Life with Nat - EP173: Reflecting on Grief #3

Episode Date: November 20, 2025

Nat and Linny are taking a moment to have another conversation about loss, especially in the run-up to Christmas and how extra hard that can make everything. Please subscribe, follow, and leave a review. xxx You can find us in all places here; ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://podfollow.com/lifewithnat/view⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ We're on Facebook: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.facebook.com/lifewithnatpod⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Get the merch!: ⁠⁠⁠https://www.lifewithnat.shop/⁠⁠⁠ Nat's insta: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@natcass1⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Neice's insta: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@natsnieces⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Tony's insta: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@tonycass68⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Linny's insta: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@auntielinny.lwn⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ THE BIG CHRISTMAS LIVE SHOW 7th December ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠- claphamgrand.com/event/live-with-nat-at-christmas/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Book Club: November's book - All Together for Christmas by Sarah Morgan & December's book (optional extra for the speedy readers) - A Heart for Christmas: Advent Romance by Sophie Jomain Nat’s solo chats - any rants always welcome!  Scraping the Barrel - SCAN AND SHOP VIRGIN NO LONGER! Bonce vs list! - Are you a list maker? Always collecting for Nostalgia Fest! What’s brewing with the Nieces - are we all skipping the end of summer, all of autumn and going straight to Christmas - Nat’s door is! Group chat ettiquette & pranks. Nice Lorraines… get in touch! Advent calendars & gift recommendations v. welcome! Things we’re nagging with Linny about - More lateness stories and some cleaning questions, please! The Tony talks chatter - Keep your DIY questions coming, also open to some saucy two paragraph stories for Tony to read out at the Southend show - think cheeky postcards (both in tone and length)! Can we make Tony an influencer and get him any freebies?  TBC Cultural differences ep - inspired by Linny’s Mediterranean heritage and her & Ellia's Italian trip, we'd love to hear about the cultural differences you've noticed between the UK and basically ANYWHERE else!  A 'Keep It Light Media' Production Sales, advertising, and general enquiries: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠[e-mail]⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hello and welcome to Life with Nat. I hope everybody is having a wonderful morning, afternoon or evening. I'm here with Auntie Linney. How are you? I'm good. Recovery from yesterday. We've been seeing quite a lot of each other. We have to be fair.

It's all or nothing. I've had a couple of messages today on Instagram about how glamorous you looked at the live show. Oh. How lovely your legs looked? My claudius legs. I loved yesterday. I thought it was my favourite one.

Brilliant. We've done so far. That's good. The live shows are cracking, aren't they? Really good fun. You can just get rid of the nerves. Yeah. It's good.

No, I probably enjoyed yesterday. Good. We've had so many messages from people. Really? Just really people that came that loved it. So nice to see all of us together. Yeah. Yeah, because for the listeners, it must be nice to just actually see us in the flesh.

See us all interacting. And see that we are just ordinary people and it's real. Yeah. I just, yeah, doing what we do. Take the piss out of each other. It's good. It's really good. Yeah, it was great.

Yesterday was particularly good. Roll on, the clap and grand. Oh, my goodness. Let's hope you're all coming. Yeah, it'd be really. really good. We've got a lovely number there. It's almost sold out, I think.

Has it? It'll be great. Really good. Really good. The Christmas spirit. So that would be lovely. Really nice. So we're here again to talk about grief and loss.

Because people just really want to talk about it. And when I put the message out earlier on, saying we were doing one, again, we were inundated with people's messages. I just, I'm overweight. It is overwhelming. I was like, where is she put a message out because it felt like you were just throwing voice notes and text messages at me. It's incredible, but it just shows.

But even yesterday, quite a few people came over and said, you know, would you be doing another grief? That it's very popular because I guess... It's an outlet for people for something that isn't spoken about openly enough. Which really shocks me in this day and age, I must say. I think women are good at talking. I think so, but I think this is a place, a safe space for people to sort of voice their opinion. And we're almost, you know, we are strangers to them.

Yeah. But because they listen to us, it brings them some comfort. Yeah, and I think it must be, again, I don't know because I've never been to grief counsellor. Although I think maybe we should have done. Maybe it's because we're not qualified. Yeah. We're just talking about our own experiences and drawing from our own experience. Yeah.

And I guess that's with anything, isn't it? It's like having a baby. Yes. It's like having a midwife or a health visitor who's trying to give you advice and they've never had a baby. Yeah. I always find that a bit. Yeah. I remember that when I had Maria, a healthista trying to tell me what to do, what not to do and how to do it.

And I had to ask her. I said, have you got children? She said, no, I went, oh, okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So it's kind of, we're just drawing. on our own experience of grief and yeah I just love the fact that people are reaching out to us and if we can just give them a little bit of comfort or just think before Christmas it's a hard time it's such a difficult time people we love it don't we the rasmataz and I know

obviously there'll be plenty of lovely Christmas episodes coming up but sometimes you need to reflect and it is a time of reflection and a time of missing people yeah you can't help it even if you feel that you're not going to go there with your faults. You can't help it. It just naturally happens because a Christmas Carol might come on, a film might come on, the children might do something that just reminds you. Well, I got the Christmas decorations are in this cupboard behind me

and Joni's been desperate. I'll show you on your way out. Desperate to put her tree up, so she did. But that cupboard, even when I open it up, and I smell all the boxes and it just reminds me of my parents. Yeah, of course. Natalie, I've got Christmas decorations from your mum's tree. Yeah. I've got our angel downstairs. Yeah. You know, and then you've only got to put that one ball ball up and that's enough to just take you somewhere that you kind of don't want to go because

you don't want to feel sad. But equally, sometimes you just draw a bit of comfort from it. Yeah, and memories and the warmth of it all, but that can also be painful. It's so heightened this time of year. It genuinely is. And I guess, I guess for a lot of people that have lost family members, pets, this time of year, again, it's bittersweet, isn't it? You know, I mean, my anniversaries of people that I have lost that were so dear to me are not in November or December. But that doesn't mean to say those months are difficult because, yeah, as we keep saying, you can't help that reflect. But for people that have lost people in December, Christmas Day, Christmas Eve, yeah. must be so different. Well, I always hate New Year's Day and New Year's Eve. Yeah, because it's

your dad's birth day. Yeah. And it just, the last few are so lovely, sitting at home with him singing happy birthday at midnight, all those things. I miss that terribly. I've never been a massive New Year person, but that made it very special. But we've got so many messages to get through. So many. So many. So let's try and... Well, I think we should start with the one that you picked out, which is talking about... Anticipatory grief. In January, a close friend of mine was diagnosed with a terminal brain tumour. Sadly, within a matter of weeks, she had lost virtually all short-term memory and stopped using her phone, etc., succumbing entirely to the care of her immediate family household.

I have been fortunate to be invited by her family to see her on three occasions since. Some friends haven't been able to see her at all, as the family have remained extremely private. I know I should be grateful for the opportunities I've had, and I do feel guilty for friends who haven't had this chance, but I just miss her so much, and the close friendship we shared. However, I feel unjust in my sadness, and that I can't grieve this loss as she is still here with us. And of course, for that, I'm thankful. We'd love to hear if anyone is having similar experiences, much love. Well, that sort of resonated with me a little bit, because as you know, my dad had a stroke, and unfortunately the stroke, we had multiple strokes.

And unfortunately, the stroke left him unable to eat, unable to, because he couldn't swallow, unable to speak. And I'm not, and he didn't really kind of, I think, believe he knew who we were. So, and he lived nine, ten months in that way. Yeah. I think you remember going, I've got video of you with him, ironically. Yeah. None of us, but I've got one of you and him. And as much as it gave me comfort because he was still smiling.

For me, I do feel that during that period I was grieving my dad, even though he was there, he would still try and cuddle me and used to blow. He used to blow him. He couldn't blow a kiss. He wasn't capable. So he'd just blow in my face. It was really strange. Yeah.

For me, I understand where this lady's coming from. You're kind of going through the grieving process, but the person is still very much alive. I feel like I had it for two weeks before dad died. Do you not remember me phoning you? I totally remember you calling me. I didn't realize that you were going through that. I knew he was going. I know, I know you said that.

My daddy's going to die and I was like, don't be so ridiculous. I just know. But do you feel like you grieve? I had that pain. Yeah. I was frightened that I knew it was imminent. And what was weird about that is no one else really got it. Yeah, but that just showed your connection with your dad.

Yeah. But do you feel that through that during those two weeks? Well, I made the best of it. Yeah. And how wonderful. Amazing. But do you feel like you were grieving him as in already you'd lost it? Yeah, I felt like I was, I can't believe I'm going to not have him here.

Yeah. So very, again, grief just consumes you of the most strange emotions that you think, wow, what is this? again, how do you manage that kind of feeling where you're thinking, hold on a minute, this person's still here. Why am I grieving them? Why do I already feel they're lost? They're here.

Well, I have to say, I feel like it, I don't know what is going on with me, but I feel very emotional about the children. I feel... Because they're getting older. Gutter all pain. Yeah. With the growing up.

Yeah, another kind of loss. Yeah, so again, that. Losing those babies, children, toddlers, six-year-olds, full of joy. You know, Eliza was 15, I've got through it with her. I've got through that pain. I now see it as lovely relationship. We listen to music, book to concert, you know, nut shopping, you know, all those things. She's still a pain in the house, but I've got through that pain.

I don't feel that pain with mine. It's funny interesting, isn't it? A little bit, I felt it probably more when they started talking about leaving home and stuff like that. But then sort of growing from babies to toddlers from, I didn't really just shows, doesn't it, I guess. Everyone's different. Everyone deals with stuff differently. But Joni, knowing also it's my last one, I think, I think I'd been mad to have another one. But knowing it's my last one, she's getting moody once.

be in her bedroom. I'll come in and go, what should we do now? She's dancing in the lounge. Shut the door, I'm dancing. And I think slowly. I'm losing my baby. Yeah. Yeah. She's still very childlike, which I love, which I spoke about with Elia on the pod a couple of ones ago. And that's lovely because she has that novelty and she's a young little girl, which is lovely. You want that to last as long as it can. But emotionally, I can see it. Yeah.

Emotionally I can see it. Even physically a little bit. Yeah. I feel we can start to see it in Joni. But that's no different to like even hearing the girls sometimes. And Lisa said it a little while ago. She said, you know, Frankie, obviously they've made a decision that they're not going to planning to have any more children. And she said, I just want to enjoy every last bit.

Because I'm not going to do this again. So again, these are all emotions of loss which manifests itself in so many different ways. We've got one here. Hey, Nat, I would love you to touch on the grief you feel when something doesn't turn out the way you expect. So this is another form of grief, which will be interesting. My youngest daughter is disabled, and in the early years of her diagnosis,

there are a lot of feelings of grief for the things that we weren't going to see her do or achieve. There was also, from a selfish perspective, the grief we felt as parents, that our life wasn't going to go the way we expected, and we might have to change plans we had for the future. like having a child that will always be dependent on you. It did take a while to work through those feelings,

but we changed our mindset, and now instead of thinking about what we aren't going to do, we get to think about what we do get, we'll never be empty nesters, and that's a wonderful feeling. Love to you all, Kirsty. Oh, well, well done, Kirsty, for putting that, being able to change your mindset.

Turn it on its head. Instead of looking at all the negatives of it, you can now sort of start to to view the positives. Again, I can't relate to what. No, I can't relate. I have, we have friends that are in a similar situation. And yes, how can you not sit back and think selfishly sometimes and why me, why us, why my child? And it's brave to say that, Kirsty.

Brave to write that down. So thank you for sharing that. Absolutely. And it's amazing that you've put that down. in a message, and that's a brave thing to admit. Why has it happened to us? Why has our life been turned on its head now? We're never going to be able to do X.

We're never going to be able to do Y. They're never going to be able to have a child. They're never going to get married. But if you think around, turn it on its head and think of the positives, which you have to do with every situation. With any situation. We have to. And what's taken from you, from one hand,

something else is given to you in the other. That's right. So you just got to look at all the, you know, you're going to have your child with you forever. How amazing, because we're not, because they go off and do their own thing. And you've just got to enjoy the best parts of that relationship. Absolutely, absolutely. I feel home caring, people that are caring 24 hours a day. I've touched on it within my documentary.

Okay. Which I can't wait for. But you really don't realise the silent carers, young sung heroes. You know, we talk about medically and people in the NHS or paramedics and all the carers, all the wonderful people, but you forget about the home carers who didn't sign up to be a carer. No, absolutely. It's not their profession.

No. And suddenly there will be. At any age? Any stage. And suddenly they're a 24-hour carer. So a shout out to all of you, because there are millions. And you're incredible people. Millions.

You really are. Bev said, hi, Nat, loving the pods. I know you love this time of year but I'm going to be a bar humbug I've not been into this Christmas festivities since my lovely mum passed away in 2013 she absolutely loved it my family stopped talking to me

then my dad died in 2022 I live alone just me and my two dog children I couldn't have any of my own Christmas is a normal day now I don't know what to say to you it sounds you know

I don't think you are being a bar humbug I think you've had a really really hard time but it sounds like you have two beautiful doggies that love you and that you adore because you call them your children so again I hope they bring you happiness and joy for walks and cuddles and you treat them and talk to them and they love you

but it doesn't sound great Again, I think you've got to think of all the positives, Bev. Hopefully you've got some friends that you can lean on. Absolutely. I don't know if you work, Beth, but I always find work for people because you're interacting with other people. You get a bit of a social life. It's or voluntary work.

Voluntary work. Or a nice hobby of some sort where you're with like-minded people. Whatever it takes to just be amongst people, like-minded people. Absolutely. Absolutely. There must still be so much room for having a little community of, like, where you've created a community, or should I say, we have created a community with your pod, Natalie. With these messages that we get. I mean, could you imagine just having a little, you know, afternoon tea in the village? Did you hear, because you listen to all of them, because you're the best, but did you hear when I spoke to lovely Lucy, who we met last night?

Yes. And I was saying, yes. Again, it's all pie in the sky at the moment, but wouldn't it be wonderful? Like people do McMillan coffee mornings, for instance, you get a pack that we do some sort of life with nothing where people within their village could start a little group if they have got the time or whatever, you know, there's lots of things. And I know these things are easy to talk about and not so easy to do. But, you know, sometimes you don't have to complicate these. No. You just need a little village hall or even if someone's...

happy to open up their home to half a dozen people. Pop the kettle on. Stick the kettle on. Few cream cakes. And have a little chinwag. It can be about whatever you want it to be. Absolutely. And it just gives someone...

That little bit of therapy, a little bit of conversation, which would be perhaps a very lonely day. Yeah. Not too dissimilar to what we are doing now. Absolutely. People that are listening now, hopefully we're giving you a bit of company. And hopefully, yeah, Bev, please. Thank you for listening.

and I hope you listen, and I hope we do give you that little bit of company. I had a message Charlotte, lovely Charlotte Hoffman, and I thought I'd just break it up a little. She said, you were all so brilliant today. Honestly felt like I was sitting around a kitchen table with you all. Tracy's share actually made me cry, such a wonderful human being, and to know that you were there carrying her through, that toughest time must make you feel so special.

You're a real tonic. please keep up the good work. Insight into me. My grandson was born on the day you first broadcaster, Life with Nat. His name is Maximus, aka Maxibon. And from time to time,

a tenuous link, it makes me smile. Everything you speak about resonates with me, and I am so grateful to have found your podcast. It really does help me get through some quite isolating days traveling to work. Thanks again, you lovely lot. Oh, that's lovely. I'm so pleased you enjoyed it, Charlotte.

That made me laugh. The girls. shared, or you shared, I don't know who it was, the message from Tracy. Oh no, it was the girls, because she said, apologise to your mum, I think I squeezed her really hard. So Tracy, I went back with, to be fair, I think she's broken one of my ribs. Amazing lady, amazing lady. Razina came as well to the show and she said,

just watch your podcast show at the wharf. I've never laughed so much. Thank you for a fabulous afternoon and a much needed. It's mum's afternoon off. Excellent. So that was nice as well. I enjoyed it, Rosina. So really good.

Yeah, great audience yesterday as well, wasn't it? Really lovely people. Yeah, it just worked. Really nice. We've got one here. A little voice note. Let's have a listen to this. Hi, Na and Lily.

Just saw your message about grief, loss. This year's been a horrible, horrible year for me. I lost my beautiful nanny. in April and I miss her so much and then I lost both my cats Harry and Pasha who were old

they lived a good life and so did my nan she's 91. Oh, brilliant. And yeah, it's been a hard year but I know she'd just tell me to get up, pull on my socks, I can get on with it which she's just trying to do.

but it don't mean you don't miss him and I miss her so much and today's my birthday 45 years old today my first one without her and I miss her so much but I know she's with me

all the time and I know she'd be celebrated with me and that's why I've already had two glasses of wine and a cocktail because of my mom and my dad my sister and grief is hard but time does help

you have your good days and your bad days but today is going to be a good day because I know she's with me anyway lovely guys and that I'm well looking forward to seeing you on 7th of December at Clapham Grand What was this late? I've got it on here

so sorry but it's lovely you've been out today you've been out with your family You've had a little drink You've celebrated her And it's good to go home And have a little cry Thank you for sharing that

And your nan will always be with you And happy birthday Yeah and happy birthday Happy birthday Oh she's making me cry Oh bless her Oh I just find it mad I really do sis

That people just come on and share that with us Such deep Yeah emotions But that just shows that there is there is so much room for people to communicate about this stuff and maybe we're more approachable because we're not here to preach or we're just we're just two human beings who have gone through it yeah on multiple occasions sadly yep

hyna and aunt aunt auntie saw your message on Instagram about the grief pod I wanted to message about a different sort of grief I'm experiencing I lost my dad when I was 18 this was horrific grief and losing a parent any age is hard. The grief I'm dealing with at the moment is due to my mum having dementia. She was diagnosed in August of this year after a few hard years of different health issues. Due to mum's personality, her ways and routines and day-to-day life changing, I feel like I'm grieving for someone who is still alive. That may sound really strange, but I'm grieving for the mum that brought me up and who was a

parent, and now I'm getting to know this new mum, but where I'm the parent, not the child. Not sure if this makes any sense. It does make sense, I promise. I think of things I really want to tell her or get advice on, but we're sort of past that point. It's just chit-chat, which I still appreciate, and I'll treasure these conversations, but it's a role change, and the grief feels awful.

So, yeah. What's this good lady's name? Charlotte, lovely Charlotte. Charlotte, again, I can resonate with your text because it was a very similar thing with my dad, but one thing I will say to you, Charlotte. when I reflect back on memories of my dad and I really hope this will be the same for you

those months where he couldn't speak he didn't know who we were I have such fond memories of those months because it was a joy being with him because I kind of had adjusted to the fact that okay he can't speak he can't eat but he's still here he's still smiling

he's still he's still giving us love in an indirect way, and we could love him back. Yeah. And I do. I've got such lovely memories of that year. Well, that's good. I don't reflect on it and think. Oh, what a horrible year.

No, I genuinely, genuinely don't. Whereas with my mum, yeah, yeah, yeah. He was dying of leukemia for a year. It was awful. So I read, just embrace this time. I think also, though, the dementia thing is. I mean, obviously you're more experienced in that field because you have, you're doing the course.

Obviously, you have a lovely Scott with the wonderful Barbara and I saw that happen. Yeah. And I did a placement in a dementia home for the dock. And it's such a strange thing because you see these lovely people and you are having a chit-chat or trying to have a laugh or a dance or what have you. But I think if that was your parent,

yeah, that isn't the same anymore. and you know things are only going to go downhill. But that's how it was, and that's, even for me, that's how it was. Yeah, yeah, yeah, of course. I remember saying, we would talk to him, and he didn't know, he didn't realize he had a wife. She'd passed, but he had no recollection. I remember getting up having a dance with him because he used to love a dance. It was no different.

It was like he had, because obviously the stroke had affected his brain. But, yeah, it's awful. It's awful. But in retrospect, you have from memories, which is. Something maybe to hold on to. Massively. Yeah. It's so sad, isn't it, life?

It can be. Do you know what I mean? These pods, you just think, but it is that life cycle. Yeah. Why do we get shocked over people dying? Because it's an emotion.

But it's a guaranteed thing that's going to happen. But it's, I was having a conversation today with a guy at work, Stabros that I often mentioned to you. Yeah, he messaged me about your term. So it's well jail.

You've got me into trouble, Stan Ross. I'll make some. He lost his dad. He's a young guy. He lost his dad a couple of years ago. And he, obviously, his dad had had a stroke, which led to whatever. And I said, did you, even though, like for me, even though my dad was ill and we knew he was going to die, when he died, it was still such a shock. Yeah.

I just don't think you can, you know, when people say, well, you know, you've had time to prepare. No, you can't prepare for someone being there and then not being there within a second. Yeah, and it's that computer, I say about myself, I think, how can I not, I'm here now. And then you're not going to be here. And then I'm just not going to be here. Which is why I can't help live the way I live. Yeah. I can't do it.

I'm sorry, I know, I'll sound, Mark will kill me if he listens to it, but all, you know, money saving and thinking of the future and I can't do it. Because what if I'm not here tomorrow? No, it's amazing. But isn't it amazing that you're like that? Because I'm not. Yeah, but I don't know if that's the right or wrong because I might live 208 and be potless I don't have a penny to pissing, pot to pissing.

But again, I'm not saying I am better, I'm better with, I'm not saying I'm not frivolous. I'm sensible and I do have finances in place and what have you. I'm not saying I'm flash. But I can't not get something for someone if they want it or see the joy in someone's face or. But I sort of do this with the grand...

I've said this before on the podcast. I do it with the grandchildren. I'll go to whatever. The girls, wherever they, whatever they're doing, I'm there. Because my girls didn't get that. Your mum had you. So she, and at one stage her mom looking after her mum, my mum had gone. Yep.

So they kind of missed out a little bit. So I don't want my grandchildren to miss out. And I feel, you know, that my haven't had my mum. And Jackie's not around the corner when she's here, it's lovely. And that nan and... But that nan round the corner. And that relationship with a grandparent, well, you heard from that lady earlier,

it's such a special relationship. I mean, I never knew a granddad. No, it's mad, isn't it? Never had a granddad. No, no. So, but again, like we've said, in life... But maybe that's why I love old men. Because I didn't have one.

Yeah, possibly. And why I'm affiliated with spoiling them and talking to them and you don't know, do you? Of course. Of course. Interesting. We had a lovely photo of someone's Christmas tree that I want to show you. Oh, wow. Beautiful tree with all the decks up.

Amazing. And this was the voice note that she left for us. Hi, now. It's Laura from Devon here. Been loving the recent pods talking about all things Christmas. And yes, our tree is up. It went up yesterday. We always tried to get it up for my birthday, which is tomorrow.

So I think we should all be a little bit more joanie and get decorations up because it's not long enough to enjoy them and get the Christmas. music on and get the Christmas films on. Totally agree. Anyway, good luck with all the upcoming shows, sending lots of love. Oh, lovely, lovely Devon. Very nice, isn't it? Very nice. Yeah, I've got to get my trays up.

They're at the loft. Oh, yeah. Are the decks down yet? No, the decks are out the loft. Excellent. Did you like that Instagram for you? With the meme, was a bloat. Time to do the decks waiting for the loft stairs.

It was because you said that David got the... Trees down. Oh, dear. She's finding the time, isn't it? But we'll do it. We'll get there. It'll be fine. It'll be fine.

Hi, just seen the message about grief. I always find Christmas bittersweet. I love Christmas and as an only long-awaited child, my ma'am, always made it so special. And the older you get, the more you appreciate the effort that your parents put in. She had rheumatoid arthritis and wrapping presents was too difficult, but she would always display them beautifully or have a treasure hunt. to find them.

Oh, lovely. Even when she was old and not well, she always made such an amazing Christmas for my family. She would present the present so lovely. One year she had cut out lots of Christmas pictures from magazines and made collages on the boxes to put the presents in. I always think about her, but Christmas is hard because she made it so wonderful. I'm going to stop that there.

I know it goes on and it's lovely, but I do want to say there, the more special someone is, the more you're going to miss them. Yeah, because... The more the pain is, it's the more you loved them. Yeah. And if you are a kind, loving person, you are going to experience more pain. Yeah. Yeah.

But then equally, you've got to look at it, how privileged you were. Yes. To have these special people in your life. Yes. But, you know, you've lost, and it does cause you so much pain, but that just shows how much you adored them. Absolutely. And you've just got to somehow try and reflect on the fun times and the memory.

I know, it's such a difficult pain to be able to navigate. But it does, as cliche as this is, it does become easier. You learn to deal with that pain. Absolutely. You know, we always say times a healer. It's not that times are healer because I don't think it is. Because 40 years can lapse And you can still have a meltdown

Over someone that you lost 40 years ago It's just you learn how to manage that pain And it doesn't hit you as often That's right As it does at the beginning Where those, that wave Of gutter or pain Yeah

And you know what? It doesn't matter If you do have that way Well you might have that for three years And you want to have a breakdown at work Or in say no's or wherever It's true. It's fine. You can. You're allowed. There's no rules. There's no right way. No. No wrong way. We're just all human being. Just get it out. Get it out. You'll feel so much better for it after. You might feel drained for a few hours, but then you'll feel better for it at the following day.

So true. So have a cry if you need to have a cry. Hi, Nat and Auntie Linney. Love the pod and saw Natalie and his Linton. Oh, how lovely. Wow, where to start on grief and loss My mum died in her sleep seven years ago My husband left five years ago My dear dad had a stroke out of the blue Two years ago and died ten days later Which was in the middle of my poor sister's ovarian cancer journey

Oh dear I then took my only daughter to uni three weeks later And as I drove back down the M1 My sister had taken a turn for the worst in Bart's hospital With a chest infection I got to see her but she died that evening in a few hours after I left her. There's been so much.

She said as I live on my own I've had lots of time to sit and face the pain and tears but equally just had to keep going and try to appreciate the little bits of joy each day can bring and keep putting one foot in front of the other. And that's the key. Strangely no one really asks anymore how I am and the pain is still there.

Sometimes and unless you've experienced it you just don't know. but for sure we all face it one day my mantra is to be grateful for every day don't put anything off enjoy life that's what my dear mum

dad and sister would have wanted keep doing what you're doing with the pod lots of love Nicola oh Nicola what a wonderful outlook painful loss not only your husband leaving losing a sister

and you know parents and again you do sometimes find this where a family seems to go through lots of stuff at once all at once and you just feel like gosh what is going on here again something we experienced as a family yeah just my dad his entire family felt like it was being wiped out sister he lost sisters young you know his wife you know it was just awful and I remember as a child thinking is this right what is going on here and then it stops and life

resume some kind of normality and you do what the lady said was it Nicola? Yes. Put one foot in front of the other and find the joy. And find the joy. Yeah.

Is it really bad to say but I will say it? Sometimes when I'm sat with us all I think I'm so lucky. It scares me sometimes. I think I'm so lucky. Do you know what I mean? Completely because again as a younger woman, I would often have exactly, especially when I had all the children and they're all well and healthy, and I had girls and a boy

and I'd think, oh God, this is too good. What's going to happen? Because again, it's imposter syndrome. It's like, oh, why is everything all right? What's going to happen? What's around the corner? Again, what terrible faults? It is.

But I'm sure many, and now we voice this, I reckon you're going to get a lot of voice notes. But even sat on the stage, I feel emotional when we're all. together because how lucky is this? And then I think about my brother's getting older, you're getting older, you're not. No, absolutely. But I feel like as you get older, you do start thinking of those things. And that's quite difficult as well. It's awful, Natalie, because you're already, you're already sort of preparing yourself.

And I think, hang on, I feel like Eliza's 15. Because I don't want her to be young when she loses me, like I lost my mum. Yeah. So I think Eliza's 15. Yeah. I'm 42. So when I'm 52, she'll be 25. So that's doable.

Please, God. But isn't it awful that you're thinking that way? I think that's doable. Surely that's doable. I've got another 10 years in me. And I do it with the grandkids because I try to calculate what my, you know, how old I could get to and be able to see the grandchildren become adults. It's horrible because I want to see them get married.

I want to see them have children. But we, but again, even with pets, you know, like Betsy's 13. Yeah. I know she's now on Borough Time. And she's such an old girl now. And she's so cute. She's just been a really lovely dog, a lovely pet to have. That's why I just think, the more people you know, the more pets you have,

you're just putting yourself through emotional turmoil. Don't need it. Talking of pets and Betsy and everything, listen to this one. Hi, Nat, I'm just listening to your second grief episode. and I wanted to share my story about my amazing dog, Marge. Marge was actually my mum's dog, but when I was going through depression back in 2011, my mum would ask me to look after Marge for a few hours, a few days a week and slowly we built this bond. And when my mum was working night shifts as a nurse, Marge stayed at mine overnight and she was really great company. A few years later,

my mum's first grandchild arrived and Marge, I believe, had arthritis. So letting her out or touching her was wrong and it was very sore for her and she would yelp and we were afraid that maybe with the pain she might bite the baby so i said marge could come back and live with me and she never looked back marge loved her life with me as she got so much one-on-one love and i was not working for a number of years due to my depression and marge helped me so much marge a few years ago was in pain and i knew it was her time to go as i always said i would never let her suffer so i could have more time with her. I made the hard decision to let her go and it broke me. There are songs that make me think of her and I cry my eyes out. I have picks of her in every room of the house.

I speak to her every day. But a few months after she passed, I heard this noise like the noise her collar made and I knew it was her and I still believe and hear that noise regularly and I know she's with me. I miss her every day. I now have two more dogs and one is very like Marge and I have a great bond with her too. That must be a thing, the hearing, it's strange you've read that out because this is going to sound really weird. A couple of weeks ago, well, you know Dave was away, he went away, so I was on my own. So Maria kindly offered to have Betsy for a couple of days for me so that she wouldn't

be at home on her own because I'm at work. So Monday night, I go home, I've got the key in the door, and I can hear Betsy barking. Wow. But I know she's not at home. She's with Maria. And I know people are going to say it was the neighbour's dog. No, no, no. My neighbours don't have dogs.

But even if my neighbours did have dogs, I know Betsy's bark. After 13 years, you know your dog's bark. Yeah. And I could hear her barking. I think that is a habitual, repetitive, where you've got that bond. Yeah. Well, it's got to be.

But how's it spooky? Yeah. But it was not like. Just a little bit. Oh, I could hear her. How funny. If I... Her head not dropped her own.

No, in my mind, I was starting to think, oh my God, she dropped her off and got to sell me. So it must be a thing that you just home into. Like you say, it's something that's so embedded in you because they are, these pets, they are just, I mean, I can't, I'm still to this day, after 13 years, can't believe that I've got a bond that I have with a pet because obviously you know we didn't really want pets

it was the girls that made us get Betsy and she's just there even if she's not there I feel like I can hear her see her feel her yeah so again the loss of a pet it's terrible but look what look what they give you look at this lady

you know her mum's dog has helped her with her depression it's they're incredible it's incredible absolutely amazing and how hard must it be to have to put your pets it down. Yeah, hard. But the right thing to do.

No, and it is the selfless thing to do. It's the right thing to do. Let's have a listen to this. Hi, ladies, it's Nikki here from Cheshire. I'm just listening to the pod with Auntie Linney, the one that's just come out on Thursday. And you were talking about that lovely lady whose daughter's just moved to Australia. And I think you have to look on it a different way. I've got five children, two are local.

one lives in Canada, one lives in London, one lives in Cambridge. And although it's hard not having my Canadian daughter near me, I have to think and positively to say that you've given them the encouragement to be able to fly and you've given them the strength to be able to leave. And I try and look at it as a positive thing rather than a negative thing. Because they have got to live their own lives, but obviously you always want them around the corner. But, you know, you just think of it positively. you've enabled that young lady to have the confidence to move away.

And I think you should be very, very proud of yourself. Anyway, loving the pod, got to go. Speak to. Take care. Bye-bye. Thank you so much. See you. But that's true.

She's absolutely right. But again, for selfish reasons, I'm glad I didn't give my children the coffee list of spread away. I don't want her. I don't want to. But that's wrong. We're wrong. It's wrong.

We are wrong. But if Eliza does. You'll support her and... Of course I will. And nowhere's that far anymore because of social, all the tools we now have to be able to communicate and see each other. Absolutely. I mean, Eliza's like, I'm just talking to Imogen. Yeah, like it's...

She's round the corner. No different. See? It's lovely. A little bit different for me and Sophie, I have to say. Yeah, you said this to me before. Yeah, it's just the time difference. Yeah.

When I'm ready to talk to her, she's in bed. Yeah. did say the other day and I haven't done it and I'm going to do it after this. I said we just need to send each other loads of voice notes. And I haven't. And I said that's what we need to get in the habit. Pictures, memes, voice notes. It's a weird one that hasn't happened.

And look, you haven't got to speak once a week. No. No, no. Of course. Constant communication, even if it's just once a month. That's a loss to me though. Again, that's another love. A loss. Someone that you connected with was a dear friend. It's been a part of your life

for X many years. Someone who I trust so much and, yes. But she's still... No, yeah, she's... But it's just not that trigger, grab a walk and a coffee. Although we didn't do it for six months where I was so busy. And that's the other thing. You remember all the times,

but actually there were loads of times when you didn't. Yeah. And when someone is distance, you find that you make more of an effort. Yeah. Whereas when they're around the corner, because you know they're around the corner, you just...

Indeed. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. Absolutely. Oh, one's just come through, Lynne. Oh, hey, Nat and Auntie Linney, missed the deadline, sorry. Or you're lucky I've looked at my phone.

I'm so pleased you're doing another grief episode. I was listening to the lovely lady on this morning's pod who lost her mum 20 years ago, such an emotional story and made be thankful that mine got to see her only grandchild grow up into a beautiful young woman. We lost our mum last year on December the 20th. She was diagnosed late-stage Alzheimer's during COVID and battled on with my fabulous sister

moving back home to care for her full-time. She fell last June and broke her leg, which left her bedbound for the following six months until infection rampaged through her body, which led her to hospital admission before passing away, peacefully in hospital two days later. It's been a year of first without her being here,

and she's greatly missed. My daughter picks the keys up on Friday to her first house, And me and the hubby are partying ways in the new year. So I'm feeling quite emotional and vulnerable at the minute. Anyway, enough of my ramblings. Love you all and the pod will keep me company. Amazing.

So there we go. Well, keep listening. We're here to keep your company. Yeah. It's a lot, isn't it, to deal with? Loads. But you find the strength. And those firsts.

Those first are awful. They're really hard. And you've got to, I feel like the first. You've got to change it. Yes. yeah got to change it because then it's different to what you knew and then once you've got through the first psychologically it feels different yeah the following year it all feels so different yeah so true so true yeah it's interesting no one has kind of messaged in about

I'm just going to put this out there how people feel about like for instance in my case my parents are buried yes so I have somewhere to go and I can just have a little chin wag and And I like, you know, I like a clean. Well, it's interesting. Mummy's grave, you know where it is and I don't go. I find it depressing. Depressing. Yeah.

I don't like graveyards, really. No. I think for the girls, I would like to do it all up and start to go maybe next year. But. Because I wish you could excavate her and put her with your dad on your. On your window, that's what I would like to do. But I was told it's impossible. Quite impossible.

Isn't that? Yeah, I spoke to someone at the council and they said it's, it's whatever, what do they call it? Because she's cremated. The land is whatever, I don't know the name of it, holy land, sacri-whatever it is, sorry, I don't know the name. And you'd have to go to St. Auburn's and then you'd have to go to right up sort of a bit of a battle. But it might be worth it Because that's what I would love more than anything It does make

It has made me Not change my view I love having my dad in the lounge Yeah I feel like I'd quite like the idea I've been with the kids Yeah I love it On a sideboard

With a little photo of me I just think they're with you all the time Yeah You haven't got to travel somewhere It's another job About the lady we met yesterday I think I'm so sorry

There's so many of you want to mention And I can't remember your name Yeah So this lady Yeah go on I don't know how we got on to the subject of the grief, but she had lost her hubby. He was young.

And she'd had him tattooed. The ashes. Yeah, the ashes were tattooed on her arm. What a brilliant idea. I've never even heard of that. I said, well, he's with you all the time. You ain't getting rid of him now. Absolutely brilliant.

Yeah. But yeah, in terms of that, I love Daddy in the lounge. Yeah, I get it. But again, and I'm clean it, and I've got a picture of mum and dad. It is like they're both there. Of course. Because I've made it a bit like that. And even that's weird because I thought I'm not going to be one of those people as like really embarrassing trines.

But you can't help it. When you lose people, someone will buy you a crystal or a key ring or a little quote. And then you have a picture. And before you know it, you've got a little trine type thing. But I love it. Well, you better get a big window ledge love because there's loads of others. Oh, don't, don't please. You're the baby.

So, yeah. Yeah. Oh. Yeah. But, yeah, no, I do. I like it. And the thing about the graveyard to me, again, it's another job. And it is a job.

And also for people. Yeah. It's another expense. A huge expense. You've got to keep it. Artificial flowers are really expensive if you want good ones. Or you're doing fresh. The gravestone.

Everything. I know. It's a very expensive business. Having your family members at home with you is a great way to go. No, I totally. got a little bit of Dad in a pot next to his whiskey bottle and glass

in the kitchen area. Have you? Yeah. The kitchen in there I feel like I'm with him. Yeah, it's mad, in it. When I'm in there on my own and I'm cooking,

did the mince mate or whatever, I feel like he's going to walk in and say, cup of tea squat. Yeah. So how lovely is that that you've got that? Because some people, obviously, they pass, they've then got to sell the family home. Again, I've not had that experience because my brothers live in the family home. So we never did, I didn't experience.

That must be so hard. Because again, especially if you've grown up in that home. And then you're losing everything at once. And then it's all going. Yeah, it's a lot to deal with, isn't it? I definitely think we've got to get ourselves a little village hall, Natalie. I think so. I think so, oh, yeah, I've got plenty of time.

Whilst doing pods, whilst working full-time while I was looking after grandchildren. And can I also say a quick going off the brief pod? And I'm so sorry, again, bless a lovely lady, collared me yesterday. She was with her daughter and her daughter-in-law. Yes. Who are now going to become new pod listeners. But she mentioned that her brother-in-law went to school with Dave. Okay.

My hubby, your brother. Yeah. And yes, Colleen Clayton did go to school with Dave and they did go to scouts together. Oh, how brilliant. Just thought I'd mention that because we didn't get to tell her because Dave text after she had left.

Oh, that's really brilliant, brilliant. Which is, what's lovely about this pod as well, isn't it? You're meeting people that know members of your family and... Yeah, old friends on this one, that one. It's lovely. It's really good. It's very, very special. Yeah.

As are you. And thank you. Oh, as are you, my darling. Thank you very much. Are we done now? I think I said that yesterday. I think we are. I think you did.

You turned to me on the stage. You went, are we done now? And I went, yep. And then I forgot to do my ending, which was a bit random. But there you go. Yeah, you forgot your ending. I wanted to do Tony, do you? I'll do it at the clap and down.

And I walked off without hugging you. Oh, that was funny. But I did run back on. You did run back on. That was funny. Only because you heard the roar of laugh. I did. I could.

Everyone went live enough. I was missing out on something. No, I was missing out on a hug. Oh, it's funny. Very good. Well, until the next time. Yeah, until all you lovely people out there, just, we're here for you. Really, keep sending in the messages.

You can send them whenever. You haven't got away for us to announce a grief pod. We have a little group, special grief WhatsApp group, myself and Linney. And you can send those whenever you like. And in a few months' time, we shall do another one. Yeah. Maybe February time where it's a little bit gloomy, isn't it? And Christmas is over and all the lights are down.

And everyone's sort of thinking, right, New Year, what we do? doing. Well, we'll do another then. So send in what you want for us and I'll get through as many as I can. And you never know. We might even do one in the flesh. I'm really hoping so. Really, really hoping so. So watch this space. We might, we might do a live grief one, which will be really special, I think. Really special. Bring your tissues. Yeah. I'll certainly have mine. Right. Love you loads. And you, my darling. And everybody, thank you as always for listening on this Thursday, please follow, tell your friends, share, follow us on Instagram at NACCAS1 and at a, what's yours? LWN underscore Auntie Linney or the other way around.

Antalini, what am I? I know what I am, I'm a donut, it's Auntie Linney dot LwN. Is that all it is, yeah? Yeah, so follow us on Insta at NatCass 1. You can follow us on Facebook, Natalie Cassidy's Life with Nat, and Linney, what she just said there? What was it? It's an odd one to remember. It's Auntie Linney.

Dot Lw-L-W-N, life with Nats. Okay, fine. Auntie Linney. Dot LwN. There you go. Right, that's me. I'm off. See you all later.

Bye. Tada.