke louder let his emptiness comfort him at night like the cement walls he's become accustomed to

i smile for my curtain call, for I regained my strength when I walked out the door, regained independence by saying no more. An empty house in solitude is how he will spend his days, and I rest assured knowing I'm beautiful, smart, and on my way. And that's the story of Tiana Notice. Oh, my gosh. I hate that. Yeah. Yeah.

To me, there's nothing worse than when someone knows they're in danger. And it seems like that's so often the case with these domestic violence cases. Yeah. They know they're in danger. Yep. And it seems like that's that's so often the case with these domestic violence cases. Yeah. They know they're in danger. She could not get the police to help her. They would not take her seriously. Oh.

It's infuriating. Her dad has said that if if they can get like this legislation done or this GPS program to take off and if it saves one person's life, he knows that Tiana would willingly lay down her life to save another person's life. And to him, like that is – that's the goal. That's enough. Yeah, that was real sad. It was a good poem.

Thanks. Or poem. Poem. As you said. Jeez. So you're already pretty familiar with this story. Oh my gosh, not the true story. I just know the movie version.

I wonder how closely it follows the true story. I don't know, but I doubt there's a fart transplant. What? It's my favorite part of the movie. A fart transplant. Okay, so it's Zach Galifianakis and kate mckinnon right kate mckinnon plays zach galifianakis's fiancee okay and they're doing a photo shoot for their engagement pictures and they're both wearing lovely denim outfits okay and at one point they're like i don't know

what's laying down the other and zach galifianakis is like laying on the ground and Kate McKinnon's like laying on top of him and she farts on him. He's like, you farted right into my butthole. It was like a fart transplant. Anyway, you'd love it. Yeah, okay, I gotta see it. Well, now I feel

nervous. Because this is a tell you no. Again, I don't know the true story at all. I just know the movie masterminds. Okay. Well, let's start off with a thank you to an episode of the FBI files called the unperfect crime. Not the imperfect crime. The unperfect. I think it's kind of meant to be like a little

joke about how stupid these people are. I thought it was like a very unbirthday to you. You know, the FBI guy did wear a mad hat. Also an episode of possibly my new favorite program. What is it? It's called Super Heists.

Will you be covering the whole It's just Super Heists. Will you be covering the whole episode? It's all heists from here on out. The episode title? A Van Full of Dollars. Oh, okay. Also an article from the Washington Post that ran in 1999 by

Jeff Diamant who later wrote a book about this. The article, sometimes this happens with older articles. Part of the headline got cut off. And so what was left behind was just dumb and. So I'm guessing dumb and dumber. Oh, maybe. Yeah.

Like a play on the movie title. Yes. Yeah. And also because as you'll see, it's very fitting here. Yeah. Also apologies. This story is super light on court stuff. Oh, okay.

But I didn't care because— Because you loved it so much! Yes. Also, my last couple cases have been real bummers. Yeah. And I couldn't do it anymore. No more bummers. All right.

No more drama in your life. Can we talk about Mary J. Blige for a moment? Stunner. She was a stunner. Yeah, she was amazing. Those boots were fucking incredible. Fuck, I loved those boots. All right.

Okay, anyway. That concludes our Super Bowl coverage. Picture it. It's the mid-90s, and we're in Charlotte, North Carolina. And David Gant's life was not going how he'd expected. He'd grown up kind of middle class. His parents had sent him to a private Christian school, and they'd taken vacations to Disney World. But now, as an adult, he wasn't doing so hot.

After high school, he joined the military, and then he'd gotten married to a woman named Tammy. And a few years after that, he'd gotten a boring, low-paying job at the Loomis Fargo Armed Car Warehouse. The job was all about the money. Loomis Fargo would pick up money from different businesses and bring it to banks and they did ATM maintenance and they always had just millions of dollars on site. It was kind of a wild dynamic because the employees who worked around all this money didn't make much money themselves. Yeah. David only made like 20 grand a year.

I'm sorry. I know you're wondering what I was typing just now. I was. I know. I just googled masterminds and I was like, what if I'm thinking of completely the wrong movie? That would be hilarious. I got nervous. Really? Yes. What have I said so far that threw you off?

Nothing at all matched. But I was like, was that scene really from, I don't know, you know. It's fine. It's just anxiety. It's just a little anxiety. It's fine. You better not have screwed up your Zach Galifianakis movies. In this story that I'm about to tell you, they're on a bachelor party thing and they lose a guy.

Derside's been on the roof the whole time. And they run into a convicted rapist. Uh-huh. But they don't seem worried about that. Yeah. Anyway. Moving on. David only made $20,000 a year and yet yet all day long, he was surrounded by money.

Wow. Yeah. Yeah. He literally. What? Nope. I was going to say something bad. Say it.

I mean, Loomis might have been asking for it. Nope. Brandy? I agree. You're only paying him peanuts, and then you're surrounding them with money. Like what the fuck do you think is going to happen? And I'm sorry, but this will happen too easily. Okay.

So I kind of think, yeah, you're asking for it. He literally came home from these 12 hour shifts stinking of money. Apparently, when you only have, you know, just like a normal amount of money, you don't realize how bad it stinks. But like when you're surrounded by millions. I bet it does smell bad. Yes.

Yeah, because it gets sweaty. People put it in their bras. You know what they said? They said it smelled like tits in there. I don't think anybody said that, Kristen. I did. Podcasting extraordinaire. David and his wife Tammy lived in a mobile home in Kings Mountain, North Carolina,

and they were always like two paychecks away from being homeless. How close to Elizabeth City is that? Very far away. Okay. Same state, so I guess it's the craziest question I've ever asked. Pretty rude how he answered that. Well, they're literally on opposite sides. And North Carolina is one of them long ones, you know?

It is. It's not like those, like, you know, northeastern states. Or even like, yeah, or even like in Illinois where it's, you know, tall and skinny. Yeah. Much like the man. The famous man from Illinois. Oh, Lincoln? I'm sorry, is there another super famous tall, skinny man from Illinois?

No, there's not. Homer Simpson. Okay, anyway, it's not tall or skinny. People are going to reach out and they're going to be like, they're not from that Springfield. It's a different Springfield. I'm sorry. I don't care where Homer Simpson's from.

See, I'm trying to save you here. Sorry. David and Tammy didn't have money to do fun stuff. They barely had money for the basics. So David began working a ton of overtime, just trying to get ahead of their bills. And all of a sudden, work became like way more fun because a woman named Kelly Campbell began working with him. Brandy, you're smiling so big. She looked a lot like Kristen Wiig in the movie.

Kelly was cute and funny and she was married with a couple kids and she and David hit it off. They both smoked so they took their smoke breaks together and sometimes they ate lunch together. And David couldn't help but notice that there was a mutual attraction there. Except unfortunately for David, it wasn't actually mutual. Kelly didn't find him attractive like at all. She thought he was nice. Yeah, that was about it.

By the way, on this episode of Super Heist, they interviewed David and Kelly separately and David talked about how he was into her and Kelly talked about how she wasn't into him and David goes, I felt like she would make a good replacement for my wife.

Well, fuck! And then they cut to Kelly spitting into a red solo cup. Ha ha ha ha ha ha! Oh! She knows she's on camera! Ha ha ha ha ha! She's being interviewed for a TV show! She knows she's on camera. She's being interviewed for a TV show.

And she's spitting God knows what into... You think she was chewing tobacco? Who fucking knows? Or you think it was like a loogie? Oh my God, don't even talk to me. Don't even talk to me. I don't think she was chewing tobacco. You think it was a loogie? Stop it. The world may never

know, Brandy. All we do know is that's disgusting. Yeah. So you get the idea. These two were maybe flirting? Maybe only flirting in David's head? but as they drove around what

i mean i have an assessment based on your viewing of a fictional movie what what's your assessment no don't wasn't she flirting so she because she thought she could get stuff from him? Maybe. So I imagine she, my assessment is I imagine she was flirting, but only for her own benefit. Yeah. She was just toying with that young man's heart, wasn't she, Brandi? Quit playing games with my heart. It's my heart. Anyway,

as they drove around in the armored vehicles with millions of dollars in the back, they joke about driving off with the money. This was a very normal joke for a Loomis Fargo employee to make. Ha ha ha! Wouldn't it be wild if we,is Fargo employee to make. Ha ha ha.

Wouldn't it be wild if we like stole all this money? Ha ha ha. Yeah, I can totally see that. Yeah. I mean, duh. Yeah. Honestly, if someone doesn't make that joke around all that money, then like get the fuck out of here. We're not friends.

No, I was actually thinking then they're planning. They're actively planning to steal the money. Oh, they are! They're actively, you're right! Yes. You're right, they're like, I can't even joke about this because then people will become suspicious. Hmm, but it backfires. Anyway, we're detectives. Okay. At some point, Kelly quit the job at Loomis Fargo.

And one evening, she went to a bonfire at her friend Steve Chambers' house. Steve and Kelly had gone to high school together. And now Steve and his wife Michelle and their children lived in a double-wide trailer, and neither Steve nor Michelle had steady jobs, but, you know, somehow they always had money on hand. And that's because they were into some sketchy shit. What kind of sketchy shit? Don't worry about it. It's none of your business. On the night of this bonfire...

That's all we get? It's none of our business? They dabbled in a lot of sketchy shit. Okay, alright. On the night of this bonfire, as they were sitting around drinking beers, Steve loaded an idea by Kelly. What if we robbed Loomis Fargo? The idea was tempting. Money was really tight for Kelly, and she would love to live a life where she didn't have to rely on a man for money.

But Kelly wasn't a criminal. Aside from a DUI, she'd never been in trouble with the law. Plus she knew all about the Loomis Fargo and about the Loomis Fargo and armored cars. And she was like, yeah, I think it's a lot more dangerous

and difficult to rob one of those things than you're making it out to be. But Steve wouldn't give it up. For months, he kept coming to her with the idea. And in that time, Kelly's old friend David got a promotion. Oh, shit. He was now the vault supervisor for Loomis Fargo. So during one of her conversations with Steve,

Kelly mentioned that the vault supervisor, well, he has a crush on me. And Steve, who loves love, because it was just recently Valentine's Day, was like, yes, we can use that. So Kelly called up David, and of course he was thrilled to hear from her. And she was like, hey, our attraction is super mutual. It's definitely not all in your head. And I miss you.

Oh, hey, real quick. Well, I have you. Have you ever thought about, I don't know, robbing Loomis Fargo? And David was like, uh, maybe? David claims he was a little on the fence about this idea. But then one day he sat down and did the math and figured that if he kept making the minimum payments on his credit card, it would take him 30 years to pay off. Oh, my gosh. So he was like, yeah, OK, I guess I'll...

Let's fucking do it. Let's go. So he and Kelly met up in the woods to plan this heist. For real? Yeah. They met in the woods? Yeah. Where would you go?

Somewhere in... Taco Bell, Chili's, Applebee's, like every other one of your stories. People are going to overhear. And also money's tight for both of them. You know what's free? Going into the woods. Well, it's fucking weird. What? Oh, let? Going into the woods. Wow, it's fucking weird. What?

Oh, let's go into the woods? Listen, they're two married people. Yeah. They can't just be seen out together. All right. They're talking about a huge heist, Brandy. Okay. I can tell you're not.

People meet with it. In the stories you tell us, people meet with their hit man at a restaurant. Yeah, and that's the key. I'm telling these stories so it shows they fucked up big time. For all we know, this is like the one crime that went wrong. Every other crime that's planned in the woods goes perfectly. Every other crime that's planned in the woods goes perfectly. If a crime is planned in the woods, does anyone get caught?

That's the thing they say. That's the thing they say about the woods. That's right. All right. So, yeah, they went into the woods. What about it? They wanted to plan this heist. Except plan wasn't really the right word. Because Steve was the brains of the operation, if you can call it that. And Kelly was the convincer and David was the moron.

Because here's what he agreed to do. The vault at Loomis Fargo usually held between 15 and 20 million dollars. So he would single-handedly disarm the security system and transport millions of dollars by himself into the company's biggest van. He would then drive off the premises with all the money, meaning that once word got out, everyone would know for certain that he was the one who stole the money. He's taking all the risk. Yeah, he's the only one stealing the money.

Then he would meet up with Kelly and Steve, and Kelly would drive David to Columbia, South Carolina, where he would board a plane to Mexico using a fake ID. Meanwhile, Steve would take all the money and hide it, and they would split the money three ways. Okay. Okay. Can you fucking believe this plan? No, it's terrible. He's going to do basically everything.

All of it. He only gets a third of the money. And he's leaving it all. Yeah. With a man he's never met. Oh, my gosh. Eventually, Kelly and her children would move down to Mexico to live with David for the rest of their lives, Brandy.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, that's what would happen. Okay. And then, for the rest of their lives, they would live like they were all on vacation. Okay. David felt great about this plan because he had recently read one book about the FBI. What he learned from that book was that the key to getting away with a crime like this is to get the fuck away from the crime scene as quickly as possible.

Getting away with a crime like this is to get the fuck away from the crime scene as quickly as possible. Because in the initial hours of the investigation, the FBI tends to search for you in like the vicinity of where the crime occurred. What? What are you making that face for? Yeah. OK. All right. Just continue.

I mean, it's not a mystery who did it, though. So, like, they're going to be looking for him specifically. Right. And he specifically is getting the fuck out of Dodge. Okay. He's going to Mexico to live on the beach. And Kelly's going to come down. And so are the kids. And I don't know if you figured this out.

They're going to get two-thirds of that money. So they're going to be all right. Don't worry about them. OK. He read one book about this. What? You want him to read two? I don't think that would happen. David also learned that if they could lay low for a while and not spend much money, then after like one year, the FBI would only have a couple agents on the case.

And after two years, it would basically be a file on somebody's desk. This was the perfect crime. It's not. It would go beautifully, Brandi. No. It would be sad to leave Tammy behind and his family behind. But he was going to spend the rest of his life banging Kelly on the beach getting sand in all his crevices. That does sound nice.

Worth it. In the movie, his wife's name is Jandice. Jandice. I do need to watch this movie. I love it. Brandi, I know this will shock you, but Kelly had no intention of moving to Mexico with David. Yeah, I figured. She had like zero interest.

But you know what she was interested in? Getting the money. Yeah. She was going gonna get a pool she was gonna go on vacation she was gonna get a house in the country so they ironed out the details of this plan the fbi would be looking for david so he'd haul off to mexico and they'd get money to him so that he could live there while the investigation died down. Meanwhile, Steve and Kelly would be super responsible with the money. They wouldn't touch it. And then after a few years, they'd each get their share of the money.

Why do you look like that? Are you jealous that you didn't think of this yourself? I'm not. That's a lot of faith. Well, David has and other people. You know what? So he was asked about this and what he said was that he's always been big on teams. You put this guy on a team and he's going to trust the team.

You know what? What? I'm also big on teams. You see a bit of yourself in David. I do. You would take all the risk. Leave the $17 million behind. Oh, no.

Okay, you guys better get me my share. I'll be waiting. Are you ready for the best part? Yeah. One night, after one of these planning sessions in the woods, Kelly and David kissed. Oh, it was transcendent. Oh, God. For David, anyway.

Yeah. Now they just had to wait for the right time to pull off this heist. And soon enough, it came. David was scheduled to work an upcoming weekend. And the weekend crew was always a little smaller than the weekday crew, so it was settled. The heist would occur on Saturday, October 4th, 1997. That day, David rode into work, and a song came on the radio. What was it?

It was Take the Money and Run. Oh, it's a sign! It was a sign! This was meant to be! Meanwhile, Kelly was at home that day smoking just a ton of pot. Oh, great. And yeah, it did keep her pretty calm. Yeah.

But then David got into work and learned, oh, shit, he had to train a new employee that day. This guy would be glued to him all day long. So they worked and worked and the last truck came in about 30 minutes later than expected, which is a pain in the ass any day, but especially when you're supposed to pull off a heist. But after the truck came in, David turned to the trainee and was like, Oh, look at me. I'm locking things up. This is how you do it. I'm doing it perfect.

Hey, you've done a great job today. Just the bee's knees. You just get out of here. Just take yourself home. You just scoot, scoot. Do the boot scooting. A little tap on the butt. Get the fuck out of here. Just take yourself home. You just scoot, scoot. Do the boot scooting. A little tap on the butt.

Yeah, and it made the guy uncomfortable. And he was like, that's sexual harassment. Yeah, that's what the trainee said. And David was like, I don't give a fuck. I am pulling off a heist of epic proportions tonight. So, you know, the trainee was kind of tired. It had been a long day. So he was like, yeah, okay, I'll leave. All right.

So he left the building, got in his car, drove away. Now all David had to do was steal $17.3 million from the vault. Oh, my. That sounds heavy. Yes. Yes, it is. He turned off the alarm, got in the vault, and the bills were all on crates and shrink-wrapped. And now he had to haul them from the vault into the company's biggest truck. It was exhausting. Yeah. Because most of it was in $20 bills. Oh, shit. Yeah.

$11 million of it was in 20s. Oh, my gosh. In total, the money weighed 2,800 pounds. Fuck! But David got to work and the sweat poured off of him. Adrenaline fueled him. He kept hauling the money and hauling the money and filling that truck and filling that truck. He filled it all the way to the ceiling with cash.

Meanwhile, Kelly and Steve and two of Steve's buddies who he'd brought along were all waiting outside. They weren't super patient. David had given Kelly his cell phone and she used it to call him at Loomis and she kept being like, hey, are you almost done? How about now? What about now? Are you done now? And he said, it'd be a lot quicker

if you'd stop fucking calling me! He was super sarcastic about it. Because he was like, oh yeah, it's really helpful for you to interrupt me all the time. Yeah, he was super annoyed. And Kelly could tell. So she paged him

with their secret code. 831. 831? What's that mean? I don't know. What's their secret code? Wait, that was just a guess? No, eight letters, three words, one meaning. I love you. Oh.

Mmm. That was not their secret code. Oh, okay. One, four, three. What's that mean? One, four, three. One, four, three. What does it mean?

One, four, three. It's the number of letters in each word. I love you. Oh, it's the same kind of thing. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, there are only so many things you can do with a pager. It took David a little over an hour to load the van, which I don't think is that bad.

When you're talking about all that. No, that's very impressive. Yeah, he was going for the gold. Yeah. Once he did load the van, he locked the vault. But this time he set it up on a time lock, which would only allow the vault to open in five days. Oh. Mm-hmm.

And he took the keys with him. That's pretty good. Okay. I'm still blaming Loomis a little bit here. Why is that a feature? Well, and like how is it possible that you're basically leaving that possibility that one person or even just two people is able to. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Why do they have all the keys? Yes. Why do they have, like, all the access? Well, I'm guessing they probably don't anymore. I hope not. If they do, then we need to get jobs at Lucas. And Brandy, I'm going to need you to do the whole thing. And I'll get you your share of the money.

Okay. Go team. So he figured that doing this would buy him some time. It would take a while for the Sunday crew to realize that the vault had been completely emptied. Then David went over to the security center, where all the footage from the security cameras was being recorded onto VHS tapes and he took the two security tapes. Then he got in the van and drove off where he met up with Kelly and Steve and Steve's cousin Scott and his old friend from high school, Eric Payne. Why are there more people here? Yeah.

So David was not thrilled about this. Yeah. But evidently, like, Steve wanted help moving all this money. Oh, weird. Yeah, David's like, yeah, me fucking too, buddy. I want to say Scott. I just moved 2,000 pounds of money all by my fucking self. 2,800.

Don't you cheat him out of that 800. I want to say Scott and Eric were only getting like 100 grand from this. I'm sorry. You open up a big old van of cash like that in front of me. Yeah, I'm not settling for 100 grand. Yeah, fudge stripes. Some might fall down my bra. How much do you think you would get your bra?

I don't know, but I'd be going for the packs of 20s. I go for the ones. I get $37. I showed them. You owe me $100,000. I got $100,037. That's called a tip.

So everyone was so excited. They didn't waste time. David took $50,000. That would be enough for him to live on in Mexico for about a year until they could send him more money. Okay. And with that, he and Kelly took off for the Columbia, South Carolina airport, pleased as punch. Once they were alone together, Kelly said, I'm a rich bitch now. But on their ride to the airport, they encountered a problem.

David didn't have any way of carrying the 50 grand on the plane. He hadn't thought it through. Oh, Jesus. But Kelly was a quick thinker. She pulled into a gas station, bought a pair of pantyhose, and they stuffed the bills into the pantyhose and made like a homemade money belt for David to wear under his clothes. I hope he doesn't get patted down. It was 97.

They let you on with an automatic weapon. The only problem was the pantyhose couldn't hold all 50 grand. How much could it hold? 25 grand. Oh, no, David. So David took 25 grand. I'm so sorry. This is so ridiculous.

He took 25 grand and gave the rest to Kelly, which was no big deal because she'd be joining him in Mexico super soon. To start their lives together. Yeah, because they were in love. Yeah, no. They were in love. They'd kissed once, Brandy. Yeah, okay. It was magical.

All right. So they drove off to Columbia Metropolitan Airport, where David planned to walk in and purchase a seat on the next flight to Cancun, Mexico. Okay. They got there and... It doesn't fly to Mexico. No, Columbia Metropolitan Airport did not offer international flights. That's a real problem. In fact, the lights were off.

The airport was shut down for the day. Oh my gosh. What do you make of this? Well, it seems like real poor planning. Yeah. Nobody, like, researched this at all? Here's what I'm guessing. First, well, no.

Here's what I know. I know these people are dumb as fuck. Yeah. But I also know the Charlotte airport is massive. Yeah. And it does fly everywhere. So I'm wondering if they just assumed that what they're – Assumed all airports. massive. Yeah. And it does fly everywhere. So I'm wondering if they just assumed that all airports. Yeah.

I'm wondering if they didn't know. Oh, our local airport is like bigger than a lot of other airports. Jesus. So they went with plan to electric boogaloo. What? What's with your face wouldn't it have been better just to go to the charlotte airport and try and just blend in and just get the fuck out of there as fast as possible yeah one would think yeah

i guess they didn't know how quickly they'd get caught so the thinking was like i kind of get the logic we need to be a little bit farther away by that stage. All right. Because surely the Charlotte airport would be like the first place they'd go to for the investigation. Yeah. How much farther is like the Atlanta airport? Can't be that far. Yeah, it's pretty far.

All right. I mean, those states, I feel like they're just kind of squished on top of each other. They are squished on top of each other, but there's more to them than you think. There's meat on those boats. Kelly drove, I guess I don't know how far away Atlanta is. Anyway, neither here. Someone will tell us. So Kelly drove David to a nearby bus station and sent him on his way and she headed back home to Charlotte.

But he's going to ride the bus to Mexico. Don't worry about it. He's getting on a bus. Okay. Where's the bus going? Don't worry. He's heading out. You know, she's going to miss him dearly. The important thing is he's getting away because he read that one FBI book, okay, and he knows he needs to get away from the scene. Okay. He's got it all figured out, Brandy, all right? Okay. Things weren't going much smoother back at the armored van. Before David and Kelly left, David had handed one of the men the keys to the van.

But... They didn't know how to open it? Well, in all their excitement, they neglected to ask which key unlocked the van. And that was a problem because the key ring had like 200 keys on it. For fuck's sake! So they start trying the keys. He didn't like hold it out with like the one key like and this is

the key. I mean he might have but I think people were all so excited. Too much adrenaline. Yeah. Fuck. Okay so now they're trying 200 keys. So they start trying the keys. None of them were working. The guys started getting pissed off at each other because this was stressful. Yeah. So then one of them

was like I've got an idea. Let's break into the van. You can't. It's an armored fucking car, you dumbass. So they grabbed rocks and boom, launched them against the windshield. And boom, launched them against the driver's side window. And this took a very long time because none of them realized that the glass on an armored truck isn't the same as the glass on a Chevy Tahoe.

No, it's a bulletproof. Yes, it's a fucking armored car. Finally, when they went back to the Keys, they got the van open. And man, it was a beautiful sight. Van full of dollars. Man. Who said Manny? It was just a guy named Manny hanging out back there.

They were like, no, we wanted money. And they did laugh because it was such a hilarious mix up. David was like, it took me a while to load Manny into the van. He did not want to go. But Kelly said that's what she wanted. This is the humor on this podcast is so sophisticated. No, it was money. More money than hardly anyone sees in their entire lives.

All stacked to the ceiling of this huge van. It was filled to the brim. Where were they taking it? Can you keep your pants on? No! We've already established that! So Steve and Scott and Eric got to work. Steve had brought 55-gallon barrels to fill with the

cash, and they began filling and filling and filling and uh-oh. Ooh. He didn't have enough barrels because the money's way more than they anticipated. Yeah, 17.3 million dollars is a lot of money. Like literally a lot of money.

Well, it's a literal ton of money. So they filled those barrels to the top and then they had to make some decisions. They'd run out of barrel but they hadn't run out of cash. They'd have to leave the fives and ones behind

and with that they hid the van in the woods they took off and took the barrels out to Steve's property and they covered the money in dog food nothing to see here just dog food just barrels of dog food massive barrels of dog food they're not going to go back for the rest of the money?

You don't want to get caught with your hand in the honey pot, Brandy. How much do they leave behind? Do you think I'm going to tell you? Yes. Do you think you have to keep your pants on? It's my money and I want it now. How much do you think I'm going to tell you? Yes. Do you think you have to keep your pants on? It's my money and I want it now.

How much do you think they left behind? Oh, gosh. Two million dollars. They left more. They did? Yeah. Okay. So back to the story.

You may be wondering about David's wife, Tammy, which is nice because David was not wondering about her. By this point, it was like 7.15 on Sunday morning. Yeah, she's like, where the fuck's my husband? Oh, my God. I feel terrible for this woman. OK, so, you know, her husband hadn't come home from work the previous day. She was worried. So she called the police and she told them about her concerns.

And so they sent an officer over to the Loomis Fargo plant. That's not good. They're going to find out that the money's gone. Sure enough, David's truck was there. Yeah. And oh shit, the gate was open. And so was the door to the warehouse. The officer called for backup, thinking that maybe something horrible had happened to

David. Well, something horrible had happened to David. He was too stupid to know it yet. He used. And now he was on a bus to nowhere. But he had 25 grand. Used to have 50. Before that, he had 17 million. The pot is getting smaller and smaller. Other officers arrived and a supervisor for Loomis Fargo arrived and the whole place looked fine. There was no blood, no body, but they couldn't get into the vault. Yeah, and there was a truck missing. but they couldn't get into the vault. Yeah, and there was a truck missing. So Loomis Fargo had to break into their own vault, you know,

because David had taken the keys and he'd set up that little code. Investigators went to the security center to watch the surveillance footage and, oh shit, someone had taken the tapes. But weirdly, they hadn't taken all of the tapes. There were three tapes. And for some reason, the thieves had only taken two. Oh, no. By this point, the FBI got involved because most of the money belonged to federally insured banks. So that made this a federal offense.

Who called the FBI? Obviously, the mayor. Duh! You think just anyone can call the FBI? No, I don't! You know how the FBI always has cute little names for their investigations? Yeah. You want to hear this one?

I sure do. Operation Charloot. I love it. It's so good. I loved the college admission scandal. Operation Varsity Blues. Yeah, it was good. I would like to just be included in those meetings.

The naming process. I don't want to do any actual work, but it's like, okay, we got to come up with a cute name. Cute name. The investigators all gathered around to watch the one remaining surveillance tape. And holy shit, there it was. Just David walking back and forth. Oh, shit. It was an hour straight of David Kidd just emptying out the vault.

Fuck! David, my man, what happened? FBI agent John Wydra, who in the FBI Files episode had a figurine of Mickey Mouse in scuba gear on his desk and wore not one but two Disney ties for his interviews. Disney adult. Mm-hmm. I am.

Which Kristen's totally cool with. I'm totally fine. I don't have any judgment for adults who are super fucking into things that are meant for children. I've got no judgment. And that's the facts. Should we admit? Okay.

On our most recent bonus episode, I talked about my prejudices against Disney adults. At great length. And then, but we listened to it back, and I was like, you know what? We're going to have to cut some of my spicy takes here. Because I had a feeling deep down in my soul that the Disney adults, maybe as a group, don't have a great sense of humor about themselves. And boy, was I right.

Because we cut the shit out of my spicy taste. Yeah, we cut all of the spiciest things. And people were still upset. People were still very upset with me. So anyway, Kristen has now become a Disney adult herself. Hey, don't throw me in with those freaks. I do think it's amazing. I mean, when you think about all the crap we talk on this podcast, that's the thing that people were like, how dare you come for Mickey?

They're very sensitive. So, you know, John Wyd widra totally normal guy yeah just decked out likes making just a normal amount he admitted they were all pretty impressed by david's athleticism okay it was like night wait was the interview from 1997 or is it from current day? Why would that matter? Because there was a moment in time when Disney was very popular. People had, like, polos with a Disney character on them. Just plain old normal adults. No, I don't believe it. That's a real thing.

But, Brandi, I am telling you. Every Tom, Dick, and Mary had a Mickey Mouse watch. Okay, you know what? It was a more common thing. But this man had a figurine on his desk at the FBI. Okay? And in one shot, he had all of the seven dwarves on his tie. Now, he was also interviewed in the Super Heist episode, and he wore no tie.

And you best believe I was looking in the background for, like, a Mickey. Any sign of Disney paraphernalia. Evidently, he grew out of it. He realized he was an adult. Oh, no. Oh, no. Oh, no. Okay. So the FBI was like, wow, this employee stole all the money.

Yeah. Oddly enough, he has none of it. It was pretty clear that David had accomplices. The footage showed David answering the phone a bunch and getting pages. Investigators went outside to David's truck, searched it, and found something in the ashtray. It was his wedding ring. Poor Jandice or Tammy, whatever her real name is. Her real name is Tammy.

So, okay, this is terrible. As the investigators, they were like, well, you know, this is probably a sign that he's done with this life. Yes. But Tammy and poor David's family were like, no, no, he would never do this. This isn't in his character. They knew that someone had put him up to this. David was clearly in grave danger. He had been kidnapped, maybe worse.

But while Tammy and his family were worried sick, David was in the New Orleans airport chilling. And while he was there, some woman came up to him and was like, you look familiar. And he about crapped himself because he's like, oh, my gosh, am I on the news already? And then she was like, oh, you're that German tennis player, Boris Becker. What? Okay, so I looked this guy up. I mean, kind of. Kind of?

Did he claim to be Boris Becker? No. Was he like, yeah, that's who I am? No, he was like, no, ma'am. And then, you know, he got on a plane to Cancun and lived it up. Uh-huh. Well, not for long because he only has $25,000. No, Brandy, he has it all worked out.

They're going to get him more money whenever he needs it. And Kelly will be down there just like lickety-split really soon. I also don't think that's going to happen. There's no I in team. So obviously they're going to share this as they established. There is an I in heist. I don't really know where to go with that, but it is there. So David was just living it up.

He stayed in the best hotels. He went to all the restaurants. He went parasailing and scuba diving and power skiing and horseback riding and deep sea fishing. He parachuted. He toured Chicharitza. He bought five pairs of sunglasses. He was on top

of the world! For six days. And then he burned through his entire pantyhose. I mean, $25,000 goes real fast in a vacation spot. Back home, his wife Tammy was so worried about him. God, I just... Poor Tammy. In her interview with the FBI, Tammy said that David had been acting totally normal lately.

She said he'd even made a dental appointment. They'd had dinner together the night before he went missing. He wouldn't do this. He did it. But he did. I know. He did do it. Can you imagine, though?

You're thinking, no, my husband is like maybe dead. He's definitely in danger. Yeah. And the FBI is like, man, we got video of him just like going to town back and forth from this van, just loading up 2,800 pounds of money. And we don't know what 143 means, but we're pretty sure it's I love you. Agent John Wydra had to turn off Fantasia to interview a few of

David's friends and family. Stop it! But it was a sacrifice he was willing to make because Fantasia sucks. Fantasia is for adults. That shit's not for kids. It's willing to make because Fantasia sucks. Fantasia is for adults. That shit's not for kids. It's for no one. Fantasia sucks.

Fantasia's the worst. I know, we're going to get letters from Fantasia sympathizers. Sympathizers. John learned that David had been honorably discharged from the military. He had no criminal record. He was very hardworking. But he also learned that David had another side to him. Some people said he was a hard worker, proud of his job, and other people said he was disgruntled and thought he was too good for the

job. On one hand, he went to church and was very dedicated to his family. But on the other hand, he was very unhappy at home because Tammy had these rules like, oh, we should budget our money and, oh, you shouldn't smoke inside the house. What a fucking bitch. Yeah, right? Jeez. Who smokes inside the house? You know what's funny? That sounds like the craziest thing ever i when i was a kid my grandpa smoked inside the house like yeah i mean maybe just another time yeah i don't know so yeah in many of these interviews a name kept coming up. Kelly Campbell.

This bitch. When agents asked about David's friends, all of his co-workers mentioned Kelly. They talked a ton. They ate lunch together. They smoked together. And when Kelly quit Loomis, she stayed in touch with him. So they went anded Kelly. They talked a ton. They ate lunch together. They smoked together. And when Kelly quit Loomis, she stayed in touch with him. So they went and interviewed Kelly. And Kelly played it perfectly.

She was like, huh? Who? David Gant? Why, I hardly remember him. Twas so long ago. Okay, she was quite proud of her performance, but in the episode of Super Heist, so she's like,

oh, yeah, I thought they believed me. But then they cut to Agent John, and he goes, we knew she was full of shit. Because, I mean, obviously, everyone knows you're friends with him, and so, I mean, it would have been so easy to do. And also, there was just like a stack of 20s sticking out the top of her bra.

Yeah. She was wearing all fur pajamas. And they're like, where'd you even get those? I mean, they look expensive, but dang. So they knew something was up with Kelly. So they knew something was up with Kelly. And then, two days after the heist, a guy was cutting grass when he spotted an unmarked Loomis van abandoned in the woods. Like you do. Oh, there it is.

A creepy unmarked van. It was less than 10 miles from the warehouse. Oh, my gosh. The van was locked. Can you imagine if it wasn't? Yeah, he just goes and he finds millions of dollars left inside of there. So the man called the cops and investigators arrived to

inspect the van and they opened it up and they discovered that Manny was still sitting there. Manny was like sitting there. Manny was like, oh my god. I'm so hungry. It's fucking hot in here. They did leave me a bottle

of water, but only one Nutri-Grain bar. I thought I'd be in here an hour. I consumed all my rations that first night. They discovered $3.3 million in cash. Holy shit.

Yes. The van also contained two missing surveillance tapes. They didn't even give her the surveillance tapes. They didn't even get rid of the surveillance tapes. Okay, so this was super confusing. Why the hell had someone left behind $3.3 million? Yeah. And also, why did they leave behind the surveillance tapes? I mean, they bothered to take them.

So that was the really weird part. OK. Hang on. When they found that one tape that was still at Loomis Fargo investigators figured that David had just accidentally left it behind. Yeah. Which is true. Yeah. He just didn't know there were three tapes. So but they're looking at this and they're like, well, then why would he leave these other two tapes behind? Is this some kind of message to us? If so, we don't get it. You're going to need a decoder ring on this one. So investigators kept looking into this and they looked at David's phone records and they saw a bunch of phone calls had been made from inside Loomis to David Gant's cell phone on the night of the heist.

Plus he'd gotten all those pages that night. It seemed to be a code. 143, 143. What did it mean? It was probably super sophisticated. They might never crack the code. I put those Zodiac people on it. Okay, you know how they actually cracked it? Like a little kid looked at it? I don't know.

So they were like, wow, we don't know what that means. But then they were reading the newspaper one day, and I guess an article was like, oh, yeah, different pages. Here's what it means. It means I love you. And they're like oh investigators were nervous because they didn't have a lot to go on so they did the best thing they could think to do they reached out to a very sophisticated tv program called america's most wanted oh john Walsh strapped on his trench coat, walked slowly down a dark alley,

and said, yes, I'll do it. And so, one week after the robbery, the story of the heist aired on America's Most Wanted. FBI agents were all huddled together to collect all the hot tips that were going to roll in. But then tragedy struck. The show got preempted by a baseball playoff game.

As if anyone gave a shit about that. So the show didn't play on the East Coast. Oh, no. They were screwed. They had nothing. I haven't mentioned this yet, but none of these bills were marked in any way. Yeah. So there was no way to know.

Yeah. Where they were getting spent. It was just gone. Yeah. But then Loomis Fargo posted a $500,000 reward for information on the heist. Okay. So one of Steve's dumbass friends is going to turn him in, right? Because he only got $100,000 plus $37.

And now he could get $500,000. Here's what happened. Okay. So they wanted info on anyone who suddenly seemed to have a ton of money. So they wanted info on anyone who suddenly seemed to have a ton of money. But if you'll recall, all that Steve and Kelly and Scott and Eric had to do was play it cool. They talked about this. They didn't do it. They wouldn't draw attention to themselves, Brandy.

We already know Kelly was wearing fur pajamas. No, they would not go spending money on willy-nilly raising eyebrows. What the fuck did Steve do? Is it Steve? Is Steve the one who fucked this up? Well, I think there

can be blame spread around. Spread it about the cabin, if you will. Eric, in particular, couldn't help himself. He got himself a Chevy Tahoe. He got a Harley. He paid off his credit card. He went on vacation.

Didn't this dude only get $100,000? I think he pocketed more. Clearly. Or like maybe. He was just accessing the barrels whenever yeah i think it was probably one of those deals like hey take what you want yeah what are you gonna do call the police i mean they left 3.3 million behind i don't think it was like you had a ledger. And here's your paycheck for the heist. Also, okay, family is very important to Eric. So you come into a lot of money.

What do you do for your sisters if you're a good brother? I don't know. What do you do? Give them some money? Yeah. But, you know, you want to buy them something.'s what's a nice gift to give to a lady i don't know i think and eric agrees that the nicest thing to get for your sisters is a new set of tits he bought his sister's titties he He bought them boob jobs. Man. What are you?

No one has ever offered to buy me a set of titties. Well, just wait for the right heist to come. Then he got his wife a new set of knockers as well, plus a new nose. Oh. What goes wrong with your old nose? Probably nothing. But, you know, it's like, hey, if we've got a barrel of money, you know, I'll make an upgrade. What else can we toss on there?

You think they give like a two-for-one deal? Or a three-for-one in this case? Two titties and one nose. No, but I bet you you save the anesthesia fee and all yeah i mean yeah while i'm under upgrade the whole system right then flip me over to the other side downsize those ears while you're at it how dare you do you think they have a surgery to make my butt not look like the surface of the moon? I mean, I don't know what that would be.

What would that be? They'd probably put fillers in there, yeah. Yeah, just plump that thing up. Okay, well, like I said, Brandi, I need you to go rob Luma's for not doing it. I'm not falling for it. You meet up with me a couple years later. I'm like, I don't know what happened to the money. I'm just like totally plastic. I can barely move.

You look like a living Barbie doll. I'm smooth like a seal. So, you know, Eric just, you know, he got everything. Eric told his coworkers that he'd inherited the money. But everyone knew about the abandoned Loomis Fargo van that had been found in the woods right across from their work. OK, you idiot. Yes. So when this reward was announced, one of Eric's coworkers called the FBI directly.

Brandi, I hate to tell you, Mayer was not involved. Fuck. I don't like when people don't follow the proper chain of command. Okay, but here's the thing. He didn't call the mayor, but he did call John Mayer. I'm sorry. That was so stupid. And John Mayer relayed the message that Eric Payne might be involved in this heist.

Mm-hmm. I don't think he did. You're right. He was busy doing that terrible Rolling Stone interview at the time. Anyway, so the FBI looked into some of these purchases and found that he'd made the down payment on the Chevy Tahoe in $20 bills. Well, that's... Which, how did that not set off alarm bells? You know what?

When someone comes in and buys something from me, I don't ask them where the money came from. Okay, but you're selling haircuts. Yeah. You're not selling Chevy Tahoes. I think it would depend on the condition of the money. Yeah, if it was like a stack of what appeared to be like uncirculated

bills, that would probably raise some alarm bells. But if this was money that had been taken in from other businesses and it looked like used money, I don't know that that would raise any questions. Okay, I guess I don't know that that would raise any questions. Okay. I guess I don't know.

Because I think people save up for purchases. They don't keep the money in the bank. Kristen, I believe you told a story on this very podcast where you took $11,000 out of your bank account to pay for something. Okay. You're right. you're right. You're right. That was a scary day. Yes!

That was a very scary day. And I bet they didn't ask you if you had... I just did an armored car. I couldn't think of a word I wanted to say there. The bank asked me a ton of questions. The roofing company did not. The roofing company was like, do you have money? Thank you for the money. Yes, we will take it. We will give you your new roof. Yes. So Eric wasn't the only one spending his newfound money. Before the heist, Steve Chambers and his

wife, Michelle, were living in a double-wide trailer. But not long after the heist, they bought a $635,000 mansion in a gated community called Kramer Mountain. So they just, like, threw the fucking rules out the window? And they moved to Kramer's house? It appears so. They paid for the house in cash. Well, okay, that is alarming. This new house was right outside of Charlotte in Kramerton. Kramerton is three square miles, and it's in the Guinness Book of World Records for the world's smallest main street.

It's only 75 feet long, Brandy. Is this a thing I can look up? I mean, I guess. How do you spell Cramerton? How do you think you spell Cramerton? Well, not Cramerton. Cramerton, North Carolina. Show me the pictures. Show me the pictures. So blessed.

That's on their homepage. Okay, I just googled Cramerton Main Street. It's on their homepage. Okay, I just googled Cramerton Main Street. It's currently 58 degrees in Cramerton with clouds. Alright. Oh, fuck. This place looks nice. Shit. Yeah, it's a nice little town.

This looks like Stepford shit. Yeah. Do they turn into robots, too? Do they spend the rest of their money turning themselves into robots? Okay, so what do you think is the problem with Steve and Michelle moving to a place like this? Well, they don't blend in. They stick way the fuck out. So this was like, this is a super small town.

It's a very nice town. And the people in this small town were very intrigued by their new neighbors. This gated community was filled with doctors and lawyers and the mayor lived just a few doors down from the chambers. That's good in case you need to get in contact with the FBI. It's true. And people went over to meet them and they were like, oh, what do you do for a living? And Michelle told them that her husband, Steve, was a former professional football player for the Dallas Cowboys.

Well, that's way too easy to verify or debunk, ma'am. Right? debunk, ma'am. Right? She added that he'd been gambling in Atlantic City and had done very well for himself. Also, he owned laundromats in Texas.

Then Michelle and Steve just went all around the place, you know, buying everything they saw. They bought a boat. Just balls out. They everything they saw. They bought a boat. Just balls out. They bought a BMW. They bought a painting of Elvis on velvet. No, they did not. They did.

They bought a velvet Elvis? They absolutely did. And it was not well done. Let me tell you. Elvis's face was really wonky. Although, I imagine velvet is a tough medium to work with. I imagine so. They stocked their new wine cellar with boxed wine. They bought fancy cigars and a humidor for the fancy cigars, but Steve didn't realize you had to put water in it, so all the cigars were ruined.

Oh, well. They bought Rolexes and a bust of Caesar and a tanning bed and a six-foot-tall wooden statue of a Native American. They paid for everything in cash. Mostly 20s. The Cramerton police force only employs nine people but they were on this everyone in town was like okay what's with the new weirdos they're obviously criminals right yeah and so police chief david young called the fbi and was like hey we've got new people here and i think you want to look at them for the loomis heist around what's wrong? Cramerton, North Carolina has an opening for the town's finance director. Should we apply?

No. I think if I show up with my boxed wine, they're going to assume that we're involved in some kind of heist. And we are involved in the heist. I mean, you obviously have to go to Mexico. You can take 20 grand, Brandy. That's not going to last me very long. Not with all the parasailing you want to do.

Around that same time, the FBI got a report that was a few weeks old. It was a suspicious activities report that had been filed by a local bank teller. Apparently, on the Monday after the heist, Michelle Chambers went into a nation's bank with a briefcase full of cash, and she flashed it open at the teller and asked how much of it she could deposit before she had to sign any paperwork. Well, Jesus. Oh, but wait. Then Michelle reassured her, saying, don't worry, it's not drug money. Okay. It was just taken in that armored car heist everybody's been talking about.

And, of course, the teller was like, uh-huh, okay, hold on one second, and then filled out the suspicious activity report. Duh. Yeah. You could not have done that more suspiciously. Who goes in with a briefcase of cash

and flashes it? I mean, come on. Bad criminals. So the FBI was like, wow, and flashes it. I mean, come on. Bad criminals. That's who does it. So the FBI was like, wow, okay, these two are definitely involved in the Loomis Fargo heist. Obviously, Eric Payne was involved.

But they still couldn't figure out how any of these people were linked to David Gant. And again, the money was untraceable. So even though these people were buying everything in sight using $20 bills, investigators couldn't prove that the money was stolen. So the FBI went balls out surveilling the chambers. They saw them go to banks all over town depositing cash and opening up safety deposit boxes. They saw friends and relatives of the Chambers going to open up the safety deposit boxes in their names. One night, Steve and Michelle went out to a bar, and Steve got so drunk that he got

thrown out. And as they were throwing him out, he yelled that he would buy the bar for 400 grand cash. Did they accept his offer? I don't believe they did. The funny thing is, it was really hard to surveil Steve and Michelle in such a small town. Because everyone knew everyone in this town. And everyone knew what cars their neighbors drove. And as soon as they saw a new car in the neighborhood, they were like, well, what's that?

What's this weird new person doing hanging out in the neighborhood? Why are those two dudes hanging out alone in a car together? Why does one of them have a tie with the seven dwarves on it? He's a grown man. That's what they said. That is it. on it. He's a grown man. That's what they said. That is it.

The people of Cramerton called the local police non-stop on the FBI surveillance team. Sometimes when Steve or Michelle were out driving somewhere, the FBI would track them by following them in a small airplane. Oh my gosh! And of course,

the people in town called the police again, and they were like, what the hell is that plane doing flying so low to the ground? Michelle and Steve, ironically, seemed to be the only people who didn't know that they were under surveillance. So they kept spending. They bought a brand new truck for Michelle's stepfather. Steve got Michelle a teddy bear and inside it was a three and a half carat diamond ring for which he had paid 43 grand cash. Wow. Side note, there is something similar to that that has been going on in Johnson County. What are you talking about? A Kansas City police helicopter has been circling

two specific areas in Johnson County. People have been calling the police and the police are like, it's part of an investigation. We can't tell you anything. Oh, my God. Yes. Oh, shit. What's happening? I don't know.

So like the local newspaper in Shawnee just posted like a whole thing about the flight pattern that this helicopter, there's two helicopters that are trading off, circling two very specific routes. Oh my God. What is happening? I don't know. They won't tell the public anything. I'm fascinated. Yes.

Okay. Anyway, sorry. That just like sparked my. Do you think that the people are as dumb as Steve and Michelle? No. Do you think they know they're being surveilled? No. Well, wait. Those are two different questions.

So – no, I don't think they're as dumb as Steve and Michelle. Maybe they're not surveilling anyone. Maybe they're like – I don't know what they're doing. What do you think they're doing? Searching for something. But I don't know what. How do we get up there in that helicopter? I don't know. Michelle and Steve bought the Furniture Discount Center and renamed it M&S Furniture Gallery. M&S for Michelle and Steve. Yeah, good thing they didn't call it S&M Furniture Gallery.

People show up in just leather pants. They're latex suits. Like, what the hell is this? I mean, I do need a new coffee table but i am disappointed not enough ball gags in here i'll tell you that byo ball gag am i right Am I right? So, you know, the FBI is still watching them. They still didn't know where David Gant was and they still couldn't conclusively tie these people to the house. Or conclusively.

That's where you try to glue people together. So rude of you. God, it's so hot in here. It is so hot. I'm conclusively glued to my jacket right now. It's so stupid. Take it off. I don't care.

Take it off. Take it off. It's too hot for podcasting. Oh, man. Do you see this bra that I'm wearing with this? It's one of these numbers with a zipper in the front. And you can kind of see it through the shirt. I didn't know what that was.

I know. It's a weird looking thing. It had like a harness on it or something. I had been shopping at S&M Furniture Warehouse or whatever the fuck it was called. You think they sell bras at the furniture warehouse? Boy, they've got everything. It's your one-stop shop.

No, all my bras were dirty. So I'm wearing a sports bra. That's a sports bra? Yeah. Your titties aren't nearly mashed down enough. No, they're not. A typical sports bra, they really mash that shit down. I know,

but there's a zipper that you can make a weird pokey outie in betwixt my titties. Betwixt your titties. Yeah. You see my problems. I do. I do. I do. Anyway, one thing that they noticed in their surveillance was that Steve didn't make new friends. He only hung out with

two types of people, friends he'd had for years and family. So they were like, okay, maybe we'll find the connection if we look at Steve's old yearbooks. So the investigators looked at the yearbooks and they were like, wow, I wonder who did all the writing and editing and design work on this thing. Probably the coolest kids in school. And once they were done talking about all the work and dedication that goes into a high quality yearbook, they looked at the pictures. How many awards did the yearbook win when you were on it? Plenty. Obviously.

You add me to something and it's going to become award winning in no time. They looked through that yearbook, Brandi, and they saw a familiar face. It was Kelly Campbell. Kelly and Steve had gone to school with each other, and that was the connection to David Gant. So they went and talked to her again, and she was like, nope, I still don't know anything.

But she did know things. Because the truth was that David had been calling her like once a week ever since he'd been in Mexico. And those calls had started off super lovey-dovey, but that $25,000 hadn't lasted him as long as he thought it would. Yeah. And now he needed more. And also, when the hell were she and the kids coming down to Mexico to live with him? The answer is never David.

Things had taken a real turn for David. He'd started off life on the run eating lobster, dreaming of banging Kelly on the beach. But now he was low on money and not banging anyone and just eating a ton of grilled cheese, like so much grilled cheese alone in his hotel room. Oh, no. He told Kelly that she needed to send him more cash. So that November, Steve hired a guy

named Mike McKinney to go down to Cancun to give David $10,000 in cash. That's it? What? Only $10,000? Yeah. What? It's not like they had 55-gallon barrels filled with millions of dollars.

Well, I mean, they've been spending a lot of money, but I'm sure there's plenty of money still for them to take down to David. And, oh, might I remind you, David is the one who did all the fucking work! Brandy, you know how you stay rich? You don't give your money away? You don't give your money away? You don't give your money to David Gant. I'll tell you that. You tell that guy to get the fuck out of the country, and then you keep the money. Keep the money.

So, yeah, he hired Mike McKinney to go down with the $10,000, and it was going to be kind of cute because Mike McKinney was also David's alias. So maybe they'd have a moment on the beach where they'd be like, Hey, I mike mckinney was also david's alias so maybe they'd have a moment on the beach where they'd be like hey i'm mike mckinney and the other guy would be like oh no way me too okay you don't think that's funny okay mike mckinney when he went down there he went by the alias bruno we don't talk about bruno what k Kristen, you're the only person in the world that's not seen in Kanto. Oh. We don't talk about Bruno.

I'm an adult. You have children. Yeah, now you do. But before you had children. You're right. I always loved Disney. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

You'd go home alone. Went and saw Beauty and the Beast as a childless adult in the theater and they were like ma'am we're gonna have to ask you to leave so you and Jared Fogle

got up no how dare you this is how it started last time. I know. I've got to stop. I've got to stop. I start making fun of you. It's gross.

It blossoms into something beautiful. So Mike got down to Mexico with the 10 grand. And Brandy, the $10,000. And Brandy, the thing is, Cancun is really fun. Okay, it's like really fun. Mike McKinney just spent the money and didn't give it to David? Yeah. Fuck!

So he went back to North Carolina. And he was like, oh, Steve, I'm so sorry. I looked everywhere for David. Couldn't find him. Couldn't find him. So Steve sent Mike back to Mexico with more money. And this time he gave him David's address. So Mike went to David's hotel and handed him an envelope containing eight thousand five hundred dollars. And David was like, what? This is fucking it. and David was like what this is fucking it he's like that's not enough it was at this moment Brandy for the very first time that David realized he'd been got not even quite I mean he's oh my he didn't completely put it together. This was the first moment, though, that he was like, I might not be getting my fair share of the money.

Bless his heart. But when Kelly gets here, everything is going to be fine. Oh, wait for it. Yeah. Yeah. We're not done. wait for it. Yeah, we're not done. So meanwhile, the FBI was really having to roll up their sleeve and loosen their Mickey Mouse ties because they knew deep down in their souls that Kelly and Steve and Michelle and Eric were somehow

linked to this heist. But they still didn't have solid evidence. And then Michelle fucked up. It was January of 1998. She made an $8,000 cash deposit at a local bank, and the cash that she handed the bank teller was wrapped in money bands. One of them was wrapped in a Loomis band.

Why would she do that? Because she's dumb as shit. It had the handwritten initials of a Loomis employee on it. That employee hadn't worked the vault since the heist. Finally, they had something. So they could have arrested them for a couple things there, but they decided to sit tight because they were hoping to discover where David was and where the rest of the money was. And so on February 10th, a judge authorized a wiretap on the chamber's phone. They also got permission to place taps on the S&M furniture store and anywhere the chambers might be talking.

You know what I realized we missed with the S&M furniture store? They would totally have that thing from the movie Burn After Reading that George Clooney... That dildo chair! Yes! I mean, if I'm going into the S&M furniture store, I expect a couple of those. I'm expecting a dildo chair. Yes. I want some options.

Well, sure. You don't want just one. No, and I'm going to sit in each of them. Ma'am, due to COVID, we are no longer letting everyone try out the dildo chairs. Dildo chairs? I thought this was a miracle. They're trying to take my rights away in here. Why don't they compromise? You can do the dildo chair, but you have to keep a mask on.

Do I have to keep my pants on? No, obviously not. That's the compromise. All right, I'll do it. So they started listening to the calls. And wow, none of it was helpful. Because the chambers talked about what they wanted to do with the money. But they never talked about how they'd gotten it.

Or where the hell David was. Because they didn't give a fuck about David. No, nobody's talking about David at all. David's just eating grilled cheese. Riveling up in Mexico waiting for Kelly to come. And nobody has given him a second fucking thought. He's probably got a job by now in Mexico. He's like, it's just temporary.

Any day now, really going to be coming into some money. And I'm going to be banging Kelly. For sure. We had one kiss. Yeah. And then she took me to a bus stop. It's the real deal. They talked about setting up a bank account in the Cayman Islands.

They talked about hiring a bodyguard. Kelly was like, oh, I'm self-conscious because I've gained some weight. Maybe I'll get liposuction. And the FBI was just like sweating their balls off because you can only wiretap someone for so long. And that period was coming to an end. And none of this talk had been useful. Great. And then one day on the phone, Kelly told Steve, guess who I just heard from? David. Mm-hmm. She'd gotten a page from David.

143. Opposite of 143. Yeah. Oh, but I hate you is the same number of letters. So it would be kind of. Yeah. Yeah. Yep. No, apparently they had some system worked out.

I can't imagine that it was sophisticated at all. But like he would page her with like his location and when to call and, you know, blah, blah, blah. Anyway. So investigators were like, OK, David is alive. This is huge. But in a later call, Kelly was like, oh, David just paged me again. I'm afraid he's going to ask for more money. So at this point, the FBI was like, what the fuck?

How is it possible that David needs money? Right. He's the one who stole it all. Is this guy really this bad at stealing money? Yes. Yes, he is. Yes, he is. So Steve asked Kelly to stop by the furniture store because they needed to discuss something

that they'd been talking about for a while. By the way, by this point Kelly had spent a bit of money herself. She bought a brand new minivan, some jewelry, and she'd taken her kids and her mom on a vacation to Florida. Did they go to Disney World? Probably because they had children with them.

Anyway. Oh, my gosh, my earring. You just talked your hoop right out. That was so loud. And I was going to ask a question and now I can't remember it. Oh, she has all the fucking money in the world. She buys a fucking minivan? I know.

Okay, here's what I'll say in her defense. I think she was kind of trying to lay low. Trying to keep it on the, yeah. Yeah, so, I mean, a trip to Florida with your mom and the kids, a minivan. But she bought it using one of Steve's aliases. And, of course, the FBI was already on to Steve and his many aliases. Yeah. Anyway, she really regrets that because, you know, Michelle and Steve just had themselves

a wild time buying all the velvet Elvises. So an FBI agent went into the furniture store during their meeting, and apparently the agent overheard Steve tell tell kelly that they couldn't give david any more money it was time to kill him okay which i'm like really they over i mean were they that stupid that they would have that conversation in earshot of someone else yeah they should have gone to the woods i agree thank you brandy should have gone to the woods. I agree! Thank you, Brandy! Should have gone to the woods. Indeed.

He was like, Mike McKinney has been ready to kill David for months. Next time you talk to David, you need to figure out where he is. So, the next time David and Kelly talked, he told her he loved her and that he couldn't wait for her to join him in Cozumel, Mexico.

No. She said, OK, stay where you are. I'll have someone bring you money. The FBI obviously arrested Mike before he could go kill David. Yeah. But are you ready for this story to get even weirder? Yeah. OK, couple things.

First off, David was still in Mexico, miserable as ever. And now he was scared. Because one night at a restaurant, a stranger came up to him and he was like, hey, you know who you look like? And David was like, Boris Becker? And the guy goes, no, you look like that guy who stole like $20 million from North Carolina. Oh, shit! And David has like the thickest southern accent you've ever heard in your life.

And this motherfucker, he hadn't even shaved. He had done nothing to disguise his appearance. Oh my god. But he was like, no, it couldn't be me! I've lived in Mexico for years. Yeah, so it couldn't be me. I've lived in Mexico for years. Yeah, so it couldn't be me.

So after that, he shaved his facial hair. Wow. Master of disguise. No kidding. And he basically stayed inside all the time, reading comics and listening to Eagles CDs. Poor Dave. And then one day, a stranger knocked on the door. The guy said his name was Robert.

Turns out the last time that Mike had been in Mexico, he'd made friends with Robert. And for some reason, Mike told Robert that he and some friends were planning to kill David. They were just waiting for the right time to do it. And I guess Robert had a conscience. So he told David, hey, your friends are trying to kill you. So David gave Robert two grand as a thank you and to keep quiet. And he switched hotels and he began using a new fake name and he started being really careful. But even though David knew that his accomplices were trying to kill him, he didn't believe that Kelly was part of that plan. So he stayed in contact with her this entire time and always told her exactly where he

was staying. Well, yeah. David. He needed to come there. David, you. Poor David. I poor David I mean no at some point you lose me luckily for that dumbass the FBI had been listening in on that phone call where he was like, I love you. Come see me. And so on Sunday, March 1st, 1998, five months after the heist, three agents flew out to see David. They approached him in the street and asked for his ID.

And David said to agent Mark Rozzi, please tell me you're an FBI agent. And he said, I am. And David said, we really need to talk. And Mark said, yes, we do. And David said, I'm really glad to see you. Oh, my gosh. And Mark said, I'm really glad to see you. And then they kissed.

Stop it! Glad to see you. And then they kissed. Stop! And then they arrested him, which is a mixed situation. Yeah, it is. So on the day he was supposed to have been murdered, he was in FBI custody on a flight back to North Carolina. And now he and Mark were in love.

I don't think, I think you may have embellished that part of the story. It was going to be devastating for Kelly, who was definitely still in love. He didn't know how he was going to tell Kelly. He's like, oh, you guys, I can't leave Mexico. Kelly's probably on her way here right now. leave Mexico. Kelly's probably on her way here right now.

And on Monday, March 2nd, 1998, they went to the Chambers home and Steve went to the door and they were like, oh, open the door.

Someone broke into your furniture store. And so Steve opened the door like, oh no, did they take my canopy beds? And they were like,

freeze! Freeze! They arrested him and arrested Michelle. And that day, Steve squealed like a piggy. He told them everyone else who had been involved in the heist. And so they arrested Kelly and Mike

McKinney and Eric Payne and Scott and there ended up being like 21 defendants in this case. When you add in all the people who opened safe deposit boxes and put a bunch of sketchy money in there, 20 of them pled guilty. The prosecution basically said that the people who opened those safe deposit boxes should have known that the money was illegally obtained. I mean, duh.

And they did. Come on. Interestingly, the only person who pled not guilty was the chamber's attorney, Jeffrey Guller. Interestingly, the only person who pled not guilty was the chamber's attorney, Jeffrey Guller. But that didn't work out very well for him because he got found guilty by a jury for money laundering. Yeah. And honestly, I probably should have covered that in more depth than just a couple sentences. But I think this is the more interesting story.

So most of the relatives who co-signed for those deposit boxes just got probation. Yeah. And the rest of them headed off to prison. Eric Payne, what? I'm dying to know what they got. Eric Payne got six and a half years. Scott got four years and seven months. Michelle Chambers got seven years and seven months. Michelle Chambers got seven years

and eight months. Steve got, what do you think Steve got? Ten years. Eleven years and three months. Mike McKinney got eleven years and six months. Kelly got five years and ten months. She's the fucking mastermind. I don't think we can call any of these people masterminds. So they just said.

Which is how the title of the movie came about. Yes. They said she cooperated. And I thought that was interesting because it seemed like a lot of these people were cooperating. Yeah. She must have said more. Yeah. Right from the get go.

And David got seven years and six months. Wow. A few of them were ordered to pay restitution. David only had to pay like 23 grand. I'm sorry. The FBI seized everything they'd purchased with the stolen money and auctioned it off in February of 1999. Can you imagine? No. Okay, imagine? No.

Okay, so picture it. 5,000 people showed up to this auction. Oh, my gosh. More than 1,000 items. And it was all there. The BMW, the Velvet Elvis, the Harley Davidson, the bust of Caesar, a statue of a waiter holding a tray. I hate those. Yeah, I don't like those either.

To this day, $2 million from the heist has not been recovered. Yeah. Who do you think has it? I think they didn't catch everyone who Steve handed money off to. I bet that's exactly right. Steve owns a gym now. What? Well, all these people are out.

Well, yeah. David works construction in Florida. How's Tammy? I don't know. But, okay, here's – oh, God, this is heartbreaking. Tammy, like, stayed by him through a lot of this. And, I mean, there's, like, interviews with him where he's like, yeah, I've got a good woman. A lot of them wouldn't stay by you.

It's like, yeah, no, she's – this is horribly traumatic to go from I think you're dead to all of a sudden, oh, no, you've betrayed me horribly. She obviously divorced him eventually. Thank goodness. Yeah. Yeah. The interviews with these folks, I mean, they're pretty funny. And shortly after he was sentenced, David was interviewed about his experience. And they asked him if he would do it all again.

He said yes. Here's what he said. He goes, now that I've been sentenced, would I do it again? Yeah. An opportunity like that comes around once in a lifetime and now that i'm already in prison and been judged and everything i can be more honest and say sure david my man you gotta at least pretend the answer is no i know right? In another interview I saw with him, he said that if he could do it again, he would just do it alone.

Which, like, yeah, you really, I mean, having more people helps in a way, but, I mean. Did he and Kelly ever bang? No, all they did was kiss. And he talked to the FBI about it. You know, Mark, who he definitely kissed. And he said, if you can believe it, we only ever kissed. And then he said, that was one expensive kiss. Oh, my gosh.

Yeah, and that's the story of the hillbilly heist. Oh, my gosh. Okay, well, your homework for this week is to watch the hit film Masterminds. Okay, I will watch it. I really want to watch it now. It's funny. Okay, how did my telling differ from? It's pretty similar.

Really? Yeah. Okay. Yeah. The main parts all stick to that. Okay, Brandi. Should we take some questions from our Discord? Of course we should.

To get in the Discord, all you have to do is join our Patreon at, you know, the $5 level or higher. And then you can get on in here and chitty chat the day away. Oh, NotAFugInTheBunch wants to know, Brandi, are you mad about the Super Bowl? Couldn't care less about the Super Bowl this year. What a boring game. I loved the halftime show, though. And the Chiefs 100% should have been in the Super Bowl, but we did not show up to play the second half of the AFC championship game. So we sat on our couches like we deserve to be there.

That's exactly how I feel. And I am also upset. Hanster wants to know, any weird phobias? I can't be in the room when a bottle of champagne is uncorked. I'm very dramatic about it. I don't like a champagne bottle being uncorked either. I'm very dramatic about it. I don't like a champagne bottle being uncorked either. I get very nervous, but I wouldn't call it a phobia. My weird phobia? Escalators. Yeah. Yeah. You are really weird about it. I am. I am extremely phobic of escalators.

extremely phobic of escalators. Yeah, I have this fear that I'm going to get sucked inside the mechanism. I know it's not rational, but it has happened to people. Yeah, I mean, these things are rarely rational. Yes. I'm also super afraid. Anytime there's a champagne thing, I always just like hand it to someone. It's like, can someone open this?

And then I like stand very far away. Yeah. But not so far that I miss getting a glass of champagne. Right. Yeah. Oh, Awkward asks, I've noticed Brandy always says, oh, my gosh, instead of, oh, my God. Brandy, are you a religious person or is it for another another reason it's kind of two things i am i consider myself more a spiritual person than a super religious person i um have very strong faith i actually pray constantly like that's a very big part of my life

um which feels kind of vulnerable to admit that i don't know but um yeah that's a very big part of my life but But I specifically say, gosh, instead of God, because it bothers my mom when I say, oh, my God. I remember early on in the podcast, she was bothered because we said Jesus Christ. Yeah. And not in like, so specifically, I am mindful of it because it does really bother my mom. So when you talk on this podcast about buttholes, no, it doesn't bother her. my mom so when you talk on this podcast about buttholes no it doesn't bother her and sitting on a dildo chair you're like i'll say all that but not oh my god oh my gosh let's go to costco says brandy our house caught on fire and my entire family got COVID. It's been a rough few weeks.

Can you pet my hair and sing Christmas Shoes to ease my anxiety? No, I'm sorry. Not even for you. No, that's terrible. I'm so sorry you're going through that. Sarah, get your body shoes for my mama, please. It's Christmas Eve and these shoes are just her size. Is that enough? That's more than enough.

Could you hurry, sir? Daddy says there's not much time. Oh, my God. She's been sick for quite a while. Daddy just murdered her, so it's done. They don't need the shoes anymore. To be beautiful if mama meets Jesus. Crispy Unicorn Forever says DNA tests for dogs.

Why is that a thing? If I didn't have, like, what I know is 100 100 a bulldog at home i would absolutely do a dna test for my dog i always wanted to do one for peanut but i didn't know i kind of wanted to do one for the girls i know i'm so curious i would love to know what those beautiful girls are everything they are everything. Bella Gritty goes, I just shopped in Costco while listening to your latest episode on headphones. Do I get a special Discord badge or something? You should.

Absolutely. You absolutely should. Three gold stars for you. Chili is Mom Goals wants to know, is there a song that immediately makes you think of one another? For instance, my childhood long-term friend and I have Bohemian Rhapsody. Any Spice Girls song. Any Spice Girls song. A lot of NSYNC songs make me think of you.

Mbop. Yeah. We were very into Mbop for several minutes. Mbop bop doo-wop. I mean, yeah, all those. Yeah, those would all do it. Yep. Yeah.

We were full-on Spice Girl reenactors when we were but children. No one asked for these reenactments. No, they sure didn't. But we did them with passion. Fart Sponge asked, do you butter your Pop-Tarts? Okay. I feel like this is the rice thing, because when I

first read it, I was like, no, who the fuck does it? I totally did that when I was a kid! Buttered your Pop-Tarts? Buttered a Pop-Tart, yeah. So you'd put it in the toaster, get it all warm. I understand how butter works. And then you butter it and it gets all melty. Yeah, totally did that when I was a kid. I mean, that does sound good, but it feels like gilding the lily, right?

Yeah, I mean, Pop-Tarts are already good. Yeah. What more do you want? Butter on it. Seems like you're ungrateful buttery crispy it's flaky dan you didn't expect my impression to be so good. That's wonderful. Secret lesbian Lizzie Borden wants to know, Brandy, if you were a Yellow Jackets character, who would you be? 90s and now.

I'm a hard Natalie then and now minus the drugs and men because I'm super gay. LOL. Okay. So 90s Yellow Jacket. super gay lol okay so 90s yellow jacket gosh okay now now i would be shauna for sure she's my i'm very much her i think i would be what was the yeah misty she's the okay so when i'll be honest i was spacing out during the question portion yeah it's fine you haven't seen the show anyway. I'm reluctant to admit that in the plane crash situation, I would be the Misty who is gathering all the supplies and trying to make sure everybody's taken care of.

I wouldn't take it as far as she does. And that's where I'm going to leave that in case nobody's seen the show. I wouldn't take it as far as she does, and that's where I'm going to leave that in case nobody's seen the show. Okay. So I'm not proud of that, but those are the facts. Okay, Plasticat wants to know, short version, how do you feel about trashing things that you associate with negative feeling? Long context. I knitted a pair of fancy gloves for my partner as a representation of my commitment to our relationship, and then he told me he didn't want to commit to me indefinitely, but he would still love the gloves. We've been together for more than two years.

I currently want to cut up and or burn the gloves. I don't want to reuse the yarn. They are currently living in a drawer, so I don't have to look at them. I'm fine with that. Me too. currently living in a drawer so I don't have to look at them yeah I'm fine with that me too I when I got divorced I got rid of so much you did you did yeah um I got rid of like everything in our house that like had our last name on it which was a lot of stuff. And I did that like the next day. We can cut this, but like when I went over. Yeah.

No, we can talk about this. Yeah. I took down all your wedding photos. Yeah. I mean, obviously with your permission. Yes. Yeah. I wasn't like.

Yeah. Took the wedding pictures off the walls. Took the. Yeah. Took all that shit down made a nice pile in the garage that pile moved to the dumpster yeah i think yeah if you've got a negative feeling with something yeah let it go let absolutely um if you can donate it, even better. But honestly, if you don't want to, it's OK. And sometimes it's just cathartic to physically throw something away. Yeah. Yeah.

Also, I'm sorry. That sounds rough. Yeah, it sounds terrible. But hey, at least you didn't pull off a heist for him and then go to another country and wait for him, you know? Ooh, Cinnamon Toast Bitch wants to know, Kristen, have you been continuing your journey with yoga? The endorphin rush I get every time I nail a new pose is insane and I hope you're experiencing that also. I'm not nailing a lot of new poses, but I am continuing with my yoga journey. Have you done that thing?

Can you do the thing now where you grab your opposite foot when you're laying down? No, I cannot. But OK. Sorry. The other day I went, OK, so Norman and I, oh, we had Chipotleotle okay so I don't think you're supposed to go to yoga after you have Chipotle especially not hot yoga I'm an animal and like but I was kind of like okay I've been to hot yoga enough I kind of know the deal and you know I digested a bit I thought I was fine so I get in there and like things are going fine.

You know, I'm balancing, doing whatever. Well, then we started getting into the poses where like you get down on the floor and you kind of turn yourself around. And I was like, oh, biscuits. And I was like, I can't throw up in this class. It would be like the worst. Can you imagine someone throwing up in a hot yoga class? It would be the worst. Horrible. So I did some child's pose. Well, then they had you do the one where, you know, your legs are way up in the air and then you bring them back and then you've got your knees on either side of your ears. Yeah. And I've been kind of proud of myself because I,

that's one of like the rare ones that I can do. Yeah. And I wanted to do it so bad. But then I thought, no. No. I do this. I'm blowing Chipotle right out my ass. And I can never come back here. So there you go, folks. You know, so many people say that we don't talk about poop and farts enough on this.

I know. And that's why I had to shoehorn that story. You know what? That's not even a real story. That didn't even happen to me. I didn't have to. Why not? It wasn't happening to you?

No, it didn't happen to me. So don't worry about it. Don't ask me about it. You know what? Let's move on to Supreme Court inductions. Let's. Let's. We're going to be continuing to read your names and favorite cookies for the rest of time.

You know, we haven't gotten complaints like we did with the books. Yeah, a couple people have complained. Oh, well. They'll get over it, I'm sure. I'm sure. Okay, it's the second episode. It's named 202. What?

There's a 203 in here. Yeah, I know. It's all messed up. We're skipping the 203 and going back to named 202. What? There's a 203 in here. Yeah, I know. It's all messed up. We're skipping the 203 and going back to the 202? Yes. Okay. Oh, wait. There's multiple 203s.

Yes. What have I done? You know what? The last time I put this list together, I was watching TV while I did it. I think that was the problem. So should we do this 203 and then just renumber these down here? Yes. Are we starting with Mackenzie's?

Yes. Yes. Mackenzie. Old family recipe for Pfeffernusser. Not as fancy as Mandelfloren, but it's a German spice cookie usually made during the holidays. Okay. Lauren Paz. Meringue cookies.

Leah. Chewy white chocolate chip cookies. You lent liquor. Kitchen sink cookies. Morgan G. Double chocolate chip big witch from Insomnia Cookies. Oh, I bet that's good. What?

What? I read this person's name. I was about to say Lil Yacht. But her name is in say Lil Yacht. But her name is in fact Liz Yacht. A slightly more common name. Tiff's Treats Warm Snickerdoodle.

That's like her right name. Lil Yacht. Yeah, we all get it. Allie Noctegal. Pumpkin chocolate chip snickerdoodles. That's so much stuff. Allie, I don't know. That's too many.

That's all a bunch of cookies together. Jess Higginbotham. Thin Mint. Jamie Robertson. Orange Milanos. Stephanie Golfin. Peanut Butter. Brie Tazar.

Ooh, Frozen Thin Mints. Thatie Tazar. Ooh, frozen thin mints. That's how I like them, too. Joe Florio. No-bake peanut butter oatmeal. I also enjoy those. Christy Purnell. Dark chocolate digestives. Beth Durham.

Russian nut horns. Boy, I've got a hangren for some Russian nut horns. Boy, I've got a hangren for some Russian nut horns. Andy. Moose shit cookies. Okay. Jessie G. A big ass cookie.

Hannah Oman. Sugar cookie with sprinkles. Welcome to the Supreme Court! Thank you for all of your support. If you're looking for other ways to support us, please find us on social media. We're on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, Reddit, Patreon. Please remember to subscribe to the podcast wherever you listen, and then head on over to Apple Podcasts and leave us a five-star rating and review.

And then be sure to join us next week. When we'll be experts on two whole new topics. Podcast adjourned. And now for a note about our process. I read a bunch of stuff, then regurgitate it all back up in my very limited vocabulary. And I copy and paste from the best sources on the web and sometimes Wikipedia. So we owe a huge thank you to the real experts. I got my info from an episode of the FBI Files titled The Unperfect Crime

and an episode of Super Heists titled A Van Full of Dollars and an article from the Washington Post by Jeff Diamond. I got my info from an episode of Deadline Crime with Tamron Hall, True Crime Daily, The Hartford Courant, and The Court Record. For a full list of our sources, visit lgtcpodcast.com. Any errors are, of course, ours, but please don't take our word for it.

Go read their stuff.