Let's Go To Court! - 209: A Durham Staircase & the Transy Book Heist

Episode Date: April 6, 2022

Brandi starts us off with a story about a staircase in Durhan, North Carolina. To clarify: That’s a staircase in Durham – not the staircase in Durham. Turns out, there’s more than one staircase in Durham. Hmm.  It was January of 2007, and Corey Smith was on his way to work when he spotted a woman lying at the base of a staircase near his apartment. The woman was unresponsive, so he called 911. He checked her ID and learned that her name was Denita Smith. Denita was working on her master’s degree at North Carolina Central University. She’d recently completed a prestigious fellowship with the New York Times. She had no known enemies, and yet, someone had killed her.  Then Kristin tells a story that’s so stupid it’s delightful. (Unless you ask Brandi. Brandi is very anti-heist.) During a tour of the special collections library at Transylvania University, freshman Spencer Reinhard perked up when the tour guide showed off the library’s set of John Hames Audubon’s “Birds of America.” The librarian told the group that a set had recently sold for $12 million. Spencer was intrigued. The special collections room evidently held valuable books, guarded by almost no security.   And now for a note about our process. For each episode, Kristin reads a bunch of articles, then spits them back out in her very limited vocabulary. Brandi copies and pastes from the best sources on the web. And sometimes Wikipedia. (No shade, Wikipedia. We love you.) We owe a huge debt of gratitude to the real experts who covered these cases. In this episode, Kristin pulled from: “Majoring in Crime,” by John Falk for Vanity Fair “Secrets of the Transy Book Heist,” episode of Super Heists “Four charged in Transy book heist,” by Andy Mead and Cassondra Kirby for the Lexington Herald-Leader “Librarian: Emotional scars remain,” by Beth Musgrave for the Lexington Herald-Leader “Wrong-way gang,” by Gary Thompson for the Philadelphia Inquirer “Transy thieves took names from film,” by Beth Musgrave for the Lexington Herald-Leader “College caper appeal backfires, robbers to get even more time,” by Martha Neil for the ABA Journal “Sentence stands in Transy book theft,” by Brandon Ortiz for the Lexington Herald-Leader In this episode, Brandi pulled from: “Internal Affairs” episode Dateline “Shannon Crawley” episode Snapped “Denita Smith” chillingcrimes.com “Shannon Elizabeth Crawley” murderpedia.org “State of North Carolina v. Shannon Elizabeth Crawley” findlaw.com YOU’RE STILL READING? My, my, my, you skeezy scunch! You must be hungry for more! We’d offer you some sausage brunch, but that gets messy. So how about you head over to our Patreon instead? (patreon.com/lgtcpodcast). At the $5 level, you’ll get 30+ full length bonus episodes, plus access to our 90’s style chat room!  

One semester of law school. One semester of criminal justice. Two experts! I'm Kristen Caruso. I'm Brandi Egan. Let's go to court! On this episode, I'll be talking about the Transy book heist. And I'll be talking about a staircase in Durham, North Carolina.

Brandi, don't you toy with us. Carolina. Brandy, don't you toy with us. We know but one staircase in Durham, North Carolina. It's not that staircase. Although, I am tempted to do it because the show's coming out. Yeah, you should do it. No nuts.

I would have to do a two-parter like I did on the Jodi Arias one. We'll accept a two-parter on the staircase. All right. Let me think about it. Work that owl theory in there. We want everything. We want, he's a bisexual. He's a bisexual. And you better talk about her eye shadow in that scene in the courtroom.

I know. She died. She died. We can still talk about people's eye shadow after they have died. I know. She died. She died. We can still talk about people's eye shadow after they have died. And the outfits that seem to be straight from 1993 even though the trial happened in the 2000s.

Hey, if the suit fits, you've got to keep wearing it. Beautifully said. Beautifully said. Is that what people say? That's the phrase? That's the phrase. If the suit fits, you must acquit. But.

This is a dumb bit. This is stupid. Patty, we're going to need you to cut that. Cut all that. Brandy, how you doing? Oh, I'm doing pretty good. How are you doing? Rude.

Yeah, so thank you to everyone who has reached out in the past week. Last week I didn't do a case because we put my grandma in hospice and she has since passed away. So, yeah, thank you, everybody. It seems like a process that a lot of people have been through. And it's a hoot. No. No, I'm just kidding. No, it sucks.

It sucks. It's terrible. But I was really glad that we all got to say goodbye to her. Yeah. Man, the people who work in hospice are amazing. I mean, they really made sure she was comfortable. And, God, that's like all you can hope for, I think. Yeah, absolutely. Anyway, this is a comedy podcast.

If you're not laughing already, you don't get the jokes. Oh, no. Got a lot of hospice material well you're not really doing any heavy lifting here i'm sorry what did you want me to make a joke about your grandma dying i'm fresh out well you're yeah because you just blasted me with him at lunch today boy that was rough. Call yourself a friend. How are we doing this? Me.

Okay. Wow. All right. That's how we roll. All right. I didn't know because you did the only case last week. I didn't know if you wanted to switch it up. No. All right.

I'll go first. I've got nuts. I also have to apologize for my voice. It's a little deeper than usual. Very sexy, probably turning on a lot of people. People are going to be too turned on listening to this podcast. I know. You guys have other things you're doing right now. And, you know, maybe you don't have time to masturbate, but it's too bad.

Brandy, keep it classy, all right? Okay? What were you going to say? Something much classier than that. See, listening to me right now is like listening to smooth jazz. And you don't masturbate to smooth jazz, but you might think about it. Oh, you know what we should talk about now? Speaking of masturbating to smooth jazz, check out our Patreon.

masturbating to smooth jazz, check out our Patreon. Has there ever been a smoother transition? People often say that joining our Patreon is like... Makes them feel like they're masturbating to smooth jazz. We hear it all the time. We're sick of hearing it. You know, at the $5 level, you get a monthly bonus episode. Plus, you get the back catalog of all those other bonus episodes. I know.

There's like 33 of those fuckers on there. All right. Calm down. And they're like. They're meaty boys. They are meaty. It is hours upon hours of listening material. I couldn't find.

I don't know what word I was trying to say there. You were thinking about pleasure, but you thought,'t know what word I was trying to say there. You were thinking about pleasure, but you thought, you know what, I've done too much. It's too far. You can also sign up for our Patreon at the higher levels. I'm just going to skip to the top one. If you're VIP,

then you're going to get in there, you're going to get all the bonus episodes, you're going to get a sticker, you're going to get inducted on the podcast, you're going to get our autographs. What are you going to do with that? Oh my gosh. Sell it on eBay for a million dollars probably. And also you're going to get your episodes a day early and ad free. That's right. And 10% off merch and a monthly Zoom call. Whoa. We recorded a Zoom call last week yeah norm stepped in for me yeah i'm realizing this is kind of oh boy this is dead i was i was with my grandmother yep okay well that's

a down right back down all right anyway yeah so i taught norm how to make cookies last week did you enjoy the cookies yes the public wants to know. Yes. Yeah. So did Norm. Okay. What were they called again? Cornflake cookies? Cornflake cookies. I thought they were delicious. You were a baby ass bitch about them. Yeah. I didn't like them.

You are so weird about textures. Yeah. I thought it was delicious. No. It was not for me. All right. Well, I ate them all. I left you all the dough and everything.

Did you make them? No, Brandy. Okay, here's what happened. You and Norm set a basically a tub of dough in the refrigerator. And I was go, go, go. Okay, I'm trying not to talk about hospice, but you know, like hospice.

All right. So this cookie dough had been sitting in the refrigerator for days. And I was like, I know my husband. He's not going to like all of a sudden get up and make some cookies. So. You tossed it out. You tossed.

Tossed my cookies. Cookies. Yeah. Yeah. That didn't seem like the kind of dough you would eat. I don't think so either. No. Way too much stuff going on in there.

Those were the weirdest fucking cookies I don't think so either. No, way too much stuff going on in there. Those were the weirdest fucking cookies I've ever made. No, those were good anyway. There was a cup of fucking everything in there. But it was all good stuff. Yeah. Okay. Sure. Okay, let's move on and talk about a staircase in

Durham, North Carolina. Brandi, I don't like how you've teased me for this. Okay. This case just came to me very organically. I don't even remember how I found it. But it had all the things I love. There's a staircase involved. There's a snapped episode about it, which I watched.

There's a Dateline episode about it, which I watched. It's all the things you love. There was an entry on ChillingCrimes.com. So shout out to all of those things. All your favorite things. These are a few of my favorite things. That's correct. So here we go.

It was 10 a.m. on January 4th. Did I say January really weird just then? You sure did, but I was going to roll with it because I'm a professional. So whatever, January, that's how normal people say it. January 4th, 2007, when Corey Smith walked out of his apartment in the Campus Crossing Complex in Durham, North Carolina. The complex was home to a lot of students at nearby North Carolina Central University. Familiar? Heard of it? Yeah. NCCU, as they say.

Why did you lose confidence? I was thinking I didn't do enough Cs. North Carolina Central. NCCU. Yeah. I know what I'm talking about, obviously. So lots of students from the- I got into their law school. You did? Yeah. Well, that's amazing. I mean, I'm talking about, obviously. So lots of students from the – I got into their law school. You did? Yeah. Well, that's amazing.

Is it? I mean, I didn't go there. So lots of students from NCCU lived in this apartment complex because it was like a few miles from campus. Hence the name Campus Crossings. I think this is like a corporate thing. I think they have lots of little apartment complexes near colleges all over the United States. Was this affiliated with the university?

It was not. I don't understand that. Stop it! I thought you were asking a real fucking question. I know you did. You dick! I just feel like

you're really over explaining like an apartment complex that's dead. Anyway, so a screen door. What the hell is that? Anyway, so he lives at this apartment complex that's dead. Anyway, so a screen door. What the hell is that? Anyway, so he lives at this apartment complex. And because a lot of students live there, it was actually pretty quiet. Stop it.

It was actually pretty quiet there on this particular day because it was during winter break. Anyway, Corey left his building. And as he walked out of his apartment, he noticed something unusual on the staircase in the breezeway. There were a lot of personal belongings kind of scattered all over the stairs, a wallet, some keys, some papers. Do I need to list more personal belongings? Probably not.

Oh, now you're feeling self-conscious. Now you're going to under-tell the story. That's right. Then as he descended the staircase, he saw a young black woman laying at the bottom of the stairs. He called out to her, but she was unresponsive. So he called 911. He told the dispatcher that he'd just come upon a young woman at the bottom of the stairs and that he could tell that upon a young woman at the bottom of the stairs and that he could tell that she was bleeding there was a pool of blood under her head he said that he believed based on her position that she must have fallen down the stairs he asked the dispatcher if

he should try and find her id and the dispatcher said yeah go ahead and so cory opened the wallet that he'd found near the young woman and he found out that she was Danita Monique Smith. No relation, but they do have the same last name. Not very many Smiths out there, so I knew. Yeah, you really had to clarify. And Danita was a— Imagine if they were related, but that's not how he led off. Right?

Yeah. No, no relation. So was she responsive at all or no? She was unresponsive. Oh, I'm sorry. Did you already say that? I did. Sorry. So her name was Danita Monique Smith and she was a graduate student at NCCU.

Corey called out to Danita by name now that he knew it, but she was still unresponsive. This part was actually captured on the 911 call and I heard it on the I believe it was the Dateline episode. I found it really touching because Corey was like, Danita,

baby girl, can you hear me? He was very gentle, very personable with her but he got no response. And so emergency crews were dispatched to the scene and Danita's parents were contacted. It's unclear to me how they got her parents' contact information.

But that morning, Danita's mother, Sharon, received a call from the Durham police saying that her daughter had suffered a fall at her apartment complex and that she was unresponsive. They told her she needed to get to Durham as quickly as possible. But Sharon lived in Charlotte. And that's like two hours from Durham. And so she called Jermier Stroud, which is Danita's fiance. Jermier was – The one who pushed her down the stairs? No, Kristen. Jermier was a police officer in Greensboro, North Carolina, which was like a little under an hour away from Durham. And so Sharon was like, can you head to Danita's apartment, get there?

I'm headed there too, but you can get there faster. And so he did. By the time Jameer arrived at Danita's apartment, police obviously were there. What was Danita studying? So she had completed her undergrad at NCCU. North Carolina Central. Uh-huh. And like English. Okay. But she was known for being really involved in journalism and photography. She actually had, after she had completed her undergrad, she had gotten a fellowship at the New York Times.

Oh, wow. Yeah, which I think is the same fellowship that Rory Gilmore wanted to get in Gilmore Girls and was not selected for. Wow. So that's the fun fact. So glad you brought that up. So Danita got it. That feels – yeah, Danita, a real person. Yeah.

Got the real fellowship. Correct. A fictional character did not. Yes. Is everyone following along? Yes, I think they are. Also, this is an apartment that's near a university, not affiliated with the university. Anyway, so I'm not sure what her graduate studies were in, but she was there getting her master's in something.

By the time Jameer arrived at Danita's apartment, obviously police were there. I think I already said that. But they had also determined that Danita had not fallen down the stairs. Danita was dead and she had died of a gunshot to the back of the head. She had been shot execution style in the back of the head. Oh, my God. In broad daylight. Yeah.

Jermier and Danita's family were obviously devastated. Her best friend had showed up at the scene too. Her best friend's brother lived in the same complex and he was like, there's something going on here. You should get over here. And she had immediately tried to call Danita and had been unable to reach her.

And so she showed up at the scene and then found out that it was Danita. Danita was like in the prime of her life. She and Jameer, she was like 25 years old. She and Jameer had just gotten engaged in November after being together for like six years. They'd met in college at North Carolina Central, and then they both completed their degrees. And then he'd moved to Greensboro to become a police officer, and she'd stayed there to go to graduate school. But they'd kept their relationship,

you know, long distance and things were going really well. Like I said, they'd gotten engaged in November. They were planning their wedding. If he's not the murderer here, I'm going to feel very guilty that I accused him. Am I about to feel really guilty? I don't know. You do know. It's hard to say. No, it's not. You do know. It's hard to say. No, it's not. Okay, continue.

A short time after police determined that Danita had been shot to death, they actually received their first break in the case. So within a couple hours, they learned that the call from Corey to 911 had not been the first 911 call placed from the apartment complex that day. A call had come in from the maintenance director, Michael Hedgepeth, at the apartment complex at like 8 o'clock that morning. He said that he'd just arrived at work and he was just kind of like standing outside killing time before he, you know, got to whatever his first tasks of the day were. And he heard a gunshot. And so he had kind of gone in the direction of where he thought he heard the gunshot fired. And he had encountered a woman who was running through the apartment complex in kind of an odd manner. And

she was like hysterical. She was crying. She was shaking. She had her like hands over her face. And so this maintenance guy approached her and he was like, are you okay? And she's like, yeah, I'm fine. And he's like, did you hear the gunshot? And she was like, yes, I heard it. And she's like yeah I'm fine and he's like did you hear the gunshot and she was like yes I heard it and she's like I'm terrified of guns that's why I'm upset and he's like okay and she's like well I live in a building over here and he's like okay

why don't you hang out I'm going to go see if I'm going to call the police I'm going to go see if I can find where the gunshot came from and then I'll come back and check in on you in just a minute and he watched her go get into a burgundy SUV. He called the police, said that he'd heard the gunfire. Police responded to the scene. They could not determine where the shot had come from and they didn't find a victim.

And so no report was made. But she was right out there in the open, right? Yeah, but if they don't know what built – like we're in an apartment complex. He can say a general direction but you can probably hear that gunshot for quite a ways and so they were never able to ever determine where the gunshot came from and no victim was found. So the police left and when they came back the second time, he comes over and he's like, hey, I called the police this morning because I heard a gunshot a couple hours ago. And then he

told them about his encounter with this woman. And he tried to track her down after the police, after he'd made contact with the police and they were unable to find her. And so he gave the police a general description. It was a young black woman. She was tall, probably 5'10". She had her hair in a ponytail and she was driving a burgundy SUV. He believed it was a Ford Explorer. OK. And so police obviously thought she must be involved in this some way because why would she have been like crying and running through the apartment complex if she wasn't involved?

Well, I mean – OK. Yeah, probably. Yeah. But also, I mean you don't know what somebody has been through. Absolutely. That's absolutely true. Yeah. Yes.

And obviously we all know how crime works. We know how investigations work. So we know we're all murderers. No, we just we've had our experiences with them on this podcast. And so we all know that Jermaine Stroud was the number one suspect at this point, her fiance. And so the very next day, they sat down with him for an interview. They asked Jermier where he'd been the morning of the shooting, and he told them that he'd just gotten off shift the night before, so he was at home sleeping in Greensboro. Not a great alibi. Not a great alibi at all. Hard to prove. Yes, because he lived by himself. Oh, shit. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. They asked him if he and Danita had been having any problems. And he said, no, their relationship was great. They just

recently got engaged. They were planning their wedding. Things were really good. And he was super emotional during his interrogation. He cried the whole time. He was very forthcoming. He answered all of their questions. And then they asked him if he knew of anyone who would want to harm Danita. He said no. She had no enemies. Everyone loved her.

And then they asked him if he knew anyone who would be capable of harming Danita. And again, he said no. He didn't know anybody who would do something like this. And then they asked him if he knew anyone who drove a burgundy-colored SUV perhaps a Ford Explorer? And he like froze. And he said, yeah, I do. No way. Who? It was a woman named Shannon Crawley.

Shannon Crawley was a woman with whom he'd had an affair. Oh, no. After moving to Greensboro. Oh, sir, I'm sorry for calling you a murderer. Mm-hmm. So he's like, yeah, I do know someone who drives a burgundy suv her name is shannon crawley we had an affair i broke it off like a year ago but since then And she's been stalking me. She moved into my neighborhood.

She started going to my church. Yikes. Yeah. She just started like showing up places I was at. He said that he and Shannon had met through his job at the police department. She was a 911 dispatcher in the Greensboro Police Department. And so they met through his position as a police officer. When they met, Jameer was obviously already in a relationship with Danita, but he at first didn't tell Shannon that.

First, didn't tell Shannon that and they started seeing each other a little bit and then finally he let her know that he had a serious girlfriend and things kind of, I don't know, tapered off. Did Danita ever find out? Danita had no idea. Oh. Yeah. He said that Danita and Shannon had never met, but Shannon was aware of Danita and aware that they had recently become engaged. And so police decided they should probably sit down with Shannon. Yeah. And so they brought Shannon Crawley in and they said, you know, do you know a woman named Danita Smith? And she said, I know of her.

They asked her to elaborate on that. And she's like, well, I was having an affair with her fiance. I've seen pictures of her in Jameer's house, but I've only seen her in person once. And it was like two weeks ago, 10 days ago on Christmas Eve when he brought her to Christmas Eve service. Oh. Yeah. The Christmas Eve service thing was kind of a big deal for Danita and Jameer. Christmas Eve service thing was kind of a big deal for Danita and Jameer.

Jameer brought her to his church to kind of show off the woman that he was newly engaged to. They had only gotten engaged like a month prior to that. Yeah. And so it was like this big to-do and Shannon had sat there in the same church and watched him parade around his fiancée. He had to have been sweating bullets too though because – Yeah, he's bringing her in front of this woman who he's had an affair with that Danita knows nothing about. Yeah. Danita knows nothing about. Yeah.

So they learn that this interaction has taken place and then they ask Shannon some more questions. They asked her if she owned a gun and she said, no, I don't. I don't like guns. I'm scared of guns. I've never owned one. They asked her where she was the morning of January 4th when Danita was shot and killed. And she said that that morning her child was sick, that she had called in sick to work. Oh, boy.

To take her son to the doctor. And then she determined that he wasn't actually – I'm sorry, he or she. I don't know the gender of this child. She determined that her child was not actually sick enough to take them to the doctor. And so she eventually called the babysitter and headed in to work just a little late. Oh, boy. They asked Shannon if she had ever been to Durham before and she said no. She'd been through Durham but never, never been there for anything. Through Durham like to go murder somebody and then come back?

That's a good question. Thank you. So they finished their interrogation and then they decided to look into Shannon's story a little bit. They got a warrant to search her SUV, that burgundy colored Ford Explorer that she drove, and they tested the steering wheel for a gunshot residue. Oh boy. And it came back positive. And then they were approached by one of Shannon's coworkers, someone who worked with her in the call center, the dispatch center. It was a man who said that he had recently sold Shannon a gun. Oh, my God.

The whole transaction had been perfectly legal. She'd said she needed to protect herself because she was being stalked. Huh. Mm-hmm. Okay. Yeah, and he'd sold her a.38 caliber handgun. By this time, they'd also determined that the bullet that had killed Danita had come from a.38 caliber gun. They also then checked out her cell phone records.

And while they couldn't place her in Durham on the day of Danita's murder, they did place her in Durham the day before Danita's murder where you know, like just outside of town, just around the same time that the original 911 call had come in from the maintenance guy. Yeah. So obviously with all of that information, Shannon Crowley was arrested and charged with the murder of Danita Smith. At some point in here, after she was arrested and charged, she actually made bond and was released on bond and she moved to Charlotte where her parents lived. But I don't know the timeline exactly. I don't know how much time she spent in custody before she made bond.

But what I do know is about five months after her arrest, Shannon reached out to detectives. And she told them that she wanted to sit down with them. She was ready to tell them the truth about what really happened on January 4th, 2007. All right. Let's hear it. So she and her lawyer came in and sat down with detectives and she told them that on January 3rd, so the day before Danita was murdered, she came home and found Jameer Stroud in her bedroom. They had been – they had an affair but that had been over for quite some time. But in – since they had broken off their relationship, he wouldn't leave her alone.

She said he was constantly calling and harassing and showing up at places she was at. And on that particular day, she'd found him in her bedroom. And he said that he had a gun and that she needed to be quiet and she needed to come with him. And so that day he forced her into a car and they driven to Durham and parked at the campus crossings apartment complex. And then he drove her back to Greensboro and he took off. What did they do? They just, you know, went there. For what purpose?

Just to go there. It makes no sense. That's correct. That is correct, Kristen. Then she said that the very next day, January 4th, 2007, she woke up that morning and Jameer Stroud was there in her bedroom again. Okay. Again at gunpoint. 2007 she woke up that morning and Jameer Stroud was there in her bedroom again okay again at gunpoint he told her

if you don't come with me if you don't do everything I say I'm going to kill your children oh and so he took her at gunpoint and they got in her car this time that burgundy Ford Explorer.

And again, they drove to the Campus Crossings apartment complex. And when they got there, Jameer got out of the vehicle. At that point, Shannon couldn't see him. He was out of her view. But she heard arguing. He was out of her view, but she heard arguing. And so she got out of the car and she started walking in the direction that she'd seen Jameer walk. And then she heard a gunshot.

And after the gunshot, she saw Jameer running at her full speed. And she turned around and tried and followed him like he had run by her at this point. She followed him to the car he got in the in the driver's seat put his hands on the steering wheel and then she tried to get in the back seat but the door was locked and so he then had climbed over the back of the seat into the back seat. And she was like, get in the front seat. And so she got in the front seat and was sitting there. And that's about the time that she was approached by the maintenance guy.

This is so stupid. Who was like, hey, are you okay? Did you hear that gunshot? All the time that she talked to this maintenance guy jameer was sitting in the back seat of the car hiding yeah any time that he she'd say anything to the maintenance guy jameer would kick the back of her seat and she kept looking at the maintenance guy and like darting her eyes yeah to the back seat he just wasn't he just wasn't picking it up. He didn't notice. He didn't notice at all. So that's it. That's the full explanation.

That's how her cell phone pinged that tower. That's how the gunshot residue ended up on her car. Well, that is incredible. Absolutely incredible. Yep. So the police were like, wow, that is a story. Great. So why is it that you're just now telling us this version?

Because she'd been scared. That's exactly what she said. You're so good. Thank you. She said she was terrified. Jermier had threatened her. He knew where she lived. He knew how to get to her.

He knew how to get to her kids. She could not put them at risk. Yep. And they were like, okay, well, what's different now? She had no answer for that. Well, I mean, that is a good question. For what it's worth, investigators did actually look further into Jameer following this statement. They actually thought it was Jameer from the beginning.

The lead investigator said when he sat down with Jameer, he was like, that's it. I got my guy. Well, yeah. I mean, it's always the fiance it's always the husband not this time no it wasn't they were like as much as they tried to like connect him to it in any way it just clearly was not jamir yeah and so they moved forward with their case against sh. A few months after that, June of 2008, Shannon comes forward. Something horrible has happened to her while she's been out on bond.

June 20th, 2008, she heard her dog barking at something at like 2, 2.30 in the morning. And so she got up. She was staying with her parents at this time while she was out on bond. Okay. In Charlotte. She got up, took her dog outside for a walk to calm it down.

And when she got outside, Jameer Stroud was standing there with a knife. And for the next three hours, he raped her. He put a knife to her throat. He cut her clothes off with a knife. He cut her thigh. She said he penetrated her vagina with the knife. Oh, my God. And then after like three hours of this,

he ejaculated and left. She had run inside to her parents. She'd woken her sleeping mother up, sobbing, telling her what had just happened. They immediately got her to the hospital where they did a rape kit and a full examination. The rape kit came back and showed no signs of any semen present. Well, what about knife wounds though?

I mean – There were knife wounds to her body, very superficial wounds. OK. Knife wounds to her body. Very superficial wounds. OK. And her vagina showed no signs of trauma. None that would be present in a typical rape.

Yeah. Oh, this is so troubling. It is. It is. I want to reiterate that false rape accusations are extremely rare. Yeah. But it seems that that was the case here. Yeah. Pretty quickly they determined that this wasn't – first of all, it wasn't possible for Jameer to have been there.

No? During that time, he had to clock in for work at like 6 a.m. She said he was there until 530. He would have had to have driven 120 miles per hour and stopped at no red lights to make it there. In addition to that, he had a receipt from his breakfast that morning in Greensboro. Thank God. Yes. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Wow. And so they believed that this was a false accusation by Shannon to further cast suspicion on Jameer and away from her.

On February 8th, 2010, finally, Shannon Crawley went on trial for the murder of Danita Smith. The prosecution said that Shannon was obsessed with Jameer and had began stalking him and then was set off when she saw Jameer and Danita together engaged at church on Christmas Eve. together engaged at church on Christmas Eve. And she went into a jealous rage and had to get Danita out of the picture. And that she'd gone to Danita's apartment complex on the 3rd and that she had basically cased the joint, figured out where she needed to stand to be able to sneak up on Danita and shoot her from behind as she left her apartment. The prosecution had that maintenance worker, Michael Hedgepeth, testify. He testified that he saw a woman there running through the apartment complex. Lots of things about it stuck out to him.

She took a really weird route through the apartment complex when there was a much, much cleaner exit she could have made. He could not positively identify Shannon as the woman he saw there. But he said she matched who he had seen. She was about the same height, had the same hair, that kind of thing. But he was not willing to say like, for sure, this is the woman I saw. They had a forensic pathologist testify about how the bullet that killed Danita was a.38 caliber bullet. They had a forensic firearms expert testify that the gun that the co-worker had sold to Shannon had been a.38 caliber and that Jameer had owned guns, but that none of his were that caliber. He had two guns.

He had his service weapon, which was like a.40 caliber Glock, and then he also had a personal gun, and it was also a.40 caliber. And that firearms expert testified that a.40 caliber gun cannot fire a.38 caliber bullet. Obviously, because we know so much about guns. Ask me anything. That's right. The prosecution had an expert testify, a forensic chemist, about the gunshot residue that was found in Shannon's car. They presented a bunch of evidence about cell phone towers and how they go ping and the phone goes pong and, you know, everybody knows where you are all day long. I read this.

They really butchered that, though. Oh, my gosh. I read this whole explanation of this in the court record. And they had to bring, like, one guy from Sprint next to like just issue. His whole job was just to present the jury with the call records. And then a whole other guy had to come out and then map all of it out. I'm like, I would have fucking fallen asleep if I was a juror. That's the most boring testimony.

That's why they just need the rhyme. Yes. Cell phone go ping, towers go pong. We know your location all the day long. Yes. Yes. Cell phone go ping, towers go pong. We know your location all the day long. Yes. Yes. Yep. And so they were able to determine that, yes, Shannon had said in that interview that she'd never been to Durham when they could place her in Durham the day before Danita's murder and near Durham.

He drove her there. At gunpoint, obviously. Duh. Yeah. Okay. The defense fought like hell to keep Shannon's rape allegation out of the trial. But the judge allowed it in. Oh, that's interesting.

Yes. And so the prosecution presented all the evidence about the rape allegation that Shannon had made, that she'd said that he'd come to her house in Charlotte. She'd gone outside at like 2.30. He'd been there. He raped her for three hours and then cut off her clothes and all of that. day had been like, oh, you should probably check Jameer's trash cans because I bet the knife is in his trash cans outside his house. Yeah, because you put it there. And so they went and checked.

So his trash cans were checked and a knife was found in the bottom of his trash cans. So the prosecution brought forward two of Jameer's neighbors to testify that on like the 21st of June, they saw somebody dump something in his trash can and then drive away. Two people saw that? Two people saw it. Okay. Yeah. Yep.

They heard all the information about how the rape kit was done and it tested negative for any semen. And then they also talked about how the lacerations on her body were superficial and there were no injuries to her vagina. The prosecution had one more piece of evidence that they wanted the jury to have before arresting their case. that they wanted the jury to have before arresting their case. This was actually something that they got when they asked for discovery from the defense. They were a collection of cassette tapes that Shannon had made and given to her attorney. And she claimed that they were secret audio recordings that she had made of Jameer when he was calling her obsessively and threatening her about Danita's murder. This was after the time that Danita was murdered. Jameer was calling her constantly.

All right. Let's hear the tapes. OK. So here's a fun fact before we get there. OK. Jameer testified for the prosecution at this trial. He testified that, yes, he'd had an affair with Shannon. Yes, he had a service weapon.

Yes, all of these things. But he was not involved nor could he have been involved in the murder. Great. Wonderful. Jameer has a pretty distinct voice. It's a deep, gravelly voice. So the prosecution – this is kind of beautiful. The prosecution doesn't tell the jury what they're doing.

They literally bring in a boombox, set it up in court, put in a cassette tape and just let it play for a while. On it, you can very clearly hear Shannon arguing with a man on the phone. And he is telling her that he can't go down for this. He's not going to jail for this. And he'll do whatever he needs to do to stay out of jail. And he's killed before and he will kill again. OK. So over and over again on this tape, Shannon refers to this person that she's speaking to as Jameer.

Yeah. Only. And she asks him, like, why are you whispering? Why are you doing that with your voice? Because the person she's talking to has a very high-pitched speaking voice. It is so clear that it is not Jameer on this phone. Some of the jurors laughed. Oh, really? Yes.

When the prosecution was like, the defendant would like you to believe that she is, she has, this is the smoking gun, that she has Jameer on tape confessing to murder. But you heard him speak in this courtroom today. Oh. Oh, it's bad. She's a mess.

Yeah. What the hell is wrong with her? Had planned to not use these at all. And they hoped that the prosecution would do the same. But it's just further evidence of her nature, of her vindictive nature. Trying to frame him. Exactly. Exactly.

Yeah. Finally, it was the defense's turn and they tried to say that it was all Jameer and that Jameer had actually framed Shannon. Well, he did a hell of a job. Jameer had been the stalker, not Shannon. Jameer had been the stalker, not Shannon. Jameer had been threatening her. He raped her. He admitted to killing her.

And Shannon took the stand in her own defense. She basically word for word, her testimony was the story that she told the police five months after she was arrested about how she'd woken up and Jameer had been in her bedroom and taken her at gunpoint to the apartment complex and then he'd taken her back home and then the next day, same thing. And he'd been the one to shoot her and he'd been the one to get the stuff on the gunshot residue on the car. And that was pretty much the extent of her testimony. I couldn't find anything on her cross-examination. I don't know how she stood up on cross-examination. I can't imagine it was not well. Yeah, I can't imagine it was great. Uh-uh. No.

And that was pretty much the defense's case. They couldn't argue a lot more than like, hey, this is all the work of Jameer trying to frame Shannon. With the jury deliberated for like no time. Well, of course. And they found Shannon guilty. Yeah. Of the murder of Danita Smith.

Of course. Before sentencing, Shannon was given the opportunity to address the court and she declined. That surprises me. It surprises me too. Because she came up with all this bullshit. And you would think she would want an opportunity to spew some more bullshit. Exactly. Yeah. spew some more bullshit. Exactly. Yeah. Danita's mother, however,

Sharon Smith, did address the court. And she said, someday I may forgive you, Shannon, but I don't right now. I hope you rot in hell. You took something from me you had no right to take.

Yeah. The judge sentenced Shannon to life in prison. He didn't question the verdict. He believed that Shannon was guilty, but he had a message for Jameer as well. He said Jameer Stroud caused a perfect storm to happen, and then he walked away from it. And that is unfortunate for everyone in this case.

He called Jameer the catalyst of this whole thing. That's unfair. I think it's unfair too. That's way out of line. I totally agree. Yeah. Obviously, it's bad to cheat and that's bad. But that is not fair at all.

I completely agree. I think that's out of line. Fucked up. Yeah. To say that. Yeah. Shannon's parents believe she is wrongfully convicted. Oh, okay. They are interviewed at length in this Dateline episode. Oh, my. They believe that the rape allegation is true.

They believe the recordings are Jameer. So the police actually tried to trace these calls and they were actually successful. They don't come from Jameer's cell phone, obviously, because they're not Jameer. They come from a pay phone. Okay. Yeah. Mm-hmm pay phone. Okay, yeah. No. And so Josh Mankiewicz is the guy who does this

episode of Dateline, and he's like, okay, so if you're saying that you believe that these tapes are real, the rape allegations real, all of that, then you're accusing the police of like a massive cover up here. And her parents are like, yeah, Jameer is a police officer.

Please protect police. Well, I mean that is true. And honestly, I wouldn't put it past the police to do a lot of stuff, but they didn't do this. I agree. Her father, Keith Crawley, said, if it is the last thing I ever do, I will prove that Jameer is the one that actually committed this crime. Oh, my. Yep. Oh, these poor parents yeah josh minkowitz also sat down with shannon

in prison and was like okay you know do you have do you have anything you want to say and she's like it's all true everything i've said is true it's all true true. The tapes, those are Jameer. The rape, it happened. And he's like, okay. But like I listened to the tapes. I don't believe for a second that that's Jameer on those tapes. And she's like, how would I – how would I fake that? Well, you would have someone else do it. That's exactly what he said.

He's like, you have a friend. Pretend to be jameer you think that if if jameer really committed this crime he's going to admit to it on the phone with you and she's like and he's like no you you have a friend pretend to be jameer on the phone you record it she's like i could i would never do that. Put my parents through that? Absolutely not. So she's sticking to her story and her parents believe it. For the record, Jameer has never been charged with anything in connection to this crime. I don't believe that he's involved in any way. And I think it's really out of line that the judge called him the catalyst behind this whole thing.

People have affairs all the time. That's really bad. It's terrible and he admitted it was terrible. Yeah. I mean it would be nuts if he didn't think it was just – Of course. Yes. But like – no, you don't bring stalking upon yourself.

You don't bring murder upon someone. No, no, no, no, no, no. Nice effing try. Yeah, I say to that judge. On this episode of Dateline. What happened? Danita's mother apologized for what she said in court. Oh, really?

She said that she was just really hurt and caught up in the moment and that she does not want Shannon to rot in hell and she apologized for saying that. Yeah. I can't imagine being that big of a person. I know. That's – and it makes me sad that we lost Anita because like anyone raised by people like that, you know. Absolutely.

Absolutely. That's got to be a good person. The newsroom at North Carolina Central has been named after Danita Smith. Oh, that's cool. Yeah. And that's the story of the murder of Danita Smith or a Durham, North Carolina staircase. Very misleading. Yes.

Are you telling us about a heist? Yes. You're going to hate this. Oh, great. You're going to hate it so much. Like every step of the way, you're going to hate this. Great. And I love it. Every step of the way.

Excellent. I'm very happy for you. Cannot wait. I love this story. of the way. Excellent. I'm very happy for you. Cannot wait. I love this story. Also, it's infuriating. Also, let's go. OK. Shout out to the article Majoring in Crime by John Falk for Vanity Fair.

That's a wonderful article. Very thorough. Very helpful. Also, an episode of Super Heist called Secrets of the Transy Book Heist. By the way, I am uncomfortable. Can we call it Transylvania? Why do you have to call it Transy? I'm just like – Is it Transylvania?

Yeah. Is that what people call it for short? Transy. Yeah, I don't – I think that needs to stop. It feels dangerous. That does feel dangerous. Yeah. Ooh.

Yeah. All right. I'm glad I'm not the only one who feels that way. I agree. That does feel dangerous. Yeah. Ooh. Yeah. All right. I'm glad I'm not the only one who feels that way. I'm on board with you. Like, aren't we just like one letter short

of saying something really terrible? Yes. Good Lord. Yes. Anyway, also, excellent reporting

in the Lexington Herald-Leader. Ooh. All right. You ready? Yeah. Is Dracula involved? No, but Count Chocula is. Oh, I'm sorry.

Your joke was so sophisticated. Spencer Reinhart and Warren Lipka were long-term friends. They both grew up in the suburbs of Lexington, Kentucky, where they were steeped in privilege. Brandy, tell me if this sounds familiar. They grew up in the kind of neighborhoods where people could be penalized for improper lawn care. Yes. Or worse, putting up tacky Christmas decorations. That made me sad, too.

Yeah, that makes me very sad. One person's tacky is another person's treasure. Exactly. Spencer, what? I really like those vintage nativity scenes that light up. I think they're so kitschy and so cute. And that neighborhood certainly would not allow them. Okay.

The article specifically mentioned like tacky Santas. I love a big tacky Santa. So do I. Yeah. I guess we'll never be moving to upscale Lexington, Kentucky. I guess not. Cross that off the list. Spencer and Warren became best friends when they were eight years old, mostly because they were both into soccer.

They ended up going to different high schools, but they stayed friends, and both of them became captains on their soccer teams. And both of them made All-State. And I'm not sure what that means, but I am sure that I don't care. Warren was a jock, a real cool guy, kind of a jokester. My name isn't fucking Warren. What? Nothing. What movie is that from?

Empire Records. All right. Anyway, Spencer was an artiste. He had a green Nalgene bottle on his backpack. He took himself very seriously. He made a face at the Nalgene bottle. Took me forever to figure out what it is. It's the, you know, the plastic screw bottle.

Do you remember high school? Yes, I do. All the cool kids had Nalgene bottles. I thought, I hated Nalgene bottles. I hated them too. Because the mouth was too big. It's huge and you gotta use two hands. What the fuck are you doing? You know what?

You should get one of these. Everyone, Brandy's still really proud of her water bottle that has like an invisible straw. Do you know how proud of it I am? How proud? I upgraded it this week. You just shook the table again. I'm sorry. I'm very excited.

I upgraded it this week to the 32 ounce version because the straw makes it so easy to drink that I was having to refill it too often. I mean, are there straws that make things hard to drink? I mean – Yeah, look how – I mean, we can hear how hard you have to work at that fucking straw. Yeah. That's why my pucker is so powerful. Gross. Disgusting.

You know what? That makes me feel unwanted and unattractive. Why do you react that way? Anyway, Spencer had an algin bottle. They both graduated from high school in the spring of 2003. Are you OK? Just a little older than us. I know. They're too similar to us.

No, they're not. OK, great. Yeah, because first of all, neither one of us had Nalgene bottles. That's true. Also, listen to this entire story. Okay, great. None of it will be – I've never pulled off a book heist in Transylvania, I'll tell you that.

Yeah, ours have been more locally based. That's right. I am constantly stealing books from Rainy Day Books. Oh, my God. If only you stole the rare ones. No, I've got all the Judy Blumes. Just used Judy Blumes as far as the eye can see. Everyone, Rainy Day Books is our local bookstore here in Kansas City.

It's quite good. Yeah, it's a really nice, cute, locally owned bookstore. Brandy loves to shoplift from local businesses. Not Walmart or Amazon. Not the big ones. She pays there, but she goes to her local businesses and shoplifts. Is that not what people mean when they say support local? Her, her, her.

Okay. So they graduated from high school in the spring of 2003. And that fall, they went to colleges that were only about a mile apart. Warren got a full athletic scholarship to the University of Kentucky, and Spencer got an art scholarship to Transylvania University. Oh, we're not in Transylvania. I was wondering when we were getting to Romania, is that where Transylvania is? I have no idea. Yes.

Okay, great. And if we're wrong, we will hear about it on Twitter. Endlessly. Get ready to be charmed, everyone. Oh, wait, I skipped a part of my script. Back up. Don't get charmed yet. Hold on to your charm bracelets. Oh, God, that was so stupid. Oh, I can't help it. yet. Don't get charmed yet. Hold on to your charm bracelets. Oh, God.

That was so stupid. Oh, I can't help it. Also, my bra doesn't fit well. So, you know, I can't be expected to do a good job today. What do you mean it doesn't fit well? What's wrong with it? What do you mean? The band is too loose.

Oh, yeah. And so I've tried to compensate it for it by making straps really tight. No, that doesn't help because, you know, none of the support is supposed to come from the straps. It comes from the band. Yeah, I'm getting that vibe. So you just got. What? Droopy titties.

Did you almost say droopy titties? I did. I've also got those. You want to know the saddest thing? Droopy titties. Rooty, tooty, fresh andruity, am I right? Rudy Tootie, Troopy Tooties. No, you want to know the saddest thing?

A while back, I was like, fuck all my bras. Got rid of all my bras. But I hate... All of your replacement bras? Well, stop buying them at Costco. No, no, no. Here's the thing. I hate bra shopping.

So she just picked up five Playtex 18-hour bras at Costco, and she's wondering why she's not satisfied. You know what? Fuck you. That's exactly what I did. I got one set, and it fit at the time. I don't know what's happened now. Like I, I obviously changed sizes,

but when that one set fit, I was like, I'm just going to buy like a shit ton of these. So now I have a shit ton of bras that don't fit. And I'm like, damn it. I'm going to have to go. I'm going to have to like actually brush up.

Yeah. You're going to have to go somewhere. Probably get fitted. Don't say it so condescendingly. You should going to have to go. I'm going to have to like actually brush up. Yeah, you're going to have to go somewhere and probably get fitted. Don't say it so condescendingly. You should go to Soma. I'll have to like enter a mall. Soma has standalone stores. There's one on Plaza. No.

Here's my problem. I'm used to paying, you know, $12 for 14 bras. You're going to have to spend like 50 bucks on a nice bra. Yeah, it's going to be the shock of a lifetime. And then you won't have droopy tooties anymore. I mean, my boobs are driving me crazy right now. Look at how much they can move around. They are pretty mobile.

You're just going to give yourself a black eye going down the stairs. I know, I know. Oh my gosh. Anyway, everyone, the lesson here is go ahead and get fitted for a bra. Anyway, that's our tangent. That's our one tangent in this whole story.

No more tangents. Here we go. Okay. When they got to school, both Warren and Spencer struggled. Okay. Now are we ready to be charmed? We're ready to be charmed now. Okay.

Spencer was bummed because he had hoped to play a lot of soccer at Transylvania, but the coach didn't give him much playing time. Which, like, okay, I don't know shit about sports, but like, well, no, there's more hard times to come in. But like you're a freshman. You're probably not going to get a lot of playing time. Right. Like congratulations on being all state sports. They had a soccer team at the art school. I mean, apparently.

Okay. Maybe that's why he expected to like. Yeah. He was like, I'm going to be the best athlete at art school. That's ever been to art school. Yeah, that's probably true. Okay. Maybe that's why he expected to like... Yeah, he was like I'm going to be the best athlete at art school. That's ever been to art school. Yeah, that's probably true. Maybe. Anyway, worse than that, his art classes

were filled with a bunch of girls and he was way more talented than all of them. Okay, I hate this guy. I would now like to read you a quote from the Vanity Fair article. You think you hate him now? Listen to this.

In all my art classes, I was the only guy. In with a bunch of girls who didn't have any idea what they wanted to do. All these girls I could draw better than when I was in sixth grade. Okay.

Fuck you, dude. Seriously? Yeah. Toxic masculinity at art school? I know. Fuck. Warren had his fair share of problems too. Somebody glued all the quarters to the floor.

Would you quit quoting Empire Records? No one's familiar with that film. So many people love that film. It's a cult classic. Okay, well, go drink some Kool-Aid. That was a rude cult joke.

Anyway, his parents were going through a divorce. It seems that maybe his dad, who was also the women's soccer coach at the University of Kentucky, had a gambling problem. And so they were filing for bankruptcy and getting divorced. I mean, whole thing. The dad did not comment for this article. Cannot imagine why. Anyway.

I cannot imagine why. Anyway. So all Warren did was go to class, go to soccer practice, smoke pot, watch Comedy Central, and read German philosophy. Oh, boy. Wow. German philosophy? Yeah. Who's a German philosopher? Nietzsche. Nietzsche? Yeah. That's a German philosopher?

Nietzsche. Nietzsche? Yeah, that's what I – That's my one – that's who I assumed. I mean if we're playing Trivial Pursuit and there's a question on that, that's my one thing. By October of that year, Warren decided to go all in on the pot smoking in the Comedy Central and he quit the soccer team. Oh, no. He lost his scholarship but he stayed enrolled in school. But don't worry about Warren.

He had that entrepreneurial spirit. And so he started a business. It was a fake ID business. He reached out to a fellow student who'd also played soccer with him in high school named Eric Borsik. And he was like, hey, Eric, how would you like to make unlimited money working from home? And Eric had always wanted to be a boss babe, so he naturally said yes. And so they were in business.

Warren became the sales department and Eric became production. And it seems like they made quite a bit of money because it turns out – College kids want fake IDs? Yeah. Who knew, right? Nope. Fun fact about Eric. He looks like a baby-faced Billy Eichner.

And when he was little, he always wanted to be an FBI agent. When he was little, he always wanted to be an FBI agent. And according to Eric, when he was little, he was pen pals with famous FBI agents. Such as? I would love to know more. Name a famous FBI agent. Right? I mean, so number one, I'm kind of thinking, like, how many famous FBI agents are there? I mean, doesn't this just sound like when he was a kid, his parents humored him?

Yeah. Oh, yeah. When I was a kid, Santa wrote me back. You know? Anyway, that's what he told the people on Super Heist. I'm sorry. I'm grabbing a Kleenex. We are not cutting this.

The people need to know that I'm getting a Kleenex. I don't think they need to know any of that. They certainly don't need to hear you blow your nose if that's what you're about to do. Everyone, Brandy is so nervous. It's fine. I'm fine. I'm just dabbing my nose. I am really better now that I'm a mom. Well, I mean, you couldn't possibly have been worse than you are.

That's accurate. Literally, any time we were with my dad for more than half an hour at a time, you about threw up because he is an at-the-table nose blower. He is an at-the-table nose blower, and that's just simply unacceptable. There has never been an occasion where he hasn't felt perfectly fine. This is the man you want to officiate your wedding. Yeah. Yeah. An at-the-table nose blower. I know, and I mean,

I am fully aware what we're getting into here with this request. I've known DP for many a year. That's true. Decades, Ethan. All right.

Well, anyway. So the Boss Babes were hashtag grateful and hashtag beyond blessed. Yes. But then Eric and Warren got into an argument. Two grand went missing from Eric's desk. That's a lot of money. Sure is. Where'd it go?

I mean, do you want me to guess? I'm guessing Warren took it because Warren... Did Warren accuse him of taking it? No, hold on. The money came from Eric's desk. Yeah, I know. I get it. But you're asking, did Warren accuse himself of taking it?

Did Warren accuse Eric of taking it? But it's Eric's desk. I get it! I get whose desk it is! But it seems like if it's Eric's desk, then Eric would have

the most access to the money. Well, no. It's so... it's so hey brandy some money went missing from my purse did you take it christy yeah no that's what i'm saying that's exactly what i'm saying like was warren like what are you trying to set me up and you actually took it? I unfortunately do not know the details of the fight. Anyway, $2,000 went missing from Eric's desk. No word on who took it.

Eric said later that like he wasn't accusing Warren. But I mean, come on. Anyway. Okay. So it got really ugly. Warren accused Eric of not supporting a fellow boss babe and the relationship fell apart. So after Warren and Eric had their falling out, Warren reached out to Spencer. Surely Spencer, as an artiste who was way more talented than all the dumb girls in his classes, could make a decent fake ID.

Yeah, surely. So they got together to discuss it. could make a decent fake ID. Yeah, surely. So they got together to discuss it. They were at the Transylvania campus, sitting in a car, smoking pot, near the J. Douglas Gay Jr. Library. Here's how Warren remembers their discussion.

Okay. And then Spencer said, I just took a tour in that library, and there's shit sitting there that you wouldn't believe. They said that this set, Birds of America, sold for 12 million dollars. I said, 12 million dollars just sitting there? They got security around that? Nonchalantly. Very nonchalantly. I mean, just kind of shooting it between us. So I kind of go, that would be pretty crazy, wouldn't it? And he said, yeah, that would be kind of crazy. And then I said, you know, why don't you look into it more and we'll go from there.

Just like very unofficial. So super casual, no big deal. But they did look into it. What? Is he trying to frame this like it's not his idea to pull off this heist? Because even that way he just told it, it sounds like it's his idea. Here's the thing about the guys in this heist. I hate them all.

Okay, great. Because there's a lot of, and I said, oh, I guess I'll do it. But only, you know, I'm not going to do this, that or the other thing and then the other boys did it. It's kind of – yeah. OK. Anyway, they can kiss my ass. OK.

My pimply ass. That's – And they can all pitch in to buy me new bras just as a favor. new bras just as a favor. So Spencer started staking out the library. The special collections room at the Transylvania Library had a focus on natural history and it was true. The room was home to incredibly valuable rare books, most notably The Birds of America by John James Audubon. You didn't have to tell me that.

Because you just heard it? No, I knew they were by Audubon. How did you know? Because he is the bird guy. He founded the Audubon Society with the bird watching. Yeah. Pretty big effing deal, huh? Yeah, and they just got just OG copies in there?

Yeah, I mean— First editions? What do you fucking think? The Birds of America is a gigantic, beautiful set of engravings of birds. Birds, yep. beautiful set of engravings of birds. John James Audubon created these sets in jolly old England in 1838 and he only created like 200 of them. So they are super valuable.

Amy Goodman Rossi, Jr.: Rare. Rare books. Amy Goodman Rossi, Jr.: Rare books. Yeah. Amy Goodman Rossi, Jr.: Spencer had been right. A set had recently sold for $12 million. I think somebody is going to notice if they're missing, though. Yeah, of course.

Those aren't the kind of books that you can, like, check out. That would be nuts, Kate. You know, in retrospect, we shouldn't let people check these out. Someone spilled cola on the birds of America. Now it's not worth shit. And I found seeds and stems in the binding. Oh, what a mess. Yeah, so the special collections room of Transylvania's library had its own set.

And as Spencer quickly discovered, the university didn't have a lot of security around the Special Collections Room. In fact, there were zero security guards in there. When you went in, you signed your name on a little sheet

and a sweet little librarian named B.J BJ Gooch showed you what that's not real. That is real. That is real. Is she related to unity? I don't believe so. Oh man.

I guess I don't know. You're probably related to BJ Gooch. Well, good. Cause she is awesome. Okay. You're probably related to BJ Gooch. Well, good, because she is awesome. Okay. Your future child is now named BJ Gooch.

Absolutely not. You know, BJ, okay, she could go by Betty Jean. Yeah, it's cute. But for reasons that defy logic. Around college students. Right? She chooses to go by BJ. Why? Oh, well.

Hey, if you've lived your whole name with the last name Gooch. Your whole name? Oh, if you've lived your whole life with the last name Gooch, you've got some thick-ass skin, I'm guessing. I guess you would. You've got some thick-ass skin, I'm guessing. I guess you would. I feel like you'd really be like, anything to take the focus off the Gooch. That's why you do it.

Maybe she married into the Gooch. Oh, what about that? Yeah. I mean. Gooch is her married name. Yeah. So maybe she was BJ and that was kind of funny. Then she falls in love with Mr. Gooch.

She's like, oh, no. Oh, no. This is going to be a mess. But, you know, they loved each other too deeply. Yeah. And so they had to get married. And she's an old-fashioned gal. BJ and the Gooch. That's what they called him.

BJ and the Gooch. BJ. BJ and the Gooch. Oh, no. peter peter at the coach oh no so it seemed that it would be very easy to steal valuable books from the transylvania university library are there cameras i'm sorry Sorry. I'm so sorry. The way you asked it, it was like the question sprung out of you. Are there cameras? The library does have some cameras. Okay.

But not in the special, what is it? The rare books room? The special collections. I don't believe so. Okay. Is it the rare books? The special collections. I don't believe so. Okay. In this episode of Super Heists, which I strongly suspect was produced by a Ms. Brandy Egan, they pointed out that oftentimes selling stolen material is harder than stealing the material itself.

That's correct. Who the fuck is going to buy it? They really went all in. They were like, if these guys went through with the heist, they'd have to find a buyer on the black market. And of course, if they sell the books on the black market, they can only expect to get like 50% of market value. Top that off. You've got to do money laundering.

You're going to lose some money. They think it's a bad idea,y if you can believe it yeah i'm right there with them yeah because especially when you're talking about rare fucking book oh my here i go okay we're talking about rare fucking books which means that in order to get top dollar from them you're gonna need to authenticate them and they're gonna want to know where they came from in order to get top dollar from them, you're going to need to authenticate them. And they're going to want to know where they came from in order to do that. Yeah. They're going to get them authenticated.

Don't worry about it. How are they going to do that, Kristen? Kristen. Keep your pants on. How about that? This is stupid. I love this story so much. Fuck.

Warren was not worried because he was very well connected. Since Warren was already doing sketchy shit, he knew a guy who knew a guy who knew a guy, yada, yada, yada, who was perhaps interested in rare books. The man, whom Warren had never met, referred to himself as Barry. He said he wanted to discuss the books in person in Central Park. This is an undercover FBI agent? It sounds sketchy as fuck. Barry, who are you? What happened? I'm not sure. Everyone, who are you? What happened?

I'm not sure. Everyone, the words got caught in her throat. They did. They didn't come out. Who are you? Who are you? Who, who, who, who? And then Warren was like, is there a fucking owl on here?

Yeah. And then he was like, stay away from staircases. That's what the owl said? No. Everyone knows that owls can only talk about how many licks it takes to get to the center of a Tootsie Pop. A one. A two. A three.

So anyway, Barry wanted to meet in Central Park. Also, he wanted $500. Central Park? Yeah. So Warren's got to get his ass to New York? Yeah, I mean, here's the thing. If you're like, oh, yeah, I've got like $12 million worth of stuff to sell, you should be able to get yourself to Central Park, right? All right, okay.

So Spencer and Warren got a bag of weed, and they hauled ass to New York. They checked into a Hilton in Manhattan under fake names using fake IDs that they'd created themselves. Do you know the names? No, I don't. Fuck. Sorry. Okay. Did they order Domino's while they were there?

No. Okay. They're much cooler than that. Okay, just checking. They paid for everything in cash because they'd seen movies. And the next day they met Barry. Barry was an older gentleman who had a long ponytail and wore a green scarf. Warren and Spencer –

Did he like always wear a green scarf or he just happened to have a green scarf on that day? It was one of those like you'll know me because I've got a ponytail and a green scarf. Have you ever met a mysterious man in a park before? Obviously not. No, because I'm alive. Warren and Spencer approached Barry in the middle of Central Park and did their best to look like criminal masterminds. But it was tough because they were like 19. They had little baby faces.

So they tried to talk in deeper voices to seem more like big, beefy men who had rare books. Okay, but they're reading him in person. Yeah, but sometimes you got to sound older. Okay, but they're reading him in person. Yeah, but sometimes you gotta sound older. Okay. Okay. To help sell Theranos. See, you almost gave me a billion dollars just then. I did.

Just one drop of blood. That's all it takes. That's right. So that we don't have to say goodbye to you too soon, Brandy. So Warren gave Barry the $500 he'd asked for. What's the $500 for? He wanted $500. They're trying to sell something to him.

Yes, and also he wanted $500. Which brings me to my next point. Brandy, I'd like 500 bucks. So Barry gave them an email address and said, when you correspond with this email address, use the name Terry. Warren and Spencer were stoked. They had a connection. They drove back to Lexington and as soon as they got home they created a Yahoo email

address for their brilliant heist. Yahoo email address. Yeah, only sketchy people have Yahoo email addresses, am I right? That's correct. We are all looking at you, my love.

David? Does he still have his Yahoo? Yeah, it's his email address. It's not even like a backup email. It is his email address. Is his backup an AOL? Yeah. So they sent an email to the address that Barry had given them. And they were like, yeah, got some rare books.

Want to sell them. My name's Terry. And a week later, they got an email back that was like, well, if you want to sell me those books, you're going to have to fly out to Amsterdam. Because that is where I do business. And they were like, Amsterdam it! Oh, boy. Boy, that was terrible. That was not nearly as good as my charm bracelet joke, which both charmed people and made them

laugh. Warren and Spencer were like, no problem. Warren got himself a fake passport and he got a ticket to Amsterdam and he paid for everything in cash because movies. And in March of 2004, he landed in Amsterdam. He knew he was supposed to go to a cafe where he would meet – what? What? He's going to go to an cafe where he would meet – What? What? He's going to go to an Amsterdam cafe.

Yeah, what about it? Is he going to get pot brownies? Well, probably. One of the first things he did was get a joint. Oh, OK. And then he went to Club Vonderssex. Is that a real place? I don't think so.

Just to see. It was in Eurotrip. Oh, my god. Everyone, Brandy hasn't been to Europe, but she has seen Euro trips multiple times. That's right. Excuse me. So

he knew he was supposed to go to a cafe where he'd meet a large bearded man wearing a blue sweater. Okay. So at the arranged time, he went to the cafe and he saw a large bearded man wearing a blue sweater. So at the arranged time, he went to the cafe and he saw a large bearded man wearing a blue sweater sitting at a table with three other men. Warren went up to the men and was like,

Hello, I am Terry. He sat down and the men asked him questions. Could you show us the books? And Warren had to admit that he didn't have the books on him. So they were like, okay, do you have pictures of the books? He was like, no, I don't have that either. Well, what the fuck did you bring us? Do you have literally any evidence that you are in possession of these books?

Nope, didn't have that either. They asked him, have you had the books appraised to prove that they're real? And Warren was like, also no. Great. They were like, okay, can you at least tell us the names of all the books that you have for sale? And Warren couldn't really say a lot in that regard either. So after about 15 minutes, the dudes were like, OK, get these mystery books appraised and then maybe we'll talk. Goodbye.

So Warren flew back to Lexington and told Spencer everything. And they were like, shit, how are we going to get stolen books appraised? Yeah, that's also what I said. How do you do it, Brandy? I don't fucking know. You say, okay, hold on. They say they're doing it on behalf of the library. Hmm.

Not bad. Here's what they did. They did some research and they settled on a little-known auction house. Stop me if you've heard of it. It's called Christie's. Like the biggest auction house. The biggest, most reputable auction house. Yes.

And that's where they wanted to get their soon-to-be-stolen books appraised. Here was their logic according to Spencer, again from the Vanity Fair article. The way I rationalized it was, it's the biggest auction house. If we go in there, they're not going to suspect that we stole these because no one would go to Christie's with stolen books to get them appraised. That's how we did a lot of stuff. Like we would smoke weed directly under the security camera on the Transy campus, park a car right underneath it, and then smoke for like an hour. We figured the more obvious we were, the less likely we would be suspected. These are the dumbest dudes ever.

Yeah. So here's my thought. There's a huge fucking difference. Yeah, between smoking weed. On a college campus. Yeah. And getting away with it and going to Christie's Auction House. Yeah, with stolen books.

And getting them appraised. OK, great. How did it go for them? Well, first off, it was a foolproof plan. Oh, was it? They'd steal the books and they'd have them appraised at Christie's and they'd sell the books to the sketchy dudes in Amsterdam and then they'd become millionaires. Cool.

Sorry you didn't think of it first. I am also sorry that I did not think of it. Warren and Spencer didn't want to rush things. They decided to push the heist to the fall of 2004 and they also decided to involve more people. So Warren reached out to his old buddy Eric and they met up at Pazzo's Pizza Pub, which sadly is no longer in business. Triple P's.

That's what they called it. No, they didn't. Yeah. You guys want to meet up at Triple P's tonight? Hey, how about the PPP? Nobody's saying that. No one. Triple P's.

No one's saying Triple P's. Yeah, they are. No, it's disgusting. Yeah. It makes you sound like you have to pee pee pee. It's stupid. It does. So, Eric and Warren... Yeah, we're gonna get some wings at Triple P's tonight.

Eric and Warren hugged it out, and Warren told me... Will we see you at Triple P's later? Oh my god, no! You will never catch me at PPP. Eric and Warren. What's your favorite pie at PPP? I like to stay pretty standard and I bring in a fourth

P. Oh my gosh. I spat everywhere. So Warren told Eric all about the heist. It was official. Eric, Warren and Spencer would pull off this heist together. Would they? They would.

That fall, Warren dropped out of school so that he could channel all of his energy into this heist. It's really a full-time job. He and Eric moved in together into a little bungalow off campus located at... Oh, shit. I'm not even ready. I'm just sitting there with my thumb up my butt. Get out of there. 613 Beaumont Avenue, Lexington, Kentucky.

Is that like a B-A-U? Of course it is. B-E-A-U-M-O-N-T. Yeah, you know what that means. I see it. That's a cute little bungalow. Yeah. Did you describe this as a bungalow?

Yeah, I said it was a bungalow. It is. It's a cute little bungalow. Well. Did you describe this as a bungalow? Yeah, I said it was a bungalow. It is a cute little bungalow. Well, did you think I was lying? I don't lie about bungalows. What? I love the bathroom. Oh, let me go through. Hang on.

I haven't scrolled through all the pics. I kind of wanted to save it. They've done something atrocious with this tub surround, but they do still have the original tub and some of the original tile, and I love it. Oh, no, they fucked that all up, Randy. Yeah, that surround has to go. Sadly, I think the whole thing has to go. No, save the tub. This isn't like save the whales.

I mean, well, no, you could save that tub you're right it's savable you're right you're right calm down all right okay so you get the picture three dudes living in there it's like a little crawl space over there oh did you see any pictures of the basement that well i i saw like a little crawl space area. Okay, I didn't see any basement pics. Okay, so this is what I... I mean, I think there's probably like real creepy shit that happens through that hole.

Sure. But you know, every bungalow needs a glory hole. That's what I'm always saying. People have been saying there's not enough glory hole content on this podcast. They have noticed that and we will correct it today. Yeah. People have been saying there's not enough glory hole content on this podcast. They have noticed that and we will correct it today.

So Eric's friend Chaz. Oh, good. We have to bring a Chaz in. My God. Has there ever been a decent person named Chaz? No. No, you have to be a douchebag if your name is Chaz. That's the truth. Oh, yeah, because Chaz is short for Charles, right? And you just go like – if you're not a douche, you go by like Charles or Charlie or Charlene. I think that's short for Charles. Whatever.

I mean but to go by Chaz. Yeah. No, I insist on being called Chaz. Yeah. I went to high school with a Chaz. Yeah, and he was a douche. I'm not telling you something you don't know. No, you're not.

So Eric's friend Chaz's dad actually owned the place. Chaz's dad was a big-time real estate dude. I got very annoyed in the episode of Super Heist because Chaz was interviewed and he was like, yeah, my dad and I owned it. No, dude, you were 20 years old. Dude, my dad owns a dealership. Yes. Your dad is a big real estate guy. No, you did not own it.

Chaz. Chaz. Living up to your name. Also, we may have to cut this because I know it's not appropriate to say, but Chaz, I am telling you, looks like a guy who roofies every one screen. I mean, you would not believe this guy. Okay. He's got the look. Yeah, he's got the look. Shama na na na.

Did he have a popped collar? I mean, in 07, I'm sure he did. Yeah. But I'm telling you, if I saw this dude coming. Yeah. You'd put your hand right on top of the drink. Hand over the drink. I bet he thinks that that's just a thing people do.

Maybe he starts doing it too because he's like, I see everyone do this. Let's all cover our drinks. And he doesn't know that people are just looking at his face like, mm-mm. Anyway. So Chaz had a room in the bungalow. Eric had a room in the bungalow. Eric had a room in the bungalow and Warren rented the basement. Through that little tiny hole. He paid $200 to live in that basement.

I know. That doesn't sound great, right? No, it sounds terrible. You're going to love what he did with the place though. I'm sorry. What did he do? He put up some lights. He put up bed sheets to like create walls for his bedroom.

Cool. And he had a really nice mattress. On the floor. Yes. And a recliner that he got at Goodwill. And yeah, it was orange. Yeah. And naturally he had a big screen TV and a recliner that he got at Goodwill. And yeah, it was orange. And naturally, he had a big screen TV and a PlayStation. And he grew pot down there too.

Okay. So anyway. Sorry, I'm just dabbing. It wasn't long before the three guys decided that they should invite Chaz to be part of the heist. So they invited him down to the basement and laid out the plan and Chaz was like, you guys are idiots. This isn't going to fucking work. No. But the second they told him that they were talking about stealing books worth $12 million

surrounded by zero security, Chaz was like, ooh, okay, I'm in. They have underestimated B.J. Gooch. You think so? You think B.J. Gooch has some throwing stars? I was going to say she's a trained ninja. That's in fact what I was going to say. From there, the dudes got down to business.

They did stakeouts. They got down to business. They did stakeouts. They got blueprints. They watched Ocean's Eleven. They watched Snatched. They decided to pull off the heist. What? They watched Snatched?

Yeah, isn't that a film? Did I miswrite it? What? Is Snatched not a movie? It is, but I'm pretty sure that came out like in... Like Snatch? No! Oh. No, like that movie is about a kidnapping.

Uh-huh. And I think it came out like in 2018. No! Hang on. Snatched movie. Oh, that's with Amy Schumer. Hang on. Well, this can't be the first movie named Snatched. Are you thinking of a particular film?

Well, the Vanity Fair article, he couldn't have gotten that wrong. Hang on. hang on. I'm going to get to the bottom of this. Oh, I would be the one to get this wrong. Okay. Hold, please.

Oh, it's just snatch. Okay, snatch came out in the year 2000 man they loved a brad pitt movie didn't they yeah okay that's one where you can't hear what he's saying right you're asking me you can hear what he's saying he doesn't speak like any uh what's the word english English Dissertable words He just speaks like in slurred speech the whole time Is that right? Yeah, because he'd been snatched Don't go googling this

You're not going to find better information Than what I'm giving you right here I doubt that very much. So they watched Ocean's Eleven and they watched Snatch, not Snatch-ta, which came out ten years later. They decided to pull off the heist on Thursday, December 16th, the last day of final exams. It would be perfect. BJ Gooch wouldn't see it coming. No, because why would she?

Yeah. I mean, she's been at the library since like 94. Yeah. You know, just doing what has to be a pretty normal job. normal gerb. Yeah. Using the email account walter.beckman at yahoo.com, they made appointments at

Christie's and at the library with B.J. Gooch. By the way, they chose the last name Beckman because it sounded kind of like Beckham. And they liked David Beckham? No, they liked Posh Spice's husband. David Beckham? No, they liked Posh Spice's husband. David Beckham?

In this household. We refer to him as Posh Spice's husband. Mr. Posh Spice. Mr. Spice. I'm pleased to make your acquaintance. So on December 16th, they were ready for action. It was the day of the heist. This was what they'd been waiting for.

Are you ready? You don't look ready at all. I'm not. Yeah, and they kind of weren't either. Yeah, exactly. But no thought into this? Well, no, they put a lot of thought into it. They had ordered stun guns online.

But they didn't get there in time. No. So unreliable. So they just put forks in their pockets. They were like, that will have to do. No. They claimed they went out that day and got a stun pen. Oh, OK.

Kind of a little buzz. Yeah. Yeah. They just had to hope that it would bring down the gooch hard and fast. And that sounds like a stupid thing that I am saying, but in their plan, which was of course written up and saved, because why would you destroy? Bring down the gooch. Hard and fast. Hard and fast.

Okay. Excellent. They maybe didn't say the gooch, but, you know, the needed to be in there. So, you know, they've got their stun pen. It's the day of the crime. Now they needed to get into disguise. They disguised themselves as old men. That is stupid.

This is so stupid. Why is it stupid, Brandy? Because one look at them, you're going to be like, those are fucking college kids in disguise. It's like a jackass sketch. That never occurred to them. Okay. They thought, here was their thinking. Old people are invisible.

No one looks at old people. We will dress up as old people. Therefore, no one will look at us. That was their thinking. They made every one of these plans while they were high. Guaranteed. They glued facial hair to themselves. They put on gray wigs.

I was going to steal some books, but then I got high. I was gonna stun B.J. Goosh, but then I got high. I was gonna fly to Amsterdam and sell some books for 12 million dollars,

but then I got high. But then I got high. But then I got high. Da I got high but then I got high Randy, you predicted this perfectly. They looked ridiculous. They walked into the library thinking that they were invisible. Instead everybody just was like

why the fuck are there guys in costumes in here? Yeah, everyone turned and stared at them invisible. Instead, everybody just was like, why the fuck are there guys in costumes in here? Yeah. Everyone turned and stared at them because they were four 20-year-old guys who were clearly part of some theater troupe, right? So like, hmm, I wonder what they're about to do.

Clearly perform or something. Oh my gosh. Hey, look. There's going to be a sketch over there. They're going to do a sketch. They're going to do a sketch. The guys were devastated. They'd brought too much attention to themselves. They had to abort the mission, Brittany. Oh, no.

Yeah. And they were pro-life, so it was terrible. Sorry, that was such a stupid joke. So they went back home. They took off those stupid old man costumes and later that night warren reached out to bj gooch and apologized for missing his appointment he rescheduled the appointment for 11 a.m the next day then he bleached his hair that night night, they came up with a new plan. Warren would still be Walter Beckman. He would go in, subdue the gooch, and then Eric would come in and help him get all the books. Meanwhile, Spencer would be the lookout. He would be over in the athletic building

watching from afar using a stolen cell phone to communicate with them. Where did he get the stolen cell phone? Too soon to tell, he'd steal it that morning and use the phone during the heist. Okay. Chaz would drive the getaway vehicle, which was his mom's minivan, which luckily she planned to sell like later that day. Okay, great. which luckily she planned to sell like later that day.

Okay, great. For the occasion, Chaz took off the license plate and put on a fake temporary tag because movies. They had to get this right, Brandy. Warren's appointment was at 11 and he and Eric would have to work quickly because at 12.30 p.m., Chaz's mom needed the minivan back. And Spencer had his final exam in sociology, and Eric had his final exam in tennis. And you would think that a tennis final doesn't exist. Right. What is a tennis final?

That's not a class. I'll have you know it had more trivia on there than he was expecting, so he was thrown for a bit of a loop, all right? Okay. So the next day, Warren showed up for his appointment at the special collections room, and BJ Gooch greeted him. She was a little surprised. First off, Walter Beckman was much younger than she'd anticipated. Also, he was nervous. Why was he so nervous?

She began showing him the books that he'd asked to see, and Walter asked if he could invite a friend to come look at the books with him. And she was like, well, sure. So he made a quick phone call call and up comes the other guy. And BJ noticed that this other guy seemed even more nervous than the first guy. BJ could not understand why these two young men were such nervous Nellies. But it's not her place to judge. So she kept showing them the books in the episode of Super Heist.

Eric claims that he was upset because he had said from the beginning that he didn't want to harm BJ in any way. That would be all Warren. So he gets up there and sees BJ up walking around

and he's like, what? I'm going to have to help with this. And he's very upset. What the fuck ever. You could have walked out if you were really that upset. But he did not, of course. So Warren used the stun pen on BJ and BJ fell to the floor. Which is like a floor. Just more nasally.

It's native to Minnesota, these floors. I believe it comes from the French. The floor. And she screamed. Her heart was pounding so hard that she was afraid she would have a heart attack. Worse still, she knew that no one would be able to hear her screams because the special collections vault was soundproof. What is this?

You? Oh, yeah. I'm sorry. I was like, you what? Yeah. I mean, they bother to soundproof a vault. They do all this stuff. They don't have like some security guard.

That's ridiculous. Anyway, Eric zip-tied her hands and feet. They put a stocking cap over her head. And she says she told herself, I have to get through this. Just get to the other side of this. She was so scared. And at one point, Walter Beckman said to her, quit struggling, BJ, or do you want to feel more pain? And of course, that was pretty chilling, partly because BJ was what her friends and colleagues

called her. So she's like, how do these guys know me? Yeah. So she's like, how do these guys know me? With BJ tied up, Warren and Eric started loading their backpacks with books. They grabbed a first edition copy of Origin of Species by Charles Darwin, worth about $25,000. They grabbed what's called an illuminated manuscript, which looks very pretty. It's one of those, you know, like old-timey books that has like the painted border around it. So it's this gorgeous hand-painted book from 1425 worth about 200 grand. They grabbed American Ornithology worth about 40 grand, 20 Audubon pencil sketches worth about 50 grand. Then we get into some Latin words.

Complete Angler worth 110K. Viviparis Quadrupus of Naa, 225K. And of course, who could forget Hortus Cenitatis. 450K. I don't have to tell you. And of course, they grabbed Audubon's Birds of America. This was what they'd come here for. The engraved plates, 435 of them in total worth $12 million.

How wonderful. But, oh, fun fact. Turns out massive engraved plates are very heavy yeah this set weighed about 250 pounds jesus but you know they kind of knew it would be heavy and hard to work with so that's why there were two of them that's they've been getting their pump on no that's not they need a fucking dolly no dollies so warren and eric had their backpacks full of rare books and they wrapped the most prized possession in a sheet and each guy grabbed either side of it and they carried it out of the special collections room and into the staff only elevator meanwhile chas was in his mom's minivan just dying because this was taking forever. Yeah.

What was going wrong? Funny you should ask because elevators are tough. We all know this. How do you work an elevator? I still don't know. They put the up button and they needed to go down.

They got down to the basement but then they couldn't find an exit. So they got back on the elevator but oops, fudge stripes, they accidentally stopped on the main floor. So the doors of the staff elevator open up. And there they were, two 20-year-olds holding something very heavy with a sheet draped over it. And a woman named Susan Brown, who, according to one source, was the library director. According to another source, was an assistant librarian.

This seems like very different titles to me. I am titling her Badass Motherfucker. Oh, B-A-M-F. BAMF. Yeah. That's right. That's like Emeril with just like a little extra F. Oh, my God.

How much brain space does Emeril occupy? A lot. Have you ever fantasized about Emeril? No. Not in a sexual way. Yeah, you have. No.

No. The lady doth protest too much. So she spotted these two guys on the staff elevator and she's like, hmm, that was weird. So she decided to go check on BJ in the special collections room. Meanwhile, the guys were like, yikes, and they went back down to the basement, still couldn't find the exit. So then they went back up to the main floor and then they found a stairwell. And at this point, they stopped to catch their breath

because those Audubons were heavy. But they probably should have powered through because by this point, Susan Brown had gone up to check on BJ and found her hog-tied and terrified. Maybe not hog-tied. That's when they tie your feet to your... Yeah, but I love how that hog-tied and terrified... Shit.

That's the name of my... That's an album kit. Yeah. So BJ shouted to Susan that they'd been robbed. So Susan was pissed. She ran to the stairwell and spotted the guys taking a breather. And she screamed at them. And they were like...

Yeah. And they hauled ass out of the library, leaving the heavy and extremely valuable... Valuable books behind? Uh-huh. Yeah. Fuck.

You're idiots. Uh-huh. Eric blames Warren. But again, Warren wasn't interviewed for Superheist, so I bet you if he had been it would be Eric's fault. Yeah. Warren would be like, I have been in the gym working on my fitness and Eric had been just working on fitting triple Ps in his mouth.

Which is its own workout. But funny enough, not helpful when you're trying to carry autobahns down the staircase. Yeah, no, not helpful at all. Yeah. All right. Anyway, so Susan Brown gave those dudes a run for their money. She hauled ass after them. But Chaz was right there with his mommy's getaway van.

And he was watching the doors. And all of a sudden, boom, the doors burst open and eric and warren ran out of the library with susan hot on their heels but eric got in the van and warren dove into the band van band van what was it we don't know giant deodorant stick and they sped away. So the guys blew through red lights, sped past stop signs, and at one point, Warren rolled down his window, leaned his head out of the van, and he vomited down the side. Great. Hardened criminal. It was around this point that Chaz was like, guys, where are the Audubons?

And they were like, oh, cute story. You're going to love it. Those fuckers are so heavy. We dropped them. And Chaz was pissed. But they still had their backpacks full of stuff. They had, you know, all those books. And why would we name them again?

We don't need to. Everybody is clear on what they were. Absolutely. Because I said them perfectly. In total, they had about $725,000 worth of rare books. Worth it? No. That's nothing.

I thought they were getting 12 mil. Yeah. Is it worth it? No. That's nothing. I thought they were getting 12 mil. Yeah. So, I mean, that was the plan was to get like 12 mil and some extra stuff.

Instead, they just got the extra stuff. The extra stuff, which totals 750 grand. 25. 725. And that's like fair market value. And keep in mind there's four of them. Yeah. They got to split that. That is so not worth it.

My hair was all over the mic. I know. I was watching it sinking with despair. My locks are too luscious. It's true. Will you shave your head for the podcast? No. I am waiting for G.I. Jane 2.

Too soon, Kristen. Too soon. Don. Jane 2. Too soon, Kristen. Too soon. Don't smack me. Okay. So at this point, I am going to pause and warn everyone that from here on out, there's going to be a lot of white guy bullshit. Oh, good. Okay. First off, the author of this Vanity Fair piece refers to these guys as boys.

OK. Boys, boys, boys. I'm sorry. I'm not singing a song, although now I want to. Yeah. All they really want is boys. Oh, you went that route. With the wave hairdos, they want boys. No, that's not the route we're going. OK. We're going the route we're going. Oh, okay. We're going Britney Spears.

Oh. Boys, sometimes a girl just needs one. Boys, to love her and to hold. You're not really joining in. Are you not into the deep cut Britney tracks? I don't think I know this Britney song. Wow, what a loser. Okay.

So, see, I'm a loser. So I hate this because like we read true crime shit all the time. Very, very rarely do people over the age of 18 get referred to as do criminals over the age of 18 get referred to as – do criminals over the age of 18 get referred to as boys? Yeah. When it does happen, it's to a – Trying to downplay their guilt. Creamy little white boy. Yep. That sounds disgusting.

It is disgusting. So the author writes that Chaz believed that having three dudes in a midi van would look sketchy, so he dropped Warren and Eric off in front of what the author referred to as a, quote, predominantly black housing project. I would now like to read you a paragraph from the article. The two boys sought cover from the cops in the sprawling grounds of the housing projects, but before long they were put to chase once again, this time by two local thugs. Jesus! Uh-huh. Frightened and alone in an unfriendly neighborhood and weighed down with priceless books, Warren and Eric barreled down the street, frantically trying to hail a police cruiser to rescue them.

You're fucking kidding me. As they ran, they stumbled again into Chaz, who had returned in another car, as promised, just in time to save them and drive Eric to UK for his tennis class exam. That's stupid. So the boys were saved from the thugs. Yeah. That is such bullshit. That is such bullshit. That is such bullshit.

I feel like I should also mention all four of these guys had been arrested before. Not for anything major, but give me the biggest fucking break. Yeah. If we were talking about 20-year-old black guys. Yeah. They would not be referred to as boys in these articles. No, they sure wouldn't. Anyway. So word got out about the book heist.

It made the news. And that weekend, Warren, Spencer, Eric, and Chaz all went to New York City for their appointment at Christie's. They had to have been a little bummed because their Amsterdam buyer backed out of the deal. Yeah, because they don't have $12 million books like they promised. Yeah. They got less than a million. Yeah. We got less than a million.

Yeah. But the guys decided to keep their appointment at Christie's and just live it up while they were in New York. Because obviously they were going to have no trouble getting the other books appraised. Bull fucking shit. That night they stayed at the Midtown Hilton and got super drunk at a Japanese restaurant. In fact. In Hanna? No, I don't think so. At a Japanese restaurant.

In fact – No, I don't think so. Spencer knocked over a table full of drinks and got into a bar fight. And Warren and Chaz went to the China Club because they'd heard about it on the Chappelle Show, which is the most white boy 2007 thing I've ever heard. Sure is. Wait, is this 2007? No, it's like 2005. Anyway, don't worry about it it's fine time is a construct yeah the next day still very even more so 2005 the next day horribly hung over

the four dudes made their way to ground zero to pay their respects. Are you fucking serious? Okay, I'm not laughing about Ground Zero, obviously. But is that not the bro-iest thing? Yeah. Let's get, like, blackout drunk, and the next day, you know what we're going to do? Ground Zero. Yeah. Never forget.

Jesus. Their appointment at Christie's was on a Tuesday, and they decided that Chaz and Eric would wait around the block in an SUV with the books, and Warren and Spencer would go in and interact with the Christie's people. For the appointment, Warren wore a suit that his parents bought him to wear on job interviews. Great. And Spencer wore a gigantic yellow blazer that had once belonged to his grandfather. What? He paired it, hang on, with a gold silk scarf and white sneakers. He looked ridiculous.

So Warren and Spencer walked into Christie's and they were greeted by a woman named Melanie Halloran. And Warren was like, hello, I'm Mr. Williams. And Spencer was like, hello, I'm Mr. Stevens. Which is the weirdest thing. Do you think like rich, fancy people don't? No, they have first names. Yeah. Don't tell me. They told Melanie that they were the sole representatives of Walter Beckman, who is a very private individual from Boston.

But 100 percent real. Very, very real. We represent a Mr. Macintosh. Melanie was stunned by these two. I mean, can you imagine the types of people she usually interacts with? First off, they were super young. One of them was wearing a jacket that was like two sizes too big for him. It looked like it came from the thrift store.

And she was like, okay, let's see the books. Sure. And Spencer was like one second and he ran outside and he came back in with two red wheelie suitcases full of books. This story is so ridiculous. So they showed her the books and she was like, OK, thank you. And after about 30 minutes, she said, OK, well, I'm going to talk it over with some of the higher ups here and I'll get back in touch with you about the value of these items. And the guys were like, cool. Yeah, OK.

What they didn't know. He said she's going to call the police the minute they leave there. No, no, not exactly. What they didn't know was that Melanie thought they were total sketchballs. And she immediately told her boss, you know, seems like there's something up with these guys. I don't think we should do business with them. But Spencer and Warren

didn't know that. They got in the van with Eric and Chaz and they were like, it went great! We totally pulled it off! Yeah! And Chaz and Eric were like, okay, so how did you agree to get back in contact with them? And Spencer was like, oh, I gave them my number.

And they were like, you did what? You gave her your real phone number? Jesus. So one that can be traced back to you? And Spencer was like, yes, I did. Sure did. Chaz blew up. He was like, you guys are all idiots.

I don't care what it takes. Wherever she wrote down your number, you need to go back in there and just get it. And Spencer and Warren were like, we can't do that. No can doozles. Chaz and Eric were like, we can't do that. No can doozles. Jess and Eric were freaking out. Like this is going to be the thing that gets us. Yes. But they went back to Lexington hoping to hear from Christie's and hoping that their

payday would come through soon. Meanwhile, investigators were working the case. Funny thing is investigators initially thought that they were dealing with professionals. OK. Thank you. Exactly. For the life of me, I do not understand how they thought they were dealing with professionals. Like I passed the gooch.

No one gets past the gooch. Except for those two dudes. I mean seriously. They for those two dudes. I mean, seriously, they're clearly very young. They drop the most valuable thing when Susan tracks them down. Susan Brown! Badass

motherfucker! I mean, that's what I'm saying. Susan's a librarian by trade and she almost caught them. Like like what the hell you're seriously underestimating librarians here kristin no i'm just saying like they are she's got a particular set of skills yeah exactly you know some people get pumped up for jesus librarians pumped up for books i mean mean, yes, that's true. All right.

You know what? I was going to argue with you, but maybe you get the adrenaline pumping at the thought of like somebody stole the books. Yeah. It must protect books. That's why you've been tackled so many times in front of rainy day books. That's right. so many times in front of rainy day books. That's right.

I've got my picture up in bookstores all over this town. So they were kind of worried because Transylvania had some surveillance footage, but it was black and white and super grainy. All it told you was that these guys were shaped like humans. The one thing they knew was that the thieves had used an email address to set up the appointment with BJ Gooch. So investigators sent a preservation freeze letter, which sounds redundant to me, to Yahoo saying, hey, freeze this email account. They also served a search warrant on Yahoo to try to get the other emails that had been sent from the account. Ten days later, Yahoo sent them a CD with all the information, all the emails, IP addresses. And I kind of love this. Again, they thought they were

dealing with professionals. They thought, why are we even bothering to track down this email address? No one would be stupid to do anything more than just email the librarian about this. Well, no. They're meeting at Christie's. Exactly. So investigators went to Christie's and Melanie was waiting there. And she's like, yeah, I was kind of thinking you guys might contact me. Melanie was super helpful.

She handed over Spencer's very real phone number and showed them the Christie's surveillance footage, which was nice. I mean, you could see everything. And they did a search warrant on the phone number and, of course, traced it back to Spencer Reinhardt, a student at Transylvania. Did they still have the books? Did Christie's still have the books? Well, no, they didn't. The guys didn't give Christie's the books. Oh, they didn't leave the books?

No. Oh. No, you don't leave them. I thought that's what she said. You leave these here. Oh, no, no, no. It was like, we'll get back to you with the figures. Okay, great.

Wonderful. No, they put them back in their red wheelie bags. Perfect. Perfect and perfect. Yes. red wheelie bags. Perfect. Perfect and perfect. Yes. Sergeant Pat Murray, who was interviewed on Super Heist, was like,

this shot to heck, my theory of it being a professional. Yeah. Sure did, didn't it? Shot it clear to heck. Clear to heck. H-E-C-K. According to the Vanity Fair article, once they had Spencer's name, they did a search and came across a photo of him that had run in the local newspaper in like 2002. And he was playing soccer against Warren.

So they had the footage from Christie's. So they have this photo of like, oh, my God, these are the two guys. Yeah. Now, the episode of Super Heist had this a little different way. And I kind of like this story, too. So I'm including it. They said that Sergeant Pat Murray had a son Spencer's age and he'd gone to school with Spencer. And so his son became a confidential informant on this case.

Oh, Jesus. And he was the one who was like, well, you know, if Spencer's involved in something, then he had to have done it with his BFF Warren. Yeah. So anyway, I like both stories and I won't play favorites. I won't. I wouldn't ask you to. Either way, they found Spencer and Warren. And from there, it didn't take a genius to find Eric and Chaz.

Chaz had been locked up for roofing a bunch of people. That's not true. That's not true. It's not true. By this point, it was February of 2005, and the Lexington police and the FBI were tag-teaming this thing, surveilling the four dudes. And they weren't subtle about it. The guys knew they were being watched, and they did not handle the pressure well. Warren got caught stealing a TV dinner from the grocery store. What?

I know. That's the saddest sentence I've ever read. Well, I mean, that's how they brought down Robert Durst. He stole that sandwich. What? Robert Durst was arrested for stealing a sandwich. Was that how they got him? Stealing a sandwich?

Stealing a sandwich from the grocery store. Yes. Well, that is. It's like a $9 sandwich or some shit. That's the worst thing I've ever heard because grocery store sandwiches are disgusting. Yeah, almost as bad as that tuna that Norm had from Hudson News. You know what? We have decided to blame the victim on that one.

You buy a tuna sandwich from Hudson News. Whatever happens to your body afterward is your own fault. Also, Eric was arrested for driving drunk with Warren on top of the car. Like, Jesus. Yeah. Spencer, in what appears to have been an unrelated accident, but I guess I don't technically know, crashed his car. And Chaz seems to be the only one staying out of the trouble. By the way, at this point, there was a clear rift in the friend group.

Warren and Eric and Spencer were really good friends. They didn't really like Chaz. And it seems Chaz didn't really like them because he thought they were all dumb potheads. And it seems Chaz didn't really like them because he thought they were all dumb potheads. And I don't blame him because if I joined in on a heist and they dropped the $12 million stuff, I'd be pissed. And left their real phone number with Christy. Anyway, one day when they were all under surveillance, Warren and Spencer and Eric went to see a movie together. It was Snatch. They got into a time machine.

Jesus. It was Ocean's Twelve. Really? Yeah. Oh, my God. So they're in the movie theater. Did they arrest him in the movie theater? No.

OK. But you're going to love it. OK, great. So they're watching the movie. They're laughing. They're like, oh, that part's just like us. They're saying to each other, oh, that part's like you. Oh, my God.

They didn't realize that FBI agents were sitting in the row behind them listening to the whole thing. So stupid. So investigators knew they had the right people and they were kind of afraid of what the guys would do with the books. Yeah. So on February 11th, 2005, they took action. It was 610 a.m. All the dudes were asleep in the house. Not a creature was stirring, not even a mouse.

When a SWAT team, boom, broke down the front door with a battering ram. Fuck yes. Did they come in through the windows too? Yes. Just like that movie. Yeah. What movie am I thinking of? Christmas.

Christmas Vacation. Thank you. National Lampoon's Christmas Vacation. Also, okay, one of the articles said they blasted stun grenades in the house. What does that even mean? Flashbangs. Flashbang boom. Just scary times.

Not going to hurt you, but just scare the shit out of you. All right. That'd do it. Chaz, God bless him, woke up to this commotion. Jesus. And thought they were being robbed. Chaz! My dude!

But, like, I mean, there were literally, like, 20. He tried to rookie the police. He was like, everybody get in a line. Gather around the punch bowl. No, I should clarify. Chaz, that's not fair. So he thinks they're being robbed by like a very organized team, I guess. Not as like the SWAT vests, the clearly marked vests they wear?

No. So he got up in his flannel jammies, which in Vanity Fair, the author made a point of mentioning that they were high-end jammies. Of course they were. And he grabbed a gun. Jesus. And aimed it at the intruders. Okay. What?

What? You ready? Nothing. Uh-huh. I don't have anything to ready? Uh-huh. I don't have anything to say. Uh-huh. At that moment, he saw FBI written on one of the guy's hats. But he did not lower his weapon. He's like, I see one of those female body inspectors. Yeah.

Am I right? Me too, my boy. The SWAT team yelled, police, police, drop your gun. And Chaz didn't. He was frozen in shock with his gun aimed at them. So clearly white. Yep. And they didn't shoot him.

Yep. In some of the interviews, the guys were like, whoa, I can't believe he didn't get shot. Yeah. White privilege. Yep. In some of the interviews, the guys were like, whoa, I can't believe he didn't get shot. Yeah. White privilege. Yep. Like that should be the first thing. Mm-hmm. White privilege is why he was not shot.

Yeah. So, you know, instead he just like lowered – like he got out of the shock. Yeah. He's like, oh, shit. These are actually police officers here. I should probably. Yeah. Comply.

Meanwhile, officers went down to that stinky basement and arrested Warren. I'm just assuming it stank down there. Yeah, I'm sure it did. And in a duffel bag next to his floor mattress, they found all the missing books. As this was happening, Spencer was also arrested in his dorm at Transylvania University. So all four of these guys were brought to the station and interrogated and they all confessed. The prosecutor offered them leniency if they would agree to testify against one another. But none of them wanted to do that.

Two months later, what? I mean, you probably don't – if they're all confessing, you probably don't need anybody to testify against anyone. So I was a little confused by that too but here's what I'm thinking. Oftentimes people will confess and then – Yeah, but they still plead not guilty. Yeah. Yeah.

I think that's a pretty reasonable assumption about these rich white dudes. Yes. But two months later, all four of them pled guilty to six federal charges, including robbery, conspiracy, and theft of major artwork. Is it an assault charge for B.J. Gooch? I didn't write down all of their charges, but we're going to get to B.J. I don't like what happens here. Okay. All right.

I'll keep my pants on for now. I'm prepared to take them off, though. They are the terror wake up. Yeah, that's right. Their sentencing hearing took place in December of 2005 and it lasted nine hours. The prosecutor asked that Eric Chaz and Spencer get 11 to 14 years and Warren get 14 to 17 years. Shit. Had been the ringleader.

Okay. What are your thoughts? That's a lot of time. That's way more time than I would have thought. What do you think is appropriate? Three to five. Okay. Yeah.

I think they need more than a slap on the wrist, but wow. Okay. So the way they calculate like the federal sentencing guidelines on this is like the value of the works you stole and whether you inflicted harm on someone. Yeah. And so the prosecution was arguing like they stole like I think like $13 million worth of stuff and they inflicted bodily harm on BJ Gooch. The prosecutors also submitted documents they found in which the guys wrote down all the details about the crime including their nicknames for each other.

Apparently in the film Reservoir Dogs. Oh, yeah. Mr. Pink. Yes. Yes. So they gave each other colors. Chaz was Mr. Pink and he was not happy about yeah. Mr. Pink. Yes. Yes. So they gave each other colors. Chaz was Mr. Pink and he was not happy about it. Wonderful. Which apparently is just like

in the movie. I don't remember. Have you seen the film? I think I was forced to because I think like every guy in Boston around that time was obsessed with that movie so I think it was one of the... Tarantino film.

Snooze, anyway. Another factor at the sentencing is the well-known fact that one does not fuck with librarians, Brandi, so don't even try it. I told you that. I told you that librarians are awesome. And when other

librarians found out what these men had done to BJ, they wrote letters to the judge asking her to not be lenient. BJ told the court about her experiences and talked about how terrified she'd been. She said she didn't think anyone understood how much this crime had affected her. So much that she had to release that rap album, Hogtied and Terrifying. BJ Gooch! Yeah. Album, Hogtied and Terrifying. BJ Gooch! Yeah.

Yeah. And, man, it's still good. It is. You know, you'd think it'd be dated. It holds up. She said, I felt like a non-factor in all of this until my single dropped.

The defense focused on the value of the works that were stolen and the harm inflicted on BJ. So, you know, like I said, two factors, the value of the stolen goods and the harm inflicted. Yeah. Those are what kind of affect sentencing. So the defense pointed out that they used a stun pen, not a stun gun. But, of course, the prosecution was like, well, we don't know that it was a stun pen. We think it might have been a stun gun, you know, blah, blah, blah. So there's kind of some argument over that.

I mean, it's a stun anything, potato, potato. Well, but a stun gun is going to deliver more shock than a stun pen. So, you know, more or less harm. Yeah, yeah, you get it, right? I mean, I get it. You don't like it. No, I mean I get it. I'm just saying. You don't like it. No, I don't like it.

All right. The defense also argued, you know, they never made it out of the building with the most valuable books. So do those ones even count? Yes, they count. They attempted to steal them. That's how I feel too. Yeah. Warren's lawyer, Adele Brown, argued that her client was not the ringleader.

She said they were all equally responsible. He was just the one that was out front at Transylvania and at Christie's. He's personable and talkative and had the interpersonal skills more so than the others. Don't punish him for being awesome. Yeah, OK. Judge Jennifer Kaufman said that, first off, each of the men were equally culpable and that the value of the stolen goods should only include those that were taken from the building. Really? I think that's bullshit.

I knew too. They stole them from that little – Yeah. Special collections. Soundproof booth. Yeah. So the value wouldn't include the Audubons that Eric and Warren had dropped in the stairwell. She also pointed out that BJ Gooch didn't suffer any bodily injury.

Don't care. Well. She suffered harm. No one asked you, though. I am just inserting my opinion here. With that, the judge sentenced each of the men to seven years in prison. It was the minimum amount of time that could be given under federal sentencing guidelines. Wow.

So, the Vanity Fair article ends with this sentencing hearing and goes into detail about how none of the guys have any regrets. They don't? That's what they said. No regerts? No regerts. The article ends with a quote from Warren, which I will read to you now. Fuck bitches get money. In a few years, we'll be released.

We'll all be still young. We will be stronger, better, wiser for going through this together, the three of us. Before, in college, growing up, we were being funneled into this mundane nickel-and-dime existence. Now we can't ever go back there. Even if we wanted to, they won't let us. That was the point all along. See, we have no choice now but to create something new someplace else. Believe me, you haven't heard the last of us yet.

Jesus. Yeah. Fuck off. What a gigantic douchebag. Yeah. That dude learned nothing. No, and I understand that maybe BJ wasn't severely physically harmed, but that had to be terrifying for her. And just say you have no regrets after all that. Yeah, that's ridiculous. And also – also people have a very lighthearted view of this and I get that because it is so fucking stupid. Seems like a victimless crime.

But it's like, again, if these guys hadn't been white, this would have turned out so differently. Yeah. You point a gun at the people who get into your house. Yeah, that's not going to end well. No. So according to Warren, after this Vanity Fair article came out, prosecutors saw it and thought that he exhibited an extreme lack of remorse. I wonder how they got that idea. And as a result, he was put in solitary confinement for four months.

Jesus. I know. That seems harsh. months. I know. That seems harsh. Newspaper articles from this time say that BJ Gooch sued all four of the men for unspecified damages. I couldn't find a follow-up on that.

So let's just hope she got a nice settlement out of court. $725,000. Yeah. I want more than that. I know. But that would be kind of funny. Yeah. Twelve million.

Yeah. There you go. But we're not done here. What's Warren been up to now? Oh, well, first off, you should know that even though these guys got pretty lenient sentences under the guidelines, they were not pleased. So they appealed their sentences and they won. They argued that the judge had made a sentencing error and the appellate court agreed. The court said that the judge had indeed made a sentencing error. She hadn't given them enough time.

Yes! The appellate court was like, yeah, the judge messed up. Judge Alice Batchelder wrote, the government argues that the district court erred by considering only the objects actually removed from the library building and tabulating the loss for its sentencing calculation. We agree. You know, I'm realizing 10 minutes ago I was like, well, that seems like a lot of time. Three to five years is probably what they deserve. But hearing his cavalier attitude after – here's the thing. I'm kind of with you too.

Like seven years does seem like quite a bit. Yeah. And I should also clarify like I don't want anyone to get shot when they pull a gun. But like I think it's just these guys are so obnoxious about it. Yeah. That's the problem. I don't see any remorse. No, exactly.

So the four guys went back in front of Judge Jennifer Kaufman to be re-sentenced. They were facing an additional two to four years. All of them told the judge, we are so sorry. We're more mature now. Please don't give us additional time. And Assistant U.S. Attorney David Marr said, Judge,, we are so sorry. We're more mature now. Please don't give us additional time. And Assistant U.S. Attorney David Marr said, Judge, I'm not really sorry. This is just an act.

And he brought out the article from Vanity Fair. And he was like, read this. You'll see that they aren't really sorry. They have no regrets. And the judge was like, well, they weren't under oath when they did the Vanity Fair interviews. So I'm not going to consider that. Wow. I know. Okay. weren't under oath when they did the vanity fair interviews so i'm not going to consider that wow i know okay and she asked them all again if they were remorseful and they said yes and she didn't give them any more time hmm yeah again i'm i kind of think seven years is like fine i don't know that you need a whole lot more time for something like this. But no, they said how they felt in that Vanity Fair article.

Now hopefully over time – so they're out of prison now and hopefully they've matured. In 2018, a movie came out about the book heist called American Animals I've never heard of it who's in it? I don't know anybody good? people human men

show me the cast oh no I was like oh oh, my God. Did they play themselves? No. Evan Peters played Warren. That's the only one I recognize.

It's the only name I recognize. Anyway, so they did a bunch of press for the movie and some of them expressed remorse. Yeah. Chris is making a, what? A hand motion. You guys can guess which one it is. And that's the story

of the Transy book heist. Wow. Did you hate it? It was stupid. Those guys are stupid. I loved it. It was so stupid. But,

oh man, I love a good heist. I love one when no one's seriously hurt. Yeah, I mean, that is nice to have a little lighthearted case in here. You say that like, I mean, I guess if we have to eat zucchini, we will. I love zucchini. I was just. It's a terrible example.

Oh, my God. Hate heist, love zucchini. I was just... It's a terrible example. Oh, my God. Hate heist, love zucchini. I guess if we have to have a little avocado on the nachos, we will. There we go. Gotcha. You know what I'd like to do now? Now we can go to the Discord. All right.

Let's see if we have any questions there. There were some Discord issues earlier. You know, to get into our Discord, you just sign up for our Patreon at the $5 level or higher. Oh, how do you get into the Discord, Kristen? I should have said that before you said all of that. You really messed up. I did. And I will never forgive you.

That's okay. You're about like Spencer leaving his real phone number behind at Kristen's. Jess was stunned. Says, I've been feeling like poo-poo butter the past couple days. What do you do to try feeling better when you feel like poo-poo butter? Brandy, I fully expect you to have a very specific regimen. I do. What do you do?

This is what you do. You take a really hot shower, right? Because no matter what you're feeling, it's going to make you feel better. If you've got stuffy head, that steam is going to help. If you've got achy muscles, the hot water pouring over you is going to help. If you stink, it's going to help. All these things. Fun fact about showers.

Showers help. And then you get yourself a room temperature Sprite and some saltine crackers. Why room temperature? Because that's how you do it. Don't question my process. Why room temperature? Because that's how you do it. Don't question my process. Okay. Yeah.

So I have not been feeling well for the past couple days. I had a Sprite. I do think Sprite. There's some magic going on there. I did not get room temperature though. Room temperature Sprite and saltines. No. Also, my family as a whole has never found a problem that ibuprofen couldn't fix in some way. I agree.

London, not feeling great today. Poor little baby. She's never been sick and she just feels – she just doesn't feel good. She didn't want to eat dinner. She's just sitting on the couch. David sent me a picture. She's just sitting by herself with a blanket on, which she's never done ever. So yeah, we gave her

Motrin. And threw her in the shower. No, but I wouldn't. David did give her crackers, but he doesn't like saltines, so he for sure gave her townhouse crackers. That's not the right answer. When saltines are what's going to fix it. I'm going to have to go home and remedy this situation. I know.

Also, you put a saltine in your mouth and then you take a sip of room temperature. Gross. Why are you like this? High Priestess of Costco wants to know, did your parents ever give you the sex talk? Yeah, my parents had a conversation about how condoms

don't work like one in 50 times or something like that. And so like, if you were going to jump out of an airplane and there was a one in 50 chance that your parachute wouldn't open, would you still do it? And I've still never had sex. That's a dog that stuck with you to this day. That's right. Yeah, when I was around that age, my mom was a school nurse, and Kyla and I had to watch all of the growth and development videos under the guise of help me find what's the best one. They were all terrible. Did you watch the one that showed you an erection like in thermo view? Yeah. We had to watch that in health class in high school and I had an old man gym teacher as my health teacher.

And so he was very uncomfortable and so he fast-forwarded it. And so we just saw in very quick time a boner and then it went right back down. I also had that guy. You did? He was terrible. He was terrible. I also had that guy. You did?

He was terrible. He was terrible. He told us that toxic shock syndrome was something that we didn't need to worry about because it happened with a specific brand of tampons in the 80s. That's not accurate. No. He was not the best. Michael the Mandelflarn asks, is the idea of a chef tasting menu where it's multiple courses and the chef picks all the food without your say-so your absolute nightmare, Brandy? That would be my dream. I love it.

I know. I actually think that sounds pretty cool and I could eat around things that I don't want. Actually, for the wedding, we're getting to do something kind of similar to this. Did I tell you what they do? Maybe you did, but go ahead. Oh, my gosh. Okay, so our venue. tell you what they do?

Maybe you didn't, but go ahead. Oh my gosh. Okay, so our venue, like for our dinner, like for our tasting, the chef is sending us a questionnaire that we fill out about all the places we like to eat, what we like to eat, what we don't like. And then the chef is then

custom making a menu for us to taste and then we will give him our notes and he will adjust it to our liking for the wedding that's awesome it's so fucking cool so you're like our favorites are olive garden uh-huh tgi fridays dressing i like the tgi fridays mozzarella sticks apple bees this is going to be a very highbrow wedding. No, I think we're going to have one fancy dinner.

Fancy dinner. Yeah. How fancy will it be? It's going to be pretty fancy. Hmm. Okay. I will put a top hat on both my tits and I'll get a bra that fits by that time. You're giving me a few months.

Yeah. You got to get a bra that fits by then. This is driving me crazy. I've got to go. Look at this. I know. I can see. You know, mine's sitting right here against my breastbone as it's supposed to. Mine is sticking out.

Okay. How long is my thumb? Yeah. That's not doing anything. Those tits are free floating in there. Free, free falling. Yeah, all right. You got droopy tooties.

Oh, you know what? I just remembered that Danny messaged us earlier in the week. Happy anniversary to Danny and their husband. Oh, congratulations. Yes. A round of applause. Yes. Oh. A round of applause. Yes.

When I say a round of applause, you're supposed to join me in applauding. Wow. I'm doing it in a round. Sorry, Danny. She ruined it. I did it. Richard in Balls asks, what does your ideal rainy day look like? I would curl up with a blanket, a good book, and a cat and read the day away. I like the idea of the blanket and the curling up.

I watch horror movies though on rainy days. Oh, God. Yeah. I like it. No, thank you. What? Did you just say Picasso at me? Yeah. That wasn't scary it's a tiktok thing okay anyway what's your ideal rainy day oh just like getting drilled just kidding

no here's the truth i realized my answer would be very boring. It would be like curl up on the couch with some food, with the dogs. Yeah. Maybe read a book. Maybe watch some movies. That's what you do. Yeah, but more exciting answers. You would get bent over the end of your couch. Yeah.

And get banged. By someone. Who knows who? Who knows who? Who knows? Wait, what? What? What do you got?

Steer Queer Y'all says, Brandy, are Hey Dudes a hair salon thing? My mom got me a pair for Christmas because everyone at her salon is wearing them. Are they a hair salon? Well, they're really comfy and you can stand in them all day. Oh, okay. So, I mean, I guess maybe. Your people, along with nurses, are the reason for Crocs, OK. So I mean – So then yes. I guess maybe. Your people along with nurses are the reason for Crocs. So –

I did wear Crocs in cosmetology school. Yeah, you had no choice. It was like part of the – Yeah. How did your feet smell after a day in Crocs? Probably not great. I wore – no, I didn't. I was going to say I wore socks with my Crocs? Probably not great. I wore... No, I didn't. I was going to say I wore socks with my crocs, but I don't think I did.

That would be hilarious. I mean, not that it would make that much... Well, people do all kinds of crazy shit. Yeah. I got London some crocs this weekend. Yeah. They're black and white, kind of tie-dye-y. They're really cute. But they're small in size. You sound amazing.

It's like one size too big for her, so she's got to grow into them this summer. Yeah. Anyway, this is riveting material. That's something to look forward to for sure. Yep. Hot chick with bad allergies. I like this idea. What?

Okay. Have you ever considered reading posts from the Am I the asshole or relationship advice subreddits and giving your reactions on a Zoom video. I love that. Let's do that for our next Zoom call. Okay. That sounds awesome. Yeah, no, that's a great idea.

Love it. Love it. All right, should we move on to Supreme Court induction? Yeah, let's do some Supreme Court inductions. Obviously, we are continuing to read your names and your favorite cookies to get inducted on this podcast. All you have to do is join our Patreon at the $7 level or higher. That's the Supreme Court level and the Bob Moss level. Wow.

Made Bob Moss sound kind of lame. No, Bob Moss is super cool. Yeah, definitely. Obviously. Carrie. Pepperidge Bob Moss is super cool. Yeah, definitely. Obviously. Carrie. Pepperidge Farm Bordeaux cookies. What are those? They sound sexy.

I don't know. They do sound sexy. Don't they sound sexy? My goodness. Reham. White chocolate macadamia nut. Karen Decker. White chocolate macadamia.

Oh, shit. Cat Hire. The ooey gooey s'more cookie from Yummy. What's Yummy? I don't know, but it sounds yummy. God. Jim C. Red velvet cookies with cream cheese frosting.

That sounds good, too. Melissa Chavez. Girl Scout Thin Mints. Theodore Cameron. It sounds like you have to say it that way, Theodore. Yes. Yes. Empire Biscuits It sounds like you have to say it that way, Theodore Yes Empire Biscuits They're made with two Scottish shortbread cookies

Sandwiched together with jam And iced with either a cherry Or a sweetie on top Oh, shit, Theodore Kelly Butler Stroopwafel But it must be made with honey and not gross-ass caramel. Mmm.

Alright, Kelly. Alright. Allison LaRosa Flick Costco Double Chocolate Chip Megan Coates Iced Sugar Cookies from the Baking Grounds Amanda Watson Russian Tea Cakes

Elementary, my dear! Sorry. Jess Neville. Confetti cookies. Darling. Shortbread cookie. Lauren Jordan. Soft, fresh molasses cookie.

Claire Derwent. Chocolate hobnabs. On your bobnab. That sounds like a handjob. No, it doesn't. It does. A hobnob sounds like a handjob. No, it doesn't. It does. A hobnob sounds like a handjob. Lauren Boswell.

Anything from Crumble. They made a cookie that was a peach cobbler and came in an actual mini pie tin. That's not a cookie. That's a pie. That sounds wonderful. That does sound delicious. Welcome to the Supreme Court. My voice cracked in there.

And I sounded super cool. You just hit puberty. That's right this minute. Thank you, everyone, for all of your support. We appreciate it so much. If you're looking for other ways to support us, please find us on social media, on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, Reddit, Patreon. Please remember to subscribe to the podcast wherever you listen. And then head on over to Apple Podcasts and leave us a five-star

rating and review. And then be sure to join us next week when we'll be experts on two whole new topics. Podcast adjourned! And now for a note about our process. I read a bunch of stuff, then regurgitate it all back up in my very limited vocabulary.

And I copy and paste from the best sources on the web, and sometimes Wikipedia. So we owe a huge thank you to the real experts. I got my info from Majoring in Crime by John Falk for Vanity Fair, Secrets of the Transy Book Heist episode of Super Heist, and reporting from the Lexington Herald-Leader. I got my info from an episode of Dateline entitled Internal Affairs. An episode of Snapped, ChillingCrimes.com, Murderpedia, and The Court Record. For a full list of our sources,

visit LGTCpodcast.com. Any errors are, of course, ours, but please don't take our word for it. Go. Read their stuff.