Let's Go To Court! - 272: The Murder of Imette St. Guillen

Episode Date: October 11, 2023

Imette St. Guillen wanted to have a good time. Her birthday was just a few days away, so she and a friend went out to celebrate. But when the bar closed and her friend wanted to go home, Imette insisted on staying out. The hard-working graduate student went to the next bar alone. She had no idea she was being watched by a predator. And now for a note about our process. For this episode, Brandi copy and pasted from the best sources on the web. And sometimes Wikipedia. (No shade, Wikipedia. We love you.) We owe a huge debt of gratitude to the real experts who covered these cases. In this episode, Brandi pulled from: “Downtown Disappearance” episode New York Homicide “Imette St. Guillen” chillingcrimes.com “‘The Body Was Ice Cold’: NYC Bar Bouncer Raped, Strangled Grad Student” by Joe Dziemianowicz, oxygen.com “Imette St. Guillen” podcast episode, Women & Crime “The gruesome murder of Imette St. Guillen” by Clint Van Zandt, NBC News “In Bouncer’s Murder Trial, Victim’s Friend Recalls Their Last Night” by Kareem Fahim, The New York Times “People v. Darryl Littlejohn” casetext.com “Murder of Imette St. Guillen” wikipedia.org YOU’RE STILL READING? My, my, my, you skeezy scunch! You must be hungry for more! We’d offer you some sausage brunch, but that gets messy. So how about you head over to our Patreon instead? (patreon.com/lgtcpodcast). At the $5 level, you’ll get 51+ full length bonus episodes, plus access to our 90’s style chat room!  

One semester of law school. One semester of criminal justice. Two experts. I'm Kristen Caruso. I'm Brandi Pond. Let's go to court. On this episode, I'll be talking about the murder of Emet Senghian. Are we going to France?

We're not. Oh. No. I was going to ask, do you know this case? No. I feel like there's a good chance you might know it once I get going. Were they the perfect couple? No. Oh. No. Okay, then maybe's a good chance you might know it once I get going. Were they the perfect couple? No.

Oh. No. Okay, then maybe I don't know this. No, but this is a big deal case. Happens on the East Coast in 2006. Oh. Where you were living on the East Coast in 2006, so. Thank you, yes.

You're welcome. Does it happen in Boston? Is that what you're saying? It doesn't, but she's from Boston. Okay. Yeah. Interesting. All right.

I suppose I'll listen. Welcome, everyone, to the Let's from Boston. Okay. Yeah. Interesting. All right. I suppose I'll listen. Welcome, everyone, to the Let's Go to Court podcast. Yes. Yes. Welcome again to yet another episode of... We don't... Don't say again. Maybe people are coming in for the first time.

Oh, welcome for the very first time. Welcome to all our new listeners. I know you're just coming here in droves. Let me tell you something, folks. The thing about our podcast is it feels like the first time. Feels like the first time. It's over really fast. Feels like the very first time. You're kind of nervous. You want to talk about our Patreon? You want to give a butt plug for our Patreon? My goodness. My goodness.

Okay. Hey, everyone. Boy, have I got a story for you. What? I don't have a story, really. It's the story of our Patreon. Okay. We've got so many bonus episodes over there.

Oh, my goodness. They're so beefy. Yeah. Or lentily, you know,. They're so beefy. Yeah. Or lentily, you know, depending on what you're into. Yeah, if you're vegan. So we got a lot of those. We've got Zoom calls. Yeah. Those are fun. They are fun. We've got

a Discord where you can shitty chat the day away. You get a sticker with our autographs. My god, the monetary value on that alone! Priceless. $3. No, way more. Way more.

Also at the top level, you get your episodes a day early and you get them ad free. So you get to say to people, oh, did you listen to the new episode of Let's Go to Court? And they're like, what? No, they only upload on Wednesdays.

And you're like, huh. Maybe if you're poor. That's what to court. And they're like, what? No, they only upload on Wednesdays. And you're like, huh. Maybe if you're poor. That's what you say. And people want to get mad, but they can't because they're just so jealous. They are. They're jealous. They're focused on the jealousy. Yeah.

And so in that sense, you can say whatever you want to them. All right. Was that a good ad for our Patreon? No, but it is an ad. Wow. A lot of criticisms here today. Hmm. Hmm.

Weird, because I'm so magical. Anything going on with you? I see you've got a new lip gloss over there, ma'am. I've shamed you into pulling out a... No, you didn't. I'm putting new in air quotes. First of all, you didn't shame me into anything. You finally used up the other one, did you?

I did. I declared it used up because it was used. I used that tube of lip gloss to completion. I mean, you use it like probably for a full year beyond when I told you to start throwing it away. This is true. Yeah. And I used it in your face. You did.

In this very podcasting studio aggressively. That's true. Yeah. And I came in today with a new lip gloss. And you claim I purchased for you. I know you did. I have no recollection of ever purchasing a lip gloss. I am pretty sure. Let me tell you exactly where this comes from. OK. You, several years ago, before I believe Christmas, bought me like this Lancome gift set. And this lip gloss right here was a part of that set. Now, at the time, I didn't need a new lip gloss because, as you know, I had one. I was working my way through it. And so I saved this bad boy for this very moment right here. And I will now use it for the next five years. You just use one lip gloss at a time? You only got one lip gloss open? No.

Oh, hello. There's another door. We've got a special visitor. Oh, Norm, do you want to say something to the people? Say hello to the people. Oh my gosh, you should make the announcement. You're in a ghost voice. Norm, come over here.

Make the announcement about the remastering you've done. Yeah, Norm, tell the people. Tell the people what you've been doing behind the scenes. But do it in a ghost voice.

Yeah. Creep them out. Go ahead. Hello, everyone. Ew, don't do it that way. Use your real voice. So behind the scenes, I have been remastering every episode of Let's Go to Court. Weird, because we've never had any complaints about the audio ever.

Yeah, so I don't know why you did that. That's weird. So your ears will no longer bleed on certain episodes. You know, I've equalized everything, so it should sound a lot better. And you did that for the Patreon episodes as well, I understand. Literally every episode they have ever made has been remastered.

Amazing. My goodness. So enjoy. Thanks, Norm. Thank you, Norm. Goodbye. Ooh, the ghost just left the room. Ooh! You didn't make a single ghost noise. No. Fine.

You know, you think you know what your ghost experience is going to be like, but they can surprise you, okay? It's not like Hollywood makes it out to be, all right? Anyway, the story of my lip gloss is that— Okay, so do you really—you don't have only one lip gloss open at a time? No, no, no. Okay. I have a bathroom lip gloss. Okay. I have a nightstand lip gloss don't have only one lip gloss open at a time? No, no, no. Okay. I have a bathroom lip gloss. Okay. I have a nightstand lip gloss.

I have a purse lip gloss. I have a podcasting lip gloss. I have a desk lip gloss. Okay. But I'm a completionist, baby. Yeah. I get through them and oh, I'm satisfied. I've never once finished a lip gloss in my life.

You don't know the satisfaction. You're right, I don't. I don't think I'll ever know it. Okay. You know what? I don't. I don't think I'll ever know it. Okay. You know what I am a completionist on? It's not going to surprise you. Blush. Highlighter. That actually does kind of surprise me. Oh, it does?

Those are my two, aside from eyeliner, those are my two favorite. But I'm not even a completionist on eyeliner because once the eyeliner, if I start having to fuck with it a lot to get it to do what I need it to do, I just throw that shit away give me a new one you shouldn't have to fuck your eyeliner I always say okay I mean you can if you want I'm not going to tell you if I'm going to have to do more than a single pass get the fuck out of here wow okay yeah I see I'm a bit of a diva about my eyeliner. Just about the eyeliner?

No kidding. No kidding. You know what I'm a diva about? Ads? I'm a diva about ads. That's right. Doodaloo. Doodaloo.

We're back from the ad and boy are we ready. Are you ready to talk about a murder? I mean, yeah, I guess so. Don't act all sad. You chose this. You did this to yourself. I did. I did it to myself.

Okay, shout outs, too. An episode of an Oxygen show that I'd never watched before. Okay. Called New York Homicide. All right. I liked it. Okay. It was decent.

Oh, decent? It was enough. Sounds like you'd like to take about half. I liked it. Okay. It was decent. Oh, decent? It was enough. Sounds like you'd like to take about half a shit on it, so let's hear what half a shit. No, it was okay. It was pretty good. Reenactments? No reenactments. Cheesy voiceover. No, just very... What? I don't know

if this was specific to this episode. It was just very police-centered. Well, you love the police. You're always saying, blue lives matter. That's what your t-shirt says right now, right? Stop it. Everybody relax.

We're not that kind of podcast. No, we're not that kind of podcast. Also to ChillingCrimes.com Gosh, who could have guessed that you would pull something from there, your favorite website of all time. also to chillingcrimes.com gosh who could have guessed that you would pull something from there your favorite website

of all time and then also next to Pornhub the Wikipedia page I didn't miss the Pornhub comment by the way damn it

I thought for sure you did and there was a twinkle in my eye because I was like she's gonna hear that on the edit and it's gonna be too late.

Okay. The Wikipedia page on this was quite thorough. Okay. Wonderful. You ready? I am. I got to take a drink. Oh, so you're not ready.

I see. I see. Okay. Let's get on in it. Ew. I don't like that. That sounded like what you say to get in overalls. You're right.

It does. All right. Let's put our overalls on and get to work. It was just before 8.30 p.m. on February 25, 2006, when a call came in to 911 from a man who said he wished to remain anonymous. man who said he wished to remain anonymous. The caller said that he had found a body wrapped in a blanket near Seaview Avenue and Fountain in Brooklyn, New York. According to this Oxygen show that I watched, New York Homicide, this is a remote, rough area of the city known to be frequented by sex workers. So police responded. Specifically, Detective Christopher DiBernardo was sent out.

He's from the NYPD 75th Precinct. OK. That's a pretty badass last name, don't you think? I do. I do think so. OK. Yeah. Also, I do feel like maybe I was drawn to this case because I just finished The Sopranos

and I'm feeling very like New York. New York. OK, let me ask you a question. Yeah. So you are aware that Norman and I binged The Sopranos. Yes. Like a month ago. Yes.

The amount of pasta we ate in that period of time was mad. I mean, it's insane to me. Did you and David do the same thing? We have not. But I have. I have told David so many times that pasta sounds good. And just right now when you said this, it's like, that's why. Yes. Yes. You watch them. Tony says they're eating pasta all the fucking time. So delicious. Okay. Continue. Okay. So detective comes out and he sees what does appear to be a body wrapped in a blanket. He checked for a pulse and the body was cold. It was clear that this person was deceased. Okay, I thought this was kind of odd and I didn't actually include it at first,

but I'll include it now to see if you maybe know what this means. Okay. Or have any insight on this. The color who asked to remain anonymous referred to the discovery of this body as there's a DOA, dead on arrival, is what that stands for. I think just a lay person using that terminology on a 911 call seems weird, right? Yeah. Yeah, no, that's really strange. Right? None of the sources talk about it at all. But I was like, the fact that he called it a DOA, yes.

I mean, that has to be someone who has some kind of either medical experience or police experience. That's what I thought. Right? Yeah. No idea who this caller is. They're never identified. They, as far as I know, have always remained anonymous. Okay.

Anyway, I just thought that was interesting. So inside of this blanket, and it was like a floral, like thin bedspread type blanket. Like kind of a cheap little number. Right. In one source they talked about it looked kind of like maybe like a motel blanket. Yeah. Oh, gosh. Yeah.

We all know the type. It's not. It's not. But that's kind of the vibe. We're picturing it. So inside this blanket was a young woman. She appeared to be in her mid 20s. Her face was wrapped with packing tape. She was nude. Her hands were bound with zip ties and her feet were bound with what appeared to be a shoelace. A red speck, what looked like possibly a drop of blood, was on one of the zip ties. Obviously, they didn't know at first if it was her blood or her killer's blood. There was also like a snow brush, you know, like the thing you brush off the windshield of your car, found on the ground near her body.

And it was collected as potential evidence i'm sorry i'm worried it's going to sound weird that i was giggling but everyone you should know that sometimes when brandy says something yeah i do emotion and it's a term we've all heard before maybe people don't use snow brushes in the south i mean yeah probably not it'd probably be a weird thing to just yeah handy. Yeah, and they're like, what's a snow brush? Yeah, but they're not going to be helped by you on this medium right here. Snow brushing an imaginary vehicle. But boy, have I gotten the snow off of this, wouldn't you? You've done a great job.

Yes. But are you going to do the top? Ooh, yeah, see, that's the thing. You need one of those extender ones to do the top, and this was not an extender one. Yeah, okay. I'll tell you, I saw a picture of it, and it's a real short one made of wood. What are these, old-timey times? I don't know.

I've never seen one made of wood before. All right. All right. Anyway, an autopsy revealed that the young woman had died by asphyxiation. A sock had been shoved into her mouth before the packing tape had been wrapped around her head. She'd been beaten and sexually assaulted and chunks of her hair had been cut off. That's really weird. It's so weird. Okay. So it's humiliation. Humiliation, dehumanizing. Yeah. Yeah. So this is the second case that I've covered where the victim had their hair cut off.

Yeah. I'm in the Heather Bogle case that I did. She was also found with her hair cut off. And one of the articles that I used here is a source they do go into like this is a dehumanizing tactic. Yeah. Yeah. Part of torture that was that this poor woman went through. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah, part of torture that this poor woman went through. Yeah. Yeah. It was also very clear that this young woman had fought her attacker as several of her fingernails were broken. Red fibers were found on the tape, on the sticky side of the tape when it was removed from her face. But no ID or personal belongings of any kind were found on the victim. So the police turned to the public for help identifying her.

They specifically mentioned that the woman had tan lines. They suspected that she was maybe from out of town or that she had recently returned from a vacation because of her tan lines. Really? I know. Okay, see, they talk about this on the New York Homicide Show. I wouldn't think anything of it. I wouldn't think anything of it either. Especially in 2006.

In 2006, everybody's using a fucking tanning bed. Right. I really did not think anything of the tan lines either. But honestly, it was a big part of how she was identified. Huh. Okay. Yeah, so they make that they make this public you know appeal asking for anybody with information they give some identifying information including the tan lines and they got a phone call from a young woman who believed that

this victim could be her cousin oh the woman came down to the station and she told police that she'd been unable to reach her cousin and that her cousin had recently returned from visiting her mother and sister in Florida. And so when she heard the tan lines thing, it had caught her attention. Wow. Yeah. Okay. So detectives showed this woman a picture of their unidentified victim, and she was able to confirm that it was, in fact, her cousin, 24-year-old Emmett St. Guillen.

I believe this is pronounced Simundo. That's her dad's name. S-E-I-M-U-N-D-O. Guillen. And Maureen St. Hilaire. So that's her mother. Her last name is a combination of her parents' names. I know.

I love it, too. Yeah. Yeah. She and her sister both have the last name St. Guillen. And it's a combination of their parents' two last names. I've always wondered why more people don't do that. Yes. I love it. Yeah.

So, Ahmet's mother was French-Canadian and her father was a Venezuelan immigrant. He tragically had died of AIDS when Ahmet was just nine years old. God. Yeah. So, Ahmet had grown up in Boston. Her mom remarried. I believe her stepfather was a big part of her life right she grew up in boston she graduated from boston latin school in 1999 oh do you know that hang on let me look i mean maybe i'm okay full of shit hang on yeah this is definitely right by simmons is it really? That's right by Simmons. Oh, my gosh.

I thought it sounded familiar. And I'm everybody. I'm not bragging, but I did go to Simmons University, which obviously means I'm very, very smart. Obviously. Yes. And this is right next to it. OK. Yes, absolutely.

So they're probably proud just to be affiliated with us. Sure. Sure. OK. So Annette graduated from Boston Latin School in 1999. Then she moved to Washington, D.C. to attend George Washington University. Oh, shit. Okay. Yeah. So, to honor her father, Amet followed in his footsteps and studied criminal justice, which he had done as well. She graduated magna cum laude. How were you going to pronounce it?

Well, my lips got stuck together. Okay. And then she decided to go on to graduate school at John Jay College of Criminal Justice in New York City. Yeah. To pursue her master's degree. Originally, she intended to study forensic psychology at John Jay College of Criminal Justice, but it looks like she changed her major, some sources say to just criminal justice and some say to criminology. Okay. What did she want to do with that?

You know, I don't know. Okay. I don't know what her plans were after graduation. I believe she wanted to work in forensics somehow. That was her goal. Okay. She was an amazing student she was super dedicated she ranked in the top five percent of her class good grief yeah and she was scheduled to graduate in may of 2006 just like two months after she was found murdered this is so weird to me. All right. What do you mean?

Well, first of all, I would assume it's pretty, well, no, I know it's pretty damn unusual to be murdered in this brutal way. And she's a criminologist. Exactly. That seems very weird to me. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. So please tell me more. I will. Okay. So they've identified Amet now, and they decide to piece together her movements before her murder.

On the night of February 24th, Amet had gone out bar hopping with some friends, including one of her best friends, Claire Higgins. They were celebrating her birthday. It was just a few days before Amet's birthday. And so they were like, she's about to turn 25. So it was like a night out in Manhattan Manhattan drinking, like just having a good time. And yeah, so they were kind of in like the Soho area at some trendy bars and they were having a great time. Around 2.30 in the morning, Claire was ready to like call it a night. She was ready to pack it in. But Amet wanted to stay out. The bars in New York City stay open until four. And so she wanted to stay out until the bars closed. Claire, at this point, knew that

Amet was pretty intoxicated. Yeah. And was like, let's just go. Right. We've had a great time. Yeah. Let's get home. Dear God, it's 2.30 in the morning. Exactly. Claire even called, like, hailed a couple of cabs, like, as they're having this conversation. But each time, like, Emet kind of sent the cab on or the cab got tired of waiting and left. And so, like, this conversation was kind of going on and on. Eventually, an argument ensued between Claire and Emet. And Emet said she wasn't going to leave.

She didn't want to leave. Oh, God, this sucks. And so she stayed at the Pioneer Bar, which is where they were at the time. And Claire got in a cab and left. It was about 2.30 in the morning. About a half an hour later, Claire called to check on Amet. By that time, Amet had left Pioneer Bar and had moved on to another bar called The Falls. And that was the last time Claire ever heard from Ahmet. So they did talk? They did talk briefly, I believe.

Okay. But Ahmet had said, I'm having a good time. I'm at, you know, The Falls now. I'm good. Don't worry about me. Right. Oh, poor Claire. Mm-hmm.

So they talked to Claire about that night. You know, she fills him in on all that information. I mean, Claire. I know. Yeah. Yeah. She feels terrible. Yeah.

But she didn't do anything. No. She told police that there was a bartender at the Pioneer Bar that night that had hit on a Met. And a Met had kind of kind of like brushed it off. Right. So detectives decided to go to that bar and talk to that bartender. It didn't go anywhere. They cleared him right away.

I mean, a bartender who flirts with people. Exactly. Yeah. It's like, is it just the job? Yeah. Okay. They also, of course, looked into an ex of Amet's. I don't believe she's dating anybody currently, but there was an ex-boyfriend that they looked into.

He told them where he was and then they checked his phone records and it all matched. And so they cleared him as well. They then decided to see if this was maybe related to any other crimes that had been going on in the area. And they found that on February 12th, a woman had been sexually assaulted by. OK, it's described as an unofficial cab driver. Does that mean like somebody who doesn't have their cab license? Maybe would that have been like an Uber? I don't know.

I don't think Uber did not exist in 2006. It's funny because I think of New York as having pretty strict regulations on that. Yeah, exactly. So I'm surprised an unofficial cab driver can even exist. Exist, exactly. But okay. Okay, so February 12th, there was this woman who had been sexually assaulted by an unofficial cab driver. And then she had been dumped out of the cab less than half a mile from where Ahmet's body had been found.

So they bring this woman in. They get a detailed description of this cab driver. They release it to the public. And then something very surprising happened. What? A guy comes into the police department. He's like, I'm the guy? Yeah.

He says, I'm the guy. I did assault that woman, but I have nothing to do with this murder. Wow, that's weird. Right? Yes. But, I mean, potentially very smart if you feel like, hey, I did this real bad thing, but I didn't do the really, really bad thing. I did not do this murder.

I did not do this brutal murder. I did attack that bad thing, but I didn't do the really, really bad thing. I did not do this murder. I did not do this brutal murder. I did attack that woman. Holy shit. Isn't that nuts? Honestly, if you had asked me to list the things I was expecting, I would not have even been on there. Seriously, right? Okay.

Okay. Yeah. So he's like, I did attack that woman, yes, but I had nothing to do with this murder. In fact, I was in New Jersey on the night that Ahmet Senghian was murdered. They were able to verify that. He actually gave a DNA sample as well. He was like, I was assaulting another woman in New Jersey.

Right. No kidding. Yeah, so they did the same thing. They tracked his cell phone. It matched his story. They cleared him on this, but I believe, you know, hopefully they charged him in the other case. I didn't actually see anything that said that, but good Lord, we hope so. All right.

So they're like, fuck, where do we go from here? Like, we thought this was our big break, and it's not. So then they finally were able to access Emet's credit card records. Okay. And it showed that she had used her debit card at the Falls. I think that she hadn't, that Emet had not told Claire where she had gone. Okay. She just said, I'm somewhere else now.

I'm fine. Don't worry about me. And so they weren't real sure where she had gone after she left the first bar. But now they have her credit card records. They see that she went to the Falls, this bar that's within walking distance from the Pioneer, where she was at initially, and that she bought two rum and Cokes there. OK. So they go to the bar and they talk to the bar manager.

And he was kind of weird. He said, I don't know, maybe she was here. I don't really know. He seemed very standoffish, not willing to confirm or deny anything. Just not real cooperative. Okay. I mean, all right. What?

What, Kristen? I don't know. I always think when we get to this thing of like a bartender is trying to remember. He's the bar manager. Okay. Well, he wasn't ordained by God. Correct. I agree. Okay. So the bar manager, you're talking about, you know, I don't know how long ago a woman was in here. Yes.

How do you remember that? Right. No, I agree. Lots of people coming and going from the bar. Obviously, you would remember. I would. Because you have a weird memory. Yes, I have a weird, I have a very visual memory. So yes, if I see her face, I'll be like, yes, I saw her on this date and she said this thing. Yeah. And they'll be like, you're clearly the murderer. You're the murderer.

Why do you remember that? Nobody's memory works that way. Yes. Exactly. No, so they think that the bar manager is being kind of weird about it. They talk to one of the bartenders, and he's like, I do remember serving her. She was definitely in here, but that's all I remember. Okay. And they talk to a bouncer who was there, and he says, I don't recognize her at all.

Okay, so the bartender. Did she consume the two rum and Cokes herself, or did she get one for herself and one for someone else? They were both for her. Okay. Yeah. Well, damn it. I'm acting like I'm solving the case. So police don't love this interaction at this second bar.

Like I said, they thought the bar manager was being kind of odd. So they dig a little deeper into that. said they thought the bar manager was being kind of odd. So they dig a little deeper into that. And they find out that this manager of the Falls, his name is Danny Dorian. Is that a name that sounds any kind of familiar to you? Should it? No. Okay. Okay. It doesn't for me either, but I'm going to tell you that there's a connection here. I think it means something to some people. Okay. Okay. So his name's Danny Dorian. His father ran a famous bar in New York City in the 80s, or owned a famous bar, I believe, named Dorian's Red Hant.

Hmm. Okay. It is the bar from the Preppy murder case. Do you know this case? Oh, yeah. Yeah. So the Preppy murderer met his victim at this case? Oh, yeah. Yeah. So the preppy murderer met his victim at this bar. Oh, God.

Yeah. And so they're like, holy shit. What? So this guy is the son of the bar owner from the preppy murder case from 1986? Like, they think it's pretty sketchy. What? No, that's just a weird coincidence. I agree. I think it's a weird coincidence.

Yeah. But they wonder if it means that there's something that this is there. If there's more to this bar manager not being up front with them. Hold on, hold on, hold on. Yeah. I don't remember the preppy murder thing well. But, like, the bar had nothing to do with it. But it got really bad publicity after it.

Right, but that doesn't mean. Correct. Okay. Correct. Just so but that doesn't mean— Correct. Okay. Correct. Just so we're all on the same page. Yes. You know, he had just— You know, I've had a couple bad nights at Apple, but that's not—

Yes, no, they just happened to both be in that bar that night, as far as I know. Again, I don't know all of the details of the preppy murder case. We have not covered it on this podcast. Well, in fairness, it sounds like a you case. For sure. So, that's on you, sister. So, it's like a you case. For sure. So that's on you, sister. So it's now March 3rd. There's six days into this investigation.

And Danny Dorian wanders into the police station with his attorney to sit down and talk to the police. So this is the manager of the Falls. Had he been asked to come in? Nope. Oh, wow. I tell you what, shit's popping up all over this story, isn't it? Yes, it is. Okay. Yeah, I think it's kind of wild how this case developed. All right. So he comes in with his attorney and asks to sit down and speak to detectives.

And they're like, okay, great, let's talk. And he admits that he had not been completely truthful when they had questioned him before. He said he did remember a met. He remembered a met very clearly because a met had been at his bar that night. She'd been very intoxicated. And even after last call, which is that like 4 a.m., she wouldn't leave. which is at like 4 a.m. Yeah. She wouldn't leave.

Okay. And so he had had his bouncer, Daryl Littlejohn, escort her out of the bar. Oh. Okay. So I think it is weird not to offer that information up when the police come asking about her. Unless you're obsessed with covering your own ass and you think there might be some liability there. Yes. Exactly.

That sucks. Yep. So police had actually spoken to Daryl Littlejohn. Yeah. When they'd come by the bar, they'd ask the bouncer if he recognized him. And he claimed to not remember. Nope. Didn't recognize her. the bouncer if he claimed to not remember nope didn't recognize her which is real fucking weird if it's a little lady who you had to basically drag out of your bar and it's interesting that

you say that a little lady because she's really little she's like five two like yeah yeah yes she's a little tiny woman that yeah basically had to be physically removed from this bar at closing time can you imagine being five'2"? I cannot. Sounds amazing. I would feel like the cutest little thing you ever did see. I'd sneak up behind people. And I'd be like, oh! And they couldn't be scared because I'm 5'2". I'm adorable.

Too bad for you. How tall is Kyla? Kyla's like 5'2". I'm adorable. Too bad for you. How tall is Kyla? Kyla's like 5'7". Yeah. Why? Did she give 5'2 vibes to you? It's only because she has me as a sister. Everyone says she's short.

I know. That's exactly right. That's why I wanted to know. Because next to you, she does seem short. But she's not short. No. She's, in fact, not short at all. She's quite tall.

That's what... Okay. So it's interesting. That's what people say about us, too, is that I fact not short at all. She's quite tall. Okay, so it's interesting. That's what people say about us, too, is that I seem short next to you, but I'm not short either. You're not short at all. No. How tall are you? I'm 5'8". Yeah. Yeah.

Here's the thing. I'm just a big old string bean. Tall. You're a tall lady. I can't sneak up on anybody. Yeah, no. No sneaking. Makes me sad.

And a London's doctor says that she thinks she'll be 5'3", which is that just the cutest thing you've ever heard. Oh, my gosh. Yeah. Is there a way to give her enough caffeine that she only hits 5'2", so she's even cuter? Okay. Sorry, tangent. They know we're on a tangent. It's fine.

They know. That's the whole thing about, you know, I switched London to a big girl bed this past weekend. I talked about it on the last episode. We did it this weekend. She's loving it. Things are going great. She's a real cliffhanger for the people. They're glad to hear that it happened.

She's tiny. She looks so tiny in her big girl bed. It's just a standard twin bed. Yeah. But she looks so tiny in it. But the reason that I decided it was time was because I saw her sleeping in, like, her crib still. And she was, like, outstretched and her hand could hit the top bar. Yeah.

And her feet could hit the bottom. And I was like, oh, my gosh, she's like a little koi fish that's never going to grow bigger than her enclosure. So now she's going to be 6'5". I hope so. All because of this bed. 5'3". 5'3", yeah. Folks, write in.

Yeah, if you're 5... Is it as adorable as we think it is? Yeah, it just sounds adorable. Because it seems cute as hell. Seems real cute. Yeah cute yeah okay back to this you ready i don't know that i am you're not ready to get back in here imagine being the little spoon all the time with basically everyone yeah yes i go up to random people and spoon them all the time so do you know i realized how weird that sounded.

This idea of always being the little spoon. How many people are you really spooning? Yeah. No judgment, obviously. Right. Well, I am judging you all the time. Anyway, maybe we should move on from this tangent. I think we should.

Don't give me a look like I'm being creepy. I'm not. I'm not. I've not spooned anyone against their will. Okay. This week. Great. Boy.

Okay. All right. So police talked to Danny Dorian. He's like, I did actually, I do actually know her. She was in the bar that night. I, in fact, had to have my bouncer escort her physically out of the bar. And the police are like, really? Because we talked to him and he said he'd never seen her either, which seems super sus.

And so they go back and they re-interview Daryl Littlejohn. They also like look into his background at this time. Yeah. And this, I think, is the reason that Danny Dorian was not up front at first. Okay. So Daryl Littlejohn was a career criminal. at first. Okay. So Daryl Littlejohn was a career criminal. He was on parole, which in and of itself should have kept him from being able to have a bouncer job. Right. He had a long rap sheet, no necessarily violent crimes, but because he's on parole, he has a 9 p.m. curfew. Oh. So he cannot work as a bouncer at a bar.

He also, in order to hold a security license, which New York requires bouncers to have, has to go through the security course and be able to pass a background check, which he would not have passed. Yeah, so this guy's trying to cover his ass. Correct. Correct.

So they bring Daryl Littlejohn in. You know, they know about his background now. And he's like, they let him know that they've talked to his boss. And he's like, your boss has said that this woman was in the bar that night and that you actually are the one who escorted her out at the end of the night. And he does say that like, oh, yeah, you know what? I was actually going to come and talk to you guys because I saw her picture

like in the news and stuff and it did kind of jog my memory. I do remember that she was there that night. Yeah, okay. According to one of the detectives who was in like on this little interview with Daryl Littlejohn,

he said he was very forthcoming. Well, no, he, he was very forthcoming. Well, no. What? I agree. Okay. He says very forthcoming, very cooperative in this second interview. He said his whole thing was I walked him out of the bar and I went on my way and she went her way. So over the course of this investigation so far, they had gotten a tip from like a security guard, like night watchman type of dude who kind of worked in the area where Amet's body was found.

Okay. And he said that on the night that Amet disappeared, the night before her body was found, that he saw a van in that area, like parked on the side of the road. He saw someone sitting in the van. It was clear that someone was in the van because they were on their phone. So he could see the light of a cell phone, but not enough to see who was in the van. He gave a very detailed description of the van. And so that, I believe, description had been made public as well by this point. And so in this meeting with detectives, Daryl Littlejohn's like, and by the way, I do drive a van that does look exactly like the van.

You're kidding me. That's been mentioned being spotted in the area where Amit's body was dumped. Also, by the way, I did do this. Right. Was he forthcoming about everything except for that last part? He was not. He just said he said he didn't have anything. He did walk her out of the bar that night.

She went one way and he went the other. And it's just a weird coincidence that he happens to have a van just like a van that was spotted in the area where her body was dumped. All right. He did not get to go home from that interrogation. You're kidding. They actually placed him under arrest for parole violation. Yeah, I mean.

Yeah. So that's kind of like a fun little thing that they were able to do that. Fun is definitely the right word. Yeah. What other things do you do for fun, Brandi? Fun is definitely the right word. Yeah. What other things do you do for fun, Brandi?

So they decide that they need to look into Daryl Littlejohn. So they start by obtaining his cell phone records, which I don't know if you know this, but cell phones go ping, cell towers go pong, and his cell phone put him. You're fucking up my poetry. So just stop right there. Let me get some cheese cubes, and then I'll tell you. Cell phones go ping, cell towers go pong, and we know your location all the day long. Do not roll your eyes at me. You have sang Christmas Shoes to me against my will multiple times on this podcast. I thought I could do an abbreviated version.

It's already abbreviated. That's the abbreviation. Okay. Anyway, wouldn't you know it, his cell phone records have him placing a call in the remote Brooklyn area where Emet's body was found. Pure coincidence, I'm sure. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So then with that information,

they're able to get a warrant to search Daryl Littlejohn's home. When they walk in... They noticed that his shitty comforter was missing? No, we'll get to the comforter, but they did notice that he had red carpet. Okay. Red fibers were found in the tape when it was removed from Amet's face.

Yeah. What, did he live in a fucking church? He has red carpet. I don't know. Isn't that like a 70s thing probably? I mean, yes. It's probably just the carpet's never been updated. Any kind of colored carpet is for sure a 70s thing.

Yeah. And, like, if you were fancy, and I am bragging, my grandparents, every room, a different color. Different color. Yeah. Absolutely. Taste the rainbow, baby. That's right. So they notice that he has this red carpet.

So they pull some fibers and they, I'm sorry. I don't know why I said, why didn't you say, I was nodding and also trying to let this guy know we're on to him. I say like, he's not in prison right now. Okay,

cool. So they do an analysis on the carpet fibers, and they are a match to the fibers that were found on the packing tape. That's why I said, I knew. They also happen to have Daryl Littlejohn's DNA on file because he had a previous bank robbery conviction. And at that time, he had served like 12 years for bank robbery and they had taken a DNA sample at that time. So they run it against the blood that was found on the zip ties. And then they had also taken touch DNA off of that snow brush. So they ran a couple of things.

So there was DNA pulled from under her fingernails, DNA that was on that zip tie, DNA from the snow brush, and a couple of different samples from the blanket. Okay. So let's break it down. This man lives in his grandmother's house. No. That was not a question. It's a fact. I don't believe he does.

Yes, he does. Red carpet. It is possible that he lives in his grandmother's house. I don't think his grandmother lives there, but it is likely his grandmother's house. This man did not do this himself. The floral thing. Yeah. Okay.

Okay. So let's talk about each of these things. Okay. The little speck of blood on the zip tie. They test his DNA against that. It's a match. Yeah. He was prone to nosebleeds, and they believe he got a nosebleed while he was attacking Ahmet.

Yeah. The touch DNA from the snow brush was also a match to his DNA. These samples from under Ahmet's fingernails were not a match, though later they determined that it was probably her own DNA that they pulled from there. were not a match, though later they determined that it was probably her own DNA that they pulled from there. Right. And then they pulled two samples from the blanket. They had a hair and a semen sample from this floral comforter. And neither of them were a match to Daryl Littlejohn.

Little John. But during the analysis, the person doing the DNA analysis was like, it's not a match. But it's close? But it's close. Oh, God. So then they did some familial testing. Okay, the hair was a pubic hair. And they determined that it was consistent.

It had the bulb attached, and so they were able to do a DNA test on that, and it came back as Daryl Littlejohn's mother's DNA. So is it possible this is just a blanket they've got around the house? Just wait. Okay. Then they did the DNA sample on the semen. Okay. Did the DNA test on the semen sample.

I said that backwards. That's fine. Keep going. Put sample in the wrong sample on the semen. Okay. Did the DNA test on the semen sample. I said that backwards. That's fine. Keep going. Put sample in the wrong place. You're killing me here. Okay. Go ahead. And the semen was also not a match for Daryl Littlejohn, but it was a match to his brother. Okay. Who had died 12 years earlier. What? What? Mm-hmm.

How? That's disgusting. What are you talking about? It just was a real dirty blanket. Oh, gross. Yeah. Yeah. So when that match came back as close to his, they actually – his brother had actually been in prison for – I'm not sure what it was.

But he had actually died while he was in custody. And so when they did an autopsy, they keep samples. And so the police have access to samples from his brother's autopsy. So they take those samples and run the DNA test and the semen is from his brother who died 12 years earlier. How do you feel about that, Kristen? I have no fucking words. I know. I am horrified.

I know. That is disgusting. So that's a minimum 12-year-old crusty jizz stain on this blanket? That's correct. That the whole family's rubbing their pubes all over? That's correct. I'm horrified as well. This is nasty.

It's so gross. You know what? Okay. I, oh, oh my God. Oh my God. I have a theory. Oh. That some people think that some things just don't get washed.

Yeah. Like bedspreads. And blankets. Yeah. No. That's very likely. Let me tell. That's very likely the case here.

Let me tell everyone. You actually can wash those. They are very washable. And let me tell you something about decorative pillows. Uh-huh. First of all, if you got a good one, it's got a zipper. Zipper. You just zip that cover right off. It's kind of a hidden zipper. Uh-huh. First of all, if you've got a good one, it's got a zipper. Zipper. You just zip that cover right off.

It's kind of a hidden zipper. Yep. Yeah. And if it doesn't have a zipper, you do not buy that pillow because it can't. Well, I've been known to just throw them in the wash. Throw the whole thing in there. Absolutely. You've got to wash that shit.

Oh, my God. Okay. I watched both of my kids wipe their noses on their blankets this week, on their little throw blankets that they like when we're watching TV and stuff. And I was like, both of those fucking things are going in the wash right now. See, I would see that and be like, maybe in 12 years. That's the thing is it's minimum 12 years old. Minimum 12 years old. No, you said he died in prison.

He died in prison. So I don't even know how long he was in there. It's an artifact. It was called like disintegrated semen at one source. Well, I should hope so. Yeah. I mean, unless those were the most. Okay.

You know, you stop right now. I did. Thank you. I did stop. Thank you. Because I'm a Simmons University graduate and I've got class. Yeah. I'm so glad that you're as disturbed about this blanket as I am.

What did you think I was going to say? Oh, sure. No, I knew this would be your reaction. This is horrifying. It is. Also, people won't vacuum enough. I would agree. Let me just like list it off grievances at this point.

Yes. What else don't people do enough, Kristen? Don't get me judging. Wash their butts in the shower. You can't just, you got to literally soap it on up. Okay. And I'm sorry. Tangent city. I'm not sorry. Let's talk about washing buttholes i am sorry because people do get mad and i want to please the people but i can't help being me yeah

someone was talking about something and she was like that that kid's 18. He's not even washing his own booty hole. And I thought, whoa, hey. First of all. Who's washing it for him? Yeah. And also, at what age do we wash our booty holes? I would hope that that'd be a thing you'd learn. Yes.

Real early. Yeah. Yeah, you got to suds that puppy up. You got a routine, do you? I do. Do you feel comfortable sharing? Sure, absolutely. Okay.

Let's hear it. Okay. I shampoo, I get in the shower, get all. Shampoo your butt? Get all rinsed down. Get my hair all wet. I shampoo twice. Yep.

Meanwhile, my body's just, you know, living it up. I've got my podcast on, you know, whatever. Shampoo twice. Always the Let's Go to Court podcast. No, I'm listening to my own podcast in the shower. Shampoo twice. Then I get my conditioner on. Really slather that on.

Gotcha. I like to let it sit in like a treatment. And then I do my body stuff. I get my soap. I lather that on. Gotcha. I like to let it sit in like a treatment. And then I do my body stuff. I get my soap. I lather up. I have a kind of like, you know, start at the neck, work my way down. Sure. It's, you know, hoo-ha

butthole. You got to lather it all up. Yes. And then you work your way down to the legs. Get it all lathered up. And then while my conditioner is still sitting, I rinse everything off. And then if I'm going to do a little leg shaving, I do that real quick. Yeah. Yeah. If I'm going to do an exfoliation on my face, I do that real quick. Yeah. And then last thing I do is rinse that conditioner out and get on out of there. Okay. What's your routine? Frankly, I think it's more involved than your

routine. Oh, wow. Okay. Frankly, I think you could eat a meal off my butthole. Okay. frankly, I think you could eat a meal off my butthole. Okay. Great. Keep in mind you've not been invited to, so just calm down. Yeah, thanks. Okay. Just calm down. Here's what I do.

I get in the shower, shampoo twice. I think of you every time I do it because you advised that we shampoo twice. Yeah, shampoo twice. You've got to get one to get the real difference. Yeah. You got to get one to get the product out and one to cleanse the hair. How's that feel? Knowing I'm naked in the shower thinking of you.

It doesn't bother me. Okay. I use one of those scalp massager things. Oh, love it. You do that every time? Yeah. Every time you shampoo your hair. I'm living in luxury over here.

Okay. All right. Yeah. Do that up. Then I do the conditioner. kind of same thing as you sometimes because i've got such dry parched hair yeah i actually have to do a real treatment and i put on a little shower cap oh you put on a cappy huh i do trap that heat in there like like an 80 year old woman okay then let me tell you what I do. Washcloth. Oh. Okay. I don't do a washcloth. I just do my hands.

Well, you're fucking up big time. Okay. You really got. Washcloths freak me out. Why? I don't really know. Think on it, would you? Okay.

Okay. I think it's because then it would be like, I don't even have a loofah. I have nothing in there in my shower that could become a happy little home for a spider. I think that's what it is. That's what it is? Yeah. There's no loofah in there. There's no, yeah.

Okay. No. My arachnophobia origin story took place in a shower. Yeah. But so now you're not giving yourself the most thorough cleanse possible? I lather up pretty good with my hands. I don't know. Let me tell you what happens in my shower.

Okay. Wash cloth. 12 spiders in it at all times. Yeah, obviously. I take bar soap. Rub, rub, rub. I do the same thing. I start up high.

Do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do. I use a shower gel. Okay. All right. Hold on. Okay. Hold on. All right. Wait on. Okay. Hold on. All right.

Wait, you do multiple washes? Yes. On your body? Well, I'm giving you the routine, ma'am. Sorry. Other people are like, could we get to the story? No. No.

We can't. Then I use an unscented liquid soap for my sensitive vagina and butthole. Yeah. I've been considering moving to an unscented for the downstairs. Yeah. I highly recommend it. Okay. Then what do I do?

You ask with bated breath. Yeah. I get out my loofah. It also has spiders in it. I put on my scented shower gel because i feel like the bar soap that gets me clean yeah the scented yeah you know that kind of like you know moisturizes me a little that's probably not what it actually does but i use that okay thoroughly i also have a little scrubby brush for my feet and i scrubby scrub you are taking a way more thorough shower

than i am you know what i even left something out because I felt like I was telling too much. I also have this bar soap that is supposed to lighten dark spots. So I go through with that in certain places. And I have an exfoliant. On your butthole? Actually, yeah. Man, you try to class up a story. You try.

I know you too well. You fucking try. I know exactly where you're putting that. And you couldn't keep it to yourself, could you? No. So I do that, if you must know. Okay. And then I've got a body scrub.

And I scrub-a-dub-dub on certain areas that shan't be mentioned. scrub-a-dub-dub on certain areas that shan't be mentioned. Okay. And then at the very end, I take the shower head off. I turn the water pretty cold because I have burned the shit out of my labia in the past. Okay. You got a real sensitive labia, it sounds like. Well, I like a really hot shower. I do, too.

I take a really fucking hot shower. So, yeah, I mean, it's like treating it like a lobster, you know? Yeah, okay. So, anyway, I just, it's like treating it like a lobster, you know? Yeah, okay. So anyway, I just blast my nether regions. You are really doing a very thorough cleaning. I don't have kids. I've got all the time in the world. Yeah, I don't think I have the time for a shower quite that.

I think I will try it, though. Anyone, if you're like, should I have kids? Think about this. Like, how thorough do you want your shower to be? Yeah, that is a nice thorough shower. I feel real fancy when I do it. I bet you do. Wow. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So in conclusion, your butthole's cleaner than mine. Would you like to eat a turkey club out of my butthole? No, thank you. But thanks for the invite wow that's gosh the whole

point of telling you all that was so that you'd say yes okay well that's devastating okay let's go back to your story okay so we we've just found out that the dna on oh yeah i remember yeah the dna on the snow brush is a match uh-huh and so with that information and then the information about the blanket, while it doesn't tie Daryl Littlejohn himself, it ties. It ties. It definitely came from his home. Exactly. So clearly he was involved in wrapping her in that. And also he's not involved in any kind of laundry situation.

So we can't rule him out of any kind of laundry crimes. Yeah, absolutely. in any kind of laundry situation. So we can rule him out of any kind of laundry crimes. Yeah, absolutely. And so with that information, he was arrested and he was charged with the first degree murder of Emet Sankian. Let's break for an ad after that tangent. Sorry. Doodaloo.

Ad. Doodaloo. Doodaloo. Okay, so we've got him. We've burned the crusty blanket. Oh, gosh. Oh, yeah. Okay, so he's been arrested.

He's charged with a Mets murder. But now it's time for the investigators to kind of build their whole case against little John. And another victim came forward as they were doing this. Oh, wow. Her name was Sh Sine Woodard. She was a student who happened to be following Emmett's case in the news. And she saw images that were released of Daryl Littlejohn's van. Oh, shit. And so she came forward to police and told them that in 2005, Daryl Littlejohn had posed as a law enforcement officer and abducted her. Oh, my God.

So Sinead was walking home around 4 p.m. on one day in October of 2005, and she saw Daryl Littlejohn. He was wearing a law enforcement uniform. He had dark blue police pants on, a jacket, a cap, a belt, handcuffs, and a gun. The shirt, she said, appeared to have a police logo and the words fugitive agent on it. Okay, where the hell did he get that? No idea. All right. Great.

So Daryl stopped Shanae and asked her. I believe it's pronounced Shanae. I've not seen it pronounced. It's spelled. I'm sorry. I've not heard it pronounced. Obviously, I haven't seen it pronounced either, but I've not heard it pronounced. It's spelled S-H-A-N-A-I.

Okay. So he stopped her, asked her for identification, and then handcuffed her with her hands behind her back and then pushed her into his van. Oh, gosh. She knew something was obviously wrong. Yeah. Yeah. She managed to throw herself from the moving vehicle and call for help. Oh, my God.

How did she even do that? No idea. Okay. So when Daryl was arrested in a Mets case, she, you know, she recognized it, came forward to the police,

tells them this. So then police, obviously now that they have Daryl in custody, he's charged with the murder, they search his van. And they find Sinead's DNA in his van. Because this man's never cleaned anything in his life. They also found her DNA on some handcuffs that were recovered. Oh, my God. Yep.

Holy shit. Yeah. So he's in custody awaiting trial for a Mets murder during this time. She comes forward. They find out this whole case. They end up charging him with this. And in 2008, while he's still awaiting trial, he was convicted of kidnapping and unlawful imprisonment of Shanae Woodard. Wow.

And he was sentenced to 25 years to life. So did he go to trial for that? Yes, there was a trial for it. Yes. I didn't find much coverage of it. But yes, like everything just says he went to trial. He was convicted. He was sentenced to this all while he's still awaiting trial for a Mets murder.

Okay. Finally opening arguments in Daryl Littlejohn's first degree murder trial were given on May 11th 2009. The prosecution told the jury that Daryl Littlejohn was a sex fiend. He told them what you don't like that? No. Yeah. Why? Because, morons, it's 2009. Rape is not sex. Yeah, you should know by now. Yes.

That those are not the same thing. They're not the same thing. Okay, anyway. Yes, absolutely. I guess I don't need to call them morons. Prosecutor Kenneth Taub told the jury he did the same thing to two other women three months before. So there's another victim as well that's going to come out during this trial. You're kidding me. No, it's nuts.

He said until this case, he got away with it. And then just briefly in the opening statement, he laid out the evidence they have against Daryl Littlejohn, the DNA evidence, the blanket, the fibers. So it's interesting. I heard another place talk about how like a lot of this is considered circumstantial evidence. I think the DNA is not circumstantial. And the fibers from his house don't really feel circumstantial either. No. No, this doesn't feel circumstantial to me. Kind of creepy. A couple of sources talk about like,

evidence was fairly circumstantial, but there's a whole bunch of it. No. Exactly. That's how I feel. No. Yeah. You're the last person we know of who's seen her alive. Your van was spotted where her body was

dumped she's wrapped in a blanket from your house definitely from your house there are your dna is on her yeah fibers from your carpet from your house on the tape that was used to suffocate her. It seems pretty open and shut. I agree. Fun little tactic the defense took at trial. Is it fun or is it going to be horrible? No, no, no. It's fun. Because I don't think you hear about this with men very often.

What? They pulled a Jodi Arias. What did they do? They had him dress like almost like nerdy at trial. What? They pulled a Jodi Arias. What did they do? They had him dress like almost like nerdy at trial. And they had him wear glasses, which he never was known to wear. Uh-huh. Yeah. Well, that can't possibly work.

Are you serious? Mm-hmm. It was an effort to make him look less menacing during the trial. All right. I've never heard of it. Yeah, that's funny. You really don't hear of people doing that for men. Men doing that.

Absolutely. Okay. You hear about pretty frequently with women. Sure. Yeah. Okay. The defense was headed up by Joyce David. She said, this is interesting.

She said this was a racially charged frame up by police eager to close a blockbuster case. So Daryl Littlejohn is black. Uh-huh. And she says that that's the whole reason that they selected him. He's a black man with a long criminal record. Who's going to care about him? Well, but his DNA is all over her

and she's wrapped in the blanket from his house. Right. I think it's a good defensive take. I think we don't have anything. I guess it depends. Because this is something that happens in our justice system.

Well, of course it does. It happens a lot. But it's and it's a great argument. Yes, that's what I'm saying. No, hang on. No, it's a great argument. If there's not a ton of evidence that backs it all up. There's a ton of evidence that backs this all up.

Because it was framed and also by all those other women too yes everyone it's a giant conspiracy exactly what she said racially she didn't say giant i'm sorry racially charged frame up by police eager to close a blockbuster case yeah they even went so far as to get his mom's pube with the bulb attached and put it on a blanket. They went too far, I say. I do say that's too far in that semen.

12-year-old, 12-year-plus old semen. They didn't have to, but they went there because this was an epic framing. Yeah. All right. You hate it.

You know, it's... I just don't think... You're right. You got to say whatever you... You got to say what you can say. You got to say something. You got to say what you can say. There's not a lot you can say when there's this much evidence against your client.

Okay, fine. It's a a lot you can say when there's this much evidence against your client. Okay, fine. It's a fine argument. Oh, my God. So the jury did hear about the attack on Shanae. She testified about all of it. Oh, wow. Okay.

She testified about the whole story. The jury was told about Daryl's conviction in her case and how he was serving 25 years for it. Yeah. Did she admit to being part of the framing? No. No word on that. She didn't admit that, huh? No. Wow, that's too bad.

They also heard that the same month that she was attacked, that another student was attacked. Oh, my God. In that case, a 22-year-old woman was approached by Daryl Littlejohn as she exited the subway in Queens. Again, this woman believed he was a law enforcement officer because he was dressed similarly to how he'd been dressed when he approached Shanae. I'm so worried that's not how she pronounces her name now, and I'm so sorry if I'm getting it wrong. It could be Shanae. Do you think it's Shanae. I'm so worried that's not how she pronounces her name now, and I'm so sorry if I'm getting it wrong.

Could be Shanae. Do you think it's Shanae? I mean, I have no idea. So he approached this other woman. Her name has never been released, this other victim, though I do believe that she testified at trial. Okay. Said that she believed he was a law enforcement officer based on his outfit.

He asked for her identification, and he cuffed her with her hands behind her back. Oh, my God. And then she was pushed into a vehicle and she was driven on Queens Boulevard towards Jamaica, Queens. At some point, he stopped driving. He covered her head with a jacket and she was taken out of the car and into a room. A black knit cap was taped to her face. She was handcuffed to a bed and she was raped. Holy shit.

After she was sexually assaulted, Daryl Littlejohn made her rinse her mouth with alcohol and mouthwash. Okay. And then he released her. Wow. And it wasn't until Amet's murder and his face was everywhere that she was able to come forward and say this had happened to her. Yeah. I believe she reported it at the time, but they weren't ever able to make an identification.

Yeah. You know, we hear about these things sometimes where someone gets raped and then the attacker is like, okay, you can go.

I mean, my God. Yeah. So the prosecution says, I don't even know. Exactly. So the prosecution says these two incidents show that this is Daryl's M.O.

Yeah. And he's and he's escalating. And the fact that these two women were released was because they couldn't identify him. But a Met could. She knew where he worked. OK, so it's not that he's escalating. It's just that it's that she would have been able to go to the police and say the bouncer from this bar did this to me. He didn't have that fear with the other woman because she knew where he lived? No, she didn't know. Oh, he didn't take her to his. I think he did take her to his home. But then he when he I don't think he released her like out the door and was like, take off.

I think he took drove her somewhere and. Yeah. Dropped her. Yeah, I don't think she ever knew where she was. God, that's even more terrifying. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. This guy's the fucking worst. Uh-huh.

Yeah. So the prosecution laid out... prosecution? A lot of people don't pronounce the H. The prosecution laid out for the jury how they believed this happened. They said that after Daryl was asked to escort Amet from the bar, he abducted her, took her home to the basement of his queen's home, attacked her, wrapped the tape around her face and head, bound her wrists and ankles. And that during that whole thing, Amet had fought for her life. Yeah.

Broke her fingernails. That whole thing, Amet had fought for her life. Yeah. Broke her fingernails. They even, I think, mentioned at one point that maybe her hair had been a result of her fighting with him. There's no way to know for sure. And that they believed that Daryl's blood had gotten on those ties from a nosebleed. As I already said, he was prone to nosebleeds. It's possible that she hit him in the face as well during this altercation.

And that when he was questioned by police he also had scratches on his neck yeah they showed the jury all the cell phone data that they had that placed him at the area where emet's body had been found the security guard night watchman whatever testified about seeing the van there and how, you know, they showed that it was Daryl Littlejohn's van. And they talked about all of the fiber evidence as well. I mean, there's plenty of evidence here in this case. But it's all circumstantial. I just don't think it is.

It's all part of a frame job. There was also something about there being rabbit hair and mink fur on the items. rabbit hair and mink fur on the items. And like there was apparent like things in the home that were made of rabbit fur and mink fur. Yeah. OK. Because he lives in his grandma's house. Because he lives in his fucking grandmother's house. I tried to tell you.

Yeah. Yeah. Mm hmm. I bet he was covered in doilies too. Probably. So the prosecution rests their case announced the defense's turn and they're like, this is – it's all a setup. Daryl is innocent. Defense attorney Joyce David claimed that Daryl was framed so that the real perpetrator could be protected.

And that person was – Who's the real perpetrator? Daniel Dorian, the manager of the Falls Bar. Well, yeah, that guy's a piece of shit. No doubt about it. He should not have hired that guy. Yeah. And he shouldn't have lied about it.

Right. But no. See, he was part of a really powerful family that had ties to Mayor Rudy Giuliani. Goes all the way to the top, Kristen! All the way to Rudy Giuliani! And the courtyard by Mary. Wow, Brandy. Were you pretty excited by that?

No! I know how much you love Rudy Giuliani. Stop it. With his shoe polish running down his face. Yeah, can you believe that? That's the whole, like, yeah, this is all part of a big cover-up because the Dorian family is very connected. They're connected all the way to Mayor Rudy Giuliani. Honestly, if you're going to say this is a vast conspiracy, why not?

You'd be dumb not to. All right. Yep. Yeah. The defense said that Danny Dorian may have accidentally killed a Met after a night of sexual domination play and then asked his family to help him cover it up. Sure. And so then they framed Daryl Littlejohn. Okay. Danny Dorian did testify at the trial and he acknowledged that he was not initially forthcoming in the investigation. But that was because he was worried about the bad publicity that the bar would receive, not because he was covering up a murder. Oh, that's so funny.

I thought I thought it was only about the liability aspect. But, yeah, I mean, with his dad's experience. Yep. OK. Yep. Okay. Yep. Yeah, he denied being involved in a Mets murder in any way. Okay.

The jury deliberated for seven hours. You're kidding me. Six men, six women. And they found Daryl Littlejohn. Guilty, guilty, guilty. Guilty. Yes.

Are they holding out for lunch? I mean, what's their time? I know. I think it's kind of a long time. Yeah. Well, you probably got a lot of forms to get through. Might. Okay.

Yeah. Yeah. At sentencing, Judge Abram. No, sorry. Judge Abraham. It's a pretty common name, Brandi. Why can I not say it? It's Abraham. it's just abraham that's not a weird name abraham are you sure i'm positive the first a is silent what i don't know is how to pronounce

his last name let's hear it smith gerges gerges spell. G-E-R-G-E-S. Gurgis. Gurgis? Gurgis. I don't know. Gurgis. Okay. Judge Abraham told Emmett's family, I hope that the conclusion of these proceedings today

will provide you with some small measure of solace. Then the judge spoke directly to Daryl Littlejohn and called him an unrepentant predator who should never taste freedom again. And he sentenced him to life in prison without the possibility of parole. Yeah. Yep. The judge said that Emet was a promising woman who never deserved to die and said, if there were truly justice in this world, I would have the power to bring her back to you. That's what he said to Amet's mother and sister. Yeah. He concluded with, to my great sorrow, that is not possible.

It really is so sad. It's so sad. Little John's sentence will be served consecutively to his 25-year sentence for the kidnapping of Shanae. You just wonder what the real number is on how many times he did that. Oh, my gosh. Right? Yeah, because you know. You know it's not even. This is not even close to all the victims. No.

Absolutely. This is not even close to all the victims. No. Absolutely. So he'll have to serve those 25 years and then he starts serving his life without parole. So he's in Attica forever. All right. What?

I'm just thinking, you know, if he did a lot of these in a police uniform, that especially makes you wonder how many victims were like, well, I can't report this to the police. Yep. Exactly. It's hard enough to report a sexual assault as it is, but then you think you've been assaulted by the police. Yep. Holy shit. Yep. He did appeal his conviction on the grounds that those— But I bet Rudy Giuliani put an end to that.

Stop it. On the grounds that his previous bad acts should not have been allowed to be mentioned. I was kind of surprised that they were mentioned at trial. But in 2013, an appeals court upheld his conviction. They said, we conclude that while some of the challenged evidence was improperly admitted, the error was harmless and did not deprive the defendant of a fair trial. Yeah. There was enough without it. It was not the reason that he was convicted.

And then they made the kind of unusual decision. They did not make him a dildo and tell him to sit on it and spin. What? Oh, my God, Brandy, that's disgusting. What the hell are you talking about? Oh, my God. This case did start a big conversation in New York City about the safety of nightclubs and bars and the process that bouncers have to go through to get hired. And so they made some stiffer laws. Well, what's frustrating to me about that is it sounds like they had some good laws. There already were guidelines in place and they just didn't follow them. Yeah.

Yes. So it really comes down to the fucking bar manager. Yeah. Are they following the rules or not? Right. So they did pass a Mets law, which enhanced those requirements and failure to comply with them will result in a bar losing their license. Oh, good.

Yes. Okay. Now that's. Yes. Okay. Now that's. Yes. All right. I think probably it was art. I don't know. How is that not already the rule?

Like. I don't know. Okay. And it looks like several cities right after that followed. And then I believe it's like a nationwide law now. Okay. A federal law? That's right. No, Nationwide is on your side.

You don't even know how hard I had to fight myself to not say is on your side as soon as you said Nationwide. A scholarship in a Met's name is in place at John Jay College of Criminal Justice for second year students. It awards $12,500 a year to a student studying criminal justice. That's cool. Yeah. Her family also started a foundation afterwards. I wasn't able to find anything on it currently operating, so it looks like maybe it's not so round. It takes a lot of money to

it's really difficult yeah okay yeah and that is the story of the murder of amet sankian that's awful yeah oh i saw some stuff in like some coverage at the time. There was a lot of like victim blaming stuff about a met being out alone at four o'clock in the morning. Even some comments about how she was dressed that night. Like, fuck yourself. People are allowed to drink. They're allowed to get drunk. Yeah.

You know, we're not allowed to do? Rape and murder people. Rape and murder them. Exactly. And also I read some stuff about her best – about her friend Claire just having horrible guilt for leaving her that night. Like you didn't do anything wrong. No. No.

Someone murdered her. That's the person who did the wrong thing. Yep. Yeah. Ugh. Yeah. Oh. Yeah. I think that would be, I mean, I think. No, you couldn't help but feel awful.

Feel awful about it. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Especially in a culture where we're blaming the victim so much. Why not blame yourself as well? Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah.

No, it all falls on this disgusting, terrible man who's never heard of a washing machine. Right. Should have been charged with that, too. I know. Is there a crime for that? There has to be. Seems like there should be. 12 plus year old semen.

No. I won't hear of it. I will not discuss it any further. But you know what I will do? I will go to our Discord and take some questiones from the people. Everyone, if you're wondering how to get into our Discord,

well, it's a pretty good time. All you got to do is sign up for our Patreon at the $5 level or higher. At that level, you also get access to all of our bonus episodes immediately. And you get into the Discord, and every week we're like, Hey, we're recording. Do you have any questions from us? For us. Whoops. Not from us. How embarrassing.

That's so embarrassing and so they ask the questions and we answer some of them and here we go oh my gosh okay bob marimo asks if you were pushed down a well what would be your escape strategy i think about this sometimes you do yeah i i actually do too is this a weird thing? Do people think about this? I don't know. I just know that there's no chance I'm climbing the walls. Not with that attitude, you're not. No, I think I die in the bottom of the

wall. You do? I mean, okay, is the bucket down there with me? No, bucket's up. Bucket is up. You're down there. You, is the bucket down there with me? No, bucket's up. Bucket is up. You're down there. You can see the bucket and you're like, man, I wish I would have grabbed that on my way down. Okay.

So I start by hollering. Yeah. Yes. I mean, that's obviously my strategy. I'm yelling and fucking yelling. Yeah. Okay. This is where my long limbs might help me.

Yeah. If I can starfish and then scoochie-woochie-wooch up. I think there's a real chance that you could do that. I think there is, too. Yeah. Somehow that seems easier than, like, trying to find a slippery rock to grab onto. Oh, yeah. No, you got to do the, yeah, that's how you got to do it.

You're going to have to do, you're going to have to spider climb the wall, crab climb. Yeah. Yeah. I just, I'm it. You're going to have to do. You're going to have to spider climb the wall. Crab climb. Yeah. Yeah. I just. You just. Maybe. Maybe I get enough adrenaline. I get like that superhuman strength thing and I can do it.

I can tell by the look on your face. I don't have a lot of confidence that I'm getting out of that well. You've already given up. It's kind of how I feel about a zombie apocalypse. There's just not a chance I'm surviving that. I'm not made for that. No, that's a different thing. A different thing entirely. Here's the thing about a zombie apocalypse. I don chance I'm surviving that. I'm not made for that. No, that's a different thing. It's a different thing entirely.

Here's the thing about a zombie apocalypse. I don't want to see that. Yeah, me either. I don't want to live that life. Goodbye. Now, if I get out of the well, it's just normal life. So, yeah, I want to go back to that. And I want to take my long, luxurious showers.

Yeah. Yeah. I am very intrigued. I'm going to have to do your shower routine, I think. You Mm-hmm. Yeah. I am very intrigued. I'm going to have to do your shower routine, I think. You don't have the time. I don't. I want to try it, though. Oh, this is wonderful.

Dop and Ditz has a business idea for us. Oh, okay. Let's open a fruit stand named Bobby Cherry and sell Billy Wafers. Okay. You know what I've thought about? Uh-huh. So, everyone, Norm is doing some work for the podcast. I want him to do for us a compilation of every business idea we've ever had on the podcast.

Oh, my gosh. Yes. Wouldn't that be – We've had some good ones. Oh, they're all good. Yeah. They're all gems. And the best thing is I envision, you know,

this would, it would be quite a long compilation because we've had some gems. Yeah. I want people to start businesses inspired by our wonderful ideas. Absolutely. Subaru clits, they're happening. I mean, how have they not happened already? That's a genius idea. The only thing stopping it from happening is Norm hasn't created the compilation for us. Okay. And the right person hasn't heard it. Hmm. Julie Chka wants to know, Brandy, you've previously said you go to the bathroom to fart.

Does this include sitting on the toilet? And if so, do you flush the fart? I will save my follow-up environmental impact questions for after your answer. Thank you. No, I save them until I go to the bathroom. Okay. No, I don't go to the bathroom just to fart. So you're just sitting on a cloud.

I don't have to fart that much. I also am very used to having to hold going to the bathroom because of my other job. I work at the salon all day. I'm very busy. I don't have time for bathroom breaks. And so I think it's just like the natural state my body has taken on. Are you saying you've got the tightest butthole this side of the Mississippi? That's what I'm saying.

That's what I'm saying. Okay. Yeah. Nothing's squeaking out of you. No. Well, that's very interesting. Thank you for answering the question. You're welcome.

Oh, oh my gosh. I hate this question. What is it? Lesbot wants to know, would you rather have slugs for fingers or always be naked from the waist down? Porky pigging it. Slugs for fingers. I have to take slugs for fingers.

Yeah. How am I going to do my job? Am I going to learn to use my slugs? No one is going to get their haircut from a woman with slug fingers. If I wear gloves and nobody knows I have slug fingers. Oh, they're going to know. No, they just think I have like a... You've got limp, weird fingers.

Yeah, I've got something wrong with me. And nobody wants to talk about it. They want to be respectful. You think that you're going to give good haircuts with slug fingers? No, just become a full-time podcaster. Yeah, I think I'd have to give up the— That's the obvious answer. Yeah, I think I'd have to give up the—

Fucking weirdo. The hairstylist career if I had slug fingers. I'm seeing a lot of questions about what London's going to be for Halloween, so I do have an update. We talked about this on last week's episode. We're doing a family theme, Super Mario, but we hadn't nailed anything down yet. We've nailed it all down. So, London

is being Princess Peach. Jackson is being Wario. I just got both their costumes. They're here. They've tried them on. They look amazing. And David and I are being Bowser and Dry Bones, but I just got us their costumes. They're here. They've tried them on. They look amazing. And David and I are being Bowser and Dry Bones, but I just got a sweatshirt that have the characters on them. So, yeah. And you think that's good enough? I do.

I think it's pretty good. That is good. That's really cute. Ooh, Scale of One to Thumb asks, Kristen, what's the oldest beauty product you still have and use? Is it the Sex Dungeon lip gloss? Well, no, because you got a new one. What do you have? Oh.

What? I think I know what it is. How could you possibly know? It's the lipstick from your wedding. Well, I don't still use that. Okay. Then why do you keep holding on to it? Memories.

Well, I don't still use that. Okay. But you still, then why do you keep holding on to it? Memories. No, I'm trying to think of like what I've got that I am like actively using. Okay. For, hmm. See, the problem is like I bought a lot of this stuff a long time ago.

You got a lot of old shit. So who's to know? Okay, I think, I believe in Christmas of 2020, my mom got me the big hula bronzer. Oh, yeah. Yeah, it's a good bronzer. I love that bronzer. That's not that old. No. And I'm going to have it for a long time.

You've barely. No, I've hit pan. Okay. But just in the middle. Just in the middle. That's a big thing, a bronzer. It is a big thing, a bronzer. It's going to be with me for a long time.

Ooh, Tickle Bitties wants to know, Brandy, have you gotten into sports betting now that it's legal in Kansas? Any big wins? I do not do sports betting. I could not care less about it. And I love sports. But David does sports betting. Yeah, he loves it. And then he tries to tell me about it.

And then what happens? My eyes kind of glaze over a little bit. Oh, wow. Okay. What? Okay, this is not anything that I've not told him, so he will not be surprised by this at all. But it's like, I bet $1.12 on this, and look, I got $4. It's too low stakes for me.

It's not. This is a terrible thing for me to think, and yet I can't help myself. What? In my fantasy. Yeah. You know, he's trying to tell you about these sports bets because he's so into them. He loves it. He follows a bunch of stuff

as recommended stuff. And you keep being like hey, it's great that you're into it. I just really don't want to hear it. And he's like, but, and you're like, really I don't. Just do your thing. I don't say that. I listen. This is my fantasy.

Okay, your fantasy. So don't say that. I listen. No, this is my fantasy. Okay, your fantasy. All right. And so that's how this starts. Then one day, the cars are gone. And you can only blame yourself because he's like, I wanted to tell you. He's like, I've been trying to tell you. I've been desperately trying to find a way to tell you. But then I remembered.

She said to do my own thing. She doesn't want to hear about it. He's a very responsible sports bettor. Yeah, for now. He bets very small amounts. But then you say, I don't want to hear about it. Yeah. And he keeps going and going.

And next thing you know, there's some guy in a sweatsuit on my front step breaking my kneecaps. I almost said jumpsuit, but jumpsuit's not the right word. Tracksuit is the word I was looking for. He's in a romper. No, he's not a romper. And you're like, are you in a romper? And then before you know it, boom! Your knees are done-zo.

And it's all because you couldn't pretend to be interested in sports betting. I hope you've learned something. I have so learned my lesson here today. Should we move on to Supreme Court inductions? We shall. Everyone, to get inducted onto this fabulous podcast, all you have to do is sign up for our Patreon at the $7 level or higher. This week, we are reading your names

and your first celebrity crushes. Ooh, it's about to get so steamy. Emma Irene. Chad Michael Murray. Oriana Zeiss. Spider-Man. Not one of the actors who played him, just Spider-Man.

Excellent. Cassie King. Mike Vitar, a.k.a one of the actors who played him, just Spider-Man. Excellent. Cassie King. Mike Vitar, a.k.a. Benny the Jet. Benny the Jet Rodriguez! Krista Lee. Kevin from Backstreet Boys. Brianna. Nick Carter.

Beth Outlaw. Luke Perry. Beboop. JTT, of course. Duh. Rochelle. Pacey. Is it Pacey? Yeah, Pacey. I'm sorry.

I never watched Duff. It's Joshua Jackson. Oh, why did you say Joshua Jackson? We know him. Nikki. Peter Steele. The lead singer of Type O Negative. I'm not familiar.

Not familiar at all. Andy R. Twiggy. Lake. Sabrina Carpenter as Maya in Girl Meets World. Little me wanted to both be her and be with her. I'm now a traumatized artsy gay, so I guess it worked out. Girl Meets World, was that a thing?

Yeah, that's where they're all grown up and it's their kids now. Oh, okay. Yeah, I see. Yeah, I see. Caitlin Outland. Nick Carter again. Goodness. Kayla Dolly. Ryder Strong. Lindsay I see. Now I see. Caitlin Outland. Nick Carter again. Goodness. Kayla Dolly.

Ryder Strong. Lindsay Iden. Nick Jonas. Brandi Nauman. Michael Ely. Maddie Grace. Zac Efron. Natalie Findel.

Nicki Minaj. Bobby Thompson. Leonardo DiCaprio. Welcome to the Supreme Court! Thank you, everyone, for all of your support. We appreciate it so much. If you're looking for other ways to support us, please find us on social media. On Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, Patreon.

Please remember to subscribe to the podcast wherever you listen. And then head on over to Apple Podcasts and leave us a five-star rating and review. Then be sure to join us next week when I'll be an expert on a whole new topic. And she's pretty sure about it. Podcast adjourned! And now for a note

about our process. I copy and paste from the best sources on the web and sometimes Wikipedia. So we owe a huge thank you to the real experts. I got my info from an episode of New York Homicide,

ChillingCrimes.com, Oxygen.com, NBC News, The New York Times, The Court Record, and Wikipedia. For a full list of our sources, visit LGTCpodcast.com. Any errors are, of course, ours, but please don't take our word for it. Go read their stuff.