Let's Go To Court! - 239: A Bank Robbery & SoHo Karen

Episode Date: December 14, 2022

A gunman rushed into the Texas Commerce Bank, barking orders. He wore a mask. He disguised his voice. Bank tellers Kelly McGinnis and Lisa Silvas were terrified. It had finally happened. The bank was being robbed. The young tellers had asked management to increase security measures. But management said that the motor bank, which only provided drive-thru service, was secure enough. The gunman proved them wrong. Then Kristin tells us about Keyon Harrold and his 14-year-old son, Keyon Harrold Jr, who were staying at the Arlo SoHo Hotel on December 26, 2020. That morning, they headed down to the hotel’s restaurant for brunch. On the way there, an irate woman accused Keyon Harrold Jr of stealing her cell phone. When Keyon Harrold Senior told her to back off, she chased after them, tackling 14-year-old Keyon to the ground. A video of the incident went viral. People dubbed the woman SoHo Karen, though her true identity quickly became known. Her name was Miya Ponsetto, and she wasn’t very sorry. And now for a note about our process. For each episode, Kristin reads a bunch of articles, then spits them back out in her very limited vocabulary. Brandi copies and pastes from the best sources on the web. And sometimes Wikipedia. (No shade, Wikipedia. We love you.) We owe a huge debt of gratitude to the real experts who covered these cases. In this episode, Kristin pulled from: Keyon Harrold’s Instagram “Woman pleads guilty to tackling Black teen she wrongly accused of phone theft,” by Jonathan Edwards for The Washington Post “Miya Ponsetto, woman who falsely accused Black teen of stealing her phone at NYC hotel, makes plea deal,” by Zoe Christen Jones for CBS News “Woman who tackled Black teenager at SoHo hotel is arrested,” by Mihir Zaveri for The New York Times “Woman who falsely accused Black teen in SoHo is charged with hate crime,” by Precious Fondren for The New York Times “Woman pleads guilty to tackling Black teen at SoHo hotel,” by Ed Shanahan for The New York Times “Parents of the teen who Miya Ponsetto falsely accused say her arrest is the first step for justice,” CBS This Morning video on YouTube “‘SoHo Karen’ is no-show in civil case, shows ‘disrespect’: judge,” by Tamar Lapin for the New York Post “Jazz musician calls for charges against woman who falsely accused Black son of theft,” by Haley Yamada and Sabina Ghebremedhin for ABC News “Video emerges of ‘SoHo Karen’ Miya Ponsetto fighting with cops during DUI bust,” by Rebecca Rosenberg for the New York Post Miya Ponsetto’s interview with Gayle King for CBS This Morning on YouTube In this episode, Brandi pulled from: “The Almost Great Bank Robbery” by Skip Hollandsworth, Texas Monthly “True Crimes: Don’t Mess With Texas (Banks)” by Kara Kovalchik, Mental Floss “Ex-cop, bank robber in trouble again” by Guillermo Contreras, mysanantonio.com “Sentencing delayed for former SAPD officer turned bank robber” KENS 5 News YOU’RE STILL READING? My, my, my, you skeezy scunch! You must be hungry for more! We’d offer you some sausage brunch, but that gets messy. So how about you head over to our Patreon instead? (patreon.com/lgtcpodcast). At the $5 level, you’ll get 40+ full length bonus episodes, plus access to our 90’s style chat room!  

One semester of law school. One semester of criminal justice. Two experts. I'm Kristen Caruso. I'm Brandi Pond. Let's go to court. On this episode, I'll be talking about the Soho Karen. And I'll be talking about a bank robbery.

Oh, I love a bank robbery. I know you do. Oh my gosh. This is a gift to you, Kristen. Oh, thank you. Are there die packets exploding? Are there? Is there a getaway vehicle?

Oh, wouldn't you like to know? Cheap wigs. Bad facial hair. You're not giving anything away. I'm not. I'm not going to tell you anything until I tell you the story. Hey, couldn't help but notice as I entered your Delmasile today that you've decorated for Christmas and it looks wonderful. Thank you.

Did you see? I can't remember if this was on our Discord or where. Plugs, plugs all around. Yeah. Someone was like, does anyone else think it's weird that Brandy knocks on Kristen's door? Yes. Okay. It was in the fan group on the Facebook.

Do you think it's weird? No, I don't think it's weird because your door is locked. Right. What, am I busting in like the Kool-Aid man? Exactly. No, we keep our doors locked. Yeah. That's why I have to knock.

Okay. No, I don't think it's weird at all. All right. I was truly stunned that someone else was stunned, and then I wondered if I was the freak. No, I don't think so. Turns out they're the freak. They're the freak. Hello, freak.

Welcome to the episode where we make fun of you directly. That's correct. Brandy, what's going on with you? What's new? What's poppin'? Well, it was almost Christmas time, and we put up our Christmas tree. What song was that? That's the beginning of Christmas shoes. There I stood in another line. Trying to find that last gift or two.

Okay, we get it. Not really in the Christmas mood. Everyone's gonna do all the work we put into these cases for nothing, because everyone's turning it off right now. Terrible. Alright.

I saw a boy in front of me. How about you do a plug for our Patreon? Oh yeah, we got a Patreon. You can find it at patreon.com slash lgtcpodcast. There you will find all kinds of extra content that you could enjoy. There are 41 bonus episodes. Boy, if this doesn't work, I don't know what will.

We got 41 meaty boy bonus episodes over there. All you got to do to enjoy those is join at the $5 level or higher. That'll also get you into the Discord where you can chitty chat the day away. If anybody asks you your age, sex, or location, please run. I don't know where I'm going from there. I was going to say, run to the park where they want to meet you. No! With a pitcher of iced tea and some condoms.

No! Why iced tea and condoms? Wait, is that to catch a predator? Yeah, of course. Oh, okay, great. You clearly never watched enough. I'll tell you that right now. It makes me very uncomfortable.

I can't handle it. Yeah, as it should. The things I watched, like... Gosh, and it was always like, you'll never guess what this man's profession is. Oh, he's a police officer. Or he's a teacher. Yeah. Or he's a minister. It's like.

Yeah, no, we guessed it. Yeah, like, obviously, if you want to diddle kids, you probably work around kids. Kids, yeah. Very likely. It's not what we want to hear, but it's not like the surprising thing. You'll never guess. This is a great ad for our page. I'm sorry.

You know, so few ads mention diddling kids anymore. That's because of censorship. These days. Anyway, if you don't get enough of this on our regular episodes. What do you think would be the most surprising profession for a kid diddler?

Mm. Mm-hmm. Hmm. What would be the most surprising? Accountant for an old folks home. Okay. All right.

Although maybe the kids come and visit. Maybe not. Never mind. I don't know. I don't know. Santa Claus. Oh, no. Brandy.

You're just like the To Catch a Predator, folks. That's exactly where a kid diddler would want to be in. Great way to ruin Santa. I'm sorry. Around the holidays. You know what? People were listening to this on the way to take the kid for the mall Santa stop. Now they don't know what to do.

They don't know what to do. Just keep an eye. Don't go to Auntie Anne's Pretzel or whatever. Why? What happens to Auntie Anne's Pretzels? I'm just saying, don't drop your kid off to be diddled while you're getting a pretzel. Oh, my gosh. That's my parenting advice.

Great. Thank you. You're welcome. Didn't it start as an ad? Yeah, so if that's not enough for you, then sign up at the $7 level and you can get all of us to talk about diddling kids and more. You can get Zoom hangouts where we very rarely talk about kids getting diddled. Almost never. Almost never comes up.

We make no guarantees about the content. Oh, my. And there's also the Bob Moss level. I think we should just stop. No guarantees about the content. Oh, my. And there's also the Bob Moss level. I think we should just stop. We've got to abandon this ad. We've got to abandon. Okay. Yeah.

Well, anyways, the point is we're on Patreon. It's a great time over there. Yeah. You should sign up. Do you want to hear about a bank robbery? As a matter of fact, I do. You need to lube up your anus first? How dare you?

Ma'am, you know, I just grabbed my Carmex to just lube up these lips. The people love my lips and they want them supple. Okay. Soft and supple. That's what they demand. Are people demanding that? A lot of people have been like, I'm not signing up for the Patreon until Kristen lubes up those lips.

I'm like, fine. I don't know why you don't ask this of Brandy. I guess you don't care about her. I guess not. Nobody's ever once asked me to lube up my lips. Alright, well this is somehow too weird now. I know I started it, but we've. No, actually, you started it. All right.

Tell me about a bank robbery, please. First of all, huge, enormous shout out to our boy. David Kradicek? Nope. Skip Hollinsworth. Yep. Yay. All right.

This comes almost entirely from an article of his for Texas Monthly. Naturally. Yes. He's so good. At everything? I was about to say, he's so good, he's the best in the biz. But then I thought, what if David Kradzic is listening and just a single tear comes to his eye? Boy, do I have some information for you about our boy David.

What about him? Oh, no. Did he do something terrible? No. Okay. He messaged us on Instagram. Shut up. Yes.

Shut up. Uh-huh. He said a fan of the show reached out to him and suggested that he reach out to us and tell us how to pronounce his name because it comes up regularly. And for the record, folks, it's David Krychek. Wow. Okay. Well, you know, in my fantasy, I was like, he reached out to say he likes us.

No, he reached out to say. Stop mispronouncing my fucking name. He said it very nicely. I'm sure he did. Little David Krycheck. What if we're mispronouncing Skip? I know! This whole time it's been Skypollins.

It's actually Hollinswert, the H is silent. Stop it. Anyway, shout out to Skip and David Krychek. I apologize, I've mispronounced your name many times on this program. Not me. Not me. this program. Not me. September 21st, 1991 started as just a typical Saturday morning at work for bank tellers Kelly McGinnis and Lisa Silvis, 21 and 19 years old, respectively. Kelly and Lisa were good friends and customer favorites at the Texas Commerce Bank Motor Bank location

off of Loop 410 in San Antonio. Kristen, do you know what a motor bank is? No. I didn't have any idea what a motor bank was either. But apparently, it's like a little stand-alone bank with only a motor bank was either. But apparently it's like a little standalone bank with only a drive-thru. Oh. No lobby or anything like that. You cannot go in. You can only go through the drive-thru. Like a scooter's coffee shop. Yes. All right. Yes. I gotcha. Apparently motor banks were at this time seen as like super secure. They had an elaborate locking door system

to get into the buildings and then like bulletproof glass in the drive-thrus. And as such, this particular location, no. You've come a long way, baby. Do you remember in the beginning of this podcast where you would burp and be like, we have to cut it cut the whole episode just we can't even air this now wow anyway this particular location was seen as like so secure that it didn't have here was it

didn't have any like of the standard bank security measures well that's stupid so it did have an alarm system had an alarm system like every bank has an alarm system but it didn't have any kind of security guard on staff it didn't have any uh security cameras of any kind it just had this elaborate door locking system and then like a vault inside and bulletproof glass. The bank's management was- So couldn't someone just wait for the employee to show up for the work and then rush in with them? Do you know this story already, Kristen? Well, I don't think it takes a genius, right?

Yeah, no. This is terrible. Yeah, it's not. It's not great. Yeah. So the bank's management was so confident in Kelly and Lisa's capabilities as tellers that they were actually the only employees scheduled to come in for this particular Saturday shift.

It was a nine to one shift. It was just the two of them on the schedule. No management, no security, nothing. No, this was not confidence. This was we're saving money. Oh, 100 percent. Yeah. I don't buy this for a second. As I mentioned, the customers loved these two young women or as I put it in my notes, these toe young women. They had those nice young toes. The hairs had barely started to spring up on them. I get like three hairs on my big toe.

Yeah. Yeah. I just shave it when I shave my legs. You don't braid it? No. One time though. What? it? No. One time though. What? One time when I was like, I don't know, in my early 20s. Okay. I went and got a pedicure. Right. And at that time I was like mortified that I grew hair on my big

toe. You thought you were the only one? Of course. I also thought I was the only one. Of course. And so I was very meticulous about shaving my big toe. Right. No one could know your secret. Because heaven forbid anybody sees my three hairs on my toe. And so I went to get a pedicure and I apparently forgot to shave my toe before I went for the pedicure. And the woman who was giving me a pedicure, she said. Threw up. No, but she did say, you have hair on your toe.

She did? Yeah. And I was like, oh, yeah, I must like, oh yeah, I forgot to shave. I'm so sorry. And she goes, no, it means you're a hard worker. And I was like, does it? She's like, yes. And I was like, okay, thanks. And I was just like, devastated that this woman

pointed out that I had three hairs on my big toe. But you are a good worker. That's right. See, I But you are a good worker. That's right. See, I myself am not a good worker, and yet I also have toe hair, so I don't know what to do with this. I assumed that's like a superstition thing. I don't really know. No, it's a fact.

No, it's not a fact. Anyway, the customers loved Kelly and Lisa. They were both former cheerleaders. They had both grown cheerleaders. They had both grown up in, like, small towns and the area. Well, yeah, they were, like, little hotties. Sure. Yeah, absolutely. And they were, like, the perfect tellers for the bank.

Customers would request them by name. Oh, probably creepies. Yes. Old men driving through the drive-thru would, you know, wink at them and flirt with them. Oh, my God. No. You don't get to request a teller. at them and flirt with them. Oh, my God. No. You don't get to request a teller. That's not how that works.

Yeah, no. Sure. Yeah. Also, we need a security guard. Right. Exactly. So on this particular morning, Kelly and Lisa came to work as they always did. They got out of their cars and they, you know.

Were bum-rushed by a gunman. Walked toward the first of the locking doors. So this is what they – oh, shit. They call it a man trap? Is that what it's called? I didn't fucking write it down. Why are you asking me? Hold on.

I got to make sure that's the right – Fun fact. The way this works is you do the research on your case and I do mine. Yeah, yeah. Okay, sorry. Anyway. Yes, it's called a man trap. That's the way these elaborate doors worked.

So you can't open them both at the same time. The previous one has to be closed and locked before the next one opens up. It doesn't sound that elaborate. It sounds like your average dog park. Yeah, basically. That's basically it. So they get the first door unlocked. They go in.

They're in this little vestibule. And you have to, like, there's like a 15-foot walk down a hallway to get to the second door. Right. And so Kelly and Lisa both walk in the front door. And Kelly walks down to go unlock the next door. And she turns around to say something to Lisa. And she sees that there's a man who has followed them in. The man was holding a gun.

Yep. He had on like a maintenance worker, like jumpsuit. Uh-huh. He had on gloves and he had on a flesh colored mask and hat that covered his entire face and head. Wait, you mean like pantyhose? No, it was described as more like a puffy material, maybe like sweatshirt material, like a ski mask maybe. Oh, OK. Yeah.

Yeah, yeah. But flesh colored. Gotcha. I don't know that the flesh colored part is pertinent, but. Well, you know it wasn't clashing with his skin. That's nice. Yeah, that is nice. We couldn't see his skin, so.

Then how do you know it was flesh colored? It was somebody's flesh colored. Not necessarily his. And who even has said it was a man? Did I say it was a man? I'm pretty sure you did. I think I did. Anyway, he had managed to get in behind them when they unlocked the first door before they have unlocked the second door.

That's weird because the bank set them up with this perfect system. Perfect system, right? So immediately the two women are obviously freaked the fuck out. Yeah. And the man says to them in a voice that is clear that he is disguising his voice. He says to them, hey, sweetheart. Sorry. Once they open that second door, he tells them to open the second door.

And then he says, cut the fucking alarm off, bitch. Oh. And waves the gun toward Kelly. Kelly started screaming. She kind of stepped backward. She was very alarmed. She didn't really know what to do. And he pulled his gun out and he pointed it directly at her head.

And he kept going on and on about the alarm. And then he motioned toward the door that led to the alarm room and said, turn it off. At this point, both Kelly. So he knew where the alarm room was. Sure did. Good, good, good up there, Kristen. Was this one of the managers who was so confident in these two working alone that they didn't need anyone else to be there with them? Was it? I think it might be.

Why don't we continue on and you'll find out. Or, as you would say, keep your fucking pants on. Oh, I say it way cuter than that. So by this point, both Lisa and Kelly are crying. They are scared. But Lisa knows that if that alarm panel isn't disarmed within 45 seconds, it sends an alert to the police. And so she is terrified that he is going to shoot them if that happens. And so she goes and she disarms the alarm. While she is doing that, this mystery man takes out these

plastic handcuffs and restrains Kelly, like puts her hands in the cuffs behind her back. And then he points toward the vault room from where they are standing and he says, let's go. And so they open the vault room, they go in and he pushes them in. And inside the room are two big safes. And so as he pushes them into the vault room, he points to like his outfit that outfit that he has on his jumpsuit and there's like a bulge in it. And he says, I have a police scanner in here. Don't even think about trying to trip a silent alarm.

If I hear anything come across the scanner, I'll shoot both of you. Oh, my God. And so at this point, both Kelly and lisa are like we just have to do whatever yeah whatever whatever the hell they get into the vault room they um lisa goes to open up one of the safes so the safes are double locked which means you have to open them first with a key and then there's a spin dial code as well and so lisa starts opening one of the safes she gets the key in she's like trying to put the combination in but she doesn't know the combination so Kelly is yelling the combination

to her and she's putting it in and she puts it in wrong at first and then finally she gets the safe open and at that point this man throws her a trash bag and she just starts pulling money out of this safe in this vault and putting it into this bag. How much money are we talking about at a motor bank?

Oh, we'll find that out here shortly. I'm interrupting you too much, aren't I? I'm too excited. You're too excited. So then he motions to the other big safe in the vault. And both Kelly and Lisa tell him like that just has change in it and so he's like well don't fuck with that like that's you know too heavy for it to be worth it and whatever and so then he motions to this other like locked case and it is where the

drawers that the tellers have all of their money in for the day are in and so he tells he tells them to open up their drawer. So each person's, each teller's drawer is like locked separately and you have to like unlock it and do a code, same kind of thing. But only each teller knows the code to their own drawer. And so Lisa unlocks hers,

gets her drawer out, dumps it in the bag. And Kelly at this point is so panicked that she can't remember her combination. And so she is, she's handcuffed. Yeah. So she's trying to tell Lisa her combination and she's not getting it right and they can't get it open. And so finally Kelly's like, just grab one of the other ones, grab one of the other drawers

because they were like, just like basic drawers that don't have very much money in them, like backup drawers. Yeah. And Lisa goes, you are going to get us killed. You've got to get it together. You've got to remember your combination. Whoa. At this point, like this man is like aiming the gun right at Kelly and is like, get your drawer, get your fucking drawer open.

I'm going to blow your fucking head off. Oh, my God. And finally, Kelly like pulls it together enough to get her combination. She gets her drawer open. She dumps it in the bag. And the the robber is like, OK, you guys stay here in this vault. Don't fucking move. And he's gone.

The whole thing lasted maybe five minutes. Was Lisa in on it? What makes you ask that? Is that a for real question? That's a for real question. I don't know. I'm just getting a vibe. Okay.

Why don't you stay tuned? I will stay tuned. I'm just getting a vibe. Okay. Why don't you stay tuned? I will stay tuned. I have no plans to leave. Okay, great. For the next, I don't know, 30 seconds to a minute, the two women just like stood in the vault, freaking the fuck out. And then Kelly was like, we got to go. We got to call the police. We've got to, you know, we've got to hit the alarm button.

And so and Lisa's like, let's just make sure he left. Let's make sure he left. And so they wait a few more seconds. Because he's my boyfriend and I want to make sure he gets away safely. Wow. It's very suspicious of Lisa. That's right. Okay.

That's right. Her name's too short. Don't trust her. The same syllables as yours. Yeah, but not as many letters. OK. So they wait like a minute. And then when they're sure that they don't hear him in the building, they go out. They hit the alarm buttons. They call 911. Lisa called 911.

Kelly, after hitting the alarm button, she calls their supervisor. And then once they've made all those calls, they then do, you know, the next thing that feels natural to them. They both call their boyfriends. So Kelly calls her boyfriend. He had, like, just gotten back home from – because he dropped her off at work that day. So he literally, like, dropped her off, gone back home. He'd just gotten back home from because he dropped her off at work that day so he literally like dropped her off gone back home he'd just gotten back home when kelly called him so he immediately comes back up to the bank kelly is hysterical my god can you imagine no oh okay gosh but then lisa went to call i'm sorry i said her boyfriend but it's actually her fiancé. Excuse me. She calls her fiancé Jack.

So her fiancé was much older than her. She was 19. He was 28. And he was a very well-respected police officer with the San Antonio Police Department. So she calls him. His name's Jack Neely. I don't think I gave his last name. Yeah, and she's like, hey, baby.

I know we just saw each other, but I miss you. Oh, wow. No, that's not what happened at all. She called her fiance, and she couldn't get a hold of him because he works midnights, and he was sleeping. He works midnights? Yeah, he works the overnight shift. He works nights. That's what they say. A lot of people say midnights. No was sleeping. He works midnights? Yeah, he works the overnight shift. He works nights. That's what they say. A lot of people say

midnights. No, they don't. A lot of people say countertop, but I wasn't allowed to say countertop last week. I was only allowed to say counter. Doesn't feel good when it's directed at you, does it? It feels great. So Lisa couldn't get a hold of her

fiance, Jack, because he had worked the night shift. And when he got home from work, he often would go to sleep and he'd unplug the phone so as not to be disturbed. And so when he didn't answer the phone when she called, he then paged him on his beeper. Yeah. Yeah. Because it's 1991. And he waser. Yeah. Yeah. Because it's 1991. And he was cool. Yeah.

And left the bank's number for him to call back. Yes. She didn't just leave him boobs. No. 8-0-0-8-5 in case anyone wants to know how to do it. Yeah. There you go. You're welcome.

Not too long after this initial 9-1-1 call came in from the bank fbi special agent kurt hunt mike's brother stop it nobody has come forward to claim the victory of forcing you to say Mike Hunt on this podcast. Maybe they're just silently basking in the glory. They must be. Anyway, so FBI Special Agent Kurt Hunt was working in his yard in San Antonio on this particular Saturday morning when he gets the call that they need him at the motor bank off Loop 410. And he is like...

Do you have a leaf vacuum or anything cool like that? I don't know. He's not as cool as me. All right, cool. Here's the things that I know about him. He's a 22-year veteran of the force. Oh, okay. And never in all of his days has he heard of a motor bank being robbed.

Oh, I mean, first time for everything. Come on, dude. No, these things are secure. No, they're not. That's so stupid. A 19-year-old and a 21-year-old show up to work and all you have to do is just be right there. He wondered to himself how it could have been possible to get past those locked doors and bulletproof glass of a motor bank. You just rush in.

Kristen. Well, that's so stupid. Never in his 22 years has he heard of such a thing. Well, maybe he ought to go into a new line of work. Kristen. That's really all right okay so he rushed to the scene and when he got there he learned that this was the scene of the biggest bank robbery in san antonio history you're kidding me the robber had made off with just under $250,000. Wow.

That is an unheard of amount of money for a single bank robbery. Yeah. I always think back to the, you know, the heist. Yes. Where the guy just took millions. Yeah. But yeah, I mean, banks usually don't have shit no but this guy made it into the vault so that's how he had right i mean he had a woman on the inside

i'm gonna feel terrible if lisa is just an innocent victim in all this but i don't think so on account of her lack of letters. Yeah. At this time, the average bank robbery netted about $2,000. It nutted about $2,000? Netted. Netted. I did not say nutted.

This bank robber nutted all over $2,000. Well, he's going to have to clean that up. That's disgusting. Money is filthy. This bank robber was so efficient that he'd made it into the bank, made it to the vault, gotten almost $250,000. Nutted all over all of it. Stop it. And then he was back home in no time. And then he managed to leave the bank in such a way that a customer who was waiting for the bank to open didn't know that any of this had happened until all of these police officers like surround the bank.

Wow. Yeah. There's like just a guy like waiting in the drive through and all of a sudden there's just like fucking police cars everywhere. And he's like, what's going on? Huh. That'd be pretty wild. Yeah. I'm just thinking like, did he just not notice the guy with the flesh colored mask?

Yeah. I don't know. Okay. My uncle was involved in a bank robbery one time. Have I told you this story? No. Yeah. What do you mean involved?

Did he rob a bank? No. He walked into a bank while it was being robbed. No. Yeah. And he had no idea what he had walked in on until the robber pressed a gun to his back and used him to exit the building. What? Yes. That's terrifying.

Yes. And then he stole my uncle's car keys and used his car as the getaway car. Oh, my God. Yes. Okay. Well, how quickly did they catch him? I mean, they recovered the car very quickly. Right. I'm sure he ditched it.

Never caught the guy. Never caught him. What? My uncle says that, like, I believe it was, like, a couple years later, he was, like, at the salad bar at a grocery store like making himself a salad he's pretty sure he saw the guy and he looked up and he swears the guy was like across the salad bar from him i bet he was he probably was oh my god yeah that is nuts. Yes. Did your uncle say, I know what you did? No, he said like his whole body just like.

I'm sure. Like went totally cold. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. He didn't obviously say anything to him. No, of course not. It would be nuts to say something. Yes. Not wild.

Yes. Yeah. I can't believe I didn't know that story. So it's funny. It's like a story that I remember hearing when I was a kid because it happened when I was very young. And then something made me think of it not that long ago. And I was telling David about it. And then I had to call my dad and confirm the details because I was like, am I remembering this right?

Wow. Yeah. Yeah. All right. Anyway, now back to this bank robbery that I'm telling you about. I also have a bank robbery story, but I don't really have all the details. Okay. Do you want to tell us the parts you do know?

Well, I'm pretty sure. Well, no, I know for sure my Aunt Cindy used to work at a bank. Yeah. And a robber came in, and I just know it was very traumatic. Yeah, I bet it was. That's the end. That's all. The whole story. Yeah. And a robber came in and I just know it was very traumatic. Yeah, I bet it was. That's the end. That's all. The whole story.

Yeah. And Jenny is probably, maybe Jenny is listening to this. My cousin, hey, Jenny, might be listening to this, shouting all the details at us. We'll never know. That's right. We can't hear you, Jenny. Jenny, don't be ridiculous. So anyway, so the FBI shows up.

They learn that this is the biggest bank robbery to date in San Antonio history. This robber has managed to get off with almost $250,000, which he nutted all over, if you listen to Kristen. And so they just, like, start, like, fanning out and searching searching the immediate area looking for any signs of anything. But they came up empty handed. They looked through trash bins to see if he'd like dumped his disguise as he ran away. But they found nothing. And as I already mentioned, there were no security guards or security cameras on the premises. But how the hell did he get into this place?

I just can't believe it. It was so secure. The only witnesses to the crime were the two young tellers. And they were hysterical. Well, one was hysterical. The other one was like, I'm rich now. Wow. If I'm wrong, I'm going to look like such an asshole. Through tears, both Kelly and Lisa recounted the whole horrible ordeal to the officers on the scene.

Around 10 o'clock that morning, Lisa's fiance, Jack, finally responded to her page. He called the bank and he said, oh, yes, I've been sleeping. And whoever he talked to at the bank was like, oh, you know, Lisa's actually being interviewed right now. There's been a bank robbery. And he said, oh, God. Is everything OK? And confirmed that like nobody had been harmed during the robbery right and so you know jack got off the phone with whatever police officer he spoke to at the scene and he waited a couple of hours before he came up what the to the bank what no once he got there. No. Once he got there. Why on earth would you wait? He introduced himself to the officers on scene. Said he was a fellow.

I'm the guy who wrote this place. No, I'm a fellow officer. I wanted to give you plenty of time to process the scene. I knew you wouldn't want another cop up here just tromping all over the crime scene. That's ridiculous. What about your girlfriend who's traumatized and needs your support? She was fine because she was talking to officers. He knew she was fine.

He called to check on her. She's fine. Mm-hmm. And so he didn't want to be in the way, Kristen. Mm-hmm. Jack and Lisa. Same number of letters. Oh. Mm-hmm. Can't trust either of them. That's right. Four letter names.

Despite what Kristen says, everybody was excited to see Jack on the scene. He was very well respected. He was a very decorated ex-Marine and then had been doing very well for himself as a police officer. He was president of his police academy class and he had graduated sixth out of 38 cadets. I mean, OK, that's good stuff. Well, I don't know that I'd be creaming my jeans to see that guy. They were creaming their jeans. In fact, they were so happy to see them that the bank executive who had turned up on site to assess the damage of this robbery.

I'm surprised they showed up. I know. Give it a couple hours. Well, he offered Jack a job on the spot to be a security guard at the motor bank in his off-duty hours. Really? You think maybe there should be a security guard? Maybe. Wow, what a wild idea. As it turns out, both Kelly and Lisa had previously asked management if they could hire a security guard.

Of course they did. Or install some security cameras. Of course they did. Because they were concerned about the security at this bank. Naturally. No, never in 22 years had Kurt Hunt heard of a motor bank being robbed. Okay. Maybe you haven't heard of it, but I think it's very foreseeable.

I will say I would assume that a motor bank would have like no money on hand. So I wouldn't. Sure. Yeah, I don't think it would be a big target. You would assume there would be no money on hand. So I would. Sure. Yeah. I don't think it would be a big target. You would assume there would be some money. Yes. Yeah. And therefore should probably be secured.

Yeah. Did you not hear about the man trap elaborate locking door system? That is not an elaborate locking door system. That is in place at any dog park anywhere. Okay. Ridiculous. system that is in place at any dog park anywhere okay ridiculous anyway don't you think in certain professions that i are high risk i would yeah i would argue that's a high more high risk profession don't you have an obligation to your employees to provide extra security? Absolutely. So everyone can blow it out their ass.

Wow. Okay. That's how I feel. All right. Well, Jack got himself a job right there on the scene, and he agreed to start the following Monday as a security guard at the motor bank. I mean, talk about double dipping. First you rob the place and then you get a job out of it. You

created a job! He's a job creator! I will tell you though, the police working this case, the police combined with the FBI agents, they were puzzled. They wanted to know how the robber had known

where the vault was, howber had known where the vault was. Yeah. How they had known where the alarm shut off was. Uh-huh. Yeah. And by the accounts of Kelly and Lisa, the perpetrator had not, like, scoped out any other parts of the bank. Yeah, he knew right where to go. Uh-huh.

Well, and he trusted when he was told, oh, that vault's just full of change. He also had disguised his voice for some reason. Which seemed very odd to them as well. Maybe he had a killer Daffy Duck impression. I don't think that's how he disguised it. But you don't know for sure. Is that what I'm hearing, Maddie? That is right.

Okay, so we can't rule it out. That's right. Pretty quickly, the investigators were considering that this may have been an inside job. Goodness. Inside job. What on earth? And suspicion was quickly cast on none other than Jack Neely and Lisa Silvas. Hmm. Hmm.

Huh. Huh. Weird. Yeah. Distinct lack of letters between those two. That's what they said. That's what they said. It was about the four letter names.

Mm-hmm. They didn't trust them one bit. Yeah. I sure don't. In my 22-year career, never have I heard of a motor bank being motorboated or a criminal with more than four letters in their name. That's just the way it is. Mm hmm. So as I mentioned, Jack was a really well-respected police officer. If you spoke to other people on the force, if you spoke to people who just knew him, he was kind of a dick and someone who abused his power.

Oh, cool. Turns out that he'd actually met Lisa when he was on a call. Oh, God. In an apartment complex, maybe looking for like a prowler. Somebody had called about like a suspicious person. And then he'd come and like gone door to door in an apartment complex. And started hitting on like all of us. And Lisa answered the door and he started hitting on her. And then over the next several days, he left his card repeatedly at her door saying, it was really nice meeting you. Give me a call sometime he wrote i

miss you on one of the cards i miss you yeah yeah and uh lisa was 18 at the time and jack was uh 28 28, had recently divorced and had two kids. Yeah, but, you know, Lisa had a lot of life in her because she had, like, done it up big at prom, you know, like high school. At the time she was living with her high school boyfriend who they had, in fact, attended prom together. Yeah. Yeah. Talk about different life stages. Yeah. But her high school boyfriend didn't make enough money to shower her in the gifts that she felt like she was worthy of.

And so she dumped him for Jack. No. Come on, Brandi. That's what the article says. I don't doubt that that's how the article portrays it, but it sounds like she was being preyed on by a much more powerful— Well, 100% she was. So let's not make it out like she's some gold-digging hoe. No, no, no, no.

No, this man absolutely was a predator, and she was a child. But yes, she broke up with her high school boyfriend. Yeah. To date an adult police officer. Yep. Yep. And then her adult police officer boyfriend. Well, I hope he's not a child police officer.

Well, yes. Would then start pulling over her high school boyfriend. Oh, my God. And giving him citations for anything he could and uh just harassing the shit yeah reminding him to stay away from lisa also then this guy like started dating someone else and jack would then pull over the new girlfriend too sometimes and be like stay away from just remind your boyfriend to stay away from lisa yeah okay jack yeah we get it um you're so cool yeah harassing teenagers yeah so lisa reportedly loved the attention that Jack gave her and bragged to her friends about how Jack spoiled her and bought her really nice stuff.

And also she really seemed to like like that he was like a powerful guy. Yeah. Yeah. I mean you think about like how little money it takes to impress a 19-year-old. Oh, absolutely. Like any amount. Any amount of money. Yes.

Super impressive. Yes. And any amount of power would be impressive. Yeah. Yeah. So they had not been dating very long when Jack proposed to Lisa. Naturally. And she accepted his proposal.

Yeah, there's no time. You've got to rush these things. And she asked Kelly to be her bridesmaid at the wedding. And they, you know, went to work planning a wedding. They, you know, went to work planning a wedding. But it's interesting that the investigators would later find out that nine days before this robbery was pulled off, Jack and Lisa had secretly gone to the courthouse and gotten married. So she can't be compelled to testify against him. Oh, what a cynical view of that. Or romance.

No, what really happened, if you ask Jack and Lisa, is that Lisa needed to be able to get on Jack's insurance. And so they got married. I mean, that is a sad American tale. Yes, it is. All right. But yeah, the investigators were convinced that they had got married. I mean, that is a sad American tale. Yes, it is. All right. But yeah, the investigators were convinced that they had gotten married so that Lisa could not be compelled to testify against Jack. You know, why can't it be both? It could be both.

Why can't she get some dental coverage and also not be compelled to testify? Wow. I am loving this story, by the way. Yeah, it's pretty good. So when did old Skippy write this article? Like in 1992 or 1993. That's what I thought. Why?

The thing about she was so enthralled with the gifts and like making it very victim blamey to me reeks of early 90s. Yeah, very much. I bet he wouldn't write that today. I'm sure he probably wouldn't. We think so highly of Skip. Or Skype. Or Skype as it may be pronounced.

We have no way of knowing. So they're starting to like try and see if they can put put together a solid case here against Jack and Lisa and they start talking to the people who knew them and I mean even Kelly who worked at the bank with Lisa was like absolutely not there's no way Lisa would do this there's no way Jack would do this they're great people there'd be no reason for them to do this. Well, it would be horrible to think that people you considered your friends. Absolutely. Did that to you. Yeah.

Yeah. Oh, I'm sorry. Also, when the police found out that Jack and Lisa had secretly gotten married and they questioned them about it and they said it was just so that Lisa could get on Jack's insurance coverage. They asked them why they hadn't told anybody that they'd gotten married. And they said they didn't want it to spoil their big wedding plans. They didn't want anyone to know they'd gotten married because it might spoil, you know, the big wedding. See, I actually, I don't think that's that weird. I don't think it's that weird either.

Okay. Yeah. You're presenting it like it's weird. No, I don't think it's that weird. I think it's an explanation they're giving. Aww. I mean, we an explanation they're giving. I mean, we know why they got married. Oh, do we?

We do. Yeah, so that she doesn't have to testify against it. She had a fungus on her foot that just was not letting up. So after learning that the two had gotten married and that this was all looking pretty much like an inside job, they thought, you know, let's see what we can do to put together a case against them. So there's no security footage. That's not great. There's no one else who witnessed the robbery except for someone who they think was in on it. And then Kelly, who truly seemed to have no idea about any of it. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Also, whoever did this had had a very extensive knowledge of the bank's layout and the lack of security measures and all of that. But what there was that they could check into was a parking area that had a gate that you had to be let in and out of using a computerized card. And so they checked that. And on the date of the robbery at 820 a.m., Lisa Silvis' card had been used to access that parking area. Okay. But Lisa hadn't been parked there that day.

Oh, my God. She'd been parked right by the bank, an area that didn't require the access card. An area that didn't require the access card. And when they asked her about it, she said that her card had been stolen like a week before the robbery or had gone missing. Maybe not stolen. Uh-huh. Had gone missing. Yeah, bullshit.

So, you know. That made sense. I can't believe you're a former Marine, a police officer, and you do something that stupid, that traceable. Yeah. The other thing, the things that really like started them really thinking like Lisa was in on this was the things about like why had the robber handcuffed Kelly but not Lisa? The robber handcuffed Kelly, but not Lisa. Why had Lisa encouraged Kelly for them to wait in the vault for, you know, another minute after the robber had left? Why had Lisa gone and disarmed the alarm when if she just let it go for the 45 seconds, like it would have signaled to the police? And they could have acted like, oh, you know, we're I can't I can't get the code in.

Right. I can't. You know, it would have been an easy way to alert the police if you. But, you know, nobody knows how they're going to actually act in a situation like that. I think it's like when you add all that up, it's really bad. But yes, individually, I don't know that that would be enough for me to think. But yes, individually, I don't know that that would be enough for me to think. Yeah. But there was also like some stuff that made them think that maybe Lisa wasn't involved because there was this really weird moment when Jack finally showed up at the bank after the robbery and they were discussing all of the details kind of with him and Kelly and Lisa. And they were talking about how Lisa had described the man who had robbed the bank that day. She described him as being probably about 5'8". And he weighed approximately 170 pounds.

And Lisa was giving this information while Jack was standing right next to her. And she goes, oh, my God, Jack, just like you. And then, like, reached up and touched his head and then like touched him on the stomach. That's really weird. Yeah. Why'd she say that? So it's funny. So the police were when they're like going back over all of this when they really think it's it's Jack and Lisa who did this.

They're like, OK, like, does she really not know that he did this? Did he somehow do this without her knowledge and just get all of this information from her? Or is she really that cold? Could she play it that cool in front of the police? I do think see I don't even think it's like that cold it's like oh gosh what am I trying to think of but like did you ever play like

when you were a kid hide and seek but you hide an object and like the person's really close to the object. Yeah. And like you can't help but look in the direction of the object. Yeah. So you end up giving it away. Right.

I almost wonder if there's something about like she's given these two descriptors, height and weight. And then she's like, holy shit. Yeah. And, you know, maybe the people around her aren't thinking anything of it because you probably wouldn't. But she's like, oh, my God, he's standing right next to me. Yeah. Did she really say 170 pounds? Yeah.

Yeah, that's way too specific. It's way too specific. That's like I could describe my husband that way. Yeah. Some dude. Yeah. No, I can't my husband that way. Yeah. Some dude. Yeah. No, I can't guess anyone's weight. No, I had to do that once.

The guy who came in my garage, I had to give a description to the police. And I was like, I don't have a fucking clue. Yeah, like I can tell you his build. Yeah. Approximately. Yes. But unfortunately, he wasn't in a bodysuit. Right.

Because I can't just, you know. Yes. But unfortunately, he wasn't in a bodysuit. Right. Because he can't just, you know. Yes. One thing that really was nice about Jack having this new security guard job at the bank was that he could stay really close to the investigation. I bet he could. He could hear all of the information that they were getting. And there were always FBI agents coming in and out. And so he could get little tidbits here and there, ask him what they knew, ask him about any updates. You guys on to anything you heard about anybody? What's going on? So were they intentionally feeding him stuff? I don't think so. OK. I don't think so. But at this point, like. they're like, okay, we're just going to have to basically accuse them and see what happens. Oh, wow. That's risky. It is risky.

But they thought Lisa would be the one that they could make crack. Right. And so they brought Lisa in for an official interrogation. They thought they could get her to confess to the robbery. They thought they could get her to confess to the robbery. So they brought her in and they did it like down and dirty style. Put her in an interrogation room with like a single light and shined it right in her eyes. And they said, you know. Do you like presents, do you?

There's no presents here. That's right. They were like, we got a pretty good case against you. No, you don't. Oh, you do? Like, we got a pretty good case against you. No, you don't. Oh, you do? Like, yeah. We know your parking garage card was used that morning and that you weren't parked over there. And this was actually a point when she was like, oh, yeah, my card went missing, you know, a week or more before this.

Gave it to my husband. That douche hasn't given it back since. And they're like, okay, all right. You know what? Here's, we're just going to cut to the chase here, Lisa. You tell us where the money is and we'll help you. You're a young girl. You don't need to spend the rest of your life in prison.

You need to help yourself. Help us help you. Maybe, you know, maybe you got kind of tied up in something here that you didn't know what you were doing. You got mixed up with the wrong people. Oh, yeah. We just want to help you. Through it all, Lisa cried the entire time.

Okay. But she said over and over again that she didn't know anything. She knew nothing. She couldn't help them. She wasn't involved. Huh. So this lead FBI investigator. Well this lead FBI investigator, Kurt Hunt, he said this was super hard for him. He said he was used to dealing with hardened criminals.

He wasn't used to having to interrogate like a young, cute girl crying in front of him. He didn't really know how to handle her. His usual tactics didn't really know how to handle her his usual tactics didn't work but they they tried he kept pushing he laid it on real thick told her what jail was like how difficult it would be for her in there absolutely told her if that she would just confess they'd go light on her she never wavered okay you know what this does this speaks to her truly not knowing anything because i would think if they'd been in on this together the first thing he would say as a police officer is if you're taken in and read your rights, ask for an attorney.

But if she just sat there and took it and cried. Yeah. All right. And they let her leave. They said she was good. She was really good. They said everything about her interrogation was perfect. Her body language, everything.

Following Lisa's interview, they then did a separate interview with Kelly. They thought that maybe Lisa had told Kelly something by this point. They were super close and they'd become even closer since the robbery. I'm sure. Because they'd gone through something together. Trauma bond. And so they questioned Kelly and Kelly was insistent. There's no way Lisa had anything to do with this. It wasn't possible that she was involved.

And they were like, you know, if you could help us get Lisa to confess, you know, if you had any part in this, you know, we can – we'll help you out. And that made Kelly mad. Well, yeah. Yeah. Kelly was pissed. She said, you've got the wrong people. Lisa and Jack did not do this. And then she like got up and stormed out and said, if you want to talk to me again, you can talk to my lawyer. Oh, my fucking God.

Is she involved in this? Is she? That's not cute. Everyone, she did the thing where she like puts her hands up like i just don't know so with those two interrogations getting them nowhere they then brought in jack neely but jack was plenty prepared for this he like walked in sat down he He didn't. Hey, boys. He was like, if I did something, you're going to have to prove it. Yeah.

He said, you are going to have to prove it. I'm kind of surprised they bothered because they didn't have anything on Lisa and Kelly. And Lisa and Kelly are at least inexperienced. Yes. So with the same amount of nothing, they're going after Jack.

Yeah. And so then they're like, OK, how about you just let us search your car? Why would he agree to that? Uh-huh. Let us search your car. Let us search your apartment. And Jack said, you'll have to get a search warrant to do that. Yeah.

you'll have to get a search warrant to do that. Yeah. And at that point, according to Jack, Okay. Kurt Hunt was pissed. He jumped up, he like slammed his hand down on the table, and he said, don't you ever tell me how to do my job.

He said that he was so angry that spittle was coming out of his mouth. Kurt, get it together. At that point, Jack said, am I under arrest? Oh, this is, I am on the side of the robbers at this point. And he was told no. And so Jack stood up and walked out of the room. Yes, I'll leave, bitches. He said, I'm going home. Bye.

out of the room. Yes, I'll leave, bitches. He said, I'm going home. Bye. Yes. So at this point, the police were convinced that they had the right people. Jack and Lisa had done this,

but they could not prove it. Right. And they were furious because Lisa was back working at the bank just like nothing had ever happened. And even worse, Jack was back on duty at the police department and working the security job at the bank.

They were convinced he had just robbed. Yeah, it was infuriating to the investigators. And they really could not prove anything no in this case so what they needed was a way to first of all they had to recover the money right they then needed to tie it to jack and lisa somehow in order to i'd say like glue and strings. Very good. Thank you. Very good. So there was Sorry, the look you gave me

was so hateful. There was one thing that could tie this whole case together if they could find it. A big string. That's it. A big string. That's right.

One giant string. No. $4,000 of the money that had been stolen. Was marked? Was marked. Okay. It's called bait money. And like a small amount of it goes in each teller's till.

Ah. And then another bigger portion of it is in the vault. Okay. But there were no die packs. This was also something that the tellers had asked for. Yeah, no, this is ridiculous. This is ridiculous. Yes. And so they're like, if we could just find that. This bank was asking to get robbed and they didn't care about the employees who would be there to deal with the trauma of it or the possible death. good grief yeah yeah so they're like if we can find this bait money like that's our only hope of being able to prosecute this case if we

find the money without the bait money like that's as good as finding nothing because we can't prove that that money was then taken from the bank yes and they're like if lisa was really in on this surely she was smart enough to destroy the bait money oh so we probably have an unprosecutable case on our hands oh my gosh yeah Yeah. Wow. Uh-huh. But so the tellers know which bills are marked? The tellers know which bills are marked, yes. Okay. Yes. And so they're like, fuck, if she's really in on it, then she would have been smart enough to destroy that money.

Yeah. They also learned that at some point after the robbery, Jack and Lisa had gone on a little vacation. Oh, had they? They told everybody they were going to Florida just for funsies. But actually, they'd gone to the Cayman Islands. Oh. I don't know if you know this about the Cayman Islands, Kristen. Oh, my Lord. Are you serious?

But it's really easy to set up a bank account there that is then untraceable. Did they have exactly $250,000 in it? No. Nobody knows how much money is in it because it's untraceable, Kristen. $246,000. Anyway, so when they learned that they took this trip and they're like, well, fuck, this is not good. So they're like, OK, we got to we got to like go for it. We got to go another layer out from these people.

So then they start interviewing people that know Jack and Lisa and they end up going to Jack's mom, Victoria Murray, I believe is her name. Her husband's name is – her husband is Jack's stepfather and his name is Bill Murray, which I really enjoyed. Anyway, so they track down Jack's mother, Victoria, and she's super reluctant to talk to the police. She's actually like a recluse. She doesn't like leave her home. And so they track her down. She lives on this like big property kind of like on the outskirts of San Antonio, I guess. And they track her down there and she won't allow them to come in her house. But she comes like out to like the gate of the property and talks to them over a fence. OK. And and they ask her, you know, do you know that Jack and Lisa are suspects in a bank robbery? And Victoria's like, what bank robbery?

She said that she didn't really keep up on the news. And so they told her about the bank robbery. And she said that the idea of her son robbing a bank was an impossibility. Okay. They asked her a bunch of questions. Had she seen Jack recently? And she said yes. He'd been out to the property like four days earlier.

Did he bury anything? And they were like, okay, what was his behavior like when he was out here? And she was like, he was fine. No, you know, nothing, nothing weird. He was just kind of his normal self. More length mink coat. Dripping in jewels. And so this this questioning with Jack's mother goes nowhere.

And it's like four officers who'd come out to question her. And they are so frustrated that this line of questioning is going nowhere. They actually leave to drive back to town. And all of a sudden, Kurt Hunt, this lead FBI investigator, is like, we got to go back. He had this idea. He had this idea. He had poop. No.

Sorry. He had this idea that he needed to plant a seed in Victoria's mind to make her suspicious of her son. Okay. And so they turn around. They go back to the property. They stand at the gate and they call Victoria back out. She comes out to the gate and they're like, sorry, you know, we thought of another question we wanted to ask you. And she's like, what? And they're like, did your son give you any money while he was here? And she says, no. And then they say,

did he wander around your property at all? Is it possible he could have buried something out here? And she says no, not that to her knowledge, he brought nothing with him. He hadn't done anything. And then they gave her a warning. They said, don't try to do that the first time? No, apparently not. That little nugget that they put in Victoria's mind worked out in their favor.

Because three days later, they got a call from Bill Murray, Victoria's husband, not the actor. They were excited at first. Boy, were they excited. And it turns out that after that visit from the police, he decided to go out and walk their property. And he'd found an area that looked like the ground had been recently disturbed. And then kind of like sticking out was like a little piece of cloth. And he pulled it out. And it was a blue canvas bag filled with thousands of dollars.

Had it always been there? Yeah. So according to Victoria, Bill had searched the property because after the visit from the FBI agents, he was like, I'm not going fucking down for something that Jack did. And so he was like, I am not getting tied up in this at all. And so he'd gone out and searched the property and he'd found the bag. So they turned the bag in to the police. The police counted. It is one hundred and forty seven thousand seven hundred and seventy nine dollars in cash.

Ninety five thousand000 was missing. Why didn't they put more in the Cayman Islands account? Maybe that's as much as they felt like they could safely get out of the country with. Yeah, okay. Maybe they'd planned a secondary trip to take more of it. Yeah. And that trip never happened because they found the money. I'm just guessing that I don't ever really find out. But OK. Along with the money was a little packet of money that had been separated from the rest of it. It had a handwritten note across the top that said Mexico money and it was $4,000 bills. It was all of the marked money from the bank. Yeah.

Uh-huh. So it seems that the bait bills had not been destroyed, but they had been neatly separated from the rest so they wouldn't accidentally spend them and get them like out into circulation. But the plan was to take them to Mexico where they'd be less likely to be traced. OK, it's funny because as you were talking about that, I thought, would I have the nuts to like, first of all, I don't know that I could burn. Right. Four thousand dollars. Oh, my gosh. Yeah. But, you know, I don't know that I could burn. Right. Four thousand dollars. Oh, my gosh.

Yeah. But, you know, you can't spend it. So do you risk it and go to another country? That's just buy all the piña coladas. Mm hmm. Yeah. That was Jack and Lisa's plan. All right. A handwriting expert later analyzed the writing on the thing that said Mexico money and said that it was Lisa's handwriting.

If you want to believe handwriting experts. I mean, not really, but I think it all makes sense. It does. It makes a lot of sense. But still, they were worried this wasn't enough to tie everything back to Jack and Lisa. But there was a little treasure in the bottom of that bag. There was a Wish Upon a Star keychain from Flower Buff. I'm sorry, that's not correct.

Flower Bluff High School, which happened to be the high school that Lisa had attended and Wish Upon a Star was the theme of her senior prom. Did it get accidentally dropped in? Accidentally left in a bag. It was like her prom mementos were in this bag already. Oh, and she thought she dumped everything out. They put the money in. Yep. This is why you don't date an 18-year- out. They put the money in. Yep. This is why you don't date an 18-year-old.

Yeah. You're going to wind up with a dusty corsage in your pocket. The FBI would later say that without that keychain in the bag directly linking Lisa to this money, this would have been an unprosecutable case. Well, I still don't know that it's exactly a smoking gun. I mean, if he's her husband, he just grabs a bag and. Yeah. Yeah.

I mean, her key chain doesn't necessarily mean she's involved. Means she's involved. I 100% believe she is involved. Believe she's involved. I'm just saying, like, I don't think that key chain is. Jack and Lisa were arrested and charged with the armed robbery of the Texas Commerce Motor Bank and when Kelly learned that Jack and Lisa had been arrested she was devastated. Yeah that'd be horrible. She could not believe it. She left the bank

and didn't come back for like two days. She said she didn't know what was worse. The betrayal of someone who she thought was like her best friend. Right. Or going through the trauma of this bank robbery. Like it was terrible. Yeah. And that it was

her best friend who'd done it to her. Yeah. That would be terrible. Yes. Whew. Okay. I have to tell you that there's not a lot of trial coverage on this because it happened in federal court. Oh, I hate that. Yes.

Motherfuckers. It was robbing a bank. I was going to say banking a rob. That's when you marry a guy named Rob. Which, again, my cousin Ginny did. Yes. She's banked a rob. Anyway, robbing a bank is a federal crime.

So this went to court in federal court. So there's almost no trial coverage. What we know is that Lisa and Jack were tried together and the prosecution said they planned this whole thing, that they had been in on it together, and that the $95,000, which had never been recovered, was sitting in a bank account in Grand Cayman or the Cayman Islands. So this article actually says Grand Canyon, but I can only assume that Skip meant Grand Cayman. I don't think they should have thrown that money into the Grand Canyon. They did call a couple of witnesses. They called Kelly to testify about the knowledge the robber seemed to have of the bank's premises. They called Bert, who was Lisa's high school boyfriend, to testify about the prom memento.

The key chain that matched what was handed out as the gift at the prom that he attended with Lisa. Lisa's defense did try to say that like it was all Jack. She hadn't known anything about it. And Jack's defense kind of did the same kind of thing. Jack's defense also said that like maybe Kelly had done it the whole time and maybe they were framed or maybe Jack's parents had did it. Maybe Victoria and Bill Murray had done the whole thing. Because they had conveniently left town after the money was found on their property and were not available to testify at trial. Had they really?

Yeah. Also, that could be explained if Victoria really is like a recluse and doesn't like being in the public eye. She could have just been very. Yeah, but you don't get to just leave. Well, so this is something that came up, you know. Yeah. The defense tried to continue the trial because the FBI said we can't track down we can't track down Victoria and Bill so they can't testify. And they wanted a continuation of the trial until they could be until they could be produced. And the judge said, no, they've done enough to try and find them. They've put in, you know, whatever, enough goodwill effort that we're moving forward. The jury deliberated for like an hour and a half. Yeah. And on February 14th. Oh, romance.

They found Lisa and Jack both guilty of Lisa guilty of aiding and abetting a bank robbery and Jack for armed robbery. Also, Lisa was convicted of a gun charge as well, because like since she was in on it, she knew that a gun was being used and like wasn't actually I don't know. Is it what's that felony we talk about yeah it's capital murder well nobody was murdered so yeah yeah basically a crime she was in on a gun was used in the commission of it right right whether she was the one that held the gun or not so they were found guilty in february following April, they were sentenced. And at sentencing, Lisa spoke for the first time in court. She told the judge that it was all Jack's fault. She said, I realize now that I fooled myself into believing Jack loved me. I'm guilty of being a fool. I'm not guilty of being a bank robber. She broke down sobbing. She said, I feel as if I am drowning.

I am going down for the third time and I implore you to help me. Don't let me die, judge. Don't let me die. Die? Yeah. In prison, I guess. Oh. What kind of time was she facing?

Do you know? Well, I know she was sentenced to. I don't know what the maximum she was facing was. But she was sentenced to 12 years and eight months in prison. Ouch. Yeah. I mean, I do think that's a lot. It is a lot.

When she's this young. When you talk about exactly how young she is, how impressionable she was, how much of a power imbalance there was between the two. Yeah. Yeah. two. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Jack was sentenced to 15 years and one month. Really? Yeah. He was the one with the gun.

Yeah. He was the one who basically did the thing. And he's a police officer. I would think that that would up the stakes a little. Yeah, I don't like it at all that they were sentenced to almost the same amount of time.

Wow. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Following their convictions, Jack would send love letters to Lisa in prison. Skip Hollinsworth did sit down with Lisa for this article, an interviewer, and she said that Jack was constantly sending her love letters and that she didn't send him any back and she wanted to get the marriage annulled.

But Jack said that's not the case. Jack said she was also sending him love letters. So who knows? I couldn't find if they ended up annulling the marriage or getting divorced. I'm sure they did not stay married. I just don't know how quickly after all of this they split up. Yeah. It seems that they both kind of served their sentences. There was one appeal that I found, but it looks like it wasn't successful. It looks like they both served their sentences and then were kind of quietly released.

And I couldn't find anything more about Lisa. Jack Neely did make the news again in 2012, though, when he was caught impersonating a federal agent. though when he was caught impersonating a federal agent and he was in possession of a gun which as a felon is illegal yeah so in 2012 he was running a company called tactical transportation and security services llc which he said was a transportation service where he'd kind of be like a bodyguard who also like drove he drove um like oh the irony of getting your security needs met by a criminal uh-huh so here's the interesting thing in texas felons are barred from getting security licenses so he wasn't able to legally run a security company. So he called it a transportation company. But one day he was caught sitting in what looked like an unmarked police car, but he called it his transportation car. And he was wearing like a San Antonio Police

Department like lanyard around his neck. The car had like a spotlight and takedown lights on it. He also had a San Antonio Police Department baseball hat like propped up in like the window of the car. And then he had a badge on. He sure missed being a police officer. He had a badge on that said special agent United States Department of State. What? Did he get it at party?

Yeah, exactly. And he had a fully loaded Glock handgun in his waistband. Also, two lock blade knives as well. Sure. He was arrested and charged with impersonating a federal agent and possession of a firearm by a felon. Ultimately, he pled guilty to those charges and was sentenced to 41 months in federal prison. I did look him up in the federal inmate database, and it shows that he was released from federal custody in September of 2017. And that's the story of a bank robbery.

Wow. Wow, that was weird. Yeah. So there's also, there's a lot of people, there's some mentioned in a couple of articles that there are people that think Kelly may have been involved. There was a moment in court where this was like brought up. And at that time when it was brought up, Jack turned and looked at Kelly in the courtroom and winked at her.

Hmm. You don't think that that was just him? Oh, I'm sure that it was. Honestly. Honestly. Honestly, I would very much enjoy a movie or a book about two young gals working at a bank. They know it's unsafe. They talk to management about how they feel unsafe and management is just yada, yada, yada, whatever. They don't care because, you know yeah they're saving money living better

and the ladies rob the place that would be wonderful and they get away with yeah of course and and go to the guy they framed for it goes to federal prison for 15 years love it i would love that uh this was there was a made for tv movie made about this case called the almost perfect bank robbery starring brooke shields oh and dylan wall she's one of the guys from nip tuck movie made about this case called The Almost Perfect Bank Robbery starring Brooke Shields and Dylan Walsh. He's one of the guys from Nip Tuck. Okay. Let me pull this fella up.

Dylan Walsh. Okay. Boy, he's a basic looking dude. He's very basic. Very basic looking dude. All right very basic. Very basic looking dude. All right. Very good. Yeah.

Yeah, I don't think Kelly probably had anything to do with it. I think that Lisa, yeah, it's a real shame that Lisa's age and all of that was not taken into consideration when her sentence was handed down. Yeah. Well, I think. I think sometimes it's a sign of the time. Oh, you're absolutely right. Yeah. The thing about like, oh, she just loved the presents.

Well, yeah, she was a fucking teenager. She was a teenager. She was fresh out of high school. Yeah. And this corrupt police officer met her on the job, targeted her. And, yeah, they immediately got engaged. They immediately got married. Boy, hmm.

Yeah. Yeah, I didn't mention this in the story, but the article, Skip's article, says that a lot of people believe that the motivating factor behind the robbery was that Jack wasn't making enough money to keep up with all of Lisa's expectations of gifts and clothing. And she liked to get her hair done a lot and get her nails done. It was all very expensive. That is sickening. Yeah. Yeah. So.

Uh-huh. Wow. Holy shit. yeah so uh-huh wow holy shit so he gets to be the like the double victim yeah that is so gross he had to do it yeah to keep his teenage teenage wife happy yeah god teenage wives can be such brats. Am I right? That's right. Oh, that is so gross. I hate that. Yep.

Okay. Soho Karen. Brandy, what do you know about this one? I don't know anything about it. You don't know anything about Soho Karen? No, I don't think so. Oh, bitch. You're going to love it.

You're just going to love it. You're just going to love it. Okay, shout outs to reporting from the New York Times and an iconic interview with Gayle King on CBS this morning. Oh, wonderful. You never watched Soho Karen's interview? I don't think so. Maybe once you get in, maybe I'll remember it, but I don't know what to say about this. Prepare yourself. You're in for a treat.

Twas the day after Christmas and all through the house, not a creature was stirring except for a Karen. Ho, ho, ho, ho. It's so ho, Karen. Great. May your Kate Gosselin haircut roast on an open fire. All right, I'm done. Picture it. December 26, 2020.

New York City. Musician Keon Harold was staying at the very modern and boutique-y Arlo Soho Hotel with his 14-year-old son, Keon Jr. Keon Sr. is a very successful musician. He's from the great state of Missouri. Oh! He's a jazz trumpeter. He's a songwriter, producer. He's performed at the White House.

He's toured with Rihanna, Eminem, Mary J. Blige. He's provided instrumentation for recordings for artists such as Beyonce, Jay-Z. Oh. Mac Miller. Oh. I don't know what it means to provide instrumentation for recordings. Doesn't that mean you're just playing? No, it means that they're specifically the musician who's in the recording studio when they're recording music.

So like touring musicians and recording musicians are usually different people. So he was in the recording sessions. Gotcha. Gotcha. So he's on the actual like album and stuff. That's cool. Yeah. He also worked with LFO.

Oh. He did not. I don't think. The light funky ones had a lot of trumpet on their tunes, don't they? Oh, yeah. Keon is a big deal. So the day after Christmas, he and his son woke up and decided that they'd have a nice breakfast together in the hotel. I realize the way I read that made it sound like since he was a big deal, he woke up and had breakfast.

But you know what? I did the same fucking thing today. And you're also was a big deal he woke up and had breakfast but you know what i did the same fucking thing today and you're also a very big deal so suck on that not big deals they hopped in the elevator went downstairs and they were walking through the lobby when all of a sudden an irate 20-something-year-old woman came up to 14-year-old Kian and accused him of stealing her phone. This woman was going cocoa bananas. I mean, oh lord. You're making a face. She find her phone in her purse? No. Okay.

I did watch a clip of a woman who accused a young man of stealing her phone, and then she found it in her fucking purse. No. Yeah, but I was pretty sure that happened in a store, not in a hotel. Did she apologize? No, she fucking didn't. Of course she didn't. Of course she didn't. She was standing there with the hotel manager, and she was flipping out, saying that Keon had stolen her iPhone. Keon Sr. and his son were stunned.

They'd never seen this woman before. And of course, Keon Jr. hadn't stolen her phone. He was holding his own iPhone. His own phone, yeah. But the woman was making a big scene and the hotel manager seemed to kind of sort of be taking her side. Oh, yikes. Worth noting, this was only about six months after the Central Park Karen incident. In addition to all the other Karen incidents.

Keon Sr. said that he'd obviously heard stories about black men and boys who were falsely accused of random shit. But, I mean, this was different. This was his own son. So Keon did the smart thing. He took out his phone and started recording. The video lasts about a minute, and I will describe it to you now. Okay. In it, we see a very angry woman looking peak basic. She had on black leggings, a black zip-up jacket, black leather bag, tan Birkenstocks. And she was standing sort of behind the hotel manager.

And Keon Jr., who is off camera, says to her, this is my phone. The woman tells him to show it to her. And Keon Sr. says to his son, you don't have to explain nothing to her. And as he's saying that, the woman goes up to the manager, very agitated, kind of taps his shoulder and says, take the case off. That's mine. Literally, get it back. Ew, I hate that. Oh, God. Yeah, this kid stole stole my phone put a case on it real quick

and kian senior says are you kidding me you feel like there's only one iphone made in the world no shit she gets very close to kian and his son she She says, no, then, okay, show me on the, show me the, and Keon Sr. says, no, get a life. I don't have to show you shit. Back off. Yeah. The manager asks the woman to take a few steps back. And Keon Sr. says, you better go use Find My iPhone. And the woman says, yeah, Find My iPhone is on.

It's on that right now. And she points to his son. At this point, the manager goes over to the 14-year-old boy. And because the video is pretty chaotic, it's unclear what he's saying, but he seems to be trying to get Keon Jr. to hand over his phone. What? And Keon Sr. sees that, and he says, no, no, no, you can't. No.

And the guy goes, I'm the manager of the hotel. And Keon Sr. goes, I don't care. Yeah. And in the background, the woman is like an angry dog. Like, yes, yes, he will. Yes. Keon Sr. says, he's my son. Didn't you just see us come downstairs out of the fucking elevator?

Manager. And I'm trying to help, man. Keon. But you're not helping. No. Manager. I am. Keon.

What you're being is disrespectful. Manager. No, I'm trying to settle this situation. Kian, my son has nothing to do with her. Woman, no, yeah, then let me have my phone. Show me the proof. He's not leaving. Show me the proof.

Kian, are you kidding me? You better get on. Keon turns to his son, says, let's go. And they appear to be headed down the hall toward the hotel restaurant. But the woman wouldn't let it go. She came rushing after them, freaking out about her stolen cell phone. And Keon turns around and says, you see two black people. And the woman goes, no, I'm not letting him walk away with my phone.

And there's some sort of struggle. Oh, my gosh. And then she comes back at them again saying, no, I have to get my phone. And there's another struggle. And you can't really see what's happening. The last words in the video are Keon saying, get your hands off. The video goes on for about a minute, but the incident itself went on for about five. And it got worse.

Surveillance footage showed the woman running after Keon Jr. and tackling him to the ground. Oh, my gosh. It was insane. She grabbed hold of him, ran with him for some distance, and spun him to the ground. It was wild. Yeah. And terribly traumatic. Keon Sr. pulled this woman off of his son.

And at this point, not a moment too soon, the hotel staff does seem to have intervened in a meaningful way. Okay, great. Finally. So Keon and his son went to have breakfast together. And, oh my gosh, what do you know? A little while later, an Uber driver showed up with the woman's phone. She'd left it in the Uber. It hadn't been stolen.

Holy fucking shit. Yeah. Oops, she'd tackled a child for no reason. Great. Oh, well, you know. No harm, no foul. Right. Who cares? We've all done it before. No! Brandy, the

important thing is she got her cell phone back. Okay, great. And so with her phone in hand, she left the hotel. But Keon Sr. was like, that's it? Yeah. He didn't like

the idea that some anonymous person could just attack his child and get away with it. No. So he decided to do something about it. As I mentioned earlier, Kian is a big time musician and that means that he goes and has breakfast in the morning. Yes. But also he has a big presence on social media.

So he took that one minute video and he posted it on Instagram. Here's what he wrote to go along with the post. I hate I have to post this. I am furious. We see this crap happening all the time, but it hits different when it hits home. I typically try to keep things positive, but nothing about this video is positive. The lady in this video assaulted my 14-year-old son and me as we came down from our room in the Arlo Soho to get breakfast. This person quote-unquote lost her iPhone and apparently my son magically acquired it, which is merely ridiculous. The incident went on for five more minutes. Me protecting my son from this lunatic.

five more minutes. Me protecting my son from this lunatic. She scratched me. She tackled and grabbed him. He is a child. Now watch it again. This lady is not even a guest at the hotel. She checked out of the hotel on the 23rd of December. Today is the 26th. The fuck was she doing there? Now watch as the manager advocates for the lady who is not even a guest at the hotel, insisting and attempting to use his managerial authority to force my son to show his phone to this random lady. He actually empowered her. He didn't even consider the fact that we were actually the guests. Now think about the trauma that my son now has to carry only coming downstairs to have box day brunch with his dad. Then her phone was magically returned by an Uber driver a few minutes after this incident.

No apology from her after this traumatic situation to my son. Not me. No apologies from the establishment. This shit happens so often. It needs to stop. If anyone recognizes this person, please tag or DM. That's wow. Yeah.

I mean, I think he has every right to be outraged. Absolutely. Oh, my God. Yeah. And I'm sorry. Logistically, this fucking woman thought that this 14 year old stole her phone and then magically had a case on him. He just carries it in case he steals an iPhone. He was so prepared.

He had schemed and plotted this whole thing. It was ridiculous. Yeah. I always think it's so weird when people can't find something and they immediately go to, it was stolen. Yeah. I always think it's so weird when people can't find something and they immediately go to, it was stolen. Yeah. Like, how many people really want to steal your musty old cell phone? Right. I don't know that cell phones are musty, but.

I don't know. Depends on where you take them, I guess. I guess that's true. Keon's video quickly went viral. People were outraged by what they saw. They dubbed the woman in the video Soho Karen. But it didn't take long to determine her actual identity. Her name was Mia Ponsetto.

She was 22, and she lived in Peru, California. P-I-R-U. Sure. All right. And, you know, she wasn't facing any kind of punishment. People were upset by that. Yeah. They rightly pointed out that if the roles had been reversed, if a black woman had attacked a white child, she likely would not have just walked free.

Yeah. Mia was, of course, aware of the viral video and aware of... Even if the 14-year-old had attacked her. Oh, absolutely. He wouldn't have walked free. Woo, no! Hell no. Hell no.

I didn't even think about that. He absolutely would not have. He would not have. The police would have been there so fucking fast and he would have been arrested. Yeah. Yeah, that's ridiculous. So she was aware of the viral video and aware of the surveillance footage that showed her tackling a 14 year old. And she was mortified that everyone misunderstood her. People were thinking that this

was racially motivated, but they were wrong. They were thinking that she had behaved very badly, but there was blame to go around. They just hadn't heard her side of the story yet. Let's hear her side. I'd love to hear an explanation. Meanwhile, Kian hired civil rights attorney Ben Crumpump and ben got to work pressuring the manhattan da to bring charges against mia and crumping which was distracting crumping it sounds so familiar what's crumping it's that dancing where you're like hayden panettiere did it very embarrassingly in like the second uh bring On movie. It's very crunchy. Did she look like the whitest woman alive when she did it?

Is it the third Bring It On movie? It might be. You know, I got to say, I dropped off after the first one, so I cannot participate in this. It might be in the third one. Yeah. Anyway. Could you crump a little for me?

I did. Do some more, please. No, thank you. I'd like you to do it from a standing position. No, thank you. All right. I guess I'm just left to wonder. In a statement, he wrote, as this year of racial awareness is drawing to a close, it's deeply

troubling that incidents like this one, in which a black child is viewed as and treated like a criminal, continue to happen. We strongly urge Manhattan District Attorney Cy Vance Jr. to bring assault and battery charges against this woman to send the message that hateful, racially motivated behavior is unacceptable. Keon Harold Jr. was deeply impacted by this incident. He kept asking his parents, why me? Yeah. And Keon Sr. had to explain to him that it wasn't his fault. He said, people do things. They act the way they act, and sometimes it's just not you.

Keon Jr.'s mom is Kat Rodriguez, and she is gorgeous, and she plays the saxophone for Beyonce. Oh, fuck. I know, right? What's Keon play? Is he just, like, any instrument he touches? Wait, junior or senior? I'm sorry, junior, yes. If he's got two amazing musician parents, is he also a musician?

I saw some, you know, they really kept him out of this news as much as they could, which I think is wise. I saw some footage of him on the drums. Oh, okay. But I don't know. I have a feeling he could probably do just about anything. That's what I'm guessing. Not jealous at all. Except for crumping. No crumping allowed.

He crumps just like any panettiere. I never learned how to say her last name. I think it's panettiere. I'm not really sure. It seems like a complicated dessert, don't you think? Oh, it does. Like, yeah, it's a technical round on the Great British Baking Show. This week, Paul would like you to make 12 identical panettiere.

They need to be light and fluffy with no soggy bottoms. Kat was so upset about what had happened. She said it about broke her heart when she went up behind her son to hug him one day and he pulled away. He said that after he'd been tackled like that, he didn't want to be hugged like that. Oh, that would be heartbreaking. I know. Oh. But this was all just a big misunderstanding.

Am I right? Mia thought so. No, Mia. She decided that she needed to smooth things over. So she and her lawyer, Sharon Gattan, decided to do an interview with Gayle King for CBS this morning. For the record, Sharon and Mia seem to have had very different ideas on how this interview should go. Sharon wanted to use this as an opportunity for her client to apologize. You know, maybe it would humanize her a little.

Mia wasn't quite as excited about apologizing. And what resulted was an interview that is nothing short of glorious. OK, great. You're going to walk us through it. Oh, my God. The time I took to transcribe this. Oh, my gosh. Amazing. OK. The interview took place on January 7th, 2021. Where were you? And these were COVID times,

so they did this over Zoom. And I'd like to set the scene. Okay. Okay. Gayle King looks wonderful. She appears to be in some kind of fancy living room. Excellent.

She's wearing a white sweater. Obviously cashmere. Yeah, obviously. Duh. Give me a's wearing a white sweater. Obviously cashmere. Yeah, obviously. I mean, duh. Give me a fucking break. And Mia- Do you have a cashmere sweater? No.

Me either. You think I've got Gayle King money? No, but you know, Kohl's does a nice cashmere deal every- I guarantee you, Gayle's sweater is not from Kohl's. She didn't save up her Kohl's cash. I almost...

What? I almost bought a cashmere scarf the other day. What stopped you? It's expensive. Yeah. You got me cashmere socks. I did get you cashmere socks. Those are fancy, but you know what?

When I get something fancy, it's like, well, I can only wear these on special occasions. I hate to ruin this fancy thing so it'll sit in a drawer and I'll never use it. Yeah, exactly. Which is the story of all of my bath bombs. Mia's lawyer, Sharon, also looks professional. She's got on a tweed patterned pink suit jacket, kind of Chanel-esque. A little Jackie O situation? You jacket, kind of Chanel-esque. A little Jackie O situation? You know, kind of-ish. Her hair is nicely styled and she and Mia appear to

be sitting in like the fanciest backyard or local botanical garden. Okay. You choose. Okay. No, no offense to Gail or to Sharon, but the best dressed award definitely goes to Mia. For this nationally televised interview, Mia chose to wear a beige bralette, black leggings, a black leather jacket, and a baseball hat that said daddy on it. Really? Absolutely. The outfit was weird enough without the hat. Yeah, I mean, the bralette, that's a bold choice. Yes.

It said daddy? It said daddy on it. Just daddy in white letters. Okay. Okay. Different sources have this next part different ways. One source said that Sharon prepped Mia for the interview. Another source said that Sharon had only been communicating with Mia's mom and that Mia showed up for the interview at the last possible minute, completely unprepared.

I'm inclined to believe the latter. Yeah. One thing everyone can agree on is that when Mia showed up in a daddy hat, Sharon was like, please take that off. No fucking shit. And Mia refused. And thus started a theme of Mia ignoring her lawyer's advice and instead saying whatever was on her heart. Okay. Wow.

I bet that's going to go really great for Mia. I would now like to reenact this iconic interview. It will take a while. Okay. But I guarantee you, you're going to want to hear this. Okay. Gail. Mia, help me understand.

What made you think that Keon had your phone? That's why I'm confused. Why did you think he had it? Mia. I was approaching the people that had been exiting the hotel because, in my mind, anybody exiting is probably the one who might be the one who's trying to steal my phone. I admit, yes, I could have approached the situation differently or maybe not yelled at him like that and made him feel,

you know, maybe some sort of inferior way, making him feel as if I was like hurting his feelings because that's not my intention. I consider myself to be super sweet. I really never ever. I consider myself to be super sweet. I really never ever meant for it to like hurt him or his father either. Gail, are you saying that you were stopping everyone in the lobby, asking them about your phone? Is that what you're saying? Mia, um, not everyone. Just the, just the people that in the meantime, while the hotel manager was checking the footage, I just wanted to do my part as best I could.

Gail. So you were just asking the black people, is that what you were doing, Mia? Gail. You just described yourself as super sweet. I'm sorry, that kills me! I know, it's great. You wouldn't believe what she says and it's like, holy shit. I know you've seen the video. When you look at the video, the reaction seems very extreme.

It doesn't seem like it's someone who's super sweet. I'm sorry. I can't handle it. And then I love this because then we cut Mia, and she looks a little hurt. Uh-huh. She says, how would you feel if you were alone in New York, and, you know, you were going to spend time with your family during the holidays, and you lose the one thing that gets stolen from you that has access to the only way that you're able to get back home. Okay.

Gail. I just don't think that I would randomly attack people is what I'm saying to you. I know you said you could have handled it better, but I just don't think I would randomly attack people in the manner in which you did. I just don't think I would randomly attack people in the manner in which you did. What do you think when you look at the video? You're standing there in your leggings and your flip-flops, and it looks like you're just going nuts, for lack of a better word. Mia, I don't feel that is who I am as a person. I don't feel like this one mistake does define me, That is who I am as a person. I don't feel like this one mistake does define me.

But I do sincerely from the bottom of my heart apologize that if I made the son feel as if I assaulted him or if I hurt his feelings, the father's feelings. Okay. Hold. Yep. Okay. I'm sorry if I made them feel like they. I love. I made them feel like I assaulted them. No, you did.

No, you fucking assaulted them. You tackled a kid. Also, learn their fucking names. Uh-huh. The father and the son. Yeah. Yeah. Also, I love the idea of falsely accusing someone.

Yeah. Tackling them to the ground and being like, I'm sorry if I hurt your feelings. I'm sorry if I hurt your feelings. And I'm sorry if I made you feel like you were assaulted. By actually physically assaulting you. By physically assaulting you. Gail, I don't believe that one mistake defines anybody. But I think when I look at that particular video, you did more than just accuse him.

The video seems to show that you physically attacked this young boy. You do see that too, right? Mia. But at the end of the day, the dad did end up, like, slamming me to the ground and pulling my hair and throwing me and dragging me across the ground. So I will say that. He pulled you off his son. Right. And you'd better believe if there was footage of her being dragged around by the hair, we would see that.

Gail. Yeah, but I think you. Yes. Gail. Yeah, but I think you know the video we saw. It looked like you had just attacked his son. Mia. Yeah? The footage shows me attacking his son? Of attacking him how?

Of yelling at him? Yes. Okay, I apologize. Can we move on? How about when you physically attacked him and tackled him? Gail. What about that? Gail. Mia.

Gail. I know you're saying I don't need to, I just want to apologize, but I do think that there should be some context to your actions that day. Mia. Okay. So basically I am a 22-year-old girl. I am, I don't, racism, I, is, it's, I. How is one girl accusing a guy about a phone a crime? Where's the context in that? Oh, Lord.

So Gail starts laughing. And she goes, Mia, Mia. And Mia goes, what is the deeper story here? What? Gail goes, Mia, you have to at least understand your actions that day. You seem to have attacked this little boy, this young boy, this teenager. You seem to have attacked this teenager about the phone, and then it turned out that he didn't even have your phone. Mia. Okay, well, so? Gail, that's the thing.

Mia, you want to get to that part? She leans forward in her chair. Holy shit! Gail, you're saying, look, I'm 22 years old. You are 22 years old, but you're old enough to know better. So you're saying you're 22. Mia. All right, Gail.

Enough. Yeah. What. Yeah. What? Yeah. Okay. You kind of have to see this. But she literally goes, all right, Gail, and then puts her hand out like a little stop sign and goes, enough. Can you fucking believe that?

No! All right, Gail. Enough. Oh, my gosh. Can you imagine? No! All right, Gail. Enough. Oh, my gosh. Can you imagine? No! As soon as she did that, her lawyer looked like she wanted to die. Sharon turned her head away from the camera toward Mia and, like a ventriloquist, goes,

No, no, no, stop, stop. But Mia kept talking. Remember, super sweet person. You're a super sweet person. Remember how sweet you are. Remember, we're trying to show you're not racist. So maybe don't be super crazy disrespectful to a black woman. Oh, Lord. So Mia keeps going because why wouldn't she?

Why wouldn't she? She said, the hotel did have my phone. The hotel did end up having my phone. I did get my belongings returned to me, so maybe it wasn't him. But at the same time, how is that as soon as I get asked to leave the premises after I had accused this person of stealing my phone? How is it that all of a sudden they just miraculously have my phone when I come back? And the two the two that it didn't it didn't seem as if my accusations really bothered the son and the father because they were just enjoying a nice meal right after this whole encounter. Holy shit. Oh boy. Gail, I don't know if you... Mia, I just want this to be over and I'm sorry. Gail, whether they were bothered by your, Mia, let's just make this short and sweet, Gail. Wow. Gail, Mia, Mia, I want to go back to that day. Take us back to that day.

We've all seen the video. So Mia smiles, sits back in her chair. OK, so I arrived back at the hotel after grabbing some Starbucks. I had noticed my phone had been missing, so I just approached the hotel manager, asked him if he could just kindly check the footage. In my opinion, I was like, OK, any person walking down could possibly be the person that would have my phone. I wasn't racial profiling whatsoever. I'm a woman. I'm Puerto Rican. I'm like a woman of color. I'm Italian, Greek, Puerto Rican. I'm like a woman of color. Gail, you keep saying you're Puerto Rican. Does that mean you can't be racist because you're saying you're a woman of color? Is that what you mean?

Mia. Exactly. Exactly. Oh, goodness. Gail. Oh, boy. Well, I would disagree with that. People of color can be racist, too.

Do you believe that you should pay a price for this? Mia. I don't feel that my accusation is a crime. Gail. But it's more than an accusation. It's the way you tackled him, it seems, on the videotape. What would you do differently? You said that you look at that tape and that's not who you are.

Mia. I think I could have just asked the hotel manager. So, yes, I could have stepped aside or the father and I. We immediately could have just started speaking at a lower tone, and probably that would have handled the situation a whole lot better. Or you could just not accuse people of stealing your fucking shit. Gail. With all due respect, when Mr. Harold was talking to you, it seems to me that he was responding to you because you had accused his son.

Mia. I'm saying that both of us. I said that both of us. Well, both of us nothing, Mia. So at this point, Sharon cuts in. Poor Sharon. Poor Sharon. Sharon's just left her body at this point.

It's just a Chanel puddle. She goes, bottom line is that this issue is much bigger than I think Mia is appreciating. She sees it as a very simple thing. Okay, so then she gets cut off. But I mean, yeah, that is the only thing you can say my client's a fucking idiot i wish we weren't here yes how do i pull the plug on this interview can i access a time machine i should have been a baker.

So later, Gail asks, it's been reported that your phone was returned to you by an Uber driver. Is that true? Mia, that is not true because I arrived at the hotel with my phone in my hand. Gail. Okay, who returned your phone to you? Wait, if you were, what? Mia. The hotel receptionist? Gail. Mia, where had the phone been? Mia. Why don't we ask the hotel receptionist? Oh my gosh. Oh, my gosh. Gail.

Mia, to be honest, I'm telling you, you seem to be not remorseful, to have no contrition, and you're almost a little flippant about this. Yeah. You have to understand that for this teenage boy who says that he was shattered, who says that he was traumatized, Mia, I'm traumatized. Oh, my. Oh. Gail. So Gail's still finishing her previous thought. And then she goes, this was a big deal.

And then Mia says, I'm traumatized. And Gail goes, you're traumatized, too? Because? And Mia goes, yes. And I'm sorry sorry I'm sorry from the bottom of my heart he is honestly he's 14 and that's what they're claiming um yeah I'm 22 I've lived probably just the same amount of life as him honestly I'm just as a kid at heart as he is I feel sorry that I made the family go through all that stress, but at the same time, it wasn't just them going through that. Oh, Lord. Gail, I just don't think that you helped yourself by your behavior. Mia, of course not. Gail, when you look at that video, what did you think? What did you think? Mia Mia you already asked me that

you already asked me that you asked me that in the beginning of the interview I'm not going over it again Gail okay all right Mia I would like to have I would like to have a real interview with real questions and real heartfelt, sincere apologies. Let 2021 be the moment of healing. Seriously. Who's giving the heartfelt apologies? Yeah. Yeah. So many questions.

Real questions. Real questions. Gail. Okay. You want an interview with real questions. I'll. Gail. Okay. You want an interview with real questions. I'll give you the floor. What would you like us to know, Mia? Mia.

That I'm sincerely sorry to the family and the dad and the son for making them feel as if I was a racist toward them when that is not my intention. I was a racist toward them. But is not my intention. I was a racist toward them. But she's like a woman of color. Okay? Okay. Oh, no. There was a big reaction to this interview. Yeah, I bet.

Okay, one of my favorite parts is like, okay, they do CBS This Morning, they do them in segments, and then they cut back to the anchors. Yeah. So it's Gail and these two white guys. I don't know who they are, but they're like older guys. And one of the first things the guy says is, nice hat. To this day, one of the top searches of this woman is the daddy hat. People are like, what the hell? Yeah.

So there's some speculation that it's from the Call Her Daddy podcast thing. I don't know. Oh, yeah. Okay. Sure. Can you imagine? Another one was like like it's from urban outfitters i don't know but can you imagine if someone went on tv in let's go to court merch and was the Daddy. Oh, no. Gail later said that her favorite part was when Mia said, Okay, Gail, enough.

And I would give just about anything to see the unedited footage of this interview because apparently Sharon kept trying to stop Mia from saying dumb shit. And at one point Mia started arguing with her. But those assholes over at CBS left all that beautiful bean footage on the cutting room floor. That is a real shame. Brandi, this is going to shock you, but that interview didn't actually help Mia's public image. In fact, some say that in doing that interview, Mia effectively took a big sloppy dump Mia's public image. What? In fact, some say that in doing that interview, Mia effectively took a big sloppy dump on her public image. Oh, yeah, imagine that.

Just hours after Mia did that interview, she finally faced some consequences for her actions. Are you super hot? It is warm in this little room. Should we turn the fan on? Yeah, you can fan it up. Turn the beat around around love to hear percussion i had that song on a vh1 diva cd back in the day i don't mean to brag to you i

you are bragging yeah that's the kind of life I led. So two detectives from New York flew out to California and they teamed up with deputies from the Ventura County Sheriff's Office and they went to arrest Mia. I'd love more details on this. Yeah. The New York Times just said this. At around 4.30 p.m. on Thursday, the police said, Ms. Ponsetto got into her vehicle outside her home in Peru, California, and ignored orders from the police to stop. They, quote, followed her for about a mile before she was finally detained.

Goodness gracious. Unquote. One of the dudes from the Ventura County Sheriff's Office later said, she kept driving. She was very uncooperative. Another source said that Mia refused to get out of the car, and she slammed the door shut on a deputy, and the police had to pull her out of her car.

Oh my gosh. At any rate, when police finally got her into custody, Mia was charged with attempted robbery, endangering the welfare of a child, attempted grand larceny, and attempted assault. But, interestingly, no hate crime charges. Well, and I think the assault was more than attempted. I agree. Yeah. She tackled a 14-year-old boy.

She tackled him to the ground. Yeah. She tackled a 14-year-old boy. She tackled him to the ground. Yeah. But no hate crime charges, and that's because race hadn't been a factor here. The police department announced that it would not treat this as a, quote, bias incident. Okay. That was a little strange considering that just about everyone agreed that racism played some role in this crime. considering that just about everyone agreed that racism played some role in this crime. Mayor Bill de Blasio told the media,

It's almost become tragically comical how much you can rely on the fact that someone will unjustly accuse a young man of color in America. When someone does something like this, they have to suffer consequences, and there needs to be real action here by the criminal justice system to make sure there are consequences in this case. Following her arrest, more information came out about Mia's past. She was only 22, but she'd been a busy gal. Oh, yeah? She'd been charged with lewd conduct in LA County. She'd also gotten a DUI. Those were misunderstandings, too, I'm sure. Mm-hmm. Okay. Someone videoed her DUI arrest because it was bonkers. This was obviously before she became the beloved Soho Karen. Soho Karen, yeah. It's wild.

She resisted arrest, yelled at the cops. They had to cuff her on the ground. And she yelled at them, there are gang members that are killing people right now and you're arresting a girl? Wow. The whole time, her mom, who sounded just as drunk as Mia did, kept running up to the cops going,

no, she's my daughter. She didn't do anything wrong. No. She sounded like a fucking bird. She goes, ah! I don't know if this was the same incident. I don't think it was. This appeared to be taken at like a gas station or something.

I could be wrong. I saw another news report that she and her mom had gotten super drunk at a hotel and refused to leave. Oh, boy. Yeah. Okay. Great gals. Yeah. that she and her mom had gotten super drunk at a hotel and refused to leave. And so they... Oh, boy. Yeah. Okay. Great gals. Yeah.

Super sweet. No! Can you imagine? No! I mean, you talk about privilege. Yeah, exactly. It just reeks of privilege. As things progressed with criminal charges, Keon Harrell decided to take further action. He said, our life changed because

of somebody having the entitlement, an idea that just because of the way my son looked, he was the one who stole her property, which is so ridiculous. It's been a couple of months, but every time I talk about it, it brings back all kinds of emotions, like the fear that if I wasn't there to protect my Yeah. Yeah. So in March of 2021, Keon Harold and his son filed a civil suit against Mia and the Arlo Soho Hotel, amongst others, saying that the hotel should have done more to de-escalate the situation and that they'd been treated differently because of their race. Keon explained in an interview that the hotel had basically treated him and his son as guilty until proven innocent. Gayle King also interviewed Keon Sr. and Kat Rodriguez following her interview with Mia,

and Gayle specifically asked for their reaction to Mia's apology. And Keon Sr. said, listen, I feel like her apology was, you know, as genuine as when she shushed you. It said a lot. I have an issue with the idea of entitlement versus character. It has all been tragically consistent. versus character. It has all been tragically consistent. And Kat said, yeah, I apologize. Can we move on? Those were the exact words that she used with you. Does that sound like an apology? She knew she assaulted a 14-year-old boy, not a guy, not a man. Yeah.

So the civil suit moved forward, and in the summer of 2021, the Manhattan DA brought additional charges against Mia. She was charged with two counts of second-degree unlawful imprisonment as a hate crime. She pled not guilty. At a court appearance in March, Mia interrupted the proceedings to clarify that she didn't want to go to jail. Great. And her new lawyer, Paul D'Amelio, advised her to please stop talking. Unfortunately, this case did not go to trial and Mia did not take the stand in her own defense which is probably a good thing because if she took the stand in a crop top and daddy hat I would have lost my mind in a court

of law instead in April of 2022 she accepted a plea deal she pled guilty to a felony hate crime charge as part of her plea deal she didn't have to go to jail, which was great because she'd asked specifically not to, which is all you have to do. Why don't more people do that? Yeah. She just has to finish probation on her DUI case in California, go to counseling, and basically not do anything bad for two years. At the end of those two years, if she hasn't had any contact with the criminal justice system, she'll be able to plead guilty to second-degree aggravated harassment, which has a hate crime element, but it's just a misdemeanor. So the felony goes bye-bye. After the plea deal was announced, Mia's lawyer said,

Ms. Ponsetto looks forward to her eventual final plea to the harassment charge, a plea that we feel more realistically reflects her actions that night at the Arlo Hotel. It is Ms. Ponsetto's wish that Kian Harold accepts her regrets and apology for her behavior that evening and that all involved can move forward with added insight and compassion. All involved, Brandy. There's so much blame to go around, right? Wow. If she doesn't abide by the terms of her plea deal, she could face between one and four years in prison. In a statement, Manhattan D.A. Alvin Bragg said,

As a black man, I have personally experienced racial profiling countless times in my life, and I sympathize with the young man victimized in this incident. This plea ensures appropriate accountability for Ms. Ponsetto by addressing underlying causes for her behavior and ensuring this conduct does not reoccur. Okay, what do you think of all this? does not reoccur. Okay, what do you think about this? I mean, I don't love it, but I'm not surprised by it. I mean, I had a tough time with this because I kind of think, okay, first of all, I kind of think, okay, first of all, let's pretend like race really isn't a factor. Yeah. I feel that if you tackle a 14-year-old to the ground, you should probably do some jail time. Yeah, I mean.

Right? I mean, that doesn't seem like too much to ask. No. But the other thing is. She specifically asked not to go to jail, Kristen. I forgot. That's like saying Beetlejuice three times. Magic.

I don't know. I think what gets to me more is like knowing that the law would be applied so differently to different people. It's not so much that I'm like, oh, this is this is the wrong resolution. It's that like, who else would get this? Yeah. Just like the video of her with the police. Yeah. It's like, wow.

Mm hmm. I mean, she's yelling at them. She's. And they just, you know, they cuffed her, but they didn't. Even the way that she was taken into custody. Mm-hmm. Yeah. In California.

Yeah. Yeah. They pulled her from her car. Mm-hmm. Many people would not have been that lucky. No shit. No shit. Yeah. Oh, my God. Yeah.

I think that's what's so gross to me. Yeah. Absolutely. It's like how many innocent Black people have done so much less and gotten so much more. Yeah. So the criminal case is over-ish. But around the time that Mia got her plea deal, there was a hearing regarding this civil case. And Mia just didn't show up. Great. The judge was pissed. Yeah, I bet. He said there are ways to deal with this situation and not showing up is one of them. That's the worst thing you can do. It shows disrespect. Yeah. And then the judge

was like, I will wait for no man. And he scheduled the whole thing to move forward. That was April of this year. I wasn't able to find anything new about the case. So maybe it's still moving forward. Maybe they settled for an undisclosed amount. Yeah. Either way, I'd like to end with a quote from Keon Harold. He said,

people can say I'm sorry and it's empty. Justice has to do with change. And that is the story of the Soho Karen. That was wild. That's enough, Gail. Do you fucking know who you're talking to?

Oh my God, you're talking to Gayle King. Are you? Holy shit. Oh my. Take off your daddy hat. Yeah. Can you imagine that level of trolling? No.

You know what I think we should do now? We should take a few questions from our Discord, but we have to make it quick. Why? You got someplace to be? Yeah, we got a Zoom call to get to. Oh, that's right. Did you know that if you sign up for our Patreon at the $7 level or higher, you get to be on exciting Zoom calls with us? That's correct. But for now, we are taking questions from our Discord,

and we are not taking many because there's simply no time. There's no time. There's never any time. Oh, oh, I hate this question. What is it? OatmealScreamPie asks, Would you rather have fingernails for hair or hair for fingernails? Well, hair for fingernails, obviously. But that all sounds terrible.

Yeah, it's not great. But it does mean you're a hard worker. DP for DP says, Brandy, if London or Jack want to have spiders as pets, how are you going to handle that? Oh, no. It won't happen. Yeah. Sorry. Sorry, how are you going to handle that? Oh, no. It won't happen. Yeah. Sorry.

Sorry, folks. My house, my rules. That's right. When you live under your own roof, you can have a pet spider. And I'll never visit. Yeah, absolutely. Good grief. Yeah. Ooh.

Wikipedia saves lives, wants to know, Kelly or Birkin? So they're asking which Hermes handbag you would prefer. I'm Birkin all the way. I can't picture the Kelly. So she's a little more structured. It's a little smaller than the Birkin. Not as a – hold on. Let me pull up an image.

I think I'm going to go with the Birkin because that's the bag I know. Yes. It's the bag that says, yeah, I've got money and I need you to know it. Yeah. Here's the Kelly. It's not a lot different from the Birkin, but it's – Jesus, so many ads. Oh, I think that's cute.

There's the Kelly. It's cute. I mean, I guess it better be for that price. My God. That's right. You know what?. There's the Kelly. It's cute. I mean, I guess it better be for that price. My God. That's right. You know what? I'd do the Kelly. Oh, you're mixing it up.

That's right. All right. David Steele's ranch wants to know, Brandy, if, heaven forbid, you were murdered in the shower, which would be worse, being dead or being found naked? Being found naked. Oh, my God. Brandy. Absolutely worse. Okay, but what if you were found by David?

Well, that'd be better. And he would know to suspiciously put clothes on me before the paramedics arrived. Then he gets framed for your murder. No. He shouldn't mess with your body in any way. He'd have to have a talk with the police. My wife would just, she would die again if she knew that you all were seeing her naked right now. And they're like, sir, this is not our first rodeo. We promise to be disrespectful.

I almost said we promise to be disrespectful. We're only very disrespectful of her. And then they go into the bathroom very solemnly and they just honk your hooters. I was going to say they motorboat. Yeah. Ooh. Classy Penis Cake wants to know, you get one Bath & Body Works scent for the rest of your life.

Oh, God. Which one are you choosing? Do I have to? White Tea and Sage is what I would pick. Why? It is a very light, clean scent. You wouldn't get tired of it. You could smell that smell for your whole life and it wouldn't bother you. Wait, is this

like I have to exclusively wear this scent? Yeah, you get one scent. That sucks. Yeah. Picks, if you want, cucumber melon? No, gross. My one scent has to be from Bath & Body Works? Yeah, goodbye, Chanel.

Oh, I'm not that kind of gal. I'd be devastated. I find their fragrances usually too sweet for me, too juvenile. Yeah, I don't like their sweet ones. That's why I went with white tea and sage. Okay, what if you just had to smell it in your home? Do you have one that you could? Then any of like the Christmassy candles,

the holiday stuff. Yeah. We did just buy balsam and firewood. Yeah, it's good shit. Holy shit, it smells so good. I don't know that I'd want to smell it for the rest of my life, but. Oh, Kenneth Cole's reaction wants to know, what's your favorite Christmas movie?

I love Christmas movies. You do? Love them. But I don't like Hallmark movies. I'm not watching the Hallmark Christmas movies. Get the fuck out of here. All right. No.

But I love Christmas movies. So every year, the first Christmas movie I watch every year is Christmas with the Cranks with Jamie Lee Curtis and Tim Allen. Okay. I've never seen that film. Okay. Well, they decide they're skipping Christmas because their daughter joins the Peace Corps, and so they're not going to be involved in Christmas. Right. They take a cruise instead.

And then at the last minute, their daughter gets engaged and decides to come home for Christmas and celebrate. And so then they have to pull Christmas out of their assholes. Oh, my God. When they could have just said, hey, Blair, sorry, we're skipping Christmas this year, so we're not ready. But sure, we'll skip the trip. You just come on home. No, that's not an option. Thank you very much.

That is not an option. Thank you very much. That is not an option. I really like Christmas with the Cranks. I like a Christmas story. I watch it every year multiple times. I like a Muppet Christmas Carol. Oh, my God. You don't like Muppets, so. Yeah, I'm a grown woman.

Which is more than I can say for you. You didn't like Muppets when you were a kid. Yeah, I was born an adult do you have a christmas movie you like i mean i like a christmas story but i'm not going to watch it multiple times a year i watch it multiple times uh throughout the year no no i usually only watch it christmas time but i watch it multiple times on Christmas Day. Oh, yeah, because they've got the reruns. The 24-hour. Yeah, yeah.

We've all done that. Calm down. You're not special at all. Also, Four Christmases. Really like that one. Maybe I need to get into Christmas movies. Reese Witherspoon, Vince Vaughn. They're going to go on vacation.

They get grounded because there's fog, and so then they have to go to all four of the Christmases that they usually skip. Okay. That could be a hoot. That's pretty good. Yeah. Hilarity ensues. Interesting that Vince Vaughn and Tim Allen are involved in your favorite Christmas movies. Why is that interesting?

I mean, aren't they both huge douchebags? I know Tim Allen is. I don't know if Vince Vaughn is. I'm pretty sure he's a big douchebag. Okay, great. He's a big, tall douchebag. Big, tall douchebag. He collects.

Bleep. Not this again! Oh my gosh, Brandi, we kind of have to move along. I know, we've got to wrap this up. We've got to wrap it up. Thank you for everyone who sent in questions. We simply do not have time. You know what we do have time for?

Supreme Court induction. That's right. To get inducted on this podcast, all you have to do is join our Patreon at the $7 level or higher. And then we'll read your name. And for now, your first celebrity crush. What episode are we on? 239. Oh, I am here.

Yeah, I can see your little pink Kristen just floating around. Alicia Gamble. Elijah Wood. Amber. JTT. Kristen Jay. The Rock. Then I realized I was super gay, so I changed it to Sandy Boa.

Alexis Webston. Jesse McCartney. Kelly Joyce. Ryder Strong. That's Sean from Boy Meets World. Oh. That sounds like a made-up name. No, it's a real name.

Sherry Sinicola. Russell Crowe in The Gladiator. I like Russell Crowe in that throne... Throne throwing? Phone throwing scene at the hotel. You mean where he beats somebody with a phone? Do you know who he is? He's too important.

Mikkel. Rob Thomas. Do you need me to explain who Rob Thomas is? No. Is that a Third Eye Blinds guy? Oh. I guess you do need to explain who Rob Thomas is. That's fine.

Let's move along. We don't have time. No, I've been wrong. It's Matchbox 20. Was that a Matchbox 20 song? Yes. Was it? Yes.

What song was it? Lisa's Diner. Uh-oh. It looks like I... Did I cut off Lisa's crush? No, it was probably Chingy. Who's Chingy? I like the way you do that right there.

Oh, Lisa. Jean-Pierre Isabelle Rossi. Ooh, Joey McIntyre from the New Kids on the Block. Danny Cronin. Isaac Hansen. Wow, that's really going for, you know, the less popular of the three. Megan H. Like those odds.

JTT. Carrie Coggin. Devin Sawa. Laura Kelly. Oh, Devin Sawa. Laura Kelly. Oh, Devin Sawa. Kathleen Surratt. JTT, of course.

My God, these two are just dominating. Kenzie H. Johnny Depp. Beth Giannion. First crush was on the older brothers from Three Ninjas. Rocky loves Emily. Rocky loves Emily. Rocky loves Emily. Okay, I have no idea. Rocky's the oldest one.

All right. Well, great. I liked Tum Tum, so. I'm very happy for you. Emily, I'm sorry, Emily Patterson. Justin Bieber. EJ. Lucy Liu.

Welcome to the Supreme Court! Kristen sugar titties all over the place during that. I couldn't help it. Thank you, everyone, for all of your support. If you're looking for other ways to support us, please find us on social media. We're on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, Patreon. Please remember to subscribe to the podcast wherever you listen, and then head on over to Apple Podcasts and leave us a five-star rating and review.

Then be sure to join us next week. When we'll be experts on two whole new topics. Podcast adjourned! And now for a note about our process. I read a bunch of stuff then regurgitate it all back up in my very limited vocabulary. And I copy and paste from the best sources on the web and sometimes Wikipedia. So we owe a huge thank you to the real experts. I got my info from reporting by the New York Times, the New York Post, and CBS This Morning. I got my info from an article for Texas Monthly by Skip Hollinsworth, an article for Mental Floss by Kara Kovalchik,

MySanAntonio.com, and Kins5 News. Kin just works his ass off. I don't know that that's right. Oh, it is right. For a full list of our sources, visit lgtcpodcast.com. Any errors are, of course, ours, but please don't take our word for it. Go. Read their stuff.