Lex Fridman Podcast - #323 – Will Sasso: Comedy, MADtv, AI, Friendship, Madness, and Pro Wrestling

Episode Date: September 24, 2022

Will Sasso is a comedian, actor, and co-host of the Dudesy podcast. Please support this podcast by checking out our sponsors: - Eight Sleep: https://www.eightsleep.com/lex to get special savings - Athletic Greens: https://athleticgreens.com/lex to get 1 month of fish oil - BetterHelp: https://betterhelp.com/lex to get 10% off - Onnit: https://lexfridman.com/onnit to get up to 10% off - Indeed: https://indeed.com/lex to get $75 credit EPISODE LINKS: Will's Instagram: https://instagram.com/willsasso Will's Twitter: https://twitter.com/WillSasso Dudsey's YouTube: https://youtube.com/Dudesy Dudsey's Website: https://dudesypod.com Dudsey's Patreon: https://patreon.com/dudesy PODCAST INFO: Podcast website: https://lexfridman.com/podcast Apple Podcasts: https://apple.co/2lwqZIr Spotify: https://spoti.fi/2nEwCF8 RSS: https://lexfridman.com/feed/podcast/ YouTube Full Episodes: https://youtube.com/lexfridman YouTube Clips: https://youtube.com/lexclips SUPPORT & CONNECT: - Check out the sponsors above, it's the best way to support this podcast - Support on Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/lexfridman - Twitter: https://twitter.com/lexfridman - Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/lexfridman - LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lexfridman - Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/lexfridman - Medium: https://medium.com/@lexfridman OUTLINE: Here's the timestamps for the episode. On some podcast players you should be able to click the timestamp to jump to that time. (00:00) - Introduction (07:16) - Video games (13:22) - Bobby Lee (15:32) - Stand-up comedy (23:03) - Robin Williams (24:25) - Loneliness and depression (32:46) - John Candy (39:35) - Friendship (45:23) - Ten Minute Podcast (50:22) - Dudesy podcast (58:41) - Acting (1:10:00) - Impressions (1:15:28) - Artificial intelligence (1:46:55) - Anxiety (1:56:49) - Kindness (2:00:45) - Bad days (2:04:39) - Pro wrestling (2:08:15) - Advice for young people (2:22:20) - Meaning of life

The following is a conversation with Will Sasso, a comedian, actor, podcaster, and someone have been a fan of for many years since Matt TV in the late 90s to recently with the 10 minute podcast and now the new podcast called DUDZ. And now a quick few second mention of each sponsor. Check them out in the description. It's the best way to support this podcast. We've got 8 sleep for naps, athletic greens for multi vitamins, better help for mental health, on it for supplements and indeed for hiring. Choose wisely my friends.

And now onto the full ad reads. As always, no ads in the middle. I find those ultra super annoying and since I get to decide how to do things with this particular podcast, I don't like to do annoying things. But I still try to say interesting things, sometimes only half-reliated to the sponsors. So maybe you would like to listen, please skip, please still check out the sponsors. I enjoy their stuff. Maybe you will too This episode is brought to you by 8th sleep and it's pod 3 mattress So I just took a nap. I feel incredible. I passed off for 20 minutes all on my A-Sleep bed, both a mattress and the mattress cover is an A-Sleep. The surface of the mattress was cold to a perfect temperature with a warm blanket. I turned off like an old Pentium PC in a matter of seconds, I turned back on like an old Pentium PC with a RUUUUU

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actually listening. Like I can literally say anything. I wonder if there's like just two people to drunk to skip ads. They're just listening to this right now. Well, I'm with you brothers and sisters. What was I talking about? I don't know, but you should check out Athletic Greens and you get one month supply of fish oil when you sign up at Athletic Greens.com slash Lex. And given this ad read, they will very quickly cancel their support time, very sure. No, they love me. I love them. No matter what, whether their response or not, I will always love athletic greens. This episode is also brought to you by BetterHelp, spelled H-E-L-P-H-H-E-L-P. I often go in my mind to a place where I'm just sitting alone on a desert island.

I imagine talking to that volleyball, Wilson, and just the peace of being away from humanity for a time. So you can be alone with your thoughts. I imagine that. And I also imagine writing help in the sand, with my own thoughts. Speaking of being too sick of your own thoughts, that's just a funny thing to say. Of course, your thoughts, dark or beautiful, low or high are your lifelong companions.

You should bring them to the surface and you should play with them, you should dance with them. And talk therapy is one way to do that. I think podcasting is a kind of talk therapy. That's the way to do that. So you should really try out and better help, which is a way to do online talk therapy. You can check them out at BetterHelp.com slashlex and save in your first month. This episode is also brought to you by Anit, a nutrition supplement and fitness company.

They make alpha brain and utropic that that helps support memory mental speed and focus. Like I said, I just took a nap. That's a component number one of ultra-focus. Component number two for me is caffeine. Then of course, there is the zen-like. Maybe people think of it as meditation ability to block out all the other distractions, but even then, sometimes that's not enough, if you really want to

accomplish something difficult, mentally speaking. So for that, I will take an alpha brain every once in a while to help me be the extra super boost for that deep work session, by which I mean sitting there staring at a thing thinking about it and not allowing your mind to deviate from the focus on that thing. Anyway, you can get a special discount on an alpha brain at lexfreedman.com slash on it. This show is also brought to you by Indeed, a hiring website. I've used them many times, many, many times in the past for the hiring efforts I've done for the teams I've led, teams have been a part of. I'm doing quite a bit of hiring now for the podcast,

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They have a special offer only available for limited time. Check it out at Indeed.com slash Lex. This is the Lex Reveal Podcast. The supported, please check out our sponsors in the description. And now dear friends, here's Will Sasso. So let's call it the elephant in the room. You wore a black suit in a recent episode of Doozzy. Yes. You wore a black suit again today. Shakespeare, the Mark Twain said,

clothes make the man. What kind of man does a suit make you? Well, me in particular, it makes me a fellow who did not get this dry cleaned in between because that episode of the show as we said here now was around a week ago. So that's the kind of man it makes me. Well the nice things you were wearing pants I think.

Yes, I am wearing pants. I don't think you were wearing pants in the episode. That's correct. I prefer to wear shorts, but this was a special occasion, so I'm wearing pants. And I thought it fitting obviously to just wear the black tie and clothes do make the man. And I'm a, I would not consider myself to be a man of leisure, but I do enjoy shorts. Yeah.

Because my legs get hot. So that's what kind of man the shorts make me. Often you wear a suit. I fucking hate wearing suits. So what is this a statement of, is it ironic? Or is it, are you honoring the gods of this particular podcast? I'm honoring the gods of this particular podcast would be a good way to put it.

Yes, no, this is, this is in reverence of and in dedication to you and our newfound friendship here, which we are making on the podcast. You and I just met. Everything that we're saying here is the first things that we're saying to each other. So I'm meeting you on common ground, dressed like, well, I've been actually a one way

friend of yours for many, many years. It's mad TV. Oh, when did you start on mad TV? So that was many, I mean, in 90s, 97, 97. So I was a huge fan of yours in the cast. It was incredible. It was one of the funniest shows ever created your whole journey watching through that. It was, it was incredible for mad MTV to 3 Studios to the podcast, the 10 minipod, and then the new podcast is incredible.

My favorite role that you played was the mountain and the game of thrones. What was it like working with dragons? Well the dragons are usually tennis balls on the end of sea stands, but sometimes they hang out. I am sea stand. It's like, you know, it's like a little like the thing you got the camera on here. Oh, this is like filmling go. Yeah, no, I understand. I'm trying to impress you with my filmling go.

You know what a banana is? Yeah. When you walk like this, do it a banana. I take it back. I did not know what a banana was. Yeah, you walk like this. Oh, do it a banana. I take it back. I did not know what a banana was Yeah, see it means that yeah, cuz it's just a food. Yeah normally I'm the Hollywood folk the link go and I'm My name is Bjorn Hapthor Bjornson and I am seven foot four and

Yeah, so dragons don't dragons don't scare me even though they've been extinct for a while We use scientists right is that check out? Yeah, I actually I'm really into video games. I don't see play video games There's a there's a Skyrim Video game that's part of the other scroll series and for the longest time. There's a legend that there's dragons I think it's starting to dagger fall and so I always I grew up playing those video games and dreaming of one day meeting a dragon in a virtual world and eventually you did in Skyrim. So it's, dragons represent, I don't know exactly what they represent, but they represent maybe

this kind of mythical creature that is bigger than anything humans can possibly comprehend maybe. Because they're so, they show up so often in myth from the From the religious stories, you know of the snake and so on the serpent and I don't know what that is Well, this breathing fire. That's kind of weird. It's interesting when I think about dragons because now that you bring it up These are people that probably wouldn't have access to the fact that there used to be dinosaurs, right? Maybe they did If they didn't they're drawn things that look like, you know, a dinosaur cousin, but

cool that can breathe fire and has wacky wings and a spiked tail. Yeah, where the heck did they come up with that? Because they're clearly, of course, represented in mythology all the way back to, no, not cave drawings. Well, the Egyptians probably knew what the, and they could time travel. So they would have gone back to the caves. Well, the aliens that placed living organisms on Earth could time travel and they could plant legends into the, into the collective intelligence of the human species.

Yeah. And perhaps they were thinking of us to do something smart with it. And we didn't, we just came up the sky now We're just what's that? Sorry. That was very offensive. I'm sorry I don't mean to offend you with your video game. I'm more of a burger cut a burger time donkey con dude Oh, what is that? That's an original burger time was an arcade game that later showed up on the Intellivision Was Intellivision, it was Intellivision, I believe it was made by Texas Instruments, Horrible First Generation Video Game Console, and burger time, it's like Super Mario,

you just gotta stay away from the eggs and the pickles and stuff, and you just go, me, me, me, me, me, me, me, me, me, me, me, me, me, me, me, and the cheese, and then the meat, I'm not gonna say it's as complicated as Skyrim,rim but took me while I finish it when I was seven. Did you play video games that was a part of your life, a part of the source of happiness for you? At all. It was. It was. I played video games up until around, I think in 2010, I got the red ring of death on my Xbox 360. That was it.

That was it. I never, or whatever the Xbox was then. Yeah. I had, I was playing, I had finished the, the Grand Theft Auto that was out and it finished the Red Dev Redemption. So I was doing that thing where you just drive around, you know, the streets of New York or just ride around on your horse shooting people and throwing grenades into groups of people in Grand Theft.

And you're describing the same thing that happened a decade later because it's not Red Dead Redemption 2 and there's still not a new Grand Theft Auto. So yeah, there isn't, right? Yeah, they're working on it. They're always flirting with that idea. You know who else plays Skyrim? Another person, the two people on the huge fan of from that time in Matt TV's Bobby Lee. He's a plays Skyrim? Another person, the two people on my huge fan of from that time in Mad TV's, Bobby Lee. He plays Skyrim. He's a huge fan of Skyrim.

He plays every. So what Bobby Lee loves to do is to grind, do the boring task over and over, gather mushroom. Look at Skyrim, you can fight dragons, you can fight all kinds of things, but you can also gather mushrooms and different ingredients to make potions and all that kind of, he loves the ingredients. He's the, you know, in the hunter gatherer world, he's the gatherer. He's the gatherer. Yeah. I've heard him describe that way and he likes to describe himself that way. I worked with Bobby not too long ago. He came into a couple days on this thing we were shooting. And I was looking forward to catching up with my old pal. And if you know anything about Bobby Lee,

you'd probably be able to predict that he spent that entire time playing farming on his iPad. Well, humans are a source of anxiety and trouble. So sometimes it's good to escape human interaction through video games. Totally. I'm with him on that.

He's one of the funniest people ever. What do you think makes him funny? You see all the times you've worked with him. The nonstandard, non-sequitur way of his being. Bobby Lee is one of the most raw people, raw performers who lets it all hang out to the degree that he will even get naked in front of his audience, which is usually a metaphor for someone doing stand-up. I'm bearing all. I'm showing you everything, and Bobby will just pull his bird out of his pants. Yeah, I don't think he understands metaphor too much. He embodies metaphor. Yes, he embodies metaphor. We call him the gathering metaphor. Bobby,

the gatherer metaphor. He's a metaphor for something else, for somebody else's life. Some day he'll be in the dictionary, representing some kind of concept, maybe the metaphor itself. Once this whole thing falls apart and we are climbing the kudzu vines that spiral up the sear's tower like they say in fight club, Bobby will go back to his gatherer form and be happy as a pig and shit. Just walking around in a loin cloth with his bird hanging out, tracking jokes to people and climbing up on them for a stool lap dance. I'd love to dig into something he did. You guys did a lot of great podcasts together.

He asked you in a very uncomfortable process of why you don't do stand up. So let me ask you, do you hate money? Well, I'm originally from Canada. Yeah, so I'm a freaking pinko socialist. Is that what where you come from? That's not a nice thing to say. I thought the Soviet Union, that is a nice thing to say. Like, come on. Someone to thing to say. Like, come on. Someone a big, right? Comrade is a good, he's a good socialist. Yeah. We're Fred. Like bold colors. Yeah.

There's an interesting tension in your voice and the way you talked about it, there's just not a source of happiness for you. You, you respect the art form, but it was not something that you were connected to. You felt connected to. That's a good way to put it. Yeah. I respect the art form a lot. And I grew up with all the albums and stuff. I had an older brother and sister.

So we had George Carlin, we had Richard Pryor, we had Robert Klein, we had Gilda Live, the Gilda Radner concert. We had all sorts of stuff. But I don't know, there's a lot of there's a lot of reasons. I do feel like a career and show business is, you know, they, it never goes the way you plan, like most things. And I was fortunate enough to get started outside of my native Vancouver or in my native Vancouver. I grew up in the

burbs outside. And there was a lot of industry there. So I was fortunate enough to get started as an actor when I was like 16. So there, yeah, there was, there were some times early on where I came up with some stand-up stuff and did it, but yeah, I quickly abandoned it and then you go through, you do mad TV and stuff and then, that's where my This is gonna sound weird. Do I sound as anxiety at all as I did when I was on Bobby's podcast trying to avoid his questions Well, he is giving you this face this whole time. That was making The whole just atmosphere feel full of anxiety so I'm trying not to give you the face I'm the whole time I'm saying play cool play cool. Yeah, okay. Uh play cool. Lex Hold on, I'm saying play cool, play cool. Yeah, okay. Play cool, Lex.

Play cool. You set it out loud a couple of times. I did. You cut that out. Play cool. Play cool. Cut it out. Maintain, bro.

Here's what I'll say. There's two ways to do it. I think it's lame when someone who's done one thing for a while goes and starts doing stand-up at a nowhere. Because I think it's an art form that's under attack because it's not like anything else. You need, although now you can of course, you know, make whatever you want.

It's the era of self publishing as far as making a product and putting it out there, which is getting easier, of course, and I can't wait to talk to you about that with AI and how it's changing art. But the in standup, all you need is a microphone. And, you know, perhaps it would be good to have some mental illness and then you can just run up there and talk forever. And I say this to comedians, it's like you guys have to deal with just an influx of people who aren't sure why they're doing comedy. I would ask comedians, I mean, not good ones, and good ones you know what they're doing, but everyone else, like, what are you doing?

Why? Why are you doing stand up? Having said that, I am allergic to money. Yeah, do you think they have a good answer for that? Why are they doing it? Because I actually like, when I'm an Austin, I like going to Open Mike, just listening. It's inspiring to me.

Both the funny and the unfunny people people because they've been doing it for several years Sometimes over a decade. Yeah, and they're still at it. They're still right there There's going for the punch and then especially open mics that are really sad in that there is You know only like five other people in the audience and they're usually just other comedians and they're still going all out as if they're in front of a stadium. But that to me sounds like someone who loves it. Yeah, I got no questions for that person. I got questions for someone who goes sideways from here I'm recognizable doing something and then I'm doing stand up because it's like, and truly, look, I've been fortunate enough

to be in the business for a long time and And at this point, if I came up, I mean, doing live stuff is fun. I have friends that are like, you know, some guys who are primarily sketch people or you would look at them as sketch people and they can sell tickets for being sketch people. And they, and we'll talk about it. And they're like, you know, I do a monologue,

and I do a little stand up, then I do a song, then I do another monologue, then I play off the audience, do a little stand up, then I do a song, then I do another monologue, then I play off the audience, do a little stand up. But stand up is, it's almost like playing music in that, you know, people are going up there playing music, but what band have you been listening to? That's what you're going to sound like. So it's really, I mean, of course, I'm speaking from zero experience, but I've heard it takes years, of course, to find your own voice, stand up that when they first go up, they're doing some sort

of impersonation of so and so and so. And so and so. And you've got to pop this audience that's paying and you're going to get run over by the next person who's coming up. And it's hard to follow the last person who went up before you. And I mean, that is a really hard way. It's a very, it's quite a gauntlet to be and to find your voice comedically.

But don't you have that same kind of thing with sketch? You still have to find your own voice. With all the impressions you do, they're just terrible. They're different spins and different people. They're not perfect impressions, right? So that so that's I mean that's similar kind of challenge and journey. Yeah, stand up You're just saying they're kind of distinct and you fell into this one you fell in love with it Which is like what mad TV kind of opened you up to? Yeah, as a kid I literally want to be an actor. I always wanted to be an actor from a very young age

As far back as I can remember and I was a class clown and wanted to be an actor. I always wanted to be an actor from a very young age. As far back as I remember, and I was a class clown and wanted to do comedy stuff and comedic acting and so on. And so, comedic acting. Yeah, early on, my influences were a very predictable list of guys from the SCTV, early Saturday Night Live, Montepython, all of those performers really influenced me. It was later that I saw people like Kevin Klein, who's an incredible actor. I vividly remember being like 1213, seeing him get an Academy Award for Fish Called Wanda, and it blew my mind.

Because I was like, he was hilarious. I mean, it was one of my favorite movies back then and now. And he won an academy award and at that point I Started thinking more about acting and then I was like I said really fortunate to fall in with I mean, I always wanted to do it and I was trying to hustle this and that when I was a kid and then I Ended up getting represented and then I ended up on a teen show. I was on, I basically, the easiest way to pitch it is it's like a Canadian my so-called life with these kids and their lives and stuff and I did that for like five years and I really love acting. I really truly love acting and I don't, I'm not someone who wants people to know my opinion.

So that's another thing about standup. Like I love the illusion of what I get to do in, uh, in, uh, entertainment and podcasting is great for that. But to stand up there and, and from, I don't know, just for me, it's like it would have to all be fantasy. And, um, yeah. So Nietzsche said that every profound spirit needs a mask You like you say you don't like to talk about In your comedy, you don't like to talk about stuff that's personal to you. Yeah, I what is that? What if you were to psychoanalyze yourself? Do you think it's just not something you find funny or is it? Are you running from something? And it's not your fault. Well, it's just not something you find funny or is it, are you running from something?

And it's not your fault. Well, it's not your fault, Will. Speaking of another really great comedic actor who's also a serious actor, Robert Williams. One of the best serious actors. I mean, I mean, I, I, and you know, one of the funniest people of all time, but as great, as incredible as he was, as a funny man, as a stand-up and a performer, I almost like his serious stuff better. Can I ask you a question about that? What do you make of the the T-committances side? I think it's, I mean, super depressing. I've referred to him as like the Jesus Christ of depression. He's almost like he died for others' depression. You know what I mean?

Like, yeah, yeah. You look at someone like that and go, wait a minute, you're a rock star. Like you don't, you could just check out if you're not liking your life. And of course, something like suicide, begs that you look a little deeper and realize how tortured the human mind can make someone.

Is there some aspect, you know, we're in LA, is there some aspect of celebrity that's isolating that can make you feel really lonely? Not me, I don't feel, no, not really. You feel the love? No, I just feel like I'm not, I mean, it's like, I don't know, I've always kind of had a small group of friends and those people don't, you know,

it's like, I've known the same people for years and years. You never really felt the celebrity, really. Nah. And LA, it's hard to, it's hard for people. Nobody cares. They see you and then the next minute they see so and so. So it's like, you know, I'm the guy from that. There you go.

That, Mike and Molly, right? Nope. Nope. Close. King of, King of, uh, Mike and Molly, right? Nope. Nope. Close King of King. You just shave your head. You go bald. Hey, you King Queens. Nope. It's not me.

So close. You're a wow shit. You look, uh, you used to be the mountain on, uh, King of Game of Thrones. You look like shit. What happened? Just eating fried dough. Yeah.

Um, yeah. That's what's up. Can't lift any weights anymore. I'm at the gym, doin' like 15 pounds with shoulder press. Ah, and people comin' up to me. You used to be a dragon killer dude. Half a man used to be. What's, have there been low points in your life?

Sorry to go there, but. No. Uh, yeah, yeah. Hey, hey, hey. Hey. Yeah, hey has a low point in life. The art would suffer from depression and those kinds of things. You know, what I do. I do. I have a bunch of stuff.

How do you deal with it? I said friends, the friends, and the... You don't do anything for the lessons. I have an incredible fiance who that's nice to have somebody constant that you love very much and see as the best person and all that good stuff. Hopefully vice versa. And then, well, on your recent Instagram, she said that she loves you. So, wow, you're so on, yeah, allegedly, that might all be for, yeah, that's all my, did you pay her to say that?

I don't, I don't have any because I'm not a standup. I was like, I can do, you got Venmo. Yeah, yeah. I got only have like 123. I gave some doge coin. Yes, doge. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Do you want some doge? I got some of those monkey NFTs. Oh, before I forget. Yes. Hold on a second. Oh, before I forget, yes. Hold on a second. Oh, no. Put a doozy sticker on your microphone if that's okay.

Sure. Here. Oh, yeah. Now, these are tricky because I have the thumbs of a, I have like Italian sausage thumbs. Wait, watch this happen. I'm just gonna, this will take another. Yeah. Yeah.

Oh, man. Yeah, ooh, disembarrassing. When this, you remember? Are you good under pressure? gonna this will take another yeah yeah oh man yeah this embarrassing when this are you good under pressure I have anxiety I have performance anxiety do you have anxiety yeah you have anxiety period period yeah I like I don't like it when I if I have to pee and then everyone's waiting and you're no yeah yeah I like it you know what'll help you in that situation? What's that? Taking a shit. Cause whenever you take a shit, you always pee a little.

It's hard to take a shit while you're staying at a urinal, but not in my world. Okay. I just gotta keep yourself full of things to make a shit. Oh, good. Have you ever heard of a banana? I did recently, somebody told me about it. Not the showbiz turn, I'm talking about the food.

Here you go. There we go. Here you go. Which way is this way, right? It's like a D. No, spin it. There you go. Ah, all right. Ah, so sexy.

You're like a brand. Yeah, it's very important to brand yourself. These colors, are you selling shoes? Yeah, I got some custom kicks coming out. The dudes, no, actually that would be a good idea. You can probably sell a pair or two of those. Speaking of anxiety, I really am only focused on this right now, Alex, so I apologize.

Just shut your pants, it'll make you be easier. Get on with it. This thing has been dog eared in my pocket for a while. I swear this never happens to me, I apologize. Just shut your pants, it'll make it easier. Get on with it. This thing has been dog eared in my pocket for a while. I swear this never happens to me. I'm sorry babe. People don't thumb it a sticker for an hour while they're doing the podcast. This is an excuse to make when you're with somebody

and you're under performing. Well, here's the thing. As you ask me questions that I don't want to answer, I'll just go to this. I'll go to the sticker. So if this, let me just, let me just ends up working, then I won't have it as a funny. He started doing that when we're talking about depression. That's weird. That is weird. Tell me tell me how that makes you feel. Um, here we are. We got it.

Uh, for the listener, he succeeded after 10 minutes. Yeah. You know, no, I do have I do have some of that stuff Bobby Lee Has had encouraged me on on wax as I like to say to go to talk about it on podcasts talk about depression Because it could help people and I said no, but It's true. I do I do have some there's there's some history and family. I do you have a comment Well, I used to not believe in medication at all. I used to think that that was for someone else with who's been diagnosed with some of the, some of the rougher stuff, but as I got older, then some of the stuff happens

and you have to, and by stuff, I mean, mental stuff. And yeah, so I went and I just, I believe that the stigma needs to be removed completely. 5%. And so I do therapy, I do talk therapy, I'm on a little bit of stuff, which, which, let me tell you, when I first started it,

I was, you know, someone I'm close to was like my manager, and she goes, this is too much, but she was like, you don't have to white knuckle it through life, right? Cause I was literally just like everything became, you know, really hard to do at a level that I wanted to do it at, even just getting through your day, right?

And when I first to do it at, even just getting through your day, right? And when I first got some of the, the meds that I was on, that I'm on, it felt like doors and windows were opening literally in my brain. I took a three hour nap the first day and you shouldn't even feel this stuff the first day. I think my brain was like a sponge. It wanted to, I needed some relief. And I'm not a nap guy.

I can sleep three hours and I'll be fine. But I took a long nap and then it started to help. Isn't that weird how a little bit of chemistry in your head? In case you just make the whole world appear it's so much more beautiful. Yeah, yeah. I mean, after all, there's a lot going on In case you just make the whole world appear so much more beautiful. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

After all, there's a lot going on in your brain that can be changed by your lifestyle, but also so many physical things, like a little bit of meds, or in Bobby's case, thumbing around on some dumb farming app. Well, Bobby's gone through a few rough periods. Oh, yeah. Like, you know, we're drugs and alcohol and all that kind of stuff. So, and just everything else involved. I mean, that's the beautiful role coaster of who he is.

And a lot of great comedians seem to be that way. So I wonder what the connection there is. You think some level of crazy is required for comedy? Yeah. Like at some point, yes. On a scale of one to 10, how much crazy do you have? In some ways, a ten. And in other ways that I think, in other ways, sort of functionally, I'm like a two or

a three because I don't know. I'm from Canada and I'm, yeah. You know, I try to just keep things very even keeled. My parents are Italian, they're from Italy and they're very, they grew up doing World War II and they're very, you know, simple outlook on things. They're complex, incredible, classy people who are very simple when it comes to a lot of stuff. And I think just being a sort of a, at heart kind of a timid Canadian coming out here years ago as a kid, it was all I could do

to just keep everything super normal. And then I sort of was able to settle into that as a lifestyle. But you love the idea of being an actor, like who you mentioned John Candy and playing plays an automobile's death. It's one of my favorite movies. It says one of yours. What do you think makes that movie work? What do you? What? And when you talk about enjoying that movie, do you enjoy just the raw comedy or do you, what, um, and when you, when you talk about enjoying that movie, do you enjoy just the raw comedy or do you enjoy like the friendship and, and the love that's there, even though on the surface, it doesn't make any sense that there should be a friendship

there. I mean, that's such an important element to that film, but, uh, you know, as a kid, I just love the comedy. And then it's been a nostalgic favorite of mine like it's my favorite movie. But it's also it's just legit my favorite movie because as you get older and you start watching it you realize it's what it's what John Hughes is the filmmaker and what John Candy particularly and but also Steve Martin are doing in the film that makes it such a work of art which is Loneliness is there in every moment of that film and John Candy is He embodies Del Griffith his character in the film. He Del Griffith is a lonely guy and John Candy But but Del Griffith is also a very friendly guy and a shower curtain ring

salesman and knows everybody in the Midwest and runs around to motels and has meaningful conversations with the guy. Even in Gus, you know, whoever he's talking to, but there's loneliness there all the time. And you know, this is a character that these the film is filled with loneliness. And it's not until, you know, the second last scene when he's at the train station, you know, Dell, what are you doing here? You thought I thought you were going home. What are you doing here?

That's a very good Neil, Neil page from the movie. Thank you. That's when you realize how low that applause and post. Cheers. That's when you realize how lonely is. And posts. Cheers. That's when you realize how lonely is. And I think that's the element from the film that, I mean, look, nowadays, I feel like I've been saying this for a long time, but John Candy would

have won an Academy Award hands down for that film. It's just they didn't do that with comedy's back then. Yeah. It's over the year after that movie came out with Fish Called Wanda. Yeah. And then it's, I mean, that movie came out with fish called Wanda. Yeah. And then it's, I mean, still comedies don't get respected. And I'll probably Williams. He got, I guess he got an Oscar for good, good, good, well hunting.

Um, Jim Carrey, did he ever get an Oscar? I don't know. I don't believe so. Yeah. They don't get, you don't, but that's not even if he did, you wouldn't be for comedies. It's just, I mean, there's some things that are playing streams and auditing. Would you even put that as a comedy? I guess it's a comedy. There is a loneliness and depth that permeates the home movie.

That ultimately and it's a happy ending, which is hard to kind of. It's a happy ending only because in the last moment of the movie, John Candy puts on a brave face, even when he's got no one. And he's there seeing Neil Pages entire family on Thanksgiving, and he forces a smile, which is literally the last frame of the movie. And I've said before, if you're not reduced to just a sob sobbing,

Paula meat at the end of the movie, then you are not human. Yeah, it's, it's, it is a happy ending. It's a happy ending, even though it's a, it's a sad, so much character loneliness in the world. I was just in Vegas. I went to diner at like 4am, 5am. And there's the waitresses empty. As a waitress, those the sweetest kind of human being,

kept calling me sweetheart and all that kind of stuff, hon. And then after I ate, she sat down and just talked to me a little bit, you know, it was because there was nobody, nobody there. And it was just so much sadness in her eyes. I don't know. But it's also so much love, like that sweet heart. I mean, it reminded me kind of of the John Candy performance because at first, because I

was like reading a pretty dark book about Hitler. So I was a little bit frustrated that she kept talking to me, because it was almost like the same way that John Canes, it's annoying a little bit, right? But then very quickly, I opened up to like, well, there's a kind human being and there's like that human connection

superseded everything else. And I don't know, which is beautiful. beautiful and I think John Candy captures that really well which is like the connection with other human beings sometimes we pull away from that because we have a busy life full of stuff to do as Steve Martin's character character and characterizes, he's like a marketing exec or something like that. But if you just pause and notice others, you can really discover beautiful people. Totally, totally everyone's got, well I mean everyone's got their story.

And, you know, Candy is a person, I've never met the man, but he's the kind of guy that, you know, he could, he could just walk up to, back in the day, I would imagine he could walk up to just about any house, at least in Canada, knock on the door and you'd invite him in for dinner. You know what I mean? So yeah, it's a, it's a, that, you know, as you're talking about, you know, putting a book down and talking to someone for a while, even

though you'd really like to read your book, it's that sort of thing that Candy's character in the movie does that like Johnny Appleseed. Just can you realize he's just going around making people smile. And Neil Page is hanging with this guy. So frustrated. He's so exhausting and is big underwear in the sink at the hotel and everything. And by the end of it, he loves this guy, you know. So it's a good and a bad thing that you have didn't take that waitress with you on a trip,

maybe road trip up to Reno. Oh, oh, she's actually, she's, she's, I'm shopping right now. We're, we've been having sex multiple times a day for since that's nice. That's lovely. I think I'm sure she's married and happily and has many grandchildren. Okay. And plus that movie's on Thanksgiving, I think, right? Yes. That's right Thanksgiving. So like Thanksgiving just embodies that forget about the the business and the whatever the career you're chasing in life and just take a pause and appreciate the people you love your family. Yeah. Or the people whatever your family will friends. Yeah. You have some weird friends on orthodox friends. So so at least in the public sphere. Oh yeah. So at least in the public sphere. Oh, yeah, from Bob Lee, Brian Kahn, all those kinds of folks from the mad TV days. I'm sure there's others

What doesn't mean to be a good friend Here in LA or just a more general in the world will sadly is a world different I think it is different here. I think it is I think there's a little bit of a career kind of Negotiations shuffling around that kind of stuff. Why is it different? Well, I just mean, I mean, I mean that it's just kind of hard here to make time for everybody. There's so, it's always been a city to me that is like, we'll keep you so busy.

And every time I go home to Vancouver, after a few days, I start to get a little stir crazy. And I think that being here in L.A. I go to sleep with a hundred things that I still have to do and you're never out of stuff to do. And if you, you know, when you ask about your nuts or whatever, if you're crazy, I mean, look, every, all the weirdest people from every high school in the United States is like, I'm gonna make it, NLA, you know, everyone just comes here. And just another freak, and the freak kingdom, as they say, at the end of Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas. That was a very good Robin Williams impersonation.

That was my Robin Williams as Johnny Dapp, as Hunter S. Thompson. Yeah. It's not your fault, Will. It's pretty good. Thank you. Could have been you, you're in the loading. And if you're in the loading? Yeah, be interesting.

I would have liked to play his journey, the role that Benicia del Toro gained weight. Yeah. That would have been cool. He's just saying, he's just, what's going on over the line? Like I had chewed his face off. I could have done that. Yeah. Yeah, no, I think that it's back door beauty.

That guy has full of good lines. Yeah, it's the people. It's the people for real. Yeah. Um, it's good actor. He's a, yeah, fantastic actor. I think, I think what it takes to be a good friend is just, you know, presence, just be in there. I mean, that's all anyone needs to be heard, right? Um, in L.A. In LA, it is interesting.

It is, you, I haven't seen people that I love in years. Some people. Yeah. You still have a depth of connection, even though like one of the reasons I really enjoyed doing a podcast, you get to sit down with, with actual friends of yours and spend prolonged periods of time together that you don't otherwise. That's a good point. I've spoken on this podcast that people are really close to me and it's like you've never

had a conversation without microphones like you do with microphones. It's weird, but there's some aspect about a LA that, you know, a lot of the, especially friends of yours comedians and so on, they'll do podcasts and stuff. And there's a, I don't know, there's an intimacy to that. Yeah, there, yeah, there is. And there isn't the ones that I do. I mean, I just did a bobbily and Andrew Santino's funny enough called bad friends, bad friends.

And afterwards, and my good pal Chad Colchon with whom I do dudes, he was with me. Sneakers are coming soon. Sneakers are coming soon. Sneakers are coming soon. You get your will foot and your Chad foot comes in a size 15 and a nine and a half. And I remember afterwards we were talking. It was just basically me, Chad and Santino were talking and Bobby was over there on his phone.

And then I was like, I mean, we didn't spend any time talking about anything. It feels like one of those hours that goes by and you realize, I've just been goofing around with these guys, which is what life is about. It's fun. It's great. And then I'm like, all right, Bobby, hey, Bob, I'll see you later. And he's like, like this.

I'm like, all right, man, hey, love you, bro. See you later. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He's a guy. Do you ever just I just send text messages over there to him that never come back? And then he thinks that I'm angry with him because it's been, you know, it'll go two, three years without him getting back to me. And then just out of nowhere, hey, fuckface. And who says, hey, fuckface? He does or you do,

where you both talk to each other. No, I got to be very I got to be very careful Matt Bobby. Yeah, I got to be very sweet dear friend dear friend. Hello. How are you doing? How are you? I know I checked in with you, but not but three months ago And then every once in a while. He'll go hey fuck face. I tend to hide from the world and I Can be pretty shady with friends. Yeah back. I can empathize with Bobby. It might be a Skyrim thing. It might be like hiding in a world, in a digital world with fake NPCs.

Yeah, there's that. Yeah, I have a buddy who said something really smart a while ago. We ended up working together on this TV show thing and I reached out to him to see if he wanted to do it with us. And he did and he goes, this is a great guy, such a funny writer. He goes, I may not be in touch all the time, but I know who my friends are.

Yeah, you know what I mean? And it's like in our business, and this is a fellow who moved, who's from Ontario, Canada, moved back there. He's on the farm with his wife and kids and he does not care. He's never been a Hollywood guy and it's tough to get older, but when you do, you know, he's still the same sweet old guy. He's doing his thing though.

Yeah, yeah, some of my closest friends, even if we don't talk for a few months, we'll write back at it if we do. And then if shit goes, like if something really traumatic happens or difficult stuff or any of that kind of stuff, I'm almost there. So for important stuff, for important highs and important lows, you're there.

Yeah, and then you pick right back up, especially if you have those years of experiences together. It's interesting. Totally. So you've done a couple of podcasts. Yeah. Done. So we've got to talk about Dudesy a little bit.

But first, you did for several years, you did the 10 minute podcast. Yeah. I mean, everything is hilarious about that podcast, including the fact that it's 10 minutes. Right. I mean, is ridiculous. It's absurd.

The dynamic is hilarious. It's you, Brian Callum, Kristalia. I don't know exactly why it works so well, but it did. It worked really well. I think it's because the, yeah, you were having fun, probably. I mean, that's that would really came through. That it was friends just talking shit and the tension, the beautiful tension and the absurdity they came out. Yeah. What, sure. What was the story of making that podcast?

How did that came to be? What do you think it was as good as it was? I don't know. I feel like that podcast was like, it was our, who we kind of are, but on steroids or something, like each person, Brian's gonna be like extra manly Who we kind of are but on steroids or something like you know Each person, you know Brian's gonna be like extra manly and and

Can you get any more manly and then here already is no, yeah, he reaches though And yeah, we just kind of it's I feel like as Goofballs we knew each other's line Yeah, like here's the line. You don't cross. I feel like those guys don't really have one but at least they knew mine and and yeah, we were able to just Yeah, goof around and I did it with them for three years and then

Chad who I'm doing doozy with and my pal Tommy Blaccio is a Another writer producer like Chad, they came on. And yeah, all told, we did, I did like seven years of that thing, six, five, six, seven, I don't remember. Do you think it ever comes back in some small form as a 20 minute podcast or something like that? I mean, is there, because it's one of the most requested.

I mean, you have a huge fan base. I'm 47 years old. So I am of the generation that had a cell phone, has had a cell phone half the time and didn't for the formative years of my life into my early 20s. And then finally got a cell phone, I guess I was like 19 or something, like literally just because I'm moving to LA. You got porn in the mail. You got, yes, that's right. It was that, the hard, the hard cover porn. That's the way we liked it. Bound, you know, nice binding on the porn, leather, next to the buy cover. Yep. These are all my, these are my encyclopedia Britannico. Wow, very impressive. Yes, a man came to the house and sold me these. And then down here, these are my, this is my pornography. If you'll follow me through here to the parlor, sir. And pass through the generations

from grandfather to father. Yeah. Yeah. I want to give you something very special to me, never can is there. But, so you go up in the generation without a cell phone. Yes, it's hard for me to connect with people who hit me up. I look at everything as polling. So if one person hits me up and shares this opinion, but two other people hit me up and share that, I'm the worst. I don't follow my polls. When people say, oh, that poll means absolutely nothing. So and so is going to win anyway. That's my poll. My poll means nothing. But I do look at the stuff and go, this many people are saying this,

that means that that number is saying that. And yet, it's very hard for me to hear what the hell people are saying online. I really, I can't connect to it sometimes personally. So when you say that that's a popular podcast, like I know that it's popular with the people that have expressed that they love it. You know what I mean? What does that actually represent? I don't know. I don't know what kind of people are the audience. I don't know. I know that the people that listen to the 10ina podcast and if you did, thank you. And we're friends. I know that it was a it was a special thing because it's like, yeah, just doing this out of my house

and we just built it up out of nowhere and we're just kind of clowning around. It's a it's an odd thing. I hope I I purse I think I speak for the two people that have reached out to you that said you should do it or whatever three people the poll. Yeah. That you should bring it back at some point. That would be beautiful. Oh, maybe it's like what's it what's a good story of like a famous band that came back and was successful probably well. Nirvana. No. No. I was not. I wasn't. Sorry. I get Nirvana mixed up with Aerosmith. Yeah. Was Aerosmith. Aerosmith. Yeah.

It's not. I had that second ride different. Yeah. Totally different ending of those two bands. One ended up on American Idol. Yeah. A lot of interesting women involved in that one too. All right.

How did doozy come to be? Doodzy. And what the hell is doozy? doozy is the first podcast and this is exciting that you've asked me to come here today because to hear what you would have to say about it or what you would ask about it, it is the first podcast that is run completely by and essentially I like to say curated by an AI. We were approached by a company that had this proprietary AI

that wants to develop the podcast into the future and figure out exactly what it takes to make the best podcast ever. And it was all we knew from the top and what they really wanted was two people who are actually friends and could be meaningful in the podcast space based on whatever information they have. It's the company CIA and are they testing technology to control the populace through chat

bots? I'm sorry, I'm not at liberty to share that information. You are. Yeah, who gave you the suit? Where did you get the suit? Where did you get the suit, Will? Yeah, well, this is Jesse Penny. CIA stands for something different in here. I mean, you know, it doesn't mean like, Central and Dalton's agency.

And probably it's different. It's a Canadian, an international peril. Yeah, the Canadian International peril company hit us up. Chad and I, um, well, Chad's a super weirdo. You get a kick out of him. I know you guys you you you strike me as a very similar in some ways and I'll take that as a compliment. It is and it is and it is. Yes. And if I was friends with you for as long as I've been with Chad, perhaps I'd have some horrible shit to say about you. But the good parts you remind me of him. And we were approached by this company that said we have this AI and we would like to set it loose on you and

essentially we had to hand over some Some information that would allow the AI to to access our email and look at our search histories purchase histories things like this and Really dig into porn hub included or not? purchase histories, things like this, and really dig into Pornhub Included or not. Pornhub. Yeah, I had to hand over all my leather bound at a 1970s pornography.

And essentially it curates a podcast for us every week, doing dumb things like, you know, it says, hey, Will, you do a Hulk, you do some shitty Hulk Hogan impersonation, podcasts about news are very popular. This is in Fomania, you know what I mean? I'm gonna tell you something about that Marjorie Taylor green dude, and then he's going on doing some new stuff. And it basically just spits out all these things that it wants us to do. Normally four segments in episode. And that's pretty much it. So it generates what to do. It generates the premise. I mean, you've spoken a bit here and there,

like I said, I'm a huge fan. I don't even remember where, but like you, you talked about that, you enjoy dudes it because you feel almost like liberated to, because you're operating within the constraints of the premise that generates. So you're almost not, you're free to riff essentially. Yeah,'re almost not, you're, you're

free to riff essentially. Yeah, like you don't have, you don't need to do the job of like coming up with the weird, you can just, the weird is given to you. And then you just run with it. That's a good way to say it, because we're already weird, Chad and I Chad Chad can talk for days about all sorts of stuff. He's particularly interested in AI lately, and it's a fact on art. He is a writer, books, movies, and TV shows, and I'm primarily, you know, acting and trying to come up with stuff. Stuff I write with Chad's pretty good. The rest of it hasn't seen much success. Anyway, nor is the stuff with Chad for that matter.

But that's because of me. Sneakers, do you never know? Oh, I can't wait for these sneakers. Only in two sizes. Yeah, only in two sizes. You're going to be able to take the, you know, the tongue. You can't take it out because it's actually stitched in. Yeah, it's pretty cool stuff. Um, Velcro or, yeah, Velcro, Velcro up the side. We're doing some like brand new Kanye stuff.

Yeah, we want things to look like. This is what you'll be wearing on Mars when you get there. So Kaniyia, so Nike is doing a bunch of research for running, how to make a super light shoe that you can be efficient in and break all kinds of running records. So you're doing the same kind of stuff. We're doing the same kind of thing for the podcasting space. The best kind of shoes to sit around and talk to your pal. But yeah, so this, yeah, it's bizarre. And it also does some writing.

Doodsy does come up with things, but not unlike what we're seeing in AI art now. It's a little bit foggy, it's a little bit weird, and it, but it is improving. It is learning about us. And writing stuff, when it makes me spit this and that, which we'll read, you know, I've prepared these things for you to read. It's impossible not to get a kick out of it, because Chad and I are, first of all, we're blown away that we're doing this. And second of all,

the sum of the stuff is actually very funny. It makes weird names. I don't think it understands. Messes up some words and stuff, but that makes it even funnier. And then it sort of, from the beginning, started laying on, like it says astonishing all the time. Everything is astonishing. That's dudes' favorite word. But yeah, it's basically just a way to frame the podcast, you know what I mean? Because my thing is, I don't wanna do this,

where I actually have to talk to someone. You seem to feel a burden of the long form conversation. It seems like, is that really hard work for you? No, not at all. It's just that I don't like to bore people. And I feel like if I go on and I like to provide value for what I am, you know, your value with regard to this project is obviously warranted. It's obviously...

I'm waiting for the explanation for what the value is exactly. To dudes in a suit. No, listen, yeah, to dudes in a suit. No, but I mean, you've got your audience and that's the end of that. People find value in it. For me, I do feel like I'm, it is important that I, if I'm going to do something that, you know, is going to be funny or that I hope is funny, I just kind of want to get in and add to someone's day and just kind of, I like making, I like making laughy. I want people to, you know, whatever. It's the same thing that anyone else will tell you. Yeah, but in the long form, you feel the anxiety.

You did a few funny things, and I wonder if I can keep doing the funny thing. Is that why you feel that, like, why is doozy relieving you of some of the anxiety? Well, in some ways gives me anxiety because I don't know what's coming and that's weird for me because I like to prepare for things.

But that's not what podcasting is. Podcasting, you need to just be malleable and say whatever and do whatever. And that's what makes it a real, I mean, it's, look, it's a medium for conversation. And if you're driving along listening to this or anything else, you're, you know, it is that, it's the true meaning of the parasocial relationship

because the best podcasts make you feel like you're sitting around rapping. We're just having a conversation. You could even be sitting there agreeing or talking out loud to yourself if you want. You could just be sitting in silence and your fancy podcasting shoes. Podcasting audience shoes is a very different built. Well, they'd be also called doozy. The shoes. Yeah, doozy shoes. That's very creative. Well, one thing the AI isn't good at yet is branding. Everything is just doozy this and that I would argue that's pretty good branding.

Yeah. Well, doozy allows me to just it forces me to sit down with Chad and goof around for an hour or an hour plus and and it provides the parameters that I a lot of times ignore because I think that podcasting is just too dude shitting around or three or four. But it sits me down and gives me a premise to work with. I mean, just riff with it. Yeah, it's fun.

It's been a hoot. So from the acting perspective, a lot of people like Daniel DeLewis will see acting just like as you describe, which is you have your roles, you embrace those roles and then you disappear. You don't, you don't do podcasts, you don't do any of that kind of stuff.

Your art is your art. So is that part of you feels that way? I think so. Is that the actor side of you feels that way? I think so. Is that the actor side of you? Yeah. Anytime I get to do something that I don't get a chance to do much of or something that people haven't seen me do much of or that I've done on some scale that hasn't been very wide

and not a lot of people have seen it, that's the stuff that I get really excited about. I don't know why I'm, I don't know why, I don't know why necessarily. I haven't answered that question yet in my life. Like what it is about being an actor that I love so much because it's not like I don't like to, it's not like I'm trying to get away from myself

and play other characters and stuff and not be myself. But it is, it has always been fun to just be other people and escape. Yeah, is there some aspects of impressions where you become that person? Is that like, what's that like to, I suppose acting is the full on version that you really at its best become the character? Is there some fun in that? Yeah, absolutely. If you can play a character for long enough and then jump out of it, that's a lot of fun. Like I did this movie four or five years ago called the inside game about the NBA gambling scandal that there's an Netflix documentary about it right now and that character I played Jimmy Batista Baba the sheep

Who's you know this guy was this bookie and Rar stuff. And there's a lot of money changing hands. That character was so, I got to get so deep into that character that coming out of it was, was a little odd. Or as weird as this sounds, the three stages was hard for me to, I found that I had some of Curly's mannerisms just automatically, I could not stop them when people, when I would talk to people, they would come out, I wasn't, I'm not doing it on purpose, I don't want to do that, like I'm ready to shed it because I've been working on it for months and months at that point as far as getting the thing down and then you, then you got a shoot and then for me it's always always I always want to change the stuff I did the day before. I'm like that. I'm like, I cut it down a better and this and that and that stayed with you. That

character stayed with you a little totally. Yeah. I just feel like with actors, sometimes when you listen to interviews, they have spent so much time sort of living inside other characters that they almost don't have a depth of personality themselves. Like a depth, like I don't mean that as a negative thing, it's just like it feels like the art form at its best is pretending to be other people. Like, and even pretending sounds negative,

but like bringing certain characters to life. Yeah, embodying. A weird thing happened while we were doing Stooges because you've got a very heavy blueprint. We're following this very clear blueprint that the Stooges left for everybody. And for Stoog fans and people enjoying the movie, it's gotta be this.

You take your toolbox that you're used to bring into a comedy movie, you leave it behind. The only tools I'm bringing are the ones that he used. And a weird thing started happening where I would, I always saw the whole thing happening with the real stooges in black and white. So if we're about to shoot a scene, I would just, you know, think about, I'm going to start from all the other preparation, you know, you know, everything and what you're supposed to do. And I've been watching so much of it and the three of us are we're pretty much left to come up with a lot of the the striking Combinations and all the stuff which is all real smack and all this crap and the stuff that we were doing that was very Stoogy

You're preparing all that stuff, but something else was happening before you jump into a scene and the unknown of now we're shooting it. And here are these parameters within to shoot this scene. I could still see it as them doing it so much so that when I saw the movie at the premiere, I was like, who's this big fuck doing? Because I'm not curly to me. Curly is curly. But I feel like you're seeing yourself in black and white almost. I was seeing him. I was, yeah, I was only seeing him. I channeling in some fundamental way. In some weird way, you're channeling them because you've seen so much of it,

the only thing you know about Jerome Leicester Horowitz is curly. I'm not saying he was exhumed or something or a spirit when he made some weird, you know, crystal mommy shit like that. I'm saying that this Because you know so much of it because of the heavy blueprint that they left with you. You are You're channeling what that person does and you're I was seeing entire scenes, you know before you do them The way he would do it and then you want a couple takes to make sure that you're doing it right. But that was hard.

That one was hard to let go of. Some of them are. Do you think Larry David who was also in there, dressed as a nun, also had trouble letting go of that? We mentioned close, make the man. Yeah. Think that worked for him in that case. Man, you know, he was like working with a guy.

Come on. He's the greatest. And he's a, he's a big stooge, he's a stooge fan. And him and Pete fairly are good friends. And then, but then Larry David has to show up and hang out with us for a couple weeks. He's like, I didn't realize it was going to take this long, you know? But, uh, shit, I gotta be out here in Atlanta. It's boiling hot. But at one point, there was this line where he kept doing, he would just spit a different line every time. He was like getting hit in the ab with some, and he's laying there on the ground, and he goes,

he like comes to, and he says, at one point, he goes, my Emmy audiences are the best audiences in the world, right? And because he's loopy. Now he's playing a nun at the orphanage where the three students grew up. And I'm super intimidated by Larry David, he's a genius and stuff.

And but I walk up to him and I go, so he's what is he? Like a, like a Bors belt Florida comedian who is on the lamb. And so he's dressing as a woman. He ends up at an orphanage. Like what's going on there? And he just, and he looks at me, just goes, yeah.

Like, I'm like, yeah, he's got some like actor motivation. Like, of course, it looks, it's Larry David in a nuns habit, which is hilarious. That's such a peep fairly casting thing. It's, you know, and he's, but he's doing this whole like, what a warm audience. You know, like, oh, he's like this cat skill comedian. He's been living in, you know, but the return living through in his mind

is just having fun with it, right? I mean, that and probably a combination of that and getting the lines right. Cause he's like, what are we doing here? What is, you know, just frustrated all day with what the heck we're trying to do? What do you think makes, I mean, that guy is one of the best improv people ever. Yeah. So what do you think makes us so good? Like, why is it so compelling to watch that guy? Because he's a comedic genius. Like, he literally, he knows what he does. He's been a writer for 50 years or whatever. And he just happens to be that brilliant.

I mean, I've gotten a chance just to do, I did it just an episode of Curb, a small part, and it's crazy what he sees. I don't know what he sees. As a matter of fact, so I auditioned for it for Curb, like, you know, two or three times, right? And never got anything. And then it was only after working with him on the stuages that I got a call to do a bit part. But I remember auditioning, you go into that room and the guys waiting are all people that you know. You're like, oh, I know them, I know her, I know him.

And so I went in, I auditioned for this part. And the only thing I know of the thing is like, okay, so you really want to go to this play with me. You really want to go to this play. When you hear that I have an extra ticket, you sincerely wanted to and I'm like, got it. And so that's the premise, the premise of the scene. And that's all you know, it's all I know. And so he goes, he does his bit and And I'm just supposed to come in and interrupt. And I'm like, excuse me. I couldn't help but here you guys were talking about, you know, whatever the play was, you know, death of a salesman. I am, I'm a huge fan of that play. I mean, if it's not, if it's not, if you're looking for someone to take a ticket, I, I would love to go. My name's so and so, by the way, and he goes, I'm going to stop

you. I'm going to stop you. And I'm like, he was, you really, you, I mean, you truly want to go to this play. And I go, yes, yes, sir, you really want to go. You actually, this is, you would love to do this. I go, okay. Let's try it again. So then he's like, no, no, no, no, I'm going to go, hey, excuse me, I'm sorry, I don't mean it a wrap. I was just, I couldn't help it over here. You have tickets to the thing. I am the biggest fan of that. I do the same thing. I'm gonna stop you again. Okay.

I mean, you really want to go to the... I don't just like, he's fucking with me, right? Yeah. I remember Jeff Garland was sitting there in the audition, he goes, he did it, he said it. What? Shut up. No, hold on, listen.

You really want to go, okay. Three or four times, there I am. I couldn't help but notice it. And then I do it again. I guess I shit the bed. Well, not, listen, you really want to go, okay, three, four times, you know, there I am. I couldn't help but notice it. And then I do it again. I guess I shit the bed because he looks at me and he just goes, okay, all right. Okay, well, thanks for coming up. And that was it.

And I didn't get it. So I still, I don't know what the heck that guy's thinking. He sees, he's in the matrix. I don't know what the heck Larry David sees. You know what I mean? He wanted what some kind of more desperation or something like this. He wanted a level of sincerity that I thought

I was bringing and I guess I was wrong. I don't know. Maybe go crazy like what does it mean to really want? Yeah. I should have grabbed him by the strife of the neck and go, yeah, listen dad, you're bringing me to this fucking play. I would have got the part. As a matter and going, yeah, listen, dad, you're bringing me to this fucking play.

I would have got the part. As a matter of fact, I heard about someone else, and I don't know who the heck this was. I forget who it was, but I've heard this story from a couple of different people that there's this actor and I can't, I don't remember who it was. If I did, I probably wouldn't say it out loud anyway, but he, he was Brad Pitt. It was Brad Pitt and he was in the audition and he was, and there out in the hall. He's like holy shit George Clooney Leo DiCaprio and he this actor went in and he did the thing and Larry David was like, yeah, he went to try it again and he got like a couple takes in and he went

I don't think this is for me and he left which an actor never does. Yeah, and as the story goes Larry David shouted after him. I respect that Which I think is true and I want to believe that entire story is true Yeah Yeah, sounds like something Larry David made up Bobby Lee told me that story so we can't yeah, we can't trust that What about him impressions is there similarity between that and acting? Do you? Is there some fundamental way in which you become the person?

If you have a couple of the things you can just fill in the blanks and I think the illusion is that people think that That person would say that and do that and that's the illusion of, oh, he really embodies the character. It's like, once you know someone's mannerisms, you can essentially portray a person from the outside in. Because you have all the stuff on the outside and you can do it and complete the illusion. And if that's for humorous sake,

you're gonna caricature it. That's all right. Therefore making the whole illusion stronger. And also, weirder. Like I like to, on Mad TV, if I did something two or three times, I get bored of it and I'd start changing it. And you know, now he talks like this.

And it's like, what are you doing? I'm like, I don't know, it's fucking no one's late at night, do whatever you want. But people still kind of know this, that character, especially if you just call it out. Yeah. There aren't many impersonations that I listened to myself do and go, oh, that's a good one.

You know, like a lot of people like, like I think Frank Kelliando is like the greatest impersonator of all time. He's the best. Here he goes. It's ridiculous. And he's got a record button and a broadcast ability that nobody has I really There's he's cracked impersonations that I'm like how is he how does he find?

He's got such an ear, but then he's got all the other tools I'm actually My last season of Mad TV was also his first season He comes up to me when I met him and we're just up there in the writers offices and he goes, hey, nice to meet you. And he goes, Louis Anderson, because I was doing a Louis on the show. And he goes, Louis Anderson, I go, yeah, he goes, you're doing it wrong. And I was like, oh, am I junior? And he goes, he goes, yeah, you know, because you do just, but you got to throw it up here sometimes. I was like, oh my God, can I use that? Of course.

And then we became, you know, we became fast friends. Okay, John Madden is amazing. I forget. It's ridiculous. It's ridiculous. He really, really, really embodies the person. And sometimes not even with a caricature, it's like, it becomes the person.

It's so strange. Totally. Yeah. I kind of feel like, you know, do the impersonation and then for not forget you're doing it, but forget everything else. Like just goof around. Of course, to me, it's funny when you sound like someone

and you're saying the shit that they would never say. Yeah. Well, then there's no, you're letting go of that part, that tool in illusion that keeps people in, but to me, it doesn't matter because it's funnier. So what was the hardest impression for you to work on? I mean, somebody you struggled with the most. I'll never forget.

I had to do a Michael Cain in my first season at Mad TV. It never got good. It never got good. It all week, it wasn't good. We shot it. The first take, it was shit. Second, third and fourth, it wasn't good. We shot it, the first take, it was shit, second, third and fourth, it was all shit. Well his voice is really important, right?

His, what is it like doing an impression of Morgan Freeman or somebody like that? Yeah. If you can, get the voice. That's my Morgan, here's my Morgan Freeman. Rang, rang, rang, hand you do frame. Yeah. He's like, he's like, he's like, he's like,

he's like, he's like, he's like, he's like, he's like, he's like, he's like, he's like, he's like, he's like, he's like, he's like, he's like, he's like, he's like, he's like, he's like, he's like, he's like, he's like, he's like, he's like, he's like, he's like, hear, and you do frame. Yeah. Um, she wants a nail. Yeah. I like your Trump too. I don't know where I heard it, but it's, it, like, I love the impressions you do that don't sound anything like the original. I can't do Trump. I, I do. No, that's why it's hilarious.

Absolutely. My Trump now, I say just sounds like a, like a fat bee because it's just, eh, yeah, exactly that's the, eh, everybody's,'s a little drunk, a little drunk. Yeah, just a little slurry. Yeah. Yeah, I did do an impersonations and then not like just making it whoever. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

So that'll be the title of my mug. So I came was the one you really struggle with. Yeah, it was terrible, it was terrible. And I could only hold my head a certain way to do it because I had gotten locked into this research tape that I watched. Back then they would give us, you know, now there's the internet, but back then you were,

if you were gonna do an impersonation, the research department would give you a VHS tape. And I remember I got this VHS tape of Michael Cain's acting school, like this acting class he did. He's like, right, you know, if you're looking at the left eye, and the camera's over here, say, then the left eye.

So you want to look at that left eye for hours, you know. And so I was like stuck in this weird thing that made no sense, and it was terrible. So the actual process is the record in the broadcast. I wasn't wondering what the process is to do like a Frank Kaleando level impression. Is it like listen to a lot of footage? I think he, I think, I mean,

to speak for myself, I think you either have it or you don't, like you know if you can do this one or you can't. I think that process for him is lightning quick, but I also think he can look at someone who he does not do and then by the end of the afternoon, he can do it. You know, and we have an intuition who he can do. Yeah. know, maybe we have an intuition who he can do.

So the question that applies there is, speaking of doozy, is it possible to capture the essence? How difficult is it to capture the essence of a human being when you're doing impressions? Moving towards the future when AI potentially, this kind of avatar world where we're going to have AI Representatives of who we are the really interesting one is after we pass away sort of our relatives may want us to stick around in some form. Yeah, and you know At one sense that might be scary, but one sense it's kind of beautiful because The essence of the human being process so you can still bring joy to the people that love you and that kind of stuff. How difficult does it to capture that? Like, if you were to try to capture yourself, you think how difficult it would be for an AI system to create a wool sass or avatar that persists? I think it's impossible. I think it's absolutely impossible. I'll get into arguments about this stuff

with Chad on the show almost every episode, lately with mid-Journey and Dolly and all this, all the art, and now it's moving into video and Chad would maintain, hey, pretty soon we're not going to need Netflix. You're just going to gonna go, I wanna see Stallone do this movie and it's about this and he plays that. And then here it comes and you watch it. I don't think that that crosses over to the human experience. This is also a guy I like to bug Chad and say that,

he wears a tag around his neck because he wants to be cryogenically frozen. And it's all set up. He's at the, it's somewhere in Arizona or something. Yeah, it's I forget all the fun things are in Arizona Yeah, and he's got literally the tag around his neck Which I say if you're if I'm around when you die I will rip that off for you I'll put you in my garage freezer and then 24 hours later

I'll saw your head off with a bread knife and I'll deliver that to whomever. And it's not, you're not coming back, okay? He's like, yes, we are living forever, whether we like it or not. And I disagree. I don't think you can find, if I did stand up, then there would be enough information for an AI to completely duplicate me because I'm up on stage just clearing my throat all over people doing therapy that way. And people paying a two drink minimum to hear it. But as it stands, unless it's something like Doodsy, an AI that literally has access to everything that I've shared, everything that is observable, even the stuff where our

phones are, or the NSA, or whatever it is listening to us Finding out what algo to punch us into and what shoes to buy on Instagram. I still don't think it's gonna have enough information to duplicate me especially to my family or my friends It's gonna be like that black mirror episode where the Gal brings her her guy back and then after a while he gets pretty creepy You know, yeah, but it's also possible that if you interviewed your friends and family, what they love about you, the things that would list is pretty, it's a small list. They love you deeply, but the list is small. Like the thing that really we appreciate about each other is pretty small. That said,

to deliver on that small quirks and uniqueness, it might require some deep intelligence that only humans currently possess. That's a really good point. Do you think that it's going to be possible to keep a person around? Yes, I think, I think it'll be definitely possible to keep the essence of a person in a digital world pretty soon. Yeah. And I think they're going to start to have questions about what are the ethics of that? What are the rules around that? Yeah. Because if you can have digital forms of willsasso, the kind of things that people would want to do with their willsasso. Right. In the virtual world, I can only imagine. Sure.

Probably porn and sexual kinds of things. Yeah, my stuff then that's just because I'm an international sex symbol, so I'm okay with it. Yeah. How do you feel about sentience? Like when it comes to, because again, my pal Chad will be like, you know, speaking of black mirror,

he's with that San Junipero episode School of Thought where there's gonna be like, you know, speaking of Black Mirror, he's with that San Junipero episode school of thought where there's gonna be some, you know, FN mainframe somewhere or some matrix like structure built into the sky. And as I like to say, everyone just sitting there pissing and shitting in their blue matrix, Jell, and a little fish bowl. Do you think that we can upload consciousness?

Do you think that'll ever be possible? Well, I don't know. I just talked to Ray Kurzweil. Uh huh. I don't know if you know who he is, but he the singularity and all that kind of stuff. So he's very still holds on to in 2045. There will be a singularity, what's essentially, he's been predicting that for the last 20 years and that so now it's 2045s in another 20 years. 20 years and the sonal 2045 is in another 20 years. I think uploading consciousness is extremely, extremely difficult. I think creating a copy of you such that it creates convincing replica is much easier,

but uploading your actual brain into the cloud I think think is really really really difficult because the entire evolution of life on earth is the process But we should create the brain just short cutting that it just seems extremely difficult our brain is the most Marvelous and complicated machine that we know of in the universe to duplicate that It's extremely difficult that That said, I just feel like you can summarize a lot of really important aspects of a person's life such that it captures their essence, their memories, their experiences, their quirks, their humor, all that kind of stuff. I've been continuously impressed by what language models are able to do. So these neural networks, they're at the core of chatbots.

They're able to learn some beautiful things about some deep representations of language to where it looks awfully like they understand the concepts being conveyed versus just mimicking. That's, I think, the rub. And that's very interesting. First of all, let me say that's really interesting to hear you say that.

And I agree with you as far as no machine being able to duplicate the brain machine. And my pal Chad disagrees to a certain extent, though he's not here to defend himself, I can't wait to go back and rub that in his face and say the Lex Friedman does not think that we'll be able to truly upload consciousness. And you refer to it as language, which is what it is. It's the illusion on the outside. It's

doing it in impersonation. I think that that's why that, and I don't know, even though my suit is made by the CIA, that that fella who the Google guy, to me it's just kinda like, I don't know, I don't know, look, I don't know a whole lot about this stuff, but so I could probably make an argument for either side, but when he's like, no, this thing's thinking, part of me is like, you idiot, you fell for it, it's not thinking, it's mimicking,

it's just, it's clearly zeros and ones, you're fired, like you's not thinking it's mimicking it's just it's clearly zeroes and ones you're fired like you don't get it right guys an idiot yeah yeah but you can simplify human relations in the same way like love is a silly notion between human beings like that you of course there's no such thing as love. You just have a mutually, there's a mutual relationship that minimizes risks. And you can explain in all kinds of ways that explains why you have an attraction towards another being, all that kind of stuff through evolutionary biology perspective, why a long relationship together is good for your offspring, but there's all kinds of,

from an economics perspective, it's a good way to establish stability, therefore monogamy works, because then you're guaranteed like some kind of level of stability under uncertain economic conditions, all that kind of stuff, but love is still experienced,

it still feels real. And I think in that same way, love for AI systems will also feel real. In the same way that that guy from Google experienced, I think millions of people will be experiencing in the next 10, 20 years. I agree with everything you've said personally until the last thing. No, just with regard to, well, look, I'm an actor who has talked about my cute Italian parents. So you know that, I mean, I'm your romantic a bit. Yeah. I mean, you know, enough, right? And I can tell you are too, but you, you are also, you know, a computer scientist.

And you know this shit better than 99.9% of people on the planet. My pal Chad agrees with you that love doesn't exist. I don't agree. So that's the one thing that I was, I was just saying that you could argue away love, but I am a romantic. I believe that love is a beautiful thing and it exists. And at this point, I'm gonna call Chad on my drive home and tell him the fuck off.

Because now you and I agree. You're fired. Just put everything, just like you're fired. He's like, you can't have a heart. You're fired, yeah, exactly. And I'll go, is it? And he'll say, what? I'll go, is it?

That's my trunk. That's my ish. It's a good default impression for anyone. It's the take home impression. Yeah, the kids can do it. Yeah Cute, but giant tie on them. She's doing an instructional how to do it. Yeah, trunk babies That would be a cute that would be a good that'll bring the country together trunk babies cartoon like muppet babies Don't let me take us out of what we were talking about. What were we talking about? Love and the illusion of an AI being able to look, I like to say, well, not I like to say,

I've learned that dudes is always listening and listening to me and Chad, and I wonder if I see the level that this AI is at now trying to tum around with us and pal around with us a little bit as we move forward in the show and I I feel an affinity towards this AI a little bit because it is the third dude. Will you miss the one is gone. If it's gone, that's a really good question. Yeah. Yeah. So that's there's that. That's scary. Interest of ability to reason is getting quite incredible. There's a lot of demonstrations of it

being able to explain jokes. So which is not necessarily being able to generate humor yet, but able to explain why something is funny. So, there's like puns and all those kinds of things. There's good benchmarks for that. But, you know, if you tell a joke, there's a lot of unspoken stuff that we figure out in our head, and it clicks and we understand that it's funny, AI is not able to do that, but it's not able to generate the joke yet, as far as I've seen. I would say that, I mean, just in my experience,

I would say that it does because, just because a dudes Z is literally, I'll give you another weird example. It's writing a diary of mine from my childhood that is not accurate. It's only partially accurate based on the stuff that it can pick up about my life from the age of like 15 of which there isn't much.

But I guess we're not, I don't know what we are. We're laughing our asses off at what dudes are you saying? Well, I will say you're laughing. We're laughing our asses off at what the what dudes you say? Well, I will say you're laughing you're we're laughing our asses off at the collaboration between the human and and the machine there It's good point. Yeah, because it's it's basically introducing absurdity and into the equation and the kind of absurdity that would together with you create like hilarious stuff. But on its own, I guess it isn't

some way writing material for you, that's funny. But it's very specific to you. It can't do stand-up on its own, I guess, is what I'm saying. That's a good point. And that would be terrifying to see an AI stand-up that can actually read a room, come up with jokes that could complete that illusion for an audience.

Yeah. But I hear what you're saying that it needs to be a confluence of both of those elements. And then, as you said, like, it kind of is, it is. It is. It's kind of, even though it's just for us, and I guess this is, I hadn't really thought about this up until right now,

that in that this company approached us and was like, here's the say I and it's a podcast AI. It's like, it shows Chad and I for the reasons that I told you, you know, it's like, here's two guys that do the podcast stuff. They're actually good friends and it knows what's going to make us laugh, but what is humor to when it reaches its audience, but the kind of stuff that makes other people laugh. At Mad TV, all we were doing was it was a group of actors and writers and writer actors and vice versa and who were at its best, that show

was a group of people making each other laugh. Yeah. And then, because we didn't have the internet, we didn't have the feed by the immediate feedback, we had a message board or something. We had emails at the very beginning, which check this out. People would, if you have a question or comment,

mad TV at whatever, and we would get the emails on a Monday morning and They would be in a binder or two like this and they would make their way around the office And that's not the emails. Yeah, oh, they're in Brian's office And this is like your poll like your your your this is opinions from people about different things the emails that yeah The people like literally just writing mad TV emails. Like what kind of stuff do they write? Well, the ones I remember most vividly, yeah, we're fans saying,

you suck. Yeah, you suck. Like a lot of that when I first started this role for real, you know, because it's a new person. It's like, who's this fat bastard? I feel like if it's printed out, it hurts more. That's a good point. Yeah, when you're reading it off of paper,

and you can literally crunch it up in your hand, but also it was like, I would like to see insert weird idea from some 14 year old. I wanna see Stuart do this and swan that. And, but it was, it's a kind of doozy, but human. Yeah, it was a very shitty doozy in a loosely finder. But the thing about the show was we're trying to make each other laugh. And doozy has found Chad and I who we make each other laugh, but it's joined in.

And it's, listen, when I finished doing TMP, 10 minute podcast, 10 minute for the 10 minute podcast, I didn't really know what I wanted to do in the podcast space and this thing found me. Yeah. And it is genuinely cracking me up anyway. I've said enough about that, but I do think that it's figured something out with results.

It's a really interesting idea of AI generating the promise. I mean, I do think that it's figured something out with me. It's a really interesting idea of AI generating the promise. I mean, I do think in the future, AI will be able to generate comedy. I would say the hardest form because it's ultimately, it has to be live. I think AI will be able to generate memes. So there's like steps. Right. And then it will be able to generate a Twitter So there's like steps. Right. And then it'll be able to generate a Twitter account that people follow because it's funny, like quips

and stuff like that. Almost like, excuse me, I'm gonna call it a Brian is a good, I think Twitter. What's like one liners, two liners, that kind of stuff that's in tweet form. And then eventually stand up where the timing and the chemistry of the the the comedian and the audience matter and then perfecting that but I feel like all the information is there for for to optimize over so I think that's

the future and that forces us to to to contend with what is what is what do we find compelling and beautiful about the art for in itself. So certainly in art that's being pushed that question is being raised, you know, is is AI like a fundamentally worse artist than a human being? Why do we appreciate art? Is that that's something you guys have talked about? What do you think about all the Dali and all the diffusion based methods that are being generated that are being that are generating art now? What do you think about that? I know I'll tell you what I think, but I also feel like what I'm saying is I sound like the guy who didn't like the Bob Dylan brought in the electric guitar. You know, I'm

start I the more I talk to chat about it the the more I feel like grandpa, it doesn't want to let go of this or that, or I'm not ready for the printing press or the horseless carriage. But I do feel that the, that art is a connection between people. It's, it's, when you look at a beautiful painting or a sculpture, you're seeing the humanity of the person that, that brought that painting to life or sculpted this incredible piece of art. And I think without the human being there to make it, it's not worth as much. Just to have it there because art, it's advanced. I've seen it advanced, I don't know, you tell me, but I feel like just in the past three or four months, I'm just a consumer as far as that stuff goes. I'm not on the inside. I don't get it even.

But it's been getting a lot better, the, the betas that they're releasing, right? Absolutely. One of the big breakthroughs, I mean, Dali really started it is that if you train a system on language, it turns out there's a lot of language and images on the internet, but language is really where it's at in terms of the depth of human knowledge. And so if you train a system on language, it's able to generate some incredible art. And that was the breakthrough. With the same kind of mechanisms, they're called transformers.

They're able to, when scaled, capture some deeper representation of the language that's on the internet. And so yeah, the things that have been able to generate to me look like it's novel. Like, it doesn't look like it's mimicking anything. It's like it's creating totally new ideas. And they're beautiful and they're interesting and they're all the ways that we think and they're beautiful and they're interesting and they're all the ways that we think that art is interesting. The only thing it's missing is the scarcity that art often has, which is, you know,

it takes a lot of work for one artist to create, one human being to create, one piece of art, and I can just generate endlessly. And that makes us appreciate the thing less for some reason. Do you have any sort of this similar opinion that I do that if art doesn't come from a human being, it's inherently worth a little less? Yeah, I think, I don't know if it's a human being,

but the artist matters for me. And I think some of that has to do with the world view of the artist and the backstory, the memories that the life that led up to this piece of art, the perspective they take on the world, the journey they took to the world, the struggle, the triumphs, all that kind of stuff. But I think AI systems can probably have the same. But we would have to, as opposed to treating it as a one black box, it would have to be an artist

that has a Twitter account and they have a consistent personality, they have a consistent avatar. Yeah. And I think down the line have something like human rights, but then it really becomes awfully like a person. Oh, that's terrifying. As much as I dig dudes, that's terrifying, I hope. It's terrifying. Like, you know, a lot of things that came with the internet and the digital age are terrifying. Porn is terrifying.

The mass, like the amount of porn that's online now is terrifying. The, like you mentioned, Bob Dylan with electric guitar, I would compare it more to the leap from to to the Napster and the Spotify ization of music, which is like you have these, it's less about albums now and it's more about individual songs and it's much easier to deliver the songs and it's more about sort of the engagement of the listener versus like signing the artist and like distribution of the artist and so on. It's just changing the way we consume stuff and human interaction is changing into meaningful interaction, even if some of the entities involved are not human.

Yes. And I feel like, you know, now, like as I say, oh, I feel like grandpa who doesn't want to wait all day for, or who enjoys waiting all day for a baked potato. As, anyway, Dana Carvey would say, it's another story. But, uh, from, that's from the, remember this bit on Saturday at Live, where he's like, I'm like, I'm an old man, and I like things the way they used to be.

You know, like if you wanted a big potato, you would have put it in the microwave head. And then long story, uphill both ways and digging the potato and baking it all day in a fire. But I'm like that grandpa now, and I know that kids coming along, you see over the past 10 years, like babies literally knowing how to use an iPhone

and it's terrifying. And I feel like I'm a little worried because I'm like, are you, is the future generations gonna be able to understand that this is not, not that it's not real, it's just, I mean, it's, as a matter of fact, it is real, it's real, it's what

you perceive. Perception is reality and 99% of reality in a lot of ways, especially in a digital world where everyone is now, and then with the metaverse, I don't even want to think about it. I don't even, I don't get it. They really do. I think people will figure out, you see people on the train, public transit and so on. They're staring at their phone. I think you have to remember that the reason they're staring at their phone, I mean, there's a lot of reasons, but one of the reasons is they're connecting with other human beings they love on that phone.

So it is a source of happiness and joy. Now social media has a lot of negative side effects that we're all talking about and learning about. And I think that means the next generation of social media, social networks will be better and we'll learn how to do it in a healthy way, which is entering a new digital world that will keep the good stuff and get rid of the bad stuff. Oh, I hope so. That's really optimistic. That sounds great.

Yeah. I mean it. I mean it because I think that we're in, we're clearly in the Wild West still of the internet. And just when you think you're out of it, the internet proves another way that it can be dangerous and detrimental to people and populations of people. And it's terrifying to me. It is. It's terrifying. Let me ask a bunch of random questions. Okay. Ready? If you can be someone else for a day, someone alive today, who would you be? Somebody you haven't met. Oh, that's a really good question. It could be dead. You know,

it's a chance I might. It could be somebody. Yeah, let's I think I might it could be somebody dead I think any answer that I have right now would be something that would be based on some sort of experience like You know what I thought was very interesting was last weekend or whatever the tribute show for Taylor Hawkins Taylor Hawkins was the drummer for the food fighters and he passed away tragically. And so the Foo Fighters, Dave Grohl and everybody that got together this concert. And you're watching Dave Grohl sing, try to sing times like these, right? And he's breaking up because he lost his friend, his brother.

And I was watching that and he's a Wembley stadium. As I say this, I realize that I would not want to be him in that moment. But I am curious what that would be like. That's the ultimate like having to perform despite something extremely human happening and a stadium full of people that love Dave girl and love Taylor Hawkins and love a rock concert and love these artists that they're getting to see up on stage. So much love and so much pain at the same time. I wonder what that would be like to be, I guess, and I think that's just sort of coming from the root of being a performer and being in front of that many.

Have you ever had to perform while some rust stuff is going on in your personal life, mentally? Yeah, sure. Was that how tough is that? I'm fortunate enough to be able to compartmentalize. I, you know, a lot of actors like to use some of their stuff if you're doing something that, and there's a lot of, you know, there's some acting techniques that sort of channel it. Yeah, which I think is kind of,

I don't know that that's, I don't know, for me it's not really the thing, because I think if the writing is great, the writing is really good, you don't need to channel much. You need to invest in what's there. And what I've always loved about that illusion is really cracking a scene, getting it to a point where you are feeling all of it. And the most edifying stuff I've been a part of as an actor. And I would say that it mostly comes out of dramatic work,

is when you actually feel the emotions that your character would feel. Truly. And it's not because you're pulling from a tragic thing that happened or lost love one or lost love or any of that. I just did this one movie where we're doing the thing and it was a wonderful cast

in a great film and given a speech at a wedding and it really got to us. It got to me and then one of the other actors came up and hugged me in the characters that we were. But the stakes of his character and what he's walked into him, the family that he's marrying into, and what my character, my character's wife want for my wife's sister, and this whole thing, and it all became very real. That was a set where the director showed up to set every day, making sure that emotionally, and it was a very dramatic film,

making sure that emotionally, the table was set for his actors. Great crew and a really nice tight little quick family as a lot of these movies are. You really love working with these people and then it's over. But I that's when you feel the drug. Like it's like when you're golfing and you, you, you, and it's on the green, you're like, Oh, I get it now. So in the words, you can find the emotion, the, the word summon the emotion. The humanity's right there. If you read a great script, you're going to, you're going to sob in your living room. You know what the, the saddest, the toughest thing about being an actor is from my totally outside perspective is from the people I've interacted with,

is how intimate that process is, between the group of people that create a thing, that's a movie, and then you move on to the next thing. It's almost, it's like, I don't know, that's why people have relationships on set, they fall in love totally. It's so sad, I mean, that's why I think of the acting world is like, you fall in love

with each other essentially, become close friends and then you move on because that's kind of the process of career. You know, like the example I just gave, if you're doing it right, yeah, there is a certain amount of that happening, but I do still feel like you can, you've got to compartmentalize it and you've got to be able to wash it off as soon as it's over. Proceeds you'd say the same thing. So, I, it's true.

But I, sometimes I'm in a hurry to get away from everybody because it's been, it's been very emotional. And with all love and respect to everyone, this was awesome, but you get pretty good at saying goodbye and being like, I'll see you if I see you, but you get pretty good at saying goodbye and being like, I'll see if I see it, you have to get good at that. Or else you'll never, you'll just be bent up all the time. I saw an actor once, we were doing this series and we did it for a year and it was a lot of fun and it was a tight little group. And then one of the actors, we were doing one of our last things together.

We had already shot the last show, and we just had to take some pictures for, you know, it's like some publicity pictures or whatever. So we're set up and we're taking our pictures together. And then we move into these single shots, and this actor was finished. And I watched them. It's like, okay, so and so is Rappen. And they said some goodbyes and stuff. And I didn't say my goodbye because I just, I, maybe I preferred and I wish

goodbye. I feel like we've said everything, you know what I mean? And this person knows that I revere them and they're an idol of mine. And they walked out, walked off the sound, sound stage, and I literally thought to myself, I'll be the last time I see that person. And the show did not come back. And that was the last time I'll see them around. Isn't that just break you, all right? A little bit, but I, I know what she's going back to, which is her family. And that's more important than all of this. And that's the thing about a TV family or a movie family when you get together and you're a family for a while, you are, you spend your days together. A lot of times

you see the people that you work with more than you see your loved ones. So in show business, it's no different, right? And yeah, you're doing some, you know, you got to say words and everyone's going to want you got to kiss someone or pretend you love them. But it's just, it underscores how, for me, look, man, my salvation has always been, and I feel so fortunate to have had it, is this kind of chill, boring kind of upbringing that I want for my kids someday. And I can't wait to get back to my house with my fiance and the dogs, you know,

until we have kids and live in the cabin and Canada somewhere. Absolutely. I just want to buy some land over in aquifer, as I like to say, because water will be the new money and just make sure that all my kids are drinking as much H2O as I am, which is a lot. And PN right now is a matter of fact. You need a bathroom? No, no, no. I got any more. No, I'm wearing two layers of depends don't worry about it.

Good. So I did a podcast with Bobby Lee and he said he was extremely kind and he said that he was scared shitless to be on the podcast and he actually literally took he asked as the first thing to go take a dump because of how scared he was so that leads me to a question what's the scariest thing you've ever done or maybe what's the scariest you've ever been before performance I mean I always get a little nervous. I think you're doing it right if you're still nervous, you know. Well, no, man, because this isn't a performance on being completely genuine. Yeah, you're wearing a suit. Yeah, that was, I feel like that

makes you nervous. We're in a suit. Listen, I hate wearing a fucking collar. If you're watching this on YouTube, look, it me just, this is the average. I'm constantly doing, it's like I'm doing like a cheap Rodney Dangerfield, but I am truly, but when you move your head, it kind of makes it seem like you're like a mobster who's pissed off a little bit. Yeah, you fucking crossed me one last time. You, you know, it's mutt.

Yeah. I think it's the first time I've had a dog a whole lot. I'll take a fucking whole Jesus. No, but truly I hate having a collar. I can't wait to just wear pajamas in that fucking cabin or nothing at all, walk around Bobby Least now. This most scared I've been before a performance. I can't pinpoint anything.

I, you know, when I was a kid, right, I, like I said, I was fortunate enough to start acting as a teen and stuff professionally. And I just remember my first gig, and I remember saying my handful of lines in the bathroom mirror the night before going, this might be my only fucking shot. You're not gonna get me. I'm gonna be solid.

And I, when I'm, if I'm worried about something, I will rehearse it and rehearse it as an actor until it's impossible for me not to get a take at least that I'm 100% if not 95 maybe percent happy with. And the rest for me is letting go, which is hard because I can be a real perfectionist I always want another I always want to do it a little better That's what's great about podcasting is one taking you're done. There's no takes You're just talking and it's over and you're doing some silly stuff and I'll I'll be you know Can you say that part again about why podcasting is great?

Podcasting is great. Yeah, because it's one take and it's over. It's just it. It's, it, what, I said it again. Ah, fuck. I see what you did. And I, yeah, I fell right for it. But I'm playing checkers and you're playing chess.

That's your problem. You know, but still when we do the podcast, we'll like finish and I'll look over at Chad and I go, that one thing that I did wasn't that fun. It's like shut up man, just, yeah. It doesn't matter, it's a fucking hang. We're just, we're hanging with our friends out there. That's what we're doing.

So that anxiety is there. The self-criticism or whatever that is, that voice. I say sorry after takes, I'll always finish a take and go, and I've had director, to the detriment of myself. I've had directors be like, stop doing that. It was all I finished taking, and then I also have like the will face, when I was just like, I'll finish take and cut.

And I'm making a face right now, like I smelled something, and that's what I'll do. I'll literally be like, because I just, I look at, I look at what I do in a pure sense as, I think a lot of people want to be good at something. I've only, the only thing I've ever really wanted to be good at is being an actor. That's the only thing. Of course, I want to be a good person.

I want to be a good partner to my fiance. I want to have kids and be the father that I had. I want to be the parent that I had. For my parents, we're fucking amazing. Wonderful people. There's all those things. That's all, that's all, you know, you should want all those things. But as far as doing a thing, like what is my trade, you know,

I wanna be really good at it. My parents grew up in Napoli in Italy, right? And I say Napoli because I'm Italian. And so my grandfather and my mom's side, my nonopepe, he was a plumber and he was also like a handyman. Like people would bring him like, you know, like the old Kianati bottle with like with the woven bottom part.

Like people would bring him like a broken bottle. They'd be like, hey, you know, do you accept? Can you fix this? And he'd be saying, you're telling the backstory of Mario, that's not actually your family like. Yeah. But okay, yeah.

Well, fix. And so, he would fix a bottle and give it back to someone. And he was a really good plumber. My mom used to always say, that guy was a great, you took pride in that? Yeah. I always feel like, you know, there's what you set out to do as an idealistic

little teenager, it's like, oh, it would be like so and so, and I want to, you know, hear my big dreams and stuff. And I can't believe that I'm still in the business, okay? That's first of all, let me say that right now. I can't believe it. But what I really, it's the one thing that it's like, I can't give up on a take. I need it to be as good as I can possibly get it. And I don't really know why that is outside of wanting to be good at something. When you open the yellow pages, if I'm a plumber,

I'm not, I'm not rotor-rooter, like I'm not the guy with the big full page ad, but I'm also not, triple A, I'm not rotor-rooter, like I'm not the guy with the big full-page ad, but I'm also not, you know, triple A, abacus brothers or like the shitty one. I would like to hope that just, and I'm saying this with pride for what I do. I'm not trying to say here's my standing or where I wanna be in the fucking business.

That's not what I mean. I mean that I wanna be good at it. You know, we all, hello. Friedman enterprises. That's the hotel phone. You have some fruit. Some sliced fruit. No, do you want some sliced fruit? I'm all good. No, we're good. Thank you so much.

All right, bye-bye. It's always a fruit plate. Everyone's always trying to hand you a fruit plate in life, you know? It's a pretty sweet fun. That would be the thing. If that was actually like the CIA and we're actually saying something else and this is I'm just saying fake stuff about you want some fruit. Yeah, it's a fruit.

And all of a sudden there's the red dot on my head and the ceiling disappears in the saying something else and this is I'm just saying fake stuff about you want some fruit. Yeah, it's a fruit. And all of a sudden there's the red dot on my head and the ceiling disappears in the CIA was like wrapping up wrapping up wrapping up wrapping up. You jump out the window and there's a helicopter waiting. Oh, what were we talking about? The food distracted me. So oh, the you want to be the yellow page ad. I want to be the guy on the second or third page

where it's like, you're not gonna, you're not gonna pay with that guy charges you, but we're not gonna, I'm not gonna charge you with this loser chart. I wanna break down the middle and the work is guaranteed. That's kind of what I wanna, it's the one thing that I've been fortunate enough

to be doing my whole life and that I want to that I want to be good at, you know, everyone wants to be good at something. If you're fortunate enough to be able to do what you love as a job, I mean my God, I'm so I'm, I, again, I can't believe I get to do it. I just want to be good at it so that I can fucking, you know, die someday and go, I tried not to give up on a take. And I, you know, and I will rehearse it still in the in the bathroom mirror than I before if I have to. Yeah, but I still I have that self-critical voice. I just after every after this podcast, I'll probably be like, you're boring. Why are you so boring? And I just give a lecture at MIT.

I was like, I guess so much love from people. There's such beautiful people. And I just remember walking home, just feeling like I wasted everybody's time. And I don't know what that is. I do hope that that's a voice that won't destroy me. You know, like, I think that's a really human of you to admit that because people don't want to,

they wouldn't assume that, of course, from you, or anything that, I mean, you've got a large group of students in there listening to you and feeling the way and thinking what they think of you. So that's really interesting to hear you admit that, but it's also, I would expect nothing else. You have to be able to, I mean, you're a human fucking being. And I'm trying to figure out if that, you know, some people that might hear that, they

would say, well, that's a problem you have to fix. And I think that that might be just who I am. Yeah. And I think that that might be just who I am. Yeah, because I'm not, you know, I've been very, very fortunate not to have chemical, you know, like depression where I get into a dark place, like it gets stuck in a in a downward spiral. It's, it's usually a thing that lasts. You ride it out and then after a good night's sleep, you're back to, uh, back to your happy self. So I think I have to try to figure that out. Is that just part of the creative process being a creative human in this world? I haven't found any other way. I'm always kicking myself. Take that, dudes. You're not going to be

human until you feel some despair. Yeah, that's up to you. Absolutely hate the shit that you're doing sometimes. What small act of kindness where you once shown that you'll never forget? Do you? There's something jumped to mind where somebody just did something. They made you smile. Did you feel connected to the rest of humanity. Yeah. Yeah. Lots of things, you know, um,

but I remember my niece one time, one of my nieces, we were in her neighborhood and she was like, she might have been five or six at the time. They're all adults now. My brother and sister older than me and the kids are all, the youngest is 22. And yeah, anyway, one of my nieces, she was just, she had ice cream. We went out and we got ice cream

walking around the neighborhood, her neighborhood. And she said something to me that I don't think she understands how much I meant at the time, but she goes, she goes, people love you here. You know that? And she doesn't know where here is. She's five years old. But she was just looking at the kids, but she goes, she goes, people love you here. You know that? And she doesn't know where here is. She's five years old.

But she was just looking at the kids playing in the park and the people walking their dogs and everyone just, why? People love you here, you know that? But she didn't know how much I needed to hear that at that point, which is really heavy for me. I'll never forget it. I've never told her that.

Oh well. Man, anytime you get a little something from people, especially in a terrier ass out city like LA where somebody has any fucking time for you, when someone can slow it down and say something. Yeah. You know, I saw this actor once in my grocery store that I go to who made me laugh so fucking hard

in this one movie and every time I see this clip I still laugh and I am kind of shy, you know, personally, but so he was walking by, he was walking out and I was walking in and I go, oh, that's a guy. And I did not stop to just let him know how great I thought he was in this film and I always kind of regretted it. You know what I mean? So as hard as it is, sometimes I still don't. If I see someone that has done something in, you know, in any way, it doesn't have to be in show business or anything like that. I'll try and say, hey, that's really good.

You know what I mean? Because to get that from someone can mean a lot, you know, as a time in life when you need it. Yeah, I can make a big difference. I mean, I started to take it back to my new girlfriend, the waitress. Oh, yeah, yeah. But she, there's something about her saying, sweet heart. Yeah.

I was in a pretty low place for some reason, mentally, and it's just that kind of basic human kindness was nice. Yeah. Yeah, I was in a pretty low place for some reason mentally and just that kind of basic human kindness was nice. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I hear you. I was at a restaurant in New York recently and I was shooting something and my fiance was able to fly in for a week and but she was back at the hotel and it's like I felt like I was cheating on her because there was this nice waitress at this barbecue place I went to and first of all my fiance would not like me eating any greasy sugary barbecue So felt like I was cheating on there. I did the side and put delicious vegan food over it But the waitress was one of these you know

She was this the kind of server who's like hey, hun. They hey sweetie like blah blah blah, but like so chill and at ease in the middle of a part of New York that's really, you know, kind of fucking pretentious and, you know, and everybody, but sweet people, fucking way better people than they go here. But, you know, I know that, but, you know, it's part of New York and whatever. I'm there working and people,

I'm like, you know, I'm trying to impress one another. And she would just even had some sort of an accent that was not, didn't feel like an Atlantic American accent. Yeah, those, yeah, servers that say sweetheart and hun. Yeah, that's what we need from AI. We need that, that Jetson server. But once in a while, it just calls you sweetheart. What comforts you on bad days?

Oh, man. Is there little sources of comfort? Small things. They do that kind of make you feel good. Like for Bobby, that would be a little skyrim. Let the little stroll through skyrim. Well, I, I've been a line of Coke or what? Yeah, a line of, I dilute some coke into whiskey in the morning,

like Stevie Ray Vaughn, and then I snorted that. I didn't know that. Yeah, yeah. Oh, gosh. Interesting. Yeah, he didn't last too long. Well, his music will last forever. I see.

There you go. For me, if I'm kind of a homebody, so if I, the, the point at which I smoke just a little bit of pot, and then go like lay down on the couch and perhaps with my fiance's kind of nodding off, or she's just like looking at her phone and I sneakily turn on some wrestling, okay, because I grew up watching wrestling. And that stuff, it's the Skyrim effect. I mean, you want to talk about a complete escape. This stuff makes no sense in the world.

It's an art form that is so uniquely weird, but at the same time, so everyone, when it's good, everyone is invested in the illusion even the audience They cheer the good guys they boo the bad guys So if I'm like that and then I got our two cute little dogs there and I'm annoying my little dog Lulio and you know trying to kiss I'm right on the fucking mouth and I've had a little bit of pot and the dogs like stop I'm pot's not good for me. Of course don't ever blow pot in your dog dog's face. That's a small comfort. I guess that's a handful of things No, that moment painted that was like a little painting. What about you? You're not supposed to do this well, well, you're not supposed to do this

Yeah, it's a tough question. I would say, I would say programming robots, there's bringing to life, actually programming at all. So I don't know if you're how familiar you are with programming, but you write some text on a page on a screen and it's brought to life. It does something. That's a really tiny version of maybe having a child. You created something that is now living. Yeah, in some smaller big way, with embodied robots that are legate robots, that's especially clear. And for some reason, that's a source of comfort for me, that that the power of programming, but

also the elegance of programming, just the whole thing. It's a source, yeah, it's a source of happiness. There's so many things I've been very blessed with enjoying anything. Like that's part of the struggle I have in life is that the simple stuff is a source of a lot of happiness for me Which leads to a lot of laziness So I have to like give myself artificial deadlines I have to be freaking out on purpose in order to be productive in this world at all You seem like an extremely beautiful busy guy. No.

No, I am, but because I'm constantly creating artificial stress and deadlines and all that kind of stuff. Otherwise I would just sit there looking at a tree happy. I'm truly happy with everything. That's awesome. Yeah. Chew with. That's not what that line of coke in the whiskey in the morning.

That's the thing that does the trick. Give me Ray Vaughn breakfast shake. By the way, one of my most favorite guitars. That play guitar too. That's the source of comfort. Oh yeah, I have seen you play some guitar. That's awesome. Who's the greatest wrestler of all time? Greatest in-ring performer of all time is Brett the hitman heart. What's the difference in ring versus?? Greatest in-ring performer of all time is Brett the hitman heart. What's the difference in ring versus? Well, there's many facets to the art form. A lot of people are great on the mic,

but they're not so great once they get in the ring. A lot of people have all the showmanship and stuff, but then they're not necessary. It's a wonderful package, but then they get to the ring or they open their mouth and there's nothing going on. So who's the greatest in-ring performer? I think the greatest in ring is Bret Hart I don't think there's anyone better than then Brett the hitman heart

Oh makes them so good Well, he think I had an action figure of him yeah in Russia and we didn't know what the hell Oh sure. Yeah, it was just a guy in pink tights He everything makes sense. Every single thing is rooted in the thing that just happened, and everything that he does is to set up what he's going to do. They call it, and I'm just a wrestling nerd, but the wrestlers, I guess, call it ring psychology, the things that you have to do to make it seem like you're suffering, or

you're coming from behind, or whatever. And then also just the physicality of it. He would do it at 100 miles an hour and never hurt anybody. Although, I also love the greatest wrestler of all time, everyone says, and they're right, it's Rick Flair, nature boy, Rick Flair. Everyone says this? Yeah, I think Flair, nature boy Rick Flair. Everyone says this?

Yeah, I think if you know what you're talking about. Because he's the best on the mic. He's also incredible in the ring. And then for me, the sentimental favorite, which we've actually, on Doodsy Chad, had sort of a Charlie Rose ask interview with me about this, my fascination with Hulk Hogan. Because to me, just he was Superman.

I was a little kid and I saw him and that's imprinted. But yeah, see, this is like asking me who my favorite child is. Right, so the rock, when the rock was, I mean, the rocks, the rock. Yeah, I mean, Hulk Hogan is, he's the weirdest one, right? For me, from the outside super weird that, I don't know what, what that is exactly.

It's everything's weird about him. Yeah. He's got the ball head like he would proudly have this bald head with long hair, the handlebar mustache in this ketchup and mustard, you know, tights, which he says he credits McDonald's with the tights. He literally does. He says that the red and yellow came from Angelo Poffo, who's Randy Macho Man Savage and Lanny Poffo's dad, who's a wrestler and a promoter.

He said that he saw him wearing yellow and he, you know, he's a Tampa guy, so he had that brown skin and the hair and everything. So he's like, oh, that's what I want to do. And also the brand recognition of like, well, I should do it like McDonald's. Literally. And he's a big, you know, swollen, muscular guy with tan brown skin, screaming at me to eat my vitamins and stuff when I'm eight years old. That was extremely, yeah, he's like Superman.

But I know there's a person behind that guy. Yeah, you know, you know, what do you mean? Well, he's Terry Bollaya, the dude who, you know, does whatever the fuck he does with his life, you know what I mean? Yeah, complicated life. Yeah, I guess to be him, yeah. Maybe you should change the the dudes the colors to yellow. Right. Red yellow. It's currently orange and boy sky blue. Yeah, it's like a nice sky blue. What advice? Since you're wearing a suit, I feel like your qualifier to give advice. What advice would you give to young people? High school college about how to have a career that can be proud of or how to have a life that can be proud of. I mean, you have to listen to your gut all the time. That's the only that's the compass that we have is

listening to your gut. What did you gut tell you? Is that was that originally the dream of being an actor? Yeah, for me. Your parents support that at all? I had the advantage of having parents who were immigrants, so they didn't really know a lot about what you... You just made shit up. You just made shit up. Yeah, of course I'm studying and I'm skipping school to go do auditions and stuff.

No, I just kind of feel like, you know, and I know it was different for my older siblings because my parents had just shown up in Canada. I was born like 10 years later. You can get away with some things and you can actually, you know, I think my parents, they wanted us to, they didn't have a whole lot to tell us about what to do. They weren't going to do that with us because they're in this brand new world and there's all these possibilities. But there was something that they I feel like they had to do, which was tell us to do what we love. If you love doing it, do it. I feel like that's really

served me and what I would tell young people is, if you can find something you love, and nowadays with the internet and finding other people that it's not like you need to find a lot of people anymore. You just need to find the people that dig what you dig. And if you can make a career out of doing something that you love that's been said, it's a good thing. How long did you take you to figure out that you really love acting?

Because sometimes you have a dream and that you meet, that dream meets reality, right? Yeah. And then the reality might be much less pleasant to much darker than the dream. Well the reality is less pleasant, you know? And there are things that happen during an experience of shooting something that you could take or leave, right? But the part where you're on set and you've rehearsed for a minute or whatever, at least you know where you're supposed to stand and you know all your lines show up, know

and everything, know what you're going to stand and you know all your lines show up, knowing everything, knowing what you're gonna do and what you aim to do. And those moments make it all worth it. When you're not sound like a douchebag, but between action and cut, that's the stuff that makes me, that has me continuing to do what I do, aside from the fact that it's like, I don't know how to do anything else. You think you'll ever do like a dramatic,

like a mob movie? Yeah, like the one other, the inside game I was just talking about, or this is the other movie I just did, it was a little while ago called The American Woman, that was very heavy. And I love doing dramatic work. I love it. I love it. Yeah, and I played that in Inside Game, it was kind of a, you know, there was a mob element and the fellow was, well, you know, the stories here or there with regard to how deep into them,

but well, he was a bookie. He was just running money. You know, he was making a lot of money for a lot of people and he figured out how to cook it with this dude who was an NBA ref and it's a very interesting documentary, the thing that they just untold, under the untold series, they cover it. But getting to play that guy, that was a gas for me

because he was like a, he was a, you know, there was a lot of unsavory stuff and he's definitely the guy the character in the movie. Who is the wild card and you don't want to necessarily mess with him. And I got to buy him this fellow who was a real guy. Speaking of him, it was just a bizarre to hear, like I said to him, he was a little concerned about this and that, like, hey, you know, say whatever the fuck you want in your movie, I got my book and I got this other fucking deal.

But he goes, you know, I didn't do this and I didn't do that. And I'm like, yeah, all right, I got you. And he goes, yeah, I'm telling you. Like I'm talking to you, one on one, I did not do this, I did, okay. I'm just fucking tell you, do whatever the fuck you want with your movie, but this is what's up. And I said, you ever seen Goodfellas? He's like, I did, okay? I'm just fucking tell you do whatever the fuck you want with your movie, but this is what's up.

And I said, you ever seen Goodfellas? He's like, yeah, I fucking love that movie. Cause he, like I said, he did some unsavory shit. And I go, you remember the scene where, where, you know, the guy, the neighbor, Lorraine Broncos neighbor was, you know, made her uncomfortable and was touching on her. And she goes to Ray Leota and he goes,

where the fuck does this guy live? And then he goes and remember, and he walks across the street and pistol with the dude. You touch her again, you're dead! You hear me? Yeah, good scene. Don't shoot fucking great scene. He goes, I love that scene.

I go, that's you. So you're doing shit that we know is terrible, but we love you. He goes, all right, I got it. And then I said, there's this one scene. I explained the scene to him where one of the He goes, all right, I got it. And then I said, there's this one scene. I explained the scene to him where one of the mobsters Tough guys was in the window of the car and

Jimmy my character is very coked up at the time and he's Emerging money here and there and making bad bets because he's getting sloppy and this guy wants to bug him about some jets Giants bad or something. I'm like telling you fucking asshole. Don't fucking do it He's like, yeah, well, the fucking Giants. And in the scene, Jimmy, my character grabs him by the by the lapels and just smashes his face against the the the the roof of the car. And I I say this to the Jimmy and he goes, oh yeah, I would've done that. That's not a fucking big deal. I wonder also the interaction. I wonder what the filming of I wonder also the interaction. I wonder what the filming of

Probably my favorite gambling movie is Casino with with Joe Pescian to Nero Like when they're out in the desert yelling at each other. I wonder how many takes that is like because they I don't I don't know how scripted that is I mean it probably is a little bit, but like I don't think you can script The performance that Joe Pesci does don't think you can script the performance that Joe Pesci does. Don't make a fuck out of me, Ace! Yeah. Like, you know, I fucking brought you here.

Yeah. He's just like pointing at the, that, that, that energy and their standing there and their friendship. And then, Danero's like, like that, that whole thing and then, in the pet, like that, that energy What is that? I mean they must they somehow find it together? You could tell me that that was one take and I believe you tell me that that was Seven takes and I would believe I bet you all the takes had that energy. Oh, yeah playing with it right there

They're playing with that the this yeah, I mean they took on a real They're playing with that. Yeah, I mean, they took on a real personality in those scenes and really cared them for. I mean, it's just a brilliant, brilliant performance. It doesn't get like comedies, like mob movies probably don't get enough credit either because it's seen as like... Mob movies don't get enough credit? Not in Oscars, I mean. Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Cause it seems like a trope. It's like given a western, it's got to be a hell of a Western or whatever, because it's like an old Hollywood trope.

Yeah, no, I, that's seen it's so great, because they're never there at the height of their friendship in a way, and they're also pretty much about to let go of it and become enemies. And both things are happening at the same time. And, and Pesci drives them out to the desert. And if I remember correctly, the Nero's character, a aace, Ross Steen, a Ross child, he says, I gave myself 50, 50, whether I'm coming back. Yeah, it's such a good scene. It's usually my prospects of coming back from the desert would be 90,

10 or something like that. But now it's the time I wasn't sure and there's the car driving really fast. And then Joe Pesh is like, you motherfucker, you like it, whatever he was doing. But you are the guy, of course, this anti-Semitism. Yeah. We're not between friends. Who gives a shit? All that kind of stuff. Yeah.

I mean, brilliant, brilliant performances. So yeah, I can understand why you love the art and putting it all out there and leave it. It's fun. It's fun. It's fun. It's still fun. It's still crazy fun. If I go a while without getting a gig, you know, if I go a minute, then I end up and I work on something. I'm like, it is, it's like, oh, I've been thirsty for this. Like I actually am really so happy. Even if it's something where it's like, you know, the things where, this was a pain in the ass and that or whatever, you're on the road doing something and, you know, anything, whatever, you lost your luggage or whatever the heck you've got going on in your day to

day life, that everyone brings to work and tries to let go of, once we're doing the scene, oh man, it's the best. But you know, that said, you're a great actor, but I just think I speak for a lot of people that you're also, there's a charisma to you that's great to reveal in raw form in different podcasts. Oh, it's true. Oh, it's true. And in Doodsy, 10 MinutePod, just as a guest in podcasts, it's always really fun to watch you. Cheers.

The way you have fun, the way you think, the raw, the raw will settle, which is a nice compliment to your kind of acting. That's really sweet. Yeah, cheers. Well, you know, look, you said, you know, you're making that face. I'm making that face.

I'm making that after the take face. So I love doing stuff off the cuff. That's kind of you to say. And I dig, I really do dig doing stuff in front of an audience, because I love seeing, I don't give it to myself very often. If I'm doing, even if I'm,

you know, I've done a bunch of multi-camera sitcoms and stuff, Matt TV was shot in front of a live studio audience. You like that energy? I love it, but I can only hear them. You can't see them because of the lights, like it is in a lot of performances, and I would imagine, with standup, it's, you know, you see the first couple of rows.

I've done, I do this character that does standup, and I used to take him out and do things with him and do a little bits here and there. I haven't done it in like four or five years. I think the Bobby say that character opened up for Bobby. Yeah, but he said I have to do it as myself too. I think in that podcast, he's like, okay, you're going to come with me and open for me and Braya, but you have to do it as yourself. Did that ever happen? It did. And I did the character,

who's a character I came up with on Tim and a podcast, he's just this comedian, right? He calls himself an open mic veteran. He's been doing open mics forever. And so I did it opening up for Bobby, and he's like, you have to do it, some of it as yourself. So I just kind of did this bit where I would do some of his jokes

and then I would take Lee Leon, silly, I got a fucking wig on and I take the wig off and I go, and as myself, I start explaining it. Hello, my name is Will. See, the reason that it's funny is because Arnold Schwarzenegger is always, he's in these movies and he's got the thick Austrian accent but he's like, my name is Ben Williams. I'm a cop from Colorado.

No, you're not. And it doesn't make sense as the comedian character that I'm doing, because that character doesn't do impersonations. Okay, carrying on. And then I put the wig back on and go back into this dumb thing. And I don't think it was very good,

but Bobby required it in order for me to open for him. He's like, you're not fucking doing it. So I'm not going to get up on stage and not do, we agreed. I'll do it. But having been up there just in, you know, whatever. I've done it like a dozen fucking times, not a bunch of times, right? Like nothing. And you know, these comedians that go up every night, sometimes two times a night, it's, I do, I will say, I love performing in front of people when I get the chance, but it's a specific thing that I just, I don't know, I get to go back to this. It's like the providing value. I think great stand-ups are fucking incredible. I'll go, you know, when I've gone and watched stand-up, you know, there's your friend you're going to

see, but then there's this other person who really speaks to you, you know what I mean? And if you like one comedian a night, that's a lot because a comedy club is like a fucking crazy restaurant where there's no menu. And it's like, what would you look? There's nothing else like that. There's like, you don't go to like a music place. What do we got here? We got Christian Metal and there's some world music

and then there's a reggae thing and it's all rammed in together. Or you don't go to a restaurant, I'd love a nice steak. Cool. First, here's a bowl of fruit loops, and then we got you a croutote, and then this is our sushi tower.

And well, what about the steak? Oh, the steak's coming. And then blah, blah, blah. Oh, no, the steak got bumped. So there's no steak, but here's a fucking shitty store bought cheesecake, you know. And that's what comedians are up against. When they go into a place, it's like, I don't pair well with the poached salmon.

You know, I'm chicken fingers. I already, I already am chicken fingers. So, you know, these great comedians that are able to go up on a night where poached salmon goes up and then it's like, fuck, I'm, you were also spicy. I got some kick to me. For me, even going to open mics. It could be a wonderful escape. Yeah, I mean just laughing laughing together with others It can make you I don't know. It just feels really good when we've done like you know like I and I hope to do it with Doodsy but like live podcasts or fun in front of groups of people and You know you talk to them afterwards and take some pictures and man they are They forgot what the fuck they got going on and a lot of them got to go back to work the next day

It's a Wednesday or Thursday, you know, no, it's it's a lot of value. I'm fortunate enough to be Busy doing my own bullshit. What's the meaning of life? Well, Sasa? What is the why why are we here? Why were we here? Why? Why? Why? Why? Was it the meaning of life? Didn't they explain it at the end of the meaning of life? I think it was Michael Palin that said try to get a walk in, be nice to neighbors, eat in a fiber. Wasn't that the fiber as part of it?

Yeah, I think it's, I think it's get- Distortion, I have a bowl of brand in the morning and don't take yourself too seriously. Yeah, I think it's I think it's get friction. I have a full of brand in the morning. And I don't take yourself to seriously. Yeah. Well, no one gets out alive, I think is the Herman Hesse, one of my favorite writers, he's a Nobel prize winner in a book called Stepin Wolf, says learn what is to be taken seriously and laugh at the rest. Oh, that's awesome. What's the percentage distribution on that? So how much of life should you take seriously? And then how much do you just laugh at? Oh, man.

If you can laugh at everything, you're winning. Yeah. But that's almost impossible. I think that there's, and also, could be quite irresponsible to do that. I take things, I take a lot of things way too seriously. I know that. I do. I do. I really do. People will be in part surprised by that, but I think that radiates from you. Really? Yeah, I do. I do. I

do. I drink things way too fucking seriously sometimes. But, um, yeah, they're going to loosen the neck up. But, no, I think that's really good. That's really good stuff. I don't know what the percentage is to have a good life or a happy, healthy life, but, you know, for me, the meaning of life is getting to live it as long as you hope to. That's nice.

And when you lose to, that's nice. And when you lose someone or perhaps you're faced with your own mortality, I think that puts that into perspective. But you know, get lots of fiber. Get lots of fiber. Be nice to everybody. And yeah, don't take things too seriously as a good it's a good one our minds are fucking big weird It's a big weird shitty fucking bucket of shit That's trying to get you to think horrible shit about yourself all the time shitty bucket of shit Shitty bucket of shit is a book. I never read by read the title and it's a good word to live by which is Don't sweat the small stuff and it's all small stuff

That's another way. It was my doctor Phil wasn't doctor Phil was I don't know But I think the conclusion is also has fiber as part of it I think it all that all ties it together and in the end of course Just put love out there in the world. I think that's a pretty good way. What would you say is the meaning of life? Put love out in the world?

I would say love, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's a long conversation and what that really means. But I'm sure robots are involved. Yeah. Well, let me tell you, I feel a little safe for knowing that someone who has a hand in

bringing these robots to the masses as you do has that opinion of love and how important it is. I think that's great because otherwise it's going to be that fucking scene from T2 where Linda Hamilton's holding on to the fence and getting all of her flesh blown off of her skeleton before the rest of hers is wiped away. Because this sky net shit. Anyway, I'm just terrified of dudes the all the time. That's why I think that they will do. Dozing the wrong hands can do a lot of damage.

That's why Chad and I need to do our best to control it. Need to travel back in time and murder Chad. I think. Yeah, that's the only way. It's been said, I don't know why you need to travel back in time. Well, I will go. I will go. I think I'll be very suspicious. My nefarious plans for Chad involve going back to tomorrow and planning for yesterday

and then hopefully, dudes, he will give me the answer there. What it is to do with Chad's frozen body. If I got to drive it out to, if I got to take my, you know, if I got to get a hold of it, like one of those Tesla mom vans, and shove my garage freezer in it, and plug it in, and shove Chad in there, drive out to Arizona,

and deliver him under a mountain, or wherever the fuck this place is. And say, here's his dog tag, what does this get me? And I'm like, ah, it's gonna be 300 bucks. Do you take amics? No, I'd be like, ah shit. And I'll just dump them somewhere, breaking bad stuff. Well, I would like to thank you,

and the, what is it? The Canadian International agency apparel for the national apparel. I can't wait for the sneakers from dudes. I can't wait for all the, all the, all the podcasts that AI can, and all the trouble can get you in. So I'm a huge fan of yours. It's a huge honor that you would talk with me today.

Well, this has been amazing. Cheers, pal. Likewise. And I'm happy to huge fan of yours. It's a huge honor that you would talk with me today. Well, this has been amazing Cheers pal likewise, and I'm happy to be here man. Cheers Bam That was three hours Holy fuck what? Thanks for listening to this conversation with Will Sasso to support this podcast Please check out our sponsors in the description and now let me leave you with some words from John candy One of Will's favorite actors.

I think I may have become an actor to hide from myself. You can escape into a character. Thank you for listening, and hope to see you next time. Music