Lex Fridman Podcast - #287 – Bobby Lee: Comedy, Skyrim, Sex Robots, Love, Fame, and Power

Starting point is 00:00:00 The following is a conversation with Bobby Lee, a stand up comedian and a podcaster and one of the funniest humans on the planet. And just someone who brings joy to my heart with a mix of non-sequitur absurdity, darkness, and the singing voice of an angel. In all seriousness, Bobby is just a beautiful human being. I've been a fan of his for 20 years since his time on Matt TV to today with his podcast Tiger Belly that he does with his other half the love of his life Kalala and the podcast bad friends that he does with Andrew Santino. Now I'll quick to you second mention of each sponsor check them out in the

Starting point is 00:00:39 description it's the best way to support this podcast. We got Brave for web browsing, give well for charity, linoid for cloud computing, on it for supplements and indeed for hiring. Choose wise and my friends. And now onto the full letteries. As always, no ads in the middle. I try to make this interesting, but if you skip them, please still check out our sponsors. I enjoy their stuff. Maybe you will too. This show is brought to you by my favorite browser, Brave. It's fast, privacy preserving. It feels like Google Chrome, but without the ads,

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Starting point is 00:06:46 andd.com slash lux, get it at andd.com slash lux offers good for limited time, terms and conditions apply, go to indeed.com slash lux. This is the LuxFeedment podcast, and here is my conversation with Bobby Lee. I've been a fan of yours for many, many years. I think you're one of the funniest people in the world. I've been a fan since Matthew V. Days 20 years ago to today with with Tiger Belly. So given that given your status as a world-class comedian How did it feel that you were not invited to Andrew Schultz's wedding and I was? What you were there. Yeah, I was there. I was the least funny person there.

Starting point is 00:07:48 And the whole time I was thinking, is not funny that Bobbie Lee's not here? Yeah. All my life, I always felt like people didn't like me and didn't want to invite me to things, you know what I mean? I think that's fundamentally the reason why I do what I do. So it really did hurt a lot. And I had resentments.

Starting point is 00:08:07 I did some revenge fantasies about how I'm going to get revenge on him and stuff. Yeah. I'm him specifically. He's been him specifically. Okay. Like have a big wedding invite everyone, you know, me accept him, stuff like that. Yeah. And then just write him a letter like, see that's how it feels or whatever.

Starting point is 00:08:29 But instead of that I'm because I've been therapy and stuff. I'm just kind of like trying to let it go. What did you do there? This right here. Why'd you do that? I forgot to start the timer. And now it's start over. Yeah, let's do this. So again, take two. No, you still feel like an outsider? Your exception is successful. Me, Domey, you still feel. Yeah.? Your exception is successful for me, Domain, you still feel? Yeah. I'm doing a Netflix show tonight with Andrew Santino at the comedy store and this nap, but like last night, I just felt like I wasn't a part of, in fact, on stage, I go, I even mentioned that I go, Netflix, they don't like me, you know what I mean?

Starting point is 00:09:00 And I just say things like that, they're not true. And this is something that I want to correct with myself because I have this internal dialogue that's based on just the past. And 99% of the things that go on in my mind aren't true. And I'm just at a point in my life where I just don't want to start, I don't want to look like that anymore. Really?

Starting point is 00:09:22 Because I'm the same way I'm deeply self-critical all the time. Yeah. And that's kind of an engine that drives you to do stuff. Yeah, but it doesn't give you the kind of freedom that I would like. Don't you want to be truly free? Free from your mind? Free from negative thoughts?

Starting point is 00:09:41 No, I'm free part of the day. And some of the day I spend being extremely self-critical and that drives you. Because I'm afraid I'll become ultra lazy otherwise. Because I love life. I love being comfortable. I love just relaxing. I need very few things in life. And some of the way I'll just get super lazy.

Starting point is 00:09:59 Are you a minimalist? Yeah. So if I went to your house in Austin, do you have a couch? I recently got, this is the first couch I've gotten ever, because the guests were complaining, because I also record the podcast there. The guests are complaining, there's nowhere to sit. I have no chairs, no couch.

Starting point is 00:10:18 I sleep on the floor, like a mattress is on the floor. Not out of principle, I think, out of some kind of minimalist momentum. Minimals, so we're the opposite in that way then. Oh, so you like stuff. I'm not a hoarder, but, because I can throw things away, but I have a shopping addiction, I think. Like when I'm on the road,

Starting point is 00:10:39 like I was in Oklahoma for two weeks, I just, I bought a bunch of stuff, you know what I mean? And then, oh my God, I went to Todd Snyder and I bought, how about these shoes? You know? Because, you know, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, But you're wearing them. So they're, they're actually, you're using them

Starting point is 00:10:55 and they're giving value to your life. That's awesome. Yeah, but this is the last time, when I wear these. This is one time. Yes, it's like a wedding. But yeah, yeah, it's a red carpet dress. Who's the designer? Do you know?

Starting point is 00:11:07 I don't know anything about it. What are you wearing? Bobby. I don't know what I'm wearing, but I, because I'm on a native show called Reservation Dogs, right? I just want to get into the spirit of things. That's your... Yeah, this is...

Starting point is 00:11:17 Because if I was ever like native and I was in a tribe back in the day, you know what I mean? I would have been a gatherer. Not a hunter. No. I'm gonna weave baskets with the ladies. Yeah, I want to pick berries with the ladies. You wouldn't be the chief. Then no, no, no, and I would make after the hunt, I would probably make some, so some of the guys make love to me. Oh, yeah, because I'm getting up just because, you know, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, like, there's a power heart. You gotta know your place, the hierarchy. Yeah, your alpha male then.

Starting point is 00:11:46 I don't even know what that means. Joe Rogan. Joe Rogan is the definition of alpha male. And to me, yeah, if there was a picture of alpha male in the dictionary, it would be, it would be Joe Rogan. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:12:00 So you hoard stuff. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. But you can throw on what was the last time, let me call you out on that. One's the last time you threw away something that's actually valuable valuable like something valuable to you or valuable in general most things that I buy aren't valuable to me There are things that are valuable to me. They're like keep stay safe from my family and stuff that I will keep forever So I like in terms of like an old photo of my father or what not. So those kind of things I keep.

Starting point is 00:12:25 But when it comes to like, you know, aviator nation sweats, like if some somebody came over to my house and goes, he can I have six of those sweatshirts or whatever I'd be like, yeah, go take it. Okay. And my my brothers come over to my house and just done a clearance, you know, man, like, I'm going to take this this is I generally little have a problem with so the self critical voice is serving no purpose in terms of because you're you're pretty You know, I'm a fan of yours, so you're known to be a little bit lazy sometimes 100% lazy. Yeah, yeah, so the self critical voice. Don't you think that it's serving a purpose and fighting off the laziness beating off the laziness serving a purpose and fighting off the laziness, beating off the laziness.

Starting point is 00:13:04 The self-critical voice that I have, I'm been able to compartment, how do you say compartment? Yeah, however you say. Yeah, you're free. Yeah, yeah, put in a compartment, right? And I'm able to like, I'm a good avoider. I'm good at avoidance.

Starting point is 00:13:23 So for instance, right now to avoid I've been playing Stardew Valley. You know what that is? No. It's a phone game or? No, it's a you can keep played on your Switch, but it's on the Xbox and it's a farming simulation game. And so I like to farm, you know, I mean, and so in playing video games and doing stuff like that distracts me from you know what really is going on. Okay, you've mentioned elsewhere in terms of video games and doing stuff like that distracts me from giving me what really is going on. Okay, you've mentioned elsewhere in terms of video games, Elder Scrolls. Did you play that?

Starting point is 00:13:50 Yeah, of course, it's probably my favorite game. If I could live in a world, you played more-wind and Skyrim. I played Oblivion. Oblivion? I played a little bit of more-wind, but I didn't like the graphics back then, but I really played the,

Starting point is 00:14:04 kind of swore on this podcast. I played the fuck out of Oblivion and Skyrim. Like, eight characters played it all the way through. I have to do all the quests, that type of thing. What's your favorite thing about those games? What, why did you spend so much time in that world? Because I like games that you can grind. What do you mean by grind? So like Stardew Valley for instance, right? There's a lot of back to the farming right? Okay, the same thing as Skyroom the reason why I like it is that there's a lot of like I have to collect a lot of these things. You know what I mean? I have to just

Starting point is 00:14:38 constantly pick things up. You know what I mean? Yeah. Like for instance in Skyroom there's a mushroom called blisterwort mushroom that you can pick and then you can make it into some sort of formula, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Potion, yeah. So I would spend like literally 12 hours a day just going to every cave and picking up as much blisterwort as I could, like that kind of grinding, you know what I mean?

Starting point is 00:15:02 Yeah, yeah. So you're actually the randomly generated quests that you do designed for people like you. Yeah, you don't get bored. That's the fun. Yeah, that's fun for me. Okay. Yeah, there's always something to do. And I find like when you play a game that's linear, like, there's certain games where you have to go this way, right? I don't like games like that. I like open world games where I can make choices and I can grind if I want. Yeah, yeah. Would you stay in that world if you could live in that world in the Elder Scrolls world? That's how I feel. In reality or become like an animated thing in there? Oh, no, say like virtual reality. We're moving towards that direction. Oh, yeah. If you look

Starting point is 00:15:41 at Skyroom, you mentioned graphics is graphics, it's starting to get realistic. Yeah. I'll sometimes just walk around, I mean, it's been a while, but I'll just walk around and Skyroom. Yeah. You can know there's code, you can turn off enemies, and you just walk around. Really?

Starting point is 00:15:58 You can just listen to music, can just walk around. That's what you did. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, I would do that. Wouldn't you do that? Would you do it with me? You sure? We would have a house together. Yeah, I would do that. Wouldn't you do that? Would you do it with me? You sure? We would have a house together?

Starting point is 00:16:08 Oh, I mean, live. I thought walk around. No, no, no, no. If you and I were able to go into Skyrim, right, and walk around and live together, would we make love? No, no, no, no, man. Don't go there.

Starting point is 00:16:19 OK. No, no, no, no, no, because we like girls, man. That's right. But it's not gay. You told me it's not gay. Yeah, it's not, yeah, yeah. All right. So you and I would, yeah, no, because we like girls, man. Oh, that's right. It's not gay. You told me it's not gay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. All right. So you and I would, yeah, I would hunt.

Starting point is 00:16:29 You would gather. But in that world, there's no hunting. Yeah, but there is hunting. I would do, we have the, because we don't have to find a bandit. We have to fight. I'm not going to gather a bandit. I'm going to hunt them. But I thought it's all about the potion.

Starting point is 00:16:42 You don't need the bandit. OK, well, we could do this. We could, you could be the guy that like defends our place. Yeah, right? I'll gather all the Blisterward all the white caps all the mushrooms. I'll get all the food. You know, I mean I'll go to white run Remember white run, yeah, right or winter hold and I'll do all the like quests that have nothing to do with You know, I mean so no dragons though.. No dragons, but we would have a banquet. We'd invite the dark dark brotherhood. Yeah. Right.

Starting point is 00:17:10 The fighters guild. We definitely invite them. Mages guilds. We'd invite them. Are you a thief kind of guy? I'm a thief guy. Yeah, I'm a bit, I'm for life. Yeah, I'm a thief guy for life.

Starting point is 00:17:18 And you still wouldn't invite Andrew Schultz to that. No, no, no. But what a piece of shit though, huh? Because let me just say something, okay? I just want to get back to that, okay, no, no. What a piece of shit though, huh? Because let me just say something, okay? I just want to get back to that, okay? Okay. Sure. So I met him at the Montreal Comedy Festival, and him and I are kindred souls. We really connected. Yeah. And he did my podcast. He's done a several times done his. We've communicated on the phone, this and that. And to me, and he invites Whitney Cummings, which Whitney is a good friend of mine.

Starting point is 00:17:48 But what I'm saying is that I know Andrew as well as Whitney knows him. I don't think that Whitney knows him more than I do. Right? What if it was a competition? Like it was a tie, you know, and like, and be like a, a Bobbie Lee versus Whitney. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:18:04 In what way do you think she's better and what way do you think you're better? You know what? And like, and be like a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, I don't think there was a lot of Koreans there So he could have used that card. This is true. Right, but I think he went for you know, Whitney's a woman. It's better for optics Okay, so she was a diversity higher for the wedding. Yeah, I see it was it's pretty fun. It was pretty I have to say I don't Is Joe Rogan. Yeah, I know his wife I get it now and then Whitney are those the leading comedians that were there? I spent a whole ton of talking in Joe's. I think, no, I don't think there was that many comedians. So I'm kind of joking about, it was a pretty pretty small wedding. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:18:58 What do you talk to Joe about? First of all, we're both grapplers. So we talk a lot about Jiu-Jitsu. We talk a lot about. I'm a grappler. Are you? I was on the wrestling team in high school. Yeah, I know.

Starting point is 00:19:09 I know this. Because I grappler the TU that I don't know Getsu is it is it only one kind of grappling that you like? Yeah, there's levels to this game, I think. I just talked that. No, there's nothing more. Yeah, that's a surprising fact that you've dropped that. It almost feels like a lie.

Starting point is 00:19:24 Because you've said that before, you were a wrestler in high school, it doesn't make sense. Well, it's funny that you say that because, and I'm gonna call it a little controversy here. Yeah, right. But Joe Rogan, one time came to me, when he lived in LA, this year's ago, he said, you're a liar, you've never grappled.

Starting point is 00:19:42 And I go, yes, I did. You're a fucking liar, no, you didn't. And at that time, I didn't have any photos to prove it. But if you look at my Instagram, I have photos. That I was a graph of you as a young man dressed in a singular. What on the wrestling team? On the wrestling team. If you go to the fucking, sorry, if you go to my, I'm sorry, if you go to my fucking high school. Yep. You're right. I was on the wrestling team for three years. I'm not gonna go to your high school.

Starting point is 00:20:08 So is there actual photo evidence of you? Yeah, I know. You know what? You're being like Rogan right now and I, you know, it really is. How do we know it's not photoshopped? Well, you can you, oh, you be the judge then, dude. Okay. So this is my brother and me in high school on the wrestling team, which

Starting point is 00:20:24 Oh, it's your. Yeah, I'm the bottom. That's my brother and me in high school on the wrestling team. Which, oh, it's your, yeah, you're... I'm the bottom, that's my brother to the left. I mean, yeah, to your right. Oh, handsome. Yeah, I'm not as... Yeah. How much do you weigh? Wow.

Starting point is 00:20:36 At the time I weighed, I was on the 105 weight category. Yeah. But, so I was also on the tennis team. What people don't realize is that I'm very athletic. Yeah. Yeah. Um, but so I was also on the tennis team, what people don't realize is that I'm very athletic. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. And I resent the fact that people that think that I'm not because I'm doughy. You're an athlete. So, uh, which is very surprising to me. Why? That, uh, so I was invited to the wedding. Yeah. Yeah. I've also been on Joe Rogan's podcast. He's a big fan of yours. I know, I love Joe. No, when Joe's and I see to the WeHoG,

Starting point is 00:21:07 it's not WeHoG, I just talk to him today and I'm talking to you. It's clear. So why, oh, YouHoG, I mean, just never, it just hasn't worked out. I don't want to go like, hey, because I don't want the rejection. So it's like, if I go, hey, can I do it?

Starting point is 00:21:23 And he goes, I don't know, man, I'm busy, man. I got a lot, I do it and he goes I don't know man. I'm busy man. We got I got a lot I mean maybe later you know, I don't want that so if you know if If he said hey, are you available Thursday this day fly out do my podcast I would 100% do it and that hasn't happened yet So interesting Why is it interesting? I don't know, because you're, like I said, you're one of the funniest people in the world.

Starting point is 00:21:48 That'd be a great conversation. It's just funny, it hasn't happened yet. Well, it's like this conversation. It's like, I just learned how to tell time. Yeah. Not like, I know how to read digital. You showed up on time today. No, digital.

Starting point is 00:21:59 I know how to write digital, obviously, but in terms of the hand clock. Yeah. I just learned that six months ago. How to operate digital, obviously, but in terms of the hand clock, I just learned that six months ago. How to operate a hand clock. To read a hand clock. Hand clock. Not that I obviously, I'll be able to absorb the information.

Starting point is 00:22:14 I'm one of those guys that just refused to learn things if I just... What did you think it was before? I would look at it and I would try to sometimes, like if I was at a train station, and I would look at it and I would try to sometimes like if I was at a train station. Yeah. And I would look at those old clocks. Yeah. I would look at it and try to guess and I kind of go, I think this is the way, you know, I mean, but like not fully, you know, I mean really grass of the way. Ancien people looked up at the sun to try to tell time you looked at at a clock to try to tell time.

Starting point is 00:22:41 Right. Like for instance, like we don't look at the sun, right? So it was to me was an obsolete information to me. Because of your digital, you already had digital. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And so that's somehow comparable to you going on the jarogon. And you, because it's like I don't know much about podcasting.

Starting point is 00:23:01 Not podcasting I can, but in terms of like the singularity and all that stuff, like I know what it is You know me when machines gonna be have consciousness When is that gonna happen? Soon are you afraid of robots? See if you were an austin I will show you some robots. Oh, I'd love to are you afraid of Robots? No, I love it. You love robots. Oh, yeah, yeah, in fact, I have this I think to me unless they become hostile and it becomes like the terminator, which I think could happen, right? There'd be a sky net,

Starting point is 00:23:30 we have to bring it down, whatever. There's definitely going to be a autonomous weapon system. So a lot of the robotics research is being conducted funded by the military. Wow. You know, the military industrial complex. I know what that is. Yeah. So a lot of the cutting edge research is done. It's funded by DOD Department of Defense, DARPA and so on. So a lot of the robots will be used in war, but hopefully not Most of consumer robotics will be in the home. I'm just trying to terrify you. No, no, but could I ask you this? No? What you're saying to me is that, as a layperson, is that in my lifetime,

Starting point is 00:24:09 that machines will have consciousness. Oh, that, I don't know. Computers. I'm one of the people, depending on your, you live dangerously, so I don't know how long you're gonna live. So let's put, but I believe that consciousness, yes, could be engineered in a machine,

Starting point is 00:24:29 or at least we can have machines that are human-like, and we believe they have consciousness. Can I ask you one last question about it? Yes. We'll do it one more. Will they have the smoothness of skin, and will they look realistic? See, I'm one of those people that believes that visual appearance isn't the magic

Starting point is 00:24:50 So if you close your if you're blind you can still have a connection with a person People can fall in love with each other through just letters So yeah, I know you're mocking me with your entire energy, but yes Yes, I believe that part too. You're talking about sex spots is what you're probably getting it. Okay, intimacy. Just friends, friends, but you want to feel

Starting point is 00:25:12 the smoothness. Yeah, like a guy like, you know, just go, what's up? And just, just hug and kiss my couple cheeks kind of thing. I get what you're saying though, right? Obviously there's no soul, you're right. You know what I mean? And I'm just curious to see. Have you seen it?

Starting point is 00:25:27 I was going with sex spots, but let me. Have you seen Whitney Cummings' robot? Yeah, I've seen it. How do that make you feel? She's a beautiful girl. I just don't find her attractive. The robot or Whitney? I find the robot way more attractive.

Starting point is 00:25:42 Yeah, if I had the choice robot. So you were turned on by the robot way more attractive. Yeah, if I had the choice robot. So you were turned on by the robot. See, I was surprised by the very thing you're saying, which is the realism of the skit, like it was quite, they did a really good job in that robot. Oh, they did. The life when, when it's animated, the life is not quite there. You can tell us the robot boat just sitting there still. It a lot of human like elements the texture I don't know. Yeah, it's quite fast. They're getting there. They're getting there. Yeah, yeah, but the funny thing about sex robots is most people that get sex robots They don't get it for the sex they get it for like intimacy

Starting point is 00:26:20 like Not not sexual intimacy, but like Just somebody being there. It's the emotional connection not the sexual. Yeah, I mean, I you know I saw a long time ago a Documentary about real dolls and people marrying them. Yeah, yeah, and What I was fascinated about is the cuddling you know me and then watching TV together and stuff like that Which I find you know, I've just been able to find human girlfriends and stuff So I'm really impressed. I think that's one of the reasons

Starting point is 00:26:56 Thanks man. Yeah, thanks. Hey speaking of human girlfriends I'd love your advice in this direction, but you're you have an amazing relationship with Calyla. Yeah. So you two are very different. So you host the Tiger Boiler podcast together, but there's there's real love there. There's there's a real connection. What do you what do you love most about Calyla? Let's talk about love, Bobbi Lee. Yeah, I mean, that's a really pretty deep. I've never really gone down this path. We're going to walk down that path together holding hands.

Starting point is 00:27:30 It's one of those things where the first time I met her, it was almost as if I had known her all my life. It was really weird. You know, I mean, there was a trust there, you know what I mean, that was just fundamentally there, that I could trust her, and that I could, you know, when I look in the mirror and I see all my character defects and stuff, a lot of those things aren't necessarily things I want to share with people because I don't want to be judged or ridiculed. But with her, I felt comfortable showing those things. And I think she feels the same way about her. And then secondly, she's funny.

Starting point is 00:28:13 You mean she made me laugh and she's hot. It's all, you know, I mean, the perfect, it was like a perfect combination of things. You know, I mean, she one night we were in bed and I forgot what the joke was, but she really made me laugh one night. She was living in an apartment in Long Beach, and I cackled, you know, I mean, and generally women don't make, I mean, not women I'm dating, comics do, don't make me cackle in that way. And then, thirdly, she has, she's partly Asian. Thirdly, she has... She's partly Asian.

Starting point is 00:28:50 So it's like, you know, one time I dated a white girl and I invited her to create town. I hear about the beauty racists. A little bit. Yeah, yeah. And what I love about Asian girls is, they'll eat something first and ask what it is after, but white girls ask what it is before. What is this? But Clile would eat the eyeball, eat everything, go, what did I just eat? I like that.

Starting point is 00:29:14 So it's like, and it reminds me of my mom in that way, in terms of like, my mom growing up just to scare us and freak us out, we'd have a fish and we should eat the eyeball first to see a squirm. And as a kid, you thought it was gross and weird and this and that, but it's like, you know, when Kaliila does it, it just kind of like, I don't know, it just makes me feel like at home. You know, weird way. It's a little act of fearlessness. I like that. Just putting your mouth and figuring it out. Yeah, that's what I like. And at the end of this, she also, out of all my girlfriends, this is going to sound not strange, but hard to admit. But my career when I met Kuala was in the shit box.

Starting point is 00:30:06 I could not get anything going. And this is at the time where Ken Jong, who's a very good friend of mine, and very talented, was getting everything. And I just remember going, I can't even get an audition. Like I can't, I would go on the road, Lex, and I would fill half the room.

Starting point is 00:30:24 I just couldn't sell tickets. And when I met her, I was just kind of like, maybe this is the, I had to find love and open up my world in that way. And she was the first girlfriend that I ever had that looked at me and saw the potential. And she said, no, this is not, this isn't feel right. You're so funny and you're so relevant to me. And this is what we're going to do. And so she started Tiger Belly, you know, and then obviously I had the skill set to do it. But once Tiger Belly happened and then Andrew was like, let's do bad friends and then now things are great.

Starting point is 00:31:09 You know, my career is, I'm too busy almost in a weird way, you know. And I feel like she had a lot to do with like, for instance, before I met her, even if I would get an audition, I wouldn't go because I just wouldn't get it. In my head, I was like, I'm not going to get this. I've gone on a thousand of these and they just never hire me. So I just didn't go on them for years. And then she was the first girlfriend that said, no, I don't care if you don't get it, right? I just don't need to be a pussy. And I want you to walk through fear.

Starting point is 00:31:43 And so she would drag me these fucking things. And I for some reason would book them. You know what I mean? So, you know, in that way, I saw the potential of what you could be. But she loved you for who you are already. Yes. But also loved you for the potential that you could become. Yeah. And I'm lucky in that way. You know, on day one, you could show her, you said you could show your floss to her. Like you felt like you could be fragile with her. Well, I accidentally farted. Yeah. Or day one on day one, you know, because I just had my fart machine. Yeah. And I have loose cheeks. Yeah. I like how you were, were the listeners, you just winked at me. Yeah. I have loose cheeks and but not in a gay way.

Starting point is 00:32:26 Not in a gay way, no, and I was, we were in a couch and we're talking and I kind of adjusted my body. I ripped one by accident and she laughed, you know, I mean, it wasn't embarrassing, you know, and also have a little penis. I have a little penis and it's all relative. Yes, it's a little, but relative to an elephant, everybody's penis is low. Yeah, but I'm not an elephant. I'm a human. So relative to be human, it's very small. And so when she saw it, I thought she was going to bark at it.

Starting point is 00:32:58 She looked at it as if it was an orphan. It's, I wanna, it's a lost child, and I wanna, you know, take care of it. Yeah, yeah, cradle it. It's a little bit. Yeah. What you meant, you haven't meant anybody like that? Never met a girl, never seen one of them. I hear they're nice.

Starting point is 00:33:23 When are the two you get married. We don't know yet. Yeah, is that something you would like? Yeah, this comes up sometimes. You know, we're in couples counseling, we're dealing, we're working on some issues that we have, every relationship, even my friendships have issues.

Starting point is 00:33:41 And so we're working through some issues, and once we get to the end of it, we'll figure it out. Would you like to be a father one day? This is kind of couples council. You know, yeah, I do. I do because I feel like You know before I was very childlike, you know, I play a lot of video games, I'm irresponsible, I'm lazy, this and that, right? But, you know, to be honest with you, Lex in the last six months, I've really have come through some breakthroughs. And I'm in therapy and I'm doing a lot of things and really self-analysing myself and my behaviors

Starting point is 00:34:25 and what I want, my desires, and I think ultimately, yes, I really do because it's a life experience that I don't wanna be an old man looking back and going, it's something that I've always was interested in and I think it's based on fear because I don't want to scar my child the way my parents scarred me. But at the same time, my parents didn't do the work on themselves like I am and they were

Starting point is 00:34:58 never about self-improvement. They were just about, they were immigrants, you know, and they wanted to put food on the table. And after that, they just went about their business. And I'm not like that. I would never be violent toward my kids, like my parents were. My dad was very physically abusive, you know. There was a lot of trauma on stuff. And so, you know, as a kid, I thought,

Starting point is 00:35:23 you know, I would never put my kid through this. So that's why I never wanted it. But I would completely do it differently, you know, even yelling and those kind of things. I would be very mindful about those things. And I think that I have certain things, you know, I'm not a science guy like you, but there are life things that I have learned over the years that I could teach a child, you know, about living in the moment or walking through fear or, you know, things that, you know, things will pass and just different things, you know, that I could, I would be a good listener and, um, yeah, I would like to do that. Your dad died in August of 2019.

Starting point is 00:36:05 Wow. Yeah. He did your research. Yeah, it's on your Wikipedia. Yeah. So you said some of it was rough, but what's your fondest memory of your dad? What, those memories happened later in life. As a child, my fondest memory was, my mom, because he never spent time with us.

Starting point is 00:36:32 So my mom made him take me out one day and he took me to a park. Like, he doesn't, there was no baseball glove or baseball or anything like that. And we sat on a park bench right and We just sat there for hours. We didn't talk because he didn't know English that well and no Korean So it's just very, you know, basic, you know information being you know, man. How are you? Does that we go how are you doing?

Starting point is 00:37:05 I'm okay, you know? Good, good, good. That type of thing? Yeah, for a long time. For a long time. And then, but the day turned bad because I forgot my jacket there. And he yelled at me. But there was a bit of peace together.

Starting point is 00:37:21 At that time, yeah, that was peace. But then what happened was later in life when I got Matt TV and I was doing, you know, in my early years, you know, I booked a couple of things like in 2000. I did the tonight show on Leno and then I did, um, I got Matt TV in 2000 and um, wow, that's over 20 years ago. And that's when my parents kind of went, huh, you know, because obviously, you know, there's some nepotism in Hollywood, right? But in my case, my parents were straight up immigrants. I had no connections to Hollywood.

Starting point is 00:38:01 And I came up here poor, you know, with no connections and I built it, you know, I'm in through the years, you know, and in that way, I'm very proud of myself because I went through a lot of fucking hell and sadness and desperation and all that stuff and I persevered and I did all that shit on my own, man. I the tonight show on my own. I got Matt to the aunt my own. And when I did those things, my parents were very proud. But before that, did they dial you? Oh yeah. You're not funny.

Starting point is 00:38:40 You're never make me laugh. Right. And that kind of stuff. you're never make me love. Yeah. Right. And that kind of stuff. Yeah. You're never gonna make it. You know, I mean, you're gonna be poor all your life. You know, that kind of stuff. But Mad TV, he was proud. You're dead. Well, you know, every, because it was a weekly show.

Starting point is 00:38:57 So on Saturday nights, they would watch it. They would. Yeah. And then I would, I would play characters that they would understand. Like I did Kim Jong Il at the time Yeah, right? So they love that right they loved you know the things that I would do the physical comedy Yeah, and they couldn't believe in their mind, you know, I imagine your parents from Korea

Starting point is 00:39:19 Coming here, you know not knowing the language having a child here, right? And in their minds, that was never like an option, right? And so when they see their kid, I guess, on TV, it's mostly there was no internet too at the time. The internet had just started. So to them, they were like, this is a miracle. In fact, when I I did the tonight show my dad called me the next day and asked me He literally asked me this he goes How much did you pay them to do it? He thought that I'd saved all my money like that like he thought that like Tom Cruise goes up there and goes Here's a grand thanks. They have me like you know, I go. No, they asked me like so all the conceptually

Starting point is 00:40:03 like, you know, I go, no, they asked me. Like, all the conceptually, they were just shocked by it. So when I got it and then they were watching me weekly, Matt TV, the producers was like, hey, have your dad on. So my dad did two or three sketches on television. So, and that, so those memories, I also did a pilot for Comedy Central and he was on my pilot.

Starting point is 00:40:26 Uh, pilot for like a show. Yeah, show. I didn't got picked up, but he was on the pilot. He was in the show? Yeah, he was in the pilot. He was on that TV too. On television. Interesting. Yeah. Oh wow, okay. Yeah, yeah. So it's like he, he would get residual checks. Yeah, you know, I mean, you know, just change everything. Those nepotism and reverse. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, it was really nepotism and reverse. And so he, in those memories are very,

Starting point is 00:40:53 I have very fun memories because he had changed as well. He was no longer that violent kind of guy. He had softened a lot, you know what I mean? But when he died, is when those issues came up, you know, like a freight train, the bad stuff. Oh yeah. And I didn't know what was going on. I was really hard. You miss them? Yeah. How often do you think about them every day? Obviously, a lot of it's regrets, you know mean Like what kind of regrets not having said something or

Starting point is 00:41:28 Not having had a conversation It's not regrets because even if you were still alive there are just things that are impossibilities Because of his culture and the way he was raised but my regret in life will always be Having those types of, even because I tried, I was with my mom a couple of months ago. And I looked at her and I tears in my eyes where the star box, I go, I just want to let you know that I'm so sorry that you lived in that house and my dad, you know, and dad hit you and you survived and you

Starting point is 00:42:06 staged in the marriage because of us, right? And you know what a response was? Let's go to book a chapel. She wanted Italian food. Like it was, it like there was no, there was nothing there, right? And so my regret is that, you know, that they just wouldn't, they'll never be able to even grasp the concept of that kind of communication, you know what I mean? And I'll never have it. So that's sad to me, you know, but there's nothing I can do about it.

Starting point is 00:42:38 Yeah, that calis, that comes with the immigrant mentality. You don't even, that emotional connection is not even there. I've had my grandmother, yeah, she, there's something called Haldemore, which is starvation in Ukraine in the 1930s that you had to live through, she lived through World War II, and there's nothing like the only way you survive that is the callus. You bring it. You can't talk with people that fought in major wars. They can't talk about it.

Starting point is 00:43:11 My mom, when she was 12 years old, she walked her little sister, my aunt, to school. Right? She forgot a book. So my mom goes to my little sister, my aunt, stay here. I'm going to go get my book. She ran up, she came back. While she was gone, a military truck ran over my aunt, and my mom discovered her body, split and have,

Starting point is 00:43:34 entrails the whole thing, and my mom and my uncle has had to go and get rice bags to pick up her, you know what I mean? And then bury my aunt, you know, when you live through something like that, and also the guilt, because my mom believes deep down that if she didn't forget that book, that her aunt would still be alive, right? So she carries all this guilt in this and to survive all that trauma, you have to build a callus.

Starting point is 00:43:58 Back then, they didn't have EMDR and therapist and psychologists and any of that, right? So they had to survive. So that's who she is. they didn't have EMDR and therapist and psychologist and any of that right so they had to survive. So that's who she is and it's sad to me that you know I mean that it'll forever, she'll forever live in that torment. Um, boy, what about your own? What's, uh, what's been the darkest place you ever gone in your mind? Did you wrote that down in my mind? In your mind, do you ever consider suicide? I didn't write that down.

Starting point is 00:44:38 Okay. Have you considered it in a distance? Yeah. I've distantly thought about it. Um, you know, about four months ago, I was in a really bad place. I was naked in a hotel room in Arizona, and eaten in like almost a week.

Starting point is 00:45:00 I hadn't slept in over a week. I haven't slept, you know, and I thought I was dying. I was coughing up blood and I was waiting to go into a outpatient psychologist place, you know what I mean? In Arizona, I literally thought I was dying. So recently I was in a very dark place. How much was that connected to losing your father? How much was that connected to rehab and that kind of stuff? Alcohol drugs. All the same thing, dude.

Starting point is 00:45:35 It's all the same thing, man. It's, it's, um, it's all from my childhood, right? The reason why I do stand up is because of my childhood, the hating yourself or like being self-critical has to do with your childhood. Yes. So the drugs and drinking is childhood, childhood. It's all about survival and protecting your heart. You know, and there are ways that I did that as a kid, like using humor as a defense mechanism and also avoidance of all emotions, you know,

Starting point is 00:46:08 main because it just want to feel. And I'm able, the reason why comedy is so good. I, the reason why I was able to survive in comedy is because I can withstand a lot of bullshit and pain. You know what I mean? Like physical, emotional, spiritual pain, I'm, I can absorb it, right? But now what's happened, you know, later in life, is I'm unwilling to do that. I'm unwilling to absorb it.

Starting point is 00:46:42 I'm unwilling to carry this weight around with me. And it'll kill me. So I am doing everything I can to free myself of all this baggage. Okay. So how you make it in Arizona in a hotel room. Face down or face up or on the side. What's your favorite when you go to a dark place? No, no. On the floor on the bed or... So what happened with... Bad sum. Shower. A fetal position. Okay. I don't lay on my stomach. That's weird. Like, like, I'm not doing like a downward dog. Oh, yoga position has been or anything like that. No, I'm like... I'm on the bed on the floor. No, what happened was... So I had relapse, so I was doing drinking all night long. What was the first relapse?

Starting point is 00:47:29 What is the thing, the first thing you did, just drank what, wine. No, I could get an edible. Yeah, and that opened the door to drinking. Yeah, and the combination is not good for me. And the excess of the amount isn't that good for me. I just can't stop. And I do it 24 hours a day. Were you alone?

Starting point is 00:47:52 Well, no, I was living with Kaliila. No, I mean, at that moment, we did the Edibles. I was alone. No, I took a flight because I was shooting a magnum, I'm on a show called Magnum PI. So I was flying to Hawaii. So I bought edibles and then right before I was gonna get on the plane, I looked at my girlfriend and said,

Starting point is 00:48:13 I'm gonna relapse. I'll send you, you knew. I knew. So I got on the plane, I took it and then literally the next three months were like a blur. Why'd you know? What gave you the sense that you're gonna relapse? There was a couple of things that happened in my life that were very shocking to me. and I just, and I wasn't going to meetings and I, you know, it's the same old story, you know, I was not connected to my sobriety brothers and sisters and I was drifting away and I,

Starting point is 00:48:55 um, and something in your mind, it was just, I just, the pain was too much. So I did it. And then so what happened was now two and a half months in three months in I I started coughing up chunks of blood Right, so I was because I've been a smoker since I was 17 years old, right and I was smoking so much weed and cigarettes I was just cough up blood But then simultaneously what happened was Bob Sackett and Louis Anderson died. Right?

Starting point is 00:49:27 And that week when I was coughing up a lot, and because I knew them, both of them, I just in my head going, I'm next. Because to me everything happens in threes. You know me? You know it? Yeah. And I'm like, and I had convinced myself that I was going to die and I was on the precipice of death. And so I begged my people to put me into this place in Arizona.

Starting point is 00:49:55 So because I knew I knew what I needed to go to a really rigorous psychology program to get me out of wherever what I was going through. And also I was getting, at that time, when I was in that hotel room, I had not drank or even smoked a cigarette or didn't drug in a week. I had to wait in LA for this bed to open up, right? So I was coughing up blood, I hadn't slept and eaten, right?

Starting point is 00:50:21 I was sober, but I was in so much pain. And I slept naked by the right? I was sober, but I was in so much pain. And I slept naked by the door of this hotel room because I thought it would be easier for the maid to discover my body. I mean, that's how fucked up I was. I was just in this prison in my mind, you know? And how much better now?

Starting point is 00:50:44 Can you give some insights to how to get out of that place, how you got out of that place? I think getting sober, first of all, was very important, but that still didn't do it completely. I still was convinced that I was, and then I went to this place, and I did, this place is a 12 hours a day psychotherapy place where you do 12 hours of, you see therapists all day long.

Starting point is 00:51:10 So it's like a 12 hour long podcast every day. Yeah, yeah. But with professionals and they call you on your shit and they tell you what's real and they tell you, you know, I mean, you know, I'm going also dealing with, you know, my still my dad's still some of these other things are, you know what I mean, you know, I'm going also dealing with, you know, my still my dad still some of these other things are, you know what I mean, and the third thing that happened was when I got back to L.A. after that place, I got my lungs checked out and I got my physical done and, you know, EKG, my heart, heart all of it and I was completely fine You know and I quit smoking I haven't smoked in almost four months I've been drinking done drugs since then too, so um, you know, there's definitely a complete clarity and I have to also admit that

Starting point is 00:52:01 this time around It's just been completely different. Is there still in the distance a fear of relapse and all that kind of stuff? Is that still? No. So you feel good. I feel great. Yeah. I feel better than I've ever felt. Even when hard shit happens. Yeah, because it's like I no longer want to be in that place. Yeah. And also on top of it, it's like, it would be real shame because I've worked so hard to get to this place in my life, not just in my career with all of it. You know what I mean?

Starting point is 00:52:34 I have so much to lose. I have so many people that love me. I just don't want to be there again, you know. Let me ask you, sorry, you've talked about this before but it's interesting. Let me ask you a question. You always wear suit only for the podcast. Yeah, I wear it in private too.

Starting point is 00:52:51 Oh, you do? Not always, no, because I get recognized that unfortunately, you have to be selective about how I wear what you like it when being recognized or no. So because of podcasting, as you probably know, the people that at least recognize me are happening to be amazing people. So like, yeah, like they, it's immediate connection.

Starting point is 00:53:13 So there's two things about that. I don't like, so one, I'm, I fall in love with people. And so the nature of interaction is like, well, it's gonna be short. So yeah, yeah. So like, you have to say goodbye. And I hate good vibes. You do. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:53:33 And then the other thing is just introversion. I'm an introvert. I have social anxiety. I have nervous about talking to people and so on. So you have to always, I'm walking around always a little bit anxious that there will be an interaction. But ultimately, once it starts, it's fun, it's beautiful. And then the, the, the, the goodbyes of what hurts.

Starting point is 00:53:57 So both the hello and the goodbyes of what hurts, it's the stuff in the middle of this delicious. I think there's a beautiful thing though for people like you and I in a weird way, you know, because number one, I don't know about you, but I'm an isolated or I don't really like, you know, any kind of social thing, you know, I like my, even when I was doing drugs and drinking, I never do with people. I do it privately in a garage, you know. And secondly, um, you know, like I was my girlfriend, I went watch the Northman, the movie of the Northman. No, what is it? Does it tell me the plot line? You didn't even hurt the Northman? I have not hurt the Northman. It's aggr is he did a movie called The Witch. He also did a movie called

Starting point is 00:54:42 The Lighthouse. You ever seen The Lighthouse? Okay. You watch movies. No, you've never seen a movie called The Witch. She also did a movie called The Lighthouse. You ever seen The Lighthouse? Okay. You watch movies. No. You've never seen a movie. I've seen The Godfather. Yeah. I bet you money you've seen Dr. Javaka. Yes.

Starting point is 00:54:53 You have. Yes. Yeah. You like historical sweeping. Yeah. Shindler's list. Yeah. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:55:01 If it's not historical or sweeping, you're not going to like. All right. So I have to explain. It's basically a Viking movie. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. And scars. One of the scars guard. I don't know. Scar's guard. Brothers isn't it. York's in it. Willem Dafoe, Nicole Kidman, Ethan Hawke. And it's a, you know, it's a Viking revenge movie. So why does it make you think about isolation? No, be good. No.

Starting point is 00:55:24 What I was going to say is when we went when we went to the movie theater, right? Afterwards, there was a kid sitting next to me and he just looks at me because I guess he didn't know I was sitting next to him or whatever. And he just went, you know, hey, dude, I just can't believe you're sitting next to me, you know, and you're my hero. And I'm, I'm think I'm doing comedy and it's really hard So I was able to give him some encouraging things and cuz that's who I am too, you know I mean I want to help people and I also You know the idea that he likes me because he also sped it up specifics about my life, about my comedy and this and that. So he definitely was a fan and I was able to, you know, you know, I'm not even if I

Starting point is 00:56:15 become Joe Rogan famous or that big, you know what I mean? I'm always going to say hi to people, I'm always gonna take photos with people. I like that part of me. It makes me feel also that I belong in a weird way because I felt so invisible before I did comedy. I mean, I felt invisible. And it puts me in the game of life, I think, in a weird way. So I think it's good for you as well. Yeah, it's a little moment of experiencing love. It does feel like celebrating life together. You smile each other and so on. Although you did say, I think in a recent podcast

Starting point is 00:56:54 that people recognize you, but recognize you incorrectly. That I don't like. That's the opposite of love. Okay. Yeah, I don't like, love you the opposite of love. Okay. Yeah, that, I don't like, love you when they hangover. Yeah, I mean, you know, I, you know, I, or this is what I don't like. This is why I hate this. Yes.

Starting point is 00:57:15 Some guy will like me, right? I'll take a photo and then other people will go, huh? He's somebody and will walk up to me and go, hey, so why did he take a photo? You know, I want a photo. Yeah, and they're like no, I Don't do would you do that? No, I would I don't like that. No, yeah, no, but I do like the Experience where maybe there's a couple a Guy and a girl boyfriend a girlfriend and the guy is a fan and the girlfriend has no idea

Starting point is 00:57:46 And it's always a funny and a ranger. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, she's like trying to figure out what is happening here. Yeah, and it's always beautiful to see. But what if the guy when he the guy explains to his girlfriend who you are, do you feel comfortable about that? Yeah, yeah, yeah, it loads the information is transferred quickly and she starts to understand because she's not used to her boyfriend being excited about a stranger. Yeah. What was happening here? So it's a fascinating little dynamic that's beautiful.

Starting point is 00:58:12 It's like the spread of information happens right there in real life. It's beautiful. It's mostly though, would you say that it's probably usually men that recognize you or no, but men the thing I've discovered is men are more likely to approach aggressively right Women recognize you they have a different way of like double take They don't want to invade your space guys are like bro Yeah, they come in with a hug and South by Southwest at a guy

Starting point is 00:58:48 I just walking till 7 I go to 7 I'm a lot my favorite spot. Guys, 7 11 years. Oh Sugar free slushy, I think For happiness. I like I find happiness at a 7 11 Late late at night and he came up and you know? Can I tell you something that happened to me? I haven't told anybody. This never happened to me before. I was outside of a 7-Eleven in Austin. I'm not gonna say which one.

Starting point is 00:59:13 And there was a gentleman that approached me. This was at three or four at night, which is usually when I go, I program all night and I just like to go and take a break. He approached me in the way that maybe somebody who recognized me approached me. He did a double take. He walked past me and then walked back and then looked at me and I went into the 7-11 and thought that's weird.

Starting point is 00:59:38 And then I came out with my slushie and then he approached me and he said can I give you a blow job. So I have not... No, really? Yeah, so the energy he put... I've never had... Were you wearing a suit? No. Okay.

Starting point is 01:00:04 I was wearing like The sweatpants and I was very kind of like hiding from the world. Yeah, yeah, type of thing I've never had anybody approach me that way, but the energy he put the love he had in the approach. I thought you'd be like Love you on Rogan. Yeah, love I love you on Rogan. Yeah, I love you. Yeah. Something like love, some kind of, and then he just said, can I, I'm forgetting the exact wording because it wasn't,

Starting point is 01:00:30 the wording was such that he wasn't, he wanted to make me happy. Ah. He didn't want to make himself happy. You want to make me happy. Well, I forgot, can I give you a blowjob? I think that was the thing. I said, because if he said, can you give me a blowjob, it would be very different.

Starting point is 01:00:49 Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, but I think there's more aggressive way of phrasing that, but he presented himself. Yeah, forget. It was almost like gentle and poetic. And I was like, I just started and said, no, no, thank you. I just moved past. That's what everyone does. Yeah, no thank you too. Well, I will probably start.

Starting point is 01:01:10 No, no, no, no, no, no, no, thank you. In my mind, I was like, is this a threat? Because it's for a night. I wasn't exactly sure. I mean, I've never experienced it. I imagine this is what sort of women often experience the kind of the danger, the constant threat to all the wrong.

Starting point is 01:01:26 But I've never, it was a funny little moment. I didn't know what to do with it. Yeah. That happened and I go to that 7-11 often looking for the guy. It's now. All right. I would say yes. No.

Starting point is 01:01:41 There used to be a steam room in Beverly on Beverly Boulevard and My brother and I walked in their ones and I we walked in and was a man sitting there erection and His dick was so big. He was jerking it off with both hands and We kind of walked in and he goes what's up? And he just did it and we just sat there, you know I mean because it was not aggressive. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And maybe that was the same feel you sense that it wasn't an aggressive thing. Yeah. It wasn't. Yeah. Yeah. It was just a kind, it was, he was just minding his own business and he threw it out. But it wasn't also, it wasn't sexual either. It was like, it was like, it's just,

Starting point is 01:02:21 you know, it's just like, it's like love or something. Yeah. I felt like know, it's just like it's like love or something Yeah, I felt like he it's almost like can I give you a hug? Right the one just take it. I I keep looking for it. It's fine. I see it But not in a gay way. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I just want to be clear while that you grew up in Russia or Ukraine Russia a Russia. Yeah, but you great grandmother where grandmother was in my father's Ukrainian. Oh, your grandmother's Ukrainian So if you just look at the full family trace about half and half his Russian lot of conflict with you right now The internally. Yeah, let me let me ask you talked about this before, but I'd love to sort of re-explore this is Carlos, Mencia Oh my god. Yeah,. Why go there again? Yeah.

Starting point is 01:03:06 I'm willing to do it, but do you like Carlos? Well, first of all, I'm friends with Joe. And I remember being a fan of, I'm outside of this whole world. I remember thinking Carlos was funny. Yeah. So it's just as a fan, I was like, oh, funny. And then I remember this remember all this big controversy about him stealing jokes.

Starting point is 01:03:31 And because I'm a fan of yours, it's such an interesting human dynamic. And I'm a fan of friendship and loyalty. And you had a great podcast conversation with him. It was tense. It was tense. It was very tense. But it was interesting. And it kinda, what makes you think of you talking

Starting point is 01:03:47 to your father on that bench? So, that's what it was. Yeah, that's exactly what it was. Some of it wasn't getting through. But maybe, how do you feel about that whole thing about the guy? I mean, he gave you, he's a friend, he gave you a lot. But you're also comedians, he gave you a lot.

Starting point is 01:04:05 But you're also comedians, stealing jokes is no good. But also there's like a, I don't know, all the tensions in your heart about all that whole thing. How do you feel about it? Do you forgive him? Okay, let's just, let's go back to the, it's very Shakespearean in a very weird way why because there's some Betrayal there, you know, I mean there's a lot of drama when it comes to that situation Again, also, I'm a very loyal guy like I've had the same manager

Starting point is 01:04:38 since um The late 90s and I've had every the late 90s and I've had every gigantic manager want to sign me. Even though my manager is great, she's not a big company and there's only so much she can do. Maybe my career would have been different if I would have signed with a bigger management. I don't know, but I will never leave her. I'll never leave my agent Matt. People go, well, you're at CAA, that's amazing. The only reason why I'm at CAA is because of Matt Blake.

Starting point is 01:05:09 There are certain loyalties that I have, the comedy store. I generally play the comedy store mostly because my loyalties are with them. I don't know if that's a good trait, but it's just the way I am, right? I admire that. Yeah. Okay. So when it comes to Carlos, you know, in the early, in the mid 90s is when I met him. That was a door man at the lawyer comedy store. He brought me on the road. He introduced me to a map like my agent, right? And he bought me a car, you know, when I couldn't pay rent, you know, and I was really desperate, I could always go to him for money, you know, and he helped me out in so many different ways, right? So, in, you know, I really appreciate that. Paul did the same thing. So anyway, and then all of a sudden,

Starting point is 01:06:05 and I always knew going on the road with them that number one, I found it odd that he never had a notebook. Usually comics riff with each other and they write things down. You know what I mean? Me, I'll get together with people and write. I'll do a new joke night because I'm too scared to try it in front of a pack room or whatever

Starting point is 01:06:27 it might be, okay? He never had did that, right? And he had hours of material. And you know, a lot of it was derivative of other peoples. He would sometimes hear a bit change it to Mexican. Like for instance, if Paul Mooney had a joke about black people, he would change it, change it a bit, but premise wise, it was always extremely too similar. And there are examples on the internet.

Starting point is 01:06:58 So, you know, you can't, there's things that you can't really deny. And so when that whole thing happened, you know, it was like the Titanic. I mean, I was either going to sink with Carlos or survive. And I did the worst, not the worst thing, but I made a difficult decision and my decision was to cut ties. And over the years, I've felt very guilty about it in some respects, but You know there is always in my mind

Starting point is 01:07:30 I want to help him, you know, I want to help him Reestablish some sort of a different, you know Route for him to go in terms of his career and whatnot, and so I had him on my podcast and it didn't go the way I wanted it to go. You know, I mean, I've always believed if he just fully just was apologetic and said, you know, I'm sorry for stealing in general because we don't know specifically. I mean, there's specifics, you know, I mean, and I don't want to argue every case, you know, so I thought the healthiest thing to do was like in just an abroad way Listen, I stole I'm so sorry the use of the reasons why and I'm a different guy now, but it just never happened in that way And so it's been

Starting point is 01:08:18 Difficult. So you don't think he self-reflected looking in the mirror about mistakes of the past at all Like do you think he's aware? I think it's ego. I think that he, for one reason or another, because there are probably jokes that he literally, legitimately in his heart know that he wrote that people are accusing of stealing,

Starting point is 01:08:43 right? But it's like, we don't know, right? So it's like just apologize for all of it, right? But he won't. He fights for every, you know, every point. And, you know, I just think that that's not the route. And he, I mean, he's always going to make money. He's, you know, he's never going to be what he should be, which is he's a powerful performer, you know, in

Starting point is 01:09:14 terms of laughs. I mean, dude, I wouldn't, I wouldn't want to follow him. He's a crusher, you know. So it's like, you know, it's really, he can act. He has all the skill sets. It's just that, to me, he went about it in the wrong way and it's sad to me. But I always love him. I've always, we'll thank him for all the help that he's done. So you still got room in your heart form. I've room for my heart for a lot of people, man.

Starting point is 01:09:42 Hitler. All right. What was returning back to Tegabelli? my heart for a lot of people, man, you know, Hitler. All right. What was the returning back to tagabelli? Because you said, Kalala basically started it. What's the origin story of tagabelli? You know, when I met her, by the way, for people listening in case you somehow don't know what tagabelli is, the podcast you do is an amazing podcast, you also do bad friends with Anderson centino.

Starting point is 01:10:06 Yeah, so on. Thank you so much for the plug. Appreciate it. I don't know. It's context. It's not the plug. Can I plug other things? What's this?

Starting point is 01:10:14 We're doing it. Sure. Sure. I'm on a show called Ruffler. Okay. That's enough of that. Thank you. So what's the name of the show you're on?

Starting point is 01:10:22 I'm on a couple shows. It's good for you. Netflix. No. Okay. I'm on a couple you couple shows. Oh, it's good for you Netflix. It's no okay. I'm on The sex in the city sex in the city. Yeah, I'm on reservation dogs It's an effect show wait sex in the city is not a joke No, I am actually on sex in the city. Wait, are they rebuting the show? They did okay It's called and just like that sex in the city. Oh, and you're on it. Yeah.

Starting point is 01:10:47 Is this not a joke? You can Google it. Okay. You know what I mean? Who do you play? I play a podcast or on it. On the show, Syracuristic Aparkas, Carrie has a podcast and I'm a podcast partner.

Starting point is 01:11:01 Oh, got it. Perfect. But then, but I'm also now they've my storyline. Anyway, it's fine. Do you sleep with somebody on there? I am married on the show. Yeah, they showed my, I'm married to a young lady on it. Yeah. All right. It felt like it felt like it. You know, because you don't think doing it. I look around going, are you sure I'm supposed to be on this? You know what I mean? I do feel that. But lo and behold, I'm on it. Yeah, you are.

Starting point is 01:11:27 So, um, I started this way. So, you know, my friend David Cho, do you know him? He's an artist. He used to have a podcast, right? Called DVD-ASA. And, um, he used to have me on it. And then, Collilah started good doing it. And then, when DVD-ASA ended, And he used to have me on it and then Collilah started doing it.

Starting point is 01:11:48 And then when DVD essay ended, Collilah was just like, let's start our own. And I was like, nah, it's not gonna work. So she goes, well, fine, I'm gonna just do it on my own then. So she went and bought the equipment and we were living in a condo at the time in Hollywood and she would do them on her own. She did probably three on her own. And one day I was watching television,

Starting point is 01:12:10 the door was open to the podcast room and I looked, turned around and she was literally like this, dude, we had a table like this with, she had the mic and all that stuff. And she was doing this, she was like slumped over like this. And I just kind of went, fuck it. So I walked in there, I got, our lets us do one. Yeah. And that was, that's how it started. And then chemistry was there immediately. Well, I already knew that she could do it because of DVDSA, right? So I

Starting point is 01:12:36 already knew that she had the skillset. It's, you know, it's just all about, even in this conversation that you and I had today, right? There were gaps of like, oh, what else should we talk about, right? Yeah. Or like, I don't know what direction, right? And it's all about the old improveral adding information. Even if you don't know what you're gonna say, just fill the dead space with something. Like, so if right now if we had stopped,

Starting point is 01:13:02 we stopped talking about something, I'm like, like, when I asked you, did you grew up in Russia or Ukraine Right was one of those dead spaces where I was just like let's just start out there to see where this goes right and she has that ability to fill that dead space with Information that's all you need right and She gets it in that way so it's like when we um You know started doing it at DVD assay. I just knew that she had the skill set. So when we started doing a for Tiger Belly It was a given, you know, you know, she can do it. I've had girlfriends that wouldn't be able to do it. What what are you doing? You know, you have the skill set

Starting point is 01:13:43 You know, you're a sciencey guy. You spend all night long, you know what I mean? You know what I mean? You know what I mean? You know, I'm doing whatever you're fucking doing, right? But you have this innate ability to do it, right? And I think it's a talent. Do you think it's a talent?

Starting point is 01:13:58 Do you think it's a talent? Do you think it's, do you think you have talent? What are you doing? I know what you're doing, not any information. I know what you're doing. That's a good thing. It's a good thing. I kept doing it and you kept filling the space. It's quite interesting.

Starting point is 01:14:15 Yeah, that is true, huh? Because you're, yes, saying, ending yourself, which is great, the improv thing. I was really impressive. Can I ask you a question? Sure. Have you ever had a guest on that didn't add information and then you had to keep doing it? Yeah, yeah. But it's part of the magic too. And sometimes I feel like there were actually giving me a gift of silence and I

Starting point is 01:14:41 was stepping on it. Like, for example, I had a with Jocco, you know, Jocco will link. And every question I would ask him in the beginning and I'm not better friends with him. There was the first time we met in that conversation and I would ask him these long questions of mumble and meander and so on and he would answer with yes or no. And that's it. Yeah. And then, but he do it in a strong like Viking like way. And I kept, I kept trying to go full like, Bobby Lee style of create chaos and just keep talking and talking and so on. As opposed to, I think it was inviting me more for the stoic type of and so on, as opposed to, I think it was inviting me more for the stoic type of silence, short sentences, that kind of conversation.

Starting point is 01:15:29 So I fucked that up, I believe. But yeah, there's, they're not adding information part, but the adding chemistry part, where something, it's usually ego, where, where people don't realize there's a magic to be found between two humans like genuinely it's like a first date Like that to truly listen to each other and to do the yes and thing and have fun with it When you have this energy on way too important for this conversation that the yeah the information might be there, but the chemistry's not, so you have to remember that a lot of the podcasts have done are like technical.

Starting point is 01:16:11 Yeah. And so you could still say a lot of stuff about like what this project or whether it's physics or robotics or biology, you could say informational stuff, but the excitement the magic is not there. But I often blame myself because if I'm excited, they'll be excited. I've learned this. So I'm learning I'm not allowed to have a board face, which my face naturally looks bored.

Starting point is 01:16:41 But on the inside, I'm excited. Yeah. It might be a Russian thing. I don't know. It's not. I can I tell you why at your not boring? Your face. Right. Because you have cross feet. Oh, this thing? Yeah. That would be the thing. Yeah. And the reason why you have cross feet is you smile a lot. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You're very expressive. I know white dudes. I don't trust white dudes. Yeah, right with no cross feet Right because that means they don't that they're not you know me accessing that part of their you know me face Yeah, you know, which is why I hate when This isn't a lay thing especially

Starting point is 01:17:20 Women have talked me like Botox and and they hate the quote. They hate not I'm not me on themselves and they hate because it's all wrinkles and stuff like that. And to me it's like no, that's where the magic. That's the magic. It really is. Yeah. So, okay. So the interesting thing about Tiger Belly is there's some weird like aesthetic to it. It's really unique. It's not just good. It's also unique. Like in the way that Wes Anderson films are unique, like life aquatic, I don't know if you know those films.

Starting point is 01:17:50 Yeah, I love those. I mean, they're my favorite films. Yeah. What is that? What is that? It's not just the chemistry between you and Koala. It's like, what is that? Can you put a finger on it or is it just like,

Starting point is 01:18:02 well, it's essentially who I am. I like, that's what all my houses have looked like that. You know what I mean? Like I've always been a collector of designer toys. You know what I mean? I've always been a collector of kind of weird artwork. Yeah, I've always been like that. You know, I like weird wallpaper.

Starting point is 01:18:22 Like I'll get instead of like going to a wallpaper store. What I'll do is I'll get artwork that I like weird wallpaper. I'll get, instead of going to a wallpaper store, what I'll do is I'll get artwork that I like from an artist, like, and go get their approval and go to a place and make wallpaper out of their artwork. You know what I mean? Like if I wanted to, like, free it from your face on my wall, I would ask for your permission and I would probably put your face on a gigantic wall like I would do stuff like that That's awesome. Yeah, but I Would you do that? Yeah, I think of that. You have my permission. You know, I think I will yeah I think I will just for the laugh. Yeah, you know, but I would do it big. Yeah, yeah

Starting point is 01:19:00 Yeah, yeah, but my point is is that I um It's essentially who I am on the inside I guess in terms of like my you know I don't know, but I don't really I've never I'm glad you said that because I never even thought about that Yeah, he's just you know you just kind of do it like this you know because all your podcasts have this black do it, like this, you know, because all your podcasts have this black, ominous thing. You're, you know, you're, you're throwing a black suit. You're, you have a specific thing too. It's like, but I don't, I don't really think, people ask me like, why do you wear a suit? I really don't, I just feel good in it. Yeah, just who I am. And the reason why my podcast looks the way I do is because I feel comfortable in that environment. And it, you know, like you,

Starting point is 01:19:45 I don't try to think too much about what I'm doing on Tiger Belly or even bad friends, right? Because when you start thinking about it and go, we should do this segment and I should, you know, do it this way or this podcast doesn't this way. So what, you know, no, I just show up.

Starting point is 01:20:02 I keep my mind open and I do the best I can. I add information like we talked about, and I just keep talking, right? And I'm trying to be authentically myself, like right now, you know, I had this fear when I was, I was, I was, I shitting your fucking bathroom, man, yeah? Because I was so scared out of fear.

Starting point is 01:20:19 Out of fear, yeah, yeah. And like, you know, I was like kind of nervous, because I, you know, this is this all week and it was anticipating coming here Yeah, and I watched the no Mark Norman one. I watched the honest one to see, you know how Tonally and last night my girlfriend just looked at me just goes just show up. Yeah, come on those Who I am dude, you think that first of all Let me actually something yes, you think that first of all, let me actually something. Yes. You think I have the day, you know, busy, I'm to drive all the way over here to West Hollywood,

Starting point is 01:20:55 to do your fucking thing. Why would I do that? Yeah. Because we are well aware of who you are and we like you. Thank you, man. God, we want you one ours. I would love that. I would love that. I would love that as a I mean

Starting point is 01:21:05 That's that's that's the reason I'm doing this is just to get on your pocket. You gotta get on it. Awesome Yeah, it's funny because I just mentioned to you offline. I got a chance to talk to Oliver Stone And he asked me this thing, which is you know how many listeners does this thing get all the that kind of stuff and I don't even pay attention to that So it's like I just don't a little bit. So you do don't Error extensions of my browser. So I don't see the views the number of views Really, yeah, don't pay you know that like some of your YouTube videos on interviews and stuff have over a million that I know I know I know like loosely that

Starting point is 01:21:46 It bleeds through but it's it's not part of my conscious like thing I think about. I'm very, I've just seen it destroy people's minds where they're no longer thinking creatively. They're not, they don't feel good if something they do doesn't get as much as attention as they thought it should. It just can destroy you. Even though it's good,

Starting point is 01:22:07 there could be great stuff you create that nobody everybody ignores, but it was still great. It is still great. And sort of letting that negatively affect your mind is a, I don't know, I've seen it destroy people, so I'm very nervous about that. It's like that old saying never living the results.

Starting point is 01:22:26 It's like if I podcast to make, I'd like initially, honestly, when I did Tiger Billet, we made no money for the first couple of years. Like not enough to put a dent. I couldn't buy anything, like, you know, nice or anything. It was side money, you know, I mean, I could buy some shoes once a month or whatever, right? And like I said before, my career was in the shitter, right? So, it, it, it, it, Tiger Bell, it wasn't like, this is going to be the thing, you know, I mean, it was just something to do with my girlfriend creatively, you know, and it just so happens that it did do all these things for me, right, podcasting. But, um, yeah, I never, and still today, I don't do it for any of those things, you know, I do it because, um,

Starting point is 01:23:17 it's fun. Yeah, yeah, it is, right? Yeah, yeah. Let me ask ask you since you say why you love Kaliah, why do you love slash hey George George Kimmel your producer? What's your favorite thing about them? Let's say that. Positive thing. Positive. Because you know it's like you know I don't want to give them compliments but you know I'll try. Yeah yeah I'll try. I do actually I don't think to give them compliments, but I'll try. Yeah, I'll try. Have you actually, I don't think you've publicly ever said anything about it. I don't think I have either. So I'm gonna give it a go.

Starting point is 01:23:54 I'm gonna give it a good little go here. Okay, yeah. You know, at the end of the day, when it comes to money, when it comes to responsibility. You know, obviously this is a business now for you and me It is you know, it's a it's a side business, but it's a business and You want to be able to trust the people that are running it and I have 100% Trust in everything that he does in terms of financial things, in terms of technical things, in terms of all of it, you know, I mean merchandise and I have 100% belief in him.

Starting point is 01:24:35 I, and that's rare, you know, to find someone like that. Also, at the end of the day, I know his heart and he really is a great guy. He there's nothing about him. Like for instance, you know, he was over the other day and I go, you know, I bought this key wooden thing that some native man made and I don't know how to put it on the wall. So I just, you know, I go, hey, can you figure this out? And he goes, yeah, I got it. You know what I mean? Like, he's just that guy. You know, um, he's also, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but I go, Hey, can you figure this out? And he goes, yeah, I got it. You know, I mean, like he's just that guy, you know, um, he's also, but, but there is a part of me, and this is probably wrong. Yeah. But there's a part of me that feels like I kind of made

Starting point is 01:25:16 him. Yeah. He would be nothing without. No, that's what I'm saying. Why? That's the fucking thing. That's the way I heard it. That's what I meant. OK. But that's how he said. It's probably wrong, right? Because he did all the things that he has in his life, he did on his own, right? But still, for some reason, he'd be nothing without you. I don't know if you know what I've seen,

Starting point is 01:25:37 but that's what I mean. Yeah. So basically, like, because when I met him, I was a part of this YouTube studio called Maker Studios, and he was just a producer there, and that's how I met him. And when he left Maker, he came to us, and he wasn't a podcast producer. And now he has this big company. He produces a bunch of podcasts, you know, and he has a bunch of employees, and he has

Starting point is 01:26:03 a nice business, you know, and I feel like I had a lot to do with it So both the competence and the good heart. Yeah, what about Gilbert? Yeah, Gilbert is a godsend as well. You know, I don't know because of let me ask you this because you're a science guy This is an interesting question for me Do you believe just the universe it gives you certain things at the right moment at the right time? Do you believe that there is a mechanism out there where it's just we're just a part of this machine that's kind of like almost as if things are just happening the way it's supposed to happen? Or do you think there are these random things that are occurring? And we're just chaos in that way.

Starting point is 01:26:48 I don't know from a science perspective because I wouldn't be able to explain it, but I do believe you mentioned karma. There's a karma thing. It just, if you put love out there in the world, like certain doors open in a certain kind of way. They're almost waiting for you and then you walk to them. So yes, in that way, I believe that it just, it feels like not everything is like a basic, like, billier ball model of like, you have to fight for everything. You could just generally be cool to people and kind to people and certain opportunities just pop up at the right moment. just generally be cool to people and kind to people and certain opportunities just pop up at the right moment.

Starting point is 01:27:27 More specifically though, you know, so for instance, let's suppose like Gilbert for instance, he just showed up at my house one day. I didn't know who he was. I had a fight night and a friend brought him, right? This is right when Kali-Lenai were starting Tiger Belly, right? And in conversation, he was like, we didn't know how to engineer. We didn't have an engineer for our podcast. And that night, he was like, you know,

Starting point is 01:27:52 I know how to do it, right? And if I hadn't met him that night, he just wouldn't, I don't know if it would be as good, it would be completely different. And I really believe that we were met, we met him that night for a reason, you know, so you don't believe that It's complicated. I believe that for love and these kinds of things But I don't believe that as much for

Starting point is 01:28:15 Building a team, but that's the engineering thing. I think that's the the artist in you I'm less of an artist. I think artists thrive in the chaos of it. So it's not only that you guys met at that time is you didn't probably ask in detail about its qualifications or didn't go through a rigorous thing. You just dove in and figured out on the fly. I think that's sort of the artist ethic. I think if you're doing a startup engineering, there's a little bit more rigor in the selection process. But, because the same with Rogan, Jamie just walked up to him.

Starting point is 01:28:55 Jamie Vernon, yeah. Yeah, he just walked up to the same kind of situation and then he made it, both of you have one of the best podcasts in the world. And so it's like, how do that? What? Yeah, I believe that's very strange. Yeah, strange.

Starting point is 01:29:11 Or maybe it's just like cool people hang out with cool people. So you kind of collide a lot. But that's not true because that's not true. Because with bad friends, for instance, right? I've had 12 people before Andrew Santino that it asked me to do one with me, right? And you know, they just was it wasn't didn't want to do it. Yeah, you know With Andrew though, it happened kind of organically and in in in a way that was almost like in my heart Men to happen in a weird way. That's a weird combination, by the way.

Starting point is 01:29:45 So why was that the sticky one? Because you have a lot of comedian friends, why Andrew? Because number one, we both know just instinctually without even talking about it, that in many ways we're polar opposites in terms of like energy, right? He's more aggressive. I also know I respond good with alpha males.

Starting point is 01:30:06 You know, because I'm more of a follower, you know what I mean? We're sensitive in that way. But in many ways, I am an alpha male in certain areas of my life, you know, you know, when it comes to smashing dot, what's up? You know, yeah, yeah. So we both knew instinctually that that in that way, our chemistry worked, right? And also, in terms of style and all that stuff is completely just It was just an organic given to us. Yeah, yeah But you trust yourself with power

Starting point is 01:30:37 You played dictators What do you mean do I like because I feel like you would be because you said you're not an alpha male, but in many ways When you smash what's up, and you went that me would you What do you think about that if I give you absolute power would you be able to what would you what would you change? What does absolute power mean like you said to me listen? You are gonna be the dictator of planet Earth. And anything that you want is at your means, including violence, sex. No, I would not.

Starting point is 01:31:12 Because even in my personal life now, there are things that I could do, right, that I have power, I guess, that I don't participate in, right? So why would I do it if I had ultimate power? I mean, because there's always, there's still a moral and ethics that I have't participate in, right? So why would I do it if I had ultimate power? I mean, because there's always, there's still a moral and ethics that I have, right? That I don't feel comfortable with, right? So you wouldn't even enjoy it.

Starting point is 01:31:35 No, I mean, I think that there would be no, if I had ultimate dictatorship on planet Earth, there would be no violence. I mean, I would not cause any wars, right? But if there's an uprising, I'd have to quell it. That's how it starts, Bobby. You quell it with a little bit of rise. Right, but so first you're gonna censor everybody

Starting point is 01:31:56 who wants to even suggest the idea of uprising. And then one person gets out of line, they run out of red light, okay? That's, that's, but here we get angry and traffic. Yeah. I get rage full. So if you could murder that person. No, no, no, no, nobody has to know.

Starting point is 01:32:18 No, I would give them cancer. But I would not. Not much more. I would not. I know. I know. Okay. So, but no, here, no, this is interesting thing, because I want to, I want to elaborate. Alright, so the thing, if I was the dictator of the planet Earth, right, there would be a reason why people would uprise, right? So give me a reason, because I would give them food, shelter, right, and all the things I feel like that people would desire, right? But you're right, but you're right because they're, you're right. I think this is

Starting point is 01:32:51 what you're talking about. Yeah. So here's the deal. So there are certain things that I do believe in, right? Like, for instance, it's a very controversial thing, right? In terms of a woman's right, thing, right? In terms of a woman's right, right? In terms of abortion, right? I feel like as a male, I, it's not my body, so I don't really even have an opinion or I shouldn't even have a voice on it, because you know, I mean, a woman, like, it's like if they created laws, if white people, men, created laws for Koreans in America, like, you don't have the right to, right? So it's like, so if I was a dictator, right, I would just be like, yeah, women have all the rights in the world, right? And they, you know, and I think abortion should be legal throughout the planet, right? But there will be people out there that will believe that no, you know, I mean, we, you know, we're pro-life.

Starting point is 01:33:45 No, you know what I mean, we, you know, we're pro life. You would put them in jail. Just so that's right. So I think as a dictator, there was no way to be able to please everyone. So there will be an uprising. So yeah, fuck it. I don't want to do it. Okay.

Starting point is 01:33:56 Would you do it? Uh, not, no, there's several loaded questions. Would I enjoy it? No. Would I do it? No, because I don't trust my own mind under power. Like I'm well aware that situations that I have control it's as much a freedom as it is a burden. Like it can change you. I'm very nervous about that. Interesting. How much the ego starts to flare up, how much, just like the less pleasant things about your nature come up, you know, I have a temper to like I have all that kind of stuff and you have, I'm sure you have a bit of a temper. Yeah, I have a temper. And so when nobody is able to ask clearly,

Starting point is 01:34:47 call you out on your bullshit, that could be a problem. Do you have this when you rage out and you have a temper, is there like either a day later or a couple hours later, is there shame and regret that comes along with that or no? Yeah, no, no, of course. Yeah, during it. Yeah, during it too, yeah, shame and no. Yeah, no, no, of course. Yeah, during it. Yeah, during it too. Yeah, shame and regret.

Starting point is 01:35:06 Yeah, yeah. And then, but I tried to make sure it's like love and respect are felt always underneath the whole thing. But still it's like human emotion. You can't control it. And if you're giving up to a power, you start to lose your sense of the world. You start to be unable to see what is right and wrong. You think everything is right. You start to have a distorted view of who is doing the wrong things in the world and then also distrust. Well, that has to

Starting point is 01:35:36 do more with how absolute power is usually attained because when you're in the seat of power, everybody, first on the outside, but then in your inner circle, you start to distrust them. You start to believe that they're going to, they want your power. So the people you love, the people that were source of so much beauty for you previously, like even like your girlfriend, wife, your closest life long friends, you start to suspect them. I don't want to live like that. Yeah, yeah, yeah.long friends, you start to suspect them. I don't wanna live like that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And you're often right to suspect them.

Starting point is 01:36:09 Because you think they change a little bit too. They change too. Yeah, yeah. They start a little bit taste of that power. Yeah. The interesting thing is a bunch of people in Hitler's inner circle at the very end betrayed him to in search of their own power.

Starting point is 01:36:23 Wow. Fascinating. Yeah. Fascinating. Fascinating. This power thing. Let me ask you a bunch of ridiculous questions real quick. Okay. If you can be someone else for a day, someone alive today who you haven't yet met,

Starting point is 01:36:37 who would you be? For one day, you get to be, could be female, male, that'd be a little... I always wanted to see what a pop star was like. Which one would you go? Like Harry Styles. Okay. Yeah, yeah.

Starting point is 01:36:47 So if I'm Harry Styles, right? I just want to see like, wouldn't like to go to the Beverly Center. Okay. As Harry Styles. As Harry Styles. Yeah, yeah. Or Coachella, I just walk around Coachella

Starting point is 01:37:00 as Harry Styles, you know what I mean? We get a lot of attention and it's a very specific kind of attention. Yeah, I just want to see what that's like. I want to be able to, because the thing is, is that I want to be able to like, see what it's like in terms of how easy it would be to get a hot chick.

Starting point is 01:37:16 Oh, I thought you meant to like get a table of restaurant. No, no, no, no, no, that, you know, you, I can still do now as Bobby Lee, you know, and, but as Harry Styles, or I want to see what it'd be like, and how that would go about, no, no, no, that, you know, you, I can still do now as Bobby Lee, you know, and, but as Harry Styles or I want to see what it'd be like and how that would go about, like how easy would be, you know, I mean, yeah, yeah. Like could you just walk up to the hottest chick at a, at Coachella and start making out with them? Yeah, that's interesting. Just to see, just to see if you could. Yeah, yeah, because I know as Bobby Lee, no, no, no, no, no, could you know, you couldn't do that. No, no, no.

Starting point is 01:37:48 It's interesting reason. Yeah, yeah. So if you were the last person on earth, like everybody disappeared, everybody's dead. What would you day look like? What would you days look like? What would you do? That's interesting because if I was able to figure out the, you know, electricity, right? I think my days would be like, why didn't you learn about electricity? Oh, yeah.

Starting point is 01:38:12 Right? You realize how little you know. Yeah, yeah. Why didn't you learn about these things? Because how you're going to die? Yeah, right. Yeah. But I think the first thing obviously is, no, let me ask you something.

Starting point is 01:38:22 Why? Now, if you're saying that I'm the last person on planet Earth, because there was an alien invasion and there's predators and things that I have to fucking look out for, that's one way. But if I'm just all of us and I wake up and just everyone's gone, and there's no dead, everyone's dead, but there's no threat. There's no threat. Then what I would do is I go, well, let's find a place to live, not

Starting point is 01:38:43 probably my house, right? So, I'd probably live in a place where it's closest to grocery stores, right? So I would get food and stuff first, right? And then secondly, it's like, you know, I'll probably go, you know what I thought about. I would probably go to San Marcos San Diego Vista, because that's where the real doll factory is. They just fuck all of them. No, no, no, I would have to grab like six of them because I'm going to get lonely.

Starting point is 01:39:08 Six of them for a variety. You would be monogamous with one doll. No, and no, and I also would carry out like the, you know, the vagina parts or right, you know, me and all the accessories and stuff, right? And then go back to LA probably. Oh, man. Why was he down there? And you could stay in the factory.

Starting point is 01:39:24 No, yeah, maybe it's that factory. And then, but I think thirdly, I would run out of electricity, right? And I think, you know, I mean, my demise would come slow. Well, you could find source of electricity because nobody's using it. But I don't know how to turn the machines on like,

Starting point is 01:39:38 I don't know how to go to the fucking, yeah, what do you call it, the place where, I don't even know what it's called. The place where, you know, me, where, in all the energy is generated. Yeah, the generators. Like, where do I go? Yeah. It's good questions.

Starting point is 01:39:54 All right. Would you rather lose all your old memories or never be able to make new ones, the past or the future? No, I mean, I can't lose my memories. All of them. That makes me who I am. But you wouldn't be able to make new ones. So you'd be living in the moment not stop with all the, but you did say you're in a really good place. So maybe this is a pretty good set of memories you got. You got all the trauma. Yeah.

Starting point is 01:40:27 I mean, you just, that's a nightmare. You just created a nightmare for me. That's a nightmare. The choice is a nightmare. Yeah, you're fucked either way. Is it really beautiful? It's a kind of death, not being able to make new memories. That's it, that's all you got.

Starting point is 01:40:48 You get to relive the memories you have as a science. Let me ask you a question. Sure. Are you afraid to die? Yeah. Of course. I'm not, I'm not. Of course. I am. I think about it every day. Yeah. I, yeah. I meditate on my mortality all the time. Right.

Starting point is 01:41:04 It doesn't make any sense. time. Right. It does make sense. It's terrifying. It's terrifying. And because are you terrified because of the unknown or because you believe it's nothingness? The unknown, but my best guess is that it's something like nothingness. And that nothingness is so terrifying. Yeah, the infinity of the nothingness. And that nothingness is so terrifying. Yeah, the infinity of the nothingness. Yeah.

Starting point is 01:41:27 But Ramdha says, and this is something that I always, you know, Ramdha said, yeah, Ramdha says, he believed that death is like removing a tight shoe. Like release. Like, ah, that could be it too. I think maybe when we die, that's initially maybe the last feeling that we have is release. And then if that happens and there's nothingness, I think that's cool. Well, no, that has to do more with the actual feeling of death, which I think some people

Starting point is 01:42:03 are afraid of, the experience to make sure it's one of release, like you said, but the existential aspect that you're no longer exist, like all this shit you're doing, kind of as soon as you'll live forever. Right. Like you don't really, like all the career and all that kind of stuff,

Starting point is 01:42:24 you probably will be forgotten. I know. Like completely erased. So all you have is a few moments in this life, a few moments of joy, a few moments of trauma, of suffering. I know. But here's the thing. And you're wasting your time today talking to me and you have you have a few such moments

Starting point is 01:42:47 You do a couple hundred more podcasts and then you'd be dead No, because this right here dude, right is Human number one I Walked through a little fear today, so I learned something this right? I'm talking to a science guy, which I never thought I could You're're the first scientist I ever talked to. Right? You get a diploma at the end of this. Oh, good. And there's I believe that there was a connection. Right? Not in a gateway. Not in a gateway. Non-gay, or a connection. Right? In certain circumstances, I probably would blow you. Would you? In a certain circumstances, like if we were the last two people on the

Starting point is 01:43:23 planet Earth, that's stuff like that. Sure. Yeah, yeah. But yeah, those are probably the only ones, or like somebody put a gun to my eyes. You got to blow legs. Okay. Yeah, that kind of a turn out. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Starting point is 01:43:33 I'm turned on right now. I think I was. Yeah. Let me ask you one one one one one question. Go ahead. What do you think is the meaning of life? What the fucking, that's the last one? Yes, this is the last one.

Starting point is 01:43:44 Yeah, yeah. What do you think? Why are we here? Why are you here? Why are we here? Does any of it make sense to you? I think ultimately, here's the, what's, why I like life in general is what we talked about like we view death.

Starting point is 01:43:58 There is a mystery there. There's a wonderment to it, right? So it's like, when I walk outside, you know, and I look at the trees and I look at buildings that man made these buildings and, you know, I look at the universe and I look in the sky and I don't really completely comprehend what's going on, right? It's just so in, I mean, all of all of it, right? And I don't have any answers, right? But that, I think, is what the meaning of life is,

Starting point is 01:44:26 is to be in awe of it and the wonder of it all. And it's just amazing. Yeah, just open your eyes to the wonder of it all. Yeah. While we're still here. Yeah. Bobby, it's a huge honor to finally meet you. I've been a fan for many, many years.

Starting point is 01:44:43 It's an honor that you would even consider blowing me in the correct kind of circumstances. I think you would blow me in the right circumstances. I think that's the definition of love. Bobby, thanks so much for talking to brother. Thank you so much. Thanks for listening to this conversation with Bobby Lee to support the spot gas. Please check out our sponsors in the description. And now, let me leave you with some words from Kurt Vonnegut. Laughter and tears are both responses to frustration and exhaustion. I myself prefer to laugh, since there's less cleaning to do afterward. Thank you for listening, and hope to see you next time.

Lex Fridman Podcast - #287 – Bobby Lee: Comedy, Skyrim, Sex Robots, Love, Fame, and Power

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