Life.Church with Craig Groeschel - Bonus: Pastor Craig Shares About Why We Need a Better Way

Episode Date: August 25, 2021

On this special, bonus episode, you’ll get to hear extended content from Pastor Craig about why we need a better way, what sparked his message series, A Better Way, and how we can have a healthier relationship with work and rest. This episode is the first in a 2-part miniseries to help you dive deeper into this series. Find the second episode, and others like it, at You’ve Heard It Said—Life.Church’s spiritual growth podcast for LifeGroups. To subscribe and get the Conversation Guide, visit https://www.life.church/yhisAbout You’ve Heard It SaidWant more meaningful conversations? We started this story-driven podcast to help LifeGroups and friends reclaim their time together. Listen before meeting, then use your time to do what matters most—talking about the episode, praying, and making memories together. Join us as we have honest discussions about the things that matter to you, the struggles you’re facing, and the spiritual truths that can guide you to a deeper understanding of who God made you to be.  Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Welcome to a bonus episode of the Life Church podcast. Today, we'll sit down with Pastor Craig Rochelle to talk about his current message series a better way. This special episode is from Life Church's spiritual growth podcast for life groups, You've heard it said. Today's episode is the first of a two-part series where Pastor Craig will provide extended content about the series for life groups to discuss. The other episode will be available exclusively on the You've Heard It Said podcast.

You can find everything you need and subscribe. at www.life.church slash YH-I-S. Now on to the show. Welcome to the You've Heard It Said podcast. This is Allie. And this is Jason. And I'm just excited that I get to sit with kind of an unprepared Alley. Is that fair? Is that fair to say? That is very fair. Yes. So today's conversation, we literally were like, let's just start recording and talk. So whatever comes out, you're hearing. And I'm excited because you got to talk with Pastor Craig just a few minutes ago. about how to live a better way.

And I just want to know, was anything he was saying already connecting with you? Like, what are you thinking right now? Yes, 100%. Every time I hear him talk, I always am like, oh, man, it's really good. But now I have all these action steps. And so I really liked one thing he shared was that people are really good at things on the first try. And I think about how in a better way series, the first week he's talking about, you know, why we need this better way and everything and healthier relationship with work and rest.

Yeah. And every time I try to rest, like take a Sabbath or something, it's a dumpster fire, Jason. Literally everything goes wrong. And it's just like, why did I even do this? And so I think just having him say, like, it's okay. Just try again next time. Yeah. It was like, oh, yeah, that's good advice.

Yeah. So if you're listening, you have permission to not already be good at this. That's why we're talking about it. And I'm just super excited because I get to say, let's go here from our pastor, Craig O'Show. Well, Pastor Craig, thank you so much. for taking some time to be on the You've heard It Said Podcasts with us. We're so excited to have you. And I know that life groups are going to have a really great conversation about your message series.

Oh, good. Thank you, Ellen. Glad to be here. And hello to the life groups? Well, I want to go back to something you said at the very beginning of your message that I think a lot of us can relate to. You're kind of talking about how sometimes it feels like we're checking off the right boxes. Like we're at life group. We're serving.

We're reading our Bibles. But we feel far from God or like our lives just aren't really working. And then I think about how you took time. off thinking this is going to help and then that's not exactly what happened. And so how did you process the disappointment of doing this good thing that didn't really turn out the way you expected? Right. Well, for one thing, I think rest is an incredibly important biblical perspective that we should take. And weekly rest is really important. And I can imagine all the people in life group right now that probably like me, we haven't always honored the Sabbath. And so that's a lot of

an issue and then disconnecting in our current culture, we're always, always, always, always, always connected. And you're probably too young to even remember a time when you could go somewhere and not have your phone ring or someone text you or know where you were the whole time and have an email, interrupt anything. And so I think that little by little, in many ways, you have progress with technology, but it's also become a prisoner to it. And so I think a lot of people, whether they have a grueling job or not, probably find themselves connected more often. And so we tried to disconnect and to really unwind. And the vacation didn't go exactly as we had hoped with a lot of things going the other way. But in many ways, we still were committed to it,

meaning even though we didn't have some of the fun or recreation that we wanted to be able to have, we still were taking time off. And that was good. I mean, it wasn't creating content, wasn't trying to a lot of the more difficult decisions that we have to make in the church and some of the heavy, weighty, ongoing pastoral concerns. And so we just pressed into it. It said, even though this isn't as fun or engaging as we'd want, it's still really, really important to rest. And so we went it that way. And ultimately, sometimes whenever life's not going your way, it's really easy to be upset or complain or be negative. And I ultimately had the sense and try to always keep the perspective that God, you are doing something. I don't like it. I'm excited about this and what I chose, but I want to

look for you in it. And so we continue to just try to look for what is God trying to teach us in the middle of this. And evidently, he had quite a bit to teach us. Yeah, that's really good. I like that you say that because sometimes I think we try these new disciplines and then we get kind of frustrated because it's like, we tried Sabbath and then our kid got sick or we tried something and it didn't really work out. And so for anybody who's maybe tried to implement some of these things in the past, but maybe it didn't go well the first time. What advice would you give them? I would say I would probably expect it not to go well the first time in most of what we try to do because we're really rarely great at something the first time. And this was my first kind of

extended break and I hope it won't be the last because I did learn some things about how to prepare for it, what we can do differently next time to maximize the recovery time. And so I think that's a part of it. It's really easy to give up when something doesn't go the way we wanted to. And sometimes even people say it must not be God's will or whatever, or it could be that you just aren't good at it yet, or it could be their spiritual opposition or whatever. So I think if anything's important, if it doesn't go well the first time, consider that a lesson and try to make it better the second time, but don't walk away from the important disciplines. That's really good. So I also wanted to thank you for your vulnerability in this message series, just because you shared a lot of things that are really

personal and that are so helpful for all of us. And one of the things that you said that I just can't stop thinking about is the way you were doing the work of God was destroying the work of God in you. And I think so many of us kind of had that powerful like, oh, that might be true of me too. And so for you, when you looked at your life, what were some of the disconnects between how you were living and working in this better way that Jesus offers? I think that for whatever reason, all of us have wounds, hurts, dysfunctions in our lives. And sometimes those dysfunctions can wreck us and we end up coping in really bad ways. Other times they can make us successful in the short term and then wrecks later, right?

And so there are times when I'll try to work to prove myself or I'll wrongly work to try to find fulfillment and achievement versus just relationship. And so I think that that works, meaning it helps you to be driven and get a lot done. But if that's all you do and you do it for the wrong reasons, ultimately it'll catch up with. you. And so I think I just have been driven for a long, long, long, long time. When I started studying Jesus just with the different eyes, not just what he said, but really looking at how did he live? And he wasn't rushed like I'm rushed, and he had a lot more time to slow down for people. And was it really blew me away, Ali, is that he only had three years of public ministry to do what he did. And I've been at this for 25 years. And if he got as much done as he did

in three years without being rushed, then I can get a lot done in 25, 30, 40 years and maybe not be rushed. So my kind of goal is to not get up so early in the morning. I could get really ridiculously early on some study days and work too many nights, but do it in a rhythm that is more sustainable over time and believing that at the same time will continue to have even greater impact, meaning the amount of people we reach isn't necessarily a reflection of how hard or how much I work, that I can work smarter, wiser, according to the rhythms that God would have me to work, and he can multiply it. He can continue to do what he does that I can't do. So I'm pretty optimistic about what it's going to look like. And I loved how when you were sharing all of that,

you told us why, but then you also told us how difficult it can sometimes be. So we know that this way of Jesus is better, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's easier. And so what are some things that maybe you've found difficult or frustrating about this pace of Jesus and the way that he lived his life? Well, it frustrates me. He was so relaxed all the time and I'm not. So he's the son of God, the Savior, the world. He's sinless and he's not stressed. And he's saying, don't worry about tomorrow. And I'm kind of obsessing about tomorrow. And he, you know, he says tomorrow is enough to worry about itself. You know, scripture really, and not just Jesus, but James says, you're not promised tomorrow. And so Jesus seemed to really be focused in the moment. And a lot of times, I think for a lot of

people I know, including myself, it's sometimes hard to be in the moment because you're thinking about, you know, what you could have done, should have done, what you need to get done. And so that's not only hard to be in the moment all the time, but it's incredibly important to be in the moment. So that's one thing I'm working on is being incredibly present, and that's one of the weeks that we're going to talk about in the upcoming and series. I'm looking forward to sharing about that. Yeah, I'm excited to hear more about that. I liked how you talked about some of the things that have been difficult for you.

But what are some things that you're learning as you're implementing some new rhythms? Like, what are you learning about God and how is your life changing as a result of pursuing this better way? Well, I say there's so much. One of the illustrations I have is, because I probably haven't rested as much as I should, is it's a little bit, to me it's like the tithe. The tide doesn't make a lot of sense, right? You know, if we take the first 10% of what God trusts us with and give it to him, and then somehow he extends what we have. We're more blessed as we tithe. I'm viewing rest like that as kind of like

a tithe that I'm going to give him, I even joke about it. We typically say I'm going to give God my first and my best. I'm going to give God my first and my rest. And so I'm viewing it as like a spiritual act, not like, you know, I was always programmed to think that's lazy or you're not going to get as much done. So I'm going to give this to you first and believe that you're going to give me more creativity or more wisdom or more spiritual power if I set that aside first. And I feel that. So it's fun to see God's principles work. They kind of work, right? That's really good because I think that working a lot is something that's really easy to justify because it's like, I'm not hurting anybody. but what I'm hearing you say is it's still disobedience though from like God's rhythms.

And so that's a really good perspective as to why we need to implement all of these things. Yeah, one of the things I came across Allie that I don't know how I'd miss this before, but it was something I read said that, you know, God worked six days and he rested the seventh. Well, on the seventh day, you know, God's day of rest was his last day in the cycle, but it was actually Adam's first day. And so Adam, the first thing he did was he rested. And so he worked from a place of rest. And I'm usually working to get to rest.

And then the rest sometimes seems insufficient. And so what I want to do is I want to work from a place of rest. And I thought that was a good perspective for me. That is really good. So what do you think it looks like for us to work from rest? Well, I don't know. I think I'm probably talking to a broad group of people. And there are some people that really, really need to rest or other people that might

need to get up and do something. So I'm not going to tell everybody just to go on a vacation or whatever. Some people you might need to go get a job, go hunt something, kill something, bring it home, right? So what I would say is my guess is that the vast majority of people right now are too plugged into something. And it might not be just work, but it might be too plugged into the approval of what other people think or too hyper-connected to what they post. how people respond or to connected to what everybody else is doing on social media or something. And so, well, I think a good thing to do, Allie would be to look for wherever our life is out of balance. We're trying to find meaning in the wrong place. And so for me, if you get, you know,

really analyze it, which sometimes I hate, but it's sometimes helpful is, is the why? If you work so hard, why? Well, part of it's because we want to reach people. And that's the purest part of it. The other part is, is like, I want to prove that I'm worth something. And that's the dysfunctional part. As followers of Jesus, we need to look at where are we living in a way that's really different than the way that Jesus lived? And is it something that by the power of the Holy Spirit that we need to let God help us to change? That's really good perspective. So another thing that gave me a really good perspective in your message is when you talked about the yoke of Jesus. And so you showed that picture of an actual yoke, which was so powerful because I'd never imagined it like that before.

So I have a couple of questions about that. My first question is, how do we know when we're kind of pushing against the easy yoke of Jesus and pursuing our own way instead of Jesus's better way? Well, that's a good question. I think the word push is a good word. You said, what I want to do is I want to look for times when I'm being led versus trying to push. And I think sometimes we push, right? Like there's something we want and so we're going to go get it.

And if we're being led, we may still be working hard or we may be whatever is behind the yoke, but we're doing it at the pace of Jesus. And we're doing it with Jesus. We're not doing it for ourselves. We're not doing to prove something to accomplish something, but we're doing it with Jesus. And so that would be tough because then,

like, how do I know him being led or how to how to us my own desire? And then that goes to week five, if my plan works together, is the, we just have to have an ongoing awareness of the presence of God. When we wake up in the day, we're trying to align our heart to His. We're trying to align our mind to his.

So that all through our day, we have an ongoing sense of his presence. He is directing us. He is guiding us. So ultimately, I want to be letting him lead me and me follow him rather than me pushing my own desires, my own agenda. And if I follow him closely enough, then ultimately I'm praying that my heart becomes conform to his word. My mind becomes conform to his word.

So then eventually, like I think it's Psalm 37, 4th, is delight yourself in the Lord, he'll give you the desires of your heart. Delight means to be made soft or pliable. Enjoy so you get so enthralled in the presence of God where you're so comfortable in his presence, want to be in his presence, desire his presence, that he gives you the desires of your heart.

So that can be interpreted two ways. One is he gives you what you want, or two is he gives you what he wants and his desires become your desires. And so that's my hope is to be so close to God that ultimately I'm following him, and his desires are my desires, and I'm not pushing my will, but I'm following his prompting. That's good for us to think about.

And so my final question, I know we could talk about this all day, but we don't want our life groups just to hear this conversation. We want them to have their own conversation and to really take action on what they're hearing. And so what do you hope that life groups talk about this week? And what's one next step that they could take to apply this to their lives? That's a great question. You can't solve a problem that you don't identify, right? And so I would start with identifying the number one biggest discrepancy from the way that

Jesus lived in the way that we're currently living right now. And I think that all of us, because of our sinful nature, we're all going to have a big way. We're all going to have dozens of ways, likely, right? But you can't fix dozens. But if you fix or work on, let the Holy Spirit lead to one big one and let God start doing a healing work there. That's where you're going to get the most spiritual bang for your buck. So I would just probably suggest a great topic for discussion in our life groups would be to ask ourselves,

when we think about, look at study, observe, admire the life of Jesus, where is the way that we're living, the most different from the way that he lived, and name that area, and then let's take it before God and letting him start to do a healing work. And the interesting part is, that's not going to be fixed by next life group for most people, right? So it's probably not, but that's where you start to do a deep work and let him. the Holy Spirit, do some work. You might meet with a Christian counselor. You might start reading some books about it.

You listen to a podcast about it, watching YouTube videos, about whatever that is. And then you start on the journey. And it's kind of like what you said earlier. What if you don't get it right? You're probably not going to get it right. It's because we're not that good. But if we can identify,

here's how Jesus was living a better way than I am. And in this area, I want to be more like him. Then that can start giving you focus. You can talk about it. You can have some accountability. You can start bringing some other resources or people into your life. You can start praying about it. And then you can start letting the Holy Spirit do a healing work to take you to a better way.

Their time is going to be painful and hard and will be persecuted. But it's still, even with the difficult things, it's better. His peace is better. His joy is better. His presence is better. His kingdom values. They're better. His way is always better.

That's so good. Well, Pastor Craig, thank you again for taking some time to invest in our life groups. So we just are really excited for this message series. So thank you for sharing. My pleasure. Thanks for being involved in community life groups. That means a lot. That is good.

When he said the thing about pushing against the yoke of Jesus, and I'm thinking now about myself and somehow locked in and step with Jesus, but I'm trying to push harder or push further or going in a different direction, it's just like, that's dumb. That doesn't make any. Like, why would I think that actually I had a better way, right? Like, why would I think, oh, you know, Jesus, just bear with me for a second. I got this.

Yeah, I got it. I got it, dude. Just, you know, you chill out a little bit. I'm going to take it from here. That just doesn't make any sense. Why do I try to live that way? I had the same realization, too. I was like, oh, yeah, that is a really good warning sign.

If I'm pushing versus being led, that's really good. Yep. And I also think his challenge was so convicting this week, but I think it's really healthy. And so he invited us to just ask, what is the biggest area where our lives look different than Jesus's life? And he said, you know, there may be like 50 that you think of, but pick that one. Maybe it's the one that everybody in life group is kind of like elbowing themselves around. Like, yeah, that's probably your one. And get their input and go with that one.

Yeah. I love that idea of if you can't think of your thing, maybe ask your friends, your life group, your family, do you see any ways in my life where I might be pushing against the yoke of Jesus, where I might be out in front of him where my life doesn't look like him? To talk about it and then don't just talk about it, but think about it. And I love how you also shared. It's probably not going to be immediately fixed by your next life group, but it is something that you can continue to talk about together. Right. People don't always do new things right the first time. But keep trying. Commit to it and watch God change your life. We hope you've enjoyed this bonus episode for Pastor Craig's A Better Way Message series. Make sure you and your life group are making plans to attend every week because I really think that this has the potential to be one of those anchor messages that you'll come back to for years to come. We'll link to the series, the Bible plan, and more in the conversation guide in the show notes wherever you're listening. Also, stay tuned for another bonus episode next week with you'll link to the series, the Bible plan, and more in the conversation guide in the show notes wherever you're listening. Also, stay tuned for another bonus episode next week with Pastor Craig. You can subscribe to be notified when it releases at www.life.com. Church

slash YHIS. Have a great week.