LINUX Unplugged - Episode 261: GNOME, GNOME on the Range

Episode Date: August 8, 2018

GNOME is discussing big changes, Elementary OS has big news, and a big bug has been found in Linux. Plus an update on our PeerTube efforts, our take Android P, and Lenovo’s big commitment to ThinkPad’s running Linux. Special Guests: Alan Pope, Cassidy James Blaede, Danielle Foré, and Eric Hendricks.

Hey, Chris, did you see the Gnome Foundation received a whole bunch of money lately? Yeah, they got $400,000 in total. Like $300,000 is going to the foundation, and another $100,000 is going to GIMP. It's awesome. It's all coming from this mysterious handshake.org. I got to be honest, Wes, I did not know about handshake.org, I don't think, before I saw this. Kind of a sleeper project, but it's interesting. Yeah, it is.

It's kind of promising what has always been hoped for, which is decentralized permissionless naming, like DNS, and certificate trusts. And it works with DNS in a way. Put that another way, an experimental peer-to-peer root DNS server. This is very fascinating and a great idea. I'd love to know more about them, so we might reach out in the future and have a chat with them. But yeah, this is great. Even if we haven't heard about them, that they have this kind of money to slosh around, not only seems to benefit us a lot, but does make me think like, okay, what's going on over there?

Hmm, perhaps this will relate to something else we're going to talk about today. Strokes the beard randomly. This is Linux Unplugged, episode 261 for August 7th 2018. Welcome to Linux Unplugged your weekly Linux talk show that's fully staffed and ready to podcast. My name is Chris. My name is Wes. And my name is Brent. Hello, guys.

We have a great show coming up today. 261 is packed full of great community good news, really, including new features that are coming to Linux, great news for friends of the show, new features that are surprising to even Microsoft, and hope for those of us that want to play Windows games on Linux, as well as a couple of great apps, an update on our community PeerTube instance, and a breakdown of what's got our attention in the new Android Pie release. That's a ton of stuff this week.

Absolutely packed. And not only do you have your humble host, myself, Wes, and Brent, but you have that virtual lug. Time-appropriate greetings, Mumble Room. Hello. What's up? Greetings.

Hello. I don't know if it comes across, but that's a full room this week. I'm excited, too. I think they're raring to go. I'm raring to go, Wes. Tell you what, I've been out there in the heat, charging myself like Superman,

preparing myself to podcast this week. Because the news has even reached the halls of Microsoft. It's undeniable the power of developers on Linux. July ended with 3.97 million starts of PowerShell Core, 82% of which were all on Linux. They were expecting those numbers to be reversed, and they thought it would be on Windows 10. This is from a little birdie tells me that would be in a position to know that they were expecting the numbers to be the exact opposite. They thought that Linux would be around 20% and Windows 10 would be around 80-ish percent.

I mean, that's how it normally goes. And they got the numbers back from the, you know, insight metrics that they collect. And 82% of the PowerShell start instances happened on Linux boxes. That's a, I mean,

that's Microsoft's own shell. Okay? I mean, that's Microsoft's own shell. Okay? I mean, that's why that really gets me. It's not like it's Bash, okay? It's PowerShell. I'm really curious to know what all those people are using it for. I mean, not that they are not legitimate uses. I'm just genuinely interested.

See, I've always had a theory. The whole PowerShell core coming to Linux thing was really a gift to system administrators who wanted to use Linux and still manage a bunch of Windows boxes. And I wonder if that's a bit of what's going on here. Oh, sure. Yeah, it's your little open source tie-in into that system. There's also certain things about PowerShell that are very appealing when you compare it to certain other shell environments, which I am not an expert to get into, but we did cover that in a past episode, if people want to know. I just thought that was a fascinating stat to start with right there.

I also love hearing that 82% of anything is on Linux. I think that's a really good thing for us. That's very true. That is very true. I want to give a special shout-out to not one, but two fine gentlemen from the Elementary OS Project. Hello to Dan and Cassidy. Good to have you guys here. How's it going, man? Guys, I feel like we should start on a journey.

I want to go on a journey with you guys to talk about where we're at. But the reason why they're both here, one of the reasons at least I assume, is last week Cassidy announced that after quite a while at System76, he is going full-time at Elementary OS. And that's massive. For anybody who's ever had a side passion project that they were super committed to, there's always been that agony to go full-time. I'm pretty familiar with that.

So, Cassidy, I'm just super happy for you, man, because I can imagine how good that must feel. So, congratulations. Thank you. Yeah, I'm really stoked. because I can imagine how good that must feel. So congratulations. Thank you. Yeah, I'm really stoked. So we are going to get to that as well as some other potentially interesting community news.

But the crew voted, and we decided to start with just a bit of a TechSnap security notice in a way, really, here. It's this vulnerability notice for a flaw in the Linux kernel TCP implementation, which makes it vulnerable to an easy denial-of-service attack. Linux kernel versions 4.9 and above can be forced to make a very expensive call

to the TCP collapse queue and the TCP prune queue calls for every single incoming packet, which would lead to a denial-of-service. They say can, but of course that would. An attacker can induce a denial of service condition by sending specially modified packets within ongoing TCP sessions. Maintaining the denial of service condition requires continuous two-way TCP sessions on a reachable port.

Thus, the attacks cannot be performed using spoofed IPs. But the impact is a remote attacker may be able to trigger a denial of service condition against a system with an open port and it's on anything above kernel 4.9. Yeah, that's rough, especially if you're running a server out there on the internet. Looks like with less than two kilopackets per second of an attack traffic, you can then just totally,

totally load a box, delay all the network traffic. That's not really good if you are trying to serve webpages. This is how podcast wars will be fought in the future, once they become big business franchises. That's so funny to even think. The podcast wars, when it's just

five podcast companies left. They began exploiting old Linux boxes on the internet with denial of service attacks. I mean, when you're too busy making podcasts to patch your box, that's your problem. Who can patch? Who can patch? Anyways, the crew wanted to get you.

The crew being those of us that chatted about it earlier today, which was a few of us thought, you know what, if we're going to talk about this on the show, we should probably get it out there in sort of like a kind of like the more you know kind of thing. And there's no real workaround except an updated kernel. So go look for those. Yeah.

Okay, now here's the news I've been avoiding, even though it's the beginning of the show. I've still been, I've been delaying to get to this point because I feel like it's going to be perceived as an attack and it is not an attack, it is an analysis. And we start with a piece that was written about common causes of Fedora workstation crashes and the fact that they have been traced back to GNOME, Shell, JavaScript extension, JavaScript extensions crashing. So here's the scenario. And this is a write-up that we'll have linked in the show notes at linuxunplugged.com

slash 261 if you would like to read it yourself or if you've been experiencing some instability issues. Now this is predominantly the worst on Fedora 28 because it's using Wayland and here's the scenario. A GNOME shell extension crashes. That takes out the shell. When the shell goes out,

it takes out Mutter, which is the thing that's talking Wayland, that is the display server, and you lose your entire desktop because a shell extension crashed. That's very upsetting. And so the developers have started talking about ways to potentially resolve this issue. There's been a few different discussions, really.

So this isn't any one particular developer's idea. It's been kicked around a lot, even at this year's Guadec. The idea could be to perhaps just sort of enhance the existing behavior in Gnome Shell, where when it crashes and it comes back, the shell, when it comes back, all extensions are disabled, and it is up to the user to sort of go through and play Russian Roulette and re-enable their extensions until they get to the thing that crashes. Of course, we all know in the real world, you don't crash immediately often. It's a day or two later. So it's really hard to actually

figure out which one it is, even if you're checking the logs. But that's sort of the most easy course to take is you just sort of change the way the shell crash behavior works. Another possibility that has been considered is decoupling GNOME shell and MUTTER. But obviously, that would require major architecture changes, something we've talked about on this show before, and also likely changes in the way extensions behave, and the creation of some sort of IPC communication system in the background. Then there's a third proposal, perhaps in some ways the easiest proposal, but the most controversial proposal, and that's discontinuing unlimited extensions, introducing a limited

API they can use instead of hot patching, because this is how it works right now, like the old macOS Classic extensions that literally hot-patched macClassic. Right now, extensions on GNOME Shell are hot-patching the GNOME Shell code itself. Obviously, this is risky. And if you introduced an API that the extensions could use, and you could even limit that API, it would mean that basically all of the existing extensions

would have to be completely re-implemented, and likely some of their feature sets that they take advantage of now because they can just insert themselves into the code of the shell, they would lose that access, and that functionality would be gone. So this is a difficult point that GNOME is approaching, and they're not necessarily taking any action right now. These are just things that they're concerned about and there's also a conversation at the same time and again just discussions and this is how this is supposed to work and we should give them the

space and the room to make these discussions but also ongoing right now are discussions around removing the theme capability from GNOME. I'm going to let that sit in for a second. One theme, their theme. No more custom distro themes. And that's a big one. Think about how Canonical sort of makes their GNOME shell theirs. Fedora puts their touch on it as well.

Everybody does. And that's sort of a kind of distinguishing feature of GNOME 3 in a way. And really, that distinguishing choice is one of the standout features of the Linux desktop, to have that level of choice. But I have seen

what an absolute shitshow that code really is. You're hot-patching CSS. You're going in there and you're yanking out lines of code and CSS and putting in new ones and then you're reloading the shell and seeing what the hell happens if the shell even loads again. That's how you create a GNOME shell theme. And the way anybody gets it done right now is they fork. That's why everybody forks themes now. Because so much of that super crazy ass hard initial work has been done. So people are just building on top of other themes now.

Because you got to kind of be a masochist to go back and do that to yourself. And I watched somebody do it at a canonical event. Let me tell you, that was one of the things that, I'm not joking, made me switch to plasma. When I saw how that was being done, I completely lost faith. And that was one of the things that made me switch to Plasma. When I saw that, I went, holy shit. So I can understand why they would want to get rid of that functionality entirely. Not only that, but it creates consistency for developers, and it solves security, potentially, and stability issues, potentially.

And it solves a problem they call visual fragmentation, which sounds just great. Across the GNOME desktop ecosystem exists visual fragmentation, and it's very real, and it's a problem for app developers. Since very few distributions ship GNOME as is, it's hard to determine what visual identity GNOME is, and therefore it's difficult to know what visual system to build your applications for. The biggest offenders continue to be downstream projects that theme GNOME extensively

by overwriting the default icons and style sheets and insist that part of their own brand identity. But so long as that practice carries on, this fragmentation will continue. Now, I thought to myself, holy crap, that would be a massive change. And I was really curious to know what one Mr. Daniel Foray thought. So I went to his Twitter feed, and he says, you have to think about the fact that GNOME was used, GTK, I should say, GTK Plus is used outside of GNOME. about the fact that GNOME was used, is GTK, I should say, GTK Plus is used outside of GNOME.

And that right there, I think, brings this whole thing into perspective is this really underscores how in the bag GTK is, GTK Plus, that toolkit is for GNOME. It really is the GNOME shell desktop toolkit. And what do you think about this entire proposal, Dan?

Do you think it's going to go anywhere? Do you think it's just sort of,unkworks talk right now? Or are you concerned this may actually progress into something that could be difficult for elementary OS to deal with? Because I would have to imagine you guys rely on these mechanisms quite a bit to create the elementary look. So we actually went out to Guadal, and we participated in the talk, the theming kind of discussion, API overall talk. And kind of the takeaway is that

there's a lot of different parties, right? They kind of have competing interests. There's GNOME as a platform. There are other GTk platforms like elementary there are kind of gnome downstreams like ubuntu and pop os and we have app developers and we have users and they all have different things they care about right and the the kind of overarching theme of the discussion is how can we make everyone happy? And I don't think that there's anyone on the either inside or outside of GNOME that wants to introduce a sweeping change

that's going to make any of these parties like really upset. I think we're all trying to work together. And the kind of overarching idea that came out of that talk was we need to make it easier for downstreams from GNOME to write style sheets that are fully compatible with Adwaita so they can keep doing their branding without adding an extra burden for developers. So is that your way of saying something's going to change, but it probably won't be the end of the world for people that want to have their own downstream identity. I'm not necessarily sure something will change as far as the internals of GTK, but I think that in terms of more and better documentation or more and better tooling. Oh, okay. I follow you. That would be a really positive development.

Yeah, so I think that everybody wants to make sure that everybody's freedoms are still preserved, right? I think that everybody wants to make sure that everybody's freedoms are still preserved. It's a real pain for developers if we start locking down things because then it makes our development environment hostile. That's not fun. So nobody really wants to do that. We want to make sure that third-party developers have a stable and consistent platform to target. So if they choose to write an app for GNOME, that it works how GNOME apps should work.

And if they choose to write an app for elementary, that it works how elementary apps should work. We just want to make sure that our developers have something sane to target. And it seems that the way to do that is to make it easy for people to write style sheets that are compatible with Adwaita or style sheets that are more compatible with elementary OS. All right. Okay, so you've convinced me I won't be making a prediction

at the end of the year that elementary OS announces the switch to Qt in 2020. So, okay. All right, I'm convinced for now. So do you have any other comments or thoughts on this story? I know one of their concerns was visual fragmentation. Do you have any thoughts about that as an issue for the GNOME desktop? You have your Ubuntu look now, you got your Fedora look now,

SUSE looks a certain way, Antigros looks their certain way. They all are shipping a GNOME shell, but they all do look a little different. Even the way they function is a bit different due to different extension implementations or lack thereof in some cases. Do you have any thoughts on that particular concern

just as Gnome Shell as a brand, as an identity itself? Yeah, I think that people who try to make the conversation about branding don't understand the problem. It's not about branding at all. And people try to get down on designers and talk about control. And it's not really about control either. The thing is, when we started that discussion, everybody in the room

had an example of an application on their computer that was broken because it was developed against a style sheet that they weren't running. And so that's what the problem is that's trying to be solved. It's not necessarily about branding. Yeah, Ubuntu wants to have their brand. It's also about trying to make a good experience. Yeah, it isn't about trying to take away people's ability or enforce a brand or anything like that. It's about making sure that applications aren't broken,

is what we all care about. A fundamental level of consistency so that you actually have a platform. Yeah, we just want you to load an application and not have a spinner that's crazy huge or text that's invisible. Style sheets are super powerful and they can make your app look really crappy

and then developers get complaints from users and then they're like, hey, what the hell, you changed the style sheet that I built my app against and now it doesn't work. And, you know, we're trying to make people happy and it's a super hard problem. Yeah. Poby, I don't know about you, but I feel like I've seen this movie before. It kind of goes something like this. Hey, here's an idea. And then the internet freaks out. You're going to take away my toy. And then it kind of ends up being not quite as big of a deal as everybody expected it.

Do you think that's what's happening here, or do you think this could be a major shift, considering the talk about extensions too? So this is one of the pitfalls of us doing open source development. You can imagine that there are massive bun fights inside Apple and inside Google and inside Microsoft when they're talking about their OSs, and all the relevant parties and all the people who have a vested interest in whatever that feature is, we'll all be discussing this. And then it comes to a conclusion and a decision is made and the solution is published. Whereas with open source, you have people who have different vested interests from different

parties like Dan and cassidy from elementary and people from endless and people from canonical and people from red hat all getting together and discussing this stuff in the open and when there's a whole load of peanut gallery outside who are getting snippets of conversations from one party from one side of the conversation and then rebroadcasting that, it doesn't help because everyone has a slightly different perspective. Dan has a different perspective than I would, I'm sure. So, yeah, it's totally exactly that.

What's the name of that gal who went and observed the monkeys forever? What was that gal? She fell in love with a monkey. She loved a monkey. What was that? Come on. Jane Goodall. Yeah, thank you, Brent.

Yeah, I feel like that's got to be our approach with this stuff. We loved a monkey. What is that? Come on. That's Jane Goodall. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you, Brent. Yeah. Yeah. I feel like that's got to be our approach with this stuff. Like, we can get the binoculars out. We can get ourselves a fancy, like, a jungle suit and all that kind of stuff. But, you know, we only can really observe. We can only observe here. The process is the process.

They will go through whatever process that is, and we just happen to get to watch it. And it's a neat opportunity for us, especially for podcasters. But it is a really hard line to walk because taking away themes and taking away extensions causes an emotional reaction. And then you want to respond to that. So I think it's a – my point is it's just I think sometimes these things start somewhere that can be scary to the end user in a degree. I don't mean to say that like to belittle people,

but it is kind of like a, it's a jarring thing. Maybe that's a better word. It's jarring to the end user. I don't know. I think part of your observation, like the fact that we can observe what's going on. Yes, we can, but it's open source. You could also get involved.

There's nothing stopping someone doing a google summer of code project to um isolate and separate out extensions or or build something that does some validation of extensions or captures the trace of an extension at the point when it falls over or something you know there's there's plenty of opportunities to improve what we have it doesn't have, well, we're going to have to throw this away. There's an opportunity because it's open source for people to get involved. But it's difficult when there's lots of parties. Yeah. Okay.

So just we don't have to spend a lot more time on this. But while I have your ear, one more question to you is, wouldn't we be better off if it was all just one look and one standard and it was sort of the way Windows and Mac are? I mean, I'm not saying I want it that way, but I am saying if your goal is to attract more developers and more end users, wouldn't that be better? I don't know, would it? I mean, which project gets to decide what that one look would be?

Well, the GNOME project. Right. And maybe other people have, so long as there's a feedback loop there that allows people who are consumers of the work that the GNOME project do to feedback, and there is at Guadec, and there are mailing lists, and there's IRC, and all kinds of ways to feedback to GNOME to say, hey, look, that's not working. We need to do something else.

That's exactly what is happening now. This extension thing isn't working. This theme thing isn't working. People are providing feedback. It doesn't have to be, yeah, they could come up with one theme, but consumers would decide whether that's a good theme or not, really, and you'd find out. And this is part of the process.

As much as we sometimes, you know, you and I hate it, but it is part of the process just to watch and see where they go and talk about it a little bit. I think it is worth exploring. I think it's worth exploring the way they do extensions. I think they're a reasonable way to extend a desktop when you have a team that does have limited resources. I mean, they did just get

some money, but it's only going to last them so long. And development takes time and money. It takes years. So when you have those realities, extensions sort of bypass that. And you don't have to wait on that core team to bring in functionality to the desktop. So I think they have merit. And ironically, I'm sure just totally coincidentally, really, there was a post on how the Plasma Project does their extensions. Is that right? Yeah, and it was, you'd be surprised to learn it may be technically superior. Yeah, surprise, surprise, spoiler alert.

And anyways, this conversation goes on, and I say, let's all just wait and see. Don't worry. These developers are also users of the desktop. They're not going to break their own desktop. We'll see where this goes. I actually am really happy to see them asking some of these hard questions.

I cover it more on Coder Radio this week. Not safe for work. In a not safe for work way. Just as a warning to you if you want to go listen to it. And I think this is, I think this is a technical debt that Nome has needed to pay off for a long time. And now they're looking at that bill and going, okay, right. So how are we actually going to pay for this? What solution do we want to implement? What pain are we willing to endure? And that's the conversation's beginning and it's a necessary one. So I'm all for it. I think it's

really, that's where it it. I think that's where this is leading. It just starts at a place where it may startle you a little bit. It may be a bit jarring. Right. And as always, we see the parts that bubble up into the surface of drama and work continues all the while. Yeah, no kidding, right? Yeah. Speaking of work continuing, so Mr. Cassidy joins us. He's here as now a full-time employee of Elementary OS. Normally, I would say Cassidy James is here from System 76, and he works over at Elementary OS. But now I say, formerly of System 76, now joining us on the show is Mr. Cassidy James of Elementary OS. Hey, how's it going?

Hey, congratulations. So I grok that the project was the benefactor of a recent contribution, and you guys must have looked at the numbers and said, hey, I think I can make that work full-time. Is that essentially what happened? Yeah, I mean, it's multiple things, multiple things that came together kind of all at once.

We've had great success with OS purchases from the website, app purchases from App Center, and other avenues like Patreon and Bounty Source. And then on top of that, we had a really generous person from the community, from the elementary community, who liked what we were doing and reached out and said, Hey, I'd like to help you guys out. What can I do? And we worked with them and just figured out that bringing another person on full-time was the right thing at the right time, and that's me.

Wow, wow, wow, wow. Congratulations. Huge. Thank you. Super exciting. And I think you guys, one of the reasons I love it is, first of all, both you and Daniel are obviously super committed to the project here.

And you have a good product. I have my son on it still, and it's just been a solid product. It's a good product. I think what you guys have needed is more execute power. Let me tell you, as somebody who is in that same exact position, I think that's what you've needed. And bringing you on gives the project more power to execute on certain things. So it sounds like some of those things, because you call them out in your blog,

is spending time with app developers and other parties to keep elementary OS financially sustainable. So that sort of came across to me as a bit vague. Essentially what I read from that is you're going to do a little developer advocacy, try to maybe reach out to a few developers and convince them to bring their application over to elementary? Is that, am I interpreting that right?

Yeah. So there's really like, there's really three areas of focus I've had over the past few years and looking to continue focusing on those areas. It's the writing and communicating with people. So we do, you know, monthly app center spotlights on the, on our medium. Yeah. Monthly progress reports of development. We do developer tips, articles, things like that.

So writing, you know, I love to write, and Dan and I both kind of tag team on the Medium site quite a bit. So that's one way of outreaching to developers. But then there's also the more direct interaction with developers. That's helping people bring their apps to App Center, focusing on the developer experience of App Center dashboard itself.

Those areas are really interesting, and I haven't had as much time to focus on them. And so it's great to be full time now being able to focus on that. And then the third thing, which is, you know, I've always been doing with elementary is design guidance and input, obviously, work on the human interface guidelines, sketches, something I've started doing more recently as organization-wide projects to improve the overall experience. So it's just, it's kind of a scattershot and it's kind of all over,

but that's kind of what's exciting about it is that I'm pretty deeply involved in different parts of elementary and now being able to focus full-time on that, I think means a lot more meaningful results from that. Yeah, and you may find you start digging in on something and you get a lot of traction there, and that's something you'll have flexibility to dedicate time to now.

Whereas before it would have been like, well, how the hell am I ever going to be able to pull that off? Exactly. There's one in there that we haven't really talked about, and I bet you're not going to tell me much, but I just got to ask, dedicate time to working with OEMs with an S. What? What's that about?

So this is something I've been doing on the side. There's several OEMs out there who ship elementary OS as an option. I think, what is it? Tuxedo computers. There's one called Obsidian. There's Slimbook that you can order elementary OS on. I've been talking with them, obviously, because we're really interested in getting their feedback as an OEM. That's a really unique perspective where you're directly interacting with customers, paying customers of hardware.

We're paying $1,000 or however much for a computer. So I haven't had the time personally to dedicate that in the past, So I haven't had the time personally to dedicate that in the past, but being able to actually interact with them and talk to them about it would be, you know, a great thing, I think, for everybody, for people who want to purchase a computer with elementary preloaded. Right. I hope to see that expand. That'd be really cool. All right. So let's get Dan in here for a second. So, Dan, I mean, obviously you and Cassidy are friends, but there must have been other people you could hire. So what made you think Cassidy was the right one with some limited resources?

You got time, you got some flexibility now. All of a sudden this guy comes in and he says, hey, if I can help out somehow. Was it specifically, but you have to hire Cassidy or was it your thought? No, you know what? This is the way to go. This is the right call. So we've had a lot of internal discussions, right, about what kind of skill set should our next hire have.

And there's been a lot of talk about, well, they need to be a developer. Or, well, maybe we need somebody who is good at marketing. Or, well, maybe we need another designer. Because our design team has so many things that we just don't have time to get to. And our developers are making it up. And we stacking technical debt right yeah yeah and and so there's all these conversations about who should our next hire be and what should they be good at and kind of the beautiful thing about hiring cas is he'll never admit it but he's great at everything cas is an amazing ux designer cas actually is a developer um and he's published a couple apps in App Center.

You see all of his blog posts on our blog. He helps me manage all of our social media accounts. He's really good at putting people together. He has all this great insider knowledge of how a hardware company works. He's kind of this amalgam of knowledge of everything. It's a really, really great opportunity to be able to hire him on, to be honest. Yeah, I think so. And the man grows a good beard, too. Which never hurts. That doesn't hurt.

Plus 10 hireability right there. Yeah, that is. So, Cassie, are you going to stay in the Colorado area or what are your plans long term? Are you going to move out to the coast or are you going to stay put? Well, I'm pretty rooted here in Denver, Colorado. I love it here. My family vacationed here growing up like almost every year.

So I really love it here. So I'm planning on staying here. My wife has a job out here as well. So, you know, we're on staying here. My wife has a job out here as well. So we're pretty rooted here. I know Dan has been lightweight looking at apartments and things in the Denver area. So that might be an interesting job at some point. We'll have to see. You know, that's not a bad idea, Dan.

Although right now you're kind of on my route for certain places I go. So we get to hang out from time to time. I'd be a little disappointed. But I could make a trip to Denver, I suppose. Then I get to hang out with both of you guys. And then you can hang out with System76 time. I'd be a little disappointed, but I could make a trip to Denver, I suppose. Then I'd get to hang out with both of you guys. And then you could hang out with System76, too. Yeah. Zach, now it's a party.

Now that would definitely be a party. I'll bring the fish. It'd be a good time. All right, guys. Well, congrats to both of you. I think it's going to be really good for the project. Looking forward to the new release, too. I mean, think about it.

The future releases with both of you there working on that kind of stuff. And I hope you find a path to sustainability so that way this position remains. It's something you can keep doing, Cassidy, because I think that'd be really great too, obviously for not just you, but for the project as well. So everybody go, when the new release comes out, put

another, put a little dollar amount there for Cassidy and for Daniel for the whole project. Keep this gravy train coming. Yeah, well, at least keep food on their plates, I suppose. Speaking of keeping foods on plates, why don't we do a little food keeping here for the program?

do.co slash unplugged. You can go there and get a $100 credit for the DigitalOcean platform. Infrastructure on demand in less than 55 seconds. You can build and deploy a lot in 60 days with a $100 credit. So go to do.co slash unplugged. I'm trying to come up with a new way to describe DigitalOcean.

What would you, do you have anything that comes to mind? Like, cause like, you know, I can say it's like super crazy fast, all SSD based infrastructure that you can spin up on demand. That is accurate. Yeah. But I feel like I need something new. Some spice. Yeah.

Something to change it up. You know what I mean? Like need something new. Some spice? Yeah, something to change it up. You know what I mean? Like something that has a beat, something that's exciting, something that's fresher than me. Because I feel like we could use a little freshness. I don't know. I'm going to just, I'll tell you what, I'll just mix a little something live. Oh, you've got a little secret sauce for us? Yeah, you just go, you just play

backup, okay? You do my backups. DigitalOcean's cloud computing platform was designed with simplicity in mind. Okay, you and your team can seamlessly go from deploying to scaling highly available web, mobile, PaaS, DBaaS, or machine learning applications. In just a matter of seconds, quickly set up one to thousands of virtual machines, easily secure servers and enable performance monitoring, and effortlessly attach more storage. Plus, you'll always know exactly what you'll be paying every month with a predictable flat pricing structure across all global data center regions. By using DigitalOcean, you'll get the infrastructure experience that development teams love with the features your business needs.

Sign up for DigitalOcean today and experience simplicity at scale. Man, you nailed that, Wes. Good job, dude. I know what I'm doing. So also, just to give you a mention, they have a new guide up they posted a couple days ago about using a CDN to speed up static content delivery. And when you look at the pricing of DigitalOcean and you look at the ways you could utilize DigitalOcean and the benefits of using a CDN, it's a no-brainer way to use DigitalOcean,

especially if you go to do.co.unplugged to get that $100 credit. Did you say $100? $100 credit. What? I say $100 sometimes. Whoa. You know what else is fantastic is those great folks.

So great I had to move my microphone arm in there. Did you catch that? I wanted to give you a little studio ambiance. It's Linux Academy. Those people over at Linux Academy, they are hard-working folk. LinuxAcademy.com slash unplugged. I just got a little

sneak peek at something that's coming down the pipe. Beakley, Beakley. It's so cool. I might reach out to them and try to set up an interview here in the near future to have them do a little overview of one of these things they're working on. I just so desperately want to say what it is, but I don't think I'm allowed to because it's in development. You know how they feel about that stuff these things they're working on. I just so desperately want to say what it is, but I don't think I'm allowed to because it's in development.

You know how they feel about that stuff, but they're always working on stuff. It's a platform to learn about Linux. Anything that Linux runs on or that you can run Linux with or on top of or inside of. That's a big list. That's a giant list.

Turns out it's most of Microsoft stuff these days. And they've got courseware on that as well as AWS and OpenStack and of course the Linux Essentials and the Google Cloud platform and Docker and trying to wrap

your head around big data or just basic DevOps concepts really and now really some great courseware for reals. Really.

I like saying really. On security. So go check it out linuxacademy.com slash unplugged. It's pretty pretty pretty great. And they're always working on new stuff.

They're always building new content. They're always adding new features. You get a lot out of your subscription. So linuxacademy.com slash unplugged. You can sign up for a free seven-day trial, even if life's busy. They got a course scheduler that'll work with your busy day and days and days and days. I understand. But they'll work with you on that.

That's like the hardest part when you're like, okay, I want to learn something. Oh, now I go, if we've got to go find the resources to learn. No, it's just right there. It pops up. You log in. You keep reading. There's also something that just makes it real when you just see this, this concept is going to take me two hours to master, you know, and then I go, oh, okay, two hours.

I can do that. Yeah, I can do that. And then you can get study tools and you can get lesson audio and they got videos and interactive diagrams and all of that stuff. So it's a great platform, and it gets you ready for the big certs. It's got instructor mentoring, human beings that help you if you need help. Yeah, it's great. Human beings.

You're real humans. I would never have thought. I know. Powered by Linux. Linuxacademy.com slash unplugged. Speaking of powered by Linux, Ting. Yeah, the Ting infrastructure runs on Linux. Linux.ting.com. Linux.ting.com.

Linux.ting.com. That's where you go to save $25 off a device if you want to buy one from Ting. And I'll tell you more about that here in a second because they've got a good one. Or if you bring one, they've got CDMA and GSM, you get $25 in service credit. Pay for what you use wireless as Ting's secret sauce. It's a fair price for however much you talk, text, and data you use. And there's no contracts, no early termination fees, no quote-unquote agreements,

and you can manage the entire thing, turn stuff on and off, individual services even, like text messages on or off, right from their control panel. It's super, super easy. You can set usage alerts. They have fantastic customer service. But I wanted to tell you about a great deal right now. If you just want to get a nice, clean, performant Android phone that's going to

get updates for a little while, friends, I'd like you to consider the Motorola G6 Play. I've talked about the Moto series before. They're the ones where I legitimately don't mind the skin. Like, it's so minimal, you know, and if you just get in your way, you don't feel like spending $800 on a smartphone, which I don't, but you'd like to have something that's no way. You don't feel like spending $800 on a smartphone. Which I don't. But you'd like to have something that's no contract, that you're not paying for monthly. I do. Yeah, linux.ting.com.

Then you go to their store page. You can get the Moto G6 Play for $174. You own it, and then you just pay for your usage. That's it. That's awesome. Yeah, no contract. It's multi-network too, so if GSM is better in your area, your CDMA, you can utilize that. It's really, really nice. It's multi-network too, so if GSM is better in your area or CDMA,

you can utilize that. It's really, really nice. It's got a fingerprint scanner. It's got a bunch of nice features built in like an SD card reader, 13-megapixel rear camera, 4,000 milliamp battery. They say you can get 36 hours on a single charge with that sucker. And it's got a Snapdragon quad-core processor in it. It's a great phone, and you can own the whole dang thing for $174.

That's not bad. That is not bad. And you can go up to 128 gigs with microSD. I think it comes with 32 gigs built in, but you can go up to 128. If you can get off that got to have the latest and greatest sort of ride, then this is a secret weapon to saving some money. It really is nice. 5.7 IPS screen.

It's a higher, it's a 1440 by 720, which is not bad for a 5.7 when you're not trying to kill battery life all day. You know, if this podcasting thing doesn't work out, you could be just a phone salesman. I think you've got it. I really like these phones. Like, when you find the right phone,

it's like, I don't know, something about it. It's like, this is, you know, because everybody's always buying, like, the iPhone or the Samsungs or the Pixel. The easy choices. Yeah, and it's like, oh, cool. So you spend $1,000 on a phone. But if you didn't need X, Y, whatever that one thing is, you could get these Motos, and they're just great phones. $174. Linux.ting.com.

All right, I've said my piece. I just think that's a great phone and a great service. I get excited, Wes. I can't help it. I love gadgets. Not as much as I love Linux and free software. Just mix those two together. I have not bought an Android device since the Nexus 6P.

It's been a while. It may change, you know. After a while, the OnePlus is starting to look better and better. It is. But I got to save my pennies right now because I think this week's news has sealed the deal for me on buying a ThinkPad. I was on the, as you guys know, I've been on the fence for weeks. We had Barton on last week and, you know, we were talking about the XBSs plus my XBS has been one of the best computers I've ever owned. I still, it's still my daily

driver for so many things. I prepped today's show on my XPS 13. I took it down to Texas, like just a solid system. And one of the things I love about my XPS 13 is I get firmware updates through GNOME software and Plasma Project has announced that they're bringing that same functionality to Discover. So you'll be able to get firmware updates on the Plasma desktop. And I know it's silly, but that's something that really matters to me. It makes it feel like a complete consumer product in a way that just hasn't really been there on Linux

before. I just love LVFS and I love that my XPS 13 got firmware updates that way. You mean saying that I don't have to boot into DOS to update my firmware anymore is somehow good for Linux? Or the modern version of that really is, you know, you have to keep your Windows partition around. That sucks.

And so, it is such a censure for me now that Lenovo has joined the LVFS project. And the laptop I've been looking at, the T480, is on the supported list of hardware. And I got a couple of notes,

emails with screenshots from listeners that are like, hey, I just got this on my ThinkPad like two days before this went public. Oh, it just shows up. Yeah, I guess the timing went that the images started showing up in the stable repos while Richard was on vacation so he couldn't get back to write the blog post in time.

But he writes, bringing Lenovo to LVFS has been a lot of work. It needed changes to the low-level FW update library, which is FWD, and even LVFS admin portal itself for various vendor-defined reasons. I love that term. In other words, they had particulars they wanted taken care of. He says, we've been working in semi-secret for a long time, and I'm sure it's been frustrating to all involved not being able to speak openly about the grand plan.

But I do think Lenovo should be applauded for their work done so far due to the enormity of the task, rather than chastise about being to the party a little late. Then he writes, if anyone from HP is reading this, you're now officially late. Amen.

That's great. This is, to me, this is the censure for that T480. But there's only one person here who I believe has authority to speak on this topic, and that would be Popey, because he owns 35. Hello, Popey. Did you have any hint

this was coming? And when you saw the news, how excited? How excited were you? I was very excited. It's always good to see more hardware appearing in the LVFS. Do you think this is indicative of other things that may be in the works at Lenovo? I don't know. I know it's something that Richard has been working on for a long time. We had him in the office recently when we had a GNOME software design sprint. He came in for a day and we chatted over some stuff

and he was telling us a little bit about the amount of work that goes on to get companies on board with LVFS. And it's certainly a labor of love for him. So it's really good to see he's succeeded with Lenovo. Boy, do we appreciate it. It just, it makes a difference for so many users in such a big way. It's such

an appreciated... Not having to boot into Windows or create some shonky boot disk and get your firmware that way. Just pressing a button, reboot. And it's cross- distro, you know? Yeah. Which is also so great

for somebody like me who seems to not be able to last more than a year on a distro anymore, which is for actually a lot better than it used to be. Just accept it now. There's nothing wrong with it.

I am really elated by this news. What do you think of my choice, Popey, on the T480? You think that's a solid choice for like a travel laptop? It's an excellent choice, of course. Hey, that's all I need.

Home validation. Yeah. Okay. I feel good. That's like... We get need. Boom. Validation. Yeah. Okay. I feel good. That's like when I discovered that Jeremy Clarkson bought a VW Golf. I'm like, oh, that kind of validates my new interest. That's how I feel Popey is with the ThinkPads. He's like my Jeremy Clarkson for ThinkPads.

He has earned it. Oh, my God. Please no. I thought you'd like that. All right. Well, well moving on just a few other things. Eric the IT guy is in the mumble room today and you may recall that name because

not only does he chime in from time to time but he chatted with me a few weeks back about Jupyter Broadcasting's efforts around setting up PeerTube. And he is back with many encoding jobs later to give us kind of an update on where things are at and some other things that are in the works. So Eric, thanks once again for all your

work on the PeerTube stuff. And where do you think we should start with the update? Yeah, I try and chime in whenever my son's not playing with my mixer. Yeah, that is always fun when he reaches for the EQ. So, you know what I do is I just swat at them. If I find that works, you just swat at them. They seem to learn. Wes is looking at me like, I think you're joking. But he's like, no, I'm Chris. I'm not sure.

Well, it helps that Dylan's a natural broadcaster, so you don't need to worry about him. He's quick. He dodges. That's what, yeah. Yeah, yeah. All right, so what do you think, Eric? Where do we start with the peer tube?

Is there any significant new developments? I know where there's been some backend changes. We've had a whole bunch of encoding jobs going. Uh, kind of the, the 30,000 foot view we've, uh, we've rebuilt peer tube about three times on three different setups and, uh, and operating systems. And we've, we've settled on Ubuntu and, uh, and we, we've got a nice big,

uh, VM. Thanks to some of the guys in the community. They've, they've donated a huge VM with, I think 16 cores. Um, if,

if you're on the Macedon server, you've, you've seen that, uh, about every couple of hours, a new video is being posted as I'm going through, uh, 10 plus years of Jupiteryter Broadcasting backlog.

We're in the next few days. Transcoding job should finish for BSD now. I don't know if anybody watches that, but it's there. I kid. I love you guys. That was solid, dude. Well done. Nicely delivered.

So we're I think NASS NO Noah's up there. BSD Now is almost done. Several of the other shows are done, and then the rest are on their way. So once the active shows have all had their backlogs ported over, then I want to try and start on some of the shows that aren't active anymore. So we've got the entire catalog there at some point. Yeah, and this started as, hey, YouTube is pulling down our stuff sometimes.

Or, man, wouldn't it be great to just help lend some attention towards a project that is helping replace YouTube? Because we've talked about the issues of that, especially for free software coverage. And so that's really, I think, where Eric and I started with this. software coverage. And so that's really, I think, where Eric and I started with this. But then we started going, you know, wouldn't it be really great if you could go to one place and have the entire archive available, at least as far as we have it in video? And so that, I mean, I can't imagine the amount of CPU heat that work must be creating, Eric. So how long does that take? Is that a manual process? Are you SCPing MP4 files around? Or how are you doing that part? So what's fun is it's a two-step process right now.

So for the backlog, PeerTube is using YouTube DL. Oh, good. And it's got a scripted job that I run and just point to. There's the Jupyter feed webpage that I just point the YouTube DL script towards. And so it'll pull in the backlog. But then manually, once I catch the tweet that a new show has been published, I go up, pull down the current. So when this episode gets published, I'll go down and pull that down with WGit

and then SCP it up to the server and manually, or actually manually add it in through the web UI. And there's been some people notice that when I do that, there's a disclaimer that the video hasn't been transcoded yet. So quality is not so great. We've actually, as a community, been submitting pull requests for new features. And one of the new features that we have requested is the ability to basically set importance. So I want the server to be busy all the time. So if you don't have anything that's been published in the last week, chew on the backlog. But as soon as one of the new shows gets published, I want you to drop everything else you're working on and transcode this.

That's a great idea. I need to double check on it, but they just sent out an email, PeerTube did, earlier this afternoon stating that version 1.0 beta 3 was just released. So we should be expecting a full version here within the next couple of weeks with a lot of really nice features and bug fixes. And they're changing up some of the things on the back end.

I mean, this project has exploded. I don't think they had a clue just how popular this was going to be. Well, yeah. I was just looking at their active instance site, which I'll have linked in the show notes. You can see the other PeerTube instances out there, and there's a whole bunch of them taken off.

A lot of 1.0 versions, so it's good to see that they're still chugging away because I know that they've been super busy with their fundraiser stuff. Well, so what's the site people go to to kind of see some of the hard work you've been doing? What's the URL? So the official URL is getjupiter.com, doing? What's the URL? So the official URL is getjupiter.com. And that's a restricted instance that is official Jupyter Broadcasting content only. But if you jump over to peertube.linuxrocks.online, it's tied into the Linux Rocks Mastodon instance. And that is where community members can submit videos, things they've seen,

things they've produced. I know there's a couple of us like myself who haven't done, who are getting our feet wet with podcasts that have uploaded a few videos just so we've got somewhere to publish it and say, hey, go check out this video and tell me what you think. And did we end up implementing the chapters, or not the chapters, but the channel? So like, if you want to just see all of Linux Unplugged, you can just go to that channel. How does that work? Because like, if you go there right now, it's all BSD now all the time. And like you said, nobody watches that. So is there a facility for that on PeerTube? They're still fleshing out some of the functionality around channels. But if you

go to getjupiter.com and you register for an account, I know, another account, I'm sorry, but that's how it works. If you register a new account. I know, another account. I'm sorry, but that's how it works. If you register a new account, you can actually subscribe to individual channels. So if you want to get that Noah guy, you can just go and subscribe to Ask Noah and get those. That's the only thing people listen to around here. So, okay.

Well, Eric, thank you very much. We should probably keep moving because we want to also talk about Android P and get to some pics. But I really do appreciate that work. So getjupiter.com I really do appreciate that work. So getjupiter.com is where people will see it. And I think it's good timing because I think it's going to play into our overall plan to sort of get our back catalog in shape one day. Well, and one last quick note.

effort for PeerTube has actually led to another project that we've been working on, a couple of us, where Jupyter Broadcasting now has an official GitLab instance that we're managing. At some point, we're going to move all the PeerTube scripts, perhaps a code for JBots, the

caster soundboard, things like that. We're going to be hosting on Jupyter Broadcasting hosted instances. With a cool URL. It's the great GitHub Exodus. We're just a little late to the party. We're a little late to the Exodus party. But yeah, we're setting it all up. We'll have our own

official site. So if you hear us talking about which I have a suspicion there will be more projects added to that list in the near future. Well, maybe not in the near future, but in the distant future. It'll just be one resource you go to. So if it's the soundboard, if it's the, yeah. It's so easy. Yeah, the bot and all that kind of stuff.

Yep, so that's all stuff Eric's been helping us with, set up the backend stuff. And it's kind of bringing together several initiatives, which is great. So, all right. Well, check out more of that, and I'll have links to what Eric was talking about in the show notes.

Keep up the good work, Eric, and everybody else helping Eric. And let's talk about Android P for a moment. It up the good work, Eric, and everybody else helping Eric. And let's talk about Android P for a moment. It was released this week, and I don't have a lot to really cover on it, other than I noticed a few things that stand out. Other than your typical new features like

adaptive battery and adaptive brightness. So adaptive. There's a lot of... There's a big vibe of monitoring you in this thing. So like app actions, which will predict what you want to do next based on your other activity, or application slices, which try to figure out what you're searching for

and show you content from an app. And there's also this new dashboard that helps you understand how you're spending your time on your device. And the app timer that lets you set limits on apps and graze out the icon on your home screen when you've used it too much. Too much Twitter for you, Wes. I know. Oh, God, I'm so embarrassed. And then there's other nice features like Do Not Disturb,

which silence visual interruptions, and then there's the wind-down mode, which turns on a nightlight and then turns on Do Not Disturb and then fades the screen to grayscale. I'm willing to try that out. We'll see. But the digital well-being stuff is a little scary to me, and I don't know if it's just me being RMS or if this isn't just the mecca of metrics for Google to collect here. Like, imagine now all of the things they can add to the profile

that's already enormous that they have about you, about all of the things they can add to the profile that's already enormous that they have about you about all of these things about how because in order to monitor all the stuff they've had to build in hooks to watch and then they have to be collecting this information and storing it and storing it in a dashboard it seems like it would just be almost negligent for them not to also eventually have a copy of that information, even if in this first release they don't. I mean, right, yeah. You just want more data. That's kind of the rule.

And it's all being sold to us under the premise of digital well-being. Well, I mean, you can't. How are you going to do all your machine learning if you don't have all the data, Chris? Yeah, that's true. You've got to have all the data. Yeah. Bobi, have you flashed all of your Android devices with Android P?

Are you running it on everything now and got the friend? No. No, because as is always the case, I am bottom of the pile because I've got a OnePlus 3T. So I seriously doubt that I'll get Android P anytime soon. Yeah, I joke though, but it is kind of a serious thing. It's like now we wait. Now we wait for the code dump

and then we wait for all the other lag of the projects that are based off that code dump to actually catch up. It is not quite. I mean, it is far better than the alternative in many ways but it is not quite the glorious free open source ecosystem that perhaps we once naively thought long ago. So Cassidy, you've been giving it a go though, quite seriously. I'd be curious to know about your first impressions,

including maybe some of the new nav stuff, if you had a chance to give it a go. Yep. I got the update over the air yesterday and I've actually really been enjoying it. The new navigation is optional and off by default on existing hardware, but I guess it's going to be the default on new hardware from Google, at least in the future. But I turned it on. I really enjoy it. I actually really enjoy the digital well-being stuff. And I think I have a different perspective on this, maybe because we do something similar and we've done it for a long time, just really

not as well fleshed out, I guess, in elementary OS. And that's the tool called Zeitgeist, which is something that on your device, it tracks what you open, what files you access, what applications you use. It keeps all of that information on the device, but then that can power some really interesting things in the OS. And we've been talking actually how we could expand our privacy settings to be more like this digital well-being where the user's in control of what apps they themselves can open when. And we have something called parental controls right now, and we've been talking about maybe rebranding that as something like digital well-being, because I think it's a really interesting topic of like setting restrictions for yourself for what, you know, how you use your device. Like devices these days are made to be so addicting

that I think it can be important to impose limits on yourself as long as it's you doing it and it stays on the device locally. Yeah, I really have no problem with people setting their own limits on themselves if they have control over those limits. It seems like it kind of speaks a little bit about trust. Like when you, the idea as you describe it, coming from you, it sounds very interesting, but I think maybe some of this is just... It's concern. I don't know if it's actually even an issue. It to me is just, it's just when I hear it,

I can't help but wonder it a little bit. And there's this voice in the back of my head that always goes, well, RMS was usually right about this stuff. It could be nothing, right? It could be nothing. And I think too, if you do have, if you have a hard time with controlling how much you use these devices, building something in is probably good. And I think the intention here from the companies is a good one, I think. So, yeah.

So Android P, come into a phone near you in 2021. But you can go read about it with the link in our show notes. It does look like a nice refresh. If I had a phone it would run on, I'd give it a go. There's some good security improvements baked in as well. Yeah. And runtime stuff. In fact, the one that I noticed, I think you called it out in our chat,

was that it is now using TLS by default and DNS over TLS. That's nice. More encryption. Yeah. Yeah, I do not mean to besmirch the good name of Android Pie because, as everyone knows, we love pie, right? It's just complicated. Yeah, it is.

It's a complicated relationship. So let's make things easy for a little bit with a Snap. There is a new app that I found this week in the Snap store, I guess, and it's called Transitions DJ. And it is a, to me, I guess, I don't mean to say it badly, I don't mean to like talk it down, but it's like a light version of Mix, M-I-X-X-X.

It's nice. It's a cool little app, and it's used for mixing music. It's great for live production or just making a mix that you like it has cross fading tempo adjustment looping cue points tempo synchronization and it also has a online database it can pull down of strong song structures that you can use to get the beats and the bars and the beats and the bars and the phrases to help you mix it up.

And it's a snap to install. It's actually quite literally a snap. You just do snap install transitions DJ. And then you'll be the star of the party. Yeah, so that looks pretty cool. That is neat. Yeah, you got a summer party. Then there's a tool that I didn't know anything about,

but I knew it was something The Intercept was working on. That's the outfit that Glenn Greenwald works for and others. And their parent company, First Look Media, has been investing in a tool to help them manage PGP encrypted emails. But not the emails so much themselves, but the keys. From the beginning of First Look Media, they've been using PGP or GBG encryption for all of their emails. And they've been using PGP or GPG encryption for all of their emails. And they've tried to make it as simple as possible by creating a new open source tool called GPG Sync. They've developed it in order to offload

the most complex part of encrypted email, the key management part of encrypted email. And they take it out really away from the users, the fiddling from the users, and they kind of move it into the IT staff realm. So this is sort of a pick for those of you in IT that might want to solve this for your end users. So here's how it works.

GPG Sync is designed to make it so everyone within your organization always has the correct public keys for everyone else in your organization without even having to think about it. I want that. I want that right now. Yeah, I was thinking like, and I heard this like, we could use this here. That'd be kind of cool. We could all be talking encrypted. Although we just don't really.

When's the last time you've emailed me or I've emailed you? Ever? Very rarely. Probably once. Maybe once, yeah. Yeah, that's weird. That's very odd. Yeah, that's weird. Twice once. That's very odd. Yeah, so the tech staff generates a PGP key called the authority key,

and they also recommend you use YubiKey with this. They create a list of all the PGP fingerprints that all members of the organizations should keep updated called a key list. They digitally sign the key list with the authority key, and then they upload both the key list and the signature to a website that is accessible from a public URL. All members of the organizations then install GPG-Sync and subscribe to that key list.

You can also subscribe to as many key lists as you'd like. So if you had multiple projects or companies you were working with, they could all have their own key list, and you could subscribe to them. You can stay up to date on all of them for multiple organizations. When someone joins your organization, the tech staff helps them generate the PGP key, adds their fingerprint to the key list and re-signs it with the authority key. And then they upload it to the same URL. If a user migrates to a new key, the tech staff adds their new fingerprint to the key list and also leaves their old one on the list as well. And now

each member of your organization doesn't have to track down everyone else's public keys and make sure they're authentic. You don't even have to hold regular key signing parties, though you probably could. The users don't actually have to do anything. They just write encrypted emails to their colleagues, and it just works. That's pretty neat. Yeah, so you're just delegating

trust to IT, which you do for so many other things anyway in an organization like that. And just a nice way to keep it all in sync. And in a Windows organization, you are. The domain admins have access to all that stuff. They get master keys. So yeah, there you go. There you go.

It's called GPG Sync. And version 0.20 came out this week. So congratulations to First Lock Media for putting that together. So there's a couple of app picks for you. How about that? Boom, boom, boom. A couple of app picks right there. Pow, pow, pow. And you can find all of those at linuxunplugged.com

slash 261. Wow, how about that? 261, Wes. Good job. Holy smokes, holy smokes. Well, that just about brings us to the end of this week's broadcast. If you want to get more Wes Payne, go check out what? TechSnap? Yeah, TechSnap.Systems.

Nice. If you want a little more Popey, he was just recently on Late Night Linux in their most recent episode. Did a fine job there. And also that excellent Ubuntu podcast. So you always can check out more Popey there as well, UbuntuPodcast.org. And you can find Cassidy and Dan. It will have links to their social profiles and their websites in our show notes,

so you can get their stuff there. And Brent, is there anything you want to mention before we get out of here this week? Anywhere you want to send folks? Yeah, I think sending people to at BrentGervais on Twitter is a good place. Just come and say hi if you don't have anything better to say, but I'd love to say hi.

Check that. All right, very good, sir. All right, you know't have anything better to say, but I'd love to say hi. Check that. All right. Very good, sir. All right. You know, one of these days, we got to get another barbecue planned. We got to get another barbecue planned. We need it.

Yeah, we do. We smoked meats. We do need it. Hey, I encourage you to follow me on Twitter, too. Why not? We're all doing it, at ChrisLAS. The network is at Jupiter Signal.

And if you join us live on Tuesdays, you get a nice Linux rounded meal because the pre-show starts around 1.30 Pacific time. And then the show starts around 2 p.m. ish. And then we tend to go till about 3, 3.30 ish, you know, whatever that might be. And then we hang out till that Noah Chalaya guy shows up. And then we do a little handoff to him and the Ask Noah program fires up. It's a beautiful, beautiful afternoon of Linux. Now a lot of people say, but Chris, I gotta work.

And to that I say, no you don't. Just put this on in the background. And you say, and they come to you and say, why aren't you working? You say, boss, this is my extended training. Don't you want me to be better at my job? And if they say no to that, then you're working at the wrong place. Alright, thanks so much for tuning in to this week's episode of the Unplugged

program I hope you enjoyed everything don't forget links are on the Linux Unplugged website our live stream is at jblive.tv you can also get it on our YouTube channel at youtube.com slash jupiter broadcasting thanks so much for being here see you back here next Tuesday Thank you. There we go. Oh, yeah, yeah.

We're bringing it in now for a landing. Soft, gentle JB landing. Yeah. Keep your seats buckled and drink it if you still got it because I'll probably smack into the ground a little hard. I tend to do that. Well, thank you, everybody, for making it to the show today. What are we going to do for 300?

I know it's a ways off, but if we start talking about it now, you know what I'm saying? We have time to execute something great. I'm putting that out there. What are we going to do for 300? All right, jbtitles.com. What are we going to do for titles right the heck now? Let's go.

Thank you, Mumbaroom. You guys were great. A rowdy, riotous Mumbaroom. Anybody cooking like we are? It's, what do you say, probably 83 in here, 84 in here right now, maybe? My entire state is on fire. That is awful. Literally.

Yeah. I mean, that's what we need here in Europe too, rain. Rain would be really good. Yeah. It's hot as balls. I appreciate that everybody's suffering with this. That's nice would be really good. Yeah. It's hot as balls. I appreciate that everybody's suffering with this thing.

That's nice. That's good. That's why we do this. It distracts us all. I'm not suffering right now and yet I still have my glass of wine

and now it's pretty decent because we have off to midnight here so it's pretty cool now. It's good. Yeah, I bet. Well, that's,

you know, when you're on vacation and in the mumble room, that's real dedication right there, I got to say. You're the best. I'm your servant. All right, well, now let's pick a title then. And then I think we've checked all of our boxes. I liked there was something Gnome Gnome on the Range.

That was one that went by at one point. Yep, TechMove. Yeah, we got to get the boat going. It's a long one. We need your help to sort this out. Like, we can't pick from a series of ones. I resisted the urge to ask when the release is going to be Dan and Cassidy. You know, I didn't.

I saw you squirming. It was on your mind. I didn't say. I just wanted to say, like, I believe Dan's birthday came and went, and that was the deadline as far as I was concerned. When it's ready, as always. Yeah, just a bang to Jess when it's ready. Yeah.