Life Will Be the Death of Me with Chelsea Handler - Never Laugh at an Exorcism with Joel Kim Booster

Episode Date: July 20, 2023

Joel Kim Booster joins Chelsea in-studio to discuss his recent diagnosis of Bipolar disorder, the family who saved him as a teen, and why a good friend is there for your wedding day and your divorce.�� Then: A writer struggles to get anything done - despite working 3 jobs.  A longsuffering wife is desperate for her husband to ditch the stubble.  And a bridesmaid is torn between a funeral and her best friend’s wedding.   * Follow Joel Kim Booster on Instagram or Twitter! * Need some advice from Chelsea? Email us at [e-mail] * Executive Producer Catherine Law Edited & Engineered by Brad Dickert * * * * * The views and opinions expressed are solely those of the Podcast author, or individuals participating in the Podcast, and do not represent the opinions of iHeartMedia or its employees.  This Podcast should not be used as medical advice, mental health advice, mental health counseling or therapy, or as imparting any health care recommendations at all.  Individuals are advised to seek independent medical, counseling advice and/or therapy from a competent health care professional with respect to any medical condition, mental health issues, health inquiry or matter, including matters discussed on this Podcast. Guests and listeners should not rely on matters discussed in the Podcast and shall not act or shall refrain from acting based on information contained in the Podcast without first seeking independent medical advice.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Listen to The Survivor Files with Elizabeth Smart on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Did you hear the new episode of the Hey Jonas podcast? We are at D23, so we'll see who stops by. The cast of Frozen stopped by. Kristen Bell, Josh Gad, and Idina Menzel. I auditioned for Frozen. What? For Kristoff.

They said, okay, what are you going to be singing today? I said, I don't know. That must have been why you didn't get it. Oh, you probably won. Plus, John Stamos, Hayden Christensen from Star Wars, and more. And I guess I can share that, uh... No way. Listen to the latest episode of Hey Jonas on the iHeartRadio app,

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Listen to Pro Society on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi. Oh, hi, Chelsea. Hi, how's it going, Katherine? Oh, it's great. It's finally sunny here in Los Angeles. I'm so sick of people complaining about living in Los Angeles. I mean, what the fuck? You got a couple.

There's been a month of bad weather and people are ready to move. Oh, my gosh. I told Brad, I'm like, I think it's time. We got to make a run for, I don't know, BVI or something. Oh, yeah. Somewhere tropical. That would be a real hot existence. And they'll be underwater soon, so probably don't head down there.

Good point. Okay, guys. We have added more shows to my Little Big Bitch tour because I'm coming all over. We had a second show at the Pantages in Los Angeles. So that's October 12th and Friday the 13th, which is my favorite day of the year. We added a second show in Boston at the Wang Center. September 29th and 30th is two shows in New York. I also have a show in East Hampton, New York, August 26th.

We added a second show in Portland. So Thursday, November 2nd, Friday, November 3rd in Portland. November 4th and 5th in San Francisco, two shows there. We added a second show in Seattle, November 10th and 11th. Two shows, Boston, are November 16th and 17th at the Bach Center at Wang Theater. And I'm also coming to Toronto and Montreal and Ottawa and so many other cities. Columbus, Cincinnati, Detroit, Louisville. So I will see everybody at all of these shows.

Thank you. Get your tickets at ChelseaHandler.com. Chelsea, I have a question for you. Yes. Is there anything in a romantic relationship that's not actually bad, but would be a deal breaker for you? For example, I don't think I could date a guy that was like really into sports. Like there's nothing wrong with that, but I just, it would be a deal breaker for me. A deal breaker? Yeah. I don't know about sports. I've never really dated anyone that's that into sports because I don't think I'd be attracted to someone like that. But it wouldn't be a deal breaker.

Yeah. Like if they were watching Sunday football, that would be a turn off. I know. You know, like, if they had to watch football every Sunday. Mm-hmm. I don't know. I think it's just, like, how you spend your time. Like, when Brad and I first started dating, he was doing a lot of jazz music and playing out every night.

And, like, I was like, I'm not particularly into jazz, but this is fun. It's a cool thing to do. Like, I couldn't have been in this relationship if it was, like, go to a game with me. Yeah. I mean, of course. It's what you're into, right? I would be into watching jazz, too, in the beginning. Yeah.

I'm into anything for a short period of time. But it kind of takes away. If somebody watches football every Sunday, it kind of takes away the option of, like, being together unless you're going to go and watch. And I'm not doing that. Right. I'm not going to spend my Sunday watching football. No. Especially if it involves, like, multiple men and beer on sofas.

Like, no, no. Anyone who takes sports so seriously, it's hard for me to take seriously. Yeah. I get it. But, like, it's not, like, when people are just so invested. It's just, like, are you on the fucking team? Like, relax. And then they have their fantasy teams.

They have, like, fake football. Yeah. I used to play that on Chelsea Lately. they made me join a fantasy football league just because I was so clueless about sports. I think I won the whole thing like two years in a row with no way, nothing, just on good luck. Yeah. Beginner's luck. Yeah. Any other sort of like, well, this isn't something that's wrong with this person, but I just couldn't date someone who. I mean, clothing. I, there's so much clothing that I can't get past and a toe toe action and also food. Like if you can't eat with your mouth

closed, I find that to be pretty gross. Yeah. Clumsiness. I don't, that turns me off when guys are really clumsy. I once went on a date with a guy to this restaurant in Santa Monica and he spilled chips and guacamole all over me, like within the first 10 minutes of me being there. And I just was like, you're such an idiot. Like, why would you, if you did that, you're not together. Like you're a mess. Literally and figuratively. Yeah. I was just like, what? I mean, it was just so clumsy. Do you believe like when you get the ick, you can't come back from it? But like, oh, this person gave me cringy feelings. It depends how ick it is, you know.

But I have a lot of... Icks. Yeah. Fingernails. If there's any length on a fingernail, man, I can't take that. That's a no. I don't like anything. God forbid toenails have length on them.

That's also like you have to get your foot amputated. Something tells me our guest today has nicely pedicured feet. Our guest today is a GLAAD award-winning writer, producer, and star. Yes, and he's a hysterical stand-up. You can find him at IHateJoelKim on Instagram and Twitter. Please welcome actor, comedian, Joel Kim Booster. Hello. I'm so excited to be here.

And now finally every single white gay in my life can stop telling me, you should go on the Chelsea Handler podcast. You should really go on the Chelsea Handler, as though it's been my choice all along. I know. That's like when somebody's like, why don't you go on the Oprah Winfrey show? hold on hold on i'm not comparing myself to oprah winfrey but i am yeah you're like uh that sounds like a good idea why don't you go do snl yeah exactly great idea joel kim yes booster thank you for the full name yes well i mean you know who knows what you're into i just want to get it

fucking right right let's talk about your life and your career because everything's taken off for you and it's it's very nice to watch yeah it is always funny when people say that because it Your conception of what success looks like changes every single time you hit a new sort of echelon of success. And suddenly now I feel like I'm a nobody and I'm nothing. And even though if you told me 10 years ago what I'd be doing now, if you told me 10 years ago that I'd be sitting across from you specifically, I would be like, shut the fuck up. That's never going to happen. I'm going to be working at this olive garden for the rest of my life. So it is funny to hear that.

But it's nice to hear, too. It's like the opposite of manifestation. You're like, I'll never amount to anything. Because I honestly think both things work for certain people. Like some people never think that they're going to do anything. And they're like, oh, when I hear certain celebrities or musicians talking about how they would have never believed where they are. It's like I have the whole opposite mentality. Like I always believe like everybody should be talking to me and listening to me.

Like I have strong opinions. I'm definitely the opposite. I have a nice mix of imposter syndrome with resentment, which is I never believe that I deserve anything that I have. But I definitely don't think that a lot of people who are as successful or more successful than me deserve what they have. And that's sort of what keeps me going every day is because I see people and I'm like, well, I could be doing that. And then I get there and I'm like, oh, God, can I be doing this? So it's a nice mix. That's good.

That's good. Healthy mix. And I read that if you're comfortable talking about your bipolar disorder, I read that you've been diagnosed with bipolar. What happened? Yeah, I finally got diagnosed like a year before the pandemic happened, which what amazing time. By the way, no shit. Just to like sit at home and figure out what the right cocktail of drugs is was a real nice wrinkle for my lockdown experience. But yeah, I mean, the thing is, is I have always been sort of my moods have been wild since I was growing up. And my parents were very, very Christian, very, very evangelical, and did not believe in any sort of actual, real, hard scientific psychology therapy, anything like that.

They sent me to Christian therapists who would pray over me and try and make me better. And that never worked. But I got to tell you, Abilify works wonders. Jesus, not so much. Abilify and Wellbutrin have kept me in check for a little while. but it is difficult because I don't know if you feel this way. Sometimes a little crazy like helps me. My biggest worry since being diagnosed is that like I'm killing a part of myself that I really relied on to make myself funny to write to like find interesting you know things about

myself because like I definitely do not like being depressed but being manic being manic can be kind of fun sometimes until it's not until it's until yeah very productive because you can be really sexual right you can be really happy about like shopping like over shopping like yeah yeah yeah you feel like on top of the world that's in fact my manic periods were some of the only times i didn't have imposter syndrome about like what i was doing or what i was having and and so it is that is it's a difficult thing to let go of because ultimately it is very destructive you know like i don't need to be having sex with four or five guys in a day just because and i don't need to be abusing drugs to the level that I would when I was manic I still abuse drugs but just you know

at a reasonable level yeah but yeah there was a lot of self-destructive stuff that came hand in hand with that would I write a script in like 12 hours yeah you know like did I write a lot manic absolutely and did it turn out okay sure but like those first drafts were a little rough I'll tell you that but yeah it's it's one of those balancing acts I think is like a person in entertainment and an artist whatever the lie that the disease tells you is that you need me in order to do what you do and what you love and that is I have found not to be the case because I have been medicated now for going on four years and off and on there's been there have been times when I've gone rogue and it has not turned out super well but for the most part I think like I am still funny I am still

myself. I am just a slightly more chilled, calibrated, calibrated. Yes, exactly. So when you were growing up, how does bipolar disorder present itself in a person? Is it something that you're born with or is it something that is triggered by an event? You know what? It's probably a little bit of column A, a little bit of column B. I think like for me, it definitely manifested really young. Like I was really hyper emotional and hyper reactive to things since I can remember like I was just throwing tantrums way longer into my life than was appropriate probably like in public on the floor screaming crying kicking you know the whole nine yards because I just did not know how to process any of my emotions and I didn't and my parents were not

giving me the tools necessary to process any of this and I wonder often like how my life would have turned out differently if they had maybe you know found supported me in a more scientifically based way earlier on but like I remember this one time I was being such a jackass and like throwing things in my room slamming the door so angry that my dad tried to exercise me in the middle of the fight I was 13 years old and he literally started saying like exorcism bullshit to try and get the devil out of me and in that moment I realized what he was doing and I started to laugh in his face which in hindsight is something a demon would do in that situation is start laughing maniacally at your poor father who's trying to exercise you so it didn't help

matters okay so then what led to you getting an official diagnosis in 2019 or 2019 yeah it was 2019 and it was getting to the breaking point I was destroying relationships I think that was like the big thing I think it was getting harder and harder because like listen when you're manic and you're like the life of the party it's really easy to make friends and it's really easy to get people to like you and then if they hang on and they stick around long enough those episodes become really destructive and really toxic. And I became a really tough, I would eventually become a really toxic person. I, I remember this is something I haven't shared very much at all, but like I went off my meds to film my movie because I was convinced that I would not be able to write or

punch up the script or act if I was on my meds. And I remember the near the end of the filming process and thank god they all love me so much I really tried to burn down every bridge I had with every single cast member on that shoot and like we're they're some of my best friends but I remember looking at Bo and Yang and saying you're only friends with me because you wanted to be in this movie and I said that in the height of a manic episode that was so insane and he had so much grace for me in that moment and it just said like that is not true you know that's not true I'm going to leave now and we'll talk about this at another time and luckily like it was so like it was so intense and so heartbreaking in that moment that it was a real like wake-up call for

me where I was like this is not who I am right you know and there were little moments throughout the filming process like that and everyone had so much grace for me and and was so kind and I eventually you know made the decision to go back and it's a difficult thing to wean on and off constantly it's not healthy but that's the tricky thing right with bipolar disorder is a lot of people feel that way that they can get on and off their meds at their discretion which kind of is not the case not the case no and what is the flip side of the bipolar so the mania and then you have the depression yeah the depression honestly it doesn't manifest for me a ton i'm not a super depressed person i will say like those episodes last for shorter periods of time than than the

the mania does and they're less noticeable i think because i'm able to push through them a little bit easier without anyone noticing I will say like when I'm depressed I'm just quiet and I like fade into the background and I think like that's how people especially like my boyfriend will know that I'm in a depressive episode because I'm just like at a party standing in a corner on my phone not engaging with anybody which is like pretty normal behavior for a lot of people actually I just become more of an introvert but like yeah they're just they're they're not as intense the The mania was the life ruining stuff that was going to end up with me in a facility eventually, you know, and that's the scariest part about being bipolar is that like untreated and it can turn into worse and worse things if you don't sort of manage it early on. That's my big worry is I don't want to it to turn into from mania into psychosis, you know, which is like that specter hangs over me and specifically my relationship a lot because I look at my boyfriend sometimes when I'm in the depths of something and I'm always like this could get worse.

You know that, right? Like you're signing on for something that could eventually get much worse if I if if things don't go my way. And that is like that's a really it's a really shitty thing to lay on your partner in the middle of a fight usually. But he seems game for it so far. Yeah. Pretty game for it. What about your parents and your Christian parents? How did they handle your gayness? Not well, Chelsea. Not well. They were not super keen on it. They also found out in the most invasive, aggressive way possible. They read my journal when I was a senior in high school. I had been out at school for a year.

They read my journal and a year's worth of journal entries, which were literal listicles at this point, not even like introspective observations about my life. It was literally guys dicks I've sucked this week and then just like a straight up list. And then so they didn't even have to sift through like my dreams or anything like that. They just got straight to the meat of it. Like, this is what I'm doing. I literally had entries that were like lies. I told my parents this week, just itemize the bullshit for them. That's pretty funny.

I know I was a fucking idiot. So they confronted me about this. Well, maybe you were in a manic episode when you were journaling because it sounds like it. Quite honestly. And I had a manic breakdown when they confronted me about it in a really big way because it was a seismic paradigm shift for me. I, at this point in my life, had planned on never coming out to my parents, never telling them, living like a completely separate life. I thought that was possible. And in a moment, they completely shifted everything and sort of took that control out of my mind.

And I broke down. It was bad. And so they sent me to an inpatient mental hospital for teens with the caveat they tested me three times for HIV. they were they were like nope test him again because they were so convinced that because of all the dick sucking I was doing I had AIDS and they left me there for a week and for the whole week there the people were like this doesn't seem like the right facility for you because this was like a place where like kids who are addicted to heroin or who had straight up tried to murder their parents went and they were like this is a little outsized for you obviously have issues

that you need to work out and like this is a serious issue with your parents but like this is not the place for you but they event they left me there for a week eventually my insurance wouldn't cover it anymore my parents insurance wouldn't cover it anymore so they're like you got to come and get your kid they brought me home I stayed for about like three days at home and then got up and left and started couch hopping and I eventually ended up living with there's a girl in my who I stood next to inquire we were not friends she was very popular in a different way than i was because i was also very popular okay okay calm down calm down but she was a jock and her dad was the methodist pastor in our town and she um everybody knew i was missing for that

week because i was the voice of the announcements and when the voice of the announcements goes missing you know people start talking you know people people would have started a podcast if it was that time about where am i where i was and so she was like hey if you ever need a place to stay you can come stay with me she was just being nice whatever whatever and then i like it was getting colder I showed up at her house and I was like hey remember when you said that shit about me staying here and she was like oh yeah and her parents were like you can't just invite strange boys to stay at our house you know her dad's a paraplegic they she had two younger brothers but I stayed that night talked to her mom like all in through the night and then the next day they

were like come back for dinner and long story short I stayed with them for the rest of my senior year they co-signed my student loans to go to college they bought me a car for graduation she is still to this day my best friend I was like her best man in her wedding I flew back to see her when she got a divorce you know like I and I will say like as a follow-up my parents and I are good my mom and I are good at this point my dad did pass away during COVID and that was really hard but it was honestly the silver lining of my dad's passing is like I had never been in a relationship in my entire life and we so my entire life my the homosexuality part of my life was sort of a don't ask don't tell situation with my parents like they were very uncurious about who

I was dating if I was dating anything like that as long as we didn't have to talk about that then it was it was cool and then my dad died and I was like well shit like I would have liked to have known how he would have reacted if I brought someone home and so I finally talked to my mom And I was like, hey, I just need to know, like, if I fell in love today and wanted to bring someone home to meet you, like, what would you do? I just need to know this. And she was like, you know, we're not on the same page as you are on that part of your life. But if you found someone you loved and who loved you back, I would love them as much as I love your brother-in-law. And your dad would felt the same way.

And then coincidentally, two months later, I met my partner now and I brought him home to meet her. She was lovely. He was a hit. But it's still not perfect because they're like, you know, Fox News Trumpy family to the nines. But things are better. And she asks about him now. And that for me coming from like where we came from, where it all started with the journal and the breakdown and the hospital and all of this bullshit to now where she's like welcoming my boyfriend into her home with open arms. It's really like it's a nice sort of closing of the loop for me.

It's also a beautiful example of your girlfriend's parents, like the idea of acceptance versus denialism, you know, of your own children, what you can foster when you accept someone's choices, just because they're different from your own. Is it a reason to exclude someone? It's a reason to say, oh, you know, and obviously with people with Christian backgrounds, religious upbringing, obviously, that's an indoctrination of another kind. But what a beautiful story to know about that that family that took you in and gave you a home when your only own family couldn't provide that acceptance. Well, and one of the ironic things about that story is her dad was the Methodist pastor in town, very progressive pastor, though, and like very much like and I remember this is how fucked up I was when I was leaving my parents house. And for that full year I was out, I was like, well, I was so indoctrinated into evangelicalism that I was like, I'm going to hell. Eventually I will go to hell. But I can't deny this about myself. So I might as well have some fun, suck some dick now, and eventually I'll go to hell. And her dad eventually caught wind and like figured out that that was what my thinking was. And he straight up, I remember, I will always remember this conversation because it changed my life. He was like, that's not the case. Hell isn't real. And if it were, God would not send gay people there. And hearing that from a man of the cloth, you know, like an actual pastor, changed my life and changed my outlook on the rest of my life. Because suddenly it was like freeing to hear that from somebody in authority.

So it was really life changing. And it's why I have like, as a card carrying liberal gay person, you know, obviously religion is a touchy subject for me. But I do believe that there are people out there who are doing good in God's name. not necessarily all of them certainly not the majority of them but there are people out there who are trying to change the conversation and my friend actually became a pastor just like her dad and she just held a drag show at the church is mostly focused on getting homeless people off the street she does not give a shit about like any of like who what you smoke or what you drink or who you fuck or any of those things like her ministry is very much based on like making sure

people have community and are feel supported you know in all the the real ways that you need to be supported in order to live a full life in this world so yeah that's sort of where i'm at because if those people hadn't taken you in like who knows what would have happened especially with your bipolar like who knows what could have happened like anyone who's listening like when you see somebody who needs help and you can give them that help like provide them you can open up your home to them or help them financially or whatever like you can change someone's like the course of someone's life and imagine that feeling not even just for the person you're helping for your own you know yeah like it just feels so wonderful those people must feel so good and i mean and

and their real children must feel so proud of that you know and they're going to be able to suck it forward since we're talking about so much dick sucking i thought i would throw in another sucking okay well this is an advice podcast joel right are you fucking ready i'm fucking ready okay estamos listos we'll be right back There's no shortcut for saving time, but saving money is simple. Just combine your car and home insurance with Bel Air Direct and save. Get a quote at BelAirDirect.com. When I was 14 years old, I was kidnapped and held captive for nine months.

I survived, and I've spent my life exploring how other people survive what should have destroyed them. I'm Elizabeth Smart, and these are the Survivor Files. I just remember this low, taunting voice next to my ear saying, shut up, don't say anything. Every week, I'm with survivors who live through the unthinkable. I knew if he woke up, without a doubt, he was going to hurt me. I started feeling that there was someone at the end of my bed, and I just started screaming. They are abducted, stalked, controlled, and nearly silenced. but these aren't stories about what's taken from them.

They're stories about what it takes to make it out alive. Listen to The Survivor Files with Elizabeth Smart on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. If your bookshelf and your For You page are equally important to your personality, welcome home. This is Prose Society,

the weekly podcast that's part book club, part group chat for thought daughters, pop culture obsessives, and anyone who thinks Pride and Prejudice and Love Island deserve the same level of discourse. I'm Eli Rallo, and every week we're connecting the dots between books, the internet, and the conversations everyone can't stop having. I'm going to have to look up this story. I'm obsessed. I'm obsessed. From best-selling authors and your favorite book talk creators to the latest pop culture moments,

nothing is off the table. It's like if you can hide some real messages inside compelling characters, then that is a Trojan horse. Whether you're looking for literary deep dives, smart pop culture conversations, or a community of readers who love to think a little too much, you're in the right place. Listen to Pro Society on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. See you between the pages. On the new podcast, Solita, we share the messy reality of traveling alone as a woman. I can wait four hours for the next bus or this random dude is offering me a ride on his motorcycle.

I chose option B. I'm Julie Pinheiro, and I travel by myself because it's a rare space where I can say yes without asking anyone else first. I'm on a mission to reclaim the word solita, trading the pity for possibility. Every time I tried to be alone, I kept meeting people, and they were like, you smiled at us. Not a lot of people smile around here. It's when you're alone that you're most receptive to the world as it is and not the lies you're sold about it. It can be a time where you push your limits, change your mind, or wake up to a new version of yourself. So whether you're a solo travel veteran or you're too nervous to book your first trip,

I hope you listen to Solita on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. We're back. We're back. Our first question comes from Alyssa. Milano? It is. It is, in fact. I told her to stop calling into this show.

It's enough already. She says, dear Chelsea, I'm a queer 36-year-old woman, and I'm in my first same-sex relationship. It's still a bit new, but honestly, I feel head over heels in love. My question is about telling my own mother about this relationship. I have been able to be open and honest and have come out to my close friends and sisters. I've just been learning how to set small boundaries with my mother, and it's been hard. We essentially don't really talk anymore. The next time I see her, we'll be on a week-long family vacation in a few months.

Would it be okay to send a text message to my own mother telling her I'm actually bisexual and have a serious girlfriend? Or should I wait until we're together? Alyssa. Yeah, I kind of wonder. I would like to know a little bit more context for, like, where the mom is at with these things. Because you do have – you generally know how your parents feel about gay people these days because we're everywhere. We're on the TV. We're in Target.

We're everywhere. Yeah, but if we don't say gay, everyone will stop being gay. But without that knowledge, I think the responsible thing to do for both her and the mom is to text before the vacation. Because if things blow up because of the text message, you ain't going on that vacation. Yeah, vacation's bad. Yeah. Yeah. What's the dynamic between the mom and her?

She just said there's been some boundaries and they're not really talking. Okay. Yeah. You're about to go on a fucking vacation together? Yeah. Well, family vacations are always such a hot mess. You know, three days in, they're fine. And then the last four days, you're like, what the fuck are we still doing here?

You know, everyone gets so annoyed with their families. But I agree. You have to tell her beforehand, just out of respect, because you don't want to put yourself in that situation. Yeah. You know, like, go showing up at a vacation that you might have to leave prematurely early. And, yeah, and saying you're bisexual and that you're in love with someone, like, it's not like you're telling her you're bisexual and that's it. Like, you're telling her for a reason because there's someone in your life that you love and respect and is hopefully going to be loved and respected by your family as well. So, yes, I would definitely let her know or call her.

Yeah, that would be nice. I think ultimately, if you go on this vacation and you reveal this information, I mean, you are following in a long line of bisexuals who love attention, but you will make this vacation all about you. Like that suddenly the vacation is no longer about the vacation. It is about this revelation that you have revealed to your mother and the group. So I think, like, priming her beforehand so that she has time to get over it, too, if there is a problem or she's, you know, got a time to process it before the vacation is, I think, the respectful thing to do for your entire fam. Or another creative way to do it is just to get some video of you going down on your girlfriend and just sending that to your mom. Yeah, leak your sex tape, babe. So good luck.

Let us know what happens. Thanks, Alyssa. Well, our first caller is Mia, and her job is she is a freelance dancer. And she'll give a little more context for this when she pops on the phone as well. My childhood best friend just shat on me and our entire friendship and says she doesn't want to work on our relationship. But she's getting married in a few months, and I'm supposed to be her maid of honor. She still wants me at the wedding and the bachelorette, read, to plan both of these things. But I feel there's no way I can go, given the unforgivable things she's said to me.

I'm worried if I don't go, it'll seem really dramatic and self-centered, which would only confirm her assessment that I'm the most self-involved person she's ever met. Do I fake it for her sake or do I protect my own feelings and wallet and tell her I won't be attending? Mia. Hi, Mia. Hi, Mia. Hi, how are you?

I'm good. How are you? Good. We're wonderful. I have to say for the listeners at home, Mia is gorgeous. All of our callers are good looking. Important context to have, for sure. They always are.

Yes. And Mia, you told me a little bit more about the falling out that you had centered around a mutual friend's wedding. So let us know what happened. So my grandmother, who I was very close with, died a few weeks ago. And her funeral happened to be on the same day as a friend's wedding that I was in. I was a bridesmaid. As soon as I knew, I told this friend.

She understood, obviously, that I wouldn't be there until the ceremony. And I would try my best to make it to the ceremony. and she had a plan B in case I didn't make it because I didn't want to leave my grandma's funeral early. And then my childhood friend who was also attending this wedding came with me to the funeral, which was very nice. And then we went to the wedding together and we made it eight minutes before the wedding started. And I ran in, told the bride that I was ready to go, but I completely understand if you don't want me to mess up your plan B, I can sit in the back, I can stand whatever you need. And she wanted me to walk. So we made it work. Went back to the

original plan. Ceremony happened. It was great. And then afterwards, my best friend who had come to the funeral with me said, you better not pull that shit at my wedding. I won't be as nice. And then proceeded to talk a lot of shit about me to my friends at the wedding about how selfish I am and how annoying it was that we got there so last minute. And so then I reached out to her a week later to talk and have a sober conversation and I was expecting it to be very non-confrontational which she usually is and kind of just brush over but she just went at me and said I'm the most self-absorbed person she knows and that I should have waited outside of the wedding until it was over and I made it all about me and then went on to say that I'm super judgmental

and critical of her, of her life choices. And she feels anxious every time she's around me and I'm needy and I need to let go of how our friendship was in middle school and just dig after dig. And I know I can't prove to you guys that I'm not these things, but I think I have a pretty good- You seem pretty chill. So yeah, it was just super hurtful. We talked for a long time and I was on the verge of tears. and then at the end I was like all right well it seems like we have both have resentments towards each other that we can work on I'm so sorry that for my part whatever and she was like what are you talking about I don't have any resentments I'm fine I don't hold grudges still wants me to

be her maid of honor at the wedding still wants me to plan her bachelorette but to me like she just broke my heart and just like completely dismissed our entire friendship so I'm wondering if I should go to this wedding. I'm very close with her whole family. My family is going to the wedding. We just got the invite a few days ago. Like it's still very much expected that I go, but I also feel very hurt.

And, you know, there is a level of like, do you go to the wedding or are you the maid of honor? I mean, that is a whole other level of commitment and spending hours and hours planning a party and bachelorettes and cost and all kinds of things. Have you straight up asked this woman if all of these things are true why do you want me in the wedding i haven't i haven't spoken to her since this conversation which was like two weeks ago now was the conversation in person or

on the phone it was in person and we ended it with her being like i'm fine i'm ready to move on and me being like i need a second and so i think the ball's sort of in my court to reach out which i haven't done i think this needs another conversation for sure before you make a call either way i think like it's i i'm having trouble understanding where she's coming from if she just needed to unload on you and then expect it to be done or if there are still like she still needs to work something out before having you because my instinct is to say no like fuck this chick but right i do think you because of history owe her at least one other conversation where you express to her i don't feel comfortable doing this because of the things that you said and if

this is how you feel about me then why would you want me to be your maid of honor right yeah that's how i feel too have you discussed this with your family at all that's going to the wedding yeah and they they think i should go and just fake it and my brother says it would be our friendship funeral so sort of like there might not be a future after this but just go and and not give her a reason to say like see she's making it all about her again it's a trap it's such a fucking trap she's trapped you i yeah i also did you bring up during this conversation i was coming from my fucking grandparents funeral yeah she was there i was like i'll try not to have somebody else i love a lot die right before your wedding and she was like i'm not saying don't have them die i'm just

saying don't come to the ceremony then but it's not like you walked up in the middle of their vows you know but wait she didn't come to the funeral with you she just came to the wedding with you right oh she went to the funeral with you too yeah she saw firsthand like how tragic it was listen it doesn't even matter if any of the things she said about you are true you don't even you don't deliver information like that to somebody that you care about and love she's obviously stressed out about her own fucking wedding or her own life or whatever the fuck's going on but i absolutely you cannot put yourself in a position to be abused like that again And you can't throw her a bachelorette party after she spoke to you like that.

It's one thing to show up for her wedding. It's another thing to participate in that wedding and be in the wedding party and be a part of her bachelorette. You absolutely need to have a conversation with her. And I think you can either start it with an email that lays out your feelings in a very calm and graceful way. Like, these are all the things that you said to me. And it's been really hard for me to even think about all of this stuff. And it's been so hurtful for me that I have to talk to you again about this, because if this is really how you feel about me and you don't want to discuss it any further, I don't understand why you would want me to be a part of your wedding. Right.

Out of respect for our relationship, I deserve you to have and be able to have another conversation instead of saying, I can't. It's all for her to vilify you going to your grandparents funeral before a wedding and then making the effort to show up to that wedding is anything but dramatic. Right. Yeah, it's not like you did this in front of like, you didn't interrupt the ceremony. It's not like you ran in while they were doing their vows or pushed some other girl out of the way for your place in the receiving line. Like, it's giving sociopath behavior. I don't like it. It kind of is. Are you like you're sitting there during the whole wedding crying about your grandparent dying? Like, what is she talking about? I don't understand. I don't either. It's really shocked me. Has she ever exhibited behavior like this to you before?

no I mean I will say we have been distant in the past few years and we still you know had a great relationship but it was not as close emotionally and so I knew something was up and I tried to sort of like sometimes bring it up in a gentle way but it was she didn't want to talk about it and she didn't want to like talk about feelings and so I kind of was just like all right I'm just going to leave it until after the wedding maybe she's stressed about that I don't want to add to her stress i didn't want to make it about me shocker how much time before the wedding it's in september so several months she's got time she's got time to figure it out i've got like two months until the bachelorette that's plenty of time yeah i think you're a dave and busters

okay that's that's what she gets if you tell her if you want me to be your maid of honor this is what you're getting okay based commiserate with the way you've treated me your bachelorette is that dave and busters bitch and i think to further let her off the hook she did mention there is a co maid of honor oh my god so like i feel like you're fully off the hook yeah yeah i think you just you couch the conversation and like i don't feel comfortable being in this position in your wedding i'm happy to want to stand up for you be in the wedding come to the wedding but like you obviously you don't want me to be your maid of honor anymore yeah it doesn't sound like you like me that's what i said yeah it's a huge prereq for the job i thought yeah yeah so mean spirited i

mean to go off on somebody i just can't i can't get past the fact that you were coming from a funeral like what friend would be bad mouthing you to your other friends and how did you find that out because your other friends told you yeah oh geez and they defended me while she was doing that oh they did yeah yeah love that yeah that's a nice good thing to add in the letter too your friend is a mess as you've told me and as i've heard from others you were very you know and as you said to me thank you for telling me to my face because i know now how you feel and yeah no i don't i'm all for saying fuck off she owes you an apology like a major apology and yeah yeah so annoying i hate when friends are like play her this podcast when when it comes out and so she

You can hear me say definitively, you are a mess. Yeah. Yeah. That's worse than bridezilla behavior. That's something else. It's funny that you say that your friends told you because I was having a conversation with someone the other night and he's like, this is just between you and me. I go, can we all stop saying that?

Like, obviously, but also as an adult, you think I'm going to go to our mutual friend and say that you don't like her, that you hate her. But then that's exactly what happened. But at a certain age, you just stop repeating what everybody else is saying, even if it's about mutual what's the currency there she doesn't like you like we're not in high school anymore we're adults at least i mean i'm 48 you're young so but i mean in this situation again i i actually like your friends for telling you that because yeah yeah she is a bitch i need to hear that she needs to know that no everyone she's talking to is talking about her i think are you are you gen z

are you a millennial i'm a millennial you are yeah it's because we can't buy houses we're all stunted you know we don't have money so we have gossip yeah that's your only currency it's our only currency is information yeah drugs pills and information that's all you can do just fill yourself up with all three things novel yeah i would definitely send her send her an email like a preliminary email laying it all out in a very calm nice way like you've demonstrated this entire conversation to counter the behavior that she's demonstrating and see where that gets you and be prepared to just be like i'm not doing it i'm not gonna go and be you like it's so abusive for somebody to tear you down like that all right mia would you do us a favor and send us the letter

that you write to her i'd be happy to look over it before you send it if you want help yeah absolutely great idea awesome thanks mia let us know how it goes we are waiting and you're real cute mia yeah oh yes don't forget that i'm definitely instinctually on your side because i know what you look like and you're pretty um i feel like joel kim is attracted to you maybe a little bit hey it's coming i'm getting older though i'm getting older it can be reversed don't forget i did once finger a woman in a bar when i was on my 21st birthday immediately started to cry afterwards um she did or you did i did there's nothing gayer than fingering a woman and then crying afterwards.

Did you cry in front of her? She had to console me. We were sitting on the curb outside the bar afterwards and she had to console me. Oh, dear. Drive me home. Oh, man. What about her made you cry, fingering her made you cry,

the inside of the vagina? I was like near blackout drunk and I was like, what does this mean? Does this mean I'm not gay anymore? And she was like, yes, sweetie, you're definitely gay. I'm just thinking about getting fingered by a gay man. How disappointing that would be. All right.

Thank you, honey. Thanks for calling in. Thank you so much. Okay. Good luck with everything. Keep us posted. I want to hear what happens. All right.

Bye. Did you ever, you never had sex with a woman? No, no. Gold star. Did you make out with this woman that you were fingering? Yeah, yeah. Because I like the idea of just fingering without a kiss. No, yeah.

Going straight in there. That's like whoopsie doodle. Just slipped in. I don't think that's ever happened to me. Oh, yes, it has. there's no shortcut for saving time but saving money is simple just combine your car and home insurance with bel-air direct and save get a quote at bel-air direct.com when i was 14 years old i was kidnapped and held captive for nine months

i survived and i've spent my life exploring how other people survive what should have destroyed them i'm elizabeth smart and these are the survivor files i just remember this low taunting voice next to my ear saying shut up don't say anything every week i'm with survivors who live through the unthinkable i knew if he woke up without a doubt he was going to hurt me i started feeling that there was someone at the end of my bed and I just started screaming. They are abducted, stalked, controlled, and nearly silenced. But these aren't stories about what's taken from them. They're stories about what it takes to make it out alive. Listen to The Survivor Files with Elizabeth Smart on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

If your bookshelf and your For You page are equally important to your personality, welcome home. This is Prose Society, the weekly podcast that's part book club, part group chat for thought daughters, pop culture obsessives, and anyone who thinks Pride and Prejudice and Love Island deserve the same level of discourse. I'm Eli Rallo, and every week we're connecting the dots between books, the internet, and the conversations everyone can't stop having. I'm going to have to look up this story. I'm obsessed. I'm obsessed. From best-selling authors and your favorite book talk creators to the latest pop culture moments, nothing is off the table. It's like if you can hide some real messages inside compelling characters, then that is a Trojan horse.

Whether you're looking for literary deep dives, smart pop culture conversations, or a community of readers who love to think a little too much, you're in the right place. Listen to Pro Society on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. See you between the pages. On the new podcast, Solita, we share the messy reality of traveling alone as a woman. I can wait four hours for the next bus or this random dude is offering me a ride on his motorcycle. I chose option B. I'm Julie Pinheiro and I travel by myself because it's a rare space where I can say yes without asking anyone else first. I'm on a mission to reclaim the word solita, trading the pity for possibility.

Every time I tried to be alone, I kept meeting people and they were like, you smiled at us. Not a lot of people smile around here. It's when you're alone that you're most receptive to the world as it is and not the lies you're sold about it. It can be a time where you push your limits, change your mind, or wake up to a new version of yourself. So whether you're a solo travel veteran or you're too nervous to book your first trip, I hope you listen to Solita on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Well, our next caller is Emily. This is a slightly more sober question, but not too serious.

We'll figure out a way to take the piss out of it. Dear Chelsea, I want your advice on how you remain productive and motivated whilst managing so many different projects in your life and career. I recently had a really hard time with being really tired at the end of my work days and therefore drained of energy to keep up with the thing I enjoy doing outside of my job, which is writing. I've been chipping away at a novel series, contributing to an online feminist magazine, and expanding an essay I wrote into a book. I recently started thinking that I may want to publish these in the future, but here's the problem. When my work day ends, I have absolutely no motivation to sit down and write like I used to. I work in a high-stress, demanding 9-to-5 where I'm constantly interacting with people for the entire eight hours I work for the federal government. I spend all day writing little notes to myself for my nonfiction book, I've begun, and thinking about plot lines for my novels.

I tell myself when I'm done with my actual job, I'll get down to business with my writing. But by the time 5 p.m. rolls around, I'm so exhausted and tired of typing, talking, thinking of words, and looking at screens that I just lie in bed like a potato on my phone. On top of this 9-to-5, I also work a part-time job, which I enjoy. Yeah, seriously. No wonder you're fucking tired. Just as something to get me out of the house and see my friends. She's 26, by the way. Okay.

Yeah, that's nice. So she's got the energy. As someone who somehow – She doesn't have the energy, though. As someone who somehow miraculously finds time to write books and pieces while actively engaging with your career, what's your advice for someone who just feels perpetually tired and whose brain feels like mush after eight hours of work? P.S. As a history major, I absolutely eat up your book recommendations with a spoon. I just finished Cuba and American History, and I've preordered On Our Best Behavior.

And as a Canadian, I love how much you love us. Emily. Hi, Emily. Hi. Another gorgeous woman. I know. They're so hot this week. Do you screen for the—

I do. We only take good-looking callers. Actually, that's not true. I don't want people who don't think they're good-looking to not call in. I just want you to send us a picture first. This is our special guest, Joel Kim Booster. Say hi. Hi.

Hi. Nice to meet you. Nice to meet you, too. I really relate to this because I worked a desk job for many, many years and was writing at the same time trying to and doing stand up at the same time. And so I completely understand the experience of working 50 hours a week and still trying to find time to do your creative pursuits. So this really this hit home for me in a big way. Can I ask you, so you work the second job for what purpose? Is it for financial reasons or you said just to get out of the house? it is to get out of the house a little bit because it's the first job i had like after undergrad so all of my friends are there and this current job is remote so i just find i don't know

that i would be able to force myself to leave the house if i didn't have this other job so it is yeah a reason of course money is involved in that as well but mostly to see my friends and to get out of the house and that's at night yeah evenings and weekends how many days a week do you do that about three two or three okay that's not too bad so you just have to set this is so easy all you have to do is set up a new system okay so writing is your passion that's really what you want to get after right you need to wake up in the morning and i was gonna say the same thing that is what every creative like there's a book this i want you to get this book it's called daily rituals and it do you know what i'm do you have it have you seen that i've heard of it okay this it shows

you what every philosopher, artist, all the fate, like Michelangelo, like D'Angelo, the guy who made the pizzas, any Angelo, philosophers, politicians, comedians, artists, actors, people who get up in the morning and do like the first three hours between like 5.30 and 8.30 a.m. are the biggest peaks of creativity for all artists. And if you have all day to be an artist, then that's supposed to be like a three to two hour work session in the morning. Then you take a break, go for a walk, take a nap whatever you're into and then you come back and you have like another two hours in the afternoon but first thing in the morning for writing I can tell you is my most creative and where I have the most clarity is first thing in the morning because of course after the day you're

tired of you're working a full-time job so you have to like harness your energy when you have it right so just start changing the time that you go to bed and the time you wake up and give yourself Even if it's one hour in the morning before you go to work, if you have to get up, get ready and then do it or you do it while you're in bed, write for an hour and then go get ready for your day. Start changing your schedule and reconfigure how you're doing that because your goal is to get your books published, right? So you have to make that your biggest priority. And you're letting the other things that you don't care about as much overshadow that. And can I say, too, this is a big thing, I think, especially for people who work remotely now. change where you are doing your personal writing because you are spending so much time at home and

your brain is in work mode now you're you've turned your home into work mode and so it's really hard to make that switch from i'm at work to now i'm doing this thing for me when it's all in the same place so if you can find a separate space a coffee shop what have you if you have the money a we work space whatever you need to do either take your work out of your home and make your home your sanctuary of where you do your actual writing or take the writing out of your home and figure out because it really does change your mindset when you're when you're trying to do both things in the same space it doesn't work as well yeah and she actually was at a cafe when we had our pre-interview she was like i'm doing some writing so that's great what time do you

start your work day nine my work day uh eight to four is what i work oh eight to four so that's early okay but i think i think you should try that for a week get up early you're gonna have to try and go to bed earlier and get up early let's set your alarm for 5 30 in the morning or whatever can allow you an hour of creativity okay where do you live you live somewhere where you can go somewhere that early like at 6 a.m can you go to a coffee shop I could yeah actually yeah I think you should I was even saying to Catherine yesterday as well like trying to that mindset of trying to get out of the house because even when I was in university I found the same thing like I was not able to get academic writing or creative writing done at home I had to go out but even that I'm

finding like it's much harder to make myself focus even out of the even outside of my house like if i go to a starbucks or wherever else okay well you have to try out a couple places can you go right in a park like is there oh my god lot libraries so underrated you don't have to buy shit but they're not open at six in the morning is true that's fair but if you go after work you could go like make four to six sort of your your period too i know it's not as effective because it's later in the day it's not less effective i just think you need to get into a habit right Like you want to create a habit so that – because if you do something for a week, you're going to – the next time you're like, wait, wait a second. Why am I not doing it?

Like it becomes part of your day and it becomes a daily ritual, which is really important for you to just – because that's going to infuse everything. Once you get your creative juices flowing, that infuses the rest of your life. You're not going to feel as tired, I promise you, from your regular job when you're giving yourself the grace. and like he said you know if if it's completely undoable but it doesn't sound like it is you start at 8 30 you can get up a couple hours earlier get up at six o'clock in the morning and write from 6 30 to 7 30 and then get ready for work and do that for a week and you're just going to feel your self-esteem is carried by your creativity when you're a creative that's all you need is to constantly be working and writing and then that fills you up and it adds and lends energy

to the stuff that isn't as exciting. And I don't want to, I feel like I need to address the elephant in the room, which is why aren't you writing while you're at work? I mean, like, why, like, I'm sorry. I know what it's like to work a desk job for 50 hours a week. There's so little work that you, like, there are ways you can figure out

how to sort of half-ass it at your real job so that you can spend some hours during the day doing your writing work. You work for the government, so it sounds like you have a really intense job. I was working for fucking startups where you sell men's socks online. So it's a little different. But I did some of my I wrote my first script while at work.

So I think it is it is possible. Or lunch breaks. Maybe there's a lunch break situation. Big lunch break. Yeah, my lunch breaks are really short. Unfortunately, the nature of my job, like my notes on my phone are full of stuff like little thoughts that I do have time to jot down throughout the day. But then by the time I do get off work and go to sit down, that's it.

I just don't want to look at a computer anymore or do anything. And if I had, like, more opportunity throughout my workday, I definitely would be taking more advantage of that. I would also say, I mean, maybe not staring at a screen, maybe you're writing longhand, that you can then point your phone at it and it turns it into text. That's, like, a new thing that you can do. But if you are— Who's writing longhand besides Barack Obama? Me. Really?

Oh, yes. I write a thank you card. I'm like, oh, forget it. I'm just like, thanks. I think I'm going to write this whole thing, and then my hand is so tired. They're barely teaching kids how to write longhand anymore. No more Penman chat. You're not allowed to read or write in this country.

But also I'd say take a look at your notes at night right before you turn off your light so that you have those sort of percolating in your brain all night. And when you wake up, you're going to find like things have synthesized and you are like, oh my gosh, I can't wait to get this onto a page. That's a good idea. Yeah, that is a good idea. Wow. And then or you could take Joel's advice and lose your job.

Yeah. Then you'll have plenty of time to write. You decide. Even if there's a little place in your apartment, like a side little sanctuary that you set up as your writing area, like you put a couple of things, notes, like things that, you know, all of your writing notes, if you put those on little post-its or you print them out from your phone and just put them all over. So it's like a creative kind of little area for you.

So, you know, we just have to psych ourselves into situations sometimes. And that's what you're like. Yeah. And you could do it. You'll do it. Do it for five days straight and get back to us and let us know if it made an impact. Yeah, it definitely will. Thank you so much.

If it doesn't, if you're like, I just can't like will myself into this, get a writing buddy. If you know you have an appointment of like, I owe three pages to this person on Wednesday. Accountability is everything. Yes. I will say too, like. Is it? I mean, I don't, I don't feel accountable to for another, but I'm more accountable to myself than anyone else. If I tell somebody, if I tell somebody that I'm doing something, then like, I feel so much guilt if I don't actually show up.

Midwestern guilt. Yeah. Midwestern guilt. Like I, you know, I'm about to do a full frontal scene for the first time on a show. And I have now told all my friends I'm doing this. So I cannot chicken out. I have to do it now. It's accountability for my dick.

Great. Is that an honor of AAPI? Yeah, yeah, yeah. You're doing the Lord's work. I'm putting the P in the AAPI. Thank you so much. Thank you. Okay.

Good luck, Emily. Thank you. Bye. I like how Joel just goes into an offshoot at the end of each call about his own issues and what he's up against I'm here for a short time not a long time I gotta get it in

it's a nice bookend to the calls to look within introspection for Joel well let's take a quick break and we'll be back to wrap up oh that flew by we'll be right back shut up Joel

Saving money is simple. Just combine your car and home insurance with Bel Air Direct and save. Get a quote at BelAirDirect.com. When I was 14 years old, I was kidnapped and held captive for nine months. I survived, and I've spent my life exploring how other people survive what should have destroyed them. I'm Elizabeth Smart, and these are the Survivor Files. I just remember this low, taunting voice next to my ear saying, shut up, don't say anything. Every week, I'm with survivors who live through the unthinkable.

I knew if he woke up, without a doubt, he was going to hurt me. I started feeling that there was someone at the end of my bed, and I just started screaming. They are abducted, stalked, controlled, and nearly silenced. but these aren't stories about what's taken from them. They're stories about what it takes to make it out alive. Listen to The Survivor Files with Elizabeth Smart on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

If your bookshelf and your For You page are equally important to your personality, welcome home. This is Prose Society, the weekly podcast that's part book club, part group chat for thought daughters, pop culture obsessives, and anyone who thinks Pride and Prejudice and Love Island deserve the same level of discourse.

I'm Eli Rallo, and every week we're connecting the dots between books, the internet, and the conversations everyone can't stop having. I'm going to have to look up this story. I'm obsessed. I'm obsessed. From bestselling authors and your favorite book talk creators to the latest pop culture moments, nothing is off the table. It's like if you can hide some real messages inside compelling characters, then that is a Trojan horse. Whether you're looking for literary deep dives, smart pop culture conversations, or a community of readers who love to think a little too much, you're in the right place.

Listen to Pro Society on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. See you between the pages. On the new podcast, Solita, we share the messy reality of traveling alone as a woman. I can wait four hours for the next bus or this random dude is offering me a ride on his motorcycle. I chose option B. I'm Julie Pinheiro, and I travel by myself because it's a rare space where I can say yes without asking anyone else first. I'm on a mission to reclaim the word solita, trading the pity for possibility. Every time I tried to be alone, I kept meeting people, and they were like, you smiled at us.

Not a lot of people smile around here. It's when you're alone that you're most receptive to the world as it is and not the lies you're sold about it. It can be a time where you push your limits, change your mind, or wake up to a new version of yourself. So whether you're a solo travel veteran or you're too nervous to book your first trip, I hope you listen to Solita on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. We're back. Sorry, guys. Sorry. We're back. That really flew by. You're funny. It's always so much fun to do it with a comedian.

Mateo came and we laughed so hard the whole session. Like people were calling it with – we couldn't even – we were just making fun of everyone. And Mateo was like, this is so fun. I'm like, it's not normally like this. I'm like, but when you have a comedian where everyone just goes to the wrong place right away or the right place. Yes. Okay. Well, our last question comes from Jenna.

Jenna Bush. Dear Chelsea. I hate my twin. Close. I have a simple question. Is it fair of me to ask that my boyfriend shave his face more regularly? He regularly lets his stubble grow out, and frankly, it is painful to kiss him after a couple of days of growth. He does not have a gene for facial hair and is certainly not growing it out with intention.

He just can't be bothered to shave. What grows in is sporadic around his upper lip and goatee zone and by no means attractive. I see it not only as him not bothering to take care of himself, but also that he can't put in a minimal effort for me and my comfort. I find the stubble very pokey and irritating to my skin when we kiss, and I tell him as much all the time. I think the lack of any sort of initiative is what bothers me as much as the stubble itself. He also regularly compares it to how I don't always feel like shaving my legs, and how would I feel if he asked me to shave my legs more often? I don't think it's a fair comparison. What can be done about this?

Am I being unreasonable or controlling, or is it fair to ask that he simply shave his face every couple of days? Much appreciation, Jenna. Listen, Jenna, you got to take a page out of the WGA book. You got to go on strike, bitch. No more kissing until you shave your little Fu Manchu. That's what you need to do. Because to compare it to shaving legs, the surface area alone, okay, it is not the same thing at all. And he's not having to put his lips on her legs, his entire face on her legs.

Great point, Joe. Great fucking point. First, absolutely, you can demand that. And also you could also say, sure, I'll shave. Great. I'll shave my legs every three days and you can shave your face every day. Facial hair that you're kissing. Exactly. Is the point. Like it's bothering you and it's not attractive to you. If you have a boyfriend or a girlfriend that says, I love this. I love this about you. Don't you do it more like, oh, I love your hair like that. Then you start to wear your hair like that. You don't change your personality, but it's like pleasing to the person that you care about. So you want them to like it. So it's totally within your right to be like, OK, fucking shave. Yeah. It's not bad. Facial hair is bad.

Yeah. It's not hot. It's the worst. Like a patchy beard. There's nothing. And if he's acting like that when you're dating, then like then that's only going to get worse if he doesn't nip it in the bud now. You need to you need to do you not have like a mean gay friend who can just straight up

to his face every time he doesn't shave? Be like, bro, you look ugly as fuck right now. Can you get a gay friend that will do that? I'll do that. Give me his number. Okay. I'll FaceTime in. Yeah, yeah.

You don't have to put up with that. I had a boyfriend who, when he did shave, I didn't like it. Oh, no. Like, he looked better with facial hair than without. And I was like, oh, you better keep that fucking beard, buddy. Like, I don't want to see what's under there without the beard. Well, your boyfriend has facial hair, right? He does, yeah, yeah.

A lot of men look better with facial hair. That's true. I like him both ways, I will say. But he does look considerably younger. And he is already younger than me, so it's a problem. And he looks like he just looks like a little boy without his without his beard, which I guess I shouldn't have just said that I liked it both ways, because God knows in this climate, hearing a gay man say I like my boyfriend when he looks like a little boy. That's that's trouble. That's I think from based on everything you've said during this podcast, nobody's going to hold that against you.

I will be lifting that out and we'll be putting it on. Yes, yes, yes. That's the clip. Joel Kim Booster, groomer. Thank you, Joel Kim. That was so much fun. Thank you for having me. Love you, honey.

What a dream come true. So much fun. And thank you, Catherine. Ah, yay. It was good to be with another Midwesterner. Yes, finally. Shabbat shalom, everybody. If you'd like advice from Chelsea,

shoot us an email at dearchelseapodcast at gmail.com and be sure to include your phone number. Dear Chelsea is edited and engineered by Brad Dickert, executive producer, Catherine Law. And be sure to check out our merch at chelseahandler.com. I survived nine months in captivity, and I've spent my life exploring how other people survive what should have destroyed them. I'm Elizabeth Smart, and these are The Survivor Files. Every week, I'm with survivors who lived through the unthinkable, abducted, stalked, controlled, and nearly silenced.

These are stories about what it takes to make it out alive. Listen to The Survivor Files with Elizabeth Smart on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. And I guess I can share that, uh, no way. Listen to the latest episode of Hey Jonas on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Ben Stiller, and a lot of other big shots that wouldn't be where they are without us. Listen to Hollywood Handbook on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. On the new podcast, Solita, we share the messy reality of traveling alone as a woman. I can wait four hours for the next bus, or this random dude is offering me a ride on his

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