LINUX Unplugged - 534: We Nixed Proxmox

Episode Date: October 30, 2023

We did Proxmox dirty last week, so we try to explain our thinking. But first, a few things have gone down that you should know about.

If you felt left out from all the LinuxFest excitement last week, well, the good news is the talks are already up on the LinuxFest Northwest YouTube channel. Ooh, I think I see your face there. Oh, don't. No, no, no. Well, you know what? Let's put a link to Brent's introduction to NextCloud. Carl had a great talk that really explains the background with Stream and CentOS and where Apple's going. We don't need to see mine. That's my old hair. You know, I noticed Neil's talk had the most views, so I think it might be a competition.

Oh. Let's see. Hello, friends, and welcome back to your weekly Linux talk show. My name is Chris. My name is Wes. And my name is Brent. Hello, friends, and welcome back to your weekly Linux talk show. My name is Chris. My name is Wes. And my name is Brent. Hello, gentlemen, coming up on the show this week. I admit it, we did Proxmox dirty last week.

I want to try to make good this week and go into a little more detail. But first, a lot's happened in Linux land this week. So we're going to break it all down for you. Then we'll round it out with some boosts, some picks, and a lot more. So let's give a big good morning to our friends at Tailscale. Yeah, Tailscale, it's a mesh VPN protected by... Wild God!

That's right. We love it. It'll change your networking game and build a flat mesh network across all your devices, your services, your containers, your applications, your VPSs, you name it. Get it for free for 100 devices at tailscale.com slash Linux Unplugged. That's tailscale.com slash Linux Unplugged. Hey, don't forget, you can put it on your Pi KVMs, too.

Yeah, you can, and we have. I do have Tailscale running on the Pi KVM. And a big-time appropriate greetings to the Mumble Room. Hello, Virtual Lug. Hello. Hello, Chris. Hello, Chris. Hello, Virtual Lug. Hello. Hello, Chris. Hello, Chris. Hey, guys.

Hey, friends. Thank you very much for being here. It always feels right. You know, every now and then we have to do the show without the Mumble crew, and it feels weird. It almost makes me a little nervous. Yeah, it's like driving on a spare tire. Right. You can do it, but you don't want to do it for very long.

Okay, we have a big announcement. The Tuxes, the 2023 Tuxes form is officially live. Thank you, everybody who sent some feedback in. You can go to it directly at tuxes.party. We'll put a link in the show notes. And we're doing something new. Wes had a big brain idea. Instead of making you email us your suggestions or things we missed,

we're just going to make another NextCloud form and we'll have a form, it's linked at the top of the Tuxes form that you can fill out for the things we missed and we can do honorable mentions in the Tuxes when those come up. Those will be coming up soon so please go to Tuxes.party and vote for the best projects the best tech setter. We added some new categories based on some suggestions Thank you everybody It is going to be a great

tuxes this year i think especially with some of those new categories so head on over there and go boat please we really appreciate that tuxes dot party don't call it a delay perhaps but fedora 39 has been bumped oh i think right now last i looked um aiming for november 7th okay all right we thought we might be looking at fedora 38 right now being on this episode 39 oh 39 thank you yes we thought maybe be this episode but uh it happens right yeah it was gonna maybe be delayed due to a u-boot bug impacting the Pi 4. And while the Fedora devs debated delaying the entire release or just the Pi images, more bugs popped up.

I think Brent must have been involved. I'm not sure, though. He was doing his bug testing even when he was out hunting for moose. It's just the constant fear, you know? You got to keep it going. Yeah. He just fires it up on the machine. He finds bugs.

The bugs come to him. It's Neil's fault because he was like, hey, Brent, you really got to run it going. Yeah. He just fires it up on the machine. He finds bugs. The bugs come to him. It's Neil's fault because he was like, hey, Brent, you really got to run Fedora on your new machine there. I like that idea. I think now we also have a new bug, right? So two new bugs. It seems like this one's a weird one. Some of the Fedora 39 RC 1.2 images sometimes have RC in their name, and they sometimes don't, which causes issues with certain programs or users or scripts and might expect the version to match during a check of some kind. I was going to ask which way is it supposed to be, but I suppose that doesn't matter.

The problem is that it's not consistent. And then there's one other bug that seems like a little more serious. There's if, and hopefully this never happens to you, but if you do the media check in the Fedora installer and that fails, instead of like giving you a good error or something like that, it just goes to like a blank screen and just leaves you there. Okay. I guess I can't install. Yeah. I guess I can't install. Yeah, I guess it's not working. So they figure, you know, with those issues, now the new target date is the 7th. Now you remember, guys, the way that it works with Fedora is they kind of have a window

that they target. And they have these sort of release milestone markers in that window. And they kind of have a range to pick from. And so the 7th is the next one in that window. And, you know a range to pick from and so the seventh is the next one in that window and you know you make sense to troubleshoot these things i don't think it has real any real meaning in terms of uh the actual release you know once we get it it looks like it'll be a good one it's just a matter of days difference in in the grand scheme of things um and also looking at these bugs i feel like this list not really going to impact myself probably most

the audience out there you'd probably save at this point running the rc in fact i'd be kind of curious if anybody out there is already running like a dev version rawhide or already running 39 boost in and give us your take on it because our review is going to be coming up soon and i'd like to hear what your thoughts are if you've been trying it out. I think it's probably there. We'll see. In other news this week, Linux Mint started working on Wayland support. Oh!

Now, many of us have wondered for quite a while what Linux Mint would do. And inevitably, they would have to adapt to the Wayland-only future. We all do. This is really good to see, I think. I was starting to get a little worried that maybe when we saw their X versions of apps and stuff, it was kind of an indication that they were just going to ride that X train until the very end. But this seems like a pretty good sign that they're actually going to embrace the Wayland future, which we all, like you say, Wes, we all kind of have to one way or another. You're right, though. I mean, there's a variety of currently X-based

environments out there. Some of them have smaller teams, and migrating to Wayland is probably no small effort, depending on implementation details. And the more custom environment you build, the more custom apps you have, those are more things that you're responsible to port. Right. That's why I was kind of concerned it might never happen. custom apps you have, those are more things that you're responsible to port. That's why I was kind of concerned it might never happen. I found the blog quite a refreshing read if you are interested in just knowing a little bit about how cautious they are with adopting new technologies, for instance. They say the work likely won't be done until 2026 to have Wayland as the default in Linux Mint.

And that is, you know, two years, what, more than two years from now. So I think they take these large changes very carefully, which their users clearly really value. Now, they have been working on this Wayland support in Cinnamon. And I would imagine with the other desktktops it works just fine. So Cinnamon 6.0 is planned for Linux Mint 21.3, which is this year, and will feature experimental Wayland support, so you can try it there, but it will not be the default. The default will still be the X session, but you can, from the login screen, choose the Wayland session if you'd like to play around with it and see what's featured. Hmm. I'm probably going to try that. Cinnamon on Wayland. It could be pretty neat once they get all the kinks worked out.

I don't use it a ton, but I sort of semi-rely on, like, I'm glad to have it in the back pocket because it's a very functional, easy-to-use, quick-to-get-going sort of desktop that I can use without a bunch of customization. So it's like a fallback for a machine that just needs to work. It's been nice. Seems like a safe one to recommend to friends and family that are switching from a traditional desktop OS. Yeah.

I will say as well, if you're a lot more interested in the details, they have a public Trello board that you can dive into to see the progress on the project and how far they've come. Or maybe you want to get your hands dirty. So that would be a good place to go. Otherwise, we do have some links in the show notes that'll get you started. A public Trello board. That's interesting. I see more and more projects using Trello for that kind of stuff. I'm really kind of looking forward to seeing what they come up with. 2026, that actually seems, if you were to gauge time in LTS cycles, pretty fair. If you're going to gauge it in six-month cycles. Round up, it's almost 2024 now, right?

So it'll be there before you know it. But does it feel like it's years behind everyone else? Like is that going to really put them behind for the foreseeable future? I don't think yes, but no, right? Because I don't think it matters to their user base. I've been thinking about this, and I know I've talked to you guys privately in person about this.

If you look at who's really getting decent funding in Linux and open source software, a lot of money from the users seems to be flowing to the projects that are somewhat capturing a traditional work paradigm. A couple of the best funded projects in open source, Linux Mint and Thunderbird, right? Thunderbird gets better funding than the entire Genome desktop. Wow. Yeah. And when I think about what are those two projects predominantly doing, you know, Linux Mint is preserving a traditional workflow and work environment,

and people that want that are probably very serious about that. And Thunderbird is providing a traditional way to read and manage your email, which is not in a web browser. Now, they're updating the application, but it still represents a traditional workflow to email. And I think the people that value those classic workflows, if you will, are willing to support those projects. And I think that's why you see Mint get the funding it does. Go look at the bottom of the October report.

It looks really healthy. So I think for their user base, it's probably just at the right speed. In fact, would you be surprised to learn that in 2026 when it ships, that the majority of Linux Mint users choose to just run X? They'll probably use whatever the default is,

but I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of people just stick with X, especially if they have a hardware workflow around NVIDIA that requires it. So I think, Brent, yes, but no. Great answer. Well, something else we have to look forward to, at least things going to plan, it's a special Sunday today, because perhaps right now, as we're doing the show, Linux 6.6 is being released. Ah, that's always fun, doing a show on a Linux Sunday. I mean, it means we have to wait a little while to try it out, but okay.

Well, it must be close because Michael Larabelle over at Pharonix is already writing about Linux 6.7. That's how you tell. Now, okay, going backwards to 6.6, as usual, you know, tons of just like quality of life stuff minor features driver updates for sure pharonix has uh extensive coverage if you do want to dive into those details which can be pretty fun and i mean we're talking banger coverage even for for them they you know michael usually goes pretty deep into these kernel releases but this one pages and pages of of coverage which means you know uh we can't really cover all of it, but there's a couple goodies we should talk about.

ButterFS, one of our favorite file systems, has seen a lot of attention the last few release cycles, but in 6.6, good old EXT4 gets some love. You know, it's mostly code cleanups and bug fixes, which that's great just on its own,

let's be clear. There is a particularly exciting change from an Alibaba engineer, Lu Song. It's an optimization result in something like a 34% performance improvement. I'll take it. Yeah, in a situation with many concurrent writes to an append write scenario, it's an important improvement. And then they demonstrated that Apache Kafka is a particularly good real-world test of this, which does a lot of that sort of append writing. And that's a 10% improvement, which, you know, isn't 34,

but I think pretty much anyone running a big Kafka cluster will take 10%. Yeah, no kidding. Boy, a 34% improvement with concurrent writes in an append write scenario that's kind of remarkable for a file system as established as Extended 4 It is cool to see nice performance improvements this far along in its life cycle. Yeah but then part of me is like

so you mean all these years I could have had a 34% faster? But I am grateful I am grateful Okay and not to be left out butterfs did also see some improvements uh no new features uh but lots of bug fixes refactorings cleanups and uh also a notable fix in scrub performance there was a rewrite of the scrub back in 6.4 and the new version isn't yet as fast as the old version it's's better in a lot of ways, but it's not quite caught up. Uh,

so six, six brings that not all the way back, but, a lot closer. Yeah. I find that interesting just because for many releases in the six cycle, it's been butterfest improvement, butterfest improvement,

faster this way, faster this way. And then we snuck in a little regression there just in the, in the scrub scenario. Right. Yeah. Uh, but nice to see them fixing that.

XFS got some love in 6.6 as well. It has a new online repair that's just starting to land. It is using memory more efficiently while it does it, and it'll probably be landing over the next few kernel releases. There's also, with this, a new XFS release manager. Now, the previous manager left with very large shoes to fill. This individual did all the things, really took on all the roles, wore all the hats, and not exactly a model the new maintainer necessarily should replicate.

And so they're looking for help for code review for XFS, bug triage, perhaps a community manager because XFS has a community. And there's some LTS manager roles that need to be filled as well. It's a good reminder of just all the hard work that goes on behind the scenes to keep these things taken. Yeah, it's more than just code in the kernel. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. That's a big part of it. But yeah, things should really

kind of improve for XFS's online repair, though, over the next few cycles. So keep an eye out for that. And then there's one I thought I just wanted to note for you guys. It's not a big deal, but I think it's noteworthy. In Linux 6.6, references to the NSA for SELinux are being removed. It's just SELinux now, not NSA SELinux. The patch strips out the NSA references from the SELinux code, and there is a kconfig text that adds a quote that I thought I'd read.

It kind of gives us some of the context here. It says, This changes the NSA Linux to just SELinux in kconfig to help text and comments. While the NSA was the original primary developer and continues to help maintain SELinux, that's an important note, SELinux has since long transitioned to a wide community of developers and maintainers. SE Linux has been part of the mainline Linux kernel now

for nearly 20 years and has received contributions from many individuals and organizations. So look, guys, it's bigger than the NSA now, is what they're saying. Yeah, other spooks use it too. We'll never forget. But, you know, know i mean i think it's probably fair uh maybe there's um a brand issue there uh i think uh also you know especially just when you're outside the states you know it probably feels a little

awkward using nsa se linux when you're in Switzerland or Berlin or whatever. I think having to be, you know, having been here for so long and, you know, fairly widely deployed or outside just systems like that. Yeah, makes a reasonable case. But I'm so curious. Why this year? Like it's been 20 years. Who made that decision to finally, you know, say something about it? That is a fair question.

Why now after 20 years? That's the true question. I think we're going to have to do some research on the patch submitter. Maybe somebody knows. An insider. Or we may never know. Now Linux 6.6 did bring some extra features that I think we might get excited about. So, gents, you better dust off your brass, because Rust got an update in 6.6.

Rust toolchain gets a version bump, which is not as big of a bump as we saw in 6.5, but it is a bump worth celebrating. Among other things, support for Rust Analyzer for out-of-tree kernel modules landed, along with improved Rust availability detection script. And there's a lot more, which we're, you know, just scratching the surface here. So we have a bunch of links in the show notes, as always. Yeah, you know, it's nice to see it ticking along. There hasn't really been, like, you know, that major Rust driver getting accepted yet. There's stuff in the works, like, you know, Asahi's got Rust-written drivers for the... That's kind of, I think, the big driver why I want

Rust support fully baked in is eventually I want to see these Asahi drivers upstream so then all distros can be ARM-enabled on the Mac platform. You just install any distro you want, it's just in the kernel. But you've got to get this Rust support working. Right, you've got to have that working, keep it up-to-date, you know, keep adding

features to enable eventual Rust in the kernel. Akamai. Yep. The Akamai. And the best part, all the tools that we love, like the command line client, their API, the cloud manager, the stuff that you've heard us talk about that we use to build and deploy and scale, all that is there. But now it's combined with Akamai's power and global reach. And we're talking serious global reach. And as a result, they're expanding Linode services, now Akamai, to offer more resources and tools and more data centers that come on online all the time. I just took advantage of a really great, really great quick system. I love that you can spin these up so super simple. You can have images or stack scripts to make them ready to go quick. And I have Jupes in the shop. I spun up a server. I'm queuing a bunch of data on there and then as jupes comes online and she gets cell signal when she's in and out of the shop um you know like the garage it starts syncing up with my linode and pulling everything down i just love the

reliability there too so i can just keep things going and i've used linode for the business i've used it for my personal stuff my kids game. There's so many different ways you can take advantage and use Linode to learn too. So go experience the power of Linode, now Akamai. Go to linode.com slash unplugged to learn how Linode, now Akamai, will help scale your applications if you're an individual, a project, or an enterprise from the cloud to the edge. Go see why we love it and get that $100 at linode.com slash unplugged. Now, if you caught last week's episode, you may have noticed it was a bit of a party. Slightly, hmm, wild, I think is how I would describe it, which was really fun for us. We had a lot of Linux Fest to burn off, okay, Brent?

Yeah, it was super fun, especially for us in the studio. I mean, I've been thinking about it all week, which is a good sign. But it wasn't the best format for us to get into some of the nuances of complex topics that we may have hinted at. Fair. That's fair. Yeah, that's fair. So the one that comes to mind for sure is Proxmox. We did it a bit of a disservice last week with our server adventures so i feel like we have to do a redo this week is this brent just being like chris explain yourself you did bad yeah well it wasn't our finest moment was it it wasn't uh we were

having a little too much fun uh lesson learned there and it just wasn't the right moment to convey like the full context around the decision to scrap Proxmox after all this, like a year of planning to use it. So quick background, friends. Come back in time with me a bit. We have three local servers. One is an ancient rig that's just been running like a champ forever. And then two newer boxes contributed by audience members. And storage and compute are kind of the top jobs for these machines, all three boxes, different services and applications that are facilitating the use of that storage and compute. And we're only adding to the list constantly. Like one of the things this new box is going to do, I probably mentioned this on the show last week, can't remember a damn thing,

but I probably mentioned this. We're going to download the back catalog. We're going to transcribe the entire back catalog. And one of the ways we can do that is with this. But then what if we could take that to the next level? Don't know, but what if we could? We could start training something like Meta's open source Lama 2 on our back catalog transcription. So perhaps one day there could be a Jupyter Broadcasting search engine that's powered by this box. You could go to and say, when did the guys first talk about NixOS on the podcast? Hit enter, and this chatbot would come back with an answer. Now, maybe we'll never do this, but it would be a very nice tool, even if it was just something

internally for us. And these are just jobs that we're constantly adding all the time. And storage and compute were going to be the big focus with running applications and containers and some VMs. And I wanted to deploy Proxmox on this local infrastructure. I wanted to have a reliable way to manage, you know, a medium VM load and get at least two different servers in this mix that we could maybe move things between. And if you're not familiar with Proxxbox, it kind of fits that bill. It's a virtualization and container management system built on top of Debian, tightly integrates KVM.

It also has Linux container LXC support, can do software-defined storage, got complicated and advanced networking functionality, all in a single platform. You've got APIs, you've got a web-based user interface to like sort of easily, you know, you can do stuff at scale with APIs or easily manage it just in the single platform. You've got APIs, you've got a web-based user interface to like sort of easily, you know,

you can do stuff at scale with APIs or easily manage it just in the web interface. It's got a community of users. You know, there's a lot to like about this. It uses ZFS for storage.

There's a bunch of tools and stuff for backups, doing VM migrations. And best of all, unlike a lot of competitors, say like VMware stuff, you can run Proxmox for free. Yeah, I mean they build themselves as open source

but there's obviously commercial stuff around it and different commercial packages you can get and there's a backup server that's separate and all that but good stuff. And it's come highly recommended by our audience for years and because of the consistent high recommendation, I've basically taken that as signal. You know, when we get something like that over and over again from the audience, it's something to pay attention to.

I mean, our audience builds a lot of really impressive stuff. And, yeah, so we should take note. And I was a Proxmox user like in the 4.0 days. I ran some JB infrastructure on Proxmox back then. And I liked it. But I felt it was definitely time to refresh my take. I wanted us to have some real hands-on time with Proxmox, understanding that it's a really good tool

and it's something we should be able to speak to. But after deploying it, and it took a while to get it deployed, but after deploying it because of the hardware, it was more complex than I expected. Yeah, Chris, we did have many issues with the hardware, but we got over those thanks to Jeff and Noah. Well, you and I were just watching for the most part, but once it got working, uh, you dove just immediately into the

software. And I had played with a little bit on that one liter box that Alex dropped off at my place. And I could see the reaction you were having on your face, you know, cause you have quite a few facial reactions and software frustration is maybe one of them. And I could just tell that you weren't having a good time. Yeah, it's a lot of UI to the point where you're going to need to learn it. You're going to need to learn Proxmox, especially if you're going to run it in production. Like any complex, useful tool, it needs training. useful tool it needs training and i going through it felt like i would probably want to use proxmox kind of casually with some semi-important stuff for about a year before i felt comfortable enough using it in anger in production and when things go sideways in my experience it's always better

if it's a simpler setup if If you allow a bad analogy, I kind of think that working on Proxmox is sort of like the difference of trying to upgrade a MacBook and work on a MacBook versus a framework laptop, right? Like one is like a DIY modular thing that you put together and you understand intimately and you can take it apart and rebuild it pretty quickly.

The other is a product that meets a large market demand, but is very inflexible in ways that I need it to be flexible. And, or, you know, another bad analogy, which I probably mentioned before is it's like an old car versus a new car. You can open up the hood and you see where everything is at in a new car. It's all sealed up. And the simplicity of a NixOS host with a few containers and a few VMs that we can manage through the Nix config makes a lot of sense when you consider that

most of the systems we'll be running, especially the things we build, will either be NixOS VMs or NixOS-based containers. And so then at that point, it's kind of obvious where to go. We don't need all the tooling around Proxmox, and all of the jobs we're going to be running are going to mostly be Nix already. Okay, Chris, but I could just see maybe the audience, even myself, just kind of thinking, oh, yeah, these guys are going on about NixOS again. And hey, Chris, it's just Debian underneath. Why can't you just kind of dive in and do the flexibility from that side? What's your answer to that? Well, it's Debian, Brent, but it's not enough Debian underneath, why can't you just kind of dive in and do the flexibility from that side?

What's your answer to that? Well, it's Debian, Brent, but it's not enough Debian. It's just not quite there. Because one of my very first experiences, I probably mentioned this too, sorry everybody, is that I had to get in and edit the grub defaults. I had to go in and SSH to the box and start editing the Debian system. And that also was my experience the last time I used Proxmox, is semi-frequently when I needed to do something,

I would be dropping down to the OS and doing it in the OS. And I don't like that dichotomy where you have a GUI management system and then you're also editing the OS and the two are kind of in sync but not necessarily aware of either. Right. And maybe it would be different too if we were deploying a lot of Proxmox.

So we had occasion to be messing with it regularly. We had centralized storage. We were taking advantage of their backup services. Or if one of us was like a professional using Proxmox in production at their day job, then we knew Proxmox in and out. So for me, it's like, well, if you're just going to always be dropping down to Debian, why not just use Debian? And if you're just going to be dropping into Nix all the time, why not just use Nix?

The other thing, and it's not as big of a deal, but we're often kind of pushing the edge on what is new and what you want to run. And a lot of times it requires just the right libraries to use the video stuff or whatever it might be. And so an example of this is some folks are struggling with like LXC containers to get things like stable diffusion running in Proxmox. And you can find on the Proxmox support forms people that are tweaking the underlying system trying to get stable diffusion to work in a Proxmox container. That kind of thing would be happening to us every couple of months. And so we need something that's a little more flexible and customizable for us.

But what I'm picturing now is essentially two Nix hosts with their configurations probably stored on GitHub so we can do our change management and tracking that way. Maybe we even deploy that way with a GitHub action or something. And we manage the VMs through the Nix config. I thought about installing something like Cockpit, but it's a little wonky on Nix. I honestly don't think we need it. If I need to mess around with the VMs in a GUI,

I could just use VertManager. Yeah, true. So I think the long-term solution is really simple base os as you and i were wrapping up after the show we were in no state to be working on the system and we were in a very suggestive state of mind and neil's hanging out of the studio with us he walks up and says well hey why don't you instead of putting zfs on there why don't you put bcash fs on there how dare you put BcacheFS on there? How dare he? Why don't you put BcacheFS?

Now, we actually gave it a thought. What did we end up – I actually, again, cannot remember. What did we do? I know – so we have two storage pools. We have a fast one that's all 10,000 RPM drives, and we have a slower one, which is 7,200 RPM. It's about larger. So we got two pools of storage. When I did Proxmox, I just set them both up as ZFS.

I don't think that's how it is now, though, is it? No, it still is. Oh, okay. If I'm recalling correctly, you know, and these things. Fuzzy. It was a long week. We had two pools set up, as you described, but there hadn't been any data sets created yet. Yeah, right, right.

So I think it's still left in that configuration. We were sort of debating what all the file systems we wanted on this box. But we did get BcacheFS installed. Yes. So it is available should we want one or both of those to try it out. Yeah, it's really just a matter of time until we put BcacheFS in production. I think the real question is do we do it before or after it's officially released? All right,

now I'm leaning on before. Yeah, I'm leaning on before as well. You got my vote. We can't be BcashFS hipsters if we wait till after. We used that file system

before it was unstable. Mm-hmm. You know, it's, it is kind of, it's a reset. And this is what we do sometimes. We just throw things out.

We try something and we throw it out even after like a year of planning. And I think it's a good thing. We didn't stick to it just because we were tempted after all the work it took to get it running on there. We were tempted just to stick with it. But since we could Nixify it in place, we figured why not. And this isn't a takeaway from anybody running Proxmox in production.

Because if I were using it for years, if I had multiple systems I wanted to run Proxmox on, I think I would still be very happy with it. It was just simply just more than I needed. Often I find that with the GUI stuff because I, it really, if something really hits the fan, I want to be able to just SSH in and know that all the config changes I'm making there are consistent and I can recover it and what I can see there in the disk layout, I can just see it all

and fix it. Or, you know, put another cheroot and put another system in place and get the data back online. Like, I just want that flexibility for our critical systems. And, hey,

it'll be a fun experiment. We'll see how it goes and maybe, do we regret it in a year? Stay tuned and find out. Collide.com slash unplugged. I love Collide so much I could sing about it.

Maybe I'd still be in IT today. And then there'd be no podcast for me to talk about Collide. Well, I doubt that. Can't stop me from talking. Collide solves a problem I was always dealing with in IT, especially as I moved into security. And it's just gotten worse since then, actually. It's all the low-hanging fruit, out-of-date software,

phished credentials, or just simply being out of compliance. It'd be really, really great in some sort of imaginary world where you could stop these things before these devices and these users even connect to your applications. That's what Collide does. That's the secret sauce. But what they've done to make it even better, because right there, I'm a customer. But what would make it even better if you could, is if you could then work directly with the users, notify them through their whatever messaging system they have, and give them easy walkthrough guides on how to solve and fix the problem so then they can connect to your network resources. Imagine no longer friends. That is literally what Collide does. It's like an IT department's superpower because you can just collect all this low-hanging fruit. You don't have to inundate IT. It's really genius. I think you got to go see the demo to see

what I'm talking about and see how Kali could help you say goodbye to dealing with compromised credentials, old user account stuff, software that's out of date, no longer in compliance, and manage it all with a single-pane dashboard that covers Windows, Macs, and Linux all in one spot. Go see the demo and support the show. Go to collide.com slash unplugged. That's K-O-L-I-D-E dot com slash unplugged. We got a ton of feedback again this week. Thank you for everyone.

Now, Archie left us a little bit of feedback. Archie did also show up to LinuxFest Northwest. And I got a little story about that. I met him, you know, again, for the very first time. Again for the first time or really for the first time? Well, let me rephrase that. I met him again. And the very first thing he mentioned to me, he came up, hey, Brent, hey, how's it going?

Oh, good, good, good. And the very first thing he mentioned to me, he came up, hey, Brent, hey, how's it going? Oh, good, good, good. Hey, you got a bunch of like stats tied up in my Bitcoin node here because, hey, remember your old. We got to get your channel. Remember your old node that you shut down like, what is it? We were supposed to fix that this week, Brent. We totally forgot. So that was feedback I got in person from Archie quite directly.

And I got to say, Archie, I'm so sorry. We totally forgot. But we'll get on that soon. And if we don't, please tell us again. But he did also write in and said, hey, if Mitch does not get to this in time, there are a couple other ways to help with Podverse. And those, of course, are located at podverse.fm slash contribute. And P.S., Archie is a party member. Yes, thank you, Archie.

Podverse is the GPL podcasting 2.0 app that's available on Android, iOS, and the web. And it does have a tight little team behind it, which Archie is now part of, also known as SUCD in our Matrix chat. But I think the really exciting thing here is Mitch, who Archie referred to, is the main developer, and he has gone on a three-month sabbatical from his full-time job to focus 100% on Podverse. Now, the other great thing about Podverse is because it is open source, our community and the Podverse team worked to make the web version of their player actually embeddable. So if you go to the Jupiter Broadcasting Community Built website,

the player that's embedded there is the Podverse player, thanks to the open source nature. So cool. And it's a great player. It's a great team. It's been around for a long time and it's picking up some momentum. And so this would be a great time to step up and support them a little bit i just love how easy to share it is too you know it's great you're just like trying to someone maybe they don't listen to a lot of podcasts you're trying to like

send them one they might enjoy it's a great little web ui and very linkable well what do you what do you send somebody when you when you're you're like going to give them a web link like you're on i send them to the itunes live like what right's great for web linking. I used it just this week to link someone to a specific chapter because it also supports that, which I really appreciate. Right. Yeah, that is a nice feature, too. That is very good. So, yes, if you can. Also, by the way, if you boost, a portion of your boost will go to support the Podverse dev team as well.

So that's another way you can support. We'll have a link to that in the show notes. Hey, also, can someone schedule some boosts maybe once a month just to remind us to move those sats off of that node? That would really be good for all of us, I think. So thank you. And now,

it is time for Le Boost. And our first boost comes from AtDeleted. He is our baller boost with a ludicrous 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 sats. And he writes, I'm catching up on the last few episodes. Great work on the Windows challenge. I'd like to propose another. Oh, boy.

Danger. That's why he's coming in with the big sats. Here we go. Okay, he says. He gets the program, though, at least. The 32-bit challenge, using hardware that does not support 64 bits. Could you survive a week or even a single day? I'm imagining something with an Athlon or Pentium 4 in it.

This idea came out of the remarks that 4 gigs of RAM isn't enough for modern systems anymore. It occurred to me that we used to run everything on far less. My first Linux install was a 166 megahertz Pentium with an MMX, of course. Got to have the MMX. Yeah. And 16 megabytes of RAM. Wow. A real baller.

That is, I think the question there is, A, would we – how would we get our hands on 32-bit hardware? I don't know if I have any. That's the problem. Wasn't the first Pi 32-bit? Hmm. Hmm. Hmm. Feels like that's a bit of a cheat, but I was wondering, too like, could we somehow just, at software, force the computer into 32-bit, but then you're not getting the disadvantage of the old crappy hardware that's also part of the fun.

Could do it with a VM, like an old OS, constrained environment, you know, tiny RAM. Yeah, but then you're missing the whole beauty of having this ancient computer in front of you with like a CRT and such. I'm now imagining, is there a market for like a cloud provider, but it's all just Pentium 4 boxes? I know I must have a 32-bit system somewhere. I do have a, no, that's an Optron box. I've got like a 13-year-old system here, but it's an Optron or something or whatever the AMD server CPUs were back then.

You know, it just occurred to me that some listeners would have never used a 32-bit computer, which is a shame in one way, but also really. That's an interesting point. They have no idea. They're 64-bit privileged. Okay, I like this idea. I think it needs a little refinement. If you've got an idea on maybe how we get our hands on the hardware, maybe eBay, if

you've got a link or something, boost in. i think over the next week or two i'd like to i'd be down for trying yeah i'd like to tighten that up sneak boosts in with 50 000 sets first time booster with a tuxes suggestion best chat platform and i'd like to put simple x up as a contender been using that with the family since you guys mentioned it. And, you know, Element should be on there too. Maybe others could chime in with suggestions? Yes, Snake. First of all, thank you for taking the time to set up and boost.

And I know that that is the mountain you have to climb once it's all set up. It's really simple, but that setup process can take a bit. I sat down, so I took the kids out on an early trick-or-treating event like two hours away from the studio and then uh came back to the studio after that sat down i brought up the the form brought up slack brought up helipad boom top boost right there with sneak and i'm like that is a great idea we do need a best chat chat We do need a best chat platform category. So I added that to the tuxes and pulled the element room, the matrix room, for some ideas and talked to Wes and Bren and got their ideas and put them all in there. So thank you, Sneak.

That is now a new category for the tuxes. We almost need a new category sound, I feel like. There's got to be Wheel of Fortune or something. Wait, what? Oh, like a new category has been revealed, you're thinking? Oh, yeah. And now we have a new category. How was that? That was perfect. Exactly what I had playing in my mind. Chris, you nailed it. Anonymous podcast guru user came in with 36, a thousand Satoshis. Appreciate the show. Been listening for years.

I work in the space industry and I'm in the process of putting ZFS on Linux onto a satellite that will launch next year into low earth orbit. Pretty neat stuff. I share your enthusiasm for ZFS and also Flatpak. That is incredible. How about that boys?? Yeah, that's great. Linux and ZFS in space. I hate to be greedy anonymous podcast guru user, but I'd love to know what distro. If you want absolute bulletproof, do you go Ubuntu since they kind of have the most simple ZFS integration? I could see this both ways. Maybe you go Debian because it's super stable and predictable, but maybe you want everything extremely predictable, so maybe you do go NixOS

or something. I guess, like, you're not doing, like, dist upgrade on your satellite. Or are you? Like, what if something goes wrong? You gotta plan for these things. Hmm. I bet they're rolling their own kernel. Right? I was gonna say, come on, it's Arch, right? It's gotta be Arch. Does anything go into space that doesn't

have its own kernel? Do we know of any space come on, it's Arch, right? It's got to be Arch. Does anything go into space that doesn't have its own kernel? Do we know of any space Linux device that is using a stock kernel? I don't know of one. I guess that's the fun, right? Everybody gets to, like, roll their own. We should add, too, maybe just because, you know, we weren't trying to throw shade on Proxmox, nor is ZFS. Like, we didn't, you know, we got NixOS all configured with ZFS support. We're not taking that out of the config.

Right. It's so solid. Yeah. We're big fans of a lot of file systems. In fact, I have really solid confidence in ZFS on Nix because it's not like some sort of DKMS shenanigans or anything like that. So I think it's going to be really solid. or anything like that. So I think it's going to be really solid.

But I'd love to know if you can share with us, Anonymous. That's just a little fascinating detail about the distro. Bong comes in with 30,123 sats using the Podverse. Says, hey, guys, thanks for getting me into NixOS recently. I'm running on a 2015 MacBook Pro. Nice. I had to reinstall it after the 18th generation because it wouldn't boot anymore on any generation, but we'll see what happens this time.

That's crazy. He says, thanks for keeping me entertained on my long road trips. Hey, we are a road tripper's best friend, Bunk. Thank you for the boost. Thanks for listening. Good luck with your install. Yeah, let us know how that goes. I don't think I've ever heard of anyone in the audience running on a 2015 MacBook Pro.

So you are our boots on the ground reporter. Listener Jeff Boosin with 22,222 sets. Things are looking up for old McDuck. I thought for sure my giant schnoz was messing with that headset mic. This boost is for Drew's amazing work cleaning up the insanity that was episode 533. Thank you, Drew. Yeah, thank you, Drew. It wasn't your snozz. It was

the cord rubbing on your shoulder, which I admit was driving me crazy the whole episode, but it wasn't your fault. It happened just because it has a cord and we didn't pin it. Should have thought of that one. I don't really like the sound of that headset mic either. Noah manages to really make it sound better,

but I think it's just not a great dynamic range to begin with. So there's just not a lot to do there. Thank you for the boost, Jeff. Appreciate it. Thought Criminal came in with 20,020 and two Satoshis. Hmm. Hey, how about a Chris name mangle of the year taxi category?

We can give out an award for that. I love this idea. If, again, we had like a way to say, hey, where's all the times,

what are all the times Chris has mispronounced something? If you could ask something that and then we could produce that list, I would have made

that category. I feel like if you're voting for this too, you have to provide an audio clip that we can, you know, make a year in review. That would be really lovely. That would be incredible. Take that pod versus time cutling. Yeah, that is true. If you got a few suggestions,

I could always slip it in there at the end and everybody go vote again. I really think that's, it's a good one. I'll own it. High five connoisseurs back with 5,000 sats from the podcast index. Good to see you connoisseur It says, I'm responding to cross shows on how to install NextCloud. It's been a popular topic. I'm using the all-in-one image. I struggled to get the ancillary services up and running and connected like Calabra. I do want to point out that NextCloud is just like any other service. We should be treating it like cattle and trying all the ways to install it to see what works for you at that specific time. It's just my two cents.

And thanks to the JB crew for all the entertainment and thought-provoking conversations. Yeah, I mean, it's a good point. You should definitely do, like, what works with your setup? What are you comfortable administrating? Maybe the all-in-one works because it's sort of the default way and you don't care about any of the particulars and you just want the blessed configuration. Or maybe you've already got some containers running and you want to understand what bits are actually

going on in Nextcloud. I mean, like, if Brent would have come to us, how many years ago, Brent? Five,

I think. Have you been running the Snap version of Nextcloud? If you would have come to us five years ago and said, guys,

should I run the Snap version of Nextcloud? We would have said no. Yet here we are and it works great. Yeah, I know our listener, Jeff,

has tried a few different ways and had, I don't know, issues. He's having, anyways, but everyone's different I think is really my point. Oh, we really did. Now I'm realizing we never sat down and had that next cloud session either.

There's so many things we never did. Yeah, we did say that Wes would solve all his problems. Sorry, Jeff. It's so hard. He's a precious resource, you know. But Connoisseur, thank you for your thoughts and thank you for the boost. Nice to hear from you again. Tier boosts in with 2, you know. But Connoisseur, thank you for your thoughts and thank you for the boost. Nice to hear from you again. Tier boosts in with 2,500 sets.

Looking forward to seeing y'all at Texas Linux Fest 2024. Keep up the good work. And what base OS would y'all recommend for a Nix noob? Hmm. You know, you could really start with any distro you're even somewhat familiar with and then put Nix on top of that yeah i mean it kind of depends on what you're trying to do with nix maybe like are you just

trying to check it out as a package manager are you trying to build some stuff with it um but yeah i mean it runs great on pretty much any regular old linux distro uh easy to install easy to get rid of and uh you have access to a huge array of packages now i feel like wes you might have a recommendation on how to install it, because I know the default method of installing kind of scours some files a little bit everywhere. Do you have any better recommendation? No, I mean, the default installer's fine, or the determinant installer works great as well.

That one's nice because it will, by default, enable flakes. They've also got some nice recipes set up if you want to install it inside a container or on WSL or that kind of thing. Probably for a very new person, the Terminate installer is probably a little more approachable. Don't you think? Yeah, I mean, just a quick curl pipe to SH away. Yeah, I mean, you're not

doing all the plumbing yourself, but it gets you going with the package manager in the Nix language pretty quick. Yeah. There is also Nix Portable if you don't even want to install it. There are a few caveats there because it's kind of a funny little environment to make it portable and make it work. So if you're getting serious about learning, that might not

be the best just because there's additional constraints that you'll run into, but it is an easy way to try it out if you don't want to go the full install route. I believe the Texas Linux Fest call for papers are open. Carl, I'm not sure if your mic's hot, but I think that's the case, right? Yes, sir.

That's correct. Oh, boy. Looking forward to this. I think open until December 16th. Okay. So December 16th to get your paper in. We're going to be there. Yeah.

Hopefully all three of us is the plan. I'm in. Brent doesn't know, obviously, because it's in the future. Yeah, I don't know how to plan more than about six and a half days ahead. I don't either, but I just have resolve. I have resolve. I have resolve and a hunger. The thing that works for me best is

typically someone else plans it for me, and then I just have to show up because I feel so bad for disappointing people, so I think that's the route we should go. We should just buy tickets right now. It's official right now. Yeah, Brent's going to be there at Texas Libby's Fest, and we all should expect that. I'll see you there. If, you know, if you were a meat eater, it would be a foregone conclusion since it's a cross from Terry Black's. How's their coleslaw?

Very good. Everything they make is good. And if you were going to meat cheat for a day, you literally probably couldn't meat cheat anywhere else better. I mean, it changed my whole perspective on meat and barbecue. April 12th and 13th. There you go. Thank you. I was hoping we'd pull that out. We hear again this week from the open source accountant.

3,000 Satoshis this week, plus one for the fall mini-fest and spring full Linux fests. I'll be there in the spring. That was my very first fest this year, but not my last. Loved meeting you guys. Yeah, okay. I'm already getting excited about that it's gonna be pretty close are you gonna be there

Chris? should we book ahead of time? yeah the only thing is I'm already committed to Texas Linux Fest so if they

uh oh we better not have any date collisions right I'll just say yeah I'll be there yeah yeah you'll be there Brent's gonna be there

oh okay yeah I'm in Wes just drives up of course he's gonna be there right?. Yeah, you'll be there. Brent's going to be there. Oh, okay. Yeah, I'm in. Wes just drives up. Of course he's going to be there, right? Even if his car broke down, we'd come down and pick him up and bring him out. I'll hitchhike if I have to. Yeah, it's still happening.

And ladies and gentlemen, he's back, Mr. Rustic Castaversa with 15,554 sats. There's a mispronunciation right there. There you go. There you go. There you go. That was across a few boosts. And he says, thanks for the great conversation with Frank. It makes me hopeful for the future. You know what makes me hopeful for the future?

Your boost. Rusta, thank you very much. Pegged up, boosts in with 3,333 sats. It's like a plus one duck. I don't know. Yeah. Hmm. It's, yeah. Hmm., I don't know. Yeah. Hmm. It's, yeah.

Hmm. I like that. So, about the tuxes. I saw that you had both as an app and as a server OS. In my opinion, Home Assistant should have that too. It had a fantastic gear, and with their add-ons, it's a great OS to deploy apps on. And jumping to the apps, apart from Home Assistant, the app I'd like to see on the list too is Image. I haven't actually deployed it yet,

but it's up there on the top of my list. Recently, they added external libraries, which was kind of the missing puzzle piece for me. I might be over a year now on my image use. I was going to say. Yeah, it's really, really good. Screw Google Photos. So this, Pegged Out, was a great recommendation.

So Home Assistant is really two components if you're running the whole HASS suite. It's the core OS, which obviously is Linux-based, using containers to run the Home Assistant container and then add-ons that you install, which also come down as containers. And so I've done what Mr. Dodd here has recommended is I've put Home Assistant OS in the best self-hosting category of the year. And I've put the Home Assistant app in its appropriate category. So I've separated those two things out. So you'll see Home Assistant OS and Home Assistant in different categories. This is why. And then his last idea there about image, boom, also added to the list because it is absolutely fantastic. And it was a shame it wasn't on there, but it really entered into its own this year. It was an early alpha last year.

Yep. I think it's great. I think I might be deploying it. We'll see. I've played with it, but because it was kind of alpha, I was like, eh, well, I'll wait a bit. Yeah. Well, and you know what really, the thing that gave me peace of mind is I just run it over Tailscale. So my phone connects to Tailscale, and all the backups are taking place over Tailscale. So my phone connects to Tailscale and all the backups are taking place over Tailscale.

And what Image does that some of the others don't offer, even though I think they're really great, like Prism, is it gives you a really nice local app to view the photos. So that's the thing that Google Photos also does, is an app to view the photos. So like you want to look at a photo or show somebody a photo. It's right there. It's easy. Yeah. Image does that. And when you open it up, it also shows you the to look at a photo or show somebody a photo. It's right there. It's easy. Yeah. Image does that.

And when you open it up, it also shows you the backup status with a nice little icon. And they're working on smart features for face detection and generating memories and stuff like that. How Was Right came in

with 2,100 sats from Podverse. I've always avoided proc mocks just based on my own intuition. I've never heard anything bad about it until this show, which is quite interesting. I'm glad I'm on Team NixOS for now, though. Declarative containers are nice in NixOS land, which I want to explore more. LXC and Docker have always got the job done for me in the past. Here's the takeaway I want people to have. When you invest in a skill set,

takeaway I want people to have. When you invest in a skill set, it enables you to build on top of that and create things that can do the jobs and tasks that you need in a way that you understand and can reproduce and rebuild. And so the reason why we keep going on about, oh, we'll do this with Nix or that with Nix is because after years of you guys kicking our butt to check out Nix, I mean, it took us forever. Yeah, we were a bit slow on that one, sorry. When we finally picked it up, what we did is we, all three of us, invested in a skill set that is paying dividends now. And I think that's why you hear us bringing it up in these different scenarios.

It's a lot like when you first learn Linux. You learn all these things you can start solving and doing with Linux that were maybe expensive or even impossible with proprietary operating systems. And so you just start finding all these solutions. I imagine it's much like if you get a 3D printer. So that's why you hear us talking about it like this. And I think Hal was right as it dialed in. It's like you invest in this idea or for you Rails sysadmins out there, you know, you're probably well-versed in just using KVM on the command line and connecting with VertManager.

It's kind of like that platform's approach. And so that's just the approach you take for deploying VMs. And I think that's something now that I appreciate a little bit more that I didn't at the beginning of this process. And I think, Hal, you put it into words. So thank you very much for the support. Are you saying Hal was indeed right? Yeah. Hal was in fact right.

Space Demo? Space De Niro? What is this one? Space Nerd Mo. How do you do that? How do I look at that? I get Space Dino. I like that almost as much. I don't know. It's a Rhoa Dux from Space Dino using the index. Long time listener, first time booster. Hello, sir. Thank you for taking first time booster. Hello, sir.

Thank you for taking the time to get that set up. We really appreciate that. Although I was not able to attend the talks at LinuxFest Northwest, I was able to get to the meetup at Stone's Throw Brewery, and I met some amazing people. I had a great time, and I'm looking forward to the next gathering. Oh, great. I'm glad you got to participate at least a little bit.

Yeah. I always feel really crappy if somebody traveled or took the time or it's their first, and I didn't get a chance to say hi to them because it's a real tricky balance of moving around the room but spending time talking to people and depending on where the venue is, I kind of just adapt. We often three kind of get a good rhythm. The three of us get a good rhythm going eventually. But you got to get your – I usually try to look over at you guys and if i've seen like oh chris is in a deep conversation with someone then i'll i'll kind of you know for the next 15 minutes take the the task of being the one that cycles quite quickly circulates yeah exactly and then i get caught up in a great conversation i hope you guys are doing the same thing

we haven't really talked about this david booson with 2 cents. Coming in hot with the boost! And actually do note that they are coming in hot with a low boost. Debian doesn't have flavors. That's an Ubuntu thing, because the corporate tax is them only supporting Genome. Genome, sorry. Thank you. Proxmox is not a Debian flavor. It's a Debian base with an Ubuntu kernel with corporate choices on top.

I mean, Lexi in an OCI world? Also, regarding the server and the three days wasted with prepping it, server hardware is corporate tax. Why else would they restrict boot options? Strategy tax is all over the place. Used SFFs is the way to go. Cheaper, less power, less corporate tax. Scale horizontally instead. Shout out to Brent for using hardware longer than it should be and buying used. You are not alone. Shout out to Brent indeed.

Shout out to Brent indeed. Did we say Debian has flavors? Oh boy. The things we got wrong last week. It's embarrassing. We're not doing that again. I mean, it was very fun. I kind of want to do it again.

I mean, how strong were those ciders? What was in those ciders? I just don't know. You know, there was also a couple long days beforehand. Oh my gosh. And no sleep. And just go, go, go. Sultros boosted in with 5,000 sats.

Hey guys, I thought I'd share my Ne drivers being loaded, right? and you can tell a lot. You can tell a lot, and I stole a couple things from this config, so I really appreciate that. Yeah, I see some VirtualBox drivers being loaded, right? I decided I'd never tried VirtualBox on Nix. Oh, yeah. Haven't used it for a while, and I thought, that's exactly what I did is I grabbed his VirtualBox config in here and popped that on my machine, did a build,

and now I've got VirtualBox working great. The other thing that I see in your config here is you basically got, like, every single desktop environment, and you just comment out the ones you're not using and uncomment the one you want. So you must be a desktop environment hopper. You got Genome in here, Cinnamon, Pantheon, Deepin, XFCE4, Budgie, Mate, with Plasma as the current active one. I thought that was kind of interesting. You got Pipewire all set up. You're a Bitwarden user. I noticed that as well. Still using

X11 because you're also an NVIDIA user, I can tell, with this config. There's a lot you can pull out of this, isn't it? Interesting. You can see just all kinds of stuff. Their user information, their networking settings, and how they're doing Podman as well. And if you want that, it's so easy to copy.

You know how typically we get postcode boosts into the show and we get to learn about our listeners a little bit more? This is like your digital postcode. Yeah, Soltros, I hope you start a trend here. If people want to post their config, make sure it's safe to do. It should be. The most of the giveaways are really your username and host names, probably private. And unless you have some static stuff in there like IP. But anyways, put it up on GitHub and then boost it in with the link.

I'd love to go through people's Nix configs. And I got some nice value out of that, Sultrus. Really, really do appreciate that. Lowell Saboteur comes in with a little bit of Rho Dux. He says, I recommend checking out silverbullet.md for the Garage PC and Notes. I don't know how I hadn't seen this before. Yeah, it looks nice. I'm curious.

Well, first of all, if you go to silverbullet.md, the entire web page is rendered using the app, and it's all, like, text that you can highlight and copy around. It is a little markdown note-taking application that runs in the browser that looks really, really nice. If I wasn't already sipping the Obsidian juice, Silver Bullet looks pretty cool, and you can self-host it, you can run it in a Docker container. I spent a minute with it after Saboteur boosted this in. Really like Silver Bullet. We'll put a link in the show notes so people can try it.

VT-52 boosts in with 6,667 sats. And links us to some juicy news about the Nix packages supply chain security project. Sounds like by the end of the year, I don't know if that's this year or next year, but coming up, Nix packages vulnerability tracker. TPM2 backed UEFI secure boot. That could be slick on Nix packages vulnerability tracker, TPM2-backed UEFI secure boot. That could be slick on Nix. Full-source bootstrap chain for standard environment, making it possible to go from nothing to a Nix build environment without using any tools that can't be themselves built from source.

Neat. Thank you for the link. I'm going to have to go through this after the show. That is really cool. So you can make it possible to go from nothing to a full Nix environment only using tools that were built from source themselves. Wow. That's neat.

Yeah, you know, we don't, I mean, there's a lot of things to like about Nix. We kind of gush on it probably too much already. We don't really talk about the sort of reproducibility aspect of it, but it's neat to see that marching onward. Alright, rounding us out, Team Morgan497 comes in with 4,269 sats. Thank you. Using Fountain.

And they are emptying out the Fountain wall because they're trying out Podverse for a while. He has some observations and feedback for the Fountain team. He'd like the full JB show notes and the links in there, which I will contact them about and try to get that figured out because it does seem to be specific to Fountain yeah I wonder are they just choosing to display a different feed

element for that? I think and I don't think it's just our show but I'm not sure I don't genuinely need our show notes because I have the doc so like I never really check the show notes often unless we're publishing and then

i'm kind of done don't need them uh i don't even think often to go to the public page i just go to our internal docs but i will i will try to follow up on that he writes that he also had some issues with uh fountain recalling when he switched between apps where he was playing back and i think that could be a low memory situation um But I think you'll like Podverse. I hop around a bit. I have been using Fountain and Podverse and Castomatic and Podfans and on and on. And right now I'm testing the Fountain 1.0 beta. Or really RC, so that's where I'm at.

Let me know what you think, Morgan. Sam Squanch comes in with 10, sets shout out from victoria bc sounds like a few other people out there are using wise cams i flashed mine with rtsp firmware and using frigate which works great however i cannot figure out how to deny the cams access to the cloud i block all the traffic they seem to use and still somehow they keep working through the app. Any experience with this? So there's the Wisecams. You can also install Wisecam hacks firmware, which gives even more control.

That might be something you want to look into. Just got to make sure your devices are supported. I have successfully been able to block this as far as I guess I should double check. I haven't checked in a long time at the DNS level. I don't block it at the firewall I block it at the DNS level and I just kind of confuse it that way then to get access to the wise cams I use the wise docker bridge I think it's called wise docker bridge maybe double check me on that Wes and that uses wise's local kind of RTMP proprietary stream to pull it in to the bridge and then just convert it to plain old RTMP, RTSP, HLS.

Docker-WISE-bridge. That's it. And so I have then pretty much just kept the – since I've started using that, I've kept the WISEcam stock. If you're in the States, they're like $25 a cam with pretty good optics, decent feature set, but they do require a cloud app and a cloud account. And ultimately, they're Wi-Fi cameras, and Wi-Fi cameras are sort of hit and miss in their quality. It depends on your Wi-Fi implementation.

If I remember when I get Jupes back, which will be after I've traveled, so I probably won't remember, But at some point, I would like to try to see if the Wyze app works again. It's been a minute since I've checked that. If anybody else has experience, please do boost in and let us know your experience with that. Also, a thank you to everybody who streams Sats as they listen. Our dashboard and helipad now shows that in real time. So there's little tricks we've had to pull before, but now I just have it up there on the screen as I'm working, and it's so great to see. So, thank you, everybody, who just turns on that streaming, Sats, and just streams along as they listen. We had 24 boosters this week, and we stacked 356,338, Sats.

Thank you, everybody, who supported the show. Honestly, I think we need to do better, and I appreciate the value we did get, but we tried harder this week and are in a better state of mind, and we appreciate the support of this production. You can support us with cash, you know, your fiat fund coupons, if you'd like to go to unpluggedcore.com

or jupiter.party. Those are membership options. They also give you access to special exclusive member features, like the bootleg version of the show that's like twice the show. Sometimes more. And if you want to just support each production with a boost, you can do that with a new podcast app at podcastapps.com.

Fountain's real close to that 1.0. Podverse is going through that sprint. There's so many good things going on over there. Or keep your app. Just get Albie. Getalbie.com. Top that off using anything on the Lightning Network or indirectly just in the app just boom top it off get some sats and head over to the podcast index you find unplugged you boost them from

their web page boom there's other sites too fountain fm you can boost in more and more now it's boostable from the web heck even the pod verse player on our web page you can do it you just need albie at get albie.com thank you everybody who supports each individual production this is a value for value show and we always want our audience to be the biggest customer i was having some fun with came on this week think of like kind of like h top but just for what the kernel is doing it's a a Linux kernel manager and activity monitor, and it has end cursors like UI that you run on the command line, and it'll give you basic info about your kernel.

It's got a really cool search where you can look for a particular module and then get all the information about that module, its file system location, how to load it, how to unload it. What the license is. Yeah, the author, the description, the device IDs it's talking to. It's such a cool tool. It's called Kmon.

And guess what? It's written in Rust. I thought you were going to say it's packaged in Nix. Oh, it is. Yeah, it is. Even better, though. But, you know, it's a double whammy. It's a double whammy. It's a great little app.

I'm going to basically install it all the time now. I love to see what's going on. I love, Chris, how in our show notes now you've included the command to run it in Nix temporarily. That's really helpful for when I need to test something. Oh, you didn't do this. It was Wes. Wes added that in there. Oh, that's a great idea because now we all can just copy that.

We can just paste it and try it. Currently downloading. Oh, great. It's in Arch too. So, you know, you don't really have an excuse, audience member. You got to try it. I gave it a quick go. I'm like, no, I'm installing this permanently.

That was really great. Okay. Well, thank you, everybody, for listening. Before we let you go, though, I do want to remind you, please, please go installing this permanently. That was really great. Okay, well, thank you everybody for listening. Before we let you go, though, I do want to remind you, please, please go vote in the Tuxes. We want to get as much representation as possible. So Tuxes.party for that. And also just a little programming note,

couple of things coming up next week. Number one, I will be live from Bitcoin Beach in El Salvador. So my first out-of-country live show. We'll see how that goes. I'm excited for this. Wow. Assuming I'm going to have a good one. Yeah, we should probably do some scheming on that.

I'm trying to think if I have any tips for you. Maybe time zones? I'm not sure. Cover the room in pillows. Oh, yeah, that works really well. Try to eat as much. Time zones is going to be hard because next Sunday we fall back.

Daylight savings ends on November 5th. Man, but not everybody does, right? Nope. It's a show day and El Salvador does not observe daylight savings as far as I can tell.

So that means I think when it is noon here in Seattle the go time for you guys I think that means it's going to be

something like 2 p.m. for me. Just your perfect starting to get sleepy time. I know. I'm going to have more prep time but I it's going to be something like 2 p.m. for me. Just your perfect starting to get sleepy time. I know. I'm going to have more prep time, but I'm also going to be getting sleepy. So we'll see. But just keep the time math in mind if you want to come try to witness live my first remote out-of-country show. You better be trying some tasty food and reporting back.

Oh. See you next week. Same bad time, same bad station. Indeed. Why not make it a Linux Tuesday on a Sunday? Join us Sundays at 12 p.m. Pacific, 3 p.m. Eastern. Don't forget about that daylight saving time change. And if you want more show,

our Luplug gets together on Mumble every Sunday. You get a live low latency feed right from the mixer. You get absolutely everything, even the bits that you probably don't want. And then the members, they get the full bootleg version with basically twice the content. Raw, unfiltered Brent. Who doesn't want that?

You know, those Canadians, they can really curse. But it's so pleasant when they do. I also want to know if you're going to run Cinnamon 6 when that lands with Wayland support. If you're a Cinnamon user, are you going to try it? Or have you reached your desktop nirvana already?

Let us know. Boost in. And links to everything we talked about today, how to contact us, the Mumble Room info, the Matrix chat info, how to subscribe to our feed,

all of it is at linuxunplugged.com. Thanks so much for joining us on this week's episode of the Unplugged program. We'll see you right back here next Tuesday, as in Sunday. Thank you. you