Life with Nat - EP195: Nat's Chats #8 - home education

Episode Date: January 31, 2026

Nat's dialled up some listeners for a chat! A deep dive into kids education, with a bit of focus on home education and how that works. Enjoy! xx Kellie Bright & Anna Maxwell Martin on Radio 4’s SEND in the Spotlight https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p0mksq4x/episodes/player Please subscribe, follow, and leave a review. xxx You can find us in all places here; ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://podfollow.com/lifewithnat/view⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ We're on Facebook: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.facebook.com/lifewithnatpod⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Nat's insta: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@natcass1⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Marc's insta: ⁠⁠⁠@camera_marc⁠⁠⁠ Neice's insta: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@natsnieces⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Tony's insta: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@tonycass68⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Linny's insta: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@auntielinny.lwn⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ MORE LIVE SHOW! 07/02/2026 Brighton, The Forge ⁠⁠⁠TICKETS⁠⁠⁠ 08/02/2026 Newcastle upon Tyne, The Stand ⁠⁠⁠TICKETS⁠⁠⁠ 25/02/2026 Folkestone, Quarterhouse ⁠⁠⁠TICKETS⁠⁠⁠ 28/02/2026 Colchester, Arts Centre ⁠⁠⁠TICKETS⁠⁠⁠ 07/03/2026 Manchester, Fairfield Social Club ⁠⁠⁠TICKETS⁠⁠⁠ 22/03/2026 Leeds, The Wardrobe ⁠⁠⁠TICKETS⁠⁠⁠ 29/03/2026 Bristol, The Gaffe - ⁠⁠⁠TICKETS⁠⁠⁠ Book Club: November's book - All Together for Christmas by Sarah Morgan & December's book (optional extra for the speedy readers) - A Heart for Christmas: Advent Romance by Sophie Jomain Nat’s solo chats - any rants always welcome!  Scraping the Barrel - SCAN AND SHOP VIRGIN NO LONGER! Bonce vs list! - Are you a list maker? Always collecting for Nostalgia Fest! What’s brewing with the Nieces - are we all skipping the end of summer, all of autumn and going straight to Christmas - Nat’s door is! Group chat ettiquette & pranks. Nice Lorraines… get in touch! Advent calendars & gift recommendations v. welcome! Things we’re nagging with Linny about - More lateness stories and some cleaning questions, please! The Tony talks chatter - Keep your DIY questions coming, also open to some saucy two paragraph stories for Tony to read out at the Southend show - think cheeky postcards (both in tone and length)! Can we make Tony an influencer and get him any freebies?  A 'Keep It Light Media' Production Sales, advertising, and general enquiries: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠[e-mail]⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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I'm going to talk about home education and schools. I think it's so important. Me as a mother, I've been through a lot of emotions regarding this subject because I do care immensely about education. I care about the children reading a lot. I've, from a very, very young age, always read to them, done a bedtime routine. And the kids have loved their books growing up. Then Eliza got to teenage years, if not a little bit before. And she sort of lost the love of reading, which I've mentioned in book club episodes before. But it is quite hard and difficult because you really want them to continue for their English and, you know, to expand their vocabulary really.

I don't really want Eliza to be saying like 15 times in a sentence, which I do hear a lot these days. You can correct me if I'm wrong, but if you do watch Love Island, which I don't, but if you ever do put it on or see clips, like, you know what I mean, like, like, and I know I say like as well, I think it is something that has come into the language, but I am aware of it and I try not to. So yeah, going off on a tangent, but I've always done extra curriculum stuff, lots of workbooks at home that I buy. I used to do a thing called Mrs. Wordsmith, which is still out there to expand vocabulary and stuff.

And I'm going to start by talking to a lovely lady called Camilla, who has her own business. And I just think it's going to be really, really fun. So bear with me. Hello. Hi, is that Camilla? Hi, yes it is. Oh, hi, hi, it's Nat here. How you doing?

Hi, Matt. I'm all right, thanks. I'm full of cold today, so apologies if I'm a bit croaky. That is all right. But it's lovely to speak to you. It's so lovely to talk to you. Thank you so much for your message. And I've just been discussing with my listeners,

just telling them how I feel about sort of a little bit of extra help at home. I've always been really into reading with the kids. I've always bought the odd workbook. I'm playing games with them, that sort of thing. It's just always been a... That's awesome. Well, also, I think I've been lucky. Camilla as well because I've had the time, you know, I have days off. I can schedule in that time.

And I think that's sort of something that we do need to remember when it comes to parents these days, but working their socks off and not being at home. So before I go into talking about home education with some mums who home educate their children and I'm going to talk to a couple of teachers, I just thought it would be lovely to hear about your business, why you started it and your passion about learning and school, home education. I just think it'd be great. Awesome. So I ended up falling into education by accident,

but although it's kind of one of those things where when you look back, it's like, oh yeah, things were kind of leading to this, it turns out. I just didn't realise at the time. But so I work with my mum even to this day. She'd always worked in childcare and education and started tutoring when I was quite young. Okay.

Then in my late teens, I started helping her out with that and that led to taking on some more pupils and just discovering a real love for working with children on either a one-to-one basis or small groups and just making it enjoyable for them. I've always really believed that learning can be fun. I love learning and making sure they're developing. But yeah, it's just it's a lifelong skill and it makes them so much more successful when they're older as well. They want to learn. So that's what I try to incorporate when I'm teaching them, even if it's at a young age. So you tutor, is that correct?

Yeah. Are you tutoring in the evenings with children who do go to school? Are you tutoring throughout the day for kids that don't go to a school, but they are home-educated? Yeah, I have tutor during the day over time, but what I tend to do now is I tutor in evenings and Saturday mornings. with children. And then quite a few years ago now, I started making my own resources because I was trying to find things that kind of fit my philosophy and taught the way that I wanted to teach and I couldn't find anything. So yeah, as well as teaching, I spent a lot of my days writing new material for children. That's fantastic. And what is it called? Because obviously

I've had a little look, but please tell the listeners. My materials are under my company Word So it's W-O-R-D-I-E-R. Online. So I have flashcards, online courses. That is all vocabulary-based games, workbooks, lots of pictures in there, making it really colourful. Is that for different ages, you know, throughout from preschool onward? So I made it mostly with ages 8 to 10 in mind. Okay. But I know a lot of the, so the words that I cover, a lot of those words come up in GCSE papers

and teenagers don't know them either. So I've had messages from parents saying they use the game with their seven-year-olds, they've used the flashcards with their nine-year-old and their 16-year-olds. So they cover quite a wide range. Does it make you sad to think that vocabulary and reading definitely has dwindled, hasn't it?

It definitely hasn't. I think for vocabulary especially, there's a decline in conversations. Like you say, with parents are really busy, they're coming home late or they're trying to get their children to all these activities because they want to give them the very best. But then it means that sometimes they can go a while without having a really in-depth conversation. And that's when the children pick up their vocab. Are you a mum, Camilla? I'm not.

No. Yeah, for health reasons. I'm sorry. I don't plan on. That's okay. I don't plan on having my own. kids, but I just work with hundreds of other children, which suits me. That's amazing.

I am guilty of what you just said. There can be evenings where I do the dinner. Eliza's 15, so she'll head upstairs. She'll do a bit of homework, but I will look round and it's two and a half hours later. And I think, oh, she's not here. You know, she's spent the evening in her room and be that on the phone. She is very chatty. So she isn't really a doom scroller

Just sat looking at the phone But she'll be on a video call to someone Or she'll be, you know, talking to people But she's still not talking to me And I think it's the hours go so quickly And it's so easy It's so easy And then I feel guilt and think

I haven't seen Eliza a lot this week But I'm doing stuff downstairs I'm busy, I've got to get Joni to bed You know, it is a real juggle for parents It is And you're doing everything you're doing everything you're doing is for them at the end of the day. I know.

But it is nice, I think with my materials, because some of them require that bit of interaction, it's nice to just even have 10 minutes where, you know, you had a bit of a laugh together and you maybe went off on a tangent and had a little chat. And those things are just so important in so many areas, academically, emotionally. Yeah, but we forget and you just don't make the time. I think that's modern life, isn't it? Yeah, I think so. And I think we do need to go back to basics sometimes with the children.

I really, really do. Oh, but thank you so much, honestly. So lovely to hear from you. And I know that you've kindly said you're going to send me some of your stuff. So Joni and I can have a little look at it. So that'll be absolutely brilliant. And I shall... I'd love to know what she thinks.

Yeah, I will let you know what she thinks. And I'll do a cheeky Instagram post for you as well and the business. I love to help small businesses out. So there you go. Oh, that's amazing. Thanks so much, thank you so much. And I hope you get over your cold

and I hope you have a great rest of the weekend. Cheers. You see, I love that. You see, I love that she's been brought up by her mum and has been around that kind of teaching, tutoring world and has wanted to go into that. I just think it's great. And I do think that we need to make time.

We've got to try and make some time to sit and talk to our kids. And that sounds so stupid And people listening might think, oh, how rude, you know, I do that But be honest with yourself Do you do that? I don't do it enough.

We're going to talk now To Tina And Tina Home Educates And I'm going to be very interested To hear her story So let's give her a tinkle, shall we? Hello?

Hello, is that Tina? It is Tina. Hello, Nat. Oh, how are you? I'm all right. Oh. Satie going, oh my God, Natalie Cassidy's going to ring me. Do you know what?

I've run over a little bit tonight because I had an episode with Auntie Linney. And you know what we're like? We don't stop talking. So we've gone over a little bit. Are you all right yourself? I'm all good, thanks, Tina. I've just been having a chat with a lovely lady who has online materials and tutors and stuff, which is really interesting.

She didn't have children of her own. But again, this pod, this Natch chats is trying to just gauge what everybody feels about what they're doing. And there's no right and there's no wrong. But for me, I've always thought about home education. And I've always thought, if I didn't need to go to work, would I have done it? Because in COVID, I truly love. the schooling. I loved schooling the children. And I know there wasn't many people that could say that. I know people found it a struggle. But I really, really loved it. I think that's what opened our eyes to homeschooling.

Really? Through COVID. That actually you can do it. Yeah. And it's opening the door to new possibilities. It's like having a job and then going into a different career. That's how I've seen it personally. Well, tell us your story, Tina, if you don't mind. Basically, my 12-year-old has special needs and has always struggled with separation anxiety. Yeah. And school, because of his mental age. Yes.

But going through schools, it's always been a fight. Yeah. And in COVID, it really sent him a bit mad. He really got frightened by He couldn't even go and see Grandad Oh bless him So he didn't go back to school And that's what opened our eyes

That something has to change in life Yeah That we have a child that is so upset And you have people going It's fine, it's you It's you, it's you, it's fine And I said no, enough's enough now Yeah

And then once we got him home and you come out of the regimental school, things started to blossom. And you could see that various interests were that his interests have always been animals. Yeah. And you can do anything. You can do maths with animals. You're counting the food. You're weighing the food.

How many feeds they've got to have in a day? How many legs they've got? And that's what it's learning, a different way of, Yes. And more we carried on, the more we're going, look how happy he is. Look at the stress he's not got with education. And look how he's thriving in X, Y and Z, he's independent. He's choosing. And then it blossoms. The tree of learning blossoms so much. You think, ah. We may not be learning. We may not be learning. the sedimentary rocks of the Earth's car or whatever. Do you know what? My child can easily run nine ducks and care for them

and look after them and feed them and breed them and clean them. All by his own self. Yeah. And it's more independent life skills. I do know coming out of education, schools, schools they go or how are you going to manage and the council I don't know if this is the same for every council yeah but you do have to you do have to evidence what you're doing with your children because at any time you can have a knock at the door saying excuse me what are you doing

with your child yes as far as the government and the council and the social services I could have him locked under stairs oh yes I get that I understand understand that. Yeah, we do have to evidence what we do. We can't just sort of say, we'll go and sit in the cinema all day. No. So that's the other idea of it, because I do know quite a lot of people go, how do you know what to do?

You've just got to be the sensible adult. And I guess there is people out there that don't home educate to another person's level. I suppose that's the worry from me, if I'm honest with it. of you. I think, is it the right, let's put it this way. I hope that the people that have made the choice to do it are doing it for the right reasons. I suppose that's my worry. But I've never heard a negative story, but I don't know enough about it. It worries me that would I be doing enough? Do you think about your son, for instance, sitting exams or A levels or you're not worried? Do you want life skills, can you see different paths for him?

He won't be achieving exams. That isn't how my son is built. Yes. He really needs to learn life skills and living in the world we have now. Yeah. God forbid if we're not here. And that goes above priority of having GCSES in French. geography for saying sake.

Maybe one day he might do his GCSEs and his English and his maths, but you've just got to take every day as it comes. Absolutely. And there are so many wonderful apprenticeships out there. Like you say, he loves his animals. There are zoos. There are farms. You know, like you said, you've got to look outside the box.

If your child doesn't fit that education system, you know, I've been very, very fortunate, Tina. I do have two children that go to school with a smile on their face and they learn. And yes, we have our ups and downs. But I am very fortunate, you know, I don't have those worries. But I know there are thousands of people that do. Very much so. And it's taken a long time.

He was eight before we fully home educated him. We did try. We tried every avenue possible. and it's also with the local authority and the education system that in our area where we live in Cumbria, we don't have the facilities that maybe London has and the schools that could possibly fit him in. Yes, I understand.

Which give you also another opening to home educate. Because if you've got nowhere to go and nowhere that's right for him, I've got to do something about it. Yeah, absolutely. Well, I think you're wonderful what you've done. It's amazing. There's some days where I don't. There's some days I want to hide in my wardrobe and cry.

I'm sure, I'm sure it is, because I tell you now, I know that what you're doing, you're not having a break. You're not having you time. And I just think it's a very, very selfless thing to do. So I think it's very special. and I really look up to you and I really, really hope that it continues

being a positive experience for you. Thank you. It's a scary opportunity. Yeah. But you've just got to, you play the hands at the car, the player of the cards that hand has dealt you.

Absolutely. Yeah. Oh, you sound like me now. All I do is get my words mixed up. Yeah. Well, that's menopause thought, unfortunately. Well, Tina, thank you. Thanks for taking the time

to talk to me and um thank you keep it keep on listening and i'm no doubt talk to you again soon yep we'll do and i'll keep listening cheers tina lots of love all right thanks bye see that's something else that you don't think about you know i'm in hartfordshire i'm 40 minutes to london central london on the train we do have a lot that's accessible to us down here you don't realize different throughout the UK, that they haven't got the materials or the places or the support they need. You know, I love doing these because it is mind-blowing. Local news is in decline across Canada, and this is bad news for all of us. With less local news, noise, rumors and misinformation fill the void,

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For panoramic volume with lashes that are so fanned out, eyes appear 1.4 times bigger. See life in panorama because you're worth it. Shop L'Oreal-Paris Panorama Mascara on Amazon now. We're going to talk to Sophie next, who's a teacher. So a completely different take. And let's see what she thinks about home education, who she teaches, what she sees in the classroom. Just find it fascinating. Hello.

Hi, is that Sophie? Yeah, speaking. Oh, it's Natalie Cassidy here. Hi, Natalie. How are you? I'm all right. How are you? I'm good, thank you. Yeah. Good. Good. Thank you so much for talking to me. That's okay. Welcome.

It's such a huge subject this and I'm in the middle of the pod and there is so much trump pick. I can't go into everything but I've, you know, spoken to a couple of people and I just thought it'd be really lovely to talk to a teacher about what, just about, well, everything, anything you want to talk about regarding education. You know, what age do you teach? How long have you been teaching? Do you love it? What do you see in the children in the classroom? Have you got any worries? I've got a million questions.

So tell me all. Okay. I teach in a primary school. I teach year six at the moment, but I have to all three school right from reception up to year six. And I've been doing it. This is the 27th year of a senior teacher for me. So I started in 1998,

and things have changed a lot since I started teaching. Some for the better. Well, a lot for the better, actually. My main thought about it, is that it depends on where you teach and what your school environment is like as an adult. And then what is offered then to the children because of that, really. I've taught in four different schools and had quite different experiences from my side of it. I'm sure the children had the same experience, but it's different when you're the teacher

because, you know, rules are put in place for different things. That is so interesting. So is it your teaching experience, those four schools? Were they in the same area or have you moved around a bit? They've been in three different counties because I kind of lived on the edge of, I lived in very North Hartfordshire, so I've been in Cambershire, Bedfordshire, and I then moved to Essex and I teach in Essex now. Okay, okay.

So it's more about leadership and how the school is being run rather than county-wise, I would say, in my experience. Okay, okay. Just different head teachers have different visions about how things work. So some of them align really well with your sort of vision and ethics of a teacher and some of them less so. But, you know, you work in that environment so you make that work how you can within those parameters really. Yeah, but the children are all the reason that we all do it, teachers. If you speak to any teacher, I'm sure they'd say the same thing.

It's, you know, there's not many perks to it other than people think that we have long holidays. and work nine till three, which is absolutely not the case. No, I know that my primary store up the road. They're lights are on at 7am and they're certainly not leaving at 3 o'clock, that's for sure. Yeah, I'm at work at 7, yeah, absolutely, just to get ahead of the game really. But the pressures are there, but it depends on how it's being run, whether the pressures are on you, the children or not, if that makes sense. Yeah, no, it does.

Yeah, the school I currently work at is the best school I've worked out. I love it so much. and I travel a good 30 miles a day. Okay. Each way to get to it because I enjoy working there so much. Well, that's lovely. That says something, doesn't it? Sometimes, you know, you have to take consideration times and what have you.

But actually, for the enjoyment of the majority of your week to travel a little bit more, it's sometimes worth it, isn't it? Yeah, totally. I definitely agree with that. I've worked at schools closer to home before, and it's been different experience. But it's just run very well. and everybody who works there really likes it. And therefore the children have a really good experience as well

because we're all happy within our work. So we're able to give them more time and thought over what it is that we want to get through with them and how we want to teach them and different experiences we want to give them because we're all feeling comfortable in our environment as well. That does make a big difference to them, I think. I completely agree. And I think it's the same as anything. If you're happy, that's your happiness shines through to whoever you're talking to,

in my case acting with or your teaching you have to be content and if you're not content that does shine through I think in whatever you're doing and the work that you do and sometimes that is quite hard to hide if you're not feeling it but obviously with children you get quite good at being an actor yes like you're doing as a job but we we are acting all day every day really and it's you do let them see your own personality obviously but you do have to be you have a bit of a front on you, I suppose you'd say. I don't know. I described that. I completely agree. The teachers that I know at the moment at my daughter's school, there's definitely that kind of that bubbliness, that light, that come on, let's go, that kind of entertainment almost for the

children to keep them focused, to keep them engaged. So I completely agree with you. Feeling welcome in your classroom as well. You want them to feel welcome there. So you do give a bit of yourself so that they feel like they've got a connection with you. Yes. And when our year six is leave and then sometimes come back to either pick up younger siblings from school or come to, we had several come to our Christmas fate this year, which was immediately after school. And they have no siblings at school and they still came back because they wanted to see everybody. So that really makes you feel like you've done a really good job. That is so special, isn't it? I have that as well with a lot. I have it with my oldest, you know, she'll pop back to the primary school and give a

year six teacher a great big cuddle. And it is very, very special. Yeah. Especially as year six is a bit full on with sats and things, which are another issue that, a longer discussion, I think. Well, I think so as well. I really do. What do you think about home education? How important is it do you think to go to school? Well, obviously, I'm really pro-school.

Yes. That's my job. But also I'm doing that. I've been doing that. That's why I went to university to train to do. So I will say to my class, I've never left school. I started at four and I'm still here at 50 this year because I love it so much. So the experiences and the time and the teamwork and the social aspect of it is of equal importance really than the educational academic aspects there.

Yes. For me, I was talking to my nephew actually today. We've had a family thing today and he left one school in the summer and the place at his new school for year eight wasn't available until he just started before Christmas. and he was saying how much he felt sad, didn't ever sleep at home because he was at home all the time. He was doing schooling at home, but he wasn't getting that sort of physical activity or challenge with other people and found it really had a negative effect on him personally. That's kind of my only contact with anyone who has been homeschooled, other than what you see on the internet, which is not always exactly curated, is it?

It's always a little bit of, like you say about Instagram, it's the best moment. of the day. Yeah, that's true. That is true. I see a few people on things like TikTok, you know, homeschool parents showing what they've done and it looks great, but we don't see the whole story. The process, do we? Yeah.

And I don't know, you know, I'm not going to put anyone down for doing it because that's obviously a personal decision about their child. But, you know, I trained for four years to do this job. So I have all of that plus the 26 years experience in knowing the best ways to help children learn. Yeah, no, I don't know. Completely get that. Yeah.

Gosh. I think it would be hard to go in blind, as it were, without those sort of background information about how to learn. And, you know, I'm sure you've learnt that on your course recently. There's more to it than meets the eye in those sort of jobs, the caring jobs, aren't there? Yes, I think there are. And also, I think you have to be a certain person to care and have empathy and to want to sort of do those things.

So again, I, I just wonder about who is being homeschooled and are they doing it for the right reason. Yeah. I'm sure that the other thing is I don't know, there are so many, I know so many people myself. There are millions and millions of families who feel that their child just isn't right

for the education system that we have in place. You know, there's so many families struggling. That's been a wider issue, isn't it, rather than homeschool necessarily always being the right solution. for those children. Yes. You know, it's more of a wider discussion around education as a whole, isn't it? Because we make work well what we can and what we have at our fingertips

and we make it work the best we can for the vast majority of children in our care. But there will always be parents who, as you said, see that differently than we do even. And their children are very different at school and at home as well. So, yeah, I think we have more patience perhaps with 30 children than you might with your own child at home all day on their own. I think that's the best, most sensible and true thing that will be said on this podcast,

quite frankly, Sophie. Yeah, it's easier to be patient with other people's family members than potentially people that you're that close with because you go home at the end of the day and you start again tomorrow with them, whereas if you've got them at home with you constantly morning, day and evening and night,

it's, yeah, I think everybody knows what holidays can be like. I don't know. I don't know. I think it's something that you'd have to work out if that works for you and your family. Absolutely. No, I completely agree. Oh, Sophie, thank you. Honestly, fascinating. It's just so nice to have a little natter about it all. I'm not going into great detail, because as I always say on my pod, you know, this isn't a subject that I know loads about, but I do have two children that go to school and I really appreciate all teachers that have ever taught them. And it just really, you know, is an interesting thought to me, the home education side of thing. So it was lovely to get a

teacher on and lovely to talk to you and thank you. Thank you for everything you do. Oh no, you're welcome. It's hard work but it's definitely worth it. Thanks Sophie. No, that is amazing. Okay. Thank you so much. Cheers. Have a great weekend. You too. And you. Bye. Teaching is one of those things, isn't it? It's like nurses. I don't think teachers get thanked enough. And I think when they've been on strike before or you hear teachers complaining about their pay. There are a lot of people who are a bit, you know, oh, exactly what Sophie said. They get long holidays. Nine till three, that's all right, when that isn't the case at all. And they are trying to give the best to our children with the resources they have, you know,

I'm sure they'd love another two or three teaching assistants, you know, more send trained teachers to help in classrooms. But it's not their fault and they're doing the best they can. Lovely to talk to Sophie. Really, really was. I'm going to have a little chat now to Liz from Cheshire. Let's see what Liz has got to say. She teaches from home.

Hello. Hiya, is that Liz? Yes, it is. Hello, Liz. It's Natalie here. How yeah? How are you doing? I'm all right.

How are you? How's your weekend going? Yes, it's all right. Pretty slow, to be honest. Is it? Is it? Well, that's good. That's nice.

So Liz, thank you for getting in touch with me regarding home education. An episode which is kind of, I'm just very open to hearing about everything really, because I have got two daughters who go to school. I've always gone to school. I've been very, very fortunate that they go to school with a smile on their face. I know how lucky I am for that. When COVID hit, I really, really enjoyed homeschooling them. I really enjoyed it.

I got them up every day. We did loads of work. We had a break. We'd then do PE. And I really enjoyed it. I didn't find it a struggle. And it has crossed my brain. You know, if I didn't financially have to go and earn my money,

because it's really important that I do so, would I have really enjoyed doing it? myself. So that's where I am and I would love to hear your story. My story is, I guess, but it's obviously going to be different. It's funny you mention lockdown because, you know, it was so funny to have so many different takes on how people, you know, different friends and family and, you know, the homemade community, we were just like, well, you know, we're not really leaving the house very much, but it's just sort of day to day for us. Yes, absolutely.

And I did have a friend actually who, they decided to take their child out of school. They'd enjoyed it so much, you know, exactly like you're saying. They were like, oh, no, this is much more fun. We'll do it this way. But yeah, for me, it wasn't really a choice. It was a necessity. It was never something that I'd thought about at all until I met my daughter. Yeah.

She was nearly three when she was adopted. Yes. And so you automatically are coming at everything with a slightly different lens. I'm sure you are. I'm sure you are. Oh, excuse me. That's all right. For some reason, she goes off at half five every day and I thought I'd stop this.

She fancies a party, ready for a Saturday night boogie, I think. I don't know why. It's like I thought every time I think I've sussed it. I've stopped it. I'll tell you, honestly, technology will always piss us off. Don't worry about it, Liz. I know. It's just like, oh, I'm a bit myth now because I thought I'd actually fix that.

No, mind. Oh, never mind. Never mind. So we took quite a different approach to school in the first place because she's end of July birthday. And we'd only known her about, well, not much more than a year. Yes. When she should have started school, we delayed for a year so that she started age five rather than just four.

And that gave her more time at home. It makes perfect sense because my daughter Eliza is September the 24th. So therefore, there's nothing in it. It's ridiculous. No. So, yes, I get why you did that. But even then, we only lasted eight weeks. Right.

Okay. There's a combo of things really. And at the time, it was just sort of supporting her and seeing what she needed. Obviously, now I've known her for almost 12 years. Yeah. We've learned a lot more about her. And so much of it makes more sense now. So things like she's now diagnosed autistic and ADHD.

As well as the difficulties that come with a trauma background. And you put all that together in a busy resect. classroom away from any sort of safety net. And yeah. Yeah. Yeah. She just, she just, I can't imagine really. I can't imagine.

And I know other people's stories, very similar to you. And I just don't think school, as we know it, is right, is right for many, many people with many, many aspects of their life, not being the bog standard, get up, go to school, smile, come home, do your homework. There's so, so many people in this world that it doesn't cater for. And I'm not blaming them. I'm just saying there's not, there's not an, I don't know what the answer is. I know that my darling friend Kelly Bright has been doing a podcast on BBC Radio 4 all about Sen and all, you know, amazing. Yeah. You know, it sounds amazing. I don't listen to it because I don't, you know, it's not,

it's not in my life. I've seen clips of that actually, but I haven't realised it was like a regular podcast. Well, I think she's been on a couple of times. And also, I know that lovely Anna, Anna, Maxwell Martin, I know she does a lot, you know, a lot of sort of campaigning and speaking out regarding all of this situation. And, you know, there are people out there. for you guys, I think, that, you know, you can relate to them. Unfortunately, this is not a subject I can relate to. And that's why I'm sitting here and listening to people's stories

about why they're at home with their child, you know, and it all makes perfect sense to me. It really does. I think it is one of those things that until you've actually lived it, it's almost impossible to comprehend sometimes. And so, you know, the amount of advocacy work that's being done now is just fantastic. Yeah. And we're really lucky that we've had so much support from friends who, like you've said, you know, then it's not their situation.

But they've been happy to listen and, you know, be supportive. Yeah. Which just means everything because the difference it makes when somebody is just prepared to say, okay, what does she need? Yes. So many things are possible if someone just asks. Yes. What do they actually need?

And then you go, well, this is, you know, for the majority of the time, we're just starting to make some progress with this now. But for the whole time, really what she's needed is me to be right there. Yes. And you don't get a break at all. No. No. But with that, you know, we've slowly built up things that she,

can go and do, you know, with me. I mean, oh, I'm thinking about it now, like guiding, for example. We've been a girl guiding since she was five. Yes. And it was something that I'd done as a child. So she probably would have started at the same sort of time she started school, to be fair. Yes, yeah. But I said, you know, I have to come with her, but I had a background in guiding before.

I was already a leader. like before just like when I was 18 but also those groups love volunteers don't they so that's a really good thing that's worked for you hasn't it to be there you know it's not out of the ordinary for mothers or parents or grandparents to be at those clubs so it works

bite your arm off oh yes of course please do you know we've been very fortunate that the group where she is the rainbows there's connection there's some leaders that are all also in the brownies. And some of those leaders then also lead a connected guide unit. Yeah.

And now, so she's now over 14, so she's wanting to be a young leader. Yes. And she actually, with the support of someone who's known her since she was seven, I just sat there. I was still there, but I just sat there. She actually helped run an activity and speak to, you know, like gathered the brownies around and was like, you do this, you do that, we're off, you know.

And it was like, oh my goodness. That must have been such a moment for you to sit and watch. It was just like, this is phenomenal, but you can't, you can't say that. You can't say, oh, this is exciting. You have to just sit there, is it this is completely normal. I'm not inside going, oh my God, my God, this is so exciting. We have to do a lot of that around here. It's like, oh, this is totally normal that this happens.

Whenever something exciting happens. That's quite a common thing with a lot of autistic children that I know. You know, it's like just present the opportunities and the things and then just give them a chance to do it and then go, oh, okay, that was good. Yeah. And all, all right, now should we do this and pretend that this exciting thing never happened. Wow. Do a lot of that. You learn and you adapt and home educating means that we can do what works for her.

at her pace and she can achieve things that just coping, as soon as you put multiple people in a room she starts to struggle just from a sensory perspective

even when they're people she likes without even thinking about sit down, concentrate by yourself you know, school still very difficult and you mentioned before I've seen her do a post about

this on some sort of podcast. Yes. The government have cut the adoption support fund this year as they seem to be cutting everything. But, you know, because we have access to the adoption support fund, not very much funding, granted, is given for therapeutic support. But, you know, we can prioritise a day. You know, Tuesday is she has an animal therapy session and she has her trauma therapy. session and it's just, you know, it's therapy day.

Well, that's so important. And being able to have that time and space to process things now as a child, you know, the longer you leave it to process things, obviously the harder it can be. So that's what it's meant for her, really. Yeah. I don't think absolutely incredible and it is great that there is that little bit of funding in place, but I do feel they need to go a lot longer, a lot more money, a lot better in terms of education and special educational needs

and, you know, just all of the programs that people are fighting for where they know that their children needs it and it can take years and years and years. And, you know, it's an eye-opener when I hear these stories. It really is. And I've worked with quite a lot of children who, have, it's not strictly home education, but it's like funded, educated other than at school, which is the solution that you can come to through a massive site if, you know, a special needs placement either can't be found and can't be suited.

And then the local authority has to find education in some way and that's how these plans can come into place. Right. I've never gone down that route. It's one where I sort of sit on the fence. because they keep changing the goalposts. And the control that they're trying to bring in to home-educating families

and special needs schools and education healthcare plans would potentially mean that me asking for that support for her could mean that they turn around and say she has to go into this environment. Yes, or she has to do this amount of work. Or, yeah, or like you say, change of routine is hard as well, isn't it? It's a tricky one because I'm like, well, that's a gamble.

A gamble that all this work we've done for her could then be lost. Yeah. So... It's just a lot, isn't it? It's a lot for you to take on. And as her mother and a wonderful one for all those years, financially, you know, obviously you're at home and she's your life, you know, but why if people can't do that? What if they've got to go to work?

What do you do? I'm just asking you as someone who has no idea how it works. I think it really depends. I mean, there's so much, if you are really curious, there are so many different ways of earning money. Yes. When we first started home educating, I was married. I was doing two or three days of work.

My husband was working full time. We had, actually we had my daughter's foster carer who, she still had a really good relationship with, would have her for one day a week. And they both just loved it. And we had support from grandparents to enable me to work a bit. Yes. When my husband left, it was trickier, and I'm not going to lie. Yeah. And I'm also in a situation where I'm disabled.

and so even if I wanted to, I physically couldn't work full-time. Right. So it's a really tricky balance of needs that you just kind of have to keep going. We do at this point because my health has declined quite a lot. I'm sorry to hear that. We rely on benefits because we just, we literally don't have another option. Yeah. If I did borsa into school, I couldn't, you know, manage.

but we are having sports and battles getting some support from social care teams now like as in disability support funded support hours to help me to do things, her to do things which has been a, you know, it's nothing to do with home education. No, no, of course, but the social care system, you know, again, health and social care, that's what I've just been doing. I've done my course on that, my level three, MVQ. I don't know bundles about it. but it's so important. It's so important.

And that helps. I was going to say, well, it helps everything. You say it's not about that. Everything links up. It's lifestyle. Your health, how you feel, what you can manage to do.

It's a domino effect of everything else. How you care for people, what you can do, education, everything. You know, so I'm pleased to hear that, please God, you know, that that support continues for you. I think you're one.

wonderful and I think don't ever doubt what you do because I think you have to go with your gut and you've got like you say there is no other option you just go for what you know is best to do and that's what you've been doing for all these years and it's obviously working because of what look at the night you had on Thursday and the pride that you felt yeah that's true yeah so yeah yeah you know thank you so much for talking to me liz sorry thank you no I really appreciate it and I hope you and your daughter have a lovely rest of the weekend. Thank you. All right. Thanks Liz.

Bye. And there is Liz. Isn't it amazing what people's lives are like and what people go through? I say it all the time don't I? Should get it tattooed on my forehead perhaps but we don't know how lucky we are, do we? We have no idea at how privileged and lucky we are. I should be playing this.

to my children, that is for sure. Adobe Acrobat Studio, your new foundation. Use PDF spaces to generate a presentation. Grab your docks, your permits, your moves. AI levels of your pitch gets it in a groove. Choose a template with your timeless cool. Come on now, let's flex those two. Drive design, deliver, make it sing.

AI builds the deck so you can build that thing. Do that, do that, do that with Acrobat. Learn more at a table. doby.com slash do that with Acrobat. Now streaming on Paramount Plus. It began on the shores of New Jersey. The calls of gym, tan, laundry, reverberated north to Canada, where a new type of party animal resides. They move as a herd migrating to their favorite watering holes, asserting dominance by flexing, grinding, and twerking.

Coupling is quick, steamy, and sometimes in hot tubs. When morning arrives, they do it all over again. Canada Shore, new original series, now streaming on Paramount Plus. The podcast that I was talking about people is Send in the spotlight. And that is BBC Radio 4, I believe. So it's, you know, all different people's experiences around Send. And I think anybody who is interested in that should have a list. listen, because I've only seen clips, as I say, on Instagram on BBC Woman's Hour with my dear

friend Kelly Bright and Anna Maxwell Martin there. But there's lots of episodes and I just think, again, I can't relate to that subject, but there's lots of different stuff out there, stuff out there that can help you. And that's sometimes why social media and podcasting and those sorts of things, I think in this day and age are helpful, you know, YouTube, we can poo-poo all of these things. But I think when you are looking for like-minded people in like-minded situations, those places can now be a bit of a godsend for people, for community, and to discuss things you're going through with strangers that are going through the same. And I think that's really, really important, so important.

As I've said about these little Natch chats, there can be episodes that you might pop and think, well, really, it's not very relevant to me and I'm not interested. The reason I want to pop them out on a Saturday morning, and they are audio only, is because I love the radio. And radio to me is a lovely hum in the background, be it BBC Radio 2, BBC Radio 4,

but I love just having it on sometimes and not even listening to it. So sometimes I think that's what this could be for people as well. You know, just the sound of a voice that you enjoy and even if it's something you're not interested in, pop it on in the background and have that familiar voice there with you. I've had so many messages saying that people fall asleep to it or they pop it on when they're doing their cleaning and life within that brings comfort. So just these little bonuses, you know, every now and again when I can, they will be on Saturday mornings

when I can fit them in. I hope they just bring you that little bit more company. I have got one last caller to talk to. And Pippa sent me a few messages. She is a teacher. But she also just is talking about life and dropping the balls and worrying about everything as we all do as women. Job, life, home, fitness, blah, blah, blah. So I thought we'd end this little chat with Pippa

chatting a bit about her job but also a bit of life in general. Hello. Hi, is that Pippa? It is. Oh, how are you doing? Very well, how are you? You're right? Very good, thank you.

Not too bad on this Saturday, 532nd day of January. Yeah, isn't it just? Isn't it just? We got paid yesterday, so life is slightly better than it was two days ago. Oh, very, very good. So you sent me a message, thank you so much. You've sent me a couple actually over the time. Oh, yeah, I think I did actually.

Yeah, you have, which is lovely. But I wanted to talk to you really about teaching and, you know, how important it is to you to be a teacher and to be with children all day and, you know, what you think about home education and just everything, really. How long have you been a teacher? I went into teaching relatively late. Yes. There's, what my now, 51, so I was probably in my mid-30s, I guess.

Okay. And I decided to go into teaching really, you know, because it fitted better with family life. I used to do a lot of event management. I was travelling a lot away. Yeah. And it just didn't really work with my daughter's 21 now, but at the time she was, you know, relatively small. It just didn't really work.

And, you know, I started doing a bit of work in schools because I'm also a musician. So I started doing a bit of music teaching, etc. In schools. And then, you know, sort of ended up bits and pieces. And I thought, actually, I better just do the qualification and, you know, have the class teaching as something that will hopefully fit with my life. Yes, yeah.

Yeah, and I've always taught year six. So, yeah, for anyone listening who doesn't know what that is, right at the top end of primary, just before they're going to go to secondaries. They're kind of 10. 10, 11, aren't they? Yeah. And I've taught in both state and private.

I'm in private at the moment. I'm taught in state and private. I've done stats in both, so, you know, kind of, you know, there's not much difference, really, day-to-day. No. For me, personally, I mean, you know, I can only speak for my experience, but, yeah, pretty similar. slightly longer holidays in private, but again, not massively long ones.

We're not a kind of posh private school, if you like, you know, that, you know, that sort of massive long holidays and, you know, Ferrari's drawing up outside. It's only normal school, really, but very nice. Yes. So when you're with your children, and obviously you've been teaching now for roughly 20 years, 15 years. 15 years, yeah, 15 years, yeah. Have you seen a large change in children in terms of how they are at school in terms of technology?

Yes. So I think there were changes before COVID, but I think there's been many more changes in terms of how children are since COVID. Certainly the children that I'm getting through now obviously were still some of them preschool. Yes. I think some of those formative years were lost in terms of them. normal interaction in a, in inverted commas, normal classroom with, you know, with their peers, as it were. Yes. In terms of technology, I mean, frankly, it's a pain in the...

Backside. Yes, exactly right. Because when they get to year five and six, a year six particularly, you know, once they start getting phones, we do a lot of work on safety on the phone and, you know, what they should and shouldn't be on and all those things. And obviously, a lot of them are gaming as well. that's also a thing. I mean, at the risk of sounding a little bit sexist, it is mostly the boys.

Though we do have girls at game, but mostly, certainly for my personal experience, it's mostly the boys that are into gaming and chatting to each other on the games. And as I understand, you can also chat to other people on games. So it's making sure they know who it is there talking to. Well, absolutely, absolutely. But also, that's a whole, you know, you're trying to educate the children, and you've got another whole level of things to educate them in now. Totally.

And, you know, I mean, I am a parent as well. And, you know, I remember when my daughter was younger, you know, I would say to her randomly, right, hand the phone over, unlock it. And, you know, I never found anything other than, you know, teenage silliness, but I never found anything inappropriate. I said to her, you know, I'm doing this for two reasons. One to check that nobody's being nasty or bullying you. But actually, I also want to check that you're not.

being nasty to anybody else. Yes. Because it's very easy for them to say things on a text message that they wouldn't say to somebody's face. Yes, I completely agree with you. You know, and I love my daughter dearly, but I'm very well aware of what teenagers can be like. And, you know, it's a, it was much easier, I think.

Certainly for me, I mean, I'm 51, so I was at school in the 80s. If you had an issue at school, you went home, you went to, you? And it didn't carry on all evening. So true. So true. You'd come home, weren't you? And you were just at home. You'd have your tea.

You'd watch your telly. and you could switch off. You know, my dad would be saying, you know, six o'clock, it's cheaper. You can talk to your friends for a bit, but you'd be talking to your friends, you know, sat on the bottom step, you know, and then everyone walking, you know, there was no sort of, you know, private messages or privacy or anything. And then it was like, right, you've been on there long enough now, you know.

Yeah. You couldn't have been, and you had to wait until after six o'clock. And, you know, in my house, you know, you didn't ring anybody after 8 o'clock. That was just considered, you know, it just wasn't the thing, you know. And whereas some of them are still talking to each other at 10, 11 o'clock. And I think it's definitely affecting sleep and consternation. concentration and all of those things. And obviously that's a general comment because not all, you know, it doesn't apply to every child.

No, but I think we all know that is the case, you know, and I think. Yeah, absolutely. I also think a lot of smart free childhood, you know, they're doing so well now and we've got the petitions going and they're talking about it and the House of Lords and it's all kicking off, which I personally think, thank God it is. Yeah, absolutely, because I think, you know, children have forgotten how to talk to each other. Yes. And it affects as a teacher, it affects the way they write

because they think that what they write on a text message, you know, they're using the sort of slang and no... Wow. I say, right, boring, old fart now, but, you know, no capital letters at the start of sentences, you know, abbreviations for just about everything, and language that we don't even understand, you know, these abbreviations. And I'm thinking, what earth are you talking about?

Someone's going to have to explain to me what it is you're talking about because I have no idea. And they laugh at me, you know, my class, oh, you know, she's not got a clue, but I don't have a clue. I don't know what you're talking about, so you're going to need to explain it to me. I do find that, oh, I don't know. I don't know whether we're old dinosaurs now. I mean, you know, language over the years, hundreds of years ago, if you read text,

it has changed immensely. Absolutely. Are we going through that shift? But at the same time, you shouldn't know how to use a capital letter, I believe. So I don't, you know. Yeah. It's a really different... My daughter laughs at me, you know, because I, you know, I write my text messages like I would

write, actually write something to someone, you know, so, you know, might have got semicolons in them and everything, which is ridiculous, I know, but, and that's probably too far the other way, but you know what to mean? There isn't that, I swear, if my class could write, you know, a whole piece of work with emojis, they would love that because that's kind of how they, yeah, that's how they communicate. Yeah, absolutely. And the verbal art of communication, we work very hard on it. I work very, very hard on being able to, you know, actually articulate your, yourself and oracy has been put back very strongly in the in the curriculum the writing curriculum has changed since uh july 25 they brought out a new thing and and in it was a lot about oracy

and being able to speak out loud and being able to articulate your ideas because that's kind of been lost yes through through a whole kind of texting and stuff i mean how often do you write anything down physically with a pencil or a pen i mean i very rarely write i i i do marking my kids books I have to say that is purely because, again, everyone has a go at me, but I have a paper diary. I write. Okay, interesting. In fact, when I did my Level 3, MVQ for Health and Social Care course, and because I've never sat, I've never done anything on a computer. So, you know, scrolling, scrolling along, looking at shopping or holidays or whatever.

Yes, but in terms of... That's not the same as working on there, is it? Yeah, exactly. I've never worked on a computer. So for me, I actually, I did everything by hand and then I had to type it out. I found it all really hard because I do everything by hand. So I'm the complete opposite, really. Right, okay.

Yeah. Yeah, I mean, I've sort of embraced it, I think, but not in the, not in the kind of missing out, missing out punctuation and missing out letters and talking in what appears to be a different language sometimes. Yeah, that is an eye opener to hear. That really is an eye opener. Wow. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, if you read text, you know, if you read a text message, it's, yeah, quite often, you know, and weirdly, my daughter is 21 and she's actually very articulate. Yes.

But when she texts, I think, have you not actually, you know, but if she sent an email, like a proper, like a professional email, it would be beautiful, punctuated beautifully. So I know she knows how to do it, but for some reason, text messages seem to be a, you know, a different language. Well, I think, I kind of get, I think it's. the speed of things and you're quite right because my Eliza's 15. So if she is, you know, composing an email to a teacher, she knows how to write. Exactly. She wouldn't be writing in slang. No, she wouldn't be writing in slang.

And it is a worry that children are writing in slang in a classroom. That is a worry to me. And again, it's a different generation. It's a younger generation. We obviously try and make sure that all writing is at the level it should be. but, you know, for some children, their natural default is how they would, you know, I think more for, you know, year seven and above than for mine, obviously, because mine have only just sort of got mobile phones in year six.

You know, a lot of them get them prior to secondary school, as it were. Yeah. But certainly, you know, I think if you went into a year seven or eight classroom, you would find a worrying level in some. I mean, obviously, again, you know. I know, I know, we're generalising. Yeah, of course. But you definitely would find in some places that you, you know, you would find people who actually don't really know how to construct a proper sentence with all the correct bits and pieces in it because they don't have to do it really, you know.

Yeah. Which is why I worked really hard with my year sixes to make sure they leave with a really good level of written English. Whether, of course, it carries through to their text messages stuff, I don't suppose it does, but at least I know they can write something. And if they can differentiate the two, you know, that's a. thing, isn't it? Exactly. If you know how to differentiate it and you know who you're talking to. No, what's appropriate. Exactly. Yeah. It's exactly right. Wow. That's amazing.

Absolutely amazing, really. It's an eye-opener, isn't it? It really is, yeah. What do you think about home education? If you'd ask me five years ago, I probably, or before COVID, I probably would have said, to be honest, I think I probably had a misconception of it. I just thought home education meant literally sitting down at home with a parent and basically doing the work that I would have done with the child as a teacher in the classroom. Yes.

Obviously, I think COVID was a, you know, because obviously I taught online in COVID during COVID and we basically taught a full-time table on Zoom. So I taught pretty much my normal lessons. I marked the work normally. You know, they turned it in on Google classroom as opposed to, obviously, but, you know, but I taught a full, carried on with the curriculum.

We didn't just sort of set work for children to do. And I expected all my children to be present for maths and English and sitting up at the very least. I mean, they didn't have to be dressed in school uniform or anything, but, you know, I did have a no-pajamas rule. Yeah. Not because I mean, I'd love to, you know, I'd have been quite happy to sit in my pyjamas all day,

but I just think it changes the way you're ready to focus. Let me tell you, Pippa, with mine, they actually did get their uniform on at home. Did they? Yeah. It was the working day. Yeah, yeah. We sort of got ours, you know, once we'd got over the initial few days of, you know,

would you like to see my cat and, you know, my hamster and all the rest of it, you know. But I realised that wasn't homeschooling in the same way, because obviously they were still being taught. I've got a couple of friends who homeschool their children. Yes. I could never have done it. There would have been bloodshed and tears and tantrums,

and that would just be me. Yeah. I just don't think I could have done it. But what I understand about it is there is a lot of a really varied curriculum. So children's interests are able to be followed. There's a lot of going out and actually visiting places and using what they've learned to learn more. I think as a primary educator,

I mean, whilst I wouldn't have been able to do it in my own child because I just don't think she would have embraced that at all, what I wonder is how secondary age children are homeschooled. I mean, because as a parent, I mean, I'm a teacher, but I wouldn't like to try and delve into GCSE physics or something. No. You know, I'm just wondering how that works. I guess they dial in.

to things. I think so and I think the other thing is it's a completely different mindset. So it's not about the learning at school because I would imagine a huge percentage, if not all, those children aren't made for the education system that you and I are talking about. Which is, yeah, and that is, there's a lot to be said for the fact that children are being squeezed into a system that just isn't for them. Absolutely. You know, for sure. You know, there's a lot of children who have, you know, serious anxieties about going to school, or going anywhere, actually, not just going to school.

And school is fairly inflexible. For some children, that's great because they like the routine. Yep. Some children love the fact that, you know, I have children, I have taught children, you know, if maths is normally at 9 and English is at 10, if I have to change it around for some reason, it completely sends them, you know, they just can't cope. Yeah. They just can't cope at all.

They're just like, oh my, you know, what do you mean English is not now, you know? But other children would love the freedom to be able to learn when it works for them. Yeah. And I get that totally. Personally, it wouldn't suit me. I mean, there are online schools now, I believe. You know, there are actual schools that are online and you can register as effectively a member of that school. And all the lessons and activities are done online.

Wow, that's amazing. Which is not quite the same as homeschooling. that my understanding to homeschooling is parents teach you. Yes, right. But I think that's become less the case probably since COVID. And there's been so much more access to online resources for teaching. Yeah. And a lot of tutors do online.

Yeah, lessons. And yeah, of course, of course. It's a minefield, don't paper, isn't it? It is a minefield. And it's not a responsibility, even as a teacher, it's not a responsibility I would have wanted for my own child. No. because I would have just been worried that not so much a primary

but I would have been worried about my ability to make sure that they, you know, really knew the curriculum for whatever it was if it's not an area of my, you know, that I knew much about. Knowledge that you know, yeah, absolutely. No, I completely agree with you. Oh, it's a complete minefield, but yeah, thank you so much. So it's so lovely to talk to you.

My pleasure. Yeah, thanks so much for picking up the phone and reaching out and talking to me. No problem at all. No problem at all. Enjoy the rest of your weekend. I will do. We'll have to do my school work now.

Living the dream. Thanks, Pippa. All right. You take care. Thanks a lot. Bye. Bye. Bye.

Oh, lovely Pippa there. There you go. It is true. I think until you're in a situation with your child, you know best as a parent. You've got a gut instinct and you need to follow your gut, your heart, on what's best for your child. If you can do that, again, the situation that you find yourself in,

you might not be possible to do that. So I suppose this Little Natch Chats was just a tiny, tiny look into education, into schooling. And I hope that you've really enjoyed it. I hope it's giving you a little bit of food for thought. And these conversations are just there, just so we can be a little bit more inquisitive

about the things that we don't know a lot about. I hope you have a really cracking weekend. I hope you join me on Monday. 077-8-28-201919. Let me know your thoughts on this episode. Again, it's another one that we could just pick up. There's so much to talk about so many stories, so many people. But yeah, do let me know what you thought. And I will speak to you very, very soon. Loads of love now. See ya.