Let's Go To Court! - 252: Ringing the Wrong Doorbell & the Disappearance of Maribel Ramos

Episode Date: April 26, 2023

This week, Kristin starts us off with an old, yet very timely story. In 1992, Yoshihiro Hattori and his friend Webb Haymaker arrived at what they thought was the location of a halloween party. In reality, the two teenage boys were at the wrong house. When they went up to the house and knocked on the door, a woman opened a side door, spotted the two boys, then quickly slammed it shut. Yoshi and Webb were confused, but they figured they’d arrived at the wrong home. As they were walking away, the door opened again. This time, a 30 year old man stood in the doorway with a gun. When Yoshi approached him, saying that they were there for the party, the man shot Yoshi in the chest. Then Brandi tells us about Maribel Ramos, who thought she’d found the perfect roommate when Kwang Choi “KC” Joy responded to her ad on Craigslist. KC described himself as an easygoing professional. He soon moved into Maribel’s home in Orange County, California. Initially, Maribel and KC got along great. They even went on vacation together. But when KC couldn’t pay rent, their relationship went downhill. Maribel feared that things might get violent between them. Then she disappeared. And now for a note about our process. For each episode, Kristin reads a bunch of articles, then spits them back out in her very limited vocabulary. Brandi copies and pastes from the best sources on the web. And sometimes Wikipedia. (No shade, Wikipedia. We love you.) We owe a huge debt of gratitude to the real experts who covered these cases. In this episode, Kristin pulled from: “Yoshihiro Hattori: The door knock that killed a Japanese teenager in the US,” by Toby Luckhurst for the BBC “Defense depicts Japanese boy as ‘scary’,” The New York Times “Acquittal in doorstep killing of Japanese student,” The New York Times “Student’s trust in people proved fatal,” by Adam Nossiter for The New York Times “Judge awards damages in Japanese youth’s death,” by Adam Nossiter for The New York Times “Mother of slain teen felt murdered herself,” by Leslie Zganjar for the Associated Press “Each other’s arms,” by David Schimke for the Carleton College Voice The book, “I have lived in the monster,” by Robert K. Ressler and Tom Shachtman “How the mother of Japanese student shot dead became a force for US gun reform,” by Daniel Hurst for The Guardian “Homeowner testifies in shooting death of Japanese exchange student,” UPI Archives “Slain teen’s parents hope U.S. gun control fight continues, 30 yrs on,” Kyodo News “Parents of slain Japanese student push for gun control from afar,” by Akiko Fujita for ABC News “Gun violence conference to remember 20 years since Yoshi died,” by Kira Chawla for WAFB “Rodney Peairs found innocent in exchange student shooting case,” UPI Archives In this episode, Brandi pulled from: “The Rent Check” episode See No Evil “Murder Can’t Be Proved in Death of Maribel Ramos: Defense Attorney” by Melissa Pamer and Chip Yost, KTLA5 News “Roommate Found Guilty of 2nd-Degree Murder in Death of Maribel Ramos” by Melissa Pamer and Chip Yost, KTLA5 News “Maribel Ramos’ Killer Sentenced to 15 Years to Life in Prison, Says He Cared for Victim ‘More Than Anyone’” by Melissa Pamer and Chip Yost, KTLA5 News “KC Joy gets 15 years to life in prison for Maribel Ramos murder” by Greg Lee and ABC7 News Staff, ABC7 News “Who Is Kwang Chol 'KC' Joy, The Killer Profiled In 'Worst Roommate Ever?’” By Jax Miller, oxygen.com “Southern California man convicted of killing ex-roommate Army veteran Maribel Ramos” by Sasha Goldstein, New York Daily News “The Murder of Maribel Ramos” by Kiley, It’s Crime O’Clock Somewhere “'Worst Roommate Ever': KC Joy killed Maribel Ramos for demanding overdue rent” by Akhila Suresh, meaww.com YOU’RE STILL READING? My, my, my, you skeezy scunch! You must be hungry for more! We’d offer you some sausage brunch, but that gets messy. So how about you head over to our Patreon instead? (patreon.com/lgtcpodcast). At the $5 level, you’ll get 45+ full length bonus episodes, plus access to our 90’s style chat room!  

One semester of law school. One semester of criminal justice. Two experts! I'm Kristen Caruso. I'm Brandi Pond. Let's go to court! On this episode, I'll be talking about ringing the wrong doorbell. And I'll be talking about the disappearance of Mirabel Ramos.

Oh boy. Oh, that's a timely topic that you're covering there, Kristen. Yeah, it really is. Wow. Mm-hmm. Okay. It's gonna be a big bummer. Okay. You know what else was a big bummer? Our bonus episode that we just recorded. Woo! Was it?

We apologize. Hey, you. Hey, you. Are you in a good mood? Oh, great. Don't worry. Would you like to not be? Check out our latest bonus episode You have to pay You have to pay To be depressed

Five dollar minimum To get access To all those Meaty bonus episodes Yeah Which now there are Forty six of Yes

Question mark I feel confident about it Forty six Exclamation point. Yeah. Baby. Yeah. This one is probably the biggest bummer of them all, though.

Yeah. Yeah. Well, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. If you give us even more money, you get all kinds of stuff. You get a sticker. You get our autographs.

You get a monthly Zoom call. You get episodes a day early. You get them ad-free. You get a sticker. You get our autographs. You get a monthly Zoom call. You get episodes a day early. You get them ad-free. You get 10% off merch. Is there new merch coming? Why, yes, there is. We're working on it. LGTC thongs. No, we're not. Nobody asked for that. I know, but sometimes people don't know what they want until they see it in our store. Oh, a slight. A thong with a gavel. Nobody wants that.

No. Slight disclaimer for this episode. There is a very loud truck outside doing Lord only knows what some kind of construction, but it is creating a hum in this room. So if you're hearing that, it's that's what that is. And hopefully it wraps up soon. I'm sorry. All of Kansas City is under construction. Yes. They're building entirely new roads from scratch. Or at least that's how it feels. Yeah. And

stages. Stages? Yeah, they're building a stage right in front. Oh. Kristen, keep up. We just drove by it, I guess, two days ago. Okay. NFL Draft. The NFL Draft is going to be here. They got a giant stage they're building down there. It's very exciting times.

If you insist. You know what else is exciting, Brandi? What? Doing an ad. Do-loo! Woo, doggies. And we're back from the ad. Where's your noise?

Do-loo. There you go. Oh, listen to you. Miss I from the ad. Where's your noise? There you go. Oh, listen to you. Miss I hate the noise. Oh, wait. Now I love the noise. I never hated the noise. People complained about the noise.

You're hot and you're cold. You're yes and you're no. You're in and you're out. Jesus. I have no shortage of songs that describe you, my dear. If only I knew the words to the bitch's back. Oh, look. That's rude.

Oh, because the bitch didn't go anywhere. We've been with each other all day. Oh, am I going first? You are. Yeah, that's how it works. Unfortunately. Okay, everyone. I got a term I do not disturb on because my phone's blowing up over here.

Are you popular or something? What's going on? So, Brandy, my dear, there have been like five million very depressing stories in the past five days. Yeah. stories in the past five days yeah most recently and i think the one that sticks out most to us is because it just happened here right in the city is ralph yarrow so ralph yarrow last week he was sent by his mother to pick up his twin siblings from a friend's house it was like 10 o'clock at night he was sent to an address that he had never been to before and he ended up at a house one street over from where he was supposed to go. And so he just got confused. He rang the doorbell and a man opened the door

and shot him twice. Yeah. Yeah. That's horrible. And of course, you add the really fun layer of Ralph is a black teenager. The shooter was white. And initially it looked like the guy who shot a kid wasn't going to face any kind of consequences. They questioned him and released him saying they needed to do further investigation. Seems pretty cut and dry. Yeah, I agree. So, yeah, that story has since been arrested just for the record. Well, he's already bonded out. So that's super cool. Ralph did survive. Yeah. Yes. Thank God. I don't know how he was shot in the head. Yes. Above his

eye hit the frontal lobe like the bullet was in his head for 12 hours before they could remove it. Yeah. It's awful. So Norman and I were talking about that story. And he said, hey, did you ever hear the story of Yoshihitori? And I was like, no. Yeah. So he started telling me. And I was like, okay, well, that seems really timely and horrible.

So here we go. That's what we're talking about today. Okay, wonderful. Thank you to Norm for suggesting this case. Case. Case. This case. This case.

When you're sad, you just add an H to things. And it makes you seem more distinguished. And happier. Because you added an H. You know what I do sometimes? What? I've noticed. I've noticed.

Anytime I talk about my depression, I say it like, depression. Yeah. Like you're in a musical. That's kind of what it feels like to me. Yeah. Yeah. And like, depression. Yeah. Like you're in a musical. That's kind of what it feels like to me. Yeah. And it feels grand and kind of exciting and like maybe I should be showing cleavage.

Yeah, sure. And also in a very flouncy dress. Yeah, yeah. Not just like, not random cleave. No. Obviously. Obviously.

Depression. Do you picture yourself like jumping onto a streetlight and like spinning around it? No because it's not really happy No I know! That's what you do when you're joyful. Oh okay. That's when

the manic phase enters That's when you get on on the light pole Duh! Excuse me Not light pole, street lamp. Street lamp, light pole Light pole works. I know but light pole gives a different it's too modern oh yeah it's an old-timey street lamp where i'm you know using

vel velvet to like encase my cleave you know that's old-timey stuff i thought you were gonna say velcro at first oh well i mean that hey has anyone thought about that velcro your titties well i'm just thinking like i feel like there's an opportunity for a real powerful sports well oh that exists that exists with velcro yes it has velcro straps okay so you like load yourself into it yeah and then you take those straps and you you velcro them back as far as you can to get that super compressed okay i have seen those before i don't buy it. Okay.

You don't think it works? No. You don't think that Velcro's strong enough to hold up dim titties? Absolutely not. Especially because I've seen it with sports bras. It is a sports bra. The one that I am specifically describing is a sports bra. Yeah.

And what I am telling you today, my friend, is I'd get, well, no, I guess I don't technically know, but I just have a feeling that I would get on a treadmill. And then just one titty is just flopping free because that Velcro has given way. Absolutely. All right. And then all of a sudden, Planet Fitness has to have a talk with me. And then everyone's embarrassed. Do you have one of these bras?

No, I've just seen it on, I don't know, like an Instagram ad or something. No, what I'm proposing is more of a Velcro strappy. Oh, to push them together. That pushes the cups together. Yeah. Yes. And it's not a sports bra, so you're not running. You're just like sitting around looking very alluring.

Well, I mean, if you're jumping on street lamps, you probably need. Well, it's a one jump thing. Something kind of supportive. You're not just like happy all the time. It's a one jump thing. Okay. I'm pretty happy most of the time. Yeah, this is not about you.

This is about me singing depression. Do you not have depression? I do not. Have you not have depression? I do not. Have you ever had depression? I have not. I think I have, like, the opposite thing.

Okay. No, no, no. I just think that I have, like, no, no. I think that, like, my brain makes, like, just, like, a lot of

happy chemicals that I'm able to just, you know. Oh, and you're just snarfing them down. Yeah. Not sharing them with anybody, huh? Using them all up.

I don't know that there's a way to share them. Let's get a stainless steel straw up your nose. Maybe we can suck some of those out. There's definitely something going on there because the things I've learned about my life is I was in a pretty terrible marriage for a long time and I had no idea. It was shocking to you. It was shocking to me. I was maybe the most shocked of anyone to learn it. The most, the only, the few.

Yeah, well, sometimes our brains do lie to us so yeah i think my brain's like doing the opposite it's producing like a lot of those happy chemicals damn yeah yeah see mine i gotta get the store bought yeah uh-huh yeah mine does Well, I just had a really dark thought. Maybe mine's just going to like, I'm using more than my allotted amount, so it's just going to like run out one day. Oh, that would be such great schadenfreude. All of a sudden, five years from now, you're like, I don't know what it is, but I just don't want to shower today. And I'm like, I bet you wish you were swinging from a lamppost right now, but you're not. Did you just look at the clock?

I did because we've yet to start a case and we're, yeah, many minutes into this. Brandy, I'm doing the thing I often do when we stall. It's also a two-episode week. It is. Oh, yeah, that is important for people to know because we're barely holding it together at this point. We recorded the bonus episode. It was horribly depressing. Afterward, Norm was like, how'd the episode go?

We were like, terrible. It was horrible, but Afterward, Norm was like, how'd the episode go? And we were like, terrible. It was horrible. Great. But thank you for asking. Anyway, now I've got another bad story. And I'm just, instead I'm inventing bras with Velcro across the cups. Okay. Why don't you tell us the story?

She's rude, isn't she, she is oh is that the the crowd of listeners yeah yeah that's them be like we're always on your side talk more about politics you seem really fun Talk more about politics. You seem really fun. Okay, Brandy, please stop stalling, all right? We don't have the time. Yeah.

Okay. Yoshihiro Hattori, who went by Yoshi, was born in Nagoya, Japan. I don't mean to interrupt you because you've just started. Oh. But typically you give sources at the beginning and you did not do that. Do you want to do that? You know what? I do.

Thank you very much. Okay. A lot of this comes from the New York Times. A lot of it comes from, oh gosh, lots of different articles, honestly, because there's a documentary about this case, but it cost like $157 to view. Oh, my gosh. And, you know, no. It's a bit pricey. I thought so.

Yeah. When it comes to movies I'm willing to download, it's like $4. Yeah, exactly. Maybe $5 is the max. Yeah. But I did find a show that some blessed soul uploaded to YouTube. It was from like 94 or something. Okay.

Justice Files. Oh, yeah. You were on Justice Files. I had no memory. Anyway. Yeah. Great episode. Okay.

Enjoyed the Justice File. And now I will start my case, which was rudely interrupted by a very happy woman. Now I will start my case, which was rudely interrupted by a very happy woman. Yoshihiro Hattori, who went by Yoshi, was born in Nagoya, Japan, which it's a good thing you had me start again because I just mispronounced the name of this city. Okay. And now I did it properly. Well, I know better because I did write notes to myself. Yeah.

I know sometimes people think that I'm not even trying when it comes to pronunciation. I am. I'm just very bad at it. Did you say pronunciation? Yeah, as an intentional joke. Because I'm very funny. What? Did I say pronunciation? I'm not sure.

I mean, I wouldn't be shocked. Anyway. Are you done making fun of the beautiful big-titted woman who sits before you? Beautiful big-titted woman. He was born into an upper middle class family. His dad was an engineer. His mom was a stay-at-home mom, and he had two siblings, one younger, one older. Yoshi was super outgoing.

He never had any trouble making friends. Also, because some people really do have it all, you should know that he was also very handsome and athletic. I'm very happy for him. You don't get jealous when you hear about people like this? No, I think that's amazing. That's why I fucking love, like, the Olympics and stuff, because it is amazing to see people who are so talented at things I am not talented at. Okay, right.

But, like, if you also found out that they were, like, super smart and hot, you'd continue to be happy for them yeah oh okay me too i wouldn't be like that's unfair well no i mean i'm also jealous but i'm also happy for them yeah okay um by the time yoshi got to high school he was super into rugby i know all about that sport and also always ready for an adventure. So when he was like 14 or 15, he took a test for the American Field Service, which is an exchange student program. Yoshi passed the test and he got really excited about the idea of going to a new country. He had visions of making, wherever he ended up, a second home. In an essay that he wrote for the program,

he wrote about one day introducing his host family to Japanese cooking, like, you know, tempura fish, and teaching them about the Japanese way of life. Would you ever have done this as a kid? No. Yeah, you couldn't have paid me. No. I was scared enough to go to our regular high school. Yes, absolutely. Don't send me somewhere else. Yeah. In the summer of 1992, Yoshi got his wish. He was going to spend his senior year of high school in America. And it was so exciting. Yoshi didn't speak a ton of English.

You know, he'd studied it in school, but there's obviously a huge difference between taking a few language courses and being fluent in another language. Absolutely. Huge difference. But that was okay. That's what an exchange program is for. You get to immerse yourself in another culture. You learn a ton. So that summer, Yoshi flew over to the United States to live with his new host family. that summer, Yoshi flew over to the United States to live with his new host family.

My personal opinion, Yoshi lucked out with this host family. He'd been placed with the Haymakers, and I mean, the mom, Holly Haymaker, in addition to having an amazing name, was a doctor, and the dad, Dick Haymaker, was a physics professor, I believe at Louisiana State University. And they had us, what, Brandy? Brandy, you are so immature. I am. A haymaker is a punch. So that guy's name is Dick Punch. Haymaker is a punch?

It's a type, yeah, it's like a punch in boxing, isn't it? Oh. You're asking me? Give me a break. Okay, Google it, lady. I'm looking at him. So you really think his name is like Dick Punch? Everyone, she's Googling intently.

She's smiling and kind of covering her mouth because she doesn't want to be this person. She doesn't want to be the woman in her 30s laughing at a, it's not even a dick joke, it's just the word dick.

Haymaker is a punch delivered with great force, especially one that results in a knockout. Well, I mean, you punch a guy right in the dick and that'll do it. Oh, that's not what I'm picturing. You're picturing getting punched with a dick. With a dick, yeah, obviously. You can get slapped with a dick. I don't think you can get punched with a dick. With a dick, yeah, obviously. You can get slapped with a dick. I don't think you can get punched with a dick. What, are they charging at you like it's a javelin?

Sure, yeah. All right, listen, we don't want to hear about your weekend plans. No one needs to know. Although now you do have me thinking about a knight's tale. Yeah. I wouldn't have minded. Okay, anyhow. By the way, how dare you?

Because one of the sources referred to him as Richard. Oh, okay. And I was like, you know what? This story's too serious. If I call him Dick, she's gonna be really immature. But then, he goes by Dick, is the thing. Okay. And so, that's what he goes by Dick is the thing.

And so that's what he goes by. It's not funny at all. Yeah? Nope. I'm a very mature 36 year old woman. 36 and like three quarters. I'm almost 37. Yeah. You wouldn't know it. I'm very mature. I don't think there's anything

funny about the name Dick Haymaker. All right, great. They also had a son. His name was Schlong McGee. And I suppose you have something to say about that. And I suppose you have something to say about that. No, his name was Webb. His name was Webb?

Yes, W-E-B-B. Like short for Webster, you think? Well, I don't know because it was W-E-B-B. Do you get to add another letter when you're shortening? Short for Webulin. Okay. This is... Weber. Oh, short for Weber, I bet. Yep, that has to be it. Okay. Yeah, alright. Mystery solved. Yeah, it's like a family name, probably, that they've turned into a first name. We've got it. We solved the mystery. Alright, and Schlong McGee, to be clear, was

just a hilarious joke. So, Webb was 16, just like Yoshi. So, you know, this seemed like it was going to be a really good match. They'd get to go to school together and, you know, I don't know. What you hope for in this situation is they become best friends forever, right? Absolutely, yes. They're in each other's weddings. Like, it's the whole thing.

Yeah. Okay. That's my... What? My ex-in-laws they um so my jesus is so complicated yeah you're you're not looking awkward at all what's wrong anyway like the they i your ex-in-laws the penises no they hosted when they hosted an exchange yeah they hosted an exchange student they the whole the whole family has remained in in contact with that student

they visit her she visits them it's wonderful lifelong friendship i am so glad we got through that story. That was amazing and totally worth it. Patty, here is my prediction. She is going to listen to each and every one of us. Don't you dare. Just go ahead and do it right now. Don't you dare, Patty. It's an amazing, amazing story of Brandi bending over backwards going, why did I start this story?

No, it's good. Yeah. I mean, that's exactly what you hope to happen. That's what you hope for. Yes. Yes. And then you hope that one day someone talks about it on a podcast and goes, awkwardly. The Haymakers were experienced hosts.

They'd hosted exchange students, I believe, twice before. And worth mentioning, if you had to stay somewhere, the Haymakers' home was not a bad option. They lived good snacks. Oh, you know what? I bet they didn't, now that you mention it. She was a physician. She looked, I'm just going to give you a vibe here. We got an almond mom situation.

Well, perhaps. I'm just thinking, I read in her the same energy that is in me when I'm like, you know, I could make fettuccine alfredo, but what if I did it with Greek yogurt? Yeah. I feel like I saw, I saw... Glimpses of myself. No, what I'm trying to tell you is they had a nice home with a pool, Brandy. Oh, shit. Can you imagine how lucky you'd feel?

That would be amazing. Yeah. So they lived in Baton Rouge, Louisiana, and again, they had a pool. So Yoshi arrived in his new home in the United States, and the haymakers just instantly loved him. He was really fun. He was kind of a free spirit. He was super sweet. Right away, he began referring to Holly and Dick as mom and dad, which I think is so endearing.

Yeah, that's super sweet. Again, you know, he didn't speak much English. So he kind of, you do what you can in that situation. You express yourself a lot through kind of playful movement, you know. And just as everyone hoped, Yoshi and Webb hit it off. Unfortunately, they did have a terrifying moment like 10 days into Yoshi's arrival. Apparently, Webb had a bunch of friends over and they were all playing out back in the pool. And they started a game of Marco Polo.

And Webb accidentally dove into the shallow end of the pool and broke his neck. Holy shit. He ended up being fine, but I'm guessing that scared the ever-loving shit out of everyone. Yes. So, Webb had to wear a neck brace for a while. Aside from that, things were going pretty well. I mean, that sounds like the most traumatic moment you're going to have of the year for sure. That fall, Yoshi and Webb started their senior years at McKinley High.

So I imagine for most people it would be really hard to start a new school in a new country in a new language. Yeah. You know what's funny? I'm like literally just realizing that I have done this. You have done that. But I was in second grade. I think it's so much easier when you're young. Yes.

Anyway, it was a good time. Yeah. But Yoshi did just fine. His classmates really seemed to love him. Again, he's handsome. He's really funny. One time he showed up a little late to a football game and his classmates saw him and started chanting, Yoshi, Yoshi, Yoshi. And, you know, he's a total ham.

So he was grinning and busted out a little tap dance. Oh, my gosh. I love that so much. He signed up for a jazz dance class. I believe it was through the school. And I mean, evidently, he was super popular in this jazz dance class. And I am assuming

it's because it was one of those things where no other guys were in the class. And so he's the one guy in this jazz class, don't you think? And so all the girls are like in love with him. Yes. Everything okay with your throat, ma'am? Yeah, it's fine.

Nothing happened. So Henry is right now the only, like, I'm pretty sure, like, the only boy in this gymnastics class. Uh-huh. And he is the worst. Oh, no! But everyone loves him. Yeah, I mean, he, you know But everyone loves it. Yeah. I mean, you know, everyone loves it.

Everyone loves him. Of course. He's the little boy out there. He started late, you know. Yeah. And, you know, maybe us pits folks aren't the most coordinated in the world. No, Kyla is very coordinated. Oh, yeah, she is.

Kyla's an amazing dancer. All right. I guess I'm just talking about myself. I have noticed you've not said anything about my dancing. You also sometimes dance. Wow. Wow. You know, I guess all that wonderful dancing I did at your wedding went unnoticed.

I didn't want to be up on stage, but I did it for the crowd. Anyhow, the Haymakers made it a point to show Yoshi around, and at one point they all went to a local blues festival together. And as Holly remembers it, it took Yoshi, like, no time whatsoever to spot a Japanese girl who was also an exchange student. Yeah. And they struck up a conversation, yada, yada, yada. She ended up inviting him to a Halloween party. Oh, shit.

Yeah. So that was kind of awesome. Where's Chuck Woolery when you need him? How many times? As many times as I can. Everyone, if you're like, who the hell? That's a love connection joke is what that is. Hey, do you want to make any pop culture references to like the 1930s? Would that be good?

Maybe some 1890s jokes. Anyway, Yoshi and... Chuck Woolrey was very popular in the early 1990s, so it's very timely for this case. Very popular in the 1990s. That's when Love Connection was on!

Oh my god. I'm very sorry. I didn't realize that you and Chuck Woolery were close personal friends. I didn't realize that you exchanged Christmas cards with the man. I wish. And you flew on his private jet. Anyhow, Yoshi and Webb were going to go to a Halloween party at a girl's house.

Yoshi was pumped for this party. He'd become kind of obsessed with John Travolta, so he decided that for the party he wanted to go as John Travolta in Saturday Night Fever. Oh! That night he put on a white tux and a ruffled button-down and I assume some flashy jewelry because why wouldn't you? Yoshi normally wore contact lenses. Lenses? No T in sight in that word.

I'm not sure why, but he didn't put them in that night. Webb, I must say, didn't put in nearly as much effort to his costume. What'd he dress up as? I don't know that you can call it anything, okay? Like, and I'm not mad, but... You sound kind of mad! I guess... Okay, here's the thing.

Like, he had his neck brace. Uh-huh. And I guess he felt like, well, I need to make this part of a costume. And so he just added some bandages to himself. Oh, yeah. What do you mean, yeah? Yeah, he's like an accident survivor. Yeah.

Yeah. I mean, but, like, Yoshi's bringing the fire. All right. The fever. He's bringing the fever. The Saturday night The fever. He's bringing the fever. The Saturday night fever. And it was a Saturday night. Wow.

Okay, that's, I don't want to hear your sarcasm. I think that's kind of cool. Anyway, that night, Webb and Yoshi headed out for the party. It was Saturday, October 17th, 1992. And, you know, it was around like 8 o'clock at night. October 17th, 1992, and, you know, it was around like 8 o'clock at night. This party was taking place in an area of Baton Rouge that Webb wasn't super familiar with, so they got a little lost. Eventually, they got on the right street.

It was East Brookside. And they came upon a house that just kind of had to be it. It had a bunch of Halloween decorations, you know, paper skeleton, plastic ghost, and there were three cars in the driveway, and the boys looked at the numbers on the house, and they read 10311. And Webb was like, oh, this is it. They'd arrived at 10311 East Brookside, Baton Rouge, Louisiana. Should I look this up? Yeah, if you want.

I was wondering why you were sitting on your ass. 10311 East Brookside, Baton Rouge, Louisiana. Okay, I'm seeing it. i'm seeing a house oh yeah a little brick number it's a little brick number brick number i like these little archy windows yeah yeah so it's kind of your standard brick ranch yeah got an interesting little carport yeah Yeah, I don't like it. Neither do I. What Webb didn't realize was that the address they were looking for was 101-31 East Brookside. Oh, no. So they just transfixed two of the numbers.

Right. Transposed two of the numbers. Yes. Yeah, actually. Yes, that's correct. Transported the numbers to another place. So the party was actually being held five doors down. And boy, that shouldn't be such an ominous, terrible thing.

No, it sure shouldn't. But this is America. Easy, Childish Gambino. Is that a line from a song? Yes, it is. That's the name of a song by Childish Gambino. Is that a line from a song? Yes, it is. That's the name of a song by Childish Gambino. Yoshi and Webb obviously didn't know that they were at the wrong house. So, you know, they walked up, went to the door, knocked, and no one answered. Seemed a little weird.

Then they noticed a woman open the door to the ugly carport. That's just me being rude. And Webb told her, we're looking for the party. And the woman quickly slammed the door shut. Webb and Yoshi were pretty confused. Yeah. But they figured, all right, we must be at the wrong place because that was weird. Yeah. So they just walked away. They were nearly to the street when someone opened the carport door again. That person was a 30-year-old man named Rodney Pierce. He was a

butcher for the local Winn-Dixie supermarket and he was holding a gun. We like peers like Piers Morgan or like peers as I'm like peering at you. It's like peers like I peered into the microphone and I knocked it with my hand. No one's going to hear that because I only hit the pop filter. They're going to hear it. They're not.

They're going to know deep down. They're going to be like, I feel like Brandy made a terrible mistake. No, it's spelled P-E-A-I-R-S, which I think is very complicated. It's not Paris? Multiple articles told me that it was pronounced Piers. Okay, I love it. I don't know what to tell you. That's great.

That's how I'm choosing to pronunciate it all. So it's impossible to know what Yoshi made of this situation. Judging from the way he reacted, it's pretty clear he didn't understand what was going on. Because Yoshi got really excited. He started walking toward the man, kind of singing, we're here for the party. We're here for the party. Yeah. He was so happy.

Rodney yelled at Yoshi to freeze. But Yoshi didn't seem to understand what he meant by that. I'm sure that he wouldn't. No. It's like even if you know what the word means, you would probably know it in the traditional sense. Yes. But even then, if you don't have a good grasp on the language, freeze would not be one of the words you would know necessarily. So he kept walking toward the man, still excited to go to the party meanwhile webb spotted the

man's gun and he could see that yoshi didn't understand that he was in danger maybe yoshi thought this was a halloween prank maybe yoshi didn't even see the gun because again he didn't have his contact lenses so well so webb Yoshi, no, Yoshi, come back. But Rodney was yelling too, and so was Yoshi. He was talking about being there for the party, and, you know, he's smiling, laughing. Yoshi was about five feet from Rodney when Rodney fired the gun. Oh, my gosh. He shot Yoshi in the chest, then slammed the door shut. Oh, my gosh. He shot Yoshi in the chest, then slammed the door shut.

Oh my gosh. Webb immediately ran to a neighbor's house for help. He asked them to call 911. Then he ran back to Yoshi's side. Yoshi was still alive. He was moaning and crying. Rodney and his wife Bonnie stayed inside. Bonnie did eventually call 911.

She said that her husband had shot, quote, a boy. Soon an ambulance arrived on the scene. It took Yoshi away, but he died on the way to the hospital. Oh, my gosh. Dick and Holly Haymaker were out at the movies when this happened, but, you know, police were able to get a hold of Holly via her pager. Uh-huh. So she returned the call, and they told her that Webb and Yoshi had been in some sort of accident,

that Webb was fine, but Yoshi wasn't. Uh-huh. And, you know, Holly was like, oh, OK, well, we'll meet you at the hospital. Yeah. And the officer said, that won't be necessary. Oh, my gosh. So Dick and Holly went to the police station to get their son. And, I mean, it just sounds like he was kind of shell-shocked.

Yeah. Holly told him that Yoshi had died and Webb just put his head in his hands and he said, his poor mother. Oh my gosh. It was awful. Yeah. Yoshi was dead because they'd rung the wrong doorbell. Are you kidding me? The haymakers were very upset, and they were also very worried for Yoshi's family. They were about to find out that their son had been killed so far from home. Yoshi's mom, Mieko, got the news when someone who worked for the exchange program called her. She said that when she found out, she went into Yoshi's bedroom

and just cried herself to sleep. Yoshi's family was devastated. I can't even imagine. And being, I mean, you're a world away. Right. I think, oh gosh, that just adds a whole nother layer to it, I feel like. Yeah. To add to that is the fact that gun violence is extremely uncommon in Japan.

Yeah. Civilians don't have handguns in Japan. You know, there are very few deaths from gun violence. deaths from gun violence. And usually when people do die from gun violence, it's, I believe they said it was like associated with organized crime. So it's just not something that's going to happen to a 16 year old who shows up at the wrong house. Yeah. Within a few days, the Hattori's flew out to Baton Rouge. Their first stop was to the morgue. This story became huge international news, particularly in Japan. People were stunned by Yoshi's death, and they became a whole lot more outraged when Rodney Pierce wasn't charged with a crime. What now? Yeah. I mean, same shit that just happened here. It turned out police had questioned him, and they'd almost immediately released him.

They felt that he was totally within his rights to shoot Yoshi. Yoshi had trespassed, you see, onto Rodney's property, therefore it was totally fine to shoot him. He's protecting his property, standing his ground, if you will. Oh, my gosh. Yeah. These cases infuriate me. Yeah. But not everyone saw it that way.

Yeah, what did this guy think this kid was going to do to him? Um, okay. So what do you think happened? Why do you think you shot him? I have no idea. Okay. You'll find out. Okay.

Well, you'll find out what he says. Yeah. The governor of Louisiana and really a lot of people internationally were like, no, Rodney Pierce needs to face charges. He killed a kid. Yeah. So thanks to that pushback, Rodney was eventually charged with manslaughter. With a criminal trial in the works, Yoshi's parents were left to deal with their grief and their shock. in the works, Yoshi's parents were left to deal with their grief and their shock. On the flight back home, Yoshi's mom, Mieko, said that at one point everyone was asleep on the flight,

but she couldn't sleep. And she felt that in a way her son was there with her. And she felt like he was telling her to do something with her grief. to do something with her grief. So she did. And so did her husband. They decided that the best thing they could do in the wake of their son's death was to try to make a positive change in the world. The Hattori's started a petition in Japan calling for the removal of handguns from American homes. Wow. The exact number kind of changes, and obviously they got more as this petition grew, but they collected approximately 1.6 million signatures, which they then presented to the United States ambassador. The Haymakers joined the Hattori's in their activism. Dick began a petition in the United States. It was obviously a lot less popular

here. Yeah. But he dedicated a lot of time to it. This was before the internet. So. Oh, yeah. Phone calls, got a fax machine in their home. He's a fairly soft spoken guy, but this really fired him up. He told the media the real issue is that the United States has not grown up. That frontier mentality is not out of the national psyche. And because he'd said that, Dick then received a very threatening phone call from a dude who loves guns. Great. There you go. Depending on who you asked, this wasn't just about gun violence. This was also about racism. In an interview, Holly said that Yoshi's race definitely played a role in Rodney's decision to pull the trigger.

She said, I've often wished that we had a French boy or a Norwegian boy because I'm not sure that that boy would have been shot. Yeah, she's probably right. Absolutely. When it came time to select a jury, the prosecution had their work cut out for them. One potential juror said that she didn't understand how this case was going to trial. Okay, goodbye. She said, a man's home is his castle. Oh, for fuck's sake.

This kid was in the driveway. Right. Asking about a party. Yeah. The woman was dismissed from the jury. Meanwhile, the defense was able to dismiss every single potential juror who didn't believe that people should keep guns in their home, which I'm guessing in Louisiana was like three people. Right. I don't know.

This is another thing I read but did not write down. I read that the defense attorney. Oh, shit. I should have written this down. But OK, so picture it. He's got all the potential jurors right there. OK, so picture he's got all the potential jurors right there. And he's like, you know, we have a social contract that I'm not going to, you know, charge at you, whatever, blah, blah, blah.

And just for some theatrics, he kind of out of nowhere in the middle of his story charged at a juror and startled them. Yeah. And he's like, see, that's my point. I came at you and it surprised you. I broke the social contract that we had. That's stupid. I mean, here's the thing. Like, okay, yeah, I don't expect someone to come at me really fast. So, yeah, I'm going to be startled.

Do I have the right to shoot you? No. No. And also, that's not what happened here. Mm-hmm. Knocked on the door. The wife answered. Then she went back in. And then the guy came out fully knowing that these two teenagers were in front of his house.

He wasn't surprised to find them out there. I don't know. I don't know. Okay, continue. A lot of reporters came in from Japan to cover the trial. This case was a big deal. By that point, the Japanese government had begun publishing a guide for Japanese tourists who wanted to visit the United States. It included learning the American meaning of freeze and hands up. Rodney's trial took place over the course of one week in May of 1993. The big question was whether he'd acted reasonably when he used deadly force against Yoshi.

District Attorney Doug Moreau focused on how quickly and carelessly Rodney had acted that night. He pointed out to the jury that when Bonnie told Rodney to get his gun, Rodney hadn't asked any questions. He'd just done it. That was not what a reasonable person would do. No, it's not. Plus, Rodney was 6'2", he was 30 years old, Yoshi was 5'6", 16, and he weighed 130 pounds. He was dressed like John Travolta.

Did Rodney really think he was in serious danger? Right. Coverage of the trial indicates that the prosecution took a pretty dry approach. Webb actually later criticized the prosecutor for never bringing up the issue of race. That was clearly a factor. But you know who didn't think that race was a factor in this case? Berendi. Defense.

Yeah, that would be Rodney's defense attorney, Louis Unglesby, who sucks. He painted Yoshi as a wild, erratic, terrifying young man. No, he's a 16-year-old kid who was excited to go to a Halloween party. Oh, no, no, no. Was he 16? How old was he? Yeah, he was 16. Yeah. In opening statements, the defense said that on the night of October 17th,

Yoshi acted in a menacing, aggressive fashion. Lewis said, and this is a direct quote, This is not an American or Oriental or any other known being casually walking up to the front door and saying, Hello, we're looking for the party. That's not what happened. He said, Yoshi had an extremely unusual way of moving. It's been described as aggressive. It's been described as kinetic. It's been described as antsy.

It's been described as scary. He would come right up to you as fast as he could. Okay, so you look pretty terrified. That's so fucking ridiculous. He's making Yoshi sound like he wasn't a person. Yeah. No one in any culture walks like this. Yeah.

No human being, essentially. Right. He was singing and dancing. Yeah. No human being, essentially. Right. He was singing and dancing. Right. Then the defense described Rodney. Rodney was an average Joe, one of your neighbors. He worked down at the Winn-Dixie. He was a pretty good mechanic. He liked sugar in his grits. He's just like you, Brandy. I just think he's great.

And do you know what Rodney did when he discovered... I do like sugar in my grits. Mm-hmm. Whisking your tea. What? What's all these crazy questions you're asking me? What is that? This is the craziest party I have ever seen. What the fuck is this?

Is there song lyrics? Mama told me not to come. Oh. That ain't the way to have fun, son. There are some people who are loving this moment. Yes. And others who are confused but intrigued. Those are the only two categories.

You're absolutely right. Also, just for notes, the truck outside has gotten louder. Somehow this has gotten worse. It's 5.07. They've got to be wrapping it up. How dare they work past 5 o'clock. Don't they have margaritas to drink? Don't they have margaritas to drink?

Brandy, do you know what Rodney did when he discovered that he'd killed Yoshi? What's the defense going to say he did? Because I'm not sure that's what he actually did, but I'd love to hear what they say. He cried. He cried and cried. and you know what no killer cries and cries when they kill someone so that's how you know he's not a real killer he's just a dude just like yourself defending his home from a very scary teenager Teenager. Yeah, okay. Webb, of course, testified at the trial. So did Rodney's wife, Bonnie.

She said that when she opened the door to the carport that night, she'd seen Yoshi coming around the corner. First, she'd seen Webb, and she was not alarmed by Webb. Wonder why. Yeah, because he's a white kid. Yeah. Yeah. And she'd seen Yoshi coming around the corner, laughing or smiling, and he'd scared the ever-loving shit out of her. She said, he was coming real fast towards me. I had never had somebody come at me like that. I was terrified.

Yeah, I'm sure. Well, here's the thing. Sure, you could be scared. Maybe you were scared. Go in your house. Lock your door. Call the fucking police. Right.

Don't shoot a kid in your driveway. Right. Right. Asked to describe Yoshi, she said, and this is a quote, I guess he appeared oriental. He could have been Mexican or whatever. He was taller than me and his skin was darker colored. Neat.

Bonnie maintained that it was Yoshi's fast movements that scared her, not his race. Definitely not his race. Yeah. After that, she slammed the door shut and called for her husband to get his gun. And he hadn't asked any questions. He'd just gone and gotten his gun she cried on the stand she said she wished she'd thought more what's that face for this is just i mean it's just mind-boggling to me i just can't imagine having this reaction. Yeah.

To a kid dancing and singing his way up toward your house. Like, I can see maybe being like, who's this kid? I don't know this kid. Right. Can I help you with something? Did you need something? I mean, that's what you literally said to a man. You said to the guy who broke into my garage.

Yeah, that's true. Yeah, I just I don't. And if you legitimately are startled, you're scared by this person. Go in your house and lock the fucking door. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, it's so simple. Yeah. Yep.

it's so simple yeah right yep on cross-examination the prosecution got bonnie to acknowledge that even though she'd claimed she'd only seen yoshi you know for just you know a few seconds because he'd come at her so fast and she'd shut the door um when she did call nine one nine one then she needed the second one is the problem. Oh, my gosh. So then she did that, and then she got connected. When she did call 9-1-1, she said that a boy had been shot. Yeah. So she must have gotten a pretty good look at him. Yeah. Rodney testified in his own defense.

He talked about his wife telling him to get his gun and how she'd never reacted that way before, so he did it without asking questions. He said he'd gotten the gun, gone out to the carport, seen the two teenagers, and became frightened when Yoshi came toward him. Yoshi was holding something in his outstretched arms. It was a camera. Okay. Rodney told the jury, I wanted him to stop. He didn't. He kept coming.

The next thing I remember, I was scared to death. This person was not going to stop. This person was going to do harm to me. He said, I felt I had no choice. I couldn't understand why this person wouldn't stop. Dude, go back in your house and lock your fucking door. That's an option. Rodney cried several times on the witness stand.

At one point, his lawyer asked him if he thought anything good could come out of this whole situation. Oh, I'd love to hear his response to that. Well, I mean, I do think something good can come out of tragic situations. Yeah. Here's what Rodney says

is the good thing that could come from this. That Mr. Hattori can understand how I feel. Fuck all the way off. Yeah. Oh, this is about you. Okay. Yeah, so Yoshi's dad had come to stay for the whole trial. Mm-hmm.

had come to stay for the whole trial. You want him to understand how you feel. Okay. Okay. That's the best thing that can come out of this tragedy. In his closing statement, District Attorney Doug Moreau said, he goes back to the bedroom, gets the gun, never, ever asking, hey, what's up? What's out there? What would you like me to do? It's his conduct and going to the closet and getting the biggest handgun made by human beings and never asking what it's for. He had plenty of time to

inquire, but he did not. He had a telephone, windows he could look out of. He was safely behind his locked door, and he had this gun in his hand. He was secure. In the defense's closing statement, Rodney's defense attorney said, all the things Yoshi Hattori did to a reasonable person were absolutely calculated to scare you to death. And Yoshi was creating the danger without realizing it. He was creating the situation. You have a legal right to open the door to your house anytime you want to, to look outside anytime you want to. You have the legal right to answer the door with a gun

to everyone who comes along. We are not required to cower in our homes while other people cause us heartache. I hate everything about that. Yeah. Yeah. Oh my gosh. That is ridiculous. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, my gosh. That is ridiculous.

Yeah. The jury deliver... Deliverated. Yeah, sure. That's when you order delivery. They deliberate while they get pizza delivered. That's exactly what it is. So everyone's kind of happy.

Yeah. Except they got dominoes. So listen, it's free pizza. OK. So picky. The jury deliberated for about three hours and they found Rodney Pierce not guilty, not guilty. Not guilty. Not guilty. When the verdict was announced, people in the courtroom apparently cheered. Oh, my gosh.

I can't imagine. No. He had a lot of local support. Yeah, I bet he did. Yoshi's father, Maza Echi, had been present for the entire trial, but he'd been on a walk when the verdict was announced. So when he came back, you know, he heard the verdict and he spoke to the media through an interpreter saying, the verdict is incredible, unbelievable.

Yeah. The Hattori's had such a hard time, not just with losing their son, but with the injustice of it all. So two months after Rodney was acquitted, the Hattori's sued him and his homeowner's insurance company, Louisiana Farm Bureau Mutual Insurance, in civil court for wrongful death. OK. So unlike in criminal court where the prosecution has to prove something beyond a reasonable doubt, Here, you're just looking at the preponderance of the evidence. Yeah. The civil case went before Judge Bill Brown. I love alliteration.

Yeah, me too. There was no jury, which I think was wise choice. Yep. This case covered a lot of the same arguments that came up at the criminal trial, so, you know, don't really need to rehash that. One key difference was the Hattori's attorney, Charles Moore, asserted that Yoshi's race had played a role in this case. Yeah. He pointed out that when Bonnie testified in the criminal trial, she talked about Yoshi's race. The Hattori's legal team also presented some evidence that hadn't been presented at the criminal trial. Evidence that perhaps Rodney wasn't the sweet little average Joe he'd been portrayed to be.

Oh, yeah? I wish I had a little more info on this. Turns out Rodney had once shot a dog when it came onto his property. He'd made a death threat against his wife's ex-husband. He made a death threat against his wife's ex-husband. I read a portion of a book about this that said, and I don't know if this came up in the trial, but it was uncovered that, you know, people had come to the house many times before. Yeah. I guess I don't need to say it's a race thing.

It's a race thing. Yeah. I guess I don't need to say it's a race thing. It's a race thing. Yeah. Yoshi's parents, Mazaichi and Miyako, both testified. Mazaichi testified that when his son died, it felt as though he had been murdered too. Miyako testified that when Yoshi died, it felt like a part of her body was lost and that her dream was taken away. Now, Brandy, you might be thinking that it would be pretty difficult to cross-examine grieving parents, huh? Yeah. Yeah, I mean, what is there to ask them? They weren't here for this crime.

Yeah. Are they going to ask them about their son's aggressive nature? No. No, worse than that. Oh, great. John Hankel, who was the attorney for the insurance company, figured it out. Here's what you ask him. He asked Yoshi's mom how many letters she'd written to yoshi while he was in the united states oh holy shit you this is okay this is my

prediction the direction you didn't even care about him he's you're in this for money that's what i think he's going for yeah I don't care about him. He's, you're in this for money? That's what I think he's going for with these questions. She said that she'd written him twice and called once. He asked Yoshi's dad how much time he spent with his son in a given week. Masayoshi was an engineer and he worked 7 a.m. to midnight during the week and eight hours on Saturday. So he responded that he spent a few hours a week with his son. The lawyer asked if he'd written Yoshi any letters while he was in the United States.

And he said no. What a giant sack of shit no fucking kidding also cultures are different absolutely absolutely cultures are different and how much you communicate with your son how much you loved your son

all those little factors we're talking about here. That's not what this trial's about. No. But I guess it'd be really bad for your client if we made it what the trial was actually about. Yeah. Ultimately, the judge ruled in the Hattori's favor. In his ruling, he said that he was not making any kind of social comment about gun control, but he was definitely saying that Rodney was wrong to fire a gun in this situation.

Duh. Yeah. He said, quote, There was no justification whatsoever that the killing was necessary to save himself or his family. No. The judge said that a reasonable person, after hearing what Bonnie said, would have asked questions. Why do I need a gun? What'd you see out there? But Rodney hadn't done any of that. The judge awarded the Hattori's $650,000 in damages.

$100,000 would be paid by the insurance company, and the rest would be paid by Rodney and Bonnie. Rodney and Bonnie appealed the decision and the appellate court was like, nope, we're fine with it. So then they took it to the Louisiana Supreme Court. Wow. I'm so sorry I didn't pick up the cue at first. I raised my hand in the air

dramatically. My God. And the Supreme Court was like, yeah, we're not interested in hearing this case. Goodbye. Bye. And the Supreme Court was like, yeah, we're not interested in hearing this case. Goodbye. Bye. So the Hattori's had won something, but they didn't keep any of the money that they made from the lawsuit. I personally doubt they got anything from Rodney and Bonnie.

Yeah, same. But anyway, they did get the $100,000 from the insurance company. And they gave all of it to the fight for better gun control. I almost said better bun control. Which is what you have to do in a specific aisle of the grocery store. You don't want stuff falling off the shelves. Oh, I thought you were talking about... Bun control, like buttholes.

Yeah. No. That's butthole control, which is an entirely different thing yeah but i would argue that if you're never this is ridiculous we should stop this conversation you think it goes under the same umbrella don't you i do because if you're if you're controlling your butthole, your buns are also engaged. Yeah, I'm talking about supermarket buns. Okay. So that's a whole different phone number you're going to have to call, ma'am.

And no, I can't transfer you because we're not in the same system. It's totally different. Okay, great. Thank you. You're going to have to Google it. All right? All right. I get really annoyed when people make that mistake because we get so many calls about

buttholes at the bun control agency. It's an agency. It is. It's not like a foundation or a center. What makes something an agency? That does sound like we've got. Oh, you know what? I've decided it's an agency because I've got agents.

Yeah, going out and checking the buns. They're secret shoppers. You don't know. You don't know who they are. I mean, the trench coats kind of give them away. That's right. Yeah. And they're cat-like reflexes.

Yeah. Throw something at them, boom, they catch it. That's right. Yeah. And they're cat-like reflexes. Yeah. Throw something at them, boom, they catch it. Anyway, everyone thinks that we don't need the bun control agency until the bun control agency is gone.

And then there's buns all over the supermarket floor. People step on them. It's a mess. Yep. That's right. And your barbecue sucks. And you get squished buns. Yep. Yep.

You know, you tried to end this tangent. I sure did. Prematurely. And I simply couldn't let it happen. Anyway, so they, oh, yes, they gave all the money to gun control. Yes. Mm-hmm. A much more worthy cause, as it turns out.

You know, sometimes I think you have no respect for the work I do at the button control agency. I mean, you're not even a foundation. Wow. Wow. Way to kick me when I'm down. Agency kind of makes it sound like you're in it for the profit. Yeah. You're getting me when I'm down. Agency kind of makes it sound like you're in it for the profit. Yeah.

You're getting cut a big bun. Well, haven't you ever wondered why I always have access to so many Hawaiian rolls? Haven't you thought it was a little suspicious? I have. I've always had my suspicions about it. Anyway. little suspicious. I have. I've always had my suspicions about it. Anyway, their activism, coupled with support from the haymakers, actually made a difference. In July of 1993, the Hattori's and haymakers were able to meet with Bill Clinton in the Oval Office. By that point,

the Hattori's had collected, gosh, I think the number was like 1.8 million signatures. The Haymakers had collected 150,000. That month, Congress passed the Brady Handgun Violence Protection Act, which mandated background checks for people who wanted to buy a gun. And a five-day waiting period on, I believe it was civilian purchases. Bill Clinton signed that into law a few weeks after he met with the Hattori's and the Haymakers. Worth noting, that bill had been around for a couple years, but it wasn't until after Yoshi's death that it came to a vote. Can I call it Yoshi's murder? I feel very strongly that it was a murder.

I'm sure legally I can't call it a murder. But I mean, when you get killed in cold blood like that. Yeah. Both the Hattori's and the Haymakers are very modest about their impact on the Brady Act. But, you know, a lot of scholars believe that their activism was kind of the thing that pushed that over the finish line. Yeah. I use a lot of sports analogies. You're excellent at it. Thank you.

Really? Knocked it out of the park, didn't I? You did. It was a real hole in one. Thank you. Shut up, or I'm going to give you five for fighting. A few months later, in September of 1994, Congress passed the Federal Assault Weapons Ban, which was in effect for 10 years.

Sure was. I mean, that did a lot. It sure did. It's hard to know how much good that did. Yeah. The Tories remained very active in the fight against fun. I almost said it. Fun violence.

I don't even know what that is. I'm making up new agencies right and left. Dracula's buns. He calls me up every day. He's like. I want to suck your buns! And I say,

Dracula, I don't have time for this. We are a small agency. Do you have any idea how many supermarkets are in this country alone? You're calling me wanting to suck my buns? My best friend's being such an asshole to me. She's like, you don't even have a foundation.

She doesn't even think about, like, I'm spending half my time on the phone with Dracula. Pretty sure it's her calling me. What's that saying? The devil doesn't have to something. He just has to distract you. That's that's you.

That's you calling me up at the bun agency. So good with the phrase. So they remain very active in the fight against gun violence for years. Beautifully said. You said it so well. Thank you. They were very discouraged to see the expansion of stand-your-ground laws. Yeah, I can't imagine.

Yeah. And the growing number of school shootings. laws. Yeah, I can't imagine. Yeah. And the growing number of school shootings. In 2012, after the Sandy Hook Elementary School shooting, Mieko said, it was so heartbreaking to see so many young children killed. But I can't say I was shocked. Yep. Yeah. So here's a fun thing. Yeah. So here's a fun thing. So I pulled that from an article in 2012 and it didn't specifically say the Sandy Hook shooting. It was just the shooting, the school shooting. I'm like, well, was that Parkland? I look it up and it's like, oh, no, that actually happened. I mean, it just happens so often. Yep. In 2018, they spoke to survivors of the Parkland shooting. They established a foundation in Yoshi's name that allows U.S. students to study in Japan. I believe they used part of the settlement, not settlement, judgment for that.

Settlement, not settlement. Judgment. Judgment. For that. As of last year, 31 American students have come to Japan through the program. They said that obviously, you know, Japan isn't 100 percent safe. No place is. But it feels good to give students a chance to experience life without fear of gun violence. Yeah. Fear of gun violence. In an interview in 2022, Yoshi's mom, Mieko, announced that she and her husband, who are now in their 70s, are planning to retire from their work on gun control activism. She said that she has a lot of hope for this new generation of Americans, that maybe they can do something about gun violence.

She said she hopes they will lead the fight. And that is the story of the senseless and racist murder of Yoshi Hattori. Yeah. I know some people don't call it a murder. I'm calling it a murder. Well, that was terrible. Yeah. Thank you.

What is wrong with these people? What's wrong with this country? Yeah. When's it enough? Mm-hmm. I'm not sure. I don't fucking understand it. The people aren't in control in America.

Yeah, yeah. Because when you actually look at what the people want... The majority of people want common sense gun laws. Yeah. Yeah. But... The majority of people want a lot of things. Yeah. Yeah. But. The majority of people want a lot of things. They want access to health care. All kinds of stuff.

All kinds of amazing things. Somehow our politicians can't make happen. Yep. Yep. Hate it. Oh good fucking times. You know what I think

we should do right now? An ad? Doodoo! And we're back from the ad. Doodoo! That's a remix. Oh, I liked it. Yeah, I know.

It's great. All right. You ready to hear about a disappearance? Yes. Okay. ready to hear about a disappearance yes come i watched an episode of the program see no evil oh it's an id show all about how like a crime is solved by technology so there's you know cameras that capture stuff and you know computer stuff and, you know, all that fancy stuff. Uh-huh.

I like this show a lot. It's really low on the reenactments, heavy on the actual, like, surveillance footage. Okay. It's my jam. All right. Also, shout out to KTLA 5 News for their reporting on this. I watched another show as well. What was it? And I as well. What was it?

And I hated it. What was it? I ignored everything that I learned from it. What was it? I don't want to tell you. Say it and we'll bleep it. Now I can't remember. Oh.

Oh. Yeah. People recommend that show to us and I'm like, I'm not a fan. I did not care for it at all. I also think they made some very inappropriate comments about this case. Oh, will you tell me what the inappropriate comments are at the end? Yeah. Oh.

Yeah. Okay. Okay. at the end? Yeah. Oh. Yeah. Okay.

Okay. Maribel Ramos was an impressive, driven, strong woman. At the age of 23, she enlisted in the army and then, like,

five minutes later, September 11th happened. Oh, shit. And Maribel was deployed for multiple tours of duty, both in Iraq and Afghanistan. By 2008, though And Maribel was deployed for multiple tours of duty, both in Iraq and Afghanistan. By 2008, though, Maribel was ready to take her life in a different direction. She had always dreamed of having a family.

She was super close to her own family. And so after eight years of military service, Maribel was honorably discharged from the army. I believe she reached the rank of sergeant. Like she did very well in the military. Maribel growing up had wanted to pursue a career in law enforcement. So after retiring from the military, she moved into an apartment with her mom in Orange, California and enrolled at Cal State Fullerton to pursue a degree in criminal justice. But she went to all the semesters. Well, that's one way to do it.

That is one way to do it. Maribel settled into her post-military life very well and became very focused on achieving her goals, including earning her degree from Cal State. Okay, from here, the timeline is a little bit fuzzy to me, but it seems that somewhere in 2011, Maribel's mother became ill and ultimately passed away from that illness. Maribel was obviously devastated by the loss of her mother, and it also left her in a bit of a difficult position. She had previously had her mother as her roommate, and her in a bit of a difficult position. She had previously

had her mother as her roommate. And now if she wanted to stay where she was living, she needed to get a new roommate. Yeah. She reached out to her sister, Lucy, with whom she was very close. She was also very close to Lucy's daughter, her niece. And so she asked if they would come move in with her. But Lucy declined. She said that she finally felt settled where she was living and she didn't want to uproot her daughter from the school that she was attending. Oh, yeah. And Maribel was like, totally get it.

Yeah. You know, I totally understand. I just thought, you know, it'd be really fun for us to live together and whatever. And Lucy told Maribel that if she was unable to find another roommate, she would move in with her. So Maribel went to work to try and find another roommate, and she posted an ad on Craigslist, which, fitting for the time. Yeah. It wasn't long before she got a response that sounded like the perfect fit. That response came from a man named Kwang Choi Jo,

who went by Casey. His response read, in part, I am a Korean single professional male. I am looking for a small apartment or private room with kitchen use and your place sounds perfect. I have a 10 pound dog, a Yorkie. I'm a social drinker, a non-smoker. I'm straight and I like to keep things clean.

I'm easygoing and get along with most people. That sounds awesome. Absolutely. The dog is a bonus. The dog is absolutely a bonus. Yeah, I get a little Yorkie roommate too. Fuck yeah. Move right in, Casey. So Casey told Maribel that he was from Knoxville, Tennessee, but that he was interviewing for a position with a company in Orange County. So he was looking to relocate. He asked if he could come see the apartment while he was in town for that interview. And Maribel was like, absolutely. Right. So Casey checked out the apartment, met with Maribel, and Lucy was there at the same time, you know, just for safety or whatever.

And it seemed like this could be like a great fit. He was quiet and polite and a bit of a loner, it seemed, which Maribel saw as a selling point. Yeah, that's kind of what you want in a roommate. Exactly. He wasn't going to be bringing a bunch of people over to the apartment. And that's kind of what he told her. Like, I don't know anybody out here. Right.

I don't I don't have any family to speak of. So just kind of me. Yeah. I'll be adjusting to a new place. Near the end of 2011, I believe in November, Casey Joy moved to Orange, California and became Maribel Ramos's roommate. Is Orange in Orange County? It is.

That's too much. Yes. All right. I actually looked in this because I was like, are they just dropping the county? Is this like a thing that they're saying? No, it's like a town in Orange County. Okay. It's near Santa Ana, which is the county seat.

Got anything else you want to say? That's all I remember from the Wikipedia page. Casey and Maribel quickly became friendly. Since Casey didn't really know anyone, Maribel invited him to come to family get-togethers with her. Sometimes they'd go out to dinner together. They were friends. They went on like an Alaskan cruise together. They'd go out dancing sometimes.

Oh, wow. If one of them was running to the grocery store, they'd pick stuff up for the other. Like they were very friendly. Yeah. Then on May 2nd, 2013, after they'd lived together for about a year and a half, Maribel disappeared. lived together for about a year and a half, Maribel disappeared. So the following morning, May 3rd, around 10.45 a.m., Casey called 911 and told them that his roommate, Maribel, had never come home the night before. And that was super unusual, he said. Yeah. Also, the light was on in her bedroom, which he said was super unusual.

Mm-hmm. He said he'd last seen her about 9 p.m. the night before. Casey told the dispatcher that her car was there and that he wanted to file a missing person report. It's unclear to me what the police told him at this time, I'm it's unclear to me what the police told him at this time, but it doesn't seem like any official missing person report was made at this time. OK. Maybe they told him to wait.

Maybe they said he needed to come down to the police station to do it. I'm not I'm not totally clear. But after getting off the phone with 911, Casey then texts Lucy, Maribel's sister. Casey then texts Lucy, Maribel's sister. Why did you do that twice? I think I said Maribel wrong or I think I said it weird. I don't know. I think you wish you did because I did such fun things with bun control today. So he texts Lucy and says that Maribel's missing. Lucy knew that Maribel was super busy

at this point in her life. She was days away from graduating with her degree in criminal justice. Oh, yeah. So she wasn't immediately worried. Also, like, you might be thinking, well, did she just hook up with somebody? Yeah, exactly. She's a grown woman. Yes. Yeah. But then Maribel... Jesus. I know you said it wrong there. I did, for sure.

Jesus. Then Maribel missed a speaking event for veterans that she was supposed to attend that day. And then she didn't make it to her softball game that night. This was absolutely not like Maribel. Right. So then Lucy knew something was wrong.

So Lucy and some other family members came to Maribel's apartment that night. They saw that her car was there, just as Casey had said, and then the light was on in her room. And so they called the police and told them that, you know, her roommate had called the police earlier in the day, but that Maribel was still missing and that they needed to make an official missing person report. Yeah orange police sent officers out to the apartment and they came in and they went back to maribel's room and they they forced it open i believe the door was locked i'm not positive but like nobody had entered the room to this point and so they go in the room and the there was nothing particularly out of place in there other than the fact that the bed wasn't made, which was not her style.

Not her style. She's, you know, military, like very. Yeah. She makes the bed first thing. She makes it very particularly. And the pillowcase wasn't on her pillow. Also seemed very weird to Lucy. Yeah. Yeah.

And Maribel's phone and wallet were not there. They didn't they did search of her room and didn't really find anything of note except when they looked in her closet they found a pajama top that had some blood

on the sleeve. Okay okay so they sent that off for testing spoiler though it comes back and it's just maribel's blood all right and it's not like a large amount of it okay bloody spot on the sleeve okay but there's no sign of maribel they did call in a homicide unit just to you know know, make sure that the scene is photographed properly and whatever evidence might be there is secured and whatever. And around that time, Casey arrived at the apartment as well. You like in these big noises right outside. At first I was like, wait, why is she rolling her eyes at me

you you just you know you're too much that's what i say now this construction i could deal with it all day all day every day it doesn't even bother you so casey shows up at the apartment as well while the police are there and And so he gives them a statement. He said that he had seen Maribel the night before at like nine o'clock. But he said he'd gone out for a drive. And then when he returned, Maribel wasn't there and she hadn't come back that night. So this apartment complex did have a couple of surveillance cameras. One was on like the front entrance of the property and one was on kind of like the office part of the property. And so they checked those and they didn't see.

I believe this was like a gated complex. They didn't see Maribel exiting the property. They didn't even see Casey exiting the property. I believe maybe there was like another way out that was not on camera though. Okay. What they did find when they looked at the surveillance photos was that on that night, May 2nd, around just a couple minutes before like 8.20 PM, maybe like, you know, whatever, 8.15, 8, somewhere in there, Maribel had walked up to the office. So she had their standard procedure was for people to drop their rent checks through the little there was like a little slot in the

door to the manager's office. So she had walked up to it. She'd slipped a check through the slot. She had on pajamas. Interestingly, she had on the matching pants to that shirt that they had found. Not the shirt. Not the shirt. OK. Actually, they kind of made a deal about this on the program, but, like, I do that all the time. Yeah, I do. Where I just wear the pants and not the shirt that matches. Yeah, I don't think that's true. I don't think it's anything. She had on, like, the pajama pants and then, like, a tank top with it.

Okay. You know what this sounds like? What? This sounds like only dudes were in the room. 100%. Because, like, don't you think? Yes. Because I feel like any woman would be like, no, that's a thing.

And the pants that she had on were a match to the shirt that they'd found in her closet. Which, as we all know, must be only worn as a set at all times. Yeah, exactly. So on it, Maribel seems like totally normal. She doesn't seem concerned or anything. She just walks up, puts the rent check in, and walks away. Well, we know things weren't good because she didn't have that matching top. Oh, that's true.

That's true. Clear sign of duress. So at this point, they really have no idea what has happened here. Has something happened to Maribel? So at this point, they really have no idea what has happened here. Has something happened to Maribel? Has she just like decided to take off for a couple of days? She catch a ride with someone? No, you don't pay your rent and then take off.

Well, maybe she went on a little trip. Oh, I see. Yeah. OK. Yeah. Yeah. Like a fun trip. I thought you like leaving, you know. No, no, no, no, no.

Lucy was concerned, though. This was not like her sister. Yeah. And so she got on social media. She posted a picture of her sister and asked anyone who had seen her, knew anything, to please come forward. So at this point, the police are like looking into those closest to Maribel to see if anybody has spoken to her or anybody knows anything. And she has this kind of like boyfriend thing. Okay.

What? All right. So they get her phone records. They find out that the last person she talked to was this man named Paul Lopez. They had been casually dating for the last several months. Do you not approve of that? I don't approve of the way he described it. So he agrees to come in and sit for an interview.

And this is recorded. And the footage of it is on this episode of See No Evil. OK. So he sits down and he's just like, you know, they're like, so how long have you been seeing Maribel? And he's like, I don't know, a few months, I guess. He's like, that's super casual. And they're like, OK. So were you were you seeing other people?

And he goes, me? And they're like, yeah, were you seeing other people? No, the dude behind you. What are you talking about? He goes, I mean, yeah, yeah. Oh, okay. So he's like a huge stud. Uh-huh.

And they're like, well, was Maribel seeing other people as well? And he goes, well, I mean, come on. Don't ask, don't tell, man. Okay. Yeah, fucking hated it. Ew. All right. Yeah.

Anyway, this guy's fine. He didn't have anything to do with it. He's not fine. He's not fine. He's a douche. Hated all of it. Yeah. Wow.

Anyway, so he... Can you imagine having such a cavalier attitude? I cannot. Because, like, they didn't just, like, approach him at an Applebee's and ask what he's been up to lately. No. Like, he's in a police station. He's talking about a woman he's been seeing. Who is now missing.

Ooh. Yeah. Yeah. Okay, anyway. Yeah. Hated it. Anyway, he's like, I did talk to her on the second. That's the day she disappeared. But he had been at work from 4 p.m. to midnight. And so, like, they were able to confirm that he worked for the gas company. He was say that he had had a conversation with Maribel on the phone that day and she had been upset. She'd actually put him on speakerphone so that she could have a conversation with Casey that night and that Paul could overhear it. Oh. So apparently Maribel and Casey had gotten into an argument the night of May 2nd because Casey had told Maribel that he couldn't pay his portion of the rent that month. This was something that had been happening with increasing frequency over the recent

months. Casey had like lost a job and then got another one and lost it and just was not consistently employed. And so he was having trouble making his rent. And like the previous month, Maribel had kind of told him like, you can't pay your rent. You got to move out. Right. Like that's the deal.

And so then on the day that like their rent was due, Casey had said, I can't I can't pay my portion of it. And so Maribel got Paul on the phone on speakerphone so that she could have a conversation with Casey and tell him, like, you're out tomorrow. If you're not paying your rent, you're out. Did she have Paul on speakerphone because she was afraid or like what was. I think so. OK. Yeah, I think so.

And we'll get to a little bit more of that here in a minute but yeah it seemed that she wanted him and maybe she thought I mean what the fuck is even that noise that noise is that's the sound

of a monster groaning and I kind of hope that the mics picked it up because it was kind of cool yeah so I think there was also something about like Maribel thought Because it was kind of cool. Yeah. So I think there was also something about, like, Maribel thought maybe the conversation would go smoother if Casey knew there was another person listening in.

She hadn't made it a secret that she'd had Paul on the phone. Right. Yeah. So Paul actually told the police that he told Casey that, like, if he wanted to make a big deal about it, he'd come over there and move his stuff on out of there for him. OK. This guy's real cool. I can tell for sure. And Paul told the police as well that when that phone call had happened, he had asked Maribel, do you want me to come over there tonight? Like, are you are you nervous? Are you you know, do you want me to come over there tonight? Like, are you nervous?

Are you, you know, do you want me to come? And she said, no, I'm just going to go to bed. I'll lock my door. Yeah. So they do look into Paul. The story checks out. He's fine. He's just kind of douchey. Yeah.

But now they're like, OK, we need to obviously look into the roommate, Casey. He's been told, like, you have to move out the next day. And then, oh, Maribel disappears. Like, that's pretty sus. Yeah. So they started looking into Casey and his past. And it was, you know, they found the same stuff that he'd told Mare. He was born in Korea.

He'd moved to the United States as like a young teenager, gone to school in Tennessee. He had some kind of chemistry degree, worked several jobs as some kind of chemist. But he had recently lost a job, which is why he could not pay his rent. Why did he lose the job? That I don't know. Okay. It seems like that'd be a pretty in-demand skill set. Yeah, I would think so.

So you'd have to like really fuck up. Yeah, I would imagine. I don't know any specifics about what the job was or how he lost it other than he was some kind of chemist. And this is the case you're covering today? It sure is. I'm sorry, there's not that much background available on Casey Joy. Okay. I read a whole article that specifically

said... A whole article? Okay, no, I read this whole article from some stupid website that was like, there's not much known about Casey Joy, but here are the things we do know. And it was just everything that was said on the show. Yeah, I hate that shit. So while they're looking into this relationship that Casey and Maribel had, they found out that, yeah, because of who Maribel was as a person, she had welcomed this guy into her home. She'd

become very friendly with him. And maybe he had thought that friendship was more than Maribel had. So he was like, maybe Casey had feelings for Maribel. He'd taken her on a cruise, an Alaskan cruise. And maybe even at some point had admitted to Maribel that he had feelings for her. And she was like, yeah, I have a boyfriend. I like you as a friend. I like having you, whatever. But like that's not the situation here.

Yeah. The police also learned while they were looking into this relationship between Maribel and Casey that Maribel had called 911 a week before she disappeared. So they played bits of this 911 call on this show. So you know Maribel is distraught. She's crying. She tells the dispatcher that she had gotten into a fight with her roommate. That she told him that he needed to leave by the end of the month if he couldn't. Apparently this was started as another rent conversation. She told him like he's out at the end of the month if he couldn't. Apparently, this was started as another rent conversation.

She told him, like, he's out at the end of the month if he can't make his rent for the next month. And that some kind of fight had ensued, and she had had to tell Casey that she had a gun. Wow. She called the dispatcher specifically to say, first of all, didn't actually have a gun uh-huh she did have like she just wanted to scare him okay she did have a machete oh and she was calling 9-1-1 to tell them like if i am forced to do something tonight to protect myself oh i want this on record that this fight has happened wow yes holy shit she told the dispatcher that she was an army veteran and that

she knew how to defend herself if need be i think they sent out someone to the scene that night and they kind of like a police officer came and asked both of them some questions and Maribel said she had felt comfortable staying there. She would just again lock her door. Yeah. So they're like okay probably time to talk to Casey. So they bring him into the police station. He was very cooperative. Even chatty. At this point like these searches for Maribel have been going on people are joining in they're looking for her there's posters everywhere Casey has done

interviews on the news talking about how this is a really hard time for him and he just misses his friend he talks about how she's he loves her she's his only friend she's his only friend. She's his only family. And he just wants her to come home safe. Wow. So he sits down with the police and they're like, you know, tell us about your relationship with Maribel. And he said, oh, we have a great time together. We party together. We go to clubs together. We've gone on a cruise together. We call 911 on each other. Right. No mention of that initially. But he said in recent weeks that their relationship seemed to have been falling apart

a bit. And so the police asked him, they're like, oh, yeah, it might have been. Can you tell us about what happened when the police were called out to your apartment a week before Maribel went missing. And Casey had a different version of events that had taken place that night. He said Maribel had been drinking and that when she drinks, she's one of two people. She's either very aggressive and angry or she's like really sweet and fun and loving. And that particular night she'd been aggressive, angry Maribel and she threatened him. But everything was kind of smoothed over. And yeah, he said that she had gone on this rant about how she wasn't attracted to him. And he was like totally fine with that and like no big deal.

I'm just we're just friends. Yeah. OK. with that and like no big deal. I'm just, we're just friends. Yeah. Okay. Yeah, I'd love to know what the real version of that is. I mean, Maribel's version I'm sure is when she called the police is. Yeah. What happened? I would take it so well and have so much fun with someone being like casually like I'm not attracted.

Yeah. So then Casey was, you know, asked about what happened that last day that he had seen Maribel. Had they argued? Had anything happened? And he admitted, yes, they had had an argument that day about the rent. Had anything happened? And he admitted, yes, they had had an argument that day about the rent. And so he had left the house that night for a drive to Kula somewhere around 9 p.m. And that when he came back, she wasn't there.

No. As Casey is sitting in this interrogation, he is wearing a very fitted black tee. OK. V-neck? Oh, no. Scoop neck. OK. More of a crew neck even. Not a scoop. Yeah. black tee. Okay. V-neck? Ooh, no. Scoop neck. Okay. More of a crew neck even, not a scoop.

Yeah. Crew neck, sorry. Uh-huh. And it was not a low-cut tee. All right. I believe a pair of jeans and some flippies. Okay. But what the interrogator noticed as he was sitting there was that Casey had scrapes all over his arms.

Oh, shit. All over his arms. I saw pictures of these because they photographed them. They are pretty small scrapes, but they are welted, red, fresh scrapes on his arm. Yeah. And so the police are like, tell us about those injuries you have there. What's going on there? And Casey, without like skipping a beat, he says, oh, I got these at Eisenhower Park.

How'd that happen? And that's exactly what the police say. And he's like, there's this spot at Eisenhower Park where the ducks swim and there are these bushes. And when the ducks get near these bushes, there is like tangled up fishing line and the ducks will get caught in them. So I was down at Eisenhower Park. I was getting these fishing line out of these bushes so the ducks wouldn't get tangled in them. And the bushes have thorns and very pointy leaves. And so my arms got scraped up digging this fishing line out of these bushes.

Just being the best possible guy, Brandy. And so the police are like, this guy is so full of shit. And so they're like, great. Take us to eisenhower park show us show us where this is yeah and so casey agrees and he takes them to eisenhower park and he goes to this part where there's this pond and sure enough there's fucking ducks floating on the pond and then they go over to this area where casey shows the bushes are and wouldn't you fucking know it there is a duck caught in a fishing line oh as they get down there and so they are then trying to free this duck

and sure as shit these bushes are full of fucking thorns oh wow okay yeah oh wow all right like holy shit is this guy actually just like telling the truth? Yeah, because I mean, in theory, wouldn't you wear long sleeves if you were trying to cover that? If you're trying to cover up? Exactly. Wow. Yeah. It didn't stop them from thinking that these were defensive wounds caused by Maribel, but they're like, okay, well, that story that seemed like a big fat lie, actually.

They thought they were like the cops going with Jodi Arias to Disney World. No, no, no, that's Casey Anthony. Excuse me. The cops were talking about ninjas with Jodi Arias. Very real ninjas. So they start doing searches on Maribel and Casey's apartment. He allows them to.

He allows crime scene investigators to come in. This is not just like a surface level consented search. He's like, search the place top to fucking bottom. Take my DNA. They bring in cadaver dogs.

They do a full scale search. I believe seven separate searches on this apartment. Oh, my Lord. And they come up with nothing other than that one pajama top that was found with a little spot of blood on it. Yeah, that's. That's nothing. lot of blood on it yeah that's that's nothing but the police are pretty sure that casey had something to do with maribel's disappearance with maribel's disappearance what about her i just got like stuck like the word just would not come out the end of the word

it disappeared that's right That's very good. That was very clever. You're so witty. I know. So they put him under 24-hour surveillance. They actually asked him to turn over his cell phone and his laptop. And he was like, yeah, sure thing. He gave those to them.

Yeah. And he made a statement to the police. I'm sorry. He made a statement to the media that he was fully cooperating with the police. And he also said to the police, I'm fully cooperating. So while they've got Casey under surveillance, they notice that he's making some trips to the library. What's wrong with reading, Brandy? So they have surveillance photos at the library.

And on one trip, he walked into the library, walked like to the back to like a bank of computers and sat specifically at one where his back would be to a wall where no one could be behind him, essentially. And he spent about two hours on that computer. God, how many dudes have jerked off in that corner? So many. Yeah, that sounds like a recipe for disaster. And so they're like, okay, great. This is an opportunity. So he leaves the library and they zoom in there, check his search history.

He'd wiped it clean. Well, yeah, obviously. So then they're like, OK, this guy's smart. We're going to have to know we're going to have to be one step ahead of this guy. And so then they set something up with the library to where they have one computer set up with monitoring equipment and that if Casey comes in, he's supposed to be led specifically to that computer. What? Okay, if I were a librarian, I'd be like,

go fuck yourself. I've got enough on my plate. You want to do this investigation, you pose as a librarian for a day and you flag him down. And make it not weird that he has a computer or something. The other thing is, so he gave them his laptop, right? Yeah.

So, I mean, of course he's on the computer at the library. Yeah. Are you about to say this guy's innocent? I'm not going to tell you that. Okay. All right. I'm going to tell you I have some problems with this that. Okay. All right. I'm going to tell you I have some problems with this case, but.

All right. Okay. So they set up this sting operation with the library. And just as they had hoped, Casey comes in one day. It's May 16th. So Maribel's been missing for two weeks at this point. And he comes in, tries to get a computer. And the library's like, oh, I'm sorry, sir. You'll have to use this specific computer.

And he's like, okay, yeah, that's fine. And so he spends some time looking at it. Meanwhile, the police are surveilling everything he's looking at. And at first he just, you know, he filled out like a job application. He did what? He filled like a job application he did what he filled out a job application spent some time on facebook and then he did a weird fucking google search what how long does it take a human body to decay well okay human body to decay? Well, okay. So he searches for that. And then when he'd been on Facebook, he'd seen an announcement that Maribel's family was doing this awareness walk. It was at Peter's Canyon, which was a place that Maribel loved. It was her favorite hike. She hiked it all the time. And it was like, you know, getting people out there hoping, you know, to get awareness for Maribel missing.

I don't understand. Then he got on Google Maps and he searched for Peter's Canyon and he looked at where that walk was going to be. And then he took Google Maps and he zoomed it in about eight miles away. He kept zooming in and zooming in and zooming in. It was clear that he was focusing on a large tree in the area. Oh, my God. And then he deleted his history and left the library. So the police are like, what the fuck was he looking at? Yeah.

So they send a search team out to find that location that he zoomed in. And all they have is like, I mean, they have some coordinates and they have an idea of what the tree looked like and so it takes them a little while to find it um but they get out to peter's canyon and they find the tree and at the base of that tree they found a shallow grave yeah and there they found Maribel's body. Yeah. She was so badly decomposed and had been exposed to the elements out there for an extended amount of time that a cause of death was unable to be determined. She had to be identified by her dental records. Wow.

But it was, I mean. Yeah. Obviously, Casey knew something. Yeah. Because he knew where her body was. He had led them directly to it through that Google Maps search. So they brought Casey back into the police station for another interrogation and they started questioning him and it became very clear to Casey that they were hinting that they'd found Maribel's body and he said are you implying that Maribel

isn't coming home and the police told him that he already knew the answer to that. Yeah. At that point, they started trying to, like, get Casey to tell them what he knew, how involved he was. And at that point, he stood up and he told the police detective that he wanted to leave. And the police detective stood up, too, and kind of, like, pushed him in the chest and was like, come on, come on, sit down, sit down. Let's let's talk. And so Casey initially sat back down. I don't like that. Nope. Don't like it at all.

Am I being detained? Am I being detained? Well, and that's essentially what he says. He says, are you saying I can't leave? And the detective goes, no. If you want to leave, you can leave. And he goes, OK, I'm going to leave. Yeah, and don't push me down.

And so he gets up and he walks out the door. And outside of the door were two police officers waiting to take him into custody. Oh, the switcheroo. Yes. of the door were two police officers waiting to take him into custody. Oh, the switcheroo. Yes. That's that moment in To Catch a Predator where the guy leaves the house because he doesn't want to talk to Chris Hansen anymore.

And boom! Yeah. They catch him by the bushes. Love it. All right. What? They do catch him by the bushes. I thought you said catch him by the bush.

Oh. Well, you know, if they grab hold of some cubes. You're not mad about it? I'm not mad. Hope it stings. Hope you've learned something. So Casey Joy was arrested and charged with the murder of Maribel Ramos. Yeah. In July of 2014, Casey Joy's trial began. This is very interesting to me because.

Wait, is this all they have on him? It's all they have on him. Oh. They cannot even prove that a murder took place. They do not have a cause of death. Oh, shit. And they have no evidence linking Casey to Maribel's death. Right.

All they have is that he knew the location of her body, which I agree is not great. No. I don't know that it's enough to secure a murder conviction. Well, and I mean, yes, he knew exactly where he knew where he was located. But even then, you can't. He probably looked at a lot of places right on Google Maps. Yeah. I mean, any good defense attorney can tear that apart, right?

Oh, we'll see. I mean, he had specifically zoomed in very close on that tree. He led the police there by that Google search. Yeah, I think it's he obviously knew Maribel's body was there. This was not an accident. But there's shockingly little evidence in this case. The prosecution in court laid out their theory that Maribel saw Casey as a friend and Casey wanted more and that they had been having arguments leading up to her disappearance because Casey felt rejected by her. And then on Thursday, May 2nd, Casey and

Maribel had gotten in that fight and she told him, that's it, you're out. Yeah. Tomorrow, you got to leave. And so they said that that night Maribel had gone to bed and while she was asleep, Casey had gone into her room and smothered her with a pillow while she slept. Oh. her with a pillow while she slept. Oh. They said that because of Maribel's training in the military, had she been awake, she would have been able probably to defend herself against Casey and fought back against him.

And so that is their belief that she was smothered while she was sleeping. Yeah. And that she was smothered while she was sleeping. Yeah. And that she had fought some. They still actually believe that's the source of those scratches on his arms. Sure. Of course. Yeah. Yeah. There's not any evidence to prove any of that, though. Right.

Which I'm very uncomfy about. I don't think it's a bad theory. I don't think it's a bad theory. I don't think it's a bad theory either. Yeah. Yeah. And it's likely what happened. Right. But there's no evidence.

But damn, there's no evidence. There's no evidence that that's what happened. None at all. Wow. Zero evidence. Zero evidence. They told the jury that Casey then put Maribel's body into his car and drove her out to the canyon and left her in that shallow grave below that tree. They believe that Casey got nervous when he found out about the awareness walk, that her family would be in that area and might come across her body had he not really buried her so it was a very shallow grave um it was

yeah mostly just like rocks and stuff were put over her body so that's part of the issue with why they were not able to determine her cause of death. She had been accessible to animals and such. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Well, thank God her family didn't discover her.

Well, absolutely. Holy shit. But that's like the entire case. This is what we believe happened and there so there was no evidence in his car none he gave them full access to his car his home his own dna they did seven searches and found no physical evidence linking him to Maribel's disappearance or death. Wow. Yep.

I hate that. Mm-hmm. Yeah, the prosecutor told the jury he almost got away with murder, ladies and gentlemen. He almost got away with it, but he didn't. The defense, for their part, just tried to poke, I mean, just tried to show that the prosecution had not proven that even a murder took place. They told the jury, the evidence you will see in this case does prove a crime. Improper disposal of a body. That's all the evidence proves.

And not even that their client was the one who did it, necessarily. Not necessarily. Yeah. So Casey's defense attorney said, does the Internet search prove beyond a reasonable doubt that he's involved in her disappearance or burying her remains? I don't think it does. It is so suspicious. I completely agree. I do think that it says something that he knew exactly where her body was and was looking at it on a Google map.

That is something. Absolutely. And probably it means that he murdered her and put her body there. Right. Probably it does. Right. But I don't love that we're getting a conviction on it. Yeah.

So the jury deliberated. Not for very long. Did the defense bring up any other alternative suspects? So no alternative suspects. They did present possible alternative situations. Perhaps Maribel died of natural causes in case he didn't want her family to find her body. And so he put her in a place that she loved. Maybe he didn't want to lose his apartment.

So he found her dead and then... That's stupid. Maybe she died by suicide. That's all the alternative possibilities that the defense presented that I found anyway. So the jury got the case and they deliberated for not very long. They found him not guilty of first degree murder, but they found Casey Joy guilty of second degree murder.

Mm hmm. At sentencing, some of Maribel's family members gave victim impact statements. One of them said, Mr. Joy needs to be put away for life. He is an evil man and a coward that should never be forgiven. Casey Joy made a statement on his own behalf as well before he was sentenced. He said, I miss Maribel more than anyone. Oh, OK. No.

I've been here about 440 days in jail and I think about it almost every day. About what? Missing Maribel, Maribel's disappearance, Maribel's death. I don't know. OK. That's a bold statement to make in front of her family. Yeah. Maribel's sister was basically like, fuck off. Yeah. Yeah. How dare he say that? Casey then said, the family wants me to apologize, which I cannot apologize for something I haven't done. Maybe someday the truth will come out, or maybe I'll just die in prison. Wow. Wow. Mm-hmm. Casey then was sentenced to 15 years to life in prison.

Mm-hmm. He, throughout, like, the time leading up to the trial and throughout the trial, he had sent dozens of letters to the judge, apparently, declaring his innocence. He also wrote a letter to Eyewitness News, which is like a local news station, I guess. And he said the same thing in that letter. But he also said that he was working on a book. Okay. Which was going to be titled Suspect Guilty Until Proven Innocent. Casey Joy maintains his innocence to this day. He OK. I have a real problem.

Say it. No. OK. So he wrote a letter to the judge asking for a retrial rather than filing an appeal which is there someone telling him the proper channels like I'm very concerned about that. Yeah. He doesn't know. That's exactly my concern. There's somewhat of a language barrier. I mean, yeah, I'm concerned about that.

I'm concerned about the lack of evidence there is in this conviction. I do think he probably did it, honestly. Yeah. It's very damning that he knew where her body was. No, I'm totally with you. And that call she made to 911. Yes, all of those things are very important. And yes, I just don't like a conviction on this little evidence. Yeah. It scares the shit out of me. Yeah. Casey Joy actually became eligible for parole in February of this year, but I don't, I didn't find anywhere that he's actually been before a parole board or anything to this point. Did he have a public defender?

Do you know? He did have a public defender. See, a case like this, I wonder different race, different class. What happens? Yep. I feel like you don't get a conviction. Yeah. Yeah.

So the thing I hated about the show that I watched and then was like, yeah, I'm not using any of that. Mm-hmm. Is that there's this part where one of the detectives is talking about how when they're interrogating Casey after Maribel has disappeared, but before they really have narrowed in that he's probably involved, they talk about his broken English and how they think he's putting on an act, which I hate. Because, like, they're like, we spoke to several people who said his English was much better than that. Okay, but he's under a very stressful situation. I think it would be very normal for him. Like, English is his second language. Right. And you would want to be extra careful with your words. Yeah. And I would assume that in that situation, which you're not familiar with, people are using terms maybe you're not super familiar with. Yeah. So yeah, you would.

super familiar with. Yeah. So yeah, you would. Yeah, I think you're at a real disadvantage if you're being questioned or interrogated in your second language. Yes. I'm just very uncomfortable with this whole case. I mean, honestly, my opinion is that yes, he probably did it. Yeah. I don't think there's enough evidence for a conviction. Are you going to say your opinion one more time? No, I'm just worried that people are thinking that I'm defending a murderer. It's not... People are going to think what they're going to think. You've said your opinion 15 times. Brandy, are you okay with people being upset with you?

I mean, I don't love it. No, she's not. Anyway, that's the story of the disappearance of Maribel Ramos. Yeah. I wish you hadn't defended a murderer so much. You stop it. Where do I complain about this? Okay.

You can complain about Kristen. Oh, what? Well, that sort of thing doesn't happen. You know, in a future time, years from now, there will be an ad in this very spot. There's actually an ad in this very spot right now.

No, we've already done all the ads. No, we haven't done the Lumi ad. In a future time, like right now, there will be an ad right here. And it will be for Lumi. Or will it? Doodle-oo. We are back from the ad.

Doodle-oo. And now we're going to read questions from our Discord. How do you get into a Discord, Brandy? Oh, Brandy has dropped the ball. Oh, all you have to do... Dropped it entirely. All you have to do to join... Sorry, I picked up my phone

and there's nine text messages. I was making sure no one, you know, there was no emergency or anything. To get in our Discord, all you have to do is join our Patreon at the $5 level or higher. You can, you know, chitty chat the day away in there

with other fans of this fine program. And then when we record, we ask for questions and we answer a few. Oh, DP is my spirit animal wants to know what is a life hack or invention that you do or use that would make you rich if you sold it? Do you have one? No. If I had one, I'd be rich. See, I feel like you do a lot of life hacky shit. I do.

I do so many life hacky things, but I learn them from other people. So it's not my proprietary information. Put your label on it. Brandiola. What? That reminded me of Brandi Snot. You want to tell the people? No, I don't. I want Patty to cut this.y snot. You want to tell the people? No, I don't.

I want Patty to cut this. This is disgusting. Everyone, Brandy is bringing up a disgusting joke from our childhood about her nasty snot. You made the joke. It was about rubber cement. You're the one that said it was snot.

Yeah. Obviously, I'm the one who made a hilarious joke in the fifth grade. Obviously I'm the one who made a hilarious joke in the fifth grade This is the rudest question ever My uncle was a barrister Brandy, would you be okay if David dressed up as a penguin for Halloween? Not now

After Kristen has ruined penguins for me David dressed up as a penguin for Halloween. Not now. After Kristen has ruined penguins for me. I mean, you say you don't like it, but. Okay, that's enough. We all feel like you could get away if you really wanted to. Ooh, okay. The Ginger Snap asks, what concert or band would you drop everything for to go to last minute?

Okay. So Blink-182 was my favorite band growing up. And they recently announced a reunion tour. And I looked at tickets. And they're ridiculously expensive. So I was like, I've seen them like four or five times already. I don't need to go. I've seen them like four or five times already. I don't need to go.

Right. And then this past weekend, they performed at Coachella. And so the videos of that performance have been all over fucking TikTok. And now I want to go so fucking bad. I mean, how much are tickets? I just remember looking. I don't remember, but I remember looking at them and being like, I don't know. That's a lot. But maybe I'll buy tickets now.

Spice Girls reunion tour. Oh, fuck yes. I would be there in a second. Yeah. Even if the tickets were $80. Shut up. Which is how much she wouldn't see pay to see Ben Folds, which was the most amazing concert I've ever seen. All right.

We all know that I get a little iffy about spending money. There's something about clicking. Yes. Oh, Two Whole Podcast wants to know, Kristen, I just finished listening to the Amityville Horror episode. Have you changed your stance on the hip V? I'm here to tell you it's definitely a thing people are into. You know what? You be into it. And I'll judge you for it.

No, you know what? Norm and I were watching something the other day and some dude showed his hip V to the world and I was like, Mr. You don't find it attractive at all? I don't know. There's just something about it I don't appreciate. See, here's the thing for me is that like in general, I don't find like super fit, muscly guys that attractive. Okay.

I just like that hip-vy thing. Mm-hmm. That's the thing that I find very hot. So what you're wanting is some kind of cosmetic surgery. Like, have you ever seen? This is so funny to me. Do you know what I'm about to say? The thing that I like the most is, like, a fucking dad bod.

Like, hot. Yeah, like you like a fucking dad bod like hot. Yeah. Like you fuck a lot of dads. No. Oh, I misunderstood. No. What I'm talking about is that. OK.

You know, I feel like they don't do this anymore because it looks so stupid because, you know, like to get a six pack. You're talking about the spray on abs? No, not spray on abs. People were getting like some kind of insert yeah put in underneath the skin and it looked ridiculous because like to have those abs you have to have like no percent body fat like it doesn't work if you just like put some lumps no ab implants no no so i'm picturing someone with a dad bod, but like some giant inserted V thing. For your pleasure.

Oh, okay. Amber the Buy Disney adult wants to know, since we know the opinion on personal cookie cakes, what do you think about mini cupcakes? Aren't they just smaller versions of an already small version of a cake i've never thought about it before but yes yes it is i still like them though because you could the thing about a mini cupcake you can just throw that whole thing back you have to fuck with the icing and you know it is funny because like that's that is always my thing with a cupcake is how do you eat this in polite society? You take the bottom off and put it on top and make a cupcake sandwich.

All right, Anne Hathaway. That's how you do it. Okay. But the thing is I see those mini cupcakes and I'm like, meh. You don't like mini cupcakes? Too small? No, it's stupid, isn't it? I mean, it's the same stuff.

It's just smaller and easier to eat. But there's something about them. I see them and they're too small. Okay, let me ask you a question. Okay. You're at a gathering. All right. What's your favorite kind of cake?

I mean, I like all cakes. Okay. It's a chocolate cake party. Okay, it's a funfetti party. Okay, specifically a funfetti party. Everybody's been asked to bring some version of funfetti. So you're in the kitchen. Nobody else is around.

And it's like everything's up for grabs, okay? Right. You see a full funfetti cake. Right. You see funfetti cupcakes. You see mini funfetti cupcakes. Which one are you going for? Cake, no question.

Really? Of course. But you've got to get a plate and a fork and a hole. And it's so much easier that way. I don't have to look like a wild animal. Because I've got news for you. When I eat a cupcake, I have to get a plate and a fork anyway. That's how you're eating a cupcake?

Yes, because I cannot unhinge my jaw. That is true. My mouth opens very wide. So there's nothing weirder than watching me eat a cupcake. I guarantee it. OK. So, yeah, piece of cake all the way. All right.

What about you? What do you answer? I think I'd go with the cupcake. See, here's the deal. The mini cupcake would be easier, but then I'd feel like I want like three of them and that seems greedy. And so I would just take a single full-size cupcake. All right. Very good.

If no one was around, I might sneak a mini cupcake first and then be like, okay, yeah, it's just me eating my one regular cupcake. And then someone catches you. Yeah. And then I'd be embarrassed. And they're like, I can't believe you did that. I can't believe you ate a mini cupcake and a full size cupcake. Yeah. Oh, Mimi's Krusty Muffin says, Brandy, I was relistening to episode 17 where you say something along the lines of white men with big butts are in short supply.

I've also noticed you've mentioned a few times that David has a big butt. Is this what attracted you to him? And how does it feel to have a unicorn as husband? No, it's not what attracted me to him, but it is a wonderful bonus. He has quite the bulbous booty. It's wonderful. It's also, I mean, I'm just talking too much about his butt now, but it's so firm. Like it's... Norman's is too.

I know. I have a big butt, but my butt is not firm. I have a... I don't need to talk anymore about my own butt. It jiggles. It jiggles. I have a jiggle butt. Me too. Yeah. David, firm ass. Okay. But what David and Norm have in firm ass. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Okay, but what David and Norm have in common is they both grew up soccer players, so.

That doesn't make any sense, though. Like, playing soccer in your youth guarantees you a rockin' ass for the rest of your life? No. If that's true, then sign everybody up for soccer right now. Ooh, Kids Bop for Racists wants to know, Brandy, I want to stop dyeing my hair and embrace the gray. What are your recommendations for the transition? Is having someone color it all to match my gray roots viable?

Is there a product that will remove all the dye already in there? No. You're screwed is what she's about to say. Unfortunately, there's not a great way to transition. The easiest way to do it is to go to a salon and have them likely like balayage where you still have color to break that up, get it as light as possible to ease the transition. The best way is to just grow. Oh, to just smack an entire microphone? I don't see how that's going to have any effect.

Okay. And then just grit your teeth through the grow out process. You can get it colored and then toned to a silvery tone, but that will last you approximately three shampoos. And then you're just going to have basically blonde ends with your gray roots, which is less contrast probably. So still more desirable. Joke's on you. She doesn't shampoo her hair. Okay.

I love how stressed you look during this question as if you were going to have to leave here today and then go do this. And then go do this. That's immediately what I'm thinking about. Really? Yeah, absolutely. That's how I I'm thinking about. Really? How would I tackle this? Yeah, absolutely. That's how I think about it in my head. Okay, how would I tackle this if this was sitting in my chair?

Sounds like you'd just run out a window or something. There's just a brandy-sized shape in the wall, like a brandy shape in the wall as I run next door. You're like, I don't want to do this. No! I'm going to be next door eating dip. Oh, Edgar Allen Ho asks, if there was a The Last of Us-style zombie apocalypse, would you try to survive or would you live, laugh, toast, or bathe? Oh, I think about this all the time. Yeah.

Especially when, you know, Walking Dead first came out. It's like, I just kill myself. Me too. That's, I'm not cut out for that life. Sounds terrible. Sounds terrible. You know, occasionally in that show, you, they'd like walk into a house where clearly an entire family had offed themselves. That's, that would be our house.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I'm not going to watch my loved ones die, then try to eat me. No, that's not for me. And then I end up in some compound where some dude has. OK, well, I don't need to. Yeah, we get it. Boom Influenced wants to know, Kristen, you mentioned that you were in Michigan on this week's episode.

As a Michigander living in another state, I need to know which lake is your favorite. Also, I lived in Lansing for seven years and the thought that I could have potentially crossed paths with one of my favorite podcast hosts in that time made my soul temporarily leave my body. P.S. I hate Brandy. Oh, my God. I don't think that P.S. was really on there. Okay. So the truth about Michigan is I know it's a beautiful state. But I have only gone to Lansing.

We only ever go to Lansing to see Norman's grandma. Yeah. And we eat at all the places she loves to eat at. Yeah. Every time. Yeah. bar there last time and we can't go back because I did something really embarrassing. You gonna tell us? Okay. I haven't even told you this yet. Yeah, no. This is the first I'm hearing in this.

Okay. So every time we go to Michigan, you know, we go to all the places that Grandma likes and everything, but we always try to do like one date night or something. So we found this bar that was really highly rated. We went there and the food was great. We were like, oh my gosh, we're going to have to do this again. So great. And then we were getting ready to leave and I was like, oh, I'm just going to go to the bathroom. So I go to the bathroom and I open the door and um our waitress is in there and she's like clearly like i don't know maybe like tucking her shirt into her apron or something okay but like the toilet's not visible there's a stall and i'm assuming there are multiple stalls but she looked really startled when I opened the door.

And so I was kind of like, oh. And she's like, oh. And so I kind of backed up. Yeah. Because she seemed so startled. But then I'm, like, looking at the bathroom. I'm like, well, okay. So she's startled.

Like, I need to go to the bathroom i'm like well okay so she's startled like yeah i need to go to the bathroom so she this is i wanted to die uh-huh um so she's like oh no you can come on in and i was and at that point i'm already in'm like, what? Was this like an employees only bathroom? No, no. And she's like, yeah, I can. And again, I'm in there. We're in there together. She's clearly thinking this is super weird. I'm like, why does she think this is so.

Is this a single person bathroom? It's like a it's not this is not a stall situation. This is a one person in at a time. Well, here's not, this is not a stall situation. This is a one person in at a time. Well, here's the thing. There was a stall. Uh-huh. But it's just like the, it doesn't like close? No, it did close.

It was fully, it was fully enclosed. So I'm like, what's, what's the problem? What's the problem here? You, you wash your hands. I'll pee. Yeah. But she's like, clearly, like clearly i'm the first person in all of michigan to ever come into this bathroom with someone else in there and she's like yeah i can

just wash my hands here and so i'm like oh okay and so i go into this stall i close it and then she goes actually i'll just i can wash my hands behind the bar and then leaves and i'm like oh my god i don't i don't know why it was the most weird i still i'm not sure what yeah i don't really know what happened to them so and then we still had to pay the bill and norm was like this place is great and i, yeah, we can never come back again. How weird did you pee? 12 streams at a time. You scared her on out of there. Oh, my gosh.

It was. What do you make of that? I have no idea. Right. I mean, but clearly it's. I don't know. Clearly no one. It's not a two person thing.

Yeah, obviously. But in my world, if a toilet is enclosed. Yeah, yes. Well, and also, if she didn't want somebody in there, why didn't she lock the door? Did the door lock? Well, the door looked a little sketch. I'm wondering if maybe she thought she locked it. Oh, maybe. And then, boom.

You come busting in. In walks me. Demanding to pee. Pants around my ankles. Yeah, maybe that You come busting in. In walks me. Demanding to pee. Pants around my ankles. Yeah, maybe that's what set her off. Do you think that's what I immediately just disrobed entirely? You just fully knew. I was wearing a romper.

Who knows what's going to happen here? No, it's like that guy. What guy? That walked in there. Don't you know this story? The Home Depot story? What happened? Oh, no.

People, this guy walks into a bathroom and says, you guys better leave. I'm about to blow this place up. Oh, no. And they called the police and said this guy made a bomb threat. He was going to take a big old shit. It's a real story. It really happened. That also happened at some fast food place. A guy

said something like he's going to go blow it up and they called the police. Which, in fairness, they should call the police. How dare you? Just quietly blow it up, sir. You don't need to tell everybody. you don't need to tell everybody

they'll figure it out should we move on to some supreme court inductions I think you're just as uncomfortable as that waitress was what kind of look did you have in your eye

me oh my god I've replayed it in my mind so many times What did you have in your eye when you gave it to her? Me? I don't. Oh, my God. I still. I've replayed it in my mind so many times. I'm like, I don't. I know I did the wrong thing. I don't think you did do the wrong thing, though.

Well, no. In retrospect. When she was alarmed, you should have maybe just, like, backed out? Yeah, but then. How would you have handled it differently? But then she was, like, telling me, like, no, it's fine. But she didn like telling me like no it's fine but she didn't mean no it's fine i have no idea oh my gosh if we ever do go back i'll have to wear like a top hat and a mustache all right to get inducted on this podcast all you have to do is join our patreon at the seven dollar level or higher we are continuing to read your names and your first celebrity crushes okay very cute alexis alexis says her name is pronounced sexy potato

jared leather Alexis says her name is pronounced sexy potato. Jared Leather. Haley P. Cole Sprouse in The Suite Life of Zack and Cody. Oh. I think it's funny that people have crushes on one of these specific twins. It's a thing. Yeah.

Yeah. You don't like them both. One specific twin. You know these kids were Frankenstein and Big Daddy. That's't like them both. One specific twin. You know these kids were Frankenstein and Big Daddy. That's who that kid is. Okay. He also played Ben. Or they both played Ben on Friends. Anyway, this is not what we're here for. Mary Helen Paradis.

Brad Pitt. J. Juan Lee. Justin Bieber. Erica Buckwalter. Leo DiCaprio. Brad Pitt. J. Juan Lee. Justin Bieber. Erica Buckwalter. Leo DiCaprio. Brad Dunshee. Chris Evans. Duh.

Anna Norman. Orlando Bloom. Jillian Alder. Macaulay Culkin. Bea Deegan. Sandra Bullock. Pizza Lover. Nikki from Westlife.

Hinata Hyuga. Okay. No First Celebrity Crush. I am ace slash A-R-O. First Celebrity Admiration. Kel from Keenan and Kel. Ooh, yeah. Nice choice. Strong choice.

Jenna McDaniel. Rider Strong. Kiana. Corbin Blue. Tessa Britt. Hugh Laurie. Stephanie Winnie. Batman. Not Bruce Wayne. Not any of the actors who played Batman.

Batman. I was only eight, but I knew that bat could get it. Shaggy from Scooby-Doo. Not the live action one. Animated Shaggy only. Oh, we're getting weird in here. Amanda. Joey Lawrence from Blossom.

Whoa. Sarah Bennett. Jared Padalecki. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Catherine Lister. Morton Harkin from Uh-huh.

Take on me. Take on me. Take on me. You're welcome, Catherine. Hannah Emerson. Devin Sawa in Now and Then. Lily Kimler. Nick Jonas. Katie Rogala.

Frankie Muniz. Welcome to the Supreme Court! us a five-star rating and review. Then be sure to join us next week when we'll be experts on two whole new topics. Podcast adjourned. And now for a note about our process. I read a bunch of stuff, then regurgitate it all back up in my very limited vocabulary. And I copy and paste from the best sources on the web and sometimes Wikipedia. So we owe a huge thank you to the real experts. I got my info from the New York Times, the BBC, and an episode of the show Justice Files. I got my info from an episode of See No Evil, reporting for KTLA 5 News, New York Daily News,

and Oxygen.com. Or the error. Oh, yeah,.com, yeah. Not the error. For the fullest of our sources, visit lgtcpodcast.com. Any errors are, of course, ours, but please don't take our word for it. Go read their stuff.