LINUX Unplugged - Episode 116: What's New MATE | LUP 116

Episode Date: October 28, 2015

Behind the scenes on Ubuntu MATE’s new features pushing the Ubuntu platform forward for traditional desktops, why Apple’s latest court case proves Richard Stallman was right about owning your own software & there is real debate about Xiaomi's new Linux laptop.Plus the big EFF win that’s great for Linux users, the big problems facing x86 that are a wake up call to distro makers & more!

I think, Kev, the reason Wimpy's not here is because we did our time change last weekend and you do yours next week. Yeah, oh boy. Oh boy. Okay, what's happening, Wes? Will you break it down? We're falling... I don't know, Chris. How can I know? This is an arcane system. It makes no sense. Hold on. Are you serious? You don't know? Okay, we're falling back. Does that mean it gets darker earlier or lighter earlier? Just tell me which one it is, Wes. This is too much fun.

No, come on, Wes. I've been trying to figure this out. It gets dark earlier. Okay, thank you. Okay, I've been trying to figure this out for two days. It also gets lighter earlier. So, you know, it's already, this is a problem. This is a real problem.

It already gets dark way too early. And I've got to be honest with you guys, I start getting sleepy as soon as it gets dark. Oh, I know. It's like, well, 8 o'clock, I guess it's bedtime. Yeah, it is a big problem. It is a, I screw getting sleepy as soon as it gets dark. Oh, I know. It's like, well, 8 o'clock, I guess it's bedtime. Yeah, it is a big problem. It is a... I screw getting lighter earlier.

Screw that. I don't need to get lighter earlier. Then I just feel pressure to wake up earlier. Well, and sometimes as soon as it's... I do, actually. I like... I get up... I usually get up around 5.30.

Around 5.30 is usually when I'm up. I don't want to get... I like X-Metal's point here. What is that? Maybe JB time should just be agnostic. Just make UTC the thing you've pinned to. All the best places use UTC. We're on UTC now.

Hello, Wimpy. Hello. Hello. I've just been caught out by time math. Yes, we were kind of thinking that might be the case. I just wanted to do a little, when we get into the show, a little Ubuntu Mate 15.10 yak-a-yak, if you would, with us. Well, that would be delightful. I'll look forward to it.

And somehow I'm driving all the way to Liverpool in a couple of days' time. I mean, how did this happen? Oh, by the way, who's calling shotgun? I think Mark should sit in the front and I'll sit in the back so I can write my presentation. All-time shotgun. Sure, sure, sure. You can do shotgun to Laura's and then sit in the back.

No, I want to sit in the back. I want to sit in the back the whole time so that you're my chauffeur all the way to Liverpool. Hang on, let me work this out. I'm just going to extrapolate here. Would you like me to wear leather driving gloves and a peaked cap? Wear whatever the hell you like.

We're playing dress up, don't mind. You just want to look like Miss Daisy in the back of my car, is that right? Only on the weekends. All I heard was leather. Oh, boy. Oh, hello, Chris. You know, I've decided I'm going to move.

I've got to move somewhere where it's sunny. Where can I go where it's sunnier right now? Where do I got to go? Australia. Australia? That's what I was thinking, Australia. It's sunny right now. Yeah.

Six months of sun in the South Pole. Yeah, I could do that, yeah. Then I could be more productive. Then I could be more productive. Then I could be more productive. That's what I was thinking. You're looking at this talk show that's ready. It is nice, sunny, and 70 degrees out. Where are you?

I gotta go. That's ridiculous. Looks familiar is yelling at me in IRC. What? I live in Texas, man, and it's sunny all day from 6 a.m. to 9 p.m. Well, that would be 9 p.m. still, really. Because the thing is I can feel my productivity is going to start falling off. It's time to hibernate soon.

Well, because our time zone change is going to make it darker sooner. And I just start – something with me, I think it's probably because I don't get good sleep or something. As soon as it starts getting dark or whatever, I'm an old man. As soon as it starts getting dark, I start falling asleep. I start getting tired. My energy drops way off. It's the release of melatonin that does that. I know, I'm 33.

I know, I mean, I'm not actually that old, but I don't know what it is. It's been for the last two years. 33, I remember when I was 33. Now, listen, you mock, you mock now listen it is so you mock you mock but it is so bad i thought there was something wrong with me because there might be yeah don't discount okay all right because for the last couple of years when i was 33 for the last couple years i was like why am i falling asleep at like 6 o'clock 6 30 at night what is wrong with me why and then as it started getting lighter out i started staying up later and then i started staying up later and then I'm like up at 11 o'clock at night and I'm feeling just fine.

In the middle of summer, I'm like, oh, because there's sunlight. And then as soon as it starts getting, so now I'm starting, you guys, I'm starting to get tired around 7.30 when the sun set. It is ridiculous. I've got like, so basically I've got from 5.30, from about really six, well, really who's going to get out of the house? So from about 7.30 a.m. to about 7 o'clock p.m., that's my window of opportunity right there to do anything. And if it doesn't get done in that time period, it's not getting done. We need to get you some nice solar temperature lights in your rover. The truth is I just got too much work.

I need to work until 11 o'clock. You see, that's how my life is structured. I have a job that expects me to be available till 11 and I can't make it past 7.30. Actually, 8.30, really. Yeah, so I tell you, maybe I'll get one of those sad lights. Yeah, there you go. Yeah. You would think

being in a studio full of lights... The ones up in a constellation or the ones attached to the side of your house. No, like, you know, those seasonal affective disorder lights that give you... I've got Hughes lights. I've even... This is not as cool as I thought it would be. No, in fact...

In fact, one of the things that's really kind of neat with these Hughes lights is check this out. Now, Wes, tell me this doesn't actually feel a little bit different. Tell me you don't notice a little difference when I do this. I'm going to hit the button here. It's called Energize. Ooh. You see what I'm saying?

Suddenly I'm awake, alert, ready for alert it does it does feel a little more like uh look at those you feel energized yeah you do yeah I didn't hear I didn't hear the energize sound all right so here's the difference all right so here's here's here's before right here right see there's before and here's after boom need to... Boom. I need to open a browser. Yeah, you do, you do. See before? Yeah, see that's... Hang on, hang on. That's kind of boring, right?

It's kind of sleepy. Sad, sleepy Chris. It's working much faster. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Does that only work with a cell phone? All right.

Go on, do it again. Do it again. Okay, so here's sleepy mode. This is what we're going to start the show with. Now, here is energized mode. Boom. Boom. You see that going to start the show with. Now, here is energized mode. Boom. Boom. You see that?

Big difference. Big difference. It basically, and I have other modes, too. Oh, right. Okay. Here's concentrate, which I don't like as much. Oh, that's kind of intense. Yeah.

Here's sunset. Ooh. Yeah. Now, it just got warm in here, didn't it? Day is done. Yeah. It got warm in here. This is grease.

Oh, it's green. That's weird. Now, where's the score here, didn't it? The day is done. Yeah, it got warm in here. This is grease. Oh, it's green. That's weird. Now where's the score? God, I can actually see you, Chris. This is unnatural. I don't normally do that. Sorry. There, that's better.

I think it's fixed. Put the curtain back up. Yeah, that sounds good. Cool. All right. So what does Philips Hues run on? Just a mobile phone app? Well, no, actually they even have like a Python API for it.

Like pretty much anything. There's all kinds of things you can use to set it. But the consumer out-of-the-box expectation is a mobile device. So do you have to have firmware update your lights? Not the lights themselves, but the controller. I don't know if it was the Hues, but I saw Matthew Garrett talking about how one of the lights he has has netcat on it, which is pretty disturbing. I don't know about these.

I mean, it does have a little controller, and it does need updates from time to time. You know, they're pretty obvious for a studio use. Having color control over your lights is pretty obvious. I don't know. Without you having to go fiddle with the gels. You know, I was talking to Benjamin Carinza. Did I say his name? Carinza.

Lol. Carinza. What is it? Carinza. Carinza, right. That's right. Benjamin Carinza. Thank you.

And he was talking about how you could tie in his Glucosio app, which checks for, like, your blood sugar levels and whatnot, with Hughes lights. Oh, nice. To change the light of the Hughes depending on your blood sugar. Credenza, yeah. We just need to record you saying it correct once, and you can just have that as a clip.

I know! I've got a freaking soundboard. And also, whilst you're on form there with correct pronunciation, go on, do Antergos just once. Antergos. There we go. You gave it. Everyone, it's Creative Commons, everyone. You can open up whatever YouTube video ever.

I've never installed GNU slash Linux. I just need to replace all these Richard Stallman clips with me saying things correctly. That's all I need to do, and that'll solve the problem. This is Linux Unplugged, episode 116 for October 27th, 2015. Welcome to Linux Unplugged, your weekly Linux talk show that's ready to head out and find the sunshine. My name is Chris. My name is Wes.

I'm just saying I get sleepy in the fall, Wes. That's all I'm saying. I do too. Maybe after this we'll take a nap. Actually, you did bring us Red Bull before the show. I'm doing my part. I'm doing my part. We've got to have a show somehow.

It's been a long time since I've had Red Bull too, so when you crack it open, it's got that distinct Red Bull smell. Yes, it does. But we are well caffeinated for today's episode of Linux Unplugged. We're going to get into, well, a few things. First of all, we're going to chat with Wimpy about some of the new things in Ubuntu Mate 15.10. I'm looking forward to that. Big win for the EFF that benefits Linux users. We're going to chat about that.

Why Intel x86 platform is going to be just basically we've got to write it off. We've got to write it off. We're done. I love me some x86 CPUs. We've got to write them off, you guys. You think I'm kidding? Actually, a really, really compelling report just came out on why we have to do that, and why Linux users are in the best position to take advantage of that.

It's from the guy who created CubeOS. And then later on after that, we're gonna, right here, right now, we're gonna admit Richard Stallman was right. In what may become a reoccurring segment at this point, he nailed it. RMS nailed it. RMS nailed it. This week, a judge declared that because an iOS user does not own their software, Apple can be legally compelled to unlock the device because by Apple's very own EULA, that user doesn't own their device. They don't own their device. Apple owns their device, the OS that runs on their

device. And so because of that, Apple has to unlock it. Wow, is that not a huge red flag and exactly what Richard Salmon warned us about and exactly something that the Linux users should be thinking about. And then after all of that, some really sleek new hardware could be coming out for Linux users. I believe now I've been working on this. I believe it's pronounced Yaume. Sounds good, Chris. Damn it, Wes.

Yaume. And they have something really interesting up their sleeves. So before we get into all of that, let's bring in the Mumble Room. Time-appropriate greetings, Mumble Room. Good morning. Hello. Hello. Hi.

Hi. Hi. So you guys may or may not recall a couple of weeks ago, we played the Linux Foundation's The World Without Linux episode. Let's play their second one that just came out, and then we're going to play Critics. All right? So we're going to, like, mystery science-themed this thing. You ready?

All right. So here it is. The World Without Linux. Episode number two, by the way, with a real serious guitar intro. All right. Road trips are the best, but I think we are totally lost. Don't fret, dude. I brought a trusty map.

Dude. So, a map. All I have to do is convert inches into miles and cross-reference our perceived location with the mile markers on the road and... Uh, my bad. Yeesh. Sorry. Map goes out the window.

Don't worry. As a backup, I printed out directions. These two aren't going to make it. Yeah. So... Broken up by the end of the window. Don't worry. As a backup, I printed out directions. These two aren't going to make it. Broken up by the end of the series. You take a left on... Slight right on... Right. Now...

What in the world are you saying? Sorry. The printer cut off the directions on the side. Ah, MapQuest. I hope you never, ever go away. Okay, well... I think U-turn. Wait, U-turn?

I was supposed to make it U-turn? No, U-turn. Wait, U-turn? I was supposed to make it U-turn? No, U-turn. Wait, are you saying U-turn or you should turn? Right. Are you saying right as correct or turn right? Stop. Wait, are you saying stop it or stop the car? A world without Linux would mean a world without direction.

We are so lost. When do you think we'll get there? All right, let's see. No, I'm going to do this. Okay, so if a train leaves New York at 3 o'clock. Okay, wait, carry the one. You want miles, not kilometers, right? Okay, the way it looks to me,

we're going to be there by Halloween. A world without Linux is hard to imagine. Thanks to the hundreds of thousands of individuals and companies who support Linux, so we don't have to. Learn more and help support Linux today. Wait, that sign says Bermuda Triangle straight ahead. Finally, some good news.

I know, right? Sounds tropical. Oh, hashtag world without Linux. So what do you think, Wes? Are you impressed by the World Without Linux series so far? There really wasn't very much Linux in it, so I guess that's good. You know, yes. Yeah, go ahead, Bopi. Is this a cultural difference between you guys and us, or is that just not funny in any way, shape, or form?

No, I think you're right there, Bopi. It's pretty much not funny, Bopi. Not only is it not funny, but I don't get the premise. Like if she has print.directions, what did she print them from? Yeah. Probably the internet. And then he references MapQuest. Which is probably running Linux.

And I think the fundamental – maybe I'm overthinking this, but I think the other fundamental thing is like it sort of assumes that something wouldn't come up in its place, like a BSD or something like that. I love the idea, though, and I love the basic idea that they're trying to convey. That's the part I should say. I love that. I love the idea they're trying to convey is Linux makes the world easier in a way you don't even realize. Right, spotlighting how it builds

all the common infrastructure. Do you think maybe these promotions are not aimed at us? Yeah, exactly. Yeah, exactly. Exactly correct. Do you think this is more suitable for my mum when I want to explain what Linux is and what it's done for the world? Yeah, yeah.

I do think so. I think it's kind of fun. I'm glad they're putting it out there. And, you know, I've noticed that the first episode did get a little bit of attention. Yeah, it did. I think if I showed this to my mum, she'd say, that's nice, dear, and that would be it. Yeah, there's an element of that as well.

It didn't make a big connection to the part Linux plays, really. No. No, I guess you have to... There's a huge amount that goes into providing the real-time directions. You kind of have to infer that Linux would be providing solutions for all those things in some way. But if you don't know anything about Linux... Debbie Downer and all that,

but it just seems like a complete waste of time. The other question that has to be asked is, is that being created under Linux? Yeah, right. Exactly. I don't think it is. Contracted for a designer using a Mac. Yeah. I don't know. I'm torn. Part of me really

likes them getting the word out, and part of me likes the idea of sort of showing how Linux has made our modern lives easier, but part of me thinks it's a little off-tone because you have to kind of know how Linux has made our modern lives easier, but part of me thinks it's a little off-tone because you have to kind of know how Linux fills in the gaps in order to get it in the first place, and if you know how Linux fills in the gaps, it's not resonating with you. And number two is I probably think it was probably made on a

Mac. My thoughts. Hey, you know what? Speaking of things that are probably not made on Macs, OggCamp 15 this weekend, October 31st and November 1st in Liverpool, which is a little bit uh in liverpool which uh is a little bit of a commute from here just a little bit of a commute so i don't think i'll be making it but i bet a few folks and everything i know i could i could the rover yeah yeah just put the rover on the ferry

and call it good put some pontoons on it what else do i need so uh anybody want to chat about odd camp and kind of tell us what to expect if people are in the area? Maybe they could make it. Oh, yeah. Go ahead. Yeah. So this is, I don't know, like the eighth, seventh one. I've lost count. No, I haven't.

Something like that. And we do them every year. They're community-run events. It's an unconference. And we've moved around the country a few times. We've run them in Liverpool a few times because one of the organizers organizers lives near there and we've got a really great deal on a venue it's at liverpool john moore's university 31st of october 1st of november so that's this weekend as we're recording um and people come along it's not a necessarily a linux or open

source or foss conference it's it's free culture open hardware hacking there's some linux people there you know i bet there's a fair amount of linux people there yeah there is and but it's it's um it's not distro specific so while ubuntu is one of the sponsors fedora is another sponsor and martin can tell you one of the other sponsors in a minute but uh we yeah we have a bunch of sponsors who uh help fund the event but the key thing is it's free to attend so you can buy a ticket if you want to if you want to pay and donate a little bit that helps run the run the event or you can just have a ticket for free we don't we don't uh that's a cool system you don't get a seating or anything like that but But the thing is, most years when we started doing this, community funded, it turns out that the community turned out to be one of the biggest sponsors voluntarily.

So people just voluntarily gave five pounds, ten pounds, whatever they could. And that was comparable or higher than the corporate sponsorships we got from, like, you know, big name brands, which I thought was really nice and really shows off the way that the conference runs. And if people want to come along, come along to Liverpool John Moores University. If you go to ogcamp.org, you'll find out all the details, the schedule. And if you've got something to talk about, bring that along and do a long form talk or we've got lightning talks as well. Cool. That is that's exactly the kind of event that I think is really in that sweet spot. So that sounds really cool. Ogcamp.org, and I'd love it if you guys

showed up and told us a little bit about how it went next week. So Wimpy, you had a little deets on one of the potential sponsors here, and is this the one listed here at the bottom of the page here? No, at the top of the page. So Entroware, who are the Platinum sponsor this year, they are also a hardware partner for Ubuntu Mate. Right, right.

So Entroware is sort of the UK's answer to System76. So if you want a computer that is designed to run Linux, then Entroware is the place that you go. And at Oggcamp this year, they're the Platinum sponsor. I think the only Platinum sponsor. They're going to be showing off their new Skylake-equipped systems at the event. They've also donated one of their new Azure unreleased models to the raffle. So there's a £600 laptop unreleased models to the raffle so there's a 600 pound laptop in the raffle and uh i can exclusively reveal that entroware are also a valve partner and they

will be showing off their steam machine at this year's odd camp and so you can come along and have a play with entroware steam machine so yeah. That's exciting. And this is great for me, personally, because I know these people via email and telegram and what have you, but I've never met them in person, so this is an opportunity for me to meet the guys at Entroware for the first time. So, you know,

this is a perfect example of what Entroware's all about. It's about bringing people together from the community to have a chat, have a meal, and have some fun and, you know, do good things. Well, really cool. I'm glad that they're doing that. And oddcamp.org is now, is there any chance at any point

that this thing would ever be, like, live streamed? We've recorded talks in the past and in fact we've had some people record talks and send them to us one notable one was steven fry who sent us a talk that we played to the audience at odd camp a few years ago which was really nice and he talks about software freedom and gnu and all that good stuff. We tend to not live stream because we just don't have enough people and infrastructure and stuff to do it.

You know what would be amazing? You know what would be an amazing goal? It's probably impossible, but how cool would it be for OddCamp 16 if Jupyter Broadcasting could go and we could live stream it for you? That would be amazing. Yeah, put that in the budget, Chris.

Yeah, wouldn't that be great? I just got to take care of a few things. I That would be amazing. Put that in the budget, Chris. Yeah, wouldn't that be great? I just got to take care of a few things. I just would love to. That's not a bad idea, actually. No, it's a really great idea, and I know of at least half a dozen podcasters in the UK that could help with your accommodation whilst you're out there.

That'd be fun. That would be a lot of fun. Well, let's talk more. I think that'd be really cool. All right, so Wimpy, while we're talking about Ubuntu Mate 2, guess what? As part of fun. Well, let's talk more. I think that would be really cool. All right. So, Wimpy, while we're talking about Ubuntu Mate 2, guess what? As part of the big release, all the big 15.10 releases came out. And the one that we follow really closely on the show is Ubuntu Mate Edition. 15.10 is out. And I like the press kit page that was put together.

And it looks like a ton of stuff. Obviously, the really big feature is Mate desktop 1.10. Also, I know you worked really hard on the new welcome screen. So, Wimpy, where do you want to start with some of the new stuff that's in Ubuntu Mate? Because it looks like a killer release. Well, I think so, but then I'm biased, aren't I? Well, I'm telling you realistically. I mean, one of the reasons people might ask and wonder,

why do I follow it closely on this podcast? Why don't I follow Kubuntu or Zubuntu, which has been around for longer? Because honestly to me, I feel like I've been watching a lot of different flavors for a long time, a lot of different distributions for a really, really long time. And there is really some great things you're doing here. So I think this is one of the standouts. And so that's why I like to cover here on the show. So you really, I mean, I think I'm biased as well. I think it really is a fantastic desktop for anybody that wants to game under Linux

because the Mate desktop has very low overhead, but you're getting a very high quality, very modern looking desktop. Or anybody that just wants a very simple, straightforward desktop that works the way they expect that has low resource usage. But still looks really good. Yeah. And it's friendly to use. It's very friendly to use. So I'm biased as well. Well, thank you very much for the kind words.

That's very gracious of you. Yeah, so we've got the Marte Desktop 1.10, and you touched on the Steam stuff there. So there's a couple of things where the planets have aligned there. I think Pharonix either today or yesterday published an article about the different desktop environments and their performance with running games under Linux. Mate was up there in the top couple of desktops

for gaming performance. It makes sense. And then you marry that with the Ubuntu 15.10 base, It makes sense. that can, you know, with one click, be your desktop gaming environment. So, yeah, there's a few things that sort of come together in a very sort of last-minute, timely fashion, but, you know, it's nice to see all of those things being pulled together. But I suppose the Ubuntu Mate welcome is more than people realise. I see people sort of, you know, immediately hitting close because these sort of welcome screens traditionally have been a bit anemic.

You know, just a bunch of links to websites. And Ubuntu Mate Welcome is not that. It actually does things. You know, it gives you some help through the initial post install configuration and can install, not right definitely for 1604 but but now at least a good proportion of the software you would want to install on a computer you know if you've used a computer regardless of operating system you've probably you're probably familiar with things like dropbox and google chrome or spider oak one or a whole heap of other things and Ubuntu Mate Welcome's got one-click installers for all of those and many others besides and we'll expand on that selection slightly not overly

maybe about 20 titles or so in the next release just to sort of make that the place you can go once you've installed and also it's asynchronous I don't think anyone's picked up on this, but you can go down that list and hit install, install, install, install. Oh, I love that. That's wonderful. Thank you for that. So, is this also sort of a...

Is this sort of an answer to the software center that isn't a software center? It isn't an app store? It's almost something better, because it's actually more in line with what users actually need. Every single time I give someone a new Linux desktop, and it baffles me to this day, the hugest concept gap that they have is how to acquire new software. Definitely.

Because in their minds, just Monday, I gave somebody a new Linux laptop. And his first thought was he wanted to go download Scrivener for the writing month that's coming up. Download. He just went to Scrivener's website and immediately started looking for a download link and a download in EXE. And it just does not register at all how it should be done. And I think so an app store is actually too much. It is overshoot. They have a category of applications

they just want to get up and running with pretty quickly. And then they pretty much never really go back and change it again. So for most people, that's what they're doing. They're using the computer to use these applications. That few functions, right? And so if you nail it with the welcome screen, you almost negate the need

to have a really well robust app store. I mean, it doesn't completely replace it, but for a gotta be a good decent chunk of users, it negates the need as much. Yeah, for a good chunk of people, it certainly fills a need. And that's what it's designed to do. So Matt Hartley actually helped with the software selection in Ubuntu. Marty, welcome. So he helped identify the applications and what they were alternative or equivalent to. So some of the apps you'll find in there says, you know, this is an alternative to.

So GIMP says it's an alternative to Photoshop. That's nice. Say it's equivalent. It's an alternative to. But we've done as much as we can to these applications to make them the best they can be. So in the example of GIMP, it doesn't just install GIMP, it installs GIMP and a series of plugins, including CMYK support.

Oh, that's very polished. And there's a little bit of tweaking that goes on there. So when you choose to install Chromium, so there's a little tick box that says hide proprietary software if you're looking at the internet section and you click that chrome disappears and chromium appears in its place but when you install chromium it installs chromium and all of the supported multimedia extensions for chromium that are available yeah so it does an awful lot behind the scenes does a lot of the supported multimedia extensions for Chromium are available.

So it does an awful lot behind the scenes. It does a lot of the heavy lifting. And, you know, it also brings some things in that probably need a bit of promoting. So things like VeriCrypt, which is now the successor to TrueCrypt. Now that TrueCrypt have been through its NCC group, you know, validations, and they've signed it off, and the guys at VeriCrypt have really improved the cryptography and some of the key generation in veracrypt i think that is now a genuine alternative to truecrypt so there's a one-click installer you know for that for those

people that have got truecrypt volumes that really need to stop using true crypt now there's a solution for you to import your true crypt volume bring it up to date with the latest oh love it that's wonderful makes it nice and easy to move over yeah yeah so there's there's it does a whole heap of things and as you say you know for most people this will so i i haven't cooked this up you know out of thin air this is actually made by talking to actual people that use the distribution or use other operating systems and trying to understand what they need and it is more geared towards people who just need a helping hand to get started but that asynchronous technique is also convenient for someone like me who when I install a new machine, I can just go down the list,

install, install, install, install, install, walk away, make a cup of tea and come back and all my stuff's installed. So this is, I mean, that's just the welcome screen but there's also one of the things that you, I saw also updated was Mate Tweak which I think is kind of maybe a nice point to underscore because I don't know if people realize when they install it, you can go in here and you can actually turn on a whole bunch of more stuff and tweak a whole bunch of stuff. So not to stop the welcome screen, but I also wanted you to touch on the updates to the Tweak app too. Yeah. So Mate Tweak is distribution agnostic.

Right. I forked it from Mint Desktop, so it's a utility that is shipped in Mint Desktop. I forked it from there and then stripped out all of the Mint's specific stuff and then made it distribution agnostic, so it'll run on any distribution, so it's not pinned to Debian or Ubuntu. It runs on Arch just fine and some people

stuck it in the aur but this enables you to uh one click activate compis for example right um so just like ubuntu used to do back in the day you used to go into those extra options and turn on extra animations and compis would come on there's a drop down to enable compis and it's also got a facility to um somewhat uh reproduce the look and feel of other desktop environments outside of the linux world and within so you've got a theme called redmond which looks uh much like windows xp a theme called cupupertino, which looks like Mac OS X. And then within there, I've changed the layout slightly. I've improved the way the UI works.

So now there's the enable indicators, which enables the app indicator capabilities of Ubuntu underneath the hood. If you want app indicator support it's a tick box away or the advanced menu the advanced menu again is forked from the mint utilities that's the mint menu which again i forked and made distribution agnostic so this is something you can install on any distribution running mate and it gives you that mint desktop and i've sort of stripped out all of the bits that are specific to Mint

and made it something that you can run anywhere. And those two utilities are sort of those sort of value add that give sort of Ubuntu Mate some of its identity, you know, that distinguish it from the other distributions. Right. Very much so. And it makes me wonder, the next thing that comes to mind is why I'd love to have somebody have all these things but not have to worry about them upgrading their distro in nine months is what is the likelihood that any of this stuff ever makes

it any further back down to say like an LTS release? Is that even possible? Well, definitely it's going to be in 16.04. So going forward. All right. So I guess I'd have to wait. So if somebody today wanted to set up an LTS laptop, they'd kind of have to either kind of wait or go with 15.10 and then update. Well, you've got a number of options. There is an Ubuntu Mate 14.04 release, which is based on the Ubuntu LTS release strategy. Those two utilities that you're looking at there have been backported. So Ubuntu Mate Welcome and Mate Tweak have been backported to 14.04. So if you want them, they're there. you want them they're there now the thing is i didn't appreciate this at the time but the gap between ubuntu mate 1404 and 1510 is vast so my advice is if you're interested in trying out ubuntu mate today install 1510 because it the best version we've made the most polished version we've made and one of the other things we've worked on in this release is that you can distribution release

upgrade so i've upgraded all of my machines that i was on 1504 to 1510 using the internal upgrader i worked with the ubuntu foundations team to make sure that that stuff worked right. So if you install 1510 today, I will personally guarantee you can upgrade to 1604 in April. Wow. Wimpy will fix it for you if it breaks. Yeah, well, I mean, I was going to even with even if you didn't mention that, I was just going to say it seems like a pretty safe bet that since. Since the gap between 1510 and 1604 is small. It should be fine.

It's one-to-one. You should be able to upgrade pretty safely. So it seems like this would be the one to jump in at. But for me, I've recently rediscovered my love affair with Bluetooth. So something the Marte team have been working on for a while now is helping the new maintainer of Blue Man in Blue Man 2 to fruition. Very nice. That's great. Complete that.

Yes. So Blue Man 2 also features in 15.10. And Ubuntu Marte is not the only flavor to take advantage of Blue Man 2. Oh, shoot. Awesome. flavor to take advantage of blue man too but also the underlying stack has been upgraded as well to blues 5.35 rather than an extremely old version of blues 4 so consequently i'm now able to do um uh bluetooth you know sharing over you know network sharing and connecting to beautiful beautiful yeah beautiful and stuff.

Very recently, things I've become more and more, I've wanted more and more as I've sometimes been in the rover without connectivity, and I just want to move a file from my phone to the desktop. I just want to move that file between these two devices, and I just have Bluetooth as my available option. That should be easy. Yeah, yeah, it should be. Bluetooth as my available option. That should be easy. Yeah, yeah, it should be.

So, I mean, I don't, so it also feels like we are now really reaching the point where 14.04, even with its updates, even the point updates, 14.04 is beginning to feel very old. And I, you know, we have a machine here in studio now that is dual booting and one of the systems it's booting is Ubuntu 15.10. And I think I'm going to stay there for a while and go to 16.04 because I don't think I can go back. Who's clicking there, Wes? Who is that? Who's click-a-lickin'? Who's click-a-lackin'?

That's Swift. Alright, Swift. Swift, maybe Swift needs to move up to the staging area for a minute. Sorry about that. So what I was just saying is, I just very recently went through this debate as I was setting up this machine here in the studio, thinking,

well, I might as well just stay at 1510 for a while. Just hang out there. And then go to 64. That'd be better than this. Generally, 1510 is a really solid release. Yeah, that was my experience in the review testing that we did. There's an awful lot of effort, but behind the scenes, having some involvement with some of the people at Canonical and and and being able to see what goes on sort of behind

the scenes on a on a day-to-day basis yeah to say there's whilst visually on the surface he's seen how the sausage is made yeah yeah and you didn't get grossed out i'll give you an example if you look at it on the surface you might not think ubuntu software center has changed but i know it has so at the back end ubuntu software center has actually seen some bug fixing and improvements that you won't appreciate you know through the through the ui because the version number is the same. But if you go and look at the change logs, you can actually see that the Ubuntu desktop team have been working on this stuff.

Well, that's a statement right there if I haven't heard one before. There's a whole heap of things like that that I've now got an insight to and an appreciation of. You know, that has been... I didn't previously have. That has been a universal experience of mine every time we've gone in and worked with any with a lot of these companies that work in this field is that there is a lot of work and things that get done that they are, A, just not very good at communicating because they don't have the time.

They don't see the need or the people who would be communicating don't see the need or aren't connected to people making the change. Or there's legal reasons a lot of the times, too, that they can't say anything. Or, you know, there's thousands. change. Or there's legal reasons a lot of the times, too, that they can't say anything. Or, you know, there's thousands. But every time we go in there, it's like, wow, you guys are really working really hard, even though from the outside we don't see it all the time. That's universally really much been the case. And I'm usually very impressed. And, you know, speaking of impressed, very impressed by Ubuntu Mate 15.10. I think that's becoming the default recommendation. When somebody wants to try Linux, I think this is the go-to,

especially if they're coming from a Windows or Mac desktop even. Yeah, definitely. It's just very approachable. Yeah. I mean, unless there's a specific reason they would need GNOME 3 or Unity, it just to me seems, if there's not a specific reason for that, because even on a brand-new machine, they're going to have a good performance. Yeah, definitely.

And all the apps they could want. If Ubuntu Mate is the gateway drug for people to find Linux, I'd be perfectly happy to be that gateway distribution that people find Linux through. There you go. Very noble of you. If you use Ubuntu Mate and you like it, and then it wets your palate and you want to go on and find other stuff, then great.

Job well done, I think, if that's the position we hold in the Ubuntu distro community. So if you give it a try, let us know. LinuxActionShow.reddit.com and find episode 116. And I wanted to also give Simonctu a chance to mention about his excitement for 16.04. Go ahead. Yeah, I think I'm actually really, really excited for 16.04 because I think it was TechRepublic that posted an article, and I kind of agree with this,

where 16.04 is probably going to be a very exciting release specifically for Ubuntu Unity because Unity 8 is going to come around the corner i don't know if it's going to be 1604 or what their plans are but i think this it's going to start to pick up pace not only with not only with ubuntu unity but with with other flavors um so i really think this will be this will be one of the um we'll see yeah if if 16 or is 1604 going to be relatively simple and straightforward, but yet with some nice features, and 16.10 is going to blow your freaking mind.

Yeah, probably. Something around there. Within the next couple of years, I think it'll drastically change. Stay tuned and find out. I love it. Keep watching this show. Okay, so we have a big win for Linux users to get into. We still have the Intel discussion to talk about. Also, we have to discuss this. You don't own your operating system. Therefore, it can be decrypted.

And the new Linux laptop. And we have some emails to get into. So I'm going to take a second here. I'm going to tell you all about Linux Academy. Yeah, I want to talk to you about Linux Academy right now. Go to linuxacademy.com slash unplugged to get our special Linux Unplugged discount, and then give a tour, if you will, of their different features. I think you'll be pretty impressed. It's Linux users that got together with developers and teachers to make something really great.

And it's not, oh, here's what I love about Linux Academy is it's not just an attempt at covering Linux and open source stuff. It is truly what they are passionate about. They have step-by-step video courses, comprehensive study guides, and the courses as well have come with instructor help, so you're not on your own necessarily. You can contact a real human being instructor and get help.

There's a great community stacked full of Jupyter Broadcasting members. The courses come with their own lab servers, seven plus Linux distributions you get to choose from because they get that there's different distros you might need to learn on. You can keep track of your progress as you go, and they've been rolling out brand new features. Rather than just checking solutions, you'll now get instant feedback. So you don't have to just try something, submit it,

and see how it does and get scored. You can get immediate feedback when performing exercises, and then you can know if you need to make a change to do it correctly. There's a new learning tool that's part of Linux Academy membership at no additional cost that really adds some nice functionality. Like they're applying this new tool to build performance-based practice exams for certs such as the RHCSA and the Linux Foundation search. Now those Red Hat certifications are a serious thing that people really get stressed out about.

And spend a lot of time and effort trying to get. Yeah, so the fact that they're building this performance-based practice exam, I think, is really slick, really well done. And it's for, finally, for people that are Linux users that have certain high expectations of what is being taught to them, and not just like this basic stuff that's coming from somebody who's just doing a professional read, but actually somebody who wrote, sat down, and wrote the material, instructors that are familiar with it when you need help, scenario-based labs.

You actually work with this stuff in a production live environment, a real lab server where you can SSH into and do the actual work. I think it's really nice. And they also launched their professional development certification platform. It's a new set of tests that are very targeted and a lot different than professional certification. So there's a lot of new ways to challenge yourself. There's also tools available when you have limited availability that automatically adjust the courseware to match your availability. You combine that with the video

streams. It's really pretty neat. And then, last but not least, you can deep dive into single topics with their nuggets. You go there two to 60 minutes long, learn something really simple like how to use IP tables, how to use rsync, how to use Samba, how to set up Samba for this or that, just really specific topics. And it's really nice because they're all really quick or at least very specific. And I really think you should check out their lab systems. It's really cool. The fact that it comes with the lab is a nice feature too

because if you're doing some of the AWS courses, you don't have to worry about setting up all that stuff. They'll take care of all of that for you as part of the integrated lab platform. It's really cool. No surprise, AWS builds. That's a big thing. Yeah, that has bit me. Linuxacademy.com slash unplugged. Go check them out. And a big thank you

to Linux Academy for sponsoring the Unplugged program. You guys are rocking. And that new October update is huge. Huge. If you sign up, you can go read more about it and go check out their community section as well. It's very nice. LinuxAcademy.com slash unplugged. Thanks, Linux Academy. All right.

So BRTMR wrote into the show. He says, I was not satisfied with podcatchers for the command line, so I built my own. And it's called PodFox. Now, I don't know how – how do you catch your podcast right now, Wes? How do you catch your podcast? How many podcasts do you subscribe to, Wes? Oh, maybe on the order of 10. Okay, yeah.

10 to 12. Yeah, it's actually almost exactly where I'm at. Yeah. How do you download them? Are you familiar with Curl? Are you serious? Well, no, actually I use Aria 2, but it is in the terminal. That's usually how it goes for me.

Really? Yes. Okay, so this might be perfect for you. So PodFox is a pod catcher for the terminal. That's usually how it goes for me. Really? Yes. Okay, so this might be perfect for you. So PodFox is a podcatcher for the terminal. I'm loving this logo here. Yeah, that is good, right? That is good. It's a work in progress, but it has got a nice, simple directory structure.

Every podcast is identified with its own short name. I think you were checking this out a little bit ago. What do you think about something like this? I mean, you're doing a dozen shows manually? That does sound crazy now that I think about it, but yeah, that's what I have been doing. Have you tried Bash Potter, too? I have not, actually, no. So maybe I should give PodFox

a shot here. I mean, I like Python. It looks neatly implemented. I thought for sure your answer was going to be on your phone. Oh, yeah? Well, actually, no, I do it the reverse. I usually download it on my computer and stick it in my sync thing folder, and then it syncs to my phone. So tell me actually, no, I do it the reverse. I usually download it on my computer and stick it in my sync thing folder, and then it syncs to my phone. So tell me, IRC, how do you, IRC Room, what do you use?

Like, what's the app name or the tool you use to download your podcast? And then Mumble Room, I'm curious, is anybody in the Mumble Room also using the command line right now to download your podcast? Stay with me, brothers. You used to, Popey? What do you use? Okay, how did you do and what do you use now?

There was a tool called HPodder. Oh, yes. Oh, yes. HPodder is good. Written in Haskell, I think, which is why it's called HPodder. I used to use that. But now, actually, I have an iPad 1 that is pretty much useless for anything because no apps work on it anymore and there's no software updates.

Right. So I just have it sat there with the Apple podcast app running and it downloads my podcast from itunes and i sit and listen and that's the only thing it does i guess it's a decent enough speaker too right so yeah exactly that's not too bad yeah okay so sort of a mobile setup there um do you see they have a tech snap as one of the example urls here no i didn't see that are you serious it looks like it that's really funny where do i go to see that go down to uh import and then yeah you're That's really funny. Where do I go to see that? Go down to import, and then, yeah, you're right, the TechSnap MP3 feed. I love them already. Well, I'm

glad I came across them. That's funny. No, I was just checking this out. Oh, well, he did submit it to the Linux Action Show subreddit, so that makes sense. That makes sense. That does make sense. The TechSnap MP3 feed, that's a popular feed. Yeah, that's some great stuff there. That's a good commuter show. I gotta say, if you haven't listened to the TechSnap show, you throw that.

I mean, you can look at Alan Jude's face if you want. See, for me, it's his voice. It keeps me calm when you're sitting in traffic. Right? Especially when he's talking about ZFS. Yep. Which is a lot. All right.

So, anyways, moving on. So, okay, YouTube. I'm seeing YouTube DL. What are podcasts? That looks for me. Somebody kick him out of here. Reek, I Sizzy, streams all on YouTube. BeyondPod on Android.

Hmm. Anybody else in the Mumble room have a shout-out for the podcatching software they use? PocketCasts. Yeah, PocketCasts is one of my favorites. I totally agree. Oh, yeah, Wimpy, that's what you use for the 20 podcasts you subscribe to. Yep, PocketCasts. And occasionally I send those via Chromecast, but almost exclusively through Pocket Casts. Yeah, and on the internet phones, the Overcast from the Marco Armit is really good. It's free now.

And one of the nice things, and Pocket Cast does this too, if you get a podcast player for your phone, it's really nice to have it sync with a web player. Oh, yeah. Because when I, if I've been driving and the podcast gets really interesting and I park, I oftentimes want to go in and finish it on my computer speakers, which are usually pretty nice, and listen to the podcast there. So to have the podcast mobile app sync with the web app is really nice. Oh, that sounds like a feature I would like. Yeah, it is. So you should check out Pocket Cast. Or Overcast if you want to get an internet phone.

Yeah. So there you go. Apparently we woke up Alan. Now Alan's in the chat room. Sorry, Alan. We love you. Everybody say TechSnap is awesome. And ZFS rocks in the chat room.

All right. So you can go check it out. So moving on from there, Wes, you caught this one today. This came out today as we're recording. It is a release or a media alert. Media alert, media alert. Hold on, we should do this legit style. Do you want to do this legit style?

Let's do it. All right, here we go. It's a media alert, everybody. This is CNN Breaking News. All right, from the Electronic Frontier Foundation, a media alert is coming in here that is actually a pretty big deal. It's actually good news because I started the day with bad news because CISA is raging through the U.S. right now. And net neutrality just got a piss in the EU. So I was like, I was just nothing but bad news this morning.

I was like, I was just, nothing but bad news this morning. But today, the EFF made a post that says the Librarian of Congress has granted security researchers and others the right to inspect and modify the software in their cars and other vehicles, despite protests from vehicle manufacturers. They would protest. Well, this has become a big deal that those of us who have grumbled about the proprietary software in our cars have been talking about it for a while, but it really came to light with the Volkswagen stuff. So the fact that this Volkswagen scandal with the cover-ups has really sort of forced this issue through, I think. And this is a big, big win for the end user. They say this access control rule is supposed to – against harmful and unlawful copying, said the EFF staff attorney. But as we've seen in recent Volkswagen scandal where VW was caught manipulating some tests, it can be used instead to hide wrongdoing hidden in computer code.

The EFF also won an exemption for users who want to play video games after the publisher cuts off support. Yeah. For example, some players may need to modify an old video game so it doesn't, they say, yeah, some players may need to modify, oh yeah, because this is what you're not getting in trouble for now. Some players may need to modify an old video game so it doesn't perform a check with the authentication server that has been shut down. The librarian also granted the EFF's petition to renew previous exemption to jailbreak smartphones

and extend that to other mobile devices, including tablets and smartwatches. It's really upsetting to me that we have to get this as an exception that's occasionally granted by the Librarian of Congress, but I'm still very glad that it's continuing to be the case. It's like a subtle win for digital ownership that we kind of subscribe to. Yeah, it's like a continued win of something we should already just have. Yes, exactly. That should be enshrined and we shouldn't have to get it renewed every so often.

But thank you, EFF. Yeah, I guess they – I mean what this really is is it's sort of working around the rules that the proprietary software vendors try to put in there, which we are going to be talking more about in a moment. So let's not go too far down there. While we're in the things that Wes came across that made us scratch our head this week category, because I think you also sent this in this morning when we were chatting, this is a real interesting piece on the invisiblethings.org blog, which is also where you would find Cubes OS. And I'm just going to read it to you, and then we'll see what to make of it. So

today I'm releasing this first paper. Finally, you can see the PDF or EPUB here. As mentioned, this paper is mostly a survey of the various problems and attacks presented against the x86 platform over the last 10 years and uh boy is it it is uh it is it is basically a uh it is a litany list of issues with x86 that basically to me look like it condemned the platform because there's so many different vulnerabilities built in uh so they start with the BIOS, the root trust of everything, a bad SIM, SSMs. Then they go on to talk about UEFI. They talk about some of the stuff Intel's built in for management. And then from there, it's networking devices, of course, USB devices, the graphic subsystem,

disk controllers, audio cards, microphone speakers, cameras, embedded controllers, Intel management engines. controllers, Intel management engines. The bottom line is specifically Intel x86-based machines are just extremely, extremely vulnerable. No way is about it. Is that essentially what you grok from it too? Yes. I mean, I think a lot of what they're talking about as well is just the amount, you know, the instruction architecture is not necessarily bad. I mean, it might be old and gruffy now. People have different opinions on that. But the amount of microcode and other things that runs without the running operating systems knowledge or

intervention in any way has made it so that efforts from the open source community to make secure kernels that are running on verified hardware, you can never trust it now. It's similar to what we see in cell phones. Yeah, it's very much like that baseband that has its own...

memory and stops the regular processor in its tracks. So let's just—we'll just roll with the theory here that x86 is a very vulnerable platform. You know who I wouldn't want to necessarily be right now? I wouldn't want to be Windows because they're really, really tied to this. I feel like this is something that Linux is going to be much better at rolling with if, I don't know what we'd roll to, but let's just, you know, we're just going with this theory here. If this is really a big deal, it seems like this

would be something much quicker for Linux to respond to than it would be for Windows or Apple to respond to. Right, assuming that, you know, we could get the headwind to change major architecture that is used by, you know, the computing public. Yeah. I think you're right. Yeah. What do you think, Wimpy? Is it possible? Is it all in the hands of the distros?

Or could it just be maybe one big distro comes out and says, all right, we're releasing for this laptop. And who knows how it could happen? There could be something there. But what are your thoughts? Well, all the big distributions are making their platforms available for other architectures. But when you look at DistroWatch, there's 800-some Linux distributions,

almost exclusively aimed at PC, the Intel chipset. Of those, there's about 20 or so that are aimed at ARM platforms. 20 or so that are aimed at ARM platforms. And if you're a distribution maintainer, it's very difficult for you to differentiate yourself from everybody else if you've got eight other distributions to, you know, compete against in air quotes. But if there's only 20 distributions on ARM, for example, or half that on PowerPC.

And PowerPC is still a thing. You know, people think of the old PowerPC on the G4s, but you can buy, you know, new PowerPC-based equipment. You know, there's the Amiga 1, X1000, X5000, and X500 devices. x 5000 and x 500 devices then you know if you're building for those architectures then you're also you know just hedging your bets for the future because the trend is arm is becoming the consumer chip platform and you know you still want a foot in the intel camp for serious gaming and professional workstations you can't ignore ignore that. And obviously, at the moment, despite the energy efficiency of ARM, you want Intel in the data center. But as a distribution maintainer, you can't not be looking at those alternate architectures. alternate architectures. I do agree to an extent.

It's an interesting thought that you put forward, that ARM is going to become the consumer platform. And kind of the concession that you're making there when you say that is consumers don't need a lot of CPU power. Well, they need some hardware acceleration for things for media consumption. And they need some degree of 3 things for um media consumption and they need some degree 3d performance for casual gaming and it's only when you into the serious gaming arena and

professional workstations that you actually need to step out of the arm arena where that isn't isn't yet and it could well be i mean i think it will i mean i think you look at some of the latest generation of cpus and gpus coming out for arm think it will. I mean, I think you look at some of the latest generation of CPUs and GPUs coming out for ARM, and it's... I have to say, I think most of the ARM stuff is driven by economy at the moment rather than, you know, technology, and I think ARM is far more capable than people are paying for. So I think it could well be, you know, the next platform.

You know, I really do think it's a contender. But, you know, we should be gearing up, you know the next platform you know i really do think it's a contender um but you know we should be gearing up you know our distributions to support these platforms yeah so just thinking you know if you're being myopic and saying oh well i'm laser focused on uh um intel 64 bit right well i tell you what you, you're missing a trick there. What is it? I think in February, the Raspberry Pi Foundation said they'd sold 5 million Raspberry Pis in two years. You know, if you extrapolate the numbers out, they must be clearing and approaching 7 million by now. Right now, there are two Linux desktop desktop operating systems soon to be a third in

in the guise of labuntu desktop operating systems available for the raspberry pi two so do you want to be competing against 800 distributions on intel or do you want to be one of the three with 7 million devices? Yeah, you need to be gearing up to ARM. And like I say, PowerPC isn't dead. PowerPC is massive in the data center. This is what's driving these new IBM mainframes. Yeah, that actually all rings pretty true. Well, let's be clear.

They're not PowerPC. They're Power. Well, it's, yeah, true. Well, let's be clear. They're not PowerPC, they're Power. Well, it's, yeah, the architecture is obviously... The Power architecture, yeah. Yeah, it's the linearity, yeah. And also there's still a pretty healthy... Which by the way has very similar problems to the x86. There's still also, I mean, a crap ton of literally PowerPC desktop

machines on eBay. There's still a crap ton of those things getting sold. And I don't know if we could really walk away from this conversation without admitting that ARM probably is riddled with its own issues, too. There's still a crap ton of those things getting sold. And I don't know if we could really walk away from this conversation without admitting that ARM probably is riddled with its own issues, too. It's not like ARM is some sort of savior platform that doesn't have security vulnerabilities. And not to mention, it's always going to come down to implementation. And you have to trust the

whoever's manufacturing them anyway. And when you have physical access to a device, it doesn't matter what the CPU architecture is, there's going to be vulnerabilities. Because all these ARM chips, all these ARM systems also have USB buses, so is there the same vulnerability there? But I think all the underlying points that Wimpy just made, and the point that I'm trying to make too, is that Linux is specifically at a just technical advantage to roll with

this. I think Wimpy underscores a good point, though, that really just out of the box, good to go consumer focused distros that anybody could use. We're really lacking that right now. And I hadn't really thought about it because when I think about it, I think of I think of Raspbian and I think of Arch. And that's what I run on the Raspberry Pis. I don't really think about it. And unless you're up to speed with Arch, you've got to augment that into a desktop distribution. Right now you've got Raspbian, Ubuntu Mate, and soon Lubuntu. And then you've got things like Riscos, and you've got other distributions. There are other distributions out there, but they're not desktop-focused,

end-user-focused. And whilst the Raspberry Pi 2 is just about capable of being a desktop replacement it's not about what what's there now for example odroid if you buy an odroid and an emmc chip uh with ubuntu pre-installed as your linux distribution rather than android when you plug that in and boot it it's ubuntu with the mate desktop now it's not ubuntu mate but it is ubuntu and the mate desktop and they've got the fortunate position that their gpu has also got open source drivers so you've got all of that stuff all accelerated out of the box and raspberry pi is very very close to you know delivering their

uh accelerated drivers for x so i think linux 4.4 is targeted for the initial version that doesn't have all of the 3d acceleration yet but you know it's coming so this is why i've ported every ubuntu flavor to the raspberry pi 2 because when that driver is available, every Ubuntu version is ready to go. I agree with you. When the horsepower gets there, I think you could see there's machines here in the studio I could even see replacing to a certain degree. And it seems like we're only on the start of that. The desktop computer revolution really gave Intel the

funds to work on their fabrication techniques. That's true. That's what we're going to see now in the R and the phones are definitely, they're really adding a lot of fuel to that development fire. Apple pays all that money to get those A9s manufactured. Yeah, yeah. That investment gets pushed out. And Samsung is building a lot of those.

So that's not all lost. Even when they're building the Apple chips, that can't all be lost R and D. They have that machinery, right? They have all, I don't know. They have that machinery, right? Exactly. I don't know. They learn from this. Right, exactly. And so I would say for me it's nowhere near ready.

Nowhere near. I mean, like, yeah. I mean, I just can't even see it for years for me. But I could see it for my kids already. And I could see it for a lot of people in a lot of different work roles very soon if not already. So it's very cool. Alright, so I want to move on from this and I want to discuss

this EULA situation that is very uncomfortable because it's a bad, bad precedent and I think it's one that might be a good talking point for us that are discussing with users why would you want to maybe use Linux over Windows 10? Why would you want to maybe use the Ubuntu phone over Android or something like that? Well, this might be the number one talking point from here on out, I would think. But first,

I want to tell you about our friends at DigitalOcean. That's where I have my servers. Back in the day, before DigitalOcean, I was all about Proxmox. I was all about Proxmox. If I needed a server, I'd spin up a Proxmox VM. Have you ever messed with Proxmox? Only a little bit. But I've heard some good things from maybe you. Oh yeah, definitely. So I would go get

my best Core i7 PC and I'd put a bunch of RAM in it and a bunch of hard drives in it of various quality and I would put that in my garage and that would be how I would do my virtualization. Like a Frankenstein monster virtualizer. That worked for basically always about a year before. For some reason, it completely blew up. And now I'm like big time.

Now I'm like I walk in. I'm like a boss. I'm like, yeah, I have infrastructure in the cloud. I have data centers in New York, San Francisco, Singapore, Amsterdam, London, Germany, and I just got a new one up in Toronto. Yeah, I got it. It's straightforward, that API. You know, and one-click deployment of things like GitLab,

Docker, one of the first to deploy Docker. Wow, Chris. My data center is DigitalOcean. Yeah, I know. It's a big surprise. DigitalOcean, if you use the promo code DL1PLUG, you can get a $10 credit, and you can try out DigitalOcean. Yeah, I know. It's a big surprise. DigitalOcean, if you use the promo code DO1PLUG, you can get a $10 credit, and you can try out DigitalOcean two months for free.

The $5 rigs, Wes, I'm telling you, I think just about every time you come in here, you sit down and log into a droplet in some form or another. Yeah, that's pretty much true. Is that QuasalCore there running off of it? It sure is. At a point, Wes, I got my QuasalCore running off of DigitalOcean droplet, too. Seriously, if you use IRC for work or for communications, you should be looking at Quasal and QuasalCore and put QuasalCore on DigitalOcean Droplet.

Worth $5 right there. Oh, yeah, and it's real easy to get set up. It is. It just always runs. It's just right there for you. Trust me. What you'll do if you do that is you'll be like, why did we ever use anything but IRC? Why is Twitter a thing? Why is Twitter a thing?

Why is Slack a thing? Why are we even using email? Really? Why are we not using IRC for all the things? Anyways, there's a lot of different things like SyncThing, OwnCloud, like I mentioned earlier, GitLab, BitTorrent Sync. We do a big distribution for BitTorrent Sync for our Unfilter show. Lots of people sync from that. All powered by DigitalOcean droplets. It's really a cool system. And one of the really nice things, if you need like a back-end storage rig, there is some really cool solutions

when you use private networking with DigitalOcean. The data sent between machines on a private networking doesn't go against your transfer. Even though you get a terabyte of transfer, you can use private network and do like back-end caching, proxying, or a back-end file server. And they have a really good interface to manage all of this. So for $5 a month, you can get 512 megabytes of RAM, a 20 gigabyte SSD, one CPU, and a

terabyte of transfer. DigitalOcean is nuts, son. They're crazy. I want you to go check them out. And they now also have floating IPs. So that way when you go big, when you're Ubuntu Mate and you're going big, you want to be fancy and you want to have a big launch day, they've got floating IPs. You can scale out however you need. Just move it around.

It floats. It floats. That's fancy. You know what? Things in the cloud float. Yeah. What I like about DigitalOcean, too, it's all running on top of Linux. They use KVM as the virtualization platform, which some other providers out there that you may have heard of before are kind of kicking themselves for.

No kidding. They're kind of like, I wish I would have gone KVM. The best thing about KVM, you get your own kernel right there, you know? You get all the new fancy kernel features. You want C groups. You want IP tables. Like, whatever you want. It's right there.

And that means they're able to roll out the newer distros way before other guys do, which is really cool. DigitalOcean.com. Use the promo code DEONPLUG to support the show and get a $10 credit. And a big thanks to DigitalOcean for sponsoring Linux Unplugged. You guys rock. All right. So just let's talk about this from a general Linux perspective.

The DOJ dismisses Apple's argument against encrypting iOS. And to Apple's credit, they have been fighting this case, trying to say that it will do them harm if they have to unlock it. And they say they can't unlock anything iOS 8 or above. However, the federal court is not agreeing. The U.S. government rejected Apple's argument in federal court that unlocking iOS devices for police would damage the tech giant's public image because they've done it before. Boom.

Apple designed, manufactured, and sold the phone that is subject to the search warrant, the government told U.S. Magistrate Judge James. But this is only the beginning of Apple's relationship to the phone and this matter. Apple owns the software and runs the phone, their argument is. And the software is thwarting the execution of the warrant. The software is thwarting the execution of the warrant. In the Justice Department's filing in the case involving the iPhone discovered on the suspect. He's indicted for a drug possession, meth. And this is an ongoing battle.

Apple filed a brief saying in most cases now and in the future, it would be impossible for it to extract encrypted data from an iOS device. But they dismissed the argument. It says Apple's burden is not provable since they've done this before. Apple's asserts – Apple's burden is not provable since they've done this before. And they also – see, moving ahead here, they say Apple is – Apple should be able to unlock it. The government's argument is essentially that Apple has never really objected to this case, and the fact that they have set up guidelines by which they'll comply doesn't stop them from objecting to any particular case. But they have the ability to do it here, and clearly the judge was concerned. It doesn't stop them from objecting to any particular case, but they have the ability to do it here, and clearly the judge was concerned.

Apple also warned that if it was forced to routinely decrypt data for law enforcement, its employees could theoretically be subpoenaed in every case to provide expert testimony. They cited a previous case where an actual employee who did the decrypting ended up getting hauled into court because he then saw the evidence. So just like the technician that had to do the decrypting. Wow. Yeah. So there's several things Apple is trying to fight against, having to do future decrypting, having to bring its employees into court if they do the decrypting,

and now this argument that Apple's software licensing agreement specifies that iOS software is licensed, not sold, quote-unquote, and that users are merely granted a, quote, limited non-exclusive license to use the iOS software. So in their argument, because it's the software preventing the decryption and Apple owns the software, not the user, Apple must decrypt it because the users don't own the software. Yeah, I like how they came back and said that. You know, well, you guys have been claiming for so long now that it's your software that you're just licensing it, so you can't have both sides of it. Proprietary software is not ethical. Yeah, you know what else makes me think of? Malicious functionality.

Mm-hmm. Perverting free software. That program, although it may be attractive, is really a trap. I think all of those statements are correct. All of those statements. He's right. RMS is right. All of those statements are correct. All of those statements. He's right. RMS is right. I mean, this blows my mind. Their argument is literally that because you don't own the software, you license the software, the manufacturer should be able to decrypt it. And they might actually get this. They might actually win on that argument. They might actually be able to convince the judge of that.

Maybe Apple will take their security claims seriously enough and change their licensing agreement. Probably not, though. That would be, I guess, the best direct fix, right? Right. I mean, they've already got the encryption going on, you know, eight and nine. But doesn't this seem like the biggest argument, like out of all of the arguments, I mean, doesn't this really fundamentally prove why it's important to own your own software? Yes, I think so. Like this is like, to me, seems like the biggest, the biggest bullet point for that.

And there was a post that I caught recently titled Richard Stallman is the hero the internet needs. And a few bullet points. He warned of the growing danger of DRM and the great story, The Right to Read, in 1997. He warned about DRM in 1997. He refuses to own a cell phone on the grounds that it might be used as a tracking or covert listening device. Slightly paranoid, but looks increasingly possible. Stallman considers cloud computing dangerous.

In 2008, he thought this would sound like an alarmist. Now nobody trusts the cloud. He always held the proprietary software could not be trusted. Windows 10's shady behavior proves that point. You mean the Windows 10 I'm running here in the studio, Chris? Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah.

But he was right. He has been right. Yeah, he's been consistently on the ball there. Yeah. So I don't know. Does anybody in the Mumba Room have thoughts on the EULAs and not owning the software and the ramifications

that maybe we're just now beginning to understand? I'm still reading the witness. Go ahead, North Ranger. Well, if the idea behind copyright is for the benefit of the public to secure for authors a limited time, there's really no limits at this point as far as the government's concerned. Yeah, exactly.

That's a good point. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Now, I know two other people. Who else wanted to speak up? I caught that. Next, go ahead, and whoever goes first can have it.

That's not a very good system, is it? Nope. Free for all. All right. This is unplugged, after all. Yeah. Go ahead. Sean Kesey. Let Sean This is unplugged, after all. Go ahead. It was Sean Casey.

Let Sean go first. All right, Sean, go ahead. I was just saying, like, given the fact that basically all software is licensed, do we really own any of it? Yeah, I mean, I guess you'd have to look into the individual ULIs for open source software. But I think if you have the code and you can modify it functionally, you own it. Right. EULAs for open source software, but I think if you have the code and you can modify it, functionally, you own it. It's at least closer to our pre-software definition of ownership than what you get with an Apple or Windows

style license. And Casey, you were next? Or was it Sean that was next? Sorry, I can't see your names, guys. The screen's too small for me. I'm an old man now. No, it was me, WW. Actually, the EULA for Windows 10, I plan on going over with it and looking at it. It's pretty horrendous when you see that, oh, we can use subject and the body email to just return user input.

It's really bad. Yeah, that is a particular nasty one. And, Heavens, you want to get a chance to jump in, too. Go ahead. Oh, we can't hear you. Wow. While he's getting his mic fixed, I would say in the future, I look forward to the day when the DOJ hauls Richard Stallman into court

and says that he has to speak for the fact that he created the license and all the stuff on my machine is licensed under GPL. And so he's responsible for the software that's on my machine. There you go. There you go. That's a good twist. I like that. Heavens, one more chance.

Did you get your mic working? Going once? Going twice? I wonder what happened over there. What happened over there? Maybe Pulse Audio. That's what everybody always goes to, right? Everybody always has to blame Pulse Audio.

All right. Well, heavens, I'll give you a chance to troubleshoot that for a second. It was just a thought-provoking piece, and I wanted to just kind of call it out because I think it underscores something a lot of us Linux and open source enthusiasts have been talking about for a long time. I'll tell you about something else I've been talking about. That's Ting, my mobile service provider. Ting is mobile that makes sense. It's only pay for what you use wireless. It's your minutes, your messages, and your megabytes. They add them

up, whatever bucket you fall into, that's all you pay. It's $6 for the line, a great control panel, really enthusiastic customer service, and really good selection of devices, too. All these are unlocked, so you own them outright. You can go to linux.ting.com. linux.ting.com. You know, Chris,

I was doing the math yesterday, trying to get my parents to switch to Ting. I looked at the last year of their bill. They would save an average of $62 a month if they switched to Ting. That's a nice savings. Yeah, these are real-world figures. I did it yesterday. Yeah, when you go to linux.ting.com, they have a savings calculator there on the front page. Makes it really easy.

Yeah, you just plug it in there. And then, you know, so would they be getting more of a smartphone device or more of a feature phone device? Well, this is on their current feature phone track. Maybe not the current, most current. So they're cool with feature phones? Yeah. And Ting works great with that. And, you know, they've been on another provider who their phones will just work right with Ting.

They won't have to change anything. Yeah. The feature phone prices are ridiculous. And then, of course, I love right here that you can get the Moto X 2nd Gen for $299, unlocked, the Moto Nexus 6, or you can get the LG 5X. Right, when they're ready to go to that next level, Ting's got it all right there. You own the device outright.

It's nice. It's nice, including my S6 Edge. Yeah, so you can check them out at linux.ting.com. I love their customer service. I love the way their control panel works. It makes it really easy to manage my account. It's really easy also to pick between GSM and CDMA, so you can pick and choose which one's better in your area. And if you're a little savvy with Wi-Fi, it's going to blow your mind with the savings. Blow your mind. Check it out. Linux.ting.com. And a big thanks to Ting for sponsoring Linux Unplugged. Okay, Evans, did you get your mic working? Did you get it fixed?

Going once? Yes, I believe I did. All right. You're a little over. Testing, testing. Okay, Evans, did you get your mic working? Did you get it fixed? Going once? Yes, I believe I did. All right. Testing, testing. Yeah, you're a little hot, but you're good. You're coming in now. So what did you want to add on before we wrap up? Sounds good.

Yeah, what did you want to add on before we wrap up? It really just applies to Apple's product, Apple's software, or possibly the Apple hardware. So if we have a hardware module, which we own ourselves, which they do not own, but their operating system APIs call, we could have our own owned decryption keys. Kind of like little, you know, here, whatever. Or the SIM card. That would be nice. So it would come down to the user owning the hardware

and then just installing their OS on it. Which they would use, and then it would bypass the ULIS agreement for us using their software or their OS. That's an interesting idea. That is interesting. I wonder if that would ever actually happen. Ever happen, yeah. You know, so speaking of hardware,

Yaume, I think is how you say it, they have been pondering a Linux laptop for a while and now the folks over at OMG Ubuntu say it's going to happen. Their long-rumored Linux laptop has been kicked around

and we've covered it once before in its earliest stage. It looks like it's going to be a 12.5-inch display and then another with a 13.3-inch display.

The model with the 12.5-inch screen will be manufactured by InvenTech who also makes laptops for Acer and Toshiba and HP, with initial order of 250,000 units. The slightly larger device is being made by

Compella Electronics. They also supposedly manufacture some Apple devices and various PlayStation, Xbox, and Nintendo game consoles, and Yame is supposedly placing a 300,000 order unit with them. Hmm. Now, this would be shipping with their own version

of Linux, they say. Oh, interesting. Hopefully with not too much out-of-tree stuff. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And no word even on if it would be shipping anywhere specifically. According to the same sources, they'll be priced cheaply but offer high performance.

I like that. Just like the company's smartphones. So probably going to debut in China, I would imagine, but maybe eventually make it over here. Is anybody interested to see what Yao Mei could do? Actually, I don't think anybody in here was last time we talked about it. Has anybody changed their mind? No. Seems to be more popular online though. We've gotten people sending in to the show that are definitely looking forward to it.

I mean I'm interested. I don't know that I would necessarily get one, but I feel like there's a couple, you know, 13, 14-inch laptops that people can look at. But really, like 90% of the laptop field is boring, 15-inch, you know, it's like five pounds. It doesn't have a great resolution. If you're coming in the laptop market today with a 12.5-inch or 13-inch laptop, you are probably targeting the MacBook Air, right? Right. And so then when you say that, I think light, thin, but decent performance. Right. But if you could just offer me a few things that the MacBook doesn't, like a couple more ports would be nice. Better Linux compatibility.

Absolutely, that would be nice. Then maybe you got something here. And it might be nice to invest. You know, maybe not, but it's nice to see clearly, you know, the Asus and Acers of the world. They have some stuff for us, but they're not really supporting our crowd very much. So we might be able to support a new company who will leverage that. Yeah. System 76 has a laptop in this space.

There's the Dell XPS. Then you can also go get yourself a ThinkPad. But maybe it'll be terrible. I don't know. But there's still room here, I think. No, I think there is still room here for this. You put a really nice screen on there, you put a decent CPU in there, and maybe some PCI Express storage. At the right price point, yeah.

I could be interested in that. I'm not really in the market right now. My XPS 13 does the job, but I could be interested in that. Yeah. I don't know. Anybody in the mom room interested now? Anybody? Come on. I don't know. Anybody in the member room interested now? Anybody? Come on. I can't believe it. You guys, what do you got? You're all a bunch of

ThinkPad users. No, you're just all a bunch of ThinkPad users. What if I got... The problem is, chances are it's going to only be available in China. Probably have some wacky version of Linux that doesn't contribute upstream at all, and so if I wanted to wipe that and put something else,

like Ubuntu Mate or Ubuntu proper, I would probably find the wireless doesn't work or the touchpad's skitty or whatever. And I don't want to have, to buy something from China, find it doesn't work and then end up putting it in a drawer or chucking it on eBay. I would rather know that it works, which is why I'm veering towards a ThinkPad or a Dell XPS.

At least they contribute upstream. So my question would be... At least they contribute upstream. My question would really be, is it going to be more Chromebook than it is Linux laptop? Right. And you know what I just kind of remembered? Incidentally, is I believe my Librem 15 was supposed to arrive in September. Oh.

It is now October. We'll have to do some following. Remember how I backed that? I'm sure it's coming soon. I was told it was. Maybe it's to do some follow-up. Remember how I, yeah, remember how I backed that? I'm sure it's coming soon. Yep. I was told it was. Maybe it's on the

doorstep right now. Maybe. It would still be late. Yeah. I would really like to do that. All right, Swift, you want to talk about

ThinkPads? Go ahead. Yeah, my thing about the whole ThinkPads thing is, while the recent ones, I keep hearing about the whole Superfish issue, the classic

ones are really nice. The only thing I would say is the resolution is an issue. I'm currently in front of an X201 right now, and I love this machine. Yeah, I think that's about what I hear all the time. That seems to be a pretty fair assessment. Wimpy, you have a Librem 13. Tell me, what do you think? Well, I have the better version of the Librem 13 in that I actually have one that you can buy today and it works and is running

stuff, yeah. And do you like that hardware? Well, I do now that I've helped fix the touchpad driver in the Linux kernel. Yes, it works very nicely. But what's interesting about the Lib 13 i have some involvement with them so hello uh everyone from uh purism uh you'll know me from the guy that

sent you the kernel patches um but it's a long time coming so they're just shipping the libram 13 and enterware who i spoke about earlier who have been shipping that hardware platform since almost the start of this year have already revved on that platform and are just about to release their new version based on Skylake

and that's coming out next week or the week after that's going to be nice yeah I just don't get this purism thing next week or the week after. That's going to be nice. Yeah. I just don't get this purism thing. Or, you know, honestly, that and this Xiaomi Linux laptop. I mean, I think

this Xiaomi Linux laptop, or however you pronounce it, is a total non-story for any actual users. I don't think it's going to be a product that we really get our hands on. Well, maybe not in the US, maybe not in Europe, but it could be a thing in China. But even then, they won't even probably know it runs Linux. Well, do they care?

No. They just want something to replace Windows XP, don't they? Yeah. Or a first computer. Not even necessarily something to replace XP. There's a giant market of people who've never even owned a computer at all out in the burbs and beyond in china that that have never had a computer yeah yeah absolutely for those people something like this that can get on the internet is a fantastic device very much i agree uh and uh i wait with uh anticipation for

my libram so i can give it a shot i have been thinking it would be oh oh oh oh yikes yikes did you hear that how much did you pay for that I don't remember it was during their crowdfunding and that was I think over a year ago now I can't remember maybe it wasn't a year ago maybe it was the beginning of the year

I you know really really if I wasn't going to you know a lot of times a lot of times I will buy something specifically so I can have it for review on the show. And this is, that does fall into the category of I, this, from a news standpoint, is an interesting topic. And it's really nice to be able to contribute some actual genuine observations on the product in the shows. So for me, that pushes it over the line. If I didn't have that, I don't think I'd push it over the line. But we'll see.

Fair enough. I think the latest update from CrowdSupply said that the Librem 13 would ship in late October. The 15? The 15. Oh, right. If you order the 13. No, the 15 is October 19th, it says here. Okay.

So today is October 27th. All I'll say is that the Librem is about three times over the price of where you can get it elsewhere. And if you want... Yeah, but you get hardware kill switches, though, Wimpy, remember? Have you actually seen those? Well,

we'll see. We'll see. The jury is out. We'll see. Well, Chris, look, if you want to review another hardware platform, then I know Entroware would be interested in hooking you up with one of their new Skylake devices. Oh, they should email me. Yeah, I would not mind a Skylake device.

That sounds cool. Well, all right. I know. My quest, I feel like this quest for like a laptop that would be available in the stores you walk in, a thing runs Linux. It's impossible. We're so close, but yet so far away. runs Linux. It's just... We're so close, but yet so far away. There's really great places now to

go get good devices, like Entreware, System76, and even Dell has Linux. Do they start shipping that again? I can't keep track of what they do with Linux. They will. Okay. But you have to know. That's the thing. You have to know.

It's just a significant time investment figuring all that out. You know what else you have to know? You ready for this, Wes? LinuxActionshow.reddit.com. That's where you go to give feedback to this show or jupyterbroadcasting.com slash contact. You can choose Linux Unplugged from the dropdown. We'd love to get your feedback.

Yes, we do. Join us live, jblive.tv. We do this show Tuesdays, jupyterbroadcasting.com slash calendar to get in your local time zone. It's 2 p.m. Pacific. Usually when we start, we usually start a little bit before that, you know, just for funsies. Wes, anywhere you want people to check you out online? Not this week, but there should be some stuff coming. Mysterious.

All right. Follow the network at Jupiter Signal for live stream announcements and things like that. Linux Action Show on Sunday this week. Moving it to Sunday. Oh, exciting. This week to make room for some stuff. So check out Linux Action Show on Sunday instead of Friday. And see you right back here next week, everybody! Thank you. All right, Wes, we're all done.

We're out of here. We're done. We're complete. Mission accomplished. JBtitles.com. Yes, it was. Thanks, everybody. Thank you, everyone.

Sorry for being a grumpy old sod about the Abram. No, no. It's fine. It's good. Don't worry about it. I'm sure you'll have fun reviewing the device. Well, we'll see. We'll see.

Linux communities survive on grump. So it's needed. I think people have gotten a little too sensitive about criticism. Just saying. There's people out there that get a little too sensitive about it. Sometimes criticism can be well placed. So criticize Chris as much as you want. They do.

He takes it very well. Oh, my God. Don't they? Geez. Oh, brilliant. If there is – seriously, people just criticize me constantly. They really do. And that's how you got so good.

Yeah. Oh, sure. Yeah, thanks. And that's why you moved away from IRC. Why you moved away from Telegram. Yeah, right? No kidding. No, that's not true. I'm in IRC all the time. But yeah.

It is very true. And honestly, there's just tools to tune it out too if it gets ridiculous. That's really what it's about. It's like, you know, there are plugins to just turn off comments when you don't want to see them, and there's all kinds of things you can do, but you've just got to walk the line, because you don't want to overdo it either.

JebbyTitles.com? JebbyTitles.com. I wasn't trying to enroll myself into your TwitFilter. I was just trying to provide some level-headed... I suppose I'm just forewarning you. Yeah. Oh, man. It's a little bit of a bummer.

It's a bit of a bummer. And you know what else? If you had paid for the Librem 13, what you can get for it elsewhere, and what you can get for it elsewhere and what you know what you pay for elsewhere it's a good machine but it's like three times more expensive through libram and they're trying to pitch this as like an apple type product and it just isn't that so yeah it's well you know

fundamentally how does a brand new company compete with a 30 year old company at manufacturing? How do you even do that fundamentally? Even if it's well, and the other thing is, is that purism have tried to pitch that, you know, they're doing all of this manufacturing themselves. And that's not the case either. So, you know, it's a little bit smoke and mirrors. So, Chris, can I criticize you for being so negative on the Xiaomi laptop? Sure. Yeah, that's fine. Yeah, you think it has a good chance of becoming big? Well, I won't make any prophecy, but this company has been doing great phones, and it seems like they really have a great price to performance ratio and also their devices are always very well thought out and they are also a very big manufacturer of phones

so i think they have quite some experience and i was actually hopeful that they might shake up things a little bit oh you should have said that in the show that's a good you know uh i hope i and i agree i think probably if you could what i would criticize our takeaway on is it could be big for thousands and thousands of people, but just not for us. I mean, we're jaded Americans. Yeah. The problem is getting into the U.S. market, I think, for a lot of these products. Not really. The Chinese market is gigantic.

And that's, like, we get this in get this in ubuntu we get like when is it coming to the u.s when is it coming to the u.s and there's like 300 million people in the u.s or whatever your population is but there's a shit ton of people over in china as well and those people are people who are actually buying devices who don't currently have a device or don't currently have a laptop. And so there's a gigantic untapped market over that side of the planet. And that middle class over there is expanding. I mean, there is a lot of growth potential over there right now.

Yeah, when Apple's profits in just China dwarf Samsung and Motorola and LG and and Motorola, and LG, and everybody else combined, you know that's a big market. Yeah, also China has one-seventh of the world's population, so. Yeah, and so it could be. I'm really excited for my Chinese MacBook Air. Yeah, so exactly. It could be a Chinese MacBook Air, exactly. And it could eventually make its way over.

Exactly like a MacBook Air. Well, that picture might literally be a MacBook Air. I don't know. Exactly. They could eventually make its way over. Exactly like a MacBook Air. Well, that picture might literally be a MacBook Air. I don't know. Well, I'm curious. I saw a comment before. It was really funny. In IRC, I saw a comment that said that they could just

ship from China a MacBook that has an Apple logo that just runs elementary OS. i thought that was funny but i'm bum uh what's new mate i i have been looking at um new phones like you know looking at what alternative devices are there out there and the xiaomi phones look really nice there they've got some nice mid to high rain high end like you're talking like three gig of ram rather than two they look with 4g chipsets and decent resolution screen and multiple sim slots and all that kind of stuff for a really decent price point like 180 dollars

or something like that yeah i know but you have to get rid of the software. If you've used one and the Chinese software on there, oh man. Right, probably wipe it and put Cyanogen or something else on there. It almost reminds me of that Windows firmware thing with the I don't know that it was the

Windows, something with the BIOS or something like that with the firmware that something was in there. I heard it on a previous show. I don't know if it was Linux Action Show or Linux Unplugged or something like that. But I heard about Windows loading something onto your, oh, yes, it was for the OEM laptops where the manufacturer or someone could put special firmware on your device. So whenever you install Windows, if you reinstall Windows, it would automatically install those applications again.

Yeah. It kind of reminds me of that. Yeah, Lenovo's, yeah. Again. I think we should go with What's New Mate, or Mate. Yeah, that sounds good to me. I think I like it. It was a good conversation.

Thank you, Wimpy, for making it in here. And thank you, Poppy, for paying Wimpy. No, thank you. You're welcome. Thank you very much. Yeah, I'm just Poppy's bitch. He summoned you. Oh, come running.

We were going to sick the—well, it was either that or sick the whole chat room on you, and so we figured that was probably more— More efficient of anything. Well, yeah. So thank you for making it. And thank you guys for being here yeah and so

chat room don't forget I mentioned it right there at the end of the show but we're going to do Linux action show on Sunday Sunday probably 10am our regular time

yeah so okay alright bye mumble room thank you for being here adios when do you change your clocks is it Saturday night

Sunday morning so your oh my god JB is going to move oh my god my God. Oh, my God. Is that a thing? Could I possibly? Yes. You change this weekend.

Oh, why did I have to? On the one day we move back to Sunday. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. That's horrible. That could not have gone more worse. Just set it back an hour.

You've done it. That is horrible. Oh, geez. Just do it early on Saturday. You've done it. That is horrible. Oh, geez. Just do it early on Saturday. You know what makes it even more complicated is Noah is traveling across time zones right now. And he will be traveling while we're doing the show across time zones.

Oh, that's going to be a disaster. Holy crap.