Life Will Be the Death of Me with Chelsea Handler - Alone is Not a Bad Word with Chelsea’s Sisters, Simone and Shoshanna

Episode Date: July 25, 2024

Chelsea’s sisters are back by popular demand!  Shoshanna and Simone are here to chat about why terrible driving is an inherited trait, the ups and downs of traveling with family, and what menopause really means.  Then: A newly-single gal decides she doesn’t want to jump into the dating pool.  A deadbeat baby-daddy comes back to haunt a loving family.  And a highly-sensitive sister makes life difficult for everyone around her.  * Need some advice from Chelsea? Email us at [e-mail] * Executive Producer Catherine Law Edited & Engineered by Brad Dickert * * * * * The views and opinions expressed are solely those of the Podcast author, or individuals participating in the Podcast, and do not represent the opinions of iHeartMedia or its employees.  This Podcast should not be used as medical advice, mental health advice, mental health counseling or therapy, or as imparting any health care recommendations at all.  Individuals are advised to seek independent medical, counseling advice and/or therapy from a competent health care professional with respect to any medical condition, mental health issues, health inquiry or matter, including matters discussed on this Podcast. Guests and listeners should not rely on matters discussed in the Podcast and shall not act or shall refrain from acting based on information contained in the Podcast without first seeking independent medical advice.  See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Bell. Connection is everything. I survived nine months in captivity, and I've spent my life exploring how other people survive what should have destroyed them. I'm Elizabeth Smart, and these are The Survivor Files. Every week, I'm with survivors who lived through the unthinkable, abducted, stalked, controlled, and nearly silenced. These are stories about what it takes to make it out alive. Listen to The Survivor Files with Elizabeth Smart on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

If your bookshelf and your For You page are equally important to your personality, welcome home. Pro Society is a weekly podcast that's part book club, part group chat for anyone who thinks Pride and Prejudice and Love Island deserve the same level of discourse. Each week, we're connecting the dots between books, the internet, and pop culture with your favorite writers, book talk creators, and plenty of overthought opinions. Yeah, I'm obsessed. I'm obsessed. Listen to Pro Society on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hello, Catherine. Hi, Chelsea. How are you?

I am coming to you live from Los Angeles. De Los Angeles. I can't believe it. You're actually here in your house. I know. I'm not from Los Angeles. I'm from Nueva Jersey, but I'm in Los Angeles. I have a new assistant who only speaks Spanish to me, and I'm hoping that he will cut it out because we are not communicating well. I'm like, I only want you to speak Spanish. And now, then like three sentences in, I'm like, okay, a little bit of English. You know what? Starting with Spanglish is fine. But I'm home. I'm home in Los Angeles. I haven't been here in forever. My house is still not done, but I'm living in it. And Doug is here and Doug loves me. And that is really the most important part of this story. Are you two having a love reconnection?

He's so sweet. He loves me. He gets into bed. We play together. He follows me everywhere. I mean, this is exactly what I was hoping for. And my bell, he does not give a shit about my bell. And that is exactly what I was looking for. He's bonded with you. Yeah, yeah. We have a really ridiculous episode today, and I want to preface this episode by telling our listeners that I had my sisters back on the podcast because everybody really seemed to enjoy it last time, and everyone really enjoyed my niece episode. So I mistakenly booked them again, and one of them is a hot fucking mess during this entire podcast. And I can't wait for you guys to figure out which person that is and understand why the other sister, who was also on this podcast episode, has since told me they are no longer available to do podcasts. And she said, that is it. We're done with your podcast.

and you are done with us. I'm so sad. We love them. We love them on the podcast. I cannot believe this episode. I hope you guys enjoy it and please let us know your thoughts. Please welcome Shoshana and Simone Handler.

Hello. Hello. What are we talking about? Yeah, give us a heads up. What do you mean? You guys, we're talking. You guys are doing the same fucking thing we did last time.

We're giving counseling with Catherine. We're taking live callers. No, like before that, before the callers. Well, I don't know. What did you take today? Anything special for your performance this afternoon? Are you on anything that we need to know about, Shoshana? No.

I'm not on anything. That's a lie. I think you took something. No, I didn't. What would you prescribe, Dr. Handler? A beta blocker. I would prescribe her a beta blocker. Actually, I've prescribed Simone a beta blocker before and with much success, actually.

For anyone who's listening, these are my two sisters, Simone and Shoshana. Wait a minute, we started already? Yes, Shoshana. I know that you're on something. I can tell by the smile on your face that you took something. And that's okay. You're allowed to take something if it calms your nerves to talk to people. Okay, let's go.

Do you want? Anyway, these are my sisters, Simone and Shoshana. And they are back by popular demand for sissy advice. Sissy advice, truly popular. Like your episode is one of our most listened to last year. Don't tell them they're going to want to get into my cash flow if they know that. So don't give them too much background. OK, please. Catherine, keep it to yourself. Girls, you know what we can talk about, actually, to open up our episode today? We're going to talk about the fact that this was funny. I have a friend, Sophie. She came to visit us on vacation

and she she was telling us about a recent experience she had at work getting an anonymous 360 review so the people that report to you or her in her case reviewed her performance as a ceo and gave her feedback about herself but i don't know why it's called an anonymous 360 because it's not that it's pretty obvious who's telling you know so anyway she she pitched the idea at our last summer vacation on the vineyard when we were all together that we should do a performance anonymous 360 review for our family members to see who fucking has earned the right to be on the trip and who hasn't you know like who's contributing what does this person bring to the table does this person make drinks for everyone does this person cook you know what

and everybody's on board everybody got very very nervous and and and especially Shoshana and Simone were like we're not doing that and I was like I think it's a great idea and Shoshana's like well who's gonna review you I'm like I have no secrets you review me I already know what you all think of me i think the only ones that really need to be nervous are the in-laws yeah that's right and they know why yeah but i mean you know you can't you come to the family you know your personality should have been checked before the marriage not now 20 years later yeah if they're gonna get booted no because of the exposure the repetitive exposure that i'm subjected to has made me rethink my strategy i i didn't know 20 years ago that i wasn't gonna want to vacation with everybody all

the time. Now I know because I've done it so many times that I have like, it would be called a non-anonymous 360. Actually, we renamed it a non-monogamous 360, which I'm not sure what that has anything to do with, but that's where we went with it. So anyway, just thoughts that are spinning around. That's the kind of vacations we have. I threaten my family when we go away that this may be the last trip ever. And that's pretty much the pattern. But let's face it, it's the in-laws that are going to be at the top of the list. Okay. All right. Well, I guess you're trying to build immunity for yourself, but yeah, this is like survivor. But what I decided to do. So another way for me to avoid my in-laws is I don't even know why I have in-laws. I didn't get married.

You know, why do I have to deal with this? So I decided to take all my nieces and nephews to Mallorca. And I was like, this is a good workaround to avoid the other adults that, you know, are kind of but now I have two interlopers my brother Glenn and Roy have invaded the trip so they're we're doing an all boys trip apparently I put them in a hotel together in a hotel room with two beds for two 60 year old men and I think that is going to be fucking out of this world what an adventure and they're the two most opposite people you could put together basically like you know one's neat and one's a big slob well roy travels with a garbage bag as his uh suitcase well no he goes shopping wherever he ends up and just buy some clothes there he travels light shopping with is

in quotes because i wouldn't call what he's doing shopping it's like he picks up the basic necessities so he'll get boxer shorts and maybe a couple t-shirts and some gross you know sweat pant outfit thing and the fun thing is he buys the t-shirt from the place he's visiting so all week long he's wearing the t-shirt from the place that the tourists buy so it's like Martha's Vineyard all week or Eggertown all week and that's where he is it doesn't make any sense Roy is very much like our father our father was a slob not when he was younger only when he was older yes he got older everything went down it went downhill right like when I grew up he would show up to my softball games it was the sweaters covered in dog hair and just you know embarrassing it's like

Slip-on sneakers. Yeah, slip-on sneakers. What are those things that he wore? The boat sneakers. The little dock shoes. Sparrows. Yeah, but he never put his foot fully in, so there was always half of his foot hanging. It was just so gross.

Anyway, Roy has picked up some. Shawna, you have picked up some of Dad's habits, too, by the way. Oh, really? Would you care to expand? I'm not sure I want to hear this. What you got there? You're going to have to give examples. I don't know. I mean, Simone, I don't know. You're not a slob. I can give you one example. Your driving skills are very much like that. Like you stop signs are just like a suggestion to you. You cut behind places like you're like weaving in and out of traffic. She's a lunatic driver. I'm also not. I'm also a driver that's better on my own than having any passengers because I don't want to hear about it when I'm up to on the road.

Listen, in New Jersey, it's every man for himself. You have to just survive. So you got to do what you got to do. It's genetic, though. Is it? Yeah. I mean, I learned to drive from him. We had to follow him to pick up used cars.

And in order to follow him, you had to go through every red, yellow light that existed just to stay with him. Because there was no, you know, cell phone with directions. Like, if you lost him, you're on your own. And you had to find a pay phone. He would be like, hey, I need you to come with me to pick up a car. And you're like, fuck. and then you had to go follow him to Verona or West Orange or something

and he never would stop at stop signs. Yellow lights meant go. Red lights meant go slow through them while you look both ways. And then if you didn't keep up with him, he'd scream at you and be like, why weren't you following me? It's like, because I'm not a fucking lunatic.

Yeah, that's why I drive that way. Yeah, I have some special driving skills too. They're not great. I mean, I think they're great, but most people don't. Most people don't drive with me because they'll get sick. But Shoshana, when Charlie was a little girl, remember, she got car sick the whole time

when you would take her to school. Every morning they thought she had motion sickness, which she does, but it was because Shana gave it to her. But only with certain drivers. Which she was Shana. She would just, and then in Africa this summer, she threw up on the plane. No, she's had motion sickness every trip we've ever been on. She really had motion sickness and it was more like for long drives.

Yeah, but she got the motion sickness from your driving. Well, you're entitled to your opinion. Simone, what do you have to say for yourself? Not much. I'm at work, girl. So this is, you know, this is a little down low. Well, it's not that down low, Simone, because we have a lot of people that listen to this podcast. So they're going to find out.

Well, I'm at work. Okay. So you're at work giving life advice to people. This is your lunch hour. It's fine. Okay. Okay. So you want to talk about menopause? Sure. Let's talk about that because actually this is a subject. Where are you with your menopause journey? I don't know because I got an ablation

after Simone got one and she told me about it and then I went and got one immediately. And I don't know if I, where I am because I don't get a P. By the way, have you told your listeners about that procedure? Because that procedure is not very like well-known and doctors don't talk about it. An ablation. We've talked about it. Yeah, we have. We have. Yeah. Yeah. No, it's, it's amazing. It's the best thing i've ever done i mean not ever but it's one of the best things i've ever done it's amazing once you stop getting your period that you just forget about periods altogether like it should be like more of a season of gratefulness to celebrate no more periods before you just ease into the rest of your life because if someone i mean i would have gotten rid

of it when i was 16 if i had known about this ablation thing but for most people they have to go through everything else i mean most people are not getting an ablation to start menopause but they should like that's my point like if people like go they suffer they have heavy periods they have accidents and then and the doctor never brings up that this is an option that's my point is that it's like such a great option if you're done having kids and you had a good experience with that oh my god it took like 15 minutes and then my life was like back on track that's amazing i was literally anemic for like two years before that and it just solved that problem overnight shauna do you still get your period no so a lot of people don't know this the definition of menopause

is the day it's one day 12 months after you've stopped getting periods it's literally one day so good to know you're either pre-menopausal which happens like for years before you actually go through menopause or you're post-menopausal or you have menopause for one day so there's pretty much before or after so yes I have I probably a year and a half so I am post-menopausal but I'm suffering from hot flashes, night sweats, mood swings, poor sleep, weight gain. You wouldn't say that's menopause. You would say that's post-menopausal? Because those are all menopausal symptoms, no? All these symptoms can happen before, during, and after, yes. Okay. So menopause is the day, you said, 12 months after you've had your last period.

Yes. And it's just that one day? Yeah. Like Halloween. Exactly. One day. I've never heard that before. I always thought it was a period of time that you're having symptoms. It's not the whole period of time. No, people just confuse the term and it's just become like, you know, vernacular, but really it's not, you know, it's just the literally that one day that you're one year without any period. So. Okay. Well, that's, that's good information to know. You know, but all these symptoms can last from, you know, a year to 10 years even. Yeah. I don't know if I have symptoms. I mean, I sometimes wake up sweaty and that that's

something, but I don't know about other symptoms. I don't know. What are the other symptoms? Memory? Memory loss or memory problems, trouble sleeping, hot flashes, night sweats, vaginal dryness. Thank you. That sounds hot. Thank you for bringing that up. So it's like, what time is it? It's not even noon. I don't want to talk about vaginal dryness. What are people supposed to do about vaginal dryness? Lube? Is that what you're supposed to do? And are you supposed to lubricate your vagina when you're having sex only? Or are you supposed to lubricate it all the time? how does that work that seems like a subject for another podcast no guys we're this is a health podcast Sean is a registered nurse Simone works in the health care industry and I'm a doctor so

between the three of us we can figure out so you can explore hormones hormone replacement or bioidentical hormones and yes you can supplement with lube supplement with lube you're not supposed to lubricate your caslapus every day right I don't think we know the answer to that question we need to get i think the answer is no i think we're going down a slippery slope no no pun intended or pun intended i do have a question about have you both been through menopause or like post-menopause yeah yeah so aside from the physical manifestations of it are there any sort of like emotional positive emotional feelings that you've gotten like yeah great you know some cultures believe that post-menopausal women are like basically you're like goddesses because you

have that sort of strength of character and not giving a fuck that you do before you go through puberty. Are you feeling any of that? Are you feeling extra confident, happy, anything like that? I feel like you get that with age, but I don't know that it's directly related to hormones or menopause. I feel like after you get to a certain age, you start to give less and less of a fuck. I mean, about everything. And that you don't like people have opinions. You're like, whatever. You just don't care. But I don't know that that's an effect of menopause. I think menopause does have some like emotional like valleys, kind of like the same thing when you're having your period or whenever you're on this sort of, you know, emotional roller coaster your whole

life. I think you go through that during menopause too. Some people get really, really sad and emotional and some people don't. Like it's very, very individual. And it's just so annoying that there's not a barometer to tell you when you're feeling those mood swings that it's related to your hormones. Like it would be more beneficial to say you have a mood coming on for the next two to four days, and you're going to be a bitch. Like, I want to know that information. Like, there should be some sort of smart app that can tell you. I'm sure there is, actually. There has to be. Yeah, I'm sure it has to do with your temperature. Like, you could put something, you could put a monitor on you that would be able to show your cycles. But no, but you know,

because women's health is such a low priority in terms of what people are working on, it's probably just not out there. But I guarantee that that could be easily created. And ablations are recommended highly for people with endometriosis, right? Yeah. Because of the bleeding. Yeah. So if you have endometriosis, you're definitely a candidate. Before we take callers, here's an upbeat question. Where do your favorite memories from childhood lie? Shauna, you go first. I would have to say Martha's Vineyard for sure. It's, you know, still to this day, my favorite place in the world. And I just remember like there always being somebody around to play with, to hang out with, to do something with because we had six kids and just like an endless summer you know that just

was seemed like forever and it was like Camelot just beautiful just beautiful memories of the beach and the water and warm weather and good food and laughing and playing and and ticks that would definitely be it yeah what about you Simone actually this came up recently because I was talking to someone about mom and different memories that came up and this really really strong memory came up of a trip I took with her when I was about 10 years old. For some reason, she just, I don't know, you were like an infant, I think, Chels. And I took a trip with her to California. So it was my first trip to Seattle and then LA. And it was just the two of us, our mom and me. And we just did all of this cool stuff together. And we rented a car together. And

I got a map. And we like, went all around LA and all around Seattle. And it was just like this really, really, I have no idea, again, why nobody else came. But it was just such a really fond memory that I have my first plane ride and my first like, big city. And I don't know, I just have been thinking about that for a while, because it was just one on one time. I remember a time when I was eight or nine, and mom took you to look at colleges, I think, Simone, I must have been seven, because you would have been 17. And she was taking you to look at colleges. And I remember being so fucking pissed at her for leaving me alone with dad. And I was like, unforgiving. Like I wrote her the nastiest letter. You wrote her a letter in response. I was like, I cannot believe

that you would leave a seven year old daughter alone with your husband. Like this is ridiculous. And you've deserted me. And I yeah, I was so pissed at her for taking that trip. So that was another trip you got to take with mom alone while I stayed at home with dad. Sorry about that. Shauna, where were you in that scenario? It seems like you would have been like helping out, no? Yeah. I mean, how old would I have been?

Five. Twelve. No, if I was seven, you were twelve when Simone went for the second trip is what I'm talking about. Oh, the second trip. So you were twelve. So you were probably torturing me as usual. Probably. Probably.

Or vice versa. Okay. Well, my favorite memories are from Martha's Vineyard for sure. I have only fond memories from Martha's Vineyard. Even though that is where we found out our brother died and my brother's favorite place, I think of Martha's Vineyard as like the most idyllic childhood scenes. Everything was so nice. Our bikes and riding into town and hitchhiking and walking around in bare feet and Main Street in Eggertown and going to South Beach and just the food and the blueberries and all this. Yeah, it was really those are my favorite memories.

Yeah, I think it's part of it. It's just the freedom we had up there. like we were so lucky that I think that was the single best decision probably my father ever made was to buy a house up there yeah as opposed to all the kids that we grew up with they all went down to the Jersey Shore every summer and I was like jealous of that until I realized then she met Snooki and was like wait a second we were in the right place at the right time in the right place we got to escape like I literally had a completely different friend set different personality like a whole different life up there it was like having literally having a

double life like living up there in the summers was so awesome and we had so much freedom because our parents were always out to lunch yeah not out to lunch no no they wouldn't even go out to lunch that would have been an improvement okay we're gonna take a break and we're gonna be right back to take some calls behind every night spent making the kids lunches there's a lot of suspense will they finally eat the veggies will the pesto survive the first bite will the lunchbox come home empty half full or come home at all and will you finish episode eight before you're done slicing the cucumbers get bell pure fiber internet with crave netflix and disney plus from 94 a month price guaranteed for two years on internet with a two-year term and auto pay credit visit bell.ca

for details and to check availability bell connection is everything when i was 14 years old i was kidnapped and held captive for nine months i survived and i've spent my life exploring how other people survive what should have destroyed them i'm elizabeth smart and these are the survivor files i just remember this low taunting voice next to my ear saying shut up don't say anything every week i'm with survivors who live through the unthinkable i knew if he woke up without a doubt he was going to hurt me i started feeling that there was someone at the end of my bed and I just started screaming. They are abducted, stalked, controlled, and nearly silenced. But these aren't stories about what's taken from them. They're stories about what it

takes to make it out alive. Listen to The Survivor Files with Elizabeth Smart on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. If your bookshelf and your For You page are equally important to your personality, welcome home. This is Prose Society, the weekly podcast that's part book club, part group chat for thought daughters, pop culture obsessives, and anyone who thinks Pride and Prejudice and Love Island deserve the same level of discourse. I'm Eli Rallo, and every week we're connecting the dots between books, the internet, and the conversations everyone can't stop having. I'm going to have to look up this story. I'm says. From bestselling authors and your favorite book talk creators to the latest pop culture

moments, nothing is off the table. It's like if you can hide some real messages inside compelling characters, then that is a Trojan horse. Whether you're looking for literary deep dives, smart pop culture conversations, or a community of readers who love to think a little too much, you're in the right place. Listen to Pro Society on the iHeartRadio app, apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts see you between the pages this week we'd love for you to write in about questions you have about your new relationship if you're newly dating someone and you're not sure how to proceed with a certain element of your relationship write into dear chelsea podcast at gmail.com

and we're back we're back with shoshana and simone handler these are my sisters and they are back by popular demand to give advice. We're giving family advice, right, Katherine? We're giving some sister advice. Perfect. We've got some kids advice. Well, our first question comes from Jeanette. She is in Illinois.

She's in her 60s. I'm from a small town in Northern Illinois, and my husband and I have been married for 27 years. Our two sons have graduated college and moved to Nashville. They love it. We travel to see them once a month. We love the city, too. Comedy clubs, live music, art.

We'd like to buy a second home in Nashville, but wonder if we should wait until the market changes. There are so many opinions on both sides, whether to wait or not. Financially, we can afford it, especially because we spend money on a hotel once a month. We love our empty nesting lives right now and love that we can see our kids here and there when we visit. What do you think, Jeanette? About what? Getting a second home? About the real estate market? I can't give financial advice. I am not equipped for that, really.

First of all, if they're buying a house in Nashville because that's where their sons are living and going to college, they may not be living there in three years or five years. Like, they might, you know, go somewhere else. They might go to the West Coast. Don't pick Nashville because your sons are there. If you want a second home, pick it wherever you want to live, but don't base it on the kids. Yes, exactly. Stay in a hotel. That's better.

You think? Yeah, it's more sexier. It's fun. A house is a pain in the ass. And you don't buy a house because you don't follow your children to college. No, so they're all graduated. People do follow their kids to college. People do.

I know lots of people. I know. I know. I just met a couple who did it. I was like, what? And they're like, oh, our kids are in London. I just was with a couple and they're like, our kids are in London, so we're going to London.

I'm like, to what? Follow them around? And they're like, yeah, we just want to be close to them. See, my mom said that she got advice recently that like people her age, you know, she's in her 70s. She was like, go move where your kids are. Don't expect them to move home. Like, go be by them.

And you can like help out with child care. Well, maybe when they have kids and they're older and they've started their own families, you're going to want to see your grandkids and you want to help with them. But when they're in college, you know, just go get an Airbnb or hotel and, you know, hang out a few days or whatever. But, I mean, to buy a house, that's a pretty big commitment. Shawna, you're a recent empty nester. What do you have to say for yourself? Listen, it's hard. It's hard.

I only have one that left. I have one still in high school. My daughter just left for college this year, and it's been a major transition. You know, when they're little and you start a family, you never really think about that day that's going to come and they're going to go off to college somewhere far away. And it is really a slap in the face, to be honest. What is happening? Like, how did I get here? What do you mean a slap in the face?

That's exactly what you want them to do. Yeah, I mean, I know. But, you know, it's really like I just was not ready emotionally. Like, ouch. like that sucked what was the tell us about it because I'm sure a lot of women are listening that are experiencing it so talk about it I mean there's lots of excitement of course for your child to start this new adventure and you want them to have a great experience and leading up to it you know you are trying to be positive and encouraging you know but in the back of your mind

there's just this little bit of dread or sadness like when that day actually happens like what am am I going to do? Am I going to like completely break down in front of my child? Am I going to pull it together? Am I going to, what's going to happen? And what did happen, Shauna? So Mike and I, my husband, Mike, Charlie's dad, we took her to college. We spent a few days and got her all set, decorated her room and her roommate went out to dinner and we did really well. And then it was time to go. And we kept it together until we shut the door when we said goodbye and literally in the hallway of her dorm about 10 feet from closing the door and saying final goodbyes we both started crying and unfortunately for my son Russell who's 14

he was like what the fuck are you guys doing I was like I'm so embarrassed but we were both crying it was sweet but it's not just that like that moment is really bittersweet and you know because you're like happy for them but you're sad and all that stuff but it's the it's the like the change in the dynamic of the family that changes so now Russell's like the two of you are focusing your attention on him because she's away and doing whatever she wants and studying and he's kind of like the center of your activity now and the whole dynamic changes and I think that's what you can't predict how that changes right right definitely after is you know it's a whole different environment my Charlie is much more outgoing and loud my son Russell is more quiet and he plays video games and

keeps to himself and now we do focus a lot more attention on him and you know he doesn't really like it but oh well but we're we're all just figuring it out and you know it's fine it's just different and it gets better as it goes like each month gets a little easier and also knowing that your child is doing well makes it a lot easier you know my daughter's happy she's thriving she's lots of new friends. And that definitely like makes you feel better about the whole situation. And thank God for FaceTime and, you know, texting all the time. But it's the worst one is the first one, right? No, I don't know. I think it depends how, you know, your dynamic. Like for me, I think the

first one was hard, but I still had two kids at home. So it was like, I went home to a busy household. It wasn't like every day I was thinking about Jake being away and, you know, how is he doing. And I think by the time Seneca was ready to go to college, I was like, totally ready. Like, here, go, go do your thing. And so, you know, while I still miss her, it's not the same thing. It's like, I'm ready to be an adult independent of her and independent of kids. And she's ready to go off to college. So it kind of got easier with each one, not harder. Yeah, I remember telling mom and dad that I was going to California, that I was going to drive across country and move in with Gabby and Terry, our aunt and uncle.

And they were like, please go. You know, like, don't wait another second. And dad went and got me four new tires for the car that I was driving cross country. He had never, ever sprung for four new tires for any car I drove. And he got me four new tires and they were like, don't let the door hit you on the way out.

Like, we are so fucking sick of you. And it was the best decision I ever made because then I started to like my family again once I got enough distance. Yeah. 3,000 miles is the perfect amount of distance. Absolutely. A drive across country will set anybody straight.

That's true. I do remember, though, when Simone went to college, that was a big gut punch for me because she was my ally in my house against my father. She would be our mediator. And I did not get along with my father for those years. And she went to college to Emory, which I visited her frequently. And Shauna, you did too, right? Only with the family, not by myself.

Okay. You, I think, went by yourself. Yeah. Yeah, you went rogue and came over when you were 11 years old. I think mom and dad like sent you on a plane to visit me. I don't really understand how this went down. But you were 11. And so that means I was 21. And I took you everywhere I went. I took you with me to my first bar called PJ's in Atlanta. And I went in and she got carded and I didn't. So I was 11. So that gets 11. They didn't really think you were there to drink. But well, sorry, I left you. But I had to do it. You had to grow up somehow. I know, I know. That was traumatizing, actually. Very traumatizing being alone with my fucking parents. Okay. Anyway, I'm glad I got that off my chest. Let's continue. Sigamos. Sigamos. So Lane is our next caller. Shauna, stop moving your fucking camera around. You're making me nauseous. It's saying that I have low bandwidth. You do because you're going in and out. You're kind of crackling up. All right. I'm moving. Relocating. Awesome. we're gonna put you in the basement that is shauna to a t every time she calls it's like hello hello all right is this there yeah i think so shauna yeah okay all right well our next caller

is lane lane bryant lane says dear chelsea about two years ago i got out of a 10-year relationship then a month ago i got out of a one-year long distance friends with benefits scenario that started as something sexy and fun, but feelings were caught and it turned into an exclusive, confusing situationship with a bit of an emotional ending. So she originally had emailed to talk about how she can find a friends with benefits situation, but she updated with, since I wrote in, I've had a change of heart. I recently read an awesome book, How to Be Single, and it got me excited and wanting to embrace the solo time. I want to prioritize being present and intentional in my decisions, and I need a break from getting caught up in relation and situationships.

All of this was further sparked by your episode with Jane Fonda and the caller discussing her divorce. That was me a year and a half ago. And I'm at a place now where I can tell people, like that caller, you'll make it through to the other side and it can actually feel great. So my question is, what strategies do you have for staying present and intentional, staying strong in moments of loneliness, and overcoming societal pressures in terms of relationships? Lane. Hi, Lane. These are my sisters, Shoshana and Simone. Oh, wonderful to meet you all. So where do you want to begin?

OK, so you want to know how to stay present and focus or tips to stay present and focus. First of all, I want to say something about loneliness. I really don't. I think a lot of us are confused about what loneliness is because we're so scared of it. And like being alone doesn't necessarily mean you have to be feeling lonely. Right. Being alone is can be very fulfilling when you use your time and spend it in ways that make you happy, like reading a really good book or exercising or just watching TV in

bed or whatever your stuff is whatever you like to do any opportunity I get to be by myself I jump at it I spent a long time not being able to be alone but I appreciate my alone time and I think as you get older you become much more comfortable with yourself and your alone time so don't obfuscate loneliness with being alone definitely and I think like that's something I'm just currently going through the process of learning and really embracing I think I spent you know many years in a long-term relationship and you know towards the end of that things just weren't feeling right anymore and then after I left it I kind of fell into this old pattern of maybe that little feeling of loneliness creeps in and then you start reaching out to things that you don't

actually want or maybe that you're not ready for and so I'm just right now trying to find ways to like quiet that loneliness feeling I guess and really just embrace and be excited about being on my own. I don't necessarily think being alone is a scary thing. It's something really exciting that I really just want to embrace right now. You should write down when you're feeling that way, like feeling really lonely and write the situation around it. Like what happened to your day? What happened during your day? Who did you talk to? Why are you feeling lonely? The more you examine things, the more they kind of go away. I feel like you kind of face it head on where you're like, oh, this is interesting. I'm feeling this right now. Why am I feeling this? What happens

today to make me feel this way? Is this a result of something else that happened last week? You know, that kind of stuff. It's almost just like a practice of getting to know yourself so that you get into a more comfortable ease with yourself in your alone time. I mean, all three of us as Simone, Shoshana and myself spend an inordinate amount of time alone, I would say. But OK, what was your other topic that you wanted to discuss? You're asking about being present, trying to be more present. Yeah, I think present and just really intentional. Like I think I'm at this like new area in my life a new chapter where I just have time to really get to know myself and I just don't I think like sometimes it's like easy where especially kind of like I guess one of

the things I talked about was like societal pressure your friends are like oh I could set you up with someone or you have someone that asks you out and you're like oh I could be interested in pursuing that but I just like don't want any noise of that right now I just want to kind of embrace being present and intentional when I am ready to like kind of move into dating or anything kind of casual. I just want to be able to like be very clear in my decision making and my choices and just be really confident in all of that. And not get roped into a relationship, right? Exactly. Like I think it's so easy where like if you kind of like meet someone and then all of a sudden, like you kind of get that attachment to them and they kind of filled, you know,

that void of comfort or validation. And I just don't want, I don't want someone else to provide that for me. I want to be able to provide that for myself right now and really kind of lean into that it sounds like you know what you want actually you sound like you're being pretty intentional yeah like I think what you're saying about you know having you finally have some time alone you want to get to know yourself better like act on that like write down the things that you want to do for yourself I mean you're going to meet people along the way there will always be people trying to set you up or whatever but you don't have to jump into that you can just be very intentional about saying that's nice but that's not where I am right now you know you can still

be social you can still go out but focus on the things that bring you joy or things that you've wanted to try that you've never tried I mean this is a like there's a lot of freedom that comes with being alone too like there's a lot of obligations when you're committed to someone not necessarily in a bad way but now that you have this time in this space like why don't you explore that a little bit like go a little bit deeper and try to spend some time on what you really want to do and that those things that you like, they shouldn't go away. If you start a relationship either, that's something to keep in mind. Like, I think a lot of people like do things when they're alone and then there are things when they have their partner and those things don't always

overlap, which I think is, can be really problematic. Definitely. And I think kind of along with what you're saying is within the last couple of months, I've just found this like newfound energy or like a way to show up for friends and family in a way that I maybe wasn't fully able to when you are in relationship totally totally but I do find too like especially when you have like friends or family members that are like are you happy you're alone and I just want to be like well I just don't feel like alone is a bad word and how do I yeah and it's but every now and then you know you have that like kind of dark lonely voice that does come in and I just want to remind myself of the times like right now where I'm feeling very much more like strong

about it and happier and content with it and you should write that down too like when you're feeling great and positive you should write down that and the events around it that led you there you know the kind of day you're having because i do think you're on the right track everything you're saying it sounds very intentional those comments from other people again they're coming from all different places from society from norms whatever like you have to kind of you know you don't have to be rude about it but like that's just their stuff like you don't have to put that on you if you're enjoying this time and you're exploring and you're writing these things down where you're enjoying your time alone, like none of that matters. That's just preconceived notions

that they have that they're trying to put on you. They're not about you. Or they just have nothing to say. So they say that because that's what people say. I've said it to people before. Like it's just a pointless comment. It's not helpful anyway. And also I always play this game with myself when I am dating someone casually, like to keep it casual. I always say to myself like, okay, say we have plans on a Friday night. I'm like, okay, we have plans. I have plans with this fun guy on Friday night. That'll be fun. And then I always say to myself, if that doesn't work out for some reason, I still have a million other options or I'm going to do this or I'm going to be happy doing this. I always kind of keep myself in check that way when I'm starting out with some

casual fling with somebody so that I make sure I know like this is a fun thing to have, but this is not the source of my happiness. It's good to remind yourself that you are going to have a good time and whether you're with someone or whether you're without them, it's just going to be a different time if you're with them. But to remind yourself of your own source, you're the one who's bringing the vibes to your life, not necessarily someone else. They can always help, but no one is the source of another person's happiness. What were you doing for yourself right now is going to actually reap benefits if you the next time you are in a relationship, you know, getting to know yourself, spending time with yourself so that you know sort of what you want

out of life and out of a relationship in the future. So cherish it because you don't know how long it's going to last. And, and, and, you know, it's going to benefit you in the long run too. And Simone, I know you mentioned like, of course, Lane's going to like go through her life and be meeting people. Is there a way, do you three think to differentiate between like, oh, I met someone and I actually, I'm really into them versus like, they just happened to be there. And so I'm falling into this. Sometimes when you're in a new relationship, you lose yourself. You kind of want to be what you think they need or what they want. And I've done that in the past. And it's like, you kind of just forget who you are a little bit,

and then you kind of get off course. And, you know, it's great just to stay grounded, remember who you are, and take it slow. And don't lose yourself. Remember what you like, what you want, what you are. And if that person's really worth it, or, you know, was the one you might end up with, they're going to love you the way that you are, you know, you don't need to change or or get ahead of yourself or make changes about yourself to fit them you've got to be you know secure in who you are yeah and you sound like you are secure in who you are and you're only getting to know yourself better which is just going to be like you're putting money in the bank of your happiness so I don't think you're going to have any problems and

also listen as we get older and more mature we stop taking every little interaction so seriously with men even when it is a fling like we start to understand the difference and we don't get that attachment that happens sometimes when we're in our 20s and 30s once you hit your 40s you're like oh no no no like that's a temporary gig you're not a person in my life like you know you just grow into it and you understand that certain people are just visitors and then other people are here to stay and I would just add one little point is just setting being be really clear you know if you are dating someone like be really clear about your intention like hey I am not looking for something if they're looking for a long-term relationship and you're not then that's

probably not a place to start dating you have to be really clear about like this is where I am in my life I have no interest in that and just be clear about communicating that to them so that you're not you don't end up with the wrong person and I guess along that wavelength it's like what is a good approach for when you're kind of entering into the dating world again like how do you communicate that to someone like I'm just like not looking for anything super serious at this point in time when's a good time to say that really early on I think I mean I could Anyone can jump in here, but I think really early on. I don't know.

I think that's kind of like a, Simone, think about it. When you're on your dating sites, do you like hearing that right out of the gate? I mean, I guess maybe it would be helpful. Well, I mean, all those apps actually are set up that way. So they say, I want short-term fun. I just want a one-night stand. I want a long-term relationship. I'm looking to get married.

All those options are on there. Yes, to all of that. But I also don't think that you need to say that right off the bat. Because what if you end up dating a guy that you're like, well, wow, this is actually a really good match. This is a healthy relationship. We have like it's a great give and take. We compliment each other. And then you're like, oh, OK, maybe I can have a relationship.

I don't think you have to be like black and white about things at the outset as you're dating them. And if you're like, oh, this guy needs to know like he's falling in love with me. He needs to know this is casual. Then, yes, don't string somebody along that you're not interested in. Right. But I don't know that it has to be like the first thing you say. yeah and listen you're smart lane you don't even fucking need us okay you're fine you're beautiful you're smart you're intelligent you're taking time to be alone every woman should be doing this

and good luck with everything because i know you're gonna have a good life thank you okay wonderful to meet you all have a great day okay you too you too take care bye shoshana you are making me nauseous are you in a place where you're getting a signal you have been walking around this entire episode everywhere i go it says low bandwidth. But how can you have low bandwidth in your house? How? How? I guess it's time to call Verizon. Okay. Anyway. Behind every night spent making the kids' lunches, there's a lot of suspense. Will they finally eat the veggies? Will the pesto survive the first bite? Will the lunch box come home empty, half full, or come home at all? And will you finish episode eight before

you're done slicing the cucumbers get bell pure fiber internet with crave netflix and disney plus from 94 a month price guaranteed for two years on internet with a two-year term and auto pay credit visit bell.ca for details and to check availability bell connection is everything when i was 14 years old i was kidnapped and held captive for nine months i survived and i've spent my life exploring how other people survive what should have destroyed them i'm elizabeth smart and these are the survivor files i just remember this low taunting voice next to my ear saying shut up don't say anything every week i'm with survivors who live through the unthinkable i knew if he woke up without a doubt he was going to hurt me i started feeling that there was

someone at the end of my bed and I just started screaming. They are abducted, stalked, controlled and nearly silenced. But these aren't stories about what's taken from them. They're stories about what it takes to make it out alive. Listen to The Survivor Files with Elizabeth Smart on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. If your bookshelf and your page are equally important to your personality, welcome home. This is Prose Society, the weekly podcast that's part book club, part group chat for thought daughters, pop culture obsessives, and anyone who thinks Pride and Prejudice and Love Island deserve the same level of discourse. I'm Eli Rallo, and every week we're connecting the dots between books,

the internet, and the conversations everyone can't stop having. I'm going to have to look up this story. I'm obsessed. I'm obsessed. from best-selling authors and your favorite book talk creators to the latest pop culture moments nothing is off the table it's like if you can hide some real messages inside compelling characters and that is the trojan horse whether you're looking for literary deep dives smart pop culture conversations or a community of readers who love to think a little too much you're in the right place listen to pro society on the iheart radio app apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. See you between the pages. Okay, we have one last caller, guys, so just fucking focus.

So I've got Hannah on the line here. Hannah is having some baby daddy issues. She says, I'm a single parent living in a beach town in the South with my five-year-old daughter. I have a wonderful new partner coming up on a year, and we are so happy. He's also a single dad. Baby daddy had a lot of issues. Alcohol, drugs, pathological liar, the list goes on, and he split when my little one was two. He lives in New York now, supposedly. Never paid a cent in child support, held in contempt by the courts. Took years to track him down so I could obtain full legal custody and I had to trick him into signing the papers by telling him he could be a part of my daughter's life. He finally signed and of course I'm desperate to close this chapter

for good. Now he's angry and suddenly wants to be a part of her life. I'm so against this as he's very inconsistent and unreliable and who can know for sure if he's changed. I want to protect my daughter, of course, but I feel a little guilty at the same time. I do not feel safe having him reenter her life, but am I being too harsh? How can I set boundaries with someone who has no concept of them? Hannah. Hi, Hannah. Hi, Hannah. Hi, Hannah. Hi. Hi. These are my sisters. Hi. You said you signed some papers. What were the specifics on that? Because I didn't, it wasn't clear like what he signed away or. So I would prefer if something was signed away, but the final point like case closed that we got to was sole custody parent it was just like

when we first started so so long ago I was like let's go parent let's try this like I'm a very positive open-minded person I was like yeah let's do it so the original agreement was shared custody and I just finally got sole custody because I'm the only parent here so so he's he's on the other coast he's far away he's allegedly in New York when he says he wants to be part of her life what What does he mean by that if he doesn't live anywhere nearby? Not sure. Like it's very unclear. So those messages, those begging kind of, I've changed, I've changed, I've changed.

How can you keep her from me? Like I want to be in her life. They come every like four to six weeks, sometimes every few months. And for me, it's really challenging to engage every single time and go back into that loophole and go back into that cycle because I have a heart. I have feelings. I was super invested in this and like the boundary I've put up is I either ignore it, which doesn't feel great, but it's really hard to engage with him because there's no like linear

result and he doesn't come back into her life. And I don't think it's fair for a young child to have that inconsistency and to have, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm ready. Let's have a FaceTime. Let's have a phone call. I don't know who you are anymore, but I'm going to try and then gone. When was the last time that they saw each other? Like about two years ago. does she have any memory of him at this point not really I'm currently in a new have a new partner and that's been a really positive influence and we're moving in together soon and I've even gotten a lot of great feedback from her teacher saying how she draws pictures and talks about him and is very excited you know like he's like included in the narrative now and she's like reflected on

that that has been a positive thing whereas in the past like she's like even mentioned to her friends. Like, yeah, I don't, I don't have a dad. You know, it's very clear from a young age, like the different families options that they are. And, you know, we have family events and she doesn't have a person there. I feel like he is showing you who he is by only reaching out every six weeks. It sounds like either guilt or family members of his that are like saying, Hey, what about your daughter? And you should really push that or whatever, wherever it's coming from. You have to like, he has to show up in a much better way for you to even consider him having a part in her life like he has I think you have to tell him look I can't I can't deal

with this on again off again stuff if you want to be part of her life you have to do a b c and d and those things would be like you know you have to show me that you're gonna support her you're gonna show me that you're gonna show up on a regular basis you have to do all these things that like demonstrate that he really means it otherwise you shouldn't have to deal with him at all because it's very unhealthy for her and that's the most important thing thanks and i also think it's about your health mental health too like he's gonna put such a strain he's already putting a strain on your mental health and he's not even around and he hasn't been around and you have a positive influence for her now it's like yeah if he wants to show up and and come and visit

that's one thing but talking about it doesn't really get you anywhere yeah he has to put his mind where his mouth is is he talking about coming to live there so that's another interesting aspect the state where i live he has like um i think it's called a bench arrest warrant because if you don't pay child support that's illegal right and so he after a certain amount of time it gets written into the courts like he's paid zero dollars so then there's like a warrant out for his arrest in this state if he comes back because you can't leave the state and not pay apparently you can't leave the state and not pay child support because it's a federal crime. Right.

I would just love to have the rules about what would happen if a fucking woman did that and then came back. I mean, it's just we would be arrested if we tried to fucking pull shit like that. So like part of me feels like I could go down the petty road and the mean road and put all my energy into being negative and getting him in trouble and getting back at him. It's no, no, no, no. That's no good. I want to like be free of it.

You know, I don't think you have an obligation to even accept calls and texts from him. I think it's time to block. If he has a meaningful change of heart or change of like being and can pay his child support, come back into the state, actually like send you paperwork. I want to see my child again. Then that's a different issue. But I don't think you need to be subject to getting these texts in your inbox. I wouldn't say block him because that is her daughter's father. like what if something happens and they need to know and you can handle that situation but getting

a text every four to six weeks you don't have to respond to that you could just let it go because clearly he's not that determined otherwise he would be texting you more frequently but i think you you've got the right idea just i think just try not to like limit your engagement with him you don't have to respond to him he's has he has a bench warrant in the state you're living in for not paying child support. That's all he needs to know. And if he wants to change, I mean, that's it. That's all the information that he needs. If he's not paying support, there's no reason for you to have them interact in any way. I mean, he's not even like doing the minimum of what is expected of him. So he has to show you that he's going to totally turn things around. I mean, he's not

paying support. He has no right to see his daughter. That's true. Yeah. So maybe it's as simple as that like sure once you can pay child support you can be in her life and if that winds up happening then that's a different conversation yeah i would say like okay you need to do a b and c make it very clear for six months and then after six months we can talk about blah blah blah but we'll see right yeah yeah focus on your good life that you've got going with your new man yeah and your kid i don't think you owe him anything yeah i don't think so either yeah okay that was that was the truth that I wanted. Perfect. Awesome. Thanks, Hannah. Bye, Hannah. Thank you. All right. Well, we'll take a quick break and we'll be right back with Madison and we'll wrap up.

Behind every night spent making the kids' lunches, there's a lot of suspense. Will they finally eat the veggies? Will the pesto survive the first bite? Will the lunchbox come home empty, half full, or come home at all? And will you finish episode eight before you're done slicing the cucumbers? Get Bell Pure Fiber Internet with Crave, Netflix, and Disney Plus from $94 a month, price guaranteed for two years on Internet with a two-year term and auto pay credit. Visit bell.ca for details and to check availability. Bell, connection is everything.

When I was 14 years old, I was kidnapped and held captive for nine months. I survived, and I've spent my life exploring how other people survive what should have destroyed them. I'm Elizabeth Smart, and these are the Survivor Files. I just remember this low, taunting voice next to my ear saying, shut up, don't say anything. Every week, I'm with survivors who live through the unthinkable. I knew if he woke up, without a doubt, he was going to hurt me. I started feeling that there was someone at the end of my bed, and I just started screaming.

They are abducted, stalked, controlled, and nearly silenced. silenced. But these aren't stories about what's taken from them. They're stories about what it takes to make it out alive. Listen to The Survivor Files with Elizabeth Smart on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. If your bookshelf and your For You page are equally important to your personality, welcome home. This is Prose Society, the weekly podcast that's part book club part group chat for thought daughters pop culture obsessives and anyone who thinks pride and prejudice and love island deserve the same level of discourse i'm eli rallo and every week we're connecting the dots between books the internet and the conversations everyone can't

stop having i'm gonna have to look up this story i'm obsessed i'm obsessed from best-selling authors and your favorite book talk creators to the latest pop culture moments nothing is off the table it's Like, if you can hide some real messages inside compelling characters, then that is a Trojan horse. Whether you're looking for literary deep dives, smart pop culture conversations, or a community of readers who love to think a little too much, you're in the right place. Listen to Pro Society on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. See you between the pages. And we're back. Well, Madison writes in and she says, Dear Chelsea, my sister is three years older than

me and we're super close. She's the person that knows me better than I know myself and that I'm most connected to in this world. However, I would label her as a, quote, highly sensitive person. Ever since we were little, she's always had a very big, strong and at times explosive emotions. This presents as nearly constant outward irritability to where most people in my life think she's a bitch, coupled with a fairly depressive outlook on herself and her life. I have learned to let things go and attribute a lot of her negative energy to her difficulty with dealing with her own emotions. However, I've also worked a lot to understand myself more, be more assertive with my wants and needs and set boundaries with others. My question

is this, how can I start to be honest with my sister and about how her irritability and mood impact me when I'm so worried about hurting her feelings or sending her into a highly sensitive feelings spiral. Madison. Hi, Madison. Hi, Madison. Hi, these are my sisters. They're our special guests today. Oh, what a perfect guest for today. I know. Perfect guest for your situation. Well, I would say, Simone, do you want to start? I mean, I would be the most irritable. I'm not the most sensitive, but I'm the most irritated. And I mean, it is a tough situation because this is your sister you said you're close right yeah and I can relate to that I'm a little overly sensitive too so to criticism but I don't like spiral out of control usually you're sensitive

to criticism about your children you're not sensitive to criticism about yourself I mean who's criticizing you for what when do you get criticism it's happened once or twice anyway it's a sensitive area because I think you know you care about her right I mean you're very close you care about her but I think at some point you kind of have to it sounds like she needs to talk to someone else like she needs some assistance in in accessing her own emotions and understanding why she's so sensitive and why she spirals out of control like this like this this is bigger than you I think she really actually would benefit from seeing a therapist and raising that is probably sensitive too but if you're really thinking about her well-being I think you know you you can broach

it in more gentle ways and saying like, oh, you know, I don't know, something comes up and you sometimes it's by analogy, oh, my friend is seeing a therapist, and this is how it's working, or my friend has this issue. Sometimes like you have to go about it a little sideways, as opposed to directly, because it sounds like she is super sensitive when you if you are talking about her. But I really think the two of you can't manage this alone, like she needs some assistance. It might be fun to go together to therapy a few times like with her and join her and you can bring up things. And with that third party, sometimes, you know, that makes it easier because they can kind of navigate what you both are trying to say and, you know, help break it up where it's just not the two of you alone, but somebody to kind of help you navigate through what the other person is saying and saying. Is that something that you could do?

Do you think there's a possibility to go to therapy? Would you be open to that like together? I don't know if she'd be open to it together I did try that once with her and my mom actually because they have a kind of contentious relationship and I am like the peacemaker I'm the middle man that can like interpret for both of them and so I kind of was like I'm over your guys's shit and I'm not going to be around you unless we like go to therapy together because I can't do this but that only went for one session and my sister got really defensive kind of like the therapist was talking to her about maybe some possible depression. And that's

can explain some of the irritability and the sensitivity. And she just felt like the dynamic was getting pinned on her since we were both there. So I think maybe a solo like suggesting a solo adventure for her might do better than me going with her. Yeah, that's good. That's good. And then I think then what you have to do is have a sit down and like a face to face heart to heart with her and just be like listen I feel like I'm walking on eggshells a lot because I'm worried about how you're going to receive information and I don't think you want me to feel that way and I don't want to feel that way about you like you're the person I love the most like everything you said about her was very moving and touching but you know as a sister I mean if you're not

going to tell her who the fuck is yeah yeah and then like Chelsea has an always on her podcast you know you have to come from a place of love and tell her this is because you care about her this is because you love her. This is because she's a big part of your life and that you want to see her happy and you want to see her evolve over time. And what you're seeing, she doesn't appear to be happy and content and be able to deal with some of these issues. And so if you're coming from that place, that's really valuable. Yeah. And if she's in a highly irritable state, that's not pleasant for her. So she really has to take a look at that. I've been there. I understand that. You're not a happy person when you're that highly irritated and everyone annoys

you so much. There's something going on with you. It's a deeper issue and it doesn't have to be that way. Like people who are depressed or upset, they don't realize there's another way to live. Like you can actually choose to do the work and get to the other side and be a happier, more positive, optimistic person. But you know, it's going to take time and you, and you just have to commit to being there for her during it. What do you guys think you would phrase? Cause I feel like I'm good at the taking care of her feelings part, but like, so my, my boyfriend would be like, oh my gosh, like, this is so crazy. You're like getting into her dynamic. You need to have like a life intervention with her and just tell her like, no, like you need to go somewhere and get

help. And like, this is not sustainable, but I don't know how to like word the direct part to be like, you need to, I mean, I, maybe it's just that plane. You need to go get help or I don't know. I think you would say, listen, I love you more than anything. And I really feel like you could benefit from talking to someone. As your sister, I know you better than anyone. And I know that you're not as happy as you can be. Like it's possible to be happier. And through the like counseling, I can listen to you all you want, but I'm not like a professional. Like you need someone who can help you deal with all of these feelings that you have. And then you can use some examples of like what you've seen about her, that it isn't happy, that it is irritability, that it isn't,

you know, that she is in a constant kind of state of agitation. Yeah. And I think it's important to say that you're always there for her. You're listening for her, but your skills only go so far. Like you can't solve her problems. You can be there for support and love and all that. But like, it's not what she needs. She needs much more than that. She needs someone independent to really help her work through these things. And so you're not taking away your support. You're not pulling away your love or support, but you're just saying like, I've got my own limits.

Like I can only do so much for you. Yeah, and the defensiveness is just the example of why she needs to go to therapy. When you are that defensive about anything, like when you can't hear any critique about yourself and think, oh, maybe that's something I can improve on. That's the definition of needing to go to therapy. Yeah.

Yeah. In addition to all of this, putting the onus like not you need to go to therapy because you're a bitch, but it is like the onus can be slightly outside of her. Like it'll help you reduce this tension so that you can be happy. It'll help reduce your stress so you're not flying off the handle all the time. So you can kind of put the onus next door. And so it's not like you're just terrible to be around. It's like, no, you have these other stressors.

You have these other things like it can help you dissipate that stuff. Yeah, that is a really good way to look at it because, yeah, her life would only grow because the connection other people like I'm so used to her attitude and like what she's sensitive about. So I can kind of not step on those landmines or I can like very intuitively kind of feel her energy and know like how much is too much or went back off. But I think it does really get in the way of her connecting and also being a bigger part of my life because other people in my life are having such a hard time with it. Yeah. Oh, really?

So impacting your like friendships and like it doesn't impact their relationship with me, but like my partner, for example, he has a really hard time being in the same space is both of us because he's like you don't want to like say anything but he wants to like call her out every single time there's like something said under her breath or like an eye roller definitely don't bring him into the conversation yeah don't mention him don't say anything about that because that will only create more tension between the two of them agreed yeah but framing it as something yeah a little next door yeah her circumstances everything she's dealing with it's like it's not your fault this is a lot to deal with whatever's on her plate we can help you

with this. And I think you do need help with this kind of just like spoon feeding that idea to her a little bit more. But have confidence in your relationship with your sister, like you're not going to break up with your sister. So have confidence that you are you have the ability to help her. And that even if she's upset in the beginning, she's coming back. You know what I mean? Yeah, I think that is the hard thing to trust. Yeah. If you're avoidant conflict, like I just stresses me out, but you're right. There is not a world in which we're going to be separated for a long period of time. So really leaning into that feels right. And being avoidant doesn't solve anyone's problems ever. No one has ever solved a problem by avoiding it. So

not a good strategy. Well, thank you guys so much. You're welcome. You're welcome, cutie. Good luck with everything. I'm sure everything will work out fine. It might be a little bumpy, but it will work out. Thank you guys. Have a good one. Bye. Bye. Bye. You have to look at that as a long-term plan, right? Not a short-term solution. She's got to be able to be around her sister's partner and that sort of thing. It's so tensioned, but it's so unfair when you're with someone and then they don't get along with your sister. That's so unfair for everyone. Yeah. I mean, she's a good sister. She's being loyal and she's doing the right thing, but you can't let people go on like that in life

because it's just, you're not doing them any favors. Everybody's walking on eggshells. It's awful. Okay, bitches. Well, thanks for all of your advice today. Our episode has wrapped up. Shoshana, I am physically nauseous from all the movement from watching you walk through your house 15 times with a computer in your hand. I am on the move to try to stay connected. I apologize. Okay, well, we might want to get you a booster for your house. So we'll get on that right away. love you girls miss you love you

see you soon bye girl love you bye bye peace out peace out bye bye

okay so upcoming shows that I have you guys I'm coming to Niagara Falls on July 27th I'm coming to

Hollywood Florida for my only show in Florida on July 28th I'll be in Auburn Washington on August 1st and then Santa Rosa

California for my second show August 2nd August 17th is the Santa Barbara Bowl. You do not want to miss that. And then I will be all over Maine, Charlotte, North Carolina, Charleston, South Carolina. I'm coming to Texas. I'm coming to St. Louis and Kansas City. And then I will be in Las Vegas performing at the Chelsea Theater inside the Cosmopolitan Hotel. My first three dates in Vegas are September 1st, Labor Day

weekend, and then November 2nd and November 30th. I'm coming to Brooklyn, New York at the King's Theater on November 8th. And I have tickets on sale throughout the end of the year in December. So if you're in a city like Philadelphia or Bethlehem or San Diego or New Orleans or Omaha, check ChelseaHandler.com for tickets. Okay. If you'd like advice from Chelsea, shoot us an email at DearChelseaPodcast at gmail.com and be sure to include your phone number. Dear Chelsea is edited and engineered by Brad Dickert, executive producer Catherine Law. And be sure to check out our merch at ChelseaHandler.com. The Survivor Files with Elizabeth Smart on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

On the new podcast, Solita, we share the messy reality of traveling alone as a woman. I can wait four hours for the next bus or this random dude is offering me a ride on his motorcycle. I chose option B. I'm Julie Pinheiro and I travel by myself because it's a rare space where I can say yes without asking anyone else first. I'm on a mission to reclaim the word solita, trading the pity for possibility. Listen to Solita on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. between books, the internet, and pop culture with your favorite writers, book talk creators,

and plenty of overthought opinions. Yeah, I'm obsessed. I'm obsessed. Listen to Pro Society on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an iHeart Podcast. Guaranteed human.