Life Uncut - How Much Authenticity Do We Want From Celebrities? Armie Hammer Is Living In A World of False Victimhood

Episode Date: September 2, 2024

Britt's had a baby!!! Well, technically her sister Sheri just gave birth, but we are claiming it as our surrogate Life Uncut baby. She was 5 weeks early and we have a bit of a chat about whether the person closest to Britt having a baby has shifted the needle on whether Britt wants to have kids of her own! Did your sibling or best friend having a baby change your drive to have one of your own?  Matt went and got a tattoo while Laura was away and it's... not good! How did you and your siblings know who the 'favourite' kid was? Was it because they were the 'password' kid? Was it because only one of you is tattooed on a parent's body? Armie Hammer has entered stage 3 of his 'redemption' arc. He's shared a video on instagram about how he is selling his beloved truck because he can't afford to put gas in it anymore. We unpack false victimhood and all different kinds of celebrities performing authenticity online. How do we know the difference between real suffering and performative authenticity and can Armie Hammer be uncancelled? We unpack our thoughts.  You can watch us on Youtube Find us on Instagram Join us on tiktok Or join the Facebook Discussion Group Tell your mum, tell your dad, tell your dog, tell your friend and share the love because WE LOVE LOVE! xxSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Life Uncut acknowledges the traditional custodians of country whose lands were never ceded. We pay our respects to their elders past and present. Always was, always will be Aboriginal land. This episode was recorded on Cammeraygal land. Hi guys and welcome back to another episode of Life Uncut. I'm Laura. I'm Brittany. And today is a very exciting day for you. Well, no, it's not really. It was an exciting week for me by proxy.

Brittany has had a baby, everyone. She has a baby. Yeah, I have a baby that was born into my family. It's very exciting. Now, I have a lot of nieces and nephews. If you didn't know, Britt had a surrogate. Don't start that rumor. I did not.

I wish. You would, wouldn't you? Yeah. You would surrogate. Probably. Like Kim Kardashian and then make up an excuse. Be like, I couldn't because of my... really it's just to get out of the pregnancy part. No, I wouldn't make out. No, that's not it. I

think about being pregnant all the time. I would love to be pregnant, have that feeling, see it grow. I think it's incredible. But I also would love to just get on with life, like keep working and keep doing what I'm doing. Nothing changes and then have a baby. So yeah, if somebody offered me a surrogacy, I'd probably take it. I'd be like, yeah, let's talk about it. No, I have a lot of nieces and nephews because I'm one of four kids. I have two older brothers, but my sister Sherry, who all of you guys know, Sherry Health, she's in the Instagram, she's been on the podcast before. She lives over in Scotland. Her and I have been besties our whole life. Like we've had the same job. We worked in hospitals together all over the world. Like

every day we'd go home and live together. You guys, if you're in our Facebook group as well, you know, Sherry, cause she's always in there and she also still admins our Facebook. She admins for free. We still haven't paid her. We love you Sherry. We should probably do a lump sum payment. But Sherry has had her first child, which is very, very exciting. And it was the reason it's a surprise it's like generally you know a baby's coming right like you've got nine months to prepare for it unless you're that bodybuilder who like went to the toilet one day and had a baby or was in labor but was obviously straining so hard trying to lift weights and then yeah had a baby imagine that that'd be fucking horrible no that does happen not just the bodybuilders that

happens when a pregnancy is really posterior up and down against the spine it's a whole thing anyway imagine that didn't happen to Sheridan we knew the baby we knew the baby was coming she didn't poo it out and she wasn't a bodybuilder but it did come I don't want to tell too much of the story because it's her story and she hasn't spoken about it yet but I can't wait till I can tell her story but it came five weeks early it she came five weeks early she had a daughter it was a very so no one knew it was coming Sheridan definitely didn't know it was coming and she is in the world now they are still in the hospital there's been like a few little complications but they're both very healthy and fine like everything is fine but they're not

I had to leave the hospital for a while because the baby's just small, but they're great. They're great, and I'm very excited. It's like the perfect example of when something really exciting happens in our lives but it doesn't actually happen to us and you want to tell the story because you're so excited but you can't say the baby's name. You can't say any of the details because technically it didn't happen to you.

It's not mine. But realistically, it is your baby because when you're an auntie, that child is just as much yours as what it is the person who birthed it. yes Sheridan argue this she does need to understand that he's not her baby it's our baby it's a joint baby and yeah I mean I feel so excited to be the auntie of your baby Brit it's life uncut baby let's be real life uncut had a baby she's doing well so I'm so happy for her yeah I've been facetiming a lot she doesn't really open her eyes she's too little and tired so she opens her eyes for like 20 seconds a day she sleeps all day and I'm on

FaceTime, like yelling at her through the screen, trying to get her to wake up. Sharon's like, you can't do that. Just let her sleep. Did it feel different, your sister having a baby from when your brothers had babies? Like, cause I know you're already an auntie, but you and your sister are super, super close. For sure. But I don't think that has anything to do with the fact that she's a sister. I think it has everything to do with the fact that she's like a best friend as well.

So it's not just a, because I know plenty of people that aren't close to their sisters, you know, they have sisters and they're not, they're everything. But Sherry and I are the same human in a different body. like the we have never in our entire life had a disagreement and we spent 24 hours a day together for years like it's insane so anyone else who has a sister is like what I just it's not just what you do you just fight and then make up two seconds later yeah we don't it just works it always has all I could hope is that I had daughters like Sherry and I in terms of our friendship and how well we got along because I know so many siblings like I was talking to someone the other day that

Jas went back to England for his twin's wedding, right? And I was like, oh, how was it? He's like, well, I don't even really speak to him. I don't really like him that much. His twin. No, that's wild. It's like you're literally the same DNA. You are literally from the same cloth.

How can you not like him? He is you. You are him. He's the same person. So I think it just has everything to do with it. Like she's the closest person to me in the world. I think my sister and I had like the very traditional path of sisters. Like we loved each other when we were little.

we fought like cats and dogs when we were you know in high school but also would independently like absolutely fiercely protect each other but when we were together we would kill each other and then as we became adults we became best friends again it's like the circle of sisterhood life well i think this also has to do with the fact that sherry and i on top of maybe this is why we got the same job and live together as adults but we shared a bedroom i've never not same i don't think i ever now i think about it maybe 12 months i think for 12 months of my life growing up I was on my own we shared a room from as the second she was born but you know I was three there's three just under three years difference did it make you feel different having

her having a baby did it make you feel different about becoming a mum or making the choice not to it made me open up the conversation again yeah so I messaged Ben and I said I just messaged him out of the blue and I said do we want kids question mark and he's so funny he goes what's on your mind baby he's like I was like we did go through the process of freezing embryos so like I thought we'd discuss this but now how do you feel about it well that's the difference right freezing embryos and eggs a lot of people don't do it because they want them they do it because they don't know and it's a security blanket of sorts so and that was a big part of me I was pretty sure I wanted them but I wasn't a hundred percent which is why I didn't implant them at the time

but it is a question I battle with constantly and it's probably something we need to talk about more here because you guys know I'm like I lose sleep over this well I think for anyone who's like a lifer and listens to every episode this probably would feel confusing because the last time we spoke you were like I now feel sure yeah I want to have kids so I said that off the back of my experience in the jungle in South Africa so I'd been in there for a month and I had had everything stripped from me I didn't speak to anyone I had a lot of time to think and everyone in there was a mum or a dad and everyone spoke about their kids in like because they missed them so much and everything was so beautiful and positive and I was like oh I want this like wholesome love and

then I came out and I was around kids again I was like fuck my pendulum for kids it changes doesn't stop swinging it's like in the wind it depends on the day even on the weekend we had Matt's book launch and there was a fuck load of kids around and Brittany looked at me and she was like maybe I just want to be the fun auntie maybe I did too Keisha said that too there's no I didn't say that I said I was overstimulated and I still feel that way there was a lot going on there is no judgment I don't say this with any judgment I was walking around that party the kids party obviously that all the parents were there the kids didn't just drop them off I was walking around and talking to everyone catching up and there was not one parent that I said hello to how are things

going that did not start that conversation with oh my god please take my child I cannot stress enough like they all love them but everyone was like it's a mental day like there's a lot going on and that was I think that that's what happened it's like over the course of a couple of hours I was like fuck I was like this is insane everyone wants me to take their children home so it's like definitely it's definitely something that's been on my mind but yeah I messaged Ben and I was like baby do we want kids do we want kids and he's like how do you feel I'm like answer my question And I was like, I want you to answer me. Gave the most beautiful diplomatic answer.

It's the answer that every woman wants, which is I want you and whatever makes you happy. You'll be a beautiful mum and I know I'll love being a dad, but if it doesn't happen for us, that's okay. It's not meant for us. And I was like, baby, fuck it. I said, yes or no. Tick the box.

I'm like, tick the box. Tick the box. Anyway. That's another episode that we need to deep dive into. No, I mean, we have been speaking about it so much recently in our own, I mean, between us personally. like I said I think for some people that would feel like the pendulum was swinging and I think it's such a relatable conversation because for a lot of people they have this certainty around

yes I want to have kids it's like not even a question they've felt it since they were young and then for other people it's a decision that gets made based on biology and timing because it's like the clock is running out and I have to make a decision now and I know that for you it hasn't been just like one thing that feels certain it's like one if you ask you on any given day the decision changes for me it's not really a question of if it's more a question of when I don't know if you're meant to feel like now is a good time I just don't know if that will ever come because life is stressful but there's definitely moments where I hold kids that I either related to me or I have it with yours Laura like kids that I really deeply love and I'm like oh it's closer than it

used to be you know that feeling of wanting this is closer than it and when I saw your kids Laura at the party, like they're so fucking cute because I see them when they're being cute, not when they're not sleeping or tantruming. Like they're so cute that I just want to squeeze them all the time and they come up and they hug your legs and you're like, oh, it must be nice for someone to love you this much. Aunty Brittany!

It's really sweet. Well, I mean, no, because after we spoke the other week, remember how I told you that Molly doesn't care about me anymore. So like, look, it comes in waves. But I'm going to Romania next week to see Ben and now that the baby, it wasn't in the plan right because the baby wasn't supposed to be here but now the baby is here i've only got a week but i'm trying to work out if there is a flight or something that i can make it to sherry it's not close it's not like an hour or so it's like seven or eight hour flight

so it's a lot for a week but i'm going to try and get there and selfishly for me so i can hold it and see if i cry or have feelings i'm joking i feel like i cried the second she called me the second I laid eyes on it, I was bawling. So I know that I'm going to feel something, but also that was a shock. I was taken by surprise. I didn't expect it to be there. But no, I'm definitely going, Sherry listens to this. I'm going to see my sister, Sherry, because I love her, but I'm also going to learn if I want to be a mom. I like that you had to have that disclaimer. Sherry, we love you and we're really, really happy for you. Okay. Well, look, something I wanted to quickly update you on,

and this is a conversation we've had a couple of times on the podcast before. it's actually a question that has come in for Ask Uncut. It's around tattoos and how we feel when our partners or if your partner was to get a tattoo without checking with you first. I luckily at the time when we did this Ask Uncut question had the opinion of it's your body and you have every right to do whatever you want to it with your own body autonomy. I think it should be run by the partner, at least run by. You don't have to check with your significant other if they like or care about the tattoo that you're getting. You may want to do that because it might be important to you, their

input or their feedback. You might care if they find you arousing, whatever. Clearly my husband doesn't care because we were in Melbourne for one night only. We left for one day. Britt and I had a work thing that we had to go to. We were away for Thursday night of last week. And Friday morning, I get a text message and it's just a picture of what looks like a poorly formed kangaroo with a turtle backpack on. And I was like, what the fuck is that? And it was just a picture. And then I realized it was a stencil outline. And then I looked in the background and I could see the remnants of a chair. And I messaged Matt and I was like, are you seriously getting that right now? I thought he was getting this. It's supposed to be a running turtle because he lost a bet.

I thought he was getting it on his ass. He got it on his ankle. And it is no joke. It is like the size of a coffee cup. It is so big. It was in live time. So Laura was like, oh my fucking god he's getting this right now but then it was like okay it's fine it's on his ass cheek no one's gonna see it except me and then all of a sudden you have this realization that in fact everyone can see it it is on his leg it's on his behind his ankle on his calf which is just that's so fucking stupid i think it shows he has integrity he said he'd get the tattoo if he lost the bet and he lost the bet so he's getting the tattoo is it bigger than i anticipated it being absolutely some might call it integrity and others might call it stupidity

that as a 38-year-old man he's making bets about body tattoos if he loses a marathon. That was the bet. He bet his brother-in-law that if he didn't win a running race, he would get a tattoo. And he's come through. It feels like a very permanent decision. He's got conviction.

Talking about integrity, Keisha, let's just add this little bit of tidbit information. Matt went and got tattoos when Marley was born. He got a date tattoo for the birth. He did. Did Lola get a tattoo? So that was the other thing he got. So when Marley was born, Matt got Marley's birthday tattooed on his arm.

Three years ago, we had a second daughter, Lola, as you all are very well aware, and he did not get her birthday tattooed on his arm. And so now it had come a time where finally she's able to even ask, like, Daddy, what's that one? And then Lola's like, where's mine, Daddy? And finally, he also got that done. So he went and got two separate tattoos. One is Lola's birthday and the other one is like a very poorly formed kangaroo.

I feel as though for us all growing up, you knew who the favorite child was because they were the password kid. You know, that sibling was the password for everything. It's really obvious in my situation though, because one of them is on his body and the other's not. Well, he is now, but the turtle came first. That's the part that's worrying. The turtle came first.

No, the thing that's more annoying is that Matt and I were going to go and get the birth dates together. I'm going to get them as well on one arm. Are you? You're giving Angelina Jolie. Yeah, we're going to have matching kid tattoos. So I'm going to go and get it. But we were supposed to go and do that together.

But he just went and got Lola's because he got a discount because he was already getting the turtle tattoo. So Lola was a twofer. She was a discount. Poor Lola. I feel like that happens though. Every kid down the line, like I can say this because I'm three out of four. Every kid gets that little bit forgotten.

Because when you talk about password kids, Keish, I remember growing up, I was never the password kid. I don't think my mum has ever had a password with my name in it, ever. Hopefully she doesn't still have the same passwords of people who had a fingerprint. Oh, yeah, you better. Before this comes out, you better tell them to change your password.

Now, you guys would all be familiar with Armie Hammer, who in 2021 underwent a very public cancellation. Now, this was off the back of three separate women coming forward and accusing him of really grotesque sexual assault allegations. There was a rape allegation in there as well, but also the part of this conversation that the media really clung onto and went rife with was him being a cannibal. Now, the reason why he's come

back into the sphere of conversation is because recently he did a long form interview on Piers Morgan, which is a YouTube interview. It goes like an hour and 15 minutes. If you want to watch that, he also at the same time did a podcast interview after doing this Piers Morgan interview and also the podcast, which seems like very intentional interviews around rewriting a redemption arc for himself, he has started to become more active on social media as well. Now, this is something that he posted last week. So I've been back in LA for a couple of weeks now. This is my truck. I bought this for myself in 2017 as a Christmas gift for myself because I've had a pickup truck for a long time and I have loved this truck intensely and taken it camping and across

country multiple times and on long road trips and i took it for one last road trip because i'm selling my truck uh since being back in la i have put about four or five hundred dollars worth of gas in it and i can't afford it i can't afford the gas anymore i mean this truck like kids home from the hospital all that stuff um amazing trips amazing trips but you know what that's okay i got a new car it's tiny it's a hybrid i'm probably gonna put about 10 bucks of gas in it a month and this is it so i have to clean all of this stuff out you know all kinds of shit but that's okay here's to new beginnings it's my birthday tomorrow so um august 28 i will be starting my birthday in a new car in a new apartment in a new life in los angeles my kids

are not happy about this they're like dad all of our memories in the truck oh god so i haven't told admit, but I'll tell them and they'll be fine. I just keep telling myself that parking is going to be easier and gas is going to be cheaper. Fuck. I mean, oh my God, we get it. Road trips and camping trips and sleeping in this car on camping trips and road trips. Time to clean it out. The lack of self-awareness, the false victimhood that is just absolutely entrenched in this video, the more I watched it, the more, and I don't know if anyone else feels like this, but I actually felt so fucking angry watching this because I was like, your children are upset that you have to sell a truck that you now can't afford gas in. You know what I actually think

your kids are probably more upset with? The fact that you've been allegedly sexually assaulting women and was cheating on their mom. We want to have a conversation around this idea of false victimhood, a conversation around performative authenticity, which we see celebrities do online quite a bit because it is a tactic and I think on one hand if he wants to once again have some sort of a reignite his career in the celebrity eye this is his only tactic to try and change and reform the perception of the public that they have of him and what he's trying to do now is he's trying to make himself relatable he's trying to say he is a family man at heart like even talking about the fact that this is the car that he drove his children home from the hospital this is all

language that's designed to try and make us feel some sort of empathy for him in the situation that he's currently in but the issue is is that he's been very clever with how he's done these two big media interviews and the reason why I say I think this is all him trying to allow himself to get a job back in the media industry is because he said that he has written a screen right which is loosely based around his own experience and his life and he wants to get back into doing that so for me this whole thing just reeks of like everybody I've been really hard done by and now it's my turn to tell my version of the story there's a part of me that gives him the benefit of the doubt that he's not smart enough to curate this as a PR stunt there's a part of me that just

thinks you were just that disconnected from reality and you have no social awareness that you were just doing a vlog you were just like I'm just going to talk about something my everyday life. This is what's happening. At the end of the day, what he has done, whether it was intentional or not, it is smart because it has put him on a relatable level, right? There are, and I went through, I mean, there's 6,000 comments on that. I don't know if it has though. I think people call bullshit on this. This is what I'm saying. I went through so many of these comments, right? I was like, I wonder what the perception on this, on his Instagram reel has been. There's like six or 7,000 or something. So I was scrolling through them and they were, I mean, I didn't, didn't

write them all down for like how many are pro and how many against, but it seemed pretty even-handed. There were a lot of people that were going him for like, you know, being a tool. Stop trying to be relatable. We don't feel sorry for you. You shouldn't be making a comeback. There were just as many people saying, well, we can't wait to see you on our screens again. We love you. Like it was pretty even handed from what I saw.

I think it's important for anyone who isn't. I mean, I know a lot of people are across the Armie Hammer situation and what unfolded. He was never convicted of the allegations of rape. However, a lot of the text messages of his violent tendencies or of his violent fetishes were released publicly. For me, there is a bit of a tricky one here because on one hand, we've spoken quite fiercely around defending this idea of fetishes, you know, that people can be into all kinds of kinks and that that doesn't necessarily mean that those fantasies translate into real life, nor does it make them a bad person. People have non-consensual fantasies and they can stay as exactly that, fantasies. Where I draw issue with this was the volume of women who came forward and said the same type of story.

And I very much believe that where there's smoke, there's fire. Now, yes, he was not convicted of it, but everything in me says that you need to listen to women. And there are so many of them who share similar experiences. And some of, I mean, some of it is too horrific to repeat on here, but if you want to go on deep dive into some of the allegations against him. They're pretty fucking gross. But my thoughts on this is that I don't think everybody is deserving of a redemption arc. I know we've spoken a lot around like how SAS, for example, in Australia, the TV show really centers itself

around this like redemption storytelling of people who have been hard done by in the media. But I also think that being a celebrity, being an actor, having all of the accolades that come with that, the fame, the money, that is a privilege. It is an entitlement that not everyone is entitled to have. And there simply are some people who don't have the right to come back from a cancellation. And when he says he can't afford his car and he can't afford his truck, and I know that this is supposed to incite some sort of sympathy towards him, I think why not get a normal job and stay off social media? Why not get a job as an Uber delivery driver? You can drive your truck around all day. You can drive that truck every day of your life if you love it so

much, delivering people's parcels. There are jobs that you can do that don't require you to be in the public eye. And so I think the only way he's able to get back into the public eye is to be the victim, is to become the victim, which was very evident on the podcast that Armie Hammer did recently, which is called Painful Lessons Podcast, which is all around him talking about his experiences as a celebrity how he was you know had addiction issues how the the weight and the gravity of fame was the reasons why he behaved the way he did and so it was retelling this story of assault of abuse of kinks and being like well the reason for that is because I have had such a hard time and my life has been so difficult and I just like like I said I don't

have sympathy for this level of performative victimization I think it's interesting when you start to talk about celebrities that are facing the consequences of their alleged actions or the way that they act in the public space and you see them lean into this blame deflection like we see it a lot even in much less serious circumstances you know you see them say oh that was just a grab taken of something that I said it lacked context you know they blame the media for picking up on certain parts or they say that they were misunderstood and what they actually intended was A rather than B or that there are you know there's misunderstandings of their circumstances and the things that led to them acting in a certain way. I think Armie Hammer

is the most obvious example of that that I can think of it's this blame deflection of everything that happened in his life was in control of him rather than himself and rather than taking accountability for the way that that hurt his family the way that that hurt these women he's trying to make himself out as this person that has had stuff happen to him you know he's had no control over it and this whole like now I can't even afford to drive my car like oh this is all happening to me and I can't do anything about it I actually disagree with that and I say that because I thought he gave and to be clear here I do not like the guy but I'm going to give a quite a balanced response. When I watched his interview, I thought he did the opposite. He literally said

that he was abused by a pastor and sexually assaulted. And Piers Morgan directly said, do you think that that has caused you to have the fetishes and do the things you've done as an adult? And he said, no. He said, I mean, a lot of people end up this way because they're assaulted as a child. Sure. A lot of people end up this way with nothing happening to them. It's just a fetish that they have. He's like, could it have had an effect? Yeah. Do I think it did? Probably not. He's like, I'll never know because it happened to me. I actually thought he took accountability for the things that he's into and things that he's done. I think he took accountability pretty well. He owned everything that he'd done. And he actually said that he

didn't think it was a direct reflection. He was like, yeah, I had a pretty fucking wild childhood, but I am not blaming that. No, but telling the story of it is still allowing enough of that information to persuade people's perceptions. And I really think on that, this is a tricky thing to unpack because we all know that we are products of our upbringing but being the product of abuse in your childhood does not give you the right or does not give you a free pass to be a perpetrator in your adult life like those things do not correlate but i also think it's really important it's not the kinks and the fantasies that he has are not the things that i think he should have to be accountable for if they're consensual fantasies play on you're like what

consenting adults do behind closed doors is absolutely none of my business. That's not what I think he should be taking accountability for. But that's his argument. His argument is that his relationships were all surrounded on consensual non-consent. That is the argument. We can get into the layers of this because the problem is, is that the women who have come out have said that they were manipulated into the BDSM that they performed. They were emotionally and physically manipulated into something that they weren't comfortable with. The multitude of women who came forward is what makes me believe them over him but something that you said earlier Keisha which was around how the media might take one thing and that's how people who are celebrities

who are in these positions these like cancelable situations defend themselves it's a hard thing to navigate because in some instances that is the truth there are instances where the media does take one part of a story and blow it out of proportion or people on Instagram get a certain version of the facts and they go so hard that it portrays someone in a certain way that's not congruent with their actions I think the reason why the downfall in this situation was so severe is because it's the distance between who someone is and what they're actually like and the person that they're trying to present themselves to be Armie Hammer was trying to present himself as a family man as someone who was like lovable and relatable and someone who

if you have family aspirations, you could look up to. Whereas the way that he was behaving in his personal life was in stark, cold contrast to this. So there's no way that the media can just take a small part of this story and run away with it. I guess the big question is not just speaking about Armie Hammer, but how do you, as someone who views social media, how do you sniff out what is performative authenticity versus a situation where a celebrity is actually being authentic and actually sharing the way that they feel or the situation that they are in in their life. I think it's very hard. And I think it's particularly hard when you're talking about actors because they are trained to manipulate your perception of something. That's what they

do when they act. But I also think that as time goes on, I'm personally becoming more cynical of it. And I'm potentially even leaning too far into the side where when I see something that is vulnerable or that is you know deemed to be authentic on social media my immediate thought is like oh what the fuck are you trying to gain here like you're trying to make yourself seem like every other joe blow you're trying to make yourself seem like me there's this balance right there's this seesaw of authentic conversation and talking about our vulnerabilities and then there's the very real fact that people get engagement off of that and they grow from that and they also foster this deeper layer of connection and i get that it's a seesaw because

you have to have one and I don't know if I can be critical of it because I guess we're in that business as well like we have very true conversations to connect with people and make them feel less alone and make them feel as though they're not the only ones going through an experience and we cut that up into little bits and we post it on social media in an effort to have people go oh I feel like that too like I'll listen to that episode you know maybe I'll get a bit more information about it. And as I see people like Armie Hammer create things that are meant to make me think that he's this wholesome family man that takes his kids on camping trips and that doesn't want to sell his car. Like they're really relatable things for a lot of

people in this country, not being able to afford things and not being able to spend the time with their kids that they want to. I'm like, you're literally the counter of why these conversations were created well the reason why that is is because it's the why it's okay why can't you afford your car oh because of the way that you behaved in your personal life these are look these are the consequences of your actions so it's like you're trying to relate to a group of people who can't afford gas and who don't get to see their children because they've been like you know separated from them from family matters whatever that looks like but the reason for that is your own wrongdoing I think the other thing with this whole social media conversation is like how is it

self-serving and what does that person get out of it? Because it doesn't matter who the celebrity quote unquote is, anybody who has a public social following, and I say this about you and I, Brit, anything we post has a purpose. And it may not be as like well thought out, like we're not sitting there like masterminds going, Oh, what can I do today to try and get my audience to engage? But everything you do has some feedback loop. You're either doing it for validation, you're doing it to grow your community you're doing it to have a two-way conversation with your community where they get to feed back in your life or just have a connection but there's still a purpose right doing it to share and I guess that the end of the day is that sometimes

that's used for really neutral reasons and sometimes it can be used for growth it can be used for gain it can be used for monetary purposes and I think that in his instance it's far more pointed and it has an agenda yeah but I think every human has an agenda it just goes back to exactly what you just said. Everyone that makes any decision in life, especially public facing, especially with social media, there is an agenda, whether it's a wholesome agenda or a more malicious agenda, whatever it is. We see people all the time doing things for like performative authenticity. We see it all the time in Australian media. And at the end of the day, it is not up to us. And we will never know to say if someone is actually going through something or not,

if they're calling bullshit or not, because we don't know. We're not that person. all you can do, and it's a very blurry line, but all you can do is use your common sense and good judgment to make that opinion. Do I think you have to go and cancel someone off the back of it? No, but I see some people do things and post things where I'm like dying inside watching it. Cause I'm like, why are you doing that right now? If you're going through that in that moment, like, but then again, I'm not that person and I'm not going through it. So I think you need to use your own common sense when you're watching someone and making your judgment on people. And obviously what i'm talking about now differs it extends beyond army hammer that's for sure well that's

what i'm saying it differs hugely when we're talking about somebody that had rape accusations and all the violent assaults and everything else to someone that's just in the media that we like to follow like i'm just using this as a blanket statement to make your own educated decisions when you're watching this because we cannot tell there is no definitive answer when we're watching these things happen no but i mean i think my feelings towards it have changed over the years I now and it's a tricky space because I think originally if you would see somebody be upset on social media there was this rule like wow that's powerful and it is very rare that I see someone cry on social media now I'm talking about someone who's public facing and I think that is a

powerful message it's very very rare more often than not I see someone crying on social media and I think why did you think to get your phone out when you're in the moment of this despair that's where my brain goes to now and maybe that is very cynical I feel the same but I want to try and reverse like devil's advocate kind of situation and I wonder whether people in that moment not only are they maybe not thinking in a clear train of thought but I wonder if like back to this thing that you said it's a bid for connection at what point do you think maybe they're like this is the my only opportunity to not feel alone in this moment this is my only opportunity to feel that sense of connection with people that's I very much lean into the I see it

and I roll my eyes and now I'm actually thinking like oh that's probably a bit judgmental of me like have a bit more empathy for people not army hammer but I'm happy to roll my eyes at him it depends on the situation it does depend on the situation but I feel as though because I'm I'm becoming really sick of performative authenticity I'm becoming really like sick from it and I'm like oh this is exhausting like stop trying to make this feigned connection with people and I think that that's where I really sit on the seesaw of like do I actually feel as though this person is trying to foster a sense of we're all feeling this way but people don't necessarily speak about it or do I think that they're just trying to strike a chord

with people because it will somehow benefit them the situation is so vast that you might be watching somebody online crying because they're talking about how hard their fertility journey is they're talking about that because a they want to connect and communicate with their audience and they know that their audience is probably on that journey with them totally so we like there's a difference between then somebody getting in the car and crying because they lost their phone down a drain or something like if you that's why i'm saying you just use your common sense and i even say this like i cried last week on social media it was brief it wasn't planned yeah i was talking to educate people on migraines when I had my migraine was telling people how I was feeling why I was

feeling what it was doing to me and because I was getting a lot of questions in my dms about it and a lot of people giving me advice on what I should be doing when I had my migraine so I wanted those dms to stop coming in because I have tried a lot of things over the last 30 years of my migraine so I said hey guys like I know I want to tell you what I've done in the past and I appreciate you telling me what to do right now but I have tried it and I do know it and then as I was talking I started crying because i would when i was voicing the pain i was in it was it i could not stop the tears and it was for a couple of seconds and i buried my head under the blanket and then i came back and i was like sorry i'm crying but it makes me emotional that happened so naturally and

organically was not planned and i would hate for someone then to walk away and be like oh my god so performative what a fucking wanker but it would be different if i sat down if i sat down and put the camera on filmed myself and started crying when i didn't have a migraine to talk about how I'm going through so much because I get migraines that's different don't get me wrong like I don't want to come across sounding like I'm a heartless bitch but I am cynical you don't like puppies I don't and I don't really like puppies very much I don't want to feel as though I'm being heartless to this because I know that there will be everyone listening who has seen someone be upset on social media and that upset was real like of course it does happen I'm not saying that people don't share

extremely intimate and important messages we have all done that ourselves absolutely but it's when I've seen people like set up a camera and cry in the shower or I've seen like people in the midst of a heartbreak filming themselves bawling their eyes out and I do believe that they are in the middle of a heartbreak I do not question that at all what I question is is what was the intention of putting that content on social media was it for validation? Was it for connection or was it because it grows your platform or there is a hidden agenda? In Armie Hammer's case specifically, there is a hidden agenda. It's not even hidden. He wants to get back into the limelight. He wants to be an actor and he wants to be a celebrity.

And I don't think that everybody has the right, people won't disagree with this, but I don't think everyone has the right to be uncancelled. I think there are some people who have done things or have said things that are cancelable. And I don't want to watch them on our screens as a result of it. And the thing that I worry, and it is something that we see play out on TV shows like SAS, I'll use that as an example. And I know every year it comes out, we discuss it on the podcast, but there are some really questionable people who get an opportunity to tell their side of the story, to tell the hurt and the pain and the way in which their actions impacted their life. And I go, okay, well, that pain and hurt that you experienced was a consequence of your bad

actions. And I don't feel sorry for that. And that's kind of where I think that the line should be drawn in it. I have a question for both of you, because you do have public profiles. And I think this question between authentic or performative behavior and how, I'm going to say celebrities, navigate the line between the two of them. Do you think that they very deliberately lean into the hardship that they're experiencing in a way to kind of I don't know if it creates that sense of the underdog or like we hate a tall poppy so we cut them down and so they lean more heavily into the hard things into the bad things in a way to make themselves not appear as big or successful yeah absolutely the basis of

human connection is relatability and connection like it's what we want we want to feel like we're part of a village we want to feel like we have shared experiences with people that's human nature that's science I didn't just say that that's like psychology based so we always want to have especially when we're rooting for an underdog they're us they're the people's people we want them to succeed we want them to get success until they get it and then they are no longer relatable and they don't have the connection and they have opportunities that other people might not have and then whether it's a conscious or an unconscious bias but we decide that we can't connect as much anymore whether they're with tall poppy syndrome there's a level of of jealousy that somebody might

not ever have that for their own life and it's sometimes uncontrollable the disdain you might develop or the fact that you might say well I can't relate to them anymore so I don't want to follow them or I can't you know like they're not going to do anything in their life that I'm going to do in my life so there's there's no human connection anymore I feel a little bit differently to you Brit on that I think we do have tall poppy syndrome in Australia but I think it comes from a sentiment that people hold where they think well now you've changed because you are no longer on my level then you must have changed as a person and the reason why or the person I would use as an example of this we had a really great conversation with Elodie Pullen and Chloe Fisher

who you guys if you've listened to the podcast long enough you would know we've interviewed both of them Chloe is the partner wife of Fisher the DJ she just had a baby recently after many many years of fertility issues and so many devastating pregnancy losses. And Elodie is the partner of Chumpy who died in a shallow water drowning. One thing that Chloe mentioned to us is around the backlash that they have received in some ways from their audiences as they have become happy. So when they started their podcast Darling Shine, they were both in a place and a state in life where the thing that bonded everyone was a sense of immense trauma and grief. And that's what the conversations circulated around and as they have come out of their grief in some ways you know I

don't think you ever completely come out of grief at all but people have said oh well you're not as relatable anymore and it's because a lot of people are still in their grief or a lot of people are still in the thing that they may have connected to you in the first place and so on one hand even though they may be rooting for you there's a sense of oh well you've changed because you're not talking about the same things you used to talk about but what you used to talk about was how sad you were. People want to feel like they can relate to what someone is going through. And the second that you take that away completely, which is why we see people like the Kardashians, right? The most unrelatable people in the world. That's why we see them openly talking about having anxiety,

openly talking about the struggles that they have with their kids or divorce or whatever. It's because they know that there's no other way that they can relate to their audience, but relatability is key. And so that's why they talk so openly about the struggles that they're going through it's why kim started talking about her psoriasis like her body is covered in psoriasis it's really bad but she's always covered it with makeup it makes her relatable now oh she's not as perfect oh she she has all the money in the world a billion dollars doesn't take it away from the fact that you have this skin condition yeah but i think i'd actually rather her be unrelatable than fakely authentic but it's not fake she has psoriasis why is that i'm not gonna feel sympathy

for you you know like you've got the most amount of money in the world to help yourself with those conditions what and I feel like bridging the gap between the two of you I think the thing is is that it isn't fake of course it's not fake these are real things that these people go through and all the things that people talk about that are I mean I don't want to come back to Armie Hammer because I don't think he's relatable and do think he's fake but in general these are real experiences celebrities experience trauma they experience hardship they experience difficult times but the things that they experience will never be as relatable because they have so many other privileges that come alongside it. If a celebrity is saying that they can't afford gas, guess what?

The person who actually can't afford gas is probably doing it a lot worse. It's the fact that people who are celebrities or who are in positions of power or who are entitled and privileged, their level of relatability is never going to be the same as somebody else who doesn't have all of those blessings and accolades and is experiencing the same problem that's the thing they're never on the same page yeah of course not and I don't think in going back to what you said Keisha I don't think they do it for sympathy like when I use the Kim Kardashian psoriasis example I don't think she does it for sympathy but I do think she does it for relatability and I think they're two different things I don't think relatability has to be for empathy and people

to feel sorry for her but it does bring that celebrity down a level and say oh they still do have like subconsciously you're like oh they still go through normal people things but they have a billion dollars so i'm not fucking feeling sorry for you so i think that they run side by side not in alignment i have one more question do you think there has to be hardship for the redemption arc to be successful there's no redemption arc without hardship there is no redemption arc unless somebody has suffered for what they have done whether that is that they actually have done something or they have been perceived to have done something there is no redemption arc after a cancellation without them talking about their suffering.

Armie Hammer is following the exact playbook in order to become uncancelled. Is it going to work? Who knows? Potentially. But at the moment, he is doing everything in his PR-able power to try and persuade people to have a level of empathy for him so that he can continue to work in Hollywood. That is what this is about. This is not about being a great dad.

This is not about being an upstanding person. And this is not about him being sorry for anything he did or didn't do. This is a PR tactic to be able to get a job again. And that's it. It's time for Accidentally Unfiltered. I recently started a new senior job in a large open plan office with a shared kitchen and printers in the middle for everyone to use. You get the idea.

It's also my husband's and my 20th wedding anniversary coming up. I decided to surprise him with a kid-free weekend away including a private hot spring spa retreat for some really good times wanting to reignite the flame. So I took my personal laptop to work today and during my lunch break I gave him a gift voucher with a very suggestive image attached about exactly what we're going to do on our weekend together. I was printing this so I could put it in the card and surprise him. Fuck, so game printing that at work. Fun, cute, sexy. No. After I finished making it on my computer, I went to save it to print at home later that night. Except I forgot that my laptop connects to the word printers automatically.

So when I clicked print to PDF, it actually printed to the printer in the middle of the entire office that everyone can see. Not a big deal, right? Sure. You can grab a normal piece of paper and hide it pretty quickly. Wrong, ladies. I'm an architect. You've seen those enormous poster-sized blueprints that architects carry around with them. That's what I printed my naked photos on. I ran over to the printer as quickly as possible, but I can't be sure no one saw it. It's like a fucking, you know how architects have those big prints that they have to roll out across the table it's life-size it's like a it's like a life-size sexy naked photo that you've printed surely the good thing is is that those things take a long time to print so

you would think by the time you realize it's only like gotten a few lines me me me doesn't just come out i don't know she didn't give a time frame what happens if she printed it and then didn't realize to the end of the day that her naked life-size body was laying across the printer hey Sarah I think you might have printed this Sarah I think I think this belongs to you I think there's something on the printer for you hey Sarah nice landing strip hey Sarah you're on the printer that's fun this is like a very rogue story but I'll tell you anyway I'll never forget when I was in my early 20s and I was doing like a little bit of this sounds so like lame of nude printing no like I was doing a bit of modeling on the side naked modeling not naked modeling but I also was

like a life model at uni so like I'd sit naked naked and draw and people would paint me how have you never brought this up in five years I've told you this before no bullshit you maybe not but you yeah I have never this is like fucking the armpit all over again you have never you Laura every once a year once every two years Laura like throws something into conversation like that I lived a life you would never told us you were a naked life model I only did it a couple of times I think I might have done it twice maybe three times what was your friend was an artist that needed no I was I was the artist no no my point is I was what guy did you who do I think I am what guy did you morph yourself into being the type of person who would do a new drawing surprisingly enough Keisha makes

this joke because I like to call myself a relationship chameleon so I'll become whatever you want me to be at the time this was just me being me I wasn't actually dating anyone well I was but he lived far away so it was not him what was your go-to position for like it's not it's not sexy it's okay so I went to Wollongong University I did fine arts at Wollongong Uni so life drawing was like a big part of my uni degree I would never do life drawing classes at Wollongong Uni but I went and did two at TAFE so there was a life drawing class at TAFE we would always have people come and do our life drawing classes and you got paid for them I don't even think I told any of my friends at uni at the time because I was like fucking

embarrassing what you were saying right now is there are multiple nude drawings of you they were and none of them were good i never remember looking at a single one thinking fuck that person's gonna make it as picasso but maybe was like maybe that's a reflection of you so it's not sexy you're not there with your legs spread or anything you're just sitting on a chair so they're just drawing like the naked form so it's not i would love to see that picture anyway so this is like a whole other avenue so I had all of these other oh fucking whatever I also had a friend who was a photographer and I was in nude photos at one point but they were very artistic so the lighting was great anyway you couldn't see much it was like you know it was like lights and shadows and like

very demure one might say nude photography I was working at the time so my friend was just finishing off their uni and I did this with them most of the photos were quite demure but I had like the full thing so they just sent me all of the images so I could pick which ones I wanted but also they would have vetted the ones that ended up in an exhibition you would never no one would have ever known it was me either face wasn't in it was just body got that hand tattoo anyway I didn't have a tattoo at that time I didn't know I had a work laptop at the time right and I had everything on my work laptop well work computer it was a pc but I didn't know that our bosses could remotely log in to any of our computers.

Please stop here. Stop, stop, stop. And so one day my boss said to me, Laura, it's come to our attention you have a lot of personal things on your computer and you may like to remove them. Oh, no. Sorry, how's that legal? And that's how I know, okay?

How's it legal that they didn't tell you they had access to that? They probably did tell us. They probably fucking did. They would have told us. She would have signed a contract with it. Guys, this is so many years ago. How? And then once upon a time my boyfriend fucked my knee.

so like it's all it's wild times in my 20s it all comes together it's a vicious cycle i don't know i just i just love you but i don't know how we get to this point in life and these things have not come up yeah that is the ultimate accidentally unfilled i was like still got copies and nude i don't think i have them anymore i actually went looking for my old modeling portfolio a million years ago and i was like i wonder if i still had that and i couldn't find a single one it's like shame because i'd like to look back on those photos and be like fuck that You could take it to the surgeon before your labiaplasty is the before image. There's no labia photos, guys.

I just want it to be known. They were very tasteful nudes. I was in my tasteful nude era at 22 years old. I love it. I sent a banging nude to Ben yesterday. Well done. But I sent it. It was hot and I never nailed it like that.

But it was really hot. Show me. Yeah, okay, I will. No, I deleted it. So no one hacks my phone. It's on our stories, guys. But I sent it to Ben. I had regret, right?

I sent it to Ben as a disappearing photo because we don't, even in a relationship, we don't send each other physical nudes. Like I never will do that. It's always one of those ones that you can see once, you cannot screenshot it, it disappears. But it was so good. I was like, I sort of want to just send it. You should keep that one.

I always wanted to be there. You're like, circulate it. Spread it to the press. Leak, leak, leak it. Next minute it's on the shrine. It is. Britt's like, oh, my nude got leaked. Oh, I'm a victim.

them they track that they track the ip address and it's from my laptop send straight from laptop let's get into our suck and our sweet i'm gonna kick it off my suck for the week was it's not anymore it's much better now and i know i bring this up like i reckon i say this suck once every month my suck is is that the last couple of weeks we have had so much on for work and then also off the back of lots of like really big life stuff i have not had enough time for my kids at all and there has been so many work nights where I have had to stay back and then I've gotten home when they've been going to bed or I've been out the door when they've been waking up in the morning like I feel as though the last month has just been truly the shittiest

month of parenting and Matt has absolutely carried the load and I have missed my kids so much. They did call me mum at the party. Like mummy is that you? They're like hi mum. But I also know and I spoke about it the other week and a couple of you guys messaged me thank you so much for it because it is something I'm already aware of they were like the one of the reasons why Marley might be acting out so much towards you is because she needs quality one-on-one time and I absolutely think that that is what it is last week was the end of what has been a very hectic work month it has come to an end now so that's finished and we've kind of like ticked that box and it's done but yeah last week and being away from the girls again and then just having a lot on for work I

had some real moments last week where I was like fuck I miss my kids so much yeah and then my sweet for the week is that it is also family related it is that was father's day we had such a sweet day with the kids we took the kids to the football and just the whole weekend was very family orientated spent lots of time together Matt had his book launch on Saturday so two doting dads book that they wrote it was really really sweet and just like being able to be like okay cool that month is behind me now and now I can get back into just you know spending time with the kids and being the type of parent I want to be feels very very very like I'm back to a good place yeah it has been a huge month and we've been away a lot for work totally go to a lot of different cities for work

but then also coupling that with like everything that happened with Neil and then with my nan like it's just been a fucking lot yeah you're coming out the other side I can see the light at the end of the tunnel. My suck for the week would be that because we're away and had a bunch of work on, I couldn't go up to my dad for Father's Day, but I am going up next weekend. So I missed that day and all my brothers and sisters got together with my dad and all my family and it was lovely. And they had a nice little beach day. So I couldn't get up there, but I'm going up next weekend. So that's great. And my sweet is that my sister had a baby. I can't, nothing else will top it this week. And I know we already said it and we're supposed to have rules that your sweet can't be

the same as what you're saying, but whatever. We do actually have some rules on this podcast, believe it or not. No, we do. We have stringent rules. Yeah, we all stick to them all the time. But yeah, Sherry had the baby, so I can't wait until she gives me permission to share it like it's my own baby and we'll talk to you more about it. Also, before we say goodbye, we had such an incredible response to last week's episode.

We interviewed Gus Warland all around toxic masculinity, but also he is the founder of Gotcha for Life. And he spoke so incredibly around the mental health for men and around the really harrowing statistics that they are for suicide in men, but also in a way that is just so beautifully, and I don't want to say palatable because it's not a palatable conversation, but I think any woman who has a man in their life that they care about, that they love, it is absolutely an episode that you should listen to. And this is some of the things that we touched on. At a men's group the other day, 287 blokes, Avalon Surf Life Saving Club, Tuesday night, horrible weather. They all turned up and within five minutes, they're like, oh,

he feels the same way as I do. And then, oh, this old bloke says, oh, that's how I've always felt. And I wish I could talk about it. I felt this way when I was 18. Now I'm 76. A 16 year old boy stood up and said in front of his dad, I've been thinking about killing myself for the last three months. His dad never heard that before. So we had this moment where 287 blokes, we all came together with the kid and the father in the middle, just having the biggest cuddle. That was the start of the night. Three and a half hours later, everyone's going, oh, I had no idea. I thought I was the only one. I thought I was the only one that didn't quite feel like I was nailing life. And life really is your relationships with your loved ones, your children and so forth,

having enough money to go and do things, keeping up with the Joneses, all that jazz, perhaps not being able to do it in bed anymore, all this sort of stuff. And it all just goes in this melting pot and blokes end up thinking, I'm no good. So they end up making a permanent decision based on a temporary situation. You go to one of these nights, you realise, oh, it's all right. We're just one part of one big dysfunctional bunch of blokes and that's okay. And you're really good at something and I'm really good at that and you're not so good at that. And we just bumble our lives through together. That is what life's about. What I particularly loved about the episode is that I think there are a lot of conversations about mental health and there's a lot of awareness

right and that's a really good thing we're talking about it more and more what I thought was unique about Gus's episode is that he has actionable steps he tells you the ways in which if someone comes to you and says I'm struggling he tells you what to do next and that was something that I haven't really heard spelt out so simply before you know I really enjoy I learned so much from that episode as you guys know I'm very biased Gus is one of my favorite men on the planet yeah he amazing. But I think that that was something that was unique. You know, a lot of us are in these situations where we love someone who is struggling and we just, we want to help them, but we don't know how to. And I think that episode answered a lot of the questions. It's also a wonderfully

thoughtful conversation starter. So a lot of people wrote in saying off the back of that, they went and had that conversation with a man in their life and it made a really huge difference. And that's what this whole episode is about. So we're going to link all that in the show notes and you know the drill. Tell your mom, tell your dad, tell your dog, tell your friends and share the love because we love love