Let's Go To Court! - 273: A Foreclosure

Episode Date: October 18, 2023

Nicholas Firkus couldn’t believe what he was hearing. It sounded like someone was downstairs, trying to break into his home. So he woke his wife, Heidi, asked her to call 911, and grabbed his shotgun. The couple moved quickly, hoping to get downstairs and out the back door before the person broke in. But they didn’t make it. To hear Nick tell it, the intruder broke in and wrestled him for control of the gun. The gun went off twice — hitting Nick and Heidi in the process. Heidi didn’t survive the shooting, so that left Nick to tell police what happened that morning. And now for a note about our process. For this episode, Kristin read a bunch of articles, then spat them back out in her very limited vocabulary. We owe a huge debt of gratitude to the real experts who covered these cases. In this episode, Kristin pulled from: “A Stranger in the house” episode of 20/20 “Second wife’s suspicions confirmed with ex-husband’s arrest for murder,” by Blue Browning, Brooke Strangeland, Meghan Mariani, Lexi Leib, Greta Morris, Ivan Pereira for ABC News “Nicholas Firkus gets life sentence for wife Heidi’s murder he blamed on intruder,” by Mara H. Gottfried for the Pioneer Press “Husband locked up for life after blowing away first wife with shotgun, blaming murder on nonexistent Black man, remarrying,” by Matt Naham for Law and Crime “State of Minnesota vs. Nicholas James Firkus” court document “Husband sentenced to life in prison in wife’s 13-year cold case murder,” by Brooke Strangeland for ABC7NY “How was the Heidi Firkus case closed after so long? Meet the trio who did it.” by Mara H. Gottfried for the Pioneer Press “Nicholas Firkus found guilty of murdering wife Heidi Firkus,” by Nick Ferraro for the Pioneer Press YOU’RE STILL READING? My, my, my, you skeezy scunch! You must be hungry for more! We’d offer you some sausage brunch, but that gets messy. So how about you head over to our Patreon instead? (patreon.com/lgtcpodcast). At the $5 level, you’ll get 52+ full length bonus episodes, plus access to our 90’s style chat room!  

sniff my butthole patty patty patty i was framed by that recording patty i'm so sorry for kristen's behavior brandy said it to me and Patty, if you listen back, you can hear the question mark on that statement. You gotta save that. Oh my gosh. Here's the deal, Patty.

Brandy farted. I did not fart. She farted. She blamed it on her chair but she can't make the chair make the noise again so you tell me what happened. Okay, and then

she wanted to deny the fart further, and so she invited us to sniff her butthole. And I was horrified, as I'm sure you are as well. Patty's gonna quit. Patty, I'm so sorry. Patty's gonna be like, I've put up with a lot. It's too much. I mean, technically, that is how the audio started. Really, I think that Norm is the culprit here. He's the one who hit record.

He didn't know I was going to say it right then, though. One semester of law school. One semester of criminal justice. Two experts. I'm Kristen Caruso. I'm Brandi Pond. Let's go to court. On this episode, I'll be talking about a foreclosure.

Ooh. Beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep but she can't make it. That's true. I can't duplicate it, so you'll just have to take my word that I didn't fart. Hmm, I don't know, gang. What do we think? Do we believe her? Yes. There's not a fucking chance I farted. Not a fucking chance.

You have no idea how much control I have over my butthole, ma'am. Could you be a circus performer? I think it is a foreign concept. I mean, obviously not one for kids. Listen, I think it's a foreign concept to you because you're rarely in it. Listen, you are rarely in a situation where you could not freely fart. You work at home.

You're at home 90% of the time. Right. But I don't fart in front of my dogs because I consider them coworkers. You do fart in front of your dogs. I guarantee it. You fart in front of me and I'm your coworkers. No, but I spend my time around clients. Like, I never, there's never a time when I could free fart.

I've got news for you, Tom Petty. That's who's saying free fall in line. That's correct. Okay, very good. I got news for you. Before I worked from home, I worked in an office setting. Okay? Okay. Now, I did sometimes for you. Before I worked from home, I worked in an office setting. Okay? Okay.

Now, I did sometimes let them. You told us that you farted in a bank once and thought nobody's going to know because I'm a hot one. I was hot. I was 22. You saw me at 22. Yeah. And I was in a line. Everybody, listen to this.

This is hot privilege. I couldn't get away with this today, but, man, I got away with it when I was 22. I was in a line. Everybody listen to this. This is hot privilege. I couldn't get away with this today. But, man, I got away with it when I was 22. I was 22. I was in Bank of America. I was in a long line. And it was me and a bunch of dumpy dudes. And I had to fart real bad.

And I looked at those dumpy dudes and I thought, I could release this bad boy into the wild. And no one's's gonna suspect you. Absolutely. And so I committed the perfect crime. I think about that sometimes because it's a little sad to know that like if I released a silent one people would be like It's probably her.

Probably her. She looks like she eats a lot of vegetables. It is funny to age and, like, get into new categories. Yeah. Like, I've got, oh, Midwestern mom energy. You don't have to be a mom to be a Midwestern mom. It's true. It's true.

People know they can come up to me in the grocery store and say, hey, can you get this off the Tala show? Yeah. And I'll be thrilled to help. So thrilled to help. Brandi, how are you doing? I mean, aside from the fart. There was no fart. Okay.

I'm doing wonderful. Yeah. Great. I invited you to stiff my butthole if you wanted to. To stiff your butthole? Sniff is what I meant to say. Yeah. That's not a very classy thing to offer to someone.

And I'll remind you, we're in a business setting. Okay, sure. Okay. All right. So, you know, just try to keep yourself in line. Okay. All right. Why don't you plug our Patreon, ma'am?

We have one, and it's awesome. There are 52 bonus episodes there now. That's right, folks. It's one of our weird weeks. We've recorded two episodes in

what feels like 12 hours. It does feel like 12 hours. But you know what? It's about to describe the episode we just covered. It's so depressing. It's a really dark episode. So don't you want to sign up? Yeah, sign up for our Patreon where you can listen to a really sad bonus episode.

Ruin that. Yeah. You got to balance it out by listening to our Patreon. Yeah. Anyway, you sign up. You get all the bonus episodes. So many bonus episodes. Yeah, so many.

My God. Hours upon hours of bonus episodes. I mean, it truly is. It really is. And you get all kinds of other things. If you want, you get access to the Discord to chitty chat the day away. You get access to our Zoom calls. That's right.

You can be on a Zoom call with us. my god yeah where we just talk about real life talk about nothing yeah i reenacted a viral video from 10 years ago what more could you want people demanded it i don't think they did. No one asked for it. And yeah, you get stickers. Stickers. Autographs. Woo. Add free episodes. You didn't mention whose autographs. It's a mystery. Anyway, yeah, sign up for that.

Won't you? Yeah, at patreon.com slash LGTC podcast. Woo. Whew. Alright. You ready to tell us about a, hold on, foreclosure? Yeah, I am. Okay. You don't look ready. What do you mean?

You're clicking stuff. Way to call my ass out. Okay, so well, if you must know, I was like, yeah, I am ready. And then I pulled up the document and I was like, why am I on page 15? I will quickly get to the right document I was like why am I on page 15 I will quickly get to the right place. Yeah don't start at page 15

we'll have no idea what's going on my co-host won't throw me under the bus except for she will and she'll fart on me while I'm down there no. Okay. There's a way bigger risk of you farting on me and you know that

to be true. Yeah. Like exponentially higher risk. All right. All right. Calm down. All right. Here we go.

Shout outs to, you know, I love 2020. Oh, okay. They had an excellent episode called A Stranger in the House. Also, really. I go old Ronnie Millsap. Who? He's an old country singer. Ronnie Millsap.

I only know him because he used to be on like an infomercial. Oh my God, of course. He had a song called Stranger in my House. Sing it. I don't remember. I can't remember the tune of it but the lyrics are there's a stranger in my house someone there that i can't see boy i am so glad that you took the time you're welcome into that tangent yeah the good thing is no one's ever mad about us going no never so feel free just any time yeah uh-huh if any if anything you know brings up a infomercial memory for me throughout the course of this i'll be sure to

bring it up okay also shout out to ron popeil no that's amazing no it's the court record. Oh, okay. And that reminds me of an old country song. Also reporting from the Pioneer Press. Oh. Did you see that I signed us up? I did. I did. Yeah. For $1, you could get six months of reporting. Amazing.

It sounds like a fucking deal, Pioneer Press in Minnesota. Is that where this case takes place? It'd be weird if it didn't. It would be. Mara Gottfried had, or I'm, ooh, Gottfriend. Friend. There's an N. But it sounds weird to say Gottfriend.

Sounds like she's some kind of spam. Don't you think? She was bragging because she's like. I'm pretty sure she's just a normal human reporter. Alright, here we go. Picture it. It was Saturday

April 24th 2010 and Heidi Furcus was at the most magical place on earth. It's my stepmom's birthday. Alright, calm down.

It's Lisa's birthday April 24th my god is there a country song you'd like to sing no no because you don't know the lyrics no you do i do the lyrics i can't remember the tune she was at the most magical place on earth on lisa's birthday what on midwest edition okay midwest edition magical magical place on earth midwest edition i know that sounds like a theme park yeah but it's not oh oh oh oh she's at the Okay, Midwest edition. Magical Place on Earth. Midwest edition. I know that sounds like a theme park. Yeah, but it's not.

Oh, oh, oh, oh. Is that the Mall of America? She sure is. Yeah. Yeah. I almost said not a theme park, but I remembered. There is a theme park inside. Now, it's not the best, but it's in a mall. Yeah.

So what are you going to do? Yeah. Gosh, I'd like to go to the Mall of America. It's been a while. Yeah. Let's go right now to do? Yeah. Gosh, I'd like to go to the Mall of America. It's been a while. Yeah. Let's go right now. I am busy telling this story. And you're clearly full of farts.

I'm not getting in a car with you. Stop it. She was there with her friend doing a little spring shopping. She spent a little over $200. It's not that much at the Mall of America. I agree. Should we explain the beauty of the Mall of America for those who aren't privileged like we are to have gone there a couple summers as kids? It's amazing.

It's a gigantic mall. Yeah. It has a full aquarium in it. It has an amusement park in it. I should say all of our information about this place is 15 years old at least. At least. No, longer than that. Hope they haven't made.

What? 15 years ago. Well, I don't only go with you. Were you there when you were 22? Yes, actually, I was. All right. The last time I was there, I was like 16. All right.

All right. Anyway, they have everyone. My memory from going there is brainy. Oh, that's not even true. What? I have been there as an adult. I won a work trip there. Yeah.

All right. Yeah. I didn't go to the aquarium or the amusement park, though. You're just shocked. I did go to the Jamba Juice. Did you go to any, like, stores or just the Jamba Juice? I went to a couple stores. Did you go to the As Seen on TV store?

I didn't. I was with other people. Oh, and they were really boring and uncool. Well, I didn't seem like they were interested in the As Seen on TV store. Did they? Okay. I've got questions, but it's so early in the show.

It's really early for a tangent. It's too early, I say to you. So stop asking if you went to BB. Is it Bebe or BB? I think it's BB. Yeah, I didn't go there either. Okay. I didn't ask because I'm not going on a tangent.

I did buy a pair of black, glittery, high-top sneakers. That's cool. At a store called Something Spring. And now I can't remember what it was, but they were awesome. Last time I was there, I bought a tube top at Forever 21. You did? Okay, when I was there when I was 16, I bought a plaid skirt, plaid pleated skirt. Hell yeah.

At Deb. Yes. Yes. All right, so we've established that we're really cool. Yes. Yes. All right. So we've established that we're really cool. Yes. Okay. So Heidi spent about $200, which you have said. That's not that much money.

Right. Well. Okay. But hear me out. Okay. That arguably wasn't the best decision. Heidi and her husband, Nick, were in a really bad position financially. They hadn't paid their mortgage in almost two years.

They had about $18,000 in credit card debt. Oh, gosh. Like 17 grand was on an REI credit card, which I did. Yeah. The camping store? Yeah. Which I guess you could really. You could rack it up. But I bet you can use it at other places. I guess you could really. You could rack it up. But I bet you can use it at other places. Okay. Yeah.

In just one year, they had accumulated more than $8,000 in overdraft fees. Oh, yikes. Right? But, you know, ladies be shopping. Did maybe, was Heidi maybe not aware of their, is that her name? Did I just make that up? No, you didn't make that up. Her name's Heidi. Was she maybe not aware of their financial Is that her name? Did I just make that up? No, you didn't make that up. Her name's Heidi. Was she maybe not aware of their financial situation?

Why do you say that? Well, I don't know. I mean, she's 25. Okay. What? Already? You're not trusting? I'm just one that seems like an odd choice to go shopping at yes

at the mall of america if you are in that kind of financial situation sure sure all right okay once heidi finished shopping she came back home to her husband nick and they had a nice evening at home because of course they did they were in their mid-20s. They'd been married for like four and a half years. And Brandy, I don't mean to step into your territory here, but they were the perfect couple. Oh, were they? Yes. They were members of Calvary Baptist Church in Roseville. And they'd actually met when they were in the church youth group together.

Oh. Nick and Heidi had an awesome group of very close friends. They were all married couples, all super involved in the church. In fact, they were so tight-knit that they had a nickname for their friend group. I think that's cool. What is it? It's The Core. Oh, like of an apple? I assume like hardcore friends, but that doesn't seem like i i don't they call themselves to the core all right all right they all had a lot in common they embraced the type of marriage that you know nature intended the type where the man is the head of the household don't let the liberal media tell you that you can have equality in a marriage. Okay, Brandy?

Mm-hmm. You can't be in charge of anything. Our lady brains can't handle it. Okay. I do like all of the finances in our house. Do you? Yeah. Mm-hmm.

One time as an experiment, I became the head of the household. Uh-huh. And I just vajazzled everything. Stop it. Because, you know, women can't be trusted. That's what I'm always saying. Okay. Anyway, so Heidi and Nick led youth groups at the church.

They took the kids on camping trips. They were very sweet and loving with each other. Now, they were a bit of a mismatch looks wise oh were they i say that because that's the kind of thing that i know my dad your dad would 100 said that was a very deep comment he's obsessed yeah with mismatched couples yeah he always thinks things will end very badly for a mismatched couple. Yeah. So Heidi, very attractive. Nick, kind of a mashed potato face. Is that?

No, no, no. Hang on. Hang on. I am not like my father. Well, I'm a lot like my father. Mashed potato face is maybe the best way your dad has ever described somebody on this podcast. He did say mashed potato face.

He did say mashed potatoes. There is a picture of the couple from around this time, and they're clearly at some kind of formal event. Okay. All right. They're in front of a beautiful old-timey brick building. I love this building. You know, ton of windows, English ivy growing up the sides. Heidi looks fabulous. She's in a black kind of vintage-y looking dress.

Waist snatched for the gods. And then there's Nick. Okay, I'm going to describe. I don't mean to be rude. Nick has on, can I guess? Please do. He has on khakis and a plaid shirt. Oh, interesting guess.

Okay. I'm going to give you a little more direction. Okay. Technically speaking, he is dressed correctly for this formal event. Oh. Technically speaking. Technically speaking. Okay.

So he does have on some form of suit. Yes. Then. Absolutely. But it's ill-fitting. Okay. He has on a suit. Uh-huh.

Got on the tie. You know, color coordinated. Sure. All right. He's got a boutonniere on. Okay. The suit is huge on him. Sure. All right. He's got a boot and ear on. Okay. The suit is huge on him.

Yeah. The pant legs pool at his feet. The suit jacket is long enough that he could remove his pants

and not show a bit of Don. He looks like the kid at the end of Big. Yes. Yeah. He sure does. Yeah.

I haven't gotten to the best oh okay what kind of shoes do you think he has on oh he might have a sneaker on go funnier oh um he's got crocs on you wish you fucking wish i i actually thought about that because i thought if someone asked me to guess the funniest shoe to pair with a suit, it would be a croc. Yeah. In reality, that's wrong. Okay.

A black croc would at least blend in a little in a photo. Potentially, yeah. Let me tell you what this grown ass man wearing a suit with a boot in here was wearing. A pair of Tevas. That's maybe the last thing I want to guess. Now I don't know for sure that they are like branded Tevas.

Okay, we will put this photo up on our social medias. Okay, let me pull up the photo. Okay, hang on. Just calm down, Brandy. I can't be calmed.

You know what? It's really hard for me to show you this without revealing too much. So I'm just not you're just gonna have to take my word for it. There's not a way

for you to cover whatever. Okay, there is. You have a notebook just going to have to take my word for it. There's not a way for you to cover whatever. Okay. You have a notebook right next to you. Put the notebook over it. Show me the fucking picture. Goodness gracious. Alright. Hang on. I love how you told me to calm down when I was very calm and then sensed

and I am incensed. Typical Brandy. Okay. Okay. All right. Now. What do we got? Okay. Oh.

Oh, yeah. Those might be flippies even. You think those are, they're not between the toe. He's got a wide toe gap then. Of all the things I thought you would notice about that photo. It's not that he hasn't. Look at his toe gap. Well, I mean.

He's got a real wide berth there. Okay. If that's what you want to focus on. He does. We call it mashed potato toe. Yeah, that is the last shoe that I would expect him to be wearing with that suit. Yes. Yeah, it is.

It does look like a like a Teva. OK, so I have no doubt that Nick's decision to wear Tevas with a suit had to be very tough for anyone who witnessed that outfit. Mm hmm. But Nick and Heidi had bigger things to worry about. Well, yeah, they're drowning in debt. Yeah. By the time Heidi got back from the trip to the mall, she and Nick were less than 48 hours away

from being thrown out of their home. Wow. They had a really cute house located in the Midway neighborhood of St. Paul. I've got the address if you want it. Fuck yeah, I want it. What do you mean? Calm down. Okay, it's 1794 Minnehaha Avenue, St. Paul. Oh, West, I should say. Just throw that in there any old where? Oh, where do you think it goes? 1794. Well, actually, Avenue West. Yeah, okay. Alright, fine.

It is cute. It's really cute. Oh, is it a duplex-y? I don't think so. Maybe I'm not looking at the right house. You might not be. Maybe you put the W in the wrong place. Don't you worry about where I put the W. Oh, I am on east. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Okay.

Sorry. Hold on. I hope you've learned a lesson. I have. I have. Turns out you do need to put that W in a very specific place. Mm-hmm. I would have put it before the Minnehaha.

Yeah. I would have too, honestly. Yeah. Oh, yeah. This is a very cute house. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Should we describe it in any way or no?

Yeah, it's just a cute. It's like a middle class house. It's got an enclosed front porch situation. Which I feel like I normally don't like enclosed. But in Minnesota, you really got to. Yeah. So they purchased the home in August of 2007. They'd paid $215,000 for it.

So, you know, they bought it kind of right before the bubble burst. Yeah. And they had two mortgages on it. Oh, gosh. OK. And they couldn't keep up with those payments. So it was a Saturday night and they were scheduled to be evicted that Monday. The sheriff lockout was scheduled for

Monday at noon. Heidi and Nick were so ashamed. In fact, they were so embarrassed by the fact that they were about to lose their home that they hadn't told anyone. Wow. They hadn't told their friends. They hadn't told their family. It was a secret that only Nick and Heidi knew. From the outside looking in, they were in serious denial. They were about to be forced out of their home, but they hadn't packed yet. Or made any arrangements for where to go. Nope, nope, nope, nope. Wow. Nope, nope, nope, nope. Wow.

Their plan, if you can call it a plan, was that the next day they'd go to church. Then they'd pack up their entire house, put some stuff in the garage, hoping they could come back for it later. And then at some point come clean to their friends and family and find out who would be willing to let them stay with them. Wow. This would be such a hard thing to go through. And then to do it secretly. Yeah, I can't imagine. The amount of stress.

I can't even imagine. Yeah. Wow. imagine yeah wow also um at some point on sunday heidi would be leaving for a pedicure her friend had said hey you want to get a pedicure on sunday or wednesday and heidi had chosen sunday okay so time was a-tickin'. And when Heidi got home from the mall on Saturday, what do you think she and Nick did? Not pack.

Not pack. They ordered takeout. I was going to say they ordered food. They ordered takeout, and they watched the movie Avatar, which sounds terrible, and they had some wine. And then they went to bed. You look so stressed. I am. Heidi is aware of this financial situation? Yep.

Okay. Pretty sure. Are you? Yeah. Okay. Because Nick says she was? Yeah. Uh-huh.

Yeah. Heidi's not going to survive, is she? That night, they went to sleep. Uh-huh. Yeah. Heidi's not going to survive, is she? That night, they went to sleep. Uh-huh. And the next morning at around 6.30, Nick woke up, went to the bathroom, got himself a glass of water, got back in bed. And, oh, he was just about to fall asleep when he heard a disturbing sound coming from downstairs. It sounded like someone was trying to break into their house. Mm-hmm.

Like they were frantically messing with the doorknob. So Nick flew into action. He woke Heidi up, and he told her what was happening. You know, someone's trying to break into our house. And then he ran for the closet. Don't make that face at me, Brandy. Time is a ticking. He had a shotgun that he used for hunting, but he kept it in the closet for security.

So he grabbed the gun and instructed Heidi to call 911. They waited for a little while, but then they decided, okay, we need to make a run for it. That was pretty scary. They were on the second floor, and someone was actively trying to break in, so they needed to run downstairs, go right past the front door, go out the back door, get to the detached garage, and drive away. Okay.

So with Heidi now on the phone with 911, Nick ushered her down the stairs. Heidi went down the stairs first and Nick followed behind her. He's got the gun and he's, oh no, uh-uh, uh-uh. Bullshit. I call bullshit right now. Bullshit. I call bullshit on the whole fucking thing. On what precisely?

Okay, first of all. On the joy of going to the Mall of America? First of all. If, okay, this is a religious family with very traditional gender roles. No. This man, armed with a gun, is not letting his unarmed wife lead down the stairs. So this whole thing is fucking bullshit. Heidi doesn't know

they're going to lose their house. She doesn't know about their financial situation because, again, traditional gender roles. He's the man. She doesn't question anything. This just fucking happened. This just fucking happened here in town. It did? Yes! What are you talking about?

Literally in the... Oh my gosh. Everyone, Brandy just exploded. Explained the fart from earlier. Brandy, I wish you'd been a detective on this case. I would also just jump in on the gender role thing. Because, yes, traditional gender roles are definitely present here. Yes.

I think we have to add in the fact that Heidi married this man when she was 20 years old. Yep. She was a child bride, much like yourself. Yep. But I would say, regardless of how liberal or conservative your situation is, the person holding the gun is the one who goes first. The gun goes first down the fucking stairs. Right? Yes. the person holding the gun is the one who goes first. The gun goes first down the fucking stairs. Right?

Yes. Now, he claims that he was going behind her with the gun to kind of scoot her along, you know, because she's just really dilly-dallying. Yes. Like, two weeks ago in Shawnee, a children's pastor

at the church I used to attend Okay. stabbed his entire family in the middle of the night a children's pastor at the church I used to attend. Okay. Stabbed his entire family in the middle of the night and then set the house on fire. Oh, okay. Because the very next day they were going to be kicked out by the sheriff because their home had been foreclosed on and he hadn't told anyone what was going on. Thankfully, in that situation, his wife and his children survived. What the fuck is wrong with these men?

I swear we have covered so many cases. Yes. Of these conservative men. Yes. Who keep these crazy secrets. Yeah. And then somehow convince themselves that, oh, the only way out of this is. Is to murder.

Yeah. Yeah. Anyway, but that's not what's happening here. Okay. So I don't know what brought you to that conclusion. So. Sorry for my outburst. Yeah.

Yeah. He's just trying to hustle her along. At gunpoint. Right. Right. And he's the good guy. So shut up. Okay.

Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Okay. So Heidi's. Okay. Right. And he's the good guy. So shut up. Okay. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Okay. So Heidi's. Okay. Sorry.

Heidi's on the phone with 911. Yes. He's ushering her down the stairs from behind. He's holding the gun. Yeah. She just needs to be able to get like an eyewitness account for the 911 call. That's why he wants her in front. You know, I don't think they really thought of it that way.

It's just, you know, it's a panic. Someone's trying to break in. Okay. Okay. All right. All right. Heidi told the dispatcher, someone's trying to break into my home. And she gave them the address. But 38 seconds into that call, there was a loud noise. It sounded like gunfire and the line went dead. 65 seconds later, another call came in to 911. This time it was Nick Furcus. He said, my wife is shot. Somebody broke into our house. I've been shot. Somebody broke into our house. I've been shot. Nick was in an absolute panic.

Within about seven minutes, emergency crews arrived at the home. They found the screen door open and the front door open, you know, about an inch. And inside, they discovered Nick and Heidi Furkus. Nick had been shot in the thigh, and Nick had been shot in the thigh and Heidi had been shot in the back. She was pronounced dead at the scene. Nick was understandably hysterical. But before he was taken to the hospital, he was able to tell police a few things.

He said that one or, gosh, maybe two people had broken into their home. He'd grabbed his shotgun and, you know, he and Heidi had tried to make a run for it. But as soon as they got down to the entryway, the person or people, you know, broke in. Yeah. And there was a struggle for the gun. And Heidi and Nick had both been shot during that struggle. Okay. I don't like your attitude.

Well, I think Nick is full of shit. I'm nervous to say that, though, because I've been wrong many times before on this podcast. I love it when you're wrong. Yeah, so that had happened and then the intruder or intruders, you know, who knows, fled the scene. Nick was rushed to the hospital, and in the meantime, investigators did their best to track down the person responsible for this crime. Mm-hmm. They talked to neighbors and, gosh. Nobody saw anything?

Well, they heard stuff. Okay, what'd they hear? Gunshots. Mm-hmm. No cars or anything leading up to that. Right, what a bunch of useless assholes. They brought in the canine unit and, gosh, those dogs must have sucked ass because they didn't track down a damn thing that's rude to say about the dogs well if they'd done a better job then i wouldn't have to

say it okay i'm not some kind of dog apologist all right all right you know even the crime scene itself didn't make a ton of sense how far did you think you'd get into this before I would call bullshit on it? I thought, and I'm not bragging, this is really what I thought. I knew that I would tell you how much Heidi spent at the Mall of America. Yeah. And once you found out about the financial situation,

you'd be like, no, no, no, no, no, no. But maybe we're both wrong. Maybe we both are. I don't think we are, though. Maybe us and those police dogs are all wrong. Okay, so the crime scene doesn't really make sense. You know, Nick had said he'd had this epic battle with the intruder. He sang the song from Chicago when he was...

Sing a little, Brandy. I don't remember. He was like... He reached for the gun. I don't remember! It's really hard sometimes to think of a song on the spot. Then maybe don't mention a song on the spot. Sorry. I thought maybe you'd just go with it and be like, oh yeah, he reached for the gun.

That's the line that they say over and over in the song. Anyway, that's when Renee Zellweger is talking about how she accidentally shot her lover. Wow, spoilers. Oh, wait, sorry. I thought he broke into the house. Yeah, and he reached for the gun. He sold us our furniture.

That's right. He gave us 10% off. So you do know. Maybe I am familiar. So I says to Amos, I says. Stop it. So yeah, they'd had this struggle for the gun, but the entryway did not look like the scene of a struggle. Nick and Heidi had a side table in their entryway and, you know, it had a couple of candles on it, a receipt, a pack of gum, a beer bottle, a water bottle, a potted plant, a crate and barrel catalog.

Nothing seemed to have been disturbed. Nothing was knocked over. Okay. Some things were askew. Heidi had a pair of shoes in the entryway, but to me it just looks like she walked in and took off her shoes. It doesn't look like. Yeah.

The important thing was that Nick pulled through. Not that you give a shit. I have accused him of a lot here. All right. The gunshot wound to the thigh was not life threatening. And so later that day, he went to the police station and was able to give investigators more information. But at this point, he was pretty sure that it was just one person who'd broken into their home that morning. He said that the person who'd broken in had been wearing a hoodie, you know, kind of pulled low over their face, and they'd been wearing gloves. And gosh, this person was tall, really tall, like 6'1", 6'2". Okay. He was black, maybe.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. That's wonderful. This imaginary intruder or assigning a minority race to them, that's great. What do you mean assigning? Someone breaks into your home. This is not real. This person is not.

Someone breaks into your home. It didn't happen. Shoots your wife, shoots you, politely doesn't knock over the stuff in the entryway table. You don't have control over that person's race brandy he's black maybe okay that's just the way the cookie crumbles okay all right so the interview lasted a couple hours and the investigator covered all his bases and at one point he asked nick whether he and heidi were in any financial trouble. How'd Nick answer that? He said yes.

Okay. He said, absolutely we are. Huge financial trouble, in fact. As a matter of fact, yeah. Yeah. He said they were being foreclosed on. They had to be out of the house by noon tomorrow. No one knew about it.

No one except for Heidi and Nick and now this investigator right here. Heidi didn't know. How is that possible, Brandi, for her to not know? Investigators talked to Nick and Heidi's friends and family, and Heidi's friends and family in particular were just stunned. They were all certain that if Heidi was about to lose her home, she would have said something to them. But I guess she hadn't. Because she didn't know. Frankly, that was the least of their worries.

You know, Heidi, this bright, funny, 25-year-old young woman, had been murdered in her home, and her killer was on the loose. had been murdered in her home and her killer was on the loose. The day after the murder, Nick and his parents met with Heidi's parents and Nick came clean about the foreclosure, the credit card debt, everything. And Heidi's parents, John and Linda Erickson, were shocked. But again, you know, in light of everything that had just happened, who cared about financial problems? Exactly. And so John said, they'll find this person, Nick. Don't worry. And Nick responded, they'll never find him.

Because he's not real. I made him up. My goodness. Aren't you going to feel terrible in a minute? Am I really? I don't know. You do know. Stay tuned. That had to be pretty jarring for Heidi's parents to hear. I mean, that'd be horrible. Yeah. Oh, yeah. But in fairness, Nick had a lot on his mind. He'd been very upset to learn that he was being looked at as a suspect in this case.

By me. By Brandy. Several years after the fact. Investigators and the media seemed to find it a little odd that his wife had been murdered the day before they were about to get evicted. Yes. They started asking rude questions like, hey, is it possible that Heidi didn't actually know that she and Nick were in financial trouble? Yes, I asked the same question. Nick's dad must have seen the writing on the wall because pretty quickly he hired Nick, a defense attorney.

Wow. I mean, that's a good move. I love the growth for you on this podcast. Yeah. In the early days of this podcast, anyone who hired a defense attorney was guilty as sin. Now, I absolutely don't believe that anymore. Yeah. Yeah.

Because you've smartened up. Yeah, absolutely. You know about wrongful conviction. Yes. Like poor Nick here about what's going to happen. I think I'm afraid to say anything. I love the discomfort. Like poor Nick here about, what's going to happen? I think I'm afraid to say anything. I love the discomfort.

Oh, boy, all right. The defense attorney, of course, advised Nick to stop communicating with the police. Yeah. When police asked Nick to come in to speak with a sketch artist. His lawyer told him, don't do it. They're just going to use that as an opportunity to interrogate you again, which, yeah, sure. Yeah, absolutely. So what do you do, Brandy? You're in this situation.

You're the one witness to this crime. Hmm. I think you go, but you bring your lawyer with you. I agree. That's what I would think you'd want to do. Yeah. Here's what they did instead. They decided to hire their own sketch artist.

That's a weird move. It is unusual. It's very unusual. Okay. They decided they would hire their own sketch artist and present that sketch to the police. So that's what they did. They hired a woman named Nancy Molnar and Nick went to her house and he gave her all the information she needed

to make her sketch. That's so fucking weird. What? You don't want these cops fucking with you? You don't need the aggravation? All right. Because you're a victim and really a hero because you tried to save your wife.

Am I standing behind her? From this maybe black guy. What? Nothing. Would you like to see the sketch? I sure would. I have to admit, I laugh every time I see it. Hang on.

Okay, let me pull it up. Folks, we will also put this sketch on Brandy's OnlyFans. Stop it. Okay. I'm going to cover part of my screen here. Okay. What? Okay, the police are going to see that and they're going to be like, this is not a real person.

Now, why do you say that, Brandy? Because it's almost cartoon character-y. Okay, so here's how I would describe this sketch. And I got to be honest, I think I am hitting the nail on the head here. Have you seen a black cabbage patch doll? Because you've seen this sketch. This is nothing against the artist but this sketch is hilarious. If this grown man broke into my home

I'd be like aww. So Nick and his attorney showed up at the police station with that sketch. And in a true show of Midwest politeness, the investigator unrolled the sketch and took a look at it. And he didn't even crack a smile. OK. And believe me, I watched. That's not to say that investigators weren't surprised. They'd never had anyone hire their own. No, it's weird as fuck. And also, is the movie Toy Story real now?

They released the sketch to the media and, you know, they got a couple tips, but none of them went anywhere yeah yeah that is the the difficult part of when you're doing a sketch of an imaginary person is making them look like a real person is pretty difficult that does not look like a real person oh really. Am I going to feel terrible? Maybe you are. Maybe you aren't. I'm so nervous right now. By this point, people were pretty divided.

Nick's friends and family were completely on his side. Of course. Like, I can absolutely see that i don't know man honestly okay family fine you you get a pass up till a point right okay but these friends were heidi's friends too yeah and you're telling me someone broke in the day before you were evicted. And Heidi, who I've known for however long to be very honest and not afraid to be vulnerable. And we've talked about hard stuff before. All of a sudden, I find out that she's been keeping this huge secret.

Also, she was very organized and she was a planner yeah no right right i mean i realize i'm being kind of an ass i would hate to be in that position of course i i still am kind of like how did the friends not second guess this a little right but you know so he had he had the support of his community but the lying media and the lying police were trying to pin this on him at some point heidi's family became suspicious of Nick. I'm not sure when that set in. But this narrative about her keeping huge secrets just didn't match up with the young woman they'd all known. Jolene Erickson, Heidi's sister-in-law, later said, Once you believe what Nick says, you have to trade in what we believe about Heidi.

Yeah. I feel like the story that Nick shares goes against everything that we know about Heidi's character. Right. Now, despite all this stress, Nick did find love again. How quickly? How quickly is too quickly? Well, I'm not the right person to answer that. A couple months. I didn't murder anyone, just for the record. I was going to say, yeah, I think it's a slightly different situation. It is. Not super different, but slightly.

Yeah. Yeah, just a couple months after Heidi was murdered, Nick began seeing someone new. Somebody he knew? No. Okay. But, you know. Someone from church? Obviously. Her name was Rachel Watson and she'd just left a really bad marriage, one that had left her with a lot of trauma. She'd moved back to Minnesota recently to be with her sister and her sister just happened

to have been really good friends with Nick and Heidi. So Rachel and Nick met, and they hit it off. Nick and Heidi's friends were a little conflicted. They feared maybe he wasn't really grieving Heidi's death. But at the same time, they wanted him to be happy. Of course. So as one of their friends told 2020, we made ourselves okay with the situation. That's a really good way to put it.

Yeah. Yeah. And I think, honestly, I think this is fairly common when someone dies. Like people sometimes move on quickly. So the friends are making themselves okay with it. And it's a good thing they did because Nick and Rachel got engaged. It was obviously a weird situation. With Nick under a fair amount of scrutiny, Rachel understood and really kind of was made to understand, thanks to Nick's parents, that they weren't supposed to talk about Heidi's death. Everything needed to be private.

Okay. Rachel respected that. And she respected Heidi's memory. Before she and Nick got married, she insisted on visiting Heidi's grave. She wanted to pay her respects and, you know, tell Heidi she wasn't trying to replace her. What? her respects and, you know, tell Heidi she wasn't trying to replace her. What? What happened with Nick's living situation, his finances following Heidi's death?

What do you mean? Well, so he was losing the house. Right. So did he have life insurance? Did Heidi have life insurance? No. Okay. All right.

So, all right, all right, all right, all right. Where is he living? You know, I don't honestly know where he moved after the eviction. But I do know that he got that debt paid off really quickly. He went through a financial program and he just got that taken care of. Was it Dave Ramsey's program? I would bet my butthole it was because, you know. You don't have a butthole to bet, so. That's a rude thing to say.

Very rude thing to say. But, yeah, the important thing is he got it all squared away. Okay. He returned all those canoes to REI. Mm-hmm. he returned all those canoes to REI. Mm-hmm. So Rachel and Nick went to Heidi's grave, and Nick was pretty stoic.

Rachel figured he was just trying to protect himself. I mean, it had to be a really hard thing to do. Mm-hmm. And in August of 2012, they got married. Rachel looked beautiful. She had a pixie cut. She looked the way I hoped I would look when I got my pixie cut. A lot of people were really happy for Nick and Rachel.

Rachel's sister, Sarah, wrote on her blog, I got to watch him be married once to one of my best friends who passed away. He was incredible with Heidi. I don't have to wonder what he's going to be like with Rachel. I don't have to have that sister talk to threaten him if he ever hurts Rachel because I already know he won't. I don't have to learn who he is and pretend to trust him. I mean, when I say he had support, he had a lot of support. What's happening with the investigation into Heidi's death at this time? It's just kind of stalled out? I will get to that.

I will warn you, I'm un-fucking-impressed. Okay. Because you had this case solved before I even told you, I'm un-fucking-impressed. Okay. Because you had this case solved before I even told you the crime. Yeah. Right? Yeah. I think anyone would. I... Oh, boy.

I have a suspicion of where this is headed next. Tell me. Something's going to happen to second wife. I'm sorry, her name is Rachel? Yeah. Something's going to happen to Rachel. Middle name, second wife. wife. I'm sorry. Her name is Rachel. Yeah. Something's going to happen to Rachel. Middle name, second wife. I'm so sorry. Rachel's going to die under suspicious circumstances.

And then that's going to confirm everybody's suspicions about what happened to Heidi. OK, let's see. OK. So he tells Rachel, great news, I'm debt free. They moved very quickly. They had three children together and they got a house, sort of. What's that mean, sort of? Well, okay, so it looks like neither one of them qualified for a loan.

So Nick's parents bought them a house with the understanding that Nick and Rachel would pay them the mortgage. Right. And Nick and Rachel would be responsible for paying taxes directly to the county. Okay. And I say Nick and Rachel, but really it was Nick. Very traditional couple. Traditional, yeah. Just like in his first marriage, Nick would be in charge of the finances.

Oh, boy. And now let's break for an ad. Okay. Toodaloo. Oh, shit. Toodaloo. And we're back from the ad. Toodaloo.

So, years passed. And somehow, Heidi's murder case didn't move forward. Un-fucking-believable. Yeah. And her family wasn't quiet. I mean, they kept pushing for answers. And I'm sorry, but the answers were right fucking there. The investigation into Nick and Heidi's finances

indicated that Heidi had not known they were in serious financial trouble. Shocking! I know. Foreclosure is a very long process, but Heidi's signature wasn't on any of the relevant paperwork. She'd never been served a piece of mail relating to the foreclosure. She hadn't shown up at the hearing for the eviction. But Nick had. He'd been at the eviction hearing. He'd been served with foreclosure documents. When a law firm that was handling the foreclosure reached out to Nick, they twice offered him a

couple thousand dollars in cash if he vacated the house early. And he said no both times. Wow. the house early? And he said no both times. Wow. Nick had actually signed a document saying that they'd vacate the home by March 22nd, 2010. But then they didn't. Yeah. And so the law firm was like, hello, that's not how this works. And you now have a lockout date. Yeah. Of April 9th. And you now have a lockout date of April 9th. But on April 6th, Nick reached out to the law firm and was like, oh, no, my grandma is in hospice. Could we get a couple extra weeks to stay in the house? Because my grandma is definitely in hospice. Was his grandma in hospice?

Fuck no. Absolutely not. This guy is brimming with shit. Yeah. He's just floating in shit with his Tevas. The law firm, I mean, I think this is great. They heard that and they were like, well, okay, sure, sure. And they agreed to let them vacate on April 26th.

Oh, now I'm to the part in the script where I shock you when you hear that his grandmas were fine. Oh, now I'm to the part in the script where I shock you when you hear that his grandmas were fine. Oh, okay. What? I know, I know. So this dude had just been lying and lying and lying.

And when investigators reviewed the couple's emails and text messages, they found that there had been no discussion of the fact that they were losing their home. Yeah. Heidi had no idea. This secret that they supposedly shared was never discussed via text. The funny thing is they did talk about finances. In the weeks leading up to her murder, Heidi had been kind of worried about money because she'd been getting calls and emails from creditors. Yeah.

And since Nick was in charge of their finances, the second she got one of those calls or one of those emails, she'd reach out to Nick and ask him to handle it. And she checked up with him on updates and stuff. And gosh, you would not believe what was going on with their account, Brandy. Oh, yeah. It was fraud. Oh. It was fraud. Uh-huh.

But he was handling it. Yeah. Don't worry. I got it all under control. Investigators spoke with Heidi and Nick's insurance agent. The insurance agent had actually been a longtime friend of Heidi's parents. And Heidi had always paid her car insurance on time. But then she married Nick, and Nick became the point person on all of their insurance stuff.

He was the one communicating with the insurance guy. And this insurance guy said that when the house went into foreclosure, obviously the agency canceled the homeowner's insurance policy. And he sent Nick a cancellation notice and he followed up with a phone call. And Nick explained to him that the foreclosure was all a big mix up. Oh, yeah. Oops, all foreclosures. Mm hmm. You see what had happened was a teller at the bank had been stealing Nick's paychecks. Mm hmm. And that's how this foreclosure mess even happened. And it was it was getting straightened out. Okay. Okay, so the insurance agent heard that story and was like, sure, Jan.

But he just figured, okay, this kid's embarrassed. All right. I'm saying kid. No, he's like 27. But he's just like, all right, this guy's embarrassed. He doesn't want to tell me the truth. That's fine. Fine, right.

And later, when Nick canceled his and Heidi's car insurance policies, the guy was like, all right, well, they just wanted a new insurance agent. He didn't think anything of that. Then there was the other thing. Heidi's behavior. On March 10th, she and Nick visited the Calhoun Beach Club and toured apartments. An employee from the club remembered Heidi talking about how she really wanted to sell their house and move into the city. But by that point, there was no house to sell. It had already been foreclosed and sold at auction. The very next day, Heidi emailed a friend and said,

we wish we weren't tied down to our house so we could move somewhere fun. friend and said, we wish we weren't tied down to our house so we could move somewhere fun. Then there was the other thing. Heidi and Nick had supposedly been attacked by an intruder, but the only DNA on the gun was Nick's. The investigation didn't turn up any like third party DNA in the home. But you know the guy was only in there for a minute. Yeah and he had a hood up and he had gloves on. And he was a cabbage patch doll

so he doesn't have DNA. Still on the anniversary of Heidi's murder her family always did their best to bring attention to her case.

So for years after the murder the sketch of the murderer made the news. And holy shit, are you ready for this? Yeah. In 2015, five years after Heidi was murdered and Nick was shot, a woman called up the police and said, I think I know who that man is in the sketch. What? I think I know who that man is in the sketch. What?

She said, it's Michael Pye. The investigator was kind of like, okay, and ran that name through the system. And oh my God, sure enough, in the months leading up to the murder, a guy named Michael Pye had made it a habit of breaking into homes early in the morning in St. Paul, Minnesota. Oh my gosh. And he looked exactly like the sketch. You're kidding me. I am not kidding you. He looks exactly like the sketch and the sketch does not look like a human, but it looks like him. Oh my gosh. Michael just happened to be in prison when this tip came in. So an investigator met with him and he showed Michael the sketch and Michael said, that's me. What the fuck? Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm. And the investigator was like, okay, well, this is the sketch of someone who murdered a woman, shot her in the back, shot her husband in the leg, and Michael was like, whoa, whoa, I didn't do anything like that. I would now like to show you what Michael Pye

looks like. I've got it next to a picture of the sketch. Oh my gosh, he does look like the sketch. He looks exactly like the sketch. He looks exactly like the sketch. Yeah. Okay, so... Oof. Okay, I'm just gonna

set it toward you. You react to it. What you got? Well, now my... Oh, God. Here's two theories. I have two theories working in my head. Oh, God. Here's two theories. All right. I have two theories working in my head. The first is that I am a fucking asshole and this really did happen. Explore that more, please. Very likely. Second theory is that somehow Nick has seen this guy on the news and intentionally did this sketch to look like him.

Okay. Okay. I gotcha. You know, I really think, we've joked about it before, but I really think when you are in detective mode, I want you to put on a little detective hat. I feel like we should have one. I know, we should have one. In the studio.

I would gladly wear it. Okay, you ready to find out which? Which one it is, yeah. Michael was telling the truth. Yes, he looked exactly like the sketch. Yeah. And no, he hadn't murdered anybody. Okay.

In fact, on the day that Heidi was murdered, he had been in jail. Oh, shit. Okay, so he couldn't have done it. Mm-hmm. And thank God he was locked up at that point because, I mean, he's a smart guy. He was like, look, if I hadn't been locked up, I would have been found guilty so fast. Oh, yeah. No one would have believed me if I said it wasn't me.

Yeah. So that was the end of that. There was still no movement on this case. But now people are kind of like, hold on. Michael Pye's face was all over the news in 2009 and 2010 for breaking into people's houses early in the morning. Uh-huh. Is it possible that Nick tried to frame him? I think it's very possible.

Okay, everyone. It's very possible. He's a full-on monster now. When she finds out that one of her theories is right, she becomes the smartest woman in the whole land. That's right! My head is huge right now. In the meantime, Nick and Rachel were living their lives, raising their three children, but they were growing apart. She started to suspect that he was lying about stuff, but could never prove it.

Like what kind of stuff? Okay, this, let me tell you, this triggered me. Like you would not believe. Okay. Okay. She said at first it was little things. She'd find food wrappers in his car. And she would say like, hey, can you just start bringing food from home to work so that we're not spending money every day going out to eat?

Yeah. And he always had some stupid excuse oh someone else had been in his car they left that food wrapper he didn't buy that food yeah and she got so frustrated because she's like you're lying to me and it's dumb yeah this is not even a big deal right why would you lie about something so small? Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Okay. Have I told the cigarette story on the podcast before? I know we have talked about it. Okay. Because this is a subject that's very near and dear to both of us. Yes.

Okay. So I'm going to tell my story. Okay. I was once dating a guy who smoked cigarettes. Now, obviously, I'm very judgmental, but I truly never said anything to him about cigarettes. Yeah. But then all of a sudden he tells me he's quitting for me. And I really didn't like that because I felt like that's a lot of pressure.

And also, I never asked you to do that. Yep. But he makes a big show of I felt like that's a lot of pressure. And also, I never asked you to do that. Yep. But he makes a big show of I'm quitting for you. Yeah. Okay. Thank you so much. Yeah. What great guy.

Yeah. Yeah. But again, like, I'm sure quitting smoking is very, very hard. So I could tell he was smoking again. Mm-hmm. So I could tell he was smoking again. I did not call him out on it because, again, like I get that it's hard. Now, granted, there's no need to lie about it, but whatever.

So one day I did a load of our laundry together and I pulled it out of the dryer and it smelled ungodly horrible. Like I was like, what the hell even is this? I couldn't believe how bad it smelled. And so I was like looking through stuff and I found some like cigarette butts that had clearly been in his pocket. And I was like, oh gosh, made all of our clothes smell awful. So I had to run it through the wash again.

Still, I mean, that's a rough scent. Yeah. So I told him, hey, you know, I know that you're smoking again. This isn't about that. But please, if you're going to smoke, don't leave the cigarette butts in your pockets because then, you know, I wash the clothes and blah, blah, blah. That man looked me in the face and told me that he was not smoking again. He told me that instead his friends were smoking around him and he was really worried about the dry climate

and them leaving their cigarette butts on the ground. So he, being a good citizen, had gone around and collected other people's cigarette butts and put them in his pocket. I was floored. Yeah. I was so mad. Yep.

I was like, look, man, do not talk to me like I'm fucking stupid. Yep. And then now I'm full on. So that happens yeah and then anytime anything else happens it's like well i can't trust him to be honest about anything anything because he lied to my face right yep oh my god yeah when i got to that point in the 2020 episode, I had to pause and just take a moment. Yeah. Also, I've got to listen. A listen.

A lesson for the listeners about speaking. Relationships are not a court of law. You don't have to prove somebody guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. You can just be like, you know what? I don't trust this fucker further than I can throw a cigarette butt and so i'm gonna go anyway any stories you'd like to share um my ex-husband also did the i quit smoking for you oh my god it was the exact same story well you didn't do the it wasn't the washing machine no it was cigarette butts in our yard. Oh my gosh, yes. The mailman or the Amazon guy. Those fucking mail guys.

They stop in front of the same house every time. They smoke these cigarettes. Yeah. If only my ex-boyfriend had come along and put those butts in his pocket. His pocket, none of that would have happened. Yeah. God bless America. Are you hot? I'm dying. It's warm in Mm-hmm. Yeah. God bless America. Are you hot?

I'm dying. It's warm in here, yes. Okay, let's... Kick that fan on. I will. All right, now that we've worked through that trauma... Do you want any more? It's not the time.

You know, it's just... It's so funny because I feel like that must be a pretty universal thing. OK, I don't think that I've ever told anybody this and I may decide to cut it. But I after the cigarette butt thing happened, I had a dream. I had a dream that my then husband, now ex-husband, that I found out that he had a whole secret life and that he was addicted to drugs was the dream. Yeah. And I woke up so shaken from this dream. Mm-hmm. And I told him about it. And his reaction was to kind of laugh it off, but very awkwardly.

Oh, wow. And it wasn't like, I think I just trust your intuition, folks. I agree. Yes. I agree. Yeah. Okay. So now.

Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So now. Yeah. Yeah. So it's funny because like thinking about that got me thinking about that whole relationship for me. And I remember at the time because I remember thinking like, okay, I don't know. Maybe someone will need to hear that thing about like you don't have to prove it in an argument. You can just be like this relationship is over yeah and even give some stupid vague reason like I'm just not feeling the chemistry I mean who cares just get out yeah but I remember I got to the point where I was like

all right I need to dump this guy and I thought about it for way too long, like way too long. And but I remember thinking like, well, I can't dump him over the phone. I'm going to have to drive all the way out there. And it was a long drive. Because I don't know, in my head, it was like, that's rude. Right. But then one day, I remember it so clearly. I'd gotten off work and I was changing into like sweats.

Yeah. I had no pants on, just a shirt. And I thought to myself, I cannot date this man for another second. Yeah. I picked up the phone and I dumped it. Good for you. Good for you. And he was stunned. Why is it that they're always stunned?

Stunned. Yeah. Anyhow. Yeah. Yeah. I remember sharing the story of the dream and doing like an awkward like laughing like. Imagine that if you had like a whole secret other life. Wouldn't that be nuts?

And it was nuts. It was. Yes. The secret life was that he and the Amazon delivery guy were smoking crack in the backyard. Well, we'll see how much of that we're going to cut. So Rachel's getting frustrated. He's lying about stupid shit. And then one day, Rachel found an alarming piece of paper tucked away in Nick's sock drawer.

found an alarming piece of paper tucked away in Nick's sock drawer. It said that they were delinquent on their property taxes and they were in danger of foreclosure. Oh, shit. Yeah. She was shocked. Yeah. Because she was just like, how is it possible that my husband, the man I have three children with, has been able to successfully

hide this from me right and then of course she got really scared of course because the last time nick was in this position his wife was murdered yes so rachel did not waste time that night she grabbed her children in the middle of the night and she took them somewhere safe. Amazing. Mm-hmm. She's really cool. Mm-hmm. Stay tuned. Okay.

For more. Okay. Stories about cigarettes. No. No, just kidding. It's going to be about this actual story here. So that discovery was the thing that made some of Nick's friends finally accept that maybe Heidi hadn't known about their financial troubles. Because if he was hiding it from Rachel, probably meant he'd been hiding it from Heidi, too. My God.

I'm sorry. They're not the problem. No. It's just frustrating. It is. Yes. Okay. Well, I've kind of already alluded to this, but Rachel is a badass who loves justice, and we are in love.

Okay. You guys are running away together? She just doesn't know it yet? She's probably way too conservative. I feel like she'd be polite about it, like give me a hard no, a very clear no. Yes. All right, that's fine. So with her children now in a safe space, she met up with Nick, and she brought her friend along for safety.

And she secretly recorded their conversation. Fuck yes. I would like to read some of those recordings to you now. Yes, please. Rachel, I could get through this if it was just the lying. I really could. The problem is the Heidi stuff. That's my problem. The problem is I don't 100% believe you. I know that it's shocking for you to hear that from me. And it's shocking. Trust me, it's shocking for me to think it. Nick, I don't know what to say right now. think it. Nick, I don't know what to say right now. And then he was completely silent for several minutes. And then he said, so I intellectually understand what you're saying. The fact that

you're saying it is so indescribably jarring to my soul that I can hardly breathe. I don't have words, Rach. It's so traumatic, and I don't know what else to tell you. Rachel, the fact that you're lying was so easy for you to do in front of me over and over and over makes me think that... Nick, that I could murder my wife? Yes. Rachel, that you could lie about something? Nick, that I could murder my wife?

Yes. Rachel, yes. Yeah. Nick, there are a hundred things going through my mind right now. Rachel. Yes. Yeah. Nick. There are a hundred things going through my mind right now. Rachel. Are you wanting to say more? Nick.

I don't know. I probably need to go. I think I'll be open to this conversation. I just can't do it today. That's interesting. In what way? Well, there's no denial there. The part about... Okay, here's where I, like, lose my shit.

It's so indescribably jarring to my soul. Because you're fucking caught. I can hardly breathe. Because you're fucking caught. You can't breathe because you're caught. He's the victim. He can't stop playing the victim.

Yep. And yeah, it is so interesting that he doesn't say, I didn't do it. I could never. I would never. I loved her. I didn never. I loved her. He didn't say any of that. I didn't.

How dare you say this? This was the most traumatic time of my life. I was shot. I watched my wife die in front of me. None of that. None of that. None of that. Instead, he's like challenging her to accuse him.

Come on. Accuse me. Accuse me. Do it. But just know that you're jarring my soul in the process fucker okay at some point rachel was like all right you need to tell your parents what's happening and so rachel sat down with nick and his parents and you might expect that Nick would do most of the talking, but he let his daddy, Steve, do the talking for him. By the way, Nick worked for his family

business. Okay. His carpet installation and stuff. Okay. Also, I wouldn't normally mention this, but I really don't like these people. So I will mention that in their wedding photos, Nick and his mom and his dad all seem to have the exact same pair of glasses. Okay. It's really stupid. What a weird thing for you to have noticed. And to form such a strong opinion on. I mean, I feel like I can't go as far as to say they knew their son was a murderer and they covered up.

But I can say it's stupid for three members of the same family to have the same pair of glasses. They got a three for one deal. Well, I hope they saved money on it. Otherwise, my God. Gee, mom, your frames look great. Where'd you get them? God. Gee, mom, your frames look great.

Where'd you get them? So here's how that conversation went. Rachel, I don't believe him. That's what's scary to me. Steve, what don't you believe? Rachel, I feel like I don't know the full truth. Steve, you're talking about the full truth of when Heidi died. Fuck yes, that's what I'm talking about, Steve!

Pull your head out of your ass! Don't lose your glasses! Well, if you do, we've got two extra pairs. Rachel goes, mm-hmm. Yeah, uh-huh and steve goes oh steve gee i wonder where nick learned to play dumb boy rachel these are the questions that i have if heidi did know all this was, why was nothing packed in the house? Like, that's just illogical. Steve. There was the beginnings of packings.

I mean, there was stuff in the basement that was packed up. Nick. There was things that were crated up and easily ready to go. Steve. But granted, at first blush, it didn't look like the house was packed and ready to move. By the way, the wonderful folks at 2020 played this recording over footage that the police took the day that Heidi was murdered. And the footage showed a house and basement that was not the least little bit packed up. OK, this is what drives me nuts.

Oh, some stuff was packed in the basement. Show me a basement. That doesn't have boxes in it. Right? Yeah. I have a wall of like totes in our basement of shit that we don't use all the time. Of course you do. And so it's in totes.

Right. Yeah. That stuff's ready to move. Sure. Yeah. Norman and I have boxes in our basement. Yeah. And it's because we're going to move at noon tomorrow.

No! No! No! It's because that's what people do. Yes. Anyway. Rachel kept pressing. Here's how that went.

Rachel. That, like, nobody knew. That's just so bizarre to me. Steve. So we weren't super entwined in their life. There weren't grandchildren involved. That naturally gives it more of a connection. Rachel. But that was different for their family, right?

They said that they were shocked that they didn't know because Heidi told them everything. Nick, they never pushed into our personal business. Heidi and I decided together that we would figure this out together. No, you didn't. You fucking liar. I feel like it's also worth mentioning that in addition to Heidi being very close to her family and obviously having a great group of friends and a great church community, she worked with her dad.

Yeah. They worked in the same company. Yeah. So she's seeing him like every day. I mean, this thing of like. No, no, no, no, no no no no no that's what rachel said yes she didn't trust nick and i'm just gonna go on a limb and say she didn't trust his parents either good for fucking rachel for trusting her

intuition yeah and asking fucking questions to be, she had me backing her up the whole time. Yeah. Retroactively. So Rachel and Nick got divorced in 2018. I'm so glad my prediction was wrong. Nothing happened to Rachel. My prediction was that something would happen to Rachel. I think something was going to happen to Rachel.

I totally agree. Although, okay, is he that stupid? Surely not. Although he was doing it again. Although he was doing it once. Yes, he was doing the exact same thing that he had done the first time. Yeah, I mean, when you pull off a crime that is that obvious, it's so obvious.

So obvious. And you get away with it for that many years. And somehow your family and friends still support you and think that the media and the police are lying, which it's frustrating. Sometimes the media and police police are lying, which it's frustrating. Sometimes the media and police, they are wrong. Yeah. But my God. Okay. So they get divorced. Now what Rachel didn't know was that there was a new detective working Heidi's case. Okay. It was a woman named Nicole Sipes, and she'd recently been transferred to homicide. In 2010, when Heidi was murdered, Nicole had been a patrol officer in the district where Heidi and Nick lived.

And it had always really bothered her that this crime wasn't solved. So Nicole showed up on Rachel's door one day and was like, hello, new friend. Let's talk about Heidi Ferguson. I think it's at Rachel's door or on Rachel's doorstep. I don't think you can say showed up on Rachel's door. You know what's so crazy? She was sitting right there on it. No, no, no, no. What's so crazy is like earlier you had a prediction like either this Michael Pye.

Oh, it turns out I'm an asshole. Yeah, you're both. You're right on both fronts. Look at that. Look at that. Look at that. Congratulations. Gosh, I wish I had confetti. I was unprepared.

You don't have just one pocket of confetti? Got to use Kleenex? No, I don't. I'm nothing like my parents. So they start talking. On the door, in the door, through the door. And Rachel told her everything she knew. In the meantime, Sergeant Sipes got the help of the FBI. This is what I love about this sergeant.

Okay, so she's got all this information. She was not afraid to reach out for help to other agencies. So she reaches out to the FBI. She called the mayor first. Obviously. Duh. She showed up on his door, in his door, through his door. Heidi's 911 call and use their tippy-top technology to listen for any evidence that there was a third person present. Because obviously there should be wild background noise, right? Yeah. Somebody's busting the door in, right?

Yeah. They heard it. Struggling with a shotgun. It woke them up, right? It woke Nick up. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Yeah.

So there should be a ton of background noise. Or nose. Nose. Everyone present be a ton of background noise. Or nose. Nose. Everyone present had a nose. Noses everywhere. So, you know, they're listening for background noise, indicating a third party is present. Oh, my gosh. You're not going to believe it.

They didn't find any. Not none. Zero. Zip. Mm-mm. No background noses or noises just the two noses yep the fbi also created a virtual model of the house and did some ballistic testing and they concluded that you know oh my gosh the two gunshots were most likely not gunshots that

happened accidentally during a struggle but were more likely intentional. Yeah. Oh, shit. Did you just piss your pants? You stop it. You're so surprised. This is so aggravating to me. Yes! It's infuriating! I can't imagine being Heidi's family.

No! Because you know what happened! Yes! You know what happened! Yes! I'd be like, okay, do I need to go become a detective myself? Right. She also reached out to the police department's financial crimes unit for help understanding exactly what was going on with this couple financially.

Because I'm sure it's like a ton of documents. Oh, absolutely. Maybe not her area of expertise. My goodness. out for help amazing yeah so finally in may of 2021 investigators arrested nick and charged him with the murder of heidi fergus wow his trial kicked off in january of 2023. Holy shit! Yeah. Prosecutors wanted to put Rachel on the stand, obviously, but the judge was like, no, that will unfairly prejudice the jury.

Yeah. And I hate it, but I do agree. Yeah, it does suck, but I get it. But I mean, okay, anyway. So the judge said, quote, let's just focus on one of this guy's fucked up marriages i don't think the judge the judge did not say that can you imagine like a real casual judge right yeah so at trial the prosecution argued that nick had been lying about the couple's financial situation for a very long time. And he'd murdered Heidi because he couldn't handle coming clean about the fact that they were about to be evicted.

So he killed his wife. And in doing so, he became a victim and a martyr. Yep. When really he was a murderer. The prosecution. Oh, gosh, I didn't include this, but it's so good. She said something along the lines of. Oh, shit.

Now I've completely forgotten it. But it was basically like Nick's been lying about this stranger in the house this whole time. But really what Heidi should have been afraid of was the stranger in her marriage. the house this whole time but really what Heidi should have been afraid of was the stranger in her marriage. Yeah. That's really too bad that I didn't write it down verbatim because the prosecutor had it down perfectly.

Prosecutor gets up there, she loses confidence. Is something... Hey, Hagen, I'm gonna need you to really go with me on this. I had it down pat two days ago. But the defense, and honestly, I think he had a really good defense team.

The thing about don't ever talk to the police, let's get our own sketch artist. I'm going to say, and I could be wrong, but I think that intimidated the original investigators and I think it kind of stymied them I don't think they knew what to do with that yeah so the defense gets up there and they're like that theory makes no sense it makes no sense to kill your wife to spare yourself momentary embarrassment correct because it's not logical. Yeah. You're trying to make this logical. It's not fucking logical. But neither is keeping this secret from your spouse.

This enormous secret. Right. But they. They say she didn't. I know. They're going to say she knew all about it. Mm-hmm. she knew all about it.

Mm-hmm. The defense explained that the reason the couple only had a few bins packed up in the basement was because they were in denial about the eviction. It's a good defense. Yeah, I agree.

Yeah. I really think you can go a fairly long way by saying, this is stupid. This is illogical. No one would ever do this.

Because I think you hear that and you go, well, yeah, that is stupid. That is illogical. But you forget that Nick is very stupid. Yep. A lot of people do stupid shit that doesn't make any sense. Yes. Not me. I'm perfect.

A lot of people do stupid shit that doesn't make any sense. Yes. Not me. I'm perfect. Heidi's mom testified that in the summer of 2009, Heidi had been working at a sign company. Oh. This is a theme I'm only covering. Yeah, I guess so.

That mentions sign companies. Damn. I know. Honestly, if it hadn't been a sign company, I wouldn't have mentioned it. But I was like, what are the chances? Okay, throwing that in. And the company cut her hours. It seems like the company must have cut a lot of people's hours.

And so she asked her daughter, do you need some money? And Heidi told her that Nick said they were fine. Which means, yeah, she has no idea what their finances are. Right. Friends testified about how their group was super open with each other. One couple confided in the group that they were doing a short sale on their house. Mm-hmm. Anytime anyone needed to move, they would all pitch in and help. In fact, one of the couples in that group was moving into a different home

on the same weekend that Nick and Heidi were supposedly going to move. They'd all been in a group text talking about this move. But Heidi hadn't mentioned that she and Nick were also moving that weekend. The defense argued that it would have been impossible for Heidi not to know what was going on. They had notices on their front door. All the paperwork about their eviction and foreclosure stuff was in the house or in Nick's car. You know, it wasn't hidden. He hadn't burned it or shredded it.

What do you think about that? I think that what we know of Heidi and their relationship is that she's not going to ask him questions. He's going to say everything's fine and she's going to believe him. Even if she saw something. Or even if she did ask questions, which we know she did ask some questions. He always had an answer. And gosh, they were so young. Yeah. Also, I'm sorry.

You would never suspect that someone's going to kill you over this? No. Okay. Expert witnesses for the prosecution testified about how only Nick's DNA was found on the shotgun. Also, the home didn't look like it had been broken into. No. They also tried to tear apart Nick's story. And he said, hey, I worked hard on that.

So he said he'd been up in the bedroom when he heard someone fiddling with the front doorknob. And that, you know, was completely audible upstairs. So the prosecution played a video for the... Did they do a reenactment? Of course they did! And you couldn't hear shit? Of course

you couldn't. No! And let me tell you, that investigator, he was jiggling that doorknob. Jiggling the shit out of it, I bet. Mm-hmm. So the defense pointed out that the intruder had actually used tools to break into the house.

There were tool marks on the door proving this. There were marks on the door that were consistent with someone using a screwdriver to pry the door open. And you know what? When this break-in occurred, police seized all the screwdrivers they could find in the Furka's home and in their cars, and none of them matched up with the one that was used to pry the front door open. Was it because that pry mark was already there when they bought the house? I don't know.

I don't know. All right. What do you think of that? I mean, I think that sounds good for the defense. Yeah. I also think it's funny, you know, wanting to be fair, like, if this really happened. Yeah.

Let's say it really did. Mm-hmm. Someone breaks into the home. There's a struggle for the gun. You get shot. Your spouse is shot and killed. Mm-hmm. Yeah, maybe you don't remember exactly what the sound was that woke you up.

Yes, absolutely. So, yeah, I think that's a pretty good argument. Yeah. But to counter that argument, the prosecution brought in a locksmith. This guy had like 35 years in the locksmith and biz. That's what they call it. Locksmith and biz.

He'd been to thousands of burglaries. Yeah. Because he was a burglar himself. I'm sorry. That was a lie. That's rude. That was a total lie. So he had a lot of expertise here.

Yeah. And he said that burglars attack the deadbolt because once you've got the deadbolt, then you've got the door. It's easy to get in the door. Exactly. Right. But there was no evidence that anyone had tried to do anything to the deadbolt. Fun fact, this locksmith had never seen a burglary with so little damage done to the door. Interesting.

Because get this, apparently a burglar doesn't care about not damaging your door. They don't. No, they care about getting into your home. Yes. But the defense pointed out that maybe when you're breaking into a house on the weekend at six in the morning, you do it in a sneaky sneak way. Yeah. All right.

Maybe this was a super unique burglary. Maybe. Or maybe it wasn't a burglary at all. The other thing that the defense tried to establish was that this timeline didn't make sense. According to the prosecution's timeline, Nick would have had to shoot his wife, position her body, shoot himself, and then call the police all in 65 seconds. It couldn't be done. I bet it could be. In closing arguments, Prosecutor Rachel Crocker put a timer in front of the jury and she let it run. She mimed shooting Heidi.

She walked over to where Heidi's body would have been, mimed turning her over, picked up the gun that he'd left by the door, braced against the door, pulled the trigger, dropped the gun, called 911. Not a perfect scientific experiment, but she did it in about 50 seconds. I mean, I don't love it, but I do think you've kind of got to, you know, I don't know. Yeah, no, I think there's nothing scientific about it, but it gives the jury a sense that it could be done.

Yes. In the defense's closing arguments, they said, all of this psychobabble that killing his wife would somehow save his reputation makes no sense. Which again,

I mean, it doesn't make sense. No. This dude doesn't make sense. No. He's trying to tell me that his buddy left candy wrappers in his car. On February 10th, the jury went into deliberation. They deliberated for about four hours.

They found him guilty. Yeah. At sentencing, Heidi's brother, Peter Erickson, made a victim impact statement. And here's part of what he said. Erickson made a victim impact statement, and here's part of what he said. Because of the lies we were told as early as the day after her murder, along with the pressures to believe them, it's been virtually impossible to find closure to our grief as the shock begins after Heidi's murder. The realization quickly set in that everything Nick was telling us betrayed who I knew my sister to be.

The fact that he had the audacity to peddle a story that was so obviously inconsistent with Heidi's character was, and still is, very much insulting and offensive to me and everyone else who actually knew and loved her. Yeah. Oof. That would be so infuriating. Oh, yes. Like, it's bad enough that you murdered her. Now you're trying to paint this picture of her being someone that she absolutely wasn't? Yeah.

Nick was sentenced to life in prison without the possibility of parole. Are you ready for what he said at his sentencing? I sure am. Get ready to feel bad for him. I'm okay. Is he a victim? Of course he is! My body is condemned to serve for another man's crime, but my soul is free. Free of the guilt that this imperfect world

has bestowed upon me. Oh, fuck right off. Yeah, yeah. And his defense attorney told the media, Nick Furcus is serving a sentence for first-degree murder because they had procrastinated and starting packing okay dude okay okay so now that we're at the end here the big question i had this whole time was like how did this not go to trial sooner no kidding because i feel like they had. It was all there the whole time. Right. Okay. So this is where the Pioneer Press came in. Prosecutors Elizabeth Laman and Rachel Cracker were, did I call her Rachel Crocker earlier? I have no idea. Good grief.

Apologies to Rachel. Rachel Cracker, not Crocker. I don't know. I have it two ways. Okay, great. Who's to say? Who knows?. I don't know. I have it two ways. Okay, great. Who's to say? Who knows? Where I fucked up exactly.

Yes. So in the piece for the Pioneer Press, they said that there are lessons in this case for prosecutors and investigators. And it's that you shouldn't be afraid to take a difficult case forward if the evidence supports a charge. Yeah. Yeah, I think they were. Yeah. Yeah, I think they were just afraid. Yeah, I solved this case in five minutes. Detective Brandy had it down.

It didn't make any sense from the fucking beginning. It sure didn't. This had to be so infuriating for Heidi's family. Yeah. Absolutely. And I am willing to bet your butthole that it almost cost Rachel her life, too.

Yes. Yes. Yeah. Oh, gosh. Circling back to Michael Pye, the pie from the sketch it was cool he was interviewed on 2020 and he talked about how at that time in his life he was homeless he was really struggling and yeah he was doing kind of what he knew to do which was was break in. He's really turned his life around. And holy crap, I am so glad he did not get blamed for this crime. Can you fucking imagine?

Oh, I can. I absolutely can. He would have been convicted so fast. No problem. So fast. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Holy shit.

So that's the story of the murder of heidi fergus i it drives me nuts yeah when someone this stupid gets away with it for so long yeah did i mention that his lawyers are gonna appeal that's you didn't but we all knew. Yeah. His family still says he's not guilty. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Oh, one other thing that I didn't mention. Okay.

In his original, well, original, in his only interview with police, he mentioned, so, you know, his family business, they install carpet. Yeah, yeah. Flooring, all that stuff and there is a machine you can use i guess to get blood out of carpet and he did mention that he had one of those in his personal vehicle but it was because he you know his work related work okay great so the thought there was like, okay, did he have a couple different ideas going? Yeah, no kidding. And then settled on this break-in one.

Not to be confused with break-in two. Electric boogaloo. Thank you for clarifying. You're welcome. Oh, holy shit. You're welcome. Holy shit, that was nuts. Yep, that was the story. I am so, Rachel is a rock star in all of this.

Oh my gosh. Oh my gosh. I hope she's doing okay. Yeah, I, well, she's beautiful, so there's that. Okay. I think that's always a plus, don't you? Sure. Mm-hmm. Whew.

That was wild. Yeah, it's one of those stories, I don't know. It annoys me. Yeah. On that note, should we take some questions from our Discord? I think we should. But how do you get into the Discord? To get in the Discord, all you have to do is join our Patreon at the $5 level or higher.

Then you get in here. It's like a 90s style chat room where you can chitty chat the day away with other listeners of this podcast. And then when we record, we ask for questions and we answer a few. Brandy, I wish you'd stop asking people for age, sex, and location. Stop it. Ooh, old and decrepit 25-year-old wants to know, what candies are you giving out this Halloween? Do you give out like a specific type of candy? What candies are you giving out this Halloween?

Do you give out like a specific type of candy? No, I usually do it very last minute because any time that I prepare, I end up eating all the candy myself. I like to get kind of a mix. Yeah. And then I let the kids choose their two favorites. Yeah. And they always seem real excited about it. Yeah.

What about you? I'm going to give out candy because we're out trick-or-treating. Yeah. You don't even leave a bowl and ask people to be honest knowing that they won't be? No. Maybe we should do that. Should I do that this year? Should I get a giant bowl full of full-sized candy bars and just put it on my porch and see if people don't tempt people that way.

But yeah, put a few out. I'll put some candy out. What should I put out? A bunch of bit of honey? No. My God. No. You know what I think I'm going to do this year?

If I put out a giant bowl of bit of honey, somebody would smash my pumpkins for sure. You know what would be funny? And I would deserve it. Well, no. Here's what I'm thinking. You do the unattended jar of candy knowing probably someone's going to just be terrible, take it all. But you fill it with terrible candy and then see what happens. Get those flavored Tootsie Rolls.

I think this is what I do. Okay. I set up my bowl of unattended candy. Next to it. Put a little camera. No, that won't scare him. It's not going to scare him. They're in fucking costume.

It's the perfect crime. What are you going to say? Spider-Man stole my candy. That's true. Please stop, Spider-Man. All right. You'll know him because he reeks of bit of honey. No, you know what I think I want to do this year?

What? I think I want to offer cold beverages. Oh, yeah. Little juice boxes. Yeah, yes. Because I remember— Be the coolest fucking house on the street. Well, no, because you know what?

Someone in my neighborhood has a cotton candy machine. Oh, for fuck's sake! I mean, people really do it up here. Maybe I'm bringing London trick-or-treating over here. You should. I felt like a fucking chump giving out candy last year. Kids run up with their cotton candy. No shit.

So, yeah, I think I do want to do beverages. Yeah. Because I remember one year we got those little half cans of room temperature surge. Surge. And we just, man. But, boy, did we love them. Because we'd been running. Yes. Yep. It was an athletic event. Surge. And we just, man. We love them. Because we'd been running. Yes.

Yep. It was an athletic event. It was. That's a good idea. You should get those little hug barrels. What? Hug barrels. What's a hug barrel?

You know the little juice barrels? Oh, yeah. I've seen those before. Yeah, they're delicious. And it's only one gram of sugar in the whole thing. And they taste so good. Should I say that? Kids, I know you're concerned about sugar. Don't even worry about it.

It's one gram. Happy Halloween, okay? It's only five calories. Five calories. Where do you even buy those things? Anywhere. Every store carries them. Not Costco.

I would have seen them. Yeah, I haven't seen them. They do have them at Sam's. Okay. Which, you know, Norm has revolted. Norm no longer likes Costco. He only likes Sam's. It's true.

Yeah. It's true. There are too many people at Costco, he has decided. Hmm. People. What? he has decided. Hmm. This people What? This is the weirdest fucking question.

Lesbot wants to know would you rather have the body of an ostrich or have a swarm of moths for hair? Hmm. I gotta go body of an ostrich.

I think I'd be too freaked out by the moths. Well, wouldn't you get used to them? I don't know that I would. Do they smell? I think so. Yeah. I mean, I'd have to go moths. You're going moths.

You don't want the body of an ostrich. Well, how are you going to drive? How are you going to do anything? You've got an ostrich body. So ridiculous. I know what you're thinking. You're thinking, I'll put on black pants and a black shirt and no one will know. I've got news for you, honey.

They're going to know something's up. You're going to look like two raccoons in a trench coat. No, you're going to look like a boat, right? I mean, I'm already used to having a big ass. Right. So, I mean, honestly, it might be smaller. Yeah, it might be. It might be.

Definitely more feathery. Yes, much more feathery. I think I could make the feathers work for me. Sure. Sure. I'm going to go body of an ostrich. I can't handle the moths but then that feels unfair to David

he didn't sign up for bestiality he didn't and he might be sad that my butt is smaller yeah he really likes my butt sure please don't talk about your sex life on this podcast no one asked

no one even brought it up. I'm pretty sure. May I tell you something? Yes. Like a couple weeks ago, Norm was, Norm and I were out on a walk. Yeah. And he goes, hey, I just, I read some reviews on the podcast and like, yeah, some lady was like really upset she said you guys make too many bestiality jokes and my honest to god reaction i was like what that is disgusting ma'am no i know but it's so i mean it took me a while my initial reaction was like well that person is nuts we have never we've made so many we've made so many and we had made quite a few just in the episode that had dropped the day before that walk yeah you what did you just blocked it out had you i here's the thing i think

in my head i'm a lot classier than i actually am. And so someone says to me, you make too many bestiality jokes. And I'm like, what on earth? I make exactly the right amount of bestiality jokes. No, I make none. My reaction was I make none. Ma'am. I know I'm wrong. You're just lying to yourself.

Yes. Yes. I understand that I am wrong. Yes. Yes. I understand that I am wrong, but it's so funny to me that my initial reaction is, well, that person is a nut. Inventing bestiality jokes. Someone also said that I talk about your body parts too much. Well, when you got a body like mine, you got to talk about it. I mean, these things happen. That you talk about mine body parts too much. Well, when you've got a body like mine, you've got to talk about it. I mean, these things happen.

You talk about mine too much? Yeah. I mean, I feel like it goes both ways. I totally agree. But I agree. You do it too often. You do it just the right amount. Thank you, listener. Thank you, listener. Oh, question for you from Game Show Aficionado.

Kristen, we haven't heard from DP lately. How are he and Sheree Ray doing? I'm so glad you asked. DP and Sheree Ray. First of all, my dad is getting more and more serious about starting up his own podcast. Ask an old white guy. I've tried to put an end to this, but he's getting more serious. He even asked me if I could teach him how to edit audio, which sounds terrifying. So I am considering going down this road with him before we'd inevitably get the podcast canceled after, what, three episodes?

Who knows? Ooh, I Don't Light Up a Room asks, what is your go-to retail therapy? I am a home decor whore when I need therapy in retail form. What's your go-to? Typically, I'm a self-care type. I do makeup items, maybe like a new face scrub. Yeah. Also, maybe a scented candle.

I knew. See, I thought scented candle would be way higher up on the list. It's second. I'm going to buy a makeup item before I buy a scented candle, but a scented candle is going to make me feel good. I mean, I'm going to hit Nordstrom Rack because I can do both of those things there. Also, I can look at some sunglasses. Also, a wide assortment of shoes in my size. Yeah.

Okay. Yeah, I don't know what my retail therapy is really. shoes in my size. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. I don't know what my retail therapy is really because my problem is I'll get, I'll get going some. Yeah. Here's my, here's my guess. Okay. For you.

It's not a specific item. It's getting a deal. Yeah. And finding something I love. Yes. And the thing is like you just can't always get that. Yeah. And so sometimes I leave gravely disappointed. Broken hearted. Yes. And the thing is, like, you just can't always get that. Yeah. And so sometimes I leave gravely disappointed. Broken hearted.

Yeah. Tried to shit, but merely farted. Okay. Okay. Top and Ditz wants to know, Brandy, since you are extremely competitive, do you let your kids win at games? My daughter's 11 and I show no mercy when playing Uno. I do not let my kids win at games.

Oh, my God, Brandy. You've got a three-year-old. Yeah, okay. So what I am picturing is when we play Mario Kart and London just has a play controller. She's not actually playing the game. She just thinks she is. But David, Jack and I all play and we play for blood. We are very competitive and we actually the three of us are fairly matched in skill.

David is better than us, but Jack and I have gotten to the point where we have improved so much that we can regularly beat David now. So we feel pretty good about ourselves. The really funny thing is that David and Jack are just letting you win. No. What would you do if you found out that's what was happening? I would be devastated. I really believe that I have improved so much. Well, and maybe you have.

Maybe you have. Maybe you are coming down the stairs and you hear them whispering to each other, oh, she's getting so much better. Stop it. It's so great how excited she is. Okay, let's let her win a couple rounds. How dare you? Oh, Brandy with a Y asks, what are your ideal retirement jobs? I want to leave my public job.

Yeah. And have a hobby farm where I can snuggle cows and other sweet animals all day. I want to retire to Key West and do a Carl Tanzler history tour. Everyone is a chump. The person who asked the question, you with your answer. Because you're going to retire and have zero jobs.

Yeah. Okay. That is the most American bullshit. What job do you want when you retire from your job? I want no job. Okay. I want no job today.

Okay. I want to be a woman of leisure. You want to be a lady who lunches? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I want to be a lady who takes an edible in the middle of the day. That's what I want to retire to do.

Okay. I want to be fully caught up on all the reality television. Don't judge me. Sorry. I'm only allowed to judge you. I want to keep my home looking fabulous. Yeah. I want to vacation my home looking fabulous. Yeah. I want to vacation.

Mm-hmm. Not too much. I really don't like to leave the house. Right. Yeah, and that's what I want to do in retirement. All right. Do you really think you'll have a job after you retire? Hmm.

Very likely, yes. Why? Can you not be alone with your own thoughts? Maybe not. Yeah, that's you. Yeah. But also what I would want to do is I would want to do that job with David. Like that's my dream is that we get to like do it together.

Right. Or we just retire together. Is that what you're saying? Yeah, and then do whatever you want. But maybe whatever I want is to do a Carl Tanzler tour in Key West. Sure. Okay. Okay.

Oh, people. Oh, Team Pantsuit wants to know, I've got questions about Kristen's shower routine. Do you do all of that every day? No. No, no, no. Okay. I have seen multiple people concerned that you're taking an hour-long shower every single day. I am not.

Okay. I am not. Although I do have the time. What you described to us, would you consider that your everything shower? That is my everything shower. Okay. No, I don't wash my hair and stuff every time. Yeah.

No, neither do I. But you do the butthole bar every time? First of all, how dare you? You know, it's funny. I didn't realize for some reason in the moment and also in through the edit of that episode when I talked about my special butthole bar of soap, which I did not call a butthole bar. But we are now. Pointed it out.

And I've trademarked it. Yes. I realized, oh, my gosh, my parents are going to hear that and everyone's going to hear that. And they're going to know that I've decided I want to lighten up the skin around my butthole. Why? So? Well, that's a weird thing for everyone to know about me. I don't think it's that weird at all. What? Good for you. You want your butthole to look nice. Okay. You can't even put on a top without an emotional support camisole underneath it and you're telling me that it's not weird that I have a special bar of soap for lightening my undercarriage? It's a little weird.

It's a little weird. It's fine. Anyhow. Yeah. Yeah, I do scrub-a-dub-dub. That's okay. All right. What?

That's just a lot. It's a very involved shower. It is. It really doesn't take that long, though. You've got it down to a science. Nothing I do is a science. It's always an art. So just.

Yeah. All right. It's a lot. It sure is. I don't think you should feel embarrassed at all about people knowing you want a lighter butthole. I don't think there's anything weird. I don't think there's no. There's no point in being embarrassed by it because it's out now.

Yeah. Out to our dozens of listeners. I am suddenly feeling a little embarrassed that I just said I get my butthole waxed, but it's fine. Patty, we shan't cut it. I just, I don't only specifically get my butthole waxed. Just the butthole. And the waxer is always like, would you like me to tackle the thicket up front?

And she says, what? No. That'd be weird. Just the butthole, please. That would be nuts if I was getting only my butthole wax. Oh, see, now I'm feeling a little bit like you because my dad's going to listen. Yeah. Would it be helpful if I was like, what?

No, I don't think it's weird at all. Why are you feeling weird when you shouldn't feel weird? Because I don't feel weird. I don't feel weird about anybody else hearing this, just my dad. And the irony is, he... Patty, we might have to bleep that. Might. Oh, my God. Oh, no.

This is right on topic. Bluey taught me, says, thanks to today's episode and especially Kristen for embarrassing me at my kids' elementary school. I had my windows open when another parent walked by my car just in time to hear you talking about cleaning your butthole. That's on you, Bluey taught me. Yeah. Yeah. LGTC taught you to keep those windows up. That's right.

What? What? What? What? What? what what what what what first of all i saw somebody's reaction to this question and they said are you from earth so i was like what was the question right and i have a similar response bethany asked oh i think bethany's been in here causing trouble before. Isn't Bethany the one who says traffic isn't real? Uh-oh. We've been trolled again. Bethany says, aren't ranch and mayonnaise low-key interchangeable? Same with ketchup and tomato sauce.

No. Society does not need both. Bethany is so controversial. Bethany, what? So controversial. And like, I want to say offensive, but I know I'm not truly offensive. It's teetering on the edge of offensive. It is offensive, though.

It is. It really is. No, those things are not interchangeable. How dare you. I'm not going to dip my mozzarella stick in ketchup. That sounds disgusting. Oh, gosh. Oh, no.

It probably wouldn't be that bad. I think it sounds disgusting. Well, you think everything is disgusting. Oh, gosh. Oh, no. It probably wouldn't be that bad. I think it sounds disgusting. Well, you think everything is disgusting. But I like ketchup. I know you do. And I like tomato sauce. Right. But you're complicated when it comes to food.

All right. So we're not asking you. All right. That's just the thing. Okay. Someone else responded and said, whoa, whoa, whoa. Oh, I got you. So many responses.

Somebody else said, what the fuck, girl? Bethany is a chaos creator. She has destroyed our discourse. You know what? On that note, we will move on to Supreme Court inductions. To get inducted on this podcast, all you have to do is sign up for our Patreon at the $7 level or higher. This week, we are reading your names and your first celebrity crushes. And Brandi is frantically moving to the right place in the document.

I'm here. Oh, okay. All right. Then go ahead. Leslie. JTT. I wrote him a letter. Do you have a girlfriend?

If not, I will be your girlfriend. The year was 1994 and I was seven years old. Rachel H. Corbin Blue. Allie D'Angelantino. Nick Jonas. Eddie B. Melanie Chisholm, a.k.a. Sporty Spice.

Courtney Leon. Jason Priestley. Hollis N. Matthew Lawrence. Ashley B. Lance Bass. Rachel S. Shamar Moore.

Molly Ann Ware. Henry Thomas from E.T. Is that the main logo? Yeah. Okay. PewDiePie. Krista W. Pete Wentz.

Lauren. John Stamos. Kelly Rain. Gavin Rossdale. Kendra Golden. Fred Savage. Welcome to the Supreme Court Thank you

everyone's for everyone's everyone's for all of your support we appreciate it so much if you're looking for other ways to support us please find us on social media we're on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, Patreon please remember to subscribe to the podcast

wherever you listen and then head on over to Apple Podcasts and leave us a five-star rating and review. Then be sure to join us next week. When we'll be, oh wait, no, when Brandy will be an expert on a whole new topic. Podcast adjourned! And now for a note about our process.

For this episode, I read a bunch of stuff, then regurgitated it all back up in my very limited vocabulary. So I owe a huge thank you to the real experts. I got my info from an episode of 2020 titled, oh no, I forgot to include the title. Titled, The Stranger in the House. Also, the court record and reporting from the Pioneer Press. Any errors are of course ours, but please don't take our word for it go read their stuff